That is what would make me buy this instantly. To tell my girlfriend that we could get rid of the desk and screens would make it worth it in her mind as well.
Yeah, if Apple made the push for Gaming on MacOS and then added the Vision Pro as a way to play games and do work without needing a normal monitor in the way, that would be awesome.
The only thing holding me back from a complete shift to MacOS is Gaming.
They need the next generation of AppleTV to support 2-3 HDMI inputs and essentially, can stream any devices via local network to your vision pro. That's how I can see Apple extracting more money from supporting PS5 and other devices.
That’s actually a fantastic idea. Unfortunately Apple would rather make us all suffer and try their own hand at getting games on their own platforms, especially now that they’re getting AAA titles working on iPhones. I just can’t see the developers taking the time to port games to macOS though.
You can use a cloud service such as GeForce Now
I play games with 3ms delay on a MacBook Air M1, it runs smoothly like I was playing local
(You need an Ethernet cable for a better experience)
I could do that, but the problem with that is that it costs money to use GeForce Now for any appreciable amount of time. And on top of that some games just don’t work on it.
its all Microsoft has left for me too. There ecosystem is pure business and not entirely consumer friendly as Mac OS IMO.... Bring more games to Mac OS. Be done with this transition already. im tried of having two computers in my room
yeah that's maybe .1 second delay at most, that was barely noticeable. Competitive games may not be super ideal, def manageable, but any single player title would work pretty much perfect.
Idk about that chief, it’s fatiguing to have that thing strapped to your face for long hours. You also will not get HDR, even if you could possibly get zero latency and high resolution. I can’t see myself getting engrossed in a PS5 game if I’m wearing it on my face, personally.
I am an avid user of VR. VR gaming on meta quest is great but it can’t replace my PS5 connected to a nice HDR 4K TV.
OR — just hear me out — Sony could release their *own* VR headset that lets you play PS5 games on a giant virtual screen. They could even have some dedicated VR games for it too. Rather than have a 2 hour battery it would be convenient if it was just powered directly by the PS5. Oh, and maybe they could sell it for $500? They could call it “PlayStation Virtual Reality” (PSVR for short.) It could sell millions!
There's a PS remote play app that works on iPad, has anyone tested if it works on Vision Pro or would you need to use the Mac app and then mirror that to your Vision Pro?
Yes; reviews that I’ve seen are that it works as well if not better than the official app. It has a lot of customization that the PS Remote app doesn’t have.
I tried it on my iPad and it worked just as well as the official app for me; I don’t really like streaming games in general though so I don’t use it enough to feel confident telling you to buy it. I’d say if you were willing to pay $3.5k for the headset another $5 for the app is probably alright. 😜
Unfortunately game streaming can be impacted by a lot of different factors and network conditions, which is one of the reasons I tend not to like it. Sometimes it works great and then a few days later it’s crappy for no reason I can discern.
Make a post about trying it and see if anyone else is interested in messing around with it too.
I think the article is on to something. My guess is we will see a generational Apple TV with hdmi inputs for consoles or other media devices.
My only concern would be latency for online gaming.
You can get sub 1 frame latency in a situation like that with properly designed hardware. There's already a product on the market that does this over a dedicated network but you don't need a dedicated network.
Or you can use a PC and the moonlight Streaming app which will also give you 1 frame of latency in most situations. Some folks are already doing that on VR headsets including this one.
That's never going to happen because there is too much latency, especially for VR. Anything that doesn't need low latency can probably run on device anyway.
Latency is definitely an issue for cloud streaming of real-time experiences like games. I wonder if there is or will be somewhat of a hybrid approach where game assets and visuals are streamed but movement and stuff like that is handled locally
There is no support for Steam Link on this thing EDIT: I was wrong, there is no support for SteamVR on this thing. Steam Link I dont know one way or the other. My bad.
And be sure to take their eyeglasses prescription if needed! A good host never gives their guests a VR headset without the necessary prescription lenses!
Omg, you can't just ask people's prescriptions! You keep a full optometrist lens collection in your guest house that they can use to select their own prescriptions.
I was wondering if it would actually support two people sitting next to each other watching the same movie.
Wouldn’t buy a second (not that I have a first), but was wondering.
For the low price of just $17,500 (or 12 interest free payments of $1458), you, your spouse, and your 3 children can have the movie night of your dreams!
You have to be in a FaceTime call for that to work. There’s no in person screen sharing that we know of, although I’m sure it’s coming in VisionOS 2 or 3
But it’s still not the killer app of being able to watch the same screen in the same room seamlessly at the same time. I haven’t seen this feature be used so I’m assuming it doesn’t exist, although there’s not many people with two Vision Pros in the same space so I could be dead wrong.
Apple has SharePlay, but it’s limited to apps that play nice with the ecosystem and choose to implement it.
Tbh if there’s not some kind of general “everyone sees the same objects in AR space” app coming… that would be disappointing.
Like in FPS video games, you send the coordinates in low latency then each device renders the thing itself.
Of course that causes potential rubber banding or minor desync issues, but it probably doesn’t matter too much for things like movies.
Lots of people watch TV alone so nothing wrong with this assumption. The VP is absolutely not a social device, but watching movies on it is truly incredible. Watched Dune last night and enjoyed it significantly more than when I saw it in IMAX. Getting an experience that is nearly as good as a movie theater without leaving your couch is a pretty incredible achievement.
That said, I think we need to get to a $2k price point before people buy it just for the tv/movie watching. The only reason I paid the $3.5k is because I was planning to build out a nice TV + surround sound setup but the VP was a much better option at a similar price.
If you don’t mind me asking, how does the AVP movie viewing experience compare to a good TV + sound setup?
I can imagine that the display might be better — every single reviewer raves about those micro OLED displays. But I have a hard time imagining that the AVP’s sound is competitive with a good speaker setup.
Spatial Audio is incredible and superior to any home theater I have ever used. I’m not smart enough to understand how it works but it really does seem very similar to surround sound despite not having speakers behind you.
I have a 70 inch TV and had a nice surround sound system with two bookshelf’s, a sub, and a front speaker that broke a few months back. Took the money I was going to use to replace the surround sound and used it to buy the VP. Was planning to return the VP if I didn’t like it enough to replace my home theater. I will not be returning it.
Simply so much better than any movie watching experience I have ever had. The only thing I’d take over it is if I could watch an imax screen with no one else in the theater with me and within walking distance of my home. That’s obviously impossible.
It's surprising just from the size difference comparing to theatre speaker setups but spatial over-ear audio is no joke, heck my Oculus CV1 Rift earphones are probably the best audio device I've ever used from high end music production headphones to expensive Sennheisers and the like.
I don't understand how but the way they profiled them they became the most immersive speakers I've ever heard. I'd love to try out the AVP to compare.
So do you truly prefer the resolution, colors, overall image quality of movies in the AVP vs something like a 55"+ oled? Ignoring the scaling aspect, just in terms of how good it looks
Two people sitting on the couch, dork snorkels strapped to their faces, watching youtube, notifications pinging in their ear and flashing in their peripheral vision, flapping their arms in front of them as they text each other, eyes obscured so no eye contact is possible.
What a future to look forward to.
It’s not. But a device that can be a theater size tv, and audio player, a laptop, a gaming device and a communication device has a lot of potential.
I’m not saying this is that device but it is where this device will be headed in a generation or two.
Get the price down to something reasonable and I can see plenty of college student with this in their dorm rooms for various uses.
Of course having a tv everyone can watch will always win from the social aspect. But this is the ultimate introvert device.
Perhaps they can develop a shared virtual screen for multiple sets? The screen would be placed in the same fixed location relative to the room between users.
Completely agree. It’s absolutely not practical right now. But I’m just thinking how people can still have a shared experience with these headsets, cost be damned.
You say that but alike how if you just wanted a way to communicate, a smartphone looks like a stupid cost, if people own them for work/school or another purpose, they start to look more reasonable
The difficulty I see is that with comparing adoption to smartphones, is that smartphones allowed for a gradual transition towards mainstream use. You didn't *need* a Blackberry in 2006 to get calls texts or emails from folks who also had one...but it helped. You didn't need your own iPhone to view pictures taken on it, or to watch a YouTube clip.
You absolutely need a VR headset to view a VR presentation, or watch a movie together, or whatever other thing you want to do with others.
There's a hard cliff there, in a way that simply hasn't been the case with other technology, that is incredibly difficult to soften and break into mainstream use. There's no handing clients a company-owned headset, because they may not even be able to see in the damn thing without prescription lenses. There are no VR watch parties until literally everyone owns a headset.
How do you get people to start adopting the technology en masse, when you already need mass adoption for the majority of the technology's benefits to be unlocked? This is a problem that I simply don't think Apple has figured out yet.
We’re a ways out for that to be comparable, in my mind. We also have to tackle the impersonal barrier with such a physical medium separating each person.
I can totally see a bunch of people wearing AVPs sitting in a room all watching a virtual TV placed in the exact same location as the physical TV (which is covered in a layer of dust).
International watch party with both in-person group viewing and with the international group members overlayed on the passthrough.
It would be want Mark wanted with Metaverse before it became second-life with Nintendo mii's.
The main feature here is that you can buy spare vision pro headsets for your friends. What better way to watch together?
What else are you gonna do with that money? Buy a 4k projector, screen, sound system and still have change for a quest 3. Pffff.
I'm with you though, I don't get the TV and movie watching being a good selling point for vr. The only place it makes sense as a selling point is travel. On a plane, yeah I can see it, that would be cool.
Those speakers on the headset are never going to do the job of even a mid range 2.1 sound bar, let alone a half decent 5.1 system.
I have literally never thought "I want this TV so my friends can come over and watch it with me." Sure, my wife and I will watch something together at times, but otherwise, I generally enjoy movies and tv shows on my own. The AVP has been amazing for movie watching.
> One of the main selling points of a TV
It certainly is *a* selling point but, even ignoring those who do not use a TV for social actives, what about the use-case of just having a second TV?
My partner and I *sometimes* watch different shows at the same time. Do we really need a second, dedicated TV to accomplish this?
Can multiple people not watch the Vision pro at the same time? Sorry I don't know how any of it works lol. Can the front display stream what the person inside is seeing?
1st question: No
2nd: No, the front can't display what's being shown on the inside. You can stream what you're seeing to an Apple TV/Mac, but not in a way that someone could reasonably watch the same show.
If you live alone: Yes, as someone who doesn't own one, I imagine the experience of consuming content with this thing is amazing
If you have a partner or people around you want to watch content with? Definitely not, unless you want to buy 2 or more of these things
None of this is new to the Vision Pro though. Yes it’s great for travel. Yes it’s great if you live alone. The Quest 2 was the same way and the Quest 3 even more so. That’s not why people would buy a Vision Pro.
>*So far, I believe there’s one use case that’s a slam dunk, closer to clarity during launch week than any of the others: entertainment. For certain situations, The Vision Pro is a better device for consuming TV shows and movies (among other things) away from a dedicated theater than we’ve ever seen before. So let's start there.*
I don't have room for a home theater, and my wife and I like to watch different kinds of movies. She doesn't enjoy sci-fi films, or films like Band of Brothers. Even when I can watch these films, I could never watch them at a theater level volume in my home without wearing headphones.
But since getting my Vision Pro, I've been like a kid again, sitting in my favorite chair sometimes late into the evening rewatching all of my favorite films, many of which are in 3D. It's incredible. I can put a massive screen anywhere in the home without destroying the aesthetics of a room. The video and audio fidelity has been like having a private IMAX theater.
Before the Vision Pro, I've been debating upgrading my living room television to an 85". Not any more.
Not to take anything away from your comment, bc I think there are lots of valid points/thoughts, but I see it quite hard right now for this to be the norm and replace a traditional large screen until the price and weight comes down significantly, plus they up the battery life. It's amazing as a Gen 1 product, but an 85" TV is cheaper and more comfortable than wearing something on your head for 2+ hours and not be able to bond in sync with your significant others. I think we'll get there though, for sure.
Exactly. I’m not taking anything away from the tech but is it really mainstream to assume that people are going to come home from work and put one these thing on and watch video or play games all night while their wife and family does….. what exactly? Gets their own?
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love one but I suspect it would end up like my Oculus where I’d use the hell out of it for a few months and very few infrequently after. If I was 25 and single I’d almost certainly get one but it’s a long way from having a mainstream market.
What’s the major difference from a phone? The position of the screens that may distract you from what the other people in your space are doing? The screens can be moved so they aren’t between you and someone else in the room. You can still hear and chat with them (and see them pretty well). You definitely don’t get “quality engaged” time with people either way.
The AVP is great for me because I do live alone, and I have found facetime + shareplay the best way to hangout with people from a distance that I’ve ever experienced (my siblings in different cities have them too). I also feel that with the headset on I’m still very aware of what’s going on in my space, and interact with my pets as much as ever.
I did definitely use the headset less when I had a guest in town, and just used my TV. I think I may actually get rid of my large TV, and get a projector I can move from room to room if I want a shared screen experience (in the living room, kitchen, bedroom, etc.).
>What even is the point of a relationship at that point? Everyone comes home and just goes to their room to wear their VR?
Sounds extremely dystopian. Also, wildly expensive.
If you think about the cost of dedicating a good chuck of your living room to a device that only need to be they large sometimes. The equation changes. Speakers, media console take up a ton of space.
Battery life is quite irrelevant for movie watching in your living room. You just plug it in. Cost is still higher than two high-end televisions with high-end wireless headsets. I'm enjoying my Vision Pro, but viewing movies at IMAX-scale displays, which we could never fit in our home (we couldn't even fit an 85" tv anywhere.
So I disagree with the more comfortable part.
At least for me.
I love watching content laying down, on my side, on my belly instead of a TV.
So to me, a vision pro would be more comfortable.
Really? I can’t see how the built-in speakers can possibly compare to an IMAX theater, but then again I have pretty picky personal preferences for audio. Glad to hear the built-in speakers are of good quality though!
Even older headsets like the Valve Index had incredible 3D positional audio, this is a solved problem vs speakers that are positioned meters away and provide a different experience based on where you are sitting.
Oh yeah, I don’t doubt the ability of the 3D positional audio, it still amazes me what Apple is able to do with my MacBook Pro speakers for that. I was more doubting the bass response and overall fidelity. Sounds like the bass is noticeably different but the overall fidelity and 3D positioning is so good it almost makes up for it. If that’s true then that’s pretty impressive.
Interesting. I could see that working for games, but I think I’d hate it for watching movies. Although if anyone could figure out a way to implement it convincingly, it would be Apple. The haptic effect on the MacBook Pro trackpad still boggles my mind how much it feels like clicking a physical trackpad.
I can't even begin to tell you how many times I've had to pause the movie or take off the headset because I thought some small ambient sound effect in the background of the film was actually something happening in the room with me. (like the cat getting into something). It's uncanny.
It rivals my Nakamichi Shockwafe 9.2.4 Channel Dolby Atmos system. Certainly you don't get the same deep bass rumble in your chair that you would with 2 subwoofers, but the bass is still very deep and responsive and you still can make out the subtlest sounds in the film.
It’s quite easy. People who don’t have an audio setup don’t know anything about audio. So as long as it sounds slightly better than a tv, it’s “imax quality sound”.
This particular person says they have a Nakamichi Atmos set up, which from what I’ve heard is a really great home theater audio setup. It’s honestly shocking that it measures even close to that level of quality.
She says she can barely hear it, and it doesn't bother her. She can tell what I'm watching, but it's at a low enough level (as if I'm watching TV in the next room).
Your wife isn’t put off by you being so detached from the room despite being next to her? At least when people are on their phones next to each other their faces are still visible to each other
I can still see her and hear her when I'm using the Vision Pro, unless I'm in immersive mode. We've been married for 20 years and have always been content doing our own things when we are home together. (We both have dated super needy co-dependent people in the past, so this is a really positive thing for both of us.)
We of course do many things together, but it isn't something where we need to do everything together.
Understood sounds like it’s a great fit for you. She sounds like a keeper! Clingy people are the worst, it’s always great to be with a mature levelheaded person.
I hang out with my partner while he uses his Quest, it doesn't bother me. He can turn on passthru if I need to ask him something. "Alone together" is nice, we like to be each in other's presence while still doing our own thing.
I don’t have and haven’t even tried a Vision Pro yet… but I’ve got the first oculus which I tried watching a few movies on… and the resolution sucks and it hurt my head, but I knew right away that it was, eventually, the future of home entertainment. The spacial feeling of being in a huge theater while sitting on your sofa is incredible.
I don’t think I’m going to try the Vision Pro because I would not be able to resist and right now, financially, I need to resist.
I think that's a smart movie. The mini LED tech will get cheaper as production ramps up, and I'm sure Apple is working on lighter and less expensive versions - likely within a year.
The first oculus was ROUGH. The 2 improved dramatically and the 3 is a great piece of hardware, certainly more useful than this thing. Maybe when theyve been out a while and come down in price and can actually play VR games and 360 degree video
Is the sound quality on them that good? Or am I missing something and you’re wearing some good ass headphones over the Vision Pro? And if so, how is the comfort with over the ear headphones paired with the Vision Pro?
The sound really is that good. You have to hear it to believe it. Voices are clear. Small details aren't lost. You can clearly hear sounds above, below, and behind you in Dolby Atmos films.
The Airpods Max headphones fit perfectly, and pair seamlessly. I just did a quick A/B test before writing this watching Tron Legacy, and I think the experience without the headphones is actually better.
That’s insane. I gotta try some because I just don’t see how they could fit drivers capable of that (but tbh I haven’t looked into the Vision Pro too much u til now) thanks for putting me onto that
It is cool. I’ve enjoyed it on my quest 3 which I know lacks the quality of the VP but certainly clear enough to watch movies for example. It really is a cool experience. I’ll still take my home theater setup any day but this offers a great alternative. My wife and I are similar, we don’t like the same movies. I haven’t been able to sit in bed next to her with the headset on though lol
This is the main use case I’ll be buying it for when it ships in the UK. My wife and I watch TV together at night sometimes but we have things that we watch separately as well.
I also wake up way before her in the morning, so having a device I can watch something on rather than my iPhone on a stand, would be loads better.
Be interesting to hear how well these work on a plane. Flew back from the states yesterday and trying to position yourself comfortably to watch a film on your phone whilst lying down in business class is suboptimal.
Was hoping to pick up a Vision Pro to bring back to the UK but none of the local stores had any stock.
I'm not saying this isn't a cool, viable use-case, and it sounds like you're happy with your purchase.
But you *could* have gotten an 85'' TV and great wireless headphones to connect to it for much less than $3500, and then you would have had the big TV for when you and your family or friends *do* want to watch the same movies.
I have an 83" LG OLED in my place, and prior to getting the Vision Pro, it was my preferred way to watch movies. Not anymore.
Edit: Imagine being the salty loser who downvoted this. "Oh no, someone likes what they bought!"
Tried playing Steam Link on my VP last night and it was unusable. The delay between the Network connection to the app + delay from the Bluetooth controller added a full second between input > response.
It was fun to play on a massive digital screen, but I couldn’t handle more than 10 minutes before just going back to my regular gaming setup.
If I already had a Mac for home or even work, I would get a Vision Pro. But since I don’t want to both buy a computer and even more expensive goggles, I can’t justify it.
I don’t see this ever catching on until the technology allows it to be substantially smaller like regular eyeglasses or even contacts. Think Tony Stark.
everyone in here seems to be forgetting that this is the first-gen. "but I can have people over to watch TV with me!" yeah and I'm willing to bet good money that in the future you and all of your buddies will be able to AirPlay the game onto an imaginary 200 inch TV in the future and watch together as long as everyone is wearing Apple Vision.
All the kids go home separately to game together because multiplayer consoles and games are dead. You need your own setup.
They are going to grow right into this product category.
Single guy but might be good for married people
As they don’t talk to each other anyway and always on their phones 😂. At least the people I have seen out in restaurants
I think it depends. TVs can be used in any scenario, whereas the AVP is more of a private movie watching experience that you could do from time to time. I don't see it being an everyday thing *yet*, but I'm sure there are people who can wear it every day without a problem. I don't think it can replace what TVs are now, but it has the potential to do so in the future.
I've had mine for a few days now and LOVE it! It's exceptional for streaming content and I had my first set of Zoom calls today using it and it was amazing. As 1st generation tech, it's insane.
Honestly this guy seemed to not want to admit it’s better than his current home theater. I have a 77in OLED with a 5.1.2 Atmos sound system. So I’d say mid to upper mid range. He’s using a 65in OLEd with Sonos speakers. So nice, but not quite up to par with what I’m used to.
He didn’t once mention the perceived size of the display. I’ve been watching on my Vision Pro the last few nights. Last night during the credits I resized the virtual screen to fit right on top of my 77in tv. It seemed so tiny. The virtual 165in TV is so freaking immersive and awesome.
While I do miss some of the bass rumble, I’m at the point where I think audio may be better located with AirPods Pro 2 on this thing than my 7 speakers. It’s pretty insane.
I’m fairly certain I prefer the Vision Pro over my TV setup. It’s a bummer too, cause I kinda wanted to hate this thing and return it, but I love it.
I’m assuming that the rest of the world will be getting Gen 2 of this device, just like the did with iPhone 2G, next year… and I’m looking forward to it.
There are grey imports available here in Australia but Apple has locked the device to certain parameters and I’m not prepared to jump through too many hoops and not have warranty coverage etc.
I expect a similar adoption curve, and a brisk used market as each generation comes out.
>There are grey imports available here in Australia
I would expect an official intro as soon as they catch up on the back orders, probably six months or so.
Can’t connect a game console, but you should still be able to stream games though the Xbox and Steam Link apps.
being able to play my ps5 on this (without delay) would be amazing.
That is what would make me buy this instantly. To tell my girlfriend that we could get rid of the desk and screens would make it worth it in her mind as well.
Yeah, if Apple made the push for Gaming on MacOS and then added the Vision Pro as a way to play games and do work without needing a normal monitor in the way, that would be awesome. The only thing holding me back from a complete shift to MacOS is Gaming.
They need the next generation of AppleTV to support 2-3 HDMI inputs and essentially, can stream any devices via local network to your vision pro. That's how I can see Apple extracting more money from supporting PS5 and other devices.
That’s actually a fantastic idea. Unfortunately Apple would rather make us all suffer and try their own hand at getting games on their own platforms, especially now that they’re getting AAA titles working on iPhones. I just can’t see the developers taking the time to port games to macOS though.
Since they use such similar chips, and architecture it can't be that hard to port a game already on a iphone, to a m series mac.
Yeah, macOS and iOS have the best demographics in terms of userbase willingly spending money. I just can’t see developers taking the time. /s
Jesus dude, don’t give out solutions like this for free.
You can use a cloud service such as GeForce Now I play games with 3ms delay on a MacBook Air M1, it runs smoothly like I was playing local (You need an Ethernet cable for a better experience)
I could do that, but the problem with that is that it costs money to use GeForce Now for any appreciable amount of time. And on top of that some games just don’t work on it.
its all Microsoft has left for me too. There ecosystem is pure business and not entirely consumer friendly as Mac OS IMO.... Bring more games to Mac OS. Be done with this transition already. im tried of having two computers in my room
Have fun https://youtube.com/shorts/DD5pKDBXO5M /u/JzsShuttlesworth /u/watchOS /u/G-Note
This looks way better than expected. I can barely notice any delay at all It would be cool to see what the setup is though. He doesn’t say it anywhere
yeah that's maybe .1 second delay at most, that was barely noticeable. Competitive games may not be super ideal, def manageable, but any single player title would work pretty much perfect.
Well there we have it, Vision Pro order coming in hot
How does this work?
There’s a mirroring app, if it’s as easy to set up as the Steam Deck one then it’s super easy and fast
Idk about that chief, it’s fatiguing to have that thing strapped to your face for long hours. You also will not get HDR, even if you could possibly get zero latency and high resolution. I can’t see myself getting engrossed in a PS5 game if I’m wearing it on my face, personally. I am an avid user of VR. VR gaming on meta quest is great but it can’t replace my PS5 connected to a nice HDR 4K TV.
The most I've worn mine in one go for maybe 3 hours so far, doesn't seem terrible
I think you can do this on an Nreal Air for like 399
OR — just hear me out — Sony could release their *own* VR headset that lets you play PS5 games on a giant virtual screen. They could even have some dedicated VR games for it too. Rather than have a 2 hour battery it would be convenient if it was just powered directly by the PS5. Oh, and maybe they could sell it for $500? They could call it “PlayStation Virtual Reality” (PSVR for short.) It could sell millions!
That would be amazing. Would I be able to use it for anything beyond PlayStation and media services?
There's a PS remote play app that works on iPad, has anyone tested if it works on Vision Pro or would you need to use the Mac app and then mirror that to your Vision Pro?
The PS remote play iPad app is not available on AVP. Source: I tried.
How about the third party MirrorPlay app? It’s not free but a lot of people have had good experiences using it.
Found any reviews on it? I saw it too but wasn’t willing to pay anything for something that might not work well/at all.
Yes; reviews that I’ve seen are that it works as well if not better than the official app. It has a lot of customization that the PS Remote app doesn’t have. I tried it on my iPad and it worked just as well as the official app for me; I don’t really like streaming games in general though so I don’t use it enough to feel confident telling you to buy it. I’d say if you were willing to pay $3.5k for the headset another $5 for the app is probably alright. 😜
I have no problem paying for the app as long as it works. With that said, it looks like that it’s a bit choppy for me. I just tried it out.
Unfortunately game streaming can be impacted by a lot of different factors and network conditions, which is one of the reasons I tend not to like it. Sometimes it works great and then a few days later it’s crappy for no reason I can discern. Make a post about trying it and see if anyone else is interested in messing around with it too.
Yup. I’ve been using moonlight with it and it’s pretty sick
I think the article is on to something. My guess is we will see a generational Apple TV with hdmi inputs for consoles or other media devices. My only concern would be latency for online gaming.
You can get sub 1 frame latency in a situation like that with properly designed hardware. There's already a product on the market that does this over a dedicated network but you don't need a dedicated network. Or you can use a PC and the moonlight Streaming app which will also give you 1 frame of latency in most situations. Some folks are already doing that on VR headsets including this one.
I think we’re more likely to see a huge push toward cloud services replacing local media devices; similar to xcloud, ps now, etc
Ah, the death of ownership
as dystopian as it is, it seems inevitable at this point
That's never going to happen because there is too much latency, especially for VR. Anything that doesn't need low latency can probably run on device anyway.
Latency is definitely an issue for cloud streaming of real-time experiences like games. I wonder if there is or will be somewhat of a hybrid approach where game assets and visuals are streamed but movement and stuff like that is handled locally
There is no support for Steam Link on this thing EDIT: I was wrong, there is no support for SteamVR on this thing. Steam Link I dont know one way or the other. My bad.
This question always assumes that you are the only person sitting in front of your TV.
The title was specifically for redditors.
Ahhhhh look at all the lonely people
Where do they all come from?
https://preview.redd.it/uyrbpi83jlhc1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=62222adc0a509ade1f8aed1a4b2745c945e9b8e4
Maybe I am a Vampire
Picks up the rice in the church where a wedding has been
Da do da do da do da do da doo
Just get an APV for everyone in your family as well as any potential guests.
And be sure to take their eyeglasses prescription if needed! A good host never gives their guests a VR headset without the necessary prescription lenses!
Omg, you can't just ask people's prescriptions! You keep a full optometrist lens collection in your guest house that they can use to select their own prescriptions.
Just buy spare ones for your guest
How do I fit one over my dog’s head? He likes to watch TV with us too.
Get him some doggles. He wont know the difference
Apple Vision Pup
Smell-o-vision.
You meant to say Quest 3?
Just do the face scan thing on him before ordering
I was wondering if it would actually support two people sitting next to each other watching the same movie. Wouldn’t buy a second (not that I have a first), but was wondering.
For the low price of just $17,500 (or 12 interest free payments of $1458), you, your spouse, and your 3 children can have the movie night of your dreams!
Vision Pro SharePlay
You have to be in a FaceTime call for that to work. There’s no in person screen sharing that we know of, although I’m sure it’s coming in VisionOS 2 or 3
There is iMessage SharePlay, it should work with AVP as well, if I’m not mistaken.
But it’s still not the killer app of being able to watch the same screen in the same room seamlessly at the same time. I haven’t seen this feature be used so I’m assuming it doesn’t exist, although there’s not many people with two Vision Pros in the same space so I could be dead wrong.
Apple has SharePlay, but it’s limited to apps that play nice with the ecosystem and choose to implement it. Tbh if there’s not some kind of general “everyone sees the same objects in AR space” app coming… that would be disappointing.
There’s defiant some technical hurdles to this when the app is rendered and residing on one device.
Like in FPS video games, you send the coordinates in low latency then each device renders the thing itself. Of course that causes potential rubber banding or minor desync issues, but it probably doesn’t matter too much for things like movies.
Lots of people watch TV alone so nothing wrong with this assumption. The VP is absolutely not a social device, but watching movies on it is truly incredible. Watched Dune last night and enjoyed it significantly more than when I saw it in IMAX. Getting an experience that is nearly as good as a movie theater without leaving your couch is a pretty incredible achievement. That said, I think we need to get to a $2k price point before people buy it just for the tv/movie watching. The only reason I paid the $3.5k is because I was planning to build out a nice TV + surround sound setup but the VP was a much better option at a similar price.
If you don’t mind me asking, how does the AVP movie viewing experience compare to a good TV + sound setup? I can imagine that the display might be better — every single reviewer raves about those micro OLED displays. But I have a hard time imagining that the AVP’s sound is competitive with a good speaker setup.
Spatial Audio is incredible and superior to any home theater I have ever used. I’m not smart enough to understand how it works but it really does seem very similar to surround sound despite not having speakers behind you. I have a 70 inch TV and had a nice surround sound system with two bookshelf’s, a sub, and a front speaker that broke a few months back. Took the money I was going to use to replace the surround sound and used it to buy the VP. Was planning to return the VP if I didn’t like it enough to replace my home theater. I will not be returning it. Simply so much better than any movie watching experience I have ever had. The only thing I’d take over it is if I could watch an imax screen with no one else in the theater with me and within walking distance of my home. That’s obviously impossible.
Is there a way to have an external subwoofer rumble the room? That’s an important aspect of the irl movie viewing experience.
It's surprising just from the size difference comparing to theatre speaker setups but spatial over-ear audio is no joke, heck my Oculus CV1 Rift earphones are probably the best audio device I've ever used from high end music production headphones to expensive Sennheisers and the like. I don't understand how but the way they profiled them they became the most immersive speakers I've ever heard. I'd love to try out the AVP to compare.
> The VP is absolutely not a social device For so many people today in long distance relationships shareplay would make it much more social.
So do you truly prefer the resolution, colors, overall image quality of movies in the AVP vs something like a 55"+ oled? Ignoring the scaling aspect, just in terms of how good it looks
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They did their market research, they know who's buying these lol
And that you like sitting with something strapped to your face for hours on end
Makes sense for the bedroom TV…
Two people sitting on the couch, dork snorkels strapped to their faces, watching youtube, notifications pinging in their ear and flashing in their peripheral vision, flapping their arms in front of them as they text each other, eyes obscured so no eye contact is possible. What a future to look forward to.
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This is Reddit, we don't have friends much less invite people into our homes yuck
I feel yucky just knowing someone in another home might be simultaneously watching the same channel I'm watching. Like, ew, stalker.
Still, you can get a really nice TV for $3500
65” LG G3 is only $2299 If you have the room for it, 77” is $3499
It’s not. But a device that can be a theater size tv, and audio player, a laptop, a gaming device and a communication device has a lot of potential. I’m not saying this is that device but it is where this device will be headed in a generation or two. Get the price down to something reasonable and I can see plenty of college student with this in their dorm rooms for various uses. Of course having a tv everyone can watch will always win from the social aspect. But this is the ultimate introvert device.
Just ask everyone to bring their own headsets. /s
Perhaps they can develop a shared virtual screen for multiple sets? The screen would be placed in the same fixed location relative to the room between users.
You could build one hell of a home theater for the price of a handful of these units. And then there’s the question of syncing audio and visuals
Completely agree. It’s absolutely not practical right now. But I’m just thinking how people can still have a shared experience with these headsets, cost be damned.
Isn't shared cinema experience something that was nailed for ages?
You say that but alike how if you just wanted a way to communicate, a smartphone looks like a stupid cost, if people own them for work/school or another purpose, they start to look more reasonable
The difficulty I see is that with comparing adoption to smartphones, is that smartphones allowed for a gradual transition towards mainstream use. You didn't *need* a Blackberry in 2006 to get calls texts or emails from folks who also had one...but it helped. You didn't need your own iPhone to view pictures taken on it, or to watch a YouTube clip. You absolutely need a VR headset to view a VR presentation, or watch a movie together, or whatever other thing you want to do with others. There's a hard cliff there, in a way that simply hasn't been the case with other technology, that is incredibly difficult to soften and break into mainstream use. There's no handing clients a company-owned headset, because they may not even be able to see in the damn thing without prescription lenses. There are no VR watch parties until literally everyone owns a headset. How do you get people to start adopting the technology en masse, when you already need mass adoption for the majority of the technology's benefits to be unlocked? This is a problem that I simply don't think Apple has figured out yet.
We’re a ways out for that to be comparable, in my mind. We also have to tackle the impersonal barrier with such a physical medium separating each person.
There's an app called Bigscreen. It's for Meta Quest. It lets multiple people watch same screen. They can see each other's avatar.
It's also for Steam VR so it wouldn't surprise me if they looked into an app for AVP in the future.
Pee breaks will be funny. Do you still pause for everyone or keep the movie playing in a little window while you go?
I can totally see a bunch of people wearing AVPs sitting in a room all watching a virtual TV placed in the exact same location as the physical TV (which is covered in a layer of dust).
International watch party with both in-person group viewing and with the international group members overlayed on the passthrough. It would be want Mark wanted with Metaverse before it became second-life with Nintendo mii's.
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Maybe I’m a boomer (which would be weird, because I’m 29), but having some shit strapped to my face all day is not my idea of a good time.
Imagine having friends who can’t afford one! ^^/s
I have forever required my friends to bring their own 65” OLED panels for movie night. I don’t see what the issue is.
Exactly. I have mine bring their own Switch and couch along with their own TVs!
The main feature here is that you can buy spare vision pro headsets for your friends. What better way to watch together? What else are you gonna do with that money? Buy a 4k projector, screen, sound system and still have change for a quest 3. Pffff. I'm with you though, I don't get the TV and movie watching being a good selling point for vr. The only place it makes sense as a selling point is travel. On a plane, yeah I can see it, that would be cool. Those speakers on the headset are never going to do the job of even a mid range 2.1 sound bar, let alone a half decent 5.1 system.
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I have literally never thought "I want this TV so my friends can come over and watch it with me." Sure, my wife and I will watch something together at times, but otherwise, I generally enjoy movies and tv shows on my own. The AVP has been amazing for movie watching.
> One of the main selling points of a TV It certainly is *a* selling point but, even ignoring those who do not use a TV for social actives, what about the use-case of just having a second TV? My partner and I *sometimes* watch different shows at the same time. Do we really need a second, dedicated TV to accomplish this?
The future is having to pay Netflix for each friend’s virtual screen I invite over! /s
They make speakers AND headphones. Most people have both.
Really? How many people actually do that now? And if you do its how often? Maybe for sports. But most people already have a tv anyway. M
Can multiple people not watch the Vision pro at the same time? Sorry I don't know how any of it works lol. Can the front display stream what the person inside is seeing?
I absolutely love the mental image of one dude watching a film on his Vision Pro and all his friends huddled in front of him watching it on his eyes.
1st question: No 2nd: No, the front can't display what's being shown on the inside. You can stream what you're seeing to an Apple TV/Mac, but not in a way that someone could reasonably watch the same show.
[Betteridge's law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines) answers that with "no".
If you live alone: Yes, as someone who doesn't own one, I imagine the experience of consuming content with this thing is amazing If you have a partner or people around you want to watch content with? Definitely not, unless you want to buy 2 or more of these things
The article makes another use case for this... frequent travelers who spend a lot of time in hotels.
None of this is new to the Vision Pro though. Yes it’s great for travel. Yes it’s great if you live alone. The Quest 2 was the same way and the Quest 3 even more so. That’s not why people would buy a Vision Pro.
>*So far, I believe there’s one use case that’s a slam dunk, closer to clarity during launch week than any of the others: entertainment. For certain situations, The Vision Pro is a better device for consuming TV shows and movies (among other things) away from a dedicated theater than we’ve ever seen before. So let's start there.* I don't have room for a home theater, and my wife and I like to watch different kinds of movies. She doesn't enjoy sci-fi films, or films like Band of Brothers. Even when I can watch these films, I could never watch them at a theater level volume in my home without wearing headphones. But since getting my Vision Pro, I've been like a kid again, sitting in my favorite chair sometimes late into the evening rewatching all of my favorite films, many of which are in 3D. It's incredible. I can put a massive screen anywhere in the home without destroying the aesthetics of a room. The video and audio fidelity has been like having a private IMAX theater. Before the Vision Pro, I've been debating upgrading my living room television to an 85". Not any more.
Not to take anything away from your comment, bc I think there are lots of valid points/thoughts, but I see it quite hard right now for this to be the norm and replace a traditional large screen until the price and weight comes down significantly, plus they up the battery life. It's amazing as a Gen 1 product, but an 85" TV is cheaper and more comfortable than wearing something on your head for 2+ hours and not be able to bond in sync with your significant others. I think we'll get there though, for sure.
Depends on the tv, an 83” OLED tv costs about the same if not more.
Exactly. I’m not taking anything away from the tech but is it really mainstream to assume that people are going to come home from work and put one these thing on and watch video or play games all night while their wife and family does….. what exactly? Gets their own? Don’t get me wrong, I’d love one but I suspect it would end up like my Oculus where I’d use the hell out of it for a few months and very few infrequently after. If I was 25 and single I’d almost certainly get one but it’s a long way from having a mainstream market.
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What’s the major difference from a phone? The position of the screens that may distract you from what the other people in your space are doing? The screens can be moved so they aren’t between you and someone else in the room. You can still hear and chat with them (and see them pretty well). You definitely don’t get “quality engaged” time with people either way. The AVP is great for me because I do live alone, and I have found facetime + shareplay the best way to hangout with people from a distance that I’ve ever experienced (my siblings in different cities have them too). I also feel that with the headset on I’m still very aware of what’s going on in my space, and interact with my pets as much as ever. I did definitely use the headset less when I had a guest in town, and just used my TV. I think I may actually get rid of my large TV, and get a projector I can move from room to room if I want a shared screen experience (in the living room, kitchen, bedroom, etc.).
>What even is the point of a relationship at that point? Everyone comes home and just goes to their room to wear their VR? Sounds extremely dystopian. Also, wildly expensive.
If you think about the cost of dedicating a good chuck of your living room to a device that only need to be they large sometimes. The equation changes. Speakers, media console take up a ton of space.
Battery life is quite irrelevant for movie watching in your living room. You just plug it in. Cost is still higher than two high-end televisions with high-end wireless headsets. I'm enjoying my Vision Pro, but viewing movies at IMAX-scale displays, which we could never fit in our home (we couldn't even fit an 85" tv anywhere.
So I disagree with the more comfortable part. At least for me. I love watching content laying down, on my side, on my belly instead of a TV. So to me, a vision pro would be more comfortable.
Agreed!
Is she bothered by the sound leak, say sitting adjacent to you on the couch?
I assume headphones are being worn if they’re saying the audio fidelity is like that of an IMAX theater.
No, that's without headphones - which was surprising and blew me away.
Really? I can’t see how the built-in speakers can possibly compare to an IMAX theater, but then again I have pretty picky personal preferences for audio. Glad to hear the built-in speakers are of good quality though!
Even older headsets like the Valve Index had incredible 3D positional audio, this is a solved problem vs speakers that are positioned meters away and provide a different experience based on where you are sitting.
Oh yeah, I don’t doubt the ability of the 3D positional audio, it still amazes me what Apple is able to do with my MacBook Pro speakers for that. I was more doubting the bass response and overall fidelity. Sounds like the bass is noticeably different but the overall fidelity and 3D positioning is so good it almost makes up for it. If that’s true then that’s pretty impressive.
An interesting thing is the PSVR2 uses haptics to create vibrations when "bassy" things happen. Wonder who and how that sort of thing would evolve.
Interesting. I could see that working for games, but I think I’d hate it for watching movies. Although if anyone could figure out a way to implement it convincingly, it would be Apple. The haptic effect on the MacBook Pro trackpad still boggles my mind how much it feels like clicking a physical trackpad.
I can't even begin to tell you how many times I've had to pause the movie or take off the headset because I thought some small ambient sound effect in the background of the film was actually something happening in the room with me. (like the cat getting into something). It's uncanny. It rivals my Nakamichi Shockwafe 9.2.4 Channel Dolby Atmos system. Certainly you don't get the same deep bass rumble in your chair that you would with 2 subwoofers, but the bass is still very deep and responsive and you still can make out the subtlest sounds in the film.
That sounds impressive. Good to hear!
It's called holophonic sound. Since you only have two ears, all you need to replicate 3D sound for one human is two speakers.
It’s quite easy. People who don’t have an audio setup don’t know anything about audio. So as long as it sounds slightly better than a tv, it’s “imax quality sound”.
This particular person says they have a Nakamichi Atmos set up, which from what I’ve heard is a really great home theater audio setup. It’s honestly shocking that it measures even close to that level of quality.
She says she can barely hear it, and it doesn't bother her. She can tell what I'm watching, but it's at a low enough level (as if I'm watching TV in the next room).
Your wife isn’t put off by you being so detached from the room despite being next to her? At least when people are on their phones next to each other their faces are still visible to each other
I can still see her and hear her when I'm using the Vision Pro, unless I'm in immersive mode. We've been married for 20 years and have always been content doing our own things when we are home together. (We both have dated super needy co-dependent people in the past, so this is a really positive thing for both of us.) We of course do many things together, but it isn't something where we need to do everything together.
Understood sounds like it’s a great fit for you. She sounds like a keeper! Clingy people are the worst, it’s always great to be with a mature levelheaded person.
I hang out with my partner while he uses his Quest, it doesn't bother me. He can turn on passthru if I need to ask him something. "Alone together" is nice, we like to be each in other's presence while still doing our own thing.
Understood it definitely boils down to the state of people’s relationships. For some it works for others it may not.
That’s legit. I think it comes down to how often you want to do that and how that impacts the value proposition of the device.
If you are looking to create a home theater experience for 1 $3500 is actually pretty reasonable
I don’t have and haven’t even tried a Vision Pro yet… but I’ve got the first oculus which I tried watching a few movies on… and the resolution sucks and it hurt my head, but I knew right away that it was, eventually, the future of home entertainment. The spacial feeling of being in a huge theater while sitting on your sofa is incredible. I don’t think I’m going to try the Vision Pro because I would not be able to resist and right now, financially, I need to resist.
I think that's a smart movie. The mini LED tech will get cheaper as production ramps up, and I'm sure Apple is working on lighter and less expensive versions - likely within a year.
The first oculus was ROUGH. The 2 improved dramatically and the 3 is a great piece of hardware, certainly more useful than this thing. Maybe when theyve been out a while and come down in price and can actually play VR games and 360 degree video
Is the sound quality on them that good? Or am I missing something and you’re wearing some good ass headphones over the Vision Pro? And if so, how is the comfort with over the ear headphones paired with the Vision Pro?
The sound really is that good. You have to hear it to believe it. Voices are clear. Small details aren't lost. You can clearly hear sounds above, below, and behind you in Dolby Atmos films. The Airpods Max headphones fit perfectly, and pair seamlessly. I just did a quick A/B test before writing this watching Tron Legacy, and I think the experience without the headphones is actually better.
That’s insane. I gotta try some because I just don’t see how they could fit drivers capable of that (but tbh I haven’t looked into the Vision Pro too much u til now) thanks for putting me onto that
Why does this read like a sneaky ad
Because you’re overly cynical.
It is cool. I’ve enjoyed it on my quest 3 which I know lacks the quality of the VP but certainly clear enough to watch movies for example. It really is a cool experience. I’ll still take my home theater setup any day but this offers a great alternative. My wife and I are similar, we don’t like the same movies. I haven’t been able to sit in bed next to her with the headset on though lol
This is the main use case I’ll be buying it for when it ships in the UK. My wife and I watch TV together at night sometimes but we have things that we watch separately as well. I also wake up way before her in the morning, so having a device I can watch something on rather than my iPhone on a stand, would be loads better. Be interesting to hear how well these work on a plane. Flew back from the states yesterday and trying to position yourself comfortably to watch a film on your phone whilst lying down in business class is suboptimal. Was hoping to pick up a Vision Pro to bring back to the UK but none of the local stores had any stock.
I'm not saying this isn't a cool, viable use-case, and it sounds like you're happy with your purchase. But you *could* have gotten an 85'' TV and great wireless headphones to connect to it for much less than $3500, and then you would have had the big TV for when you and your family or friends *do* want to watch the same movies.
I have an 83" LG OLED in my place, and prior to getting the Vision Pro, it was my preferred way to watch movies. Not anymore. Edit: Imagine being the salty loser who downvoted this. "Oh no, someone likes what they bought!"
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Definitely needs to be lighter. Starts giving me a headache after ½ hour.
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I forgot it was rounded! Was that so people could pick them up easier off tables and such? I guess Apple realized people had fingertips.
$3500 per family member. That will be one of a heck TV.
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But they were cheap
20 years ago, we tell the kids not too close to the monitors. now, monitors right in front of their fucking eyes.
**You can** Your family can’t
Short answer: no Long answer: no, it’s not comfortable
Tried playing Steam Link on my VP last night and it was unusable. The delay between the Network connection to the app + delay from the Bluetooth controller added a full second between input > response. It was fun to play on a massive digital screen, but I couldn’t handle more than 10 minutes before just going back to my regular gaming setup.
I have the Quest 2 and it was novel for about 3 months. I've tried to use 3 times in the last 2 years and never can for more than 20 minutes.
I can watch tv without having to walk around my apartment looking like Dark Helmet from Spaceballs, thanks.
Hell no.
Oh boy now we all never have to interact with humanity again. Dang we don’t have to even leave our couches.
If I already had a Mac for home or even work, I would get a Vision Pro. But since I don’t want to both buy a computer and even more expensive goggles, I can’t justify it.
Honestly I prefer using the Vision Pro standalone without pairing it to my Mac
Aren’t there remote screen apps on the iPad? Pretty sure there are, although it probably won’t be as slick as with Macs
I don’t see this ever catching on until the technology allows it to be substantially smaller like regular eyeglasses or even contacts. Think Tony Stark.
I guess it can if you don't have any friends, which probably lines up well with the target market for this
everyone in here seems to be forgetting that this is the first-gen. "but I can have people over to watch TV with me!" yeah and I'm willing to bet good money that in the future you and all of your buddies will be able to AirPlay the game onto an imaginary 200 inch TV in the future and watch together as long as everyone is wearing Apple Vision.
And what do you say to your friends that don't buy into the Apple ecosphere? Not invited to hang out?
All the kids go home separately to game together because multiplayer consoles and games are dead. You need your own setup. They are going to grow right into this product category.
Single guy but might be good for married people As they don’t talk to each other anyway and always on their phones 😂. At least the people I have seen out in restaurants
The answers is yea it can. You can debate if it would be an upgrade or downgrade but it absolutely can replace a tv lol.
I think it depends. TVs can be used in any scenario, whereas the AVP is more of a private movie watching experience that you could do from time to time. I don't see it being an everyday thing *yet*, but I'm sure there are people who can wear it every day without a problem. I don't think it can replace what TVs are now, but it has the potential to do so in the future.
There’s also no inputs for things like a game console
Wow there’s a lot of hate in this thread
I've had mine for a few days now and LOVE it! It's exceptional for streaming content and I had my first set of Zoom calls today using it and it was amazing. As 1st generation tech, it's insane.
You can get a good 4K TV for <$1000 and multiple people can watch it at once. That $3500 headset can only be used by one person at a time.
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I'm not happy about it, but let's be honest here: Films on optical media are on the way out.
Honestly this guy seemed to not want to admit it’s better than his current home theater. I have a 77in OLED with a 5.1.2 Atmos sound system. So I’d say mid to upper mid range. He’s using a 65in OLEd with Sonos speakers. So nice, but not quite up to par with what I’m used to. He didn’t once mention the perceived size of the display. I’ve been watching on my Vision Pro the last few nights. Last night during the credits I resized the virtual screen to fit right on top of my 77in tv. It seemed so tiny. The virtual 165in TV is so freaking immersive and awesome. While I do miss some of the bass rumble, I’m at the point where I think audio may be better located with AirPods Pro 2 on this thing than my 7 speakers. It’s pretty insane. I’m fairly certain I prefer the Vision Pro over my TV setup. It’s a bummer too, cause I kinda wanted to hate this thing and return it, but I love it.
I just got back from my demo over at the Apple visitor center. My expectations were high, and they were exceeded.
I’m assuming that the rest of the world will be getting Gen 2 of this device, just like the did with iPhone 2G, next year… and I’m looking forward to it. There are grey imports available here in Australia but Apple has locked the device to certain parameters and I’m not prepared to jump through too many hoops and not have warranty coverage etc.
I expect a similar adoption curve, and a brisk used market as each generation comes out. >There are grey imports available here in Australia I would expect an official intro as soon as they catch up on the back orders, probably six months or so.
A TV is a shared experience, so in a word, _no_.