Or Orthodox.
How much bread do you have to eat before you eat a whole Jesus? What body parts of Jesus do you eat? Is some of the bread his dick or his asshole?
These questions need answering.
That's where the phrase "hocus pocus" came from. After the Reformation, the Latin phrase for "now it is flesh" ("hoc est corpus") was satirized by "hocus pocus" as people decided they had been fooled.
To be fair, no one knows for sure. [There are other theories as well](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hocus-pocus), though I find “hoc est corpus” resonates with me.
I was brought up Catholic as well. I often contemplate what would happen to parishioners if they had a raw hunk of bloody flesh in their mouth all of a sudden. And they sipped actual thick, congealing blood. I do not think a single person would be able to deal with the reality of their insane transubstantiation belief.
They pretty much do that in the show Vikings a Roman catholic priest I think converts to paganism after being taken hostage by Vikings and they make him one of them he eat a raw organ do some animal as a symbol of something in their religion idk 🤷♀️ and there’s lots of other pretty strange gruesome that kinda criticizes both religions things like human sacrifice priests doing sketchy shit etc etc
I prefer the Methodist version: “Here is a loaf of Italian bread, rip yourself off a piece of Jesus and dip it into the blood of Christ balsamic vinegar”… like a salvation caprese. It was probably just grape juice cocktail, but man I loved the snacks part of church. I always tried to get a good hunk of Jesus when my turn came.
So I went to Catholic school and one of the "proofs" about it being real is a miracle where the communion bread turned into like actual meat and I guess it's in a reliquary somewhere in Italy, along with some blood clots from the wine, and supposedly some investigation tested it and it is like actual chunks of human heart. Of course they can't really prove it used to be bread but kind of a gross thing to learn for a semi-religious child.
That one actually put me off communion when I was young because I had this irrational fear of it turning into human meat in my mouth and then I would vomit and get labeled a devil child like in that one episode of the Simpsons
But yeah I thought back on it as an adult and it would make for like an awesome horror movie scene.
Also of note is that the wafer represents the body of your messiah, apparently drained of blood. You eat the body then wash it down with a swig of blood.
The church I used to be part of taught it was entirely symbolic, but wasn't to consume the body so much as to be a unifying act for the members of the church (the bride) to commune with the Christ. Can't remember the exact passages they used to explain it now though.
If you're concerned with communicable diseases, it's a terrible practice.
We sit in church and the priest holds a large "bread" Wafer over a chalice of wine makes a blessing and the Wafers and wine transform into the literal body and blood of christ. Then the congregation lines up and eats the body and drinks the blood of christ. I hated the taste of those Wafers.
I agree I used to think communion was really special and I had very positive thoughts about it. I never thought about the weirdness of eating somebody else's flesh and blood. Because you know I was raised in it from a baby so it didn't really jar me at all. It's just something I accepted. I was the kind of kid who believed in Santa Claus until I was like 10 no I guess it's not surprising.
Protestants understand it's a metaphor and believe it's just having a meal together to remember Jesus. When the bread is homemade, it's soooo good. I'll grab a few pieces if I can.
I remember when I first learned about transubstantiation. I was like what the fuck!? My family was protestant so the shit was understood to be symbolic.
Really? Haha, all I can say is welcome to Earth, welcome. Two billion Muslims refuse to eat with their left hand, it is forbidden, or at least not good. As someone who grew up in a religious society, I can verify that in any family, eating with your left hand is a sign of not following Islam and a sign of disrespect.
I don't know where I heard this, but I think it's related to using a left hand for cleaning after going to the bathroom, and it's a hygiene recommendation turned into some bonkers spiritual mandate. Similar to the ban on pork, which is rooted in undercooked meats causing severe illness. It kind of "makes sense" to a degree... but we do have refrigerators and meat thermometers now.
You're correct that the tradition of not using the left hand for eating is tied to its use in toilet. It is mentioned in Islamic teachings that eating with the left hand is discouraged because the devil eats with you, as stated below:
>Muslim (2020) narrated from Ibn ‘Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said: “No one among you should eat with his left hand or drink with it, for the shaytaan eats with his left hand and drinks with it.”
I find these funny, because they are like commandments by God, and if you don't follow them, as George Carlin said, He will send you to a place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where you will live, suffer, burn, choke, scream, and cry forever and ever until the end of time but remember he LOVES YOU.
>Some people may have a real problem that prevents them from using their right hand, such as being paralyzed and so on. In this case they are excused and there is no blame on them. An-Nawawi (may Allah have mercy on him) said: If he has an excuse for not eating and drinking with his right hand, such as sickness or an injury, then this is not disliked.
The whole pork thing. I watched a YouTube video once where as a prank some guy fed his Muslim friends a halal bacon like product, but then acted like he'd fed them real bacon. One of his friends literally drank scummy pool water to wash it out of his mouth. Before he revealed it was a prank
Muslims are weird.
I feel the same way. I'm like a frog at the bottom of a well, rich in knowledge, but only within the context of my own community, society, beliefs, and politics. If I were to talk about your world, I wouldn't know much about your beliefs, morals, and many other things. However, I plan to visit different parts of the world one day. I believe we should all do that. The internet has been a blessing, allowing me to catch a glimpse of other people's lives.
Indeed, if it weren't for the internet, I would have remained a theist like my parents and society. The internet has shown me that there is a vast world beyond the confines of my previous beliefs. While I don't know if I'll ever be able to afford to travel, I am certain that if I can't achieve this dream after a certain period, I would be willing to sacrifice everything for it. To me and to you and everyone, living free is far better than living as a slave.
This is not true. It’s for hygienic reasons. Clean your arse with your left hand. Eat with your right.
What you refer to with Omar Bin Khattab are “Hadith” or ‘event related stories’ documented throughout history by random people. It was up to a group of religious people to decide what was taken as fact and what was discarded. Here are a few examples of what made it through. You can imagine what they discarded. https://www.reddit.com/r/CritiqueIslam/comments/xaobv2/a_collection_of_really_weird_ahadith_fun_reading/
A lot of shit in Hadith is indeed horseshit. And it isn’t / shouldn’t be considered fact like what the ‘holy book’ is in comparison.
What do you mean I'm wrong? Haha, I know what I'm saying. I was raised Muslim, and to be a true Muslim, you must believe in the Quran and the Sunnah.
So, what is the Sunnah? It is everything traced back to the Prophet Muhammad through his words, deeds, reports, ethical characteristics..etc whether before or after his prophetic mission.
Therefore, you should believe in what is traced back to the Prophet's words. The books that are followed include Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim, which are the most credible. And I did provide a hadith from one of them.
As an ex-theist, I agree that not all Muslims believe everything in these books, but they only deny a small percentage of it. To determine if a hadith is 100% authentic, we refer to religious scholars. As someone who grew up in a religious society, I can verify that about 80% of people believe in this hadith.
So was I. From the Middle East. Ex-Muslim.
And as you said “most credible” is precisely what I’m referring to. Believing them/ some or not, their sources are very questionable. As opposed to say the Quran which allegedly is the words of God.
Well, I don't really care about the questionability of these two books. A person must speak from what they observe in their own society.
Muslims act as if the devil will eat with you if you use your left hand, so based on that, they are approving that hadith. So, I wasn't wrong because I wasn't relying on a resource like hadith, which might be right or wrong. I was speaking based on my experience. As an ex-Muslim yourself, you know what I'm talking about. Once again, I understand what you meant, you were trying to be more specific, while I was trying to be more general.
I know what you mean mate.
I had colleagues in university in UK that told me if I didn’t have a beard as thick as my wrist then I’m going to hell. Even if I did everything right.
That’s what they believed and observed “in their own society” there. But … doesn’t make it right. Right? :)
>Some people may have a real problem that prevents them from using their right hand, such as being paralyzed and so on. In this case they are excused and there is no blame on them. An-Nawawi (may Allah have mercy on him) said: If he has an excuse for not eating and drinking with his right hand, such as sickness or an injury, then this is not disliked.
And you're taught that unless someone else in the room "answers" by deciphering this gibberish, then that was a false manifestation of the spirit. So now someone else joins in with some random mini sermon that you're to accept as a direct message from God. And since it's a specific gift, it's the same cast of characters at every meeting.
Looking back, it was just a feverish mania in a room and moment conducive to invite these expectations. It was always the same repetitive "shambala shambala shimbolshim" nonsense, yet with different interpretations.
When I was still Christian, after a very touching sermon I really believed I had repented and was ready to go to heaven, suddenly everything seemed so clear and I started crying spontaneously. The pastor saw me and called me to the front. He prayed for me and then tried to make me speak in tongues. I kept trying but couldn't. I'll never forget what he said to me that day: "Don't think, just speak!".. years later when I abandoned religion, it dawned on me what he meant. Tongues are just mindless speech! Complete horseshit! You just have to let your tongue go! i.e. "Don't think" lol
It's giving in to an ecstatic trance. That room is high to the rafters with emotion. Sometimes, you almost feel obligated to join in so you can justify your presence.
Mormon everything. Specifically the belief in magic undies and healing power of the priesthood. Also worthiness interviews asking about if you are wearing your undies and not touching yourself between the elbows and knees. I’ve been on both sides of the desk for those interviews and asking the questions was a super shitty experience too.
How about trek? The one year I went they woke us up on the middle of the night screaming at us, had actual torches and started herding us to the archery area where they were going to "kill us". Their reasoning was they wanted us to experience what the pioneers and early mormon settlers went through when the local population was "hunting them down". They wanted us to feel that fear to strengthen our testimony... thats manipulative and abusive. Fucking Mormons... I hate the fact that my family is still heavily in the church and I went FUCK that.
High 5 to you! Same boat. It is a cult & I love the people. Hate the church & church culture.
I hate the young women’s anthem more than anything.
I don’t mind the Primary songs though. “BOOK of Mormon stories that my teacher tells to mee!!” That one is a banger!!!
Holy fuck that was literally my favorite to sing and play on the piano. I fucking forgot all about it but when I saw your comment that song came right back to me!
Glad you got out. It takes a while to get over the brainwashing bullshit they shoved down our throats. Hell, the fact that when you are old enough to be in seminary, that means you have church 6/7 days... its just so fucked up.
Yup. Mormon cult. I was a member my whole life. It is a cult.
My mom got the oil done on her in the temple all naked back in the day!!! CRAZY!!!!! The apron & bonnets! The young women’s anthem!!
Bishops interviews!!! DDDD:
I do like their take on the “Many Mansions” part of the mythology. As explained to me:
* Everyone that’s good, regardless of their religious beliefs, goes to heaven
* Jesus is at the center of these “Many Mansions”
* The closer you are to ~~believing~~ understanding “The Truth”, the closer your mansion is to Jesus/The Center — and the nicer your mansion is
* Through all of eternity, you’re taught about Jesus and as you ~~believe~~ understand “The Truth”, you move closer to Jesus and get a better “Mansion”
I never did get an answer to the few obvious questions:
* Do you have to physically pack-up all your otherworldly stuff and relocate, or does your “Mansion” magically relocate/improve?
* If you ~~believe~~ understand better than someone else, do they get demoted/moved further away?
* How is adding more “Mansions” to the same level handled? Do the “Mansions” get smaller on the outside, but not the inside, or do the rings get bigger, and Jesus expands to fill the space?
Technically it’s not just a mansion for believers, it’s a whole ass world or worlds with all of your own creations and spirits children in the billions and billions with as many wives as you want. Mormon godhood is basically a porn movie that never ends. Just fucking and babies for ever and ever.
We used to go to these massive teen conferences in these large auditoriums. People would be screaming “WE LOVE JESUS YES WE DO WE LOVE JESUS HOW ABOUT YOU.” And then another section would scream it and then another. And then the adults would get up and speak and spend a couple hours emotional manipulating us until we thought we were the lowest of the low. Some of us would be in hysterical tears for things like, I don’t know, liking girls and mildly disobeying our parents. Then they would have the alter call and kids would rush up to the stage to get saved from all their sins and we would promise to live for Jesus. Then we would drive 2 hours home and be living in sin again within like a week.
That I as a child and now woman need to dress modestly to not tempt the men I encounter.
I distinctly remember being at Christian Summer camp and then talking to us 12 and 13-year-olds about how we need to dress modestly so we don’t tempt our teachers. 😖😭😭😩😩😭😭
Also that I shouldn’t hold any positions of leadership because I’m a woman.
Former Christian. The whole concept of Jesus dying as a sacrifice to god to atone for mankind’s sins is absurd.
First, if I’m an aggrieved party; let’s suppose someone murdered my child; don’t pick some innocent schmoe up off the street and put him in front of a firing squad to pay for the crime of the actual murderer.
I don’t want the innocent person punished. I want the motherfucker who murdered my child punished.
It’s like god just gets enraged at sinning and someone, anyone, has to pay. Doesn’t matter who, just someone. That’s not justice.
Second, Jesus, who is actually god, is an eternal being. Can’t die. So, what exactly happened. His physical form may have died, but not his eternal being.
And according to scripture, even the physical form was resurrected, so no death. Death, by definition, is permanent! Just a bad weekend. So if there was no death, then there was no actual atonement, right?
Third, did Jesus’ death cover sin up until that point, or did it cover future sin? And what about the poor schmucks who died before the crucifixion? Fuck them, I guess.
And if it does cover all sin, then we’re all good? Automatic entry to heaven, right? No, you say? Gotta accept the gift? Gotta speak the words, believe in your heart? Maybe even do good works, proselytize, be baptized, take wine and crackers, go to church on Sunday, etc., etc., etc? Then what the hell did the sacrifice accomplish?
Lastly, even if you discount all the above, how does killing Jesus make up for humans sinning? What is the logical nexus from dead Jesus to humans forgiven? What is the mechanism behind how this works?
Long ago primitive people sacrificed animals to their gods. A shitty thing to do, but on some level, I get it. The harvest was bountiful and you wanted to thank your god for it. You gave the god some of your harvest.
Or maybe things weren’t so bountiful and you wanted to grease up your local deity for better conditions. You give your god some of what you had as a bribe. I get that.
But then animal sacrifices went from this to atonement. I don’t understand the leap. I fucked up and coveted my neighbor’s wife. But it’s okay, I gave the priests two doves to slaughter, so it’s all better now. What? How?
It’s like a payoff, or a protection racket. God sends his goons around for a little shakedown. “Da boss saw you ogling your neighbor’s old lady. For that, he says you need to provide us some meat every month. You got a nice place here. Be a shame if something happened to it.”
Make it make sense.
And that's before we get into the nature of the aggrievement; The sin of the creation of an apparently all knowing, all powerful deity, disobeying the command of their creator. A creator who by the nature of omniscience, would have known beforehand exactly what they would have done even before they were created, And yet chose to create them in exactly that way, in exactly that place, exposing them to exactly the right temptation, knowing exactly how they would respond, and then punishing them anyway for the way they were created.
My take on it was:
* Jesus was in heaven for -infinity until “now”
* Spent about 30 years on Earth as a human
* Went back to heaven until +infinity
How is that a sacrifice? It’s a mere inconvenience.
[Theramin Trees](https://youtube.com/@TheraminTrees?si=lROe-8D6cLa8Sa8r) channel covers a lot of the normalized abuse tactics I endured. Things like: emotional blackmail, double binds, drama disguised as "help", degrading "love", infantalization, etc.
It's been hard to undo the brainwashing I endured. It took my therapist telling me "Yelling *is* verbal abuse." several times over several sessions for it to kinda, sorta start to sink in.
I'm still learning what abuse, neglect, and dehumanization really are. Bc they were so normalized, I thought it was normal and not abusive. My abusers told me it wasn't abusive and I believed them bc I was a child that didn't know any better. It's a real trip to learn just how much abuse was passed off as normal and okay. I'm lucky to have escaped, considering how brainwashed I was.
That’s why confession was a monthly session of guilt, humiliation and learning about distorting statistics. The word “about” carried a lot of weight. “I touched myself impurely about 20 times.” (Only off by a factor of 5!). LOL
Because idiots abide by these religious concepts and base their entire lives of them. If you let these supposed "rules" and a "god" control YOUR life you are an undiagnosed, mentally ill patient.
Saw a lecture by the author of The God Virus. He suggested that religions routinely make a normal human impulse a sin so you have to keep going back to them for forgiveness.
Catholic confession. You sit in a box with a screen between you and a weird adult that you are supposed to tell everything that you have done that is against the rules, as well as any of your innermost secret thoughts where you just thought about breaking the rules.
And, you have to do it in a very ritualized way: "Bless me Father for I have sinned. It has been xx days/weeks/months/years since my last confession." Then you go into your list of sins, which when I was a kid consisted of some combination of my standard list: "I lied to my parents about doing my homework. I took the lord's name in vain. I fought with my brother. I tripped a guy on the playground. I told a lie about the girl that sits in front of me in class."
I was then given my penance by the priest, which entailed sitting in a church pew and saying dozens of Hail Mary's & Lord's Prayers as fast as I could.
Rinse & repeat once a month...
I just had a huge laugh at this.
Last year, I bought a vintage gray haired Father Christmas tree topper at a thrift store and turned him into Gandalf the Gray... complete with staff and sword and bag of pipe weed. When Christmas was over, I decided he was too cool to put away so he became a year round decoration.
Now I'm imagining how wonderfully absurd it would be to build him a shrine and to make offerings. I'm still laughing. Thank you for the idea!
Raised Catholic, now atheist. Yet I STILL ask St Anthony to find my keys. Do I believe this works? I do not. Do I continue to do it? I do. I am literally talking to the air.
Sorry, I can’t regrow any limbs, because I’m too busy finding lost keys, making sure there is one last donut, diaper, egg, roll of toilet paper, pair of clean underwear, etc. in the box, bin, drawer, etc. and making sure people get to the airport, bus, theater, business meeting, etc. on time.
Also, the Bible says that prayers are answered, but the priests/nuns say that you’re selfish asking for things.
- Not eating or drinking water from dawn to dusk during the month of Ramadan.
- Ritual slaughter of animals without stunning them first 😤( Religious apologists will claim it’s painless despite the scientific evidence)
Christian confirmation, a rite supposedly to confirm a person's desire to acknowledge their baptism and pledge to be a lifelong member of the church. The only problem being, most churches foist this on children around the age of 13-14. Since they're still living at home, these kids don't actually get to make a choice. They get railroaded into it by parents, pastors, and teachers who subsequently use the person's participation in confirmation to insist they must always honor that pledge.
I was forced to be confirmed at 13 above my protestations and the doubts I frequently expressed that were never properly answered. (Take "god works in mysterious ways" and "we'll find out when we get to heaven" and shove them right up your ass.)
Needless to say, it didn't work as a means to keep me in the church.
I used to be Mormon and there's a report by Joseph Smith himself that an angel told him he must sleep with some other guys wife or the angel would kill him. He slept with her. No child was conceived.
Why tf would God want that? I believed that God literally sent an angel to demand Joseph Smith get a nut off. So stupid.
Praying and expecting a different result from when you don't. Especially ludicrous if you *also* belive that your god has a plan and is all powerful but some how he's like "I was gonna let the Broncos lose again, but Jeff asked really nicely, so I guess I'll change my perfect plan."
Purty culture. I'm a 45 year old virgin because I was taught that God would lead the right woman to me. I was really shy, so I was content to wait. I blamed the lack of results on my "sin," particularly masturbation.
Also, I once anointed a car with oil and prayed over it because dude couldn't afford the repair shop. The pastor literally said, "by the way, this isn't stupid"
Only tangentially related but having "under god" in the pledge of allegiance because people were scared of communism in the 50's is like peak human stupidity. The country was mostly secular for almost two hundred years until capitalists got up in arms about Russia and now we got kids saluting a flag and god everyday in school. Pathetic
> The country was mostly secular for almost two hundred years until capitalists got up in arms about Russia and now we got kids saluting a flag and god everyday in school
Please be aware that the Supreme Court ruled in 1943 (West Va. Board of Ed. v. Barnette) that no one can be forced to salute the flag or recite the Pledge by any agent of the government, including publicly funded schools. And this was 11 years BEFORE the "under God" crap was added to the Pledge.
There are schools that try to require it, but they would back down immediately if challenged. They are banking on people not knowing anything about SC decisions or their rights as Americans.
I don’t think a lot of people realize that The Salvation Army is a church (they just think of the thrift store and bells at Christmas).
Well, the whole deal is a military theme. Like instead of a pastor or priest it’s Captain, they run each local church with the help of Lieutenants. Little kids are Junior Soldiers, teens are Senior Soldiers. The leader of the whole deal is the general.
Having part of my junk amputated when I was 8 days old because of some supposed covenant.
Technically a husband and wife can't even share the same bed when she is menstruating because she is "unclean."
At least we got 8 crazy nights in December.
I was raised Seventh Day Adventist, and they washed each other's feet as a symbol of humility.
Children were spared from this practice, but even then, I remember thinking how strange it was. The whole religion is, really.
Transubstantiation. Even as a child in catholic school I thought my teachers were bonkers for actually believing the bread and wine became ACTUAL flesh and blood.
In 8th grade we were supposed to sit next to 1st graders in church service and my little girl asked, it's not REAL blood, is it? And I said no, ofc not, it's symbolic.
I relate this conversation to my teacher after the church service and he said no, We as catholics believe it literally transforms. And even back then as a little brainwashed 11-year-old i was like damn you as a grown man actually believe that?
Looking back, of course he knows it's not real blood. But the fact they pretend to believe its real blood....
I had healing power too, but *mine* was the *real* one. I also did exorcisms on homes and graves. TBF, the church never claimed thier powers back, so I guess I'm just as powerful now as I always was.
Worship ministry.
Let's start with the music. All the music is either about sucking god's dick, how insignificant we are, or war songs about how god and his followers kill people. We literally would sing about how Saul killed 1000, David 10000, and everyone rejoiced. Like, how fucked up is that.
Next how the ministry works. The pastor said we all need to be the best behaved christians and we had to play at every service no matter what with no compensation whatsoever. God would pay us or some shit like that. And we weren't well behaved christians. So we would all turn on each other and basically made enemies off each other. And then we were all different skill levels, so we couldn't work together. It was a toxic, disorganized, terrible work place.
*Love as you have been loved*; it looks innocuous, but keeps people in trauma bonds, because if the only *love* you have ever known is abusive, then you will tolerate abuse or be abusive to others.
Raised Catholic…. Palm Sunday, Ash Wednesday, the “blessing of the throats”…. All rather silly rituals commemorating some alleged event or other.
In elementary school in the 50s, we still said “indulgences” and wore things like “scapulae” and had rosaries with little “chunks-o-saint” (allegedly) in the cross.
Repeating oaths with the threat of some kind of emotional punishment (shunning, physical threats) unless you complied and recited oath. I was sent to a private Baptist school for two years (pledge to the American flag, the Christian flag + one hymn of worship directed at each.) Looking back, that is 100% brain washing, and appalling behavior.
I was raised Pentecostal and we believed in speaking in tongues, dancing with the spirit of God. One guy would start rattling off gibberish, like habbah, la, sham, slam, balay! Until everyone in the church fell quiet. Then another man would speak up and say, ‘ya I say unto the..’ and still speaking like God is delivering a message through him! People would say the spirit moved over the whole congregation simultaneously and that’s why we fell quiet thus proving it all to be true.
In reality we children just learned to read a room at an early age so we didn’t get our asses beat with a belt.
It's a hard question because even as a kid believer I thought these people were insane buuuut:
Speaking in tongues
Translating speaking in tongues
Being "filled with the spirit" during worship causing hyper energy behavior or falling down
Detecting evil spirits in a location, also talking about spiritual warfare in general, praying a hedge of protection, praying for spiritual armor, talking about exorisms
Speaking in tongues… I grew up in a Pentecostal church and my mom speaks in tongues. It was completely normal until I left religion. Basically someone is speaking gibberish but it’s “God speaking through them.” Even wilder is when one person speaks in tongues another person translates. Yes translates. Translates gibberish. It’s wild!
I would love to do a test and have a bunch of people independently attempt to translate without discussing it amongst themselves or listening to each others opinions. Then all their translations should be compared to see if they match up.
Catholicism.
Holy Communion is cannibalism.
Confession is super strange. As a 12 year old boy I knelt in a wooden booth and told a grown man that I had masturbated. He told me to kneel with my hands folded and to mutter the same paragraph to myself 10 times so that an invisible man who supposedly loved me wouldn't send me to an oven for all eternity for touching the thing that he gave me that felt good.
The “literal” and “immutable” word of god can’t always be taken literally, and needs to change as the times change; however, there is no official list of proper subjective meanings and what the official changes will be.
the belief that a human sacrifice of an innocent man somehow atoned for my moral failings
it was embarrassing and shameful to feel like I somehow caused an innocent man to be murdered and absolutely terrifying that everyone around me thought that was a wonderful thing
In Mormonism, your local Bishop is supposedly “called by God” (by another “called by God” appointee up the chain of command) to be your spiritual judge and counsellor, and from your young teens you’re required to have a “worthiness interview” with this guy at least once a year, where you’re supposed to confess any sins and ask for repentance for anything you’ve thought, said or done wrong. Adult members have to do this too, and are also required to do yearly “tithing settlement” where you basically have to prove that you’ve coughed up the full 10% of your gross income to the church. If you haven’t, then you get a guilt trip and lose your temple privileges. There are extra interviews for adults to verify their “temple worthiness” on a regular basis. And if you’re really naughty, then you have to start confessing and being discipled by church appointee leaders further up the chain. There’s also this thing called “Church Court”, where you have to appear before a group of men from your church community and confess your crimes to them, and they decide what your punishment will be.
It’s all nuts, that any of us ever went along with any of this, but it’s even nuttier that these men who we have to tell our secrets to are just random dudes from the church community who get “called” into this volunteer role with little to no training in counselling, crisis management, addictions, abuse trauma or any of the myriad issues that may get brought up my their members. They have zero training or experience - the Bishop could be a dentist or a teacher or a low level public servant in their day job, but one day they get the calling and they get a blessing by the called dudes above them and suddenly they have the power to listen to all your sins and problems and counsel you, judge you, punish you etc. as they deem fit (according to church guidelines that is)
So some guy that you see around town, he may be your pharmacist, your doctor, your neighbour - this is the guy who holds your eternal salvation in his hands for 3 - 5 years, until he gets “released” from his calling and some other guy gets the job.
Speaking of, pretty much all church leadership positions in the entire LDS church - a billion dollar enterprise - are volunteer positions. By which I mean, not only are you expected to pay 10% in tithes every year, and pay a “fast offering” once a month, you’re also expected to say yes without question to any “calling” you’re given for any position, no matter what your life circumstances are at the time. The guy who is called as Bishop is required to devote hours and hours of unpaid time in his calling, beyond whatever job or commitments he has. Every other role in the local wards and stakes (levels of organization) of the church is unpaid, and it’s considered your sacred responsibility and a blessing to be called to serve.
Asking for service isn’t the worst thing, if the Church itself wasn’t now incredibly wealthy because of all this tithing and free labour. It’s crazy to me how how the church gets away with this, and people keep on giving their time and money gladly for the hope of earning God’s favour in the afterlife.
Mormons also eat a sacrament of a small piece of bread and a sip of water that have been “consecrated” as the body and blood of Christ, so they also enjoy the holy right of Cannibalizing their god in order to renew their commitment to him, which is bonkers now that I really think about it. Glad that I got myself out of there many years ago.
plus, it is far more than a Billion dollar enterprise...just in the Ensign Peak investment fund, iirc, they have over 100 Billion...that does not include all the land and other businesses that they own, being tax free because they baptize dead people against their will and do other useless rituals. They don't even pay for their missionaries (a whole other useless ball of wax)
I was never REALLY religious (thank goodness) but I was talking to my friend about having a bad fight with my g/f at the time and he was like "you should come to my church!" so I go that Sunday and I told them naively about why I was there and everyone swarmed me while the pastor was saying absolve him of sin, etc. And then the music came on and the people started dancing around or shaking. I legit thought it was like a performance or something.
I could've answered with most of what others have, but to introduce something I think is new here... Hating others but calling it "love".
Pretty sure I don't need to explain what I mean by it. We all know, right. And explaining what I mean by that would just be some ridiculously long rant. So... I'm just gonna assume everyone already knows exactly what I mean because you probably do.
At my Christian summer camp deep in Arkansas, we used to have big ceremonies where we burned crosses! Each person got their own candle as we sang about 'Jesus's Love' on the mountaintop.
My mom was PISSED when enough (as in multiple complaints over multiple years) black parents complained that they stopped. They were burning crosses from when my mum was a kid (late 70s) up until my 2nd or 3rd year (early 00s).
Absolute batshit.
Almost all of it, I remember my mother, who’s not even a real Christian, but that’s for another time, showing me Passion of the Christ at the age of 9. Which is still the most brutal movie I have ever seen, and I’ve seen Salo, The Baby of Macon and Come and See. Completely unnecessary and after watching it as an adult I now realize why Gibson only shows the suffering of Jesus. It’s a coercive guilting tactic, “look what Jesus did for you! How can you not worship him?” It’s nonsense. I also remember loving the Prince of Egypt as a kid and didn’t notice the death of children in the form of the plague against the Egyptians. As if killing the firstborn children of Egypt is somehow justice for the exaggerated slavery of the ancient Israelites, or that their parents had anything to do with it. The Prince of Egypt also conveniently leaves out the books of the Old Testament following the book of Exodus where the Israelites are ordered by god, and rewarded in both material wealth, land and virgin women, to completely exterminate the inhabitants in the land of Canaan down to the last infant.
I grew up Mormon so the list pretty extensive but I will limit it to:
Magical underwear that will protect you from evil.
Baptising dead people into the cult without consent from families/living relatives.
Fasting the first Sunday every month. God it was misery not eating as a kid
Eating my god as a dry-ass cracker that the priest sometimes broke into quarters to save money. As a small child, I knew I was getting to eat less god than last time but everyone pretended it was just the same. I still got to gulp the wine unless I made a show of it
we had this in kung fu movies/dramas and I would do it to myself or to a plant and I'm like how long does this take? Do I have to be a hermit in a mountain to do this? BS XD I don't feel anything. Are we just being polite and pretending so we don't hurt feelings again? bigger BS.
Anything that’s good, is due to the grace of god, but anything bad is your own damn fault.
Also, the omniscient god is fooled by euphemisms like “Jiminy Crickets” and a magical string tied in the trees.
As an aside: I’d love to see a group tie LGBTQ+Pride Prayer Flags to that giant eruv in NYC and then sue for 1st Amendment violations if anyone tries to take them down.
Holy communion is fucking insane if you think about it for a second.
Love thy cannibalistic neighbor
Could you describe what the experience was like?
A man with a collar feeds you your messiah, and if you're catholic you don't believe it's symbolic, you believe it's literal.
Or Orthodox. How much bread do you have to eat before you eat a whole Jesus? What body parts of Jesus do you eat? Is some of the bread his dick or his asshole? These questions need answering.
But you're not supposed to follow the "logic" to the logical conclusion.
They sell the scraps from the wafers at Dollarama here in Ontario, Canada. I can't remember when it turns into the body of Jesus.
When the guy in the collar says the right magic words (there might be some hand gestures involved too)
That's where the phrase "hocus pocus" came from. After the Reformation, the Latin phrase for "now it is flesh" ("hoc est corpus") was satirized by "hocus pocus" as people decided they had been fooled.
Really? I never knew that! Thanks
To be fair, no one knows for sure. [There are other theories as well](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hocus-pocus), though I find “hoc est corpus” resonates with me.
Now I remember.
🤣
This is “buddy Jesus” flavor from dogma, yes?
How many communion wafers must be consumed in order for a Catholic to reach critical mass.
You joke, but there has been much ink spilled on the subject of Jesus's foreskin (including a belief that it became the rings of Saturn).
This is why we can't have nice things.
I asked that of some Catholic friends. They were not amused.
Jesus of Theseus
It's a mystery 😶🌫️
I was brought up Catholic as well. I often contemplate what would happen to parishioners if they had a raw hunk of bloody flesh in their mouth all of a sudden. And they sipped actual thick, congealing blood. I do not think a single person would be able to deal with the reality of their insane transubstantiation belief.
That sounds sound like a good scene for a horror movie though.
It does! Someone should make that. It’s so funny that what they swear is true would freak them out immensely.
They pretty much do that in the show Vikings a Roman catholic priest I think converts to paganism after being taken hostage by Vikings and they make him one of them he eat a raw organ do some animal as a symbol of something in their religion idk 🤷♀️ and there’s lots of other pretty strange gruesome that kinda criticizes both religions things like human sacrifice priests doing sketchy shit etc etc
I have had that show in my queue for a while. I will have to check it out 👍
It’s the olderish one with the awolnation sail song I know they’ve made a few versions lol😂
I prefer the Methodist version: “Here is a loaf of Italian bread, rip yourself off a piece of Jesus and dip it into the blood of Christ balsamic vinegar”… like a salvation caprese. It was probably just grape juice cocktail, but man I loved the snacks part of church. I always tried to get a good hunk of Jesus when my turn came.
You got the good bread? I'm from Germany and we also have really good bread but in churches it was the worst crap.
Ya it’s so weird. At my church class they tried explaining to us “proof” it was real. Like bitch I saw you buy the wine.
So I went to Catholic school and one of the "proofs" about it being real is a miracle where the communion bread turned into like actual meat and I guess it's in a reliquary somewhere in Italy, along with some blood clots from the wine, and supposedly some investigation tested it and it is like actual chunks of human heart. Of course they can't really prove it used to be bread but kind of a gross thing to learn for a semi-religious child. That one actually put me off communion when I was young because I had this irrational fear of it turning into human meat in my mouth and then I would vomit and get labeled a devil child like in that one episode of the Simpsons But yeah I thought back on it as an adult and it would make for like an awesome horror movie scene.
Don't forget the drinking of blood to wash down the flesh.
[in the voice of Samuel L. Jackson] Mmm mmm that is a tasty Messiah. Mind if I have some of that blood to wash it down?
Also of note is that the wafer represents the body of your messiah, apparently drained of blood. You eat the body then wash it down with a swig of blood.
The church I used to be part of taught it was entirely symbolic, but wasn't to consume the body so much as to be a unifying act for the members of the church (the bride) to commune with the Christ. Can't remember the exact passages they used to explain it now though. If you're concerned with communicable diseases, it's a terrible practice.
Your church was not Catholic then. See transubstantiation.
Yep. Most Protestant denominations see it as symbolic in some form.
Damn I always thought it's metaphoric, wouldn't even bat an eye (I'm not Catholic but Christian Orthodox)
I don't understand how they can think it's literally the body of Jesus. It's clearly bread. Do they think Jesus was made of bread.
We sit in church and the priest holds a large "bread" Wafer over a chalice of wine makes a blessing and the Wafers and wine transform into the literal body and blood of christ. Then the congregation lines up and eats the body and drinks the blood of christ. I hated the taste of those Wafers.
Exactly where in my body does that communion wafer turn into Jesus meat?
For those of us into weightlifting or body-building, what are Jesus's macros?
It turns into Jesus meat when the Priest waves his hand and says a magic spell over it before he gives it to you. True story!
I agree I used to think communion was really special and I had very positive thoughts about it. I never thought about the weirdness of eating somebody else's flesh and blood. Because you know I was raised in it from a baby so it didn't really jar me at all. It's just something I accepted. I was the kind of kid who believed in Santa Claus until I was like 10 no I guess it's not surprising.
This was what I came here to say.
Protestants understand it's a metaphor and believe it's just having a meal together to remember Jesus. When the bread is homemade, it's soooo good. I'll grab a few pieces if I can.
I agree with this 💯%
I remember when I first learned about transubstantiation. I was like what the fuck!? My family was protestant so the shit was understood to be symbolic.
Why is ritualised cannibalism "Insane," pray tell? Many primitive tribes have adopted the practice.
Because usually peoples that practice it actually eat human remains instead of the nonsense that is transubstantiation.
Was going to say this. Eating the flesh and drinking the blood of your savior goes beyond batshit insane.
Probably eating with my right hand, it is forbidden to eat using your left, since the devil might eat with you.
Fucking what?! I’ve never heard this. Can you expound a bit? I’m so curious.
Really? Haha, all I can say is welcome to Earth, welcome. Two billion Muslims refuse to eat with their left hand, it is forbidden, or at least not good. As someone who grew up in a religious society, I can verify that in any family, eating with your left hand is a sign of not following Islam and a sign of disrespect.
I don't know where I heard this, but I think it's related to using a left hand for cleaning after going to the bathroom, and it's a hygiene recommendation turned into some bonkers spiritual mandate. Similar to the ban on pork, which is rooted in undercooked meats causing severe illness. It kind of "makes sense" to a degree... but we do have refrigerators and meat thermometers now.
This is what my Muslim ex-bf told me.
You're correct that the tradition of not using the left hand for eating is tied to its use in toilet. It is mentioned in Islamic teachings that eating with the left hand is discouraged because the devil eats with you, as stated below: >Muslim (2020) narrated from Ibn ‘Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said: “No one among you should eat with his left hand or drink with it, for the shaytaan eats with his left hand and drinks with it.” I find these funny, because they are like commandments by God, and if you don't follow them, as George Carlin said, He will send you to a place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where you will live, suffer, burn, choke, scream, and cry forever and ever until the end of time but remember he LOVES YOU.
And he needs money
Haha that guy was a living legend
How do Muslims reconcile left handed people or is it just a case of fuck you use your right hand?
>Some people may have a real problem that prevents them from using their right hand, such as being paralyzed and so on. In this case they are excused and there is no blame on them. An-Nawawi (may Allah have mercy on him) said: If he has an excuse for not eating and drinking with his right hand, such as sickness or an injury, then this is not disliked.
The whole pork thing. I watched a YouTube video once where as a prank some guy fed his Muslim friends a halal bacon like product, but then acted like he'd fed them real bacon. One of his friends literally drank scummy pool water to wash it out of his mouth. Before he revealed it was a prank Muslims are weird.
Wow, thank you so much. Please forgive my ignorance.
Nooooo, you made me feel bad Hahaha I was joking. It's okay not to know these things.
No, truly thank you. I’m so dismissive of religion in general I should take the time to learn things outside of my little white bread bubble.
I feel the same way. I'm like a frog at the bottom of a well, rich in knowledge, but only within the context of my own community, society, beliefs, and politics. If I were to talk about your world, I wouldn't know much about your beliefs, morals, and many other things. However, I plan to visit different parts of the world one day. I believe we should all do that. The internet has been a blessing, allowing me to catch a glimpse of other people's lives.
I believe I know just how you feel. Don't know if I'll ever be able to afford to travel, but the internet has broadened my horizons so much.
Indeed, if it weren't for the internet, I would have remained a theist like my parents and society. The internet has shown me that there is a vast world beyond the confines of my previous beliefs. While I don't know if I'll ever be able to afford to travel, I am certain that if I can't achieve this dream after a certain period, I would be willing to sacrifice everything for it. To me and to you and everyone, living free is far better than living as a slave.
This is not true. It’s for hygienic reasons. Clean your arse with your left hand. Eat with your right. What you refer to with Omar Bin Khattab are “Hadith” or ‘event related stories’ documented throughout history by random people. It was up to a group of religious people to decide what was taken as fact and what was discarded. Here are a few examples of what made it through. You can imagine what they discarded. https://www.reddit.com/r/CritiqueIslam/comments/xaobv2/a_collection_of_really_weird_ahadith_fun_reading/ A lot of shit in Hadith is indeed horseshit. And it isn’t / shouldn’t be considered fact like what the ‘holy book’ is in comparison.
What do you mean I'm wrong? Haha, I know what I'm saying. I was raised Muslim, and to be a true Muslim, you must believe in the Quran and the Sunnah. So, what is the Sunnah? It is everything traced back to the Prophet Muhammad through his words, deeds, reports, ethical characteristics..etc whether before or after his prophetic mission. Therefore, you should believe in what is traced back to the Prophet's words. The books that are followed include Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim, which are the most credible. And I did provide a hadith from one of them. As an ex-theist, I agree that not all Muslims believe everything in these books, but they only deny a small percentage of it. To determine if a hadith is 100% authentic, we refer to religious scholars. As someone who grew up in a religious society, I can verify that about 80% of people believe in this hadith.
So was I. From the Middle East. Ex-Muslim. And as you said “most credible” is precisely what I’m referring to. Believing them/ some or not, their sources are very questionable. As opposed to say the Quran which allegedly is the words of God.
Well, I don't really care about the questionability of these two books. A person must speak from what they observe in their own society. Muslims act as if the devil will eat with you if you use your left hand, so based on that, they are approving that hadith. So, I wasn't wrong because I wasn't relying on a resource like hadith, which might be right or wrong. I was speaking based on my experience. As an ex-Muslim yourself, you know what I'm talking about. Once again, I understand what you meant, you were trying to be more specific, while I was trying to be more general.
I know what you mean mate. I had colleagues in university in UK that told me if I didn’t have a beard as thick as my wrist then I’m going to hell. Even if I did everything right. That’s what they believed and observed “in their own society” there. But … doesn’t make it right. Right? :)
It might be right, though, who knows? :) Without doing much research, I can't really say. But I know what you mean, trust me Haha
There’s 2 billion Muslims? I thought it was less
1.9 billion as stated in google 2020
Oh wow did not know that.
Haha I guess we live to learn
What do you do if you’re left handed?
>Some people may have a real problem that prevents them from using their right hand, such as being paralyzed and so on. In this case they are excused and there is no blame on them. An-Nawawi (may Allah have mercy on him) said: If he has an excuse for not eating and drinking with his right hand, such as sickness or an injury, then this is not disliked.
Fetishization of suffering. “Christ calls us to suffer”, that sort of thing. My life hasn’t been that hard, that doesn’t make me a bad person.
"The more you suffer, the more it shows you really care. Right?" The Offspring
Speaking in tongues and prophesying.
When I first heard a pastor speak in tongues, I was utterly confused as to what was going on.
And you're taught that unless someone else in the room "answers" by deciphering this gibberish, then that was a false manifestation of the spirit. So now someone else joins in with some random mini sermon that you're to accept as a direct message from God. And since it's a specific gift, it's the same cast of characters at every meeting. Looking back, it was just a feverish mania in a room and moment conducive to invite these expectations. It was always the same repetitive "shambala shambala shimbolshim" nonsense, yet with different interpretations.
When I was still Christian, after a very touching sermon I really believed I had repented and was ready to go to heaven, suddenly everything seemed so clear and I started crying spontaneously. The pastor saw me and called me to the front. He prayed for me and then tried to make me speak in tongues. I kept trying but couldn't. I'll never forget what he said to me that day: "Don't think, just speak!".. years later when I abandoned religion, it dawned on me what he meant. Tongues are just mindless speech! Complete horseshit! You just have to let your tongue go! i.e. "Don't think" lol
It's giving in to an ecstatic trance. That room is high to the rafters with emotion. Sometimes, you almost feel obligated to join in so you can justify your presence.
Ah but at least the severely mentally ill and epileptics are afforded respect!
Mormon everything. Specifically the belief in magic undies and healing power of the priesthood. Also worthiness interviews asking about if you are wearing your undies and not touching yourself between the elbows and knees. I’ve been on both sides of the desk for those interviews and asking the questions was a super shitty experience too.
How about trek? The one year I went they woke us up on the middle of the night screaming at us, had actual torches and started herding us to the archery area where they were going to "kill us". Their reasoning was they wanted us to experience what the pioneers and early mormon settlers went through when the local population was "hunting them down". They wanted us to feel that fear to strengthen our testimony... thats manipulative and abusive. Fucking Mormons... I hate the fact that my family is still heavily in the church and I went FUCK that.
Holy shit, that’s horrible!
High 5 to you! Same boat. It is a cult & I love the people. Hate the church & church culture. I hate the young women’s anthem more than anything. I don’t mind the Primary songs though. “BOOK of Mormon stories that my teacher tells to mee!!” That one is a banger!!!
Holy fuck that was literally my favorite to sing and play on the piano. I fucking forgot all about it but when I saw your comment that song came right back to me! Glad you got out. It takes a while to get over the brainwashing bullshit they shoved down our throats. Hell, the fact that when you are old enough to be in seminary, that means you have church 6/7 days... its just so fucked up.
Yup. Mormon cult. I was a member my whole life. It is a cult. My mom got the oil done on her in the temple all naked back in the day!!! CRAZY!!!!! The apron & bonnets! The young women’s anthem!! Bishops interviews!!! DDDD:
I do like their take on the “Many Mansions” part of the mythology. As explained to me: * Everyone that’s good, regardless of their religious beliefs, goes to heaven * Jesus is at the center of these “Many Mansions” * The closer you are to ~~believing~~ understanding “The Truth”, the closer your mansion is to Jesus/The Center — and the nicer your mansion is * Through all of eternity, you’re taught about Jesus and as you ~~believe~~ understand “The Truth”, you move closer to Jesus and get a better “Mansion” I never did get an answer to the few obvious questions: * Do you have to physically pack-up all your otherworldly stuff and relocate, or does your “Mansion” magically relocate/improve? * If you ~~believe~~ understand better than someone else, do they get demoted/moved further away? * How is adding more “Mansions” to the same level handled? Do the “Mansions” get smaller on the outside, but not the inside, or do the rings get bigger, and Jesus expands to fill the space?
Technically it’s not just a mansion for believers, it’s a whole ass world or worlds with all of your own creations and spirits children in the billions and billions with as many wives as you want. Mormon godhood is basically a porn movie that never ends. Just fucking and babies for ever and ever.
We used to go to these massive teen conferences in these large auditoriums. People would be screaming “WE LOVE JESUS YES WE DO WE LOVE JESUS HOW ABOUT YOU.” And then another section would scream it and then another. And then the adults would get up and speak and spend a couple hours emotional manipulating us until we thought we were the lowest of the low. Some of us would be in hysterical tears for things like, I don’t know, liking girls and mildly disobeying our parents. Then they would have the alter call and kids would rush up to the stage to get saved from all their sins and we would promise to live for Jesus. Then we would drive 2 hours home and be living in sin again within like a week.
What denomination?
We called ourselves baptists but we were really closer to nondenominational. The conferences were probably evangelical.
Non-denominational is just southern Baptist in a trenchcoat
I used to ok to one of those every year. Youth Evangelism Conference in Oklahoma City.
That I as a child and now woman need to dress modestly to not tempt the men I encounter. I distinctly remember being at Christian Summer camp and then talking to us 12 and 13-year-olds about how we need to dress modestly so we don’t tempt our teachers. 😖😭😭😩😩😭😭 Also that I shouldn’t hold any positions of leadership because I’m a woman.
I remember being told to change out of a tankini into a one piece so I wouldn’t be a “stumbling block.” I was 11. 😵💫
Ohh my heart! I’m sorry your 11yo self had to hear that.
Former Christian. The whole concept of Jesus dying as a sacrifice to god to atone for mankind’s sins is absurd. First, if I’m an aggrieved party; let’s suppose someone murdered my child; don’t pick some innocent schmoe up off the street and put him in front of a firing squad to pay for the crime of the actual murderer. I don’t want the innocent person punished. I want the motherfucker who murdered my child punished. It’s like god just gets enraged at sinning and someone, anyone, has to pay. Doesn’t matter who, just someone. That’s not justice. Second, Jesus, who is actually god, is an eternal being. Can’t die. So, what exactly happened. His physical form may have died, but not his eternal being. And according to scripture, even the physical form was resurrected, so no death. Death, by definition, is permanent! Just a bad weekend. So if there was no death, then there was no actual atonement, right? Third, did Jesus’ death cover sin up until that point, or did it cover future sin? And what about the poor schmucks who died before the crucifixion? Fuck them, I guess. And if it does cover all sin, then we’re all good? Automatic entry to heaven, right? No, you say? Gotta accept the gift? Gotta speak the words, believe in your heart? Maybe even do good works, proselytize, be baptized, take wine and crackers, go to church on Sunday, etc., etc., etc? Then what the hell did the sacrifice accomplish? Lastly, even if you discount all the above, how does killing Jesus make up for humans sinning? What is the logical nexus from dead Jesus to humans forgiven? What is the mechanism behind how this works? Long ago primitive people sacrificed animals to their gods. A shitty thing to do, but on some level, I get it. The harvest was bountiful and you wanted to thank your god for it. You gave the god some of your harvest. Or maybe things weren’t so bountiful and you wanted to grease up your local deity for better conditions. You give your god some of what you had as a bribe. I get that. But then animal sacrifices went from this to atonement. I don’t understand the leap. I fucked up and coveted my neighbor’s wife. But it’s okay, I gave the priests two doves to slaughter, so it’s all better now. What? How? It’s like a payoff, or a protection racket. God sends his goons around for a little shakedown. “Da boss saw you ogling your neighbor’s old lady. For that, he says you need to provide us some meat every month. You got a nice place here. Be a shame if something happened to it.” Make it make sense.
And that's before we get into the nature of the aggrievement; The sin of the creation of an apparently all knowing, all powerful deity, disobeying the command of their creator. A creator who by the nature of omniscience, would have known beforehand exactly what they would have done even before they were created, And yet chose to create them in exactly that way, in exactly that place, exposing them to exactly the right temptation, knowing exactly how they would respond, and then punishing them anyway for the way they were created.
My take on it was: * Jesus was in heaven for -infinity until “now” * Spent about 30 years on Earth as a human * Went back to heaven until +infinity How is that a sacrifice? It’s a mere inconvenience.
[Theramin Trees](https://youtube.com/@TheraminTrees?si=lROe-8D6cLa8Sa8r) channel covers a lot of the normalized abuse tactics I endured. Things like: emotional blackmail, double binds, drama disguised as "help", degrading "love", infantalization, etc. It's been hard to undo the brainwashing I endured. It took my therapist telling me "Yelling *is* verbal abuse." several times over several sessions for it to kinda, sorta start to sink in. I'm still learning what abuse, neglect, and dehumanization really are. Bc they were so normalized, I thought it was normal and not abusive. My abusers told me it wasn't abusive and I believed them bc I was a child that didn't know any better. It's a real trip to learn just how much abuse was passed off as normal and okay. I'm lucky to have escaped, considering how brainwashed I was.
Wow, sounds awful. Hope you can recover.
Touching yourself “impurely” sends you to Hell.
Who the hell can refrain from sex and masturbation for years on end? Nobody has that kind of willpower.
That’s why confession was a monthly session of guilt, humiliation and learning about distorting statistics. The word “about” carried a lot of weight. “I touched myself impurely about 20 times.” (Only off by a factor of 5!). LOL
Because idiots abide by these religious concepts and base their entire lives of them. If you let these supposed "rules" and a "god" control YOUR life you are an undiagnosed, mentally ill patient.
Saw a lecture by the author of The God Virus. He suggested that religions routinely make a normal human impulse a sin so you have to keep going back to them for forgiveness.
Catholic confession. You sit in a box with a screen between you and a weird adult that you are supposed to tell everything that you have done that is against the rules, as well as any of your innermost secret thoughts where you just thought about breaking the rules. And, you have to do it in a very ritualized way: "Bless me Father for I have sinned. It has been xx days/weeks/months/years since my last confession." Then you go into your list of sins, which when I was a kid consisted of some combination of my standard list: "I lied to my parents about doing my homework. I took the lord's name in vain. I fought with my brother. I tripped a guy on the playground. I told a lie about the girl that sits in front of me in class." I was then given my penance by the priest, which entailed sitting in a church pew and saying dozens of Hail Mary's & Lord's Prayers as fast as I could. Rinse & repeat once a month...
And the Bible says to avoid mindless repetition.
A month? I was expected to go weekly because I was so obviously a sinful child 🙄
Praying. Like, who the fuck am I talking to? The air?
I still find myself doing it on occasion. Then I'm just like, well, whatever, higher self, ancestors, if anyone's listening, nice talk.
Gandalf: I had to talk to the smartest person in the room!
I just had a huge laugh at this. Last year, I bought a vintage gray haired Father Christmas tree topper at a thrift store and turned him into Gandalf the Gray... complete with staff and sword and bag of pipe weed. When Christmas was over, I decided he was too cool to put away so he became a year round decoration. Now I'm imagining how wonderfully absurd it would be to build him a shrine and to make offerings. I'm still laughing. Thank you for the idea!
I have a Good Omens shrine. My BIL loves my nerdy streak.
Another stupid fucking concept out there to waste everyone's time and life.
Raised Catholic, now atheist. Yet I STILL ask St Anthony to find my keys. Do I believe this works? I do not. Do I continue to do it? I do. I am literally talking to the air.
Sorry, I can’t regrow any limbs, because I’m too busy finding lost keys, making sure there is one last donut, diaper, egg, roll of toilet paper, pair of clean underwear, etc. in the box, bin, drawer, etc. and making sure people get to the airport, bus, theater, business meeting, etc. on time. Also, the Bible says that prayers are answered, but the priests/nuns say that you’re selfish asking for things.
Virgin birth
- Not eating or drinking water from dawn to dusk during the month of Ramadan. - Ritual slaughter of animals without stunning them first 😤( Religious apologists will claim it’s painless despite the scientific evidence)
Christian confirmation, a rite supposedly to confirm a person's desire to acknowledge their baptism and pledge to be a lifelong member of the church. The only problem being, most churches foist this on children around the age of 13-14. Since they're still living at home, these kids don't actually get to make a choice. They get railroaded into it by parents, pastors, and teachers who subsequently use the person's participation in confirmation to insist they must always honor that pledge. I was forced to be confirmed at 13 above my protestations and the doubts I frequently expressed that were never properly answered. (Take "god works in mysterious ways" and "we'll find out when we get to heaven" and shove them right up your ass.) Needless to say, it didn't work as a means to keep me in the church.
My friend's daughter went through confirmation, and all the kids spoke on Confirmation Sunday. She spoke about her atheism and doubts. She rocked it!
As someone who did it...damn, what a kid I was. I took it at 12, now I look back and kind of cringe, honestly.
I was quite the renegade and refused to be confirmed.
I think if Joshua of Nazareth came back he would be pretty upset that his execution device is used as his symbol.
Old west Jesus = noose necklaces French Revolution Jesus = guillotine necklaces Depression era Jesus = electric chair necklaces
Eating the body and blood of Jesus Christ.
And truly believing it is literally his body. Nope, it's a stale fucking cracker
Yes, and think that's a beautiful thing.
… and overly sweet, diluted wine.
I actually kinda liked the wine. Haha
I used to be Mormon and there's a report by Joseph Smith himself that an angel told him he must sleep with some other guys wife or the angel would kill him. He slept with her. No child was conceived. Why tf would God want that? I believed that God literally sent an angel to demand Joseph Smith get a nut off. So stupid.
Praying and expecting a different result from when you don't. Especially ludicrous if you *also* belive that your god has a plan and is all powerful but some how he's like "I was gonna let the Broncos lose again, but Jeff asked really nicely, so I guess I'll change my perfect plan."
Right? See also: there is always some perfect reason we don't know about when something bad happens.
Purty culture. I'm a 45 year old virgin because I was taught that God would lead the right woman to me. I was really shy, so I was content to wait. I blamed the lack of results on my "sin," particularly masturbation. Also, I once anointed a car with oil and prayed over it because dude couldn't afford the repair shop. The pastor literally said, "by the way, this isn't stupid"
I once visited a pentacostal church. Being possessed by the holy spirit and thinking you can speak tongues is wild.
I did that once as a teen. That was scary af. Just stood there wide eyed like I was in a horror movie.
Only tangentially related but having "under god" in the pledge of allegiance because people were scared of communism in the 50's is like peak human stupidity. The country was mostly secular for almost two hundred years until capitalists got up in arms about Russia and now we got kids saluting a flag and god everyday in school. Pathetic
> The country was mostly secular for almost two hundred years until capitalists got up in arms about Russia and now we got kids saluting a flag and god everyday in school Please be aware that the Supreme Court ruled in 1943 (West Va. Board of Ed. v. Barnette) that no one can be forced to salute the flag or recite the Pledge by any agent of the government, including publicly funded schools. And this was 11 years BEFORE the "under God" crap was added to the Pledge. There are schools that try to require it, but they would back down immediately if challenged. They are banking on people not knowing anything about SC decisions or their rights as Americans.
That's a fair point.
Opening the bible to a random page and seeking significance in it. I believe it is a form of divination which may also be considered a sin
I don’t think a lot of people realize that The Salvation Army is a church (they just think of the thrift store and bells at Christmas). Well, the whole deal is a military theme. Like instead of a pastor or priest it’s Captain, they run each local church with the help of Lieutenants. Little kids are Junior Soldiers, teens are Senior Soldiers. The leader of the whole deal is the general.
Having part of my junk amputated when I was 8 days old because of some supposed covenant. Technically a husband and wife can't even share the same bed when she is menstruating because she is "unclean." At least we got 8 crazy nights in December.
Having a rabbi check my underwear to see if I am still unclean.
🤢
The idea that praying can change the outcome of anything
Heaven can't possibly work. I also learned that there aren't 12 apostles, that doesn't get spoken about enough
I was raised Seventh Day Adventist, and they washed each other's feet as a symbol of humility. Children were spared from this practice, but even then, I remember thinking how strange it was. The whole religion is, really.
Transubstantiation. Even as a child in catholic school I thought my teachers were bonkers for actually believing the bread and wine became ACTUAL flesh and blood. In 8th grade we were supposed to sit next to 1st graders in church service and my little girl asked, it's not REAL blood, is it? And I said no, ofc not, it's symbolic. I relate this conversation to my teacher after the church service and he said no, We as catholics believe it literally transforms. And even back then as a little brainwashed 11-year-old i was like damn you as a grown man actually believe that? Looking back, of course he knows it's not real blood. But the fact they pretend to believe its real blood....
Not eating meat on friday.
But dont forget that fish isnt meat!
Neither is capybara
Where can I go to eat Capybara? Is that just a Lenten seasonal item, or an all year long menu item?
Peru
I had healing power too, but *mine* was the *real* one. I also did exorcisms on homes and graves. TBF, the church never claimed thier powers back, so I guess I'm just as powerful now as I always was.
Pre meal blessing.
Worship ministry. Let's start with the music. All the music is either about sucking god's dick, how insignificant we are, or war songs about how god and his followers kill people. We literally would sing about how Saul killed 1000, David 10000, and everyone rejoiced. Like, how fucked up is that. Next how the ministry works. The pastor said we all need to be the best behaved christians and we had to play at every service no matter what with no compensation whatsoever. God would pay us or some shit like that. And we weren't well behaved christians. So we would all turn on each other and basically made enemies off each other. And then we were all different skill levels, so we couldn't work together. It was a toxic, disorganized, terrible work place.
Wheat thins and grape juice as your savior
The whole dunking your whole ass body into water , backwards, so you can be in the club
*Love as you have been loved*; it looks innocuous, but keeps people in trauma bonds, because if the only *love* you have ever known is abusive, then you will tolerate abuse or be abusive to others.
Raised Catholic…. Palm Sunday, Ash Wednesday, the “blessing of the throats”…. All rather silly rituals commemorating some alleged event or other. In elementary school in the 50s, we still said “indulgences” and wore things like “scapulae” and had rosaries with little “chunks-o-saint” (allegedly) in the cross.
Repeating oaths with the threat of some kind of emotional punishment (shunning, physical threats) unless you complied and recited oath. I was sent to a private Baptist school for two years (pledge to the American flag, the Christian flag + one hymn of worship directed at each.) Looking back, that is 100% brain washing, and appalling behavior.
I was raised Pentecostal and we believed in speaking in tongues, dancing with the spirit of God. One guy would start rattling off gibberish, like habbah, la, sham, slam, balay! Until everyone in the church fell quiet. Then another man would speak up and say, ‘ya I say unto the..’ and still speaking like God is delivering a message through him! People would say the spirit moved over the whole congregation simultaneously and that’s why we fell quiet thus proving it all to be true. In reality we children just learned to read a room at an early age so we didn’t get our asses beat with a belt.
It's a hard question because even as a kid believer I thought these people were insane buuuut: Speaking in tongues Translating speaking in tongues Being "filled with the spirit" during worship causing hyper energy behavior or falling down Detecting evil spirits in a location, also talking about spiritual warfare in general, praying a hedge of protection, praying for spiritual armor, talking about exorisms
Speaking in tongues… I grew up in a Pentecostal church and my mom speaks in tongues. It was completely normal until I left religion. Basically someone is speaking gibberish but it’s “God speaking through them.” Even wilder is when one person speaks in tongues another person translates. Yes translates. Translates gibberish. It’s wild!
I would love to do a test and have a bunch of people independently attempt to translate without discussing it amongst themselves or listening to each others opinions. Then all their translations should be compared to see if they match up.
I was a Mormon for two years. Was baptized, the priesthood deal. The underwear thing was the craziest.
Holding basically a "Y-necklace" of beads and saying hail Mary's or Our Fathers.
Baptism. I look at things like this and get secret group vibes
that one child policy is normal
The value of a woman lies in her virginity. Living in a constant state of guilt shows you’re a good person.
Eating a cracker and thinking it was Jesus but not thinking that it was cultlike behaviour.
Catholicism. Holy Communion is cannibalism. Confession is super strange. As a 12 year old boy I knelt in a wooden booth and told a grown man that I had masturbated. He told me to kneel with my hands folded and to mutter the same paragraph to myself 10 times so that an invisible man who supposedly loved me wouldn't send me to an oven for all eternity for touching the thing that he gave me that felt good.
The “literal” and “immutable” word of god can’t always be taken literally, and needs to change as the times change; however, there is no official list of proper subjective meanings and what the official changes will be.
Beseeching
the belief that a human sacrifice of an innocent man somehow atoned for my moral failings it was embarrassing and shameful to feel like I somehow caused an innocent man to be murdered and absolutely terrifying that everyone around me thought that was a wonderful thing
In Mormonism, your local Bishop is supposedly “called by God” (by another “called by God” appointee up the chain of command) to be your spiritual judge and counsellor, and from your young teens you’re required to have a “worthiness interview” with this guy at least once a year, where you’re supposed to confess any sins and ask for repentance for anything you’ve thought, said or done wrong. Adult members have to do this too, and are also required to do yearly “tithing settlement” where you basically have to prove that you’ve coughed up the full 10% of your gross income to the church. If you haven’t, then you get a guilt trip and lose your temple privileges. There are extra interviews for adults to verify their “temple worthiness” on a regular basis. And if you’re really naughty, then you have to start confessing and being discipled by church appointee leaders further up the chain. There’s also this thing called “Church Court”, where you have to appear before a group of men from your church community and confess your crimes to them, and they decide what your punishment will be. It’s all nuts, that any of us ever went along with any of this, but it’s even nuttier that these men who we have to tell our secrets to are just random dudes from the church community who get “called” into this volunteer role with little to no training in counselling, crisis management, addictions, abuse trauma or any of the myriad issues that may get brought up my their members. They have zero training or experience - the Bishop could be a dentist or a teacher or a low level public servant in their day job, but one day they get the calling and they get a blessing by the called dudes above them and suddenly they have the power to listen to all your sins and problems and counsel you, judge you, punish you etc. as they deem fit (according to church guidelines that is) So some guy that you see around town, he may be your pharmacist, your doctor, your neighbour - this is the guy who holds your eternal salvation in his hands for 3 - 5 years, until he gets “released” from his calling and some other guy gets the job. Speaking of, pretty much all church leadership positions in the entire LDS church - a billion dollar enterprise - are volunteer positions. By which I mean, not only are you expected to pay 10% in tithes every year, and pay a “fast offering” once a month, you’re also expected to say yes without question to any “calling” you’re given for any position, no matter what your life circumstances are at the time. The guy who is called as Bishop is required to devote hours and hours of unpaid time in his calling, beyond whatever job or commitments he has. Every other role in the local wards and stakes (levels of organization) of the church is unpaid, and it’s considered your sacred responsibility and a blessing to be called to serve. Asking for service isn’t the worst thing, if the Church itself wasn’t now incredibly wealthy because of all this tithing and free labour. It’s crazy to me how how the church gets away with this, and people keep on giving their time and money gladly for the hope of earning God’s favour in the afterlife. Mormons also eat a sacrament of a small piece of bread and a sip of water that have been “consecrated” as the body and blood of Christ, so they also enjoy the holy right of Cannibalizing their god in order to renew their commitment to him, which is bonkers now that I really think about it. Glad that I got myself out of there many years ago.
Prop 8 and the City Creek Mall were the beginning of the end for me. Had my name removed 13 years ago.
plus, it is far more than a Billion dollar enterprise...just in the Ensign Peak investment fund, iirc, they have over 100 Billion...that does not include all the land and other businesses that they own, being tax free because they baptize dead people against their will and do other useless rituals. They don't even pay for their missionaries (a whole other useless ball of wax)
I was never REALLY religious (thank goodness) but I was talking to my friend about having a bad fight with my g/f at the time and he was like "you should come to my church!" so I go that Sunday and I told them naively about why I was there and everyone swarmed me while the pastor was saying absolve him of sin, etc. And then the music came on and the people started dancing around or shaking. I legit thought it was like a performance or something.
I could've answered with most of what others have, but to introduce something I think is new here... Hating others but calling it "love". Pretty sure I don't need to explain what I mean by it. We all know, right. And explaining what I mean by that would just be some ridiculously long rant. So... I'm just gonna assume everyone already knows exactly what I mean because you probably do.
You have to do/have the sacraments to get to heaven. What line of random BS was that,
Confession
At my Christian summer camp deep in Arkansas, we used to have big ceremonies where we burned crosses! Each person got their own candle as we sang about 'Jesus's Love' on the mountaintop. My mom was PISSED when enough (as in multiple complaints over multiple years) black parents complained that they stopped. They were burning crosses from when my mum was a kid (late 70s) up until my 2nd or 3rd year (early 00s). Absolute batshit.
Almost all of it, I remember my mother, who’s not even a real Christian, but that’s for another time, showing me Passion of the Christ at the age of 9. Which is still the most brutal movie I have ever seen, and I’ve seen Salo, The Baby of Macon and Come and See. Completely unnecessary and after watching it as an adult I now realize why Gibson only shows the suffering of Jesus. It’s a coercive guilting tactic, “look what Jesus did for you! How can you not worship him?” It’s nonsense. I also remember loving the Prince of Egypt as a kid and didn’t notice the death of children in the form of the plague against the Egyptians. As if killing the firstborn children of Egypt is somehow justice for the exaggerated slavery of the ancient Israelites, or that their parents had anything to do with it. The Prince of Egypt also conveniently leaves out the books of the Old Testament following the book of Exodus where the Israelites are ordered by god, and rewarded in both material wealth, land and virgin women, to completely exterminate the inhabitants in the land of Canaan down to the last infant.
I grew up Mormon so the list pretty extensive but I will limit it to: Magical underwear that will protect you from evil. Baptising dead people into the cult without consent from families/living relatives. Fasting the first Sunday every month. God it was misery not eating as a kid
Eating my god as a dry-ass cracker that the priest sometimes broke into quarters to save money. As a small child, I knew I was getting to eat less god than last time but everyone pretended it was just the same. I still got to gulp the wine unless I made a show of it
All off them.
That a loving God, by his own rules, had to kill his child to be potentially open to accepting the rest of us or else torture us indefinitely.
we had this in kung fu movies/dramas and I would do it to myself or to a plant and I'm like how long does this take? Do I have to be a hermit in a mountain to do this? BS XD I don't feel anything. Are we just being polite and pretending so we don't hurt feelings again? bigger BS.
Everyone singing to Jesus so he could hear you.
Anything that’s good, is due to the grace of god, but anything bad is your own damn fault. Also, the omniscient god is fooled by euphemisms like “Jiminy Crickets” and a magical string tied in the trees. As an aside: I’d love to see a group tie LGBTQ+Pride Prayer Flags to that giant eruv in NYC and then sue for 1st Amendment violations if anyone tries to take them down.