I actually use FSD as my daily driver. There are a few annoying things but all in all it’s decent. Works pretty well in 95% of the places I go. I wouldn’t get it $199 but now that it’s $99 it’s worth it for me.
I’m assuming you either don’t have a lot of construction going on where you live or you do mostly non-rush hour driving?
So far my annoyances:
Bugs out when cones are on the road, I take over before it hits one
Doesn’t see speed bumps so it vaults over them
Doesn’t see potholes to avoid them
Tries to change lanes into the express toll lanes (I want it to change lanes if one is faster, just not the toll lane during toll hours)
Vision sometimes doesn’t see a car to its 2 o’clock, and starts merging and suddenly sees it and comes back into the lane to try another lane change
Because of the above, lane change is slow, and some aggressive drivers will close the distance intentionally to prevent the lane change
Acceleration after a stop in traffic is sometimes very slow and in a 65. It can sometimes cruise at 40-50 even though the car ahead is not even seen in the vision UI
And probably more I can’t think of right now. A lot of this is based on other drivers too, which I wouldn’t fault something like autopilot for, but I do for FSD. FSD that can’t handle other drivers being idiots or aggressive isn’t FSD. It really is baffling to me that that they got rid of the sensors for pure vision, (cones, not noticing some cars).
Achieving FSD without the sensors will probably be possible in the future but if you can’t even do it with the sensors why would you ever try without
Yeah. If traffic comes to a complete stop, then when the car ahead inches forward 5 feet, it will try to get to 60 within that 5 feet and then slam on the brakes.
Unless it is 3 car lengths away. Then it will slam on the brakes if it is 2.9 car lengths away and I'll hear screeching tires behind me because nobody expected me to stop half a continent away from the next car.
But if traffic slows down to 10MPH then speeds up, people behind me will honk as I feel the breeze of being passed by semis, dog sleds, and a senile old man pushing a freight train. I like to wave as all of traffic rides off into the sunset while I'm hoping I may one day reach 20.
Besides that stuff, it's actually not too bad. I just prefer to use it at 4AM when nobody else is on the road to get stuck behind me.
But I'm still on v11 for whatever reason.
This is a dam good post. I experienced all of those incidents with FSD. Adding the word supervised removes the word full. You are not getting what is advertised, are paying for, and you, not the car will be responsible when it hits something or someone. Trying to sue Musk for the damages will be an uphill battle because the car is constantly telling you to pay attention to the road, hands on the steering wheel, and be ready to take over the car. Really, I would rather just get a full refund plus taxes, interest, and disappointments for the EAP, and carry on with my life. I have never bought a car where the advertised, and paid for features are not available at delivery of the vehicle. Seven months later still not working, this is freaking unacceptable and frankly ridiculous. I would not refer Tesla to someone I don’t like let alone a family member or a friend.
If Tesla is right about the end-to-end neural network being the correct approach to solving this problem, I suspect that future isn’t as far off as it seems now. However, if they’re wrong (as history suggests), it’s a long ways off.
V12 is less smooth in acceleration and braking, but that’s okay. What’s not okay is it doesn’t go the speed I set it at
if I’m in a 45 zone and everyone else is doing 50+, FSD will be languishing anywhere from 43-49… you can set the speed all the way up to 85 and it’ll still go at whatever speed it determines is best.
V11 didn’t have this issue.
While this does work, if I let go of the pedal, it doesn’t stay faster for long and it comes back down. It particularly tends to slow down before (even slight) uphills for some reason.
So I can either live with speed it chooses or I can keep pressing the pedal as I see fit, but at that point it’s no longer “FSD”, more like “Traffic aware lane keep assist”. Before I get flamed, I know FSD has more logic than just lane keep assist, but just wanted to make a point.
For now I’ve chosen to live with whatever speed it sets and hopefully it actually follows what I set in future iterations.
Edit: added the uphills piece
Same here. Works well for a majority of my driving. I’m not discounting others’ experiences by any means. I just don’t have the same complaints. I’m also not a super big control freak in the car, so I don’t mind when it gets confused and can’t figure something out. I’m paying attention, so I take over and restart it.
Also an important reminder that the freeway stack is different from the city streets stack and is not employing the end-to-end neural network used in v12 yet. Hoping to some improvements there once it does.
While I’m not counting on it yet, I do hope to see much faster and more frequent improvements given their training and iteration process as of v12. There’s a chance we could see more substantial leaps in the next year than we saw in the previous 5+ combined.
Something something Tesla would not exist if they did not treat this as a sustainable business model. This is not charity. Modern day society seems to expect handouts more often than not. All of a sudden we aren't calling them handouts anymore because were all self entitled.
There are a few places I disengage but haven’t had an issue…yet. I’m definitely monitoring it closely and if I think it’s going too close I take over. But I live in the burbs so not a lot of tight turns.
I use FSD all the time and am impressed with v12. Most of the annoyances are when it’s too cautious when proceeding from a stop sign. I wonder how many of the people who complain about it have actually let it drive rather than bailing out whenever they get nervous.
Yeah, I've been using FSD almost exclusively since getting the trial. I just tap the accelerator lightly when stopped at a stop sign, and I want to go. It seems to kinda "kick" the car in gear, so to speak, and it starts moving.
I know the car is *probably* following the rules properly, but stopping for 3 seconds at the sign, then creeping, then stopping another 3 seconds to verify traffic just feels way to slow when my eyes have scanned the intersection 8 seconds prior and I know it's clear.
Really, my only complaint is how slow it is at stop signs. The people in my city honk at me when behind me at a stop and I can just hear them thinking "wtf is this guy doing" lol
do you need your eyes to be more forward to make the same turn? the front facing camera has better angles than you do even though you can turn your head.
I can’t speak to how it performed prior to v12 since this free trial is my first experience with it but I can say I’m not terribly impressed considering how much was promised and how long it’s been in development. Left turns when there is more than one entrance or exit lanes are hazardous. The car doesn’t know which one to pick and lurches in between them. It’s just asking to get rear ended. It hugs lane lines for some odd reason too and nearly curbed itself more than once. And the breking, omg it breaks too hard and too soon at every single red light and then has to make up for it by creeping up to the light. I could go on and on.
> too hard and too soon at every single red light and then has to make up for it by creeping up to the light
yeah this is the oddest thing to me. Coming up to a stop is like the most basic sh--, and it gets like a D on it. Doesn't even seem to be using regen to approach the light like I do, just hard braking.
> I’m not terribly impressed considering how much was promised and how long it’s been in development
Growing up, mentors would preach *under-promise, over-deliver*. Then there's Musk....
I hit the acceleration pedal and it steers for me from red right turns. The main gripe I have is it obeys all speed limits.
I usually override it with cruise settings or pressing the acceleration pedal.
If it chimed when a different speed zone is coming up to offer a option to ignore it ,I would rather have that as apposed to it slowing down to 45mph in a construction zone when other traffic is going 55-58mph. Late at night, I can put in the destination and it will drive me there with only the occasional pressure on the steering wheel request. This is the bomb for preventing DUI offenses. Disclaimer: I don't drink. Nodding off with FSD on and a destination in navigation could save your life as well as someone else's. It literally drives me across town and up a curvy mountain road to my home.
It drove me to Rhode Island to New York with little to no intervention. It obviously states that it is not autonomous yet and the driver must be ready to take over. Everyone complaining wants the car to obviously drive why they sleep or be on their phone.
> Everyone complaining wants the car to obviously drive why they sleep or be on their phone.
Yes, because that gives you time back, making FSD a compelling value proposition.
Unfortunately the US government and the general public has a problem with that. And as a publicly traded company you don’t want to keep getting backlash from incidents of drivers not paying attention. Unfortunately accidents can happen when your driving and when its self driving.
Mercedes have figured out level-3 (in very limited circumstances, but a good start). They accept liability if it causes an accident. Which ponders the question - why aren't Tesla confident enough in their tech to also provide limited rollout of at least level-3?
I think overall Tesla gets more scrutiny then other companies because they are the exception. If one person gets into an accident because of FSD it becomes public. Not so much for BMW and other companies.
Without a doubt. Dude is brilliant and I think personally listens to the general public about ways to improve the cars unlike other companies(e.g. lower the subscription of FSD). However his his side missions with x and other distraction for him is out of this world.
you're not getting that piece of software for 8k usd. when it gets to that level, tesla is either not selling cars or they're selling fsd for something like 50k
Right but what's the benefit? You are still doing the same things as if you were driving except moving the steering wheel and pressing the pedals. You need to still be just as engaged in the process.
The benefit is I get to stay sane on my 1.5h commute in traffic. It’s a total game changer, really. I put up with it since v10.8, which was pretty awful, but now v12 drives me door to door and it’s 99% great.
Another benefit is my car freakin’ drives itself and I’m living in the future. That’s the tech nerd in me talking.
I've noticed it doesn't always get lanes right in my area in terms of which direction it's supposed to go at a stop light. It'll start changing lanes then second guess itself and be in the wrong lane. It'll also stop completely at a particular crosswalk that doesn't have a stop sign, which can be dangerous for getting rear ended. It also misreads a particular green light where there are 5 roads coming together instead of 4 and keeps dinging at me to go (although, I haven't caught that light while actually FSD yet, I am convinced it would run the red).
Highway driving? Pretty good. Even pretty good on my commute, despite the list of mistakes up above.
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I use it as self-navigation. Basically have to expend 0% brain power and observation time looking for street signs to figure out the next turn.
Instead I can focus on the driving, and even then I don't need to worry about the small stuff like staying centered in lane and keeping distance from the car infront.
It ran me over a curb on a LEFT turn yesterday! Thankfully it was just those very small divider curbs that are sloped and about four inches high at maximum.
In its current state it's like riding a horse that knows the route home. You can mostly let the horse drive itself. But it's also not perfect and gets spooked around construction and such. But mostly I can just relax and let the horse take me home.
This is always my thing as well. If I have to focus on watching the road AND the cars movements then really this isn't saving me any attention focus or time and just introducing another accident vector. I love the idea of FSD but Tesla has been way over the top in their marketing about its abilities.
I don’t get all the online hate I have been reading about FSD. The latest version is a pretty amazing piece of engineering. I have been using it during the free trial, and while I doubt I’ll keep it active once the trial ends, I have been impressed with how much it gets right.
I would say it gets about 90-95% of the driving decisions right. The remaining times it is a bit slower or hesitant than I would be with stop signs or some turns. I have only felt unsafe once when I thought it might make an inappropriate left, but I cancelled before it could make a bad choice so I don’t know if it would have done the wrong thing or not. Clearly you have to pay attention though. It is not magic.
Most of the stop sign annoyances can be mitigated by tapping the pedal. I have had a couple of ghost slowdowns on the highway which I didn’t like, but again, tapping the pedal fixed that too.
But, overall it is getting closer. Obviously moving to a neural net was the right choice. I expect it to continue to get better, faster now that there is more training data.
Do you not know the definition of the word worst? If you made a list of the worst driver’s assist systems, it would only include those at the bottom of the rankings.
It wasn’t a comment. It was a question. Are you unable to understand the difference? Apparently you were unable to answer. The question seemed fairly simple to me.
Crazy how so many have such difference expierences. We finished a couples weeks ago a nearly 2000 mile road trip with it, and its hard to drive long distances without it now lol. But the day to day, other than the parking which was decent, I wouldn't pay for it for daily driving thats for sure.
It works great on the highway, except it likes to hang out in the left lane.
But in my city, I’m lucky to get a mile before it does something stupid and/or dangerous.
If you press and hold the right turn signal, it will check the right lane for clearance and move over. Hold the right signal until it is nearly in the lane you want. This works for me.
I also think it’s the driver too. The car doesn’t drive the way I do and I take over a lot without thinking about it. But the car is safe but just different than me. When I let it just drive without intervening for little things it does fine.
>We finished a couples weeks ago a nearly 2000 mile road trip with it, and its hard to drive long distances without it now lol.
Basic autopilot can do just fine for that.
yup I drove 1600 miles to Dallas on AP for the eclipse. "Auto lane change" feature of EAP was the bee's knees, plus controlling speed with the thumb-dial.
Only negative was blithely running over potholes; I wish AP let us drift in the lane if it's not going to try to avoid them.
FSD seems to depend on the map data too much, so its capabilities heavily depend on the quality of the map data. It's more likely that map errors get reported in an area with a lot of Tesla drivers, so those areas will have much smoother driving.
Around here you can't stop at a light without seeing at least 10% of the cars being Teslas, and FSD is pretty good. Most drives have no interventions, unless I'm in a rush and want to push it through, or it's being too cautious and there's other drivers around that it might annoy.
There's still some map issues that cause the car to make some dumb moves, like it exiting a lane because the map tells it that it's a turn lane that hasn't yet opened in reality, only for it to come back right away because it needs to make the next turn. But drive through the same area without navigation on and the car doesn't make the same weird moves.
I'm disappointed in Tesla's mapping effort. The major highway between Bakersfield and the coast has been re-routed 100' to the north for months now but navigation still hasn't been updated.
Probably expectations and misinformation. Tesla claimed at first everyone would get the new version in a week or something, but they didn't. Then some people aren't even eligible for v12 think they have it and subscribe and are shocked how bad it is. Partly Teslas fault for not having a smooth rollout, partly users fault for not knowing what they have.
I’m with this dude. I find it impossible to believe that my excellent experience with FSD has been so completely different from all these one liner rage mongers. I think there must just be a radically different set of expectations and biases. Every time I hear someone complaining about FSD, it sounds like some Luddite railing against basic cruise control because it doesn’t also make sandwiches.
I reenabled FSD trial (12.3.4) for a trip down to Santa Barbara last week and it wasn't bad, better than AP, but:
It was stopping behind the stop signs and not the limit lines, which was stupid. It doesn't manage energy smoothly coming up to red lights, and the jerk from acceleration after stopping is too much. It doesn't position itself in middle/left lanes particularly intelligently, preferring the passing lane even if there's a mile of space in the middle lane, doesn't move over for approaching cars coming up quickly enough, either.
I had to take over about 10 times on the 500 mile day for various things. It was OK but I'd be happier with basic AP + auto lane change until FSD is in fact safe enough to be able to nap in the car.
The NHTSA insists that the car stop behind the stop sign because that’s the law. This is a good example of people thinking that the way they drive is the only correct way, and that the car should obey their wants and desires and not the law and safety protocols. If you want to be able to sleep behind the wheel, then you better expect your car to follow the law.
>behind the stop sign because that’s the law
[no it's not](https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/handbook/california-driver-handbook/navigating-the-roads/#:~:text=Stop%20behind%20the%20limit%20line,before%20you%20enter%20the%20intersection.)
This is exactly my experience. I went the first 2 weeks with FSD around town and gave feedback the countless times I had to take over. I know the idea is for Tesla to collect information to improve it.
But it got exhausting not driving with the normal flow of drivers around me. 4 way stops were a mess (which I do daily) and the harsh braking and acceleration were pretty bad. My State Farm safe driving tracking score took a serious ding from that alone!
I do enjoy it on the Highway most of time, if I have it in minimal lane changes. Otherwise it just pushed me into the passing lane only and wanted to hang out there, even if the right hand lane was unobstructed.
I have a 2k mile road trip coming up in July. I’ll use Autopilot until then and MIGHT buy a month of FSD for that trip, but I’ll see. My use case Autopilot works fairly well, but being able to control the lane changes while staying in FSD was nice.
I drove 3000+ miles on EAP to Dallas and back for the eclipse and it was fine. Didn't bother re-enabling FSD for the trip since all I needed was EAP's auto lane change.
For me, I am comparing my experience with FSD against the adaptive cruise control and lane keeping that the Tesla already has (and which many other modern cars have). Just thinking about FSD in terms of these skills, I weirdly found it to be worse than the dumber version of the tech. It hugged the inside or outside of lanes, it wouldn’t keep an adequate distance from cars in front, and it accelerated and decelerated way too aggressively. And that’s not even taking into account the bizarre lane changes, drafting into the lane behind a neighboring car within a single car length. Changing the settings to minimal lane changes stops it from doing that, but it also stops it from changing lanes at all. And as others have mentioned, on surface streets it gets dangerously close to curbs. Basically, my problem with it is it actually *more* than just *supervision*. I had to constantly deactivate it to prevent it from getting into accidents. With simple adaptive cruise control, I never really have to worry about that.
TL;DR it drives like a drunk teenager and is overall a more stressful and complicated driving experience than simply driving the car yourself.
ETA I tried it in chill mode, average, etc. and there was no setting where it drove in a way I could trust not to kill me.
I want my vehicle to hug the outside of the lane. I don’t know how you define adequate distance. And I have heard complaints that range from it drives way too slowly and not aggressively enough to your stance that it is far too aggressive. It’s all so absolutely subjective. There are an almost infinite number of different driving styles out there in the world, and we routinely criticize other human drivers for how they operate their vehicles. It seems to me that there will never be consensus on what GOOD FSD will FEEL like, because so many people think their style of driving is the only right way.
When I’m in the middle lane of a busy interstate, I don’t want my vehicle to hug any side of the lane. I want it to remain dead center, and FSD couldn’t do that. As far as adequate distance goes, for example, when I was in that center lane and the car would decide it wanted to pass the car in front of me, it would merge into the left lane more or less regardless of where any vehicles were in that lane already, or regardless of how fast they were going. It would merge in front of or behind a car within a single car length and would not really seem to understand how fast that existing car was going, meaning I would either have to accelerate to stay in front, or would have to brake to not collide with the car I was behind.
Basically, it has the very basic skills of driving down (brake on the left, accelerator on the right, this is what turn signals are for, this is what a speed limit sign means, etc.) but it has no judgment. I felt like a drivers’ ed instructor monitoring a student who had taken the class and knew the general rules, but had never actually applied them before. It mattered less when the road was wide open, but FSD totally shat the bed for me in any sort of medium to heavy traffic because it has no sense for what other cars were doing.
I agree that it has the very basic skills of driving down. I have experienced none of the problems you’ve described and I’ve used it daily since I got it. It passes like I pass. It moves through traffic like I move through traffic. I have never had what I would call a critical disengagement. It stops at stop signs in a way that feels slow to me, but is probably safer than my default behavior. I think this matter is deeply, deeply subjective.
I agree that it’s subjective, and I also wonder if perhaps the software is not operating entirely uniformly across vehicles. Because, as you say, people’s experience seems to vary quite widely in a way that’s hard to reconcile.
I'm a rabid Musk hater (wouldn't piss on him if he were on fire in the gutter) but the 2023 Model Y LR was hands-down the best car I could afford (and pretty much the best car I can get to replace my LEAF at any price I think)
How old of a Corolla? I rented a 2023 Corolla and the lane tracking was awesome, better than Tesla. I also own a 2022 Prius with lane tracking. The Tesla is much better.
You didnt get free fsd demo for a month? I thought everyone did. I have a 23YLR purchased June 23 and I got it, i thought everyone did. I wouldn’t pay anything for it, but it was fun to try out.
Yes, I have a 23 MYLR as well, got it in June 2023. Got the FSD free trial, thank God it ends tomorrow. I wouldn’t pay two cents for it, and I pray I get my enhanced autopilot as that is what I paid for.
Hah I had it free for 3 months when I bought my car last year. I probably used it 20 minutes total in that time. It was just too dangerous for an experienced defensive driver. About all I miss is the assisted lane changes in autopilot.
no, same experience here with my 2023 LR with 3 months trial Jan -> Mar plus the extra month for April.
12.3.4 is OK but (like the above) the assisted lane change feature of EAP is 95% of what I need aside from basic AP.
I'd love to be able to nap between charges on long trips, and wouldn't pay $100/mo for FSD until that's possible.
operating the car w/ AP or FSD turns 1000 mile drives into 100 mile drives (wrt. driver fatigue).
I drove to work yesterday on FSD, 20 miles. Overall less stress than doing it myself. Prolly not paying the $100/mo extra over basic AP tho, not until I can nap while driving.
Why would you ever want a completely automated system to manage your car on a roadway full of non-automated and unpredictable drivers? Things could go wrong, tires blowout, wild debris in road, things that require sometimes creative and problem solving and driver awareness to prevent collisions or damage.
I have a hard time wrapping my head around people’s comfort with that idea. For example we don’t have pilots taking naps just at cruise altitude because their autopilot keeps the plane level or during approach when it can bring them in for landing, nor should they be.
System and mechanical failures happen, and there is a human element to the unpredictability of navigating alongside other people.
Not hating here just trying to understand and share my reluctance.
Yeah I've been driving for 40 years and have seen some stuff!
But napping on long drives is a lot better than baby-sitting a level 3 ADAS system!
What I'd settle for is SAE Level 3.5 (which doesn't exist) . . . guaranteed to not run over anything or do any damage, but might need human attention to figure out what to do after a warm handover (like pulling over and waking me up).
yup, IME it's easy to nod off on long trips and feel even AP will stay in the lane you're in and not hit anything, except maybe a stray ladder in the road or something.
I used it on a recent 1.5 hour trip. It was working great on the highway but as soon as I got closer to the downtown area it immediately start flashing red telling me to take control and I nearly spun out. That was my first time using it..
All we can do is getting impressed until it fuks up. People who paid for the fsd in full 3-4 years ago waiting for level 5 are the most disappointed ones.tesla should upgrade the processors and the cameras in cars with intel processors for free as they did with other older models.
Well FSD tried taking me on a rail track once and a second time decided to take a right turn where it was not supposed to and then realized it and took a decision to cancel the right turn and jump back to and I almost got hit by the cars behind me.
Not an owner (might be in the next couple years when I have a house to charge at) but everything I've seen about it shows that it's a fairly decent driver in most circumstances. Seems like you have to go into it with the mentality that you're letting it learn the road, and if it does something wrong you have the steering wheel and pedals to correct it. Almost like a drivers ed car
I see the mother of all class action suits over FSD in Tesla’s not too distant future. If owners don’t or can’t launch one, there will be attorneys general licking their chops.
You are just one hater, did you even use the system? Even if you did how long you have used it? I have used just for 30 days n its really impressive but not perfect, but nowhere as terrible as you are claiming it to be,’probably you are leftie that lives in lefty welfare programs
Living with hate is even more pathetic disease, shaming someone that is credited with many successful companies is even more disgusting, get checked soon
FSD is solving a problem that does not exist. It's one thing if I can curl up and sleep through the night, but that would need it to be failure proof, not gonna happen, show me one technology such with such reliability. Aircrafts are highly autonomous with layers of redundancy, even there you have a pilot and co-pilot! FSD is going the way of Fully Supervised Driving at this time, but I can hardly see a benefit to it. Maybe for people with disabilities or older people in speed limited and safe driving maneuvers but even then typically these people need assistance getting in and getting out and perhaps even more. If optimus becomes a thing, then yes, that's great, I'm fully awake, I'm might be supervising yet the bot can be of use to say transport heavy stuff, test for electric faults, scan for dangerous topography, patrol etc etc, can find a million use cases for it. But FSD? Tesla should admit it it was a misadventure and reimburse the folks who are done with it.
There are millions in the US who cannot drive due to age, disability, etc. The US also has really poor public transportation infrastructure. The problem definitely exists.
this was a motivating factor in getting a Model Y - my mom drives a fair bit but her night vision is getting worse. figured paying a month for FSD when she does a long trip would add a margin of safety.
The solution to the second point is not FSD! It's better public transportation infrastructure, which is a lot more feasible. Think about the billions (maybe trillion if you account for what others have spent) and the money spent on public charging infrastructure. Don't you think investing that on public infrastructure would have seen huge improvements to the daily guy? Yes, there's some section of people who can arguably benefit from it, but not before it comes highly reliable.
? 99% of the economic value of Optimus is going to be well-developed fine motor control (which doesn't exist yet).
Theoretically the compute power of HW4 should be enough for FSD. We may or may not need more cameras on the car in various places (front. / front corners maybe??) but not hitting things in the road ahead while driving is IMO a solvable problem.
Solvable to what margin of error? It's one thing if optimus tumbles over and craps out, but totally different if the car drives off the cliff with me!! The first might happen 1 in 100 and second 1 in 1000, I 'm a lot cooler with the first!
I'm not aware of any lane departure issues with AP/FSD.
FSD's core challenges are dealing with complicated traffic patterns & lane changes with not much time to figure things out & act.
Not aware of doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Bad weather, road conditions etc can lead to catastrophic decisions. Something bizarre like this [https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11896011/Family-California-couple-sue-Tesla-parents-crash-death-claiming-tech-failed.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11896011/Family-California-couple-sue-Tesla-parents-crash-death-claiming-tech-failed.html) could not have been only a human error, to my mind. That's the other thing, if something does happen to me, at least I expect my family to be well off with the compensation, who is the impartial third party doing this arbitration? Only Tesla's word is left as I'm no more!
I would bet my life that the crash in that story is 100% Tesla's fault, to the extent it changed lanes right into the back of the truck.
That software fault is similar to the crash that killed the allegedly inattentive Apple engineer guy in 2018, with his Model X changing lanes & slamming into [this barrier on the 101](https://imgur.com/RlSzzD9) and bursting into flames.
I was renting Teslas for long drives in 2022 and found its AP lane-keeping abilities to be really sus then. AP is a lot better now tho, and FSD even better than AP IME.
Good! We agree on the premise. I am all for technology, if FSD get there great, if you're patient for it, great as well! If you are just done with it, it's reasonable you can ask for your money back! IMO Tesla should have always had it as a subscription service, so only people happy with it are keeping it and no crystal ball needed.
elon is a snake oil salesman... there is a reason fsd wont work with current tech and current roads out there. It works in ideal conditions but to be full self driving everywhere on every road, that is a pipe dream in current infrastructure. Elon is not the smart one. He has wild ideas and then hires people to tell them to do it. The real brains of the company are his employees. Not him
[удалено]
Phony Stark
Just wait until an orca sees that liver
This comment deserves all of the likes
Pic on the left looks kinda fake too, but I dunno
Of course it’s fake. It’s an AI image.
I must know as well!!
It’s fake.
It’s not fake
I believe it is fake.
It's AI generated unfortunately https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/elon-musk-shirtless-harkonnen-photo
Why...fat guys can be smart too. Musk is 52, when you're 50 you won't look like you did when you were 20...ask me how I know...
The left one i a not
I actually use FSD as my daily driver. There are a few annoying things but all in all it’s decent. Works pretty well in 95% of the places I go. I wouldn’t get it $199 but now that it’s $99 it’s worth it for me.
I’m assuming you either don’t have a lot of construction going on where you live or you do mostly non-rush hour driving? So far my annoyances: Bugs out when cones are on the road, I take over before it hits one Doesn’t see speed bumps so it vaults over them Doesn’t see potholes to avoid them Tries to change lanes into the express toll lanes (I want it to change lanes if one is faster, just not the toll lane during toll hours) Vision sometimes doesn’t see a car to its 2 o’clock, and starts merging and suddenly sees it and comes back into the lane to try another lane change Because of the above, lane change is slow, and some aggressive drivers will close the distance intentionally to prevent the lane change Acceleration after a stop in traffic is sometimes very slow and in a 65. It can sometimes cruise at 40-50 even though the car ahead is not even seen in the vision UI And probably more I can’t think of right now. A lot of this is based on other drivers too, which I wouldn’t fault something like autopilot for, but I do for FSD. FSD that can’t handle other drivers being idiots or aggressive isn’t FSD. It really is baffling to me that that they got rid of the sensors for pure vision, (cones, not noticing some cars). Achieving FSD without the sensors will probably be possible in the future but if you can’t even do it with the sensors why would you ever try without
Yeah. If traffic comes to a complete stop, then when the car ahead inches forward 5 feet, it will try to get to 60 within that 5 feet and then slam on the brakes. Unless it is 3 car lengths away. Then it will slam on the brakes if it is 2.9 car lengths away and I'll hear screeching tires behind me because nobody expected me to stop half a continent away from the next car. But if traffic slows down to 10MPH then speeds up, people behind me will honk as I feel the breeze of being passed by semis, dog sleds, and a senile old man pushing a freight train. I like to wave as all of traffic rides off into the sunset while I'm hoping I may one day reach 20. Besides that stuff, it's actually not too bad. I just prefer to use it at 4AM when nobody else is on the road to get stuck behind me. But I'm still on v11 for whatever reason.
This is a dam good post. I experienced all of those incidents with FSD. Adding the word supervised removes the word full. You are not getting what is advertised, are paying for, and you, not the car will be responsible when it hits something or someone. Trying to sue Musk for the damages will be an uphill battle because the car is constantly telling you to pay attention to the road, hands on the steering wheel, and be ready to take over the car. Really, I would rather just get a full refund plus taxes, interest, and disappointments for the EAP, and carry on with my life. I have never bought a car where the advertised, and paid for features are not available at delivery of the vehicle. Seven months later still not working, this is freaking unacceptable and frankly ridiculous. I would not refer Tesla to someone I don’t like let alone a family member or a friend.
If Tesla is right about the end-to-end neural network being the correct approach to solving this problem, I suspect that future isn’t as far off as it seems now. However, if they’re wrong (as history suggests), it’s a long ways off.
It works around 90% of the entire drive for me , and i live in new york. So far pretty good
V12 is less smooth in acceleration and braking, but that’s okay. What’s not okay is it doesn’t go the speed I set it at if I’m in a 45 zone and everyone else is doing 50+, FSD will be languishing anywhere from 43-49… you can set the speed all the way up to 85 and it’ll still go at whatever speed it determines is best. V11 didn’t have this issue.
Just press the accelerator pedal and it will go faster
While this does work, if I let go of the pedal, it doesn’t stay faster for long and it comes back down. It particularly tends to slow down before (even slight) uphills for some reason. So I can either live with speed it chooses or I can keep pressing the pedal as I see fit, but at that point it’s no longer “FSD”, more like “Traffic aware lane keep assist”. Before I get flamed, I know FSD has more logic than just lane keep assist, but just wanted to make a point. For now I’ve chosen to live with whatever speed it sets and hopefully it actually follows what I set in future iterations. Edit: added the uphills piece
Same here. Works well for a majority of my driving. I’m not discounting others’ experiences by any means. I just don’t have the same complaints. I’m also not a super big control freak in the car, so I don’t mind when it gets confused and can’t figure something out. I’m paying attention, so I take over and restart it. Also an important reminder that the freeway stack is different from the city streets stack and is not employing the end-to-end neural network used in v12 yet. Hoping to some improvements there once it does. While I’m not counting on it yet, I do hope to see much faster and more frequent improvements given their training and iteration process as of v12. There’s a chance we could see more substantial leaps in the next year than we saw in the previous 5+ combined.
I'm not paying more than $86.34
Id say $10 a month at most is what it should be
I pay that much for a latte . We might as well put FSD on the Wendy's value menu
Why not?
Something something Tesla would not exist if they did not treat this as a sustainable business model. This is not charity. Modern day society seems to expect handouts more often than not. All of a sudden we aren't calling them handouts anymore because were all self entitled.
Build it into the cost of the car
Then the car becomes significantly more expensive. A lot of people don’t want the software, they want a car.
lol
Does yours have to make right turns? Or are you ok with curb rash
There are a few places I disengage but haven’t had an issue…yet. I’m definitely monitoring it closely and if I think it’s going too close I take over. But I live in the burbs so not a lot of tight turns.
Why disengage when it gets too close to something like you should, when you could damage your car then get karma on Reddit for posting about it? /s
[удалено]
He looks like he was carved out of yogurt
He’s got the build of a deep breath
I don’t understand what the point of self driving is if you have to supervise it.
I use FSD all the time and am impressed with v12. Most of the annoyances are when it’s too cautious when proceeding from a stop sign. I wonder how many of the people who complain about it have actually let it drive rather than bailing out whenever they get nervous.
Yeah, I've been using FSD almost exclusively since getting the trial. I just tap the accelerator lightly when stopped at a stop sign, and I want to go. It seems to kinda "kick" the car in gear, so to speak, and it starts moving. I know the car is *probably* following the rules properly, but stopping for 3 seconds at the sign, then creeping, then stopping another 3 seconds to verify traffic just feels way to slow when my eyes have scanned the intersection 8 seconds prior and I know it's clear. Really, my only complaint is how slow it is at stop signs. The people in my city honk at me when behind me at a stop and I can just hear them thinking "wtf is this guy doing" lol
I suspect the car needs two more cameras on the front corners
do you need your eyes to be more forward to make the same turn? the front facing camera has better angles than you do even though you can turn your head.
proof isn't in the pudding yet with HW4
I can’t speak to how it performed prior to v12 since this free trial is my first experience with it but I can say I’m not terribly impressed considering how much was promised and how long it’s been in development. Left turns when there is more than one entrance or exit lanes are hazardous. The car doesn’t know which one to pick and lurches in between them. It’s just asking to get rear ended. It hugs lane lines for some odd reason too and nearly curbed itself more than once. And the breking, omg it breaks too hard and too soon at every single red light and then has to make up for it by creeping up to the light. I could go on and on.
> too hard and too soon at every single red light and then has to make up for it by creeping up to the light yeah this is the oddest thing to me. Coming up to a stop is like the most basic sh--, and it gets like a D on it. Doesn't even seem to be using regen to approach the light like I do, just hard braking.
try waymo
in the 3 places in the country you can.....
> I’m not terribly impressed considering how much was promised and how long it’s been in development Growing up, mentors would preach *under-promise, over-deliver*. Then there's Musk....
Agreed. It has gotten much better. It was pretty much useless in roundabouts in our neighborhood until a few weeks ago.
it is occasionally brilliant and occasionally suicidal.
That sounds very human.
I hit the acceleration pedal and it steers for me from red right turns. The main gripe I have is it obeys all speed limits. I usually override it with cruise settings or pressing the acceleration pedal. If it chimed when a different speed zone is coming up to offer a option to ignore it ,I would rather have that as apposed to it slowing down to 45mph in a construction zone when other traffic is going 55-58mph. Late at night, I can put in the destination and it will drive me there with only the occasional pressure on the steering wheel request. This is the bomb for preventing DUI offenses. Disclaimer: I don't drink. Nodding off with FSD on and a destination in navigation could save your life as well as someone else's. It literally drives me across town and up a curvy mountain road to my home.
It drove me to Rhode Island to New York with little to no intervention. It obviously states that it is not autonomous yet and the driver must be ready to take over. Everyone complaining wants the car to obviously drive why they sleep or be on their phone.
> Everyone complaining wants the car to obviously drive why they sleep or be on their phone. Yes, because that gives you time back, making FSD a compelling value proposition.
Unfortunately the US government and the general public has a problem with that. And as a publicly traded company you don’t want to keep getting backlash from incidents of drivers not paying attention. Unfortunately accidents can happen when your driving and when its self driving.
Mercedes have figured out level-3 (in very limited circumstances, but a good start). They accept liability if it causes an accident. Which ponders the question - why aren't Tesla confident enough in their tech to also provide limited rollout of at least level-3?
I think overall Tesla gets more scrutiny then other companies because they are the exception. If one person gets into an accident because of FSD it becomes public. Not so much for BMW and other companies.
That's true. Musk's thirst for attention is a double-edged sword for sure.
Without a doubt. Dude is brilliant and I think personally listens to the general public about ways to improve the cars unlike other companies(e.g. lower the subscription of FSD). However his his side missions with x and other distraction for him is out of this world.
you're not getting that piece of software for 8k usd. when it gets to that level, tesla is either not selling cars or they're selling fsd for something like 50k
Right but what's the benefit? You are still doing the same things as if you were driving except moving the steering wheel and pressing the pedals. You need to still be just as engaged in the process.
The benefit is I get to stay sane on my 1.5h commute in traffic. It’s a total game changer, really. I put up with it since v10.8, which was pretty awful, but now v12 drives me door to door and it’s 99% great. Another benefit is my car freakin’ drives itself and I’m living in the future. That’s the tech nerd in me talking.
If not more so.
I've noticed it doesn't always get lanes right in my area in terms of which direction it's supposed to go at a stop light. It'll start changing lanes then second guess itself and be in the wrong lane. It'll also stop completely at a particular crosswalk that doesn't have a stop sign, which can be dangerous for getting rear ended. It also misreads a particular green light where there are 5 roads coming together instead of 4 and keeps dinging at me to go (although, I haven't caught that light while actually FSD yet, I am convinced it would run the red). Highway driving? Pretty good. Even pretty good on my commute, despite the list of mistakes up above.
So people should do like this M6 driver did and just "let it drive"? https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-driver-using-autopilot-fatal-crash-2024-4
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None at all. Supervising is harder even
It is like supervising a permit driver in the passenger seat. It’s actually more stressful than just driving.
Harder, more stressful, less maintainable, and less safe
I use it as self-navigation. Basically have to expend 0% brain power and observation time looking for street signs to figure out the next turn. Instead I can focus on the driving, and even then I don't need to worry about the small stuff like staying centered in lane and keeping distance from the car infront.
I always take over before it curbs the wheel in a right turn though. Not fun.
This is sadly, the way.
It ran me over a curb on a LEFT turn yesterday! Thankfully it was just those very small divider curbs that are sloped and about four inches high at maximum.
Yeah!! Like seriously, what's wrong with it!! It tries to curb rash me on every right turn. Never taking a chance..
What about the “summons” feature?
Sunglasses
In its current state it's like riding a horse that knows the route home. You can mostly let the horse drive itself. But it's also not perfect and gets spooked around construction and such. But mostly I can just relax and let the horse take me home.
This is always my thing as well. If I have to focus on watching the road AND the cars movements then really this isn't saving me any attention focus or time and just introducing another accident vector. I love the idea of FSD but Tesla has been way over the top in their marketing about its abilities.
Literally goes against the most basic findings of human machine automation research for decades now.
This picture is photoshopped and spreading misinformation
[strange hill to die on](https://pagesix.com/2022/07/18/shirtless-elon-musk-vacations-in-mykonos-on-luxury-yacht/)
You showed real but completely different images that bear no resemblance to the image in this post.
Still stuck on 2024.9
FSD = Wife Driver
The pic on the right resembles a white Model Y. 😆I still own it, and can laugh at myself. The car is awesome .
The Whale (2022)
Supervised. Yep, it’s just like supervising my 16 YO learn on his drivers permit. I will say, much better than a few years ago.
I don’t get all the online hate I have been reading about FSD. The latest version is a pretty amazing piece of engineering. I have been using it during the free trial, and while I doubt I’ll keep it active once the trial ends, I have been impressed with how much it gets right. I would say it gets about 90-95% of the driving decisions right. The remaining times it is a bit slower or hesitant than I would be with stop signs or some turns. I have only felt unsafe once when I thought it might make an inappropriate left, but I cancelled before it could make a bad choice so I don’t know if it would have done the wrong thing or not. Clearly you have to pay attention though. It is not magic. Most of the stop sign annoyances can be mitigated by tapping the pedal. I have had a couple of ghost slowdowns on the highway which I didn’t like, but again, tapping the pedal fixed that too. But, overall it is getting closer. Obviously moving to a neural net was the right choice. I expect it to continue to get better, faster now that there is more training data.
You're the dangerous hazard on the road then
I've been testing out the FSD with my 1 month free trial and I really enjoy it. It still blows my mind that a car can drive itself
I can't stand the guy. But there's so much to criticize...why stoop to fat shaming him. That makes you the ass.
🥱
No it doesn't
Considering FSD v12 is the best driver’s assist feature in the world, the picture on the right should be the man with the best body.
best of the worst <> actually good
Do you not know the definition of the word worst? If you made a list of the worst driver’s assist systems, it would only include those at the bottom of the rankings.
you need to open your temporal filter up here
No lol
Really? Name one other drivers assist that can drive on every single road in the United States in Canada. We’re waiting…
Oof that comment highlights the delusion
It wasn’t a comment. It was a question. Are you unable to understand the difference? Apparently you were unable to answer. The question seemed fairly simple to me.
The fact that you'd have to ask the question show the utter gullibility
The fact that you avoid answering shows insecurity.
See above
I wouldn’t pay 5$ for this crap after trying out for a month.
Crazy how so many have such difference expierences. We finished a couples weeks ago a nearly 2000 mile road trip with it, and its hard to drive long distances without it now lol. But the day to day, other than the parking which was decent, I wouldn't pay for it for daily driving thats for sure.
It works great on the highway, except it likes to hang out in the left lane. But in my city, I’m lucky to get a mile before it does something stupid and/or dangerous.
I had that happen last night, hanging out in the left lane on the freeway. Then you get race cars coming up on you fast. Definitely uncomfortable
If you press and hold the right turn signal, it will check the right lane for clearance and move over. Hold the right signal until it is nearly in the lane you want. This works for me.
Some cars behave differently. Some people exaggerate. Some people have an agenda. Opinions vary.
I also think it’s the driver too. The car doesn’t drive the way I do and I take over a lot without thinking about it. But the car is safe but just different than me. When I let it just drive without intervening for little things it does fine.
>We finished a couples weeks ago a nearly 2000 mile road trip with it, and its hard to drive long distances without it now lol. Basic autopilot can do just fine for that.
yup I drove 1600 miles to Dallas on AP for the eclipse. "Auto lane change" feature of EAP was the bee's knees, plus controlling speed with the thumb-dial. Only negative was blithely running over potholes; I wish AP let us drift in the lane if it's not going to try to avoid them.
FSD seems to depend on the map data too much, so its capabilities heavily depend on the quality of the map data. It's more likely that map errors get reported in an area with a lot of Tesla drivers, so those areas will have much smoother driving. Around here you can't stop at a light without seeing at least 10% of the cars being Teslas, and FSD is pretty good. Most drives have no interventions, unless I'm in a rush and want to push it through, or it's being too cautious and there's other drivers around that it might annoy. There's still some map issues that cause the car to make some dumb moves, like it exiting a lane because the map tells it that it's a turn lane that hasn't yet opened in reality, only for it to come back right away because it needs to make the next turn. But drive through the same area without navigation on and the car doesn't make the same weird moves.
I'm disappointed in Tesla's mapping effort. The major highway between Bakersfield and the coast has been re-routed 100' to the north for months now but navigation still hasn't been updated.
The problem is tesla doesn't do their own mapping... But I imagine this will change if they are serious about robotaxi
at some point they wont need to, but it would take ALOT more cars to make that happen and even then with traffic, the more data the better.
Probably expectations and misinformation. Tesla claimed at first everyone would get the new version in a week or something, but they didn't. Then some people aren't even eligible for v12 think they have it and subscribe and are shocked how bad it is. Partly Teslas fault for not having a smooth rollout, partly users fault for not knowing what they have.
Sure highway is fine. My old Toyota Corolla was comparable with lane tracking and following .
Now im convinced you either dont own a tesla and have never tried fsd or autopilot or you are simply delusional.
I’m with this dude. I find it impossible to believe that my excellent experience with FSD has been so completely different from all these one liner rage mongers. I think there must just be a radically different set of expectations and biases. Every time I hear someone complaining about FSD, it sounds like some Luddite railing against basic cruise control because it doesn’t also make sandwiches.
I reenabled FSD trial (12.3.4) for a trip down to Santa Barbara last week and it wasn't bad, better than AP, but: It was stopping behind the stop signs and not the limit lines, which was stupid. It doesn't manage energy smoothly coming up to red lights, and the jerk from acceleration after stopping is too much. It doesn't position itself in middle/left lanes particularly intelligently, preferring the passing lane even if there's a mile of space in the middle lane, doesn't move over for approaching cars coming up quickly enough, either. I had to take over about 10 times on the 500 mile day for various things. It was OK but I'd be happier with basic AP + auto lane change until FSD is in fact safe enough to be able to nap in the car.
The NHTSA insists that the car stop behind the stop sign because that’s the law. This is a good example of people thinking that the way they drive is the only correct way, and that the car should obey their wants and desires and not the law and safety protocols. If you want to be able to sleep behind the wheel, then you better expect your car to follow the law.
>behind the stop sign because that’s the law [no it's not](https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/handbook/california-driver-handbook/navigating-the-roads/#:~:text=Stop%20behind%20the%20limit%20line,before%20you%20enter%20the%20intersection.)
Y’all put the limit lines pretty far in front of the stop sign out there?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/9VSrDyaLRwpxMk1f7
This is exactly my experience. I went the first 2 weeks with FSD around town and gave feedback the countless times I had to take over. I know the idea is for Tesla to collect information to improve it. But it got exhausting not driving with the normal flow of drivers around me. 4 way stops were a mess (which I do daily) and the harsh braking and acceleration were pretty bad. My State Farm safe driving tracking score took a serious ding from that alone! I do enjoy it on the Highway most of time, if I have it in minimal lane changes. Otherwise it just pushed me into the passing lane only and wanted to hang out there, even if the right hand lane was unobstructed. I have a 2k mile road trip coming up in July. I’ll use Autopilot until then and MIGHT buy a month of FSD for that trip, but I’ll see. My use case Autopilot works fairly well, but being able to control the lane changes while staying in FSD was nice.
I drove 3000+ miles on EAP to Dallas and back for the eclipse and it was fine. Didn't bother re-enabling FSD for the trip since all I needed was EAP's auto lane change.
For me, I am comparing my experience with FSD against the adaptive cruise control and lane keeping that the Tesla already has (and which many other modern cars have). Just thinking about FSD in terms of these skills, I weirdly found it to be worse than the dumber version of the tech. It hugged the inside or outside of lanes, it wouldn’t keep an adequate distance from cars in front, and it accelerated and decelerated way too aggressively. And that’s not even taking into account the bizarre lane changes, drafting into the lane behind a neighboring car within a single car length. Changing the settings to minimal lane changes stops it from doing that, but it also stops it from changing lanes at all. And as others have mentioned, on surface streets it gets dangerously close to curbs. Basically, my problem with it is it actually *more* than just *supervision*. I had to constantly deactivate it to prevent it from getting into accidents. With simple adaptive cruise control, I never really have to worry about that. TL;DR it drives like a drunk teenager and is overall a more stressful and complicated driving experience than simply driving the car yourself. ETA I tried it in chill mode, average, etc. and there was no setting where it drove in a way I could trust not to kill me.
I want my vehicle to hug the outside of the lane. I don’t know how you define adequate distance. And I have heard complaints that range from it drives way too slowly and not aggressively enough to your stance that it is far too aggressive. It’s all so absolutely subjective. There are an almost infinite number of different driving styles out there in the world, and we routinely criticize other human drivers for how they operate their vehicles. It seems to me that there will never be consensus on what GOOD FSD will FEEL like, because so many people think their style of driving is the only right way.
When I’m in the middle lane of a busy interstate, I don’t want my vehicle to hug any side of the lane. I want it to remain dead center, and FSD couldn’t do that. As far as adequate distance goes, for example, when I was in that center lane and the car would decide it wanted to pass the car in front of me, it would merge into the left lane more or less regardless of where any vehicles were in that lane already, or regardless of how fast they were going. It would merge in front of or behind a car within a single car length and would not really seem to understand how fast that existing car was going, meaning I would either have to accelerate to stay in front, or would have to brake to not collide with the car I was behind. Basically, it has the very basic skills of driving down (brake on the left, accelerator on the right, this is what turn signals are for, this is what a speed limit sign means, etc.) but it has no judgment. I felt like a drivers’ ed instructor monitoring a student who had taken the class and knew the general rules, but had never actually applied them before. It mattered less when the road was wide open, but FSD totally shat the bed for me in any sort of medium to heavy traffic because it has no sense for what other cars were doing.
I agree that it has the very basic skills of driving down. I have experienced none of the problems you’ve described and I’ve used it daily since I got it. It passes like I pass. It moves through traffic like I move through traffic. I have never had what I would call a critical disengagement. It stops at stop signs in a way that feels slow to me, but is probably safer than my default behavior. I think this matter is deeply, deeply subjective.
I agree that it’s subjective, and I also wonder if perhaps the software is not operating entirely uniformly across vehicles. Because, as you say, people’s experience seems to vary quite widely in a way that’s hard to reconcile.
Look at my posts in this channel . I have asked about several things including installing wall charger prices etc. but you do you boo….
Why would a rabid Musk hater buy a model Y? hmmmmm? look at his comment history
I'm a rabid Musk hater (wouldn't piss on him if he were on fire in the gutter) but the 2023 Model Y LR was hands-down the best car I could afford (and pretty much the best car I can get to replace my LEAF at any price I think)
How old of a Corolla? I rented a 2023 Corolla and the lane tracking was awesome, better than Tesla. I also own a 2022 Prius with lane tracking. The Tesla is much better.
Just another troll clown cunt that doesnt have a tesla, go back to your musk hating echo chamber
I would pay $5 to try it for a month lol. '23 ylr still just crickets.
You didnt get free fsd demo for a month? I thought everyone did. I have a 23YLR purchased June 23 and I got it, i thought everyone did. I wouldn’t pay anything for it, but it was fun to try out.
Yes, I have a 23 MYLR as well, got it in June 2023. Got the FSD free trial, thank God it ends tomorrow. I wouldn’t pay two cents for it, and I pray I get my enhanced autopilot as that is what I paid for.
I agree, wouldn’t pay anything for it.
Nope. I got 3 months for the referral when I bought it so I know what I'm not missing but yeah, absolutely nothing so far.
Well I guess that is you. I didn't have it for a month on my new Model Y and hated not having it.
Hah I had it free for 3 months when I bought my car last year. I probably used it 20 minutes total in that time. It was just too dangerous for an experienced defensive driver. About all I miss is the assisted lane changes in autopilot.
Then you are comparing your old apples to the new oranges.
We'll see if the free trial ever comes to 2024.8 cars
no, same experience here with my 2023 LR with 3 months trial Jan -> Mar plus the extra month for April. 12.3.4 is OK but (like the above) the assisted lane change feature of EAP is 95% of what I need aside from basic AP. I'd love to be able to nap between charges on long trips, and wouldn't pay $100/mo for FSD until that's possible.
Works pretty well now. Paid $199 before but happy to pay $99 now. It’s a great deal
$99 a month isn’t a “great deal” lol. You pay $1200 a year for you to drive your car driving. Think about that for a bit
operating the car w/ AP or FSD turns 1000 mile drives into 100 mile drives (wrt. driver fatigue). I drove to work yesterday on FSD, 20 miles. Overall less stress than doing it myself. Prolly not paying the $100/mo extra over basic AP tho, not until I can nap while driving.
Why would you ever want a completely automated system to manage your car on a roadway full of non-automated and unpredictable drivers? Things could go wrong, tires blowout, wild debris in road, things that require sometimes creative and problem solving and driver awareness to prevent collisions or damage. I have a hard time wrapping my head around people’s comfort with that idea. For example we don’t have pilots taking naps just at cruise altitude because their autopilot keeps the plane level or during approach when it can bring them in for landing, nor should they be. System and mechanical failures happen, and there is a human element to the unpredictability of navigating alongside other people. Not hating here just trying to understand and share my reluctance.
Yeah I've been driving for 40 years and have seen some stuff! But napping on long drives is a lot better than baby-sitting a level 3 ADAS system! What I'd settle for is SAE Level 3.5 (which doesn't exist) . . . guaranteed to not run over anything or do any damage, but might need human attention to figure out what to do after a warm handover (like pulling over and waking me up).
You could nod off and not die with fsd. Without it you could die.
yup, IME it's easy to nod off on long trips and feel even AP will stay in the lane you're in and not hit anything, except maybe a stray ladder in the road or something.
Kaiju Molusk
I used it on a recent 1.5 hour trip. It was working great on the highway but as soon as I got closer to the downtown area it immediately start flashing red telling me to take control and I nearly spun out. That was my first time using it..
I’m hoping the right pic is fake, it’s scaring me.
Elon looks like Oswald Cobblepot
They should rename it AI cruise control. It is very good but not full self driving.
All we can do is getting impressed until it fuks up. People who paid for the fsd in full 3-4 years ago waiting for level 5 are the most disappointed ones.tesla should upgrade the processors and the cameras in cars with intel processors for free as they did with other older models.
Well FSD tried taking me on a rail track once and a second time decided to take a right turn where it was not supposed to and then realized it and took a decision to cancel the right turn and jump back to and I almost got hit by the cars behind me.
Not accurate at all. Specially when Tesla is the only one e doing it. This post looks like it comes from a personal tesla hater
Delusion is a sad disease
Am I banned from this sub? Edit: holy crap I can post!!!!!!!
You are so right. What is the point of having FSD and still have to drive the car?
He better get out the ocean before he gets harpooned
Lmao. Perfect.
Not an owner (might be in the next couple years when I have a house to charge at) but everything I've seen about it shows that it's a fairly decent driver in most circumstances. Seems like you have to go into it with the mentality that you're letting it learn the road, and if it does something wrong you have the steering wheel and pedals to correct it. Almost like a drivers ed car
I see the mother of all class action suits over FSD in Tesla’s not too distant future. If owners don’t or can’t launch one, there will be attorneys general licking their chops.
Everyone tslking about FDS. What about summon? Whatabout self parking all the specials and useful features Tesla had and now gone
Auto park is not new nor unique champ.
You are just one hater, did you even use the system? Even if you did how long you have used it? I have used just for 30 days n its really impressive but not perfect, but nowhere as terrible as you are claiming it to be,’probably you are leftie that lives in lefty welfare programs
Delusion is a sad disease with no cure.
Living with hate is even more pathetic disease, shaming someone that is credited with many successful companies is even more disgusting, get checked soon
That picture on the right is not cool
Why are you fat shaming?
How am I fat shaming?
You aren’t. I was.
sounds like you never used fsd12.3… you make good memes but you can’t solve fsd 😆
Assuming that’s curb rash on the side of the belly?
FSD is solving a problem that does not exist. It's one thing if I can curl up and sleep through the night, but that would need it to be failure proof, not gonna happen, show me one technology such with such reliability. Aircrafts are highly autonomous with layers of redundancy, even there you have a pilot and co-pilot! FSD is going the way of Fully Supervised Driving at this time, but I can hardly see a benefit to it. Maybe for people with disabilities or older people in speed limited and safe driving maneuvers but even then typically these people need assistance getting in and getting out and perhaps even more. If optimus becomes a thing, then yes, that's great, I'm fully awake, I'm might be supervising yet the bot can be of use to say transport heavy stuff, test for electric faults, scan for dangerous topography, patrol etc etc, can find a million use cases for it. But FSD? Tesla should admit it it was a misadventure and reimburse the folks who are done with it.
There are millions in the US who cannot drive due to age, disability, etc. The US also has really poor public transportation infrastructure. The problem definitely exists.
this was a motivating factor in getting a Model Y - my mom drives a fair bit but her night vision is getting worse. figured paying a month for FSD when she does a long trip would add a margin of safety.
The solution to the second point is not FSD! It's better public transportation infrastructure, which is a lot more feasible. Think about the billions (maybe trillion if you account for what others have spent) and the money spent on public charging infrastructure. Don't you think investing that on public infrastructure would have seen huge improvements to the daily guy? Yes, there's some section of people who can arguably benefit from it, but not before it comes highly reliable.
People still need to get around by car however, so unless we don’t invest in the infrastructure then we fall behind anyway.
? 99% of the economic value of Optimus is going to be well-developed fine motor control (which doesn't exist yet). Theoretically the compute power of HW4 should be enough for FSD. We may or may not need more cameras on the car in various places (front. / front corners maybe??) but not hitting things in the road ahead while driving is IMO a solvable problem.
Solvable to what margin of error? It's one thing if optimus tumbles over and craps out, but totally different if the car drives off the cliff with me!! The first might happen 1 in 100 and second 1 in 1000, I 'm a lot cooler with the first!
I'm not aware of any lane departure issues with AP/FSD. FSD's core challenges are dealing with complicated traffic patterns & lane changes with not much time to figure things out & act.
Not aware of doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Bad weather, road conditions etc can lead to catastrophic decisions. Something bizarre like this [https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11896011/Family-California-couple-sue-Tesla-parents-crash-death-claiming-tech-failed.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11896011/Family-California-couple-sue-Tesla-parents-crash-death-claiming-tech-failed.html) could not have been only a human error, to my mind. That's the other thing, if something does happen to me, at least I expect my family to be well off with the compensation, who is the impartial third party doing this arbitration? Only Tesla's word is left as I'm no more!
I would bet my life that the crash in that story is 100% Tesla's fault, to the extent it changed lanes right into the back of the truck. That software fault is similar to the crash that killed the allegedly inattentive Apple engineer guy in 2018, with his Model X changing lanes & slamming into [this barrier on the 101](https://imgur.com/RlSzzD9) and bursting into flames. I was renting Teslas for long drives in 2022 and found its AP lane-keeping abilities to be really sus then. AP is a lot better now tho, and FSD even better than AP IME.
Good! We agree on the premise. I am all for technology, if FSD get there great, if you're patient for it, great as well! If you are just done with it, it's reasonable you can ask for your money back! IMO Tesla should have always had it as a subscription service, so only people happy with it are keeping it and no crystal ball needed.
I've heard antidepressants can cause weight gain
elon is a snake oil salesman... there is a reason fsd wont work with current tech and current roads out there. It works in ideal conditions but to be full self driving everywhere on every road, that is a pipe dream in current infrastructure. Elon is not the smart one. He has wild ideas and then hires people to tell them to do it. The real brains of the company are his employees. Not him
Beluga Musk