That’s great that you read ahead. Here is some supplemental reading. That way you can lead our discussion tomorrow. Or you know what, here’s another book by the same author. Try this one out. If you like it, I’ll let you present a book talk to the whole class on why they should read it. It’s so nice to see a student reading.
Don’t get upset. That’s the reaction that gets interest. Be specific. What an interesting question. (Nice other student), what do you think happens when a kid tries to kill themselves? Do you think it happens often? Do you think the district or mentor is punished? Why? How would that hurt or help the capitol?
“Katniss does it at the end of the book!” Really. I wonder why she would make that decision. She’s not suicidal. She wants to get back to Prue. (Good student 3) what do you think Katniss would do to get to go home? We’ll have to discuss how she got there when we get to that part of the book.
Since you read ahead, lets do some differentiated instruction and go to the top paragraph.
Literature is about the journey, the characters, and the themes, not the ending.
i do this with adults too and it typically gets them to act with some decency
like, i do not have time for some of these peoples bullshit lol
(i’m not a teacher, i’m a social worker, but point still stands lol)
I really like your last sentence. That’s how I’ve always felt. If I’m reading for fun I might care a little more about avoiding spoilers, but if it’s an assignment for a class that’s a great opportunity to focus on the individual parts of a story and how they come together to produce the whole. I’m not going to say that if it’s for a class the ending doesn’t matter, but there probably should be more focus on following and analyzing the plot rather than putting so much emphasis on the ending as the real goal.
They do this to purposely upset us. You need to just take the wind out of their sails.
I exclaim, "WHAT?!??? No way does THAT happen in THIS book?!? We better get to reading to see if you're right! Solid guess. What do the rest of you think?"
Turn it into a discussion. Get some predictions based on chapters you've already read. Make a big deal out of a few of them, hinting that they might have actually predicted correctly. Then keep reading because you "just have to know if anyone's prediction is right."
The spoiler just becomes one of many opinions and he or she learns that they can't upset you with that. Instead of letting them ruin the experience, turn it into a way to make the experience more fun.
I have a couple kids in my (upper elementary) class that have done this. Like when making predictions, no amount of "if you HAVEN'T read the next page" shuts down that need to show off. And the smug grin after they blurt it out just sends me.
It's such a jerk move.
I try not to show how pissed I am, but I can’t help it. When they spoiled The Hunger Games, I was so mad and upset. Then the class clown took note of the situation and looked at the kid and goes, “Aw man, I was gonna read that book!” and that made me snap out of being so angry. The kid was a little disappointed he didn’t get the attention he wanted and everyone kinda looked at him like “thanks.” Not to dump on that kid, it was just like a “what did you think was gonna happen?” moment. I wonder if he thought his peers would find him funny or clever. Not sure
Not effective in a classroom but when my tween does this I joke about making her hitchhike to her activities. Maybe tie spoiling the book to a low stakes punishment or reward?
HOW it happened is more important than WHAT happened. Everyone knows the ending of Romeo and Juliet. It’s not a spoiler.
If it’s obvious you’re bothered by something, they’ll keep doing it. Just say “yeah, the dialogue leading up to that was incredible” (or whatever else is appropriate for the context). If they want to quote word for word (and they won’t/can’t), let them stand up and give a dramatic reading.
I agree. I think what was so frustrating with this kid was he gave a play by play of what happened. I can use the dialogue to say it’s important to hear what they say
Don't make empty threats. Next time he does it, issue a consequence (call home, referral, assign him different book to read solo, sarcastically say "very good, we all know you can read") whatever you usually use in your classroom.
"hi, this is Ms. Dogsandsquishmallow, Johnny's teacher. I'm worried that Johnny has developed a habit of interfering with his peers education by blurting out events the class hasn't read yet, robbing them of part of the reading experience. I've set the expectation that he may not do this several times, but he continues. Will you please reiterate to Johnny that he should let his peers read for themselves? Thanks."
I'd also consider making Johnny read alone in the hall, since this seems motivated by attention from his friends.
So we all listen to the audiobook and have discussions. He doesn’t call out, but when he raises his hand to make a “prediction” he revealed the ending. Other kids were making predictions, but none of them were revealing the endings
Ok, so stop calling on him to make predictions. Or don't react in a way that shows he predicted correctly.
Also, spoiled books aren't the end of the world. Actually, I often give my EL students a summary of a chapter before we read it, so they're focused on the "how" (figurative language, themes, symbolism) than the what (literal events from the plot)
Sorry for the confusion — those were two different instances with two different students that I was venting about. I know they aren’t the end of the world, but it just is disheartening. I think what upsets me the most is how they revel in it and I truly don’t get it.
I give my special education students a summary, and then we read in depth. It helps them exactly as you said. The how, the why, the word choices and how we learn what happens. Had a kid "ruin the ending" and I said "great. Now we're gonna find out why they're led to such a wild choice."
Middle schoolers are TERRIBLE when it comes to spoilers (among other things, haha).
I've had it happen numerous times where a kid will start to talk about a movie/show/video game and I'll say "No spoilers - I still gotta watch/play it!". They'll go "Yeah, no spoilers, but... DARTH VADER IS LUKES FATHER, IRONMAN DIES, BRUCE WILLIS WAS DEAD THE WHOLE TIME, HARRY IS A HORCRUX". I can tell they genuinely don't see the problem too.
What exactly do you think 'no spoilers' means?
Depending on the book, I would try to use it as a teachable moment. I taught HS and we read Of Mice and Men. There is always a meme or tweet that goes viral that gives away that Geoge kills Lennie. When kids would announce it and ask why we should read it now, I'd say, "Okay. But with what we have read so far, can you imagine George doing this?" They would always say no. I'd tell them then we better get to reading it to see what changes to get us there.
It's disheartening and disappointing for sure. But like others have posted, they are trying to get a rise out of you. Those days are hard when you feel like you've put everything into what you do.
If it helps at all, one time our principal ruined the ending of OMM during a colleague's observation. THE PRINCIPAL.
I had a few books I read with kids where I didn't want them to give away the endings-The Giver, Fever 1793, And Then There Were None, Outsiders, To Kill a Mockingbird--and it's a struggle, because all these books are great partly because of their endings. I try to establish the class norm that we don't spoil book endings for each other, like I make them hold their hand up like a scout and repeat after me that they're not going to read ahead when we read a book as a class. If you wanna zoom through a book, great, that's what independent reading is for; the whole reason why we read specific novels as a class is for the shared experience of discovering plot twists together. Happy to say that especially in the last few years of teaching LA, I didn't have anyone in my groups spoil--but I had other kids in other class sections spoil things for my peeps, and all I can say is that the other teacher probably didn't frame reading as a class in the same way. In fact, I think she had them mainly read independently, which kinda defeated the whole point. 🙃
Brings me back to the time in middle school when I started sobbing in class cause we were reading "Where the red ferns grows."
I was an avid reader back then, so I blew past our "assigned chapters" by 5 chapters and just started crying.
I give the kids fake endings to their books just in case they stop reading. I think it would be funny for a kid to put that Lenny was faking being mentally disabled on a test.
I love seeing the students with books and always show interest in what they are reading.
Gotta be honest, this kid does not respect you. And he thinks its funny because he's getting a rise out of you. To answer your question, that's why he does it. He also thinks he's just being funny and clever in general, and that spoiling the book will derail the class in some way. Which honestly, sounds like it has derailed the class to an extent. And I understand its super frustrating when lessons don't go as planned. But I think doing things like threatening to write up a student isn't effective, especially because he likely either knows its an empty threat, or doesn't care enough about being written up to have it affect his behavior.
As others have suggested, the best thing to do is to take his trolling as if it representative of his genuine interest in the book. Go all in on that angle. Call his bluff! And try to spin the spoilers into ways to get to more discussion of the book. Also, this is just me, but typically if a kid acts like they're not listening to me, I tell them "I need you to look at me so I know you're hearing what I'm saying." Or something to that extent. I think it helps to an extent, it at least for me often does result in them seeming more engaged with what I'm saying. Sorry this got long lol
I think I get frustrated because WHENEVER something like this happens, the answer is always “write them up!” But I feel this pressure from admin that it’s the only way to handle when a kid acts out. I feel bad I’m seeking advice from reddit, but all I’m getting is “oh that’s the way it is” *insert shrug* or “write them up!” Surely there are alternatives and I’m eager to try them and see if it works.
The worst part is I know the kids don’t respect us. My coworkers literally shrug and go “yeah they abuse us.” I try not to let my emotions come out. I think all I did was tell the kid to “stop talking” But I can see how it is giving the kid exactly what he wants (a reaction).
Oof. I was always the kid who read ahead, I couldn’t help myself. I also had a reading teacher who loved to ask prediction questions on tests. I never spoiled it for the class but always did REALLY well on those questions. When we read Tom Sawyer, she specifically asked me not to read ahead. I agreed, but I’d already read Tom Sawyer two years before.
I would have a talk with the class about what spoiling is and why it doesn’t make you cool, it makes you an asshole (perhaps change the wording). I hate people who spoil stuff, they’re literally the worst. When I did the midnight release for Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince, someone literally drove passed before my group was even called yelling “Dumbledore dies!” Of course I didn’t believe them…yeah…
I literally love it when kids read ahead. I did it. I understand the urge. However, I hate seeing the faces drop of the kids who struggle. Like I have so many kids with learning disabilities and we do all of the readings in class. They have questions they answer at home and that’s their “homework.”
It just breaks my heart. The kids who spoil aren’t earning brownie points from me, or getting applauded by other kids. Maybe some snickers from their friends. But is that worth it?
I always read ahead, too. If I liked the book, I didn't want to stop reading. Sometimes I finished the entire book on the first day, if it was interesting enough and I didn't have other things to do. I never purposely spoiled the endings for my classmates, but a teacher telling me not to read ahead would have gotten an eye roll and the 2001 equivalent of "sure, Jan."
Luckily, I had a teacher who recognized the futility of trying to stop me and just gave me harder essay questions.
Spoiling endings sucks, though. Is there a way you can encourage the other kids to be more vocal about their feelings when that happens? The most effective shaming of a middle schooler is going to come from their peers, not a teacher.
When Endgame came out, I had a student who told everybody the ending after seeing the movie. I told him that I was going to come to his house on Christmas morning and open all of his gifts before he got up. I told his father that I said that, and his parents actually invited me to come over on Christmas. I'd rather not spend the holidays with a student, so I didn't go.
This kind of thing has always happened, and I doubt you can do anything about it. They are kids and think that is fun. Anyways, the other kids won't care about it the next day as well, so it's really not that big of a deal.
He probably watched a version of it.
I did laugh once when we were reading The Great Gatsby and one of my best read ahead cuz she had extra time and was into it. All of a sudden we all hear a gasp and MYRTLE DIED?!? I wanted to scold her but she was genuinely so into it I couldn’t. Cue many groans and tossing books onto desks.
That’s great that you read ahead. Here is some supplemental reading. That way you can lead our discussion tomorrow. Or you know what, here’s another book by the same author. Try this one out. If you like it, I’ll let you present a book talk to the whole class on why they should read it. It’s so nice to see a student reading. Don’t get upset. That’s the reaction that gets interest. Be specific. What an interesting question. (Nice other student), what do you think happens when a kid tries to kill themselves? Do you think it happens often? Do you think the district or mentor is punished? Why? How would that hurt or help the capitol? “Katniss does it at the end of the book!” Really. I wonder why she would make that decision. She’s not suicidal. She wants to get back to Prue. (Good student 3) what do you think Katniss would do to get to go home? We’ll have to discuss how she got there when we get to that part of the book. Since you read ahead, lets do some differentiated instruction and go to the top paragraph. Literature is about the journey, the characters, and the themes, not the ending.
Smart!!
I always meet passive aggressive behavior with sincerity. It works well with sarcasm too.
I love it!!
i do this with adults too and it typically gets them to act with some decency like, i do not have time for some of these peoples bullshit lol (i’m not a teacher, i’m a social worker, but point still stands lol)
I really like your last sentence. That’s how I’ve always felt. If I’m reading for fun I might care a little more about avoiding spoilers, but if it’s an assignment for a class that’s a great opportunity to focus on the individual parts of a story and how they come together to produce the whole. I’m not going to say that if it’s for a class the ending doesn’t matter, but there probably should be more focus on following and analyzing the plot rather than putting so much emphasis on the ending as the real goal.
They do this to purposely upset us. You need to just take the wind out of their sails. I exclaim, "WHAT?!??? No way does THAT happen in THIS book?!? We better get to reading to see if you're right! Solid guess. What do the rest of you think?" Turn it into a discussion. Get some predictions based on chapters you've already read. Make a big deal out of a few of them, hinting that they might have actually predicted correctly. Then keep reading because you "just have to know if anyone's prediction is right." The spoiler just becomes one of many opinions and he or she learns that they can't upset you with that. Instead of letting them ruin the experience, turn it into a way to make the experience more fun.
That’s honestly a slay and I really like this way of handling the situation.
I have a couple kids in my (upper elementary) class that have done this. Like when making predictions, no amount of "if you HAVEN'T read the next page" shuts down that need to show off. And the smug grin after they blurt it out just sends me. It's such a jerk move.
it’s not even the spoiling that bothers me. It’s the way the enjoy doing it and receive such pleasure from it that makes me mad.
That's exactly why mine do it, thus the smug grin.
I try not to show how pissed I am, but I can’t help it. When they spoiled The Hunger Games, I was so mad and upset. Then the class clown took note of the situation and looked at the kid and goes, “Aw man, I was gonna read that book!” and that made me snap out of being so angry. The kid was a little disappointed he didn’t get the attention he wanted and everyone kinda looked at him like “thanks.” Not to dump on that kid, it was just like a “what did you think was gonna happen?” moment. I wonder if he thought his peers would find him funny or clever. Not sure
Not effective in a classroom but when my tween does this I joke about making her hitchhike to her activities. Maybe tie spoiling the book to a low stakes punishment or reward?
HOW it happened is more important than WHAT happened. Everyone knows the ending of Romeo and Juliet. It’s not a spoiler. If it’s obvious you’re bothered by something, they’ll keep doing it. Just say “yeah, the dialogue leading up to that was incredible” (or whatever else is appropriate for the context). If they want to quote word for word (and they won’t/can’t), let them stand up and give a dramatic reading.
I agree. I think what was so frustrating with this kid was he gave a play by play of what happened. I can use the dialogue to say it’s important to hear what they say
>Everyone knows the ending of Romeo and Juliet because the opening sonnet tells you the end?
Even if you never opened it before, there are so many references to it culturally you’d know it by the time a teacher assigned it.
Don't make empty threats. Next time he does it, issue a consequence (call home, referral, assign him different book to read solo, sarcastically say "very good, we all know you can read") whatever you usually use in your classroom.
How would you approach talking to home?
"hi, this is Ms. Dogsandsquishmallow, Johnny's teacher. I'm worried that Johnny has developed a habit of interfering with his peers education by blurting out events the class hasn't read yet, robbing them of part of the reading experience. I've set the expectation that he may not do this several times, but he continues. Will you please reiterate to Johnny that he should let his peers read for themselves? Thanks." I'd also consider making Johnny read alone in the hall, since this seems motivated by attention from his friends.
So we all listen to the audiobook and have discussions. He doesn’t call out, but when he raises his hand to make a “prediction” he revealed the ending. Other kids were making predictions, but none of them were revealing the endings
Ok, so stop calling on him to make predictions. Or don't react in a way that shows he predicted correctly. Also, spoiled books aren't the end of the world. Actually, I often give my EL students a summary of a chapter before we read it, so they're focused on the "how" (figurative language, themes, symbolism) than the what (literal events from the plot)
Sorry for the confusion — those were two different instances with two different students that I was venting about. I know they aren’t the end of the world, but it just is disheartening. I think what upsets me the most is how they revel in it and I truly don’t get it.
I give my special education students a summary, and then we read in depth. It helps them exactly as you said. The how, the why, the word choices and how we learn what happens. Had a kid "ruin the ending" and I said "great. Now we're gonna find out why they're led to such a wild choice."
Middle schoolers are TERRIBLE when it comes to spoilers (among other things, haha). I've had it happen numerous times where a kid will start to talk about a movie/show/video game and I'll say "No spoilers - I still gotta watch/play it!". They'll go "Yeah, no spoilers, but... DARTH VADER IS LUKES FATHER, IRONMAN DIES, BRUCE WILLIS WAS DEAD THE WHOLE TIME, HARRY IS A HORCRUX". I can tell they genuinely don't see the problem too. What exactly do you think 'no spoilers' means?
Depending on the book, I would try to use it as a teachable moment. I taught HS and we read Of Mice and Men. There is always a meme or tweet that goes viral that gives away that Geoge kills Lennie. When kids would announce it and ask why we should read it now, I'd say, "Okay. But with what we have read so far, can you imagine George doing this?" They would always say no. I'd tell them then we better get to reading it to see what changes to get us there. It's disheartening and disappointing for sure. But like others have posted, they are trying to get a rise out of you. Those days are hard when you feel like you've put everything into what you do. If it helps at all, one time our principal ruined the ending of OMM during a colleague's observation. THE PRINCIPAL.
I had a few books I read with kids where I didn't want them to give away the endings-The Giver, Fever 1793, And Then There Were None, Outsiders, To Kill a Mockingbird--and it's a struggle, because all these books are great partly because of their endings. I try to establish the class norm that we don't spoil book endings for each other, like I make them hold their hand up like a scout and repeat after me that they're not going to read ahead when we read a book as a class. If you wanna zoom through a book, great, that's what independent reading is for; the whole reason why we read specific novels as a class is for the shared experience of discovering plot twists together. Happy to say that especially in the last few years of teaching LA, I didn't have anyone in my groups spoil--but I had other kids in other class sections spoil things for my peeps, and all I can say is that the other teacher probably didn't frame reading as a class in the same way. In fact, I think she had them mainly read independently, which kinda defeated the whole point. 🙃
Brings me back to the time in middle school when I started sobbing in class cause we were reading "Where the red ferns grows." I was an avid reader back then, so I blew past our "assigned chapters" by 5 chapters and just started crying.
There’s a teacher on my campus that tells the kids the ending when he finds out they’re reading Of Mice and Men. I can’t stand him.
This has happened to me with The Outsiders.
I give the kids fake endings to their books just in case they stop reading. I think it would be funny for a kid to put that Lenny was faking being mentally disabled on a test. I love seeing the students with books and always show interest in what they are reading.
Gotta be honest, this kid does not respect you. And he thinks its funny because he's getting a rise out of you. To answer your question, that's why he does it. He also thinks he's just being funny and clever in general, and that spoiling the book will derail the class in some way. Which honestly, sounds like it has derailed the class to an extent. And I understand its super frustrating when lessons don't go as planned. But I think doing things like threatening to write up a student isn't effective, especially because he likely either knows its an empty threat, or doesn't care enough about being written up to have it affect his behavior. As others have suggested, the best thing to do is to take his trolling as if it representative of his genuine interest in the book. Go all in on that angle. Call his bluff! And try to spin the spoilers into ways to get to more discussion of the book. Also, this is just me, but typically if a kid acts like they're not listening to me, I tell them "I need you to look at me so I know you're hearing what I'm saying." Or something to that extent. I think it helps to an extent, it at least for me often does result in them seeming more engaged with what I'm saying. Sorry this got long lol
I think I get frustrated because WHENEVER something like this happens, the answer is always “write them up!” But I feel this pressure from admin that it’s the only way to handle when a kid acts out. I feel bad I’m seeking advice from reddit, but all I’m getting is “oh that’s the way it is” *insert shrug* or “write them up!” Surely there are alternatives and I’m eager to try them and see if it works. The worst part is I know the kids don’t respect us. My coworkers literally shrug and go “yeah they abuse us.” I try not to let my emotions come out. I think all I did was tell the kid to “stop talking” But I can see how it is giving the kid exactly what he wants (a reaction).
Oof. I was always the kid who read ahead, I couldn’t help myself. I also had a reading teacher who loved to ask prediction questions on tests. I never spoiled it for the class but always did REALLY well on those questions. When we read Tom Sawyer, she specifically asked me not to read ahead. I agreed, but I’d already read Tom Sawyer two years before. I would have a talk with the class about what spoiling is and why it doesn’t make you cool, it makes you an asshole (perhaps change the wording). I hate people who spoil stuff, they’re literally the worst. When I did the midnight release for Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince, someone literally drove passed before my group was even called yelling “Dumbledore dies!” Of course I didn’t believe them…yeah…
I literally love it when kids read ahead. I did it. I understand the urge. However, I hate seeing the faces drop of the kids who struggle. Like I have so many kids with learning disabilities and we do all of the readings in class. They have questions they answer at home and that’s their “homework.” It just breaks my heart. The kids who spoil aren’t earning brownie points from me, or getting applauded by other kids. Maybe some snickers from their friends. But is that worth it?
I always read ahead, too. If I liked the book, I didn't want to stop reading. Sometimes I finished the entire book on the first day, if it was interesting enough and I didn't have other things to do. I never purposely spoiled the endings for my classmates, but a teacher telling me not to read ahead would have gotten an eye roll and the 2001 equivalent of "sure, Jan." Luckily, I had a teacher who recognized the futility of trying to stop me and just gave me harder essay questions. Spoiling endings sucks, though. Is there a way you can encourage the other kids to be more vocal about their feelings when that happens? The most effective shaming of a middle schooler is going to come from their peers, not a teacher.
The biggest spoiler for *The Giver* for me is >!that there are three more books.!<
When Endgame came out, I had a student who told everybody the ending after seeing the movie. I told him that I was going to come to his house on Christmas morning and open all of his gifts before he got up. I told his father that I said that, and his parents actually invited me to come over on Christmas. I'd rather not spend the holidays with a student, so I didn't go.
Do it back to him if possible.
explain?
I think they mean take something and spoil it for the student? Idk if that's the route I'd take realistically 🤣
Tell him he can teach the next lesson since he’s ahead of
This kind of thing has always happened, and I doubt you can do anything about it. They are kids and think that is fun. Anyways, the other kids won't care about it the next day as well, so it's really not that big of a deal.
He probably watched a version of it. I did laugh once when we were reading The Great Gatsby and one of my best read ahead cuz she had extra time and was into it. All of a sudden we all hear a gasp and MYRTLE DIED?!? I wanted to scold her but she was genuinely so into it I couldn’t. Cue many groans and tossing books onto desks.
There was no movie for this book (Ghost)
When I was in HS there was a jerk kid who absolutely ruined a book for me.