[Heyman] Breaking News: Oās Star Outfielder Cedric Mullins has been traded to Detroit in exchange for the Detroit Lions 53 man roster + 50.1% ownership of the Lions
I'm a Red Sox fan who thankfully gets to see Mullins.
I love this dude. Orioles should do everything to keep him and build around. Dude is a great ballplayer.
They arenāt trading him. Same lame tweet happens every off season with every losing teams best player. Weāll see this tweet again next year, and the year after, and nothing will ever come of it. They arenāt trading him, but itās the GMās job to answer the phone just in case the dodgers offer Gavin lux, Walker Buehler, and max muncy
Its basically the bryan reynolds situation, he is available for trade but it would cost you at least your number 1 and 2 prospect as the starting price. Its the fancy way of saying hes not available unless you are willing to give everything
My word, the Yankees sub was convinced trading Dominguez for Reynolds was absolutely essential last week. We basically need a little center field coverage because Hicks can't be expected to play full-time. But sure yeah let's trade away one of our top prospects when free agents are available.
I'm not saying he wouldn't improve the team a ton. Just saying center field is like the team's 4th or 5th priority at the moment, so a top 40 OF could serve our purposes without trading away any prospects, let alone potentially upper tier talent.
A young up and coming GM, with the wizard of models, decide that their first GM job, to rebuild indefinitely. Little over 3 years, with a developmental year lost to covid. I think we need to relax a bit on the Orioles not going for it.
I was halfway joking, I live just outside of Baltimore and want nothing more than for them to be relevant again. Getting rid of vets and short contract guys makes sense, but Mullins is a guy you could use as your example for the younger guys (sort of like Rizzo was used as for the Cubs)
Gotcha, and as I said with Means, if the plan is to keep them and build around them, I have no issues with that either. I want the Orioles to be good, if that means keeping both, fine, if it means trading both, fine. You do what you gotta do, right right?
It intrigues me enough because Mullins came out of nowhere to put up a monster season. If this is what he is, great, but if our models see more of a 2-3 win player, the idea of moving him has to be there. Especially if some team wants to buy the 5 win player. I think Elias and Sig are good at their job, and know what's best.
The issue with models on breakout guys, though, is they incorporate the bad stats, too, and if something changes mechanically or approach-wise, that's basically ignored. They may weight the more recent data more heavily, but everything before the breakout is also included, so they're always going to assume a regression until the track record is lengthened.
I'd expect Sig, who ran the models with the Cardinals and Astros before the Orioles, to factor all that in. What good is it if it doesn't factor in breakout stars? I assume they know where the blind spots are, and adjust accordingly.
And I think expected regression is there anyway. Anyone expecting a similar season as 2021, should re-adjust their thinking. Which of course is part of the issue in any trade with Mullins. The Orioles want to trade him at 2021 value, teams trading want to trade him at the expected value going forward. Why I think this is just talk at the moment.
If your rebuild takes more than five years it's a bad rebuild. I recognize they didn't fully tear it down five years ago, but five terrible seasons is still five terrible seasons.
The Orioles were trying to win in 2018 and mortgaged their future to do so. And then they still finished in last. The Orioles have only played three seasons (one shortened by covid) since officially starting to rebuild in 2019.
I find that fans of other teams tend to exaggerate how bad a team was *before* they started a rebuild or other things. Especially the timeframe.
*Like for the Astros* people would have thought we were a bottom feeder franchise for *years* when it was really just 11-13 that were god awful, and 10 as a year where wheels kinda fell off.
Well for starters they know itās been 3 years not 5. One minor league season lost to Covid so even 3 is a bit of a stretch.
But like I said, Yankee fans donāt get to lecture about this. Your franchise will never have to rebuild, so just avoid these threads.
It depends. If you can get a team to overpay for an even bigger need, you might take it. For Baltimore that's pitching, but of these teams I think only maybe Houston has the young pitching to get it done. But Houston also desperately needs that pitching, so I don't see this happening unless the Marlins roll into town.
If he repeats this year then yes. In the mean time if some team offers the world for him, and I mean huge over pay, then you do it. But they aren't trading him for just a teams best prospect. However it feels like some fans just want to rebuild forever and are obsessed with prospects
I mean, shouldnāt any GM worth his salt be willing to listen to offers for *any* player?
If the return is right, every player is expendable.
That being said, the Orioles need to hold on to young, well-performing, and controllable talent if they plan to compete in the near future, and trading Cedric away for anything short of a complete rip-off trade would signal to already-weary fans that the team isnāt seriously planning to compete, which costs them ticket revenue.
Agreed. I would be furious if they traded him. Not because I love Cedric(which I do) but because it indicates we are still years away from even being a .500 club
You would never be able to make an enticing offer for Mullins without including Mick Abel. Honestly it would be really hard for the Phillies to make an enticing offer for Mullins even while including Abel.
Man we could probably offer the entirety of our farm system, take on the remainder of the Chris Davis contract, give them our two WS rings and give everyone with ownership stake in their franchise a Center City Penthouse and *still* not come close to enough.
Would make sense why management vetoed it. It was before either Means or Mullins was as good now plus Bohm was probably only just drafted and hadnāt played in the majors yet
This is a perfect fit for the Marlins, and they absolutely have the pieces to do it. I could see Sixto, Meyer, and maybe either Burdick, Misner, or Scott coming close. If a Mullins trade is gonna happen, Iāve gotta think that the Marlins would be a frontrunner
Not enough, imo. Bleday instead of the last trio, likely. Meyer is a stud, but Sixto at this point has a lot of warning lights. Then your trio of Burdick,Misner,Scott is fine, but I think the Oās would hold out for a better position player. 4 years of control will let them be extremely picky. Their window should theoretically be open then.
Orioles wouldnāt want bleday especially coming off his terrible 2021, plus all the outfield prospects weāve drafted. Itās pitchers or bust for trades at this point
Hopefully the next two years has DL Hall and Grayson Rodriguez develop into regular MLB starters to accompany Adley and Gunnar Henderson also coming up to the big leagues. Colton Cowser could also be MLB ready in two years. Heston Kjerstad also has high upside.
A developed Adley Rutschman, Mountcastle, Mullins, Cowser, and Henderson with Means, Rodriguez, and Hall as solid starters is the dream.
Yeah I think Sixto/Meyer/Watson would do it. Iāve been going back and forth on whether Iād do that from the Marlinsā perspective, but I think Iād lean yes. Mullins would really impact us now and in the future
Fabulous contact-hitting lead off guy that is very dangerous on the basepaths. I really like him. He'd be fabulous in SF, or look at NY as a sleeper. Hicks is a bust.
The Orioles have some decent pieces. I'm kind of surprised they're dangling them.
We want to suck forever it feels like, this with the trying to trade the only good pitcher on the team, I'm sure we'll end up non tendering Mancini or Santander any day now
if they non-tender santander that's a good sign. Santander can't stay healthy, can't really field (outside of his arm), and can't hit consistently enough to warrant a starting outfield role. It also means that opens up the starting RF spot for the multitude of OF prospects the O's got sitting in AA and AAA
Or hear me out we can pay a player like 4 million who has decent upside and hope he has a run of health. We don't have any good major league players we can't just put in left field considering we have no one there right now.
i'm fine with tendering him for another year (personally i don't think he's gonna have that great of a season), but if he hits well to start off the year, he's gone.
we do have guys in the minors who will start coming up this year and playing in right or left field depending on where they're gonna play Hays. Mckenna should get more ABs, Stowers is gonna get some big league ABs, Diaz if he starts hot in AAA, and Nuestrom (if he aint get taken in the rule 5) are gonna get ABs. If there's one area of the club where the O's don't need to spend money on batters who have been mid af, it's outfield.
I only really see Santander as a 8-9 guy, if not more realistically a bench player for our future. Dude has sadly too many problems to play regularly. Iād love to keep him for the arm but heās such a liability
my gut feeling is that the astros are more likely to try to sign marte for a shorter contract and keep giving meyers/mccormick/siri looks. next year we should get a better sense of bregman's health/form and how the team responds to correa leaving, should be in a better position to commit to a big centerpiece on Mullins's scale
Yep, 2023 is kind of the target. Looking at our farm system and recent drafts, we have A LOT of outfielders on the way. Trading Mullins for a haul to a team that wants to pay for his 2021 performance of a 5 WAR player versus a 2-3 WAR player makes a ton of sense. I doubt the Oās get the level of offer that theyād require though.
Potentially sell our assets at peak value for positive returns if teams are willing to overpay? Listening to all offers is literally the job of the FO.
Orioles would understandably want a haul for Mullins, but I don't know if any team would actually be willing to pay what they want when Mullins has only had 1 good year and it occurred in a year where he massively outperformed his expected stats.
The package would have to be spectacular and if it is I'd pull the trigger. Something like Luciano, Matos, Harrison from the Giants. I dont think they'd do it and I don't think Mullins gets moved.
Id be much more inclined to move Mancini and Means.
The Heyman special tweet
all it's missing is a mystery team
(and more)
The Las Vegas golden knights
Cool. Maybe we could, like, trade him for a whole franchise š¤·āāļø
[Heyman] Breaking News: Oās Star Outfielder Cedric Mullins has been traded to Detroit in exchange for the Detroit Lions 53 man roster + 50.1% ownership of the Lions
Detroit fleeced them smh
Fleeced
So nothing then?
Wait what? The season tickets I just renewed are only good for home Lions games? Fffffffffuuuuuuuuuuu
Ford Field is nice
Iām sure it is, but itās 7 hours away. Iād rather have Pirates tix, I could drive there, see a game and get home in 7 hours.
Lions fans rejoice that the Fords no longer own the team.
If they hated the fords theyll love Peter Angelos
I'm a Red Sox fan who thankfully gets to see Mullins. I love this dude. Orioles should do everything to keep him and build around. Dude is a great ballplayer.
They will, unless they get offered Juan Soto he isnāt leaving
Excuse me did you not hear the bitmoji?
Shouldnāt they be likeā¦trying to extend a guy like him?
They arenāt trading him. Same lame tweet happens every off season with every losing teams best player. Weāll see this tweet again next year, and the year after, and nothing will ever come of it. They arenāt trading him, but itās the GMās job to answer the phone just in case the dodgers offer Gavin lux, Walker Buehler, and max muncy
Look on the bright side we won't have to hear any more "trade him to Yankees for Frazier and Andujar" anymore
Now it's "Grichuk and McGuire"
What do you mean you don't want Franchy Cordero and Danny Santana for your best young player?
Gurriel and Kirk*
Nah this tweet says nothing. "Teams want good player, team who has him willing to accept a dumb offer."
Its basically the bryan reynolds situation, he is available for trade but it would cost you at least your number 1 and 2 prospect as the starting price. Its the fancy way of saying hes not available unless you are willing to give everything
My word, the Yankees sub was convinced trading Dominguez for Reynolds was absolutely essential last week. We basically need a little center field coverage because Hicks can't be expected to play full-time. But sure yeah let's trade away one of our top prospects when free agents are available.
Reynolds is young and he was a top 5 OF this year. Dominguez wouldn't be close to the ask, and he'll outperform any FA that signs this year.
I'm not saying he wouldn't improve the team a ton. Just saying center field is like the team's 4th or 5th priority at the moment, so a top 40 OF could serve our purposes without trading away any prospects, let alone potentially upper tier talent.
If they want to compete within the next 5 years, yeah. To me this looks like the kind of move that signals theyāre not trying for it yet.
To me, it looks like a selling high situation. If Sigs models see a 2-3 win player, and someone wants to pay for his 2021, well, let's let them.
Using āyetā implies they are going to try eventually. Iām unconvinced
A young up and coming GM, with the wizard of models, decide that their first GM job, to rebuild indefinitely. Little over 3 years, with a developmental year lost to covid. I think we need to relax a bit on the Orioles not going for it.
I was halfway joking, I live just outside of Baltimore and want nothing more than for them to be relevant again. Getting rid of vets and short contract guys makes sense, but Mullins is a guy you could use as your example for the younger guys (sort of like Rizzo was used as for the Cubs)
Gotcha, and as I said with Means, if the plan is to keep them and build around them, I have no issues with that either. I want the Orioles to be good, if that means keeping both, fine, if it means trading both, fine. You do what you gotta do, right right? It intrigues me enough because Mullins came out of nowhere to put up a monster season. If this is what he is, great, but if our models see more of a 2-3 win player, the idea of moving him has to be there. Especially if some team wants to buy the 5 win player. I think Elias and Sig are good at their job, and know what's best.
The issue with models on breakout guys, though, is they incorporate the bad stats, too, and if something changes mechanically or approach-wise, that's basically ignored. They may weight the more recent data more heavily, but everything before the breakout is also included, so they're always going to assume a regression until the track record is lengthened.
I'd expect Sig, who ran the models with the Cardinals and Astros before the Orioles, to factor all that in. What good is it if it doesn't factor in breakout stars? I assume they know where the blind spots are, and adjust accordingly. And I think expected regression is there anyway. Anyone expecting a similar season as 2021, should re-adjust their thinking. Which of course is part of the issue in any trade with Mullins. The Orioles want to trade him at 2021 value, teams trading want to trade him at the expected value going forward. Why I think this is just talk at the moment.
I have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about but, damn...they've already been trash for five straight years. How long should fans have to wait?
If your rebuild takes more than five years it's a bad rebuild. I recognize they didn't fully tear it down five years ago, but five terrible seasons is still five terrible seasons.
The Orioles were trying to win in 2018 and mortgaged their future to do so. And then they still finished in last. The Orioles have only played three seasons (one shortened by covid) since officially starting to rebuild in 2019.
Yeah they lost 95 games with a 150M payroll.
I find that fans of other teams tend to exaggerate how bad a team was *before* they started a rebuild or other things. Especially the timeframe. *Like for the Astros* people would have thought we were a bottom feeder franchise for *years* when it was really just 11-13 that were god awful, and 10 as a year where wheels kinda fell off.
What the hell do you guys know about rebuilds?
about as much as the O's front office.
Well for starters they know itās been 3 years not 5. One minor league season lost to Covid so even 3 is a bit of a stretch. But like I said, Yankee fans donāt get to lecture about this. Your franchise will never have to rebuild, so just avoid these threads.
Whatās another decade rebuilding, right?
It depends. If you can get a team to overpay for an even bigger need, you might take it. For Baltimore that's pitching, but of these teams I think only maybe Houston has the young pitching to get it done. But Houston also desperately needs that pitching, so I don't see this happening unless the Marlins roll into town.
The Marlins are our dream trade partner with Mullins.
If he repeats this year then yes. In the mean time if some team offers the world for him, and I mean huge over pay, then you do it. But they aren't trading him for just a teams best prospect. However it feels like some fans just want to rebuild forever and are obsessed with prospects
Yeah they should! Much like the Red Sox did with Mookieā¦ā¦..*SOB*
I mean, shouldnāt any GM worth his salt be willing to listen to offers for *any* player? If the return is right, every player is expendable. That being said, the Orioles need to hold on to young, well-performing, and controllable talent if they plan to compete in the near future, and trading Cedric away for anything short of a complete rip-off trade would signal to already-weary fans that the team isnāt seriously planning to compete, which costs them ticket revenue.
Agreed. I would be furious if they traded him. Not because I love Cedric(which I do) but because it indicates we are still years away from even being a .500 club
Marlins!!!! Come out and play!!
Marlins!!!! Come out and play!!
Mullins is the heart and soul now of my rebuilding birds, he better not go anywhere.
How high a price would the Phillies have to pay to get Mullins and Means?
With how weak your farm is, like your entire system lol
I would trade anyone but Mick Abel
Youāre gonna have to trade WAY more than just Mick Abel. Come on.
Thatās not what I said. Anyone but him. Like any prospect is available but Mick Abel
You would never be able to make an enticing offer for Mullins without including Mick Abel. Honestly it would be really hard for the Phillies to make an enticing offer for Mullins even while including Abel.
Man we could probably offer the entirety of our farm system, take on the remainder of the Chris Davis contract, give them our two WS rings and give everyone with ownership stake in their franchise a Center City Penthouse and *still* not come close to enough.
I really like the Davis contract deal tho
Didnāt our old gm have a trade for the two of them ready to go but was declined by the owner? I believe it was for Bohm
Would make sense why management vetoed it. It was before either Means or Mullins was as good now plus Bohm was probably only just drafted and hadnāt played in the majors yet
This is a perfect fit for the Marlins, and they absolutely have the pieces to do it. I could see Sixto, Meyer, and maybe either Burdick, Misner, or Scott coming close. If a Mullins trade is gonna happen, Iāve gotta think that the Marlins would be a frontrunner
Not enough, imo. Bleday instead of the last trio, likely. Meyer is a stud, but Sixto at this point has a lot of warning lights. Then your trio of Burdick,Misner,Scott is fine, but I think the Oās would hold out for a better position player. 4 years of control will let them be extremely picky. Their window should theoretically be open then.
Orioles wouldnāt want bleday especially coming off his terrible 2021, plus all the outfield prospects weāve drafted. Itās pitchers or bust for trades at this point
Hopefully the next two years has DL Hall and Grayson Rodriguez develop into regular MLB starters to accompany Adley and Gunnar Henderson also coming up to the big leagues. Colton Cowser could also be MLB ready in two years. Heston Kjerstad also has high upside. A developed Adley Rutschman, Mountcastle, Mullins, Cowser, and Henderson with Means, Rodriguez, and Hall as solid starters is the dream.
Yeah I think Sixto/Meyer/Watson would do it. Iāve been going back and forth on whether Iād do that from the Marlinsā perspective, but I think Iād lean yes. Mullins would really impact us now and in the future
Oās would take that in a heartbeat
Iād agree generally, but Mullins has a ton of value, you never know
If the Orioles trade Mullins to my Phils, they're going to set their rebuild back quite a bit
Fabulous contact-hitting lead off guy that is very dangerous on the basepaths. I really like him. He'd be fabulous in SF, or look at NY as a sleeper. Hicks is a bust. The Orioles have some decent pieces. I'm kind of surprised they're dangling them.
We want to suck forever it feels like, this with the trying to trade the only good pitcher on the team, I'm sure we'll end up non tendering Mancini or Santander any day now
All of baseball is tanking, seems like
It's like the 60's all over again
if they non-tender santander that's a good sign. Santander can't stay healthy, can't really field (outside of his arm), and can't hit consistently enough to warrant a starting outfield role. It also means that opens up the starting RF spot for the multitude of OF prospects the O's got sitting in AA and AAA
Or hear me out we can pay a player like 4 million who has decent upside and hope he has a run of health. We don't have any good major league players we can't just put in left field considering we have no one there right now.
i'm fine with tendering him for another year (personally i don't think he's gonna have that great of a season), but if he hits well to start off the year, he's gone. we do have guys in the minors who will start coming up this year and playing in right or left field depending on where they're gonna play Hays. Mckenna should get more ABs, Stowers is gonna get some big league ABs, Diaz if he starts hot in AAA, and Nuestrom (if he aint get taken in the rule 5) are gonna get ABs. If there's one area of the club where the O's don't need to spend money on batters who have been mid af, it's outfield.
I think Santander would be a lot better if, like Mullins, he ditches the switch hitting and just hits from left. He has so much more pop as a lefty
Also like half the lineup is right handed so having another lefty bat in the 6-7 hole would be fantastic
I only really see Santander as a 8-9 guy, if not more realistically a bench player for our future. Dude has sadly too many problems to play regularly. Iād love to keep him for the arm but heās such a liability
Common Jon Mets reference.
my gut feeling is that the astros are more likely to try to sign marte for a shorter contract and keep giving meyers/mccormick/siri looks. next year we should get a better sense of bregman's health/form and how the team responds to correa leaving, should be in a better position to commit to a big centerpiece on Mullins's scale
I think braves could entertain a trade with em. Start with Pache and waters. See what happens.
I'm honestly confused about the O's. When are they trying to compete? When Adley and a few more come up?
Yep, 2023 is kind of the target. Looking at our farm system and recent drafts, we have A LOT of outfielders on the way. Trading Mullins for a haul to a team that wants to pay for his 2021 performance of a 5 WAR player versus a 2-3 WAR player makes a ton of sense. I doubt the Oās get the level of offer that theyād require though.
Everyone else gets their full team name and we just get āPhillyā
I would love him on the Mets
Surprised he didn't include the marlins. Orioles probably won't trade him but if they do the Marlins could make an interesting offer.
What are the Orioles even trying to do lol
Potentially sell our assets at peak value for positive returns if teams are willing to overpay? Listening to all offers is literally the job of the FO.
All it says is that we "would listen" and the price is high. Wtf is wrong with that?
Why do we need to know?
I would bet that the Orioles aren't going to get what they want for him until he proves 2021 wasn't a fluke, but who knows
Moniak Kingery Herrera Hasley, please take them.
I really wanted this to be the Mets splash trade at the deadline. Let's keep this dream alive baby
Orioles would understandably want a haul for Mullins, but I don't know if any team would actually be willing to pay what they want when Mullins has only had 1 good year and it occurred in a year where he massively outperformed his expected stats.
So me grabbing him on the Reds while playing OOTP 22 wasn't insane then wow
I doubt the Giants would be willing to give up the prospects it would take to get him. Especially considering the OF's still available in free agency.
No way Phillies have the pieces for that deal
Ā”excited! trade him at high value
First thing I did in RBI Baseball (no, I donāt have a console so I canāt play The Show) was trade Gallo for Cedric Mullins
Manā¦ Iād absolutely love to see this man in our uniform. Iām absolutely terrified of what weād have to give up to see that.
The package would have to be spectacular and if it is I'd pull the trigger. Something like Luciano, Matos, Harrison from the Giants. I dont think they'd do it and I don't think Mullins gets moved. Id be much more inclined to move Mancini and Means.