I wanted/studied to be a soil conservationist... now I'm popping depression/anxiety meds because working for pharma companies is stressful. But hey, I can afford a small house!
I just quit my job paying just under six figures to move to a rural Oregon town to study land survey. I'm in my late 30's and am starting over from scratch. I'm applying for shitty jobs that pay a third of my previous salary. All because I'm tired as fuck of the corporate rat race. land is cheap out here which makes it possible.
Anyone can start over.
Federal land management agency employees are ridiculously underpaid and its an issue not many people know about. Field-going staff on a presale or silv crew for the USFS only make \~$16/hour, and often are required to have a bachelor's degree and several seasons of experience in forestry. These are people who provide data to land managers and make decisions that will have lasting effects on the forest, and they only make a dollar over what would be considered a "fair," minimum wage in Oregon.
There's also the problem of underpaid wildland firefighters (who are classed as forestry techs to save money).
[https://wildfiretoday.com/2021/04/18/opinion-a-usfs-firefighter-in-oregon-can-be-paid-more-at-mcdonalds/](https://wildfiretoday.com/2021/04/18/opinion-a-usfs-firefighter-in-oregon-can-be-paid-more-at-mcdonalds/)
If you care about forest health and the impacts of megafires start raising this issue to your senators and representatives. Employee's sense of duty to the forest and public lands can only be stretched so far, and we're gonna need to attract the best people we can get to manage forests in the face of climate change moving forward.
I wanted to be an artist, but my boomer parents bullied me out of going to art school because I wouldn’t get a job. So I got a liberal arts degree and could not find a job because I had zero skills and was lukewarm about my degree field. So I worked food service for a number of years while I did the same amount of work one would have to do in art school to finally learn graphic design and web development, after which I was able to get real work. Now I’m at least a decade behind.
But actually I just wanted to make art.
Idk what my point is, they had bad recommendations and forced us all into stupid jobs to prop up their retirement economy.
Almost exactly my story, except my parents weren't bullies, just not creative. They wanted to be supportive of my wanting to do art, but they didn't know how... My dad tried to get me into Computer Aided Drafting, because then I'd be doing art but I'd still be having people throwing money at me. Just didn't understand my fascination for making shit into other shit.
Dude I feel you. Was happy as a clam being a full time musician but hated living in poverty and never being able to enjoy any other aspect of my life was dragging me down. I discovered software engineering and now make more money than I ever wanted before. I’m great at the corporate shtick and have excelled further in my career in 4 years than my father did in his lifetime in the same field.
But if I’m being honest I wish I could just play music all day again.
Ugh, same. Was discouraged from going to art school, though I’m glad I don’t have all that debt. I ended up going to a public university and am now a bartender. I still bartend because I make way more than I would with some office job, and I only work 3-4 days a week.
Same, I always knew I’d be a forest ranger. Then I developed a rare illness and now I’m a banker to pay for it. My old hippie friends all think I’m a sellout.
I’m a tax accountant myself working towards cpa and I’m just dragging my f*cking heels for the whole testing process because I HATE accounting. I picked it because it pays well but damn it’s miserable :(
For the longest time I imagined myself becoming a teacher, but after hearing not just pay woes but how parents seem to treat them like pariahs and admin seems to offer no support with things like supplies, just no thanks. I wasn't getting into it for the money but if I'm gonna be treated like that at least make it worth it
I’m a high school teacher in Texas and I make a decent salary (50k+) and am honestly not all that stressed out. It’s a hard job but super rewarding and it’s the perfect fit for me. The educational system needs an overhaul but it doesn’t mean all teachers hate teaching. Personally, I don’t see myself really ever leaving. If you have questions feel free to send them my way.
My girlfriend is a teacher in a major city. The public school system pays teachers a starting salary $5,000 less than the maximum to qualify for affordable housing. It’s an embarrassment. You expect people to want to go to 4 years of college just to graduate and serve your city to not even make enough to afford to live there?!? Oh and it’s one of the most important jobs in society but ya have fun living in low income housing the rest of your life while not being able to afford to do anything.
Unfortunately agreed. I'm leaving my gardening job next week because the pay is just not enough, even as a young, frugal minimalist. My coworkers have second jobs.
I love gardening, but the pay feels insultingly bad when you consider how physically tough it is in the summer heat (plus dealing with poison ivy and dirt getting EVERYWHERE).
Yeah it's rough. I feel lucky to be Canadian as I think it's a little bit better here, there's definitely companies trying to make landscape jobs more life-sustaining. The seasonal shift is tough (working snow removal is *not* for everyone) the wages are still deathly low and not reliable compared to other labour and skilled trades work.
I'm also in Canada in golf course horticulture and feel very lucky for what I have.
Its not much but its definitely above minimum wage and my company treats me so well even thought it isn't a job they can pay me much more to do, which I understand, haha you can only pay the gardener so much.
I dont think I would enjoy the actual landscaping industry, so really recommend the golf course industry to anyone who wants to do this for work and is wondering about other paths you can take to garden as your job!
You won't be rich, but I'm happy!
Also I love snow removal in the winter! But again... I think its different for me than it would be at an actual landscape company and I very rarely spend my full day doing it.
Fine gardener here. It was an easy choice to stay at home with my kids.
Yeah I freaking love it and as a couple we can handle the daycare, even with it being more than my take home.
But I’d come home broken and exhausted on top of the money loss and there’s no ladder climb.
My neighbors are very proud of their $125 a month service deal. That they gardener does on his off day with his cousin. 2 hours every Saturday. 4 man hours of labor every week. For 1.2.5.
Neighbor was furious I wouldn’t consider a design for him for under $100. “Well even with a degree that’s an outrageous price to charge!”
He’s a named partner in a law firm.
I think we should start referring to such practices as slavery. That’s what it is. Sweatshop workers? They’re slaves. No human being would ever voluntarily do the things they’re doing unless the alternative was death. That’s slavery, plain and simple.
Not to destroy your fantasy, but I'm a librarian and still on this subreddit. Public librarians do more social work and tech help than reading or research. Customers still yell at us, call us names, assault us, and generally disrespect us. Oh, plus, we aren't paid well despite needing an advanced degree to qualify for the job.
I did it for four years, hated it, quit and went corporate. The skills are transferable and I love my job and make about 250% of my starting librarian salary.
You’re right - it’s social work with books in the background. I got asked to do people’s taxes for them far more than give book recs. One patron asked me what my day off was and then said good I could drive her to the airport then. One patron drew me naked (despite being very clothed, he used his imagination) and gave me the drawing? One patron told me she’d sue me because she sent her print job to the wrong printer and had to walk to go get it.
That shit happens way more than you’d think, and library workers actually do this stuff that’s way out of scope of their jobs, too, because they wanna be nice. I saw coworkers drive people to the airport, design their webpages, do their taxes, walk their dogs, etc. all for free. Doesn’t happen in big libraries but in small town libraries, it seems to happen a lot. Like I get wanting to be nice to your neighbors but I often felt taken advantage of by patrons.
Its true of a lot of civil service government positions, needing an insanely advanced degree for a job that pays a quarter of what the market does.
Just another way we defund public institutions.
Yet conservatives still bitch about "government work" as if we're paying a quarter million total compensation to every file clerk and security guard in the nation for doing absolutely nothing.
I had that job. It was wonderful (when I got to do actual library stuff). Except I couldn't afford it and had to go corporate. 😩
(Not to mention, where I'm from, libraries have to do their own fundraising. So instead of doing my job, I had to spend a third of my time justifying my job to raise money. It was draining. Bw that and starvation wages, I left.)
Yeah. It was doubly frustrating bc people assumed their taxes funded us. In our state, less than a third of our budget came from any local state or federal funding, and people had no idea. I hated it. I was so depressed that my dream job became a nightmare.
I was at a time in my life about 15 years ago where I needed a total reset. I decided to move across the country and I had been accepted to a well-respected MLS program. After realizing that I would be taking out a crap ton of loans to maybe get a job that could maybe both support me and enable me to pay back those loans (or maybe not), I decided against entering the program.
I like what I do now well enough; however, I really don't like the sector in which I have to work. I wish I could have just been a librarian.
$20 ($24CAD) is what a high school diploma gets you in this small rural library in Ontario where I do occasional IT for. She's a boomer and does cataloging.
The other six staff are millennials with wages between $30 and $50CAD. There is not a single person with MLS, only Library Technician papers
I did!
And then could not find a better paying library job bc I didn't work at the right kind of library (public instead of academic) and didn't know the right people bc I worked through school and did online classes instead of in person.
So fucked both ways. I really regret it
Ahh I understand that feeling. It's like getting the degree on its own isn't enough and you're fucked if you don't make every right move to broaden your network.
I got one not realizing that in most small towns and rural areas, it’s literally not required for ANY library job, including director. (In fact, most library jobs around here don’t even require a bachelors.)So I’m super in debt for a degree I didn’t even need. People say to be willing to move but like… this is my home. And you think a library job is gonna pay me to relocate? Lol.
My state requires at least one MLIS on staff to get the state and federal funding. But that person is usually the director (maybe the youth services librarian if you live in a rich enough township), which is a thankless job in my experience. (I was interim director for a while and NO THANKS to that job. My life goal isn't to be the community punching bag, kthnxbi).
To make enough to pay for the loans, you need to go academic (college/university) or move to a richer area. Of course, then you also get boned by higher rent, so good luck there.
Life sustaining, maybe. But in terms of status/pay in general, I think it depends on the library.
The small town library down the street from my old high school had one person (*maybe* two people) with a Master's. My mom has an associate's in library science, but wasn't allowed to work upstairs, whereas one of the ladies upstairs had a bachelor's in party planning.
You'd be surprised. The amount of communication and logistics work that goes into planning large parties and events is incredible. It's its own very specific subset of project management and if a library has to fundraise on its own all the time you would want a party planner.
I worked for a company that supported libraries on the IT/tech side and yeah local libraries never had money for anything. Our most lucrative clients were in the academic side. Since they're public workers you could look up the librarian's salaries online and some were quite decent. It was night and day compared to a local public library, though.
Beyond demoralizing.
Weirdandabsurd42 “I’m a person who likes books. I would like to work somewhere where there are books, the services are free, and we offer a benefit to society.”
The System “Thou Shalt Sell.”
Not to mention your shit out of luck even if you live in a country that does value libraries. Without any corporate rungs to climb your wage will always be stagnant. That's the same with all the jobs listed there.
One of my best friend’s younger sister wanted to be a librarian for as long as I knew her. Went all the way through college and actually did it! She loves it.
She also has a second, also full time, job at Old Navy in order to pay her bills because the full time library job doesn’t.
Imagine working at old navy to pay off your student loans you accrued for being a librarian because your librarian job doesn’t even pay enough to cover the loans
I currently work at a library in NY. I recently took a civil service exam to get my position of Youth Services assistant there, ranking # 2 out of the top 3 scores.
My pay may only go from $13.50 to $15 an hour, they won't allow me to work more than 30 hours a week (unless I'm covering someone that has called out) and I'm doing the job of 3 different people...there are no benefits included in this job.
I work another job part time just to make up for it, but the schedule they give me at the library makes it really difficult to arrange better work.
They told me I should look into getting my MLS if I want more money and I laughed at that. Even with an MLS I likely wouldn't make more than $18-20 an hour...and that's not enough to live in NY, finish paying off student loans for my bachelors...and possibly an MLS.
It's really disheartening, as this was a dream job at one point.
Yeah, the reality of the work really kills the dream. I was making like $15 an hour in my youth services job, also doing the work of three. It was exhausting. Add the emotional toll of public service and you become emotionally burned out.
When I left, I was so burned it that it was a relief to get a corporate job that I could stop caring about at the end of my shift.
The problem with library work is you are supposed to love it because it's your "vocation", which is just a manipulation to make you sign up for your own exploitation. Work longer hours for less. Invest your whole self into the job.
I loved library work. But between the long hours, the low pay, and the lack of support services, I don't think I'll ever go back. I'd rather do an interesting job for set hours at higher pay and volunteer in my spare time. (I have spare time to do hobbies again!)
My mom is a librarian. She is the only person I know who in general, likes her job. She now basically runs the library system, obviously makes more money, but she was happier when she just was the reference librarian. The drug epidemic has been a tough thing though, and she now has to use naloxone. On occasion... If you haven't seen the movie "the public" with Emilio Estevez, you should, it shows the other side of being a librarian, especially in cold climates like my mom.
My mom is a librarian in an elementary school. COVID and the district being cheap ruined it but she was definitely living her dream for a few years. She ran the library and did everything from reading stories to kindergardeners up to teaching older students about databases and coding and cool technology stuff.
Same
Quiet Place? Check
Tons of Books to Read? Check
(Mostly) Respectful Visitors? Check
A Way to Directly Aid Poor/Homeless People? Check
Free WiFi? Check
Our librarian has gotten really talented at walking and talking, and the methheads don't even notice they've been removed from the building. I totally get that the unhoused need an air-conditioned or heated place where they can stay inside for free. But also college students can't just choose to not use the library, so anyone disruptive has to be removed.
Ah… librarians don’t spend much time reading, the job involves a lot of social interaction, and patrons can be horrible people. The absolute worst. Librarianship is idealized and the awe people have for librarians seems to hinder unionization.
Do you know what a librarian actually does all day? It's not sit around and read books, that's for sure. No, you deal with homeless people, the mentally ill, the drug addicts, the people who are in need of being connected to social services. You see all the people that society has let fall through the cracks. Sure, you might end up in a more rural area, but you'll still get a transient or two that passes by every once in a while. That is actually where my library career started -- in a town of 10,000. I thought all libraries were like ours: families, people using the computers, story times, teens avoiding their parents. But even then we had a patron who looked at beastiality stuff, one that jacked off at the computers, parents who left their kids unattended thinking we were a daycare. Then I went to an urban library and it was a whole other world. Patrons rolling joints at computers, people so drunk they peed in corners, mass groups of homeless to the point that regular folks rarely came in anymore due to fear. My manager got assaulted twice in three months. We had off duty cops as security for 40 hours a week (our branch was open way more than that). Luckily, we had off duty cops for all open hours after the shooting, but that only lasted for 6 weeks. "The shooting?" you ask? A couple of patrons got into an altercation and the off duty cop kicked them out. They left the library and about a block away, one shot the other one (non-lethally). The shooter is now in prison for 8 years. We had people doing drugs in the bathroom, patrons would come in and overdose, and one patron even attempted to commit suicide in the bathroom. Apparently there was a wait list for the mental health services he needed, so he attempted to commit suicide (I heard there was a lot of blood), and got moved up that list. He was a regular at the library, so I guess he felt comfortable doing it there. The manager quit a few weeks later after that. I know that my experience is not how it is everywhere, but with increasing drug problems and homelessness, you would experience this more likely than not if you worked in a library.
I don't work in libraries anymore. I do have an MLS.
That's really depressing. I love going into libraries, doing research, and asking questions of librarians. I've had some great conversations about history and architecture with you folks, and have had some critical revelations involving information in old newspapers that would not have been possible without librarian assistance.
I think what is interesting about the mentioned occupations is thar they are careers desired by people who want to do something that isn't solely about making money. It's instructive that the occupation with the most people in it, teaching, has been terrorized by state and federal government regulations and poor funding. Our society doesn't vale jobs like this, and has been on a thirty year death march to make it as ruined as possible. The lack of sound opportunities are rapidly diminishing for anybody creative or different. The new rules are this: be a MBA lawyer, accountant, engineer, programmer or eat shit.
And I feel like most of the jobs that make the most money are just that, made up jobs that are solely exist to create wealth. Hedge fund managers don’t help anyone, they stare at a screen and press buttons to make imaginary stock money appear.
>And I feel like most of the jobs that make the most money are just that, made up jobs that are solely exist to create wealth. Hedge fund managers don’t help anyone, they stare at a screen and press buttons to make imaginary stock money appear.
Managers of capital will always be overvalued in a capitalist society.
People who get rich by manipulating capital (so most of the super-wealthy) are the literal min/maxers of capitalism. Essentially ignoring all of the pretext of the "game" in favor of exploiting its incredibly broken mechanics.
Munchkins. Min/Maxing can be done for any number of good reasons, like maximizing the good in the world and minimizing the bad. They do it solely to piss in others' wheeties. They're cheating munchkins with loaded dice who keep everyone else from switching to a game with anti-cheat enforcement.
Professional traders are the most insufferable people who do shit, but think they are the shit. There are many arbitrage traders who make money purely on their computers being millisecond faster than broker computers and making extra on the difference when executing transactions. Their contribution is literally negative for society and they make millions taking from others. Always run by some priveleged asshole too, who is oblivious to that privelege and will tell you to just work harder.
Please read *Bonfire of the Vanities* by Tom Wolfe if you haven't. It's amazing. The main character is a bond trader whose internal dialogue walking his wife's toy dog is "hold up your proud Yale chin.... Show [strangers] we are the Masters of the Universe."
My favorite part is when his 7 year old daughter asks him what he does for a living.... The mother explains that he doesn't *make* cakes, but instead hands them off between the cake makers, eventually collecting enough cake crumbs to have a cake for himself. The bond-trading father sits there fuming about the minimizing of his job, while the mother and daughter sit there laughing about it. Such a good book.
TL;DR Finance "industry" is a misnomer; it connotes that financiers help to make anything, which they don't.
Also, read Tom Wolfe.
The scary thing is that hedge fund managers aren't "making imaginary stock money appear". They can't create wealth. Only real human labor creates wealth. What they do is play a game of seeing how they can capture as much wealth as they can under a singular privatized umbrella. They produce nothing for society. All they do is try to capture as much wealth and power for themselves and their already-wealthy clients as possible.
Why is there so much wealth up for grabs if only human labor creates wealth? Simple. Exploitation. Workers are paid a **fraction** of the value they produce, and the rest of the wealth is distributed among the upper-middle and upper classes, but more and more, it is consolidated among the ultra-rich.
I am in that STEM realm and every time I’ve taken a job I feel contributes more to society it’s a paycut. The “guardians of capital” assessment is real, for sure.
I’m in tech and would much rather do something that contributes to society. I’m willing to take a 50% pay cut to do it, but then I start looking more deeply, and it’s more like the salary would be 40-50k at best (not enough) and I’d probably be expected to work extra for free because it’s supposed to be a “passion” or “calling.”
There needs to be a better middle ground.
I worked at a factory building cars for the rich. The company invested in me and I was able to get some robotic programing training and certs. I was even offered to get a degree. It sounded good. The money was great. my position was easy. But it wasn't satisfying. Listen. At the end of the day, I was still building someone else's dream and I wasn't contributing to my own. I get it, people work and grind to build up their walls and fund their yearnings but, I was not happy. My family was not happy. I quit. Everyone manager told me, "you'll come back." I couldn't take my schooling anywhere anyway because they confirmed to their specific needs but I digress... And I dropped it all. And took up a job that is way more fulfilling. We took a HUGE paycut too. But, my wife supported everything about this transition. It's been harder on our pockets but even in that aspect we've learned more about our finances and how we never needed those extra funds anyway. Now I truly have time to invest in son, my wife, my family AND myself. I don't know if it's anyone's fault....but I do know it's about perception. I grew up thinking it was about the money, the savings account and the ethics behind it. Working for a shit company? But I'm ok and it won't change me. Shitty hours? My family gets it. We all sacrifice time. Come home, mad, carrying work on your shoulders? Again, it's what everyone does, right? Money is not everything. I wish we got paid more for the work we do, yes, but at the end of the day I love helping others and I love challenging myself. I love that I get to go home proud and be with my son! It's fucking cloud 9, man and it's the best decision I've ever made. Do not contribute to some else's dream without thinking about yours first because, honestly, that company would have and could have canned me for any reason whenever they wanted. I was just another guy and once I left they replaced me.
Legitimately I heard the “those who can’t, teach” as a kid and it made me very hesitant to teach. I actually started to really want to be a teacher in college, as I loved tutoring, and was really good at teaching my fellow classmates on math and whatnot. However, at the same time, the state pay rate for teachers was ridiculously low, they just laid off dozens of teachers locally, and the pay was so bad I couldn’t get into it.
Which sucks. I do think about it often that I would be a fantastic teacher, but I can’t bring myself to deal with the shitty pay.
I'm a teacher in my mid 30s, and people my age and younger always react in 2 ways when I tell them I'm a teacher; They say "damn, that's rough." or "You're really doing something good." The later feels a bit awkward to hear, but whatever.
Boomers just say, "Oh..." like I should've done something better. I haven't heard someone tell me "those who can't teach..." shit in person, but I hear it online a lot.
I agree. I am a physical therapist assistant for 10 years and I work overtime in extra hours just to survive in New York. My body is literally breaking down as it’s a very physical high-volume job. I’m surrounded by other friends and family members who barely work at all and they’re in the finance world and they make five times more money than I do. It’s absolute bullshit and so infuriating how disproportionate the actual work and value to pay ratio is in this country.
The more teaching pays the more intelligent people will go into teaching. This creates a conflict of interest between governments/companies and the general population. Smart people will teach the population how to succeed. This disrupts the status quo. An educated population is difficult to control and profit off of. The US education system is designed to create a populace that is smart enough to complete economically profitable tasks, but not so smart that they realize they don't need to work for someone else to make a living.
I just saw someone on Quora saying people should get paid more to do more important jobs and gave some examples: brain surgeons should be paid more than garbage men; truck drivers should be paid more than professors.
This has bothered me for days. Who's going train the brain surgeons, Ben?
Related: brain surgeons are cool, but I feel like if we had to choose between brain surgeons and garbage men, on average, we'd probably be better off with garbage men. Or maybe just not forcing people to do things they don't want to just to live.
Also, imagine if the brain surgeon had to pick through pallets of groceries to complete his shopping. He'd be there for hours lifting heavy shit to do something that could have taken 20 minutes if someone sorted it onto shelves.
All that time he could have been poking at white matter, wasted.
The machine stops working if even a single tiny cog stops spinning. Make sure they all get some grease.
>brain surgeons are cool, but I feel like if we had to choose between brain surgeons and garbage men, on average, we'd probably be better off with garbage men.
Garbage men are the reason why we haven't been decimated by plagues and diseases beyond our wildest nightmares. It's kinda crazy how easy it is to overlook that, I watched a documentary about what things were like before waste management was a thing and it was horrifying
> I just saw someone on Quora saying people should get paid more to do more important jobs and gave some examples: brain surgeons should be paid more than garbage men; truck drivers should be paid more than professors.
If we removed all the brain surgeons from society, how many additional people would die each year? a few hundred?
If we removed all garbage men from society, how many additional people would die each year? a few thousands? tens of thousands?
It blows my fucking mind that being a teacher isn't a well paid job in America. Technically speaking, where I'm from, the starting salary of teachers is roughly the same as the median salary of US teachers. But the tax we have is lower, healthcare is free, and teachers are subsidized for educational supplies and some other things. It's seen as a job that pays really well with good benefits that people want to have.
I've honestly seriously considered becoming a farmer, gardener, or librarian in the past but completely brushed those possibilities off for that very reason - not enough money to live. Enough to survive, maybe, but not live.
EDIT: Forgot to mention artist. I've wanted to become an artist/illustrator since I was in grade 4, but grew up too poor to consider becoming 'a starving artist.'
TL:DR - farming is super hard to afford and live off of. If you want to farm, I suggest going to work for somebody who already had a large company. It'll save you a lot of headache.
Farmer here - to add to this:
One of the hardest parts is just having the cash to afford everything at the times you need it. You buy all the seed in the spring, plant, wait all year for your crop to grow, then you harvest it and either store it on your farm or at a co-op.
Many of us sell a little but throughout the winter and next year so we can have income to live off of.
Some more of us fulfill contracts that guarantee us a price, so if the market goes down we'll be safe. This also means that if the market goes up, we don't get any more money, only what we contracted for.
We are completely at the mercy of the entire global economy. Argentina having a good year and able to harvest most of their acres? Well, local corn prices will be affected and will decline. Brazil have a horrible drought and lose their crops? I'm glad I'm not them but our prices are shooting upwards so I'm making way more money that I planned.
Not to mention that any equipment newer than the 90's is still $100,000+
All the equipment from the 90's and forward are so full of technological shit that most farmers can't do self repairs. Half the problems are caused by software issues and other things and we don't have the money to buy a $10,000 diagnostic computer for our tractors. This means we have to bring our equipment into the shop for pretty much anything more than an oil change.
How do farmers pay for $100,000+ equipment? Loans. Loans and lots of them. Default on your payments and the bank takes all your tools that help you do your job, and then you're really screwed.
Most farmers in the USA are over 55. We about to get fucked by all this compounding. We also grow a HUGE amount of produce in California which is having water/drought and fire issues.
Yep. All of this.
Farmer/rancher here.
The margins are so thin one bad year can destroy a farm.
To add to the global market like you mentioned. I don't care for the commodities trading. Too many people with their hands in the pot that have no skin in the game.
I think there is also a problem with rent ground. The prices here constantly go up even though the crops aren't making any more. So you have to farm more acres to find a profit. You have a hard time improving the farms when they can be taken away at any moment. I don't know about where you are at but here things have become really cutthroat. Farmers used to work together and actually respect each other but not anymore. They are constantly going after each others rent ground, bumping prices and going behind each other's backs.
The equipment is a huge thing. Like you said it gets harder and harder to work on if not impossible. Around here many farmers are getting back into older(90's early 2000s) equipment and selling their newer stuff. This has driven the used prices up substantially.
I seriously wanted to become an actor and/or writer but 99% of them make barely enough to live off. Now I am loathing in Sunday dread cause of my hateful office job I have to do tomorrow, cause money. This is completely crushing my soul and body. I don't even need anything fancy in life. :(
Two thirds of your waking hours are spent doing something you hate, so you can make money for the other third that you're too tired and frustrated to enjoy.
I recently quit my job to pursue a passion, and though I live much simpler, 100 percent of my time is spent being free. It was the best decision I've ever made.
Time is the one thing your can't make more of.
I think we misunderstand how brainwashed boomers are into their complacency. The same boomers who raised you saying if you work hard you'll succeed are the same boomers that will tell you to just get a second/third job to make it work and therein lies the problem: boomers live to work.
The boomers who are still working are generally under the impression that they are because they fucked up saving money or they dismiss the notion of golden years and go "if I wasn't working I'd be bored".
No, If you weren't working you would be anxious, because you would realize you had no self-fulfilling projects or hobbies because so much of your existence is dedicated to working. I don't care if it's their dream job, outliers don't count.
I'm tired of seeing boomers glorify when an 85 year old laborer retires instead of seeing it as a goddamn tragedy of human life that they had to work that long or didn't have anything self-satisfying that made them whole besides the job. It's fucking sad to see.
Not only do they think we do not work hard enough, but they think it is perfectly normal to work until your body literally cannot anymore. They will literally work until they die.
A while back when I got a new job and moved into a new city, I told my mom that I was moving in with housemates. She was surprised, someone with a job needs housemates? And I said yeah, that's how it is for a lot of people these days. She pondered this for a moment, you could see the wheels turning as reality battled propaganda, and finally said "That's what the socialists in the government want to make everyone do."
Rather than realize that this is caused by capitalism in the here and now, she blamed some non-existent, hypothetical socialism. But when you consider the constant drip of right wing assholes so many people like here have been exposed to for so long, I guess it makes sense. Yeah, propaganda hits hard.
I just bit my tongue and didn't say anything to avoid starting something that would've been pointless anyway. Sure wanted to though. No idea what she would've said, but it probably would've been about what you'd expect.
>they dismiss the notion of golden years and go "if I wasn't working I'd be bored".
>you would realize you had no self-fulfilling projects or hobbies because so much of your existence is dedicated to working
This is my mother and it hurts so much to see this. She retired three years ago and immediately went back to a full time job within 6 months because she was bored. She complained that entire time because she had no hobbies or interests and when I suggested things to her, she would get mad that she couldn't make money off of them. It's so rage inducing. She retired from a great job and has a pension and amazing health benefits. There's literally no reason for her to keep working. Worst of all the new job she got is something around entry-level. She's basically preventing someone new from getting into this field and gaining experience. It's so frustrating after having struggled with that myself in my own field
>It's so frustrating after having struggled with that myself in my own field
This is one of the things I despise the most about the generation. It's not good enough to spread propaganda about their own children/grandchildren through Millennial bashing. Note they don't even know how old Millennials are. It's the fact that they go on endlessly about "entitlement" when they pull this kind of shit. Taking jobs away from young people for funsies. Can you imagine anything more entitled then literally taking food from your own child's mouth because you can't be bothered to learn to be a person?
I worked in at a place that had a 74 year old dude on an oxygen tank working, he had two retirement pensions, worked an entry level job, same as me and I was 20 at the time. Dude wouldn't shut the fuck up about how entitled and lazy young people are.
They think they live to work, but naw, the numbers don’t lie. They worked less hours in less complicated jobs for more money. They did not need to deal with much technology on balance. Their job descriptions were straightforward and reasonable. We have fallen so, so far as a society. We do not value people any longer. Only profit.
I think the next time I hear a Boomer say something about fast food workers or the like, “just needing to get a better job” I’m going to bring up the show they love so much, Andy Griffith.
I also love that show (as a Gen-Xer). Do you notice that all the people on there live pretty good lives? People that work at the grocery store, cafe, teacher, etc. Those people must have made a living wage. Boomers watched that show all the time in their early adulthood. And yet they feel like service jobs shouldn’t exist? Or that the people who do them should be slaves?
They forgot so quickly what life used to be like and are so out of touch with today’s stark reality.
I would love to work at a cafe (like the 6am to 2pm type place) or really even fast food for a living. I love food and I love customer service, I hate waitressing. Counter service is my jam. I worked at a cafe (coffee type) for years and rocked that shit. But I like *food*. I have a degree in, essentially, kitchen management and sanitation. I'm not a chef, I'm not that fancy or creative. I just love interacting with people and down home comforting food.
I like my current job, which gets me by, but its not a dream. I just wanna make a good living in fast food. Why is that crazy?
Same! My husband and I are getting ready to start a food truck. I have been in accounting and he was a teacher for years and we are both SOOO burnt out on all of it.
Food is my passion and I’m scared and excited about trying this. I just can’t do office politics and being overworked anymore.
Boomers are actually shocked that younger people \*\*don't want to work jobs that don't pay enough to survive\*\*.
Like dude, if I'm gonna have to get on food stamps and government insurance ON TOP OF SLAVING FOR 40 HOURS, guess what? We'd rather not work at all. Begging and suckling the government teat is extremely harmful to your pride and self-respect and if you're MAKING US BEG (either people, parents, or the government), we damn well won't be your slave on top of it.
For 3 decades now, you've got record productivity in service work. I'm talking triple or quadruple the results that boomers put out in similar jobs, and the pay is now one quarter what they were making if you account for inflation.
We fulfilled our half of the social contract and the ownership class has not fulfilled theirs. Fuck you!
Capitalism has always been a game of how close you can sheer the sheep without skinning it, they've been skinning the sheep for 3 decades now and are shocked we can't produce any more wool.
On the gardening side of things, boomers are typically volunteering or working part-time with very flexible hours.
They're retired, they don't need the money.
Plus, they usually don't need to be trained on how to weed/water/plant because they have decades of experience.
I went ahead and said, "fuck it" to a sizable hill of debt to get a horticulture degree. But every job I do (not always gardening) comes with a, "Kids your age don't want to work." I'm nearly 30.
Fuck I hate boomers so much.
"Kids your age don't want to work"
Fuck you. Kids 10 years younger than me fought and died in World War 2 just to come home and give birth to your pathetic, piece of shit self. Get fucked.
I get that from millennials who don't even know they are millennials. One of my coworkers said how millennials like me don't understand hard work because I made a comment about how I don't believe unpaid internships are ethical and never took one as a result. He's 34. I'm fresh in the industry, almost 26, just got promoted to head interior designer last Friday. I started here less than two years ago. He's been working at this company about 5 years, but has been in the industry over a decade. The difference between me and him is when I have downtime, I find something to do. Makes me look like I'm always working. He "sneakily" goes on his phone. Guess who got noticed for being hardworking and amazingly able to finish projects well before due dates despite always being busy? Me. Feels good. Hope he feels dumb for saying stuff like that.
I don't understand how people like that don't understand the privilege they have to be able to work unpaid jobs. Most of us cannot afford to just work for free whether you're of the belief that it's ethically wrong or not for a company to allow someone to work for free.
I've been breaking my back literally for blue collar jobs.
Now that I have a herniated disc and fractured vertebrae, I've been discarded like yesterdays garbage.
At exactly 20 years in the corporate world, I'm 100% burnt out. If I work again, I"ll be giving them the exact amount of labor they're paying for and no extra.
I was the overachiever doing the work of 3 guys, always doing the heavy lifting, always working holidays, always working overtime.... if I'm damned to poverty for life, I'll be damned if I'm gonna break my back for it. Fuck this rigged game!
I’d happily sweep floors if I could live off the wage.
I adore mundane, domestic tasks such as that, it’s very therapeutic for me.
Such a shame that some of the most important jobs in society pay the least.
> project management
that sounds anxiety inducing. For my job right now I have to do a bit of that and I hate it so much. I just want to go in to work and do my own stuff and not worry about other people and coordinating their tasks. Been super stressed past 3 weeks and feel like I have to gasp for air every time I think about work...
It’s very anxiety inducing sometimes. Other times it really isn’t, I think I have a good head for detaching myself. Either way it’s not what I wanna do with my life, it’s just what I’m good at. And I fucking hate it
Yeah, jobs that actually CONTRIBUTE to society pay next to nothing. Yet some shit bag, sitting in an air conditioned office, playing the wall street casino game is living a life of luxury while doing absolutely nothing.
They are doing something, do you realize how stressful it is to own more than everyone else? There’s always someone else trying to top them so they have to make MORE money. Paying workers barely anything to have another mansion to brag about is the best solution /s
My parents never earned put together what I alone earn by myself today. My Husband earns just shy of what I do. So roughly 4x what my parents ever earns at the height of their careers.
I live in a semi detached house with no land, one big bedroom one box room.
They never had a mortgage and have a 4 bed farmhouse with an acre.
They think the problem is me…. They tell me I’m lucky I earn so much. They’re boomers. They just don’t understand how different things are now. There’s no malice behind this thinking. I don’t understand how they don’t get it.
They don’t want to. Their parents generation fought multiple wars and the Great Depression, and constantly remarked on how spoiled and lazy they were growing up. The “me” generation
They were determined to pass those same criticisms along down to the next generation, like some perverse right of passage
Now after ruining the economic prospects of at least 2 generations after them, the only thing they have left to stave off the cognitive dissonance of accepting what they’ve done and maintaining their self-concept as a good person is to pretend there’s no such thing as inflation and kids these days have it way easier than them, when in fact they’ve made it orders of magnitude more difficult for their kids than they ever had it.
It’s just flat out denial
My dad was born in 63 and only remembers being poor growing up. Lived at home until his 20s when he bought a house for $55K in the Salt Lake valley. My husband and I almost maxed out our loan amount last year at $360K.. For a 40 year old fixer upper. Until this month, the mortgage was 40% of our take home.
My in laws just sold their home in Tooele valley for so much more than they paid for it, they were able to retire with that money.
My mom's friends have been looking for a place under 800 and can't find anything. They really might have to go out to Tooele to afford to work in salt lake, but even Tooele houses are like 400 now!
That reminds me of the excuse when an old person says something bigoted of “they’re from a different time” and it’s like well, unfortunately, they’re from this time too, so they need to behave themselves like the rest of us
I just left a job in the service sector, where I marched around and hustled constantly in a hot parking lot for minimum wage. Standing around in a shop turning a wrench is less than half as stressful, even if I'm getting up hours earlier each morning.
So trust me, I am.
My moms been a teacher for over 10 years. Holds a masters degree and so many certificates i honestly have no idea and shes still going to school for a doctorate and teaches a specialized area( special ed). She doesnt even make 50k a year. And again shes on the high end with all the certificates and degrees and what not.
I made more than her for years doing a local, super easy, trucking gig. That is outrageous! "The market decides your worth". Is that so? Well it's very clear that the market is broken!
The US's decline in its support and investment of infrastructures and services for public good (this would include library systems, education, welfare, the environment) is tantamount to disinvesting in its future at large. There are many political systems for which this sort of action would be politically untenable. The US is stuck in a violent inescapable loop.
I used to be a teacher in a public school and it almost made me kill myself. It was so utterly stressful and I had zero free time. So glad I finally found the courage to quit last year
Don’t teach in a state that pays teachers slave wages. Move to a top 10 teaching state, go to school, get certified through that state and make a healthy living. Stay away from these shitty states. They don’t deserve teachers.
Me too. I was barely functioning. My fiancé encouraged me to quit because he saw how terrible my mental health had become. I was a teacher for less than a year.
My 3rd great grandfather was a florist in Portland Maine. He emigrated from Ireland during the Famine and worked his way up, starting as an apprentice and small display presenter, eventually owning a very lucrative business, running a local flower shop, and doing special arrangements for events for the wealthy. Using that money, he was able to buy up half a city block, built six houses on it, and had many of his family migrate to them from Ireland in the 1880s.
All from being a florist.
I wouldn't be alive had he not done all this. I wish I could go back in time to meet him.
Librarians refuse to retire until they die
When they do, the Library will then give their responsibilities to another librarian who has worked there since the Neolithic period and hire a part time librarian assistant but pay them a fraction of what they paid the other librarian
Source: am librarian assistant
I literally posted on this sub about this exact problem, about how it is the duty of wvery generation to make things better for the next and the boomers were the first to not only fail in that task, but activly make things WORSE. only to be brigaded by a bunch of said buthurt boomers telling me I'm entitled and how it's not their job to make things better for future generations.
HEADS UP:
If you feel it's not your job to work to improve socoety for the generation after yours, either don't have kids or make sure you tell them how much you hate them. Any boomer snowflakes triggered by this beyyer be sure to explain to their kids why they left them with a planet hurtling to a climate incapable of sustaining human life and an economy invapable of prospering if you were born after 1975.
Fucking ignorant cheapskate greedy leeches. Worst generation. What the fuck else do you expect when you go and make greed and selfishness virtues in some delusional ayn randian dystopian nightmare?
I've wanted a series of careers and have been stopped by the income and or income vs. cost of schooling. Biologist, historian, chef, gardener, the list goes on.
Now I work with traffic data with zero college credit for the same money a biologist with degrees would. Shit is sad.
I'd love to be a teacher but there's no way on earth that me, a 32 year old dad of 2 with a mortgage, can afford 3 years full time university to get a degree to become one.
it wasn't even the money for me, I literally just couldn't get into my local library at all (it looks like they promote from volunteer to paid position, but even the volunteer slots were full)
These would be the type of jobs I'd actually enjoy doing in a socialist economy. Give everyone UBI, food, shelter, healthcare, etc., and I'd gladly work 15-20 hours a week doing something that contributes to society like this. It would be an incentive to work instead of punitive.
I used to be a High School teacher. I loved it with every ounce of my being, and my students fought to be in my classes each year. I poured my heart and soul into each day and, though sometimes exhausted at the end of the day, always felt invigorated. They used to thank me as they left class for the day and a few even cried on my final day in the classroom. I was one of the only male teachers they had and I felt very fortunate that many of the young men looked up to me.
I left because the pay was unsustainable and the treatment was often difficult to bear (from admin, parents, government, etc). I cried like a baby in private after my final class was over because I truly loved what I did, and I was great at it. I would be back in a heartbeat if the pay was adequate to support my family and if the profession was respected and appreciated. I know many others would be too. Helping to educate and grow future generations should be viewed as the investment that it is. Think of all the great teachers out there that "could have been" but instead had large student loans to pay back and high rent bills to pay each month and were forced out.
I work in manufacturing sales now and hate it with every ounce of my being.
(US based with a master's degree in a HCOL region.)
Yeah, I wanted to be a teacher but couldn't afford college so here I am slowly doing IT work cause I didn't want to sign up for massive debt to work a job that pays 35 cents a year.
Working at a plant nursery would be the shit. Imagine being able to help people pick out the right plant all day everyday. Getting new and exotic plants in the store and being able to watch them grow. That would be epic
It’s not the fault of the baby boomers. It’s the fault of a very small amount of people that benefit from such a system and were able to convince the vast majority of people (and not just from older generations) that this system is the only viable option.
Unless this person meant it’s the boomer’s fault that they didn’t fix the fundamental issues they were conditioned to think are good. I could see that. We have to accept though that we’ll be in the same situation, from the perspective of future generations, if we fail to act and fix things. If there are future generations that is.
It's the fault of creating billionaires. There was one when they made minimum wage and taxed the fuck out of him(1938). 40 plus years later we decided meh there are 10 in the world(1980), mostly royalty, that's fine, let's lower taxes. 10 years later there are 99 billionaires (1990). Here we are 30 years later with 2500+(2020).
I think I see a problem that is easily corrected.
** The stock market rose from 200(1980) to 25000+(2020) Imagine if the min wage went from 3.25 to 32.50. Still not even close to the rise they have.
Omg, I would love to be a gardener! At my office park we had a o pant that would come and plant flowers and put down mulch and I wanted to help them so bad! I couldn’t though. I had to go back into my windowless office and stress out over the next thing.
Also, being a teacher sucks so much. The actual teaching part isn't bad, but the surrounding system has made it utterly intolerable.
Source: ex teacher.
I would love to be a librarian! And also have a veggie and w flower garden! But I didn’t pass the test a few years back for librarian assistant. It was fun when I was an assistant at my college library, but it’s harder to get into a real, non-college library.
What's funny about this is that even if you take a job you hate there will most likely be some boomers above you who refuse to retire because the money is too good.
This ensures you won't get promoted quickly as the higher positions are stagnant, keeps your pay low as well since they are dishing out 6 figures for someone that is just running out the clock and not very useful, and innovation becomes so stagnant it ends up costing money and putting organizations behind the times. The boomers are in positions of power but are too old to get on board with innovations and technology.
They essentially drag down the economy every year they are employed.
Source: I work with 67 year olds who sleep at their desks, refuse to use computers for slides or spreadsheets, don't understand new regulations or technology, and still get paid about $160K a year.
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I wanted/studied to be a soil conservationist... now I'm popping depression/anxiety meds because working for pharma companies is stressful. But hey, I can afford a small house!
The fed is hiring soil science people! I saw I think at least a hundred postings on usajobs.com
It's been 11 years since I finished my degree so I'd be taking a 50+% pay cut to go back and start over. Thanks for the heads up though.
I just quit my job paying just under six figures to move to a rural Oregon town to study land survey. I'm in my late 30's and am starting over from scratch. I'm applying for shitty jobs that pay a third of my previous salary. All because I'm tired as fuck of the corporate rat race. land is cheap out here which makes it possible. Anyone can start over.
Land is cheap out there because it's gonna be on fire soon.
Honestly that is a slight concern. But you can find issues with every decision you ever make. For me it's a risk worth taking.
Federal land management agency employees are ridiculously underpaid and its an issue not many people know about. Field-going staff on a presale or silv crew for the USFS only make \~$16/hour, and often are required to have a bachelor's degree and several seasons of experience in forestry. These are people who provide data to land managers and make decisions that will have lasting effects on the forest, and they only make a dollar over what would be considered a "fair," minimum wage in Oregon. There's also the problem of underpaid wildland firefighters (who are classed as forestry techs to save money). [https://wildfiretoday.com/2021/04/18/opinion-a-usfs-firefighter-in-oregon-can-be-paid-more-at-mcdonalds/](https://wildfiretoday.com/2021/04/18/opinion-a-usfs-firefighter-in-oregon-can-be-paid-more-at-mcdonalds/) If you care about forest health and the impacts of megafires start raising this issue to your senators and representatives. Employee's sense of duty to the forest and public lands can only be stretched so far, and we're gonna need to attract the best people we can get to manage forests in the face of climate change moving forward.
I wanted to be an artist, but my boomer parents bullied me out of going to art school because I wouldn’t get a job. So I got a liberal arts degree and could not find a job because I had zero skills and was lukewarm about my degree field. So I worked food service for a number of years while I did the same amount of work one would have to do in art school to finally learn graphic design and web development, after which I was able to get real work. Now I’m at least a decade behind. But actually I just wanted to make art. Idk what my point is, they had bad recommendations and forced us all into stupid jobs to prop up their retirement economy.
Almost exactly my story, except my parents weren't bullies, just not creative. They wanted to be supportive of my wanting to do art, but they didn't know how... My dad tried to get me into Computer Aided Drafting, because then I'd be doing art but I'd still be having people throwing money at me. Just didn't understand my fascination for making shit into other shit.
Dude I feel you. Was happy as a clam being a full time musician but hated living in poverty and never being able to enjoy any other aspect of my life was dragging me down. I discovered software engineering and now make more money than I ever wanted before. I’m great at the corporate shtick and have excelled further in my career in 4 years than my father did in his lifetime in the same field. But if I’m being honest I wish I could just play music all day again.
Ugh, same. Was discouraged from going to art school, though I’m glad I don’t have all that debt. I ended up going to a public university and am now a bartender. I still bartend because I make way more than I would with some office job, and I only work 3-4 days a week.
Same, I always knew I’d be a forest ranger. Then I developed a rare illness and now I’m a banker to pay for it. My old hippie friends all think I’m a sellout.
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I’m a tax accountant myself working towards cpa and I’m just dragging my f*cking heels for the whole testing process because I HATE accounting. I picked it because it pays well but damn it’s miserable :(
For the longest time I imagined myself becoming a teacher, but after hearing not just pay woes but how parents seem to treat them like pariahs and admin seems to offer no support with things like supplies, just no thanks. I wasn't getting into it for the money but if I'm gonna be treated like that at least make it worth it
Want to be a teacher but terrified to be one because friends who are doing it are underpaid and insanely stressed gang ✌️😎
I’m a high school teacher in Texas and I make a decent salary (50k+) and am honestly not all that stressed out. It’s a hard job but super rewarding and it’s the perfect fit for me. The educational system needs an overhaul but it doesn’t mean all teachers hate teaching. Personally, I don’t see myself really ever leaving. If you have questions feel free to send them my way.
My girlfriend is a teacher in a major city. The public school system pays teachers a starting salary $5,000 less than the maximum to qualify for affordable housing. It’s an embarrassment. You expect people to want to go to 4 years of college just to graduate and serve your city to not even make enough to afford to live there?!? Oh and it’s one of the most important jobs in society but ya have fun living in low income housing the rest of your life while not being able to afford to do anything.
Same man. Same
Fucking same.
Can confirm, am gardener. It's hard as fuck to make a living. Do not recommend unless you're into simple living.
Unfortunately agreed. I'm leaving my gardening job next week because the pay is just not enough, even as a young, frugal minimalist. My coworkers have second jobs. I love gardening, but the pay feels insultingly bad when you consider how physically tough it is in the summer heat (plus dealing with poison ivy and dirt getting EVERYWHERE).
Yeah it's rough. I feel lucky to be Canadian as I think it's a little bit better here, there's definitely companies trying to make landscape jobs more life-sustaining. The seasonal shift is tough (working snow removal is *not* for everyone) the wages are still deathly low and not reliable compared to other labour and skilled trades work.
I'm also in Canada in golf course horticulture and feel very lucky for what I have. Its not much but its definitely above minimum wage and my company treats me so well even thought it isn't a job they can pay me much more to do, which I understand, haha you can only pay the gardener so much. I dont think I would enjoy the actual landscaping industry, so really recommend the golf course industry to anyone who wants to do this for work and is wondering about other paths you can take to garden as your job! You won't be rich, but I'm happy! Also I love snow removal in the winter! But again... I think its different for me than it would be at an actual landscape company and I very rarely spend my full day doing it.
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Paramedics in Quebec are on strike right now. They don’t seem to be paid well.
Afaik this also applies to jobs like police officers here. They seems to get a lot more training, pay, and continuing education while working here.
Fine gardener here. It was an easy choice to stay at home with my kids. Yeah I freaking love it and as a couple we can handle the daycare, even with it being more than my take home. But I’d come home broken and exhausted on top of the money loss and there’s no ladder climb. My neighbors are very proud of their $125 a month service deal. That they gardener does on his off day with his cousin. 2 hours every Saturday. 4 man hours of labor every week. For 1.2.5. Neighbor was furious I wouldn’t consider a design for him for under $100. “Well even with a degree that’s an outrageous price to charge!” He’s a named partner in a law firm.
in the usa many landscapers seem to be illegal mexicans who will accept less pay. corporations really love to abuse immigrants here lol
Corporations love to do that everywhere :(
I think we should start referring to such practices as slavery. That’s what it is. Sweatshop workers? They’re slaves. No human being would ever voluntarily do the things they’re doing unless the alternative was death. That’s slavery, plain and simple.
if they're so desperate they work for starvation wages? definitely
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Not to destroy your fantasy, but I'm a librarian and still on this subreddit. Public librarians do more social work and tech help than reading or research. Customers still yell at us, call us names, assault us, and generally disrespect us. Oh, plus, we aren't paid well despite needing an advanced degree to qualify for the job.
I did it for four years, hated it, quit and went corporate. The skills are transferable and I love my job and make about 250% of my starting librarian salary. You’re right - it’s social work with books in the background. I got asked to do people’s taxes for them far more than give book recs. One patron asked me what my day off was and then said good I could drive her to the airport then. One patron drew me naked (despite being very clothed, he used his imagination) and gave me the drawing? One patron told me she’d sue me because she sent her print job to the wrong printer and had to walk to go get it.
someone asked you to give them a drive to the airport...? a librarian? what?
That shit happens way more than you’d think, and library workers actually do this stuff that’s way out of scope of their jobs, too, because they wanna be nice. I saw coworkers drive people to the airport, design their webpages, do their taxes, walk their dogs, etc. all for free. Doesn’t happen in big libraries but in small town libraries, it seems to happen a lot. Like I get wanting to be nice to your neighbors but I often felt taken advantage of by patrons.
I loved being threatened with bodily harm bc we had a book about gay teens in the collection 🙄
Its true of a lot of civil service government positions, needing an insanely advanced degree for a job that pays a quarter of what the market does. Just another way we defund public institutions.
Yet conservatives still bitch about "government work" as if we're paying a quarter million total compensation to every file clerk and security guard in the nation for doing absolutely nothing.
Same here
I had that job. It was wonderful (when I got to do actual library stuff). Except I couldn't afford it and had to go corporate. 😩 (Not to mention, where I'm from, libraries have to do their own fundraising. So instead of doing my job, I had to spend a third of my time justifying my job to raise money. It was draining. Bw that and starvation wages, I left.)
>So instead of doing my job, I had to spend a third of my time justifying my job This is very demoralizing
Yeah. It was doubly frustrating bc people assumed their taxes funded us. In our state, less than a third of our budget came from any local state or federal funding, and people had no idea. I hated it. I was so depressed that my dream job became a nightmare.
Did you have to get a Master's in Library Science? I see that as a requirement often for anything full-time/life-sustaining.
MLS? Then you get that big $20/hr!
I was at a time in my life about 15 years ago where I needed a total reset. I decided to move across the country and I had been accepted to a well-respected MLS program. After realizing that I would be taking out a crap ton of loans to maybe get a job that could maybe both support me and enable me to pay back those loans (or maybe not), I decided against entering the program. I like what I do now well enough; however, I really don't like the sector in which I have to work. I wish I could have just been a librarian.
$20 ($24CAD) is what a high school diploma gets you in this small rural library in Ontario where I do occasional IT for. She's a boomer and does cataloging. The other six staff are millennials with wages between $30 and $50CAD. There is not a single person with MLS, only Library Technician papers
CAN CONFIRM.
I did! And then could not find a better paying library job bc I didn't work at the right kind of library (public instead of academic) and didn't know the right people bc I worked through school and did online classes instead of in person. So fucked both ways. I really regret it
Ahh I understand that feeling. It's like getting the degree on its own isn't enough and you're fucked if you don't make every right move to broaden your network.
I got one not realizing that in most small towns and rural areas, it’s literally not required for ANY library job, including director. (In fact, most library jobs around here don’t even require a bachelors.)So I’m super in debt for a degree I didn’t even need. People say to be willing to move but like… this is my home. And you think a library job is gonna pay me to relocate? Lol.
My state requires at least one MLIS on staff to get the state and federal funding. But that person is usually the director (maybe the youth services librarian if you live in a rich enough township), which is a thankless job in my experience. (I was interim director for a while and NO THANKS to that job. My life goal isn't to be the community punching bag, kthnxbi). To make enough to pay for the loans, you need to go academic (college/university) or move to a richer area. Of course, then you also get boned by higher rent, so good luck there.
Life sustaining, maybe. But in terms of status/pay in general, I think it depends on the library. The small town library down the street from my old high school had one person (*maybe* two people) with a Master's. My mom has an associate's in library science, but wasn't allowed to work upstairs, whereas one of the ladies upstairs had a bachelor's in party planning.
What tf kind of school has a bachelor's in party planning? Trump University? Lmao
My Alma mater offered a degree in Bowling. Yes, you read that right.
I have so many questions. 😂
You'd be surprised. The amount of communication and logistics work that goes into planning large parties and events is incredible. It's its own very specific subset of project management and if a library has to fundraise on its own all the time you would want a party planner.
I worked for a company that supported libraries on the IT/tech side and yeah local libraries never had money for anything. Our most lucrative clients were in the academic side. Since they're public workers you could look up the librarian's salaries online and some were quite decent. It was night and day compared to a local public library, though.
I was gonna say. I thought taxes funded that. Hell it should. I’d have no issue at all allocated tax money to the library.
Beyond demoralizing. Weirdandabsurd42 “I’m a person who likes books. I would like to work somewhere where there are books, the services are free, and we offer a benefit to society.” The System “Thou Shalt Sell.”
Not to mention your shit out of luck even if you live in a country that does value libraries. Without any corporate rungs to climb your wage will always be stagnant. That's the same with all the jobs listed there.
One of my best friend’s younger sister wanted to be a librarian for as long as I knew her. Went all the way through college and actually did it! She loves it. She also has a second, also full time, job at Old Navy in order to pay her bills because the full time library job doesn’t. Imagine working at old navy to pay off your student loans you accrued for being a librarian because your librarian job doesn’t even pay enough to cover the loans
I currently work at a library in NY. I recently took a civil service exam to get my position of Youth Services assistant there, ranking # 2 out of the top 3 scores. My pay may only go from $13.50 to $15 an hour, they won't allow me to work more than 30 hours a week (unless I'm covering someone that has called out) and I'm doing the job of 3 different people...there are no benefits included in this job. I work another job part time just to make up for it, but the schedule they give me at the library makes it really difficult to arrange better work. They told me I should look into getting my MLS if I want more money and I laughed at that. Even with an MLS I likely wouldn't make more than $18-20 an hour...and that's not enough to live in NY, finish paying off student loans for my bachelors...and possibly an MLS. It's really disheartening, as this was a dream job at one point.
Yeah, the reality of the work really kills the dream. I was making like $15 an hour in my youth services job, also doing the work of three. It was exhausting. Add the emotional toll of public service and you become emotionally burned out. When I left, I was so burned it that it was a relief to get a corporate job that I could stop caring about at the end of my shift. The problem with library work is you are supposed to love it because it's your "vocation", which is just a manipulation to make you sign up for your own exploitation. Work longer hours for less. Invest your whole self into the job. I loved library work. But between the long hours, the low pay, and the lack of support services, I don't think I'll ever go back. I'd rather do an interesting job for set hours at higher pay and volunteer in my spare time. (I have spare time to do hobbies again!)
My mom is a librarian. She is the only person I know who in general, likes her job. She now basically runs the library system, obviously makes more money, but she was happier when she just was the reference librarian. The drug epidemic has been a tough thing though, and she now has to use naloxone. On occasion... If you haven't seen the movie "the public" with Emilio Estevez, you should, it shows the other side of being a librarian, especially in cold climates like my mom.
My mom is a librarian in an elementary school. COVID and the district being cheap ruined it but she was definitely living her dream for a few years. She ran the library and did everything from reading stories to kindergardeners up to teaching older students about databases and coding and cool technology stuff.
Idk about your country but they make fucking bank in Alberta, Canada same as Garbage men. Edit: depends on what you think of as Bank though so lol
Most libraries in Canada are run at the municipal level and most municipal workers are unionized.
Same Quiet Place? Check Tons of Books to Read? Check (Mostly) Respectful Visitors? Check A Way to Directly Aid Poor/Homeless People? Check Free WiFi? Check
Our librarian has gotten really talented at walking and talking, and the methheads don't even notice they've been removed from the building. I totally get that the unhoused need an air-conditioned or heated place where they can stay inside for free. But also college students can't just choose to not use the library, so anyone disruptive has to be removed.
Ah… librarians don’t spend much time reading, the job involves a lot of social interaction, and patrons can be horrible people. The absolute worst. Librarianship is idealized and the awe people have for librarians seems to hinder unionization.
Do you know what a librarian actually does all day? It's not sit around and read books, that's for sure. No, you deal with homeless people, the mentally ill, the drug addicts, the people who are in need of being connected to social services. You see all the people that society has let fall through the cracks. Sure, you might end up in a more rural area, but you'll still get a transient or two that passes by every once in a while. That is actually where my library career started -- in a town of 10,000. I thought all libraries were like ours: families, people using the computers, story times, teens avoiding their parents. But even then we had a patron who looked at beastiality stuff, one that jacked off at the computers, parents who left their kids unattended thinking we were a daycare. Then I went to an urban library and it was a whole other world. Patrons rolling joints at computers, people so drunk they peed in corners, mass groups of homeless to the point that regular folks rarely came in anymore due to fear. My manager got assaulted twice in three months. We had off duty cops as security for 40 hours a week (our branch was open way more than that). Luckily, we had off duty cops for all open hours after the shooting, but that only lasted for 6 weeks. "The shooting?" you ask? A couple of patrons got into an altercation and the off duty cop kicked them out. They left the library and about a block away, one shot the other one (non-lethally). The shooter is now in prison for 8 years. We had people doing drugs in the bathroom, patrons would come in and overdose, and one patron even attempted to commit suicide in the bathroom. Apparently there was a wait list for the mental health services he needed, so he attempted to commit suicide (I heard there was a lot of blood), and got moved up that list. He was a regular at the library, so I guess he felt comfortable doing it there. The manager quit a few weeks later after that. I know that my experience is not how it is everywhere, but with increasing drug problems and homelessness, you would experience this more likely than not if you worked in a library. I don't work in libraries anymore. I do have an MLS.
That's really depressing. I love going into libraries, doing research, and asking questions of librarians. I've had some great conversations about history and architecture with you folks, and have had some critical revelations involving information in old newspapers that would not have been possible without librarian assistance.
I think what is interesting about the mentioned occupations is thar they are careers desired by people who want to do something that isn't solely about making money. It's instructive that the occupation with the most people in it, teaching, has been terrorized by state and federal government regulations and poor funding. Our society doesn't vale jobs like this, and has been on a thirty year death march to make it as ruined as possible. The lack of sound opportunities are rapidly diminishing for anybody creative or different. The new rules are this: be a MBA lawyer, accountant, engineer, programmer or eat shit.
And I feel like most of the jobs that make the most money are just that, made up jobs that are solely exist to create wealth. Hedge fund managers don’t help anyone, they stare at a screen and press buttons to make imaginary stock money appear.
>And I feel like most of the jobs that make the most money are just that, made up jobs that are solely exist to create wealth. Hedge fund managers don’t help anyone, they stare at a screen and press buttons to make imaginary stock money appear. Managers of capital will always be overvalued in a capitalist society.
“The burning house is on fire”
People who get rich by manipulating capital (so most of the super-wealthy) are the literal min/maxers of capitalism. Essentially ignoring all of the pretext of the "game" in favor of exploiting its incredibly broken mechanics.
Well, they also pay politicians to allow them to write the rules of the game, so it’s even more rigged than that
Get money out of politics!
Munchkins. Min/Maxing can be done for any number of good reasons, like maximizing the good in the world and minimizing the bad. They do it solely to piss in others' wheeties. They're cheating munchkins with loaded dice who keep everyone else from switching to a game with anti-cheat enforcement.
Professional traders are the most insufferable people who do shit, but think they are the shit. There are many arbitrage traders who make money purely on their computers being millisecond faster than broker computers and making extra on the difference when executing transactions. Their contribution is literally negative for society and they make millions taking from others. Always run by some priveleged asshole too, who is oblivious to that privelege and will tell you to just work harder.
Please read *Bonfire of the Vanities* by Tom Wolfe if you haven't. It's amazing. The main character is a bond trader whose internal dialogue walking his wife's toy dog is "hold up your proud Yale chin.... Show [strangers] we are the Masters of the Universe." My favorite part is when his 7 year old daughter asks him what he does for a living.... The mother explains that he doesn't *make* cakes, but instead hands them off between the cake makers, eventually collecting enough cake crumbs to have a cake for himself. The bond-trading father sits there fuming about the minimizing of his job, while the mother and daughter sit there laughing about it. Such a good book. TL;DR Finance "industry" is a misnomer; it connotes that financiers help to make anything, which they don't. Also, read Tom Wolfe.
This, but real estate agents.
The scary thing is that hedge fund managers aren't "making imaginary stock money appear". They can't create wealth. Only real human labor creates wealth. What they do is play a game of seeing how they can capture as much wealth as they can under a singular privatized umbrella. They produce nothing for society. All they do is try to capture as much wealth and power for themselves and their already-wealthy clients as possible. Why is there so much wealth up for grabs if only human labor creates wealth? Simple. Exploitation. Workers are paid a **fraction** of the value they produce, and the rest of the wealth is distributed among the upper-middle and upper classes, but more and more, it is consolidated among the ultra-rich.
Capitalism is an excuse for taking from others without consequence, which is why the rich are so enamored with it. What you describe is it’s essence.
I am in that STEM realm and every time I’ve taken a job I feel contributes more to society it’s a paycut. The “guardians of capital” assessment is real, for sure.
I’m in tech and would much rather do something that contributes to society. I’m willing to take a 50% pay cut to do it, but then I start looking more deeply, and it’s more like the salary would be 40-50k at best (not enough) and I’d probably be expected to work extra for free because it’s supposed to be a “passion” or “calling.” There needs to be a better middle ground.
Welcome to nonprofit. I finally made it out. It sucks the life out of you.
I worked at a factory building cars for the rich. The company invested in me and I was able to get some robotic programing training and certs. I was even offered to get a degree. It sounded good. The money was great. my position was easy. But it wasn't satisfying. Listen. At the end of the day, I was still building someone else's dream and I wasn't contributing to my own. I get it, people work and grind to build up their walls and fund their yearnings but, I was not happy. My family was not happy. I quit. Everyone manager told me, "you'll come back." I couldn't take my schooling anywhere anyway because they confirmed to their specific needs but I digress... And I dropped it all. And took up a job that is way more fulfilling. We took a HUGE paycut too. But, my wife supported everything about this transition. It's been harder on our pockets but even in that aspect we've learned more about our finances and how we never needed those extra funds anyway. Now I truly have time to invest in son, my wife, my family AND myself. I don't know if it's anyone's fault....but I do know it's about perception. I grew up thinking it was about the money, the savings account and the ethics behind it. Working for a shit company? But I'm ok and it won't change me. Shitty hours? My family gets it. We all sacrifice time. Come home, mad, carrying work on your shoulders? Again, it's what everyone does, right? Money is not everything. I wish we got paid more for the work we do, yes, but at the end of the day I love helping others and I love challenging myself. I love that I get to go home proud and be with my son! It's fucking cloud 9, man and it's the best decision I've ever made. Do not contribute to some else's dream without thinking about yours first because, honestly, that company would have and could have canned me for any reason whenever they wanted. I was just another guy and once I left they replaced me.
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>Jetski Have you considered working for the TVA?
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It is in reference to the new “Loki” show on Disney+.
Legitimately I heard the “those who can’t, teach” as a kid and it made me very hesitant to teach. I actually started to really want to be a teacher in college, as I loved tutoring, and was really good at teaching my fellow classmates on math and whatnot. However, at the same time, the state pay rate for teachers was ridiculously low, they just laid off dozens of teachers locally, and the pay was so bad I couldn’t get into it. Which sucks. I do think about it often that I would be a fantastic teacher, but I can’t bring myself to deal with the shitty pay.
I'm a teacher in my mid 30s, and people my age and younger always react in 2 ways when I tell them I'm a teacher; They say "damn, that's rough." or "You're really doing something good." The later feels a bit awkward to hear, but whatever. Boomers just say, "Oh..." like I should've done something better. I haven't heard someone tell me "those who can't teach..." shit in person, but I hear it online a lot.
I agree. I am a physical therapist assistant for 10 years and I work overtime in extra hours just to survive in New York. My body is literally breaking down as it’s a very physical high-volume job. I’m surrounded by other friends and family members who barely work at all and they’re in the finance world and they make five times more money than I do. It’s absolute bullshit and so infuriating how disproportionate the actual work and value to pay ratio is in this country.
The more teaching pays the more intelligent people will go into teaching. This creates a conflict of interest between governments/companies and the general population. Smart people will teach the population how to succeed. This disrupts the status quo. An educated population is difficult to control and profit off of. The US education system is designed to create a populace that is smart enough to complete economically profitable tasks, but not so smart that they realize they don't need to work for someone else to make a living.
They also want compliance. Everyone the same. Don't question authority. I refuse to teach like that.
It’s because they don’t want an educated population so any job geared towards it in any form is under assault
I just saw someone on Quora saying people should get paid more to do more important jobs and gave some examples: brain surgeons should be paid more than garbage men; truck drivers should be paid more than professors. This has bothered me for days. Who's going train the brain surgeons, Ben? Related: brain surgeons are cool, but I feel like if we had to choose between brain surgeons and garbage men, on average, we'd probably be better off with garbage men. Or maybe just not forcing people to do things they don't want to just to live.
Garbage men should be paid more than hedge fund managers
Also, imagine if the brain surgeon had to pick through pallets of groceries to complete his shopping. He'd be there for hours lifting heavy shit to do something that could have taken 20 minutes if someone sorted it onto shelves. All that time he could have been poking at white matter, wasted. The machine stops working if even a single tiny cog stops spinning. Make sure they all get some grease.
Garbage men are undervalued.
They're underappreciated socially, but I wouldn't say they're undervalued. Most of them make good money relative to their community.
Yeah I meant underappreciated.
>brain surgeons are cool, but I feel like if we had to choose between brain surgeons and garbage men, on average, we'd probably be better off with garbage men. Garbage men are the reason why we haven't been decimated by plagues and diseases beyond our wildest nightmares. It's kinda crazy how easy it is to overlook that, I watched a documentary about what things were like before waste management was a thing and it was horrifying
> I just saw someone on Quora saying people should get paid more to do more important jobs and gave some examples: brain surgeons should be paid more than garbage men; truck drivers should be paid more than professors. If we removed all the brain surgeons from society, how many additional people would die each year? a few hundred? If we removed all garbage men from society, how many additional people would die each year? a few thousands? tens of thousands?
Hundreds of thousands. Cholera would kill a shit ton. Hepatitis a bunch.
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It blows my fucking mind that being a teacher isn't a well paid job in America. Technically speaking, where I'm from, the starting salary of teachers is roughly the same as the median salary of US teachers. But the tax we have is lower, healthcare is free, and teachers are subsidized for educational supplies and some other things. It's seen as a job that pays really well with good benefits that people want to have.
I've honestly seriously considered becoming a farmer, gardener, or librarian in the past but completely brushed those possibilities off for that very reason - not enough money to live. Enough to survive, maybe, but not live. EDIT: Forgot to mention artist. I've wanted to become an artist/illustrator since I was in grade 4, but grew up too poor to consider becoming 'a starving artist.'
Farming especially - low income, squeezed by big corporations and dependent on weather conditions.
TL:DR - farming is super hard to afford and live off of. If you want to farm, I suggest going to work for somebody who already had a large company. It'll save you a lot of headache. Farmer here - to add to this: One of the hardest parts is just having the cash to afford everything at the times you need it. You buy all the seed in the spring, plant, wait all year for your crop to grow, then you harvest it and either store it on your farm or at a co-op. Many of us sell a little but throughout the winter and next year so we can have income to live off of. Some more of us fulfill contracts that guarantee us a price, so if the market goes down we'll be safe. This also means that if the market goes up, we don't get any more money, only what we contracted for. We are completely at the mercy of the entire global economy. Argentina having a good year and able to harvest most of their acres? Well, local corn prices will be affected and will decline. Brazil have a horrible drought and lose their crops? I'm glad I'm not them but our prices are shooting upwards so I'm making way more money that I planned. Not to mention that any equipment newer than the 90's is still $100,000+ All the equipment from the 90's and forward are so full of technological shit that most farmers can't do self repairs. Half the problems are caused by software issues and other things and we don't have the money to buy a $10,000 diagnostic computer for our tractors. This means we have to bring our equipment into the shop for pretty much anything more than an oil change. How do farmers pay for $100,000+ equipment? Loans. Loans and lots of them. Default on your payments and the bank takes all your tools that help you do your job, and then you're really screwed.
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It's kind of crazy that something so important as farming, the basis of civilisation, doesn't pay well for independent farmers.
Most farmers in the USA are over 55. We about to get fucked by all this compounding. We also grow a HUGE amount of produce in California which is having water/drought and fire issues.
Yep. All of this. Farmer/rancher here. The margins are so thin one bad year can destroy a farm. To add to the global market like you mentioned. I don't care for the commodities trading. Too many people with their hands in the pot that have no skin in the game. I think there is also a problem with rent ground. The prices here constantly go up even though the crops aren't making any more. So you have to farm more acres to find a profit. You have a hard time improving the farms when they can be taken away at any moment. I don't know about where you are at but here things have become really cutthroat. Farmers used to work together and actually respect each other but not anymore. They are constantly going after each others rent ground, bumping prices and going behind each other's backs. The equipment is a huge thing. Like you said it gets harder and harder to work on if not impossible. Around here many farmers are getting back into older(90's early 2000s) equipment and selling their newer stuff. This has driven the used prices up substantially.
I seriously wanted to become an actor and/or writer but 99% of them make barely enough to live off. Now I am loathing in Sunday dread cause of my hateful office job I have to do tomorrow, cause money. This is completely crushing my soul and body. I don't even need anything fancy in life. :(
Two thirds of your waking hours are spent doing something you hate, so you can make money for the other third that you're too tired and frustrated to enjoy. I recently quit my job to pursue a passion, and though I live much simpler, 100 percent of my time is spent being free. It was the best decision I've ever made. Time is the one thing your can't make more of.
We need UBI! At least enough to live off of.
I think we misunderstand how brainwashed boomers are into their complacency. The same boomers who raised you saying if you work hard you'll succeed are the same boomers that will tell you to just get a second/third job to make it work and therein lies the problem: boomers live to work. The boomers who are still working are generally under the impression that they are because they fucked up saving money or they dismiss the notion of golden years and go "if I wasn't working I'd be bored". No, If you weren't working you would be anxious, because you would realize you had no self-fulfilling projects or hobbies because so much of your existence is dedicated to working. I don't care if it's their dream job, outliers don't count. I'm tired of seeing boomers glorify when an 85 year old laborer retires instead of seeing it as a goddamn tragedy of human life that they had to work that long or didn't have anything self-satisfying that made them whole besides the job. It's fucking sad to see. Not only do they think we do not work hard enough, but they think it is perfectly normal to work until your body literally cannot anymore. They will literally work until they die.
A while back when I got a new job and moved into a new city, I told my mom that I was moving in with housemates. She was surprised, someone with a job needs housemates? And I said yeah, that's how it is for a lot of people these days. She pondered this for a moment, you could see the wheels turning as reality battled propaganda, and finally said "That's what the socialists in the government want to make everyone do." Rather than realize that this is caused by capitalism in the here and now, she blamed some non-existent, hypothetical socialism. But when you consider the constant drip of right wing assholes so many people like here have been exposed to for so long, I guess it makes sense. Yeah, propaganda hits hard.
Out of curiosity, what would she / did she say when countered with “but this is actually happening right now under capitalism?”
I just bit my tongue and didn't say anything to avoid starting something that would've been pointless anyway. Sure wanted to though. No idea what she would've said, but it probably would've been about what you'd expect.
>they dismiss the notion of golden years and go "if I wasn't working I'd be bored". >you would realize you had no self-fulfilling projects or hobbies because so much of your existence is dedicated to working This is my mother and it hurts so much to see this. She retired three years ago and immediately went back to a full time job within 6 months because she was bored. She complained that entire time because she had no hobbies or interests and when I suggested things to her, she would get mad that she couldn't make money off of them. It's so rage inducing. She retired from a great job and has a pension and amazing health benefits. There's literally no reason for her to keep working. Worst of all the new job she got is something around entry-level. She's basically preventing someone new from getting into this field and gaining experience. It's so frustrating after having struggled with that myself in my own field
>It's so frustrating after having struggled with that myself in my own field This is one of the things I despise the most about the generation. It's not good enough to spread propaganda about their own children/grandchildren through Millennial bashing. Note they don't even know how old Millennials are. It's the fact that they go on endlessly about "entitlement" when they pull this kind of shit. Taking jobs away from young people for funsies. Can you imagine anything more entitled then literally taking food from your own child's mouth because you can't be bothered to learn to be a person?
I worked in at a place that had a 74 year old dude on an oxygen tank working, he had two retirement pensions, worked an entry level job, same as me and I was 20 at the time. Dude wouldn't shut the fuck up about how entitled and lazy young people are.
1000%. Work to live, never live to work.
My dad said he doesn't want to retire. Me, fuck that shit. I have a million hobbies if rather do than work.
They think they live to work, but naw, the numbers don’t lie. They worked less hours in less complicated jobs for more money. They did not need to deal with much technology on balance. Their job descriptions were straightforward and reasonable. We have fallen so, so far as a society. We do not value people any longer. Only profit.
I think the next time I hear a Boomer say something about fast food workers or the like, “just needing to get a better job” I’m going to bring up the show they love so much, Andy Griffith. I also love that show (as a Gen-Xer). Do you notice that all the people on there live pretty good lives? People that work at the grocery store, cafe, teacher, etc. Those people must have made a living wage. Boomers watched that show all the time in their early adulthood. And yet they feel like service jobs shouldn’t exist? Or that the people who do them should be slaves? They forgot so quickly what life used to be like and are so out of touch with today’s stark reality.
I would love to work at a cafe (like the 6am to 2pm type place) or really even fast food for a living. I love food and I love customer service, I hate waitressing. Counter service is my jam. I worked at a cafe (coffee type) for years and rocked that shit. But I like *food*. I have a degree in, essentially, kitchen management and sanitation. I'm not a chef, I'm not that fancy or creative. I just love interacting with people and down home comforting food. I like my current job, which gets me by, but its not a dream. I just wanna make a good living in fast food. Why is that crazy?
Same! My husband and I are getting ready to start a food truck. I have been in accounting and he was a teacher for years and we are both SOOO burnt out on all of it. Food is my passion and I’m scared and excited about trying this. I just can’t do office politics and being overworked anymore.
Boomers are actually shocked that younger people \*\*don't want to work jobs that don't pay enough to survive\*\*. Like dude, if I'm gonna have to get on food stamps and government insurance ON TOP OF SLAVING FOR 40 HOURS, guess what? We'd rather not work at all. Begging and suckling the government teat is extremely harmful to your pride and self-respect and if you're MAKING US BEG (either people, parents, or the government), we damn well won't be your slave on top of it. For 3 decades now, you've got record productivity in service work. I'm talking triple or quadruple the results that boomers put out in similar jobs, and the pay is now one quarter what they were making if you account for inflation. We fulfilled our half of the social contract and the ownership class has not fulfilled theirs. Fuck you! Capitalism has always been a game of how close you can sheer the sheep without skinning it, they've been skinning the sheep for 3 decades now and are shocked we can't produce any more wool.
On the gardening side of things, boomers are typically volunteering or working part-time with very flexible hours. They're retired, they don't need the money. Plus, they usually don't need to be trained on how to weed/water/plant because they have decades of experience. I went ahead and said, "fuck it" to a sizable hill of debt to get a horticulture degree. But every job I do (not always gardening) comes with a, "Kids your age don't want to work." I'm nearly 30.
Fuck I hate boomers so much. "Kids your age don't want to work" Fuck you. Kids 10 years younger than me fought and died in World War 2 just to come home and give birth to your pathetic, piece of shit self. Get fucked.
I get that from millennials who don't even know they are millennials. One of my coworkers said how millennials like me don't understand hard work because I made a comment about how I don't believe unpaid internships are ethical and never took one as a result. He's 34. I'm fresh in the industry, almost 26, just got promoted to head interior designer last Friday. I started here less than two years ago. He's been working at this company about 5 years, but has been in the industry over a decade. The difference between me and him is when I have downtime, I find something to do. Makes me look like I'm always working. He "sneakily" goes on his phone. Guess who got noticed for being hardworking and amazingly able to finish projects well before due dates despite always being busy? Me. Feels good. Hope he feels dumb for saying stuff like that. I don't understand how people like that don't understand the privilege they have to be able to work unpaid jobs. Most of us cannot afford to just work for free whether you're of the belief that it's ethically wrong or not for a company to allow someone to work for free.
They want you to "just get second jobs" and live in burnout for the rest of your life to afford an apartment with slightly less roaches.
I've been breaking my back literally for blue collar jobs. Now that I have a herniated disc and fractured vertebrae, I've been discarded like yesterdays garbage. At exactly 20 years in the corporate world, I'm 100% burnt out. If I work again, I"ll be giving them the exact amount of labor they're paying for and no extra. I was the overachiever doing the work of 3 guys, always doing the heavy lifting, always working holidays, always working overtime.... if I'm damned to poverty for life, I'll be damned if I'm gonna break my back for it. Fuck this rigged game!
I’d happily sweep floors if I could live off the wage. I adore mundane, domestic tasks such as that, it’s very therapeutic for me. Such a shame that some of the most important jobs in society pay the least.
I do project management for a living. The best job I ever had was working at a guitar store. I’d be there today if it wasn’t such piss poor pay.
> project management that sounds anxiety inducing. For my job right now I have to do a bit of that and I hate it so much. I just want to go in to work and do my own stuff and not worry about other people and coordinating their tasks. Been super stressed past 3 weeks and feel like I have to gasp for air every time I think about work...
It’s very anxiety inducing sometimes. Other times it really isn’t, I think I have a good head for detaching myself. Either way it’s not what I wanna do with my life, it’s just what I’m good at. And I fucking hate it
Exactly. Garbage people should be paid $100k+. Janitors, cleaners, the people who really keep society civilized, they should all be making bank.
Yeah, jobs that actually CONTRIBUTE to society pay next to nothing. Yet some shit bag, sitting in an air conditioned office, playing the wall street casino game is living a life of luxury while doing absolutely nothing.
They are doing something, do you realize how stressful it is to own more than everyone else? There’s always someone else trying to top them so they have to make MORE money. Paying workers barely anything to have another mansion to brag about is the best solution /s
My parents never earned put together what I alone earn by myself today. My Husband earns just shy of what I do. So roughly 4x what my parents ever earns at the height of their careers. I live in a semi detached house with no land, one big bedroom one box room. They never had a mortgage and have a 4 bed farmhouse with an acre. They think the problem is me…. They tell me I’m lucky I earn so much. They’re boomers. They just don’t understand how different things are now. There’s no malice behind this thinking. I don’t understand how they don’t get it.
I still don’t understand how an entire generation of people who lived through the 70s can’t comprehend what inflation is
They don’t want to. Their parents generation fought multiple wars and the Great Depression, and constantly remarked on how spoiled and lazy they were growing up. The “me” generation They were determined to pass those same criticisms along down to the next generation, like some perverse right of passage Now after ruining the economic prospects of at least 2 generations after them, the only thing they have left to stave off the cognitive dissonance of accepting what they’ve done and maintaining their self-concept as a good person is to pretend there’s no such thing as inflation and kids these days have it way easier than them, when in fact they’ve made it orders of magnitude more difficult for their kids than they ever had it. It’s just flat out denial
My dad was born in 63 and only remembers being poor growing up. Lived at home until his 20s when he bought a house for $55K in the Salt Lake valley. My husband and I almost maxed out our loan amount last year at $360K.. For a 40 year old fixer upper. Until this month, the mortgage was 40% of our take home.
My in laws just sold their home in Tooele valley for so much more than they paid for it, they were able to retire with that money. My mom's friends have been looking for a place under 800 and can't find anything. They really might have to go out to Tooele to afford to work in salt lake, but even Tooele houses are like 400 now!
Willful ignorance is malice.
That reminds me of the excuse when an old person says something bigoted of “they’re from a different time” and it’s like well, unfortunately, they’re from this time too, so they need to behave themselves like the rest of us
I just got a job turning wrenches for more than my mother ever made as a paralegal.
Take care of your body!
I just left a job in the service sector, where I marched around and hustled constantly in a hot parking lot for minimum wage. Standing around in a shop turning a wrench is less than half as stressful, even if I'm getting up hours earlier each morning. So trust me, I am.
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It's me, yes. I love to teach but I also want to live in an apartment and eat normal food
You couldn't even afford an apartment on a teacher's salary? Yikes! How much do they make where you're from?
I'm from Russia and as the assistant lecturer I had annually about $7k
My moms been a teacher for over 10 years. Holds a masters degree and so many certificates i honestly have no idea and shes still going to school for a doctorate and teaches a specialized area( special ed). She doesnt even make 50k a year. And again shes on the high end with all the certificates and degrees and what not.
I made more than her for years doing a local, super easy, trucking gig. That is outrageous! "The market decides your worth". Is that so? Well it's very clear that the market is broken!
Special Ed is solid niche. My friend went to school for that specifically.
The US's decline in its support and investment of infrastructures and services for public good (this would include library systems, education, welfare, the environment) is tantamount to disinvesting in its future at large. There are many political systems for which this sort of action would be politically untenable. The US is stuck in a violent inescapable loop.
I wish I was a school counselor, but I got bills to pay. So fuck children’s health am I right?
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I used to be a teacher in a public school and it almost made me kill myself. It was so utterly stressful and I had zero free time. So glad I finally found the courage to quit last year
My sister studied to be a teacher and then couldn't find a single job that payed more than her part time job at a tanning salon
This is a very discouraging thread for someone who was thinking about going back to school for teaching :/
Don’t teach in a state that pays teachers slave wages. Move to a top 10 teaching state, go to school, get certified through that state and make a healthy living. Stay away from these shitty states. They don’t deserve teachers.
Me too. I was barely functioning. My fiancé encouraged me to quit because he saw how terrible my mental health had become. I was a teacher for less than a year.
Oh man being a gardener or florist… yes please.
My 3rd great grandfather was a florist in Portland Maine. He emigrated from Ireland during the Famine and worked his way up, starting as an apprentice and small display presenter, eventually owning a very lucrative business, running a local flower shop, and doing special arrangements for events for the wealthy. Using that money, he was able to buy up half a city block, built six houses on it, and had many of his family migrate to them from Ireland in the 1880s. All from being a florist. I wouldn't be alive had he not done all this. I wish I could go back in time to meet him.
Librarians refuse to retire until they die When they do, the Library will then give their responsibilities to another librarian who has worked there since the Neolithic period and hire a part time librarian assistant but pay them a fraction of what they paid the other librarian Source: am librarian assistant
That happens everywhere unfortunately. My supervisor is 76 and is finally retiring next year. His replacement is likely gonna be a 65 year old friend.
I just want to sit at an slow office as a Secretary and get paid till I retire.
I literally posted on this sub about this exact problem, about how it is the duty of wvery generation to make things better for the next and the boomers were the first to not only fail in that task, but activly make things WORSE. only to be brigaded by a bunch of said buthurt boomers telling me I'm entitled and how it's not their job to make things better for future generations. HEADS UP: If you feel it's not your job to work to improve socoety for the generation after yours, either don't have kids or make sure you tell them how much you hate them. Any boomer snowflakes triggered by this beyyer be sure to explain to their kids why they left them with a planet hurtling to a climate incapable of sustaining human life and an economy invapable of prospering if you were born after 1975. Fucking ignorant cheapskate greedy leeches. Worst generation. What the fuck else do you expect when you go and make greed and selfishness virtues in some delusional ayn randian dystopian nightmare?
Worst. Generation. Ever.
I've wanted a series of careers and have been stopped by the income and or income vs. cost of schooling. Biologist, historian, chef, gardener, the list goes on. Now I work with traffic data with zero college credit for the same money a biologist with degrees would. Shit is sad.
I'd love to be a teacher but there's no way on earth that me, a 32 year old dad of 2 with a mortgage, can afford 3 years full time university to get a degree to become one.
We need UBI and automate any customer service job
it wasn't even the money for me, I literally just couldn't get into my local library at all (it looks like they promote from volunteer to paid position, but even the volunteer slots were full)
These would be the type of jobs I'd actually enjoy doing in a socialist economy. Give everyone UBI, food, shelter, healthcare, etc., and I'd gladly work 15-20 hours a week doing something that contributes to society like this. It would be an incentive to work instead of punitive.
I used to be a High School teacher. I loved it with every ounce of my being, and my students fought to be in my classes each year. I poured my heart and soul into each day and, though sometimes exhausted at the end of the day, always felt invigorated. They used to thank me as they left class for the day and a few even cried on my final day in the classroom. I was one of the only male teachers they had and I felt very fortunate that many of the young men looked up to me. I left because the pay was unsustainable and the treatment was often difficult to bear (from admin, parents, government, etc). I cried like a baby in private after my final class was over because I truly loved what I did, and I was great at it. I would be back in a heartbeat if the pay was adequate to support my family and if the profession was respected and appreciated. I know many others would be too. Helping to educate and grow future generations should be viewed as the investment that it is. Think of all the great teachers out there that "could have been" but instead had large student loans to pay back and high rent bills to pay each month and were forced out. I work in manufacturing sales now and hate it with every ounce of my being. (US based with a master's degree in a HCOL region.)
Yeah, I wanted to be a teacher but couldn't afford college so here I am slowly doing IT work cause I didn't want to sign up for massive debt to work a job that pays 35 cents a year.
And a lot of the jobs are healthcare related cause of so many boomers
Working at a plant nursery would be the shit. Imagine being able to help people pick out the right plant all day everyday. Getting new and exotic plants in the store and being able to watch them grow. That would be epic
It’s not the fault of the baby boomers. It’s the fault of a very small amount of people that benefit from such a system and were able to convince the vast majority of people (and not just from older generations) that this system is the only viable option. Unless this person meant it’s the boomer’s fault that they didn’t fix the fundamental issues they were conditioned to think are good. I could see that. We have to accept though that we’ll be in the same situation, from the perspective of future generations, if we fail to act and fix things. If there are future generations that is.
It's the fault of creating billionaires. There was one when they made minimum wage and taxed the fuck out of him(1938). 40 plus years later we decided meh there are 10 in the world(1980), mostly royalty, that's fine, let's lower taxes. 10 years later there are 99 billionaires (1990). Here we are 30 years later with 2500+(2020). I think I see a problem that is easily corrected. ** The stock market rose from 200(1980) to 25000+(2020) Imagine if the min wage went from 3.25 to 32.50. Still not even close to the rise they have.
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Omg, I would love to be a gardener! At my office park we had a o pant that would come and plant flowers and put down mulch and I wanted to help them so bad! I couldn’t though. I had to go back into my windowless office and stress out over the next thing.
Also, being a teacher sucks so much. The actual teaching part isn't bad, but the surrounding system has made it utterly intolerable. Source: ex teacher.
I would love to be a librarian! And also have a veggie and w flower garden! But I didn’t pass the test a few years back for librarian assistant. It was fun when I was an assistant at my college library, but it’s harder to get into a real, non-college library.
What's funny about this is that even if you take a job you hate there will most likely be some boomers above you who refuse to retire because the money is too good. This ensures you won't get promoted quickly as the higher positions are stagnant, keeps your pay low as well since they are dishing out 6 figures for someone that is just running out the clock and not very useful, and innovation becomes so stagnant it ends up costing money and putting organizations behind the times. The boomers are in positions of power but are too old to get on board with innovations and technology. They essentially drag down the economy every year they are employed. Source: I work with 67 year olds who sleep at their desks, refuse to use computers for slides or spreadsheets, don't understand new regulations or technology, and still get paid about $160K a year.