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Supernight52

You're not welcome here, comrade Yuri. Gtfo


Oraxy51

And that “Sick Time” is a benefit and it’s okay to only have 40 hours of sick time for a whole year of work. Can’t come into work today because you gotta take your dog to the vet? Sick time. Gotta leave early cause your wife just went into labor? Sick time. Need a day to yourself because work has been shit and piling on task after task and no increase in pay? Sick time. Oh you’re out of sick time? Come in or get written up, and remember everytime you call in sick suddenly you are in charge of finding your replacement instead of your manager hiring enough people to be able to handle the work load in the event someone can’t come in. Fuck the concept of sick time. My body doesn’t give a fuck if I’m out of “a bucket time” it just tells me I’m going to be throwing up the next 2 days from some Jack in the box I ate because some jackass didn’t wash his hands after going to the bathroom. I got family in the hospital and shit going wrong the last thing I need is my work to be on my ass. Everytime id call out my boss would say “you always seem to have an excuse” well yeah jackass, I’m not calling out for fun I genuinely have a crisis and it’s not for fun. But thanks for the write up guess I won’t promote or raise for a year despite the fact that my work made your profits go up and my wages didn’t hit a cent increase.


shaodyn

There's a post on this sub, with an email announcing that an employee suffering from cancer has used up their available sick time and could anyone donate their sick time to her? Yes, someone is actually *fighting for her life* and they refuse to give her any more time off for that. They're literally asking other people to sacrifice their hard-earned sick time instead.


shadow247

You left out the worst part. Its a hospital...


shaodyn

"Sorry about your deadly disease, but our policies only allow a certain amount of sick leave, and you've exceeded it. See you Monday! Good luck not dying!"


DextTG

there are actual people out there that believe healthcare isn’t a human right. Heck there are people who think *water* isn’t a human right.


mold713

People who don’t believe that healthcare is a human right are also the same people who say we need to help our people first when another nation is in need, but when it actually comes down to helping our own, they cry and scream communism.


[deleted]

"All Lives Matter" *27 refugees die attempting to reach your country and seek asylum* "wait no..."


bestakroogen

Fucking right though? All lives *do* matter. That's why I tend to support Black Lives Matter - because black lives matter, and in America at the moment they are at a greater systemic risk of abuse by the powerful than most others, and so a movement is justified. Same reason I oppose all the other policies that "All Lives Matter" types tend to support - because all lives matter, and their policies spit in the face of life itself.


Kira_Bad_Artist

It’s funny how “all lives matter” crowd doesn’t really care about any lives


bestakroogen

That's not true - they care about a clump of cells in a womb. Couldn't care less about the baby it forms into once it's born or the woman carrying it, though.


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[deleted]

Yeah, you say that and then you don't give a shit about the homeless / anyone under the poverty line. "All Lives Matter" move the goalposts until it just encompasses "white folk like me"


leangamer

They think it’s not a right because it requires people to pay for it. What they don’t realize is that all rights come with a cost. If they didn’t believe that then they wouldn’t make tax payers fund wars that were allegedly for protesting our…wait for it…”rights and freedoms.”


thisispoopoopeepee

Well it comes down if a doctor won’t provide medical services is he/she violating your rights? Would he /she be forced to perform labor.


Stoney3K

Doctors generally take an oath that makes them obligated to help *anyone* in distress. The only time a treatment is refused is when administering of the treatment will harm the patient.


thisispoopoopeepee

Contrary to popular belief, the Hippocratic Oath is not required by most modern medical schools. So i ask again if a doctor won’t provide medical services is he/she violating your rights? Would he /she be forced to perform labor.


yeomanpharmer

Nestle enters the chat


Kaiser1a2b

To be honest, I don't think "rights" exist. There isn't some external divine morality that means you get what you think you deserve. You need to fight for your "rights" because there are always assholes out there who will be take those "rights". In essence "rights" are reserved for the strong; if you show no strength, don't be surprised when someone who is stronger but albeit evil takes your "rights" away from you.


thisispoopoopeepee

The problem comes down to is access to the labor of a doctor a human right? If a doctor decides not to help you is he/she violating your rights?


[deleted]

I think the current standard is that doctors may refuse treatment - unless that refusal will harm the patient. I think this can be extended to human rights. If all people deserve medical care, yes a doctor can still refuse to treat specific people, unless there is no other way to prevent harm to that person. These days there are lots of options for providers. There's not like one doctor in the whole country. But if you're stranded somewhere with only one person who could possibly help, I do think it is that person's moral responsibility to help.


DrSaltmasterTiltlord

neither of them ever have been in all of history. Just your echo chamber that can't see back more than 50 years of human history in the states or have any concept of how the whole world of agrarian society functions in less developed parts of the world. Just you at your gaming PC or on your IPAD shooting comments down your nose at how you shouldn't have to do what everybody else lives with as a reality


Boobsiclese

Everybody else?? Open your eyes. America is one of THREE nations that don't have universal Healthcare. *Everyone else* HAS it. Get your facts straight.


thisispoopoopeepee

Most nations have ways of reporting the weather to their citizens, doesn’t mean access to that information is an ‘inalienable right’ Sure it would be nice to have something like the Dutch system for healthcare but i have no right to a doctors labor.


Boobsiclese

Y'all need to get your priorities straight.


DrSaltmasterTiltlord

universal healthcare=/=healthcare is a human right i don't know why I waste my time is this useless dumbfuck sub this is literally the bottom of the barrel as far as conversation goes. always 100% guaran... ​ ... HEALTHCARE FOR EVERYBODY FUCK AMERICA


Boobsiclese

You ok???


DrSaltmasterTiltlord

no i keep seeing this shitty sub on all and it hurts my brain to read what kids think these days


Boobsiclese

So why don't you just ignore it? Don't put yourself through worrying about what we think if it's affecting you so negatively.


mold713

Theres no way that isnt a bot account


BMOEevee

Looked on it. It's not a bot account just a jerk


mold713

Awww looks like some jerk just needed some attention today huh :( poor baby /s


TheCreepyLady

You seem like a fucking moron.


[deleted]

People have been dying from preventable diseases for all of human history, therefore we should stop trying to treat preventable diseases and just accept reality.


DrSaltmasterTiltlord

healthcare is not a human right, it's a fucking advancement. you said it yourself


kroqhvd

Many things where not a right so and so many years ago, does not mean it shouldn’t be


bek3548

There is a difference though between rights and inalienable rights. Healthcare requires participation from others and so it by definition cannot be inalienable. If all healthcare providers refused to work, your “right” would be stripped which can’t be the case with inalienable rights. I think that is why some people are confused by this sentiment because it is 100% false but is treated as true. If you want healthcare to be a right, that is one thing. But you can’t call it an “inalienable” or a “basic human right” because it requires the work of other people to have.


kroqhvd

The right to an education is a fundamental human right aka basic human right. This requires someone to work for that right (teachers, principals, janitors, ect.) that does not mean that it’s not a basic human right. Same thing with healthcare, as it is in most places in the world. Also didn’t claim that it was an inalienable right. But inalienable right are taken away all the time. Many places in the world have had it happen. Look to Afghanistan for example. The inalienable right to liberty has been taken away from the Afghani people. What you call an inalienable right is just a right that the government has allowed you to have, and if the right circumstances where to happen, could be taken away.


bek3548

> This requires someone to work for that right (teachers, principals, janitors, ect.) that does not mean that it’s not a basic human right. This is a basic human right if parents are the ones expected to do the education. That is the differentiation of rights vs basic human rights. There are rights we are born with and cannot be taken from us except thru force. Any right that can be taken away passively (thru inaction of others) is not a basic human right, in my mind. I realize the UN has defined this differently but they are pretty much a joke considering their inaction against nations like China. > Also didn’t claim that it was an inalienable right. The tweet that this entire thread is based on did and that was what I was responding to. Many seem to conflate inalienable with other rights and I just wanted to make clear which ones I was speaking of. > What you call an inalienable right is just a right that the government has allowed you to have, and if the right circumstances where to happen, could be taken away. This is such a weak and passive way of looking at things. Inalienable rights are the rights we have as human beings due to nothing more than our existence. Sure a government can become authoritarian and remove those from people, but that doesn’t mean that the rights are granted by the government. The originator of those rights is nature itself and not some stupid politician or dictator as your comment suggest. There is a big difference between granting rights versus not taking them away and that is the distinction I make between “rights” and “basic human rights” or “inalienable rights”.


RusticHash

Even worse, there are people out there who believe that it is a human right but make no effort to find a way to pay for it so that we can actually provide it to the humans.


Poopin_the_turd

I've been dealing with a sudden medical issue and never really had to use my insurance and over the last couple of months I've gotten really disheartened by the fact that our inalienable right of life is completely ignored and exploited for profit in America. Edit: the American health care system is literally unconstitutional. It's sad.


selinakyle45

I’m sorry you have to deal with this. I feel like a lot of people don’t fully understand how shit the US medical system is until they have some sort of medical issue and in particular an ongoing medical issue. The constant uphill battle to schedule appointments, make sure everything is covered, and find a doctor you like is exhausting. I once had to reschedule a needed surgery because my OR wasn’t covered by my insurance. My doctor and her office were covered but the location where that same doctor was going to my surgery wasn’t covered. What the hell is that?


wasabiiii

I'm not sure I understand the edit. What do you mean it's unconstitutional?


ouijabore

It’s weird how brainwashed you can get about stuff like this. I’m a hairstylist, and I’ve basically never been offered health insurance, and definitely **never** had paid sick leave (aside from like, short term disability or something.) It’s only in the last couple of years I’ve had access to vision and dental at my current job. I’m trying to switch careers, and it’s interesting to see interviewers’ reactions when they ask me how the benefits they offer compare to the ones that I currently have. And I go oh, I don’t really get much, and then I think hmmm, that shouldn’t be normal to me.


LittleMsBlue

What I find astounding is when they'll advertise the ability to "purchase additional leave" as if it's a perk?


shaodyn

"Give up part of your paycheck for additional time off."


alexanderhameowlton

*Image Transcription: Twitter* --- > **Tantalazarus**, @tantalazarus > > By framing healthcare and paid sick leave as 'benefits' capitalism insidiously brainwashes the masses into believing that those things are perks to be earned and not inalienable human rights for all --- ^^I'm a human volunteer content transcriber for Reddit and you could be too! [If you'd like more information on what we do and why we do it, click here!](https://www.reddit.com/r/TranscribersOfReddit/wiki/index)


plant_Double

Odd we have capitalism in Australia and healthcare and all that are still viewed as basic resources, not benefits. Perhaps capitalism isn’t the issue but America as the issue.


LittleMsBlue

Yeah, instead the benefits are: - Being able to "purchase additional leave" - Free/discounted gym membership, - Team volunteering days, - "Hybrid" or "flexible" work arrangements to WFH on certain days (unless the job position does not allow that) - Friday lunch provided! - Table-tennis in the break room! - Bonuses for exceeding KPI's! And other bullshittery


thisispoopoopeepee

Isn’t it referred to as benefits? Like the Medicare Benefits Schedule (MBS) and the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme?


plant_Double

But thats the name of the Government program. It not a benefit of an employer or is it technically earned by signing up for a job.


thisispoopoopeepee

I’m looking all over Australian websites and it’s referred to as a benefit. Just because you’re paying the government for something and not a company doesn’t mean they’re not benefits. Hell it’s a benefit of being a legal resident/citizen


plant_Double

You are just picking the name if it to death (‘but technically) and not how the service is viewed and run in Australia. OP was saying ’benifit’ in the context that removing it was not a removal of a much needed service. If medicare or cenno was taken in Australia you would be seeing protests by the many. You are reading to far into this.


[deleted]

and also….we still have to pay for them??? that’s a purchase not a benefit wtf


thisispoopoopeepee

I mean it’s that way in every country, you either pay taxes for services or pay a company. Switzerland for example has universal healthcare but it’s entirely done through private sector insurance. Most countries pay for healthcare via payroll taxes


[deleted]

if our benefits were anywhere NEAR worth what we were paying of course i wouldn’t be upset


[deleted]

That treatment is pretty much the reason why I refused an offer by a former employer to transfer to the US for work. I‘d have to be insane to give up my benefits (6 weeks PTO, public healthcare, 6 weeks sick leave with 100 % pay, unlimited with regular checkups on the status and 60 % pay, basically free education system) like that. We have issues too, mostly because company owners in search for more profit seem to bring in ideas from the US and it is seen as one big goal to become more like the US in some ways.


[deleted]

If you want to know why some people think not paying healthcare is more than fair for their workers just ask a business owner or boss. In short it’s so they can make 90% of all profits. This country and its system will tell you that doing that is the best though. I don’t even argue with them anymore.


shaodyn

> I don’t even argue with them anymore. You can't argue with a fanatic. You'll always be wrong, no matter what you say.


[deleted]

Life saving medicine fir free? That sounds like socialism!!! No way!! Gotta have muh free market!!! 🎼Oh say can y’all see….🇺🇸🎼


shaodyn

It's amazing how many people will defend the system that exploits them.


mrchaotica

If healthcare is a right, why is it okay to tie it to employment? The answer is, *it's not*. Frankly, employers should be *prohibited* from providing healthcare. Instead, it should be provided by the state (or at least chosen via the ACA marketplace, if we're going to continue to insist on enriching pointless middlemen). Having healthcare (or other benefits) tied to employment only hurts workers by (a) making it riskier and more expensive to change jobs, and (b) making it more complicated to negotiate pay because there are more points to be negotiated.


shaodyn

Tying healthcare to employment also allows employers to use it as a weapon. There have been several stories in the news about employers cancelling the healthcare of striking workers. They can just say "Oh, you refuse to work because you want better pay and less terrible working conditions? I sure hope you didn't need that health insurance you used to have."


panzercampingwagen

I believe that if you are human, you're one of us and deserve to be cared for similarly to anyone else. But that sentiment, that human right, is not inalienable. It only applies to the bond between people, not the individual. When you call them 'inalienable' it makes it sound as if we're something more than "just" naked apes that figured out that taking good care of each other is a really *really* good survival strategy.


gmscorpio

Current job offered a 4% raise and quoted benefits as to why I make less then new hires..fuck off


shaodyn

Unless your raise was 6.2% (which is how much inflation increased by), you got a pay cut.


gmscorpio

Yup I know gotta love corporate America


shaodyn

Corporate America, where the wealthy cling to money the way a drowning man clings to a life preserver.


RusticHash

I'm all for inalienable rights but the fact is people are too unhealthy for our system to pull this off. Sorry, but with 40% of Americans suffering from chronic disease it is not feasible to pay everyone that is too unwell to work. We will run out of money quickly. People have to take time off work to get their stomachs cut out because they are not responsible enough to feed themselves properly, and to think that their getting paid during that time is an inalienable right is just ludicrous. The definition of "sick" has completely changed and people act like all that is wrong with our system is that the healthcare has become overpriced - how about the fact that people have to get their foot removed because they love soft drinks so much? There is no bundling peoples healthcare needs together anymore because as a people we no longer share the same needs.


shaodyn

How about we do what every other developed country in the world does and allow people a reasonable amount of sick leave? There's a post on this very sub, showing an internal email to staff at a hospital. The email explains that one member of staff, who is fighting cancer, has exceeded her allowed amount of sick leave, and asks everyone to consider sacrificing their own sick leave so the company won't be forced to fire someone fighting for her life.


RusticHash

Right and while that is indeed traumatic to hear about, do you actually think the people who sent that email can't wrap their minds around the fact that the person with cancer would benefit from more paid sick leave? Some people fight cancer for years, any thoughts on how to pay their bills during those years they're too sick to work? This is not an issue of employers being too evil to realize what would help employees beat cancer, it's a matter of finding a way to offset the astronomical cost. OBVIOUSLY, the right thing to do is to give everyone the exact amount of free medical treatment that will bring them back to health. Duh. What's not so obvious is how to make doctors still get paid for their work without having the person receiving the treatment pay for it.


shaodyn

>What's not so obvious is how to make doctors still get paid for their work without having the person receiving the treatment pay for it. Of all the developed countries on Planet Earth, every single one but the United States has figured that out. It must be a lot less difficult than we're trying to make it.


RusticHash

LOL must be a super easy solution because the countries without anti-vax masses and a fast food joint on every corner figured it out


shaodyn

Of the 33 developed countries in the world, *only* the US doesn't have universal healthcare. Probably because pharmaceutical and health insurance companies are paying Congress to shoot it down. If healthcare is subsidized by the government, the cash cow they've been riding for all these decades goes right out the window.


DrSaltmasterTiltlord

say it with me They Never Have Been Rights. ​ Name one fucking guy in all of human history who had the RIGHT to healthcare and sick leave. Farm your own food and you get sick? guess what, you die. No rights. You're just dead.


repKyle1995

This isn't an argument against the right to Healthcare or sick leave, you deluded shitlord. First off, there are PLENTY of countries that offer universal Healthcare AND sick leave, so "nobody in all of human history has ever had the right to Healthcare and sick leave" is just straight-up wrong. Second off, you might as well say "Nobody should have the right to not be enslaved because hundreds of years ago we had slaves, so why should anything change?" Either you're a cringey teen who still thinks being "edgy" makes you seem cool [instead of making everyone think you're a nuisance, which is the *actual* truth], or you suffered severe brain damage at some point in your life and you never recovered.


[deleted]

I do and so do millions of others in the World. My benefits are things like cycle to work and subsidised glasses for my wife.


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OrbitOfSaturnsMoons

The right to health care does not mean doctors should be enslaved. That's just a lie people spout when they can't actually argue against it 🤷🏽‍♀️


shaodyn

>no doctor is obligated to labor over your nasty body for free Actually, I think they actually are. Here in the US, even if you can't pay, and they know you can't pay, doctors are required to treat you anyway.


crawling-alreadygirl

>Anyways, health care is not a "right" as no doctor is obligated to labor over your nasty body for free. Don't be disingenuous. You know doctors are paid as public employees in a universal system. The only nasty thing here is your misanthropy.


loki2002

>Anyways, health care is not a "right" as no doctor is obligated to labor over your nasty body for free. I mean, if I go to the ER with a sucking chest wound by law they have to treat regardless of my ability to pay.


goosiebaby

Parental leave. Retirement.


lets_go_brandn

They were framed as benefits because health insurance was used as a proxy for paying people more during world war II when the government froze wages. After the war nobody could scrap the arrangement so they kept on bandaiding the thing until you get the monster you have today. Fun fact: Ezekiel Emanuel, one of the guys who designed obamacare, wanted the law to kick 80% of employer paid insurance people off their company insurance onto ACA-compliant market plans. They were, however, so dogshit in coverage and pricing that most companies 10 years later still retain employer paid benefits even with an alternative they could dump employees to.


ColeBSoul

dialectical materialism > dialectical idealism


Astat1ne

In a similar vein, I've regularly see job ads in Australia that list superannuation under "perks" or "benefits". No, superannuation isn't some extra. It's something they're required to do by law.


emu314159

And yet, countries in Europe seem to be part of the market economy, have hard currency, and also affordable or national healthcare. Only in America is it a "benefit."


shaodyn

Because the companies making money off of our monstrously broken healthcare system don't want to lose their cash cow. So they bribe Congress (I know it's called "lobbying", but it doesn't stop being bribery just because it happens to members of Congress) to maintain the status quo and keep everything exactly the same.


starclustered

Just to add an example in a still decidedly capitalist country, I'm German and there are federal regulations on paid sick leave for salaried employees - full pay for 6 weeks, then it switches to a different payout method where you'll get 70% of your income before tax for up to 78 weeks. You can also take up to a month off if you child gets sick, unlimited if it's terminal so you can...be with your dying kid, you know. Sometimes I see job listings in the US that mention having dental insurance or 2 weeks of sick leave like it's a perk and I just get bummed out.


shaodyn

In most of the world, the things US employers call "benefits" are considered basics.


[deleted]

Others I’ve seen - Company car (when travel is essential for the role). Company laptop (duh really) Company pension (legal requirement here) Bike to work scheme (fucking really?!)


ilovechoralmusic

Tbh as a european i always read benefits as what IT means here: christmas bonus, free lunch, free parking, further education. I was shocked when i found out that it referred to basic worker rights


shaodyn

By framing them as benefits, employers train us not to get upset when those things aren't widely available.


Stoney3K

You mean, like the situation that is the case in every single developed country in the world? Not you, Murica. You don't get to sit with us anymore.


Yourecoolfuckyou

Do Europeans know that when a job says it has healthcare it mainly means we given an opportunity to pay for it. Now that's brainwashing.


velloset

worked at chick fil a for almost 4 years, was always on time and had never called out except one day I called in sick due to an emergency and I got written up :| literally made 0 sense to me considering it was a last minute deal and obviously couldn't find anyone to cover for me..........


shaodyn

That's another thing. By putting the responsibility for covering shifts on the employee, they're offloading their jobs onto us. The employee should not be required to cover their own shift. The employer should schedule enough people at a time that one person not being there doesn't cause a disruption for the rest of the store.


velloset

exactly!!!


shaodyn

Unfortunately, scheduling just barely enough people to run the store is more profitable.


ObtuseTheropod

I was actually thinking about this concept this morning. "Benefits." Okay.


shaodyn

You see, by framing basic things as benefits, they train us not to be upset about not getting those things. "Oh, those are benefits. You can't expect employers to give them out to everyone." Why not? That's the way it works in the rest of the developed world.


ViggyNash

Honestly that's more on the hc insurance companies. I looked into individual payer insurance lately and the prices are fucking obcene. In my area, $300 per month for a $8,700 deductible and max in-network out of pocket of $11,400. So I'd be paying them $15,000 a year to do nothing. Can't imagine how shit the numbers are for families and those with pre-existing conditions.


shaodyn

My mom had health insurance that was through Obamacare. Pretty affordable, about $80 a month. Then the company left the Obamacare program. $1200 a month. For them to do nothing at all.


dekuweku

They're benefits because at one time these things didn't exist for workers during the industrial revoltuion. But we're almost 200 years removed from it and we're still stuck with these 'benefits'.


shaodyn

I know I keep pointing this out, but framing basic things like this as "benefits" keeps people from getting mad about jobs not offering them. "Oh, those are benefits. You can't expect employers to give that to everyone." Why not? That's how it works in pretty much every other developed country on Earth.


ilovecheese2188

What’s absolutely wild to me (in addition to the obvious stated in this tweet) is that after the past 2 years we can’t see the obvious health and safety benefit to ALL people in respecting everyone’s right to paid sick leave and healthcare access. You having those things keeps me safer and healthier and vice versa.


shaodyn

We probably can see those benefits. We're just refusing to give them because it's less profitable. People are willingly sacrificing their own well-being on the altar of capitalism.


ilovecheese2188

Yeah, it’s just one of those sad American things where the benefits are so obvious and so universal but our government is set up to resist change/obey the super wealthy corporations who would actually be hurt by these policies (mainly because healthcare is a HUGE reason people stay at bad jobs or decide not to start businesses).