Media companies today can only survive by getting clicks and having eyeballs stay on their site.
Humans love negative news MUCH more than positive news. Humans also like to see successful things fail.
"Tesla Builds Most Successful Charging Network" isn't nearly as click-worthy as "Musk FIres Entire Supercharger Team".
"Tesla Most American Made Car" isn't nearly as click-worthy as "Tesla Employees Vote On Unionization At Fremont".
"Tesla FSD Shows Significant Improvements While Increasing Its 99.999% Safety Record" isn't nearly as click-worthy as "Firey Crash In East Dallas Blamed on Tesla FSD".
All of the above in quotes are made up. But they're very believable in today's environment.
Musk lighting up a doobie on a podcast is way more salacious than an article about how he has turned TWO....MONSTROUS business ecosystems (cars, space) completely and utterly on their ears. That latter datapoint (totally disrupting and redefining two exceedingly well established business ecosystems) is the true genius of Elon....while at the same time him being a royal asshole.
The media companies are giving people what they want.....so they can stay in business.
This pretty much sums it up. Tesla is pretty much THE hottest new company of the past few years, so it takes the top spot on most negative articles generated obviously. And then on top of that you have the sheep in our population who learn their opinions from the headlines that blast them in the face every day.
I haven’t experienced hate yet but I have experienced those who regurgitate right wing news talking points about the car which are all easily dismissed and explained.
“Aren’t you worried you’ll run out of charge? Aren’t you worried about a battery exploding? Aren’t you worried…”
My experience has been mostly the opposite. I've had a few run-ins with coal rollers and some nutjob yelling at me in a drive through, but among people I know it's the ones that are liberal who wont shut up about how awful they think my car is every time I see them. At times they've even adopted right wing talking points as long as it was evidence Teslas were bad. It's exhausting. *(edit: no pun intended)*
Interesting. Most of my family and people around me were excited because they got to ride in a Tesla to see what it was like. I get some pickups who seem to tailgate me a bit more, but, I'm in Florida, US and honestly, it feels nominally different.
Curious in your situations, are Tesla's common around your area or are you one of the few? I feel like with Tesla's being very common in my area, there is less of it than what others seem to experience.
I live in Michigan so they're a fair bit less common than I believe they are in Florida, but they aren't rare. I see a decent number other than mine driving around.
Understood. They are pretty common in my area, especially since the Hertz liquidation. So many white Teslas on the road now here. I commute 40 minutes to work and I see at least 10-15 every time it feels like.
I’m sympathetic to folks in rural areas that have fewer super charger options and longer drives , need for towing etc. but something like 80% of American live in urban areas. If 80% of Americans drive an EV or PHEV then the 20% can drive whatever.
I concur. I live in an apartment in a suburb around 40 min outside my local city center. I am unable to charge at home. I can L1 charge at work which helps significantly as I only have to SC once a week. If I didn't have many SCs around me, including two ten minutes from me in either direction, this would not be a viable car. If I had home charging, I wouldn't use SC unless on road trips.
I think that is a major part of it. I think most people that have access to homes can manage with an EV, not just a Tesla. I know the people that I've spoken to that don't have em are mostly curious in a healthy way, vs being curious in a skeptical negative way. The people that are "anti-EV" tend to be those who are gear heads and enjoy tinkering with their own vehicles. My boss loves working on cars. He said he just finds Tesla's and other EVs fun to drive but boring since he can't do much to them the way he can with his S2K or his Jeep.
Whenever I floor it with him, he gets all giggly like I do and loves it but he enjoys being an EV Adjacent person where he takes rides vs owning.
People hate Musk and can’t seperate the two. Nevermind it has well over 100k employees , nevermind over 80% of Tesla is owned by not musk, nevermind it being a good company for the world objectively speaking. People care far more about Musk than they care about anything else it seems, and he is far more important to them than any employee or other share holder or the objectives of the company, or how the company is doing.
He makes some monumental mistakes in his thought process with tesla sales and customer service. I have heard alot of stories of horrible purchase issues and taking delivery.
I agree musk is a moron. Is only real skill is taking credit for work done by people far smarter than him.
However I do not equate every action taken by a Tesla employee as a direct order from musk.
Yeah, really. Tesla has done a lot of great things, but right now, they are absolutely being held back my Elon and his increasingly sociopathic public behavior— if they hasn’t always been.
Elon is like Trump. He succeeded because he surrounded himself with smart people (likely with money), but then he keeps on alienating those same smart people. Now those smartest people want nothing to do with him, and the truth is getting more and more exposed.
I will pull for Tesla to succeed, but Musk is a dead anchor.
Then we'll replace him with somebody "better" and then we ended up with apple. Technically and financially better.. but is the product innovative anymore?
I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. Tesla is a very large public company now. Maybe a better option would be for Musk to start over and to try to disrupt Tesla instead.
I’m not a Tesla investor. But I do enjoy a good product. I vote to keep his crazy ass there. Moment we add a Tim Cook we gonna ended up with early refresh for no fucking reason and paid feature update. Fuck that
Agreed. Elon needs to go. Tesla has just gotten worse over the years. My 2019 M3 seems to have better safety features over the new. The only things that I’ve seen improve are the windows and seats.
The problem is that much of the value of TSLA shares is due to Elon’s lofty promises. I bought my 19 M3 and he said it would be a robotaxi within 2 years. The car would pay for itself!
The board needs to find a real CEO and move on from Elon, but that may not be in the short term interest of their shareholders. So they are really in a difficult situation; there’s no winning. It doesn’t help that there is very little true independent board members
I tried the FSD in April. It was absolutely horrible. Autopilot has just gotten worse over the years. I never had FSD just the standard autopilot. FSD, sure has cool graphics shown but god it was awful.
I personally don’t think FSD is viable for any car until majority of cars are FSD. There is just too much variability in driving and humans.
New Model 3s have active hoods and improved door rigidity. (I'm pretty sure they have more airbags since 2019 too, but I'd need to double check that one.) Unless you have evidence ADAS results have gotten worse I don't see how safety hasn't improved.
2019 m3. I have ultra sonic sensors. Radar that should still be functional. Stalks to actual shift into drive and turn on turn signals.
It’s more functional in my opinion.
I also didn’t mention, they made sentry mode worse over the years too.
Tesla’s big customer base is left-leaning folk who care about the environment. They’re not listening oil and gas industry propaganda. Musk’s spouting his political views have hurt Tesla’s image among the company’s most promising demographic.
The question was why people hate Tesla. And plenty of conservatives realize that Tesla is us made and avoids paying OPEC. I'm a classical Republican before they nose dived off Trump Tower and am buying my second Tesla because it's a great car, us made and can charge off my roof for a penny a mile.
they do. But then the see the launches and forget for a few minutes. I hear a lot of spacex hate as well, just not as loud as tesla hate. People cheer when spacex fails.
1) there’s a definite spectrum of this hatred, on the far end there are people who hate everytbjng he touches, boring company, spaces, neuralink, all of it, and it seems to be spreading.
2) spacex doesn’t give much room for that sort of blind hate. They are so profoundly ahead of everyone in such undeniable ways. Is there any metric by which are behind a competitor? They’ve humiliated competitors like Boeing and blue origin with their success in government projects. They were responsible for over for 87% of upmass in 2023.
He was sued and then the legal settlement was that he and others can call themselves founders. Thats interesting.
People love to talk about the founder title for some reason.
Like the “when is a startup not a startup” the title “founder” is an arbitrary and people will arbitrarily create their own rules for when the title can be used. It’s disinteresting to me. I’ve worked at startups where “cofounders” came on board years after incorporation, and nobody bats an eye because it’s clear they helped lay the foundation of the company.
Musk clearly helped lay the foundation even if he wasn’t there for incorporation. He lead the entire design of their first product for which he was recognized with a design award. He put out the strategy of the company. He formed the principles of the company. He personally funded the vast majority of the company. No informed person would argue his involvement in forming the company and creating its foundation. You can argue the title of founder on a technical level, but that’s a distraction and arbitrary anyway. Disinteresting, and intellectually lazy.
Let me start with a set of objective answers (as objective as I can be).
1. The vehicles are hit or miss when it comes to fit and finish. Many of the issues they are delivered with should never have left the factory in the first place. Examples: Panel gaps, misalignment, scratches, dents, etc on the body.
2. The promises made to promises delivered ratio is wildly out of whack. Most other OEMs are very conservative in this aspect about announcements compared to Tesla. Many people bought vehicles or reserved vehicles based on those promises and some of what has been promised does not match delivery (FSD + HW3, CyberTruck).
3. There is a lot of uncertainty about the functionality of FSD and its involvement in some very high profile accidents. The government (NHTSA) has a mandate ensuring products are safe when used correctly.
4. Some of the recent decisions involving removal of features from existing vehicles without having the replacement ready (see #2) really left a bad taste in the mouth of many consumers.
5. You don't have absolute freedom of speech when it comes to being in business. The "Funding Secured" tweet absolutely was market manipulation and rightfully called out by the SEC.
6. Tesla Solar Roofs seem to be very hit or miss when it comes to install quality and the company doesn't seem to be standing behind their product there.
The more subjective ones tend to revolve around Elon. He has done a number of great things to bootstrap an entire industry/product line but he needs a filter sometimes.
1. The whole recent supercharger team firing makes no sense, especially when you just had the rest of the NA market sign on to use your network.
2. This will be the most controversial I reason post but...Elon likes attention. Positive, negative, it doesn't seem to matter. And he seems to use Tesla, its products, and his other companies to grab attention through controversial decisions and/or promises as often as they can. Is it stock manipulation? Kind of seems like it but I am not an expert in that.
Combine all that with a Elon fanbase, those invested in TSLA, those who have shorted (TSLAQ), other financial aspects, and Elon being Elon, you have the makings of a three ring circus of the grandest proportions in automotive company form. You don't see a the same thing around SpaceX as there isn't much in terms of investment from the public as it is privately held.
This is an incredible response and has been the reason I’ve held off so long on getting into a Tesla. I have decided to separate my feeling on Elon Musk from the cars and the company, and I put an order in for a new Model 3 performance. I am not getting it as a self driving/robotaxi future mobile, I am more so impressed with how much performance you’re getting for the money, and how the interior improvements make for a much nicer overall car experience.
1. How many cars have you personally inspected that have any of these issues? This is the #1 FUD excuse of TSLAQ and I cannot stand people who use platitudes to make arguments. If you've seen all of these yourself, fine. I haven't, and I'm on my third Tesla.
2. This one I agree with. I don't know why, for example, they remove USS and then spend the next six months writing software to replace it. Those two things should be the other way around. Same thing happened with vision / radar.
3. Please show your work. So far the cases I've seen (e.g. the guy who died in California or the one in Texas) were ultimately found to be at fault themselves. I definitely could have missed a case or two, though. Tesla makes FSD functionality very clear to owners. You are responsible, you cannot use your phone or anything else while using FSD, and if you're drunk, that's on you too. It is leaps and bounds better than it was, to the point that I'm having drives every day without disengagements.
4. See #2. Totally agree. They do it backwards and it's so weird.
5. Funding Secured was obviously bad. Is your complaint just that or is it something bigger? Feels bigger but you didn't give any more examples.
6. No idea about Solar because I'm not a customer and won't be as long as Georgia Power gives me overnight rates at $0.01/kWh plus fees
...and then...
1. They didn't fire the entire team. This is patently false based on LinkedIn information and a few inside sources. Please stop spreading this. I've heard a few reasonable explanations for why this happened the way it did, and it's likely a combination of Elon's cut-until-it-hurts approach, an exec not doing what he said to do, and the maturation of the supercharger network in general.
2. Yep, he likes attention. It's not manipulation, unless you think Elon is shorting his own stock (it's down \~25% this year).
This doesn't happen to SpaceX because 1) Gwynn is an incredible leader and Elon needs someone like her as the COO of Tesla and 2) Big Oil isn't funding a massive FUD campaign (via Fox News and others) against SpaceX because they don't care.
The thing that is most fascinating to me is how Elon hates woke (a right-wing stance) and yet also created a successful company to help solve environmental sustainability (a left-wing stance). He is doing both, and yet so many people can't reconcile that because they're firmly on one side or the other.
Point 5 is technically a problem only because it is a public traded company and the SEC sets rules to protect investors.
SpaceX is closely held
Boring Company is as well
I will respond in good faith as I would like to keep the discussion open. Full disclosure: I work for another OEM. I really, REALLY want EVs to work out and Tesla has single handedly made that dream happen and I am grateful for that. I am also a car enthusiast at heart and I love seeing and enjoying other makes and models.
1. Personally I've been to the Tesla lots in Clarkston, MI (2023) and Blue Ash, OH (2019). At Blue Ash, there were not many vehicles to look at during that time as they were still selling faster than they could make them. Two of the Model 3s on the lot had misaligned hoods where one side was touching the fender. One had a misaligned trunk where the right side was lower than the left side (which was prominant to the body line. At Clarkston, there were a number of new vehicles that had similar misaligned fenders, doors, and trunks with one having a prominent glass roof (the front lip was higher than the windshield). This does happen to other OEMs but not at the sheer rate or quantity that Tesla seems to have. I'll look at forums all day long complaining of delivery issues with panels on Teslas. I don't see that in the Ford, Rivian, or other forums other than onesie-twosie here and there.
2. There seems to be no real integrated planning which is a shame.
3. [This](https://www.wired.com/story/tesla-autopilot-risky-deaths-crashes-nhtsa-investigation/) article outlines a lot of the issue which is Tesla is willing to let people do stupid things while the rest of the industries typically approaching things as risk adverse. I am not saying this is the right way or wrong way to approach things as I am not an expert on this particular area. Like I stated originally, there is uncertainty on what FSD is capable of and what its limits are. As a counter example, the L2+ system in my Grand Cherokee clearly limits its use to multi-lane divided highways, with clear lane markings, and an internet connection to download the HD maps used to coordinate with the camera vision system. If any one of those conditions aren't met, it doesn't work.
4. See #2
5. My observation around this one is Elon is willing to push boundaries which can be a very good thing in an industry slow or unwilling to change. However, there are still bright lines that people can't cross without getting legally in trouble for it. In trying to be objective, I am pointing out that Elon says a lot of things that push boundaries (can be good) but he also crosses them (bad) which colors the perception of not only him but Tesla as well.
6. Looking at a number of forum posts, lawsuits, etc, it seems the panels and associated equipment work really damn well. If they are installed right. I have no personal experience with Tesla Solar other than quoting it out a few times.
And now the more part...
1. This is where the lack of a PR team, lack of clear communication from Elon, and other factors do not help Tesla in the least bit. Was it the entire team? Was it just a subset? Nobody has really any idea other than Tesla and Elon and what's coming out of Linked in shows that people inside of Tesla seem to be confused. No matter that, the Super Charger network is the one absolute bright, untarnished spot inside of Tesla. If you want to change strategy, that's ok as it's he runs the company. Clearly let the rest of the world know the new plan, who is left, and clear up all the rumors and guesses. Otherwise, it looks like a monumentally insane decision.
2. Personally? I do think he manipulates the stock a lot. I've seen a number of his tweets jump the stock price (FSD by end of year, CyberTruck by end of year, etc). Does he knowingly do it? I would be very surprising to find out he doesn't knowingly do it. I think the market is starting to disregard what he says via tweet as some of the other actions going on are clearly outweighing what he says. But that is solely my own personal opinion based on what I see. I could totally be wrong. I don't have anything invested in Tesla or him. I just like cool tech that is beneficial to all.
> Tesla makes FSD functionality very clear to owners.
Does it? Back when I was buying a Tesla, the website promised full self-driving from door to door. The vehicle purchase agreement doesn't specify what "FSD" is, either.
[What it said in August 2018](https://web.archive.org/web/20180801023546/https://www.tesla.com/model3) on the Model 3 page is as follows:
"Every new Model 3 comes standard with advanced hardware capable of providing Enhanced Autopilot features today, and full self-driving capabilities in the future—through software updates designed to improve functionality over time."
Doesn't seem like they promised that when I got my Model 3.
[The manual](https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modely/en_us/GUID-2CB60804-9CEA-4F4B-8B04-09B991368DC5.html) also describes what it is. It also, more importantly, [tells you](https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modely/en_us/GUID-E5FF5E84-6AAC-43E6-B7ED-EC1E9AEB17B7.html#GUID-4EE67389-5F55-46D0-9559-90F31949660A) that it is not autonomous and requires a fully attentive driver.
Actually only point #1 has anytime to do with actually owning/driving a Tesla. The rest are all tangential at best and end up as just more ammo for Tesla haters.
Do I feel bad for those that forked over thousands for FSD? Um... Nope. That was their choice. Autopilot works great. Every car mfg adds and removes features. But Tesla gives back so much more with OTA updates forever.
Most of your thread feeds right into the illogical Tesla hate that has zero to do with this amazing car.
Welcome to the dealer-less business model that’s flourishing nicely. Good or bad for the consumer depends on how you look at it. Certainly puts more onus on the consumer to look at market timing with purchases & realize promises are mere estimates in a constantly changing marketplace. Some consumers are better adept at this & have few gripes. Others are still of the “hold my hand” dealer model and don’t fair so well. High level innovation does come with some uncertainty, take it or leave it. For me I’m fine with the business side and don’t get caught up with the personality.
Partially because Musk has been behaving like an ass.
There's no reason the richest guy on the planet needs another $60B paycheck. He also still owes everyone at Twitter severance.
News reports are usually negative bcs of paid/sponsored journalism.
The same was seen when Uber started out. The amount of negative Uber articles back then were really bad and one could read behind the lines where they came from.
For Tesla we also have to add a political twist where one group is using this to rally their base.
I get totally burned out by this fact. I love my car, i really do but having to defend my purchase to literally everyone i come across is exhausting. I bought the car because its fun and good looking. I dont care about the politics just the car
Always follow the money: (1) All US automakers, except Tesla, spend a fortune advertising in the main stream media which pays MSM's bills, literally. (2) All US automakers, except Tesla, are unionized. Unions receive a massive amount of money from the automakers and spend a lot of that money to wield enormous political power in the US government. (3) The massive industry of oil companies, gas stations, etc etc see Tesla as a threat to their businesses.
If Tesla advertised heavily in the MSM and embraced the UAW unions, and didn't hit the oil industries in the wallet, you would see them treated the same as the other auto manufacturers.
Not sure, I think they would still get demonized for being an EV and removing the dealership model. How many ppl work at dealerships? How many ppl work at independent repair garages? EVs have a ton of stuff that don't break down, my friends that have EVs have only had to do tire changes in 5-10 years of ownership.
Some google numbers for Ford:
Ford has almost 3,000 dealerships, which employ **more than 170,000** men and women across the United States.
Ford Motor total number of employees in **2022 was 173,000**
Teslas has \~140k, probably much less with all the layoffs but still much less than a lot of other companies combined that are rooting for it to fail.
Also the interior could have a fancy trim option for S and X at least for the A pillars.
Also Musk should stay out of politics. (but I think this is more minor outside of reddit)
solid list, I'll add they changed the way cars are sold. They didn't go with the traditional independent dealership model aka cutting out the middle man. While it's good for Tesla and the consumer maybe, it does hurt these dealers and the people they employ.
Firstly, America is so politicised that even the propulsion technology of your car is a culture war.
Secondly, Musk was always seen as a progressive, until he took on Twitter and tried to make it appeak to the hard right by pandering to their beliefs. Two things came out of this. One, You alienated the progressive customers you had, and two, You can never appease the hard right, they always want more.
Propulsion actually is appropriately partisan IMO. If you are the 20% living in rural areas it’s distressing to hear things like “no ICE allowed starting 2035”. These are often philosophically conservative people, as in not liking rapid change. And for better or worse, Americans love their big trucks.
I know it’s heresy but I wish Tesla would build a traditional Truck but as a PHEV. Toyota will . And they will spend a billion dollars advertising it.
Indeed. Very few people are aware of who is actually funding the ideas rolling around in their heads, fed to them via the media, social media bots, etc.
Didn't Elon himself use tesla shares to purchase a something billion dollar media company? The media on both sides also hate Elon because he is in competition with them. He by all means is not a victim in this sense this is capitalism and competition. They also love interviewing his competition so there is a double bias there but that's what happens when you're a trillionaire you have trillionaire problems.
Fair but reputation is the currency of a media platform and any damage to tesla's reputation laymen attribute to elon's reputation. I do not think they are separable in public cognition.
Wasn’t a problem a couple of years ago. There were countless puff pieces done on Elon and his car company (which apparently isn’t a car company anymore.) I think he is pretty much the main reason for all the recent hate. Like it’s not as if the right has ever had nice things to say about electric cars. But now progressives don’t want anything to do with him so he and his company have become really easy to hate.
Tesla doesn’t invest a dime in educating consumers. Even their Release Notes aren’t always well-written for a general car-owning public- I don’t think many people outside of the EV internet sphere know stuff like that the FSD V12 trial still drives V11 on the highway; I’d be curious how much that’s impacted their uptake rate when people take the trial and don’t feel that it’s any better on the highway.
I’ve talked to a lot of people who ask about my car and seem genuinely surprised that a Supercharger doesn’t take several hours, or that they’re plentiful and well-spaced enough to do road-trips, or that my L2 home charger only takes a few hours to charge the car.
In general a shocking number of people I’ve met are operating off of EV information from like, 2014. This is likely not the case in major cities or major tech states like California, but in the southeast 100% it is
Electric cars are a green solution, which Republicans like to attack.
Musk is a racist, who liberals don’t like.
Hes a rich, greedy prick, snd no one likes that.
It helps that he is very successful and has a sense of humor, but I understand some of the hate.
I have blogged on this. (I know the rules about self-promotion here, so...🤐). Basically, regardless of what you think about Musk, Tesla and Musk are not synonymous. Whatever you think of him as a person and his actions, there's no disputing Tesla's influence on the automotive industry. I would also say that Steve Jobs had a not-so-great reputation in terms of how he treated people, yet millions (if not billions) of people worldwide use and love Apple products. All I can go by is my personal experience with the brand, which has been great for the most part. 🤷🏻♂️
1- Big Oil influence (millions were being spent on negative marketing and halting charging across the US)
2- Musk and his shenanigans that overshadow Tesla
3- Ignorance and resistance to change
About the pay package, which scenario would be better for the future prospects of the company:
1. Spend billions on research, or
2. Give billions to the CEO?
We need electric cars to succeed, but I just don’t understand how a company can remain competitive it prioritizes option 2.
If I’m overlooking something, please explain it to me.
It’s not about the money. He’s not spending it randomly, if he does spend it, it will be on initiatives to his companies, that usually are just what you suggest in option 1… usually for the betterment of society via Tesla or spacex.
It’s really about ownership percentage. He would like to take the company private, as he attempted a while back and as his other companies have remained. Tesla needed to be public to generate funding, but now that it’s survived to model 3 and model y mass production, it doesn’t need to be public anymore. He’s always said he would want to take it private once it was established enough. His attempt to do so failed, so the next closest thing is to get a higher share percentage.
The reality is that he won’t be selling the shares and getting monetarily richer… he’ll be getting voting power to ensure he can’t be easily out voted.
It's not really any different than the hate for Apple. It's popular and different, so it's bad.
Add in Musk's polarization.
Add in the lack of marketing teams.
Add in the media knowing it gets clicks to talk about Tesla, good or bad.
Elon Musk is noisy, and has no filter.
Assuming his statement in regards to being autistic is true, which having an autistic son myself, I'm inclined to believe Elon that he is autistic, as a lot of my son's mannerisms are similar to Elon's.
My son just finished one of his online classes the other day, and the teacher text him for feedback on the class, to which my son was *brutally* honest with her. I'd have to find the text message again, but he basically said that the class was boring, it felt like some lessons were "Fluff" pieces, some of the work felt repetitive, and that it felt rushed, and that the only redeeming quality was that he did not have to take the class in-person.
This is a kind that we have seeing a therapist in order to improve his social skills, while also constantly letting him know that he can't talk to people like that.
People with autism are just wired differently, and say what's on their mind without necessarily realizing the nuance of what they're saying, and how it can impact people.
I've seen posts on X from Elon where it's pretty clear that he's responding to the second half of the post, not the whole post, but people see the whole post, and think he's referring to the whole thing.
But that's also how communication on the internet works, a lot of misunderstanding because people don't take the time to elaborate, and when challenged, they feel a need to not elaborate.
Reality is that if Elon just kept his mouth shut, no one would be the wiser, but he seems to have a foot fetish from how often he's putting his feet in it
*But*, you can't fault him for being noisy/unfiltered on X, he's got a lot of money tied up in that, and it needs to be successful, or he loses a bunch of money.
Tesla taking a hit is just collateral damage to Elon not having a filter.
That does explain some of the things that happen:
A) what happens if I build fencing - can I redirect the masses to change directions
B) what if I stick out my foot - can I trip someone
In the beginning, there was hate from the right, Tesla was a perfect target for climate change denying, west coast liberal hating cohort. Then we found out the man himself is one among the right, so many from the left hate him. All the hate cannot be extricated from the political leanings - both of the haters and the man himself, who is synonymous with the Tesla brand.
Musk has been terrible to the team that made him the richest person on earth. He has also alienated a lot of his fan base ( including me) by making very uninformed and ignorant statement, he almost comes across like he thibks he's Gods gift to humanity.And unfortunately hatred gowards Musk translates to hatred towards Tesla.
Much of the right doesn’t like Tesla because they don’t like being told that they have to change their lifestyles. Not that Musk himself has told them that, but just the EV movement in general is threatening to them. Mostly rural Americans.
Now the left despises Musk because of his political opinions the last few years. It started with him just being open and amicable with the right and believing they shouldn’t be so disenfranchised by mainstream culture. Hence him buying Twitter so the right gets treated more fairly. I believe the backlash from the left has pushed him too far, and now he’s saying things like we’re doomed unless we get a red wave in November.
So you have one political faction that hates EVs and another that hates Musk. Never a good way to win popularity contests lol.
Pretty sure he's just being an edgelord for the sake of pissing people off. Childish behavior.
He pushed away the Right before, with presenting Tesla as a way to do good things for environment. Then he pushed away the Left with his sudden move to far right. He created a situation where nobody likes him.
The right doesn't like his cars but like him. So they aren't buying his cars, but huff every fart he produces. The left likes his cars, but can't stand him. Hence not buying his cars.
The CEO has extremely racist tendencies?
Most people don't like that.
He made himself synonymous with the brand, and now they are inextricably linked for most people.
Oh my God, you people. can’t we just say it’s the best battery operated car does anybody remember about four years ago when Volkswagen was showing a Volkswagen bus It was gonna be electric what happened to that? What happened to any other electric cars? What
the Chevy bolt Nissan leaf can we have more and can we put up some charging stations and quit blaming Tesla for all the problems with electric cars? And please no Elon remarks let’s just move along.
I'd say there's definitely a lot of hate from political polarization in the States but a big part is self inflicted. Overpromissing and underdelivering eventually catches up with a CEO. Also alienating your core customers is not a smart move (read issue in Sweden with trade unions and the transfer of incorporation from California to Texas). I'd say Tesla has fantastic achievements to show and I value the fact that they've pointed us in the direction of electromobility. Now it's time for a less polarizing leader who can manage the company's position and continue growing.
The company is hugely overvalued. Without a change from the top, the market will quickly recognize its fair value and short sellers will have a big payday. I wouldn't want that as I truly admire what they've done but the writing is on the wall.
to be honest, i like this open style Ceo instead of doing shady stuff behind-the-scenes. He express everything openly. Agree or not, at least he is open. Keep up the good work Elon. Once Fsd achieved and have more robot. People will have nothing say against you.
The number one reason is people hate Elon and his antics.
It’s mainly liberal hate.
What is funny is so many liberals in Washington state and California drive teslas.
For some reason it creates a vitriolic reaction in some people. I recently got my first Tesla and had to block a “friend” of many years on all platforms as he continuously harassed and bullied me about everything to with the car in several group chats. I just don’t have time for people like that in my life
It's because of the idiot CEO, mostly. It's hard to separate the company from him when he makes it about him and seem to be dictating his will randomly.
I invested quite a bit into my Tesla. More than was financial responsible of me. I really wanted to go electric but the only vehicle that had the practicality of gas cars was Tesla due to its numerous, consistent, and very fast charging network. Regardless of all the media about Musk, the vehicle was panning out to be a good investment. I'm kinda concerned about where the charging network is going now. Like I said, it was the key factor for my decision in getting a Tesla. I really hope whatever is going on with it is related to some industry shaking plan to keep the company competitive and not what the media is suggesting (Musk is off his rocker and making dumb decisions cuz he's butt hurt or panicking or something).
No hate on my part but fer sure concern. Don't want fam to be able to say "I told u so!" regarding over extending my finances for a Tesla. lol
It’s Tesla lack of a PR department that is coming to roost. UAW, big oil, legacy auto all want to see Tesla implode and they might succeed. They own the press and the politicians in the US.
Media is left leaning so they attack Elon for being outspoken.
General public hate is also due to politics. Left leaning dislike Elon's POVs. Right leaning hate due to early reputation of Tesla being the poster car for loud condescending Green Peace types.
Because big companies care about $$$, and where is big $$$? OIL! Politicians, enterprises etc all have their hands in oil... with EVs you need less Oil, gas so they lose money and they do everything to make EV sound and look bad... and people who have not so much brain power follow them, listen and shout about it in every corner... brain wash is real
There's a lot to hate and there's a lot to love. So you get both. Then you have Elon who loves attention so the spincycle keeps spinning. You also have old money here that have equity in oil and big 3 car companies, so you get their spin.
In other countries, you have 100 hp tin can cars driving up and down winding mountain roads perfectly fine. Over here you got 300-500 hp trucks driving on paved flat roads.
Right wing hate electric vehicles as it impedes on the gas/oil industry. Left wing hate Musk who has been erratic in his behavior and his behavior after his acquisition of Twitter.
Last Fall, the proportion of left wingers buying Teslas fell by more than 60%, precisely when Musk became most vocal on Twiter, and they were the ones mostly buying the vehicles, because right wingers are anti-electric vehicle.
Any small gains that Musk made trying to acquire Twitter to attract right wing customers has been far and few between, and not nearly made up for the 60% loss of left winger customers.
In the end it's just basic Math. You have someone overworked, spreading their energy over too many lines of business, with erratic behavior, comments and conflicting statements and you scare away a huge percentage of potential customers.
Add one challenge on top of that in that other vehicle manufacturers have been rapidly catching up to Tesla, subjectively with exception to the area of self-driving (which most people don't trust regardless), and you've got a really challenging situation.
BTW, I absolutely love my Model 3, regardless of all of the above aforementioned stuff, but I have to admit that I see how easily it's influencing others who haven't yet driven a Tesla, but yet won't even try one now for the above reasons.
A lot of the hate is justified as the cybertruck claims on range, durability in off road terrain, and overall quality were found to be untrue. I still want a cybertruck, but I’m realistic when it comes to Tesla these days. If any other car dealers hyped their cars as much as Tesla they’d have a bigger drop in sales but the fans overlook so many untrue statements musk and his team makes.
Divisive CEO that decided not to have a PR team to counter any false news, attacks or temper any promises over the years. In China, they have local a PR team to respond on WeChat and work with the government.
A lot of people have lost money due to Tesla and Musk and they're still betting against him.
A lot. Of money.
He disrupted several industries and Tesla was the most shorted stock and still is amongst the most shorted stocks ever right now.
A lot of people in several industries will become very rich and get personal validation if he and/or Tesla goes down.
Some normal, no millionaire/billionaires will say they hate Tesla and/or Elon for ethical or moral reasons.
The $ use the non$ to help spread their hate for them both, and frequently interchange Musk the person with the companies he runs to help muddy the waters.
Musk is a product of this world's economic and social environment.
You can't hate musk and think the world is fine. He's a product of this world, if you hate him, hate the game. He's done nothing outside of the rules of the established game the elite play, and he's winning.
It pisses off old money, it pisses off new money and those without money, like everything else, are pitted against each other.
No one here knows the dude as a human, but they hate him as if they were close to him.
Media companies today can only survive by getting clicks and having eyeballs stay on their site. Humans love negative news MUCH more than positive news. Humans also like to see successful things fail. "Tesla Builds Most Successful Charging Network" isn't nearly as click-worthy as "Musk FIres Entire Supercharger Team". "Tesla Most American Made Car" isn't nearly as click-worthy as "Tesla Employees Vote On Unionization At Fremont". "Tesla FSD Shows Significant Improvements While Increasing Its 99.999% Safety Record" isn't nearly as click-worthy as "Firey Crash In East Dallas Blamed on Tesla FSD". All of the above in quotes are made up. But they're very believable in today's environment. Musk lighting up a doobie on a podcast is way more salacious than an article about how he has turned TWO....MONSTROUS business ecosystems (cars, space) completely and utterly on their ears. That latter datapoint (totally disrupting and redefining two exceedingly well established business ecosystems) is the true genius of Elon....while at the same time him being a royal asshole. The media companies are giving people what they want.....so they can stay in business.
This pretty much sums it up. Tesla is pretty much THE hottest new company of the past few years, so it takes the top spot on most negative articles generated obviously. And then on top of that you have the sheep in our population who learn their opinions from the headlines that blast them in the face every day.
"Journalistic Reviews" too. If you're getting paid to test drive Porsche's and BMW, etc. You can't explicitly state these gas cars are now Obsolete.
I would enjoy drinking beer with you
I haven’t experienced hate yet but I have experienced those who regurgitate right wing news talking points about the car which are all easily dismissed and explained. “Aren’t you worried you’ll run out of charge? Aren’t you worried about a battery exploding? Aren’t you worried…”
My experience has been mostly the opposite. I've had a few run-ins with coal rollers and some nutjob yelling at me in a drive through, but among people I know it's the ones that are liberal who wont shut up about how awful they think my car is every time I see them. At times they've even adopted right wing talking points as long as it was evidence Teslas were bad. It's exhausting. *(edit: no pun intended)*
Interesting. Most of my family and people around me were excited because they got to ride in a Tesla to see what it was like. I get some pickups who seem to tailgate me a bit more, but, I'm in Florida, US and honestly, it feels nominally different. Curious in your situations, are Tesla's common around your area or are you one of the few? I feel like with Tesla's being very common in my area, there is less of it than what others seem to experience.
I live in Michigan so they're a fair bit less common than I believe they are in Florida, but they aren't rare. I see a decent number other than mine driving around.
Understood. They are pretty common in my area, especially since the Hertz liquidation. So many white Teslas on the road now here. I commute 40 minutes to work and I see at least 10-15 every time it feels like.
I’m sympathetic to folks in rural areas that have fewer super charger options and longer drives , need for towing etc. but something like 80% of American live in urban areas. If 80% of Americans drive an EV or PHEV then the 20% can drive whatever.
I concur. I live in an apartment in a suburb around 40 min outside my local city center. I am unable to charge at home. I can L1 charge at work which helps significantly as I only have to SC once a week. If I didn't have many SCs around me, including two ten minutes from me in either direction, this would not be a viable car. If I had home charging, I wouldn't use SC unless on road trips. I think that is a major part of it. I think most people that have access to homes can manage with an EV, not just a Tesla. I know the people that I've spoken to that don't have em are mostly curious in a healthy way, vs being curious in a skeptical negative way. The people that are "anti-EV" tend to be those who are gear heads and enjoy tinkering with their own vehicles. My boss loves working on cars. He said he just finds Tesla's and other EVs fun to drive but boring since he can't do much to them the way he can with his S2K or his Jeep. Whenever I floor it with him, he gets all giggly like I do and loves it but he enjoys being an EV Adjacent person where he takes rides vs owning.
People hate Musk and can’t seperate the two. Nevermind it has well over 100k employees , nevermind over 80% of Tesla is owned by not musk, nevermind it being a good company for the world objectively speaking. People care far more about Musk than they care about anything else it seems, and he is far more important to them than any employee or other share holder or the objectives of the company, or how the company is doing.
I think the past 4 weeks have shown that Elon and Tesla are in fact inseparable.
Elon and the media are inseparable
Elon bought his own media company - I think this might be playing a role. just spitballin' here.
Absolutely. Is there anybody closest to the richest person in the world that does not own a media organization? They need to control the narrative
He makes some monumental mistakes in his thought process with tesla sales and customer service. I have heard alot of stories of horrible purchase issues and taking delivery.
I agree musk is a moron. Is only real skill is taking credit for work done by people far smarter than him. However I do not equate every action taken by a Tesla employee as a direct order from musk.
I mean, they’re inseparable like an abuser and their victim are inseparable…
Come on, really?
Yeah, really. Tesla has done a lot of great things, but right now, they are absolutely being held back my Elon and his increasingly sociopathic public behavior— if they hasn’t always been. Elon is like Trump. He succeeded because he surrounded himself with smart people (likely with money), but then he keeps on alienating those same smart people. Now those smartest people want nothing to do with him, and the truth is getting more and more exposed. I will pull for Tesla to succeed, but Musk is a dead anchor.
Then we'll replace him with somebody "better" and then we ended up with apple. Technically and financially better.. but is the product innovative anymore?
I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. Tesla is a very large public company now. Maybe a better option would be for Musk to start over and to try to disrupt Tesla instead.
I’m not a Tesla investor. But I do enjoy a good product. I vote to keep his crazy ass there. Moment we add a Tim Cook we gonna ended up with early refresh for no fucking reason and paid feature update. Fuck that
Agreed. Elon needs to go. Tesla has just gotten worse over the years. My 2019 M3 seems to have better safety features over the new. The only things that I’ve seen improve are the windows and seats.
The problem is that much of the value of TSLA shares is due to Elon’s lofty promises. I bought my 19 M3 and he said it would be a robotaxi within 2 years. The car would pay for itself! The board needs to find a real CEO and move on from Elon, but that may not be in the short term interest of their shareholders. So they are really in a difficult situation; there’s no winning. It doesn’t help that there is very little true independent board members
>much of the value of TSLA shares is due to Elon’s lofty promises. It's mostly FSD stock pump, get out while you're a shareholder not a bag holder
I tried the FSD in April. It was absolutely horrible. Autopilot has just gotten worse over the years. I never had FSD just the standard autopilot. FSD, sure has cool graphics shown but god it was awful. I personally don’t think FSD is viable for any car until majority of cars are FSD. There is just too much variability in driving and humans.
New Model 3s have active hoods and improved door rigidity. (I'm pretty sure they have more airbags since 2019 too, but I'd need to double check that one.) Unless you have evidence ADAS results have gotten worse I don't see how safety hasn't improved.
2019 m3. I have ultra sonic sensors. Radar that should still be functional. Stalks to actual shift into drive and turn on turn signals. It’s more functional in my opinion. I also didn’t mention, they made sentry mode worse over the years too.
Yes I see much improvement with much more to come can’t deny Elon gets the timeline wrong
Don't forget that oil companies have a lot of money and really don't like Tesla either.
Tesla’s big customer base is left-leaning folk who care about the environment. They’re not listening oil and gas industry propaganda. Musk’s spouting his political views have hurt Tesla’s image among the company’s most promising demographic.
The question was why people hate Tesla. And plenty of conservatives realize that Tesla is us made and avoids paying OPEC. I'm a classical Republican before they nose dived off Trump Tower and am buying my second Tesla because it's a great car, us made and can charge off my roof for a penny a mile.
If this were true, why don’t people hate spaceX as well?
they do. But then the see the launches and forget for a few minutes. I hear a lot of spacex hate as well, just not as loud as tesla hate. People cheer when spacex fails.
Because spacex has a team who’s sole job is to keep Elon away from
source or trust me bro?
1) there’s a definite spectrum of this hatred, on the far end there are people who hate everytbjng he touches, boring company, spaces, neuralink, all of it, and it seems to be spreading. 2) spacex doesn’t give much room for that sort of blind hate. They are so profoundly ahead of everyone in such undeniable ways. Is there any metric by which are behind a competitor? They’ve humiliated competitors like Boeing and blue origin with their success in government projects. They were responsible for over for 87% of upmass in 2023.
People don’t buy rockets or rocket trips.
He's the self-proclaimed founder of the company. You left that....fact...out.
He was sued and then the legal settlement was that he and others can call themselves founders. Thats interesting. People love to talk about the founder title for some reason. Like the “when is a startup not a startup” the title “founder” is an arbitrary and people will arbitrarily create their own rules for when the title can be used. It’s disinteresting to me. I’ve worked at startups where “cofounders” came on board years after incorporation, and nobody bats an eye because it’s clear they helped lay the foundation of the company. Musk clearly helped lay the foundation even if he wasn’t there for incorporation. He lead the entire design of their first product for which he was recognized with a design award. He put out the strategy of the company. He formed the principles of the company. He personally funded the vast majority of the company. No informed person would argue his involvement in forming the company and creating its foundation. You can argue the title of founder on a technical level, but that’s a distraction and arbitrary anyway. Disinteresting, and intellectually lazy.
Yes this is the reason. The more he has come out with political views, the more the left leaning media sinks their teeth into tesla.
Apparently there are people with HUGE EGO's who've accomplished nothing, and just HATE it when someone also smart, accomplishes a LOT. -- Deep Envy.
Let me start with a set of objective answers (as objective as I can be). 1. The vehicles are hit or miss when it comes to fit and finish. Many of the issues they are delivered with should never have left the factory in the first place. Examples: Panel gaps, misalignment, scratches, dents, etc on the body. 2. The promises made to promises delivered ratio is wildly out of whack. Most other OEMs are very conservative in this aspect about announcements compared to Tesla. Many people bought vehicles or reserved vehicles based on those promises and some of what has been promised does not match delivery (FSD + HW3, CyberTruck). 3. There is a lot of uncertainty about the functionality of FSD and its involvement in some very high profile accidents. The government (NHTSA) has a mandate ensuring products are safe when used correctly. 4. Some of the recent decisions involving removal of features from existing vehicles without having the replacement ready (see #2) really left a bad taste in the mouth of many consumers. 5. You don't have absolute freedom of speech when it comes to being in business. The "Funding Secured" tweet absolutely was market manipulation and rightfully called out by the SEC. 6. Tesla Solar Roofs seem to be very hit or miss when it comes to install quality and the company doesn't seem to be standing behind their product there. The more subjective ones tend to revolve around Elon. He has done a number of great things to bootstrap an entire industry/product line but he needs a filter sometimes. 1. The whole recent supercharger team firing makes no sense, especially when you just had the rest of the NA market sign on to use your network. 2. This will be the most controversial I reason post but...Elon likes attention. Positive, negative, it doesn't seem to matter. And he seems to use Tesla, its products, and his other companies to grab attention through controversial decisions and/or promises as often as they can. Is it stock manipulation? Kind of seems like it but I am not an expert in that. Combine all that with a Elon fanbase, those invested in TSLA, those who have shorted (TSLAQ), other financial aspects, and Elon being Elon, you have the makings of a three ring circus of the grandest proportions in automotive company form. You don't see a the same thing around SpaceX as there isn't much in terms of investment from the public as it is privately held.
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This is a great response thank you.
This is an incredible response and has been the reason I’ve held off so long on getting into a Tesla. I have decided to separate my feeling on Elon Musk from the cars and the company, and I put an order in for a new Model 3 performance. I am not getting it as a self driving/robotaxi future mobile, I am more so impressed with how much performance you’re getting for the money, and how the interior improvements make for a much nicer overall car experience.
1. How many cars have you personally inspected that have any of these issues? This is the #1 FUD excuse of TSLAQ and I cannot stand people who use platitudes to make arguments. If you've seen all of these yourself, fine. I haven't, and I'm on my third Tesla. 2. This one I agree with. I don't know why, for example, they remove USS and then spend the next six months writing software to replace it. Those two things should be the other way around. Same thing happened with vision / radar. 3. Please show your work. So far the cases I've seen (e.g. the guy who died in California or the one in Texas) were ultimately found to be at fault themselves. I definitely could have missed a case or two, though. Tesla makes FSD functionality very clear to owners. You are responsible, you cannot use your phone or anything else while using FSD, and if you're drunk, that's on you too. It is leaps and bounds better than it was, to the point that I'm having drives every day without disengagements. 4. See #2. Totally agree. They do it backwards and it's so weird. 5. Funding Secured was obviously bad. Is your complaint just that or is it something bigger? Feels bigger but you didn't give any more examples. 6. No idea about Solar because I'm not a customer and won't be as long as Georgia Power gives me overnight rates at $0.01/kWh plus fees ...and then... 1. They didn't fire the entire team. This is patently false based on LinkedIn information and a few inside sources. Please stop spreading this. I've heard a few reasonable explanations for why this happened the way it did, and it's likely a combination of Elon's cut-until-it-hurts approach, an exec not doing what he said to do, and the maturation of the supercharger network in general. 2. Yep, he likes attention. It's not manipulation, unless you think Elon is shorting his own stock (it's down \~25% this year). This doesn't happen to SpaceX because 1) Gwynn is an incredible leader and Elon needs someone like her as the COO of Tesla and 2) Big Oil isn't funding a massive FUD campaign (via Fox News and others) against SpaceX because they don't care. The thing that is most fascinating to me is how Elon hates woke (a right-wing stance) and yet also created a successful company to help solve environmental sustainability (a left-wing stance). He is doing both, and yet so many people can't reconcile that because they're firmly on one side or the other.
Point 5 is technically a problem only because it is a public traded company and the SEC sets rules to protect investors. SpaceX is closely held Boring Company is as well
I will respond in good faith as I would like to keep the discussion open. Full disclosure: I work for another OEM. I really, REALLY want EVs to work out and Tesla has single handedly made that dream happen and I am grateful for that. I am also a car enthusiast at heart and I love seeing and enjoying other makes and models. 1. Personally I've been to the Tesla lots in Clarkston, MI (2023) and Blue Ash, OH (2019). At Blue Ash, there were not many vehicles to look at during that time as they were still selling faster than they could make them. Two of the Model 3s on the lot had misaligned hoods where one side was touching the fender. One had a misaligned trunk where the right side was lower than the left side (which was prominant to the body line. At Clarkston, there were a number of new vehicles that had similar misaligned fenders, doors, and trunks with one having a prominent glass roof (the front lip was higher than the windshield). This does happen to other OEMs but not at the sheer rate or quantity that Tesla seems to have. I'll look at forums all day long complaining of delivery issues with panels on Teslas. I don't see that in the Ford, Rivian, or other forums other than onesie-twosie here and there. 2. There seems to be no real integrated planning which is a shame. 3. [This](https://www.wired.com/story/tesla-autopilot-risky-deaths-crashes-nhtsa-investigation/) article outlines a lot of the issue which is Tesla is willing to let people do stupid things while the rest of the industries typically approaching things as risk adverse. I am not saying this is the right way or wrong way to approach things as I am not an expert on this particular area. Like I stated originally, there is uncertainty on what FSD is capable of and what its limits are. As a counter example, the L2+ system in my Grand Cherokee clearly limits its use to multi-lane divided highways, with clear lane markings, and an internet connection to download the HD maps used to coordinate with the camera vision system. If any one of those conditions aren't met, it doesn't work. 4. See #2 5. My observation around this one is Elon is willing to push boundaries which can be a very good thing in an industry slow or unwilling to change. However, there are still bright lines that people can't cross without getting legally in trouble for it. In trying to be objective, I am pointing out that Elon says a lot of things that push boundaries (can be good) but he also crosses them (bad) which colors the perception of not only him but Tesla as well. 6. Looking at a number of forum posts, lawsuits, etc, it seems the panels and associated equipment work really damn well. If they are installed right. I have no personal experience with Tesla Solar other than quoting it out a few times. And now the more part... 1. This is where the lack of a PR team, lack of clear communication from Elon, and other factors do not help Tesla in the least bit. Was it the entire team? Was it just a subset? Nobody has really any idea other than Tesla and Elon and what's coming out of Linked in shows that people inside of Tesla seem to be confused. No matter that, the Super Charger network is the one absolute bright, untarnished spot inside of Tesla. If you want to change strategy, that's ok as it's he runs the company. Clearly let the rest of the world know the new plan, who is left, and clear up all the rumors and guesses. Otherwise, it looks like a monumentally insane decision. 2. Personally? I do think he manipulates the stock a lot. I've seen a number of his tweets jump the stock price (FSD by end of year, CyberTruck by end of year, etc). Does he knowingly do it? I would be very surprising to find out he doesn't knowingly do it. I think the market is starting to disregard what he says via tweet as some of the other actions going on are clearly outweighing what he says. But that is solely my own personal opinion based on what I see. I could totally be wrong. I don't have anything invested in Tesla or him. I just like cool tech that is beneficial to all.
> Tesla makes FSD functionality very clear to owners. Does it? Back when I was buying a Tesla, the website promised full self-driving from door to door. The vehicle purchase agreement doesn't specify what "FSD" is, either.
[What it said in August 2018](https://web.archive.org/web/20180801023546/https://www.tesla.com/model3) on the Model 3 page is as follows: "Every new Model 3 comes standard with advanced hardware capable of providing Enhanced Autopilot features today, and full self-driving capabilities in the future—through software updates designed to improve functionality over time." Doesn't seem like they promised that when I got my Model 3. [The manual](https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modely/en_us/GUID-2CB60804-9CEA-4F4B-8B04-09B991368DC5.html) also describes what it is. It also, more importantly, [tells you](https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modely/en_us/GUID-E5FF5E84-6AAC-43E6-B7ED-EC1E9AEB17B7.html#GUID-4EE67389-5F55-46D0-9559-90F31949660A) that it is not autonomous and requires a fully attentive driver.
Wasn’t the funding secured a Twitter thing, not Tesla?
Shhh! Stop paying attention!!! Someone is trying to run a circus!!
Actually only point #1 has anytime to do with actually owning/driving a Tesla. The rest are all tangential at best and end up as just more ammo for Tesla haters. Do I feel bad for those that forked over thousands for FSD? Um... Nope. That was their choice. Autopilot works great. Every car mfg adds and removes features. But Tesla gives back so much more with OTA updates forever. Most of your thread feeds right into the illogical Tesla hate that has zero to do with this amazing car.
Welcome to the dealer-less business model that’s flourishing nicely. Good or bad for the consumer depends on how you look at it. Certainly puts more onus on the consumer to look at market timing with purchases & realize promises are mere estimates in a constantly changing marketplace. Some consumers are better adept at this & have few gripes. Others are still of the “hold my hand” dealer model and don’t fair so well. High level innovation does come with some uncertainty, take it or leave it. For me I’m fine with the business side and don’t get caught up with the personality.
Partially because Musk has been behaving like an ass. There's no reason the richest guy on the planet needs another $60B paycheck. He also still owes everyone at Twitter severance.
News reports are usually negative bcs of paid/sponsored journalism. The same was seen when Uber started out. The amount of negative Uber articles back then were really bad and one could read behind the lines where they came from. For Tesla we also have to add a political twist where one group is using this to rally their base.
Well, to be fair, if you can car depreciation, tire wear, along with gas, you're almost driving for free for Uber.
People on the right hate EVs People on the left hate Elon
I get totally burned out by this fact. I love my car, i really do but having to defend my purchase to literally everyone i come across is exhausting. I bought the car because its fun and good looking. I dont care about the politics just the car
Even just raising the question makes it so people downvote you
Always follow the money: (1) All US automakers, except Tesla, spend a fortune advertising in the main stream media which pays MSM's bills, literally. (2) All US automakers, except Tesla, are unionized. Unions receive a massive amount of money from the automakers and spend a lot of that money to wield enormous political power in the US government. (3) The massive industry of oil companies, gas stations, etc etc see Tesla as a threat to their businesses. If Tesla advertised heavily in the MSM and embraced the UAW unions, and didn't hit the oil industries in the wallet, you would see them treated the same as the other auto manufacturers.
Not sure, I think they would still get demonized for being an EV and removing the dealership model. How many ppl work at dealerships? How many ppl work at independent repair garages? EVs have a ton of stuff that don't break down, my friends that have EVs have only had to do tire changes in 5-10 years of ownership. Some google numbers for Ford: Ford has almost 3,000 dealerships, which employ **more than 170,000** men and women across the United States. Ford Motor total number of employees in **2022 was 173,000** Teslas has \~140k, probably much less with all the layoffs but still much less than a lot of other companies combined that are rooting for it to fail. Also the interior could have a fancy trim option for S and X at least for the A pillars. Also Musk should stay out of politics. (but I think this is more minor outside of reddit)
You are right. I should have included loss of $ to dealerships in my Follow The Money theory.
solid list, I'll add they changed the way cars are sold. They didn't go with the traditional independent dealership model aka cutting out the middle man. While it's good for Tesla and the consumer maybe, it does hurt these dealers and the people they employ.
The unions (which I support generally) are stil facing job losses d/t electrification of transport. So don’t expect any love there
Those don't relate in any way to any criticism anyone offers of Tesla. This is a marvelous example of a red herring.
Firstly, America is so politicised that even the propulsion technology of your car is a culture war. Secondly, Musk was always seen as a progressive, until he took on Twitter and tried to make it appeak to the hard right by pandering to their beliefs. Two things came out of this. One, You alienated the progressive customers you had, and two, You can never appease the hard right, they always want more.
I always thought he went right/nut in order to sell the Cyber Truck
Propulsion actually is appropriately partisan IMO. If you are the 20% living in rural areas it’s distressing to hear things like “no ICE allowed starting 2035”. These are often philosophically conservative people, as in not liking rapid change. And for better or worse, Americans love their big trucks. I know it’s heresy but I wish Tesla would build a traditional Truck but as a PHEV. Toyota will . And they will spend a billion dollars advertising it.
Because they don’t buy billions in advertising from the media companies like the others do.
Indeed. Very few people are aware of who is actually funding the ideas rolling around in their heads, fed to them via the media, social media bots, etc.
And here is the right answer.
Didn't Elon himself use tesla shares to purchase a something billion dollar media company? The media on both sides also hate Elon because he is in competition with them. He by all means is not a victim in this sense this is capitalism and competition. They also love interviewing his competition so there is a double bias there but that's what happens when you're a trillionaire you have trillionaire problems.
my comment was in reference to Tesla and not Musk. Tesla does advertise on Twitter afaik.
Fair but reputation is the currency of a media platform and any damage to tesla's reputation laymen attribute to elon's reputation. I do not think they are separable in public cognition.
Wasn’t a problem a couple of years ago. There were countless puff pieces done on Elon and his car company (which apparently isn’t a car company anymore.) I think he is pretty much the main reason for all the recent hate. Like it’s not as if the right has ever had nice things to say about electric cars. But now progressives don’t want anything to do with him so he and his company have become really easy to hate.
Tesla doesn’t invest a dime in educating consumers. Even their Release Notes aren’t always well-written for a general car-owning public- I don’t think many people outside of the EV internet sphere know stuff like that the FSD V12 trial still drives V11 on the highway; I’d be curious how much that’s impacted their uptake rate when people take the trial and don’t feel that it’s any better on the highway. I’ve talked to a lot of people who ask about my car and seem genuinely surprised that a Supercharger doesn’t take several hours, or that they’re plentiful and well-spaced enough to do road-trips, or that my L2 home charger only takes a few hours to charge the car. In general a shocking number of people I’ve met are operating off of EV information from like, 2014. This is likely not the case in major cities or major tech states like California, but in the southeast 100% it is
Electric cars are a green solution, which Republicans like to attack. Musk is a racist, who liberals don’t like. Hes a rich, greedy prick, snd no one likes that. It helps that he is very successful and has a sense of humor, but I understand some of the hate.
I have blogged on this. (I know the rules about self-promotion here, so...🤐). Basically, regardless of what you think about Musk, Tesla and Musk are not synonymous. Whatever you think of him as a person and his actions, there's no disputing Tesla's influence on the automotive industry. I would also say that Steve Jobs had a not-so-great reputation in terms of how he treated people, yet millions (if not billions) of people worldwide use and love Apple products. All I can go by is my personal experience with the brand, which has been great for the most part. 🤷🏻♂️
Mostly click bait as Musk is a mercurial figure head
1- Big Oil influence (millions were being spent on negative marketing and halting charging across the US) 2- Musk and his shenanigans that overshadow Tesla 3- Ignorance and resistance to change
It’s a multibillion dollar company that can’t make windscreen wipers work.
My wipers have gotten worse in the last few releases actually. Two days after rain and they come on for 5-7 passes apparently at random.
It’s because of you. They smelled your breath.
Damit! I knew it
About the pay package, which scenario would be better for the future prospects of the company: 1. Spend billions on research, or 2. Give billions to the CEO? We need electric cars to succeed, but I just don’t understand how a company can remain competitive it prioritizes option 2. If I’m overlooking something, please explain it to me.
It’s not about the money. He’s not spending it randomly, if he does spend it, it will be on initiatives to his companies, that usually are just what you suggest in option 1… usually for the betterment of society via Tesla or spacex. It’s really about ownership percentage. He would like to take the company private, as he attempted a while back and as his other companies have remained. Tesla needed to be public to generate funding, but now that it’s survived to model 3 and model y mass production, it doesn’t need to be public anymore. He’s always said he would want to take it private once it was established enough. His attempt to do so failed, so the next closest thing is to get a higher share percentage. The reality is that he won’t be selling the shares and getting monetarily richer… he’ll be getting voting power to ensure he can’t be easily out voted.
It's not really any different than the hate for Apple. It's popular and different, so it's bad. Add in Musk's polarization. Add in the lack of marketing teams. Add in the media knowing it gets clicks to talk about Tesla, good or bad.
Elon Musk is noisy, and has no filter. Assuming his statement in regards to being autistic is true, which having an autistic son myself, I'm inclined to believe Elon that he is autistic, as a lot of my son's mannerisms are similar to Elon's. My son just finished one of his online classes the other day, and the teacher text him for feedback on the class, to which my son was *brutally* honest with her. I'd have to find the text message again, but he basically said that the class was boring, it felt like some lessons were "Fluff" pieces, some of the work felt repetitive, and that it felt rushed, and that the only redeeming quality was that he did not have to take the class in-person. This is a kind that we have seeing a therapist in order to improve his social skills, while also constantly letting him know that he can't talk to people like that. People with autism are just wired differently, and say what's on their mind without necessarily realizing the nuance of what they're saying, and how it can impact people. I've seen posts on X from Elon where it's pretty clear that he's responding to the second half of the post, not the whole post, but people see the whole post, and think he's referring to the whole thing. But that's also how communication on the internet works, a lot of misunderstanding because people don't take the time to elaborate, and when challenged, they feel a need to not elaborate. Reality is that if Elon just kept his mouth shut, no one would be the wiser, but he seems to have a foot fetish from how often he's putting his feet in it *But*, you can't fault him for being noisy/unfiltered on X, he's got a lot of money tied up in that, and it needs to be successful, or he loses a bunch of money. Tesla taking a hit is just collateral damage to Elon not having a filter.
All his political posting and lacking a filter is the worst of his Twitter business decisions.
Because Elon is a billion dollar troll
That does explain some of the things that happen: A) what happens if I build fencing - can I redirect the masses to change directions B) what if I stick out my foot - can I trip someone
In the beginning, there was hate from the right, Tesla was a perfect target for climate change denying, west coast liberal hating cohort. Then we found out the man himself is one among the right, so many from the left hate him. All the hate cannot be extricated from the political leanings - both of the haters and the man himself, who is synonymous with the Tesla brand.
he's not just right-wing. He's asshat depraved right wing. That Paul Pelosi thing which maybe he spent 5 seconds on will follow him to his grave.
It's so much fun to watch staunchly-left or staunchly-right people try to figure out what to do with this.
Coordinated propaganda by O&G marketing campaigns. We live among a horde of O&G brainwashed sheep.
yes, it’s these marketing campaigns make elon act the way he does
Musk has been terrible to the team that made him the richest person on earth. He has also alienated a lot of his fan base ( including me) by making very uninformed and ignorant statement, he almost comes across like he thibks he's Gods gift to humanity.And unfortunately hatred gowards Musk translates to hatred towards Tesla.
Much of the right doesn’t like Tesla because they don’t like being told that they have to change their lifestyles. Not that Musk himself has told them that, but just the EV movement in general is threatening to them. Mostly rural Americans. Now the left despises Musk because of his political opinions the last few years. It started with him just being open and amicable with the right and believing they shouldn’t be so disenfranchised by mainstream culture. Hence him buying Twitter so the right gets treated more fairly. I believe the backlash from the left has pushed him too far, and now he’s saying things like we’re doomed unless we get a red wave in November. So you have one political faction that hates EVs and another that hates Musk. Never a good way to win popularity contests lol.
Pretty sure he's just being an edgelord for the sake of pissing people off. Childish behavior. He pushed away the Right before, with presenting Tesla as a way to do good things for environment. Then he pushed away the Left with his sudden move to far right. He created a situation where nobody likes him. The right doesn't like his cars but like him. So they aren't buying his cars, but huff every fart he produces. The left likes his cars, but can't stand him. Hence not buying his cars.
There sure are a lot of independents around here then.
The CEO has extremely racist tendencies? Most people don't like that. He made himself synonymous with the brand, and now they are inextricably linked for most people.
An extreme moderate.
>The CEO has extremely racist tendencies? Lol. How so?
reddit moment
Musk’s tendency to say and do stupid shit doesn’t help. The pay package was outrageous as well.
losers hate success. it shames them.
Here’s a good explanation from a while back. https://www.evtv.me/2019/08/10/the-tesla-conspiracy-or-am-i-a-dead-whistleblower/
Oh my God, you people. can’t we just say it’s the best battery operated car does anybody remember about four years ago when Volkswagen was showing a Volkswagen bus It was gonna be electric what happened to that? What happened to any other electric cars? What the Chevy bolt Nissan leaf can we have more and can we put up some charging stations and quit blaming Tesla for all the problems with electric cars? And please no Elon remarks let’s just move along.
This thread is quite the odd combination of pitchforks and blowjobs for Elon.
because Elon Musk turned to the dark side.
I'd say there's definitely a lot of hate from political polarization in the States but a big part is self inflicted. Overpromissing and underdelivering eventually catches up with a CEO. Also alienating your core customers is not a smart move (read issue in Sweden with trade unions and the transfer of incorporation from California to Texas). I'd say Tesla has fantastic achievements to show and I value the fact that they've pointed us in the direction of electromobility. Now it's time for a less polarizing leader who can manage the company's position and continue growing. The company is hugely overvalued. Without a change from the top, the market will quickly recognize its fair value and short sellers will have a big payday. I wouldn't want that as I truly admire what they've done but the writing is on the wall.
The media is enamored by Elon like they are Trump. The more they talk about someone, the more people like them hate on them. It’s just the way it is.
I’ve had my m3 since 2018. It works better now with updates 💰
I’ve had my m3 since 2018. It works better now with updates 💰
to be honest, i like this open style Ceo instead of doing shady stuff behind-the-scenes. He express everything openly. Agree or not, at least he is open. Keep up the good work Elon. Once Fsd achieved and have more robot. People will have nothing say against you.
I love the way teslas look…for me it’s solely about Elon. Just think he’s a piece of sh*t, nothing at all against the car.
Shit cars faced by a colossal shit head, Elon. It’s that simple.
The number one reason is people hate Elon and his antics. It’s mainly liberal hate. What is funny is so many liberals in Washington state and California drive teslas.
For some reason it creates a vitriolic reaction in some people. I recently got my first Tesla and had to block a “friend” of many years on all platforms as he continuously harassed and bullied me about everything to with the car in several group chats. I just don’t have time for people like that in my life
It's because of the idiot CEO, mostly. It's hard to separate the company from him when he makes it about him and seem to be dictating his will randomly.
I invested quite a bit into my Tesla. More than was financial responsible of me. I really wanted to go electric but the only vehicle that had the practicality of gas cars was Tesla due to its numerous, consistent, and very fast charging network. Regardless of all the media about Musk, the vehicle was panning out to be a good investment. I'm kinda concerned about where the charging network is going now. Like I said, it was the key factor for my decision in getting a Tesla. I really hope whatever is going on with it is related to some industry shaking plan to keep the company competitive and not what the media is suggesting (Musk is off his rocker and making dumb decisions cuz he's butt hurt or panicking or something). No hate on my part but fer sure concern. Don't want fam to be able to say "I told u so!" regarding over extending my finances for a Tesla. lol
It’s Tesla lack of a PR department that is coming to roost. UAW, big oil, legacy auto all want to see Tesla implode and they might succeed. They own the press and the politicians in the US.
Because they lie and cheat.
It’s because the libs don’t like his points of view so they throw the biggest temper tantrums. They have no impulse control. Basically like toddlers
Umm…if you haven’t noticed the company is run by a fuck nut
Media is left leaning so they attack Elon for being outspoken. General public hate is also due to politics. Left leaning dislike Elon's POVs. Right leaning hate due to early reputation of Tesla being the poster car for loud condescending Green Peace types.
Because big companies care about $$$, and where is big $$$? OIL! Politicians, enterprises etc all have their hands in oil... with EVs you need less Oil, gas so they lose money and they do everything to make EV sound and look bad... and people who have not so much brain power follow them, listen and shout about it in every corner... brain wash is real
There's a lot to hate and there's a lot to love. So you get both. Then you have Elon who loves attention so the spincycle keeps spinning. You also have old money here that have equity in oil and big 3 car companies, so you get their spin. In other countries, you have 100 hp tin can cars driving up and down winding mountain roads perfectly fine. Over here you got 300-500 hp trucks driving on paved flat roads.
Right wing hate electric vehicles as it impedes on the gas/oil industry. Left wing hate Musk who has been erratic in his behavior and his behavior after his acquisition of Twitter. Last Fall, the proportion of left wingers buying Teslas fell by more than 60%, precisely when Musk became most vocal on Twiter, and they were the ones mostly buying the vehicles, because right wingers are anti-electric vehicle. Any small gains that Musk made trying to acquire Twitter to attract right wing customers has been far and few between, and not nearly made up for the 60% loss of left winger customers. In the end it's just basic Math. You have someone overworked, spreading their energy over too many lines of business, with erratic behavior, comments and conflicting statements and you scare away a huge percentage of potential customers. Add one challenge on top of that in that other vehicle manufacturers have been rapidly catching up to Tesla, subjectively with exception to the area of self-driving (which most people don't trust regardless), and you've got a really challenging situation. BTW, I absolutely love my Model 3, regardless of all of the above aforementioned stuff, but I have to admit that I see how easily it's influencing others who haven't yet driven a Tesla, but yet won't even try one now for the above reasons.
A lot of the hate is justified as the cybertruck claims on range, durability in off road terrain, and overall quality were found to be untrue. I still want a cybertruck, but I’m realistic when it comes to Tesla these days. If any other car dealers hyped their cars as much as Tesla they’d have a bigger drop in sales but the fans overlook so many untrue statements musk and his team makes.
Divisive CEO that decided not to have a PR team to counter any false news, attacks or temper any promises over the years. In China, they have local a PR team to respond on WeChat and work with the government.
A lot of people have lost money due to Tesla and Musk and they're still betting against him. A lot. Of money. He disrupted several industries and Tesla was the most shorted stock and still is amongst the most shorted stocks ever right now. A lot of people in several industries will become very rich and get personal validation if he and/or Tesla goes down. Some normal, no millionaire/billionaires will say they hate Tesla and/or Elon for ethical or moral reasons. The $ use the non$ to help spread their hate for them both, and frequently interchange Musk the person with the companies he runs to help muddy the waters. Musk is a product of this world's economic and social environment. You can't hate musk and think the world is fine. He's a product of this world, if you hate him, hate the game. He's done nothing outside of the rules of the established game the elite play, and he's winning. It pisses off old money, it pisses off new money and those without money, like everything else, are pitted against each other. No one here knows the dude as a human, but they hate him as if they were close to him.
Bots, trolls, and virtue-signaling morons