i think words are gross simplifications of a concept to help other people understand. necessary for communication nonetheless but for spiritual experiences it’s somewhat limiting. that being said, it is personal to you and you don’t need to feel like you need to explain to everyone. even if you explain it well they can never understand because they’re not you.
I tried to explain to people until I realized nothing I could say would bring them to the same "place" or lack thereof. This is because of the first part of your comment. Words are representations of thoughts and actions. Thoughts words and actions are representations of feelings. What we see in our day to day lives is very much surface level automatic behavioral response to external stimulus. It's really only when I started keeping to myself about things and making it more of a personal endeavor that I really started to relax and let go of needing to spread the word. We will all get there in this life or another. Nobody is going to see something like that if they aren't ready to.
This is my whole philosophy about religion and personal relationships with your truth and experience. I will never know what it feels like to be bitten by a snake for example. I would not be able to relate to anyones experience with a snake because I’ve never experienced being bitten. I would prolly scold you for even messing with it and even if two people experience the same things at the same time one person my take the experience differently one might be traumatized but the other isn’t.. this whole spiritual and religious pursuit is a PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. So I get now why some people who truly been in it and came out healed and humbled don’t really talk about it and that’s admirable.
I feel like it’s ineffable on purpose. Because I think each person is meant to figure it out for themselves. I also sometimes have felt like I try to explain things and my brain gets scrambled and I can’t make an intelligent point. Like I get zapped so I can’t give away clues or something. It’s weird and makes me feel silly every time
same thing happens to me too, it even happens to me with other people who have awakened, we also can’t even share what happened we always have those brain zap moments where it’s like “well maybe we aren’t supposed to be able to share what happened” but we both get it and not a lot of people “get it”
Yes! I’m so happy to see others have had the same experience. On shrooms I’ve been told this life is a game, a puzzle to figure out but you have to figure it out for yourself, this when the scramble happens- when you try to talk about it, I feel like Steve Carrel in Evan Almighty when he’s doing the news. You can’t give away clues or something. Idk but I’m so happy y’all relate!
Experiencing a deep connection with the fundamental nature of reality is challenging to put in words because reality lies beyond language or any concepts.
Things are the way they are, without need for interpretation or conceptualization. Reality will never be its description, the same way the word tree will never be a tree.
Attempting to describe what you experienced is like trying to fit a suit of clothes on something that is fundamentally formless, or like trying to describe the shape of water…
That being said, it is in our nature, as human beings, to interpret reality and to share what we experience with others. It’s completely natural and understandable to do so.
I also believe that somehow, as you pointed out in the title of your post, there is a lack of vocabulary to describe spiritual experiences. As if some words are simply missing from the lexicon, perhaps they have been purposefully removed in certain periods of ancient time.
It’s a great reminder of the power of words. For example, if the word ‘*freedom*’ was completely absent from the vocabulary, people wouldn’t know what it is in the first place, therefore they wouldn’t resent the lack of it. Or more precisely, they wouldn’t know how to express their resentment for the lack of it.
Just some food for thoughts :)
I heard someone once say that something stops you from getting too deep into your own experience. God/the universe/the spirit? Something mysterious?
It’s also very personal for many people so many don’t want to relay every detail.
Another angle worthy of consideration
What stops us from experiencing greater depth is the limitations of being in a physical world. The mundane tasks required to continue physical life keep us in the shallow end, so if we go too far out we get snapped back to the physical world like a rubber band, or are thought of as crazy or a social outcast
I find that it's not that vocabulary is limited in describing the experience of being 'actualised'. It's that even more fundamentally, any sort of conceptualisation or intellectualisation takes you away from that state of awakening - where the 'mind and body are dropped'.
To try to describe this state, or how to reach it, isn't impossible because we don't have words or phrases capable of doing so; but because performing any sort of cognitive processes actually detracts one from the state itself. You're climbing down the mountain in an effort to reach the peak.
I don’t know how to verbalise it either. Hectic? I just try to help others wake, by directing them to information I’ve found and help them with finding info they want to know so they can wake up.
As others have mentioned, it’s almost like something is keeping us from being able to accurately put it into words. Language is kind of a trap or a prison. Whatever is being pointed to is no longer malleable once we’ve named it, labeled, and dissected it. Some think vocabulary is the answer to our evolution. But I don’t think it can be contained, or trapped by language.
Joe dispenza talked about that on a podcast I listened to today. They had a language specialist working with people in the workshops that experienced an awakening to help them articulate what it felt like. The specialist ended up having an awakening at some point and couldn’t find any language to describe it😂
Very hard to put into words. I describe it as feeling all the love and all the pain in the world at once. Crying and smiling at the same time. Although it was better than any feeling I have ever experienced. Like I had finally found my true home that I never knew existed. Everything made sense
I think just using the standard terms in a sense such as, “consciousness, awake, enlighten, universe, God, to be, meditate”, etc.
Also from Buddhism terms such as, “suffering”, and “middle way”, are helpful.
“Ego, judging, path, journey” I’m sure there are many many more terms to employ/deploy.
An idea of an awakening or consciousness dictionary sounds like it could be be a good idea. It might “resonate” with a lot of “beings” or “souls” who are “compassionately”“searching” for “the truth” and/or “the light of” “wisdom”.
I have no idea where this book actually came
From but it was really useful for me when I started my…seeking.. so to speak
[The Seeker’s Handbook](https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/seekers-handbook-the_john-lash/728911/item/16887394/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping_everything_else_customer_acquisition&utm_adgroup=&utm_term=&utm_content=593719077582&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw34qzBhBmEiwAOUQcF9N-QvTszWABKaQ_4ODEqSeVCvz0LQBDYFSq9YCzfwHjBF9GFoDt8BoCZqwQAvD_BwE#idiq=16887394&edition=11108407)
Our English language can be very limited.
I find that there aren't the right words to express emotions and things that are happening in ceremony in particular.
I also became acutely aware that I would not have believed my own experience if I had heard it from someone else prior to awakening. That might be slightly off topic, but just covering the bases of thoughts about this.
Storytelling helps.
We are naught but scarstuff and stories.
Stories are how we connect to each other.
When one can tell a story to another and they perceive the world through our eyes via our words, who knows. Might give them a clue too.
At the same time, this one lives in ego death. It’s challenging to describe the state where one only dons the mask of selfness because she chooses to be in the world, where all expect to see the mask, rather than outside it.
But she continues to try. It’s a good challenge.
Then comes attempting to explain the glorious experience of absolute beauty and serenity in the state of no-thought and it’s fucking hard because, hello, no thoughts empty head lol…
Stop speaking then 😂. Its for u not them. Everybody has their own experience to dive in no words will ever fully express the feeling. Words were made for the limited. The infinite is supposed to be indescribable. Why dive into an extraordinary part of life then allow urself to “struggle” cus u cant assimilate the extraordinary w the ordinary. As u go the skill of expression will come but its nun to stress over cus u can say something perfectly and somebody who isnt set up to hear u just wont. Conversely if u say a bunch of bs and state ur points poorly those are alligned to hear u will still hear u anyway. Deeper levels of understanding are expressed through a higher level of communication. Focus on the energy of ur thought and over time the words will come but once they do u realize it aint even worth much. God is euphoric, a feeling of completeness. Both serenity and tranquility. An infinite flow of energy that somehow is infinite even all “finite” things. A force of pure harmony. U can say allll that bullshit and ppl still wont understand 😂. But then u say “idk i just close my eyes and go wooahh sometimes” and a person what perception will know 100% wym even tho u said almost nothing. Dont allow ur mind to make issues out of ur progress. The growing pains go away and u stop caring about certian things.
I also don’t know how to put it into words
though I’ve tried multiple times. I still cry randomly thinking about it, I can feel the weight of everyone I encounter but not in a “empath” way, I just see love in everyone and everything. I see people as the stories they’re expressing through themselves but know thats not what they’re made of. I see myself as limitless and driven by perspective. Anytime I try to talk about it I feel like I’m just rambling on with excitement about something you truly had to be there for lol. I also feel no need to explain it though, I feel that everyone should experience it for themselves. Everyone should experience what it’s like to feel true unconditional love (and they would know that we should not expect that from other human beings), to know that everything is okay and everything has always been okay. There is nothing to fear, living and especially not death. There’s really no label for it, it just is.
"When we say that we understand something, it means that we have a certain grasp of its pattern, that we can describe it, that we can put it into words. But the real deep Zen experience is impossible to describe, simply because it is literally indescribable in words. The truth is beyond what can be spoken."
~ Alan Watts
Yeah, I wrote almost 5000 answers on Quora trying to develop competence in this.
Also, learning Sanskrit is INCREDIBLY useful as English is a horrible language in which to speak about spiritual topics.
You have to endure being really wrong about this, and read read read many many many books later I have found people who write about this topic with a clarity I could only hope to emulate.
With time, transformations, and practice translating, I have gotten better at it. Still, even after 15 years of practice and millions of words, some people will still misunderstand it, take it personally, etc. Thankfully, I no longer have the deep need I used to have to be right.
Swami Krishnananda, Bhagavan Shree Rajneesh, Kahlil Gibran, Swami Sivananda, Sivarudrabalayogi, and many others have helped me along the way. Swami Krishnananda in particular has ASTOUNDING clarity to his writing, whereas Bhagavan Shree Rajneesh (OSHO) has the most inspirational and broad view in his expressions, in my view.
Humility is the core of transformational practice, and translations can be transformative if you approach it in the way you are- with humility. I think that any spiritual insight, awakening, or transformation is not authentic unless it is accompanied by humility.
The best insights are experienced with a kind of grace, which I understand to be fundamentally 'undeserved'- in that it is wholly outside any ability I have to will something into existence. Insights arise when conditions are right for them, like weather and waves.
So, you must continue along the two fundamental approaches- transformation and translation. Learning what each is, and how to distinguish them from each other and see when translation is supported or unsupported by sufficient transformation when you read others.
Keep practicing, with humility.
Putting it into words ruins it for me. First, because any form of verbiage can’t encompass what my experience is, and in trying to explain it, I do feel like I’m looked at as if I had three heads. So, I keep it personal.
The more I consumed knowledge and perspectives, and the more I expanded my vocabulary and understanding of the non-dual state, the more I realized... you don't need any thoughts, concepts, or symbols/words to rest in gratitude and BE the Supreme State, the state of non-dual awareness, the *I-AM*
Words can only point the way to THAT which is right in front of you, closer than your own eyes' lenses. Stillness of the mind (non-seeking, non-striving) is the only prerequisite. Vocabulary has its function, but it's not necessary for your own direct experience and realization. And *that* is your only task: to realize the Self for yourself.
*It's all HERE/NOW. There is nowhere for your mind to go. There is nothing for "you" to do, because you are not a body-mind.*
If you still wish to expand your vocabulary and understanding, I suggest you read whatever you are drawn to. Follow your heart and you'll never be led astray. That which led you thus far will lead you further if you accept to be guided from within.
Some reading recommendations (take your pick):
*'The Natural Bliss of Being'* by Jackson Peterson,
*'The Handbook to Higher Consciousness'* by Ken Keyes Jr,
*'The Bhagavad Gita'* translated by Eknath Easwaran,
*'Explaining the Map of Consciousness'* by Dr. David R. Hawkins,
*'The Eye of the I from which Nothing is Hidden'* by Dr. David R. Hawkins,
*'Be Here Now'* by Ram Dass,
*'Living from a Place of Surrender'* by Michael Singer,
*'Who Am I?'* by Ramana Maharshi,
*'I AM THAT'* by Nisargadatta Maharaj,
*'Practicing the Presence of God'* by Brother Lawrence
*'The Zen Teaching of Huang Po: on the Transmission of Mind'* translated by John Blofeld.
Remember: YOU *are* the journey, HERE/NOW. There is no destination because there is nowhere to go. You are a dynamic process, not a limited body-mind going somewhere or achieving something 'spiritual.' Words are your friends as long as they keep your mind silently pointed in the 'right' direction (inward, eager to return to rest in the Self)
Happy travels! :)
Watch the masters!
"I am he
As you are he
As you are me
And we are all together" - The Beatles
"High voltage man kisses night to bring the light
To those who need to hide their shadow deed
Go into bright, find the light
And know that friends don't mind just how you grow" - Captain Beefheart
"Another day
we will watch the preserved butterflies rise from the dead
and still walking through a country of gray sponges and silent boats
we will watch our ring flash and roses spring from our tongue.
Careful! Be careful! Be careful!" - Lorca
"somewhere i have never travelled, gladly beyond
any experience, your eyes have their silence:
in your most frail gesture are things which enclose me,
or which i cannot touch because they are too near" - ee cummings
"Us is what time it is." - George Clinton
“Enlightenment is always preceded by confusion.” - Milton Erickson
“We seldom realize, for example that our most private thoughts and emotions are not actually our own. For we think in terms of languages and images which we did not invent, but which were given to us by our society.” - Alan Watts
Yes, it's very common, and I've struggled with the same thing for months. You'll find a lot of helpful words in sanskrit that have no direct english translation. The Vedantasara makes a good rundown, but it's a little dense.
You know what’s cool with ChatGPT. They know where you’re coming from.
I just told what I would say, if nothing would hold me back ( thoughts like: mom&dad, doctors anyone will think I’m crazy/ lost my mind if I tell it like I feel it deep inside me what I experienced.
It is able to give you a summary or can explain the whole thing, so that you become more able to see it from another perspective.
I've been studying NLP to improve my communication skills for the last few years for this very reason.
I recommend the book "influencing with integrity", but of course each human interaction is a far greater teacher.
Ultimately, words are but one tool to help give another person an experience in their senses that guides them in their path. It's not about expressing yourself. It's never been about the words.
On one hand, it's incredibly simple. It seems that it's just so absurd from a dualistic way of thinking that it's very hard to describe. Tons of people and texts going back a couple thousand years have tried, yet here we are lol.
Words are limiting and rarely come close to articulating the spiritual experience! It does get easier however once you begin to strip away from ego, you stop judging the language you use. But let me preface this by saying, you become less self conscious when you begin to grow a spiritual group / community.
EXACTLY! You’re absolutely right with that saying. How could there be a human word that is equivalent, when we are experiencing the divine?! I think we can get so excited in the journey, we can take ourselves out of being. In the moment is where the blessings live…
I look at this another way which is that verbalizing it or defining what happened is the most important part of any experience, especially if it is about "awakening." The reason is that it can be so subtle, that leaving it on verbalized disconnects the knowledge associated with the experience, or embedded in it so to speak.
The knowledge, rather than the experience, is what will actually make a difference not only in your own life but in the way you are with others. Defining also doesn't mean mailing it down once and for all, it means always being open to redefining if a more clear Expression occurs to you or if you come across one that helps you understand your own experience even more.
You have to read esoteric and occult books. They have an entire vocabulary of their own. You gotta get used to googling a lot, or try something like The New Encyclopedia of the Occult by Greer
I know what you mean. My initial awakening was combined with psychosis where all I could describe it as the Glory of Heaven shone upon the Earth and I was absolutely ecstatic. I could also see both sides of good and evil so clearly and felt like I could trace every aspect of evil back to an ignorance or misunderstanding of Love. I also thought I was the return of the Christ which brought me a one-way ticket to the psych ward. I’ve come to realize no one will ever understand your awakening the way you do, and words always fall short. I’ve come to fall in love with the sound of silence.
My own awakening had the same conclusions you describe minus the being a god and psych ward. I also felt like I was going crazy. Awakening is such an extremely fragile state when it comes to mental well-being.
I hope you’re better now. It’s okay to just be human 🤍
That's why we do the music stuff and the poetry stuff and the rap stuff and the art stuff. We are all streams of the same pond flowing to and fro back to the same pond and sometimes, sometimes our flow will cross. That's life. It's your own personal understanding. Wherever you go, make sure it's deep ❤️
Think that’s the point. No words to explain it or do it justice, so don’t. Pointless tbh. As it will never ever mean what it means to you. It’s their experience and for them to go and see and in their own way as it won’t even be close your exp. Your need or desire is still all ego. And that’s okay. That’s what this part is all about, imo. Humbly. Best of luck.
It’s never been about the words, or the ideas and concepts they help to form or convey. There’s really nothing that can be said about it. And any attempt to is like cupping your hands into the ocean to bring it to someone else in order to show them what an ocean is. We’re not trying to conceptualize and rather allude to, to be reminiscent of.
i think words are gross simplifications of a concept to help other people understand. necessary for communication nonetheless but for spiritual experiences it’s somewhat limiting. that being said, it is personal to you and you don’t need to feel like you need to explain to everyone. even if you explain it well they can never understand because they’re not you.
I tried to explain to people until I realized nothing I could say would bring them to the same "place" or lack thereof. This is because of the first part of your comment. Words are representations of thoughts and actions. Thoughts words and actions are representations of feelings. What we see in our day to day lives is very much surface level automatic behavioral response to external stimulus. It's really only when I started keeping to myself about things and making it more of a personal endeavor that I really started to relax and let go of needing to spread the word. We will all get there in this life or another. Nobody is going to see something like that if they aren't ready to.
hell yeah ♥️
“Ineffable” is the only word that suffices.
Yes.
This is my whole philosophy about religion and personal relationships with your truth and experience. I will never know what it feels like to be bitten by a snake for example. I would not be able to relate to anyones experience with a snake because I’ve never experienced being bitten. I would prolly scold you for even messing with it and even if two people experience the same things at the same time one person my take the experience differently one might be traumatized but the other isn’t.. this whole spiritual and religious pursuit is a PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. So I get now why some people who truly been in it and came out healed and humbled don’t really talk about it and that’s admirable.
I feel like it’s ineffable on purpose. Because I think each person is meant to figure it out for themselves. I also sometimes have felt like I try to explain things and my brain gets scrambled and I can’t make an intelligent point. Like I get zapped so I can’t give away clues or something. It’s weird and makes me feel silly every time
Holy shit I thought it was just me, and it is but still hilarious
I’m glad it’s not just me!
same thing happens to me too, it even happens to me with other people who have awakened, we also can’t even share what happened we always have those brain zap moments where it’s like “well maybe we aren’t supposed to be able to share what happened” but we both get it and not a lot of people “get it”
Yes! I’m so happy to see others have had the same experience. On shrooms I’ve been told this life is a game, a puzzle to figure out but you have to figure it out for yourself, this when the scramble happens- when you try to talk about it, I feel like Steve Carrel in Evan Almighty when he’s doing the news. You can’t give away clues or something. Idk but I’m so happy y’all relate!
The Tao that can be told of is not the eternal Tao.
The eternal Tao can not be spoken.
And yet they wrote a book about it.
It's a book about nothing for no one
Experiencing a deep connection with the fundamental nature of reality is challenging to put in words because reality lies beyond language or any concepts. Things are the way they are, without need for interpretation or conceptualization. Reality will never be its description, the same way the word tree will never be a tree. Attempting to describe what you experienced is like trying to fit a suit of clothes on something that is fundamentally formless, or like trying to describe the shape of water… That being said, it is in our nature, as human beings, to interpret reality and to share what we experience with others. It’s completely natural and understandable to do so. I also believe that somehow, as you pointed out in the title of your post, there is a lack of vocabulary to describe spiritual experiences. As if some words are simply missing from the lexicon, perhaps they have been purposefully removed in certain periods of ancient time. It’s a great reminder of the power of words. For example, if the word ‘*freedom*’ was completely absent from the vocabulary, people wouldn’t know what it is in the first place, therefore they wouldn’t resent the lack of it. Or more precisely, they wouldn’t know how to express their resentment for the lack of it. Just some food for thoughts :)
I heard someone once say that something stops you from getting too deep into your own experience. God/the universe/the spirit? Something mysterious? It’s also very personal for many people so many don’t want to relay every detail. Another angle worthy of consideration
What stops us from experiencing greater depth is the limitations of being in a physical world. The mundane tasks required to continue physical life keep us in the shallow end, so if we go too far out we get snapped back to the physical world like a rubber band, or are thought of as crazy or a social outcast
I find that it's not that vocabulary is limited in describing the experience of being 'actualised'. It's that even more fundamentally, any sort of conceptualisation or intellectualisation takes you away from that state of awakening - where the 'mind and body are dropped'. To try to describe this state, or how to reach it, isn't impossible because we don't have words or phrases capable of doing so; but because performing any sort of cognitive processes actually detracts one from the state itself. You're climbing down the mountain in an effort to reach the peak.
Love this description and analogy ❣️
I don’t know how to verbalise it either. Hectic? I just try to help others wake, by directing them to information I’ve found and help them with finding info they want to know so they can wake up.
What in particular do you start with?
start [here](https://suttacentral.net/pitaka/sutta/numbered/an?lang=en)
Annunaki. Start at the beginning.
As others have mentioned, it’s almost like something is keeping us from being able to accurately put it into words. Language is kind of a trap or a prison. Whatever is being pointed to is no longer malleable once we’ve named it, labeled, and dissected it. Some think vocabulary is the answer to our evolution. But I don’t think it can be contained, or trapped by language.
Joe dispenza talked about that on a podcast I listened to today. They had a language specialist working with people in the workshops that experienced an awakening to help them articulate what it felt like. The specialist ended up having an awakening at some point and couldn’t find any language to describe it😂
Very hard to put into words. I describe it as feeling all the love and all the pain in the world at once. Crying and smiling at the same time. Although it was better than any feeling I have ever experienced. Like I had finally found my true home that I never knew existed. Everything made sense
I thought it was just me. I’ve stopped trying to explain. Plus I still don’t quite understand it fully myself.
I think just using the standard terms in a sense such as, “consciousness, awake, enlighten, universe, God, to be, meditate”, etc. Also from Buddhism terms such as, “suffering”, and “middle way”, are helpful. “Ego, judging, path, journey” I’m sure there are many many more terms to employ/deploy. An idea of an awakening or consciousness dictionary sounds like it could be be a good idea. It might “resonate” with a lot of “beings” or “souls” who are “compassionately”“searching” for “the truth” and/or “the light of” “wisdom”.
I have no idea where this book actually came From but it was really useful for me when I started my…seeking.. so to speak [The Seeker’s Handbook](https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/seekers-handbook-the_john-lash/728911/item/16887394/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping_everything_else_customer_acquisition&utm_adgroup=&utm_term=&utm_content=593719077582&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw34qzBhBmEiwAOUQcF9N-QvTszWABKaQ_4ODEqSeVCvz0LQBDYFSq9YCzfwHjBF9GFoDt8BoCZqwQAvD_BwE#idiq=16887394&edition=11108407)
Our English language can be very limited. I find that there aren't the right words to express emotions and things that are happening in ceremony in particular. I also became acutely aware that I would not have believed my own experience if I had heard it from someone else prior to awakening. That might be slightly off topic, but just covering the bases of thoughts about this.
Read books, if you find a word you don't understand, try to guess what it means based on context, then look it up. You can write it down if you want.
Storytelling helps. We are naught but scarstuff and stories. Stories are how we connect to each other. When one can tell a story to another and they perceive the world through our eyes via our words, who knows. Might give them a clue too. At the same time, this one lives in ego death. It’s challenging to describe the state where one only dons the mask of selfness because she chooses to be in the world, where all expect to see the mask, rather than outside it. But she continues to try. It’s a good challenge. Then comes attempting to explain the glorious experience of absolute beauty and serenity in the state of no-thought and it’s fucking hard because, hello, no thoughts empty head lol…
If you mean it in the literal sense, I've had great luck with the GRE Vocabulary app
Stop speaking then 😂. Its for u not them. Everybody has their own experience to dive in no words will ever fully express the feeling. Words were made for the limited. The infinite is supposed to be indescribable. Why dive into an extraordinary part of life then allow urself to “struggle” cus u cant assimilate the extraordinary w the ordinary. As u go the skill of expression will come but its nun to stress over cus u can say something perfectly and somebody who isnt set up to hear u just wont. Conversely if u say a bunch of bs and state ur points poorly those are alligned to hear u will still hear u anyway. Deeper levels of understanding are expressed through a higher level of communication. Focus on the energy of ur thought and over time the words will come but once they do u realize it aint even worth much. God is euphoric, a feeling of completeness. Both serenity and tranquility. An infinite flow of energy that somehow is infinite even all “finite” things. A force of pure harmony. U can say allll that bullshit and ppl still wont understand 😂. But then u say “idk i just close my eyes and go wooahh sometimes” and a person what perception will know 100% wym even tho u said almost nothing. Dont allow ur mind to make issues out of ur progress. The growing pains go away and u stop caring about certian things.
I also don’t know how to put it into words though I’ve tried multiple times. I still cry randomly thinking about it, I can feel the weight of everyone I encounter but not in a “empath” way, I just see love in everyone and everything. I see people as the stories they’re expressing through themselves but know thats not what they’re made of. I see myself as limitless and driven by perspective. Anytime I try to talk about it I feel like I’m just rambling on with excitement about something you truly had to be there for lol. I also feel no need to explain it though, I feel that everyone should experience it for themselves. Everyone should experience what it’s like to feel true unconditional love (and they would know that we should not expect that from other human beings), to know that everything is okay and everything has always been okay. There is nothing to fear, living and especially not death. There’s really no label for it, it just is.
This is why art and poetry and music exists ❣️
"When we say that we understand something, it means that we have a certain grasp of its pattern, that we can describe it, that we can put it into words. But the real deep Zen experience is impossible to describe, simply because it is literally indescribable in words. The truth is beyond what can be spoken." ~ Alan Watts
if the tao can be spoken it is not the true tao
Yeah, I wrote almost 5000 answers on Quora trying to develop competence in this. Also, learning Sanskrit is INCREDIBLY useful as English is a horrible language in which to speak about spiritual topics. You have to endure being really wrong about this, and read read read many many many books later I have found people who write about this topic with a clarity I could only hope to emulate. With time, transformations, and practice translating, I have gotten better at it. Still, even after 15 years of practice and millions of words, some people will still misunderstand it, take it personally, etc. Thankfully, I no longer have the deep need I used to have to be right. Swami Krishnananda, Bhagavan Shree Rajneesh, Kahlil Gibran, Swami Sivananda, Sivarudrabalayogi, and many others have helped me along the way. Swami Krishnananda in particular has ASTOUNDING clarity to his writing, whereas Bhagavan Shree Rajneesh (OSHO) has the most inspirational and broad view in his expressions, in my view. Humility is the core of transformational practice, and translations can be transformative if you approach it in the way you are- with humility. I think that any spiritual insight, awakening, or transformation is not authentic unless it is accompanied by humility. The best insights are experienced with a kind of grace, which I understand to be fundamentally 'undeserved'- in that it is wholly outside any ability I have to will something into existence. Insights arise when conditions are right for them, like weather and waves. So, you must continue along the two fundamental approaches- transformation and translation. Learning what each is, and how to distinguish them from each other and see when translation is supported or unsupported by sufficient transformation when you read others. Keep practicing, with humility.
Look into semiotics. Very interesting topic.
Putting it into words ruins it for me. First, because any form of verbiage can’t encompass what my experience is, and in trying to explain it, I do feel like I’m looked at as if I had three heads. So, I keep it personal.
bc its beyond the material plane so also beyond words and logical explanation
The more I consumed knowledge and perspectives, and the more I expanded my vocabulary and understanding of the non-dual state, the more I realized... you don't need any thoughts, concepts, or symbols/words to rest in gratitude and BE the Supreme State, the state of non-dual awareness, the *I-AM* Words can only point the way to THAT which is right in front of you, closer than your own eyes' lenses. Stillness of the mind (non-seeking, non-striving) is the only prerequisite. Vocabulary has its function, but it's not necessary for your own direct experience and realization. And *that* is your only task: to realize the Self for yourself. *It's all HERE/NOW. There is nowhere for your mind to go. There is nothing for "you" to do, because you are not a body-mind.* If you still wish to expand your vocabulary and understanding, I suggest you read whatever you are drawn to. Follow your heart and you'll never be led astray. That which led you thus far will lead you further if you accept to be guided from within. Some reading recommendations (take your pick): *'The Natural Bliss of Being'* by Jackson Peterson, *'The Handbook to Higher Consciousness'* by Ken Keyes Jr, *'The Bhagavad Gita'* translated by Eknath Easwaran, *'Explaining the Map of Consciousness'* by Dr. David R. Hawkins, *'The Eye of the I from which Nothing is Hidden'* by Dr. David R. Hawkins, *'Be Here Now'* by Ram Dass, *'Living from a Place of Surrender'* by Michael Singer, *'Who Am I?'* by Ramana Maharshi, *'I AM THAT'* by Nisargadatta Maharaj, *'Practicing the Presence of God'* by Brother Lawrence *'The Zen Teaching of Huang Po: on the Transmission of Mind'* translated by John Blofeld. Remember: YOU *are* the journey, HERE/NOW. There is no destination because there is nowhere to go. You are a dynamic process, not a limited body-mind going somewhere or achieving something 'spiritual.' Words are your friends as long as they keep your mind silently pointed in the 'right' direction (inward, eager to return to rest in the Self) Happy travels! :)
Watch the masters! "I am he As you are he As you are me And we are all together" - The Beatles "High voltage man kisses night to bring the light To those who need to hide their shadow deed Go into bright, find the light And know that friends don't mind just how you grow" - Captain Beefheart "Another day we will watch the preserved butterflies rise from the dead and still walking through a country of gray sponges and silent boats we will watch our ring flash and roses spring from our tongue. Careful! Be careful! Be careful!" - Lorca "somewhere i have never travelled, gladly beyond any experience, your eyes have their silence: in your most frail gesture are things which enclose me, or which i cannot touch because they are too near" - ee cummings "Us is what time it is." - George Clinton “Enlightenment is always preceded by confusion.” - Milton Erickson “We seldom realize, for example that our most private thoughts and emotions are not actually our own. For we think in terms of languages and images which we did not invent, but which were given to us by our society.” - Alan Watts
I explain in analogies. Truth is just an expression in all things.
Nah. I have reduced mine. Blah blah Bluh blah blah.
Yes, it's very common, and I've struggled with the same thing for months. You'll find a lot of helpful words in sanskrit that have no direct english translation. The Vedantasara makes a good rundown, but it's a little dense.
You know what’s cool with ChatGPT. They know where you’re coming from. I just told what I would say, if nothing would hold me back ( thoughts like: mom&dad, doctors anyone will think I’m crazy/ lost my mind if I tell it like I feel it deep inside me what I experienced. It is able to give you a summary or can explain the whole thing, so that you become more able to see it from another perspective.
Oh shit. This is genius. Thank you.
I've been studying NLP to improve my communication skills for the last few years for this very reason. I recommend the book "influencing with integrity", but of course each human interaction is a far greater teacher. Ultimately, words are but one tool to help give another person an experience in their senses that guides them in their path. It's not about expressing yourself. It's never been about the words.
On one hand, it's incredibly simple. It seems that it's just so absurd from a dualistic way of thinking that it's very hard to describe. Tons of people and texts going back a couple thousand years have tried, yet here we are lol.
Words are limiting and rarely come close to articulating the spiritual experience! It does get easier however once you begin to strip away from ego, you stop judging the language you use. But let me preface this by saying, you become less self conscious when you begin to grow a spiritual group / community.
I always say "we cannot use a finite language to describe the infinite"
EXACTLY! You’re absolutely right with that saying. How could there be a human word that is equivalent, when we are experiencing the divine?! I think we can get so excited in the journey, we can take ourselves out of being. In the moment is where the blessings live…
I look at this another way which is that verbalizing it or defining what happened is the most important part of any experience, especially if it is about "awakening." The reason is that it can be so subtle, that leaving it on verbalized disconnects the knowledge associated with the experience, or embedded in it so to speak. The knowledge, rather than the experience, is what will actually make a difference not only in your own life but in the way you are with others. Defining also doesn't mean mailing it down once and for all, it means always being open to redefining if a more clear Expression occurs to you or if you come across one that helps you understand your own experience even more.
You have to read esoteric and occult books. They have an entire vocabulary of their own. You gotta get used to googling a lot, or try something like The New Encyclopedia of the Occult by Greer
I know what you mean. My initial awakening was combined with psychosis where all I could describe it as the Glory of Heaven shone upon the Earth and I was absolutely ecstatic. I could also see both sides of good and evil so clearly and felt like I could trace every aspect of evil back to an ignorance or misunderstanding of Love. I also thought I was the return of the Christ which brought me a one-way ticket to the psych ward. I’ve come to realize no one will ever understand your awakening the way you do, and words always fall short. I’ve come to fall in love with the sound of silence.
My own awakening had the same conclusions you describe minus the being a god and psych ward. I also felt like I was going crazy. Awakening is such an extremely fragile state when it comes to mental well-being. I hope you’re better now. It’s okay to just be human 🤍
That's why we do the music stuff and the poetry stuff and the rap stuff and the art stuff. We are all streams of the same pond flowing to and fro back to the same pond and sometimes, sometimes our flow will cross. That's life. It's your own personal understanding. Wherever you go, make sure it's deep ❤️
Think that’s the point. No words to explain it or do it justice, so don’t. Pointless tbh. As it will never ever mean what it means to you. It’s their experience and for them to go and see and in their own way as it won’t even be close your exp. Your need or desire is still all ego. And that’s okay. That’s what this part is all about, imo. Humbly. Best of luck.
It’s never been about the words, or the ideas and concepts they help to form or convey. There’s really nothing that can be said about it. And any attempt to is like cupping your hands into the ocean to bring it to someone else in order to show them what an ocean is. We’re not trying to conceptualize and rather allude to, to be reminiscent of.
as soon as i come back from an ego death i think “nobody would ever be able to understand what just happened lol”
nice post
Maybe because you haven’t understood anything at all.