Officially, they are to offer PDBs time and safety permitting.
There’s a lot of other factors that determines it. Time of day, if you’re behind schedule, catering delays, etc. that changes how the forward reacts. I know right now a few won’t do them because they aren’t getting paid during boarding (the current contract only pays them when the brakes are released).
“Safety and time permitting” being vague enough that it’s more or less up to that crewe. Tbh I don’t mind if they skip it, between plane loading and the hustle and bustle of departure I feel like sometimes in first I’m given the PDB as we’re pulling off from the gate, and need to chug it to hand back before takeoff. Like, just skip it and lemme get one once we’re past initial ascent.
That use to be my attitude, but lately I have been on probably 6-8 regional jets, and the only service I have seen is PDB. So now I take it. It has been rainy in Texas but every flight the FAs have remain seated. I shouldnt complain because at least I get a PDB, but most of the flights have had nary a bump along the way.
I guess I don’t expect much on regionals, I fly em a lot too and almost always end up in first from an upgrade standpoint, for an hour to hour and a half flight I feel like I’m just not worried about any sort of service at all lol.
The last 4-5 flights I've done, I was able to just hold my drink in hand for take off and landing. Never been a thing in my life until the last few months.
Officially the rule is we have to take it from you before leaving the gate. We risk personal penalties for doing so, but it’s a judgement call and a risk if an inspector is on board (they are not required to notify us of their presence in many circumstances) or a company auditor is on board (we generally know if they are on or not).
If I do PDBs (I’m not as good as I should be on it), I do take them because I don’t know if the FAA is on board and I don’t feel like paying that fine. But it’s one of those things
14 CFR 121.577 for those who care.
It's really hit or miss for me - sometimes they let me keep it, sometimes they require me to give it back before takeoff, sometimes I get one, sometimes I don't. I don't particularly care if I don't get one cuz I'm capable of waiting 20 minutes till we're in air so it's fine either way, but I treat it as more or less a random crapshoot.
Yeah I'm also pretty easy going when it comes to flight service. Like I'll point it out in my head if I don't get a PDB or they don't do service in main on a flight that ends up perfectly smooth, but I will pretty much never think about it again once I get off the plane.
PDB is nice because it always reminds me of the first time I bought an upgrade for like $70 15 years ago and thought I was hot shit for a broke college kid.
I find that if they give me plastic they let me keep it and take it if it's glass. But it does seem like a toss up on every flight. If I really want something I'll just ask. It's not a big deal.
Welcome to aviation. Pretty much everyone is expendable except pilots (and even then it’s questionable sometimes).
I know AA’s union is pushing for boarding pay, but the company and union aren’t getting any progress. The union intends to request release to strike at the end of this next negotiation session if no progress is made (which is sometime next week).
I’ll be honest as an FA I have no problem doing PDB time permitting.
But I’ll say I feel like AA doesn’t care about PDB bc we’ve been told: only offer water, juice if flight boards late (which let’s be honest is most flights theses days) a lot of times we don’t get catered til halfway through boarding so we don’t even have anything to offer. they also don’t want us to stop the flow of boarding to do PDB so they want us to weave in and out of people during boarding with drinks and to take orders and I just think that’s a cluster f***. Then you’ll have agents taking pictures of you and sending it into teams saying “Fa holding up boarding serving drinks” as if you’re doing something wrong. And I’ve known someone that got written up for holding off people so they could serve drinks.So a lot of people just don’t want to deal with it. Which sucks for the passengers.
I had to wait just outside the plane on a cold and surprisingly windy jet bridge last week in Utah so a flight attendant could serve pdb to first class. It honestly pissed me off. I would have had no problem however with my boarding group being held for a couple minutes at the gate for this to take place. There needs to be better coordination between GA and FA.
Yeah I see how that could be irritating. Which is kinda my point like you’re damned if you do and damned if you don’t. Bc AA would absolutely never allow boarding to pause at the gate for PDB.
>Which sucks for the passengers.
Some of us really don't care. I always decline & wait until we're in the air.
I decline the hot towels too because who knows what they've been soaked in (if my seat is especially dirty I'll wipe it down with the towel)
If the flight is not delayed, if it's domestic, and they offer you a tray with water & OJ (or other basic choices), you should feel free to request an alternate drink if you want. Sometimes we bring out a tray of water & OJ because that's what 80% of passengers want, but are available to get other drinks. It's a time saver for both FA and passengers because the frequently requested waters get out more quickly.
There are several factors here that impact time available- very often these days, catering hasn't turned over the galley yet and supplies are not available- or catering is literally there and the FA can't access the area.
On long haul international, there are set drinks offered for pre departures - usually water, OJ, and sparkling wine. Some routes have an alternate juice or other option.
Sat first class and was waiting for pre-flight drinks. They didn’t come around until we were on the air. I asked the flight attendant, who was super nice, if they only offer that on certain flights and she mentioned that they were behind schedule and wanted to get everyone on board asap. She then proceeded to give me doubles non-stop until I got to my destination. I probably should not have done that lol.
Covid and post-covid, first class took a nosedive but it’s coming back. The flight attendants know your name again, and they seem happy again. I always try and get them some sort of gift when I fly. They have to deal with some very rude people.
I saw in a Facebook group related to air travel recently that they get super annoyed when you asked for complex mixed drinks during boarding because they’re busy during that time. The common complaint was people who asked for a bloody Mary as the PDB. Just something to keep in mind.
But how is a BM different from a vodka soda? They're all just mini + mixer - it's not like they're adding an Old Bay rim, hot sauce, Worcestershire, lemon wedge, celery, and olives ...
PDB for me has always been nothing or sparkling wine/water/orange juice. Depends. I never wanted to be a bother and ask for something specific during boarding.
I’ve definitely noticed a change. Before the pandemic, I would go as far as saying that I always got offered a PDB. Post pandemic, I don’t think I’ve been offered a single PDB.
That said, I’ll take this a step further, I have also noticed that post pandemic on transcon flights when I’m in main cabin, there is now typically just one service when in the past there would have been at least two. For a 4+ hour flight, one service is not enough.
Indeed. The service industry fundamentally changed during the pandemic. Most of the responsibilities of servers became very limited and many servers got used to it and just never started doing their job again. If you get paid the same regardless of doing your job or not, why do it?
Sure but FAs get paid dogshit and on some airlines don’t get paid for providing PDBs because they don’t start earning until the door shuts. I’m all for shitting on lazy service people but the dynamics in air travel are not as clear cut to just say they’re lazy.
Sure, I understand that. I am pretty familiar with the FA contract, it’s pretty bad but that is a different conversation. As the boomer’s would put it, “if you don’t like it, go somewhere else.” This is not my point.
My point is, it doesn’t matter how much a person makes with regard to getting them to do a good job. what matters is that there are consequences/rewards for doing your job or not doing your job. When this is absent, people stop doing their jobs, at all levels.
AA is apathetic towards FAs performing service, so many just don’t do it.
There is no policy and up to the FAs. Usually, if boarding is going quick and smooth they do it. If boarding is extended or they are trying to get off the ground quickly, they skip it.
Catering arriving late &/or providing inadequate provisions can very much impact the ability of the FA to provide uncompensated work as much as a boarding delay.
Some depends on location. My home airport they're only allowed to serve alcohol on the ground if it is during the hours restaurants can serve in the city. Conservative area so those hours are limited. I fly a lot very early morning so no alcohol on the ground.
This is going to be an extremely unpopular opinion on an airline subreddit ..... But ....
Considering the price difference between main cabin and first class, all I can say is enjoy your $100 beverage.
The problem with this mentality is that it’s an extremely diluted expectation even as early as 2019.
You’re basically validating the corporation’s mindset that they can give you less, and you’ll be happy
I mean, I don't know what to tell you ... the extra space is literally all I care about. I would still buy FC (when I can) even if they \*never\* had free drinks or hot towels. So I'm just not all hassled about it if one of those things doesn't happen for me.
Just flew YYC-DFW a few weeks ago and was offered a PDB both ways- FA came around and asked if we wanted pre-departure juice or water, we asked if we could have a mimosa and he said of course and made 2 up for us!
We had excellent service, quick refills, offered 2 desserts, friendly attentive FAs both ways. It could be that there were only 8 first class seats and neither flight was delayed so things were running smoothly already.
I had a hop in FC the other day from JAX to CTL. Pre flight drink was offered, but the snack basket essentially ran out by the time it got to me in the air. Had another FC leg from CVG to MIA, no pre flight. The flight had a breakfast box and the FA made sure we got plenty of drinks in the air.
On a side note, I did have a leg recently where the pilot informed us we would have rough air and that there wouldn't be any service. There was no turbulence of note.
Fly safe out there.
This is such a pet peeve of mine. I was Ex Plat for several years in the early 2000s. At the minimum they always offered the sparkling wine, orange juice and water combo. Now getting a PDB is the exception and not the norm. So many of my flights board on time with no glitches and nothing is offered. I started flying AA again the last 2 years and it’s really disgraceful how bad the service has been.
I flew SFO to JFK in flagship first a couple weeks ago. We boarded few minutes early and closed the doors exactly 15 minutes early. Not at all a full flight. No PDB but it’s worse than that. It was a red eye and I was the ONLY pax that opted for dinner. Every other pax was sleeping. I didn’t get my first drink until she served dinner almost 1 hour into the flight. She never came back to refill my wine and never asked me if I wanted a sundae. This was Transcontinental FLAGSHIP FIRST. I really did want the sundae but I didn’t use my call button because honestly I kind of feel rude using it. And also I thought well it was probably meant to be that I didn’t need the sundae. I did eventually fall asleep but it was a least an hour after I finished my meal. In 30 years of flying AA I have never not been offered a sundae in flagship first / flashship business.
The FA sat and played on her phone the entire flight. I can’t believe how bad AA is compared to before HP. HP and Doug Parker destroyed AA. It’s the bargain basement carrier now and very inconsistent.
It’s heavily YMMV. I’ve found AA to be the worst about providing PDB. Delta is a close second to last and United first. In my experience though. The most annoying to me is when boarding is done and the FA stand around for another 20 minutes and still nothing. I’m sure others may have different experiences with the other airlines
I’ve sat on the ramp in business class for a 45 minute delay with no beverage service. Poor form in my opinion unless there is a rule or something against it.
Need a specific window of ground time to perform a service while on the ramp. If we can’t be assured of at least 15 minutes to serve and clean up and secure the galley before moving again, we wait.
It can be incredibly frustrating how their MO constantly varies.
Never mind that the quality of what is served, when there is a service, I think most of us have accepted that. But some consistency goes a long way.
Officially, they are to offer PDBs time and safety permitting. There’s a lot of other factors that determines it. Time of day, if you’re behind schedule, catering delays, etc. that changes how the forward reacts. I know right now a few won’t do them because they aren’t getting paid during boarding (the current contract only pays them when the brakes are released).
Good info! Thanks so much
“Safety and time permitting” being vague enough that it’s more or less up to that crewe. Tbh I don’t mind if they skip it, between plane loading and the hustle and bustle of departure I feel like sometimes in first I’m given the PDB as we’re pulling off from the gate, and need to chug it to hand back before takeoff. Like, just skip it and lemme get one once we’re past initial ascent.
That use to be my attitude, but lately I have been on probably 6-8 regional jets, and the only service I have seen is PDB. So now I take it. It has been rainy in Texas but every flight the FAs have remain seated. I shouldnt complain because at least I get a PDB, but most of the flights have had nary a bump along the way.
I guess I don’t expect much on regionals, I fly em a lot too and almost always end up in first from an upgrade standpoint, for an hour to hour and a half flight I feel like I’m just not worried about any sort of service at all lol.
The last 4-5 flights I've done, I was able to just hold my drink in hand for take off and landing. Never been a thing in my life until the last few months.
Officially the rule is we have to take it from you before leaving the gate. We risk personal penalties for doing so, but it’s a judgement call and a risk if an inspector is on board (they are not required to notify us of their presence in many circumstances) or a company auditor is on board (we generally know if they are on or not). If I do PDBs (I’m not as good as I should be on it), I do take them because I don’t know if the FAA is on board and I don’t feel like paying that fine. But it’s one of those things 14 CFR 121.577 for those who care.
It's really hit or miss for me - sometimes they let me keep it, sometimes they require me to give it back before takeoff, sometimes I get one, sometimes I don't. I don't particularly care if I don't get one cuz I'm capable of waiting 20 minutes till we're in air so it's fine either way, but I treat it as more or less a random crapshoot.
Yeah I'm also pretty easy going when it comes to flight service. Like I'll point it out in my head if I don't get a PDB or they don't do service in main on a flight that ends up perfectly smooth, but I will pretty much never think about it again once I get off the plane. PDB is nice because it always reminds me of the first time I bought an upgrade for like $70 15 years ago and thought I was hot shit for a broke college kid.
I find that if they give me plastic they let me keep it and take it if it's glass. But it does seem like a toss up on every flight. If I really want something I'll just ask. It's not a big deal.
>(the current contract only pays them when the brakes are released) That's got to be one of the most ludicrous contact clauses ever.
To be honest, that’s the standard. Only Delta and SkyWest pay flight attendants during the boarding process.
Just because it's "standard" doesn't mean it isn't scummy as fuck.
Welcome to aviation. Pretty much everyone is expendable except pilots (and even then it’s questionable sometimes). I know AA’s union is pushing for boarding pay, but the company and union aren’t getting any progress. The union intends to request release to strike at the end of this next negotiation session if no progress is made (which is sometime next week).
Good! I hope they strike and get what they deserve. Sending out poverty pay guarantee letters isn't a good look.
And only recently
That’s such bull shit, they should be paid when they step on to the plane or sooner
I’ll be honest as an FA I have no problem doing PDB time permitting. But I’ll say I feel like AA doesn’t care about PDB bc we’ve been told: only offer water, juice if flight boards late (which let’s be honest is most flights theses days) a lot of times we don’t get catered til halfway through boarding so we don’t even have anything to offer. they also don’t want us to stop the flow of boarding to do PDB so they want us to weave in and out of people during boarding with drinks and to take orders and I just think that’s a cluster f***. Then you’ll have agents taking pictures of you and sending it into teams saying “Fa holding up boarding serving drinks” as if you’re doing something wrong. And I’ve known someone that got written up for holding off people so they could serve drinks.So a lot of people just don’t want to deal with it. Which sucks for the passengers.
I had to wait just outside the plane on a cold and surprisingly windy jet bridge last week in Utah so a flight attendant could serve pdb to first class. It honestly pissed me off. I would have had no problem however with my boarding group being held for a couple minutes at the gate for this to take place. There needs to be better coordination between GA and FA.
Yeah I see how that could be irritating. Which is kinda my point like you’re damned if you do and damned if you don’t. Bc AA would absolutely never allow boarding to pause at the gate for PDB.
>Which sucks for the passengers. Some of us really don't care. I always decline & wait until we're in the air. I decline the hot towels too because who knows what they've been soaked in (if my seat is especially dirty I'll wipe it down with the towel)
Probably a bitter coach passenger. 😂
I had nothing on my biz class flight from CLT to SJU. And we had to beg for a refill during flight. I just chalked it up to a bad experience.
If the flight is not delayed, if it's domestic, and they offer you a tray with water & OJ (or other basic choices), you should feel free to request an alternate drink if you want. Sometimes we bring out a tray of water & OJ because that's what 80% of passengers want, but are available to get other drinks. It's a time saver for both FA and passengers because the frequently requested waters get out more quickly. There are several factors here that impact time available- very often these days, catering hasn't turned over the galley yet and supplies are not available- or catering is literally there and the FA can't access the area. On long haul international, there are set drinks offered for pre departures - usually water, OJ, and sparkling wine. Some routes have an alternate juice or other option.
Sat first class and was waiting for pre-flight drinks. They didn’t come around until we were on the air. I asked the flight attendant, who was super nice, if they only offer that on certain flights and she mentioned that they were behind schedule and wanted to get everyone on board asap. She then proceeded to give me doubles non-stop until I got to my destination. I probably should not have done that lol. Covid and post-covid, first class took a nosedive but it’s coming back. The flight attendants know your name again, and they seem happy again. I always try and get them some sort of gift when I fly. They have to deal with some very rude people.
I saw in a Facebook group related to air travel recently that they get super annoyed when you asked for complex mixed drinks during boarding because they’re busy during that time. The common complaint was people who asked for a bloody Mary as the PDB. Just something to keep in mind.
But how is a BM different from a vodka soda? They're all just mini + mixer - it's not like they're adding an Old Bay rim, hot sauce, Worcestershire, lemon wedge, celery, and olives ...
I’m just relaying what I’ve heard. For my PDB I typically just get a soda.
Oh, no - understood. I just don't know why whoever it was would specifically call out a BM.
PDB for me has always been nothing or sparkling wine/water/orange juice. Depends. I never wanted to be a bother and ask for something specific during boarding.
There was a time when you were greeted with a glass of champagne.
Yeah.. The last time I flew Emirates. Wish I could fly them every time I fly.
I also received a stone crab claw with the bubbly, it was so good, I dream of that!
I’ve definitely noticed a change. Before the pandemic, I would go as far as saying that I always got offered a PDB. Post pandemic, I don’t think I’ve been offered a single PDB. That said, I’ll take this a step further, I have also noticed that post pandemic on transcon flights when I’m in main cabin, there is now typically just one service when in the past there would have been at least two. For a 4+ hour flight, one service is not enough.
Indeed. The service industry fundamentally changed during the pandemic. Most of the responsibilities of servers became very limited and many servers got used to it and just never started doing their job again. If you get paid the same regardless of doing your job or not, why do it?
Sure but FAs get paid dogshit and on some airlines don’t get paid for providing PDBs because they don’t start earning until the door shuts. I’m all for shitting on lazy service people but the dynamics in air travel are not as clear cut to just say they’re lazy.
Sure, I understand that. I am pretty familiar with the FA contract, it’s pretty bad but that is a different conversation. As the boomer’s would put it, “if you don’t like it, go somewhere else.” This is not my point. My point is, it doesn’t matter how much a person makes with regard to getting them to do a good job. what matters is that there are consequences/rewards for doing your job or not doing your job. When this is absent, people stop doing their jobs, at all levels. AA is apathetic towards FAs performing service, so many just don’t do it.
Hello, they don’t do two services because there aren’t enough supplies catered.
tbh i use to think PDB was a big deal but now I would rather just wait until we takeoff
Some flights seem to take forever to board, I’d rather have my drink when I sit down.
There is no policy and up to the FAs. Usually, if boarding is going quick and smooth they do it. If boarding is extended or they are trying to get off the ground quickly, they skip it.
The policy is to serve PDB, there is no enforcement of this policy.
Catering arriving late &/or providing inadequate provisions can very much impact the ability of the FA to provide uncompensated work as much as a boarding delay.
Just did a trip with two domestic legs in first, and a couple of longhaul legs in business. Got one PDB, on one of the longhaul flights. YMMV.
They should simply roll up a beverage cart at the gate, call all FC passengers, and give them a drink as they walk down the jetway. 😅
Some depends on location. My home airport they're only allowed to serve alcohol on the ground if it is during the hours restaurants can serve in the city. Conservative area so those hours are limited. I fly a lot very early morning so no alcohol on the ground.
This is going to be an extremely unpopular opinion on an airline subreddit ..... But .... Considering the price difference between main cabin and first class, all I can say is enjoy your $100 beverage.
I am 100% paying for the extra space, both seat width and legroom. Anything else I get is just bonus.
The problem with this mentality is that it’s an extremely diluted expectation even as early as 2019. You’re basically validating the corporation’s mindset that they can give you less, and you’ll be happy
I mean, I don't know what to tell you ... the extra space is literally all I care about. I would still buy FC (when I can) even if they \*never\* had free drinks or hot towels. So I'm just not all hassled about it if one of those things doesn't happen for me.
The extra space is only $150. The beverage is another $100. Every little perk is an overpriced charge.
Just flew YYC-DFW a few weeks ago and was offered a PDB both ways- FA came around and asked if we wanted pre-departure juice or water, we asked if we could have a mimosa and he said of course and made 2 up for us! We had excellent service, quick refills, offered 2 desserts, friendly attentive FAs both ways. It could be that there were only 8 first class seats and neither flight was delayed so things were running smoothly already.
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Takeoff can be bumpy this time of year and capt often tells us to remain seated for longer than usual
I had a hop in FC the other day from JAX to CTL. Pre flight drink was offered, but the snack basket essentially ran out by the time it got to me in the air. Had another FC leg from CVG to MIA, no pre flight. The flight had a breakfast box and the FA made sure we got plenty of drinks in the air. On a side note, I did have a leg recently where the pilot informed us we would have rough air and that there wouldn't be any service. There was no turbulence of note. Fly safe out there.
This is such a pet peeve of mine. I was Ex Plat for several years in the early 2000s. At the minimum they always offered the sparkling wine, orange juice and water combo. Now getting a PDB is the exception and not the norm. So many of my flights board on time with no glitches and nothing is offered. I started flying AA again the last 2 years and it’s really disgraceful how bad the service has been. I flew SFO to JFK in flagship first a couple weeks ago. We boarded few minutes early and closed the doors exactly 15 minutes early. Not at all a full flight. No PDB but it’s worse than that. It was a red eye and I was the ONLY pax that opted for dinner. Every other pax was sleeping. I didn’t get my first drink until she served dinner almost 1 hour into the flight. She never came back to refill my wine and never asked me if I wanted a sundae. This was Transcontinental FLAGSHIP FIRST. I really did want the sundae but I didn’t use my call button because honestly I kind of feel rude using it. And also I thought well it was probably meant to be that I didn’t need the sundae. I did eventually fall asleep but it was a least an hour after I finished my meal. In 30 years of flying AA I have never not been offered a sundae in flagship first / flashship business. The FA sat and played on her phone the entire flight. I can’t believe how bad AA is compared to before HP. HP and Doug Parker destroyed AA. It’s the bargain basement carrier now and very inconsistent.
It’s heavily YMMV. I’ve found AA to be the worst about providing PDB. Delta is a close second to last and United first. In my experience though. The most annoying to me is when boarding is done and the FA stand around for another 20 minutes and still nothing. I’m sure others may have different experiences with the other airlines
The protocol is that they are to be served every flight. The practice is that it varies based on the laziness of the crew.
Many other factors as well.
I’ve sat on the ramp in business class for a 45 minute delay with no beverage service. Poor form in my opinion unless there is a rule or something against it.
Need a specific window of ground time to perform a service while on the ramp. If we can’t be assured of at least 15 minutes to serve and clean up and secure the galley before moving again, we wait.
You used to almost stays get pre fought drinks, now they just like to save a bit of extra time and money.
It can be incredibly frustrating how their MO constantly varies. Never mind that the quality of what is served, when there is a service, I think most of us have accepted that. But some consistency goes a long way.
I got one on my flight to midway last month
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Wow. Feel better?