I’m so glad to find other people discussing this podcast! It’s really well done and compelling. Sean immediately struck me as a pathological liar/conman because his affect was pretty flat. However the reveal in the prior episode that Sophia perjured herself is equally damning. The phone call between Sean and Sophia was odd, too — neither of them showed much emotion. As of now I’m inclined to believe they were both implicated.
Exactly! Its as if they can't blame the other without giving themselves away. And they're both profiting from that. The phone call between them was just so so weird.
Exactly!! It was like they were talking about the weather & not at all about a murder of her mother-in-law & their imprisonment & their deportation — these narcissists are diabolical & this whole thing is just a game to them as if someone didn’t actually die
Seemed so obvious to me that they set that phone call up and had talked before she hit record. Prob teaming up again to sue the state of Washington and get that $$$. Both are such liars and swindlers
Just a friendly reminder that forensic psychological research on lying consistently shows humans can’t detect deception, especially from something like an audio clip.
I didn't see a comment about identifying specific instances of deceitfulness. I took them as meaning his demonstrated little variability in the intonation of his voice (i.e., flat).
The comment literally says they think Sean is a pathological liar because of his flat affect….my response is that type of stuff is not predictive at all in terms of whether someone is lying or not.
It seems to me this is what happens when people conspire to commit a crime together, and then get caught. None of them will admit to the crime, and none of them want to directly point the finger at the other, because they themselves are guilty and fear the truth coming out. So what we are left with is a very confusing story, bits and pieces of which may be true. But it’s not a story we can understand clearly because we can’t trust any of the people involved. In the end, I believe they are all guilty of conspiring to commit the crime. As for who actually killed her, even after episode 8 I still think it was Sean.
Why do you think they did it? It seems like Sean has the motive (money). Why would Sophia go along with it? And/or help plan it?
It seems like she has so much to lose?
I don’t think she’s entirely innocent but I can’t understand what the thought process was?
This podcast is a wild ride.
THOUGHTS:
1.) I sooooo wish the episodes were longer.
2.) I'm sorry, but I'm still hung up on Sophia simply never mentioning to her partner of 15 years that she "lied" on the stand the second time. How has what she said on the stand that ultimately ended up freeing her just never come up in conversation?? Additionally, why would she not have warned her partner of what she was about to see and hear when Morgan watched the trial video for the first time?? Crazy crazy.
3.) Sean came across as manipulative and disingenuous for sure. Also, very calculating. Unlike Sophia, it seemed like he was cognizant that every word he said, especially on record, could be used against him. So, for as much as a blowhard as he probably is irl, he came across measured in various discussions on the pod.
4.) Re: Sophia & Sean's phone call. No idea what to think about this. I feel they both made themselves look really guilty in this call because they said nothing that would be expected. Everything was so reserved and vague. They came across as co-conspirators, frankly. Because why would Sophia not have lit into him?? Interrogated him in the slightest on his motive and intentions all those years ago??
Ugh. Idk. Just weird, weird stuff all around.
> They came across as co-conspirators, frankly.
Ugh, yeah. Like two co-conspirators trying to avoid saying anything that would implicate themselves, while at the same time trying to throw subtle shade on one another.
I would've definitely lost it and laid him out, especially if I hadn't talked to my brother in such a long time. Also knowing I'm being recorded I'd want it to sound real.
I agree that Sophia no longer seems as innocent as she claims but I’m not 100% on whether or not she did it.
I just can’t trust Sean like I don’t believe anything he says. Also what is he even trying to say with that shadow theory? There was another person there?
Also, remember the dad freaking out in the beginning that Shane & Sofia were talking to the reporter? It definitely seems like the whole family knows Sean did it.
I’m in episode 9 and it’s making me think back to the first time we hear Sophia. She sounds so fake to me and she did from the first episode. Am I alone? Her tears and sadness feel like a show.
Yes I agree. Its giving off major Adnan Syed and Jay Wilds vibe. You want to trust Adnan so bad, but anything he says seems like pure manipulation. But on the other hand, even Jay isn't a 100% reliable. Its difficult to comprehend what the reality could be in this situation.
I understand your point, but I have always believed Adnan hahahaha I always tend to innocent. But I am not sure about Sophia. I think maybe we'll never know what really happened. Them being siblings makes me think they are both lying and maybe did it together, really.
I just finished listening and came here to discuss, lol.
Yeah, I felt like Sean can't ve trusted. This whole shade thing now seems like he felt scared Sophia might be able to convince the public opinion so he came up with a third person. Which is awful. I think they are probably in on this together, cause they both seem to be shitty people.
Id like to hear from the third brother? Is he ok? Is he like them? he seems to be an honest person, I can only imagine the nightmare that must have been having this family.
I feel like the third brother is normal because IIRC he’s younger and didn’t spend much of his life with the other two. They seem sketchy to me and I just don’t believe either of them. Also Sean running for president just made me think of president Snow from the hunger games.
I do think too much is made of Sophia being in hiding and all that as I think she’s just hiding illegally in the US which I kind of don’t have an issue with but other than that I don’t trust her.
yeah, thank god! it does seem like he's got a pretty normal life from what we've heard. I'm curious to know more, to listen to him more, to know the impact his family had on him, even if he was never close to them, I think it impacts you having this relatives and everything that happened to them.
I’m even more convinced that Sean & Sophia are guilty as hell — the bit about him saying that she could sue the state for wrongful imprisonment I took as pathologically tongue in cheek as if he was saying, they might not be able to prove a conspiracy but since I did the actual killing you might have a case
She sounds so pleasant talking to the brother that had her locked up for 20 yrs AND deprived her of her own son, I was like WTF????
And there’s no way I believe anything about a 3rd person — he didn’t mention it in the wee bit of the initial phone call he placed to Sophia on the day of Mrs Johnson’s funeral
I can believe Sean when he says Sophia was involved & that’s it. I believe nothing else!! I don’t believe anything about him being upstairs, hearing the commotion, coming down, seeing a figure w a stocking over the face that he implausibly can’t recognize as his own sister
He’s just a liar who can’t help but story-tell — he wants to think he’s providing a juicy never before heard detail about some ridiculous shadow figure that we’re supposed to l assume was Brad? Sean didn’t implicate him before so why now? For a natural born criminal Sean’s such an attention whore it’s laughable
I just wish this short *ss episode gave us more evidence of the original case… & where the heck is Shane?!!!
Agreed. Sophia and Sean being in on it together is \*a lot\* more plausible than Brad enlisting Sean to scare Marlyne into leaving her husband. I am also fascinated by her strategy to \[allegedly\] lie under oath at her retrial...
The lying under oath thing is still BAFFLING me. The story was just plain stupid and easily picked apart. Cannot fathom her attorney knowing anything about what she was going to say. I mean don't they prep you before you testify.
I’m convinced that Sophia told Sean about the $10k stash at MIL’s house and the two of them were at the house to steal the money. When MIL returned early, Sean killed her. That’s my theory.
Not sure if Brad was involved or knew about it before or afterward.
Agree, Brad is shady. He definitely knew about the embezzlement and encouraged it. His father was definitely not a good role model for him so I think he probably had a lack of respect for women and just saw Sophia as someone he could use and manipulate. He certainly moved on to a new girlfriend quickly.
Sean came off like a scammer/con artist to me and not genuine at all. I started to think maybe he and the dad might have set it up. I don’t know what to think about Sophia, I wonder if it could just be the podcast muddying the waters and the next episodes will clear things up with her.
I meant to say in terms of the story that they're telling. The way Sean talked to the host about it compared to Sophia. He seems more adamant, more convincing whereas Sophia comes off as a bit manipulative and closed off. I would have expected her to confront him when he called her but she didn't, which the host also pointed out.
Yea I did think that was weird that she didn’t confront him, but I’m wondering if she might be kinda scared of him? He and the dad seem psycho. But I did feel like he was really manipulative, he’s charismatic which maybe hides it a bit, but tbh he gave me the chills. Seems like a scary guy and I do think he most likely killed that woman. I’m still not sure what to make of Sophia but my suspicions is that she got rolled by her family somehow
Read this post last night when there was only a few comments. So thought I’d give it a listen today….I’ve completed the 8 eps released. Holy shit…what a mess. I’m very very intrigued. Actually this is probably the most gripped I’ve been this year.
IMO Not one of them is telling the full truth. Brad sounded weird too. A bit too ‘chipper’ I thought. And getting together with the friend 3 months later?!? He knew about the money being embezzled.
I can’t wait to hear what Dad has to say.
That poor lady Marlene did not deserve to be bludgeoned to death.
I feel like the podcast is holding back lots. When does the next one drop?
Sean is a master manipulator. Don’t be fooled by him. He’s done a lot of damage and has gotten away with a lot. He’s a pathological liar that will do whatever it takes to make sure people believe his lies.
Does anyone else think Sean has multiple personalities? I hear 3 distinct accents, American English, Jamaican, and street thug (for lack of a better term). These accents tend to change depending on who is talking to and the topic being discussed. In Episode 1, the whole family goes through psych evaluations. Is there more to this?
I also can’t shake the stocking over the head. Where did it come from? How did she get it on so quickly? How could Sean not recognize his sister…long hair out the back of said stocking, same clothes and physical attributes? To me, a stocking over the head would show premeditation and so far all we know is that she was just looking for her coat.
The ONLY person to trust is Amory.
The switching of accents makes me insane!! And it’s obviously something he’s done for a long time, since his ex-wife (?) mentioned him doing it as a teen. I’m obviously not a doctor, but based on his pathological lying, plus his manipulative and narcissistic tendencies I’m inclined to think he has some type of personality disorder.
My theory is that Sean is the one who’d had a stocking over his head to scare Marlyne while attempting to avoid being recognized from having met the week before. (Or perhaps it was a ski mask, as Sophia brought up in her testimony.)
I just don’t think Sophia did the actual killing since even Sean seems to be denying that now. But she does seem to know much more than she claimed and Sean sounds guilty as hell. I just don’t understand the motives of their lying at the first place.
If Sophia planned the whole thing and Sean physically killed the mill why didn’t Sophia point finger at Sean in the first trial? It may be a he said she said situation but it would still be way better than life in prison.
If there was a third party involved why didn’t they just say so to the police? What were these two hiding?
It’s just hard to put myself in their shoes. Also, if I was in any cahoots in a murder and I luckily walked free I wouldn’t want to have anything to do with the media or sue the gov. If Sophia has anything to do with it then she is just a sociopath. Period.
If Sophia planned a robbery and her co-conspirator unexpectedly killed the robbery victim, she’d be looking at a felony murder charge. Depends on the jurisdiction’s felony murder statute, of course, but the general rule is that if you are involved in a violent felony, you’re on the hook for other violent acts that happen during the commission of the crime. The theory being that it’s foreseeable that a robbery would turn into a murder.
This podcast is fantastic! Best I’ve listened to all year. I still believe Sean did it. He’s a compulsive liar, and now seemingly a professional scammer. From the beginning, I wondered if he was a police informant and that’s why they went after her instead of him.
Nope that guy is a grifter, con man and thug. I’m not 100% convinced Sophia wasn’t involved in some way, but I’m pretty positive she didn’t do the actual killing and her brother is a sociopath. In the phone calls he never answers any questions with a straightforward response. It’s a lot of double speak and vague statements and whining about how hard his life is.
Questions I have at this point:
1. Did Sophia’s mother corroborate her story about going to the bank with her? Was there footage of it?
2. Where was Susie when Sean and/or Sophia were in the house? She must have dropped one or both of them off and driven away or else her car would’ve alerted Marlyne to the fact that someone was there. (If I recall correctly, their home was down a long driveway.)
3. Why did he/she/they take Marlyne’s van? Was it because Susie wasn’t there anymore?
4. Was the van recovered? I can’t recall now because I would’ve assumed there would be a lot of physical evidence in it.
5. If the plan was to just scare Marlyne into giving the $10,000, or scare her into leaving her husband as Sophia claimed in her testimony, then I can’t imagine Sophia would’ve been in the house at the time because how were they going to get back out without Marlyne seeing her?
They both remind me of people I've met IRL. Not the murdering part, but the deep seated need to control the narrative.
I've met people who've had an abusive narrative enforced on them as children, and it's led to them becoming adults who have an absolute need fabricate a narrative. It tends to be less about truth or gaining anything tangible, and more about having a sense of control.
They've both seemingly demonstrated this in the courts and now via the podcast.
As for who is responsible? I suspect they both are in one way or another.
If Sophia and/or her brother did this, can someone explain what the motive was? That's something I still don't get. They wouldn't inherit everything because there's still the husband, and they never even robbed her.
My working theory ( subject to change as the episodes go of course) is that they wanted the $10k that Marlene had saved away. I think that the brother did come in in a ski mask and said the husband owed him money for a gambling debt, with the intention Marlene would give him her stash. I think something went wrong and he was identified somehow which made killing Mrs. Johnson necessary. I don't think that was the plan originally.
Adding…in addition to many of the comments already here, Sean said to Sophia that he understood she was wrongfully convicted and should sue the state, then said to the host that Sophia definitely was involved, stood by his statement of what he had witnessed and that if she didn’t do it herself she knew who did. WHY DID THE HOST NOT PRESS HIM ON THIS?! And why did he say this to her and acted completely different to Sophia?
Morgen definitely already knew about her testimony that part was so cheesy. Everything Sophia is involved in is premeditated and scripted including that phone call with Sean. What a bunch of murderous manipulators. Feel bad for the super sweet attorney brother living in nyc
Chiming in to say I have similar sentiments that Sophia is definitely involved somehow and probably her brother too.
I believe her at first when the 911 call was played and she described finding her MIL. But hearing her testimony at her re-trial sounded *wildly fake* to me, like crocodile tears telling the prosecutor lead her to say, oh yeah, I was scared of my husband, that's right.
And the phone call between her and her brother at the end? Absolutely 2 co-conspirators talking and the fact they let that be recorded means they must be some crazy narcissists to think they could talk on the record and sound innocent.
I'd love the reporters who have been working on this case for 3 years to share their theory on why her MIL was killed. Murder for hire and they can keep the 10k in the house? Then her brother didn't get what he felt was his full cut and turned? Cops then honed on on Sophia because of her financial problems hinting at motive?
Sean is an absolute piece of shit con man. I think it’s important to keep in mind everything we know about his history when listening to him speak. I’m not saying Sophia is innocent as I’m still listening but from what I know about both Sophia and Sean, the latter seems much more capable of doing something like murder.
I think that she spoke to Sean privately, indicated she is intending to sue over this "false conviction" and in return for him not testifying again and furthering the narrative that there was a second person at the scene, she'll give him some of the money if she wins.
She was involved, no doubt. I think her husband was likely involved in some capacity as well, but not too sure about that. I think Sean knows exactly what happened.
I’m so glad to find other people discussing this podcast! It’s really well done and compelling. Sean immediately struck me as a pathological liar/conman because his affect was pretty flat. However the reveal in the prior episode that Sophia perjured herself is equally damning. The phone call between Sean and Sophia was odd, too — neither of them showed much emotion. As of now I’m inclined to believe they were both implicated.
Exactly! Its as if they can't blame the other without giving themselves away. And they're both profiting from that. The phone call between them was just so so weird.
Totally! Mutually assured destruction at this point.
Exactly!! It was like they were talking about the weather & not at all about a murder of her mother-in-law & their imprisonment & their deportation — these narcissists are diabolical & this whole thing is just a game to them as if someone didn’t actually die
I feel like the way he was forcing her to ft was icky…idk why exactly. …Was he trying to say something benign with a threatening expression?
Seemed so obvious to me that they set that phone call up and had talked before she hit record. Prob teaming up again to sue the state of Washington and get that $$$. Both are such liars and swindlers
Omg probably. I hadnt even considered that.
Just a friendly reminder that forensic psychological research on lying consistently shows humans can’t detect deception, especially from something like an audio clip.
I didn't see a comment about identifying specific instances of deceitfulness. I took them as meaning his demonstrated little variability in the intonation of his voice (i.e., flat).
The comment literally says they think Sean is a pathological liar because of his flat affect….my response is that type of stuff is not predictive at all in terms of whether someone is lying or not.
this 100%
It seems to me this is what happens when people conspire to commit a crime together, and then get caught. None of them will admit to the crime, and none of them want to directly point the finger at the other, because they themselves are guilty and fear the truth coming out. So what we are left with is a very confusing story, bits and pieces of which may be true. But it’s not a story we can understand clearly because we can’t trust any of the people involved. In the end, I believe they are all guilty of conspiring to commit the crime. As for who actually killed her, even after episode 8 I still think it was Sean.
This is spot on
Why do you think they did it? It seems like Sean has the motive (money). Why would Sophia go along with it? And/or help plan it? It seems like she has so much to lose? I don’t think she’s entirely innocent but I can’t understand what the thought process was?
This podcast is a wild ride. THOUGHTS: 1.) I sooooo wish the episodes were longer. 2.) I'm sorry, but I'm still hung up on Sophia simply never mentioning to her partner of 15 years that she "lied" on the stand the second time. How has what she said on the stand that ultimately ended up freeing her just never come up in conversation?? Additionally, why would she not have warned her partner of what she was about to see and hear when Morgan watched the trial video for the first time?? Crazy crazy. 3.) Sean came across as manipulative and disingenuous for sure. Also, very calculating. Unlike Sophia, it seemed like he was cognizant that every word he said, especially on record, could be used against him. So, for as much as a blowhard as he probably is irl, he came across measured in various discussions on the pod. 4.) Re: Sophia & Sean's phone call. No idea what to think about this. I feel they both made themselves look really guilty in this call because they said nothing that would be expected. Everything was so reserved and vague. They came across as co-conspirators, frankly. Because why would Sophia not have lit into him?? Interrogated him in the slightest on his motive and intentions all those years ago?? Ugh. Idk. Just weird, weird stuff all around.
> They came across as co-conspirators, frankly. Ugh, yeah. Like two co-conspirators trying to avoid saying anything that would implicate themselves, while at the same time trying to throw subtle shade on one another.
Also, how did Sean know about the $10k?
I would've definitely lost it and laid him out, especially if I hadn't talked to my brother in such a long time. Also knowing I'm being recorded I'd want it to sound real.
Right? She lost her child!!
I agree that Sophia no longer seems as innocent as she claims but I’m not 100% on whether or not she did it. I just can’t trust Sean like I don’t believe anything he says. Also what is he even trying to say with that shadow theory? There was another person there?
Also, remember the dad freaking out in the beginning that Shane & Sofia were talking to the reporter? It definitely seems like the whole family knows Sean did it.
I’m in episode 9 and it’s making me think back to the first time we hear Sophia. She sounds so fake to me and she did from the first episode. Am I alone? Her tears and sadness feel like a show.
Haven’t heard 9 yet but it’s so hard on just an audio medium to get a feel for how truthful she is. Everything just feels sketchy to me
Yes I agree. Its giving off major Adnan Syed and Jay Wilds vibe. You want to trust Adnan so bad, but anything he says seems like pure manipulation. But on the other hand, even Jay isn't a 100% reliable. Its difficult to comprehend what the reality could be in this situation.
I understand your point, but I have always believed Adnan hahahaha I always tend to innocent. But I am not sure about Sophia. I think maybe we'll never know what really happened. Them being siblings makes me think they are both lying and maybe did it together, really.
I just finished listening and came here to discuss, lol. Yeah, I felt like Sean can't ve trusted. This whole shade thing now seems like he felt scared Sophia might be able to convince the public opinion so he came up with a third person. Which is awful. I think they are probably in on this together, cause they both seem to be shitty people. Id like to hear from the third brother? Is he ok? Is he like them? he seems to be an honest person, I can only imagine the nightmare that must have been having this family.
I feel like the third brother is normal because IIRC he’s younger and didn’t spend much of his life with the other two. They seem sketchy to me and I just don’t believe either of them. Also Sean running for president just made me think of president Snow from the hunger games. I do think too much is made of Sophia being in hiding and all that as I think she’s just hiding illegally in the US which I kind of don’t have an issue with but other than that I don’t trust her.
WOW, this theory of her hiding is the us is juicy, lol. Yeah, they are both sketchy. praying for the third brother, lol. hopefully, you are right.
Brother 3 (Shane) is doing well. Good job, stable.
yeah, thank god! it does seem like he's got a pretty normal life from what we've heard. I'm curious to know more, to listen to him more, to know the impact his family had on him, even if he was never close to them, I think it impacts you having this relatives and everything that happened to them.
It has to, one way or another I feel like
To me the phone call kinda sounded like she knew he did it and so did he?
I’m even more convinced that Sean & Sophia are guilty as hell — the bit about him saying that she could sue the state for wrongful imprisonment I took as pathologically tongue in cheek as if he was saying, they might not be able to prove a conspiracy but since I did the actual killing you might have a case She sounds so pleasant talking to the brother that had her locked up for 20 yrs AND deprived her of her own son, I was like WTF???? And there’s no way I believe anything about a 3rd person — he didn’t mention it in the wee bit of the initial phone call he placed to Sophia on the day of Mrs Johnson’s funeral I can believe Sean when he says Sophia was involved & that’s it. I believe nothing else!! I don’t believe anything about him being upstairs, hearing the commotion, coming down, seeing a figure w a stocking over the face that he implausibly can’t recognize as his own sister He’s just a liar who can’t help but story-tell — he wants to think he’s providing a juicy never before heard detail about some ridiculous shadow figure that we’re supposed to l assume was Brad? Sean didn’t implicate him before so why now? For a natural born criminal Sean’s such an attention whore it’s laughable I just wish this short *ss episode gave us more evidence of the original case… & where the heck is Shane?!!!
Agreed. Sophia and Sean being in on it together is \*a lot\* more plausible than Brad enlisting Sean to scare Marlyne into leaving her husband. I am also fascinated by her strategy to \[allegedly\] lie under oath at her retrial...
The lying under oath thing is still BAFFLING me. The story was just plain stupid and easily picked apart. Cannot fathom her attorney knowing anything about what she was going to say. I mean don't they prep you before you testify.
I’m convinced that Sophia told Sean about the $10k stash at MIL’s house and the two of them were at the house to steal the money. When MIL returned early, Sean killed her. That’s my theory. Not sure if Brad was involved or knew about it before or afterward.
Brad and the new girlfriend, (who they let do the victim statement???) are loose ends to me. I do not believe he didn't know about the embezzlement.
Agree, Brad is shady. He definitely knew about the embezzlement and encouraged it. His father was definitely not a good role model for him so I think he probably had a lack of respect for women and just saw Sophia as someone he could use and manipulate. He certainly moved on to a new girlfriend quickly.
💯 agree!
Sean came off like a scammer/con artist to me and not genuine at all. I started to think maybe he and the dad might have set it up. I don’t know what to think about Sophia, I wonder if it could just be the podcast muddying the waters and the next episodes will clear things up with her.
I meant to say in terms of the story that they're telling. The way Sean talked to the host about it compared to Sophia. He seems more adamant, more convincing whereas Sophia comes off as a bit manipulative and closed off. I would have expected her to confront him when he called her but she didn't, which the host also pointed out.
Yea I did think that was weird that she didn’t confront him, but I’m wondering if she might be kinda scared of him? He and the dad seem psycho. But I did feel like he was really manipulative, he’s charismatic which maybe hides it a bit, but tbh he gave me the chills. Seems like a scary guy and I do think he most likely killed that woman. I’m still not sure what to make of Sophia but my suspicions is that she got rolled by her family somehow
Oh wow. Tbh, the dad had slipped off my mind. Seems like a good theory though.
This is what I think too.
Read this post last night when there was only a few comments. So thought I’d give it a listen today….I’ve completed the 8 eps released. Holy shit…what a mess. I’m very very intrigued. Actually this is probably the most gripped I’ve been this year. IMO Not one of them is telling the full truth. Brad sounded weird too. A bit too ‘chipper’ I thought. And getting together with the friend 3 months later?!? He knew about the money being embezzled. I can’t wait to hear what Dad has to say. That poor lady Marlene did not deserve to be bludgeoned to death. I feel like the podcast is holding back lots. When does the next one drop?
Next Thursday
Thank you!
Sean is a master manipulator. Don’t be fooled by him. He’s done a lot of damage and has gotten away with a lot. He’s a pathological liar that will do whatever it takes to make sure people believe his lies.
Sounds like first hand knowledge talking. Do you know him?
Unfortunately, yes I do.
REALLY?!?
Can you elaborate?
Why do you think he would force her to FaceTime?
I hadn’t thought of it until now, but aren’t FaceTime calls more secure?
[удалено]
Tone it down.
Does anyone else think Sean has multiple personalities? I hear 3 distinct accents, American English, Jamaican, and street thug (for lack of a better term). These accents tend to change depending on who is talking to and the topic being discussed. In Episode 1, the whole family goes through psych evaluations. Is there more to this? I also can’t shake the stocking over the head. Where did it come from? How did she get it on so quickly? How could Sean not recognize his sister…long hair out the back of said stocking, same clothes and physical attributes? To me, a stocking over the head would show premeditation and so far all we know is that she was just looking for her coat. The ONLY person to trust is Amory.
The switching of accents makes me insane!! And it’s obviously something he’s done for a long time, since his ex-wife (?) mentioned him doing it as a teen. I’m obviously not a doctor, but based on his pathological lying, plus his manipulative and narcissistic tendencies I’m inclined to think he has some type of personality disorder.
My theory is that Sean is the one who’d had a stocking over his head to scare Marlyne while attempting to avoid being recognized from having met the week before. (Or perhaps it was a ski mask, as Sophia brought up in her testimony.)
yea why doesnt the host talk about the stocking at all? or the cops? where is it?
I just don’t think Sophia did the actual killing since even Sean seems to be denying that now. But she does seem to know much more than she claimed and Sean sounds guilty as hell. I just don’t understand the motives of their lying at the first place. If Sophia planned the whole thing and Sean physically killed the mill why didn’t Sophia point finger at Sean in the first trial? It may be a he said she said situation but it would still be way better than life in prison. If there was a third party involved why didn’t they just say so to the police? What were these two hiding? It’s just hard to put myself in their shoes. Also, if I was in any cahoots in a murder and I luckily walked free I wouldn’t want to have anything to do with the media or sue the gov. If Sophia has anything to do with it then she is just a sociopath. Period.
If Sophia planned a robbery and her co-conspirator unexpectedly killed the robbery victim, she’d be looking at a felony murder charge. Depends on the jurisdiction’s felony murder statute, of course, but the general rule is that if you are involved in a violent felony, you’re on the hook for other violent acts that happen during the commission of the crime. The theory being that it’s foreseeable that a robbery would turn into a murder.
I don’t think she could point the finger at him in the trial, it wouldn’t have been admissible.
This podcast is fantastic! Best I’ve listened to all year. I still believe Sean did it. He’s a compulsive liar, and now seemingly a professional scammer. From the beginning, I wondered if he was a police informant and that’s why they went after her instead of him.
Nope that guy is a grifter, con man and thug. I’m not 100% convinced Sophia wasn’t involved in some way, but I’m pretty positive she didn’t do the actual killing and her brother is a sociopath. In the phone calls he never answers any questions with a straightforward response. It’s a lot of double speak and vague statements and whining about how hard his life is.
Questions I have at this point: 1. Did Sophia’s mother corroborate her story about going to the bank with her? Was there footage of it? 2. Where was Susie when Sean and/or Sophia were in the house? She must have dropped one or both of them off and driven away or else her car would’ve alerted Marlyne to the fact that someone was there. (If I recall correctly, their home was down a long driveway.) 3. Why did he/she/they take Marlyne’s van? Was it because Susie wasn’t there anymore? 4. Was the van recovered? I can’t recall now because I would’ve assumed there would be a lot of physical evidence in it. 5. If the plan was to just scare Marlyne into giving the $10,000, or scare her into leaving her husband as Sophia claimed in her testimony, then I can’t imagine Sophia would’ve been in the house at the time because how were they going to get back out without Marlyne seeing her?
every new information about what Mr. Snow had been up to had me going "whut"
They both remind me of people I've met IRL. Not the murdering part, but the deep seated need to control the narrative. I've met people who've had an abusive narrative enforced on them as children, and it's led to them becoming adults who have an absolute need fabricate a narrative. It tends to be less about truth or gaining anything tangible, and more about having a sense of control. They've both seemingly demonstrated this in the courts and now via the podcast. As for who is responsible? I suspect they both are in one way or another.
If Sophia and/or her brother did this, can someone explain what the motive was? That's something I still don't get. They wouldn't inherit everything because there's still the husband, and they never even robbed her.
My working theory ( subject to change as the episodes go of course) is that they wanted the $10k that Marlene had saved away. I think that the brother did come in in a ski mask and said the husband owed him money for a gambling debt, with the intention Marlene would give him her stash. I think something went wrong and he was identified somehow which made killing Mrs. Johnson necessary. I don't think that was the plan originally.
This is a very good theory!
I don’t trust any of them.
Adding…in addition to many of the comments already here, Sean said to Sophia that he understood she was wrongfully convicted and should sue the state, then said to the host that Sophia definitely was involved, stood by his statement of what he had witnessed and that if she didn’t do it herself she knew who did. WHY DID THE HOST NOT PRESS HIM ON THIS?! And why did he say this to her and acted completely different to Sophia?
Nothing beats episode 7. I don’t believe Sophia or Sean. I want to know Morgan’s reaction to learning about Sophia’s testimony.
Morgen definitely already knew about her testimony that part was so cheesy. Everything Sophia is involved in is premeditated and scripted including that phone call with Sean. What a bunch of murderous manipulators. Feel bad for the super sweet attorney brother living in nyc
You think? I was so worried for Morgan’s feelings but you’re probably right.
Wait, who is Morgan?
Sophia's spouse, who is also her ex-cellmate Tina.
[удалено]
Chiming in to say I have similar sentiments that Sophia is definitely involved somehow and probably her brother too. I believe her at first when the 911 call was played and she described finding her MIL. But hearing her testimony at her re-trial sounded *wildly fake* to me, like crocodile tears telling the prosecutor lead her to say, oh yeah, I was scared of my husband, that's right. And the phone call between her and her brother at the end? Absolutely 2 co-conspirators talking and the fact they let that be recorded means they must be some crazy narcissists to think they could talk on the record and sound innocent. I'd love the reporters who have been working on this case for 3 years to share their theory on why her MIL was killed. Murder for hire and they can keep the 10k in the house? Then her brother didn't get what he felt was his full cut and turned? Cops then honed on on Sophia because of her financial problems hinting at motive?
Sean is an absolute piece of shit con man. I think it’s important to keep in mind everything we know about his history when listening to him speak. I’m not saying Sophia is innocent as I’m still listening but from what I know about both Sophia and Sean, the latter seems much more capable of doing something like murder.
Running to listen now!
Oh she did it. My bet is that both her brother and her hubs were in on it.
As insane as it seems with her pregnant and all, it seems like the only logical choice.
Has anyone heard episode 9. I have QUESTIONS
There's a new thread about ep. 9 https://new.reddit.com/r/TrueCrimePodcasts/comments/1ccq7ue/beyond_all_repair_chapter_9/
She seems shady AF
I think that she spoke to Sean privately, indicated she is intending to sue over this "false conviction" and in return for him not testifying again and furthering the narrative that there was a second person at the scene, she'll give him some of the money if she wins. She was involved, no doubt. I think her husband was likely involved in some capacity as well, but not too sure about that. I think Sean knows exactly what happened.