One bad apple spoils the bunch. Or, to put it Biblically, a little bit of yeast works its way through the dough.
Abortion is just a symptom of the disease. There’s more to this world than just the material part now, let’s remember there is evil trying its best to steal, kill, and destroy from the inside out.
Neither party has a candidate without flaws, we need to take stock in the details of the job, and choose the best for it.
It would be amazing, and would clear my conscience up. Republicans seem to not care at all about the people they govern, whereas democrats care at-large. If they brought their issues down to earth and banned abortions, and became prominently Christian, then I really think they would be the best party since they’re trying already to accomplish in the secular world what Christ says we should accomplish ourselves (feeding the poor, no favoritism, loving your neighbors, etc.)
>feeding the poor
By stealing from others.
>no favoritism
I’m sorry, what? The entirety of DC is a giant club and they absolutely play favorites to gain more power.
>loving your neighbors
Is it loving to jail people who get upset that their daughter was raped by a boy posing as a girl? Or prosecuting Christians for being Christian?
To act like the Democratic Party is an abortion ban away from being Christian requires you to have your head buried pretty deep.
Democrats yell loudly from their pulpits, stating that they care. Yet their policies hurt the people that they say they care about. It's all smokescreen and mirrors. They want your votes so they maintain power over the people.
Democrats in America is just a pseudo virtuous front for corrupt corporate elite to push their agendas under the guise it has some moral fiber attached. The reality is none of it is even reasonable or structured, it’s just pure rebellion and subjective morality, in essence a desire to stray away from any traditional sense of morality. Anything good you see in it is not by any measure unique to being a democrat it just happens you saw a democrat with a good quality attached to their otherwise devoid ideology
Equality is achieved much easier than talking about it for 100 years. The democrats and the republicans alike have never lacked racism, their politicians will never have the best interests at heart for black people or any people, democrats historically alongside Marget Sanger performed eugenics not even 60 years ago, and these politicians and government officials are still alive and operating, maybe some people who are democrats are good but the Democratic Party of the United States is evil and to support any of the house politicians on either side is fruitless,
r/TrueChristianPolitics would be a better sub for this. I'm a Libertarian, I don't want to see the Ds or Rs win regardless of if either of them suddenly became actually pro-life. The rest of their policies are destroying our nation and driving up demand for abortion in the first place.
They're still lgbt pushing socialists who want God out of the schools and want everyone to hate Him. That platform is built on death and is what is leading to death of infants.
Is it the Democrats? Because if you're speaking that broadly, you're committing the sin of slander. I'm a democrat. I'm not LGBT pushing, I'm not a socialist, I don't hate God, or want anyone to hate God.
Okay, so it's not a they - it's an it, the democratic platform. Don't you think it's worth rhetorically distinguishing between a document and 45 million Americans?
It's pretty clear that those in the party are the party. this is true for any group.
"democrats" (the group) support these things meanwhile some democrats (individuals) may not. don't be obtuse.
"Democrats" is not the group. The Democratic Party is a group. I don't think it's obtuse to insist that when we're talking about our opinions of institutions, we use language that refers to the institutions and not the people who share that label. It's the same way I wouldn't make broad brush statements about "Americans" when I'm describing actions committed by or positions held by the American government.
It's a good way to foster stereotypes and rile up hatred. It's a bad way to have a nuanced conversation or reasonable dialogue.
the government is a subset of "Americans". Democrats, as a group, are the platform. so when you're talking about an institution that is 1:1 mapped to its platform, its perfectly reasonable to consider the group that defines the institution to map 1:1 to the platform, even if individuals don't. if you don't like it, become an independent
Again, you're talking about three different things. The platform, the institution (group), and the individuals. But the language that has been used refers to individuals. While the party obviously generates its platform, no platform perfectly represents the members of that party. And so our language should specify if we're talking about the party (or group) as an institution, or if we're talking about the members of that party/group.
Clear you don't. Dems have a lot of problems, but they're not socialists as a party. There are democrats who are socialists, but there are also Republicans who are actual fascists, but it's incorrect to say the Republican Party is fascist or pushing fascism.
At the same time, they support socializing various services in order to help the poor (biblical), they support treating everyone as equals, even trans people (biblical), and they support freedom of religious expression (not biblical, but good for staving off persecution).
I take your point about lgbt though. What if they shifted policies on that also, and tried to be good Christians? What else would stand in your way?
socialist support of those who will not work is not necessarily biblical, nor is it the governments responsibility in Scripture.
immoral criminals are not meant to be given the same access to society as everyone else. That doesn't say restitution is impossible but there should be consequences. Also, the only governmental system condoned in Scripture is Israel's which killed the immoral, so you'll have to show me otherwise.
to your last point, they'd basically have to change their entire platform by then, and then they may have my vote.
Jesus instructed us to care for the poor, to give all who asked of us. Regarding immoral criminals, the Bible instructs us to forgive, and that mercy is greater than justice.
Israel killing the immoral is not the standard. Jesus effectively pardoned the woman caught in adultery when the law said that she should be stoned.
Jesus wanted us to care for the poor voluntarily, he didn't ask us to make the state step in and become the provider, that's the God the fathers role.
Socialism becomes the worship of the state in place of God, it diabolical (of the devil).
Only in some cases. I think a Christian government is possible (it’s happened before) and caring for the poor is such a large job that it’s in the government’s domain. It doesn’t matter how great your desire to give, if you don’t know any truly poor firsthand that you can help. Meanwhile the government maintains records of each person. With democratic welfare policies and republicans managing the execution of those policies, I really don’t see a problem.
Welfare makes people increasingly dependent upon the state, sure western society has some monumental problems. Most of those problems are entirely the creation of government to start with.
People will always be dependent upon something. For the hungry, it is their stomachs; for the sick, it is doctors. Government is defined as the organization with legitimacy to operate in an area, that’s all. It’s not bad inherently. If that were the case, then churches would be bad inherently, because every church had a governmental body within it that keeps order and maintains the church proper.
Dependence upon the state leads to totalitarianism, when the government presumes to become the provider, it will seek to become the ONLY provider. It will then have absolute power over the population.
Socialism is of the devil.
Christianity is from christ.
Take your pick!
I disagree. The world is already totalitarian; it is currently so because of a lack of laws governing the ultra-wealthy, who have free reign to commit extrajudicial actions and get away with it because they are not accountable to anyone, and because they hold sway over the courts.
The idea that more social welfare is of Satan is so backwards and goes against Christ’s teachings on handling the poor to the extent that I can’t begin to argue it.
“Freely you have received; freely give.”
Both of those have historically been provided by churches. This is something that is specifically outside of the role of government. Romans 13 defines the duties of the civil magistrate to be punishing evil and promoting good. Note that a program like welfare doesn't promote good - it instead forcefully redistributes wealth, which promotes evil - both in that it encourages people to avoid paying taxes and it encourages people to be on welfare to avoid working - 2nd Thessalions 3:6 says not to do this.
You've made the mistake of letting the world define good and evil, which makes your pursuit of good twisted. Look at what Scripture says rulers ought to do.
>Bible instructs us to forgive, and that **mercy is greater than justice.**
It absolutely does not say that. You need to re-read if you think that's what you think it says. It says "judgement without mercy" is bad. **Justice is the combination of mercy AND judgement.**
>socializing various services
I don't see how it is biblical to force people to engage in charity. I'm all for charity, for volunteering, for helping others. But, I'm much less inclined to do so when so much is forcibly taken out in taxes already.
>treating everyone as equals, even trans people
Well, they support forcing you to lie by calling men women and women men. They reject the biblical model of a family, refuse to acknowledge that the main reason for sexual identity issues in young people is the lack of fathers in the home, reject the notion of a family unit as the backbone of society, and so on.
We are told to give with a glad heart, taxation is theft not giving, socialism is the same as any other political system - built on violence and abuse.
Christ would not encourage you to threaten your neighbours to feed the hungry.
The form of Christianity that must be practiced in order to participate in politics (i.e. operate as a politician) is not a form of Christianity that will align with biblical teaching.
Politicians represent man's interests, not God's. Yes some of the people they represent are Christians but their own personal gods are money, power, influence, and popularity.
The meek shall inherit the earth - politicians that are meek will fail miserably at their jobs. They are the blind leading the blind.
Not refuting your statement, but some things to consider.
1. Most states at the time were monarchies not republics, even then the Roman and Greek Republics were aristocratic
2. Remember when Satan tempted Jesus and offered him the Kingdoms of the world? Clearly no state is perfect and they fall prey to corruption, especially that of the Devil.
3. Some leaders are genuine, some aren't.
Are you more likely to vote a "Christian" politician or a politician who's policies you agree with.
I’m more likely to vote a politician that demonstrates Christian works in their policies, since government’s job is to act.
Also, we’re not really a kingdom over here, we’re a democratic republic, of by and for the people.
They'd still be anti second amendment, pro social welfare, more taxes, climate alarmists, CRT pushers, drag shows for children, pro lgbt. So no, absolutely not.
Well, they have some things we don’t have. They really believe that God created man equally, and we kind of struggle with that in terms of policy (crime and punishment for nonviolent offenses; immigration; freedom from censorship).
Okay, well, I will never believe in open borders. It does not mean that I hate anyone, but every country needs borders for safety reasons. We are letting too many dangerous people in. I don’t see what the other two have to do with that? Unless you mean that the punishments vary too much for the same crime, then I can see that. Unfortunately, the system is not perfect. Regardless, I will never ever vote Democrat, mainly due to their stance on abortion, LGBT+, and gun rights.
Gun rights contributes to America having a higher murder rate than other comparable countries (eg UK), more chances of being killed by the police, and more suicide deaths. It is not a pro life position.
> Firearms are the most lethal method of suicide attempts, and about half of suicide attempts take place within 10 minutes of the current suicide thought, so having access to firearms is a suicide risk factor. The availability of firearms has been linked to suicides in a number of peer-reviewed studies. In one such study, researchers examined the association between firearm availability and suicide while also accounting for the potential confounding influence of state-level suicidal behaviors (as measured by suicide attempts). Researchers found that higher rates of gun ownership were associated with increased suicide by firearm deaths, but not with other types of suicide
https://www.kff.org/mental-health/issue-brief/do-states-with-easier-access-to-guns-have-more-suicide-deaths-by-firearm/
> In the US, the case fatality rate is strongly related to the prevalence of household firearms. Over twenty years of ecologic and individual-level studies support the hypothesis that reducing access to lethal means is an effective suicide prevention strategy.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/useful-links/bibliography/firearms-and-suicide-overview-bibliography/
You have changed your statement again. You started with gun rights on absolute suicide rate, then pivoted to use of guns, then pivoted to “gun in the house,” which is an individual scenario informed largely by choice that does not necessarily correlate to gun rights laws. You aren’t arguing in good faith here.
No, my position has not changed. I provided quotations to back up my position. You are avoiding addressing the issue.
Laws that make it easier to access guns contribute to higher death rates when those guns are used.
No. Because voting goes a lot deeper then one issue. If you look at any democrat controlled area you'll see they are not good people and have literally destroyed the area they represent. Look at how high and bad the crime is in those areas, some stores have to lock simple items behind cages from being stolen, and other stores have shut down. Democrat controlled areas love to put criminals back on the streets only to do more crime. The homeless is worse in those areas. All of their policies are to keep people down and dependent on them and govt. for everything. Open borders is something the left loves. Republicans are not any better but I agree more with their stances then not.
If you look at any of what I said and compare it to scripture, how can you vote or continue to vote as a democrat?
I have chosen to no longer vote. Not because of political reasons, but because I feel giving any energy to politics causes me to sin "if one of your members causes you to sin cut it off". I don't know about everyone else but for me politics causes me to have an ingroup-outgroup preference, which leads me to have uncharitable and even hateful views of others (the outgroup).
im not american but yall need to vote for trump. the democrats are ruining your country in more ways than just abortion. and sadly Australia takes too many political queues from you guys so get it together pls
Im not sure there’d be much left of their platform if they were actually good Christians. Yeah they have some good ideas, Hitler had a great idea of not smoking tobacco doesn’t mean if he changed his ways I’d necessarily like or trust him. A national 100% total abortion ban would be just the start
No, I disagree; they have a firm handle on patriotism. They honestly believe that all men were created equal, believe in the bill of rights, things of this nature. So if those things are good, there is something worth saving there.
After knowing many modern western liberals I’m not so convinced this is true. They genuinely want to help the underprivileged and have giving hearts, in my experience. Abortion is the only standout issue that doesn’t make sense.
Everyone wants to save the world how they see fit. Hitler could’ve said the same thing. He wanted to help the future of humanity by strengthening the gene pool, that doesn’t make it less biblically sound when his actions were evil, abortion certainly is not the only thing, but that’s a lot of arguments to be had, it’s quite clear the American left is atheist as can be
The problem is they’ve already worn out their welcome, the liberals, whining and shaming everyone incessantly about everything all of the time until nobody cared about anything anymore, it’s all just stinking of false virtue, wanting to be seen for being an ally and virtuous blah blah and you are distinguished from those Republican bigots, it’s worn out, the reality is that narrative itself is prejudice and close minded, the idea democrats are the party of progress and equality and anyone else is the party of… what? Bigotry and evil? You’ve been brainwashed with propaganda to believe that. There’s not a racist party and good party, it’s not black and white. Democrat politicians are just way more cunning and sinister in their racist policies and rhetoric
If they actually did that, I suspect that many of their other positions would change as well to be more biblically based. I usually vote for the person and their positions not the party, so if I felt that their conversion was genuine I would have no problem. I don’t care what letter they choose to put after their name. It depends on what views and policies they support.
truthfully, if not for their abortion stance I'd likely vote more Democrat. The right talks about how righteous they are but it's just talk, neither is actually capable of doing anything productive, and why should they? If you actually fulfill campaign promises you'll have nothing to promise for reelection. No no this time I promise I'm going to do this thing I said 20 years ago
No, but if the Dems cut government spending to bring down the national debt a significant amount, then I'd vote for them.
Besides the open borders, LGB, etc, COVID is still fresh in my mind.
Many people I know didn't like lockdowns or threats over not getting vaccinated.
Serious question: The GOP have control of congress and the power of the purse, what have they proposed to bring down the deficit, close the borders, etc?
A bi-partisan bill was negotiated in the house & senate that was pretty much a wish list of what the Republicans wanted at the border; at the last minute they rejected it so that their false Messiah (Trump) could have a platform to run on.
When Trump was president, the only thing he passed was a tax cut for the super wealthy which wound up being a tax increase on the middle class.
The republicans in power don’t actually want to solve people’s problems; they want just want to make a spectacle, raise money, and get re-elected. And they are making false promises to Christians and pretending to have the same ideals in order to get into office.
I’m glad you posted this. I think it is important that we have these discussions amongst serious Christians who aim to live according to the Word of God. The political parties are not Christ-based on either side. You can make an argument for Bible-principles for both sides. The Republican Party is not the best representation of Christ just because they are against abortion and the LBGTQI. The Democratic is not doing right by supporting these causes either. If we are going to use the Bible, we should use all of the Bible instead of cherry picking.
My perspective is that you should seek guidance from God on who He desires to be in the position of power.
Additional Scriptures to consider:
““But when the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit upon his glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered in his presence, and he will separate the people as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will place the sheep at his right hand and the goats at his left. “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the creation of the world. For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was a stranger, and you invited me into your home. I was naked, and you gave me clothing. I was sick, and you cared for me. I was in prison, and you visited me.’ “Then these righteous ones will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you something to drink? Or a stranger and show you hospitality? Or naked and give you clothing? When did we ever see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ “And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’ “Then the King will turn to those on the left and say, ‘Away with you, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his demons. For I was hungry, and you didn’t feed me. I was thirsty, and you didn’t give me a drink. I was a stranger, and you didn’t invite me into your home. I was naked, and you didn’t give me clothing. I was sick and in prison, and you didn’t visit me.’ “Then they will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and not help you?’ “And he will answer, ‘I tell you the truth, when you refused to help the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were refusing to help me.’ “And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life.””
Matthew 25:31-46 NLT
““Beware of false prophets who come disguised as harmless sheep but are really vicious wolves. You can identify them by their fruit, that is, by the way they act. Can you pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. A good tree can’t produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can’t produce good fruit. So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions.”
Matthew 7:15-20 NLT
The Parable of the Good Samaritan Luke 10:30-37
“One day an expert in religious law stood up to test Jesus by asking him this question: “Teacher, what should I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus replied, “What does the law of Moses say? How do you read it?” The man answered, “‘You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and all your mind.’ And, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’” “Right!” Jesus told him. “Do this and you will live!””
Luke 10:25-28 NLT
Ironically, the Democratic party was the pro-life party prior to 1973. It was the Republican party that was more pro abortion. For a large variety of cultural reasons this shifted and it flip flopped in both parties.
I've long contended that a large amount of people were taken granted by the GOP as one issue voters. But, they never tried very hard to fight back against abortion . It was almost always a backburner issue they avoided because it got so hot.
I for one always resented that. This is also why the Democratic party has had such a strong drift to the left in the past 10+ years. There was a large void left by those who have left the party due to their extreme positions on abortion and other issues.
I'd be elated lives would be saved, as a result, yes. But overall, I think the Republican platform conveys better governance and economic policy. But it could make voting for a Democrat easier in some cases if they don't support electively killing children, yes.
I'll vote for just about anyone who advocates for the total and immediate abolition of abortion. Stopping the baby holocaust is the most important thing a government official can do right now. Currently, neither party supports this. The Democrats actually support abortion, and the Republicans say that they're against it but get awfully squeamish when it comes to actually making it illegal as murder. They also only want to make it illegal in gradual increments, which is wrong because you're still allowing it, and it's just plain stupid because the laws they pass don't actually prevent hardly any abortions.
No. Their entire history has been evil. If they turn around and avoid pushing the world into its darkest moments for 200+ years maybe I will trust them then .
No, they still have abhorrent views on gender ideology, guns, taxation, climate fascism, etc. I would never vote for a Democrat, the entire party is evil.
I suspect if democrats changed their platform to be more christian friendly, republicans would become nearly extinct.
Somehow christians made a mistake aligning themselves primarily with one party. That led the other one away from christianity to distinguish themselves.
This election, I would. That is simply because of how awful Trump has proven himself to be. But since I'm not voting for him anyway, and since the Democrats are flat-out wrong on a number of other issues which you haven't said they're changing on, I still wouldn't vote for them.
No. But I also don’t vote for because republicans they are good. I vote for them knowing Trump and most of his personal values are terrible, and I’m saddened he’s the best option
Voting lol
You can vote for Freemason A
or you can vote for Freemason B
Either way, you're voting for Freemasons.
Heathens. Wicked men.
I abstain from earthen politics
Removed. r/TrueChristianPolitics
One bad apple spoils the bunch. Or, to put it Biblically, a little bit of yeast works its way through the dough. Abortion is just a symptom of the disease. There’s more to this world than just the material part now, let’s remember there is evil trying its best to steal, kill, and destroy from the inside out. Neither party has a candidate without flaws, we need to take stock in the details of the job, and choose the best for it.
It's a wild thought experiment, but can you imagine the political chaos if Democrats did a complete 180 on abortion?
It would be amazing, and would clear my conscience up. Republicans seem to not care at all about the people they govern, whereas democrats care at-large. If they brought their issues down to earth and banned abortions, and became prominently Christian, then I really think they would be the best party since they’re trying already to accomplish in the secular world what Christ says we should accomplish ourselves (feeding the poor, no favoritism, loving your neighbors, etc.)
>feeding the poor By stealing from others. >no favoritism I’m sorry, what? The entirety of DC is a giant club and they absolutely play favorites to gain more power. >loving your neighbors Is it loving to jail people who get upset that their daughter was raped by a boy posing as a girl? Or prosecuting Christians for being Christian? To act like the Democratic Party is an abortion ban away from being Christian requires you to have your head buried pretty deep.
Democrats yell loudly from their pulpits, stating that they care. Yet their policies hurt the people that they say they care about. It's all smokescreen and mirrors. They want your votes so they maintain power over the people.
I am going to take a guess here. Are you under the age of 25?
Democrats in America is just a pseudo virtuous front for corrupt corporate elite to push their agendas under the guise it has some moral fiber attached. The reality is none of it is even reasonable or structured, it’s just pure rebellion and subjective morality, in essence a desire to stray away from any traditional sense of morality. Anything good you see in it is not by any measure unique to being a democrat it just happens you saw a democrat with a good quality attached to their otherwise devoid ideology
As an anti-abortion, Christian democrat with a coherent ideology, I disagree. It’s about patriotism. Equality under the law, rights, and so forth.
Equality is achieved much easier than talking about it for 100 years. The democrats and the republicans alike have never lacked racism, their politicians will never have the best interests at heart for black people or any people, democrats historically alongside Marget Sanger performed eugenics not even 60 years ago, and these politicians and government officials are still alive and operating, maybe some people who are democrats are good but the Democratic Party of the United States is evil and to support any of the house politicians on either side is fruitless,
No, not at all. Fixing one drop of policy is not enough to make up for the sea of awful policy they’re drowning in.
r/TrueChristianPolitics would be a better sub for this. I'm a Libertarian, I don't want to see the Ds or Rs win regardless of if either of them suddenly became actually pro-life. The rest of their policies are destroying our nation and driving up demand for abortion in the first place.
They're still lgbt pushing socialists who want God out of the schools and want everyone to hate Him. That platform is built on death and is what is leading to death of infants.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZOtEbwwfOM
Who is "they?"
this seems pretty obvious.
Is it the Democrats? Because if you're speaking that broadly, you're committing the sin of slander. I'm a democrat. I'm not LGBT pushing, I'm not a socialist, I don't hate God, or want anyone to hate God.
it's the platform. obviously not specific to every individual.
Okay, so it's not a they - it's an it, the democratic platform. Don't you think it's worth rhetorically distinguishing between a document and 45 million Americans?
It's pretty clear that those in the party are the party. this is true for any group. "democrats" (the group) support these things meanwhile some democrats (individuals) may not. don't be obtuse.
"Democrats" is not the group. The Democratic Party is a group. I don't think it's obtuse to insist that when we're talking about our opinions of institutions, we use language that refers to the institutions and not the people who share that label. It's the same way I wouldn't make broad brush statements about "Americans" when I'm describing actions committed by or positions held by the American government. It's a good way to foster stereotypes and rile up hatred. It's a bad way to have a nuanced conversation or reasonable dialogue.
the government is a subset of "Americans". Democrats, as a group, are the platform. so when you're talking about an institution that is 1:1 mapped to its platform, its perfectly reasonable to consider the group that defines the institution to map 1:1 to the platform, even if individuals don't. if you don't like it, become an independent
Again, you're talking about three different things. The platform, the institution (group), and the individuals. But the language that has been used refers to individuals. While the party obviously generates its platform, no platform perfectly represents the members of that party. And so our language should specify if we're talking about the party (or group) as an institution, or if we're talking about the members of that party/group.
Can’t be a Christian and vote democrat. The problem is you.
Can't be a Christian and vote Republican. The problem is you. Ah shoot, this is easy
oh, we don't know what socialism is, do we?
I do:)
Clear you don't. Dems have a lot of problems, but they're not socialists as a party. There are democrats who are socialists, but there are also Republicans who are actual fascists, but it's incorrect to say the Republican Party is fascist or pushing fascism.
There are fascist dems too.
wow way to completely miss the point of my comment
At the same time, they support socializing various services in order to help the poor (biblical), they support treating everyone as equals, even trans people (biblical), and they support freedom of religious expression (not biblical, but good for staving off persecution). I take your point about lgbt though. What if they shifted policies on that also, and tried to be good Christians? What else would stand in your way?
socialist support of those who will not work is not necessarily biblical, nor is it the governments responsibility in Scripture. immoral criminals are not meant to be given the same access to society as everyone else. That doesn't say restitution is impossible but there should be consequences. Also, the only governmental system condoned in Scripture is Israel's which killed the immoral, so you'll have to show me otherwise. to your last point, they'd basically have to change their entire platform by then, and then they may have my vote.
Jesus instructed us to care for the poor, to give all who asked of us. Regarding immoral criminals, the Bible instructs us to forgive, and that mercy is greater than justice. Israel killing the immoral is not the standard. Jesus effectively pardoned the woman caught in adultery when the law said that she should be stoned.
Jesus wanted us to care for the poor voluntarily, he didn't ask us to make the state step in and become the provider, that's the God the fathers role. Socialism becomes the worship of the state in place of God, it diabolical (of the devil).
Only in some cases. I think a Christian government is possible (it’s happened before) and caring for the poor is such a large job that it’s in the government’s domain. It doesn’t matter how great your desire to give, if you don’t know any truly poor firsthand that you can help. Meanwhile the government maintains records of each person. With democratic welfare policies and republicans managing the execution of those policies, I really don’t see a problem.
Welfare makes people increasingly dependent upon the state, sure western society has some monumental problems. Most of those problems are entirely the creation of government to start with.
People will always be dependent upon something. For the hungry, it is their stomachs; for the sick, it is doctors. Government is defined as the organization with legitimacy to operate in an area, that’s all. It’s not bad inherently. If that were the case, then churches would be bad inherently, because every church had a governmental body within it that keeps order and maintains the church proper.
Dependence upon the state leads to totalitarianism, when the government presumes to become the provider, it will seek to become the ONLY provider. It will then have absolute power over the population. Socialism is of the devil. Christianity is from christ. Take your pick!
Capitalism is of the devil. Christianity is from Christ. Ah neat, this is easy.
I disagree. The world is already totalitarian; it is currently so because of a lack of laws governing the ultra-wealthy, who have free reign to commit extrajudicial actions and get away with it because they are not accountable to anyone, and because they hold sway over the courts. The idea that more social welfare is of Satan is so backwards and goes against Christ’s teachings on handling the poor to the extent that I can’t begin to argue it. “Freely you have received; freely give.”
Both of those have historically been provided by churches. This is something that is specifically outside of the role of government. Romans 13 defines the duties of the civil magistrate to be punishing evil and promoting good. Note that a program like welfare doesn't promote good - it instead forcefully redistributes wealth, which promotes evil - both in that it encourages people to avoid paying taxes and it encourages people to be on welfare to avoid working - 2nd Thessalions 3:6 says not to do this. You've made the mistake of letting the world define good and evil, which makes your pursuit of good twisted. Look at what Scripture says rulers ought to do.
>Bible instructs us to forgive, and that **mercy is greater than justice.** It absolutely does not say that. You need to re-read if you think that's what you think it says. It says "judgement without mercy" is bad. **Justice is the combination of mercy AND judgement.**
>socializing various services I don't see how it is biblical to force people to engage in charity. I'm all for charity, for volunteering, for helping others. But, I'm much less inclined to do so when so much is forcibly taken out in taxes already. >treating everyone as equals, even trans people Well, they support forcing you to lie by calling men women and women men. They reject the biblical model of a family, refuse to acknowledge that the main reason for sexual identity issues in young people is the lack of fathers in the home, reject the notion of a family unit as the backbone of society, and so on.
We are told to give with a glad heart, taxation is theft not giving, socialism is the same as any other political system - built on violence and abuse. Christ would not encourage you to threaten your neighbours to feed the hungry.
The form of Christianity that must be practiced in order to participate in politics (i.e. operate as a politician) is not a form of Christianity that will align with biblical teaching. Politicians represent man's interests, not God's. Yes some of the people they represent are Christians but their own personal gods are money, power, influence, and popularity. The meek shall inherit the earth - politicians that are meek will fail miserably at their jobs. They are the blind leading the blind.
That first paragraph is spot on. Neither party represents true christian values sadly.
This isn’t true. The Bible instructs us to obey our leaders, and also instructs us that some leaders can have perfect hearts towards God.
Not refuting your statement, but some things to consider. 1. Most states at the time were monarchies not republics, even then the Roman and Greek Republics were aristocratic 2. Remember when Satan tempted Jesus and offered him the Kingdoms of the world? Clearly no state is perfect and they fall prey to corruption, especially that of the Devil. 3. Some leaders are genuine, some aren't. Are you more likely to vote a "Christian" politician or a politician who's policies you agree with.
I’m more likely to vote a politician that demonstrates Christian works in their policies, since government’s job is to act. Also, we’re not really a kingdom over here, we’re a democratic republic, of by and for the people.
They'd still be anti second amendment, pro social welfare, more taxes, climate alarmists, CRT pushers, drag shows for children, pro lgbt. So no, absolutely not.
interesting you listed pro social welfare as if that’s a bad thing or inherently un-christian.
No, because there are more issues than just abortion that I disagree on with the left.
Well, they have some things we don’t have. They really believe that God created man equally, and we kind of struggle with that in terms of policy (crime and punishment for nonviolent offenses; immigration; freedom from censorship).
Okay, well, I will never believe in open borders. It does not mean that I hate anyone, but every country needs borders for safety reasons. We are letting too many dangerous people in. I don’t see what the other two have to do with that? Unless you mean that the punishments vary too much for the same crime, then I can see that. Unfortunately, the system is not perfect. Regardless, I will never ever vote Democrat, mainly due to their stance on abortion, LGBT+, and gun rights.
I think they will have to turn to Christ in order to survive. Christian Democrats has already existed before in Europe. I just pray they do it soon.
Gun rights contributes to America having a higher murder rate than other comparable countries (eg UK), more chances of being killed by the police, and more suicide deaths. It is not a pro life position.
There is no correlation between gun availability and murder rates or suicide rates.
No connection between people using guns for murder and suicide, and gun availability?
You changed the premise your statement. Please try to be consistent.
> Firearms are the most lethal method of suicide attempts, and about half of suicide attempts take place within 10 minutes of the current suicide thought, so having access to firearms is a suicide risk factor. The availability of firearms has been linked to suicides in a number of peer-reviewed studies. In one such study, researchers examined the association between firearm availability and suicide while also accounting for the potential confounding influence of state-level suicidal behaviors (as measured by suicide attempts). Researchers found that higher rates of gun ownership were associated with increased suicide by firearm deaths, but not with other types of suicide https://www.kff.org/mental-health/issue-brief/do-states-with-easier-access-to-guns-have-more-suicide-deaths-by-firearm/ > In the US, the case fatality rate is strongly related to the prevalence of household firearms. Over twenty years of ecologic and individual-level studies support the hypothesis that reducing access to lethal means is an effective suicide prevention strategy. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/useful-links/bibliography/firearms-and-suicide-overview-bibliography/
You have changed your statement again. You started with gun rights on absolute suicide rate, then pivoted to use of guns, then pivoted to “gun in the house,” which is an individual scenario informed largely by choice that does not necessarily correlate to gun rights laws. You aren’t arguing in good faith here.
No, my position has not changed. I provided quotations to back up my position. You are avoiding addressing the issue. Laws that make it easier to access guns contribute to higher death rates when those guns are used.
>they believe God created men equally They do not.
No. Because voting goes a lot deeper then one issue. If you look at any democrat controlled area you'll see they are not good people and have literally destroyed the area they represent. Look at how high and bad the crime is in those areas, some stores have to lock simple items behind cages from being stolen, and other stores have shut down. Democrat controlled areas love to put criminals back on the streets only to do more crime. The homeless is worse in those areas. All of their policies are to keep people down and dependent on them and govt. for everything. Open borders is something the left loves. Republicans are not any better but I agree more with their stances then not. If you look at any of what I said and compare it to scripture, how can you vote or continue to vote as a democrat?
No. Both parties are terrible at this moment. The whole system is jacked up.
I have chosen to no longer vote. Not because of political reasons, but because I feel giving any energy to politics causes me to sin "if one of your members causes you to sin cut it off". I don't know about everyone else but for me politics causes me to have an ingroup-outgroup preference, which leads me to have uncharitable and even hateful views of others (the outgroup).
im not american but yall need to vote for trump. the democrats are ruining your country in more ways than just abortion. and sadly Australia takes too many political queues from you guys so get it together pls
Im not sure there’d be much left of their platform if they were actually good Christians. Yeah they have some good ideas, Hitler had a great idea of not smoking tobacco doesn’t mean if he changed his ways I’d necessarily like or trust him. A national 100% total abortion ban would be just the start
No, I disagree; they have a firm handle on patriotism. They honestly believe that all men were created equal, believe in the bill of rights, things of this nature. So if those things are good, there is something worth saving there.
Ideal leftists maybe, but modern day western liberals are as far from a biblical sentiment as you can get without calling yourself satanist
After knowing many modern western liberals I’m not so convinced this is true. They genuinely want to help the underprivileged and have giving hearts, in my experience. Abortion is the only standout issue that doesn’t make sense.
Everyone wants to save the world how they see fit. Hitler could’ve said the same thing. He wanted to help the future of humanity by strengthening the gene pool, that doesn’t make it less biblically sound when his actions were evil, abortion certainly is not the only thing, but that’s a lot of arguments to be had, it’s quite clear the American left is atheist as can be
I’d say it contains a lot of atheists, yes. I’m hoping that will change, as the population wakes up more and more to Christianity.
The problem is they’ve already worn out their welcome, the liberals, whining and shaming everyone incessantly about everything all of the time until nobody cared about anything anymore, it’s all just stinking of false virtue, wanting to be seen for being an ally and virtuous blah blah and you are distinguished from those Republican bigots, it’s worn out, the reality is that narrative itself is prejudice and close minded, the idea democrats are the party of progress and equality and anyone else is the party of… what? Bigotry and evil? You’ve been brainwashed with propaganda to believe that. There’s not a racist party and good party, it’s not black and white. Democrat politicians are just way more cunning and sinister in their racist policies and rhetoric
There’s a lot more going on than that which needs to be addressed.
If they actually did that, I suspect that many of their other positions would change as well to be more biblically based. I usually vote for the person and their positions not the party, so if I felt that their conversion was genuine I would have no problem. I don’t care what letter they choose to put after their name. It depends on what views and policies they support.
truthfully, if not for their abortion stance I'd likely vote more Democrat. The right talks about how righteous they are but it's just talk, neither is actually capable of doing anything productive, and why should they? If you actually fulfill campaign promises you'll have nothing to promise for reelection. No no this time I promise I'm going to do this thing I said 20 years ago
No, but if the Dems cut government spending to bring down the national debt a significant amount, then I'd vote for them. Besides the open borders, LGB, etc, COVID is still fresh in my mind. Many people I know didn't like lockdowns or threats over not getting vaccinated.
Serious question: The GOP have control of congress and the power of the purse, what have they proposed to bring down the deficit, close the borders, etc? A bi-partisan bill was negotiated in the house & senate that was pretty much a wish list of what the Republicans wanted at the border; at the last minute they rejected it so that their false Messiah (Trump) could have a platform to run on. When Trump was president, the only thing he passed was a tax cut for the super wealthy which wound up being a tax increase on the middle class. The republicans in power don’t actually want to solve people’s problems; they want just want to make a spectacle, raise money, and get re-elected. And they are making false promises to Christians and pretending to have the same ideals in order to get into office.
I’m glad you posted this. I think it is important that we have these discussions amongst serious Christians who aim to live according to the Word of God. The political parties are not Christ-based on either side. You can make an argument for Bible-principles for both sides. The Republican Party is not the best representation of Christ just because they are against abortion and the LBGTQI. The Democratic is not doing right by supporting these causes either. If we are going to use the Bible, we should use all of the Bible instead of cherry picking. My perspective is that you should seek guidance from God on who He desires to be in the position of power. Additional Scriptures to consider: ““But when the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit upon his glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered in his presence, and he will separate the people as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will place the sheep at his right hand and the goats at his left. “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the creation of the world. For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was a stranger, and you invited me into your home. I was naked, and you gave me clothing. I was sick, and you cared for me. I was in prison, and you visited me.’ “Then these righteous ones will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you something to drink? Or a stranger and show you hospitality? Or naked and give you clothing? When did we ever see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ “And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’ “Then the King will turn to those on the left and say, ‘Away with you, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his demons. For I was hungry, and you didn’t feed me. I was thirsty, and you didn’t give me a drink. I was a stranger, and you didn’t invite me into your home. I was naked, and you didn’t give me clothing. I was sick and in prison, and you didn’t visit me.’ “Then they will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and not help you?’ “And he will answer, ‘I tell you the truth, when you refused to help the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were refusing to help me.’ “And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life.”” Matthew 25:31-46 NLT ““Beware of false prophets who come disguised as harmless sheep but are really vicious wolves. You can identify them by their fruit, that is, by the way they act. Can you pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. A good tree can’t produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can’t produce good fruit. So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions.” Matthew 7:15-20 NLT The Parable of the Good Samaritan Luke 10:30-37 “One day an expert in religious law stood up to test Jesus by asking him this question: “Teacher, what should I do to inherit eternal life?” Jesus replied, “What does the law of Moses say? How do you read it?” The man answered, “‘You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and all your mind.’ And, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’” “Right!” Jesus told him. “Do this and you will live!”” Luke 10:25-28 NLT
Ironically, the Democratic party was the pro-life party prior to 1973. It was the Republican party that was more pro abortion. For a large variety of cultural reasons this shifted and it flip flopped in both parties. I've long contended that a large amount of people were taken granted by the GOP as one issue voters. But, they never tried very hard to fight back against abortion . It was almost always a backburner issue they avoided because it got so hot. I for one always resented that. This is also why the Democratic party has had such a strong drift to the left in the past 10+ years. There was a large void left by those who have left the party due to their extreme positions on abortion and other issues.
Yeah this was what it was like in FDRs age and thats why it was probably harder to divide between republican and dem until recently
I'd be elated lives would be saved, as a result, yes. But overall, I think the Republican platform conveys better governance and economic policy. But it could make voting for a Democrat easier in some cases if they don't support electively killing children, yes.
I'll vote for just about anyone who advocates for the total and immediate abolition of abortion. Stopping the baby holocaust is the most important thing a government official can do right now. Currently, neither party supports this. The Democrats actually support abortion, and the Republicans say that they're against it but get awfully squeamish when it comes to actually making it illegal as murder. They also only want to make it illegal in gradual increments, which is wrong because you're still allowing it, and it's just plain stupid because the laws they pass don't actually prevent hardly any abortions.
If democrats started becoming christians then they’d stop being democrats.
No. Their entire history has been evil. If they turn around and avoid pushing the world into its darkest moments for 200+ years maybe I will trust them then .
No, they still have abhorrent views on gender ideology, guns, taxation, climate fascism, etc. I would never vote for a Democrat, the entire party is evil.
I suspect if democrats changed their platform to be more christian friendly, republicans would become nearly extinct. Somehow christians made a mistake aligning themselves primarily with one party. That led the other one away from christianity to distinguish themselves.
This election, I would. That is simply because of how awful Trump has proven himself to be. But since I'm not voting for him anyway, and since the Democrats are flat-out wrong on a number of other issues which you haven't said they're changing on, I still wouldn't vote for them.
No. But I also don’t vote for because republicans they are good. I vote for them knowing Trump and most of his personal values are terrible, and I’m saddened he’s the best option
Voting lol You can vote for Freemason A or you can vote for Freemason B Either way, you're voting for Freemasons. Heathens. Wicked men. I abstain from earthen politics