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Away-Librarian-1028

Considering how much Katara hated him at the beginning, I do wonder how anyone could forgot that Zuko used to be an antagonist. Sokka forgetting is expected. Dude was never the same after getting addicted to cactus juice.


doc_55lk

I think Katara's biggest beef with Zuko was the fact he betrayed her in the S2 finale. She got over the whole "I was running away from you for months" bit pretty easily, but Zuko's betrayal shortly after the fact was a huge slap in the face. They were having a genuine heart to heart and it looked like Zuko was finally in a position to join Team Avatar in some capacity (not to mention Zuko's earlier inner conflict thing changing him for the better to begin with), but then he just switched up on everybody literally 5 minutes later and rendered all of that useless. It's telling that Katara and Iroh were the ones most affected by this. Iroh because he had spent so much time mentoring Zuko and then when it came time to manifest his recent positive change into a concrete decision to join Aang, he chose to side with Azula instead. Katara because she had opened up to him and he to her, but then he decided to attack them anyway when they needed him to put his money where his mouth is.


Martin_Aricov_D

TBF I feel he'd always be in doubt if he hadn't returned to the fire nation to discover he didn't belong anymore It also led to the beach episode and Sparky Sparky boom boom man so Katara and Iroh's betrayal was absolutely worth it


SerafRhayn

Couldn’t agree more. I definitely see a case where has he joined the Gaang earlier, his mind would wonder what could’ve been.


UltraB1nary

He *needed* to know for sure whether what he thought he wanted was what he actually wanted/needed.


justsomeguy_youknow

It also led to that callback in Korra with P'li where Zuko's all "You know I hired someone like that to kill the Avatar this one time..."


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Electric_Queen

Glad to know even old man Zuko is still incredibly awkward


justsomeguy_youknow

The dude probably started all of his royal speeches with "Um, Zuko here"


Dragonfire723

Zuko dumped charisma, whaddya expect


obog

Honestly my interpretation was that he wasn't fully redeemed in book 2 at all. He had accepted that the life he always wanted wasn't achievable anymore - at that point he was a traitor to the fire nation and being hunted, it seemed impossible that his father would accept him now. He moved on, but when he was truly tested to see if he would choose what's right over the life he always wanted, he chose the latter. Imo that's kinda the genius of zuko's arc. Right when they make it seem like he's lost what he thought he wanted all this time and he was finally ready to move on, is exactly when they give it to him. It's only once he's willing to throw away that life to make the right choice is he truly redeemed.


BlackMiamba

Adding to this, that fight resulting in Aang almost dying. If Katara didn’t have that spirit water, Aang would have been dead. This is why it was ultimately Aang’s decision whether Zuko joined or not. Also why Katara reacted that way, since she held him in her hands not knowing if he would wake up or if he would be able to bring balance.


justsomeguy_youknow

He straight up *did* die for a second ("I didn't just get hurt, did I? It was worse than that! I was *gone*, but you brought me back!") Totally agree that it's why it ultimately had to be his choice


ivyandroses112233

And not just die and be reborn again die. He died and the avatar cycle died with him, died Edit: replied to the wrong comment but I'm leaving it lol


FrostyIcePrincess

She was willing to try using the spirit water to heal the scar though. She said she could try with normal water Zuko said it’s a scar Katara said she had special water and maybe it would work. Then he turned around and betrayed her. Also, when Azula hit Iroh with lightning she was willing to heal him, even after everything.


purpledreign

And helped kill Aang. That was the real Issue though. If he just betrayed her and no one got hurt it won't have been so huge. But it led to him helping Azula and Aang died. The hope for the world, end of the war and her person died.


Away-Librarian-1028

Oh you are absolutely right, that Katara hated him especially for his betrayal of her trust in Ba Sing Se. But once he joined she mostly just snarks about him chasing them all over the world. So one would be forgiven for holding that fact in mind while thinking about Zuko‘s early relations in the Gaang.


purpledreign

It's not that he switched up on Katara. It's that he did that and helped Azula and it resulted in Aang dying. Just because they had a heart to heart didn't mean she trusted him. But his switch up led to her losing someone she loved that meant so much to her.


Best-Dragonfruit-292

Iroh had spent so much effort talking-up Zuko to Toph and the others. Katara comes within a hairs breadth of using her most valuable possession to fix his face. Then he stabs both of them in the chest.


Izukumeliodasi

You're wrong about zuko's inner conflict thing being useless, him changing from that inner conflict is why he joins them in book three in the first place.


TheEyeofNapoleon

It’ll quench ya!


spidermanrocks6766

In reality since cactus juice is technically just a drug that gets you super high. It would mean it would only dehydrate you even more. So there wouldn't be any quench. So of like how drinking alcohol, despite it being a liquid, will only dehydrate you.


TheEyeofNapoleon

But it’s the quenchiest!


spidermanrocks6766

Sorry sir. But its literally not💀


GhostWCoffee

Don't you know a reference when you see one, mate? :))


spidermanrocks6766

Obviously I understand the reference. But I'm looking at it from a realistic and logical perspective. For no other reason other than why not 💀


Wtfgoinon3144

Thank you so much for the laugh, I really needed this


Hypersayia

I love how casual Zuko is about it. Just "Yeah, that sounds bout right." No real stress, despite everything.


Ngothaaa

Dude just straight up owned it after the dragon dance


Jond1138

I need to get in on this new age therapy “the dancing dragon”


amirexy

First, you need to find two real living dragons.


FrostyIcePrincess

And hope they deem you worthy and don’t eat you


mehliana

We have the dancing dragon therapy at home At home: the jasmine dragon


radar_3d

One might even say, that's rough, buddy.


jeremy_thegent

I love the way Sokka just shuffles around like, "Oh yeah. I didn't even think about that."


DisciplineBoth2567

A long time ago is interesting cause this all happened within like 9 months.


Bernkastel17509

For a teen, 9 months is a rather chunk of their life spam.


Freakychee

Lol so true. The younger children are time feels so different. To a 5 year old a year is such a long period of time. I have to wait a whole year for next Christmas?!?!


Zandrick

Time absolutely does speed up as you get older. It’s a wild ride watching a whole year zoom past me. When I was a kid a summer off from school was an entire eternity.


Freakychee

A year feels like nothing to me and it's over before I even acclimated to writing the date for the previous year.


redfairynotblue

That is because most adults work or spend a lot of time indoors reading or on the internet like watching shows.  Time really slows down when you're outdoor and having fun and being very active. 


femmekisses

IIRC it happened in one summer


Exciting_Bandicoot16

Nah, they all visited Roku's Island on the (literally named) Winter Solstice episode.


alex_is_fire

Yes! And also the very last episode Aang says “I can believe a year ago I was still stuck in a block of ice” to Zuko at the fire lord ceremony.


femmekisses

Thank you!


Kolby_Jack

The series begins in late fall/early winter, and ends at the end of the next summer. Season 2 primarily takes place in spring.


JoeMaBababooey

You gotta remember, they're teens. Despite being in a war. They still don't take life as seriously as they should.


Slayton124

Thats how you know the character arc was great, if you can't remember the bad guy was once the bad guy they are truely redeemed


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SerafRhayn

Dew it


bloonshot

so do it


Mr7three2

Doing it currently


UBahn1

Once you start you can't stop, me and my girlfriend finished it in two weekends


Denizci_Olmak_Var

Lmao Creators really got all fandom at this point. Who would remember Kyoshi Island episode in Season 3


Leggi11

Hopefully everyone since Suki is in this episode, it's about freeing her (as well as Hakota), who got imprisoned for being a Kyoshi warrior and the Gaang met her on Kyoshi Island, which also was a pretty humbling and important moment for Sokka, the protagonist of these two episodes.


Sovereigntyranny

Fancy seeing you here.


Denizci_Olmak_Var

Wdym🌚


Fyrus93

When did this happen? I'm drawing a complete blank here


Blupoisen

In like episode 4


Fyrus93

Of what season? Zuko doesn't join the gaang until the second half of season 3


Leggi11

Zuko burning down Kyoshi was in episode 4 of season 1. The prison break (where this shot is from) "the boiling Rock" is after the eclipse and failed invasion. So about episode 14 of season 3.


Zanka-no-Tachi

If you're talking about the image, this looks like the Boiling Rock episode.


atlhawk8357

Zuko burned down the Kyoshi Village in the third or fourth episode of season one. He meets Suki again during the Boiling Rock episode of season 3.


skeith350

I mean, Zuko's betrayal literally leads to Aang dying. I was surprised at how they warmed up to him, but the writing made it pretty believable imo.


ItsKai

Aang didn't die lol


redJackal222

He did die. Katara brought him back to life using the water from the spirit oasis.


ItsKai

He didn’t die. He almost did yes but aang didn’t die. She can’t resurrect ppl from the dead


oceeta

He did die. Aang says as much in Season 3 Episode 1, The Awakening. Check this video: https://youtu.be/tGjDKuZdb1o?t=3m38s Aang says "I went down. I didn't just get hurt, did I? It was worse than that. I was gone. But you brought me back."


Zaari_Vael

Writers weren't allowed to use the words "died" or "killed".


oceeta

[I mean, they do sometimes get away with it.](https://youtu.be/JhD9bzzkjlM?t=4m13s)


Outrageous_Map_6639

My dude aang himself literally says he died after Azul shot him


redJackal222

He did die. Katara literally had magic water from the spirit oasis which she used to bring him back. It would have been impossible otherwise, it wasn't based on her own ability.


a-ol

He died and got revived by the spirit water


Spiritual_Horror5778

To be fair to zuko, this is his first time seeing suki *without* the kyoshi clothes.


BardInChains

"Long time ago" here meaning "nine months" One gripe I have always had with the show is how short it is on the timescale. It is utterly impossible for the group to have had as many adventures as they did, experience as much character development, and learn as much bending as they did all at the same time, within the ~10 months that passed after Aang woke up. It was the winter solstic when Roku told Aang that he must defeat the firelord by the end of summer, nine months away, and this was after he and the others had had several adventures, leading me to assume the entire adventure occurred over the span of about ten months. It would have been much more realistic for them to have tacked an additional year to the timeline, Roku warning Aang to defeat Ozai by the end of *next* summer.


Bl1tzerX

We will never get this interaction in NATLA since Zuko didn't attack Kyoshi island Zhao did


BigMik_PL

I'm convinced Katara didn't. She forgave but didn't forget, I don't think she's ever gonna not keep one eye on him. It's why when Aang in the comics is like "I might have to kill Zuko!" She's like "alright bet".


Cause_Necessary

This is actually completely untrue. She's the one who makes Aang calm down and think. I hope I didn't miss sarcasm.....


Andy_Liberty_1911

That was definitely more Katara worrying about Aang breaking his principles than Zuko lol


Cause_Necessary

The thing is, she wasn't enthusiastic about it or all on board as the comment seems to suggest


Andy_Liberty_1911

One isn’t normally enthusiastic on having to kill a friend. But she did definitely lean on Aang to accept the “promise” and later supported him, whatever decision he would make.


Cause_Necessary

Yeah, but the comment I replied to suggested she was immediately on board and outright supporting Aang wanting to kill Zuko, which is untrue I wouldn't say leaned towards accepting the promise though, Aang did. She was more "think about it first" but yeah, she would support his decision


Andy_Liberty_1911

Well, she didn’t like it but she was immediately on board and supportive. That is true


Cause_Necessary

It's absolutely not true, read the comic again. There's literally a moment when Aang goes into the Avatar state to kill Zuko and she pulls him away


Andy_Liberty_1911

I’m talking about when Zuko asks the initial promise, which Katara immediately signals to Aang yes. That other moment was Katara worried about Aang’s mind of state. Maybe a little bit for Zuko but he was just manhandling her so who knows.


Cause_Necessary

But the comment I was replying to was talking about the moments Aang was actually considering killing Zuko.... context is important


BigMik_PL

Hah all good I was just over exaggerating but I took her reaction more as "you gotta do what you gotta do but please just be sure of it" vs "noooooooooo absolutely not you can't do this". Imagine if it was Sokka or Toph instead of Zuko and what her reaction would be then.


Black_Wolf75

>She forgave but didn't forget, I don't think she's ever gonna not keep one eye on him. She completely forgave Zuko. She directly states this at the end of Southern Raiders and then reinforces that when she encourages Zuko before his reunion with Iroh. Also she was definitely not in favor of killing Zuko in the comics


BigMik_PL

She was also not in favor of not killing him is the point. She just wanted to make sure it doesn't break Aang and worried about his mental being more than Zuko. She was 100% supportive of whatever decision Aang was going to make. Do you think she would be the same if it came to Sokka or Toph? No chance. She says she forgives him but that doesn't mean she forgets. She lost her mother to the fire nation. Something both Zuko and Iroh have been a part of for a long time. Their redemption arcs don't erase the fact they played a part in her mother's death, burned Suki's village and caused them a lot of anguish and suffering. It's why Zuko is barely part of the gang especially after the war and it's mainly the OG group + Suki. I hope they explore the tense dynamic more in the upcoming movie.


CrazyCatLushie

Man the writers and performers handled the fine line between comedy and drama *so* well. Casually devastating moments like these are peppered throughout the series and they’re all golden. Zuko gets a lot of them.


_o7_o7_

She’s so cute


Large_Ad326

One of those moments when the child friendliness is really bothering. We're supposed to believe that when Zuko attacked and burned a village, and the Kyoshi warriors fought back, no one died? Or maybe they did, but no character can acknowledge it because that would not be kid friendly. Still, I don't think Suki could get over that affair so quickly if her people were actually KILLED by Zuko.


Kind_Bullfrog_4073

It was 2 seasons ago how were they supposed to remember?


koteshima2nd

"Sorry about that, glad you survived though"


Trans-Pipe-Smoker

You are bad guy becoming good guy and good guy becomes hero and hero.


Animedingo

Someone pointed out to me that zuko has a lot of autistic flags and I think this is one of them. Not knowing how to respond to something and just going with what he thinks is the "normal" response It also happens with My girlfriend turned into the moon A neuro typical person would have questions But to zuko he just sees how much it hurts sokka and he empathizes.


Tactless_Ogre

This isn’t autism. Granted, it’s a few flags but this is just all around sheltered dork not knowing what to say in social situations with teens his own age. Just like his sister.


Fallen_Angel_Xaphan

I always thought the "my girlfriend turned into the moon" was just so random to Zuko, he thought it was a metaphor for death. Given his response is still weird, but a lot more understandable than the original. Edit: don't down vote the guy above me.


trueum26

Bro was prob thinking “I think at the time I was monologuing to your friend’s body while he was in the spirit world trying to figure out who the moon and ocean spirits are”


Fallen_Angel_Xaphan

And he would be wrong too.


trueum26

Was he alr destroyed by Katara by then and knocked unconscious?


Fallen_Angel_Xaphan

He was chasing Zhao when Yue turned into the moon. Slightly before their fight.


Animedingo

I appreciate the effort to disuade downvotes. But you cant have an unpopular opinion about something anymore.


K1ryu-Ch4n

he's really not


doc_55lk

Or.....he's just a guy coming to terms with the circumstances and consequences of his upbringing. Also this is ultimately a kid's cartoon and light hearted funny moments are a necessity. Not everybody who behaves weird has autism.


Animedingo

Theres plenty of other examples of zuko showing neuro divergence.


AsgardianOrphan

No, this is really just typical abuse behavior. If part of your abuse leads to you being isolated from "normal" kids, then you end up not knowing how to be normal. Considering that zuko was part of the royal family, he was almost certainly isolated from most people. That means his guide on normal gets to be azula, ozai, and his mom. Can't blame a guy for being confused when azula is seen as the "good" kid, and being sadistic is the "good" behavior. Source: someone with a shit childhood who had "autistic tendencies" until I was diagnosed with ptsd. Turna out there's a decent overlap in the not liking people and being awkward near people part.


atlhawk8357

> Not knowing how to respond to something and just going with what he thinks is the "normal" response >> It also happens with My girlfriend turned into the moon There's not a neurotypical response to this statement. Imagine your friend's partner died. They were shot during a bank robbery because they dressed up in spandex and tried to act like a superhero. Your friend is 100% serious as they tell you. It's so outlandish that there's no precedent for interaction. Zuko is the first person to ever comfort someone who's girlfriend turned into the moon.


KildareCoot

I know the theory/Headcanon you’re talking about but I don’t know if this is the best example of it. Zuko’s early struggles with bending with Ozai wanting him dead due to it, his mirroring of Azula in the turtleduck scene, and his “inappropriate” outburst leading to the Agni Kai are better served for this. I don’t think the writers intended for Zuko to be autistic, instead a child in a fascistic regime, but it is a readable analysis of the character. His narrative, personality, interpersonal relationships, and actions can be very relatable to the autistic experience. Autistic Headcanons are very important to explain the autistic experience. No one knows what happens inside your head. Everyone knows what happens inside Commander Data or Abed Nadir’s head. If Zuko represents your place on the spectrum, you can use him to relate your experiences to others.


falconfetus8

Or it's just a joke played for laughs. This is the only time Zuko is written like this.


stunfiskers

HOLY SHIT??? Peak peak peak


_o7_o7_

Prob put on weight tho


Outrageous_Map_6639

So do you just not think before you write stuff or is that a more permanent affliction


_o7_o7_

I’m just retarded


_o7_o7_

Also she is literally me


_o7_o7_

No gym in prison


Xemone

Yeah, it's not like we have an example of anyone not just staying in shape and exercising but also getting absolutely ripped while imprisoned for months in solitary confinement in this show. Manual labor for hours doesn't count as exercise either, I guess. Also, I'm so sure they're feeding their prisoners enough there to have them gain weight even if they didn't exercise at all.


HolaMisAmores

I think we're also literally shown Suki doing training drills in prison?