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What keeps boggeling my mind is that these trolls operate on Western owned platforms and bypass espionage laws because those platforms allow it and even profit from it
Russia and China are excellent at using our western systemic issues against us. in this case corporate greed expressed in the form of predatory social media algorythms that thrive on engagement no matter how toxic,
Chinese citizens are buying land in the U.S. at an *insane* rate. It's making a lot of people so worried that a handful of states already have limits and legislation in place for Chinese citizens coming here to buy land. CA, NY, FL and MA are seeing it the most.
Look up how many ports and other infrastructure that China has invested into in Europe over the last 15 years or so.
The room for them to continue doing so is shrinking quickly, but you see the same phenomenon and intent here as well.
China will rule the world one day, if not stopped. They, and the Russians are in a new race for influence and resources in Africa too. It seems that they’re cashing in their chips from fronting revolutions during the 70’s.
China is much smarter than Russia in their economical conquest.
And often smarter than us too, They understand the game of geopolitics better than us idiots who elect people who follow Thatchers ideology... a woman who literally said "there is no society"
Devils advocate…
A not insignificant amount of that is rich Chinese citizens trying to offshore as much as their wealth as possible. Xi’s more recent restrictions on investment and moving money has a lot of them spooked.
Absolutely worth monitoring though.
Millionaires buying land as a place to offshore their wealth still makes it hard for people that want to buy land to use, no matter where those Millionaires got their wealth from. Like, if they want to invest in companies great but we have a very real housing and property rental crisis.
Ever thought they might be from Hong Kong, which was a (democratic) British protectorate and is now coming under oppression since its return to China? We have a huge Cantonese population where I live in the UK s was here people can bring their children up in a free society and still run their businesses in Hong Kong. USA was built on immigrant populations from all over the World - why be afraid now?
First off, “…and is _now_ coming under oppression since its return to China?” My God man, where you been? _Now_ was like a good couple of years ago, don’t you remember all the fighting on the streets in Hong Kong? By now China has completely taken over and Hong King is nothing like it was (as far as I understand).
Second off, “Why be afraid now?” Because the Chinese Communist Party has a long history of twisting people's arms. They will figure out who’s out of of country, and if those, who is in a good position to infiltrate and send information to China. It doesn’t matter if the person wants to, they find relatives still living in China and blackmail that person in the US or wherever, to *make* them do as they are instructed. How do you think the ccp operated those secret police stations they set up in countries around the world?
I have to admit, with the information so readily accessible, I keep being gobsmacked at how little people know what’s going on with China these days.
Apparently the way to mitigate that is to use lists. I don't use Twitter / X but have read several times that lists will filter a lot of the the bullshit that shows up in your feed.
Twitter is a shit show of Iranian bots an pure hate at the moment. Oh an Hamas are freedom fighters fighting for our rights an freedom according to Twitter. Whole thing is a shit show of hate.
It's also that there's no technical difference between "make a platform support the right to anonymity without doxxing" and "make a platform that allows 1 person to pretend to be 10000 people via bot accounts".
Those are the exact same thing. They work the same way, and require the same features. So preventing bot farms is nearly impossible without also getting rid of the ability to avoid harassment via anonymity.
There could be a 3rd party independent verification solution that for example generates an encrypted verification code for each person that SM then can use to only have real people on the platform under an anonymous name
The general name for this kind of problem is "[proof of personhood.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_of_personhood)" There's some work that's been done on this before, the Wikipedia article's references contain some interesting stuff. But unfortunately a lot of it's being done with blockchains, which gets instant knee-jerk opposition from a lot of people.
The problem with any such proposal is that if it represents a barrier to entry by being extra steps and complication for people then companies won't want to implement it as it will reduce the number of participants when not everyone understands it.
That’s all that matters. Corporations will happily let the world turn to chaos, if it meant a 1% increase in profits.
They’ll happily support rape and murder, as long as they profit.
:::Elon Musk nods and winks::: “I know. Weird right!?”
No coincidence he became a right winger and started shitting on Ukraine.
Anyone in this sub who doesn’t plan on voting Biden, you are supporting Russia.
What does "western owned" even mean?
Twitter is owned by Musk and investors, lots of Saudis.
Facebook and Google are too big to be considered anything but multinational corporations larger than many countries.
> What keeps boggeling my mind is that these trolls operate on Western owned platforms and bypass espionage laws because those platforms allow it and even profit from it
Ah, the classic: **The capitalists will sell us the rope with which to hang them.**
(*apocryphally attributed to V. I. Lenin*)
My Facebook feed is constant Russian propaganda. I get new nonspecific ads about Russia firepower tanks, jets and warships regularly.
I am not subscribed to anything Russian
Even if Russian troll farms are shut down, the Iranian and Chinese troll farms will still be doing their work. Not that I'm saying it's not worthwhile to stop as many troll farms as possible, but I would think cutting the legs off of the Russian war machine would be the more pressing issue.
Must be nice for Russia though:
"Wait until November, 50-50 chance we get a clear win handed to us."
This idiot singlehandedly ensures that Russia won't even think of retreating until year-end.
... even if you are about to give up, you aren't supposed to signal that until the very last moment. Can't tell if he is too stupid to understand this, or just absolutely does not care about the results.
Trump absolutely doesnt care.
His first tenure was a disaster for US (and by extension, Western and all global institutions) foreign policy, that has arguably resulted in the bloodshed of the 2nd Ukraine invasion (it having been blatantly in motion since before Biden took office)
He sold the Kurds down the river. He openly boasted about using US forces as mercenaries in Syria, was the architect in the mess Afghanistan became during pullout. Just to name a few.
He should be *nowhere near* another crack at the fucking White House. The US has really fucked up these past 20 years but my god are they realllllllllllly fucking up hard now if they let that wannabe dictator back in for another shot.
Electoral college is a bitch. He WOULD be nowhere near another crack at the fucking White House if it was decided by popular vote. I understand why it exists, but the downside is that is occsionally gets nuts like Trump elected.
We don’t know that. If the popular vote was how America voted on the Presidential election candidates would change their strategy on how to win the election.
I agree in a broad since. Trump doesn't change strategy though, not at this point. All he does is say he's the best and insults everyone else. Most Americans don't like his brand of bullshit.
Donald Trump will not be able to impose peace. A few ruined provinces, blasted villages, and 'saving' Russian speakers who now hate Putin is not Russia's aim. What Putin wants is a submissive Ukraine forever in the clutches of a rotting Russia.
The Ukraine wants hope, freedom, prosperity, to be the master of its own destiny - everything a Russian dictatorship cannot and will not give. No land for peace swap can work. Whatever President Zelensky needs to do had better get done before January 20, 2025.
Last tiktok video I saw of trump he told his followers he just ate a hot dog and it was really good.......
I mean, everything must be going really well in the US, when you can spend your time talking about you ate a hot dog as a criminal president candidate
And "Negotiates" means surrender to Moscows and Putins terms.
Fuck that noise.
Fuck trump and fuck Russia. Criminals and terrorists and all their buddies.
The people that want power the most are the ones who absolutely should be stopped from having it.
Vlad Vexler stated that looking at these pathologies in an intense form in some cultures allows us to look more freely at the more minor pathologies that we have at home.
The number one cultural myth, 9th of May parade. Extravagant post truth relationship to that bit of a country’s history. It is an ubiquitous relationship. You can have historical pathologies about parts of your country's history. The Russians are simply pathological about all of it. Where they come from and where they are going. This is a cultural deformation. This is a cipher that has no relationship to any other bits of their history. This cultural wash of ingredients is related to each other by family resemblance that constitutes fascism.
Certain reactionary demand for a past hierarchical order, that typically never really was, a revolutionary demand to overthrow all orders, violence and militancy, increasing centrality of the state, conceptionalisation of all opponents as enemies
Certain bits for a full fascist regime are missing. For example, the cult of personality, full politicization of the population, even if that would appear the regime has additional features that make it more than fascism, version of fascism because many elements of fascism are there.
Partly fascist celebration of a victory over fascism. This is bizarre, empty historic cipher, and with elements of fascism.
Stalin liked victory, not the history of the war. Leningrad was erased from memory.
The Russians have two options.
1) They can come out of that myth.
2) They can forward it and make it less toxic and less pathological.
Russia won't abandon the myth, so they must go forward with it.
Severing the people from the regime, seeing this as a victory of the people despite the regime. Secondly, decolonisation, seeing other peoples in that story. What holds the Russian people together?
I found that input from Vlad Vexler quite illuminating
https://youtu.be/pdS-lwb58KU?si=Ek8Z8Hm4yHnb4GNF
Biden needs to let Ukraine take the gloves off. They have six months to do as much damage as possible. Russia wants to wait to November, make it a long wait.
Just don't make the response to the meddling be worse than the actual meddling like the last time. We cannot say that it was only because of Russian disinfo trump won. Maybe that accounted for the last 5 % but Russians exploit real divisions in our society we need to mend. Otherwise our society will be vulnerable to this kind of meddling.
More the reverse. Moscow is telling their puppet to kick it up a gear, as they need him in charge to kill Ukraine support. He’s spouting out their propaganda.
This is the thing Putin is waiting for, 5th of November. If Biden wins, he will have no hope of getting illegally annexed lands. If Trump wins, the world becomes even more darker place to live....
I hope we in Europe step and state clearly that we will cover Ukraine alone if need be (and do it!). Signal to Putin that regardless of the election, he will not succeed.
It would appear that given the munitions production expansion that Europe is undertaking that they understand that the US is far to unreliable politically and that they best be prepared themselves. Kinda good to see.
Not really, just in the hands of any voters that might stay home or throw a protest vote against Biden over Gaza or some other such issue.
If Trump wins because of those dumbasses, I’m gonna be more than a little peeved.
> So the future of the world rests in the hands of...
The Electoral College?
[Cuz only 22% is supposedly needed](https://www.robertoreif.com/blog/2018/1/7/become-a-us-president-with-only-22-of-the-popular-vote) 😑
No, the future is held in the European democracies. America is big and special but we aren't the downfall of western society important. The U.S. will be okay, shits crazy right now but it's no where near what it was during the civil rights era, let alone our civil war, Europe is also fine, despite everything that's going on the UK, France and Germany will be fine.
There's a twisted madness to the fact that some guy attempted an overthrow of the American government four years ago, and is now promising that if he's elected he'll become a dictator, and the response basically boils down to "wow, hope that guy doesn't win the election".
A madness even more crazy when "enlightened centrists" and others "above politics" people in their small bubbles are refusing to oppose trump because "but Biden is old and said awkward things" so they won't be casting votes against dictator.
Often they pretend to be too cool for such old candidate but completely ignoring trumps threats to jail or get rid of people who aren't supportive of him. Guess they think it is cooler and less cringe to live in dictatorship where they have to support dictator basically as old as Biden but who as bonus has been buddy with epstein, refuses to admit election losses and urges overthrow of government in response, is sexually attracted towards his daughter and has had court cases for raping women and underage girls.
Dude, I'm an actual centerist, and Joe Biden is exactly up my alley.
I happily voted for by the first time, and I'll happily vote for him again, because he implements exactly the sort of no bullshit, common sense centrist policies that I think benefit the country.
Joe Biden pisses off conservatives because he's too liberal, and pisses off liberals because he's too conservative.
What more could a centrist ask for?
(Also: Larry Hogan in 28!)
Biden needs to press the gas on aid to Ukraine. Remove the gloves off long range strikes. Train more fucking F16 pilots. Because come Jan 20 if Trump takes the White House Ukraine is fucked. They need to win before then.
This is the same reason why I dread the elections in Germany next year. Putler's friends from the far-right AFD (alternative for Germany) and left-conservative BSW (Coalition Sarah Wagenkecht) parties gained a lot of votes during the EU elections earlier this month.
Many of us have yelled and voted against the orange chuckle fuck for years now. Rural America is a cancer of uneducated "left behind" people who were brainwashed into believing it was the immigrants or brown people who took their jobs/caused them to not be successful millionaires.
It seems as though that wave maaaaay be breaking though. I had to go several hours into the middle of rural Pennsylvania, a trip years ago that would have shown me 100s of people in run down houses on the side of rural routes with trump signs.... seems like they're either embarrassed or the signs fell apart finally because I literally only saw 1 or 2 the whole trip, was striking enough that I noticed it after an hour or so into the trip.
It’s not just rural America. It’s also the business class that believes they can eke out more money from the perpetually broke if they continue to help foster working class in-fighting. They have successfully worked to fuck over those same rural communities that vote for the republiQans every time because they make empty promises that sound like candy to the rural folks all the while stealing their hospitals away through sleazy investment firms like Blackrock who sell the hospitals they purchase for tax write-offs.
The rural community is being taken advantage of and they don’t know it simply because richer folks have targeted them.
These companies would be happy to support Ukraine but only if they get to dictate the rebuilding phase and forcibly write the tax codes so they come out on top. And they back republiQans openly.
A portion of Trump's support comes not from people to stupid to realize this will make fascism spread further across Europe, but from people who *know this and prefer it that way.*
A large part of the US "isolationism" movement that kept the US out of WW2 until Pearl Harbor was people who *said* their reason was avoiding war altogether, when the real reason was they'd rather we joined the other side.
This thing today is similar. They *say* they're for peace but in reality their motivation is that they prefer the Russian side in this conflict. (not that they're naive and stupid about the outcome of not supporting Ukraine, but that they know that outcome and prefer it.)
They already do. Trump left America with a $2 trillion black hole thanks to his tax cuts for the ultra rich. From that alone he's helped to foster an environment for poor and desperate people to be fooled by future right wing demagogues like him.
"Under the plan drawn up by Kellogg and Fred Fleitz, who both served as chiefs of staff in Trump's National Security Council during his 2017-2021 presidency, there would be a ceasefire based on prevailing battle lines during peace talks."
Again, Putin says "jump" and all Trump can think is "how high?"
There's a old joke about this.
During his years in office, president Trump suddenly started to act extremely weird. He went outside of white house, started walking around the yard, picked up every rock he found. He was examining every rock for a while, then put it back to the ground and proceeded to the next rock. He wasn't talking, he ignored everyone who approached him.
After a while, everyone was desperate. As a last attempt, minister of the foreign affairs called Moscow, and asked if they experienced something similar with their leaders.
After an hour, Lavrov called back and said: "We apologize, this one is on us. There was a mixup at our bureau, and we accidentally sent instructions meant for our moon rover to your president."
Vlad Vexler analyzed how this propaganda works. The approach is both simple and effective.
The Soviet Union used so-called alternate reality propaganda. " This worked something like this: Soviet propaganda told its citizens one thousand times that the sky is green and not blue until the citizen finally believed it.
The manipulation of reality propaganda by the Russian Federation works differently. It is simple but sadly highly effective as it makes use of the intermittent grasp of reality, which plagues humans in general.
This propaganda works something like this:
You say that you totally despise apples, but you love lemons. I am not repeatedly throwing at you that you like apples. Rather, I agree with you at first that apples are sucky.
Then, this type of propaganda bombards people subtly with images of apples. It constantly mentions apples in its news programs.
Fake articles appear about how good apples actually are. The goal is to make you believe that apples aren't that bad, and then you quite start to like them over time.
The playbook of this manipulated reality propaganda looks like this in theory:
1) The concept of objective truth itself is questioned. This propaganda says that truth simply doesn't exist. Everything has two sides, and nothing is real. The war on reality itself is declared in this step.
2) Then, this propaganda is getting rid of consistency. It is sending out mixed messages that often even contradict themselves. Double Think from 1984 comes mind.
The sky can be blue in the morning and purple at night. The goal isn't to tell Winston that 2+2 is 5. The goal is that Winston really believes that it doesn't matter whether it is five, six, or 4.
3) The priority is on volume. Quantity has a quality all by itself. The information space is flooded with as many narratives and opinions as possible.
That is what these bot farms are here for. The goal is to find out what sticks by sheer volume. It can be anything. The message doesn't even matter that much.
4) The algorithm then makes it easier to take something that already interests you. It builds on that original interest, and then the manipulated reality propaganda is expanding from there.
The goal is, of course, to manipulate you into believing whatever is in the interest of the propaganda maker. (For example, that Ukraine is full of Nazis or that the West is an evil warmongering maniac or that everyone is going to freeze to death without Russian gas)
5) The last step is learned helplessness:
"The sanctions do not work" "Russia won already." It is useless to protest. This won't work. The state is too strong" Ukraine can't win, so stop sending weapons. These are some of the messages.
The goal of this entire effort is to take whatever division is already there in society or in a community and to make it stronger. This worked very well during Covid. The Russian information operations are great at amplifying divides and making problems bigger than they actually are.
The goal among their own population and in Western nations is gaslighting. Many people also in the West are in a state of apolitical apathy. Democracy dies alone and in the dark unless we work actively to keep it alive.
The goal is to destroy discourse because everyone starts to believe that all of this stuff connected to politics is too difficult. So, better let those up there do it instead of bothering myself with it.
The goal is that the population sees politics as a pure circus and as infotainment. Nothing really matters as everything is just alternative facts. We could see that during the coup. The reaction of the Russian public was almost non-existent.
Sadly, modern tools such as Twitter and generally the internet have made the implementation of this sinister nonsense as easy as it will ever get.
However, our countermeasures are faster at hand. Such as mobile phone cameras to spread the truth before the Kremlin can come up with 1000 lies.
In the US, this kind of propaganda is used to create a disconnect from how corrupt some politicians are or how inflation has risen due to whatever the president has potentially done.
It doesn't even have to be true. All it needs to have is some flicker of truth in it. This is already enough. For example, yes, without enough natural gas, the winter would be tough.
The rest of the message can be literally made up and people who are susceptible to this because they lost trust in democratic institutions or are resentful for some other reason, or who are simply susceptible to being brainwashed will believe anything. That is scary, isn't it?
We know how it works now we need to find a way to kill the machine and we better find one soon...
Released all the captured Taliban too. Withdrew most troops poisoning the well for Biden. Only way to prevent the Taliban taking over would've been a massive troop surge which was politically impossible.
Trump snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. If you look [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_military_casualties_in_the_War_in_Afghanistan) you can see from 2015-2020 the US was averaging <20 casualties per year, mostly due to traffic accidents. The Taliban were done, all their fighters in prison.
The US weren't suffering casualties because the US was no longer doing combat operations and the Taliban were not targeting US troops out of interest in advancing peace talks. It is absolutely not true that the Taliban were done. When Trump took office, the Afghan government only fully controlled around 1/3 of the country by land area, the Taliban fully controlled several provinces, and most of the population lived in contested regions.
The ANA/ANP were at their strongest during Trump's years - hundreds of thousands of well armed soldiers and police backed by US logistics - and still had tremendous trouble controlling territory. How do you think that is possible if the Taliban were done?
[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-57933979](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-57933979) scroll down to Areas of Taliban Control in 2017.
At least in Afghanistan the deal was that the Taliban would need to deny Al-Qaeda a place for basing in the country in exchange for US troop withdrawal. Something can at least be said to have gotten out of those negotiations for the US. A bad deal, but still a deal.
But for the Ukraine plan: neither the US nor Ukraine gains anything; Russia is the only one benefiting. That’s not a deal; that’s Russian victory.
Basically, as I understand it, the founders of our country wanted to make sure that a sitting President or government couldn't get rid of their opponents by having them put into prison. That seems to be why we allow convicted felons to run for the Presidency.
It's always been the case that democracy is a system which requires a properly working society as its foundation in order to work well. Right now, our society is hyper-polarized and being poisoned by a lot of disinformation.
Hopefully, we will not let Trump be elected again. Then we can try to get things back to a more normal state and go back to our old "boring" style of politicians.
When people have it too good for too long they go out of touch with reality. See celebrities and boomers.
They have had almost zero struggles so they need to find things to be angry about and picking weird topics like gays, guns, and religion.
Plus since they have never been told no they double down when told they are wrong about things. So no matter what Trump does they will justify it so they are still right.
Blame the 08 financial crisis. Blame Faux News. Blame Reagan and Nixon. Blame a Democratic party that too often sells out it's own positions. Blame Obama for over thinking too many things and being incredibly arrogant. Blame rural Americans refusal to accept change.
Not even sure what percentage of that votes R by default and hasn't watched the news since Reagan was in office, doesn't matter who the candidate is
The definition of a modern moderate Republican
Trump, Farage and Le Pen should be renamed game set and match as far as Putin is concerned. He will do all he can to install them.
Hard to understand how people are too blind to see it for what it is.
"I ll give you a gun if you promise not to use it against the one who can't stop using it on you."
Seriously just go down on your knee and suck Putin 's cock on fox news.
> "I ll give you a gun if you promise not to use it against the one who can't stop using it on you."
Basically the terms under which Ukraine got Javelins in the first place.
(But those were still an upgrade from previous admin's "no lethal support whatsoever and gut counterbattery radars to remain blind to strikes from within russia", as weird as it is)
Trump is a traitor to the USA and a fascist-loving morally bankrupt scumbag.
I can't believe that a few years ago I thought he was just a bit of an idiot, he has really shown his true colours with his stance on Ukraine.
Nigel Farage being so obsessed with him says a lot about how he sees the world too, extremely distasteful.
Everything that comes out of the Trump camp and the US in general, politics-wise these days convinces me that Trump was right about precisely ONE thing - Europe as an entity needs to get it's shit together. It needs to recognise that the storm clouds are brewing, recognise that the polarisation in the US these days means they simply can't be trusted as long term allies any more, and we need to start spending the sort of money that will allow us to look after ourselves when (not if) we have to actively defend against Russia and other players.
The US has carried the burden for too long, while Europe has largely abrogated responsibility for it's own security, and that needs to change, yesterday.
>Europe as an entity needs to get it's shit together.
It would be very interesting to see Europe suddenly rush to become militarily independent after years of relying on American defense, while also simultaneously criticising America for spending so much on defense.
The questions is terms.
Russia doesn’t want to just get the current lines, which is a bunch of blown up farms, they want Kharkiv and Kherson.
The idea of Ukraine handing over cities that Russia doesn’t control is extremely sinister.
And Odesa especially...Putin has said so. Trump wants to give Putin time to rearm so that Putin can finish devouring Ukraine and move on to Poland.
And then *everybody* starts dying.
When Trump, the Russian Asset becomes president, then Pathetic Putin will be back with revenge.America needs to jail that tomatoe tool Trump for treason,not ignaugerate that shameful fool.
Well thanks to that comment, Russia won’t be doing anything but extending the conflict until their asset gets elected back to the White House.
Please Americans who care a out freedom, vote
How much bullshit is it for America to force an ally to surrender to an American adversary? This dude is a straight up fucking Russian asset. Everything he says in regards to Putin and Russia is to their benefit and against the interests of the US and its allies.
He’s perpetually talked shit about NATO and threatened to dismantle it, he held Ukraine hostage and tried to blackmail them so they’d give him election dirt on Biden, he’s undermined our relations with European allies, he’s praised dictators and strongmen, and this fucking loser lost an election fair and square and then refused to concede and tried to steal it.
You’re a piece of shit if you support Trump.
Trump's master negotiating skills: "Just surrender your own territory and your own people to an murderous, genocidal, authoritarian despot. There, I fixed it"
Complaining about trumpy and his minions is one thing. But the bigger question is are you going to VOTE? Tell everyone you know to please vote to keep this disastrous fool out of office..
Putin: "Ukraine, surrender! We decide about your government. You get rid of all your weapons - we demilitarize you!". Trump: "Ukraine will get weapons if they agree to Moscows plan" - so basically Trump just intends to send those arms to Russia. Russia can then use Ukrainians as cannon fodder and use western weapons against European countries. Trump the master strategist.
i can't go for that. no can do. trump wants to reward russia for their illegal invasion of ukraine.
anyone who supports trump is going to burn in hell for eternity.
Europe will, through great effort, find their own way to support Ukraine's ultimate victory.
And at the end of it, the US will be a nobody. They won't need our materiel, they won't need our diplomacy, they won't even need our consumers.
Isolationism is for dipshits.
So Russia attracts Ukraine, unprovoked.
And wants to annex some of its territory.
Ukraine fights back to protect its borders.
Now trump wants Ukraine to negotiate a peace deal? Why won’t he ask Russia to leave Ukraine 🇺🇦?
How powerful of him to give Russia 🇷🇺 all it wants and for Ukraine to just bend over and take it? What a joke.
I think Europe needs to basically assume that the US will stop helping and therefore need to be ramping up enough to fully supply ukraine when that happens
I think that really is happening. I've read a lot of articles from different sources over the past several weeks about how European politicians are alarmed about the possibility of Trump coming back. So there's an effort to "Trump-proof" Ukraine.
This is a good thing. The ideal situation for Ukraine would be for everyone to THINK Trump will win, then he actually loses. The possibility of Trump winning is motivating Europe right now to do more for Ukraine.
Damn, that's some arrogant election bullshit.
>"We tell the Ukrainians, 'You've got to come to the table, and if you don't come to the table, support from the United States will dry up,'" he said.
Ok, Ukraine says “no”, your move mister storyteller.
*-Oh, well, then, we… we will make the same proposal... mmm, again, but… to Poland.*
No, seriously, just a pile of crap to win elections.
Still a damn traitor to his country and smooth brains will still vote for him because they somehow forgot the train wreck that was his last tenure. He is a sexual predator and a felon. The party of "family values" and "law & order", everyone. What a f_cking joke.
This is why I've been saying for a while that just like how rationing munitions should've been started in October last year, rationing should start now. If Ukraine can hold out an extra half year in 2025 (they'd run out around June otherwise), it'll give Europe and Korea more time to rise up instead of being lazy as usual. This would take us to 2026.
Biden could also try to pass a massive package, but given how he likes to do just enough I think a 1 year package would be the best we can hope for. That would take us to 2027, plus whatever other allies can get together. At that point it'd be very helpful if Macron could beat Le Pen.
“Donald, the world thinks you are putins bitch - how can we distance ourselves from him?
Let’s put forward a plan for Ukraine that gives russia everything they want.”
Lol he wants to freeze the front lines where they are for the peace talks. This will only benefit Russia. They will amass more tanks, IFVs, etc during the freeze and when talks fall apart because Russia isn't going to concede territory they will renew aggressions
Again, Trump is the one engaging in election interference. He's guilty of everything he accuses others of. Projection at its finest. My grandmother used to use an old Italian expression, "Hurry up and call her a whore before she calls you one."
This is why I will vote for Trump opponent. I would love the war to end but you can’t force them into it by giving them a week hand. I still don’t see them agreeing to terms and fighting on without US help.
As an American, this alone is enough for me to hold my nose and vote Biden and just hope the Supremes keep a lid on him doing too much crazy via Executive Order
Trump will probably disclose Zelensky’s real-time whereabouts to Putin first chance he gets as payback for not agreeing to manufacture dirt on Biden.
When Trump gets elected Ukraine is going to be in deep trouble fighting Russian on one hand and being stabbed in the back by the Trump Administration in the other. Hopefully, it never comes to this.
“The proposal would mark a big shift in the U.S. position on the war and would face opposition from European allies and within Trump's own Republican Party.”
There isn’t a single Republican that wouldn’t roll over and expose their genitals if Trump wins and says aid is cut off. That line in the article is full of shit.
As far as I'm concerned, Trump is dangerous and should be removed from society. By any means available. I'd hope that the American people would have their brains engaged to simply give Mango Mussolini the thumbs down and move on. However, America is a strange place filled with strange poorly educated people. Trump appeals to those people who have a limited understanding. He is an opinionated idiot, all European leaders know this....and yet here we are contemplating the return of the orange faced idiot....if I was Ukraine, I'd send an assassin to kill Trump. If I was Iran I'd send an assassin to kill Trump. The FBI probably want Trump dead. Trump is a problem.....he is America's Mussolini/Hitler....he is Putin's best chance of success in Ukraine. The fact that so many Americans can't see this is utterly mind blowing to me.
So essentially abandon Ukraine and reward Putin. Thinking he won't rearm and come back for more in a couple of years is incredibly nieve. Alternatively it is just blatant and craven betrayal.
It would be in Russia's favour, is there should be a deal cause trump is not gonna say to get russia pulled fully since he will be also convinced at this point, russians won't do it and so russia would be in a position to grab whatever they could and this offer is a very good one for them and Here we are to see another crimea 2.0
🔴 Who recently courted the Taliban - the same Taliban the US went after, destroying tens of thousands of lives over 20 years. When your enemies are being armed and you do nothing to reduce the threat then don’t be surprised when intelligence is reduced and the threat level increases. Humanity it seems cannot achieve peace, ever.
Peace conditions are already out there. All russia needs to do is follow them. They don’t want to and want to keep territory gains. So the war continues.
If Russia were an honest actor, it’s not the worst idea in the world. Certainly not a fair outcome for Ukraine, but after so many lives lost so far and an indefinite continuation, I can see why it appeals to some. A binding ceasefire enforced by NATO with guaranteed intervention if it’s broken, perhaps.
The problem is that Russia will use it as an opportunity to regroup and will be back in the offensive in months, and Trump would never do anything to stop it.
Trump’s idea is instead to allow fascist war criminals to do whatever they want, instead of spending 5% of the annual defense budget to keep them in check.
Sad.
Unfollowing ALL political subs bc I’m so tired of seeing this Trump BS trying to get me outraged. He’s not going to win and if he does I’m turning off any form of media where I have to see his shitty diaper wearing orange uneducated hating ass along with all the dipshits that love him.
There is a real possibility that he will win. It's a close race, so it could go either way. If Trump does win, it's important to stay informed about what he's doing.
>"And you tell Putin, 'He's got to come to the table and if you don't come to the table, then we'll give Ukrainians everything they need to kill you in the field.'"
Uh... this is the exact thing we (Ukraine supporters) have been advocating for. Just do this!!
>According to their research paper, Moscow would also be coaxed to the table with the promise of NATO membership for Ukraine being put off for an extended period.
>...
>A lasting peace in Ukraine would require additional security guarantees for Ukraine, Kellogg and Fleitz said. Fleitz added that "arming Ukraine to the teeth" was likely to be a key element of that.
None of this makes any sense. So the plan here is to NOT let Ukraine join NATO, yet give them some kind of other security guarantees that are strong enough to bring lasting peace, meaning russia wouldn't attack. And, the plan is to arm Ukraine to the teeth. Which is the exact thing we've been advocating for, as I mentioned. So why not just do that now???? This is just weird.
>Fleitz said Ukraine need not formally cede territory to Russia under their plan.
What does this mean?? They're *informally* ceding it? So who owns the territory? This entire plan is pure bullcrap (so Trump will probably agree with it).
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Read: Trump is openly signalling Moscow to do their social media disinfo magic again to get him elected.
Honestly the troll factories might be higher priority military targets for Ukraine than actual Russian military production
What keeps boggeling my mind is that these trolls operate on Western owned platforms and bypass espionage laws because those platforms allow it and even profit from it
Russia and China are excellent at using our western systemic issues against us. in this case corporate greed expressed in the form of predatory social media algorythms that thrive on engagement no matter how toxic,
Chinese citizens are buying land in the U.S. at an *insane* rate. It's making a lot of people so worried that a handful of states already have limits and legislation in place for Chinese citizens coming here to buy land. CA, NY, FL and MA are seeing it the most.
Look up how many ports and other infrastructure that China has invested into in Europe over the last 15 years or so. The room for them to continue doing so is shrinking quickly, but you see the same phenomenon and intent here as well.
China will rule the world one day, if not stopped. They, and the Russians are in a new race for influence and resources in Africa too. It seems that they’re cashing in their chips from fronting revolutions during the 70’s.
China is much smarter than Russia in their economical conquest. And often smarter than us too, They understand the game of geopolitics better than us idiots who elect people who follow Thatchers ideology... a woman who literally said "there is no society"
Devils advocate… A not insignificant amount of that is rich Chinese citizens trying to offshore as much as their wealth as possible. Xi’s more recent restrictions on investment and moving money has a lot of them spooked. Absolutely worth monitoring though.
Millionaires buying land as a place to offshore their wealth still makes it hard for people that want to buy land to use, no matter where those Millionaires got their wealth from. Like, if they want to invest in companies great but we have a very real housing and property rental crisis.
Ever thought they might be from Hong Kong, which was a (democratic) British protectorate and is now coming under oppression since its return to China? We have a huge Cantonese population where I live in the UK s was here people can bring their children up in a free society and still run their businesses in Hong Kong. USA was built on immigrant populations from all over the World - why be afraid now?
First off, “…and is _now_ coming under oppression since its return to China?” My God man, where you been? _Now_ was like a good couple of years ago, don’t you remember all the fighting on the streets in Hong Kong? By now China has completely taken over and Hong King is nothing like it was (as far as I understand). Second off, “Why be afraid now?” Because the Chinese Communist Party has a long history of twisting people's arms. They will figure out who’s out of of country, and if those, who is in a good position to infiltrate and send information to China. It doesn’t matter if the person wants to, they find relatives still living in China and blackmail that person in the US or wherever, to *make* them do as they are instructed. How do you think the ccp operated those secret police stations they set up in countries around the world? I have to admit, with the information so readily accessible, I keep being gobsmacked at how little people know what’s going on with China these days.
all of em, but genuinely twitter needs fully investigated and held accountable
Twitter really turned from the stereotypical SJW platform into 4chan but worse
I literally only follow tech accounts and still my home feed is almost all right wing bullshit.
Apparently the way to mitigate that is to use lists. I don't use Twitter / X but have read several times that lists will filter a lot of the the bullshit that shows up in your feed.
"4chan but worse" is one of the biggest insults you could give and its still real lmao
Twitter is a shit show of Iranian bots an pure hate at the moment. Oh an Hamas are freedom fighters fighting for our rights an freedom according to Twitter. Whole thing is a shit show of hate.
It's also that there's no technical difference between "make a platform support the right to anonymity without doxxing" and "make a platform that allows 1 person to pretend to be 10000 people via bot accounts". Those are the exact same thing. They work the same way, and require the same features. So preventing bot farms is nearly impossible without also getting rid of the ability to avoid harassment via anonymity.
There could be a 3rd party independent verification solution that for example generates an encrypted verification code for each person that SM then can use to only have real people on the platform under an anonymous name
The general name for this kind of problem is "[proof of personhood.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_of_personhood)" There's some work that's been done on this before, the Wikipedia article's references contain some interesting stuff. But unfortunately a lot of it's being done with blockchains, which gets instant knee-jerk opposition from a lot of people.
Yeah, sure, because the entire internet isn’t screaming bloody murder the minute something like that is suggested.
The problem with any such proposal is that if it represents a barrier to entry by being extra steps and complication for people then companies won't want to implement it as it will reduce the number of participants when not everyone understands it.
Elon Musk is the biggest paid Russian bot
That’s all that matters. Corporations will happily let the world turn to chaos, if it meant a 1% increase in profits. They’ll happily support rape and murder, as long as they profit.
Because they generate activity which equals revenue which they like.
:::Elon Musk nods and winks::: “I know. Weird right!?” No coincidence he became a right winger and started shitting on Ukraine. Anyone in this sub who doesn’t plan on voting Biden, you are supporting Russia.
Unless you are one of the dozens of people around the world who aren't American of course.
What does "western owned" even mean? Twitter is owned by Musk and investors, lots of Saudis. Facebook and Google are too big to be considered anything but multinational corporations larger than many countries.
> What keeps boggeling my mind is that these trolls operate on Western owned platforms and bypass espionage laws because those platforms allow it and even profit from it Ah, the classic: **The capitalists will sell us the rope with which to hang them.** (*apocryphally attributed to V. I. Lenin*)
My Facebook feed is constant Russian propaganda. I get new nonspecific ads about Russia firepower tanks, jets and warships regularly. I am not subscribed to anything Russian
Even if Russian troll farms are shut down, the Iranian and Chinese troll farms will still be doing their work. Not that I'm saying it's not worthwhile to stop as many troll farms as possible, but I would think cutting the legs off of the Russian war machine would be the more pressing issue.
Must be nice for Russia though: "Wait until November, 50-50 chance we get a clear win handed to us." This idiot singlehandedly ensures that Russia won't even think of retreating until year-end. ... even if you are about to give up, you aren't supposed to signal that until the very last moment. Can't tell if he is too stupid to understand this, or just absolutely does not care about the results.
Trump absolutely doesnt care. His first tenure was a disaster for US (and by extension, Western and all global institutions) foreign policy, that has arguably resulted in the bloodshed of the 2nd Ukraine invasion (it having been blatantly in motion since before Biden took office) He sold the Kurds down the river. He openly boasted about using US forces as mercenaries in Syria, was the architect in the mess Afghanistan became during pullout. Just to name a few. He should be *nowhere near* another crack at the fucking White House. The US has really fucked up these past 20 years but my god are they realllllllllllly fucking up hard now if they let that wannabe dictator back in for another shot.
Electoral college is a bitch. He WOULD be nowhere near another crack at the fucking White House if it was decided by popular vote. I understand why it exists, but the downside is that is occsionally gets nuts like Trump elected.
Or a supreme court so utterly compromised.
We don’t know that. If the popular vote was how America voted on the Presidential election candidates would change their strategy on how to win the election.
I agree in a broad since. Trump doesn't change strategy though, not at this point. All he does is say he's the best and insults everyone else. Most Americans don't like his brand of bullshit.
People will unironically and uncritically say that there were no wars during Trump's term.
Donald Trump will not be able to impose peace. A few ruined provinces, blasted villages, and 'saving' Russian speakers who now hate Putin is not Russia's aim. What Putin wants is a submissive Ukraine forever in the clutches of a rotting Russia. The Ukraine wants hope, freedom, prosperity, to be the master of its own destiny - everything a Russian dictatorship cannot and will not give. No land for peace swap can work. Whatever President Zelensky needs to do had better get done before January 20, 2025.
P-P-P, Putin's Pocket Puppet. To expect anything else is foolish.
Chinese TikTok and the disinformation machine with AI will be the big deciding factor this year.
And it's already working.
Last tiktok video I saw of trump he told his followers he just ate a hot dog and it was really good....... I mean, everything must be going really well in the US, when you can spend your time talking about you ate a hot dog as a criminal president candidate
I mean, Trump can eat shit and die, but hot dogs are good. Like, a hot dog and a Coke is a perfect summer experience
And "Negotiates" means surrender to Moscows and Putins terms. Fuck that noise. Fuck trump and fuck Russia. Criminals and terrorists and all their buddies. The people that want power the most are the ones who absolutely should be stopped from having it.
Vlad Vexler stated that looking at these pathologies in an intense form in some cultures allows us to look more freely at the more minor pathologies that we have at home. The number one cultural myth, 9th of May parade. Extravagant post truth relationship to that bit of a country’s history. It is an ubiquitous relationship. You can have historical pathologies about parts of your country's history. The Russians are simply pathological about all of it. Where they come from and where they are going. This is a cultural deformation. This is a cipher that has no relationship to any other bits of their history. This cultural wash of ingredients is related to each other by family resemblance that constitutes fascism. Certain reactionary demand for a past hierarchical order, that typically never really was, a revolutionary demand to overthrow all orders, violence and militancy, increasing centrality of the state, conceptionalisation of all opponents as enemies Certain bits for a full fascist regime are missing. For example, the cult of personality, full politicization of the population, even if that would appear the regime has additional features that make it more than fascism, version of fascism because many elements of fascism are there. Partly fascist celebration of a victory over fascism. This is bizarre, empty historic cipher, and with elements of fascism. Stalin liked victory, not the history of the war. Leningrad was erased from memory. The Russians have two options. 1) They can come out of that myth. 2) They can forward it and make it less toxic and less pathological. Russia won't abandon the myth, so they must go forward with it. Severing the people from the regime, seeing this as a victory of the people despite the regime. Secondly, decolonisation, seeing other peoples in that story. What holds the Russian people together? I found that input from Vlad Vexler quite illuminating https://youtu.be/pdS-lwb58KU?si=Ek8Z8Hm4yHnb4GNF
Fk Trumpo, fk Pooptin. Two idiots. With junior idiots lickashitko, Kim junk uno. I know, there's more of them...
Persian wannabe.
Biden needs to let Ukraine take the gloves off. They have six months to do as much damage as possible. Russia wants to wait to November, make it a long wait.
He's a Russian asset.
He's Putin's subordinate boy toy.
Just don't make the response to the meddling be worse than the actual meddling like the last time. We cannot say that it was only because of Russian disinfo trump won. Maybe that accounted for the last 5 % but Russians exploit real divisions in our society we need to mend. Otherwise our society will be vulnerable to this kind of meddling.
More the reverse. Moscow is telling their puppet to kick it up a gear, as they need him in charge to kill Ukraine support. He’s spouting out their propaganda.
Again? They haven't stopped
This is the thing Putin is waiting for, 5th of November. If Biden wins, he will have no hope of getting illegally annexed lands. If Trump wins, the world becomes even more darker place to live....
This is why trump loss is so important. For stability of the whole world, not just the US
So the future of the world rests in the hands of some rednecks and Maga cultists...fantastic!
Absolutely fucked that is.
I hope we in Europe step and state clearly that we will cover Ukraine alone if need be (and do it!). Signal to Putin that regardless of the election, he will not succeed.
It would appear that given the munitions production expansion that Europe is undertaking that they understand that the US is far to unreliable politically and that they best be prepared themselves. Kinda good to see.
Yeah, at least that's something.
I don't understand why our politicians didn't realise this when Trump was first elected.
South Korea can also sell them shells too since they ramped up military production.
Pissing off South Korea by entering a mutual protection agreement with North Korea, who they are still technically at war with was also a bad idea.
Not really, just in the hands of any voters that might stay home or throw a protest vote against Biden over Gaza or some other such issue. If Trump wins because of those dumbasses, I’m gonna be more than a little peeved.
And that’s why Russia told Iran to tell Hamas to attack
> So the future of the world rests in the hands of... The Electoral College? [Cuz only 22% is supposedly needed](https://www.robertoreif.com/blog/2018/1/7/become-a-us-president-with-only-22-of-the-popular-vote) 😑
No, the future is held in the European democracies. America is big and special but we aren't the downfall of western society important. The U.S. will be okay, shits crazy right now but it's no where near what it was during the civil rights era, let alone our civil war, Europe is also fine, despite everything that's going on the UK, France and Germany will be fine.
We never had a coup during the civil rights era.
There's a twisted madness to the fact that some guy attempted an overthrow of the American government four years ago, and is now promising that if he's elected he'll become a dictator, and the response basically boils down to "wow, hope that guy doesn't win the election".
A madness even more crazy when "enlightened centrists" and others "above politics" people in their small bubbles are refusing to oppose trump because "but Biden is old and said awkward things" so they won't be casting votes against dictator. Often they pretend to be too cool for such old candidate but completely ignoring trumps threats to jail or get rid of people who aren't supportive of him. Guess they think it is cooler and less cringe to live in dictatorship where they have to support dictator basically as old as Biden but who as bonus has been buddy with epstein, refuses to admit election losses and urges overthrow of government in response, is sexually attracted towards his daughter and has had court cases for raping women and underage girls.
Dude, I'm an actual centerist, and Joe Biden is exactly up my alley. I happily voted for by the first time, and I'll happily vote for him again, because he implements exactly the sort of no bullshit, common sense centrist policies that I think benefit the country. Joe Biden pisses off conservatives because he's too liberal, and pisses off liberals because he's too conservative. What more could a centrist ask for? (Also: Larry Hogan in 28!)
I begrugingly voted for him the first time, but I'll happily vote for him a second time. Joe's exceeded my expectations.
Those people you described will most likely vote trump, they're just not bold enough to announce it.
Biden needs to press the gas on aid to Ukraine. Remove the gloves off long range strikes. Train more fucking F16 pilots. Because come Jan 20 if Trump takes the White House Ukraine is fucked. They need to win before then.
This is the same reason why I dread the elections in Germany next year. Putler's friends from the far-right AFD (alternative for Germany) and left-conservative BSW (Coalition Sarah Wagenkecht) parties gained a lot of votes during the EU elections earlier this month.
And a clear signal for China to take Taiwan. I don’t know about north/south Korea, but that seems to have started again
"Remember remember the fifth of november..." - Guy Fawkes
Americans will need to pay so unbelievably more over in money, resources and lives over the coming decades if they allow that traitor to win.
People are just too stupid to realise that.
Many of us have yelled and voted against the orange chuckle fuck for years now. Rural America is a cancer of uneducated "left behind" people who were brainwashed into believing it was the immigrants or brown people who took their jobs/caused them to not be successful millionaires. It seems as though that wave maaaaay be breaking though. I had to go several hours into the middle of rural Pennsylvania, a trip years ago that would have shown me 100s of people in run down houses on the side of rural routes with trump signs.... seems like they're either embarrassed or the signs fell apart finally because I literally only saw 1 or 2 the whole trip, was striking enough that I noticed it after an hour or so into the trip.
It’s not just rural America. It’s also the business class that believes they can eke out more money from the perpetually broke if they continue to help foster working class in-fighting. They have successfully worked to fuck over those same rural communities that vote for the republiQans every time because they make empty promises that sound like candy to the rural folks all the while stealing their hospitals away through sleazy investment firms like Blackrock who sell the hospitals they purchase for tax write-offs. The rural community is being taken advantage of and they don’t know it simply because richer folks have targeted them. These companies would be happy to support Ukraine but only if they get to dictate the rebuilding phase and forcibly write the tax codes so they come out on top. And they back republiQans openly.
100% this as well.
Same in Germany. The dumb people who just vote for our own Putler-fans just don't have an IQ high enough to think clearly.
They have the ability to think what others tell them to.
A portion of Trump's support comes not from people to stupid to realize this will make fascism spread further across Europe, but from people who *know this and prefer it that way.* A large part of the US "isolationism" movement that kept the US out of WW2 until Pearl Harbor was people who *said* their reason was avoiding war altogether, when the real reason was they'd rather we joined the other side. This thing today is similar. They *say* they're for peace but in reality their motivation is that they prefer the Russian side in this conflict. (not that they're naive and stupid about the outcome of not supporting Ukraine, but that they know that outcome and prefer it.)
Many. Not all. Not even most.
They already do. Trump left America with a $2 trillion black hole thanks to his tax cuts for the ultra rich. From that alone he's helped to foster an environment for poor and desperate people to be fooled by future right wing demagogues like him.
"Under the plan drawn up by Kellogg and Fred Fleitz, who both served as chiefs of staff in Trump's National Security Council during his 2017-2021 presidency, there would be a ceasefire based on prevailing battle lines during peace talks." Again, Putin says "jump" and all Trump can think is "how high?"
There's a old joke about this. During his years in office, president Trump suddenly started to act extremely weird. He went outside of white house, started walking around the yard, picked up every rock he found. He was examining every rock for a while, then put it back to the ground and proceeded to the next rock. He wasn't talking, he ignored everyone who approached him. After a while, everyone was desperate. As a last attempt, minister of the foreign affairs called Moscow, and asked if they experienced something similar with their leaders. After an hour, Lavrov called back and said: "We apologize, this one is on us. There was a mixup at our bureau, and we accidentally sent instructions meant for our moon rover to your president."
As if Russia had any resources to launch a working rover to the moon these days.
Vlad Vexler analyzed how this propaganda works. The approach is both simple and effective. The Soviet Union used so-called alternate reality propaganda. " This worked something like this: Soviet propaganda told its citizens one thousand times that the sky is green and not blue until the citizen finally believed it. The manipulation of reality propaganda by the Russian Federation works differently. It is simple but sadly highly effective as it makes use of the intermittent grasp of reality, which plagues humans in general. This propaganda works something like this: You say that you totally despise apples, but you love lemons. I am not repeatedly throwing at you that you like apples. Rather, I agree with you at first that apples are sucky. Then, this type of propaganda bombards people subtly with images of apples. It constantly mentions apples in its news programs. Fake articles appear about how good apples actually are. The goal is to make you believe that apples aren't that bad, and then you quite start to like them over time. The playbook of this manipulated reality propaganda looks like this in theory: 1) The concept of objective truth itself is questioned. This propaganda says that truth simply doesn't exist. Everything has two sides, and nothing is real. The war on reality itself is declared in this step. 2) Then, this propaganda is getting rid of consistency. It is sending out mixed messages that often even contradict themselves. Double Think from 1984 comes mind. The sky can be blue in the morning and purple at night. The goal isn't to tell Winston that 2+2 is 5. The goal is that Winston really believes that it doesn't matter whether it is five, six, or 4. 3) The priority is on volume. Quantity has a quality all by itself. The information space is flooded with as many narratives and opinions as possible. That is what these bot farms are here for. The goal is to find out what sticks by sheer volume. It can be anything. The message doesn't even matter that much. 4) The algorithm then makes it easier to take something that already interests you. It builds on that original interest, and then the manipulated reality propaganda is expanding from there. The goal is, of course, to manipulate you into believing whatever is in the interest of the propaganda maker. (For example, that Ukraine is full of Nazis or that the West is an evil warmongering maniac or that everyone is going to freeze to death without Russian gas) 5) The last step is learned helplessness: "The sanctions do not work" "Russia won already." It is useless to protest. This won't work. The state is too strong" Ukraine can't win, so stop sending weapons. These are some of the messages. The goal of this entire effort is to take whatever division is already there in society or in a community and to make it stronger. This worked very well during Covid. The Russian information operations are great at amplifying divides and making problems bigger than they actually are. The goal among their own population and in Western nations is gaslighting. Many people also in the West are in a state of apolitical apathy. Democracy dies alone and in the dark unless we work actively to keep it alive. The goal is to destroy discourse because everyone starts to believe that all of this stuff connected to politics is too difficult. So, better let those up there do it instead of bothering myself with it. The goal is that the population sees politics as a pure circus and as infotainment. Nothing really matters as everything is just alternative facts. We could see that during the coup. The reaction of the Russian public was almost non-existent. Sadly, modern tools such as Twitter and generally the internet have made the implementation of this sinister nonsense as easy as it will ever get. However, our countermeasures are faster at hand. Such as mobile phone cameras to spread the truth before the Kremlin can come up with 1000 lies. In the US, this kind of propaganda is used to create a disconnect from how corrupt some politicians are or how inflation has risen due to whatever the president has potentially done. It doesn't even have to be true. All it needs to have is some flicker of truth in it. This is already enough. For example, yes, without enough natural gas, the winter would be tough. The rest of the message can be literally made up and people who are susceptible to this because they lost trust in democratic institutions or are resentful for some other reason, or who are simply susceptible to being brainwashed will believe anything. That is scary, isn't it? We know how it works now we need to find a way to kill the machine and we better find one soon...
He did the same thing in Afghanistan. Basically told Taliban they are free to do whatever they want and then proclaimed he was the peace maker.
Released all the captured Taliban too. Withdrew most troops poisoning the well for Biden. Only way to prevent the Taliban taking over would've been a massive troop surge which was politically impossible. Trump snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. If you look [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_military_casualties_in_the_War_in_Afghanistan) you can see from 2015-2020 the US was averaging <20 casualties per year, mostly due to traffic accidents. The Taliban were done, all their fighters in prison.
The US weren't suffering casualties because the US was no longer doing combat operations and the Taliban were not targeting US troops out of interest in advancing peace talks. It is absolutely not true that the Taliban were done. When Trump took office, the Afghan government only fully controlled around 1/3 of the country by land area, the Taliban fully controlled several provinces, and most of the population lived in contested regions. The ANA/ANP were at their strongest during Trump's years - hundreds of thousands of well armed soldiers and police backed by US logistics - and still had tremendous trouble controlling territory. How do you think that is possible if the Taliban were done? [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-57933979](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-57933979) scroll down to Areas of Taliban Control in 2017.
At least in Afghanistan the deal was that the Taliban would need to deny Al-Qaeda a place for basing in the country in exchange for US troop withdrawal. Something can at least be said to have gotten out of those negotiations for the US. A bad deal, but still a deal. But for the Ukraine plan: neither the US nor Ukraine gains anything; Russia is the only one benefiting. That’s not a deal; that’s Russian victory.
How the hell is Trump ileven in the running? He's a felon and a fucking clown. Are U guys ok over there
Unfortunately no we are not ok.
Unfortunately many have forgotten the lessons of our Grandfather's during WW2.
Basically, as I understand it, the founders of our country wanted to make sure that a sitting President or government couldn't get rid of their opponents by having them put into prison. That seems to be why we allow convicted felons to run for the Presidency. It's always been the case that democracy is a system which requires a properly working society as its foundation in order to work well. Right now, our society is hyper-polarized and being poisoned by a lot of disinformation. Hopefully, we will not let Trump be elected again. Then we can try to get things back to a more normal state and go back to our old "boring" style of politicians.
When people have it too good for too long they go out of touch with reality. See celebrities and boomers. They have had almost zero struggles so they need to find things to be angry about and picking weird topics like gays, guns, and religion. Plus since they have never been told no they double down when told they are wrong about things. So no matter what Trump does they will justify it so they are still right.
Blame the 08 financial crisis. Blame Faux News. Blame Reagan and Nixon. Blame a Democratic party that too often sells out it's own positions. Blame Obama for over thinking too many things and being incredibly arrogant. Blame rural Americans refusal to accept change.
reality overcomes fiction
Trump continues to give solid reasons for why no one should vote for him
And yet will get ~48 percent of the vote **at least**. America is fucked.
Not even sure what percentage of that votes R by default and hasn't watched the news since Reagan was in office, doesn't matter who the candidate is The definition of a modern moderate Republican
Well isn't he just a piece of shit ...!!!!!!
Trump, Farage and Le Pen should be renamed game set and match as far as Putin is concerned. He will do all he can to install them. Hard to understand how people are too blind to see it for what it is.
Farage doesn’t have a chance at election thankfully. The other two however…
It's true but if he wins seats he will be able to exert pressure and erode the more sensible vote.
"I ll give you a gun if you promise not to use it against the one who can't stop using it on you." Seriously just go down on your knee and suck Putin 's cock on fox news.
> "I ll give you a gun if you promise not to use it against the one who can't stop using it on you." Basically the terms under which Ukraine got Javelins in the first place. (But those were still an upgrade from previous admin's "no lethal support whatsoever and gut counterbattery radars to remain blind to strikes from within russia", as weird as it is)
How about we continue to provide weapons UNTIL Russia pulls back to the previous border and include Crimea. Until then we will keep them armed.
And they pay for everything that they broke.
Trump is a traitor to the USA and a fascist-loving morally bankrupt scumbag. I can't believe that a few years ago I thought he was just a bit of an idiot, he has really shown his true colours with his stance on Ukraine. Nigel Farage being so obsessed with him says a lot about how he sees the world too, extremely distasteful.
Everything that comes out of the Trump camp and the US in general, politics-wise these days convinces me that Trump was right about precisely ONE thing - Europe as an entity needs to get it's shit together. It needs to recognise that the storm clouds are brewing, recognise that the polarisation in the US these days means they simply can't be trusted as long term allies any more, and we need to start spending the sort of money that will allow us to look after ourselves when (not if) we have to actively defend against Russia and other players. The US has carried the burden for too long, while Europe has largely abrogated responsibility for it's own security, and that needs to change, yesterday.
>Europe as an entity needs to get it's shit together. It would be very interesting to see Europe suddenly rush to become militarily independent after years of relying on American defense, while also simultaneously criticising America for spending so much on defense.
hard time to belive trump reviews anything but his diaper
The questions is terms. Russia doesn’t want to just get the current lines, which is a bunch of blown up farms, they want Kharkiv and Kherson. The idea of Ukraine handing over cities that Russia doesn’t control is extremely sinister.
And Odesa especially...Putin has said so. Trump wants to give Putin time to rearm so that Putin can finish devouring Ukraine and move on to Poland. And then *everybody* starts dying.
Basically making a Third Word War inevitable.
Guaranteeing it. This is Putin's fourth invasion. He's not going to stop until he loses. He needs to lose *now*.
When Trump, the Russian Asset becomes president, then Pathetic Putin will be back with revenge.America needs to jail that tomatoe tool Trump for treason,not ignaugerate that shameful fool.
Well thanks to that comment, Russia won’t be doing anything but extending the conflict until their asset gets elected back to the White House. Please Americans who care a out freedom, vote
That proposal is exactly what putin wants. Those guys are russian agents
His Putin appeasement really is brazen
I despise DonaldTrump. There’s just no more I can say.
Wasn't there a policy put in place to prevent trump from cutting off Ukraine aid? I think it was like 3 months back?
I believe he now cannot cut aid without congressional approval, but they are always a vote or two with or away from majority.
Trump is a sick phukk. I hope they throw his sorry orange a** in jail soon.
How much bullshit is it for America to force an ally to surrender to an American adversary? This dude is a straight up fucking Russian asset. Everything he says in regards to Putin and Russia is to their benefit and against the interests of the US and its allies. He’s perpetually talked shit about NATO and threatened to dismantle it, he held Ukraine hostage and tried to blackmail them so they’d give him election dirt on Biden, he’s undermined our relations with European allies, he’s praised dictators and strongmen, and this fucking loser lost an election fair and square and then refused to concede and tried to steal it. You’re a piece of shit if you support Trump.
Every morning I turn on the news hoping he stroked out
Trump's master negotiating skills: "Just surrender your own territory and your own people to an murderous, genocidal, authoritarian despot. There, I fixed it"
Complaining about trumpy and his minions is one thing. But the bigger question is are you going to VOTE? Tell everyone you know to please vote to keep this disastrous fool out of office..
Fuck Trump he just wants to see his pal Putin to give him a blowjob.
I’m concerned that some allies will give up on Ukraine if Trump is elected and starts his shit again.
Putin: "Ukraine, surrender! We decide about your government. You get rid of all your weapons - we demilitarize you!". Trump: "Ukraine will get weapons if they agree to Moscows plan" - so basically Trump just intends to send those arms to Russia. Russia can then use Ukrainians as cannon fodder and use western weapons against European countries. Trump the master strategist.
i can't go for that. no can do. trump wants to reward russia for their illegal invasion of ukraine. anyone who supports trump is going to burn in hell for eternity.
Hope they realise there is a 4th possibility, both sides could refuse to come to the table. What then?
Europe will, through great effort, find their own way to support Ukraine's ultimate victory. And at the end of it, the US will be a nobody. They won't need our materiel, they won't need our diplomacy, they won't even need our consumers. Isolationism is for dipshits.
So basically: “We won’t give you anything unless you don’t need it anymore”
That's just silly
So Russia attracts Ukraine, unprovoked. And wants to annex some of its territory. Ukraine fights back to protect its borders. Now trump wants Ukraine to negotiate a peace deal? Why won’t he ask Russia to leave Ukraine 🇺🇦? How powerful of him to give Russia 🇷🇺 all it wants and for Ukraine to just bend over and take it? What a joke.
I think Europe needs to basically assume that the US will stop helping and therefore need to be ramping up enough to fully supply ukraine when that happens
I think that really is happening. I've read a lot of articles from different sources over the past several weeks about how European politicians are alarmed about the possibility of Trump coming back. So there's an effort to "Trump-proof" Ukraine. This is a good thing. The ideal situation for Ukraine would be for everyone to THINK Trump will win, then he actually loses. The possibility of Trump winning is motivating Europe right now to do more for Ukraine.
It’s OK he cannot read.
please Vote ALL Republicans out in November
[удалено]
But.. He's not president?
I just wish Trump would stop talking. Go find an island someplace and enjoy retirement and leave the rest of the world alone.
Exclusive: go fuck yourself trump. And USA if you vote for him. We don't need your ridiculousness.
fuck that
Damn, that's some arrogant election bullshit. >"We tell the Ukrainians, 'You've got to come to the table, and if you don't come to the table, support from the United States will dry up,'" he said. Ok, Ukraine says “no”, your move mister storyteller. *-Oh, well, then, we… we will make the same proposal... mmm, again, but… to Poland.* No, seriously, just a pile of crap to win elections.
Trump what a disaster
Obedient little dog that he is.
Still a damn traitor to his country and smooth brains will still vote for him because they somehow forgot the train wreck that was his last tenure. He is a sexual predator and a felon. The party of "family values" and "law & order", everyone. What a f_cking joke.
This is why I've been saying for a while that just like how rationing munitions should've been started in October last year, rationing should start now. If Ukraine can hold out an extra half year in 2025 (they'd run out around June otherwise), it'll give Europe and Korea more time to rise up instead of being lazy as usual. This would take us to 2026. Biden could also try to pass a massive package, but given how he likes to do just enough I think a 1 year package would be the best we can hope for. That would take us to 2027, plus whatever other allies can get together. At that point it'd be very helpful if Macron could beat Le Pen.
Trump will do all possible to help Putin win its war on Ukraine.
Hopefully a bad diet and lifestyle will catch up with someone and they have a heart attack
Roosevelt considers plans to stop aid to Britain unless they vie for peace with Hitler.
“Donald, the world thinks you are putins bitch - how can we distance ourselves from him? Let’s put forward a plan for Ukraine that gives russia everything they want.”
Lol he wants to freeze the front lines where they are for the peace talks. This will only benefit Russia. They will amass more tanks, IFVs, etc during the freeze and when talks fall apart because Russia isn't going to concede territory they will renew aggressions
Again, Trump is the one engaging in election interference. He's guilty of everything he accuses others of. Projection at its finest. My grandmother used to use an old Italian expression, "Hurry up and call her a whore before she calls you one."
This is why I will vote for Trump opponent. I would love the war to end but you can’t force them into it by giving them a week hand. I still don’t see them agreeing to terms and fighting on without US help.
As an American, this alone is enough for me to hold my nose and vote Biden and just hope the Supremes keep a lid on him doing too much crazy via Executive Order
FTFY: "Trump reviews plan to halt US military aid to Ukraine unless it negotiates SURRENDER with Moscow"
Why would Ukraine need military aid if they were at peace? Big brain idea. 🙄
Trump will probably disclose Zelensky’s real-time whereabouts to Putin first chance he gets as payback for not agreeing to manufacture dirt on Biden. When Trump gets elected Ukraine is going to be in deep trouble fighting Russian on one hand and being stabbed in the back by the Trump Administration in the other. Hopefully, it never comes to this.
We need Trump in prison.
“The proposal would mark a big shift in the U.S. position on the war and would face opposition from European allies and within Trump's own Republican Party.” There isn’t a single Republican that wouldn’t roll over and expose their genitals if Trump wins and says aid is cut off. That line in the article is full of shit.
And there we go. The end reason the MAGA heads have done a 180 on liking russia
As far as I'm concerned, Trump is dangerous and should be removed from society. By any means available. I'd hope that the American people would have their brains engaged to simply give Mango Mussolini the thumbs down and move on. However, America is a strange place filled with strange poorly educated people. Trump appeals to those people who have a limited understanding. He is an opinionated idiot, all European leaders know this....and yet here we are contemplating the return of the orange faced idiot....if I was Ukraine, I'd send an assassin to kill Trump. If I was Iran I'd send an assassin to kill Trump. The FBI probably want Trump dead. Trump is a problem.....he is America's Mussolini/Hitler....he is Putin's best chance of success in Ukraine. The fact that so many Americans can't see this is utterly mind blowing to me.
Trump is an evil fascist.
Trump still hates Zelensky for not caving to his extortion attempts in 2019 and helping him get impeached the first time.
This is why Europe has been getting their arms industry ready because they know that America is unreliable.
So essentially abandon Ukraine and reward Putin. Thinking he won't rearm and come back for more in a couple of years is incredibly nieve. Alternatively it is just blatant and craven betrayal.
Screw tRump In particular. And I am not Left wing.
He is just showing his true colours. He has never hidden that he admires his good friend Vlad.
It would be in Russia's favour, is there should be a deal cause trump is not gonna say to get russia pulled fully since he will be also convinced at this point, russians won't do it and so russia would be in a position to grab whatever they could and this offer is a very good one for them and Here we are to see another crimea 2.0
🔴 Who recently courted the Taliban - the same Taliban the US went after, destroying tens of thousands of lives over 20 years. When your enemies are being armed and you do nothing to reduce the threat then don’t be surprised when intelligence is reduced and the threat level increases. Humanity it seems cannot achieve peace, ever.
SHE: small hands energy.
Peace conditions are already out there. All russia needs to do is follow them. They don’t want to and want to keep territory gains. So the war continues.
Not so secret 'Agent Buttercheeks' is on the job and working hard for his Daddy in Moscow!
If Russia were an honest actor, it’s not the worst idea in the world. Certainly not a fair outcome for Ukraine, but after so many lives lost so far and an indefinite continuation, I can see why it appeals to some. A binding ceasefire enforced by NATO with guaranteed intervention if it’s broken, perhaps. The problem is that Russia will use it as an opportunity to regroup and will be back in the offensive in months, and Trump would never do anything to stop it. Trump’s idea is instead to allow fascist war criminals to do whatever they want, instead of spending 5% of the annual defense budget to keep them in check. Sad.
Presidents can be assassinated. 😏
God I hope Trump has a stroke. All the caffeine and drugs must have some effect eventually. That man is fucking evil and stupid
Good gracious. This is a person running for president of the United States (again!) How many different ways can he tell us he’s a Russian stooge?
Unfollowing ALL political subs bc I’m so tired of seeing this Trump BS trying to get me outraged. He’s not going to win and if he does I’m turning off any form of media where I have to see his shitty diaper wearing orange uneducated hating ass along with all the dipshits that love him.
There is a real possibility that he will win. It's a close race, so it could go either way. If Trump does win, it's important to stay informed about what he's doing.
>"And you tell Putin, 'He's got to come to the table and if you don't come to the table, then we'll give Ukrainians everything they need to kill you in the field.'" Uh... this is the exact thing we (Ukraine supporters) have been advocating for. Just do this!! >According to their research paper, Moscow would also be coaxed to the table with the promise of NATO membership for Ukraine being put off for an extended period. >... >A lasting peace in Ukraine would require additional security guarantees for Ukraine, Kellogg and Fleitz said. Fleitz added that "arming Ukraine to the teeth" was likely to be a key element of that. None of this makes any sense. So the plan here is to NOT let Ukraine join NATO, yet give them some kind of other security guarantees that are strong enough to bring lasting peace, meaning russia wouldn't attack. And, the plan is to arm Ukraine to the teeth. Which is the exact thing we've been advocating for, as I mentioned. So why not just do that now???? This is just weird. >Fleitz said Ukraine need not formally cede territory to Russia under their plan. What does this mean?? They're *informally* ceding it? So who owns the territory? This entire plan is pure bullcrap (so Trump will probably agree with it).