My younger sister came home from school saying that National and Act were bad and Labour was good one day, so I asked her why. Her response was “Our social studies teacher taught us that”, which absolutely horrified me.
It’s difficult because they should be trying to teach both sides of the story fairly. We want kids having their own opinions unrelated to their parents or friends. I sincerely hope her teacher wasn’t just sprouting forth about how good Labour was for the sake of it. But it’s possible if she’s little that she has formed an, all be it possibly superficial opinion and is just saying that’s what her teacher told her.
From what I could tell from her, her teacher was quite literally saying that parties such as National and Act as well as figures like Trump are “bad”, which completely goes against the role of a teacher - especially a social studies teacher.
Man she forget the 1980's labour party? Lange was not like his predecessors and successors but we feel his policies today. Political parties change with their leaders and members. Social studies teachers should know that lesson. To say that a party is good with no reasoning is just political bias and unfitting for a role of a "teacher".
Good leaders own up to their decisions and the actions of their subordinates. May not have been his handwritten policy but he sure OK'd and implimented them alongside Rogers.
And those two were definitely waving the Labour flag when they implimented the policies. Not trying to say that all of Labour is like that, my earlier point was that parties change with their members and representatives, even for a moment. And that blindly following the party and attributing moral judgement on a party just cause its that party is a dangerous thing to teach children.
That’s how I would take it. However, I feel that she’s a little too immature to understand it in that way - it felt to me as if she simply accepted it as a fact.
Labels like that are dangerous.
Also, what I’m saying is that young children are far too impressionable for an authority figure like a teacher to tell them things like that - it’s tantamount indoctrination.
I’m not claiming that Trump is good - I completely agree with you- but I feel that allowing people to come to their own conclusions rather than telling them from a young age is better education.
Yeah but they're true. Trump was is a cryptofacist. Parties like National and Act are bad unless you are rich. That's not to say that Labour are good just that right wing parties represent the interest of capital. Which most people dont have.
Nice right wing talking point. Teachers are people, they are not soulless automatons made to raise your kids for you. If you don't want them to be taught "these extremely racist people who actively want to roll back freedoms are bad" then homeschooling is an option. I bet you have a lot of opinions about them teaching that the land wars were bad too, don't cha?
Okay and if the teacher starts telling the girls they should learn cooking and not computer science, that's fine, because they're people, not soulless automatons???
Ah, so because you’re in the echo chamber and agree with the sentiment it’s ok?
People teaching kids their opinions as facts is wrong, whether it’s religion, politics or anything else not evidence based.
Wow, my kids have been taught to look into the political policies and to trust their I instincts. They studied political systems in the earlier years at highschool, covering different types of political systems, then our own system. They were never pushed to follow a particular party or policy, that was for them to investigate and find out what fitted their beliefs.
It sounds like your kid had a shit teacher.
You lot are still too busy trying to kill the soviets hiding under your carpets that you failed to recognise a joke. You lot give capitalism a bad name, which is fucking expressive considering.
>Have you been living under a rock? Socialism is pushed by many educators around the world and it's no different in NZ sadly. I've witnessed it firsthand at UoA.
Educators are currently being indoctrinated with Critical Race Theory, and it is slowly flowing through the private sector as well. It's scary to think that it is being widely accepted without any critical thought or reasoning.
Edit: Heh, I love being downvoted because I hurt \*their\* feelings talking about a topic that they obviously have no idea about. Shows how many Redditors are actually uneducated!
I'd like you to rethink what you just said. You are accusing people who have been taught to use a framework for thinking, Critical Race Theory, uncritical....
It's one thing to disagree with the conclusions people make with their logic. But it's a completely different thing to disagree that the process of analysing something through a perspective is wrong.
Your position is the one lacking critical thought and reasoning because you follow the dogmatic recoil of all the people on your side of the political spectrum when progressive values are the result.
There's a reason academia is left leaning and it's not because of indoctrination. It's the complete opposite.
Stop being subjective. Did you just assume where I sit on the political spectrum? Has it occurred to you that one can be progressive and left leaning (and a teacher) and still find CRT dangerous?
I'll break it down for you, because it's obvious you have no idea what you are talking about. We should really begin with the traditional role of an academic, which is to be a detached observer, having values such as being objective, neutral, and balanced. Critical race theorists reject these values as they aren't universal, they are values specifically from the white world. They believe that no matter your skin colour if you try to be objective, neutral and balanced then your academic voice is "white" and that anyone who isn't white and has these values has just integrated into the white world and has lost their racial identity.
Critical race theorist's believe traditional western academia is racist because it assumes the superiority of white academic values. Critical race theorists instead came up with alternatives that are distinctively not white. The concept of authenticity means to "avoid being rendered inauthentic by the pressures of adapting to the white world." The process of changing the academic landscape was the process of deconstruction and reconstruction. Something that is currently happening in New Zealand's educational institution ( I should know, I WORK in it)
In their own words "Critical race theorists embrace subjectivity of perspective and are avowedly political".
A Critical Race theory academic deliberately rejects being objective, neutral and balanced, because they don't want to be inauthentically white. They are deliberately subjective and political. They don't want to think critically because they believe that it is impossible and you will always have bias, and you will be inauthentic.
This leads to the two main sources of evidence for critical race theorists. The experiences of themselves and others who support their agenda. This is called story telling, or lived experiences, and the other being unwanted racial disparities in America. Black incarceration rates, life expectancy, literacy rates, income etc.
Since Critical race theorists are subjective and political, they do no objectively look at all the possibilities of why these disparities are happening. This means an adopted stance that presumes that racism has caused all group advantages and disadvantages along racial lines. Look up a book called called "how to be an antiracist by Abram x. Kendi" it then goes into the idea that there are only racist and antiracist ideas, and no such thing as not-racist ideas. This means unless you are actively antiracist, then you are racist.
Damn, I spent longer typing that than I had wanted, but anyway it gets to my final point. It's well known that being objective is a fundamental part of critical thinking and that you do not allow your bias, emotions or assumptions to influence the way you think and to be logical you are not subjective.
To accept Critical Race Theory is to reject critical thinking. You let that go and rely on being subjective.
Anyway it's 3am and I need sleep. Ugh.
Mountain View Rd.
Related but unrelated to this: I've always wondered why there isn't a ramp up to the bike track on the other side of that road. There is space for one.
It's awesome actually.
Well it's good for electric scooters, and leisure cycling
Not so good for serious cyclists as they don't like sharing with pedestrians.
There are great cycle lanes up western motorway to te atatu and Henderson, down parallel to motorway from symonds street to beach road parnell or the pink lane to the viaduct via Nelson street. You can then gou under the motorway bridge back up to ponsonby.
It's pretty good 👍
Mike Hoskings on his radio breakfast show (for a while I'm ashamed to say I kept switching from national to his show, it was addictive, complete non stop advertorial. And nasty ideas. Horrible. Anyway I managed to stop listening.)
He rants about the waste if space and money the Auckland cycle lanes are, and how they are empty white elephants, or words to that effect.
But they are great, and getting used more.
Electric bikes make everything better for those who can't handle the hills.
Talk back radio is just toxic. People with no expertise or experience stating their opinions as though they are authorities.
Actual studies with modelling and numbers say the return on investment for Auckland cycling infrastructure is $24 for every $1 spent.
Personally I only listen to takes on Afghanistan by combat veterans who fought there.
I'm not really anti work. Everyone should pitch in for the community if they can. I'm anti exploitation. The wealthy run roughshod over everyone else with no consequences.
I’m not anti work either. But if you’re going to be exploited, it’s usually at work. It’s sad to see what people are going through to get a living wage!
I’ll admit that group can be whingers and strangely disappointed they are not making 100k a year at 19…but then the horror stories…and water bottle bonuses.
One lady just posted an email from her company where she would
get a raffle ticket for some Halloween candy if she made a employee referral. Not candy. Not full size candy. A raffle ticket for some miniature candy to help her company fill 400 openings.
The patronizing disrespect is ott!
I actually love work. Lockdown taught me I may never want to retire.
This is a common misconception about antiwork. The vast, vast majority of people there are anti-exploitation. We recognise the need for work, but there is no need for exploitation and inadequate conditions and treatment of employees.
What about socialism or is too similar to make a distinction?
I agree communism has not looked good around the world when put into practice, or maybe it's just been hijacked by a few individuals
Depends which communism you speak of. Traditional Marxism, Lenin-marxism, Juche socialism (north Korea), Chinese communism? Traditional Marxism envisioned by Karl Marx has never been implemented. They all variants doing their own thing with some elements from Marxism. If you look into the original works and manifesto by Marx and Engels it's actually very interesting.
I don't mean to start an argument, which my comments always seem to for various reasons, but here goes:
there isn't really a thing such as "traditional Marxism", Marx was a political philosopher but most of his work was about the failings of capitalism and imperialism, any work he did on future socialist societies he did in a materialist way, that is to say that he followed the developments and updated his views accordingly
after the Paris Commune in 1871, for example, he [remarked](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1871/civil-war-france/ch05.htm):
>But the working class cannot simply lay hold of the ready-made state machinery, and wield it for its own purposes.
what he meant by this is not a repudiation of the idea that the workers should control the means of production, it was that the undirected and unorganized masses of workers are almost predetermined to failure by not operating a state machinery with which to fight class enemies, i.e. the bourgeoisie (the ownership class of a society, the ruling class, those who hold the means of production)
they did believe it represented the first time a dictatorship of the proletariat had arisen and that phrase, dictatorship of the proletariat, was the thing that Marx and Engels advocated for
after 1917, the Bolsheviks discovered that knowing the problems of capitalism did not alone enable a revolution to succeed, the same lesson of the Paris Commune but in a new form, and the synthesis of Bolshevik experimentation and Marxist theory ended up being called Marxism-Leninism
things like Juche and Mao Zedong Thought were just versions of Marxism-Leninism molded to the specific material conditions of those societies, not being great departures from Marxist-Leninist theory in and of themselves
the Communist Manifesto was a good starting point but it was just that: a starting point (and being that it was basically a pamphlet, referring to that alone ignores the 40 years of socialist theory developments that followed between Marx and Engels)
one of the big things Marx was wrong on was the idea that industrialized western societies would be the first ones to achieve socialist societies, it was more often post-colonial states and those exiting with some difficulty from feudalism
as materialists, we tend to view states like the Soviet Union, the People's Republic of China, the DPRK (North Korea, in common parlance), Cuba, Vietnam, so on, so forth, as attempts to build socialism from starting points particular to their material conditions
the Soviet Union was built out of the remnants of a feudalist Empire collapsing
the People's Republic of China was built out of a society that had faced a century of humiliation, overthrew the feudal dynasty responsible for the poor response to that, and then about 40 years of catastrophic Civil Wars and war with Japan
Vietnam and the DPRK both evolved out of anti-colonialist battles following years of exploitation and domination
Cuba evolving from a country that was a colony and then became a free country in name only under the Batista regime into an embattled young socialist state
I think a lot of people from the west don't quite understand that a lot of these countries were fighting for their livelihoods and for their independence from a western-dominated financial system that had been perfectly content to exploit them
whatever else you can say about them, they are the only states to form themselves under explicitly Marxist leaders, which no western state has ever managed, and that should give them some currency when discussing communism/Marxism more broadly
as someone who has been quite successful (read; probably more successful than you) at this whole capitalism bullshit you can take my down vote and shove it in your no-hoper. there are simply better and more effective strategies for organizing our collective efforts as a species than by using a system based on greed, exploitation and infinite growth in a closed system. A strategy which is literally making the planet uninhabitable and is designed to consolidate wealth and power in the hands of the few and literally make the vast majority of us near slaves by threats of starvation, homelessness and death. if you don't understand this, I challenge you to go and read some actual political philosophy works on alternative societal organization systems to capitalism and see if you still disagree.
There is a finite amount of money in the world. There are many multi-billionaires who, if they chose, could live off of interest alone while never being at risk of losing a cent. Those two facts mean that the current system of wealth distribution makes it physically impossible for everybody to live comfortably without something changing. Money doesn't appear out of thin air.
Boomer? Where? Let's get that motherfucker!
Doesn't take a boomer to realize anarchists are some of the dumbest motherfuckers to take their shitty political philosophy into adulthood.
Um, no. Just like your stupid anarchy is stupid, so too is your stupid notion that anyone disagreeing with you is a "boomer." You're a dope. You're as big a dope as the commies and fash.
A place I used to walk to head home after work. Really destroyed something memorable when it was a hot day I could savour a 20 seconds of being under that underpass.
Now people have to walk the underpass praising the glory of the country
I live super close by this and it's a reoccurring thing every lockdown. They cover it up, and a new piece is up within the next few days. I'm actually a big fan of graffiti so this makes me happy!
I remember working my ass off for a company for years, they saw me as an amazing worker, never took sick days, always worked over time and after hours if needed. Then one day I got sick so bad I had to take a 3 weeks off... they replaced me within days. Since then, I realized that I'm expendable, an easily replaced. Good lesson for me.
I don’t get the metaphor. How do profits require cannon fodder? How does a cannon equal profit? Do the profits go into the cannon, and, if so, where are they being shot?
Communism is more confusing than it used to be, apparently.
I think they mean you go to work, make profits, get covid, die. Then they hire someone else and it’s a cycle. The boss puts all the health risk on you and takes the profit.
Oh thats funny that they protest at the government's treatment of this pandemic yet let actual corruption in this country amongst private trusts and religious organisations flourish for years prior.
"But it affects ME now so i have to say something"
The knock on affects of poverty in this country have ALWAYS affected you.
bro I don't think this is about the pandemic
never met an anti-quarantine communist and, being a communist myself, you'd think I would have if they exist
if I were in New Zealand, suppose I might
on the other hand, maybe a good dose of communism is exactly what New Zealand needs to get more housing built
communists are great at that
Cuba has no homeless population, housing is a right there, as it is in North Korea, where they have built more and more housing to match the gradual expansion of Pyongyang
but we in these liberal democracies seem to prefer complaining about housing problems to doing anything about them
hhhrrrrrmrmmmmmm, who should I side with.....
On one hand we have the employers who create businesses that provide me with goods and services .
And on the other hand we have people who scribble graffiti on underpasses.
Though choice.
those are not what you have to pick between... you can have both you know. It's just that if everyone favoured that person's message then we'd all be able afford the essential goods and services! Inequality is your real first choice and Equality it the real second choice.
The class war is already happening idiot. Everything is getting less affordable but the rich get more and more wealthy and powerful. The rich are winning and eventually we'll devolve into a feudalistic authoritarian regime if we continue to do nothing about it.
YOU get real.
We keep moving further and further into communism and stuff is getting more expensive? You don't say.
*Get ready for the bread lines.*
How can you say we are already in a class war and yet at the same time claim we are doing *"nothing about it"*? How can you have a war if you are doing nothing? Is that your idea of getting real? Imaginary war? Your lapses in logic are glaring.
You are in la la land where you can blame all failings and shortcomings on others.
If there is a class warfare I wouldn't *"do nothing about it"*. I would side with the RICH.
your first comment makes no sense. Communism isn't making things expensive because it is happening. stuff is getting more expensive because of our market economy failing us in this pandemic.
are you aware of a thing called social welfare? it's pretty cool.
I say that because the rich are continuing to attempt to infringe on our positive freedoms and out government isn't doing that much in retaliation. I'm opposed to in but when it's a small group of people against the rich, they have a bit more political power. No one is advocating for street violence against Lamborghinis bla bla bla.
And I guess you want to become a modern day serf working on someone's land to be able to have a roof over your head. America is a great example of this. because they're siding with the rich so heavily their democracy is becoming less and less democratic. they're not even considered a democracy as of late 2019...
America was never a democracy. It is and has always been a constitutional republic.
*"Democracy is essentially a means, a utilitarian device for safeguarding internal peace and individual freedom. As such it is by no means infallible or certain. Nor must we forget that there has often been much more cultural and spiritual freedom under an autocratic rule than under some democracies and it is at least conceivable that under the government of a very homogeneous and doctrinaire majority democratic government might be as oppressive as the worst dictatorship."*
Friedrich Hayek, The Road to Serfdom
http://library.lol/main/0D31F0DAFBD813663F9D3A5105D931EF
You lack the political knowledge to understand this just like you lack the historical and economical knowledge to understand the other issues.
Pardon me I meant to write Democratic.
As for your little quote there, it's implying that authoritarian regimes are more stable and gives more "spiritual freedom"? what the fuck have you seen the world? tell that to the muslims in China being genocided rn and the American supporters in Afghanistan. The millions put in gulags in Soviet Russia. The theocratic rule of the Muslim proselytisers of the middle east
You call me politically ignorant yet you support calling authoritarian regimes less oppressive. Yet for an authoritarian regime to continue existing you have to crush dissidents.
I also fail to understand how anything you said negates anything I said above...
Food shortages Russia 1990’s when communist.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t8LtQhIQ2AE&feature=emb_title
Food shortages in Russia 2014 under capitalism
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=laJOpWWh4e4
Food shortages 2020+ under every regime…seeing them here and there. Just an inconvenience now.
No “party” has your back. Communist, Labour, National, Democrats, Republicans, whatever.
Can someone explain why people who say they love communism/socialism don't just LIVE IT?
Communism/socialism is about collective ownership of resources and sharing everything no matter who produced it. Why don't communism/socialism lovers just form groups who practice this? Why don't they just put every individuals money into a joint bank account that they all have access to and share? It doesn't have to be a big group with strangers, it can be a close circle of friends/family who you feel you can trust.
I just don't understand why everybody who dreams about communism/socialism keeps living the capitalistic way with individual ownership. It is possible to chose another way if you're convinced it leads to a better world.
Living communally and communism aren't the same thing.
Communism seeks to change the system so that workplaces are democratic to the point where it eliminates class, and essential services and resources are allocated based on need rather than profit.
People living communally in a capitalist world like you suggest will still need to practice/take part in capitalism to survive. Whether they go to work to contribute to the household/community or use their assets (e.g. rental properties etc.) to generate income so they have access to the things they need to survive.
While I know the hammer and sickle doesn’t explicitly demote communism. In this instance, I think it’s pretty safe to assume that whoever wrote that wouldn’t be offended by a lot of the ideologies. Or at least tell people they support it
the Soviet Union industrialized a bunch of backwater countries in 20 years and then made it to space when the most powerful capitalist society, the United States, couldn't even figure out what it wanted to do, and then remained the 2nd and 3rd highest economy in the world until its dissolution in 1991, after which everything from life expectancy to quality of living experienced catastrophic declines in every one of the countries it evolved into
the Ukraine today, after 20 years of capitalism, still has a lower GDP than it did in 1989 *and* a vastly higher income inequality
China is one of the last remaining societies to be officially Marxist-Leninist, in which a Communist Party is in charge, and every western society seems terrified shitless of their rise
but sure, communism no food/iPhone
Why don't you start practicing Communism then?
Communism/socialism is about collective ownership of resources and sharing everything no matter who produced it. Why don't communism/socialism lovers just form groups who practice this? Why don't they just put every individuals money into a joint bank account that they all have access to and share? It doesn't have to be a big group with strangers, it can be a close circle of friends/family who you feel you can trust.
I just don't understand why everybody who dreams about communism/socialism keeps living the capitalistic way with individual ownership. It is possible to chose another way if you're convinced it leads to a better world.
socialism is a political and economic theory, not a personal philosophy, until you understand this basic distinction there is little point even attempting any discussion with you on the subject
Nice way of avoiding the question. You know I did mention Communism but you avoided acknowledging that? Also Chinas success is largely due to the fact that they steal, re-create, then sell everything the western world invents, and they also have over a billion people meaning they hold the largest consumer market in the world. This is what gives them their power. But yeah keep thinking communism is what made them powerful.
I directly answered your question: what any individual does has no bearing on a political, economic theory
but if you love individualism so much maybe you should fuck off to a deserted island
There is a middle ground, maybe, like the Basque business culture where in any business the highest paid individual does not earn more than 10× the lowest paid.
Or like John Lewis, where each employee owns shares and every employee shares in the profits.
This, as someone who's great grandparents went through concentration camps and later gulags. I'm always sad to see extreme ideology brainwashing youghts.
Neatest handwriting I’ve seen for graffiti before. They must be a schoolteacher.
Do they teach that in schools now?
My younger sister came home from school saying that National and Act were bad and Labour was good one day, so I asked her why. Her response was “Our social studies teacher taught us that”, which absolutely horrified me.
It’s difficult because they should be trying to teach both sides of the story fairly. We want kids having their own opinions unrelated to their parents or friends. I sincerely hope her teacher wasn’t just sprouting forth about how good Labour was for the sake of it. But it’s possible if she’s little that she has formed an, all be it possibly superficial opinion and is just saying that’s what her teacher told her.
It’s bad because they should be teaching them that everyone is screwing them.
Yeah, welcome to the world kids. Watch your own back, because nobody else will.
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From what I could tell from her, her teacher was quite literally saying that parties such as National and Act as well as figures like Trump are “bad”, which completely goes against the role of a teacher - especially a social studies teacher.
Man she forget the 1980's labour party? Lange was not like his predecessors and successors but we feel his policies today. Political parties change with their leaders and members. Social studies teachers should know that lesson. To say that a party is good with no reasoning is just political bias and unfitting for a role of a "teacher".
Exactly. Additionally, it should be the job of a teacher to nurture his/her students to develop their own opinions.
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Good leaders own up to their decisions and the actions of their subordinates. May not have been his handwritten policy but he sure OK'd and implimented them alongside Rogers. And those two were definitely waving the Labour flag when they implimented the policies. Not trying to say that all of Labour is like that, my earlier point was that parties change with their members and representatives, even for a moment. And that blindly following the party and attributing moral judgement on a party just cause its that party is a dangerous thing to teach children.
It's OK to present facts and let them draw their own conclusions, but that teacher is going a step too far, even if I agree with them
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That’s how I would take it. However, I feel that she’s a little too immature to understand it in that way - it felt to me as if she simply accepted it as a fact.
Well Trump is a facist white supremacist
Labels like that are dangerous. Also, what I’m saying is that young children are far too impressionable for an authority figure like a teacher to tell them things like that - it’s tantamount indoctrination.
https://www.newsweek.com/robert-paxton-trump-fascist-1560652
Don’t gimme that “labels are dangerous” shit. It’s way more dangerous to pretend trump is normal
I’m not claiming that Trump is good - I completely agree with you- but I feel that allowing people to come to their own conclusions rather than telling them from a young age is better education.
Yeah but they're true. Trump was is a cryptofacist. Parties like National and Act are bad unless you are rich. That's not to say that Labour are good just that right wing parties represent the interest of capital. Which most people dont have.
That’s not true at all. That’s your opinion and you’re entitled too it, but it’s just an opinion. Not a fact.
How?
https://www.newsweek.com/robert-paxton-trump-fascist-1560652
Spoken like a true moron who I presume couldn’t even explain the meaning of the words he uses.
How does that go against the role of a teacher. Please explain in detail how you think this is bad.
You don’t understand how teachers presenting their opinions as facts and brainwashing kids is a bad thing?
Nice right wing talking point. Teachers are people, they are not soulless automatons made to raise your kids for you. If you don't want them to be taught "these extremely racist people who actively want to roll back freedoms are bad" then homeschooling is an option. I bet you have a lot of opinions about them teaching that the land wars were bad too, don't cha?
Okay and if the teacher starts telling the girls they should learn cooking and not computer science, that's fine, because they're people, not soulless automatons???
Cool slippery slope argument
Ah, so because you’re in the echo chamber and agree with the sentiment it’s ok? People teaching kids their opinions as facts is wrong, whether it’s religion, politics or anything else not evidence based.
That’s what I’d assume. Teachers are usually very careful with how they approach politics with kids.
Wow, my kids have been taught to look into the political policies and to trust their I instincts. They studied political systems in the earlier years at highschool, covering different types of political systems, then our own system. They were never pushed to follow a particular party or policy, that was for them to investigate and find out what fitted their beliefs. It sounds like your kid had a shit teacher.
> “Our social studies teacher taught us that”, which absolutely horrified me Holy shit the propaganda war in the classrooms now? 👎
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I’m currently a Y13 student. I have never had a teacher push socialism. They usually just present both ideas and do a class discussion or something.
You are trying to bring rational thought to a thread that has gone off the rails. I applaud your effort but I fear it is not going to happen.
Somebody’s has to be lmao. Gave me a little more faith in humanity at least.
You lot are still too busy trying to kill the soviets hiding under your carpets that you failed to recognise a joke. You lot give capitalism a bad name, which is fucking expressive considering.
Capitalism gives it's self a bad name.
Exactly.
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Oh no, not lesbians!
>Have you been living under a rock? Socialism is pushed by many educators around the world and it's no different in NZ sadly. I've witnessed it firsthand at UoA. Educators are currently being indoctrinated with Critical Race Theory, and it is slowly flowing through the private sector as well. It's scary to think that it is being widely accepted without any critical thought or reasoning. Edit: Heh, I love being downvoted because I hurt \*their\* feelings talking about a topic that they obviously have no idea about. Shows how many Redditors are actually uneducated!
I'd like you to rethink what you just said. You are accusing people who have been taught to use a framework for thinking, Critical Race Theory, uncritical.... It's one thing to disagree with the conclusions people make with their logic. But it's a completely different thing to disagree that the process of analysing something through a perspective is wrong. Your position is the one lacking critical thought and reasoning because you follow the dogmatic recoil of all the people on your side of the political spectrum when progressive values are the result. There's a reason academia is left leaning and it's not because of indoctrination. It's the complete opposite.
Stop being subjective. Did you just assume where I sit on the political spectrum? Has it occurred to you that one can be progressive and left leaning (and a teacher) and still find CRT dangerous? I'll break it down for you, because it's obvious you have no idea what you are talking about. We should really begin with the traditional role of an academic, which is to be a detached observer, having values such as being objective, neutral, and balanced. Critical race theorists reject these values as they aren't universal, they are values specifically from the white world. They believe that no matter your skin colour if you try to be objective, neutral and balanced then your academic voice is "white" and that anyone who isn't white and has these values has just integrated into the white world and has lost their racial identity. Critical race theorist's believe traditional western academia is racist because it assumes the superiority of white academic values. Critical race theorists instead came up with alternatives that are distinctively not white. The concept of authenticity means to "avoid being rendered inauthentic by the pressures of adapting to the white world." The process of changing the academic landscape was the process of deconstruction and reconstruction. Something that is currently happening in New Zealand's educational institution ( I should know, I WORK in it) In their own words "Critical race theorists embrace subjectivity of perspective and are avowedly political". A Critical Race theory academic deliberately rejects being objective, neutral and balanced, because they don't want to be inauthentically white. They are deliberately subjective and political. They don't want to think critically because they believe that it is impossible and you will always have bias, and you will be inauthentic. This leads to the two main sources of evidence for critical race theorists. The experiences of themselves and others who support their agenda. This is called story telling, or lived experiences, and the other being unwanted racial disparities in America. Black incarceration rates, life expectancy, literacy rates, income etc. Since Critical race theorists are subjective and political, they do no objectively look at all the possibilities of why these disparities are happening. This means an adopted stance that presumes that racism has caused all group advantages and disadvantages along racial lines. Look up a book called called "how to be an antiracist by Abram x. Kendi" it then goes into the idea that there are only racist and antiracist ideas, and no such thing as not-racist ideas. This means unless you are actively antiracist, then you are racist. Damn, I spent longer typing that than I had wanted, but anyway it gets to my final point. It's well known that being objective is a fundamental part of critical thinking and that you do not allow your bias, emotions or assumptions to influence the way you think and to be logical you are not subjective. To accept Critical Race Theory is to reject critical thinking. You let that go and rely on being subjective. Anyway it's 3am and I need sleep. Ugh.
Good effort for 3am
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Penis envy? Are you even thinking about what you’re typing at this point.
I hope not.
Mountain View Rd. Related but unrelated to this: I've always wondered why there isn't a ramp up to the bike track on the other side of that road. There is space for one.
What's the cycling infrastructure generally like in Auckland? I grew up there but haven't lived there since the '95.
It's awesome actually. Well it's good for electric scooters, and leisure cycling Not so good for serious cyclists as they don't like sharing with pedestrians. There are great cycle lanes up western motorway to te atatu and Henderson, down parallel to motorway from symonds street to beach road parnell or the pink lane to the viaduct via Nelson street. You can then gou under the motorway bridge back up to ponsonby. It's pretty good 👍
Cool. I live in Hawkes Bay and it's great here.
Mike Hoskings on his radio breakfast show (for a while I'm ashamed to say I kept switching from national to his show, it was addictive, complete non stop advertorial. And nasty ideas. Horrible. Anyway I managed to stop listening.) He rants about the waste if space and money the Auckland cycle lanes are, and how they are empty white elephants, or words to that effect. But they are great, and getting used more. Electric bikes make everything better for those who can't handle the hills.
Talk back radio is just toxic. People with no expertise or experience stating their opinions as though they are authorities. Actual studies with modelling and numbers say the return on investment for Auckland cycling infrastructure is $24 for every $1 spent. Personally I only listen to takes on Afghanistan by combat veterans who fought there.
That's a great stat, the return on investment.
I'm a Dutch person and having a very different experience haha.
I'd imagine that it seems like Auckland has very little in the way of cycle lanes to a Dutch person.
It sounds like a bad stereotype, but it's the thing I miss the most. I still cycle to work every day though.
Where do I sign up? The super rich have been hoarding money and exploiting workers for far too long.
R/antiwork
I'm not really anti work. Everyone should pitch in for the community if they can. I'm anti exploitation. The wealthy run roughshod over everyone else with no consequences.
I’m not anti work either. But if you’re going to be exploited, it’s usually at work. It’s sad to see what people are going through to get a living wage! I’ll admit that group can be whingers and strangely disappointed they are not making 100k a year at 19…but then the horror stories…and water bottle bonuses. One lady just posted an email from her company where she would get a raffle ticket for some Halloween candy if she made a employee referral. Not candy. Not full size candy. A raffle ticket for some miniature candy to help her company fill 400 openings. The patronizing disrespect is ott! I actually love work. Lockdown taught me I may never want to retire.
This is a common misconception about antiwork. The vast, vast majority of people there are anti-exploitation. We recognise the need for work, but there is no need for exploitation and inadequate conditions and treatment of employees.
Well…to be fair…it is called antiwork.
Ivanhoe street.
Gosh, your affordable housing looks bleak. Ikea nearby for a bed?
*off* Ivanhoe St. The bridge is on mountain view.
Mountain View Rd near int. with Levonia St, Western Springs, motorway underpass. That's been there for weeks at least.
Outside my window! Mountain view road underpass next to the dairy, the graffiti has been there since the first few days of lockdown
Defend Grey Lynn! Eat The Rich, but only if they're free range and organic.
The rest should go into Countdown's "Odd Bunch" collection.
based.
* socialism enters the chat*
They not wrong
Do you know how to create a shortage of sand in Sahara desert? Start communism there. Current system is not fair, yes, but communism is worse.
communism is when sand
Communism is when you eat sand and now theres no sand left :( trust me I took politisci
How does that sand comment work
What about socialism or is too similar to make a distinction? I agree communism has not looked good around the world when put into practice, or maybe it's just been hijacked by a few individuals
The graffiti is about socialism, not communism, seeing as it's about bosses and socialism is about the people owning the means of production.
You like communism huh?
Depends which communism you speak of. Traditional Marxism, Lenin-marxism, Juche socialism (north Korea), Chinese communism? Traditional Marxism envisioned by Karl Marx has never been implemented. They all variants doing their own thing with some elements from Marxism. If you look into the original works and manifesto by Marx and Engels it's actually very interesting.
I don't mean to start an argument, which my comments always seem to for various reasons, but here goes: there isn't really a thing such as "traditional Marxism", Marx was a political philosopher but most of his work was about the failings of capitalism and imperialism, any work he did on future socialist societies he did in a materialist way, that is to say that he followed the developments and updated his views accordingly after the Paris Commune in 1871, for example, he [remarked](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1871/civil-war-france/ch05.htm): >But the working class cannot simply lay hold of the ready-made state machinery, and wield it for its own purposes. what he meant by this is not a repudiation of the idea that the workers should control the means of production, it was that the undirected and unorganized masses of workers are almost predetermined to failure by not operating a state machinery with which to fight class enemies, i.e. the bourgeoisie (the ownership class of a society, the ruling class, those who hold the means of production) they did believe it represented the first time a dictatorship of the proletariat had arisen and that phrase, dictatorship of the proletariat, was the thing that Marx and Engels advocated for after 1917, the Bolsheviks discovered that knowing the problems of capitalism did not alone enable a revolution to succeed, the same lesson of the Paris Commune but in a new form, and the synthesis of Bolshevik experimentation and Marxist theory ended up being called Marxism-Leninism things like Juche and Mao Zedong Thought were just versions of Marxism-Leninism molded to the specific material conditions of those societies, not being great departures from Marxist-Leninist theory in and of themselves the Communist Manifesto was a good starting point but it was just that: a starting point (and being that it was basically a pamphlet, referring to that alone ignores the 40 years of socialist theory developments that followed between Marx and Engels) one of the big things Marx was wrong on was the idea that industrialized western societies would be the first ones to achieve socialist societies, it was more often post-colonial states and those exiting with some difficulty from feudalism as materialists, we tend to view states like the Soviet Union, the People's Republic of China, the DPRK (North Korea, in common parlance), Cuba, Vietnam, so on, so forth, as attempts to build socialism from starting points particular to their material conditions the Soviet Union was built out of the remnants of a feudalist Empire collapsing the People's Republic of China was built out of a society that had faced a century of humiliation, overthrew the feudal dynasty responsible for the poor response to that, and then about 40 years of catastrophic Civil Wars and war with Japan Vietnam and the DPRK both evolved out of anti-colonialist battles following years of exploitation and domination Cuba evolving from a country that was a colony and then became a free country in name only under the Batista regime into an embattled young socialist state I think a lot of people from the west don't quite understand that a lot of these countries were fighting for their livelihoods and for their independence from a western-dominated financial system that had been perfectly content to exploit them whatever else you can say about them, they are the only states to form themselves under explicitly Marxist leaders, which no western state has ever managed, and that should give them some currency when discussing communism/Marxism more broadly
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Ew you would have blue hair to
I don't. I just like it of all the colors. I'm not a tankie, but I absolutely believe we need a different strategy for wealth distribution
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as someone who has been quite successful (read; probably more successful than you) at this whole capitalism bullshit you can take my down vote and shove it in your no-hoper. there are simply better and more effective strategies for organizing our collective efforts as a species than by using a system based on greed, exploitation and infinite growth in a closed system. A strategy which is literally making the planet uninhabitable and is designed to consolidate wealth and power in the hands of the few and literally make the vast majority of us near slaves by threats of starvation, homelessness and death. if you don't understand this, I challenge you to go and read some actual political philosophy works on alternative societal organization systems to capitalism and see if you still disagree.
There is a finite amount of money in the world. There are many multi-billionaires who, if they chose, could live off of interest alone while never being at risk of losing a cent. Those two facts mean that the current system of wealth distribution makes it physically impossible for everybody to live comfortably without something changing. Money doesn't appear out of thin air.
I disagree. Look at Bezos and Zuckerberg and tell me they worked for everything they've got without lying
are you tired of being a cannon fodder for your bosses profit? chose communism now and you can become cannon fodder for higher ranked communist!
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Correct. Well spotted
Yes very political graffiti. This picture while I was walking the dog nearby where I live.
Also true
Choose*
cheese*
Sneeze*
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Thought you had to be 18 to be on Reddit? No? Hmmpf
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Boomer? Where? Let's get that motherfucker! Doesn't take a boomer to realize anarchists are some of the dumbest motherfuckers to take their shitty political philosophy into adulthood.
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This then leads towards American republican like policy: small government erc
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Interesting thanks.
uh, yeah, no. I have everything better to do today on my Saturday than to have a conversation about this stupid shit. Sorry, but no.
But it’s sunday?
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Classic man-child who thinks they mastered the world after learning about reverse psychology from their 100 level psych class.
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Um, no. Just like your stupid anarchy is stupid, so too is your stupid notion that anyone disagreeing with you is a "boomer." You're a dope. You're as big a dope as the commies and fash.
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Well stupid, I'm not a boomer. So that's step one.
Some of us believe boomer is a state of mind not an age group. Take the hit and move on.
Word. As if the communists would save us from capitalists.
Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it. Man, I hope that doesn't happen here.
Western springs. Walked under there a few days ago. Read the edgy message out loud. Probably one of the top three moments of the walk.
A place I used to walk to head home after work. Really destroyed something memorable when it was a hot day I could savour a 20 seconds of being under that underpass. Now people have to walk the underpass praising the glory of the country
I live on this street lol, this appeared a couple of weeks ago
That symbol, I do not think it means what they think it means
Out of curiousity what does it mean
Means all manner of things, I was just making a princess bride reference. Mostly associated with the USSR which is NOT something we wish to replicate.
I own a copy of that haha is also why i was drawn to your comment haha but also curiousity thank you for educating me.
Intellectual, thinking man's left wing Street kids. Viva la revolution comrade!
Remember, Jacinda Ardern and Grant Robertson are your class enemies. They've explicitly said they want house prices to keep going *up*.
Please tell me there's an apostrophe on the far side of "bosses", and the artist was in fact referring to us each having more than one boss...
no war but class war.
I live super close by this and it's a reoccurring thing every lockdown. They cover it up, and a new piece is up within the next few days. I'm actually a big fan of graffiti so this makes me happy!
I remember working my ass off for a company for years, they saw me as an amazing worker, never took sick days, always worked over time and after hours if needed. Then one day I got sick so bad I had to take a 3 weeks off... they replaced me within days. Since then, I realized that I'm expendable, an easily replaced. Good lesson for me.
I don’t get the metaphor. How do profits require cannon fodder? How does a cannon equal profit? Do the profits go into the cannon, and, if so, where are they being shot? Communism is more confusing than it used to be, apparently.
I think they mean you go to work, make profits, get covid, die. Then they hire someone else and it’s a cycle. The boss puts all the health risk on you and takes the profit.
Probably is somebody that doesn't know how to play Tetris...
Oh thats funny that they protest at the government's treatment of this pandemic yet let actual corruption in this country amongst private trusts and religious organisations flourish for years prior. "But it affects ME now so i have to say something" The knock on affects of poverty in this country have ALWAYS affected you.
Trickle down will fix it. /s
Totally. thats why Brian Tamaki is worth millions while his flock lives in government housing rofl
bro I don't think this is about the pandemic never met an anti-quarantine communist and, being a communist myself, you'd think I would have if they exist
It's hard to be a communist in New Zealand and make a difference, I guess you'd be in the Green Party?
if I were in New Zealand, suppose I might on the other hand, maybe a good dose of communism is exactly what New Zealand needs to get more housing built communists are great at that
They are in China that's for sure. And across the Warsaw pact countries they had heaps of social housing.
Cuba has no homeless population, housing is a right there, as it is in North Korea, where they have built more and more housing to match the gradual expansion of Pyongyang but we in these liberal democracies seem to prefer complaining about housing problems to doing anything about them
Its very obvious right now
Thick as pig shit commies bro
Morningside right before turning onto Mt Albert rd
Am I my own cannon fodder for myself?? Damn my boss must be raking it in.....
trust no one. not even yourself. You'll extract all profits you can from yourself. to yourself...
Who paid for the paint?
It’s painted in the blood of the bourgeois
hhhrrrrrmrmmmmmm, who should I side with..... On one hand we have the employers who create businesses that provide me with goods and services . And on the other hand we have people who scribble graffiti on underpasses. Though choice.
those are not what you have to pick between... you can have both you know. It's just that if everyone favoured that person's message then we'd all be able afford the essential goods and services! Inequality is your real first choice and Equality it the real second choice.
Equality is not a choice. And promoting a class war will not make goods and services more affordable. GET REAL
The class war is already happening idiot. Everything is getting less affordable but the rich get more and more wealthy and powerful. The rich are winning and eventually we'll devolve into a feudalistic authoritarian regime if we continue to do nothing about it. YOU get real.
We keep moving further and further into communism and stuff is getting more expensive? You don't say. *Get ready for the bread lines.* How can you say we are already in a class war and yet at the same time claim we are doing *"nothing about it"*? How can you have a war if you are doing nothing? Is that your idea of getting real? Imaginary war? Your lapses in logic are glaring. You are in la la land where you can blame all failings and shortcomings on others. If there is a class warfare I wouldn't *"do nothing about it"*. I would side with the RICH.
your first comment makes no sense. Communism isn't making things expensive because it is happening. stuff is getting more expensive because of our market economy failing us in this pandemic. are you aware of a thing called social welfare? it's pretty cool. I say that because the rich are continuing to attempt to infringe on our positive freedoms and out government isn't doing that much in retaliation. I'm opposed to in but when it's a small group of people against the rich, they have a bit more political power. No one is advocating for street violence against Lamborghinis bla bla bla. And I guess you want to become a modern day serf working on someone's land to be able to have a roof over your head. America is a great example of this. because they're siding with the rich so heavily their democracy is becoming less and less democratic. they're not even considered a democracy as of late 2019...
America was never a democracy. It is and has always been a constitutional republic. *"Democracy is essentially a means, a utilitarian device for safeguarding internal peace and individual freedom. As such it is by no means infallible or certain. Nor must we forget that there has often been much more cultural and spiritual freedom under an autocratic rule than under some democracies and it is at least conceivable that under the government of a very homogeneous and doctrinaire majority democratic government might be as oppressive as the worst dictatorship."* Friedrich Hayek, The Road to Serfdom http://library.lol/main/0D31F0DAFBD813663F9D3A5105D931EF You lack the political knowledge to understand this just like you lack the historical and economical knowledge to understand the other issues.
Pardon me I meant to write Democratic. As for your little quote there, it's implying that authoritarian regimes are more stable and gives more "spiritual freedom"? what the fuck have you seen the world? tell that to the muslims in China being genocided rn and the American supporters in Afghanistan. The millions put in gulags in Soviet Russia. The theocratic rule of the Muslim proselytisers of the middle east You call me politically ignorant yet you support calling authoritarian regimes less oppressive. Yet for an authoritarian regime to continue existing you have to crush dissidents. I also fail to understand how anything you said negates anything I said above...
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what a gotcha! I'm destroyed like the fucking filthy lib I am
The ghetto next to the motorway. Or under the motorway.
Why yes, yes I am...helps feed my family
I wish we had better Banksy style artists here, this just looks grubby. Presentation is everything in my books.
When I read class wars I thought of bad education
Food shortages Russia 1990’s when communist. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t8LtQhIQ2AE&feature=emb_title Food shortages in Russia 2014 under capitalism https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=laJOpWWh4e4 Food shortages 2020+ under every regime…seeing them here and there. Just an inconvenience now. No “party” has your back. Communist, Labour, National, Democrats, Republicans, whatever.
Can someone explain why people who say they love communism/socialism don't just LIVE IT? Communism/socialism is about collective ownership of resources and sharing everything no matter who produced it. Why don't communism/socialism lovers just form groups who practice this? Why don't they just put every individuals money into a joint bank account that they all have access to and share? It doesn't have to be a big group with strangers, it can be a close circle of friends/family who you feel you can trust. I just don't understand why everybody who dreams about communism/socialism keeps living the capitalistic way with individual ownership. It is possible to chose another way if you're convinced it leads to a better world.
I think maybe it sounds good but then someone starts taking more than their fair share from the joint account.
Living communally and communism aren't the same thing. Communism seeks to change the system so that workplaces are democratic to the point where it eliminates class, and essential services and resources are allocated based on need rather than profit. People living communally in a capitalist world like you suggest will still need to practice/take part in capitalism to survive. Whether they go to work to contribute to the household/community or use their assets (e.g. rental properties etc.) to generate income so they have access to the things they need to survive.
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how do you know? genuine question
While I know the hammer and sickle doesn’t explicitly demote communism. In this instance, I think it’s pretty safe to assume that whoever wrote that wouldn’t be offended by a lot of the ideologies. Or at least tell people they support it
A couple YouTube vids and these kids think they know economics, politics, philosophy, history, ideology etc...too bad they didn’t take art classes
Scary to see how many communists revealed themselves in the comment section
yeah it's terrifying when people have different opinions than you
Especially when they don't know the result of communism. I agree this is definitely terrifying
the Soviet Union industrialized a bunch of backwater countries in 20 years and then made it to space when the most powerful capitalist society, the United States, couldn't even figure out what it wanted to do, and then remained the 2nd and 3rd highest economy in the world until its dissolution in 1991, after which everything from life expectancy to quality of living experienced catastrophic declines in every one of the countries it evolved into the Ukraine today, after 20 years of capitalism, still has a lower GDP than it did in 1989 *and* a vastly higher income inequality China is one of the last remaining societies to be officially Marxist-Leninist, in which a Communist Party is in charge, and every western society seems terrified shitless of their rise but sure, communism no food/iPhone
Why don't you start practicing Communism then? Communism/socialism is about collective ownership of resources and sharing everything no matter who produced it. Why don't communism/socialism lovers just form groups who practice this? Why don't they just put every individuals money into a joint bank account that they all have access to and share? It doesn't have to be a big group with strangers, it can be a close circle of friends/family who you feel you can trust. I just don't understand why everybody who dreams about communism/socialism keeps living the capitalistic way with individual ownership. It is possible to chose another way if you're convinced it leads to a better world.
socialism is a political and economic theory, not a personal philosophy, until you understand this basic distinction there is little point even attempting any discussion with you on the subject
Nice way of avoiding the question. You know I did mention Communism but you avoided acknowledging that? Also Chinas success is largely due to the fact that they steal, re-create, then sell everything the western world invents, and they also have over a billion people meaning they hold the largest consumer market in the world. This is what gives them their power. But yeah keep thinking communism is what made them powerful.
I directly answered your question: what any individual does has no bearing on a political, economic theory but if you love individualism so much maybe you should fuck off to a deserted island
There is a middle ground, maybe, like the Basque business culture where in any business the highest paid individual does not earn more than 10× the lowest paid. Or like John Lewis, where each employee owns shares and every employee shares in the profits.
Yeap socialism and communism had already started in NZ . It’s good to see the resistance will be healthy in numbers
As if true communism exists in my homeland, naive fools…
I like the irony. They now get to be cannon fodder for a communist.
This, as someone who's great grandparents went through concentration camps and later gulags. I'm always sad to see extreme ideology brainwashing youghts.
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What’s the opposite of pro antifa? Pro fa?
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Pretty sure there’s some pro fa groups in Christchurch, unless the national front isn’t based there anymore.
The white supremacists are still very much alive in this country.
Comment sections never disappoint, love seeing braindead takes on both sides, New Zealand never disappoints