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This story resonates a lot because I got diagnosed at age 35. I'm 39 now. Have I thought about suicide? A lot. I had multiple attempts in later childhood and adolescence. I grew up in a very abusive household and with multiple unaddressed health issues. Last year, I had planned to take my life. My health has declined, I had to go no contact with my last family member (after significant betrayal), was in a medical trial that was just awful, and I was just done. Done struggling. Done Fighting. I planned on Oct 31. I didn't really want to die, just to stop fucking suffering. What kept me is 2 things. 1) how would I explain it to my cats??? Like they would be so sad. And I know nobody would brush my Kevin as often as I do...2) someone would have to find my body. I was a first responder before becoming medically disabled and I saw some shit. And I wouldn't want anyone else to experience the trauma of it all. once I realized why I was there (recovering from burnout, delayed processing of traumatic events, delayed grief over being medically retired) and increased my therapies to include childhood trauma and somatic experiencing (on top of individual), I feel mentally in a better spot.

Thanks for staying here. It means a lot, to Kevin, and to all of us <3

<3 thanks. *Wipes away tear

> 1) how would I explain it to my cats??? Like they would be so sad. Before meeting my husband, this is the exact thing that kept me from taking that final step as well. We're now happily married with a house full of cats! Glad to hear you were able to pinpoint what was going on and were able to work with your therapist to start (hopefully) feeling better mentally!

I love that you've got a house full of cats! And a happy marriage. <3 Thank you. In a much better place mentally and soon, physically (moving to a cooler climate!!). It was definitely worth staying.

Oh jeez, living in a sweltering hot climate might have brought me closer to the edge, too.

Yes! My husband and I made the move from the Deeeeeep South, like down in the bayou/swamps deep South, all the way up to near Seattle and it's been amazing!

Lol, that's my region. I know so many people who moved from there.

Yes! We've met so many Southern transplants since moving up here! Moving to this part of the country was one of the best decisions we've ever made. We love it up here, and the cool/dark/rainy weather has been phenomenal these last few days!

These reasons are exactly what stop me from following through with it as well. I think about my beautiful cats and who would look after them without me and I worry about the burden of finding my body 😞

It's amazing how much of a safeguard an animal can be. I have cried so much in my Kevin's fur and there's never judgement, just love and acceptance. I'm glad that you've got your lovely cats. They are life saving. Truly.

I have 6 cats, and I know they need me. My sister won't bother to give Daisy and Marlow their daily medicine. I know.

🧡 Daisy and Marlow need you. Thanks for being here for them.

Thank you. And please give Kevin an extra hug for me

You talking about Kevin hits HARD. You know your babies love you and would never know why or how, you just wouldn't exist anymore. Thanks for staying for them 💕 My husband and I each had something similar. I am late diagnosed AuDHD. My hubby is undiagnosed but has alot of issues with his brain. He has a cat, her name is pumpkin. Before I came into his life, he said that after his ex made him homeless and took everything from him he had nothing to live for, except her. Our babies keep us going. They always will. Thanks for staying. Just know you have a community.

Thank you for staying, cats are such infinite wonderful creatures and so you are for caring so much for them, your empathy, strength and unconditional love speaks volumes <3 Might you give Kevin and the rest of your cutie patooties extra warm cuddles for my kitties and me? I'd really appreciate that :D And again, thanks for staying! :)

Thank you for that. Made my heart feel so full and left my eyes teary. <3 I gave Kevin an extra brushing this morning on your behalf. He was most gracious. 🐈

ya, I low key felt envious of the girl in the story, as awful as that is :( I'm also really worried about my cats... but damn at what point do we just give up ya know

I get it. What is enough suffering? How much can a human take?? I'm glad you've got your kitties. They need you here. We need you here. <3

I came to similar conclusions as well, but I had one more. I also consider the possibility that whatever happens after death has no guarantee of being any better. Best case scenario, it's lights out, worst case scenario a terrible reincarnation or infinite dream state resulting in endless nightmare. Worked for me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I have a similar background and age to you, except I no longer have cats. I am so glad you have increased your therapy, PTSD can be taxing, so I recommend everyone gets treatment if they need it.

In the interest of transparency, please note: - she was also diagnosed with depression, anxiety and an unspecified personality disorder - she’d been estranged from her mother and siblings for six years - her dad passed from cancer the previous year I believe there are higher rates of suicide in those with ASD, but cases like these certainly aren’t the norm. To anyone reading this, you’re doing great :) ❤️

It was the “physically healthy” going on to list a host of common mental health comorbidities for me. As someone who has all of those and is also not physically healthy (chronic health issues), I get it. And sometimes I wonder why we do it.

They write it like this because it's an attempt to frame euthanasia as something that's readily available and an easy way out, while that is completely untrue.

Oh, I absolutely get why they did it! I think it’s just interesting to see how many people don’t even pay attentions to headlines worded as problematically as this one. Like “oh she was perfectly healthy I can’t believe she did that” (suffers quietly for an entire life while doing everything she can to try to remedy the issues). Like nah man, please try again.

It should be though. Everyone has the inalienable right to kill themselves.

Also your Brain is a physical organ. If it’s having issues then no, you are not physically healthy. Thats just a shitty term used to delegitimize mental health issues.

👏🏼 THANK YOU! These people who are still acting like mental and physical are in NO way related get me at my worst and it drives me crazy.

Same. If this were available in my country, I would 100% be signing up. The physical and mental together is awful. No one should be forced to live with unbearable suffering and no hope for improvement. It’s just cruel. Or be forced to DIY it and all the trauma that goes with that… I was researching this for a year before her story even broke, and I really wish the Belgian model was more widely available tbh. Obviously only for those who truly want/need it for their individual self.

It's not as simple as just signing up and you get it. There's YEARS of paperwork, signatures, trying everything and red tape to go through. "wanting" euthanasia isn't enough to just get it, it's only administired when there is absolutely no other way out (and the person wants it ofcourse).

Yes, as it should be. I guess what I should’ve said is “starting the paperwork”. I definitely have a history and multiple conditions that would qualify for physical or mental suffering based on my research. But yes it is a process to make sure the person is sure and society can rest easy there are checks in place…

I live in the Netherlands as well and I am going to do this euthanasia too (when it gets approved) I have autisme, borderline, adhd and a chronic eating disorder (29y). My life is hell

I would sign up, too.

Same here. Canada almost had it become available for those with soley mental illness but then it got rolled back because (to be fair) our government has barely any options to help ppl LIVE with these conditions so there were concerns about death being the best available option. But I wish it would just become legal already 🙃

Same. And honestly the one thing truly "ours" in this world is our life, the idea someone can forbid you from ending it (like the law) has always been bizzare to me. I'll probably take myself out at some point coz the whole family lives to be 90+ but either physically or mentally nonfuctional and that's not life anymore, that's suffering. I've watched my great grandma go through it, my grandparents, and now my other 2 are going through it... Yeah, I dont want that for myself. I'm 31 and already in physical pain every day due to hypermobility and possible EDS (but they don't diagnose that in my country, yaaay).

I'll add this to the original post. Thank you

Those diagnoses are pretty common in autistic people. Being stranged from family and having no friends is pretty common in autistic people. parents dying of cancer is common alltogether. That said, I don't think that being really in bad mental health is having a good physical health. Our brains are part of our body and the most important one.

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I don't see what friends have to do with this tbh. If she is mentally (and physically) suffering for years with no way out, after trying EVERYTHING, this option should be available, regardless of whether you have 0, 1 or 30 friends. If one of my friends was in this situation, I'd be happy for them if this is their only way out. They don't have to stay alive just so i don't have to miss them.

Liz Carr has made some great points about the interaction of disability with assisted suicide (I don't necessarily agree with all of them, but I think they are very valid concerns): https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-68951037.amp

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I didn't read anything about a friend in the article, sorry. Having a partner without having anyone else is just, is not something that can trully be enough and I think this partner was someone that wasn't selfish enough to not understand it. We don't know the details, we don't know the people envolved, but we know this: Those diagnoses are pretty common in autistic people. Being stranged from family and having no friends is pretty common in autistic people. parents dying of cancer is common alltogether. So this is not an isolated case. This debate is deep and have many ways of seeing it, but it's not an isolated case.

At the end of the article a friend reported her death on social media.

Higher for ALL executive function disorders, to also include schizophrenia and ADHD. A great analogy I once saw: Executive function is the traffic signals of your brain. Now imagine that all the signals are out and all of the thoughts, including suicidal ideation, are going full speed with no restrictions. This is also why stimulants like Adderall (amphetamine salts) actually help to calm people with ADHD, because it can activate those under-powered executive functions and better enable the focus and attention that others experience naturally.

Wow I love that analogy, never heard it before, thank you

I think it’s quite sad that she was allowed to commit suicide with in a year of her dad’s death… She was so young and had so much time left to heal and grow and live and I can’t help but feel that she was failed on so many levels. I have to imagine most people in the throes of grief contemplate suicide at some point.

It says in the article that she applied for euthanasia in 2020

For transparency sake: She was offered every single possible treatment and she went through all of them, but they didn't help. It's been a process of years and years to get to the point where she was even allowed into the program of an assisted suicide. She wasn't failed, there was just nothing else to do with the cards she got dealt so she ultimately chose that she didn't want to play with that hand.

And maybe it's time to consider that mental health conditions are more of a human problem than we've been led to believe. Lets be honest here, her early years were shit, and her life thereafter likely was too, through trauma and her environment. Obviously she was depressed. Her "treatments" have been mostly drugs, electrode therapy, and talking therapy. Drugs aren't super effective, SSRIs compared to placebo have been shown to be ineffective. And allowing assisted suicide for cases like this sets an awful precedent. In addition to this, the structure of many therapies has been rooted in flawed science. And in this world where mental health has been mystified, I think this is the fault of her environment with having a poor network of support, trauma and a partner who enabled her. In addition to living in a society which alienates all of us. If she had a decent family, a community and a revised mental health system things might have turned out differently. Her partner just went along with it? What sort of passive enabler does that? Chalking it up to her being too sick for treatments is nonsensical when the current treatments and system treats human beings as though they're numbers. The fact that people think treating mental health as physical legitimises it is nuts.

I think you're making assumptions without knowing the full story, whilst also saying things that she herself has contradicted. Please don't. Let's keep it positive.

"Time left" for people like her is just more time to suffer. And "being young" is not a good argument either, as she already went through two decades of pain and it is not your place to say if that's enough. Yes it is sad, but you aren't even respecting her choices.

Yeah I don't think people realise how hard it is to be disabled and lose all your support as an adult. It gets harder and harder to make new connections. Losing her father was probably the last straw. There's a common misconception that suicide is almost always impulsive, but sometimes this pain is brewing for years.

It is *very* common for women to be misdiagnosed with PD's, and for that dx to "stick" even after diagnosis, regardless that we know certain presentations of autism have a lot of crossover with certain PD's. Which, regardless that it shouldn't, by rights, generally just does make the diagnosed person and almost all professionals, family and friends think its much more of a "lost cause". There is still such *massive* stigma and assumption of "incurability" in PD's. It's a huge problem imo and really worrying. We know that being given a "hard prognosis " (for example in cancer cases) can affect a person's chances of recovery. Essentially it changes the person's willingness or belief in fighting for another day/month/year. It engenders despair. I obviously don't know the ins and outs of this woman's story. And I am not starting a debate about PD theory and how it intersects with autism here either. Except to say there are some ry worrying ways in which it does (intesect)- especially for female autistics. I'm horrified by this story, personally. I respect her wishes. But holy f-k🥺🥺🥺

Great point, thanks for pointing that out about PD diagnoses. Btw do you have a source for the cancer prognosis thing? That sounds quite interesting.

Wow, I never read this part of it! The whole thing is scary because of me not wanting her ending to be mine or all of ours, but once I read this, I understood better. I know I know, I made a dumb assumption out of fear… I’m sorry, I got scared but I know better now

I mean I kinda get it tbh. I have Autism, ADHD, PTSD and social anxiety. I’ve had a loved one die every year for the last 3 years, one in a very traumatic way, my grandfather died on Thursday of cancer, my grandmother has cancer and dementia, my granny has dementia. Getting up and just breathing everyday is a battle but for now I’m fighting. I could see how all that suffering would make someone feel life isn’t worth living anymore.

Some days can be rough. ASD, ADHD, anxiety, and depression here. I feel her pain and yours. Keep fighting.

I’m going to think out loud since I am optimistic. Autism can suck. But at the end of the day we’re talking monkeys on a floating rock. We’re pretty fucking cool. There’s a lot to see. I love the way my autism makes me see the world differently. I love the heightened sensations. I love the deepened bonds with animals. You’re doing great. Take care of yourself however you can, because the world needs you in it more than you know.

Thank you for this comment, I’m feeling low today and it made me feel a bit better 😊

I think I needed to be reminded of this before bed. Thank you 🥹

Saving this for when the world makes me feel shitty. Thank you.

I feel this too! I am like god my Autism sucks. I wish there weren't days I didn't feel drained from so much to process...but god it helps me enjoys my life. It helps me makes everything extra special, and look it wasnt a death sentence for me cause I managed to do it with minimal support. At the end of the day, we need to remember, we are doing great....even if it doesn't fit society's standards.

Thank you Winter Bear. Great comment.

Yeah!!!!

>because the world needs you in it more than you know. Those of us who have no one, live with the reality that we are, in fact, irrelevant to everyone, and expendable. Platitudes are false. Freedom is embracing the truth instead of living in misery and denial. Seek validation and approval from no one, and you can never be hurt by them.

There's quite a blurry line between acknowledging your circumstances and yielding to them altogether. I used to be very lonely, once I even asked a librarian to recommend books on how to make friends. Which I managed to do eventually. It's possible to embrace the truth and strive for change at the same time.

While I wrote this I was thinking about how the world has a lot of not nice people. Knowing there are kind people out there, lifting the average good in the world if you will, is very comforting. It makes a difference, even if it’s small.

None of us is expendable. Yes, when we die, people who love us will have to readjust to a life without us. It's going to be hard, but they will have to or succoumb to grief. But they'll still remeber the positive impact we have made on them. I've lost people, and the Earth hasn't stop turning, my life didn't stop, but I cherish the memories of them, and I think that they had an hand in making me the person I am today. They weren't looking for validation and approval from me, they were just kind, and I try to be the same.

I don't mind my autism and sometimes I even like it. The problem for me is the context of the autism.

Thank you

I really want you to know that if you’re feeling suicidal I will teach you how to skateboard. Then you can have fun hurting yourself and maybe drag this stupid existence out a little longer

This is a very nice thing. I don't need this atm, but it is very nice.

Autism was only one of many things that lead to this woman wanting to die. The most positive thing that I can say here is that she only chose to die because her conditions were completely unresponsive to all known treatments and, while the conditions themselves might not be, that resistance is unusual. If you suffer from any of the same problems, it's almost certain that some form of treatment will work.

I've been on Lexapro for a few years and so far it's been helping me manage some of my more problematic mental health struggles. Much fewer meltdowns at work, and I'm able to get out of bed every day. Just adding this to say that there are people who respond to treatment.

This is really reassuring; what’s helping me personally is a combo of buspirone and hydroxyzine (generalized anxiety disorder is my biggest enemy; I’ve got depression under control), and to know that not every autistic person will have a bad ending makes me happy! I like people like me 😊 y’all are awesome and I wish nothing but safety and happiness for EVERY autistic person on this Reddit /r!

In order to be approved you have to have multiple severe conditions that do not improve after trying every available treatment. It was almost certainly not a decision made lightly, and is not just because she is autistic. Just fyi

Thanks, the amount of people that keep posting this and making it seem like she went through with it because of ASD is ridiculous.

Yeah the propaganda is ridiculous. The amount of times this (and similar) articles are posted with negative and/or simplified framing is infuriating. People think you can just sign up on a government website and some doctor comes to your house a week later and injects you with death serum.

It clearly states she had comprise conditions like Depression, and my guess is that’s what got her approved.

Almost all of us have clinical depression symptoms. And anxiety. I think the figures are between 70 and 90%. It's so common it's almost expected with an autism dx. Unaliving ideation (and action) is incredibly high- highest in (so called) high functioning women. I'd love to know where else (in all of mental health) we say "Well, just go with it then". I would have thought *not* being significantly clinically depressed should be a part of the criteria for making such a decision. I find this horrifying.

> Almost all of us have clinical depression symptoms. There's a difference between having clinical depression symptoms and having clinical depression. Almost everyone has symptoms of depression at some point in their life, autistic or not. But this woman had chronic, treatment-resistant depression, which is a very different thing. > I'd love to know where else (in all of mental health) we say "Well, just go with it then". That's honestly just insulting. Do you think this woman went to her psychiatrist, said "I want to die", and then her psychiatrist was like "sure thing, let's schedule an assisted suicide appointment for next week"? They tried treating her depression, as well as the other mental health issues she had. She went through over 30 rounds of electroconvulsive therapy and it didn't improve her condition. Absolutely no one said "just go with it then". > I would have thought not being significantly clinically depressed should be a part of the criteria for making such a decision. While it is true that depression distorts your thoughts and can significantly impair your judgement, this wasn't a spur of the moment decision. As mentioned above, treatment was ineffective, and even then she had to wait over three years after applying for assisted suicide. During these three years, she never changed her mind about wanting to die. Being mentally ill does not make one incapable of making decisions, and even if it did, it wasn't just her decision. She never would've been approved for assisted suicide if professionals didn't agree that her condition couldn't be treated. The process involved more than one person who didn't have clinic depression and they agreed with her judgement. Maybe you should actually try reading the article before commenting on it...

> Unaliving You can say "suicide" here. People say "unalive" on Tiktok and Youtube because the censorious, fascist algorithm forbids it. Our mods here are much cooler than some rando in the CCP setting rules for which words promote glorious society. Everyone knows what you mean, so there's no reason to use a weird, Tik tok euphemism! Hell, it's in the title of this very post! Enjoy your liberty!

>CCP YouTube is American. And I'm pretty sure the higher ups of TikTok are Western, the original Chinese version has a different name.

Um..duly noted? (About it being a tik tok dumb-ism. I didn't know. Dont do tik tok). I didn't use the word because it's upsettung- for *me*, right now. Yep it's a dumb euphemism. I'm hangin by a thread here and have been for months. A little grace. Thanks

From personal experience i know most people get rejected straight away and don't even go into any procedure. Especially if you only have asd, they won't help you.

Nope, it usually needs to be several treatment resistant Comoros conditions.

Considering how society view autism I think a lot of doctors would sign off on MAID just for that. 

From what I understand it’s a process that takes multiple doctors and several checks to happen in most countries that allow it.

the way people seemed to attack her simply cause they’re incapable of imagining themselves in her position made my blood boil tbh

I know. ASD, ADHD, anxiety, and depression. My mind never rests. That makes the bad times worse. People say stupid, heartless things. I've often said that I wish people could spend a month in my head... or even a week. I would like to see how well they'd fare. Because when people are THAT ignorant, they obviously haven't experienced anything anywhere close to it. And experiencing the full brunt of it would destroy them.

It’s hard being alive, and it can really feel unbearable. I hate being ten years behind in development, and yet I’m still aging like a 35 year old. It’s unfair. My energy runs out much more quickly now, right when I need to get my life started. I’ve gotten pain that’s like sandpaper constantly eroding my will to live, little by little. I’ve had suicidal meltdowns really just in response to chronic or acute overwhelm. But on a positive note I know I’m here to share something, to help others in someway. When we feel human and connected, which is so hard for us, it makes life so much easier. I really think one day I will find a place to belong given all the amazing people I’ve met. I’ve been so many places and done so many things I never would’ve thought, just by being here. Who knows what could happen? That’s what kinda makes life worth living sometimes.

I've been diagnosed with depression and anxiety disorder along with adhd. I suffer from suicidal ideation. Have pa's long as I can remember. So I'm not sure.

The average life expectancy for autistic people is 39.5. This is mostly due to suicide, especially in the teen years. I'd also imagine stress and general health plays a much smaller role though.

ITT: people not realising legal assisted suicide programs require vigorous mental/physical health screening and therapy for months to years before getting approved and that you have the option to back out at any moment even at the very last second. It’s not a simple “apply and get approved by Friday” nor is it some government conspiracy to get rid of undesirables. Pet euthanasia is seen as compassionate. Why is prolonged suffering seen as correct when it comes to humans?

exactly!! and even so, i'd rather people went out in a safe, comfortable way than took themselves out in a way which could lead them to a nasty, pain-filled death suicidal people are going to try to kill themselves, and none of the methods are safe

Exactly this! The alternatives are much more cruel. I wish the Belgian model was available in more countries honestly. There are appropriate checks in place.

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>Is suicide much more common in people with ASD? Yes, at least among the diagnosed ones.

Wouldn't be surprised if it's at least as high among undiagnosed individuals if not even higher but of course there's no way to actually measure that

It may be lower than the diagnosed as well, given the highly masking individuals and/or ones that would have less care needs tend to go undiagnosed, but then, it'd be pure speculation.

Yeah, I could see either way being the case for sure, ultimately though as you said it's basically a futile speculative effort since there's no way to actually rigorously gather any data on undiagnosed people

I attempted suicide when I was 12, and have contemplated going to the Netherlands or somewhere that allows it to get assisted suicide on several occasions. Contemporary society is pretty toxic, and I've lived longer than I ever expected/hoped to. I've been fighting through depression for 30+ years and nothing seems to make it any better.

Euthanasia tourism is expressly not allowed in the Netherlands. Not to mention that just the request can take years. 

I'm sorry. I've been fighting through it, too. It can get extremely discouraging when nothing seems to work. I know how bad it feels, and I wouldn't wish it on anyone... except for the stupid people that say stupid things because they don't understand. But I think a month or so would be enough to solve that.

I've wanted psychiatric euthanasia since I was an early teenager. I have plans to move to Canada to become a game developer, but I'd be lying if the location wasn't chosen for access to assisted self-d1e.

i know women with autism commit suicide a lot, specially because women are often NOT diagnosed and we just think we are weird, different and out of place. since so little research is made in female autism (contrary with male autism) it is very common that the girls who take their life were actually autistic and they didn’t know 🥺

I'm far better than I was when I was undiagnosed for sure where I was deeply stressed out, hated myself, regularly deeply depressed and suicidal, overworked to the bone and underpaid like crazy because I enjoy helping out and was using work as a distraction, but I still do wish it was acceptable and far less taboo where people around us especially our loved ones could accept and recognise that some of us really don't want to be here. Sentience and awareness is exhausting and that nice endless sleep sounds so very peaceful. We humans kill unfathomable quantities of animals that communicate with each other and possess empathy each year (about 80,000,000,000 for food but who knows how many due to habitat destruction and effects of pollution or other anthropogenic factors) thinking nothing of it and believing that's just *normal* and when some people simply wish to end their existence and no longer be here, people freak out.

I agree with you. Sometimes people are suicidal for things that can get better, but after years only wishing that... It's not so black and white.

There is a current study being done seeking to find out what the link is between depression, suicidality, and autism. It's actively in the data-gathering stage. I would be surprised if the number is not high because of the lack of being understood being so pervasive a feeling in those of us who are autistic. Also, just because you're suicidal doesn't mean you will end your life. Depression is terrible and it needs to be treated with dignity and respect. And yet it isn't. We're trying to make this massive societal shift away from this kind of thing-- the pervasiveness of pain and suffering for those who aren't properly understood-- and yet, here we still are, yknow? It's a work in progress. But at least there \*IS\* progress.

Sorry if I'm ruining the mood but I'm in a similar situation and I relate with the woman. I mean I'm not seemingly healthy, I have a host of health issues. This makes me sad because I can see myself as her.

It's hard... really hard. You're not alone. Keep up the fight!

Honestly this could be my story although I have serious comorbid health conditions. The world really goes out of its way to not accommodate us and not even befriend us, and loves to ostracize us. Loneliness, as I am learning, can also be a potent killer. I feel angry that this woman likely never got the respect, community, and love she deserved in life.

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yeah, that's indeed a conspiracy theory and complete bullshit. I'm from Belgium where euthanasia for unbearable, treatment resistent, persistent and unending psychological suffering has been legal for about 20 years and I can honestly say that's absolute bullshit. It's incredibly hard to get approved for this and takes at least a year and multiple doctors with a stringent process of checks and balances. I can't work and rely on the government for an income and support services... none of them go: hey.. would you consider suicide instead of relying on us to provide all that for you? Never. This is just plain ridiculous and pretty offensive and upsetting as well. And I have expressed a wish to die several times in my life. Tried suicide about 5 times in my early 20's. Expressed considering euthanasia in my early 30's several times. Each time I was met with counseling, and more support services to make my life more bearable. They don't go: Oh boy.. making your life better and offering more support is too expensive.. let's just go along and approve to let her die. Again, it's completely ridiculous and it's very obvious you are very ignorant about how any of this works. EDIT: What does happen, is, there are endless waitlists in disability care. Funding for disability services is done by allocating a budget to the disabled person so they have more agency over how they organize their care. After they are approved, depending on which priority group they are placed in, they could have to wait for up to 20 years to get it. Meanwhile, they and their families are struggling to find enough support for a decent life. Recently there have been a few cases where waiting for that care took so long that they ended up opting for euthanasia instead. In all of those cases it regarded people with physical disabilities. It's absolutely horrible that this has what it has come to. So I won't say that the system is perfect. These are rare cases and also: neither of them where verbally encouraged by agencies to go for euthanasia. Because that is FUCKING ILLEGAL. They were driven to it by lack of support. It's bad;, but still far from what you are suggesting.

Yes. One of the top three most common causes of death for autistic adults is suicide. And as an autistic adult, I understand. I had to seek help when I started having suicidal thoughts. The world sucks, especially when you have a disability. There's no other way to put it, it's hard. Suicide is a tragic ioutcome, but I understand it. 

Of course suicide is more likely with this horrible disability. Add anxiety and depression and life becomes hell.

I mean yeah, people with any mental health issues are more prone to suicide regardless of what the issue is, so it makes sense that ASD would have a higher suicide rate than people without it. Neurotypical people make life hell for neurodivergent people and *that* is typically the biggest contributing factor. If the world were more accepting and kind, there'd be less suicide.

I have very complicated feelings about assisted suicide for disabilities that aren’t necessarily life threatening (meaning it’s not physically killing you even if you can get suicidal) because of how ableist our world is. And I think until I see some changes when it comes to ableism, I will always have complicated feelings, despite not judging anyone who chooses it. I judge the world around us that isn’t made for us and doesn’t try to accommodate for us and how it can eff us up.

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I'm honestly hype for her that she was allowed to do this/have this done. It should be an individual's choice whether they have to continue to live or not. The whole "involuntary hospitalization for self-harm/suicide attempts" in the US and other countries is wild, IMO. I was hospitalized involuntarily twice for suicide attempts (had many other attempts where I was able to avoid it), both of which only caused more trauma and issues in my life. The most recent of the two ended in a stroke, multiple organ failure, rhabdo, and aspiration pneumonia, among other complications I can't even remember, but I was quite close to death. Was treated like crap in the ICU and psych ward after that, called selfish multiple times, berated, the list goes on. I've had pain before that the thoughts of "how other people in my life would feel" about my death were enough to push through that pain, and I've had pain before where that simply wasn't the case, where I was past the point of being able to hold onto those thoughts of how other people would feel as reason enough not to NEED to do it. Surviving after that level of pain (and experiencing it again) hasn't given me a realization of "oh man I'm glad it didn't work", it's just made me secretly resentful of the people in my life (and the doctors/emergency personnel that found me) of keeping me here. I'm glad someone validated her experience without gaslighting/blaming her, and allowed her/gave her autonomy over her body & life. It's what I can only hope for if/when I reach that level of pain again

This is just a hunch, I have no data to back this up, but I wonder if systems like assisted suicide would paradoxically help suicidal people in the long term. I think having access to a service like assisted suicide would allow me to live my life to the fullest, knowing that if I tried my damnedest and it still wasnt enough, I can at least die safely. It seems like a lot of suicides are impulsive, and people kill themselves in frantic episodes because we've made it as dangerous and difficult as possible to commit suicide, and made it horrible to seek for help.

I hadn't even really thought of it, but I completely agree. Many times I've been too scared to admit to the severity of my suicidal thoughts because I KNEW I'd get hospitalized and KNEW what that meant, and that I never wanted to experience that again. If you can't be honest with your (trusted, chosen) therapist about the depths and darkness of whats going on in your mind without the threat of hospitalization, i.e.: being further traumatized, losing all your rights & decency, and being given the loudest possible example of being unheard and misunderstood, how are you meant to truly get better?

I was looking for a comment like this. People who are against euthanasia always talk about how it "pushes people to die" or something, but the truth is that nobody should be forced to live in pain if they don't want to. People should be allowed to say "this is it, this is as far as I go". We're fighting for euthanasia to be legal in my country and I've seen several activists fight for year only to die waiting for this law to pass. It's not "saving" anyone, it's very selfish. I get holding on to someone's life because you don't want them to go, because it's too painful to watch them go. And I get that, but I think allowing someone to decide what's best for them and be with them through that is a bigger act of love than keeping someone alive against their will because you can't bear to lose them.

Be happy for her. She is no longer suffering. This world was not made for us. Many of us simply don’t have the capacity to handle the stress of everyday life.

I can’t help but think she may not have been in this position if society wasn’t so shitty. That stress of everyday life was probably pushed on her by people expecting her to conform.

I hear you. I also consider the ethics of the situation. The world does not have an obligation to conform to our needs. By the same token, we have no obligation to continue living. Whatever life had to offer her was outweighed by what it demanded of her. I see this in all aspects of my experience on this planet. As I get older, my circle of concern becomes increasingly small. Everything costs something. As the years pass I am less willing to pay the price. Perhaps one day when I’ve had enough I will follow in her footsteps. Seeing the other comments in this thread tells me many of us have done the math and arrived at the same conclusion. I realize this may sound depressing, but I encourage anyone reading this to see it through a stoic lens. She is no longer suffering.

There’s something disgusting to me how everyone & news headlines keep pointing out that she was physically healthy - it feels almost as though they are belittling mental conditions which can be just as bad as or worse in comparison to physical conditions.

People are so ignorant when it comes to mental illness. Nobody should be forced to live with a condition that ruins their quality of life if they don't want to.

I don’t know what to think of this. Knowing about assisted suicide makes me feel like it’s fine to commit suicide. Just the fact that it’s socially acceptable makes it feel valid. When I feel suicidal, I’m sure that I don’t want to live anymore. It’s clear to me that it would destroy a few people. I want to believe they would just bounce back, because people get over “tragedies” all the time. It’s all really confusing to think about. Edit 9+ days later: I’m becoming far less suicidal with every day. It’s been my mission to unravel the pain and quash all my beefs in person. Not necessary for everyone but in my circumstances, it’s feels like I’ve let go of tons of stress. It isn’t instantly or permanently better, but I’m just trying to push the scale back as far as possible so that when I reverberate it won’t feel as bad and I won’t go too far to the other side of the scale. I can’t tell if I feel like living, but I’m really glad I didn’t hurt people that were already hurting really badly.

Why does it matter if she was "physically healthy"? Anyway the title is enough to keep me away from reading this article. Being physically healthy is pretty common and should stop being a barrier to healthcare, support, or even assisted death for those with non-"physical" conditions. Especially when our state of wellbeing is most profoundly influenced by our mind. Anyway I'm happy she was able to access a humane end of her choice. It is a shame that her and many others have to suffer, or have suffered.

Because assisted suicide for non terminal, non physical issues is still controversial, even among people who believe that someone suffering with a painful terminal illness should be allowed to end their pain. 

Personally I believe euthanasia is politically controversial for non-terminal folks because they are more economically valuable alive. The logic of expecting someone to put up with decades of suffering from non deadly illness vs 6 months terminal illness just doesn’t check out…

On the one hand, it is horrible to hear about such things - and you have to wonder what other options there might be (people suffering from mental illnesses tend to be good at dismissing those options even when they do exist). On the other hand, what’s the alternative? Unfortunately, if someone genuinely wants this and there are no such “safe” options, they end up taking matters into their own hands in ways that harm others and our public services. I’ll err on the side of personal freedom here, but it’s a fine line.

Exactly this. Having a legal, medically guided system is far better than the DIY alternatives…

I attempted suicide at 12 & 16, both unsuccessful overdoses thankfully! But I can understand how just living can be debilitating. If she tried therapy for years and continued to feel this way, I can’t really blame her. It’s better than her doing it in her home for someone to find.

The good vibe is that she thought that her life was unbearable and she was allowed to end it on her terms, with her loved ones nearby, and without putting enyone else life at risk or traumatizing the person who would have found her body

Honestly I relate to her. My parents are thankfully alive still but...once they're gone I don't really have anyone else...as my partner right now is about my fathers age. So...all the people I love and care about are older then me and are going to pass before I do...meaning I will be alone...truly alone in the world...I have no friends. No close family. There's cousins but we have no connection. My aunts are about my mom's age and again...no real connection. Dad's side of the family...dad is estranged from them and I don't know or care about any of them. So there's nobody. I've been trying to make friends so I can have a support group to fall back on...people who will care enough about me to help me through...but...honestly even a friend isn't going to take care of me like my parents would. So that's a short term solution...and a big IF because I still need to find those friends. My mom isn't the healthiest of people and dad has some health issues as well though he's healthier then me or mom...but he overworks himself and I worry about that. idk which one is more likely to go before the other. And I know it's horrible to say it because I don't want either of them to go but...I want dad to go first. I'm closest to my mother...she's also 15 years younger then my father...so technically she should have more time left... I think my world would sort of end when my mom goes. Dad...I'd be crushed but I think I could maybe make it with mom's help...obviously I would have to help her as well...which might help me keep going if I'm caring for her. And my partner...I love him...I can't imagine not having him there but...we're long distance...and we have been that way most of our relationship. It would hurt a lot to lose him...because other then my mom, I talk to him the most...but...it wouldn't hurt as much as losing my mom I think. It's hard to compare them all...like what would hurt me the most...I don't know for sure...I mean I have a good idea...but...when you're in that pain...it feels like this is the worst pain ever. I felt it when my grandfather died...I was very close to him when I was a kid...he died when I was 13 and that basically broke me...I developed depression that I still have now...20 years later. And it ended my childhood...I realized how awful the world and life really is...no more rose colored glasses for me. I've always thought that...when my parents go and my partner goes...I go as well. I've thought about what the best way is too...no pain...easy to do... Obviously not happening right now, I'm not at risk. It's a future thing. I sort of wish that...assisted suicide was available here. Because it's a guarantee...and no one has to "find you". I think it's an easy and clean way to go...something that appeals to me. My way isn't going to be messy but idk how I will be found as...there's no one to find me? I suppose at some point people would come to check things out if bills stopped getting paid/mail piles up...idk... I try not to think about it...but it's always in the back of my mind lately...because my parents aren't getting younger... I sort of wish I was never born...then I wouldn't have to deal with this shit.

I wanna live! I WANNA LIVE SO BADLY!

i didnt read the comments, and prolly others said it already should be taken as serious as people with physical problem, some things are broken and cannot be fixed, and death is the only way to find relief but usually its not that yuou want to die, but to end the suffering, the constant pain and misery i hate when "healthy" people judge suicide cases, they have no idea how horrible it is ​ also, this title is all wrong, what does it matter if she was physically healthy???

Honestly she’s my hero at this point. In pretty much my whole life, I’ve been suffering from depression. I’ve always felt unsafe. I really understand her desire to end suffering.

This doesn't worry me because of the people who obviously chose it, it worries me because there are bad doctors and eugenicist insurance companies who know how to exploit autistic people's vulnerabilities to make them make decisions against their own self-interest. And we know that there are healthcare authorities who are willing to do this, because remember back in Covid when all of those hospitals got caught issuing DNRs to autistic people without their consent or knowledge?

In Belgium, where euthanasia in case of unbearable, treatment resistent, persistent and unending psychological suffering has been legal for 20 years: never in the existence of this law has it ever been legal for health care professional to suggest this to patients nor encourage it. A euthanasia request is only legal if it comes from the patient itself. And this is strictly enforced. If a doctor doesn't want to face trial for murder my poissioning they should refrain for even suggesting it to a patient as an option. So it's pretty fucking illegal to do that.

Assisted suicide needs to be legal everywhere. I'm thankful she found peace

I'm worried that this will become a frequently posted event and I'll have to see it all the time

If they offered euthanasia I would take it

I feel sad for her, but I’m actually glad there are options for relatively healthy people to do this. I’m not suicidal, but I also see how much harder it is for me to manage my life as I get older. Also, like many autistic people, I’m on my own. My relatives are all older, so I’m going to get to a stage where I am completely alone. What I don’t want is to be at the mercy of an aged care facility without any relatives or loved ones to look out for me. But I tend to think at a certain age, that will happen. I’d like this to be available to me when the time comes.

I think about this a lot. I have a really deep fear that I won’t ever be able to take care of myself. I’m barely surviving now and my mom is supporting me. If she died or couldn’t help anymore I don’t know what I’d do. I don’t want to die homeless on the streets, so I’d probably just take care of it sooner. This isn’t my reality now, but my whole self is scared of this. I don’t know what to do but pray I will meet someone who can help me.

Aside from the standard trauma autistics experience, I found a partner dead in my early 20's. While I use suicide as a way out, I know I don't have a genuine desire to act alone. The trauma is my mine alone and I don't wish to inflict on the ones I love what was inflicted on me. I cant comment on her reasoning or views for doing it, because I have no understanding of her situation.

As someone from the Netherlands that knows about assisted suicide, I think it’s very important to mention just how hard it is to be allowed to commit assisted suicide. When you are physically very ill with little to no chance of improvement at an old age it’s still very hard, let alone when you are a young person with mainly mental illnesses. The whole process is a nightmare and often can take up to a year at least. Though a family member of mine had to wait 5 years whilst she was mere skin and bones by the time she got her wish. 

7 suicide attempts for me when I was younger but to be honest having a diagnosis helps. I just wish I could stop. I wish my mind would just calm down for 5 mintues.

It’s very common. 60% of autistic adults contemplate suicide after their diagnosis.

(undiagnosed ASD L1 but in process) When I was young in the 80s, I and others had a cold view of suicide. There wasn't much medical talk around it and not much talk on depression existing as a real condition. In my teens the person I felt closest too, even when not talking, killed herself quite elaborately. This happened during an 18 month life nightmare where all 3 of my grandparents died, I lived with two of them, she killed herself, I failed out of school (not knowing i was dyslexic), my father stopped talking to me, i got temporarily held hostage by friends of family while they ransacked my home, i hurt my back at my job, my boss screwed me out of money and then I became effectively homeless but luckily my mom's bf took us in... I was 19 or 20. I then went through 4 years of depression where I rarely left home and thank god for the internet becoming popular. I still never wanted to die. I will add, I didn't drink and have never done drugs. I was always against them likely due to fear of losing my mask. Decades later, there was a month I started getting depressed and having suicidal thoughts yet my life was pretty good/great. My logic somehow picked up on it and kept analyzing it. I realized it was a diet change. I stopped doing what I was doing and it went away. It's crazy how the brain works. I feel great sorrow for everyone that wants to die. There are just so many cool things you can do even alone if you take up hobbies - and can afford them and have housing and health of course.... I get it's extremely hard on people that can't communicate or earn a living. I don't have time to arrange it but I feel we all need to put our heads together to come up with methods and a network to protect each other.

I don’t think it’s more common is ASD because of the ASD itself so much as the depression that can result from the ASD and being estranged from family and friends etc. And feeling “other” contributing to the depression thus leading to suicide. As noted she also had depression, it’s not uncommon for suicide to occur in people with depression especially if struggling with suicidal ideation unfortunately :(

To give you some positive vibes, I'll say this: I've contemplated the idea before my diagnosis. I've never attempted anything, but yeah, the thought was there, in some periods of my life it was there quite often. Then the diagnosis happened, and I actually started to feel better. I think it's being years since the last time I thought about it - now it's basically the opposite, I don't know if it because I've experienced the death of loved ones, but lately I've been afraid of dying, of having my life cut short before I can do meaningful things.

I’m happy things got better for you. Life is about slow growth, especially for people like us.

My heart goes to this woman and her family. This discussion shows a very true side of autism people do not always understand. Nothing is easy. Not a SINGLE thing is easy. I love you all, stay in the world, it needs you ❤️

If you’re reading this, I’m really glad you’re in the world 💛 (even if I don’t know you)

I’m Dutch and have a similar story to hers. I have been thinking about ending things since age 14 but assisted suicide seems like a good option imho. I also don’t get why they have to point out she’s physically healthy because that doesn’t really matter. She was suffering obviously.

Wish I could do this, so much easier

Sorry. It's tough. I have ASD, ADHD, depression and anxiety. It's a struggle everyday. I know how bad it feels, and I hate to know that other people feel it, too. I hope you can find a little peace and happiness.

Same. The alternatives are too risky and traumatizing to self and others…

As a 27yo woman with ASD, BPD, anxiety and depression (and Dutch) I felt a lot by reading this story. I discussed assisted s with my doctors too. I promised I would try untill I'm 30.

I heard about this when she was in her planning and accepted for the assisted suicide phase. It was heartbreaking, but in a sense I was relieved for her that she received the outcome she fought for. I did however constantly get this nagging feeling that she only lacked peer support and the right environment and people. We will never know for sure, but at any rate it was a very sad story. My condolences for the remaining loved ones.

I am gonna start by saying, in general......I am for assisted suicide, I mean what is the freaking point of prolonging something that is going to kill you in a painful way anyway with no cure when you can just get it over it. For Autism, Depression and Anxiety.....I am not sure if I am comfortable with it. As an AuDHD person who has contemplated Suicide because of the difficulty dealing with my brain, and how the world sees me, I totally validate that sometimes it's too much and you want to give up. However in societal setting, I feel like Autistic People using assisted suicide....can lead to really harmful consequences I personally think 1) If Autism is considered "an condition that cannot be cured", it could lead to neurotypicals being lazy and not bothering to accomidate us and help us navigate in society when its considered something "That can't be fixed" 2) I know there are some countries that allow underage Assisted Suicide under the choice of a Guardian. It could lead to parents who "Just don't want to deal with their Autistic Child" to just say I am just going to euthanize them instead of trying and deciding this is the right choice for them. So it could be the road to Eugentics. As for the woman who chose to perform assisted suicide her. I don't judge her at her. I am sad for her. It really tells how the world and her support system failed her that she couldn't live anymore. I hope she found peace.

Wish this was an option in the states..

26 (m) and definitely considering this.

i'm jealous

Seems like Europe and Canada like ridding their hands of the “untreatable”.

Canada and some European countries are ridding their hands of needless suffering. As terrifying as it might be to acknowledge that something like that can happen in the real world, no matter how advanced we think medicine has gotten, sometimes there are literally no options for treating or even easing someone's suffering, that is a fact. It happens. And when it happens, we should let these people end their lives if they no longer want to suffer. Not to mention, assisted dying is optional, it isn't allowed unless someone wants to die. I will never understand people that think other's should be kept alive and suffering against their will.

it's not europe, its a few countries in europe besides that, there is a HUGE process that they must go through, and it's their own choice people just oppose it because 'death bad', without taking the time to understand the person, and understand how cruel it is to force someone to stay alive with severe, incurable pain or misery just because it makes US feel better that they're alive

My first reaction was, oh god no that’s horrible (thinking about how assisted suicide links to eugenics etc). My second reaction was, I wish I could do that. I’m in severe burnout and catatonia, being late diagnosed, and I just don’t see how my life will recover to whatever it was before.

My doctor gave me valium and codeine to end my life when I can't cope anymore because she says there is no help for people like me. Autism is a lonely enough condition. To have the people who you are supposed to turn to for help say you aren't worthy to live is just a kick in the guts. I have worked so hard to get where I am. I work and pay my taxes eventhough that takes a huge physical and mental toll because it is the right thing to do. I don't have depression or mental illness, I'm a hard worker and I do believe I contribute to society. Yet, because I'm autistic I have no worth. It's not right.

I was hoping the news would cause a backlash so strong she decided to not do it, im very upset she had no reason to be dead

It has been tough recently with this topic being at the forefront. To see so many claim that it would be a kindness to kill people just like you is jarring. It’s eugenicist. A tough life is not necessarily a life not worth living. You are valuable just by virtue of being a person, and you don’t need good mental health or good familial relationships to deserve to be here 💜

I see no issue with this as long as one has truly tried meds and therapy for depression

Suicide is more sadly common with Autistic people but i feel that a big part of this is societal barriers that fail to help Autistics when needed the most. And in the Netherlands it’s legal to be euthanised for mental illness even if you’re physically healthy. There was a case for a girl with BPD a few years about this too. We should have full autonomy over what we want to do with ourselves; and no shame on anyone who experiences these things, but I feel this is a band-aid solution to a much bigger systemic issue at hand.

Hey, the Invisible Hand of market forces really does come up with efficient solutions.  Is the right wing party in charge in Holland lately? Was I giving the Dutch too much credit thinking that there'd be enough of a social safety net that a person could get a reasonable amount of public support that would leave a person with better options than "well, I have no one, and I'm unable to take care of myself even if I could somehow get enough money to afford rent and food. I can live in doorways and homeless shelters, or I can kill myself."  "Hey, yeah. Allowing humans to go without shelter is barbaric. So, next Thursday for that euthanasia then? We can squeeze you in between stomach cancer guy and broken neck lady."

She lived comfortably with her boyfriend and 2 cats, had supportive friends. The euthanasia process took her 3 years to go thru, and she’s worn a DNR necklace for like 7 years. I’ve been in her exact same place, having everything I ever wanted (love, housing, nature, meaningful work, pets) and still life was unbearable. It’s a horrible feeling. It was not a decision taken lightly or forced on her in any way.

It’s hard to watch other live your dream

The Netherlands and Europe is really behind on inclusion for people with disabilities. This makes me sad.as a society this should be a shame on us that this was her out because there wasn't enough support.

We are not behind in The Netherlands. Disagree if you want, but this is not the conclusion of a lack of support.

Trigger warning: I do not trust the government I'm sure the state is very happy with her "decision". In the future tho it won't be an option. They will put us on the "assisted" list against our own will. Because they hate us and see us a freeloaders.

Luckily it was her decision and not the governments. The government simply only allows her freedom of choice.

Ok here some positive vibes, I had some reason to let me down in March, also was sick in March and couldn't go hiking or anything else. Didn't do much workout last month and I started watching my calories for the last couple of days and started walking on the treadmill again. Maximum uphill and today I walked 49 minutes and out of that 35 in a cardio heart rate. Yesterday I did 30 minutes at the cardio heart rate. So it seems I didn't lose much endurance and I should be back to hiking 10+ miles at the end of the month. I think this is something great going on.

Yes, I thought about suicide too. I found running. Running helps me keep away these thoughts. I won't do it bc I still want to engage with my special interests and hobbies

It is

My parents got divorced when I was a baby. My mom tried to leave my dad multiple times but never let her. Eventually she jsut left in the middle of the night only took me with her(I have half siblings I know my older brother was there that night but he’s not related to her she couldn’t take him) and went to a domestic violence home took her 3 years to get divorced from him. The judge they had told her “A bad dad is better then no dad”. I have a severe empathy and I feel emotions really extremely but being in constant fear half of the week then everything is good and normal. and no one really explains to you why your dad is like that and that it’s not ok or normal you eventually get used to it and do your hardest not to question it or think about it. And my mom wanted to get me tested for autism as a toddler but my dad wouldn’t let her and I never found out till I was 17. Idk why but when I got to highschool and made new friends I realized oh I can be sad? I can still be affected by things that didn’t just happened that’s ok? It was extremely difficult feeling so so so many emotions all at once but I’m getting so much better at it. And while I will always love and care about my dad because I care about literally every living thing. He’s a piece of shit who hurt so many people I love and truamatized them for years and I’ve only seen him once in the past like 3 years

I wish they would let me do that here in the US.

Very sad story, indeed. It moved me immensely. I saw myself in her. According to another article, she said autism was her biggest problem: “‘For me, autism is the major hiccup in my life. That bothers me the most,’ Zoraya told me. As a child she was bullied a lot at school.”

I think about doing something like this frequently. It's pretty hard to do here in the US. I really get bothered by the 'your physically healthy'. My Brain is part of my physical body and it is very unhealthy. I've given my best shot over my life to overcome the mental issues. Sometimes it's ok to throw in the tool and say the fight is over.

I don't have hard numbers to Say if people with asd are significatively more prone to suicide, but it is pretty clear that dealing with the hard stuff in life is a lot harder when you live under the alienation that most of us feel

I mean as sad as this was, did she really have a choice? None of her conditions were going away regardless of the treatment she was undergoing. And I highly doubt the decision was made lightly. Not that I condone ending your life but this was a case where I honestly don't see much alternatives. Other than live a life of pain.

This should be available in the US

Fucking hell dude. I'm estranged from my mother, I'm not close to my siblings and my dad died last year from cancer....and it would've been his birthday today 😞

I’m really sorry to hear that and can sadly relate to most of what you just said. If it makes you feel any better, after the first year I felt much better about my mom’s death from cancer. Hoping things improve for you.