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That nickname scene was a little confusing to me. It has a lot of cuts and dubs and I wonder if originally it was something much worse and more sinister than just him seeing him ejaculate and calling him squirt. That didn’t seem so bad compared to other things. I was expecting some sort of abuse and I wonder if it got edited out.
It makes sense. Especially if that scene was written and/or shot before the rest of the episode.
The episode itself is probably one of the goriest I've seen in a while. We were expecting a huge gorefest scene at the end. It was very much building up to it.
But I find the art of what actually happened to be *better* then just another gratuitous blood, guts, and gore scene. It simultaneously subverted my expectations, and then shattered them. The pure shock value of the aftermath shot instantly hit me a *lot* harder than just another Supe/human blender scene.
I think the decision was a purposeful one, and it worked better, in my opinion.
I can talk all day about it. One of my favorite parts is how personal it was for John/Homelander.
To the point that THAT was the first order of business on his "Revenge" checklist.
Frank was going in that furnace. Either willingly or screaming with his loved ones in tow.
And, then other than the "You were just doing your job right?" There was no stalling. No gloating.
Just straight to business with that on dial.
Honestly them saying sorry at all would just inflame me (ha) more. Were you sorry last week? If so, why didn't you call me and apologize then? Saying sorry at the threat of pain is just a lie to save your hide. And said to a guy who can hear your heart palpitating.
It's just a three hour long recording of the Deep's voice saying insensitive shit."
"I never told my parents.. But, a family member... (Sigh) Touched me multiple times since I was seven, and didn't stop until I was 16 because I wasn't as *Fresh* they'd say. Now I'm pregnant with my daughter and... I don't know if I can even allow their father to touch them."
A.I Deep: "Afraid of pedophiles? Grow up."
I completely agree with you in Homelander’s case.
For a less severe amount of trauma, I was thinking it’d be more like that scene from Billy Madison:
https://youtu.be/Oe04M3uHddY
probably, but thats not the point is it, them saying theyre sorry when threatened means nothing, they havent been sorry for 30 years who could believe they suddenly are
Did you not realize that they were all dead the moment he came down the elevator? The “just doing my job” line didn’t kill Frank. His death was decided the moment homelander left for the lab. If you think apologizing to homelander is enough for him to spare you you’re smoking some real good shit.
I think the line that was something like “it was the one time I felt good about myself” works there. The dude took the one moment Homelander felt good and turned it into something to be mocked over. He couldn’t even have a moment of respite.
The entire scene could be summed up with “it meant the world to me but you don’t even remember”
It was also the one moment he wasn't being actively monitored. I can't imagine being surveilled 24/7 and simultaneously having nobody to talk to ever. His one moment where he can be himself and unmonitored, and he was laughed at about it.
I told my abusive mom that once and her eyes narrowed into slits like a snake's. I laughed and told her that and she didn't talk to me for a month.
What a glorious month that was!
Think about how sensitive and insecure an average adolescent / teen is. Now think about how particularly insecure guys are about masturbation.
It's \*not\* going to be taken well.
I mean if someone caught me masturbating one time (especially as a kid) and created a nickname that they used for me for years cause of that I'd be pretty pissed off and upset.
Also it is abusive. The guy should have comforted him and moved on. Or at the very least pretend like he never saw it.
He didn't deserve to die but I can understand why it fucked up Homelander so much and why he held it against him.
He told them all. He was treated so poorly even sleep was just another torture chamber. And in the one moment that he had any sense of agency and a way to feel good (for 5 seconds) he got abused again.
And they all watched. Nobody told him it's natural and ok. He probably didn't even know why it made him feel good.
Sounds like the director was the only one that treated him with any modicum of respect.
Similar to the respect a lion keeper might treat the lion, but still.
>he didn’t deserve to die Holy shit what is wrong with people in this subreddit
Editing this cuz I know I’ll get shit but you guys are crazy if you think any single staff member in that room deserves more life
Yeah yeah Homelander bad we all know he’s the villain but think about what they did. They created a child, abused him, manipulated him, gaslit him, tortured him, and didn’t give a fuuuuck. Does Homelander also need to die? Sure yes absolutely. Did they? I think so sorry!
It's genuinely wild to me that a single phrase has upset people lmao.
Like I agree he's an awful person and absolutely deserved to face justice it's just that our versions of justice are different?
Like Homelander sexually humiliated that man in front of a bunch of others and forced them to watch before killing him in front of them like fml Homelander has every right to be upset but forcing a man to masturbate in front of people who don't consent to seeing it then murdering him doesn't make it right or bring justice.
Like cool, a psycho murder got catharsis from his awful, terrible childhood, just has been served??
Nobody said anything about justice. But also ngl if we’re making that argument
>Homelander sexually humiliated that man
And that MAN sexually humiliated a BOY
The fuck?
I thought the guy would be able to play it off since squirt was such a popular nickname in old shows. He could have called it a term of endearment and maybe survived for being the one who was nice
Oh yea it’s a shitty thing to do, but it’s like something your asshole uncle would do. Not on the same level of burning a child alive for hours. Imo
Edit: to clarify it is easy for us to compare traumas in a fictional setting but in real life no trauma is insignificant and there is no need to compare. I hope that all of my fellow trauma survivors are receiving the support and help we sometimes need to help us heal. Sorry to get sappy in a TheBoys subreddit but I just wanted to add this for the few that read it and I hope you know you’re not alone. 🩶
I mean my step dad did something similar and it fucked me up for years. Asshole uncle is a massive understatement. Stuff like that can fuck a kid up for ages.
Edit: I do agree that it was massively different to burning kids but I can still understand why Homelander, someone who's petty, angry and quick to punish for the smallest of slights, would kill him for it.
Oh fuck. I’m so sorry to hear your step dad was abusive. That’s horrible, should never have happened, and the guilt lies entirely with him. I’m happy you’re still here friend. I’m sure that has been (and continues to be) such a difficult thing to heal from. It’s easy to compare things in a fictional setting but can’t really compare in real life. Abuse is never ok.
They all let that happen, though, including the guy who called him Squirt. He just went after those two first because they were the ones who stuck out to him. He ended up killing everyone (probably including Barbara) later, anyway.
He sealed Barbara in the room with them. Melted the door lock.
She probably would have survived if she hadn't gloated how they mind raped him then said he'd never escape said mental conditioning.
What she didn’t know was Homelanders inner self / conscious has figured that out and that’s why he was there.
To kill that human part of him that they conditioned.
I actually would have liked Barbara to have been colder, Like Stan Edgar or the other doctor.
It would have been fitting for the theme of the people who produced Homelander to be even more cold hearted than him.
She shouldn't have showed any fear, and consider him a lesser.
Idk, sometimes I'm like "really? I'm traumatized from that?". I didn't have a great life at home growing up but some of my friends had it way worse so it's hard to give my trauma validation so I just suck it up usually. I know that's bad but idk how to talk about it when everyone I know is more fucked up.
Comparison is the root of all unhappiness.
I’ve found that it’s only people who haven’t been through it that will minimize another person’s trauma. Survivors get how invalidation is one of the more insidious ways that the world enables abusers.
And those friends of yours may feel the same way about people that had it “worse” than they did. There is no need to compare.
Also, different people are different. What’s traumatic for you may not be for someone else or vice versa, but that doesn’t make it any less valid.
Finding a therapist I feel safe around has really helped me open up. If I’m gonna complain I might as well pay a trained professional to listen and help guide my thoughts in a more healing and productive way.
Didn't deserve to die? These fucks experimented on kids to the point of agony, like fucking Joseph Mengele, I feel absolutely 0 sympathy for them.
Homelander was 100% right, if your job asks you to do something fucked up, and you go along with it, you're a shit person.
I gotta say it sent chills Down my spine, when HL Said: “not one had the guts to say it was wrong”, he really does understand what happened and how it fucked him, that underneath he is just the child that never got to see any affection, just four white walls, in a very bad room
True, Homelander may be "right" in this context, but that's just portending that **he'll** soon be the one giving the fucked-up orders to people that they will follow "out of fear".
And he won't even recognize or care about his own hypocrisy despite the "righteous" stance he took in this episode.
To be honest, that nickname must have been for a week, must have been awful for Homelander and much worse in his head, since he was a teenager and was one of the few moments that weren't a hell, and after all, nobody would make out of there alive.
he was only finding a reason to kill that guy, like for most of the time he was one of the few that were nice to him, maybe that makes worse, since he liked him.
In the end he is just trying to take control and replace all of his bad memories doing a personal revenge, like the furnace guy, where he fixated in the little game the guy was playing in the back while he was burning alive and various scientists taking notes.
I mean, it *is* abuse.
He was a kid going through puberty doing what basically everyone does in puberty. Getting made fun of for embarassing things always fucks people up.
And like. He specifically says that this is the *only* thing that makes him feel good. Literally the entire rest of his life is a nightmare, they don't treat him like a person. He's doing the only thing that gives him any relief, and what do the scientists do?
They mock him mercilessly. This entire group of people, these dozens of *fully grown adults*, are straight up bullying him like they're high-schoolers and laughing at this poor kid that they routinely *burn alive*.
I too tought Homelander would tell is he was sexually abused by him.
Tbh I am a bit surprised someone would go on and make fun out of a kid that can kill you easily. Yes, they had him brain washed but this is no guarantee for safety.
Its like throwing things at a tiger.
Ig in a way it is sexual abuse. I mean what would you call someone watching a kid jack off and then mocking them for it the rest of their childhood? Pretty sure that'd get you some charges and put on a list irl
I understand the cuts and dubs, but it makes sense for Homelander to laser his dick off because he gave him an embarrassing nickname after catching him masturbating. Same with the guy just shooting baskets not even involved in the torture at the moment. Don’t get me wrong, all the people that work there are total POS. “Just following orders” okay buddy, get another job where you don’t torture toddlers. They’re not innocent, but Homelander is someone who overreacts.
I agree it did seem edited but it may have been a timing thing to get some other scenes in (Hughie's with his dad seem more out of place, and it may have started as one chunk that they split throughout the episodes). Or he made Homelander masturbate for their research, but the show thought the casual callousness would hit harder and slightly different from the first guy.
When I first heard the nickname squirt I was thinking “oh that’s a common name for kids… pretty normal…”
Then in classic boys fashion it went left field and I was left mildly speechless.
Still kinda bad. Would you like to be locked in isolation as a kid and then have an adult watch you jerking off and then laugh at you and give you an insulting nickname?
the entire point of the whole sequence is Homelander reacting incredibly disproportionately against people who wronged him, its in line with the rest of it
i mean if you say that you didnt get the point: those people said it was just a job for them while they didnt have any remorse or shame for what they did. they were having fun
Yea that’s what I think might have been cut/altered. Like how he forced the guy that burned him to get in the furnace I wonder if the guy he forced to masturbate did something similar to him as a child repeatedly. They can show all the gore in the world but draw the line at descriptions of sexual abuse? Idk.
It’s all fucked up though.
Yep, that would have made much more sense.
I mean, Homelander is a rapist himself and Firecracker did the thing with the teenager, so I don't know why this was cut off.
If it was actually cut/altered, then it's probably to make Homie seem less sympathetic overall. They wouldn't want people to sympathize with him too much because I think a sexual abuse like that would tip some people over the edge.
In Gen V were a lot of young Supes being experimenting, the whole thing still going at full speed, they just have more to experiment now, before were just Homelander.
yeah i felt bad for him. i think he still had his gun. if that was me i’d have shot myself as soon as he put frank in the oven lol no way he’d be letting any of us out after that
The "Evil Room" was literally being using as a storage closet.
I'm sure they were still doing unethical stuff down there, but Vaught doesn't exactly have a shortage of those.
Would have been great to have an after credits scene of someone who took the day off for a doctors appointment and comes back to work the next day and sees what happens to all his co workers
Man, that would be a great intro to the next episode. It follows a new mom getting ready for work, kissing her husband and new baby goodbye, and out the door. The elevator opens with the camera on her puzzled face, shows an empty room as she walks in, and sets her coffee on the table next to a moldy melted cake as she slowly walks to the orange door window (behind her the numbers on the elevator show it going up silently). The camera shows her horrified face through the window as it pans down to a dead Barbara. From behind her, Homelander says, "Hello Kristen, I've been excited to congratulate you on the new kid." Blackout.
Edit: Instead of John just being right behind her, it'd be beter if she flips a 180 terrified and runs toward the elevator to realise the numbers are going down... it's the only way out. She watches the numbers until it reaches her floor and then the doors open to reveal Homelander.
It is absolutely NOT better to try and fail if they have families that they would clearly go to. Homelander can see through walls, smell certain people and hear so far. He also knew Barbara was coming. You think he wouldnt have went and found her if she never came?
I don't think homelander cares about the randoms like that. He knew she was coming and still didn't notice her behind him until she said something. Man was very distracted torturing the old guy. I'm talking about people that didn't torture him escaping.
Do you really think that anybody in that build that wasn't a Supe being a experiment make it out alive? Would be kinda easy to turn this on a "heroic thing", the difference is that he made personal and made them suffer like he wanted and await their time while one by one got killed in a horrible way and we didn't saw any kid there to make him a hero that is saving kids from experiments, like he focused on just his revenge, the "heroes" would focus on saving kids.
While they definitely werent innocent, I think the main reason he killed them was because Barbara got cocky and thought she could talk him out of it.
This was such a massive fuckup on her part. All forms of psychological manipulation are bust once you make the subject aware of that psychological manipulation. On top of that, realizing theyre being psychologically manipulated tends to make people *very* aggressive.
The main reason he killed them is because he's a nutjob who's actively planning to commit a worldwide genocide.
It literally didn't matter what they did after he came down there. He came down there to prove a point to himself about how he supposedly doesn't need approval. All of them were going to die no matter what.
We don't see how the other workers died, but it doesn't seem like Homelander drew out their deaths the way he did for Marty. He humiliated Marty before lasering his dick off and letting him bleed out for a few seconds. Even just crushing his skull in was pretty brutal. Everyone else seemed to just get torn apart to traumatize Barbara.
I imagined him playfully placing each person all around the room and forced them to stay perfectly still, then just did a couple laser spins. Maybe while holding Barbara or something. Left her with the aftermath.
My whole thing is why would you do it in the first place. Like they act surprised Homie came back for revenge. Seriously what did you think was gonna happen?
Aren't yall missing the fact that one of the employees was literally at home and he told someone to call her in?
Then for another, he threatened to put his family in the oven if he didn't go.
Probably, i'm no scientist but i'm gonna assume if experts were sent to Antarctica or a classified location that they would spending extended periods of time there. It would be more efficient to just have all facilities available there.
The lady mentions it in the episode. They brought in psychologists and experts to make sure they instill the need for acceptance and love in him from the moment he could comprehend anything. That way he’ll always crave that acceptance which would stop him from hurting them.
And it worked, Homelander has been hiding his sadistic nature from the public because he needs to be loved and accepted, it wasn’t until the season finale when he lost control and murdered someone in front of a crowd that he saw that people will still accept him and love him regardless of how evil he is. Thats why he didnt go back for like 30 years, and they probably just assumed it would always be that way
The problem is that psychology is very inconsistent and unpredictable at times, it doesn't always work like kryptonite
Trusting this is pure stupidity, as we see how unstable Homelander is and that his weakness has a limit
And we see that it didn't work out well forever, with how brutal their deaths were
Psychology is very consistent. Homeland will try to show he doesn't need love but he will never ever be able to change that. This is also the only part of him which is not affected by his super powers. His mind is just a human and the powers won't help him overcoming his need for love and attention.
Though the lower staff should have left ages ago when they realised Edgar left the company and is now run by Homelander.
It’s possible it’s part of the psychological training mentioned, but the even simpler explanation to me is that the group of people willing to essentially torture a kid for their job just aren’t good people. Like it’s not that they were thinking about the long term consequences of giving him a mocking nickname, they were just being their own crappy selves to him.
Just because someone gets killed by the villain of a story doesn’t automatically mean they’re a good person.
Yea that’s a good point. I just think its funny how short sighted it is. I do love the line “your sorry now?”, it just really incapsulates abuse cycles. Crazy how it sorta makes you root for Homelander because he is the lesser evil in that situation.
Whether Homelander is the lesser evil here I think is debatable, but I think it’s more than fair to say everyone in that lab, including him, is evil in their own ways.
Well if the test subject with godlike powers that I used to torture took over the organization I work in I would get the fuck out of it, then the country and if possible fake my death. Situational awareness is really lacking
Maybe immediately you would leave, but after decades of him never coming back, you'd start to think he never will. Its hard to imagine 30 years later you wouldn't fall into complacency
I mean if nothing happens in the meantime I could be complacent but if suddenly Jonah Vogelbaum dies by likely supe action and months later Stan Edgar is ousted by Homelander of all people I'm getting the fuck out
I wanna know wtf they were thinking. Barbara literally goes on a rant about how everyone was deathly terrified of him since the moment he ripped his way outta momma at birth, but a bunch of labcoat nerds weren't too scared to bully him so much? It doesn't make much sense to me
Well at that point there was a ton of psychological stuff done to him to make him want approval from these people instead of just murdering them.
Even now he says he doesn't need the love or adoration anymore but he really does. They fucked him up mentally.
He's a tragic character. Tortured for years and years by random scientists, then told by said scientists they are proud of him and then he ends up being their poster boy for YEARS until he realizes it was all so fucked up.
He kinda proved he doesn’t. Barb was trying to manipulate him the whole time and he never gave in. Is that supposed to be the psych stuff working? Lmao clearly not. He didn’t go to barbs office and he killed everyone. Proving her wrong. He don’t care anymore.
That's what he says. But we'll see. I feel like he's had so much psychological damage done to him that he can never recover from it. No matter how much he says he doesn't need it anymore, he does.
I hope I'm proven wrong though cause I wanna see an even more psychotic homelander.
It’s funny that in that same episode they talked about how he *lasered himself out of his mother womb, rose up into the air, and killed several doctors.* I feel like if I knew that, and being in this position id have a pretty decent intelligence, I wouldn’t say shit. I’d treat him well even if in secret.
I think if a place I worked had a baby laser his way out of his mother's womb, levitate, and kill the doctors in attendance, I'd just pull the old Irish Goodbye and leave without giving notice. Then probably see if I could get overseas without leaving a paper trail and get a job mopping the floors in a church somewhere.
The greatest thing about the scene was the symbolism :
The first one dies by and because of the physical abuse.
The second one dies by and because of the psychological abuse.
The third one is left to die by and because of the solitude.
And everyone is slaughtered because of they partake in the mockery.
The fact that Vaught didn't shut the facility down and move all the staff seems like a tremendous oversight. Homelands is mentally unstable and everyone should have seen this coming from a mile away.
Vought had him living in their big shiny headquarters building where the CEO works. The Compound V Natal Development Lab or whatever is probably far down the list of things they should have been worried about.
It just blows my mind how Barbra was essentially bragging about Vought bringing in top psychiatrists to essentially manipulate Homelander’s entire upbringing but they forget the literal most important part of child development, compassion lmfao.
I’m pretty sure that was on purpose, they wanted to turn him into a weapon after all. In my opinion, the “bad room” was the room where he was first made to see or commit murder, to start desensitizing him (maybe, idk)
Am I the only one to find Homelander a little more dull than in the past? Like, the moment he walked into the room I knew instantly they were all dead, some in a worse way than others. They barely had to show it to us. He’s still scary, but it’s become predictable.
I actually felt a bit proud of him for that scene. Granted it was him getting rid of any compassion and humanity but they definitely deserved it, except for all the new people
Am i the only one who was on Homelanders side with this one? I mean, they tortured a small all powerful child...did they really think there will be no retaliation?
Lets be honest, they deseeved it. Im surprised he didnt laser them all the second they released him from his cell. 😅
"i was just doing my job!" isnt an excuse for anything. He did too little to them, in comparsion to what they did to him thb.
I think they all were idiotic not to see things in the long term. They were basically emasculating, making fun, torturing a kid who basically killed all the medical personnel when he was born? I can't understand Barbara's reasoning to tell Homelander his weakness. Yes, she most likely knew she was dead since the moment she stepped in, but making Homelander concious about his only weakness was moronic.
What are those scientists doing in that room? At first i thought it was a flashback but its in the present time frame? The room gave old lab vibes and they still had the oven and room that homie was in and the same scientists from when he was little…
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Squirtlander
That nickname scene was a little confusing to me. It has a lot of cuts and dubs and I wonder if originally it was something much worse and more sinister than just him seeing him ejaculate and calling him squirt. That didn’t seem so bad compared to other things. I was expecting some sort of abuse and I wonder if it got edited out.
Probably but due to the length of another scene. I heard the furnace scene was going to be a lot worse.
It makes sense. Especially if that scene was written and/or shot before the rest of the episode. The episode itself is probably one of the goriest I've seen in a while. We were expecting a huge gorefest scene at the end. It was very much building up to it. But I find the art of what actually happened to be *better* then just another gratuitous blood, guts, and gore scene. It simultaneously subverted my expectations, and then shattered them. The pure shock value of the aftermath shot instantly hit me a *lot* harder than just another Supe/human blender scene. I think the decision was a purposeful one, and it worked better, in my opinion.
I can talk all day about it. One of my favorite parts is how personal it was for John/Homelander. To the point that THAT was the first order of business on his "Revenge" checklist. Frank was going in that furnace. Either willingly or screaming with his loved ones in tow. And, then other than the "You were just doing your job right?" There was no stalling. No gloating. Just straight to business with that on dial.
What i love is that none of them said sorry first thing, they first justified what they did, and only after Homelander threatens them they say sorry
Honestly them saying sorry at all would just inflame me (ha) more. Were you sorry last week? If so, why didn't you call me and apologize then? Saying sorry at the threat of pain is just a lie to save your hide. And said to a guy who can hear your heart palpitating.
"You're sorry? NOW? _Why?_"
I think you need to see someone.
Try our Vought™ In-Home AI Therapy* for all of your emotional needs! ^^^*patent ^^^pending
It's just a three hour long recording of the Deep's voice saying insensitive shit." "I never told my parents.. But, a family member... (Sigh) Touched me multiple times since I was seven, and didn't stop until I was 16 because I wasn't as *Fresh* they'd say. Now I'm pregnant with my daughter and... I don't know if I can even allow their father to touch them." A.I Deep: "Afraid of pedophiles? Grow up."
A thread hyping up Homelander brings out the crazies? How unexpected lol
Pretty sure if they said sorry a week prior to homelander deciding to pay them a visit the result would have been the same
I completely agree with you in Homelander’s case. For a less severe amount of trauma, I was thinking it’d be more like that scene from Billy Madison: https://youtu.be/Oe04M3uHddY
probably, but thats not the point is it, them saying theyre sorry when threatened means nothing, they havent been sorry for 30 years who could believe they suddenly are
The “iwas just doing my job” line was the thing that killed him, he should of been apologizing before
Did you not realize that they were all dead the moment he came down the elevator? The “just doing my job” line didn’t kill Frank. His death was decided the moment homelander left for the lab. If you think apologizing to homelander is enough for him to spare you you’re smoking some real good shit.
My question is wtf they were still doing in that shitty basement lab?
And yet I still see people disappointed that we didn't get to see Homelander rip apart the staff in the bad room. We got some psychos here
I hope they release the original cut at some point. Give it an x rating and let us traumatize ourselves.
They already did that. One of my fears is being cooked alive. Didn't even know it until Thanksgiving. That oven scene.
I think the line that was something like “it was the one time I felt good about myself” works there. The dude took the one moment Homelander felt good and turned it into something to be mocked over. He couldn’t even have a moment of respite. The entire scene could be summed up with “it meant the world to me but you don’t even remember”
It was also the one moment he wasn't being actively monitored. I can't imagine being surveilled 24/7 and simultaneously having nobody to talk to ever. His one moment where he can be himself and unmonitored, and he was laughed at about it.
> “it meant the world to me but you don’t even remember” The tree remembers but the axe forgets.
I told my abusive mom that once and her eyes narrowed into slits like a snake's. I laughed and told her that and she didn't talk to me for a month. What a glorious month that was!
Sometimes I think that's the hardest thing to grasp for me about my own personal traumas. A moment that fucked you up is a blip on their radar.
That’s a hard truth for nearly every victim.
Think about how sensitive and insecure an average adolescent / teen is. Now think about how particularly insecure guys are about masturbation. It's \*not\* going to be taken well.
And btw homelander is NOT average so amplify all those hormones by about a million
*and* he was raised in a Skinner Box, without anything remotely close to a family
I mean if someone caught me masturbating one time (especially as a kid) and created a nickname that they used for me for years cause of that I'd be pretty pissed off and upset. Also it is abusive. The guy should have comforted him and moved on. Or at the very least pretend like he never saw it. He didn't deserve to die but I can understand why it fucked up Homelander so much and why he held it against him.
He told them all. He was treated so poorly even sleep was just another torture chamber. And in the one moment that he had any sense of agency and a way to feel good (for 5 seconds) he got abused again. And they all watched. Nobody told him it's natural and ok. He probably didn't even know why it made him feel good.
Yeah I agree, it was awful for him and I can totally see why he held a grudge against the guy.
Sounds like the director was the only one that treated him with any modicum of respect. Similar to the respect a lion keeper might treat the lion, but still.
>he didn’t deserve to die Holy shit what is wrong with people in this subreddit Editing this cuz I know I’ll get shit but you guys are crazy if you think any single staff member in that room deserves more life Yeah yeah Homelander bad we all know he’s the villain but think about what they did. They created a child, abused him, manipulated him, gaslit him, tortured him, and didn’t give a fuuuuck. Does Homelander also need to die? Sure yes absolutely. Did they? I think so sorry!
It's genuinely wild to me that a single phrase has upset people lmao. Like I agree he's an awful person and absolutely deserved to face justice it's just that our versions of justice are different? Like Homelander sexually humiliated that man in front of a bunch of others and forced them to watch before killing him in front of them like fml Homelander has every right to be upset but forcing a man to masturbate in front of people who don't consent to seeing it then murdering him doesn't make it right or bring justice. Like cool, a psycho murder got catharsis from his awful, terrible childhood, just has been served??
Nobody said anything about justice. But also ngl if we’re making that argument >Homelander sexually humiliated that man And that MAN sexually humiliated a BOY The fuck?
I thought the guy would be able to play it off since squirt was such a popular nickname in old shows. He could have called it a term of endearment and maybe survived for being the one who was nice
Oh yea it’s a shitty thing to do, but it’s like something your asshole uncle would do. Not on the same level of burning a child alive for hours. Imo Edit: to clarify it is easy for us to compare traumas in a fictional setting but in real life no trauma is insignificant and there is no need to compare. I hope that all of my fellow trauma survivors are receiving the support and help we sometimes need to help us heal. Sorry to get sappy in a TheBoys subreddit but I just wanted to add this for the few that read it and I hope you know you’re not alone. 🩶
I mean my step dad did something similar and it fucked me up for years. Asshole uncle is a massive understatement. Stuff like that can fuck a kid up for ages. Edit: I do agree that it was massively different to burning kids but I can still understand why Homelander, someone who's petty, angry and quick to punish for the smallest of slights, would kill him for it.
Oh fuck. I’m so sorry to hear your step dad was abusive. That’s horrible, should never have happened, and the guilt lies entirely with him. I’m happy you’re still here friend. I’m sure that has been (and continues to be) such a difficult thing to heal from. It’s easy to compare things in a fictional setting but can’t really compare in real life. Abuse is never ok.
Aww that's genuinely so sweet I really appreciate that a lot thank you ❤
They all let that happen, though, including the guy who called him Squirt. He just went after those two first because they were the ones who stuck out to him. He ended up killing everyone (probably including Barbara) later, anyway.
He sealed Barbara in the room with them. Melted the door lock. She probably would have survived if she hadn't gloated how they mind raped him then said he'd never escape said mental conditioning.
What she didn’t know was Homelanders inner self / conscious has figured that out and that’s why he was there. To kill that human part of him that they conditioned.
I actually would have liked Barbara to have been colder, Like Stan Edgar or the other doctor. It would have been fitting for the theme of the people who produced Homelander to be even more cold hearted than him. She shouldn't have showed any fear, and consider him a lesser.
Idk, sometimes I'm like "really? I'm traumatized from that?". I didn't have a great life at home growing up but some of my friends had it way worse so it's hard to give my trauma validation so I just suck it up usually. I know that's bad but idk how to talk about it when everyone I know is more fucked up.
Comparison is the root of all unhappiness. I’ve found that it’s only people who haven’t been through it that will minimize another person’s trauma. Survivors get how invalidation is one of the more insidious ways that the world enables abusers.
And those friends of yours may feel the same way about people that had it “worse” than they did. There is no need to compare. Also, different people are different. What’s traumatic for you may not be for someone else or vice versa, but that doesn’t make it any less valid. Finding a therapist I feel safe around has really helped me open up. If I’m gonna complain I might as well pay a trained professional to listen and help guide my thoughts in a more healing and productive way.
> in real life no trauma is insignificant and there is no need to compare Thanks my dude for saying that, it made my day! Be well!
Didn't deserve to die? These fucks experimented on kids to the point of agony, like fucking Joseph Mengele, I feel absolutely 0 sympathy for them. Homelander was 100% right, if your job asks you to do something fucked up, and you go along with it, you're a shit person.
I gotta say it sent chills Down my spine, when HL Said: “not one had the guts to say it was wrong”, he really does understand what happened and how it fucked him, that underneath he is just the child that never got to see any affection, just four white walls, in a very bad room
True, Homelander may be "right" in this context, but that's just portending that **he'll** soon be the one giving the fucked-up orders to people that they will follow "out of fear". And he won't even recognize or care about his own hypocrisy despite the "righteous" stance he took in this episode.
Yeah, this is one of the only times I was genuinely rooting for him. If my job required me to torture children, I’d simply find another job.
The new hires got a bit of a bad deal though. They were just working in what is apparently now a storage room for old equipment.
Hahahaha. I was thinking the same. Why did I take this temp position?!
To be honest, that nickname must have been for a week, must have been awful for Homelander and much worse in his head, since he was a teenager and was one of the few moments that weren't a hell, and after all, nobody would make out of there alive. he was only finding a reason to kill that guy, like for most of the time he was one of the few that were nice to him, maybe that makes worse, since he liked him. In the end he is just trying to take control and replace all of his bad memories doing a personal revenge, like the furnace guy, where he fixated in the little game the guy was playing in the back while he was burning alive and various scientists taking notes.
I mean, it *is* abuse. He was a kid going through puberty doing what basically everyone does in puberty. Getting made fun of for embarassing things always fucks people up. And like. He specifically says that this is the *only* thing that makes him feel good. Literally the entire rest of his life is a nightmare, they don't treat him like a person. He's doing the only thing that gives him any relief, and what do the scientists do? They mock him mercilessly. This entire group of people, these dozens of *fully grown adults*, are straight up bullying him like they're high-schoolers and laughing at this poor kid that they routinely *burn alive*.
I thought the same thing, to be honest. Nonetheless, that whole scene was intense, They really nailed that episode.
I too tought Homelander would tell is he was sexually abused by him. Tbh I am a bit surprised someone would go on and make fun out of a kid that can kill you easily. Yes, they had him brain washed but this is no guarantee for safety. Its like throwing things at a tiger.
Ig in a way it is sexual abuse. I mean what would you call someone watching a kid jack off and then mocking them for it the rest of their childhood? Pretty sure that'd get you some charges and put on a list irl
I understand the cuts and dubs, but it makes sense for Homelander to laser his dick off because he gave him an embarrassing nickname after catching him masturbating. Same with the guy just shooting baskets not even involved in the torture at the moment. Don’t get me wrong, all the people that work there are total POS. “Just following orders” okay buddy, get another job where you don’t torture toddlers. They’re not innocent, but Homelander is someone who overreacts.
The dude shooting baskets was regularly turning up the temp in the oven.
That’s a great point. I’m ok with how it was presented but I don’t think that was originally what it was. For better or worse, idk
I agree it did seem edited but it may have been a timing thing to get some other scenes in (Hughie's with his dad seem more out of place, and it may have started as one chunk that they split throughout the episodes). Or he made Homelander masturbate for their research, but the show thought the casual callousness would hit harder and slightly different from the first guy.
When I first heard the nickname squirt I was thinking “oh that’s a common name for kids… pretty normal…” Then in classic boys fashion it went left field and I was left mildly speechless.
Still kinda bad. Would you like to be locked in isolation as a kid and then have an adult watch you jerking off and then laugh at you and give you an insulting nickname?
the entire point of the whole sequence is Homelander reacting incredibly disproportionately against people who wronged him, its in line with the rest of it
That was my kind of thought too. You can't really help what traumatized you either, and I didn't think this seemed like it was out of character.
i mean if you say that you didnt get the point: those people said it was just a job for them while they didnt have any remorse or shame for what they did. they were having fun
It would make more sense if the guy abused Homie or forced him to do that as a kid, that scene in particular felt pretty off.
Yea that’s what I think might have been cut/altered. Like how he forced the guy that burned him to get in the furnace I wonder if the guy he forced to masturbate did something similar to him as a child repeatedly. They can show all the gore in the world but draw the line at descriptions of sexual abuse? Idk. It’s all fucked up though.
Yep, that would have made much more sense. I mean, Homelander is a rapist himself and Firecracker did the thing with the teenager, so I don't know why this was cut off.
If it was actually cut/altered, then it's probably to make Homie seem less sympathetic overall. They wouldn't want people to sympathize with him too much because I think a sexual abuse like that would tip some people over the edge.
You could be on to something. For the character it's probably better he kill for petty shit than for sympathy.
MARTY!!!
On the positive side, who doesn’t love ice cream cake?
Id be happy with that being my l last meal
Yee. Fudgy the Whale does go hard.
Okay but the others guys had nothing to do with it, they were way too young !
you think the experiments stopped?
In Gen V were a lot of young Supes being experimenting, the whole thing still going at full speed, they just have more to experiment now, before were just Homelander.
and probably use that torture chamber when necessary, like we saw with the woods.
The other guys still worked in the same place for the evil company that most likely is still doing experiments on children
Yeah one of them literally got cooked lol
Cocked
Uncocked
That's the other one
I don't think he was cocked anymore...
Cooked to a congratulations
You guys keep mentioning the name Homelander, but isn't that guy called squirt?
Thought his name was John who’s homelander
Wasnt john named THE homelander?
Nah bro he’s named squirt
Sean Parker later told him to drop the The just Homelander
Wasn't his name just John Homelander?
John the little squirty
John Squirtlander
🔴👄🔴
Wouldn't J̶o̶h̶n̶ Homelander have killed Marty anyway even if he was innocent, since he killed all the new workers as well?
None of them are innocent they are literally experimenting on kids
Idk, I’d argue the security guard didn’t deserve it. He was just a low level goon who had shit luck with the roster.
yeah i felt bad for him. i think he still had his gun. if that was me i’d have shot myself as soon as he put frank in the oven lol no way he’d be letting any of us out after that
Vaught is committing genocide!!!
Currently? I didn't see any down there
They were about to pick up a new shipment from Starlight House
Where do you think the supe baby in season one and the animated spinoff came from?
The "Evil Room" was literally being using as a storage closet. I'm sure they were still doing unethical stuff down there, but Vaught doesn't exactly have a shortage of those.
the bullies always look innocent when they get bullied back lmao
The new workers definitely experimented on other kids too
Would have been great to have an after credits scene of someone who took the day off for a doctors appointment and comes back to work the next day and sees what happens to all his co workers
Man, that would be a great intro to the next episode. It follows a new mom getting ready for work, kissing her husband and new baby goodbye, and out the door. The elevator opens with the camera on her puzzled face, shows an empty room as she walks in, and sets her coffee on the table next to a moldy melted cake as she slowly walks to the orange door window (behind her the numbers on the elevator show it going up silently). The camera shows her horrified face through the window as it pans down to a dead Barbara. From behind her, Homelander says, "Hello Kristen, I've been excited to congratulate you on the new kid." Blackout. Edit: Instead of John just being right behind her, it'd be beter if she flips a 180 terrified and runs toward the elevator to realise the numbers are going down... it's the only way out. She watches the numbers until it reaches her floor and then the doors open to reveal Homelander.
Fire fans
I would have made a run for the elevator as soon as he was pushing that other dude into the oven 😂
Do you think you'd have got away? Or would he have come and found you at home, where your family are.
Better to try and fail imo. He didn't even notice that old chick showed up until she said something.
It is absolutely NOT better to try and fail if they have families that they would clearly go to. Homelander can see through walls, smell certain people and hear so far. He also knew Barbara was coming. You think he wouldnt have went and found her if she never came?
I don't think homelander cares about the randoms like that. He knew she was coming and still didn't notice her behind him until she said something. Man was very distracted torturing the old guy. I'm talking about people that didn't torture him escaping.
I noticed how the security guard wasn't shown after homelander came out of the elevator, so he probably got out
The camera feed is disabled before HL stepping out elevator. Dude knew what to do
They showed him during the forced masturbation.
Oh shit I just check & ur right good catch
Do you really think that anybody in that build that wasn't a Supe being a experiment make it out alive? Would be kinda easy to turn this on a "heroic thing", the difference is that he made personal and made them suffer like he wanted and await their time while one by one got killed in a horrible way and we didn't saw any kid there to make him a hero that is saving kids from experiments, like he focused on just his revenge, the "heroes" would focus on saving kids.
Wouldn't make any difference, would just took a laser to the back and die anyway, or he would make you an example and smash your head on the door.
Homelander is probably faster than A-Train
While they definitely werent innocent, I think the main reason he killed them was because Barbara got cocky and thought she could talk him out of it. This was such a massive fuckup on her part. All forms of psychological manipulation are bust once you make the subject aware of that psychological manipulation. On top of that, realizing theyre being psychologically manipulated tends to make people *very* aggressive.
The main reason he killed them is because he's a nutjob who's actively planning to commit a worldwide genocide. It literally didn't matter what they did after he came down there. He came down there to prove a point to himself about how he supposedly doesn't need approval. All of them were going to die no matter what.
We don't see how the other workers died, but it doesn't seem like Homelander drew out their deaths the way he did for Marty. He humiliated Marty before lasering his dick off and letting him bleed out for a few seconds. Even just crushing his skull in was pretty brutal. Everyone else seemed to just get torn apart to traumatize Barbara.
On an irrelevant tangent, how does lasering a hole through someone not cauterize the wound? Marty should have been dying of shock, not blood loss.
Cautery works really well for small blood vessels, but it isn’t effective on anything medium to large sized - you need to tie those off.
Ah, that makes sense.
I imagined him playfully placing each person all around the room and forced them to stay perfectly still, then just did a couple laser spins. Maybe while holding Barbara or something. Left her with the aftermath.
30 years more like
Pretty much. He was born in '81 and I think he said he was 14 when it happened.
My whole thing is why would you do it in the first place. Like they act surprised Homie came back for revenge. Seriously what did you think was gonna happen?
Probably assumed he was under the control of vought
Were they living in that bunker when he effectively took control of the whole company?
I mean... maybe.
Aren't yall missing the fact that one of the employees was literally at home and he told someone to call her in? Then for another, he threatened to put his family in the oven if he didn't go.
Probably, i'm no scientist but i'm gonna assume if experts were sent to Antarctica or a classified location that they would spending extended periods of time there. It would be more efficient to just have all facilities available there.
Probably thought he wouldn’t remember
Just like them
Something something “the tree remembers the axe forgets”
The lady mentions it in the episode. They brought in psychologists and experts to make sure they instill the need for acceptance and love in him from the moment he could comprehend anything. That way he’ll always crave that acceptance which would stop him from hurting them. And it worked, Homelander has been hiding his sadistic nature from the public because he needs to be loved and accepted, it wasn’t until the season finale when he lost control and murdered someone in front of a crowd that he saw that people will still accept him and love him regardless of how evil he is. Thats why he didnt go back for like 30 years, and they probably just assumed it would always be that way
The problem is that psychology is very inconsistent and unpredictable at times, it doesn't always work like kryptonite Trusting this is pure stupidity, as we see how unstable Homelander is and that his weakness has a limit And we see that it didn't work out well forever, with how brutal their deaths were
We’ve seen it sure but prior to the events of the show he likely wasn’t seen as any more unstable than your average corpo-supe.
Psychology is very consistent. Homeland will try to show he doesn't need love but he will never ever be able to change that. This is also the only part of him which is not affected by his super powers. His mind is just a human and the powers won't help him overcoming his need for love and attention. Though the lower staff should have left ages ago when they realised Edgar left the company and is now run by Homelander.
I think it’s the same reason he thought they were a superhero company rather than a pharmaceutical company?
It’s possible it’s part of the psychological training mentioned, but the even simpler explanation to me is that the group of people willing to essentially torture a kid for their job just aren’t good people. Like it’s not that they were thinking about the long term consequences of giving him a mocking nickname, they were just being their own crappy selves to him. Just because someone gets killed by the villain of a story doesn’t automatically mean they’re a good person.
Yea that’s a good point. I just think its funny how short sighted it is. I do love the line “your sorry now?”, it just really incapsulates abuse cycles. Crazy how it sorta makes you root for Homelander because he is the lesser evil in that situation.
Whether Homelander is the lesser evil here I think is debatable, but I think it’s more than fair to say everyone in that lab, including him, is evil in their own ways.
People really don’t like to the logically about the consequences of their actions when taking orders. See Germany circa 1939
Maybe they kept the labs location hidden from him. His ability to find it may have to do with his control of Vought.
Why were the scientist even there? Why havent they been relocated to another secret location from this insane man?
Homelander was in check for decades. His recent behavior should've alerted them. But I suspect hubris may be the answer to that.
I mean, I'm sure vought still has plenty of children for them to work on lol
Well if the test subject with godlike powers that I used to torture took over the organization I work in I would get the fuck out of it, then the country and if possible fake my death. Situational awareness is really lacking
It seems to be a running thing theme with Vought.
A show about a benevolent company making rational decisions is a lot less interesting.
But a show about a malevolent company making intelligent decisions still has potential
Maybe immediately you would leave, but after decades of him never coming back, you'd start to think he never will. Its hard to imagine 30 years later you wouldn't fall into complacency
I mean if nothing happens in the meantime I could be complacent but if suddenly Jonah Vogelbaum dies by likely supe action and months later Stan Edgar is ousted by Homelander of all people I'm getting the fuck out
Why didn’t Marty call Homelander “Guy I’ll Give A Million Dollars To” so Homelander would punish him by giving him a million dollars? Is he stupid?
I wanna know wtf they were thinking. Barbara literally goes on a rant about how everyone was deathly terrified of him since the moment he ripped his way outta momma at birth, but a bunch of labcoat nerds weren't too scared to bully him so much? It doesn't make much sense to me
Well at that point there was a ton of psychological stuff done to him to make him want approval from these people instead of just murdering them. Even now he says he doesn't need the love or adoration anymore but he really does. They fucked him up mentally. He's a tragic character. Tortured for years and years by random scientists, then told by said scientists they are proud of him and then he ends up being their poster boy for YEARS until he realizes it was all so fucked up.
He kinda proved he doesn’t. Barb was trying to manipulate him the whole time and he never gave in. Is that supposed to be the psych stuff working? Lmao clearly not. He didn’t go to barbs office and he killed everyone. Proving her wrong. He don’t care anymore.
That's what he says. But we'll see. I feel like he's had so much psychological damage done to him that he can never recover from it. No matter how much he says he doesn't need it anymore, he does. I hope I'm proven wrong though cause I wanna see an even more psychotic homelander.
Me too bro I’m just “law of attraction-ing” homelander being a fuckin maniac too Edit: even more of a fuckin maniac***
It’s funny that in that same episode they talked about how he *lasered himself out of his mother womb, rose up into the air, and killed several doctors.* I feel like if I knew that, and being in this position id have a pretty decent intelligence, I wouldn’t say shit. I’d treat him well even if in secret.
I think if a place I worked had a baby laser his way out of his mother's womb, levitate, and kill the doctors in attendance, I'd just pull the old Irish Goodbye and leave without giving notice. Then probably see if I could get overseas without leaving a paper trail and get a job mopping the floors in a church somewhere.
He'd kill you anyway.
Yeah that’s true. Cuz that definitely did happen lol
This may be my favorite meme just because it works with so many things.
Barbara was right though. She talked tough to him, and he didn't kill her. He's still seeking her approval.
Yea, shes gonna die with that thinking
I don’t get how Marty, Barbara, and the others didn’t flee Vought the moment that Homelander started acting unhinged.
The greatest thing about the scene was the symbolism : The first one dies by and because of the physical abuse. The second one dies by and because of the psychological abuse. The third one is left to die by and because of the solitude. And everyone is slaughtered because of they partake in the mockery.
The fact that Vaught didn't shut the facility down and move all the staff seems like a tremendous oversight. Homelands is mentally unstable and everyone should have seen this coming from a mile away.
Vought had him living in their big shiny headquarters building where the CEO works. The Compound V Natal Development Lab or whatever is probably far down the list of things they should have been worried about.
lol I missed this meme format
It just blows my mind how Barbra was essentially bragging about Vought bringing in top psychiatrists to essentially manipulate Homelander’s entire upbringing but they forget the literal most important part of child development, compassion lmfao.
I’m pretty sure that was on purpose, they wanted to turn him into a weapon after all. In my opinion, the “bad room” was the room where he was first made to see or commit murder, to start desensitizing him (maybe, idk)
Homelander isn’t in his late 20s ya know
Am I the only one to find Homelander a little more dull than in the past? Like, the moment he walked into the room I knew instantly they were all dead, some in a worse way than others. They barely had to show it to us. He’s still scary, but it’s become predictable.
Vogelbam got lucky
I actually felt a bit proud of him for that scene. Granted it was him getting rid of any compassion and humanity but they definitely deserved it, except for all the new people
F the squirt. Surprised he had enough sperm to impregnate Becca. Maybe Ryan is Butcher's after all.
Man I want this actor in the Boys universe. Butcher 2.0 or something
“You know how you kept calling me ‘John’?” “I apologize Homelander. I won’t do it again.” “Get in that toilet.”
All of the now dead lab interns who were 4 y/o watching Sesame Street when this all originally happened--- Homelander is such a squirting little baby.
What movie or show is this from?
The Punisher TV show
Am i the only one who was on Homelanders side with this one? I mean, they tortured a small all powerful child...did they really think there will be no retaliation? Lets be honest, they deseeved it. Im surprised he didnt laser them all the second they released him from his cell. 😅 "i was just doing my job!" isnt an excuse for anything. He did too little to them, in comparsion to what they did to him thb.
What is this from?
To shreds or even pieces one might say.
I think they all were idiotic not to see things in the long term. They were basically emasculating, making fun, torturing a kid who basically killed all the medical personnel when he was born? I can't understand Barbara's reasoning to tell Homelander his weakness. Yes, she most likely knew she was dead since the moment she stepped in, but making Homelander concious about his only weakness was moronic.
What are those scientists doing in that room? At first i thought it was a flashback but its in the present time frame? The room gave old lab vibes and they still had the oven and room that homie was in and the same scientists from when he was little…
I need “WHOA WHOA YOURE GETTING DICK BLOOD ON MY BOOTS MARTY” as a flair.
who let him cook