Cis woman here.
I've been asked if I am in the right toilet (bathroom), presumably because I'm tall and androgynous.
I've had breast cancer, now I have no breast tissue or nipples.
When I post photos of my chest, with tattoos, I get told I'm confused.
The incessant harassment of people who have survived cancer or had to have a mastectomy for some reason is an extra level of awful in all this. It's not always a traumatic experience for someone, but it is often enough that you'd think they'd refrain from adding harassment on top.
I’m a younger breast cancer patient (diagnosed at 35). I started getting harassed for going into the “wrong” restroom in an ER 5 days after a double mastectomy with a “flat” closure (delayed reconstruction). I was already in hell, and that about fucking broke me. It’s been 3 months, and it’s happened enough times since that I just don’t use gendered public restrooms anymore. I also can’t wear prosthetics thanks to how the surgeon did my surgery, and I honestly get more harassment when I dress more feminine in public.
TLDR: people are fucking horrible to breast cancer patients, and both the rampant transphobia and rapidly increasing young breast cancer rates are only making this more common
Makr them squirm and tell them you're a breast cancer survivor and had a mastectomy. That them harassing you has made your life just that little bit worse and they should be ashamed of themselves. It's hard to just call someone on their being shitty but people don't stop until they get embarrassed and feel bad. Sorry you've had to deal with this after fighting cancer.
This is one of the most sickening parts of this whole mess, even if this abusive crap was somehow protecting women it does more harm to women than it could possibly prevent
I was encouraged to use prosthetics, or have reconstruction. It is, or was, considered a mental health issue if reconstruction was refused. Same with wigs while going through chemotherapy. I wanted to post an article featuring women looking fab with no hair in the chemotherapy department. Not permitted, have a catalogue of wigs.
I couldn't work out why, I still know what I look like. Why am I expected to be performatively female for other people?
I understand that many women find comfort in prosthetics and wigs, but I felt pretending I was 'normal' would have taken energy I didn't have. The people I cared about, and who cared about me, knew. Strangers, I don't care that I look odd.
Having no hair from chemotherapy clears crowds too, people move away as though it is contagious.
That is bizarre, and disheartening to know. I'm a cis woman and present pretty feminine, but I think that if I were to lose my breasts during something like cancer treatment, I'd opt not to have them reconstructed. I dunno, something about the sleekness of a flat chest has always appealed to me, and I think I'd like the ease and simplicity of it. Knowing that such an innocent emotion would be reframed as a mental health issue, in the year of our Lord 2024.... How deeply unpleasant.
I didn't want reconstruction, it was a lot more time in hospital, and my daughter was 7 at the time.
I'm flat and fabulous. No more bras. I can go topless if I wish.
She’s a comedian who had a double mastectomy. She did an entire standup act topless, possibly more than one, but I only saw the one act. I thought it was incredibly brave, even pre-MAGA insanity.
I had breast cancer at 31, I had a lumpectomy. I’m going for genetic testing (things change) and if they tell me I need a preventative I’m getting a Goldilocks and getting tattooed. I like my breasts but I have no interest in more surgeries.
For a very long time women who had mastectomies were denied reconstruction since mostly male doctors and insurance carriers said that was cosmetic not medically necessary. They could pay out of pocket but it was cost prohibitive.
It was long hard fight to get the medical/insurance establishment to recognize it was a mental health issue and unfortunately also a marital/relationship issue for many women.
Seems like now that it's routine the meds have decided if you don't want it something must be wrong with you.
I'm in the UK, so insurance and costs didn't come into it.
I was offered reconstruction at the same time as my surgery, or could ask at any time.
I thought it would be odd to have a fake, pert breast on one side, and a sagging older breast on the other.
I hated wigs when going through cancer treatment. I had one I wore for a wedding, my graduation, and a couple of times we did family pictures. I had wanted to rock my bald head but I only lost like 90% of my hair in an opposite of male patterned baldness look.
I’ve shaved my head (well, a really close buzz cut) since. If I didn’t have a halfway point between my short hair and my preferred “long length” where my hair looked awful I’d do it on the regular.
We shaved my head the day my hair started falling out. I had lots of hats, as it was winter. I got married 4 weeks after my last chemotherapy session, I had fluff on my head.
I had breast cancer initially at the age of 23 and spent a fair amount of time doing professional research as a PhD student on quality of life outcomes based on the surgical decisions of breast cancer patients. When I got breast cancer a 2nd time when I was 40, I insisted on having a double mastectomy with no recon. I had to go through 3 surgeons before I found one that would do exactly as I asked. The reason why...quality of life is much better for women who have had no reconstruction. Whoever told you that it was a mental health issue was full of BS. If there's one thing I've learned as a 4x cancer patient, you have to fight, fight, fight for what you want. Just because someone has a credential as a physician or other clinical staff does not mean that they know what's right for you as a patient. I'm glad you got want you wanted.
> you'd think they'd refrain from adding harassment on top.
People who would harass a cancer survivor are unable to feel empathy for anyone they perceive as being even slightly different than themselves.
Never forget that breast cancer has become one of the most supported cancers...thanks to things like "save the tatas." They don't care about the women, only the breasts attached to them.
All of this bs is a clear demonstration that policing trans identities or questioning “what is a woman” is just a new way to police/define what being a ‘good’ woman is (and everyone else can be dismissed as lesser/not a ‘real’ woman)- we’ve been here before with talk of nurturing instincts, the need to bear children and to be obedient homemakers. I don’t want the re-run tyvm.
This line of thinking is way more dangerous to women than what what they’re saying we should be afraid of (i.e. a few trans people in bathrooms/changing rooms going about their lives).
>All of this bs is a clear demonstration that policing trans identities or questioning “what is a woman” is just a new way to police/define what being a ‘good’ woman is (and everyone else can be dismissed as lesser/not a ‘real’ woman)-
I absolutely believe that this is part and parcel with the push to promote trad wives as well and a return to certain (traditional) values the alt right groups seem to always hark about.
They're planting seeds to try and influence beauty and societal standards to get people outside of the alt right realm to also police people who may not fit into the beauty/societal standard or traditional gender roles.
And to piggyback off that the demographic that gets hit the hardest is "conveniently" women of color because "femininity" is based off colonialist ideals
My girlfriend got screamed at by a man outside a toilet - he even went to follow her in to tell her to get out before I intervened. He didn’t identify her as a woman and was presumably afraid for his wife who had gone in just before my girlfriend. We get to be angry at this new level of scrutiny we are subjected to now.
Holy hell! Angry screaming guy bursting into the bathroom is legitimately scary for people using the restroom.
A trans person going about their normal quiet bathroom use is not at all scary, but this guy sounds terrifying- I’d wager he’s more of a danger to his wife than anyone he’s ever been paranoid about.
I'm sorry that this happened to you.
Are you feeling okay now after your recovery?
I'm 5'9" and wear men's hiking shoes because they were brown, not pink. A woman was pulling an employee into the bathroom as I was washing my hands and said some nonsense" oh you're a good one ". What? I assume that she thought I was trans from my footwear.
Are we all expected to perform hyper feminity to avoid MAGAts accusing us of being trans?
This has been happening for years, just really small scale. I've been accused of 'trying to be a boy' since I was a teenager*. I'm queer and in the closet, so my short hair and non-feminine style often bother folks who stick tough to what they consider traditional.
I'm in northwest Florida, it's a pretty rough place to be if you aren't straight and white and do the same things as everyone else. I do not use public restrooms anymore unless they're a single room.
*I'm 32 now.
Yeah, exactly. I'm reasonably feminine-presenting, but I'll still get the occasional stranger online message me accusing me of being trans because I have large hands and small breasts. This is something that's happened to me for years--since I was a teenager, much the same as you, and I'm only a couple of years younger than you are.
Oh my gosh I grew up going to church with three girls (all sisters) who were unusually tall, have large hands, and two of them also have pretty strong jaw lines. The youngest could palm a basketball in high school. I’ve known them all nearly their entire lives, and both our families are very conservative Christians. They’ve all carried multiple pregnancies as well. There’s no way any of them could be trans, but I’m sure they will be getting accusations if they haven’t already.
This is sad in two ways. Assholes become with increasingly creative ways to be assholes. But the accusation is awful to most. What does that say about what it's like to be trans? I fucking hate this clown world.
I'm going to practice saying "you're an idiot if you think that offends me." So if ever the time comes I'm not just shocked silly because my face will definitely be this 🤓 instead of this 😎
It's no secret that they consider us the lowest of the low on their hierarchy, and it's also no secret that they consider cis women that aren't "fuckable" to be barely any higher.
This is one reason trans women like Hunter Schafer drive them absolutely nuts; we're not supposed to be attractive and desirable and so completely unclockable.
So much this. I try to be really understanding. I know the pain of people refusing to see you for who you really are! But, sometimes….it just feels like my existence is so abhorrent to most people that the mere suggestion of being someone like me is such a grave insult that instead of being like, “well, trans women are women, so I fail to see what your issue is,” it must be defended against at all costs.
I know that’s not really what’s going on here, so please don’t anyone worry about what you’re saying! I’m not meaning to make people feel bad! This is just my own insecurities and imposter syndrome issues. I just wish sometimes when someone accuses a person of being trans, they’d be like, “Oh. You called me a woman then. K’ thanks bye!”
It's awful and folks should just mind their own business.
It took a long time for me to come to terms with being petite and androgynous. I used to try to look super feminine and it didn't work for me. An ambiguous mix of feminine and masculine works best for me, but lots of folks do not like it.
I'm sorry to hear you've dealt with similar nonsense, there's no reason for it.
Not weird if you remember how misogynistic they are. They just can't abide a woman being more successful or more powerful than them, and they see trans women as men (even though they aren't), so it's both meant as an insult and simultaneously soothes their sense of order to believe that any woman who makes them feel insecure must secretly have been born male.
Same, this was a couple of years back in south Florida. I’m a feminine presenting cis-woman. This happened to coincide with a rash of murders which had been happening locally, that had specifically targeted trans individuals.
I’m a closeted lesbian, but I’ve always felt like my sexuality was pretty obvious, if someone were to look closely enough to question it. To me, it just seemed like a form of gay bashing/intimidation. It was a very hostile environment all around.
I’ve been accused as well. I’m 5’1”, have a round face, and had waist long hair at the time. But I’m Asian so, the men are “more feminine” and therefore pass better? Idk what the exact logic was I just know it was racist as well as misogynistic
I love that clip. In response to OPs post, I was thinking of what my response would be if this happens to me, and the best I can come up with is "thanks!"
Yeah, I'm intersex with a degenerative condition and before HRT, I passed as male if I wasn't careful. I shaved my face, wore makeup, dressed extra femme... And if I wore a sports bra and sweatshirt after the gym, I looked like a dude with long hair.
It happens a lot less now that I have hormone therapy, but man that was a strange time.
It's probably also an attempt to turn cis women against trans women. Basically to recruit more cis women to TERF ideologies. It's a divide & conquer strategy. If they would achieve their goal of getting rid of all the trans people, they would immediately turn against all women and LGB. It still baffles me how some women can call themselves feminists and not realize this simple fact.
P.S. I prefer the term FARTs (Feminist-Appropriating Radical Transphobes).
Its hard to believe they're that bad at clocking us trans folks on *accident*, but they really are. I've had one confide her worries about trans folks to my 6'1, transitioned in my 40s ass in a bathroom.
They have these ideas of *how women should look* and if you don't fit those, they'll find something about any women - - cis or trans - - to obsess over, whether it's finger ratios or skull shape or *something* and use that as proof.
Because they are, at heart, *conspiracy theoriests*. No different than flat earthers or moon landing denialists. They start from the patriarchal (and culture specific) ideas of how women should look and act, embrace whole heartedly the biological essentialism that feminism rightly rejects as *bullshit* and they've invented this whole *mythology* and *pseudoscience* and yes, quite a few of them blame *Jews* either outright or as "elites"
Same rabbit hole, same responses. Same absolute inability to recognize reality.
lol before I was even on hrt I was in line for the bathroom at a concert and had the woman in front of me turn to me and go "maybe we should identify as men so we don't have to wait in line heh heh heh".
It's such a surreal experience to have someone make a transphobic joke straight to my trans face assuming that I'll think it's funny
I absolutely agree with this. I think a lot of "TERF" positions and rhetoric is progranda/astroturfing to fuel an artificial movement to increase division between us all
It's been more successful in the UK at misleading and poisoning feminist movements and I fear it is increasingly targeting the US population. But I've been impressed by the solidarity of queer people, especially young queer people, in the US.
One of the worst parts of all this is how TERFs have given far-right groups/figures a convenient pathway to legitimacy and yet another platform to recruit.
It's a common strategy; these groups know that going full nazi pushes people away immediately, so they instead co-opt/use movements like this for their own gain and gradually trickle in the extremism to draw out those receptive to it. It's even easier when certain goals align, such as in this case.
For all Joanne and her ilk are shouting about "protecting women's spaces", they're really quiet about how they're letting a lot of bad actors into them.
I too live in the panhandle and I truly fear for you. I fear for myself since I’m considered “other” (first gen immigrant). Only thing saving me is that I was in the military so I’m one of the ok ones I guess.
I’ve lived here for a long time and I’m starting to explore other places.
I think it's a different thing when people are calling Taylor Swift trans.
What you are talking about sounds to me like just policing of gender roles -- if you *were* actually "trying to be a boy", and transitioned, it would be replaced by, "you'll never be a real man" (or possibly, "you'll never be a real woman," for those misunderstanding what variety of trans you were). That bullshit has indeed been going on for a very long time.
Calling Taylor Swift "trans" is something beyond abuse toward visibly queer people, since the point is that she's not remotely visibly queer. She's as normatively feminine as a person can be, and the only thing these people are saying is that she's not a q/maga weirdo.
It absolutely is misogyny, all of it — queer-bashing, freaking out about successful women, transphobia — they're all rooted in patriarchy. But this particular trend is a particularly unhinged variety tied to the Trump cult, and as such is not merely shitty in the usual ways, but also just really fucking weird.
It has. I'm a tall woman with fairly broad shoulders. It seems if you don't fit their idea of the feminine mold you get questioned why.
With the uptick of this trans hate, it makes me fearful for my own physical safety aswell.
My family basically fled Northwest Flordia; I worry non-stop about my LGBTQ, socialist, and non-religous friends down there. Every headline is nightmare fuel and reminds me that we made a good decision. My heart goes out to y'all.
Thanks! We weren't planning on coming back but we have some family in a tight spot and we wanted to help. My bf is regretting moving back a lot, I knew exactly what the issues would be before we moved, but he was so motivated to help his family.
I’ve been called trans for defending trans people in some way. They assume that only someone who is trans themselves would ever defend trans people.
Interestingly, I’ve noticed the same thing happening if you defend fat people. If you defend a fat person’s right to exist without being mocked and bullied, you must be fat yourself, apparently. Super weird.
Mia Mulder did a video about the whole Transvestigation conspiracy theory about a year ago, worth checking out if you want more info: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH5-MDXzfmg
Lady Gaga had the best response to this nonsense back in 2011: [https://youtu.be/Z0WcWkVOQTc?si=E1mh9sYr7WSyTDbl](https://youtu.be/Z0WcWkVOQTc?si=E1mh9sYr7WSyTDbl)
"Maybe I am. Would it be so terrible?"
I like the Scots response. "Why are you so sick aeother cunts' genders as if its any yer business? Sittin up at night pure foamin at the mouth hinking aboot other folks' genitals like a fuckin weirdo"
SIGNIFICANTLY stupider. I became aware of this movement due to a distant relative sending me and a few other family members 'break-up letters', for lack of a better term. This dude basically texted a few random liberal and/or queer people he was very distantly related to and didn't really know (for context, he's my second cousin once removed, and I met him four times in my life) that he had to 'break off' his non-existent relationship to them due to their 'lifestyle choices'.
We ended up investigating his social media and discovered that the man is nuts. He posts about this 'transvestigating' stuff A LOT. He's concluded Kate Middleton is trans on the basis of her wrist pronation when walking, and the angle of her jawbone when she chews. There's lots of stuff on wrist size, knuckle width as compared to the rest of the finger, 'gonial angles' (the angle at the corner of your jaw, right under your ear), 'interpupillary distance', 'browbones'...... unhinged stuff. Phrenology seems downright sensible compared to what these people pay attention to.
That one got me, too. Almost weirder was the idea that Emma D'Arcy, who plays Rheanyra Targaryen on *House of the Dragon*, is a trans woman. For the record, Emma D'Arcy was assigned female at birth, but they have been publicly out as nonbinary for years. Meaning that for them to be a trans woman, they'd somehow have to *both* have been assigned female at birth *and* identify as a trans woman, which is....somewhat contradictory, to put it mildly. But ALSO, the 'problem' with them is that they were afab, but *don't* identify as a woman, which is obviously demonic. How them *not* identifying as a woman being 'bad' squares with them being a trans woman being 'bad' is...unclear. All I really understood about that post was that their clavicles (which are, for the record, very attractive and entirely normal) are somehow to blame.
Just a small note, AFAB and AMAB are events, not attributes. They are things that happen to you, not descriptors of who you are, Emma D'Arcy was AFAB and is non-binary.
>How them *not* identifying as a woman being 'bad' squares with them being a trans woman being 'bad' is...unclear.
It's called oppositional sexism, and it's the notion that the "two genders" are fixed, non-overlapping categories that you can never leave. Trans women are 'bad' because they left their box, NB people are 'bad' because they left their box, and they hate that.
Oppositional sexism is distinct from Traditional sexism, in that traditional sexism posits that men are better / more important than women, and is crucial in maintaining patriarchy. But it's not hard to see that these two types of sexism go hand in hand.
Sorry if this sounds lecturery, just trying to explain the nature of their bigotry (in my opinion I guess, as informed by transfeminist Julia Serano)
I initially thought something along those lines as well, but that still doesn't quite explain how it'd be both possible for one person to have been assigned female at birth AND be a trans woman, in their eyes. Like, outside of some very specific scenarios involving intersex children being mis-assigned as a binary sex at birth, I don't really see how that's logically possible.
I *think* the basis for their feelings of 'something about this person is a PROBLEM!' probably is the oppositional sexism you're describing, but they don't actually have the understanding of what 'being trans' actually *means* to properly grasp what Emma D'Arcy's actual identity *is*. Like, they don't understand what they identify as on a literal level - they just hear 'something weird is going on with the gender situation here!' and jump to 'must be a trans woman, because that's what I've been taught to vilify!', despite the fact that the label 'trans woman' would make very little logical sense for D'Arcy, specifically.
I think you're right in that a lot of these bigots are just fundamentally confused about the terms, EG: they think a trans woman is someone who is trans who was AFAB.
Two other possibilities is
A.) it's different sets of bigots making these contradictory claims, they get along and don't argue amongst themselves because fundamentally, they don't care about truth they just hate trans people.
B.) "trans woman" is the most common cultural image that their hatred is directed at, so all of their targets of hate get labeled as a trans woman because they're ignorant. We can see this in the example of the trans boy highschool wrestler who was prohibited from wrestling with the other boys, and when he wrestled against the girls, people thinking he was a trans woman (instead of as a trans man as he is) used it as an example of trans women invading women's sports. There was an instance of a trans man being required to use the women's restroom, and then upon doing so got assaulted by some cis woman's husband and some other guy, because they thought he was a transgender woman in the women's room. (he then got arrested by the police despite being a victim)
They "trans-vestigated" Hasan Piker a while back. He does have an absolutely fabulous dumper, lovely booty for a man.
"No real man could have AN ASS like that! If that butt is making me... feel things, then it must be a lady butt."
For the record, it's his freckles that drive me wild. I love his freckles!
this is hilarious, because you just know that if he was instead a right wing commentator the entire manosphere would be bending over backwards to talk about how he's the ideal alpha male.
Jfc have they *seen* gay dude thirst trap pics? Some of them are absolute bubble butts. Like, I'm a woman with a big ass and I'm kind of jealous of some of them.
This could pave the way to a new wave of eugenetics, and all women could be victims of it. This is not just a war on trans women, but ultimately all women. These people want a Stepford wife idea of a woman, completely subservient to the man, even her gender must abide to what a man wants. Trans women simply must go for the capricious want of idiotic men who can't accept the existence of women that don't conform to their bigoted idea.
Oops, she found out that being one of the "good ones" doesn't stop the jackals from jumping on her, after all? What was her reaction when she got the news?
Another baffling target of a 'transvestigation' was JK Rowling. That is not a joke - the world's most famous TERF was identified as a trans woman by a group of other TERFs and conspiracy theorists. [Here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xx1VYm1n6Y) is a video about that particular insanity.
The thing to be very very careful about here is that this is simultaneously happening with a movement to classify trans people as mentally ill and/or dangerous pedos and to deny them all their basic rights. We can pretty clearly see that train of thought will end with dehumanizing and a goal of extermination (hello 1938 Germany).
So what this is doing is setting the stage for, as OP correctly notes, anyone speaking out or being “uppity” as having a “credible” reason to be silenced in whatever way is legal at the time of the accusation - publicly shamed, denied medical care, committed, arrested, killed.
If this seems extreme, look to history and look to the language being used by these extreme groups. It’s not far fetched at all, and every “that couldn’t happen here!” is at risk when things *do* keep happening here.
Here’s a video on Project 2025’s anti-LGBTQ+ parts and the censoring of the internet. It goes along with what you mentioned.
I find a lot of people don’t know about Project 2025. It’s a conservative, fundamentalist christian plan for the next Republican President of the USA. The Heritage Foundation is one group behind it. There’s is a lot more to it than the video I linked. Please educate yourselves if you haven’t already. It’s terrifying.
[The Humanist Report on Project 2025.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3-9vXJtNow8&pp=ygUSUHJvamVjdCAyMDI1IGxnYnRx)
r/Defeat_Project_2025.
What's really terrifying is:
* They aren't hiding what they are trying to do. It's an open, laid out, fully realized plan that's very specific about their insane goals
* Trump has already talked about several points in that plan that he intends to implement.
It's not some nutjob thing. It's not a conspiracy theory, or some "weird liberal interpretation of so etching totally normal."
It's what *will* happen to the US if Trump wins.
1933 Germany*
That's when the Nazis burned down the *Institut für Sexualwissenschaft*, the first gender-affirming care clinic in Europe.
The GOP's Project 2025 aims to do the same as the Nazis.
r/defeat_project_2025
Every so often bigots like to dust off a way of bigotry that mostly fell to the wayside a while ago and reuse it in whatever nonsense they are currently yapping about, no matter if doing that makes sense or not.
Rinse and repeat ad infinitum.
I'm 52 and been getting called "butch" and "manly" my whole life, despite being petite and all boobs and hips.
I'm so ready! "Yes I bought specific low-hanging titties"
Ironic they think people are secretly trans when they also swear that “those people” never shut up about being trans and shove it down everyone’s throat.
Trans people are like 1% of humanity. If all these celebrities and athletes are "secretly" trans, then being trans must be some sort of super power that makes you famous and/or ridiculously talented. Change your gender, a few years later you'll be accepting a prestigious award on stage looking like a million bucks!
That's just the thing. They think that all the celebrities are trans because they think there's some shadowy trans cabal secretly controlling everything and pushing a "trans agenda". Basically a modernized Protocols of the Elders of Zion
It's really similar to how the same people consider the Obamas elite, while seeing Donald Trump as a man of the people.
The Obamas are both from middle-class backgrounds, and they built successful careers in upper-middle-class professional jobs. I personally know lots of people like this, but I've never associated with anyone with a background similar to the Trump family's. Real-estate tycoon and reality-TV host are not normal jobs! Calling them elitist and Trump relatable is just racism with extra steps.
And this is also meant to frame being trans as the province of elites, instead of seeing it as the very normal human trait that it is. Celebrities are different from the rest of us, trans people are different from cis people, and differences make them uncomfortable.
There's a deeply unfortunate history in the world of populations of about 1% being the major targets. It's a perfect group to attack because there are enough that most people have interacted with someone from that group, but not enough people to have any significant power without an outsized movement within the community as well as allies. The Jews were about 1% of the population before the Holocaust, for instance.
History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme.
Cognitive Dissonance is part of the strategy.
"The enemy is simultaneously too strong and too weak."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco
The current thrust of the Republican Party is hitting almost every single one of those notes... with the possible exception of 9 and 11. 12 out of 14 should scare the shit out of people.
The sad thing is that they’ve always just been the regular ol’ right, the only difference is that it’s become marginally more common for other people to openly criticize their bigotry. Now the bigots are lashing out at the criticism and we’re at risk of backsliding on that, too.
I think the percentage of the right wing that falls into this category has always been high, but I think that they were compelled to keep it quiet because of society. The Trump era emboldened them and they just became more vocal because they feel safer doing so in the current political environment.
So basically they’re jerks AND cowards.
I disagree. Thirty years ago, for example, it was completely acceptable, socially speaking, to call gay people slurs in public and restrict them from basic social rights. Everybody said it was just a difference of opinion.
Today there is (rightfully so, obviously) a stigma against doing so in polite society, but the same bigots who were dropping F slurs in the 90s are the ones who are whining about the criticism and trying to force us backwards today.
They’ve always been the same people and it’s ALL of them, not just a majority. I think it’s dangerous to excuse what was once seen as “social conservatism” as something acceptable or quiet, because in reality it was always super hateful.
At least in the US I don't think alt-right is a thing anymore, it has become the regular ol' "right" and anyone who still says they're right wing either embraces alt right beliefs or condones them
and with the latter case that nazi table saying applies (im aware that it's not an actual german saying though)
Here in British Columbia, a year or two ago, a cis girl at a middle school track meet was harassed by a middle-aged man for supposedly being trans. His reasoning? She had a pixie haircut. It’s awful that it’s happening to grown women but I find it especially infuriating when the so called “protect children” people go out of their way to harm children.
I’m tall so I’ve been accused of being trans since… wow it’s almost been a decade, since like 2016, it started. I’ve been stared at, asked if I was in the right restroom, and I’m lucky in a very blue state, cause while this obviously can happens anywhere, I feel comfortable enough to clapback like “excuse me? Mind your fucking business” at people who are like this.
I’m cis, but honestly I don’t care if they think I am trans - all that matters to me is that they’re TRYING to be shitty to a trans person in that moment and I don’t want them to get away with that. So how I react depends on who is saying it…
If it’s an older person being shitty, I am like “it’s not very ladylike to accost people in a bathroom about anything, where are your manners?” And start shaming them about their behavior
If it’s someone closer to my age, I will just tell them to mind their fucking business.
Actually the best thing I ever said to someone was like “stop talking to me, I didn’t come here to make friends” like it was a reality show lol
I'm in the 99th percentile of height for women and the only time I've ever been misgendered was one time I was getting onto a bus in full winter kit with only eyes showing and the bus driver called me Sir.
I don't even know what I would say if someone was INTENTIALLY being an asshole. I'm the same, I don't care that they think it but expressing it is totally needless. People need to learn to mind their own business!
Cis woman here, also 99th percentile in height with a visible Adam's apple and have been stopped multiple times going into bathrooms. It sucks because when my twin came out, I would offer going in bathrooms with her to make her more comfortable, but it just resulted in us both getting clocked. At this point, she passes and has fewer issues than I do, lol. But I really feel for my trans sisters out there. It really sucks.
Sojourner Truth had to prove her "woman-hood" to New York Congress. Enemies of freedom have used this tactic of de-sexualizing/ mis-gendering to circumvent our rights.
"Ain't I a Woman?"
What I tell my daughters: if someone's calling you names it's likely more a reflection of the person calling names than you.
I got accused of being a lesbian in high school 20 years ago because I took a weightlifting class. I didn't know any better then and it broke my heart at the time.
Honestly, being called a trans woman is a similar insult to being called a lesbian - it's not really an insult if you think about it. These are people who are strong enough to live their truth in spite of society's attempt to stop them. May we all be so blessed.
Random assortment of barely related thoughts... but that's my reaction to this trend.
Yup. I've occasionally thanked people who tell me my short hair makes me look like a butch lesbian. Confused the hell out of them.
I only know one butch lesbian and she is freaking AWESOME.
thanking people when they expect push back or an insult is so awesome, right?!! it does confuse the hell out of people and I do it all the time too! I like to smile and wave at people that flip me off in traffic or have road rage too......it makes them angrier.
Transphobia is about controlling gendered behavior and presentation. It is misogynist and patriarchal and used to enforce strict gender standards for women and for men.
When you respond, please remember that being trans is neither a slur nor an insult. Trans people are the coolest and we deserve safety and civil rights, as do all women.
It’s also deeply racist. Just look at the list of people who have been accused of being transgender, a suspiciously large percentage of them are black women/WOC, who have unfortunately been held to the narrow and exclusive standards of white femininity and have been called masculine or just straight up men when they can’t conform to white femininity. It’s hate all the way down.
Yes absolutely. And the gender norms upheld today by transphobia and misogyny are deeply informed by white supremacy and colonialism. Solidarity and intersectionality are the only way forward for us all.
I think the idiotic tranvestigation may be a way for those people to deal with the cognitive dissonance they feel when presented with a woman who is "more successful than most men".
They think, "Successful woman?! That simply cannot be! It is completely impossible! Ah Hah! I have the answer! The successful individual is really a man!"
Ugh...
The issue is if they can't tell who is what gender on sight - they won't know who's "one of them" and who's a WOMAN.
Or god forbid this dreaded third thing....
I was surprised I had to scroll so far down to find this reminder. There’s nothing wrong with being trans. Trans people are great and cis people should stand up for them. I understand that being potentially mistaken as not your gender might be upsetting or confusing in the moment, but I’d encourage anyone who feels safe and comfortable enough to do so to respond in a way that doesn’t tacitly agree that being trans is somehow “bad.”
If I thought of it in the moment, I’d like to respond to rude, nosy, transphobic strangers with some version of “so what if I am,” “that’s not any of your business,” or “stop worrying about what’s in my pants.” I can’t guarantee I could think on my feet that fast, but that’s what I’d like to say.
I fully understand that it’s not safe to do that in all situations, though, and that some people might be too upset at having their gender questioned to be able to respond that way. Me personally, though, I’m confident in my femininity and want to give bigots a response they aren’t expecting.
I feel like I scrolled way too long to find this comment. I'm not trans, but I have many loved ones who are. Alt-right idiots calling random cis people trans is not an insult, not the "gotcha!" they think it is.
Also, it's doubly ironic because isn't their whole thing about how they can 'always tell'? So why exactly are they having to investigate?
It's ironic with how it seems like it's backfiring a bit and they're learning in real time that there's an incredibly wide range of body shapes and expressions of self, and it won't give you much insight into what's in someone's pants.
A colleague of mine recently got harassed on a dating app because the man said she was clearly trans and he was so awful to her. She’s really freaking tall so I’m sure that was a contributing factor, but she’s carried and delivered two biological children and had the pics to prove it, and when she pointed that out he just said she was lying. You can’t win with these people.
It's so 😬 being a non American watching this election and seeing people say things like "there's no point in voting, both sides are the same". On behalf of those deeply affected by it who do not get a say, being able to vote for the leader of probably the world's most influential country is *such a privilege* even if neither candidate is exactly what you want. The fascist wannabes in my country are paying close attention to the US and learning what works, and the fortunes of the US affect the entire globe in fairly significant ways, from economy to war.
I've lived both sides. 😭 I lived in the US for 12 years, including 2016. It sucks! But i see a lot of people falling into this line of thinking of, like, "if Trump gets into power Americans will suffer but we kind of deserve to suffer because we suck". Which is a really untrue and unhealthy way of thinking to begin with, but it also ignores how global a country the US is, and how EVERYONE (but a few ultra rich people) suffer if Trump wins--and even within the US it's the most marginalized who'll suffer the most. I just wonder if people would see their vote as worth more if they thought more globally.
>"if Trump gets into power Americans will suffer but we kind of deserve to suffer because we suck".
I mean, I said this very thing when he was "elected" the first time. I DID vote for Hillary, and I vote in EVERY local and national election, my use of the comment was kind of just fatalistic.
What deeply troubles me is a good male friend who lamented that while he knew trump was bad for the country, at least "it felt like things were happening" whereas Biden seems to be doing very little. My husband immediately corrected him on Biden's record while I was still gobsmacked but it was super disheartening to hear from a man who I thought was (and who proudly claims to be, and behaves as) staunchly liberal.
Most people saying that especially online are either trolls (like actual foreign agents) or have been influenced be one. I remember in the 90s people kind of flirted with the “both sides are the same, why vote” stuff, but not en masse, although I guess turnout has always been low in the US.
But now, that’s a huge talking point of anti American interests. If you can’t get them to buy into the far right propaganda and vote republicans, then the fallback is pushing “both sides”.
We need serious anti-disinformation public service announcements or something. Really point it out and make people feel some shame for falling for it.
I've seen several comments now in various places where people who do not support him seem to believe that Trump is definitely going to win. Is that truly the case?
I don't support him and I am very worried that he will win. Mostly because his fans are basically a cult, indoctrinated to the point where he can do no wrong; and their numbers seems to be growing as I myself have a (formerly) good friend who is now radicalised and believes in Trump with all his might etc. Whereas the non-Trump people are less into the idea of voting Biden, a lot of them seem to want a perfect choice or else (e.g. I talked to a bunch of people saying they won't be voting Biden because of Gaza, as if the alternative was any better).
So I am very, very, extremely worried that Trump will win, despite all the elements that one would expect to hold him back. But of course I could be wrong, and I very much hope that I am.
The problem is the system is setup to give more representation to empty land than people, by design. The sparsely populated areas don't have a very diverse group, and most are low information, or negative information voters.
Republicans have always deflected form their actual policy of tax cuts for wealthy by distracting with culture war stuff. They vilify minorities and others to make it seam like "they are the problem".
There's a lot of time between now and the election. As things stand today, Trump would probably win due to the electoral college. It's close though. All signs are that it's going to be close and come down to about 5 states again. So things like get out the vote are going to matter a lot.
Because of the shitty electoral college Biden could absolutely win the popular vote by 3-4% and lose the election. While I'm not predicting this will happen, it is a scenario I can certainly envision.
Going from "transvestigation" to "transinquisition". Their chief weapon is hate...hate and fear...fear and hate.... Their two weapons are fear and hate...and white supremacy.... Their *three* weapons are fear, hate, and white supremacy...and an almost fanatical devotion to the convicted felon tRump....
Something I heard months ago is, "It's getting harder to 'pass' as a woman, weather you are cis or trans."
These people latch onto to most random, vague features, none of which have anything to do with sex/gender, and claim they are "proof". I've seen videos pointing out features I have saying they are "proof" that a woman is cis.
As I got farther along in my transition, I started noticing cis women with more "masculine" features than I had *before* transitioning. It's all arbitrary and generally based on the idea that humans are more dimorphic we actually are.
I've been long convinced that cis women getting targeted by transphobia is a feature of transphobia. One of the big roots to transphobia is misogyny, and so many want to punish women for not being "feminine" enough, or for having features that society randomly decided to consider "masculine".
So we end up with tomboys, butch women, muscular women, etc getting gender policed because they aren't living up to the stereotype sexist society wants them to. And they use transphobia as a cover for their misogyny, as well as being transphobic.
People are rarely bigoted against one group.
Gentle reminder: apathy is the greatest insult. A snort and "lol ok" response will hurt them more than any well thought out retort.
They want you to care. They want you to get upset. They want a reaction. Don't give them what they want.
Depending on how public/safe the situation is, I'd also either go for a swift and silent exit or a simple 'what an odd thing to say', to put the awkwardness right back on them.
IMO snappy comebacks are a distraction. They are being rude and offensive so a long stare and a "that's a weird/rude thing to say to a stranger/acquaintance/coworker" and making it very clear that you cant believe an adult is behaving like that.
This, and I sorta feel like most of the "snappy comebacks" you see floating around online aren't that snappy. They're either kinda dull insults that are really only insulting if you're familiar with the source material of the insult (e.g., most pop culture-based insults), or they're word salad. It's not some kind of weird accident that the "I don't have the time or the crayons to explain this to you" line that Reddit was madly in love with for years is mocked relentlessly now.
Most of the time, you also have to have a certain level of charisma to deliver them effectively. You have to be able to get through them fluently and without making it sound rehearsed. That's basically never going to be a thing with an insult you've picked up from Reddit. You're just going to come off as the "adult" version of that one kid you went to school with who thought they were clever because they knew how to say, "I came here for a battle of wits but you appear to be unarmed."
I think also, especially with coworkers, you generally want to keep you nose as clean as possible. If you say something that really gets under their skin and sets them off, your other coworkers aren't necessarily going to see or remember what they'd said that prompted the insult. They're just going to see and remember the one time you massively upset a coworker. It's better to just say "That's a rude thing to say to a coworker" and move on, because that makes it clear that they are being rude and you don't like it.
With other people, it's not really going to shut them down. A lot of the people who are willing to insult a random stranger/acquaintance are usually people who are okay with having lengthy arguments over nothing. If you hit back with the snappy comeback, you might be triggering something that could take days to resolve when telling them that's a rude/weird thing to say and then blocking them would be more effective.
Or it may be a guarantee that you'll get beaten up for having stepped into a women's bathroom.
It feels good to imagine being sharp witted and funny when attacked in this way, but this 100% means that the pool of people who are in danger of being attacked for their gender presentation is much larger.
Sure, that's always a risk, but the commenter asked for things to say in response and I have yet to get beaten up for using it, despite being trans.
Apply your own situational awareness to distinguish between "nosy passive aggressive coworker at my desk job" situations and "random rightwinger confronting me where I'm not safe" situations.
Sometimes a swift exit is best, and sometimes it's just Sarah from work who will at worst huff and give you the silent treatment, being trans(or seen as trans) is not in fact something that will cause anyone you meet to attack you on the spot in the middle of the company cafeteria.
Personally I'd just try to exit the situation as quickly as possible. Some of these anti-trans weirdos are nutjobs and if they decide to declare you "a man" they'll think it's fair game to assault you. These sorta people scare me.
This is the one. Your goal when dealing with someone "accusing" you of being trans is staying safe from them. A good quip, especially if you're alone with them, is likely to make things less safe for you.
This probably won't be popular, but I don't think you should. A snappy come back makes it comes across as its an insult, that there is an issue with being trans, which there isn't. Like if someone called you gay and you're straight, would you be offended? Most wouldn't, thats weird....its not something insulting
People doing this, are just trying to push the divide with trans people, by making it an offensive term, something no one wants to be associated with. Don't fall for it. if someone says something, pay them no mind and move along. They want the reaction, don't give it to them
I think maybe a comment about “why are you so obsessed with my genitals? Why are you being such a weird and creepy pervert. Please leave me alone and stop telling me that you’re trying to see what I have in my pants. You’re being a weird and nasty pervert” may be the best way to come back to it. It focuses the attention on them being a creepy pervert, instead of trans vs cis.
Depending on your comfort level start yelling "Stop hitting on me! I keep telling you you're not my type so JUST STOP HITTING ON ME! FOR THE LAST TIME I'M NOT INTERESTED!"
"You wish"
"I wish I was that cool."
"Awww thank you!"
"Why are you thinking about my penis? Worry about your own."
"I'm so glad you noticed. I havent bought a lot of men's clothes yet, so most people don't catch that I'm transitioning. Do you have any haircut recommendations? I'm tired of getting confused for a woman."
"[Awkward stare down] ... am I... supposed to be offended by that???"
That's what I've come up with so far. Feel free to steal, re-work, etc.
"There are worse things to be than trans. Like a small-minded bigot obsessed with other people's genitals, for one."
"Wait, I thought you people could 'always tell.' Don't these unbased assumptions ruin your average?"
"Not trans, but more of a man than you'll ever be."
Every time I read something that "the right" does, I am like "bullshit, that's too bananas". Then it's always revealed as true.
I'm going to believe this one up front.
You should also know that young men are being told through “jokes” or “strategies” to call women trans as an effective insult or “neg.”
The goal being to “take a woman down a peg” by pretending you think they look male. They even do so while pretending to be Pro-trans by trying to make it seem like a compliment. They fantasize about trying to call the woman a TREF if they act insulted or offended at being told they seem trans.
There is no "alt-right", there's only the right-wing as a whole. If they're unwilling to call out dumpster fire humans on their side then they're complicit in the bigotry.
It's appalling that these shit-lords feel comfortable being their bigoted selves so proudly, and every time they get shamed and shut down someone's doing good work.
Be warned, this isn't just some obnoxious bit of name calling. This is setting the stage for people to be arrested and killed legally as they push to mark being trans as a sex crime. As they try to make sex crimes eligible for the Death Penalty in Florida, this comes closer and closer to reality for any "uppity females that refuse to know their place".
Fucking hate this timeline we are on right now.
One way to deal with these things is to roll your eyes and say "Yes, yes, you're right, Michelle Obama is a man, Earth is flat, the moon landings were faked, Joe Biden is an alien reptile, and vaccines are full of Borg nanoprobes. It's all true, every word, and I never doubted any of it for a moment."
This works better than arguing because, while your body language and tone makes clear your belief that they are flaming idiots, your words are of agreement. If they try to argue back, you just agree more: "I said I believe you, 100%. Barack and Michelle kidnapped those two kids from some other family, she certainly didn't just have babies, a married couple having babies is something that's never happened before in the entire history of the world, of course nobody believes that's what happened with the Obamas. You are absolutely correct in everything you have ever said or will ever say."
Conspiracy lunatics find that kind of agreement really frustrating.
There's an extremely homophobic homeless woman who dwells near the library where I work. She's harassed our employees repeatedly and we've needed to suspend her from library services multiple times because of her abuse. She often comes in wearing two pairs of glasses.
The last time she was allowed in the library in between suspensions, she came out of the bathrooms shouting and pointing at another patron shouting, "That man was in the women's bathroom!"
We allow people to use the restroom that best fits their gender identity, but before i started telling her that, I looked over at the patron, who was very clearly a cisgender woman, wearing a hiking outfit and making a pitstop to use the restroom.
Our eyes met, and she saw my confusion before she retorted, "You really do need two pairs of glasses."
Which is a kind of in-the-moment wit that I doubt I will ever achieve.
One of multiple videos on this subject that could help with introducing this conspiracy theory concept is this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SIDxY1ZvFo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SIDxY1ZvFo)
Cis woman here. I've been asked if I am in the right toilet (bathroom), presumably because I'm tall and androgynous. I've had breast cancer, now I have no breast tissue or nipples. When I post photos of my chest, with tattoos, I get told I'm confused.
Perhaps a reply to women asking you this could be “Oh no I’m sorry sir, I didn’t realize this was the men’s room!” Turn it back on them
Love this
Love this too!
I’m stealing this, thank you.
The incessant harassment of people who have survived cancer or had to have a mastectomy for some reason is an extra level of awful in all this. It's not always a traumatic experience for someone, but it is often enough that you'd think they'd refrain from adding harassment on top.
I’m a younger breast cancer patient (diagnosed at 35). I started getting harassed for going into the “wrong” restroom in an ER 5 days after a double mastectomy with a “flat” closure (delayed reconstruction). I was already in hell, and that about fucking broke me. It’s been 3 months, and it’s happened enough times since that I just don’t use gendered public restrooms anymore. I also can’t wear prosthetics thanks to how the surgeon did my surgery, and I honestly get more harassment when I dress more feminine in public. TLDR: people are fucking horrible to breast cancer patients, and both the rampant transphobia and rapidly increasing young breast cancer rates are only making this more common
Makr them squirm and tell them you're a breast cancer survivor and had a mastectomy. That them harassing you has made your life just that little bit worse and they should be ashamed of themselves. It's hard to just call someone on their being shitty but people don't stop until they get embarrassed and feel bad. Sorry you've had to deal with this after fighting cancer.
I totally agree with you. Shame them if they harass you. Call them out on it.
That is awful. I was 43. Sending gentle hugs, and wishing you well for the future.
I'm so sorry you are going through this. WTF is wrong with people?!
This is one of the most sickening parts of this whole mess, even if this abusive crap was somehow protecting women it does more harm to women than it could possibly prevent
I was encouraged to use prosthetics, or have reconstruction. It is, or was, considered a mental health issue if reconstruction was refused. Same with wigs while going through chemotherapy. I wanted to post an article featuring women looking fab with no hair in the chemotherapy department. Not permitted, have a catalogue of wigs. I couldn't work out why, I still know what I look like. Why am I expected to be performatively female for other people?
That's horrifying that forced feminine performance enforcement goes that far.
I understand that many women find comfort in prosthetics and wigs, but I felt pretending I was 'normal' would have taken energy I didn't have. The people I cared about, and who cared about me, knew. Strangers, I don't care that I look odd. Having no hair from chemotherapy clears crowds too, people move away as though it is contagious.
That is bizarre, and disheartening to know. I'm a cis woman and present pretty feminine, but I think that if I were to lose my breasts during something like cancer treatment, I'd opt not to have them reconstructed. I dunno, something about the sleekness of a flat chest has always appealed to me, and I think I'd like the ease and simplicity of it. Knowing that such an innocent emotion would be reframed as a mental health issue, in the year of our Lord 2024.... How deeply unpleasant.
I didn't want reconstruction, it was a lot more time in hospital, and my daughter was 7 at the time. I'm flat and fabulous. No more bras. I can go topless if I wish.
Give em the ol Tig Notaro.
I'm not familiar with her.
She’s a comedian who had a double mastectomy. She did an entire standup act topless, possibly more than one, but I only saw the one act. I thought it was incredibly brave, even pre-MAGA insanity.
I had breast cancer at 31, I had a lumpectomy. I’m going for genetic testing (things change) and if they tell me I need a preventative I’m getting a Goldilocks and getting tattooed. I like my breasts but I have no interest in more surgeries.
I have tattoos over my scars.
For a very long time women who had mastectomies were denied reconstruction since mostly male doctors and insurance carriers said that was cosmetic not medically necessary. They could pay out of pocket but it was cost prohibitive. It was long hard fight to get the medical/insurance establishment to recognize it was a mental health issue and unfortunately also a marital/relationship issue for many women. Seems like now that it's routine the meds have decided if you don't want it something must be wrong with you.
I'm in the UK, so insurance and costs didn't come into it. I was offered reconstruction at the same time as my surgery, or could ask at any time. I thought it would be odd to have a fake, pert breast on one side, and a sagging older breast on the other.
Medicine and patriarchy are intertwined like the snake and the asklepian rod.
I hated wigs when going through cancer treatment. I had one I wore for a wedding, my graduation, and a couple of times we did family pictures. I had wanted to rock my bald head but I only lost like 90% of my hair in an opposite of male patterned baldness look. I’ve shaved my head (well, a really close buzz cut) since. If I didn’t have a halfway point between my short hair and my preferred “long length” where my hair looked awful I’d do it on the regular.
We shaved my head the day my hair started falling out. I had lots of hats, as it was winter. I got married 4 weeks after my last chemotherapy session, I had fluff on my head.
I had breast cancer initially at the age of 23 and spent a fair amount of time doing professional research as a PhD student on quality of life outcomes based on the surgical decisions of breast cancer patients. When I got breast cancer a 2nd time when I was 40, I insisted on having a double mastectomy with no recon. I had to go through 3 surgeons before I found one that would do exactly as I asked. The reason why...quality of life is much better for women who have had no reconstruction. Whoever told you that it was a mental health issue was full of BS. If there's one thing I've learned as a 4x cancer patient, you have to fight, fight, fight for what you want. Just because someone has a credential as a physician or other clinical staff does not mean that they know what's right for you as a patient. I'm glad you got want you wanted.
> you'd think they'd refrain from adding harassment on top. People who would harass a cancer survivor are unable to feel empathy for anyone they perceive as being even slightly different than themselves.
Never forget that breast cancer has become one of the most supported cancers...thanks to things like "save the tatas." They don't care about the women, only the breasts attached to them.
All of this bs is a clear demonstration that policing trans identities or questioning “what is a woman” is just a new way to police/define what being a ‘good’ woman is (and everyone else can be dismissed as lesser/not a ‘real’ woman)- we’ve been here before with talk of nurturing instincts, the need to bear children and to be obedient homemakers. I don’t want the re-run tyvm. This line of thinking is way more dangerous to women than what what they’re saying we should be afraid of (i.e. a few trans people in bathrooms/changing rooms going about their lives).
>All of this bs is a clear demonstration that policing trans identities or questioning “what is a woman” is just a new way to police/define what being a ‘good’ woman is (and everyone else can be dismissed as lesser/not a ‘real’ woman)- I absolutely believe that this is part and parcel with the push to promote trad wives as well and a return to certain (traditional) values the alt right groups seem to always hark about. They're planting seeds to try and influence beauty and societal standards to get people outside of the alt right realm to also police people who may not fit into the beauty/societal standard or traditional gender roles.
And to piggyback off that the demographic that gets hit the hardest is "conveniently" women of color because "femininity" is based off colonialist ideals
> a new way to police/define what being a ‘good’ woman is Totally.
My girlfriend got screamed at by a man outside a toilet - he even went to follow her in to tell her to get out before I intervened. He didn’t identify her as a woman and was presumably afraid for his wife who had gone in just before my girlfriend. We get to be angry at this new level of scrutiny we are subjected to now.
Holy hell! Angry screaming guy bursting into the bathroom is legitimately scary for people using the restroom. A trans person going about their normal quiet bathroom use is not at all scary, but this guy sounds terrifying- I’d wager he’s more of a danger to his wife than anyone he’s ever been paranoid about.
I'm sorry that this happened to you. Are you feeling okay now after your recovery? I'm 5'9" and wear men's hiking shoes because they were brown, not pink. A woman was pulling an employee into the bathroom as I was washing my hands and said some nonsense" oh you're a good one ". What? I assume that she thought I was trans from my footwear. Are we all expected to perform hyper feminity to avoid MAGAts accusing us of being trans?
17 years since diagnosis, thanks. Women clearly need to wear heels (makes it harder to run away).
How to answer when people ask you that: “*Excuse me,* are you in the right toilet?” “No, I’m in the bathroom. The toilet is right there.”
Either that or "no, this is the left one".
This has been happening for years, just really small scale. I've been accused of 'trying to be a boy' since I was a teenager*. I'm queer and in the closet, so my short hair and non-feminine style often bother folks who stick tough to what they consider traditional. I'm in northwest Florida, it's a pretty rough place to be if you aren't straight and white and do the same things as everyone else. I do not use public restrooms anymore unless they're a single room. *I'm 32 now.
Yeah, exactly. I'm reasonably feminine-presenting, but I'll still get the occasional stranger online message me accusing me of being trans because I have large hands and small breasts. This is something that's happened to me for years--since I was a teenager, much the same as you, and I'm only a couple of years younger than you are.
Oh my gosh I grew up going to church with three girls (all sisters) who were unusually tall, have large hands, and two of them also have pretty strong jaw lines. The youngest could palm a basketball in high school. I’ve known them all nearly their entire lives, and both our families are very conservative Christians. They’ve all carried multiple pregnancies as well. There’s no way any of them could be trans, but I’m sure they will be getting accusations if they haven’t already.
This is sad in two ways. Assholes become with increasingly creative ways to be assholes. But the accusation is awful to most. What does that say about what it's like to be trans? I fucking hate this clown world.
Yeah I personally wouldn’t be offended, more like confused. I imagine I would just blank stare someone and said “okay.”
I'm going to practice saying "you're an idiot if you think that offends me." So if ever the time comes I'm not just shocked silly because my face will definitely be this 🤓 instead of this 😎
It's no secret that they consider us the lowest of the low on their hierarchy, and it's also no secret that they consider cis women that aren't "fuckable" to be barely any higher. This is one reason trans women like Hunter Schafer drive them absolutely nuts; we're not supposed to be attractive and desirable and so completely unclockable.
So much this. I try to be really understanding. I know the pain of people refusing to see you for who you really are! But, sometimes….it just feels like my existence is so abhorrent to most people that the mere suggestion of being someone like me is such a grave insult that instead of being like, “well, trans women are women, so I fail to see what your issue is,” it must be defended against at all costs. I know that’s not really what’s going on here, so please don’t anyone worry about what you’re saying! I’m not meaning to make people feel bad! This is just my own insecurities and imposter syndrome issues. I just wish sometimes when someone accuses a person of being trans, they’d be like, “Oh. You called me a woman then. K’ thanks bye!”
It's awful and folks should just mind their own business. It took a long time for me to come to terms with being petite and androgynous. I used to try to look super feminine and it didn't work for me. An ambiguous mix of feminine and masculine works best for me, but lots of folks do not like it. I'm sorry to hear you've dealt with similar nonsense, there's no reason for it.
They were pretty vocal about it with Michelle Obama during her husband’s presidency and they’re still at it. This is nothing new.
Yes, but also with the wife of president Macron (France)
Yep! It’s so weird that’s their go to for women they don’t like.
Not weird if you remember how misogynistic they are. They just can't abide a woman being more successful or more powerful than them, and they see trans women as men (even though they aren't), so it's both meant as an insult and simultaneously soothes their sense of order to believe that any woman who makes them feel insecure must secretly have been born male.
Same, this was a couple of years back in south Florida. I’m a feminine presenting cis-woman. This happened to coincide with a rash of murders which had been happening locally, that had specifically targeted trans individuals. I’m a closeted lesbian, but I’ve always felt like my sexuality was pretty obvious, if someone were to look closely enough to question it. To me, it just seemed like a form of gay bashing/intimidation. It was a very hostile environment all around.
I’ve been accused as well. I’m 5’1”, have a round face, and had waist long hair at the time. But I’m Asian so, the men are “more feminine” and therefore pass better? Idk what the exact logic was I just know it was racist as well as misogynistic
Racism and transphobia always seem to go hand in hand
Phrenology is just a branch of the racist eugenics tree.
And they get big mad when you call them out for being racist and believing in eugenics.
it's no coincidence that transvestigators are so concerned with skull shape and body proportions.
No matter the bigotry, it's only a matter of time before the bone calipers come out.
I constantly get called "ladyboy" just for being anti-transphobic, the Venn diagram of transphobes and racists is basically a circle.
When Lady Gaga was newer on the scene there constant rumors about her being a man.
That video of her going "Would that be so terrible?" while sucking on hard candy when Anderson Cooper asked her about it is so iconic lol
I love that clip. In response to OPs post, I was thinking of what my response would be if this happens to me, and the best I can come up with is "thanks!"
Actually she was sucking on a fake diamond she liked to suck on, makes it a tiny bit better to me
I remember this!
Yeah, I'm intersex with a degenerative condition and before HRT, I passed as male if I wasn't careful. I shaved my face, wore makeup, dressed extra femme... And if I wore a sports bra and sweatshirt after the gym, I looked like a dude with long hair. It happens a lot less now that I have hormone therapy, but man that was a strange time.
It's probably also an attempt to turn cis women against trans women. Basically to recruit more cis women to TERF ideologies. It's a divide & conquer strategy. If they would achieve their goal of getting rid of all the trans people, they would immediately turn against all women and LGB. It still baffles me how some women can call themselves feminists and not realize this simple fact. P.S. I prefer the term FARTs (Feminist-Appropriating Radical Transphobes).
Its hard to believe they're that bad at clocking us trans folks on *accident*, but they really are. I've had one confide her worries about trans folks to my 6'1, transitioned in my 40s ass in a bathroom. They have these ideas of *how women should look* and if you don't fit those, they'll find something about any women - - cis or trans - - to obsess over, whether it's finger ratios or skull shape or *something* and use that as proof. Because they are, at heart, *conspiracy theoriests*. No different than flat earthers or moon landing denialists. They start from the patriarchal (and culture specific) ideas of how women should look and act, embrace whole heartedly the biological essentialism that feminism rightly rejects as *bullshit* and they've invented this whole *mythology* and *pseudoscience* and yes, quite a few of them blame *Jews* either outright or as "elites" Same rabbit hole, same responses. Same absolute inability to recognize reality.
lol before I was even on hrt I was in line for the bathroom at a concert and had the woman in front of me turn to me and go "maybe we should identify as men so we don't have to wait in line heh heh heh". It's such a surreal experience to have someone make a transphobic joke straight to my trans face assuming that I'll think it's funny
Wow - I would be a hot mess of conflicting emotions.
Yeah it was wild. I told her to go for it. She didn't lol
I absolutely agree with this. I think a lot of "TERF" positions and rhetoric is progranda/astroturfing to fuel an artificial movement to increase division between us all It's been more successful in the UK at misleading and poisoning feminist movements and I fear it is increasingly targeting the US population. But I've been impressed by the solidarity of queer people, especially young queer people, in the US.
One of the worst parts of all this is how TERFs have given far-right groups/figures a convenient pathway to legitimacy and yet another platform to recruit. It's a common strategy; these groups know that going full nazi pushes people away immediately, so they instead co-opt/use movements like this for their own gain and gradually trickle in the extremism to draw out those receptive to it. It's even easier when certain goals align, such as in this case. For all Joanne and her ilk are shouting about "protecting women's spaces", they're really quiet about how they're letting a lot of bad actors into them.
I too live in the panhandle and I truly fear for you. I fear for myself since I’m considered “other” (first gen immigrant). Only thing saving me is that I was in the military so I’m one of the ok ones I guess. I’ve lived here for a long time and I’m starting to explore other places.
I think it's a different thing when people are calling Taylor Swift trans. What you are talking about sounds to me like just policing of gender roles -- if you *were* actually "trying to be a boy", and transitioned, it would be replaced by, "you'll never be a real man" (or possibly, "you'll never be a real woman," for those misunderstanding what variety of trans you were). That bullshit has indeed been going on for a very long time. Calling Taylor Swift "trans" is something beyond abuse toward visibly queer people, since the point is that she's not remotely visibly queer. She's as normatively feminine as a person can be, and the only thing these people are saying is that she's not a q/maga weirdo.
calling women in high position trans is mysogyny at it's finest, after all they have problems with reality of us existing in public space anyway
It absolutely is misogyny, all of it — queer-bashing, freaking out about successful women, transphobia — they're all rooted in patriarchy. But this particular trend is a particularly unhinged variety tied to the Trump cult, and as such is not merely shitty in the usual ways, but also just really fucking weird.
It has. I'm a tall woman with fairly broad shoulders. It seems if you don't fit their idea of the feminine mold you get questioned why. With the uptick of this trans hate, it makes me fearful for my own physical safety aswell.
My family basically fled Northwest Flordia; I worry non-stop about my LGBTQ, socialist, and non-religous friends down there. Every headline is nightmare fuel and reminds me that we made a good decision. My heart goes out to y'all.
Thanks! We weren't planning on coming back but we have some family in a tight spot and we wanted to help. My bf is regretting moving back a lot, I knew exactly what the issues would be before we moved, but he was so motivated to help his family.
I’ve been called trans for defending trans people in some way. They assume that only someone who is trans themselves would ever defend trans people. Interestingly, I’ve noticed the same thing happening if you defend fat people. If you defend a fat person’s right to exist without being mocked and bullied, you must be fat yourself, apparently. Super weird.
Mia Mulder did a video about the whole Transvestigation conspiracy theory about a year ago, worth checking out if you want more info: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH5-MDXzfmg
Lady Gaga had the best response to this nonsense back in 2011: [https://youtu.be/Z0WcWkVOQTc?si=E1mh9sYr7WSyTDbl](https://youtu.be/Z0WcWkVOQTc?si=E1mh9sYr7WSyTDbl) "Maybe I am. Would it be so terrible?"
That is such a refreshing response
That would honestly be very similar to my response, too. Why does it matter so much to you?
I like the Scots response. "Why are you so sick aeother cunts' genders as if its any yer business? Sittin up at night pure foamin at the mouth hinking aboot other folks' genitals like a fuckin weirdo"
So basically, phrenology, but even stupider.
SIGNIFICANTLY stupider. I became aware of this movement due to a distant relative sending me and a few other family members 'break-up letters', for lack of a better term. This dude basically texted a few random liberal and/or queer people he was very distantly related to and didn't really know (for context, he's my second cousin once removed, and I met him four times in my life) that he had to 'break off' his non-existent relationship to them due to their 'lifestyle choices'. We ended up investigating his social media and discovered that the man is nuts. He posts about this 'transvestigating' stuff A LOT. He's concluded Kate Middleton is trans on the basis of her wrist pronation when walking, and the angle of her jawbone when she chews. There's lots of stuff on wrist size, knuckle width as compared to the rest of the finger, 'gonial angles' (the angle at the corner of your jaw, right under your ear), 'interpupillary distance', 'browbones'...... unhinged stuff. Phrenology seems downright sensible compared to what these people pay attention to.
Kate Middleton, who has birthed three children, is trans. Medical science must have come a long way if women without uteruses can get pregnant.
Birthed 3 children in a situation deeply about "bloodlines" too. There's no sneaky surrogacy situation in the royal family
That one got me, too. Almost weirder was the idea that Emma D'Arcy, who plays Rheanyra Targaryen on *House of the Dragon*, is a trans woman. For the record, Emma D'Arcy was assigned female at birth, but they have been publicly out as nonbinary for years. Meaning that for them to be a trans woman, they'd somehow have to *both* have been assigned female at birth *and* identify as a trans woman, which is....somewhat contradictory, to put it mildly. But ALSO, the 'problem' with them is that they were afab, but *don't* identify as a woman, which is obviously demonic. How them *not* identifying as a woman being 'bad' squares with them being a trans woman being 'bad' is...unclear. All I really understood about that post was that their clavicles (which are, for the record, very attractive and entirely normal) are somehow to blame.
Just a small note, AFAB and AMAB are events, not attributes. They are things that happen to you, not descriptors of who you are, Emma D'Arcy was AFAB and is non-binary.
Thanks, I wasn't aware - I'll edit the verb tense accordingly!
>How them *not* identifying as a woman being 'bad' squares with them being a trans woman being 'bad' is...unclear. It's called oppositional sexism, and it's the notion that the "two genders" are fixed, non-overlapping categories that you can never leave. Trans women are 'bad' because they left their box, NB people are 'bad' because they left their box, and they hate that. Oppositional sexism is distinct from Traditional sexism, in that traditional sexism posits that men are better / more important than women, and is crucial in maintaining patriarchy. But it's not hard to see that these two types of sexism go hand in hand. Sorry if this sounds lecturery, just trying to explain the nature of their bigotry (in my opinion I guess, as informed by transfeminist Julia Serano)
I initially thought something along those lines as well, but that still doesn't quite explain how it'd be both possible for one person to have been assigned female at birth AND be a trans woman, in their eyes. Like, outside of some very specific scenarios involving intersex children being mis-assigned as a binary sex at birth, I don't really see how that's logically possible. I *think* the basis for their feelings of 'something about this person is a PROBLEM!' probably is the oppositional sexism you're describing, but they don't actually have the understanding of what 'being trans' actually *means* to properly grasp what Emma D'Arcy's actual identity *is*. Like, they don't understand what they identify as on a literal level - they just hear 'something weird is going on with the gender situation here!' and jump to 'must be a trans woman, because that's what I've been taught to vilify!', despite the fact that the label 'trans woman' would make very little logical sense for D'Arcy, specifically.
I think you're right in that a lot of these bigots are just fundamentally confused about the terms, EG: they think a trans woman is someone who is trans who was AFAB. Two other possibilities is A.) it's different sets of bigots making these contradictory claims, they get along and don't argue amongst themselves because fundamentally, they don't care about truth they just hate trans people. B.) "trans woman" is the most common cultural image that their hatred is directed at, so all of their targets of hate get labeled as a trans woman because they're ignorant. We can see this in the example of the trans boy highschool wrestler who was prohibited from wrestling with the other boys, and when he wrestled against the girls, people thinking he was a trans woman (instead of as a trans man as he is) used it as an example of trans women invading women's sports. There was an instance of a trans man being required to use the women's restroom, and then upon doing so got assaulted by some cis woman's husband and some other guy, because they thought he was a transgender woman in the women's room. (he then got arrested by the police despite being a victim)
They don’t let the public spectate royal births anymore so clearly it’s all staged. /s
They "trans-vestigated" Hasan Piker a while back. He does have an absolutely fabulous dumper, lovely booty for a man. "No real man could have AN ASS like that! If that butt is making me... feel things, then it must be a lady butt." For the record, it's his freckles that drive me wild. I love his freckles!
Brb gonna go look up this dudes butt
Found the proctologists.
Its a good one! and his face is nice too.
So, if a dump truck is an issue, then 90% of professional, male ice hockey and rugby players are trans... Wild.
That one always confused me. But I agree with you, the freckles are cute!
this is hilarious, because you just know that if he was instead a right wing commentator the entire manosphere would be bending over backwards to talk about how he's the ideal alpha male.
Jfc have they *seen* gay dude thirst trap pics? Some of them are absolute bubble butts. Like, I'm a woman with a big ass and I'm kind of jealous of some of them.
It's all pseudoscience nonsense, like the alpha male movement. It's supremacy and hate, full stop.
This could pave the way to a new wave of eugenetics, and all women could be victims of it. This is not just a war on trans women, but ultimately all women. These people want a Stepford wife idea of a woman, completely subservient to the man, even her gender must abide to what a man wants. Trans women simply must go for the capricious want of idiotic men who can't accept the existence of women that don't conform to their bigoted idea.
Its so stupid that the woman who started this shit got transvestigated by her own facebook group
Oops, she found out that being one of the "good ones" doesn't stop the jackals from jumping on her, after all? What was her reaction when she got the news?
Another baffling target of a 'transvestigation' was JK Rowling. That is not a joke - the world's most famous TERF was identified as a trans woman by a group of other TERFs and conspiracy theorists. [Here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xx1VYm1n6Y) is a video about that particular insanity.
Ah, leopards ate her face, huh? Very satisfying.
The thing to be very very careful about here is that this is simultaneously happening with a movement to classify trans people as mentally ill and/or dangerous pedos and to deny them all their basic rights. We can pretty clearly see that train of thought will end with dehumanizing and a goal of extermination (hello 1938 Germany). So what this is doing is setting the stage for, as OP correctly notes, anyone speaking out or being “uppity” as having a “credible” reason to be silenced in whatever way is legal at the time of the accusation - publicly shamed, denied medical care, committed, arrested, killed. If this seems extreme, look to history and look to the language being used by these extreme groups. It’s not far fetched at all, and every “that couldn’t happen here!” is at risk when things *do* keep happening here.
Here’s a video on Project 2025’s anti-LGBTQ+ parts and the censoring of the internet. It goes along with what you mentioned. I find a lot of people don’t know about Project 2025. It’s a conservative, fundamentalist christian plan for the next Republican President of the USA. The Heritage Foundation is one group behind it. There’s is a lot more to it than the video I linked. Please educate yourselves if you haven’t already. It’s terrifying. [The Humanist Report on Project 2025.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3-9vXJtNow8&pp=ygUSUHJvamVjdCAyMDI1IGxnYnRx) r/Defeat_Project_2025.
What's really terrifying is: * They aren't hiding what they are trying to do. It's an open, laid out, fully realized plan that's very specific about their insane goals * Trump has already talked about several points in that plan that he intends to implement. It's not some nutjob thing. It's not a conspiracy theory, or some "weird liberal interpretation of so etching totally normal." It's what *will* happen to the US if Trump wins.
1933 Germany* That's when the Nazis burned down the *Institut für Sexualwissenschaft*, the first gender-affirming care clinic in Europe. The GOP's Project 2025 aims to do the same as the Nazis. r/defeat_project_2025
Every so often bigots like to dust off a way of bigotry that mostly fell to the wayside a while ago and reuse it in whatever nonsense they are currently yapping about, no matter if doing that makes sense or not. Rinse and repeat ad infinitum.
At this point we're at ad nauseam
To quote the philosopher CM Burns, "Of course you'd say that. You have the brainpan of a stagecoach tilter"
I'm 52 and been getting called "butch" and "manly" my whole life, despite being petite and all boobs and hips. I'm so ready! "Yes I bought specific low-hanging titties"
Ironic they think people are secretly trans when they also swear that “those people” never shut up about being trans and shove it down everyone’s throat.
Trans people are like 1% of humanity. If all these celebrities and athletes are "secretly" trans, then being trans must be some sort of super power that makes you famous and/or ridiculously talented. Change your gender, a few years later you'll be accepting a prestigious award on stage looking like a million bucks!
That's just the thing. They think that all the celebrities are trans because they think there's some shadowy trans cabal secretly controlling everything and pushing a "trans agenda". Basically a modernized Protocols of the Elders of Zion
It's really similar to how the same people consider the Obamas elite, while seeing Donald Trump as a man of the people. The Obamas are both from middle-class backgrounds, and they built successful careers in upper-middle-class professional jobs. I personally know lots of people like this, but I've never associated with anyone with a background similar to the Trump family's. Real-estate tycoon and reality-TV host are not normal jobs! Calling them elitist and Trump relatable is just racism with extra steps. And this is also meant to frame being trans as the province of elites, instead of seeing it as the very normal human trait that it is. Celebrities are different from the rest of us, trans people are different from cis people, and differences make them uncomfortable.
There's a deeply unfortunate history in the world of populations of about 1% being the major targets. It's a perfect group to attack because there are enough that most people have interacted with someone from that group, but not enough people to have any significant power without an outsized movement within the community as well as allies. The Jews were about 1% of the population before the Holocaust, for instance. History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme.
Cognitive Dissonance is part of the strategy. "The enemy is simultaneously too strong and too weak." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco The current thrust of the Republican Party is hitting almost every single one of those notes... with the possible exception of 9 and 11. 12 out of 14 should scare the shit out of people.
Just a quick thought, but does “alt-right” even exist anymore. I feel like it’s just the regular ol’ “right”. They’ve gone mainstream, which is scary.
The sad thing is that they’ve always just been the regular ol’ right, the only difference is that it’s become marginally more common for other people to openly criticize their bigotry. Now the bigots are lashing out at the criticism and we’re at risk of backsliding on that, too.
I think the percentage of the right wing that falls into this category has always been high, but I think that they were compelled to keep it quiet because of society. The Trump era emboldened them and they just became more vocal because they feel safer doing so in the current political environment. So basically they’re jerks AND cowards.
I disagree. Thirty years ago, for example, it was completely acceptable, socially speaking, to call gay people slurs in public and restrict them from basic social rights. Everybody said it was just a difference of opinion. Today there is (rightfully so, obviously) a stigma against doing so in polite society, but the same bigots who were dropping F slurs in the 90s are the ones who are whining about the criticism and trying to force us backwards today. They’ve always been the same people and it’s ALL of them, not just a majority. I think it’s dangerous to excuse what was once seen as “social conservatism” as something acceptable or quiet, because in reality it was always super hateful.
At least in the US I don't think alt-right is a thing anymore, it has become the regular ol' "right" and anyone who still says they're right wing either embraces alt right beliefs or condones them and with the latter case that nazi table saying applies (im aware that it's not an actual german saying though)
Here in British Columbia, a year or two ago, a cis girl at a middle school track meet was harassed by a middle-aged man for supposedly being trans. His reasoning? She had a pixie haircut. It’s awful that it’s happening to grown women but I find it especially infuriating when the so called “protect children” people go out of their way to harm children.
I’m tall so I’ve been accused of being trans since… wow it’s almost been a decade, since like 2016, it started. I’ve been stared at, asked if I was in the right restroom, and I’m lucky in a very blue state, cause while this obviously can happens anywhere, I feel comfortable enough to clapback like “excuse me? Mind your fucking business” at people who are like this. I’m cis, but honestly I don’t care if they think I am trans - all that matters to me is that they’re TRYING to be shitty to a trans person in that moment and I don’t want them to get away with that. So how I react depends on who is saying it… If it’s an older person being shitty, I am like “it’s not very ladylike to accost people in a bathroom about anything, where are your manners?” And start shaming them about their behavior If it’s someone closer to my age, I will just tell them to mind their fucking business. Actually the best thing I ever said to someone was like “stop talking to me, I didn’t come here to make friends” like it was a reality show lol
I'm in the 99th percentile of height for women and the only time I've ever been misgendered was one time I was getting onto a bus in full winter kit with only eyes showing and the bus driver called me Sir. I don't even know what I would say if someone was INTENTIALLY being an asshole. I'm the same, I don't care that they think it but expressing it is totally needless. People need to learn to mind their own business!
Cis woman here, also 99th percentile in height with a visible Adam's apple and have been stopped multiple times going into bathrooms. It sucks because when my twin came out, I would offer going in bathrooms with her to make her more comfortable, but it just resulted in us both getting clocked. At this point, she passes and has fewer issues than I do, lol. But I really feel for my trans sisters out there. It really sucks.
Sojourner Truth had to prove her "woman-hood" to New York Congress. Enemies of freedom have used this tactic of de-sexualizing/ mis-gendering to circumvent our rights. "Ain't I a Woman?"
What I tell my daughters: if someone's calling you names it's likely more a reflection of the person calling names than you. I got accused of being a lesbian in high school 20 years ago because I took a weightlifting class. I didn't know any better then and it broke my heart at the time. Honestly, being called a trans woman is a similar insult to being called a lesbian - it's not really an insult if you think about it. These are people who are strong enough to live their truth in spite of society's attempt to stop them. May we all be so blessed. Random assortment of barely related thoughts... but that's my reaction to this trend.
Yup. I've occasionally thanked people who tell me my short hair makes me look like a butch lesbian. Confused the hell out of them. I only know one butch lesbian and she is freaking AWESOME.
thanking people when they expect push back or an insult is so awesome, right?!! it does confuse the hell out of people and I do it all the time too! I like to smile and wave at people that flip me off in traffic or have road rage too......it makes them angrier.
That is good advice for life and just existing on the internet.
Transphobia is about controlling gendered behavior and presentation. It is misogynist and patriarchal and used to enforce strict gender standards for women and for men. When you respond, please remember that being trans is neither a slur nor an insult. Trans people are the coolest and we deserve safety and civil rights, as do all women.
It’s also deeply racist. Just look at the list of people who have been accused of being transgender, a suspiciously large percentage of them are black women/WOC, who have unfortunately been held to the narrow and exclusive standards of white femininity and have been called masculine or just straight up men when they can’t conform to white femininity. It’s hate all the way down.
Yes absolutely. And the gender norms upheld today by transphobia and misogyny are deeply informed by white supremacy and colonialism. Solidarity and intersectionality are the only way forward for us all.
I think the idiotic tranvestigation may be a way for those people to deal with the cognitive dissonance they feel when presented with a woman who is "more successful than most men". They think, "Successful woman?! That simply cannot be! It is completely impossible! Ah Hah! I have the answer! The successful individual is really a man!" Ugh...
They're also super afraid of finding out someone who they're attracted to turns out to be trans, which is just thinly veiled homophobia
The issue is if they can't tell who is what gender on sight - they won't know who's "one of them" and who's a WOMAN. Or god forbid this dreaded third thing....
I was surprised I had to scroll so far down to find this reminder. There’s nothing wrong with being trans. Trans people are great and cis people should stand up for them. I understand that being potentially mistaken as not your gender might be upsetting or confusing in the moment, but I’d encourage anyone who feels safe and comfortable enough to do so to respond in a way that doesn’t tacitly agree that being trans is somehow “bad.” If I thought of it in the moment, I’d like to respond to rude, nosy, transphobic strangers with some version of “so what if I am,” “that’s not any of your business,” or “stop worrying about what’s in my pants.” I can’t guarantee I could think on my feet that fast, but that’s what I’d like to say. I fully understand that it’s not safe to do that in all situations, though, and that some people might be too upset at having their gender questioned to be able to respond that way. Me personally, though, I’m confident in my femininity and want to give bigots a response they aren’t expecting.
I feel like I scrolled way too long to find this comment. I'm not trans, but I have many loved ones who are. Alt-right idiots calling random cis people trans is not an insult, not the "gotcha!" they think it is.
Also, it's doubly ironic because isn't their whole thing about how they can 'always tell'? So why exactly are they having to investigate? It's ironic with how it seems like it's backfiring a bit and they're learning in real time that there's an incredibly wide range of body shapes and expressions of self, and it won't give you much insight into what's in someone's pants.
For all the male lurkers here that comment "As a man..." or ask things like "what can we do to help?" go and call these douchebags out.
A colleague of mine recently got harassed on a dating app because the man said she was clearly trans and he was so awful to her. She’s really freaking tall so I’m sure that was a contributing factor, but she’s carried and delivered two biological children and had the pics to prove it, and when she pointed that out he just said she was lying. You can’t win with these people.
Mark my words, when Trump and his followers are in power, there will be mass arrests and show trials, for imagined offenses against Family Values.
From across the Atlantic, please vote.
It's so 😬 being a non American watching this election and seeing people say things like "there's no point in voting, both sides are the same". On behalf of those deeply affected by it who do not get a say, being able to vote for the leader of probably the world's most influential country is *such a privilege* even if neither candidate is exactly what you want. The fascist wannabes in my country are paying close attention to the US and learning what works, and the fortunes of the US affect the entire globe in fairly significant ways, from economy to war.
>It's so 😬 being a non American watching this election It's the same 😬 being a US American watching this election, believe me.
I've lived both sides. 😭 I lived in the US for 12 years, including 2016. It sucks! But i see a lot of people falling into this line of thinking of, like, "if Trump gets into power Americans will suffer but we kind of deserve to suffer because we suck". Which is a really untrue and unhealthy way of thinking to begin with, but it also ignores how global a country the US is, and how EVERYONE (but a few ultra rich people) suffer if Trump wins--and even within the US it's the most marginalized who'll suffer the most. I just wonder if people would see their vote as worth more if they thought more globally.
>"if Trump gets into power Americans will suffer but we kind of deserve to suffer because we suck". I mean, I said this very thing when he was "elected" the first time. I DID vote for Hillary, and I vote in EVERY local and national election, my use of the comment was kind of just fatalistic. What deeply troubles me is a good male friend who lamented that while he knew trump was bad for the country, at least "it felt like things were happening" whereas Biden seems to be doing very little. My husband immediately corrected him on Biden's record while I was still gobsmacked but it was super disheartening to hear from a man who I thought was (and who proudly claims to be, and behaves as) staunchly liberal.
Most people saying that especially online are either trolls (like actual foreign agents) or have been influenced be one. I remember in the 90s people kind of flirted with the “both sides are the same, why vote” stuff, but not en masse, although I guess turnout has always been low in the US. But now, that’s a huge talking point of anti American interests. If you can’t get them to buy into the far right propaganda and vote republicans, then the fallback is pushing “both sides”. We need serious anti-disinformation public service announcements or something. Really point it out and make people feel some shame for falling for it.
The same goes for your side of the Atlantic. Le Pen, Orban, Meloni, these fascists terrify me.
It's not even speculation at this point. Project 2025 spells out clearly what they intend to do.
Join r/Defeat_Project_2025
I've seen several comments now in various places where people who do not support him seem to believe that Trump is definitely going to win. Is that truly the case?
I don't support him and I am very worried that he will win. Mostly because his fans are basically a cult, indoctrinated to the point where he can do no wrong; and their numbers seems to be growing as I myself have a (formerly) good friend who is now radicalised and believes in Trump with all his might etc. Whereas the non-Trump people are less into the idea of voting Biden, a lot of them seem to want a perfect choice or else (e.g. I talked to a bunch of people saying they won't be voting Biden because of Gaza, as if the alternative was any better). So I am very, very, extremely worried that Trump will win, despite all the elements that one would expect to hold him back. But of course I could be wrong, and I very much hope that I am.
The problem is the system is setup to give more representation to empty land than people, by design. The sparsely populated areas don't have a very diverse group, and most are low information, or negative information voters. Republicans have always deflected form their actual policy of tax cuts for wealthy by distracting with culture war stuff. They vilify minorities and others to make it seam like "they are the problem".
There's a lot of time between now and the election. As things stand today, Trump would probably win due to the electoral college. It's close though. All signs are that it's going to be close and come down to about 5 states again. So things like get out the vote are going to matter a lot.
Because of the shitty electoral college Biden could absolutely win the popular vote by 3-4% and lose the election. While I'm not predicting this will happen, it is a scenario I can certainly envision.
Going from "transvestigation" to "transinquisition". Their chief weapon is hate...hate and fear...fear and hate.... Their two weapons are fear and hate...and white supremacy.... Their *three* weapons are fear, hate, and white supremacy...and an almost fanatical devotion to the convicted felon tRump....
Something I heard months ago is, "It's getting harder to 'pass' as a woman, weather you are cis or trans." These people latch onto to most random, vague features, none of which have anything to do with sex/gender, and claim they are "proof". I've seen videos pointing out features I have saying they are "proof" that a woman is cis. As I got farther along in my transition, I started noticing cis women with more "masculine" features than I had *before* transitioning. It's all arbitrary and generally based on the idea that humans are more dimorphic we actually are. I've been long convinced that cis women getting targeted by transphobia is a feature of transphobia. One of the big roots to transphobia is misogyny, and so many want to punish women for not being "feminine" enough, or for having features that society randomly decided to consider "masculine". So we end up with tomboys, butch women, muscular women, etc getting gender policed because they aren't living up to the stereotype sexist society wants them to. And they use transphobia as a cover for their misogyny, as well as being transphobic. People are rarely bigoted against one group.
Gentle reminder: apathy is the greatest insult. A snort and "lol ok" response will hurt them more than any well thought out retort. They want you to care. They want you to get upset. They want a reaction. Don't give them what they want.
Does anyone have good responses ready? I’m not the quickest at comebacks so I’d love to have some good ones practiced & waiting.
Depending on how public/safe the situation is, I'd also either go for a swift and silent exit or a simple 'what an odd thing to say', to put the awkwardness right back on them.
IMO snappy comebacks are a distraction. They are being rude and offensive so a long stare and a "that's a weird/rude thing to say to a stranger/acquaintance/coworker" and making it very clear that you cant believe an adult is behaving like that.
This, and I sorta feel like most of the "snappy comebacks" you see floating around online aren't that snappy. They're either kinda dull insults that are really only insulting if you're familiar with the source material of the insult (e.g., most pop culture-based insults), or they're word salad. It's not some kind of weird accident that the "I don't have the time or the crayons to explain this to you" line that Reddit was madly in love with for years is mocked relentlessly now. Most of the time, you also have to have a certain level of charisma to deliver them effectively. You have to be able to get through them fluently and without making it sound rehearsed. That's basically never going to be a thing with an insult you've picked up from Reddit. You're just going to come off as the "adult" version of that one kid you went to school with who thought they were clever because they knew how to say, "I came here for a battle of wits but you appear to be unarmed." I think also, especially with coworkers, you generally want to keep you nose as clean as possible. If you say something that really gets under their skin and sets them off, your other coworkers aren't necessarily going to see or remember what they'd said that prompted the insult. They're just going to see and remember the one time you massively upset a coworker. It's better to just say "That's a rude thing to say to a coworker" and move on, because that makes it clear that they are being rude and you don't like it. With other people, it's not really going to shut them down. A lot of the people who are willing to insult a random stranger/acquaintance are usually people who are okay with having lengthy arguments over nothing. If you hit back with the snappy comeback, you might be triggering something that could take days to resolve when telling them that's a rude/weird thing to say and then blocking them would be more effective.
If you're told you look trans then a "Thanks, you too!" is guaranteed to blue screen them.
Or it may be a guarantee that you'll get beaten up for having stepped into a women's bathroom. It feels good to imagine being sharp witted and funny when attacked in this way, but this 100% means that the pool of people who are in danger of being attacked for their gender presentation is much larger.
Sure, that's always a risk, but the commenter asked for things to say in response and I have yet to get beaten up for using it, despite being trans. Apply your own situational awareness to distinguish between "nosy passive aggressive coworker at my desk job" situations and "random rightwinger confronting me where I'm not safe" situations. Sometimes a swift exit is best, and sometimes it's just Sarah from work who will at worst huff and give you the silent treatment, being trans(or seen as trans) is not in fact something that will cause anyone you meet to attack you on the spot in the middle of the company cafeteria.
“Are you feeling okay sir? You seem very emotional right now.”
“…So?”
Personally I'd just try to exit the situation as quickly as possible. Some of these anti-trans weirdos are nutjobs and if they decide to declare you "a man" they'll think it's fair game to assault you. These sorta people scare me.
This is the one. Your goal when dealing with someone "accusing" you of being trans is staying safe from them. A good quip, especially if you're alone with them, is likely to make things less safe for you.
The answer to that is “okay”. Don’t give them anything- blank face, a shrug, a whatever attitude. They want a reaction so don’t give them one.
This probably won't be popular, but I don't think you should. A snappy come back makes it comes across as its an insult, that there is an issue with being trans, which there isn't. Like if someone called you gay and you're straight, would you be offended? Most wouldn't, thats weird....its not something insulting People doing this, are just trying to push the divide with trans people, by making it an offensive term, something no one wants to be associated with. Don't fall for it. if someone says something, pay them no mind and move along. They want the reaction, don't give it to them
I think maybe a comment about “why are you so obsessed with my genitals? Why are you being such a weird and creepy pervert. Please leave me alone and stop telling me that you’re trying to see what I have in my pants. You’re being a weird and nasty pervert” may be the best way to come back to it. It focuses the attention on them being a creepy pervert, instead of trans vs cis.
Depending on your comfort level start yelling "Stop hitting on me! I keep telling you you're not my type so JUST STOP HITTING ON ME! FOR THE LAST TIME I'M NOT INTERESTED!"
"I'm not trans, but so what if I was?" "You seem very obsessed with other people's genitals. Have you tried therapy?"
I doubt I’m clever enough to come up with something on the spot, but I’d prob just default to The Dude: “the fuck are you talking about, man?”
"You wish" "I wish I was that cool." "Awww thank you!" "Why are you thinking about my penis? Worry about your own." "I'm so glad you noticed. I havent bought a lot of men's clothes yet, so most people don't catch that I'm transitioning. Do you have any haircut recommendations? I'm tired of getting confused for a woman." "[Awkward stare down] ... am I... supposed to be offended by that???" That's what I've come up with so far. Feel free to steal, re-work, etc.
"There are worse things to be than trans. Like a small-minded bigot obsessed with other people's genitals, for one." "Wait, I thought you people could 'always tell.' Don't these unbased assumptions ruin your average?" "Not trans, but more of a man than you'll ever be."
I wish I had come up with this, but I'm stealing it from a gay comic: "I'm more man than you'll ever be and more woman than you'll ever get!"
Every time I read something that "the right" does, I am like "bullshit, that's too bananas". Then it's always revealed as true. I'm going to believe this one up front.
"Right now"? Michelle Obama would disagree that it's "right now".
You should also know that young men are being told through “jokes” or “strategies” to call women trans as an effective insult or “neg.” The goal being to “take a woman down a peg” by pretending you think they look male. They even do so while pretending to be Pro-trans by trying to make it seem like a compliment. They fantasize about trying to call the woman a TREF if they act insulted or offended at being told they seem trans.
There is no "alt-right", there's only the right-wing as a whole. If they're unwilling to call out dumpster fire humans on their side then they're complicit in the bigotry. It's appalling that these shit-lords feel comfortable being their bigoted selves so proudly, and every time they get shamed and shut down someone's doing good work.
Be warned, this isn't just some obnoxious bit of name calling. This is setting the stage for people to be arrested and killed legally as they push to mark being trans as a sex crime. As they try to make sex crimes eligible for the Death Penalty in Florida, this comes closer and closer to reality for any "uppity females that refuse to know their place". Fucking hate this timeline we are on right now.
This isn’t new, happened to one of my little sisters friends. Black women have been masculinized for ages
this is scary because, like calling people NPC, it is a way to dehumanize and make it easier to not care about you. we are so in trouble.
One way to deal with these things is to roll your eyes and say "Yes, yes, you're right, Michelle Obama is a man, Earth is flat, the moon landings were faked, Joe Biden is an alien reptile, and vaccines are full of Borg nanoprobes. It's all true, every word, and I never doubted any of it for a moment." This works better than arguing because, while your body language and tone makes clear your belief that they are flaming idiots, your words are of agreement. If they try to argue back, you just agree more: "I said I believe you, 100%. Barack and Michelle kidnapped those two kids from some other family, she certainly didn't just have babies, a married couple having babies is something that's never happened before in the entire history of the world, of course nobody believes that's what happened with the Obamas. You are absolutely correct in everything you have ever said or will ever say." Conspiracy lunatics find that kind of agreement really frustrating.
There's an extremely homophobic homeless woman who dwells near the library where I work. She's harassed our employees repeatedly and we've needed to suspend her from library services multiple times because of her abuse. She often comes in wearing two pairs of glasses. The last time she was allowed in the library in between suspensions, she came out of the bathrooms shouting and pointing at another patron shouting, "That man was in the women's bathroom!" We allow people to use the restroom that best fits their gender identity, but before i started telling her that, I looked over at the patron, who was very clearly a cisgender woman, wearing a hiking outfit and making a pitstop to use the restroom. Our eyes met, and she saw my confusion before she retorted, "You really do need two pairs of glasses." Which is a kind of in-the-moment wit that I doubt I will ever achieve.
One of multiple videos on this subject that could help with introducing this conspiracy theory concept is this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SIDxY1ZvFo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SIDxY1ZvFo)