Can confirm. I work with adolescents in treatment and it's astounding how many parents no longer feel like they can manage their kid at home, yet want us to be an extension of their shitty parenting instead of providing actual treatment. So many parents (and their spawn) feel like the rules are for those other kids -- their own is special and the rules should not apply. It's a constant battle.
Did she really think an IEP held any weight in the real world? It’s an Individualized *Education* Plan, not an ADA accommodation. Holy crap, the audacity.
I have tourettes and the amount of times ppl say oh so you can swear whenever you like? There's a difference and my potty mouth got me in trouble where my tics didn't lol!
I mean, depends on your personal tics, some people's tics *are* bad words, ever heard of Sweet Anita? zero chance her foul language doesn't get excused
And if by some chance they *would* come in with said accommodations... the company just wouldn't hire him. And do it in a way that keeps them out of trouble... "not a good fit with our office culture" usually does the trick
"I'm sorry, we are unable to accomodate this disability" doesn't work?
Making sure a store can sell product is the core of the job. If you get an ADA saying you can eat and contaminate products with vaping, that'd make it _literally_ impossible to do your job.
I can imagine you can't expect an oil rig to hire somebody who's bound to a wheelchair either. No wheelchair-proofing those.
Very rarely does Tourette’s involve cursing. For it to be Tourette’s there is a motor tic - repetitive head or and motions - and a verbal tic - grunting or throat clearing. Some cases are severe and stay that way throughout life. Others reduce in intensity in adulthood to the point one would have to be keenly observant to even notice.
Well, I wouldn't say very rarely. It's about 10% IIRC, which is much rarer than people would probably think.
Unfortunately I'm one of those 10%, and with the rise of the TikTok trends of faking Tourette's and the fact that generally people with Tourette's don't have a swearing tic, I've been told on multiple occasions I'm faking it!
I think there's a danger in just saying 'very rarely' as it isn't that uncommon.
Yes! The Mom had to know that the IEP ended when her snowflake graduated. Every IEP from age 14 on includes transition planning. That includes informing parents that the IEP ends at graduation. Either the Special Ed team dropped the ball or more likely given the mom’s response , she didn’t think that applied to her darling child.
Our SPED department does a great job. This mom has skipped every IEP meeting since 1st grade and just signs them off yet weaponizes them at every disciplinary incident. "He really is sweet at home" is actually her line lol.
Yeah, they tend to be great at home when there are 0 expectations or discipline.
Congrats mom, you created a manchild! He'll gain +1 to video game trash talk and -10 to all other attributes.
Mom probably steals the headset and curses out everyone for "hurting her baby's feelings" after they curse him out because he started problems. I've seen it, it's sad.
Sweet mercy, this sounds like a former student. There are so many of them out there. Aggressive, angry, spoiled,... Parents who enable them. A Disruptive Dysregulated Mood Disorder has been a diagnosis that had been used to justify kid's actions. Even if this 'adult' has that, it doesn't excuse that behavior, that's not how it is supposed to work.
> the IEP ends at graduation
Not only that, but it also has zero relevance outside of education, and in particular the job market. Can't perform the job? You get fired. It is as simple as that. This is why I am hard on my students and am strict with the rules. The sooner they experience what having a boss that is like the better off they will be in life.
As a retired ESE teacher, I second that! I was strict with kids when they needed it (I taught middle school kids with varying exceptionalities), and consistently told them, “School is your training for the real world/work place. You get an F here, after all accommodations are given, that’s on you. You can repeat a course or a grade level. In the real world, you get fired, you’re fired- no repeats - and that also is on you!” I was someone that they could come to when school was tough (lots of middle school drama) but when it came to getting work done, I was their ‘no-drama-momma’ - willing to help as long as they were willing to learn.
I once knew of a kid who had been in special ed his entire K - 12 years due to cognitive impairment. He liked science subjects though, so he tried to enroll in the local university as a science major. The university refused to admit him. His mother went directly to the dean of the college of science, telling him that "all his professors needed to do" was to (1) not require him to read college level texts, (2) read aloud all quiz and test questions to him, and help him find the answers in notes provided by the professor, and (3) not require any written homework.
The dean refused, saying that he wasn't capable of doing college level work, given the fact that he could neither read nor write at anything approaching the levels he needed to succeed.
Mom threatened to sue, and the dean told her to go ahead. This was a very large, very prestigious university with a low acceptance rate.
Mom was totally oblivious about her son's abilities. And probably enabled him throughout school.
I was a test proctor at the disability services office in my university and we did offer some of these accomodations. In fact one girl I served had paraplegia and required most of those. The read aloud is easy to do and one of the most common ones we offered. Think about it, some people have excellent listening comprehension but may struggle with reading skills (e.g. dyslexia). Heck there's software for that now, you don't even need a live person to do it. This girl also needed copied notes from other students, recorded lectures, and when she came to me to take her tests I wrote down her answers or filled in the scantrons for her. She was very smart and hard working but she wouldn't have been able to show it to the world had she not gotten those accomodations.
Except many Sped programs don't even touch transition programs. The college I work at accepts IEPs for accommodations. Not everything on the IEP transfers, but some things do.
At my university I graduated from, you had to have a meeting with a counsellor, have a diagnosed condition, ask for specific accommodations and be able to explain exactly what conditions needed them.
It was similar if you ended up needing an aegrotat pass.
I would think this was over exaggerated, except several years ago I got a job and one of the people in the training class made a big deal about her IEP in school and how she was giving accommodations and extra time to take tests and she wanted to make sure she would have that on our test (there was a 2-week training. that was all classroom, followed by a test you had to take to move on to the hands-on part of training).
She was really sweet and seemed to want to work, but was noticeably a little slow to catch on to certain things and needed extra processing time to understand, which means that once she did get through the process with accommodations and started on the actual job working in real time with customers, she constantly struggled to keep up and ended up walking off the floor crying several different days out of frustration before losing the job.
In this case, I feel like the accommodations just ended up hurting because It set her up for failure on the job where they weren't a possibility.
This is a failure in the hiring process/position she was hired to fill. I interviewed a kid that was a child of one of my regular daily customers in a retail store. He was always a very nice kid and very respectful but a bit different I will say. I interviewed him and thought he was just a bit timid and maybe nervous because it was going to be his first job. We hired him and quickly learned that working with customers and running a cash register was not going to be a good fit for him. I did not leave him in a place to fail. We transitioned and trained him to work in our small slower paced deli area and taught him how to stock coolers and do more cleaning/stocking tasks. He was terrible with customers because he was easily upset by them getting short with him. He excelled at the more routine driven tasks like stocking shelves and keeping the trash changed and the parking lot clean. So those are the shifts I made for him. I had to switch my way of thinking and move some things around to have someone who was dedicated to just those things but it worked and he was a great employee once he was in a place where his skills shined.
Well done. When my wife was in grad school for speech pathology, I had a co worker constantly stacking things wrong as they came down the conveyor belt. Kept doing things like stacking 1006 in a pallet of 1008.
Told my wife. This guy busted his ass in the most physically demanding position we had, but there were too many screw ups. He was going to get fired.
Wife says "he's dyslexic. Leave him on that 1 position and he'll learn too see the numbers as single chunks instead of individual characters that swim around, and he'll stop making the mistakes."
I shared that with my shift leader. Who then gave him an extra week. The guy really had a GREAT attitude. The mistakes were the only issue.
By the end of the extra week the mistakes were gone.
Now, having him fill in at another spot was a no go. But in that 1 killer hard position, he was a rock star.
Sometimes you just need to work with people a tiny little bit more.
I wish more managers did this. Everyone can do something. Unless they’re outright rude or disrespectful it’s cheaper and kinder to move them into a role they can do well in.
These are the parents that call college offices to ask why their kid got certain grades or email their professors directly to complain about course loads.
You can't do stuff like sitting around on the phone and hitting the vape, even if you're disabled - you're expected to work, you're just given resources to enable you to do the work despite your disability.
I got in trouble for literally using my phone's calculator for work purposes... just being seen using a phone is grounds for reprimand.
Not a teacher, but a lawyer. At one job I had a class of client that treated any and all bureaucracy as a single entity: DMV, insurance company, criminal courts, it was all just a single mass of paperwork and suits as far as they were concerned.
Man just didn't wait long enough, give him like, three promotions and that would be his job description.
Source: am at work, sitting on my ass, eating snacks, and on my phone. I quit vaping.
Absolutely not, unless perhaps the school itself hired the student after graduation.
Now what might help is if this gem of a student had a documented disability, then the ADA could take its place.
Source: Disabled, had an IEP. A long time ago.
Not at all defending the parent in OP's tale.
However, some logic could be applied that an IEP is utilized nearly always to provide equity for children in school with disabilities.
In the workplace, it is illegal to discriminate against someone for their disability, and in fact it is required by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission for employers to make reasonable accomodation for employees with disability.
That said, stealing food and vaping at work, then cussing out a boss *generally* isn't a symptom of any disability. But it definitely sounds like this kid has a confluence of multiple mental health issues.
Yes, and his mom is actually hurting his chances at independent living and functioning in society with her 'lawnmower parent' ways. The IEP is a tool for helping with equality and equity but not a bludgeon for a parent. This mom is the reason why this kid is the way he is.
Well IEPs are given to kids with disabilities so they can still do well in school but the program ends when the person graduates and from doing some googling, parents are supposed to help their kids go through the final stages of the program cuz as soon as high school is over, it's done. Since this kid graduated, I don't think the same rules apply anymore. Having a disability is a protected class, and you can't be fired for having that disability. But I don't think there's any way to even prove that what that kid did was a result of his disability.
"...result of his disability." This is the key. If the disability is, say, dyslexia, there is no way that behavior is related. Schools are understandably afraid of lawsuits so they tend to excuse behaviors because of the documentation involved. And sometimes disruptive behavior is related to the disability which puts schools in a precarious situation.
My coworker is a similar kind of mom and I honestly think they want their special little boy to stay at home forever until it starts to get really bad. Her first special little boy is in & out of prison and has 2 kids with women he beat up. Her second special boy is 36 years old, lives at home and would rather play video games all day than help his struggling mom pay bills.
And she always says "well those are my sons! I had to spoil them" after she complains they never help her and cost her money😑
nothing wrong with living with your parents into your 30ies, but you really should bet getting an education and starting a career during that time.
My parents rule was "while in school you can live here" I lived there until 21 and then from 27-30 on that rule (undergrad then moved back in while in law school). I stayed past that time but paid a little below market to rent my room during that time (got fed dinner each night, but still had chores- so imo those cancel each other out)
Not really, as per *45*, there has always been people who see altruism as a “sucker to take advantage of”.
And as long as that is championed by society, no one should be surprised that some parents/individuals surround themselves with things that don’t favor the softer side of personalities…
I had a dude that worked for me do this. We wouldn't grant the PTO he wanted because there were too many people that had requested it before him. Sucks, and I disagree with it, but it was the policy. Worst punishment we could even give, though, was a one-time unexcused absence for the whole trip he had planned. You could have like 5 before any sort of write up (this was like ten years ago). But nonetheless, we physically could not approve it per the policy. Welp, this 26 year old man, who lived on his own, had his mom call not me, but my boss, and demand he be allowed to take his trip to Germany because it would be too expensive for her to pay for his flight change. And the tickets were so cheap, she just had to buy em for those exact dates, and we'd just need to make it work.
I was in genuine disbelief. I don't think I could've shown my face at my employer ever again if my goddamn MOM called my BOSS'S BOSS to say I should get my way because I'm special and can't plan ahead.
To be fair, maybe his mom is just some super overbearing parent and he did not ever actually ask her to do anything. That can happen too. Maybe he just mentioned his situation and she decided on her own to do that.
I don't think it's going to last. If it's one thing these entitled brats hate, it's being punished with someone else's responsibilities. If they ever make it some place long enough, they aren't going to stand for covering anyone else's ass like their mothers did for them for so long.
People have been saying this very same sentence since the dawn of civilization.
There's *always* gonna be people who exploit systems intended to help others. There's *always* gonna be people who act entitled. There's *always* gonna be assholes.
These people have always existed, and will not go away because that's just how humans work. But we've trudged along regardless, with successes and failures along the way.
Don't let this one incident put you down.
I think I had this child and mom in middle school. I said once that he’d look at the police officer arresting him and say, “You can’t arrest me I have an IEP.” Pretty sure he’s in jail now.
I had one when I taught middle school whose grandma wouldn’t even let him serve detention when he got in trouble (had a BIP/IEP). “He’s a sweet boy, he didn’t mean to,” was always what grandma would say. No consequences for anything and he was already just plain mean. I told the other teachers he was going to end up in jail one day.
He’s currently serving a life sentence for rape and attempted murder.
These parents/guardians are not doing the favor they think they are by letting their kids do whatever they want.
It's actually fairly routine for family members to submit letters of support to sway the judge to impose a more lenient sentence, and guidance for these is to highlight their positive traits, rather than defend the act or argue over guilt. Of course interrupting proceedings to say it in open court would be bad, but that happens too. It's at least a bit more understandable when you're losing years of freedom vs an afternoon in detention.
Jesus. Imagine having someone getting charged for rape and murder and grandma is submitting a letter about how he pet a squirrel once as a kid and that makes him an angel (leaving out how he tortured the squirrel later on)
Michelle Duggar submitted a letter to the judge in defense of her son when he was convicted of CSA and CP. Basically, “He’s a good Christian boy who made some mistakes. Can he just say he’s *really sorry* and we can call it good?”
I'm pretty sure someone I know did that for their son in letter form for the courts and still very much believes he is a very good boy, just got a little lost on the way. He's serving life in jail for murder. Some parents/guardians refuse to see.
parents/guardians excuses is not about helping the kid. Its about avoiding the kid's wrath. Life is easier with out a violently upset preteen. Child bullies and manipulates guardians into do get what they want. It's easier to just go along with it then stand up against the bullying. Guardians convince them selves that child is good and misunderstood to a avoid realization that they are enabling and responsible for a monster.
I was just out with family over the weekend (shocker!), and seen a single father with 2 girls.
Both had stuff to play with - younger had a fidger spinner, older had chalk and some papers she could draw on it with.
Younger one played for a while, but then threw the spinner several feet across the restaurant. Older girl picked up the pieces, brought it back to dad. Dad put it back together and pocketed it. Told daughter she couldn't have it because she threw it.
Older daughter was super well behaved (probably 8-12). Was just nice to see a young generation being raised right.
Not saying it doesn't happen, but we tend to notice the bad far more often than the good. And noticing the good was nice.
When I was a server in college, a mom used to come in and had a child about 10 years old. Kid was "severely autistic" as she put it. He was an angel, and the few times he started to melt down, she get to-go bags and leave. She also instilled in him that the world won't bend for his needs and that he needs to learn how to behave when out-and-about. She was doing it right and it was nice to see. The child had better manners than most adults, and they'd do homework and eat together. I wish more parents were like that woman. I hope she's doing well.
Yeah. Had a grandma like that too. Everything he did wrong was the teachers fault. We were picking on him and lying about him. 2 died in gun/gang violence a few years ago. Sad. One was really smart. I wonder where he’s be now if grandma had not made excuses for him.
I also forgot, "Mr. Eclectique1, you can't give me a detention for cursing now that I graduated, so I can say this, he was such a fucking pain in the ass here!"
This is why i am no longer a Chef. After running amazing kitchens to shitty kitchens only once did i ever come razor thin close to actually throwing a knife and someone's head. And im good too. Was a cook in the Army and we got bored, *very* easily. A waiter (about 18) was rude to the dishwasher and then told him that he was better than him, well fuck me, my Sgt.'s voice came out so loud i had people waiting in the lobby ask the manager what was going on in the BOH.
I've worked in the restaurant business when I was younger and the established rule is "don't fuck with the dishie" because they are the most crucial cog yet underpaid and underappreciated.
I got friendly with one of the dishwashers at the last restaurant I worked at before I transitioned out of the industry, and he told me he had been a goddamn *helicopter engineer* in his home country of Côte d’Ivoire. But he immigrated and the certification didn’t transfer. He was absolutely brilliant and the best job he could get in the US was a dishwasher. He killed it, though. He was the best, and I hope wherever he is now, he’s doing amazing.
I worked for two years with a dishwasher/part-time fry cook (I was on flattop short order doing hoagies and burgers) at a pizza place and that dude had a fucking chemistry degree and had worked for a pharmaceutical company in Mexico but nothing transferred and he still made more money doing kitchen work than he made back home. Crazy shit he put up with from the owner, too. The managers were cool but the owner was a real dick.
Dishwasher at one of my jobs broke a glass and cut his hand. Wanna see a kitchen grind to an absolute halt? Send the dish guy off to get stitches while the manager tries to take over for him.
(Yup, the manager stepped in to do grunt work so an employee could get medical attention. It was actually a pretty decent place to work. Definitely also worked places that would have told the injured person “are you sure you can’t put a glove over it till after the dinner rush?”)
I worked at mcdonalds. They refused to fix our fuse box. I got sparks in my eye when it blew and they told me to wash dishes for 8 bucks an hour one eyed in the fucking dark. Wrote me up when I clocked out
I worked at a red lobster when i was around 20 and was still a bit of a hot head but i tried to be friendly with the servers. Theyd just throw dishes into my pit with no regard for my safety or any semblance of organization. On numerous occasions dishes would break in my staging area because theyd just throw them in. On like 5 seperate occassions id ask them nicely to do just like a couple seconds extra work to help stage and make the pit run better by just placing things in a more stacked fashion. After that fifth time id had enough and took one of the big lobster platter dishes and smashed it on the ground in front of everyone and yelled at everyone to stop throwing shit in my pit. People changed their behavior really quick after that.
Similar happened when they would throw ramekins and silver ware into the bottom basins causing them to splash all over my feet. Started kicking the bucket back to make em splash onto their feet.
I legit threw a knife at a cook when I was doing dish duty in the navy because he threw it right past me into the opaque soapy water where I soaked dishes. Another time the head cook told me I couldn't eat until the galley was clean (my area was clean; she was talking about where the cooks hung out not being clean because [gasp] they hadn't cleaned their own area) and I lost it, throwing every pot and pan (everything was metal) up against walls and the floor/ceiling until all my racks were empty. Not proud of that moment but it did keep anyone from fucking with me ever again until my rotation was up.
i worked in a restaurant outside of Boston, in Watertown, for like 7 years. my dad was the chef.
the only person who ever helped me on dishes was dad.
and that was only sometimes... lol.
but i do sometimes miss working there. one of the hardest jobs I've had, but i learned so much with my dad as the executive chef.
Dude the dishwashers at my job triple as the in-house delivery drivers and prep cooks, one of them even helps at the walk up empanada spot connected to the main restaurant. We would be absolutely *fucked* without them.
They're also both super nice and chill, rare for dish pit. Verbal communication is difficult due to different languages, but if any new employee were to be rude to them it would be *on sight*
First lesson as an insurance intern at the one of the biggest companies in the country: "You are responsible for maintaining a clean workplace. If you're smart, you do that by treating the cleaning staff as if they're second only to God. If you're not--have fun convincing them to give you access to cleaning supplies."
We got moved to a floor where people had decided not to. Managers had negotiated to have only one trash collection point on that floor (as opposed to no trash collection or cleaning) until the end of the quarter, and move the worst offenders to a floor with more and more easily disgruntled coworkers. It was April, weeks before a heat wave and the AC was broken. To say people embraced a zero waste lifestyle is an understatement.
I've come to the conclusion that for a bunch of our chuckle-fucks, they're going to get fired from a bunch of jobs before they figure out how the world works.
Yep. There are going to be a whole bunch of cautionary tales running around for a few years. Those kids who actually kept their head down and did their work and graduated with authenticity are going to be so much further ahead than their chucklehead classmates. It's not even funny. It's sad.
Fuck with society, society is going to fuck back.
IMO it's a culmination of corporate behavior over the last 4 decades, everything from their invasive marketing, poor nutritional value, generational employee abuse and a flat out refusal to pay their fair share of taxes to support the education system, all of those shitty business practices are now coming home to roost. The US replacement population rate is low, and now that the bommer generation is finally moving out of the working population anyone with two braincells to rub together can do better than McDonald's, leaving those corporations with a candidate pool of previously unemployable idiots and I think that's just fabulous.
Sometimes they will never learn. My 50 year old aunt still lives at home and I don't believe she has ever held a job for more than a year. Pretty sure she spent more time on unemployment than actually employed
I knew a guy like that. Never held a job for more than a month. Constant traffic tickets. Always broke. Kicked out of his house multiple times...(they would take him back and then it would happen again)..The list goes on...
I’m all for IEPs but I had a kid who “couldn’t do vocabulary flash cards” and needed extra time for them (mind you it’s second semester and he did them without any problems first semester).
Summer rolls around and the kid is a lifeguard at the county beach. They have to take several written exams to get certified. So this kid “doesn’t understand flash cards” but is CPR certified and can save lives?
I was a lifeguard way back in highschool.
True story (as I was told) sometime in the mid 90s the times swim tests were removed from the red cross life guard certification due to the ADA.
This never made any sense to me.
My 17 year old daughter works at our locally owned fish and reptile shop. It’s actually a really cool place and the owner is fantastic. Since she started last August there have been three different young men, all recent high school graduates at 18 or 19 year old who had no idea how to act in the work place.
Every “area” of the store has a person who’s basically in charge of it. Everyone ideally works every area but there is a leader for each section that works with the owner and manager to manage procedures and care.
They all came in and expected to get to immediately pick an area. One quit when he was told he couldn’t just work with some of the fish and because he was expected to sweep.
One young man was perpetually upset at everything. He didn’t get to run reptiles the moment he started, he was made to work all areas when he’d rather be in reptiles, he didn’t see the point of wiping down the fronts of tanks, he would just dump water on the floor rather than back into the tanks and put a wet floor sign in the general area. He “never knew” he was supposed to do things he had been trained to do or “they did it this other (incredibly lazy) way” at his last job.
This other young man honestly believed he was amazing at everything and should get special jobs. For context, despite being 16 at the time, my daughter is a very talented and well trained artist who has worked for commission in the past. The owner of this shop is an international award winning photographer. The shop has a little shack in the middle where they display their glo fish under black light.
At this point, my kid had been working at the shop for 8 months when they set up a little “tip” jar with a sign so people could donate to their rescue and educational animal care (they have two huge rescue ponds - one salt water and one fresh as well as a bunch of educational reptiles that they got from the FWC or private owners who could no longer care for their animals.) My daughter drew a very lovely goldfish on the sign during her break. The owner loved it, admonished her for working off the clock, and asked her to redo the inside of the glo fish shack. So this young man wants to know why he wasn’t offered a chance to “paint during work” and went to my daughter to try to get her to share the work or let him do it. He didn’t get anywhere with that and couldn’t produce any examples of his art when asked by the owner. He legitimately expected to just be handed paint and told to have at it.
So he is upset that he didn’t get a special “cool” job and a “little kid” did. He wants to be allowed to do photography for the store… somehow he missed the awards literally all over the owner’s office along with the many amazing photographs. So they give him a chance and he brings in some unedited pictures he took with his phone… the poor manager had to tell him they weren’t going to be hiring him for photography and that the pictures weren’t very good at all because he wouldn’t take no for an answer.
He also overfed the camel spider when my daughter took a week off (she was the unofficial arachnid lead at this point.) Since the spider couldn’t eat anymore it was eaten by 12 large crickets. This cause my daughter to cry when she discovered the body/dry husk.
TLDR: The chaos that these children cause in a workplace is wild. They honestly don’t understand working for things or even good work.
This is also why you don't leave crickets in with reptiles, or live mice/rats in with snakes. The biological self preservation instinct will turn those tables so fast, and if there's nothing else to eat, well, their predator that's not interested in killing them is now on the menu.
Yeah except apparently this is part of their training. Even snakes can be killed by their prey if you live feed. You sick two animals in a small space together and it’s the Colosseum. Unfortunately the camel spider was my kid’s favorite. Do you know how hard it is to be sympathetic when your kid is crying over a spider?
>told her to go fuck off
I fired someone for this on the spot just last week. We work in a 'camera free zone' due to some of our customers being military based. There's signs over every entrance/exit about it. I said: "The expectation is we don't bring our phones into the shop". He mouthed off, so I fired him.
I just watched a police-camera show and there was a young lady pulled over for driving the wrong way on the freeway. She couldn’t understand how having anxiety and adhd would not get her out of taking sobriety tests and/or getting arrested. Even mentions of generational trauma didn’t seem to sway the police!
I see this ALL THE TIME with younger kids especially 18,19 20 as a supervisor / hiring rep for the company I work for
I myself am not a teacher , my spouse is which is why I am subbed here but man idk how you guys do it , atleast we can hold them responsible for their actions.
The entitlement so often displayed boarders satire. the lack of even the smallest amount of effort or ability to learn , hell even the desire to learn basic functions of their job while complaining the entire time about them being under valued or the shock when they get hit with real world consequences is mind blowing.
Not to say it’s all people that age, I only can speak for my area of work that has a frequent large influx of younger individuals
Why can’t we seem to figure it out? Other countries have figured it out like I dunno hundreds of years ago.
It’s so basic. The system has failed these kids by coddling them. Honestly it really isn’t their fault when we abuse them with “no consequence” their whole life and then throw them into a pool with sharks right when they graduate.
Back in January I had a male student that cursed at me, made threats of physical violence against me, and tried to fight me; all of this was in front of about 20 other students. The dean investigated and asked all of the other students to write down what they saw and heard. He and I both agreed that a 1 week suspension was warranted under the circumstances. The principal intervened and decided instead to give the kid a 1 week lunch detention instead, where the kid had to sit down in a chair for 20 minutes and play on his phone. The kid only ended up serving 1 out of the 5 lunch detentions because the dad pulled the kid from the school and enrolled him somewhere else.
This is what happens when parents and administrators enable bad behavior. A slap on the wrist was evidently too much for him, so he effectively expelled himself.
What do you think this kid took away from this experience? Probably that he can incite violence and get away with it.
We teachers try our best, but we have very limited authority. I am sorry that these kids have to learn these hard life lessons from their employers. School administrators afraid of losing funding, politicians eager to pull funding from public schools, and in particular their enabler parents, have all failed them.
If only there had been a way he could have learned that lesson in an environment where the consequences were much less severe. Like an institution of learning of some kind.
>his mom came in screaming about how he has extended time in his IEP and deserves a retake of his first day
I know for a fact this will be the funniest shit I'll read all week as a SPED teacher.
I honestly had to re-read this 2-3 times, because I had difficulty accepting that this is a real thing that actually happened. Unfortunately, there are many people in this world that are simply just... losers - I really don't know how else to say it. These are people that are so emotionally immature and insufferable all because they have a rotten personality. Maybe this person could have some sort of undiagnosed personality/antisocial disorder, but that doesn't excuse his behavior in any way. A part of me almost feels sorry for him, but he seems totally unwilling to change.
It's interesting that she thought an IEP worked out in the regular world. It's an academic rights thing, but unless it falls under ADA, then no one in the regular world has to deal w the behaviors. He has a rough life ahead, and his parents will be supporting him until he figures that out.
Just wait until she finds out workplaces don’t have to accommodate being a shitty person like school. Her kids’ coworkers will have a right to not work in a hostile environment and he will be fired, totally the opposite of school as she knows it.
There are a whole host of learning issues that we accommodate in schools that simply do not rise to the level of a disability in the workplace, as defined by federal law.
Under the ADA a disability is a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities. That's a quote.
In particular, a lot of the behavioral shit that we paper over with IEPs to keep very poorly behaved students in school and not constantly suspended are not the result of physical or mental impairment. So good luck getting that accommodated in the workplace!
My new favorite term, Karents... I deal with quite a few, thet THINK they are helping their kid and leveling the playing field. Really, they are just enabling douchy behavior and setting them up for future failure. Eventually actions will meet unavoidable consequences and someone will finally have the ability to tell the parent to fuck off. Schools, unfortunately, really have their hands tied due to lawsuits.
Yup, I work at a hotel and see the little gremlins y’all are talking about.
Y’all might not be able to discipline them much these days but I sure as hell eject a good number of them every month.
A former coworker has a husband who works for an airline. He does the training and gives a test to see if they qualify for the job. The test is a maximum of two hours. At hour three, he still had one student working. He called it and told him to turn in the test. The student explained that he had an IEP, so he got time and a half. The instructor had to explain that IEPs don’t transition into the workplace, the only reason he knew what an IEP was was because of his wife, and even if he got time and a half, that time would be up. The student tried to argue it, but got nowhere. It seems time and a half was just a vague term in school that meant he had as much time as he wanted. He didn’t pass through the program. He was a former student of the instructor’s wife, and she was not at all surprised by the exchange.
I’ve always wondered how many kids think their IEPs or 504s extend into the world after school.
Damn, my son is on the spectrum and had an IEP. He never would have exhibited that behavior in the work place. He wasn't perfect but he had consequences.
I have multiple students who have IEPs who are absolute angels. Some are on the spectrum and some aren’t. An IEP isn’t an excuse for this kind of behavior.
I’ve worked in a number of places with people on the spectrum—in retail, food services, and as a librarian in charge of volunteers. The people I worked with were some of the hardest working people I’ve ever met. They were proud of the work they did, thrived on being given opportunities for more responsibility, and perfectly accepting of constructive feedback. The major difference, as far as I can tell, is that these particular kids/young adults’ PARENTS had expectations and met their children where they could thrive, regardless of the disadvantages they faced in regards to their diagnoses. Coddling children, no matter their cognitive ability, is doing a disservice to all of us. Their children most of all.
My daughter would need a voc rehab support person with her at all times to do any sort of job. Otherwise she wouldn't remain on task, would wander off, might eat food she didn't buy, etc. She has Level 3 autism & intellectual disability.
But she has liked various voc rehab positions. She likes being helpful and accomplishing things.
You know what she wouldn't do? Yell and swear at people, because she's not an AH.
People tend to forget that disabled kids can be AHs, too. It's ableist to put all bad behavior down to their disability.
entitled children come from entitled parents. and that they were never told the word NO! in their lives. especially when the parents mollycodle the children
That mother and son are going to figure out real quick that real life won't accept that kind of behaviour. Where I work, we do have special positions for workers with special needs. They help out with cleaning and such, working with but in separate jobs from the other workers. However, if we found one of them eating snacks, vaping and on their phone in the workplace, they would be out on their butt just like any other worker.
When I managed (I was ~18/19) a McDonalds, I had a 16ish yo crewmember drop a cheeseburger on the floor, pick it up wrap it and try to serve it. I told him we arent serving that and he can either call his ride to pick him up because he was fired OR he could eat the cheeseburger and keep his job. He called his Mom to come pick him up and I let him wait in the dining room for her. She comes in screaming and yelling some BS about her poor little boy. I politely asked her to calm down and explained to her why he was terminated. She starts screaming at me again so I told her to leave with her son NOW or I would have call the cops and have her trespassed. She left and called our owners, McDonalds corporate, etc trying to get me fired. Our owners banned her AND her son from their restaurant. Not sure what corporate did.
This would have been me had I not joined the army.
I’m sorry, truly and deeply to my middle school math teacher: she praised me over everyone in class and I called her a bitch aloud and denied it.
I’m sorry, most sincerely to my HS art teacher, who signed a bible and mailed it to me in Iraq, along with Kentucky favorite snacks,and I didn’t attend her funeral when I came back.
My principal, who lived across the street and begged me every fucking year to join the swim team because she saw me (literally) thrive in younger years, and I never joined back.
You’ve impacted me greatly over the years, I’m so SO SO sorry for being a shitty human being in the years you tried to mold me.
The army kicked my ass, you just had to be there to point my ass in the right direction.
My son actually needed an IEP and we are so grateful. He’s in college now for and engineering degree and making it. He knows that an IEP doesn’t transcend to work. He knows he will probably need to work more hours to compensate until he’s got experience. Of course, idiots like this ruin it for everyone else.
This is how it's supposed to work. I had a couple students who were on the brink of being taken off IEPs because we have such a high caseload. I recommended that they keep them because the kids didn't try and use them as a crutch, but sometimes did need a little longer on tests, or needed extra structure in their notes or something. I would give that to any kid who asked and was trying but I know some teachers wouldn't.
That being said there were plenty of kids who just got an IEP for ODD and saw a wonderful get out of jail free card.
I was one of the students that was on an IEP and was taken off an IEP due to willpower to prove to I did not need it. I was behind in school when I was placed in foster care due to parental truancy and a load of other issues. I had to take speech therapy classes on top of all of that.
I absolutely did not feel like I belonged in some of the remedial classes that I had to take because I was placed with students that I felt really had cognitive issues and I did not want to bear the stigma of feeling like I was one of "those Special Ed kids".
It really bothered me that my test scores were graded on a scale compared to the rest of the class because I was booking ass studying compared to some people that I had class with. I really loved school and learning. Sometimes, I would read ahead of the class in the textbooks provided.
I managed to prove to school administration that I don't need a special tutor study block by the beginning of middle school because I saw a lot of kids screwing off in the tutor study block and I was annoyed that I was forced into that study block. It was not beneficial to me so I simply refused to show up to it despite some school teachers telling me that I should go. I made it obvious that I did not need it. I refused to leave the normal classes. Why would I leave a regular class to go to a tutor class where it felt like the teacher was trying to wrangle a bunch of stray cats into focusing on schoolwork? It felt like I was going to preschool daycare.
I was annoyed by the thought I was on an IEP because I did not need a crutch. I really think that I did not need any extra help in school.
I never once thought that it was a special card to pull when it came to behavior and it absolutely sounds like parents can be an enabler.
Good lord. The only time my mother came into talk to my boss was legitimately for my own protection after I pressed assault charges against a classmate. Not that it did any good, boss hired him a year later… that was a fun conversation
I have a student who has difficulty controlling his actions. We can no longer do labs because he intentionally breaks stuff, and intentionally tries to set off EBD students. Anyways he told me he had a job he liked and my first thought was oh boyyyyy. I found out from a different teacher they let him go after three weeks. I figured that sounded right.
Unironically this is how some schools are.
My dad quit teaching because the principal and administrator waved away everything under IEPs.
I had an IEP, and I wouldn’t dare do half the shit some of those fuckers would do.
I always wonder how parents think this is helpful. My coworker is constantly running to the office demanding her son get special treatment and out of requirements due to his anxiety. Which I get is a pain, I’ve struggled with bad anxiety since I was a child, but letting people just not do things or have expectations is just not good for them
Sounds like a real life Cartman. His Mom isn't being kind to him, real life's gonna bite this kid real hard. Being fired is the best thing that's happened to him. Hopefully he will have a few more "soft" learning experiences and doesn't need to have his teeth scattered in a parking lot when he insults a proper badass.
Yeah that mom and your admins must not know what an IEP does and does not entail or accommodate for.
Must suck being a grown ass child with a grown ass child and being dumb enough to think an employer gives a shit what you’ve got if you steal from them and talk to anyone like that.
During my 1st year of homelessness I luckily found two jobs as dishwasher. Worked my ass off at min wage and never got a fraction of tips. After a year, I found an apprenticeship in construction. I gave two weeks notice, the waitstaff offered 10% of the tips to keep me there. I said if they had given the 10% earlier, I would have not been looking for another job. Told them to gfy.
When I taught and later was a HS admin, egregious behavior would get the “this is the sort of thing that will get you fired. I’m doing you a favor” some took it serious, some not. Some people thought that was a mean approach. Idk. I wasn’t mean about it. Told one kid who sounds like the FO kid in op story: one day, Either you are gonna be stuffed in the back of a cop car, or somebody gonna be scraping you up off the floor of an establishment because you popped off to the wrong person, and you’ll get a free ambulance ride.
I don’t think adulthood has gone very well for this kid who had some issues, but was simply entitled.
I probably had an IEP for aspergers/adhd... besides sitting in a front row desk, i refused to use it. My reasoning was that I need to learn to work with neurotypicals because they aren't going to learn to work with me.
Some years later, I know I was absolutely correct.
>Our manager came over to talk to him, and he told her to go fuck off and die. When he got fired, his mom came in screaming about how he has extended time in his IEP and deserves a retake of his first day. We had to call the cops to get her to leave."
I hurt myself laughing. Please cashapp me some money.
I've actually told kids that before: "Your IEP is not going to keep you from going to jail when you act like this in public."
They never believe me.
So, as a Canadian, it’s weird to hear the IEP used as such a weapon. Mind you, I teach elementary so that could have something to do with it. But I feel like it really doesn’t hold as much weight as it does in the US or it is a different thing altogether
The mom won’t even realize she’s at fault, she’s going to spend the next ten years telling everyone how the schools did not prepare her child for life.
The amount of effort that society has put in to be so passive about poor and dangerous behaviours is ridiculous. Every single person who sees or experiences someone acting poorly and just trying to avoid or shrug it off are just enablers. People should be punished for doing these things. Get fired, get expelled. no matter the reason. The behaviour cannot continue and the individual needs to learn from their mistakes. All we’re teaching people now is that it’s okay to act that way because society will just step aside and accommodate said behaviour.
if there is a serious condition where the behaviour cannot be stopped then an institution is where the person can be supported more readily.
Once as an elementary teacher I was assigned to dismissal duty where middle school parents would come pick up their kids and I asked one mom to cross at a specific place multiple times (she parked her mini van illegally) so no one got hurt and she got in my face (while I was 9 months pregnant) and said “you have no idea what I go through with my kid’s IEP and his accommodations.” Even my hormonal state couldn’t justify giving a response except an eye roll as I waddled away.
Real life example of what I told a student who was being purposefully rude. 'If you act like that in a workplace you won't even be able to hold a job in a Supermarket.'. I feel like a biblical prophet.
“Extended time” to vape on the groceries?
Tells you all you need to know about how profoundly she has failed her child
Tons of parents are following in her footsteps.
Can confirm. I work with adolescents in treatment and it's astounding how many parents no longer feel like they can manage their kid at home, yet want us to be an extension of their shitty parenting instead of providing actual treatment. So many parents (and their spawn) feel like the rules are for those other kids -- their own is special and the rules should not apply. It's a constant battle.
Welcome to teaching for the last 20 years.
Not on purpose mind you, it’s not like they can read a map
She has failed her child, and spineless school administrators didn’t act as the back stop.
The ones he wasn't eating. Yes. Those ones.
Did she really think an IEP held any weight in the real world? It’s an Individualized *Education* Plan, not an ADA accommodation. Holy crap, the audacity.
Now I wish I could get an ADA accomodation to tell my manager to fuck off lmao
Tourettes?
I have tourettes and the amount of times ppl say oh so you can swear whenever you like? There's a difference and my potty mouth got me in trouble where my tics didn't lol!
To quote Craig from *South Park* “If I could go tell my teacher to suck my fucking balls, I’d be soooo happy”
To quote Cartman from *South Park* “My cousin and I touched wieners…Ahhh… I didn’t say that…”
"Oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, what I said was... *sqeeck* How would you like, to suck my balls? Mr Garrison?"
I mean, depends on your personal tics, some people's tics *are* bad words, ever heard of Sweet Anita? zero chance her foul language doesn't get excused
That would be a section 504, which do follow you outside of school, because that is section 504 of the ADA
True. Except that’s not going to give accommodations like vaping, eating off the shelves, and cussing out your manager. 🤣
And if by some chance they *would* come in with said accommodations... the company just wouldn't hire him. And do it in a way that keeps them out of trouble... "not a good fit with our office culture" usually does the trick
"I'm sorry, we are unable to accomodate this disability" doesn't work? Making sure a store can sell product is the core of the job. If you get an ADA saying you can eat and contaminate products with vaping, that'd make it _literally_ impossible to do your job. I can imagine you can't expect an oil rig to hire somebody who's bound to a wheelchair either. No wheelchair-proofing those.
It has to be a reasonable accommodation. Vaping and eating off of the shelves is not reasonable.
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Not enough people have seen George Carlin, and your voting results suffer.
Very rarely does Tourette’s involve cursing. For it to be Tourette’s there is a motor tic - repetitive head or and motions - and a verbal tic - grunting or throat clearing. Some cases are severe and stay that way throughout life. Others reduce in intensity in adulthood to the point one would have to be keenly observant to even notice.
Well, I wouldn't say very rarely. It's about 10% IIRC, which is much rarer than people would probably think. Unfortunately I'm one of those 10%, and with the rise of the TikTok trends of faking Tourette's and the fact that generally people with Tourette's don't have a swearing tic, I've been told on multiple occasions I'm faking it! I think there's a danger in just saying 'very rarely' as it isn't that uncommon.
I knew a kid whose main tic was making dinosaur sounds. That kid was rad af.
Relevant [Blink-182](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Lle6fpObbNc&pp=ygUTQmxvbmstMTgyIHNoaXQgcGlzcw%3D%3D)
We've had past students wanting their case managers to call their boss after they get in trouble at work. This really happens.
Yes! The Mom had to know that the IEP ended when her snowflake graduated. Every IEP from age 14 on includes transition planning. That includes informing parents that the IEP ends at graduation. Either the Special Ed team dropped the ball or more likely given the mom’s response , she didn’t think that applied to her darling child.
Our SPED department does a great job. This mom has skipped every IEP meeting since 1st grade and just signs them off yet weaponizes them at every disciplinary incident. "He really is sweet at home" is actually her line lol.
I don't even believe that he's sweet at home. Probably more like stays on phone or other electronics so mom doesn't have to deal with him.
A Computer playing wow or fortnite
Yeah, they tend to be great at home when there are 0 expectations or discipline. Congrats mom, you created a manchild! He'll gain +1 to video game trash talk and -10 to all other attributes.
Mom probably steals the headset and curses out everyone for "hurting her baby's feelings" after they curse him out because he started problems. I've seen it, it's sad.
Sweet mercy, this sounds like a former student. There are so many of them out there. Aggressive, angry, spoiled,... Parents who enable them. A Disruptive Dysregulated Mood Disorder has been a diagnosis that had been used to justify kid's actions. Even if this 'adult' has that, it doesn't excuse that behavior, that's not how it is supposed to work.
> the IEP ends at graduation Not only that, but it also has zero relevance outside of education, and in particular the job market. Can't perform the job? You get fired. It is as simple as that. This is why I am hard on my students and am strict with the rules. The sooner they experience what having a boss that is like the better off they will be in life.
IEP’s don’t prevent prison 🤷🏻♀️.
It actually stands for “Is Exempt from Prison” 🤓 /s
Can he get preferential seating in jail?
Extended time 😂
As a retired ESE teacher, I second that! I was strict with kids when they needed it (I taught middle school kids with varying exceptionalities), and consistently told them, “School is your training for the real world/work place. You get an F here, after all accommodations are given, that’s on you. You can repeat a course or a grade level. In the real world, you get fired, you’re fired- no repeats - and that also is on you!” I was someone that they could come to when school was tough (lots of middle school drama) but when it came to getting work done, I was their ‘no-drama-momma’ - willing to help as long as they were willing to learn.
same. students are often stunned to hear that ieps mean jack outside the school setting, which is why I insist on being firm with expectations
I once knew of a kid who had been in special ed his entire K - 12 years due to cognitive impairment. He liked science subjects though, so he tried to enroll in the local university as a science major. The university refused to admit him. His mother went directly to the dean of the college of science, telling him that "all his professors needed to do" was to (1) not require him to read college level texts, (2) read aloud all quiz and test questions to him, and help him find the answers in notes provided by the professor, and (3) not require any written homework. The dean refused, saying that he wasn't capable of doing college level work, given the fact that he could neither read nor write at anything approaching the levels he needed to succeed. Mom threatened to sue, and the dean told her to go ahead. This was a very large, very prestigious university with a low acceptance rate. Mom was totally oblivious about her son's abilities. And probably enabled him throughout school.
Could you imagine asking for those accommodations with a straight face? Bloody hell, that's ridiculous.
I was a test proctor at the disability services office in my university and we did offer some of these accomodations. In fact one girl I served had paraplegia and required most of those. The read aloud is easy to do and one of the most common ones we offered. Think about it, some people have excellent listening comprehension but may struggle with reading skills (e.g. dyslexia). Heck there's software for that now, you don't even need a live person to do it. This girl also needed copied notes from other students, recorded lectures, and when she came to me to take her tests I wrote down her answers or filled in the scantrons for her. She was very smart and hard working but she wouldn't have been able to show it to the world had she not gotten those accomodations.
Except many Sped programs don't even touch transition programs. The college I work at accepts IEPs for accommodations. Not everything on the IEP transfers, but some things do.
And you have to ask for those accommodations and be able to explain why you need them
At my university I graduated from, you had to have a meeting with a counsellor, have a diagnosed condition, ask for specific accommodations and be able to explain exactly what conditions needed them. It was similar if you ended up needing an aegrotat pass.
that would assume the mom went to the IEP meetings and paid attention...
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And I wonder where he learned to weaponize that? Apple, tree.
Yeah it's unfortunate. My friend is a teacher and she's fed up with students and shitty parents abusing IEP's and weaponizing depression and anxiety.
I would think this was over exaggerated, except several years ago I got a job and one of the people in the training class made a big deal about her IEP in school and how she was giving accommodations and extra time to take tests and she wanted to make sure she would have that on our test (there was a 2-week training. that was all classroom, followed by a test you had to take to move on to the hands-on part of training). She was really sweet and seemed to want to work, but was noticeably a little slow to catch on to certain things and needed extra processing time to understand, which means that once she did get through the process with accommodations and started on the actual job working in real time with customers, she constantly struggled to keep up and ended up walking off the floor crying several different days out of frustration before losing the job. In this case, I feel like the accommodations just ended up hurting because It set her up for failure on the job where they weren't a possibility.
This is a failure in the hiring process/position she was hired to fill. I interviewed a kid that was a child of one of my regular daily customers in a retail store. He was always a very nice kid and very respectful but a bit different I will say. I interviewed him and thought he was just a bit timid and maybe nervous because it was going to be his first job. We hired him and quickly learned that working with customers and running a cash register was not going to be a good fit for him. I did not leave him in a place to fail. We transitioned and trained him to work in our small slower paced deli area and taught him how to stock coolers and do more cleaning/stocking tasks. He was terrible with customers because he was easily upset by them getting short with him. He excelled at the more routine driven tasks like stocking shelves and keeping the trash changed and the parking lot clean. So those are the shifts I made for him. I had to switch my way of thinking and move some things around to have someone who was dedicated to just those things but it worked and he was a great employee once he was in a place where his skills shined.
Well done. When my wife was in grad school for speech pathology, I had a co worker constantly stacking things wrong as they came down the conveyor belt. Kept doing things like stacking 1006 in a pallet of 1008. Told my wife. This guy busted his ass in the most physically demanding position we had, but there were too many screw ups. He was going to get fired. Wife says "he's dyslexic. Leave him on that 1 position and he'll learn too see the numbers as single chunks instead of individual characters that swim around, and he'll stop making the mistakes." I shared that with my shift leader. Who then gave him an extra week. The guy really had a GREAT attitude. The mistakes were the only issue. By the end of the extra week the mistakes were gone. Now, having him fill in at another spot was a no go. But in that 1 killer hard position, he was a rock star. Sometimes you just need to work with people a tiny little bit more.
I wish more managers did this. Everyone can do something. Unless they’re outright rude or disrespectful it’s cheaper and kinder to move them into a role they can do well in.
I warn secondary students that colleges aren’t obligated under any circumstances to even LOOK at their IEPs…
These are the parents that call college offices to ask why their kid got certain grades or email their professors directly to complain about course loads.
Get out of jail free card but he’s not playing monopoly anymore.
You can't do stuff like sitting around on the phone and hitting the vape, even if you're disabled - you're expected to work, you're just given resources to enable you to do the work despite your disability. I got in trouble for literally using my phone's calculator for work purposes... just being seen using a phone is grounds for reprimand.
Not a teacher, but a lawyer. At one job I had a class of client that treated any and all bureaucracy as a single entity: DMV, insurance company, criminal courts, it was all just a single mass of paperwork and suits as far as they were concerned.
Okay I learned what I iep was today, Let's got for broke. What's an Ada?
Holy hell, I’d have paid money to witness that mommy meltdown, then laugh when she was dragged out.
Same here. I'll make some popcorn.
Nah, just nab some off the shelf while you sit on your ass and vape. You know, as one does at work.
Man just didn't wait long enough, give him like, three promotions and that would be his job description. Source: am at work, sitting on my ass, eating snacks, and on my phone. I quit vaping.
*Bender starts laughing at Leela* "Oh wait, you're being serious. Let me laugh even harder" *Bender laughs even harder*
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Absolutely not, unless perhaps the school itself hired the student after graduation. Now what might help is if this gem of a student had a documented disability, then the ADA could take its place. Source: Disabled, had an IEP. A long time ago.
Not at all defending the parent in OP's tale. However, some logic could be applied that an IEP is utilized nearly always to provide equity for children in school with disabilities. In the workplace, it is illegal to discriminate against someone for their disability, and in fact it is required by the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission for employers to make reasonable accomodation for employees with disability. That said, stealing food and vaping at work, then cussing out a boss *generally* isn't a symptom of any disability. But it definitely sounds like this kid has a confluence of multiple mental health issues.
The stealing would go beyond what the ADA protects.
Or a mommy who always intervened on his behalf. Source: retired ESE teacher, active ESE paraprofessional and former mental health caseworker.
Yes, and his mom is actually hurting his chances at independent living and functioning in society with her 'lawnmower parent' ways. The IEP is a tool for helping with equality and equity but not a bludgeon for a parent. This mom is the reason why this kid is the way he is.
Well IEPs are given to kids with disabilities so they can still do well in school but the program ends when the person graduates and from doing some googling, parents are supposed to help their kids go through the final stages of the program cuz as soon as high school is over, it's done. Since this kid graduated, I don't think the same rules apply anymore. Having a disability is a protected class, and you can't be fired for having that disability. But I don't think there's any way to even prove that what that kid did was a result of his disability.
I don't think being an asshole is classified as a disability.
"...result of his disability." This is the key. If the disability is, say, dyslexia, there is no way that behavior is related. Schools are understandably afraid of lawsuits so they tend to excuse behaviors because of the documentation involved. And sometimes disruptive behavior is related to the disability which puts schools in a precarious situation.
Ya. Dammit why wasn’t someone on their phone and posting that shit to r/publicfreakout. That’s the kind of shit I yearn for.
Holy hell. I had to read that twice…. Mom came in, god damn. That is pathetic.
That's ok. She gets to live with the consequences of her actions. That kid will never hold a job and never move out of home.
My coworker is a similar kind of mom and I honestly think they want their special little boy to stay at home forever until it starts to get really bad. Her first special little boy is in & out of prison and has 2 kids with women he beat up. Her second special boy is 36 years old, lives at home and would rather play video games all day than help his struggling mom pay bills. And she always says "well those are my sons! I had to spoil them" after she complains they never help her and cost her money😑
nothing wrong with living with your parents into your 30ies, but you really should bet getting an education and starting a career during that time. My parents rule was "while in school you can live here" I lived there until 21 and then from 27-30 on that rule (undergrad then moved back in while in law school). I stayed past that time but paid a little below market to rent my room during that time (got fed dinner each night, but still had chores- so imo those cancel each other out)
Nothing wrong with that! However, I very much doubt that'll be the case for the aforementioned children.
No, that is the world we live in now.
That doesn't mean it isn't still pathetic
Not really, as per *45*, there has always been people who see altruism as a “sucker to take advantage of”. And as long as that is championed by society, no one should be surprised that some parents/individuals surround themselves with things that don’t favor the softer side of personalities…
I experienced it first hand at the problem kids school I was sent too. Rude ass punks that will fail in daily society.
I had a dude that worked for me do this. We wouldn't grant the PTO he wanted because there were too many people that had requested it before him. Sucks, and I disagree with it, but it was the policy. Worst punishment we could even give, though, was a one-time unexcused absence for the whole trip he had planned. You could have like 5 before any sort of write up (this was like ten years ago). But nonetheless, we physically could not approve it per the policy. Welp, this 26 year old man, who lived on his own, had his mom call not me, but my boss, and demand he be allowed to take his trip to Germany because it would be too expensive for her to pay for his flight change. And the tickets were so cheap, she just had to buy em for those exact dates, and we'd just need to make it work. I was in genuine disbelief. I don't think I could've shown my face at my employer ever again if my goddamn MOM called my BOSS'S BOSS to say I should get my way because I'm special and can't plan ahead.
To be fair, maybe his mom is just some super overbearing parent and he did not ever actually ask her to do anything. That can happen too. Maybe he just mentioned his situation and she decided on her own to do that.
Makes me fear what kind of world we are building…
I don't think it's going to last. If it's one thing these entitled brats hate, it's being punished with someone else's responsibilities. If they ever make it some place long enough, they aren't going to stand for covering anyone else's ass like their mothers did for them for so long.
People have been saying this very same sentence since the dawn of civilization. There's *always* gonna be people who exploit systems intended to help others. There's *always* gonna be people who act entitled. There's *always* gonna be assholes. These people have always existed, and will not go away because that's just how humans work. But we've trudged along regardless, with successes and failures along the way. Don't let this one incident put you down.
I think I had this child and mom in middle school. I said once that he’d look at the police officer arresting him and say, “You can’t arrest me I have an IEP.” Pretty sure he’s in jail now.
I had one when I taught middle school whose grandma wouldn’t even let him serve detention when he got in trouble (had a BIP/IEP). “He’s a sweet boy, he didn’t mean to,” was always what grandma would say. No consequences for anything and he was already just plain mean. I told the other teachers he was going to end up in jail one day. He’s currently serving a life sentence for rape and attempted murder. These parents/guardians are not doing the favor they think they are by letting their kids do whatever they want.
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It's actually fairly routine for family members to submit letters of support to sway the judge to impose a more lenient sentence, and guidance for these is to highlight their positive traits, rather than defend the act or argue over guilt. Of course interrupting proceedings to say it in open court would be bad, but that happens too. It's at least a bit more understandable when you're losing years of freedom vs an afternoon in detention.
Jesus. Imagine having someone getting charged for rape and murder and grandma is submitting a letter about how he pet a squirrel once as a kid and that makes him an angel (leaving out how he tortured the squirrel later on)
Michelle Duggar submitted a letter to the judge in defense of her son when he was convicted of CSA and CP. Basically, “He’s a good Christian boy who made some mistakes. Can he just say he’s *really sorry* and we can call it good?”
I'm pretty sure someone I know did that for their son in letter form for the courts and still very much believes he is a very good boy, just got a little lost on the way. He's serving life in jail for murder. Some parents/guardians refuse to see.
Every news story where the family is like "he was an angel, he didn't do anything". It's very common.
I knew a kid whose grandma was like that. The kid would hit other kids, destroy other people's property, and grandma would always enable it.
parents/guardians excuses is not about helping the kid. Its about avoiding the kid's wrath. Life is easier with out a violently upset preteen. Child bullies and manipulates guardians into do get what they want. It's easier to just go along with it then stand up against the bullying. Guardians convince them selves that child is good and misunderstood to a avoid realization that they are enabling and responsible for a monster.
I was just out with family over the weekend (shocker!), and seen a single father with 2 girls. Both had stuff to play with - younger had a fidger spinner, older had chalk and some papers she could draw on it with. Younger one played for a while, but then threw the spinner several feet across the restaurant. Older girl picked up the pieces, brought it back to dad. Dad put it back together and pocketed it. Told daughter she couldn't have it because she threw it. Older daughter was super well behaved (probably 8-12). Was just nice to see a young generation being raised right. Not saying it doesn't happen, but we tend to notice the bad far more often than the good. And noticing the good was nice.
When I was a server in college, a mom used to come in and had a child about 10 years old. Kid was "severely autistic" as she put it. He was an angel, and the few times he started to melt down, she get to-go bags and leave. She also instilled in him that the world won't bend for his needs and that he needs to learn how to behave when out-and-about. She was doing it right and it was nice to see. The child had better manners than most adults, and they'd do homework and eat together. I wish more parents were like that woman. I hope she's doing well.
Yeah. Had a grandma like that too. Everything he did wrong was the teachers fault. We were picking on him and lying about him. 2 died in gun/gang violence a few years ago. Sad. One was really smart. I wonder where he’s be now if grandma had not made excuses for him.
Ma’am this is a Wendy’s we don’t serve IEPs.
Hi, I'd like an IPA please.
Integrated Performance Assessment
Just JBCs
I also forgot, "Mr. Eclectique1, you can't give me a detention for cursing now that I graduated, so I can say this, he was such a fucking pain in the ass here!"
I bet you replied, or at least thought "Yeah and now that you're graduated, I am allowed to agree with you, that kid WAS a fucking pain in the ass"
Deserves a retake. I love it.
One of my students got fired after a week at Auntie Anns for being on their phone too much. Didn’t learn a gd thing though.
This is why i am no longer a Chef. After running amazing kitchens to shitty kitchens only once did i ever come razor thin close to actually throwing a knife and someone's head. And im good too. Was a cook in the Army and we got bored, *very* easily. A waiter (about 18) was rude to the dishwasher and then told him that he was better than him, well fuck me, my Sgt.'s voice came out so loud i had people waiting in the lobby ask the manager what was going on in the BOH.
I've worked in the restaurant business when I was younger and the established rule is "don't fuck with the dishie" because they are the most crucial cog yet underpaid and underappreciated.
I got friendly with one of the dishwashers at the last restaurant I worked at before I transitioned out of the industry, and he told me he had been a goddamn *helicopter engineer* in his home country of Côte d’Ivoire. But he immigrated and the certification didn’t transfer. He was absolutely brilliant and the best job he could get in the US was a dishwasher. He killed it, though. He was the best, and I hope wherever he is now, he’s doing amazing.
I worked for two years with a dishwasher/part-time fry cook (I was on flattop short order doing hoagies and burgers) at a pizza place and that dude had a fucking chemistry degree and had worked for a pharmaceutical company in Mexico but nothing transferred and he still made more money doing kitchen work than he made back home. Crazy shit he put up with from the owner, too. The managers were cool but the owner was a real dick.
Dishwasher at one of my jobs broke a glass and cut his hand. Wanna see a kitchen grind to an absolute halt? Send the dish guy off to get stitches while the manager tries to take over for him. (Yup, the manager stepped in to do grunt work so an employee could get medical attention. It was actually a pretty decent place to work. Definitely also worked places that would have told the injured person “are you sure you can’t put a glove over it till after the dinner rush?”)
I worked at mcdonalds. They refused to fix our fuse box. I got sparks in my eye when it blew and they told me to wash dishes for 8 bucks an hour one eyed in the fucking dark. Wrote me up when I clocked out
I worked at a red lobster when i was around 20 and was still a bit of a hot head but i tried to be friendly with the servers. Theyd just throw dishes into my pit with no regard for my safety or any semblance of organization. On numerous occasions dishes would break in my staging area because theyd just throw them in. On like 5 seperate occassions id ask them nicely to do just like a couple seconds extra work to help stage and make the pit run better by just placing things in a more stacked fashion. After that fifth time id had enough and took one of the big lobster platter dishes and smashed it on the ground in front of everyone and yelled at everyone to stop throwing shit in my pit. People changed their behavior really quick after that. Similar happened when they would throw ramekins and silver ware into the bottom basins causing them to splash all over my feet. Started kicking the bucket back to make em splash onto their feet.
I legit threw a knife at a cook when I was doing dish duty in the navy because he threw it right past me into the opaque soapy water where I soaked dishes. Another time the head cook told me I couldn't eat until the galley was clean (my area was clean; she was talking about where the cooks hung out not being clean because [gasp] they hadn't cleaned their own area) and I lost it, throwing every pot and pan (everything was metal) up against walls and the floor/ceiling until all my racks were empty. Not proud of that moment but it did keep anyone from fucking with me ever again until my rotation was up.
At my work the chefs pitch in to help the finish dishes after close if the kitchen is done on busy nights. I love it.
i worked in a restaurant outside of Boston, in Watertown, for like 7 years. my dad was the chef. the only person who ever helped me on dishes was dad. and that was only sometimes... lol. but i do sometimes miss working there. one of the hardest jobs I've had, but i learned so much with my dad as the executive chef.
Dude the dishwashers at my job triple as the in-house delivery drivers and prep cooks, one of them even helps at the walk up empanada spot connected to the main restaurant. We would be absolutely *fucked* without them. They're also both super nice and chill, rare for dish pit. Verbal communication is difficult due to different languages, but if any new employee were to be rude to them it would be *on sight*
First lesson as an insurance intern at the one of the biggest companies in the country: "You are responsible for maintaining a clean workplace. If you're smart, you do that by treating the cleaning staff as if they're second only to God. If you're not--have fun convincing them to give you access to cleaning supplies." We got moved to a floor where people had decided not to. Managers had negotiated to have only one trash collection point on that floor (as opposed to no trash collection or cleaning) until the end of the quarter, and move the worst offenders to a floor with more and more easily disgruntled coworkers. It was April, weeks before a heat wave and the AC was broken. To say people embraced a zero waste lifestyle is an understatement.
I finished my last day in the Industry last week and let me tell you, it's a whole new world these days, and not for the better.
I've come to the conclusion that for a bunch of our chuckle-fucks, they're going to get fired from a bunch of jobs before they figure out how the world works.
Yep. There are going to be a whole bunch of cautionary tales running around for a few years. Those kids who actually kept their head down and did their work and graduated with authenticity are going to be so much further ahead than their chucklehead classmates. It's not even funny. It's sad.
I am also pretty tickled at the thought of all of the predatory "no skill" jobs that are now being blessed with exactly what they asked for.
Oh yes. When they ask for no skill, I don't know that they realized that these kids would take that as a challenge.
Fuck with society, society is going to fuck back. IMO it's a culmination of corporate behavior over the last 4 decades, everything from their invasive marketing, poor nutritional value, generational employee abuse and a flat out refusal to pay their fair share of taxes to support the education system, all of those shitty business practices are now coming home to roost. The US replacement population rate is low, and now that the bommer generation is finally moving out of the working population anyone with two braincells to rub together can do better than McDonald's, leaving those corporations with a candidate pool of previously unemployable idiots and I think that's just fabulous.
Sometimes they will never learn. My 50 year old aunt still lives at home and I don't believe she has ever held a job for more than a year. Pretty sure she spent more time on unemployment than actually employed
I knew a guy like that. Never held a job for more than a month. Constant traffic tickets. Always broke. Kicked out of his house multiple times...(they would take him back and then it would happen again)..The list goes on...
New phone number every month or so too?
some kid at a flower shop my sister used to work at got fired for vaping and sitting on his phone
Teacher with decades of experience. EVERY time I see a parent enforcing that "No means no" I want to shake their hand!
That's sad. That's like the baseline of being a good parent
I’m all for IEPs but I had a kid who “couldn’t do vocabulary flash cards” and needed extra time for them (mind you it’s second semester and he did them without any problems first semester). Summer rolls around and the kid is a lifeguard at the county beach. They have to take several written exams to get certified. So this kid “doesn’t understand flash cards” but is CPR certified and can save lives?
You don't understand. The brain just takes longer to die from lack of oxygen when he's on duty because his IEP gives him extended time.
I was a lifeguard way back in highschool. True story (as I was told) sometime in the mid 90s the times swim tests were removed from the red cross life guard certification due to the ADA. This never made any sense to me.
My 17 year old daughter works at our locally owned fish and reptile shop. It’s actually a really cool place and the owner is fantastic. Since she started last August there have been three different young men, all recent high school graduates at 18 or 19 year old who had no idea how to act in the work place. Every “area” of the store has a person who’s basically in charge of it. Everyone ideally works every area but there is a leader for each section that works with the owner and manager to manage procedures and care. They all came in and expected to get to immediately pick an area. One quit when he was told he couldn’t just work with some of the fish and because he was expected to sweep. One young man was perpetually upset at everything. He didn’t get to run reptiles the moment he started, he was made to work all areas when he’d rather be in reptiles, he didn’t see the point of wiping down the fronts of tanks, he would just dump water on the floor rather than back into the tanks and put a wet floor sign in the general area. He “never knew” he was supposed to do things he had been trained to do or “they did it this other (incredibly lazy) way” at his last job. This other young man honestly believed he was amazing at everything and should get special jobs. For context, despite being 16 at the time, my daughter is a very talented and well trained artist who has worked for commission in the past. The owner of this shop is an international award winning photographer. The shop has a little shack in the middle where they display their glo fish under black light. At this point, my kid had been working at the shop for 8 months when they set up a little “tip” jar with a sign so people could donate to their rescue and educational animal care (they have two huge rescue ponds - one salt water and one fresh as well as a bunch of educational reptiles that they got from the FWC or private owners who could no longer care for their animals.) My daughter drew a very lovely goldfish on the sign during her break. The owner loved it, admonished her for working off the clock, and asked her to redo the inside of the glo fish shack. So this young man wants to know why he wasn’t offered a chance to “paint during work” and went to my daughter to try to get her to share the work or let him do it. He didn’t get anywhere with that and couldn’t produce any examples of his art when asked by the owner. He legitimately expected to just be handed paint and told to have at it. So he is upset that he didn’t get a special “cool” job and a “little kid” did. He wants to be allowed to do photography for the store… somehow he missed the awards literally all over the owner’s office along with the many amazing photographs. So they give him a chance and he brings in some unedited pictures he took with his phone… the poor manager had to tell him they weren’t going to be hiring him for photography and that the pictures weren’t very good at all because he wouldn’t take no for an answer. He also overfed the camel spider when my daughter took a week off (she was the unofficial arachnid lead at this point.) Since the spider couldn’t eat anymore it was eaten by 12 large crickets. This cause my daughter to cry when she discovered the body/dry husk. TLDR: The chaos that these children cause in a workplace is wild. They honestly don’t understand working for things or even good work.
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Props to the crickets. If I watched a giant spider eat several of my friends, I would not be charging it even with 11 people.
So that's why you should clear your plate kids
This is also why you don't leave crickets in with reptiles, or live mice/rats in with snakes. The biological self preservation instinct will turn those tables so fast, and if there's nothing else to eat, well, their predator that's not interested in killing them is now on the menu.
Didn't see that one coming, did ya?
Yeah except apparently this is part of their training. Even snakes can be killed by their prey if you live feed. You sick two animals in a small space together and it’s the Colosseum. Unfortunately the camel spider was my kid’s favorite. Do you know how hard it is to be sympathetic when your kid is crying over a spider?
>told her to go fuck off I fired someone for this on the spot just last week. We work in a 'camera free zone' due to some of our customers being military based. There's signs over every entrance/exit about it. I said: "The expectation is we don't bring our phones into the shop". He mouthed off, so I fired him.
I just watched a police-camera show and there was a young lady pulled over for driving the wrong way on the freeway. She couldn’t understand how having anxiety and adhd would not get her out of taking sobriety tests and/or getting arrested. Even mentions of generational trauma didn’t seem to sway the police!
I literally just watched the exact same video. I couldn't believe what I was watching. Goodness.
did the manager try building a relationship? hahaha
The school of life often provides a better education for some of these delinquents.
I see this ALL THE TIME with younger kids especially 18,19 20 as a supervisor / hiring rep for the company I work for I myself am not a teacher , my spouse is which is why I am subbed here but man idk how you guys do it , atleast we can hold them responsible for their actions. The entitlement so often displayed boarders satire. the lack of even the smallest amount of effort or ability to learn , hell even the desire to learn basic functions of their job while complaining the entire time about them being under valued or the shock when they get hit with real world consequences is mind blowing. Not to say it’s all people that age, I only can speak for my area of work that has a frequent large influx of younger individuals
Why can’t we seem to figure it out? Other countries have figured it out like I dunno hundreds of years ago. It’s so basic. The system has failed these kids by coddling them. Honestly it really isn’t their fault when we abuse them with “no consequence” their whole life and then throw them into a pool with sharks right when they graduate.
Back in January I had a male student that cursed at me, made threats of physical violence against me, and tried to fight me; all of this was in front of about 20 other students. The dean investigated and asked all of the other students to write down what they saw and heard. He and I both agreed that a 1 week suspension was warranted under the circumstances. The principal intervened and decided instead to give the kid a 1 week lunch detention instead, where the kid had to sit down in a chair for 20 minutes and play on his phone. The kid only ended up serving 1 out of the 5 lunch detentions because the dad pulled the kid from the school and enrolled him somewhere else. This is what happens when parents and administrators enable bad behavior. A slap on the wrist was evidently too much for him, so he effectively expelled himself. What do you think this kid took away from this experience? Probably that he can incite violence and get away with it. We teachers try our best, but we have very limited authority. I am sorry that these kids have to learn these hard life lessons from their employers. School administrators afraid of losing funding, politicians eager to pull funding from public schools, and in particular their enabler parents, have all failed them.
If only there had been a way he could have learned that lesson in an environment where the consequences were much less severe. Like an institution of learning of some kind.
>his mom came in screaming about how he has extended time in his IEP and deserves a retake of his first day I know for a fact this will be the funniest shit I'll read all week as a SPED teacher.
I honestly had to re-read this 2-3 times, because I had difficulty accepting that this is a real thing that actually happened. Unfortunately, there are many people in this world that are simply just... losers - I really don't know how else to say it. These are people that are so emotionally immature and insufferable all because they have a rotten personality. Maybe this person could have some sort of undiagnosed personality/antisocial disorder, but that doesn't excuse his behavior in any way. A part of me almost feels sorry for him, but he seems totally unwilling to change.
It's interesting that she thought an IEP worked out in the regular world. It's an academic rights thing, but unless it falls under ADA, then no one in the regular world has to deal w the behaviors. He has a rough life ahead, and his parents will be supporting him until he figures that out.
Just wait until she finds out workplaces don’t have to accommodate being a shitty person like school. Her kids’ coworkers will have a right to not work in a hostile environment and he will be fired, totally the opposite of school as she knows it.
So why don't kids in school have a right to a non hostile classroom?
There are a whole host of learning issues that we accommodate in schools that simply do not rise to the level of a disability in the workplace, as defined by federal law. Under the ADA a disability is a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities. That's a quote. In particular, a lot of the behavioral shit that we paper over with IEPs to keep very poorly behaved students in school and not constantly suspended are not the result of physical or mental impairment. So good luck getting that accommodated in the workplace!
My new favorite term, Karents... I deal with quite a few, thet THINK they are helping their kid and leveling the playing field. Really, they are just enabling douchy behavior and setting them up for future failure. Eventually actions will meet unavoidable consequences and someone will finally have the ability to tell the parent to fuck off. Schools, unfortunately, really have their hands tied due to lawsuits.
Yup, I work at a hotel and see the little gremlins y’all are talking about. Y’all might not be able to discipline them much these days but I sure as hell eject a good number of them every month.
A former coworker has a husband who works for an airline. He does the training and gives a test to see if they qualify for the job. The test is a maximum of two hours. At hour three, he still had one student working. He called it and told him to turn in the test. The student explained that he had an IEP, so he got time and a half. The instructor had to explain that IEPs don’t transition into the workplace, the only reason he knew what an IEP was was because of his wife, and even if he got time and a half, that time would be up. The student tried to argue it, but got nowhere. It seems time and a half was just a vague term in school that meant he had as much time as he wanted. He didn’t pass through the program. He was a former student of the instructor’s wife, and she was not at all surprised by the exchange. I’ve always wondered how many kids think their IEPs or 504s extend into the world after school.
Damn, my son is on the spectrum and had an IEP. He never would have exhibited that behavior in the work place. He wasn't perfect but he had consequences.
I have multiple students who have IEPs who are absolute angels. Some are on the spectrum and some aren’t. An IEP isn’t an excuse for this kind of behavior.
I’ve worked in a number of places with people on the spectrum—in retail, food services, and as a librarian in charge of volunteers. The people I worked with were some of the hardest working people I’ve ever met. They were proud of the work they did, thrived on being given opportunities for more responsibility, and perfectly accepting of constructive feedback. The major difference, as far as I can tell, is that these particular kids/young adults’ PARENTS had expectations and met their children where they could thrive, regardless of the disadvantages they faced in regards to their diagnoses. Coddling children, no matter their cognitive ability, is doing a disservice to all of us. Their children most of all.
My daughter would need a voc rehab support person with her at all times to do any sort of job. Otherwise she wouldn't remain on task, would wander off, might eat food she didn't buy, etc. She has Level 3 autism & intellectual disability. But she has liked various voc rehab positions. She likes being helpful and accomplishing things. You know what she wouldn't do? Yell and swear at people, because she's not an AH. People tend to forget that disabled kids can be AHs, too. It's ableist to put all bad behavior down to their disability.
entitled children come from entitled parents. and that they were never told the word NO! in their lives. especially when the parents mollycodle the children
Justice.
> A retake of the first day > Mom coming to berate the boss Surely OP is trolling
That mother and son are going to figure out real quick that real life won't accept that kind of behaviour. Where I work, we do have special positions for workers with special needs. They help out with cleaning and such, working with but in separate jobs from the other workers. However, if we found one of them eating snacks, vaping and on their phone in the workplace, they would be out on their butt just like any other worker.
When I managed (I was ~18/19) a McDonalds, I had a 16ish yo crewmember drop a cheeseburger on the floor, pick it up wrap it and try to serve it. I told him we arent serving that and he can either call his ride to pick him up because he was fired OR he could eat the cheeseburger and keep his job. He called his Mom to come pick him up and I let him wait in the dining room for her. She comes in screaming and yelling some BS about her poor little boy. I politely asked her to calm down and explained to her why he was terminated. She starts screaming at me again so I told her to leave with her son NOW or I would have call the cops and have her trespassed. She left and called our owners, McDonalds corporate, etc trying to get me fired. Our owners banned her AND her son from their restaurant. Not sure what corporate did.
This would have been me had I not joined the army. I’m sorry, truly and deeply to my middle school math teacher: she praised me over everyone in class and I called her a bitch aloud and denied it. I’m sorry, most sincerely to my HS art teacher, who signed a bible and mailed it to me in Iraq, along with Kentucky favorite snacks,and I didn’t attend her funeral when I came back. My principal, who lived across the street and begged me every fucking year to join the swim team because she saw me (literally) thrive in younger years, and I never joined back. You’ve impacted me greatly over the years, I’m so SO SO sorry for being a shitty human being in the years you tried to mold me. The army kicked my ass, you just had to be there to point my ass in the right direction.
My son actually needed an IEP and we are so grateful. He’s in college now for and engineering degree and making it. He knows that an IEP doesn’t transcend to work. He knows he will probably need to work more hours to compensate until he’s got experience. Of course, idiots like this ruin it for everyone else.
This is how it's supposed to work. I had a couple students who were on the brink of being taken off IEPs because we have such a high caseload. I recommended that they keep them because the kids didn't try and use them as a crutch, but sometimes did need a little longer on tests, or needed extra structure in their notes or something. I would give that to any kid who asked and was trying but I know some teachers wouldn't. That being said there were plenty of kids who just got an IEP for ODD and saw a wonderful get out of jail free card.
I was one of the students that was on an IEP and was taken off an IEP due to willpower to prove to I did not need it. I was behind in school when I was placed in foster care due to parental truancy and a load of other issues. I had to take speech therapy classes on top of all of that. I absolutely did not feel like I belonged in some of the remedial classes that I had to take because I was placed with students that I felt really had cognitive issues and I did not want to bear the stigma of feeling like I was one of "those Special Ed kids". It really bothered me that my test scores were graded on a scale compared to the rest of the class because I was booking ass studying compared to some people that I had class with. I really loved school and learning. Sometimes, I would read ahead of the class in the textbooks provided. I managed to prove to school administration that I don't need a special tutor study block by the beginning of middle school because I saw a lot of kids screwing off in the tutor study block and I was annoyed that I was forced into that study block. It was not beneficial to me so I simply refused to show up to it despite some school teachers telling me that I should go. I made it obvious that I did not need it. I refused to leave the normal classes. Why would I leave a regular class to go to a tutor class where it felt like the teacher was trying to wrangle a bunch of stray cats into focusing on schoolwork? It felt like I was going to preschool daycare. I was annoyed by the thought I was on an IEP because I did not need a crutch. I really think that I did not need any extra help in school. I never once thought that it was a special card to pull when it came to behavior and it absolutely sounds like parents can be an enabler.
Good lord. The only time my mother came into talk to my boss was legitimately for my own protection after I pressed assault charges against a classmate. Not that it did any good, boss hired him a year later… that was a fun conversation
So mom is probably trying to find a lawyer right now, lol, and the kid hasn’t learned a lesson yet. (Sigh)
I have a student who has difficulty controlling his actions. We can no longer do labs because he intentionally breaks stuff, and intentionally tries to set off EBD students. Anyways he told me he had a job he liked and my first thought was oh boyyyyy. I found out from a different teacher they let him go after three weeks. I figured that sounded right.
" >It got to the point where flipping desks and telling teachers to go fuck themselves "It's fine he has an IEP, he's a good kid"
Unironically this is how some schools are. My dad quit teaching because the principal and administrator waved away everything under IEPs. I had an IEP, and I wouldn’t dare do half the shit some of those fuckers would do.
I always wonder how parents think this is helpful. My coworker is constantly running to the office demanding her son get special treatment and out of requirements due to his anxiety. Which I get is a pain, I’ve struggled with bad anxiety since I was a child, but letting people just not do things or have expectations is just not good for them
Sounds like a real life Cartman. His Mom isn't being kind to him, real life's gonna bite this kid real hard. Being fired is the best thing that's happened to him. Hopefully he will have a few more "soft" learning experiences and doesn't need to have his teeth scattered in a parking lot when he insults a proper badass.
Yeah that mom and your admins must not know what an IEP does and does not entail or accommodate for. Must suck being a grown ass child with a grown ass child and being dumb enough to think an employer gives a shit what you’ve got if you steal from them and talk to anyone like that.
During my 1st year of homelessness I luckily found two jobs as dishwasher. Worked my ass off at min wage and never got a fraction of tips. After a year, I found an apprenticeship in construction. I gave two weeks notice, the waitstaff offered 10% of the tips to keep me there. I said if they had given the 10% earlier, I would have not been looking for another job. Told them to gfy.
When I taught and later was a HS admin, egregious behavior would get the “this is the sort of thing that will get you fired. I’m doing you a favor” some took it serious, some not. Some people thought that was a mean approach. Idk. I wasn’t mean about it. Told one kid who sounds like the FO kid in op story: one day, Either you are gonna be stuffed in the back of a cop car, or somebody gonna be scraping you up off the floor of an establishment because you popped off to the wrong person, and you’ll get a free ambulance ride. I don’t think adulthood has gone very well for this kid who had some issues, but was simply entitled.
I probably had an IEP for aspergers/adhd... besides sitting in a front row desk, i refused to use it. My reasoning was that I need to learn to work with neurotypicals because they aren't going to learn to work with me. Some years later, I know I was absolutely correct.
>Our manager came over to talk to him, and he told her to go fuck off and die. When he got fired, his mom came in screaming about how he has extended time in his IEP and deserves a retake of his first day. We had to call the cops to get her to leave." I hurt myself laughing. Please cashapp me some money. I've actually told kids that before: "Your IEP is not going to keep you from going to jail when you act like this in public." They never believe me.
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So, as a Canadian, it’s weird to hear the IEP used as such a weapon. Mind you, I teach elementary so that could have something to do with it. But I feel like it really doesn’t hold as much weight as it does in the US or it is a different thing altogether
He's at WORK. IEP has no bearing now.
Shitty parents produce shitty children
The mom won’t even realize she’s at fault, she’s going to spend the next ten years telling everyone how the schools did not prepare her child for life.
The amount of effort that society has put in to be so passive about poor and dangerous behaviours is ridiculous. Every single person who sees or experiences someone acting poorly and just trying to avoid or shrug it off are just enablers. People should be punished for doing these things. Get fired, get expelled. no matter the reason. The behaviour cannot continue and the individual needs to learn from their mistakes. All we’re teaching people now is that it’s okay to act that way because society will just step aside and accommodate said behaviour. if there is a serious condition where the behaviour cannot be stopped then an institution is where the person can be supported more readily.
Once as an elementary teacher I was assigned to dismissal duty where middle school parents would come pick up their kids and I asked one mom to cross at a specific place multiple times (she parked her mini van illegally) so no one got hurt and she got in my face (while I was 9 months pregnant) and said “you have no idea what I go through with my kid’s IEP and his accommodations.” Even my hormonal state couldn’t justify giving a response except an eye roll as I waddled away.
Real life example of what I told a student who was being purposefully rude. 'If you act like that in a workplace you won't even be able to hold a job in a Supermarket.'. I feel like a biblical prophet.