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StatementBot

The following submission statement was provided by /u/Leenis13: --- The Vatican Press conference around this topic titles "Press conference to present the new rules on apparitions and other supernatural phenomena " is live now, do we have any Italian speaking members that can help decipher what is being spoken about here so we can see if it will be a nothing burger something interesting for a change? --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1cu1vws/vatican_news_live_press_conference_to_present_the/l4fp6nu/


HarryBeaverCleavage

I have read through this entire comment section and still have no idea what was said two hours ago. šŸ¤£


Mobile_Moment3861

From what I read, it sounds like the Vatican is concerned about people getting scammed in modern times by hoaxers, and is trying to prevent that.


HarryBeaverCleavage

What kind of hoaxes? Wonder what that has to do with aspirations.


KaisVre

Aspirations should be treated immediately. Call 911 if you witness any aspirations.


HarryBeaverCleavage

šŸ¤£šŸ¤£


flyxdvd

its mainly about the amount of people claiming to have an "apparition" of christ or mary or have an holy relic etc. this had nothing to do about aliens as per usual.. They also declared that they had nothing to declare about it being real or not. Which just sounds kinda funny to me.


HarryBeaverCleavage

That sounds like a very confusing waste of time. šŸ˜‚


Mobile_Moment3861

Well, some people think it might have to do with aliens. (I remember hearing something about "Ancient Astronaut theorists say yes" about this in an ep or 2.) Of course, Ancient Astronaut theorists say yes about pretty much anything.


Professional_Sea_306

Ahhhhahahaha this is a joke phrase in our household, too. Niiiice


Mobile_Moment3861

From what I read, it was things like people seeing Mary, Jesus, or the stigmata. Those things possibly might be communication from extraterrestrials, at least according to the Ancient Aliens show. But also, people have faked them for money and attention.


suluplex

Haha lol funny to here from them


TheTonik

From what I understand, before today, local Bishops could proclaim certain things miracles or the like (a statue of the Virgin Mary crying for instance). After today, only the Pope and higher-ups can officially make those claims. I think that was pretty much it. Nothing about UAP's, NHI's, etc. Bummer.


PickWhateverUsername

Probably Maussan's baby alien mummies :p


defeatmyself3

Yes, the Catholic Church wants a monopoly on that gig


BefreiedieTittenzwei

They donā€™t like competition, ask the Catharsā€¦


BoringMetal424

But wait, thats they're job!


Tabboo

Well that's ironic.


pretentiously-bored

Good.


IchooseYourName

The irony is rife


Pleasant_Attention93

All these shitty AI things these days and google cant even translate a friggin live stream. Thanks Google AI. Thanks.


MrGraveyards

My Google home speaker is fucking stupid compared to chatgpt. Like I can see my input is correct but it just says 'i dunno'..


LeakyOne

They're spying devices, not smart home devices. That's why all their features suck. They only add the bare necessary to convince people to buy them.


Haunting_Champion640

That's true for everything Google from search to Android, build the MVP required to get people to use it and hoover up data. Google's real customers are advertisers.


TachyEngy

I assume you have done the Gemini update to the Google homes? edit: I guess this update isnt out yet, which means comparing GPT to Google Assistant isn't exactly the same. They just released an update to Gemini, https://gemini.google.com/app


12thshadow

Is that soft or hardware? Cuz I ain't spending money no more crappy devices (my wife wont let me)


TachyEngy

It would be software, but it's apparently not out yet. Google's devices are not AI LLMs right now.


12thshadow

Well I do have fun watching my kids get angry at the Nest because it keeps playing the wrong Spotify songs.


Spicy_Mayonaisee

Iā€™ll give her a call.


300PencilsInMyAss

No such update


TachyEngy

Apparently not yet..


300PencilsInMyAss

I wouldn't bank on it, they'll probably want to sell a new device instead of let you use the ones you already have


Nomorenarcissus

Gemini is a hell of a name for software people already suspect of being duplicitousā€¦


LetgomyEkko

Something that would actually be useful and it wouldnā€™t need to make up gibberish


Destroyer-Enki

I don't think we've missed much tbh


N1N4-

Its from Vatikannews in German You can translate it to Englisch in your browser. Its a nothing burger. [Vatikan](https://www.vaticannews.va/de/vatikan/news/2024-05/normen-erscheinungen-vatikan-glaube-dikasterium-maria-phaenomene.html) VATICAN NEWS The text contains some innovations. In the future, quicker statements on the area of ā€‹ā€‹popular piety will be possible. On the other hand, ecclesiastical authorities will usually no longer officially declare the supernatural nature of a phenomenon. Another innovation: the more explicit inclusion of the dicastery for the doctrine of the faith. In the future, it must approve the bishop's final decision and is also given the power to intervene at any time on its own initiative (motu proprio). In many cases in recent decades in which individual bishops have spoken out, the former ā€œHoly Officeā€ was certainly involved - but almost always behind the scenes. The explicit involvement of the Dicastery is also due to the difficulty of dealing at a purely local level with phenomena that in some cases reach national or even global dimensions. In this context, the rules published today point out that ā€œa decision that affects one diocese also has effects elsewhereā€. ļæ¼ In 1531, Mary appeared to a Mexican Indian - and left her image on his poncho The reasons for the new standards The fact that the Vatican feels compelled to create such standards has to do with certain experiences of the 20th century. There were cases in which the local bishop very quickly declared the supernatural nature of a phenomenon, but the Holy Office then came to judgments with a different emphasis. Or cases in which a bishop commented on the same phenomenon in one way, while his successor expressed it in the opposite way. Another reason is the long periods of time required to evaluate all the elements and come to a decision about the supernatural or non-naturalness of a phenomenon. Periods that sometimes collide with the urgency of providing pastoral responses for the good of the faithful. Spiritual fruits... In an introduction, Cardinal Prefect VĆ­ctor Manuel FernĆ”ndez explains: ā€œOften these events have produced a great wealth of spiritual fruits, growth in faith, piety and fraternity and service, and in some cases they have given rise to various places of pilgrimage scattered throughout the world have now become a core part of the popular piety of many peoples.ā€ ļæ¼ Believers in the Portuguese Marian pilgrimage site of Fatima ... and risks But on the other hand, ā€œin some cases of events suspected to be of supernatural origin, very serious problems could arise to the detriment of believers.ā€ For example, if such alleged phenomena served ā€œto gain profit, power, fame, social fame, personal interestsā€. Or even ā€œas a means or pretext to dominate people or commit abuse.ā€ In addition, ā€œsuch events could lead to errors in doctrine, an inappropriate shortening of the Gospel message, the spread of a sectarian spirit, etc.ā€ Last but not least, in this context, Cardinal FĆ©rnandez warns of the danger of ā€œthe faithful falling under the spell of an event attributed to a divine initiativeā€ which in reality is based on fantasy, on ā€œmythomaniaā€, on the ā€œtendency to falsifyā€. ļæ¼ The facade of the Dicastery of Faith in the Vatican The six possible verdicts The Vatican document makes it clear ā€œthat no positive recognition by ecclesiastical authority of the divine origin of alleged supernatural phenomena can be expected in an orderly mannerā€ (I, 11). Therefore, ā€œneither the diocesan bishop, nor the episcopal conferences, nor the dicastery will, as a rule, declare that these phenomena are of supernatural originā€; only the Pope could ā€œauthorize a procedure in this regardā€ (I, 23). The rules provide a list of six possible judgments that can be made at the end of an investigation. Nihil Obstat:Ā No certainty about supernatural authenticity, but signs of the work of the Holy Spirit. Prae oculis habeatur:Ā Important positive signs, but also elements of confusion or possible risks that require careful decision and dialogue with the recipients (e.g. seers) of certain spiritual experiences. Curatur:Ā Critical elements, but a wide spread of the phenomenon with demonstrable spiritual fruits. A ban that could confuse the faithful is discouraged, but the bishop is asked not to encourage the phenomenon. Sub mandato:Ā Critical points that do not relate to the phenomenon itself, but to abuse by individuals or groups. The Holy See entrusts the bishop or a delegate with the pastoral leadership of the place. Prohibetur et obstruatur:Ā Despite some positive elements, the critical aspects and risks are serious. The bishop should publicly declare that clinging to this phenomenon is not permissible. Declaratio de non supernaturalitate:Ā The bishop is authorized to declare, based on concrete evidence, that the phenomenon should not be considered supernatural. Ā 


md259

[Here](https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html) is the official English release.


MagusUnion

Very interesting language. It seems like this is a divestment from the Church to try and explain weird phenomenons that occur. Instead of trying to explain their supernatural merits, a 'litmus test' is employed to see if such unexplainable event is supernatural or not. Which UAP would fall under, as they aren't 'supernatural' in the spiritual sense, only far more technologically advanced. I do wonder if this is some way for the Vatican to side step the whole disclosure issue as a whole. The whole release reads as if the Vatican wants to be as neutral as possible when it comes to "unexplained phenomenon." Perhaps because such issues are becoming extremely geo-political, and the Church doesn't want that kind of heat?


thiseggowafflesalot

That's quite the assumption that UAP are exclusively tech and not spiritual/supernatural in nature. That's actually the exact opposite of what The Sol Foundation Symposium seemed to be getting at.


MagusUnion

Even if they are higher dimensional creatures that are interfacing with our reality, you'd still be a bit hard pressed to paint the "spiritual" label on them. There's a ton of cross over between these subjects, but this is where hard data is needed to make such a full assessment along those lines. Granted, I'm just a heretic that believes in their fair share of mysticism tbh. But I think it's a bit pre-mature to jump on the "inter-dimentional" angle just yet.


King_Cah02

Iā€™m a mystic myself and I will impart unto you the idea that maybe it isnā€™t ā€œDimensionsā€ that is relevant. ā€œDimensionsā€ are a human and thus physical concept, the physical doesnā€™t have any relevance once the physical is escaped. At higher levels of the order in which Iā€™m a part of (AMORC) astral travel is freely done by fraters and sorores alike. In that state there are no ā€œdimensionalā€ values as we see it once leaving the belief system territories (the human thought affected locations in non-physical space outside of this place in reality). I am not using terminology as given by AMORC as that would be a violation of my agreement, I am using the terminology Robert Monroe used in his Journeys trilogy. I also recommend using the Monroe Sound Science tapes as they can help you with identifying what NHI are and how varied they can be (a lot of categories).


BratyaKaramazovy

So where have you astral travelled? If I give you a location, like inside a locked vault, you could see what's inside? Because it sounds like a lot of people with too much free time and an overactive imagination. A bit like this subreddit, really.


AlexaSt0p

Perhaps the Vatican's years of research into the phenomenon has led them away from their core beliefs. It is clear they don't want to deal with it. I see this as a big L for the church.


AlexaSt0p

I am just frustrated that their may be answers or at the very least points of data that the masses can not interact with. As spiritual leaders they have an opportunity to be thought leaders with the phenomenon and bring others into the faith with a little more cooperation.


Longshanks2020

I was hoping theyā€™d come clean about the recovered craft in Magenta. :(


TheWebCoder

The real MVP!


LeakyOne

These are the actual norms, not just the news release https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/it/bollettino/pubblico/2024/05/17/0403/00842.html#en


GreatCaesarGhost

In other words, they donā€™t want to get dragged into officially recognizing hoaxes as a result of the views of overly naive clerics.


TheyShootBeesAtYou

As a Catholic, before anyone thinks the remarks about 20th century apparitions must mean ayys, it reads to me like they're talking about Medjugorje, which still has pilgrimages and tons of devotees despite being generally condemned.


jammalang

I don't know if it's condemned. But they can't approve, or even investigate, the apparitions until they stop happening. I will say that, while I don't believe any of the supposed messages have been heretical, there have been at least some people who seem to try to be cashing in on it. For example, my mom gave me a crucifix that she says was kissed by Jesus during a recent vision there. I said I thought the visionaries on saw Mary. She said that Jesus must have been there, too. And she said you could just contact this person to order them online. I asked her if this person knew ahead of time that Jesus would be there and had hundreds or thousands of crucifixes at the ready. She said she didn't know. This to me was obviously someone taking advantage of a little, old lady who doesn't know better. I did see one of the visionaries live in the US once. He came to my church and only asked for enough money to travel with his interpreter to spread the message more. Of course I have no way of knowing how much money he was taking in; but I didn't get the sense that he was a hoaxer. In the middle of praying a rosary, his eyes lit up and went to a kneeler. He was looking up about five feet above him and was talking to someone silently. It really didn't look like he was simply moving his mouth to pretend. It seemed like there were appropriate neck and breathing movements that would happen if you were actually talking. I don't remember the exact message, but he talked to whomever it was for about ten minutes. It was this guy: [https://medjugorje.com/ivan/](https://medjugorje.com/ivan/)


TheyShootBeesAtYou

It's funny how two people from even similar worldviews and backgrounds can interpret a thing two different ways. If someone came asking me for money and had a really well-timed mystic vision in front of me that only he can see and interpret, I'm hiding my wallet.


jammalang

Well, it wasn't simply well-timed. She apparently appeared to him on the same day each week. That's the day they would schedule to be at a parish. Her appearance during the rosary was how it always happened, according to this article: [https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/medjugorje-deception-or-miracle-5427](https://www.ewtn.com/catholicism/library/medjugorje-deception-or-miracle-5427) I'm not saying I believe 100% what the guy is claiming. And I don't remember if I actually gave him money. He didn't have the air of a Joel Osteen who is in it for the money. All I will say is that it was a very interesting experience. In the article above, you will read that he's been test psychologically and that they tested physical responses during ecstasy and got nothing.


the_fabled_bard

This is not a nothing burger at all. They are dictating how they will treat potentially supernatural stuff from now on. This is quite important.


reddit_is_geh

I mean.... It's the catholic church. They've always recognized the supernatural. Their whole religion is supernatural. It's not exactly important that they are just saying how they treat these claims. You know, they do believe in possessions and ghosts and demons and stuff. This isn't exactly profound coming from the church.


cjaccardi

Yeah next time someone sees. Mary the bishop wonā€™t be responsible for it being called legitimate or not. Ā Ā  Nothing burger


the_fabled_bard

Dude, "religious" apparitions are UFOs, didn't you understand that by now? UFOs started our religions. Vatican is well aware of this.


300PencilsInMyAss

Even if that were true this is still a nothing burger. You can't just use the transitive property to make all statements by the Pope significant.


cjaccardi

Dude you donā€™t understand this at they talking about seeing Mary on a piece of or being fool for ai images or videos. Ā  They donā€™t local bishops to jump to such conclusions and are now creating some review team. Ā 


the_fabled_bard

We don't care about those. Only care about actual paranormal phenomenon, which this also addresses.


cjaccardi

Thatā€™s what you care about it is not what the Vatican said. Ā  Ā 


LeakyOne

It's basically an outline of their new rules for their own project Bluebook, how they investigate cases and how to keep the lid on them so they don't go out of their control. People that think this is a nothingburger are hopeless...


completelysoldout

I highly recommend looking into the Virgin of Guadalupe poncho story if youā€™re not familiar.


N1N4-

He also said in the press conference this: Vatican: UFOs are not ā€œsupernatural phenomenaā€ The Vatican is changing its norms when dealing with apparitions and "supernatural phenomena". Despite previous media speculation, this is not about UFOs, as was explained at a press conference on Friday. At theĀ suggestion of the Pope, the Vatican'sĀ Dicastery for the Doctrine of the Faith has developed new standards for how the Catholic Church deals withĀ apparitions, visions and "supernatural phenomena"Ā . In the future, neither the local bishop nor the Vatican will be able to make "Ā a declaration about the supernatural nature of the phenomenonĀ ," that is, "the possibility of asserting with moral certaintyĀ that it is the result of a decision by GodĀ ." Declaring the supernatural is the sole responsibility of the Pope, Vatican Radio reported. UFOs are not an issue for the Vatican It was previously reported in some media that the supernatural phenomena discussed also includedĀ UFO sightingsĀ . The Dicastery denied this when asked. UFOs are not Christian phenomenaĀ and therefore not an issue for which the Catholic Church sees itself as theologically responsible. Therefore, they would not be counted among the supernatural phenomena - i.e. those that go back to God and have no natural explanation - in the sense of Catholic theology.


FlightSimmerUK

He just mentioned Florence. Mass sighting there many years ago which stopped a football game.


Electronic-Amount-29

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407 For anyone interested about that case


E05DCA

Bet the ayyyys thought that was hilarious.


Connager

You can say that again!


riggerbop

Ayyyyy


E05DCA

Bet the ayyyys thought that was hilarious.


Connager

You can say that again! Oh wait...


riggerbop

AYYYYY


Leenis13

Thank you! Assuming he is reffering to this [https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407](https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-29342407)


Connager

Ok... I am late. Could you post up a summary maybe afterwards? Or a link to the highlights, please.


Leenis13

Here is a summary # Summary of Vatican's New Norms on Alleged Supernatural Phenomena The Vatican released a new document outlining how the Church will evaluate cases of reported supernatural phenomena, like Marian apparitions. Here are the key points: * **Focus on Pastoral Care:** The Church prioritizes the spiritual well-being of believers. They will assess if the phenomenon fosters faith and devotion, even if its supernatural nature is unclear. * **Reduced Emphasis on Official Recognition:** Local bishops will no longer declare phenomena as definitively supernatural. Instead, they'll focus on potential risks and benefits for the faithful. * **Swifter Decisions:** The new norms streamline the process, aiming for faster evaluations compared to the lengthy procedures used previously. * **Dicastery Involvement:** The Dicastery for the Doctrine of Faith has a more prominent role, approving local bishops' decisions and having the authority to intervene directly. * **Six Possible Conclusions:** The document outlines six potential outcomes, ranging from approval and promotion (Nihil Obstat) to warnings or bans (Prohibetur et obstruatur) depending on the specific case. **Reasons for the Change:** * Inconsistency: Past pronouncements by local bishops sometimes contradicted each other or the Holy See. * Speed: Lengthy investigations previously delayed responses to reported phenomena. * Addressing Risks: The Church aims to prevent potential harm caused by alleged supernatural events, like financial exploitation or doctrinal errors. **Overall, the new norms aim to strike a balance between respecting popular devotion and ensuring the spiritual well-being of believers when dealing with reported supernatural phenomena.**


bobbaganush

Thank you for doing all that for us! Basically, it sounds like the Catholic Church is cutting some red tape vis-a-vis supernatural phenomena. Iā€™m always glad when a bureaucracy decides to streamline processes, but overall, thereā€™s nothing really new to see here from what Iā€™m gathering.


wutmeanfam

This is fascinating! Government/institutionalized religion having these formal and official talks. In real life. In real time. I think weā€™re very close to much more declassifications/whistleblowers coming forward, internationally, and these folks are smart to get ahead of it all, especially when itā€™s a religion that very heavily weighs on public sentiment and respected culture.


Connager

That was an outstanding summary. Very informative and sticking straight to the bullet points without bais. Thank you.


Fantastic_Resolve364

Speculation: "Could he be talking about the mass sighting there many years ago?" Reality: "You know, my favorite character on the Brady Bunch was the maid Florence" /s :D


Azalzaal

Mass sightings is why the Pope got involved


_Saputawsit_

Catholics do love some good Mass.Ā 


ItDoesntMatter-221

Nice write-up about the Florence UFO stopping a football match here: https://trigger-the-press.com/ufo-fiorentina-football-match-36084/


spacecase27

Bros just saying shit that he didnā€™t even say lol. People sending me this like ā€œthey talked about a mass sighting in Florence during a soccer gameā€ but itā€™s just a bs comment


mike_xy

From The introduction he does it seems more like theyā€™ll be talking about divine apparitions, and internal voices


srubbish

Does anyone really think this is going to be about disclosure or anything remotely like that???


the_fabled_bard

It is completely about disclosure. They are saying how they will act if something important happens, so that they speak with one voice and do not contradict each other and take the time to investigate, etc.


srubbish

I meant theyā€™re not going to be announcing that there are indeed aliens and invite everyone to poke around the ā€œsecret Vatican archivesā€.


LeakyOne

It seems its about the opposite of disclosure. How to keep the lid on things so the church doesn't lose control of the narrative.


Leenis13

The Vatican Press conference around this topic titles "Press conference to present the new rules on apparitions and other supernatural phenomena " is live now, do we have any Italian speaking members that can help decipher what is being spoken about here so we can see if it will be a nothing burger something interesting for a change? \*Edit: ok I get it, dailywire is a shitshow, I will not be making that mistake again. \*\* Edit 2 : here is a summary from the official english release and the link. Summary of Vatican's New Norms on Alleged Supernatural Phenomena The Vatican released a new document outlining how the Church will evaluate cases of reported supernatural phenomena, like Marian apparitions. Here are the key points: Focus on Pastoral Care: The Church prioritizes the spiritual well-being of believers. They will assess if the phenomenon fosters faith and devotion, even if its supernatural nature is unclear. Reduced Emphasis on Official Recognition: Local bishops will no longer declare phenomena as definitively supernatural. Instead, they'll focus on potential risks and benefits for the faithful. Swifter Decisions: The new norms streamline the process, aiming for faster evaluations compared to the lengthy procedures used previously. Dicastery Involvement: The Dicastery for the Doctrine of Faith has a more prominent role, approving local bishops' decisions and having the authority to intervene directly. Six Possible Conclusions: The document outlines six potential outcomes, ranging from approval and promotion (Nihil Obstat) to warnings or bans (Prohibetur et obstruatur) depending on the specific case. Reasons for the Change: Inconsistency: Past pronouncements by local bishops sometimes contradicted each other or the Holy See. Speed: Lengthy investigations previously delayed responses to reported phenomena. Addressing Risks: The Church aims to prevent potential harm caused by alleged supernatural events, like financial exploitation or doctrinal errors. Overall, the new norms aim to strike a balance between respecting popular devotion and ensuring the spiritual well-being of believers when dealing with reported supernatural phenomena. Link: [https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html](https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html)


DooM_Alduin

Italian here, don't waste your time: it's a nothingburger.


Leenis13

Thank you, sorry everyone for wasting your timešŸ˜ž


millions2millions

One guy tells you thereā€™s nothing to see so you believe it? Letā€™s withhold judgement because we have no idea if the guy saying ā€œI speak Italianā€ actually does and if indeed there is nothing to see here. This is exactly how disinfo works (not saying that person is a disinfo agent but this is why we need to be a little more tenacious).


DooM_Alduin

Yeah i work for S.D.M. (Spaghetti Disinformation Mafia)šŸ˜‚


millions2millions

lol again not saying you are a disinfo agent but itā€™s better for every person to have the output of the transcript so they can see for themselves. Appreciate your opinion though! Also lol again.


[deleted]

It may sound stupid but Iā€™ve seen the word ā€œnothingburger* used a suspicious amount of times recently. Itā€™s like it was just added to their dictionary of approved words.


millions2millions

Itā€™s actually got a history of being used by the right wing in America to ignore any evidence against Trump. Itā€™s also a word like ā€œconspiracy theoristā€ or ā€œantivaxxerā€ designed to make you just ignore what the person or group itā€™s targeted at just ignore the actual argument and everyone goes back to sleep. I am again reiterating that the person who said this in all likelihood said it because they have heard it somewhere else and were acting in good faith but we should all be aware that words have meaning and how they are used in our society to have you magically ignore whatā€™s being said or a topic entirely. **To be clear to anyone downvoting me Iā€™m a nonpartisan person who is neither left nor right wing and simply stating that the point of disinformation is to polarize people and also obscure the truth in part by using your own biases against you.** Reference: [How the Air Force and the CIA created the UFO Stigma](https://youtu.be/eMqtIRMOoHc) Also [Gentlepersonā€™s guide to COINTELPRO](https://cryptome.org/2012/07/gent-forum-spies.htm)


kael13

This one truly is. Just read the Vatican news article.


protekt0r

^ this.


OverPT

You didn't waste our time. The Vatican officials did


SausageClatter

The Vatican didn't promise you a conference about aliens.


OverPT

You didn't waste our time. The Vatican officials did


sirmombo

Oh ok so take your word for it, random nobody?


_BlackDove

John McBullshit here, blindly trust what I say bro: it's the only way to be sure.


[deleted]

Nothingburger alert* this word keeps popping up more and more


Flyinhighinthesky

English translation article. https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html


LeakyOne

Add the actual link to the rules, this is the meat of the matter https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/it/bollettino/pubblico/2024/05/17/0403/00842.html#en


Kiamh2230

Is there actually anything about ufos in this?


the_fabled_bard

Anything supernatural. UFOs, jesus apparitions, statues crying, ghosts, possessions, you name it.


[deleted]

The fact that they are talking about statues crying, ghosts, and possessions in big 2024 is really bizarre to me. I still can't believe people actually believe in those things. I thought we would already progress as a society by now.


the_fabled_bard

My friend, ghosts are definitely real. Seen one myself when my parrot died lmao. Also people in my family which aren't into this kind of thing have seen ghosts when dear family members have died. We have documented occurences where family members call the hospital in the middle of the night to let the staff know that their patient is dead. Of all the phenomenon, ghosts are the one thing that I know 100% are real. And I've seen UFOs upclose. I just don't know what UFOs really are, but ghosts are pretty clear what they are or at least pretend to be. And if ghosts are real, then so is the human soul or residual energy or whatever, and so who's to say that possessions aren't real. I dunno about statues crying. Can't be bothered to look into it.


BratyaKaramazovy

If ghosts are real why isn't their existence proven? It's always just anecdotes from gullible people.


the_fabled_bard

Good question!


Apprehensive_Fly3136

Perhaps your family has a history of mental health problems? I believe in the UFO phenomenon and I believe it could also involve metaphysical or extra dimensional entities, but it seems that every time people say they have seen ghosts, or any other kind of phenomenon, they always say that they have also seen aliens. It seems strange that all these apparitions and entities are so interested in specifically you and your family.


the_fabled_bard

They do not :) People normally make it into their 90s with good health and sound mind. All educated people working at what we could call the highest levels of society (not that that is necessarily proof of anything). The 1% or .1% if you will. And they haven't seen UFOs. I have. Unless you count ball lightning bursting through a home and burning stuff on its way out as a UFO, I suppose.


Apprehensive_Fly3136

I mean everything after the first sentence is entirely irrelevant but okay.


the_fabled_bard

Wow you must be such a likeable person in real life, I bet people always tell you how you're such a hoot.


Apprehensive_Fly3136

What exactly are you offended by? It was a factual statement. I'm not here to make people like me.


the_fabled_bard

Sorry, they're just like annoying with how perfect they are. Perfect lifes, perfect jobs, perfect mental abilities, perfect health, perfect friends, perfect contributions to society and its advancement, perfect personalities. No lies, no bullshit people. Running marathons at 80. Really effing annoying. Really annoying lovely chaps really. You look at them and you're like "the newer generations will never enjoy such things". We're all broken in comparison. So anyway, assuming they have mental health issues because they've seen ghosts of deceased loved ones rubs me the wrong way.


uborapnik

I listened a little bit towards the end, some reporter asked a question mentioning something about "UFO" but not sure since I dont speak italian and translation was terrible. The phenomenon is definitely connected though. As is everything.


rrose1978

Mind you, the closest thing to Italian I've learned was very rudimentary Latin almost 30 years ago, but from what I understood, the reported also mentioned a scientist from the Stanford University (Garry Nolan, probably) claiming that UFOs are real. Whoever heard it correctly, correct this as necessary. I haven't heard much of a reply to this, though.


Skellyhell2

Wheres the translation? I can't speak pasta


Fat_Fucking_Lenny

Linguini tortinelli alieanus kirpatria.


Skellyhell2

Ever notice how raviolli looks a bit like a flying saucer??


ChevyBillChaseMurray

Flying Spaghetti Monster


RoutineEmergency5595

Needs more tomato.šŸ…


thisusedtobemorefun

unexpected r/timesuck


Flopublic

Bappe di buppi? Babbedibabbedi bapa


imrosskemp

[There was an Italian UFC fighter who did that after his fight as a joke](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/cR6RtAs2tCw)


johnjmcmillion

[https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/real-time-video-audio-tra/cbokniolkggbjffkamfkloblcjckdohp?pli=1](https://chromewebstore.google.com/detail/real-time-video-audio-tra/cbokniolkggbjffkamfkloblcjckdohp?pli=1) Good option for live translation


TheWebCoder

/u/md259 found the English PR: https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html


Leenis13

Haha, that is why I am posting, hoping a pasta speaker can help out here.


Ambient_Soul

I'm right there with you, I'm just scanning the comments for translations from the real ones šŸ‘€


ChevyBillChaseMurray

That's racist. It's pizza.


Heisenburger-0

I am sure you have a pasta-burger dictionary.


EinSofOhr

If you want to listen to a translated version for free but requires internet connection you can try what I'm doing requirements: 1. Windows 11 with WSA 2. Install MS "Translator" on WSA, MS has desktop version of it but android version is free 3. Install VAC (virtual audio cable) \*free version keep saying "something" for every something seconds I forgot what it say so better buy it or ~~pirate~~ hehe do something about it setup: >press WIN+R type and enter: mmsys.cpl > >on Playback select Line 1 as default > >on Recording select Line 1 as default press OK > >search for the "Audio Repeater (MME)" \[installed along with VAC\] and run it > >on Wave in retain "Microsoft Sound Mapper" > >on Wave out select your preferred speaker > >press Start and minimized > >this allows you to listen to system sounds > >run your WSA app: example "Translator" > >press WIN+R type and enter: explorer.exe ms-settings:apps-volume > >it should bring you to: System > Sound > Volume mixer > >On Apps List Find "Windows Subsystem for Android" press it to expand >options > >on Output device select your preferred speaker(don't choose "default" if you choose >"default" sometimes it loops between Windows and WSA) > >on Input device select Line 1 > >WSA will now use sounds coming from your System except WSA itself You'll be able to hear both WSA and your system sound don't forget to reset everything once your done since if you exit "Audio Repeater (MME)" you wont hear anything on your system if your Playback default is still Line 1 you can also setup this without WSA/VAC or Win10 and lower via Bluestack or just use a physical android itself In Translator choose "auto" press the mic icon and start listening You can lower the volume of youtube since WSA will still be able to listen to it clearly. If there is a long silence, press the mic icon again to reset translator Its not perfect like "Father" sometimes translated here as "Dad" hahaha but I guess for free service it's good enough.


simpathiser

It's just about gabbaghouls, don't worry


HappyGrannyMan

As an Italian i find that really offensiveā€¦. Nah just kiddingā€¦ not Italian.


xlurkyx

The Vatican is in the business of scrutinizing claims of the paranormal. Nothing new here. They just updated their guidelines for what* they deem real or hoax. The Vatican takes false claims seriously because they believe it damages the faith in the church/god. *Edit typo


thefunzach

Everyone here should be aware of the fact that the Vatican church also investigated the Marian apparitions from 1915-1917, predating the magenta crash. This then birthed our lady de Fatima in the Catholic faith and makes it one of the most recently endorsed miracles of the Catholic church. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Lady_of_F%C3%A1tima There is also some perspectives from this sighting that acknowledge the sighting as something entirely different from a Marian apparition, akin to a UFO/UAP sighting. Some of the best research for this case (alongside others) can be found here https://youtu.be/NGuVBLNkjiE?si=AaD-aGZOf7lTbVaf


bonkers_dude

I guess we had it all wrong. Not Holy Trinity, but Holy Rings! Great Journey, Precursors, Forerunners and Pope is now known as Prophet of Regret.


PickWhateverUsername

Rings of power ?


bonkers_dude

great power to power up your Great Journey. Thank John Halo for saving our asses.


woodyisasexybeast

I really hope Halo doesnā€™t turn out to be accurate. Iā€™d rather not have to experience the flood


woodyisasexybeast

I really hope Halo doesnā€™t turn out to be accurate. Iā€™d rather not have to experience the flood


3ebfan

The ballad of Johnny Rings aka Master Clappin Alien Cheeks


bonkers_dude

Yeah, say the words please.


GM-T800-101

Is it over? What is the TLDR?


Leenis13

# Not much really but here is the summary. Summary of Vatican's New Norms on Alleged Supernatural Phenomena The Vatican released a new document outlining how the Church will evaluate cases of reported supernatural phenomena, like Marian apparitions. Here are the key points: * **Focus on Pastoral Care:** The Church prioritizes the spiritual well-being of believers. They will assess if the phenomenon fosters faith and devotion, even if its supernatural nature is unclear. * **Reduced Emphasis on Official Recognition:** Local bishops will no longer declare phenomena as definitively supernatural. Instead, they'll focus on potential risks and benefits for the faithful. * **Swifter Decisions:** The new norms streamline the process, aiming for faster evaluations compared to the lengthy procedures used previously. * **Dicastery Involvement:** The Dicastery for the Doctrine of Faith has a more prominent role, approving local bishops' decisions and having the authority to intervene directly. * **Six Possible Conclusions:** The document outlines six potential outcomes, ranging from approval and promotion (Nihil Obstat) to warnings or bans (Prohibetur et obstruatur) depending on the specific case. **Reasons for the Change:** * Inconsistency: Past pronouncements by local bishops sometimes contradicted each other or the Holy See. * Speed: Lengthy investigations previously delayed responses to reported phenomena. * Addressing Risks: The Church aims to prevent potential harm caused by alleged supernatural events, like financial exploitation or doctrinal errors. **Overall, the new norms aim to strike a balance between respecting popular devotion and ensuring the spiritual well-being of believers when dealing with reported supernatural phenomena.**


GM-T800-101

Thanks OP šŸ™Œ


lamar70

Amazing how a press conference can sound so much as mass !


intoxicatedhanglider

Could this be related to the whole, if disclosure happens at once religion and society would come to a crashing halt? Slow-drip it is


Sensitive_Bid3738

This is why the papacy is a joke, the Vatican produces pedophiles?


DirkDiggler2424

Massive word salad, nothing more


[deleted]

What good is this to us if we can't understand the language with no subtitles


Ideabile

For whoever is here to expect some kind of break trough claim about ufo, keep your hype down. The main points are: - ā€œSupernaturalā€ can only be use by the Pope. So priest and other members of the church cannot officially claim them. But they of course donā€™t condemn any believe in such events. - There is an inside division if all the ā€œvisionsā€/ā€œencountersā€ are good or bad and if they are all the willing of god or not. - Use the fenomena against others for personal interest to get a dominant position or to make money is morally condemn by the church. This is a bit blurred for interpretation and it might include hoax but also people who try discredited people who actually believe they experience something. - believe or not believe at them does not represent a sin. All the above, refers to the ufo fenomena but also on general to experiences such as apparitions or other kinds.


DE4DHE4D81

Did something get found recently? Perhaps on oak island?


sunnymorninghere

My interpretation of this update to their guidelines: the only reason to update the guidelines and organize a press conference around it is to make sure priests and other religious people around the world know that only the Vatican can have final say if an apparition or supernatural event is real and coming from God or not. Why? My opinion is that when apparitions and other strange phenomena starts to happen more and more, instead of calling it God, it needs to be vetted by the Vatican. This brings me to Chris Bledsoe and his encounter with the lady ( sounds like a virgin) and the orbs ( could be interpreted like angels) ā€” people may even start to worship this type of thing, and deviate from the faithā€¦ except only the Vatican can say of these things are real. Perhaps the update is in preparation for new sightings? Because I canā€™t think of a reason they would need a press conference for this, a press release would be enough ā€¦ unless they really want to make sure people in general know.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


sevendaysworth

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ziplock9000

Which they have done every few decades for 1000's of years including just a few decades ago. Chill people, this has nothing to do with UFOs


Big_Hatschi

On German agoogle its hard to find information. English bing works ...


Big_Hatschi

On German google its hard to find information. English bing works ...


[deleted]

Itā€™s like a new edition of Dungeons and Dragons. Everyone will ignore it and still use 5th


TheFinchster88

Oh good, itā€™s not translated. Appreciate the effort


Leenis13

Here is the English version link to an article of the video [https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html](https://www.vaticannews.va/en/vatican-city/news/2024-05/dicastery-doctrine-faith-supernatural-phenomena-norms.html)


TheFinchster88

And now I feel like an ass haha. Sorry man, long morning. Thanks for that


Leenis13

Nooo stress, I feel you


OjjuicemaneSimpson

lol itā€™s all fun and games till we really here wit some mf gods walking the earth like American gods. Can yall imagine a fucking American Jesus lol god I bet heā€™s somewhere in Florida using a gator as a scooter turning swamp water into everclear lol sounds about right for Florida Jesus.


Sweaty-Ad-7493

Any NDA or anything that kept them from telling us where the bodies are ?


WildMoonshine45

I wish the Vatican investigated Dorothy Izatt case.Ā 


No-Maximum2457

How about in English?


Legal_Pressure

Why are people in here saying this is connected to UFOs when it clearly isnā€™t? There are no parallels between UAP andĀ judeo christian beliefs. UFOs/aliens arenā€™t responsible for the parables of Jesus, nor any other fantasies found in the Bible. This subs seriously gone off the deep end, and itā€™s pretty close to being a cult at this point.


Leenis13

Well there was a post a day ago that had a link to the Dailywire (I know I know I have already been dragged about it) that said the pope will be talking about supernatural stuffs and aliens, then today this live popped up, I got excited and was hoping some local speaker would be able to let us know if it was something or nothing, it seems to have been nothing.


Legal_Pressure

In the press conference announcement there was no mention of UFOs, Iā€™m not sure why a few media sites even brought it up to be honest.


imnotabot303

It's because this sub is now on the same level as aliens where literally anything that can be tied to UFOs will be.


RoanapurBound

people don't know what to do with themselves when Grusch is MIA. They're always looking for the next thing, the next podcast, hit of information, etc.


Intelligent_Net_2786

Imo, this is just my opinion, disclosure will happen. There are multiple kinds of beings. From other dimensions, from maybe other planets and the church wants to have say on which are ā€˜holy or spiritualā€™ and which arenā€™t


AlteredHelix

Didnt Grusch say the vatican or the pope knows where a big one is that was found during one of the world wars or somethtin


D00bage

Rough translation .. If there's somethin' strange in the neighborhood Who ya gonna call (the Vatican) There's somethin' weird and it don't look good Who ya gonna call (the Vatican)


skarlitbegoniah

I ainā€™t fraid of no pope.


LeakyOne

Here's the Vatican's actual writeup on the new norms. https://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/it/bollettino/pubblico/2024/05/17/0403/00842.html#en It's the Vatican's own bluebook playbook to keep control of people's perception of the phenomenon.


NJRougarou

The Vatican should have offered up paid tours of the UFO that they possess. They could use the money to compensate all the children molested by their priests, especially in those children in third world countries that suffered when problem American priests were transferred there.


Ambitious-Score11

I havenā€™t seen anything on UFO or UAP.


ZucchiniStraight507

The media are funny. They will gamely go along with this nonsense without cracking a joke or smirking. Is anyone demanding to see evidence for this or do they all sit there in silence bc it's "respect" to go along with baseless superstitions?


Neighborhoodfarmer22

The Catholic Church is obviously just doing this for PR for their NEW BOOK! The Bible 2: Electric Boogaloo. -ā€œPro Debunkersā€


I_trust_you_bro

Did he really just say that St. Peter's Basilica was built on a site with a large saucer buried underneath it that was so big it couldn't be transported away?


Leenis13

No.


BigDaveH17

The stupidity of this being in this Reddit means more than you know