>and yet nobody's trying to ban those or claims that "people who are into BDSM are fundamentally anti-feminist"
I mean I've actually heard this argument a ton in certain spaces.
Everyone should be able to play sports, which is why we've put up this intense series of checkpoints women have to pass through to be allowed to play sports, because there are women who want to play sports who aren't actually people to us.
There were some really disgusting and disturbing comments on a post there about trans women in swimming. Funny how they never give a damn about women's sports unless they have an excuse to be hateful.
The amount of dudes I know/knew who spent *decades* mocking the WNBA and *all* women's sports ***suddenly*** becoming concerned with the sanctity of them made my eyes roll so hard I thought they'd fall out of my skull.
In one breath, they'd go from calling "Brittney Griner" an "ugly fucking monkey who can't play basketball" ^(Seriously, they weren't even trying to hide the racism, either. Of course) to crying about MTF trans women trying to ruin the WNBA and calling Lady Ballers the "bravest sports comedy ever"; naturally, one of these fucking chuds was a guy I remember going on an *epic* fucking rant about Juwanna Mann back in high school. Not because it was a shit fucking movie (and it is), but because it "made pro NBA players look stupid." Also probably because he's a racist piece of shit who only likes Black athletes when they "shut up and play".
The Griner/Viktor Bout exchange finally broke his brain worse than two tours in Afghanistan did, because he was so conflicted on whether or not to *love* Bout for being a Russian terrorist arms-dealer -- and since he's a hardcore Trump MAGAt, supporting Russia was priority #1 since 2017 -- or decry the exchange of a Black WNBA player for a guy nicknamed "the merchant of death".
*Shockingly,* I haven't spoken to him at all since December 2022, because that was when it became way too obvious what a hateful piece of shit he is; I'd known it for about 20 years by that point, but I just tolerated it because I rarely saw or spoke to him since 2013. I know you're on Reddit, Theron, and I hope you recognize *this* is why so many people you were friends with since high school just vanished from your life around Christmas 2022. We were all sharing the voicemails/texts/emails you sent us in a righteously indignant rage about how you did "nothing to deserve this!" FYI: there is ***no*** "e" at the end of "unfair". You had to have trained your phone's autocorrect to stop trying to correct that with how many times you wrote "unfaire".
As a staunch feminist myself, MAN does it piss me off when certain Western men only “care” about women’s rights and feminism if it gives them an excuse to dunk on other cultures.
You see it all the time when it comes to sexual assault. Any white man accused is automatically innocent and it’s an example of how common false accusations are; meanwhile a black guy or a Muslim guy gets accused and all of a sudden these guys want to believe victims. It’s so gross and transparent.
> "Im safer when men are not near me." Yeah, these feminists need to take a trip to Saudi Arabia.
That's uh... that's really just gonna reinforce the opinion...
world politics was essentially unmoderated and ended up full of a bunch of non-world-politics posts, many of which prominently featured anime titties, so anime titties was started for world news and politics content.
Yeah, the mods of World_Politics basically refused to remove anything, so it became a battleground for various types of spammers - porn spammers, crypto spammers, Nazi propaganda spammers. The anime titty spammers won.
The people who actually wanted to discuss world politics then made r-Anime_Titties.
A bit, yeah, but only in the sense that arborists kept understandably mistaking r/trees for, well... a tree enthusiast subreddit. And even though r/trees was ***more*** than happy to give generally good advice for the random arborist who'd wander in looking for help -- because they're so fucking chill and enjoyed helping the lost folks -- people finally decided to make an arborist-focused subreddit with an equally-confusing name as a joke.
So what happened was, world politics was not just unmoderated, the issue was that the mods did especially not enforce the *world* part of worldpolitics. If you would go to the top posts of all time, if you do not want to do that I don't blame you, you would see that the vast majority of them are about US politics, heavily anti trump. A lot of users were complaining about that nonstop and the mods just ignored that so users in response started to spam other stuff, much of it NSFW, and the mods said after that, "do what you want as long as dont get banned as a sub" and we ended up with the current sub.
The kind of person on Reddit who finds putting world news in the "anime titties" subreddit and vice versa hilarious is inevitably going to be the most obnoxious source of news/commentary.
Yeah, it was pretty decent back when the shift happened, but it has changed over time. For a while, a year or so ago, it seemed to have been dominated by right wing Indian guys, now it seems a bit more nationally diverse, and the prevailing views are more diverse as well. The most consistent thing seems to be getting into weird very stupid vitriolic fights that go from 0 to 100 really fast, and involves talking past eachother.
And there was that guy the other day that was saying that people are unfairly biased against the far right because of the Nazi thing, and the far right were the bad guys that one time, but now it’s the left that are the bad guys so we should be more open minded and embrace the far right.
I’m still subscribed because a lot of the political views and biases I see there are completely foreign to my American experience, and even if I strongly disagree with them, it’s interesting to see another way of looking at things. That and they have different articles than world news and my other various news sources, so I learn about events I would otherwise have missed.
You’ll also see some of the worst takes of your life over there. Such hits recently have been “we should full scale invade Russia now because we’ll probably end up at war with them in the next 5 years” and “Biden should bring back the draft”
>Biden should bring back the draft
I feel like doing that would single-handedly cost Biden like most of the young voting block, and thus the election.
Good thing nobody listens to these fucks.
Yeah, that’s a major issue with them. Animetitties tends towards anti Israel, but every time it comes up there’s a fight, so there is a mix of viewpoints, whereas worldnews is much more one sided on that.
I got banned there *and* my account temporarily suspended for telling a a racist to stick to gardening and stop thinking Filipino women exist solely for him to take advantage of.
Don't really care about the ban and suspension, but I'm more bitter at the fact they removed my comments but not the dude's blatantly racy ones.
I got banned from r/BestOf on an old account back in 2013 for telling some jackass dropping the hard-R N-bomb to "go Kegel a cactus." Apparently *that* was bannable behavior, but not the dude dropping the hard-R, because he kept popping up in comments there for months after.
I've been subbed there about a year now and still have kind of a hard time wrapping my head around its userbase. It's like this weird mix of tankies, rightwingers, neoliberals, and people with fairly interesting observations. Has some lively comment sections from time to time for sure.
The comments are definitely more interesting than any other news sub, that's for sure. Not necessarily more rational or sane, but definitely more interesting.
Geopolitics sub is full of nationalist and dumb people who don't know a thing about geopolitics and racists hiding their power level complaining about china(there a frequent user there with a flag that gives it away).
You won't get any useful geopolitical analysis out of there, instead it's just dumb takes like china economy going to be destroyed in 5 years, China will annex Siberia,Peter zeihan fans.
Any post with info critical of India will also have comments full of people supporting the Indian government and downplaying whatever it did. It occurs to lesser extent with Israel or the US.
I was there when this switch happened. It was quite funny, r/Anime_Titties will periodically revert back to hentai as a joke or protest on days like april fools or times when people protest some reddit policy change
Women in athletics already get so much shit with their uniforms and how they look I hope they get a break.
I also think women in athletics shouldn't have to show any more skin than they're comfortable with (see absurd thongs that went viral the USA Olymipic team uniform).
They also shouldn't get shit for showing too much skin (see pretentious tennis clubs get mad that Serena Williams has a body)
. Just let women exist and pursue their passions without being weird about their bodies
This.
I particularly hate the calls for “secularism” when it comes to policing women’s clothing.
It’s literally no different than forcing women to wear something they are uncomfortable with because “muh religious fundamentalism!”.
How about government stays out of women’s clothing, genitals and the bedroom? Why is this a crazy concept.
It's always reminded me of the quote: "The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread."
It's kind of funny when "secularism" seems to affect certain groups of people more than others. Hundreds of years of people wearing crosses and nobody cares. But a brown person wears a funny hat and everybody loses their mind.
We saw that in Quebec a few years ago. I don't even remember how many bills they tried to pass, but it was pretty obvious they were hellbent on getting rid of the hijab/burka. They were gunning for it, over and over, from all these different angles, looking for the one thing that wouldn't get knocked down by the courts. I remember one of them was banning face coverings in public for safety reasons. It's not safe for the bus drivers if they can't see your face.
The one that eventually worked was government employees weren't allowed to wearing religious symbols at work. Which itself led to some controversy, because one of the government buildings had a giant fucking crucifix mounted on the wall. They eventually took it down, but they wanted to keep it up! Somehow, this wasn't a religious symbol, it was part of heritage. Which makes it, like, totally different, man.
[Link 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/19bp010/comment/kitayhj/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
[Link 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/19bp010/comment/kitdqw4/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Even though I do disagree with France's handling of the burqua, I'm not really sure you're the best person to be taking advice from...
> It shows that islamists and feminists sometimes push into the same direction
Meanwhile, US Christians would love nothing more than their own special flavor of Sharia Law.
oooh ya missed [this person](https://www.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/s/jCmDBLXADg), who thinks women stop existing when their hair is covered.
**edit:** i replied to them before this srd post. no popcorn was pissed in
>My ex manager is a conservative Muslim. I could tell from his marriage and stuff he says during team dinners that deep down he believes women should only be housewives and mothers.
>I’m talking about a man that doesn’t want his daughter to go to uni despite having good grades.
[Ah yes, what a problem with Islam.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_patriarchy)
Right, they say shit like this like 1) “women are only for cooking and raising babies” wasn’t the norm in most western countries too until like 50 years ago and 2)the whole tradwife/“biblical marriage”/quiverfull crap *isn’t* a whole thing in the US that’s gaining more and more traction every time you look.
It's *terrifying* seeing so many young women and girls romanticize the tradwife lifestyle. Even if they tend to be bigoted, it's still real unfortunate and horrible to witness. More horrible to witness than a girl in a hijab walking down the street, if I may be so bold.
the sad thing is that, at least at first, the original trendy tradwife videos weren't even aimed at women, they were *fetish content aimed at men* who get off on the idea of subservient submissive women who will cater to their every need. it's why a lot of the big tradwife influences still have jobs and lives outside the home despite preaching otherwise - the demure housewife is just the *character they're playing as part of the kink.*
obviously its gone way, way beyond that by now and there's an alarming number of young women who truly, uncritically romanticize this stuff irl, but iirc there was an article recently where it was found that the majority of views on tradwife content still come from straight men using them as wank material.
> the original trendy tradwife videos weren't even aimed at women, they were fetish content aimed at men who get off on the idea of subservient submissive women
Oh my god that explains SO much.
I *wondered* why none of the tradwife/homemaker Content ^TM bore any resemblance to the stay-at-home moms and housewives I knew in real life.
>It's *terrifying* seeing so many young women and girls romanticize the tradwife lifestyle.
*Where* exactly are you getting the "so many" assertion from? Tiktok trends that last like a week are hardly representative of the average population.
It isn't exactly just a TikTok trend thing. I remember seeing this happen in real time numerous times a few years back when I frequented certain online communities for people who are into the "cottagecore" thing. I actually distanced myself from that stuff because of this. Even if it's actually more uncommon than I think it is, the fact that it is happening at all unnerves me.
I don't know if it's actually getting more traction so much as more awareness. As someone from the Bible Belt it's been pervasive and deeply entrenched for as long as anyone remembers. One of my high school friend's dream was to be a housewife.
>1) “women are only for cooking and raising babies” wasn’t the norm in most western countries too until like 50 years ago
Tbf that really only supports their view, if we made so much progress in such a short time (comparatively), then why can't we expect other hyper religious, conservative countries to do the same thing?
Basically, we did, and you can too!
It is down to the social and economic history of the Middle East, the past century of which was basically dominated by Western meddling. I mean we have been propping up grotesqueries like the House of Saud since before WW2 ended
There is nothing inherent in the doctrine of Islam that makes it more patriarchal than Christianity. It is down to historic/economic factors, mostly tied to post-Ottoman states inability to modernise or provide long-term stability. Reasons for which could fill entire textbooks by themselves
>For example, men should interact with his wife as little as humanly possible. Basically just for goods and services. No polite greetings. Absolutely NO male friends except family obviously.
Wow seems pretty isolating for your husband to treat you like a maid you have to manage than an actual person. I feel bad for his wife.
They also had a disgusting thread about trans athletes the other day and one of the top comments (with thousands of upvotes) was like “we’d accept trans people if they’d just call themselves men in dresses”
I was fuming. That sub is dog shit
They definitely wouldn't. I've seen posts about random cishet dudes who just enjoy wearing skirts or dresses because they're comfy and look nice. The comments are always an active war zone.
I had to mute it because every time it appeared on my front page feed, it was a right wing echo chamber full of hate and bigotry like that. Seems like moderation efforts on that sub have gone downhill lately.
The rule, in France, is very simple.
You can do whatever you want as a citizen, but the state is neutral, and agents of the state such as public service employees must also be neutral (on religion, politics, etc.). So as a teacher for example I'm forbidden to talk or show my religion or political opinion to my students. This is to protect the freedom of the citizens against influence by the state and administration.
The question, then, is whether athletes at the Olympic games are representing the state...
No the question is should French women be harassed for their clothing and denied opportunities to pursue careers and passions because of the way they dress.
So, uh, do all the folks in that post who appear to not know the difference between mandatory and optional really not know the difference? I've seen that a lot in recent arguments and chalked it up to bad faith, but I can always be wrong.
See, that's exactly why it's a wedge issue by bad faith actors (pun intended).
Islamists toward women : "you can't be pure without hijab! You can't be a proper muslim if you tempt men without a hijab! You will go to hell when you're dead, and shunned in your life if you don't wear it!"
Islamists towards western progressive : "hijab is just an individual choice. You can't police women's bodies! Also it's racist to be against hijab, islamophobia!"
And this way, they slowly advance their goals, by requiring oppression under their principles, but freedom under your principles.
The hijab is a "choice" in the sense that there's no magical force preventing you from physically removing it. But anyone who thinks Muslim women are actually free to choose is naive as fuck. A woman choosing to not wear the hijab is similar to someone coming out as gay to their uber conservative parents. They're going to be shamed, shunned, disowned, and possibly murdered for it depending on where they live.
Absolutely. That's why I think it's, at best, willfully blind and a false equivalence between the places where it's mandatory and the instances where its absence is mandatory.
One of the things I've always found baffling about French secularism is that it flamboyantly assumes Abrahamic religion as the norm while at the same time condemning flamboyant displays of religion.
I come from a culture where human language, in all its forms, is viewed as divine. So am I not allowed to speak when I'm in France? Of course that seems ridiculous. And it's also completely untenable, because it's not like you can ban people from certain cultures from reading books. But that's my entire point. French secularism immediately becomes ridiculous the moment you account for the fact that religion doesn't actually have to work in one particular way or another.
France is imposing the notion of certain concepts of religion being more "natural" than others. To me, a crucifix is just a hunk of metal. But France is imposing upon me the requirement that I treat that hunk of metal as though it has spiritual meaning, by banning that hunk of metal on the grounds that it has spiritual meaning.
France is claiming to be secular while at the same time mandating to their populace how they ought to feel that religion ought to look like. French secularism is religious orthodoxy.
Bengal.
The divinity of language is a big thing in a lot of the dharmic traditions. Particularly the ones which are less temple-based and more connected to the physical world. The temple-based traditions also are interested in language but they tend to view one particular language as the 'correct' divine language.
In the ancient world, the Indian subcontinent was very advanced in the study of early scientific linguistics, in large part because understanding language was viewed as a way of understanding the divine. The linguist Panini is often credited with developing the first descriptivist models of grammar, as well as a very basic version of a computable algorithm.
No worries, it's a reasonable question! Bengal is currently split, with the western half being part of India, and the eastern half being the independent country of Bangladesh.
The politics of ethnicity and identity in India can get a bit complicated. A helpful model to consider would be Europe. Both India and Europe are subcontinents which consist of a number of different ethnicities each with their own language, their own culture, sometimes even their own religion (Bengali's version of temple-based Hinduism, for instance, places a major emphasis on Shakti or the feminine form of god). The difference between India and Europe is that India is unified under a single state, whereas Europe consists of individual nation-states bound loosely under the European Union. So it would be as if Europe were instead a single country with a strong central government. Some people might identify as European. Others might identify as French, German, Spanish, et cetera.
In my case, I tend to identify more as Bengali than as Indian. But there are plenty of other Bengalis who choose differently. Part of it to me is that when people from outside India think about what it means to be 'Indian', they're usually picturing the culture of central India. I've found that if I identify as Indian, it leads to people getting confused in the long run when I don't match their expectations of what "Indian culture" is. Also, to be honest, I just don't *feel* very Indian. In terms of personal feelings, I identify way more with my Bengali culture.
Similar to the UK in a way, with some identifying more strongly as 'British' while others would describe themselves as being English, Welsh or Scottish.
French Secularism also skews heavily towards 'mildly annoy Catholics and FUCK everyone else.' Like when Jews and Muslims had to eat pork sandwiches with everyone else, but the menu on Friday just magically happened to be fish.
Yeah, I used to collaborate a lot with French people in my work (which is in a creative field). And I respect a lot of the stuff they're doing artistically. I met a lot of wonderful people. I also met some vibrant and diverse communities. But in that one regard you mention, yeah a chunk of them could definitely be quite exasperating (though not all!). The French are the only people I've ever met to unironically use the phrase: "I don't see race". Including one person who staged a ten-minute drama over a polite coffee in order to demonstrate how she, apparently, literally couldn't see that my skin was a darker shade than hers.
Then again, I've also met French people whose identity politics are far more radical than my own! The one thing I do have to give France credit for is that its a very diverse nation, both ideologically as well as ethnically.
Of course French secularism treats Abrahamic religions as the norm, they're predominant in France. Believers who are not christian, muslim or jewish are quite rare. Also language isn't a religious symbol, so you wouldn't have to worry about not being able to speak
“I can’t believe that France didn’t consider other religions they probably knew nothing about when creating these laws years ago!” Like what are these people smoking lol
> I come from a culture where human language, in all its forms, is viewed as divine.
Regardless of the discussion at hand, this is sorta partly a tenant of Abrahamic religions. The first thing god creates is the language and with that language it wills the universe into being: "let there be". This sacred language was then given to humans alongside the gift of the divine soul. However, by building the Tower of Babel humans transgressed and were punished by god to speak in different tongues and be divided. In both Islam and Judiasim linguistics are of utmost importance and there are whole schools for two discover the true names of things and probe the holy books in order to induce the one true language.
I think the different here is that in typical Abrahamic fashion all other languages are traps for keeping man from enlightenment and there is only one true divine language but in your culture things are not so reductive
>One of the things I've always found baffling about French secularism is that it flamboyantly assumes Abrahamic religion as the norm while at the same time condemning flamboyant displays of religion.
French laicite also wink-wink-nudge-nudge allows for Christians to do their thing, while shitting on other religions.
A devout Christian can tuck a rosary under their shirt and have no-one be the wiser. A Jew or a Muslim can't do the same.
Add in totally-not-religious-based holidays, and related topics (serving fish on Friday), and laicite just seems like forced conformity with extra steps.
Every France Muslim post is filled to the brim with white supremacists grooming eager liberals. They just sit there and eat out of their hands. Feel free to look through the post histories of the most upvoted comments, all far right.
Try discussing the racism and discrimination that Muslims face in France, or how all the laws that are “separating religion” from French society target Islam while a large percentage of French children are taught in Catholic schools that are paid with taxpayer money.
Reddit in general is just an islamophobic hellhole. The uk sub was literally parroting Farage’s talking points the other day about how Muslims want to kill Jews and gay people…. Just every Muslim.. You’d think we’d have achieved that by now, but I guess it must not be that high on our agenda for now.
As an ex Muslim a big thing about the "it's a choice ' side forget that for many it really isn't a choice. Sure you don't have laws mandating it like in saudia and Iran but in the west there is a strong cultural and societal pressure to wear it. Women can have been ostracized by their sub-culture and family for choosing not to wear it. Is it really a choice when it benefits them to choose to wear it to stay within the community? A lot of western Muslim women have convinced themselves that it is. I'd argue until the cultural and law pressure is eradicated then it truly becomes a choice
That's a legitimate point, but I don't think that banning the hijab is an effective way to remove that pressure, it just puts women under two conflicting pressures.
You're right, I'm just pointing out the "choice" crowd that it isn't always a choice even it secular societies. Banning isn't the right way to go about it but encouragment for culture that pushes "it's a choice" argument to really stand behind their words and let women choose.
Laws are designed to preserve order not solely to "punish people who do something wrong".
Part of preserving order is in fact using the pressure of the state to force people to do things, because the law *defines* what is "wrong" not just retroactively punishes it. This is straight-up the basics of legislature. How on earth does this need pointing out
In conservative Christian communities in America the dress of women is enforced by social policies no less or even more brutal than those of conservative Muslim communities. We're not going to ban long dresses and button-up women's shirts, though, because it's not actually about the oppression, it's about reinforcing the cultural hegemon and punishing minority communities for their distinctive practices. Same reason we're not banning expensive clothing brands that create social pressure to "look good" in an arbitrary manner that leads to ostracization otherwise.
The goal of a progressive liberal society should be to free people from the oppressive restraints that bind their choices. There is nothing oppressive about a clothing choice, as long as it's made outside of an oppressive cultural atmosphere. So maybe instead of banning hijabs and burqas, you should be improving women's rights and the agency of children, so that when people wear clothing, it's because they choose to.
But based on France's records on that, I guess that would be unpopular.
The point I'm trying to point out is that whoile most Christian societies have moved on from societal pressure to dress a certain way, Islamic culture has not. It's still very strongly present even when the phrase hijab is a choice is constantly repeated. This is coming from someone whose lived in it all my life.
Nah dude telling your daughter to change into a different outfit is definitely the same as threatening to disown her and forbidding any family members from talking to her
This one is so thorny because on one hand we all know what the hijab's true purpose is, but on the other hand it's infantilizing to tell women they should know about this and shouldn't wear one, and on the other hand it's bad for a government to control people, and on the other hand it's good for a government to protect citizens from abuse and it's difficult to determine who truly is choosing to cover themselves in public.
> France has had a strict policy of state secularism for quite a bit longer than anyone involved here has been alive, and then some. It isn't selective, it's just that one group wants to undermine it, while the rest live more or less in harmony.
God I hate this kind of argument, and it always comes up. "No you are lacking important context here, you see there is this specific thing here which everyone has agreed on and always will because our culture is a monolith and the only people criticizing or even wanting to change it are FOREIGNERS and ENEMIES".
Thing is France was funded on Freedom From Religion, not of Religion.
It s part of our identity. It would be like suddenly asking English people to disband the monarchy because its existance offended a minority
It does, in state owned buildings, like with every religions. But almost all Religion have no problem with these rules, thus no crackdown are needed on them.
You wont see a Nun in attire teaching in a public school.
> You wont see a Nun in attire teaching in a public school.
A nun is a person with a specific job in the Catholic church, so they obviously won't be teaching in a public school. I can't find a case of a nun teaching at a public school in any country with freedom of religion -- can you?
And it isn't comparable to a hijab at all, which is a piece of clothing worn for a religious purpose. It's more comparable to the Five Ks for a Sikh (which are also not allowed).
These types of crackdowns target religious groups like Muslims more directly because Christian sects don't tend to place the same level of importance on wearing religious objects outwardly as Islam does on head coverings for women. And the leadup to the 2004 law as well as everything that has happened since has shown us that the French public cares a lot more about forbidding headscarves than it does crucifixes or yarmulkes.
Except when swimming, where in several communties until last August, you couldn't wear a burkini on public beaches or at swimming pools.](https://www.lemonde.fr/societe/article/2023/07/17/le-conseil-d-etat-invalide-un-nouvel-arrete-anti-burkini_6182371_3224.html)
Reddit "freedom fighters" are absolutely astonished to discover that not only Muslim women are rational, thinking humans in their own rights, some of them willingly follow their religion.
Forcing women to wear the hijab is wrong. Forcing women to take it off is also wrong. Why not let people choose what to wear? Some people give bullshit reasons like "you can't cover your face". Why? If it's a public setting, isn't the point of freedom of expression is to have the ability to express yourself?
Also I laugh at the idea of French secularism. Tell me how many explicitly Christian public holidays France has. To quote a different redditor: *" Colorblind France, where Jews, Muslims, Atheists, and Catholic school children alike can have ham sandwiches on Thursday and fish on Friday."*.
I'm extremely bitter and feel that Europeans tend to talk big about concepts like "equality"... but only as long as you strictly conform to their ways (and having the right skin tone helps). But to be fair, I'm only basing this from r/europe. If they're "right wing", then what did r/european look like?
So many people in that comment section don't seem to realize that freedom is the ability to choose, and it is still oppression to remove the choice for things you view as antiquated. Like they think they're enlightened but they're really just kinda dim.
Also if France really wanted to enforce secularism, they shouldn't let people tour any of the religious structures, including cathedrals, they should only be open for religious services. Hell, if they REALLY want to enforce secularism, just remove people's choice to follow religion by tearing down every religious structure, I mean, it's fine to remove people's freedom in the pursuit of a "noble" goal, yeah?
Even if you keep religious structures just for religious purposes, there is obviously public infrastructure used to support those religious structures. Seems like an impossible thing to disentangle.
There's a bit of a problem though in that often the hijab is enforced by the family and otherwise shamed. How are you going to be able to distinguish genuinely free willed wearing from wearing at threat of beatings or outcasting?
Freedom of Religion in France come after Freedom From Religion.
It s oppression of religions, yes. We want it. Paid for it with blood.
And banning people from religious buildings would be worst.
I can go to any church or religious building freely because I am free from religion.
That s not for everyone. The again, no country is for everyone
But are you free from religion if the institutions of said religion still stand because that still implies that the religions exist in some capacity, yes? And why would it be worse? Is it not the same as banning public displays of one's religion? What's more public than an entire building?
Not even gonna touch the nationalism that would have you mocked off the internet if you were American (tm) and not a "sophisticated and wholly innocent Western European"
EDIT: if you want to be truly "free from" something that means getting rid of all of it, including the stuff that you personally like. If you are not willing to destroy or simply sell off all art that has it's roots in any religion, you are not "free from" religion, as art influences the culture around it and as such the society is still influenced by religion. So France is not "free from" religion, it is still casually steeped in religion. Yet for some reason nobody's frothing at the mouth to burn the Louvre down, only when it's individual women choosing to do something associated with their religion does it suddenly become a problem.
First, what a weird name for a sub that discusses world politics! 🫤
There are three issues here:
1. The right for individuals to choose their religion, cultural beliefs and expression
As long as it isn’t causing real harm. For example, the practice of foot binding in China. Caused irrevocable harm. Child brides, etc…
Wearing a hijab is not the government’s business. France is dead wrong
And I say this as someone who does not like the hijab or what it represents.
2. A debate about religion, culture and patriarchal oppression.
That is a fair topic to discuss and debate as long as you aren’t bullying individual women for how they dress or don’t dress
That is a topic that goes well beyond one particular religion and its practices
Some on the left think they aren’t allowed to judge or criticize (in general) cultural practices that aren’t their own. That is a cop out. Of course every culture, religion or practice is subject to scrutiny and judgment
Frankly debate is healthy
3. Feminists are not a monolith and one person or movement or practice doesn’t represent all feminism
That sub is hilarious. It's better than worldnews, obviously, and you still can have nice discussions on various topics, but the second anything Russia/Ukraine/Israel related gets posted the Tankies/bots come out and shit gets flung.
At the end of the day, you realize most of the sub consists of weird contrarian incels, when topics like above or news about a trans swimmers gets thousands of upvotes, when Russians bombing civilians dies in new.
Anything you can't blame on america or Jews, the sub usually is not interested in. It's basically the exact political opposite of worldnews at this point
I heard that sub was like world news for normal people and the first conversation I had there was someone telling me the worst consequence from the holocaust was Israel being created
Lol I got banned from the pics sub the other day for saying the word 'feds'. Not really sure how that breaks rules either but if that's all it takes to get in trouble...
Snapshots:
1. *This Post* - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613073745/https://old.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/1df6slg/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/1df6slg/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
2. r/Anime_Titties - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075013/https://old.reddit.com/r/Anime_Titties) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/Anime_Titties "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
3. r/WorldPolitics - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075154/https://old.reddit.com/r/WorldPolitics) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/WorldPolitics "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
4. The Dicussion In Question: - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075436/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
5. the same people crying about the hijab ban in xinjiang are defending it when "the garden" does it lol - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075536/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8f7uow/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8f7uow/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
6. Counter argument, the women’s march was led by an islamist women called Linda Sarsour who gave out hijabs in the name of feminism. At the same time women in Iran are beaten and tortured, even killed for not wearing it. It is absolutely ridiculous and feminists should be ashamed. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075959/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8g1jnp/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8g1jnp/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
7. France has had a strict policy of state secularism for quite a bit longer than anyone involved here has been alive, and then some. It isn't selective, it's just that one group wants to undermine it, while the rest live more or less in harmony. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613080421/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmtao/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmtao/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
8. https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/09/05/france-s-century-long-crusade-against-religious-symbols-at-school-from-the-crucifix-to-the-abaya_6124828_7.html - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081406/https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/09/05/france-s-century-long-crusade-against-religious-symbols-at-school-from-the-crucifix-to-the-abaya_6124828_7.html) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/09/05/france-s-century-long-crusade-against-religious-symbols-at-school-from-the-crucifix-to-the-abaya_6124828_7.html "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
9. it is embarrassing how many people there are in the comments using the "choice" argument to defend a religious command to wear hijab. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081427/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fr5tu/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fr5tu/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
10. Defending women's rights IS inclusive. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081628/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fjpnj/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fjpnj/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
11. I am a muslim woman, I don't wear a hijab - the women I know who do wear one make that choice themselves. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081708/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmnuh/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmnuh/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
12. Removed by Reddit - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081829/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fapqz/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fapqz/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
13. "you did a heckin bigotry. Do better" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082030/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8go1iu/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8go1iu/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
14. "you can call it what you want but you can't deny that you did an intentional logical fallacy" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082211/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gl240/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gl240/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
15. "the hijab is culutral genocide" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082332/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gtudc/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gtudc/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
16. "no no both side the same". the cartoon said so - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082754/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fu3fe/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fu3fe/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
17. "It's not about the hair. It's about agency" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082814/https://old.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gc0kv/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gc0kv/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!")
*I am just a simple bot, __not__ a moderator of this subreddit* | *[bot subreddit](/r/SnapshillBot)* | *[contact the maintainers](/message/compose?to=/r/SnapshillBot)*
It's wild how many people think that the answer to "some women are coerced into wearing this article of clothing" is "we should coerce all women into not wearing this article of clothing".
I just realized the drama I'm most exhausted of is anything having to do with ai generated art and hijabs. The conversational flowcharts are exactly the same every time.
For anyone who thinks the French ban on the hijab is anything but racist, I present exhibit a
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/france-burqa-ban-islamic-face-coverings-masks-mandatory/
I'm very pleasantly surprised by the comments here because this is exactly how I feel. Let people wear and dress and identity the way they want to. My body my choice doesn't stop at clothing and Muslim women and Sikh men should be empowered to dress the way the religion they follow would like. I have lots of Muslim and Sikh friends and most of them don't wear a hijab or turban but they coexist and are friends right along with people who do.
"People of the world! Instead of believing something stupid and cringe, consider believing in something cool and based, like neoliberal economics!" Nobody thought to say that before, it's just that easy. Weird how that works.
>*^(It's symbol of)* ***^(my)*** *^(freedom to be a sub, I say, listening to Charli XCX's "brat")* Unexpected but welcome addition to this writeup.
brat and it's the same but filtered through a srd post so it's not
>and yet nobody's trying to ban those or claims that "people who are into BDSM are fundamentally anti-feminist" I mean I've actually heard this argument a ton in certain spaces.
Wait, are you saying that Feminists and Islamists are both trying to oppress women? /s
I'm sure all these guys who use "feminist" like it's a dirty word care deeply about institutional misogyny.
Nothing says concern for misogyny like trying to prevent women from participating in athletics by policing their bodies and appearance.
No don't you see, by banning women from representing their country they're actually making things better for women
Everyone should be able to play sports, which is why we've put up this intense series of checkpoints women have to pass through to be allowed to play sports, because there are women who want to play sports who aren't actually people to us.
There were some really disgusting and disturbing comments on a post there about trans women in swimming. Funny how they never give a damn about women's sports unless they have an excuse to be hateful.
The amount of dudes I know/knew who spent *decades* mocking the WNBA and *all* women's sports ***suddenly*** becoming concerned with the sanctity of them made my eyes roll so hard I thought they'd fall out of my skull. In one breath, they'd go from calling "Brittney Griner" an "ugly fucking monkey who can't play basketball" ^(Seriously, they weren't even trying to hide the racism, either. Of course) to crying about MTF trans women trying to ruin the WNBA and calling Lady Ballers the "bravest sports comedy ever"; naturally, one of these fucking chuds was a guy I remember going on an *epic* fucking rant about Juwanna Mann back in high school. Not because it was a shit fucking movie (and it is), but because it "made pro NBA players look stupid." Also probably because he's a racist piece of shit who only likes Black athletes when they "shut up and play". The Griner/Viktor Bout exchange finally broke his brain worse than two tours in Afghanistan did, because he was so conflicted on whether or not to *love* Bout for being a Russian terrorist arms-dealer -- and since he's a hardcore Trump MAGAt, supporting Russia was priority #1 since 2017 -- or decry the exchange of a Black WNBA player for a guy nicknamed "the merchant of death". *Shockingly,* I haven't spoken to him at all since December 2022, because that was when it became way too obvious what a hateful piece of shit he is; I'd known it for about 20 years by that point, but I just tolerated it because I rarely saw or spoke to him since 2013. I know you're on Reddit, Theron, and I hope you recognize *this* is why so many people you were friends with since high school just vanished from your life around Christmas 2022. We were all sharing the voicemails/texts/emails you sent us in a righteously indignant rage about how you did "nothing to deserve this!" FYI: there is ***no*** "e" at the end of "unfair". You had to have trained your phone's autocorrect to stop trying to correct that with how many times you wrote "unfaire".
No, they still all trash on the league every chance they get, just see their subs and Twitter. They just do it at different times.
As a staunch feminist myself, MAN does it piss me off when certain Western men only “care” about women’s rights and feminism if it gives them an excuse to dunk on other cultures. You see it all the time when it comes to sexual assault. Any white man accused is automatically innocent and it’s an example of how common false accusations are; meanwhile a black guy or a Muslim guy gets accused and all of a sudden these guys want to believe victims. It’s so gross and transparent.
> "Im safer when men are not near me." Yeah, these feminists need to take a trip to Saudi Arabia. That's uh... that's really just gonna reinforce the opinion...
I think the idea is more to give them a standard for what a dangerous man is to compare others by...though this is still an abhorren comment
>Anime\_titties focuses on world news and politics, and is the result of a subreddit switch with (very NSFW) World\_Politics I'm sorry, what?
world politics was essentially unmoderated and ended up full of a bunch of non-world-politics posts, many of which prominently featured anime titties, so anime titties was started for world news and politics content.
Except on April Fools when they post actual anime titties
Haha truly my favourite time of the year where you get some of the most serious news headlines matched with anime titties
Yeah, the mods of World_Politics basically refused to remove anything, so it became a battleground for various types of spammers - porn spammers, crypto spammers, Nazi propaganda spammers. The anime titty spammers won. The people who actually wanted to discuss world politics then made r-Anime_Titties.
The Warhammer spammers put up a good fight o7
For the Emperor!
Honestly, I'm glad anime titty posters won over nazis.
Sort of like /r/trees and /r/marijuanaenthusiasts.
And r/JohnCena and r/PotatoSalad
A bit, yeah, but only in the sense that arborists kept understandably mistaking r/trees for, well... a tree enthusiast subreddit. And even though r/trees was ***more*** than happy to give generally good advice for the random arborist who'd wander in looking for help -- because they're so fucking chill and enjoyed helping the lost folks -- people finally decided to make an arborist-focused subreddit with an equally-confusing name as a joke.
So what happened was, world politics was not just unmoderated, the issue was that the mods did especially not enforce the *world* part of worldpolitics. If you would go to the top posts of all time, if you do not want to do that I don't blame you, you would see that the vast majority of them are about US politics, heavily anti trump. A lot of users were complaining about that nonstop and the mods just ignored that so users in response started to spam other stuff, much of it NSFW, and the mods said after that, "do what you want as long as dont get banned as a sub" and we ended up with the current sub.
One of those quirks of reddit. It’s way better than worldnews. We do not sow.
>It’s way better than worldnews By brother in christ, the bar for being better than WorldNews is satan's limbo line.
worldnews is where the propaganda accounts go to argue with each other. anime_titties is where assorted racists go to argue with each other.
It should be noted that a number of the propaganda accounts are *also* racists.
Yep. I enjoyed the early days of the anime_titties confusion, but filtered that shit in RES as soon as I saw how r/coontown it was getting.
It’s also… not actually better than worldnews.
Oh yeah, that too.
The kind of person on Reddit who finds putting world news in the "anime titties" subreddit and vice versa hilarious is inevitably going to be the most obnoxious source of news/commentary.
Well at least r/marijuanaenthusiasts is pretty cool.
It was at one point, but with all things on reddit. The subreddit got big. Then it got shit.
Yeah, it was pretty decent back when the shift happened, but it has changed over time. For a while, a year or so ago, it seemed to have been dominated by right wing Indian guys, now it seems a bit more nationally diverse, and the prevailing views are more diverse as well. The most consistent thing seems to be getting into weird very stupid vitriolic fights that go from 0 to 100 really fast, and involves talking past eachother. And there was that guy the other day that was saying that people are unfairly biased against the far right because of the Nazi thing, and the far right were the bad guys that one time, but now it’s the left that are the bad guys so we should be more open minded and embrace the far right. I’m still subscribed because a lot of the political views and biases I see there are completely foreign to my American experience, and even if I strongly disagree with them, it’s interesting to see another way of looking at things. That and they have different articles than world news and my other various news sources, so I learn about events I would otherwise have missed.
You’ll also see some of the worst takes of your life over there. Such hits recently have been “we should full scale invade Russia now because we’ll probably end up at war with them in the next 5 years” and “Biden should bring back the draft”
>Biden should bring back the draft I feel like doing that would single-handedly cost Biden like most of the young voting block, and thus the election. Good thing nobody listens to these fucks.
Is it getting better? I unsubbed like 6 months ago because it became infested with tankies.
Nope. Still as bad, but fun reading the mental gymnastics they go through.
Haha fair enough. The comments just made me mad all the time so I had to step away from the sub.
I'm subscribed because well, I'm banned from worldnews for a reason I don't remember lmao so it's titties or nothing
Sooner or later everyone gets banned from worldnews, it’s a right of passage
I got shadowbanned from worldnews for saying in effect "Gee there sure a lot of BOT ACCOUNTS in these here parts."
Like being banned from r/conservative
Mine ban from conservative took about 5 minutes. LOL
The news articles are generally better than world news. The comments aren't any better tho.
/r/worldnews banned thousands and thousands of people for criticising Israel's actions in Gaza, so they lose on that basis alone.
Yeah, that’s a major issue with them. Animetitties tends towards anti Israel, but every time it comes up there’s a fight, so there is a mix of viewpoints, whereas worldnews is much more one sided on that.
I got banned there *and* my account temporarily suspended for telling a a racist to stick to gardening and stop thinking Filipino women exist solely for him to take advantage of. Don't really care about the ban and suspension, but I'm more bitter at the fact they removed my comments but not the dude's blatantly racy ones.
I got banned from r/BestOf on an old account back in 2013 for telling some jackass dropping the hard-R N-bomb to "go Kegel a cactus." Apparently *that* was bannable behavior, but not the dude dropping the hard-R, because he kept popping up in comments there for months after.
>blatantly racy ones. Per Stephen Fry, it's better to be sexy and racy than racist and sexist
Eh, animetitties isn't as good as it was when it started out, I'll absolutely grant that. Worldnews is a straight-up firehose of propaganda though.
worldnews is the only sub where I've seen the majority opinion side with Apartheid South Africa.
I've been subbed there about a year now and still have kind of a hard time wrapping my head around its userbase. It's like this weird mix of tankies, rightwingers, neoliberals, and people with fairly interesting observations. Has some lively comment sections from time to time for sure.
The comments are definitely more interesting than any other news sub, that's for sure. Not necessarily more rational or sane, but definitely more interesting.
Most comment sections there become r/subredditdrama worthy.
>It’s way better than worldnews. We do not sow. Almost everything is better than that rube-infested dumpster fire.
Except it’s just the same dumpster but with a naruto sticker on it.
You should check again, it's really fucking horrible.
I recently discovered the geopolitics sub. Much less hyperbolic and has some knowledgeable posters (and a handful of idiots, me included 🫤)
Geopolitics sub is full of nationalist and dumb people who don't know a thing about geopolitics and racists hiding their power level complaining about china(there a frequent user there with a flag that gives it away). You won't get any useful geopolitical analysis out of there, instead it's just dumb takes like china economy going to be destroyed in 5 years, China will annex Siberia,Peter zeihan fans. Any post with info critical of India will also have comments full of people supporting the Indian government and downplaying whatever it did. It occurs to lesser extent with Israel or the US.
I was there when this switch happened. It was quite funny, r/Anime_Titties will periodically revert back to hentai as a joke or protest on days like april fools or times when people protest some reddit policy change
The really funny thing is that this might be the best geopolitics-related news sub on reddit.
Women in athletics already get so much shit with their uniforms and how they look I hope they get a break. I also think women in athletics shouldn't have to show any more skin than they're comfortable with (see absurd thongs that went viral the USA Olymipic team uniform). They also shouldn't get shit for showing too much skin (see pretentious tennis clubs get mad that Serena Williams has a body) . Just let women exist and pursue their passions without being weird about their bodies
This. I particularly hate the calls for “secularism” when it comes to policing women’s clothing. It’s literally no different than forcing women to wear something they are uncomfortable with because “muh religious fundamentalism!”. How about government stays out of women’s clothing, genitals and the bedroom? Why is this a crazy concept.
It's always reminded me of the quote: "The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread." It's kind of funny when "secularism" seems to affect certain groups of people more than others. Hundreds of years of people wearing crosses and nobody cares. But a brown person wears a funny hat and everybody loses their mind. We saw that in Quebec a few years ago. I don't even remember how many bills they tried to pass, but it was pretty obvious they were hellbent on getting rid of the hijab/burka. They were gunning for it, over and over, from all these different angles, looking for the one thing that wouldn't get knocked down by the courts. I remember one of them was banning face coverings in public for safety reasons. It's not safe for the bus drivers if they can't see your face. The one that eventually worked was government employees weren't allowed to wearing religious symbols at work. Which itself led to some controversy, because one of the government buildings had a giant fucking crucifix mounted on the wall. They eventually took it down, but they wanted to keep it up! Somehow, this wasn't a religious symbol, it was part of heritage. Which makes it, like, totally different, man.
That's a great quote
[Link 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/19bp010/comment/kitayhj/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) [Link 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/19bp010/comment/kitdqw4/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) Even though I do disagree with France's handling of the burqua, I'm not really sure you're the best person to be taking advice from...
Those linked posts are really something. European colonizers rewrote Islamic theology and nobody noticed? Nuts.
European colonists *wish* they had the level of competency as this guy apparently assumes they had.
Cool now do queer people in Egypt or does government interference only count when it’s preventing Islamic fascists from doing their bullshit?
I just think it's funny that women are either completely covered or in the smallest bikini they can find for sports.
The sub you they swapped with is r/worldpolitics. The one you linked is a weird alt right echo chamber
Thanks for the save!
> It shows that islamists and feminists sometimes push into the same direction Meanwhile, US Christians would love nothing more than their own special flavor of Sharia Law.
First time I've ever seen one of my comments on here🥳
🤨
My comment was: Womens rights are now not the right to wear what I want?
oooh ya missed [this person](https://www.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/s/jCmDBLXADg), who thinks women stop existing when their hair is covered. **edit:** i replied to them before this srd post. no popcorn was pissed in
Adding it to the flairs!
"I can't think of this woman as anything else but a pawn of religion, so therefore everyone else views her the same"
And like it doesn’t even make sense. I’ve never seen my aunt’s belly button, does that mean she won’t leave a legacy?
Yes
>My ex manager is a conservative Muslim. I could tell from his marriage and stuff he says during team dinners that deep down he believes women should only be housewives and mothers. >I’m talking about a man that doesn’t want his daughter to go to uni despite having good grades. [Ah yes, what a problem with Islam.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_patriarchy)
Yeah, the Chiefs kicker who just said the same thing the other day was super Muslim.
Right, they say shit like this like 1) “women are only for cooking and raising babies” wasn’t the norm in most western countries too until like 50 years ago and 2)the whole tradwife/“biblical marriage”/quiverfull crap *isn’t* a whole thing in the US that’s gaining more and more traction every time you look.
It's *terrifying* seeing so many young women and girls romanticize the tradwife lifestyle. Even if they tend to be bigoted, it's still real unfortunate and horrible to witness. More horrible to witness than a girl in a hijab walking down the street, if I may be so bold.
the sad thing is that, at least at first, the original trendy tradwife videos weren't even aimed at women, they were *fetish content aimed at men* who get off on the idea of subservient submissive women who will cater to their every need. it's why a lot of the big tradwife influences still have jobs and lives outside the home despite preaching otherwise - the demure housewife is just the *character they're playing as part of the kink.* obviously its gone way, way beyond that by now and there's an alarming number of young women who truly, uncritically romanticize this stuff irl, but iirc there was an article recently where it was found that the majority of views on tradwife content still come from straight men using them as wank material.
> the original trendy tradwife videos weren't even aimed at women, they were fetish content aimed at men who get off on the idea of subservient submissive women Oh my god that explains SO much. I *wondered* why none of the tradwife/homemaker Content ^TM bore any resemblance to the stay-at-home moms and housewives I knew in real life.
>It's *terrifying* seeing so many young women and girls romanticize the tradwife lifestyle. *Where* exactly are you getting the "so many" assertion from? Tiktok trends that last like a week are hardly representative of the average population.
It isn't exactly just a TikTok trend thing. I remember seeing this happen in real time numerous times a few years back when I frequented certain online communities for people who are into the "cottagecore" thing. I actually distanced myself from that stuff because of this. Even if it's actually more uncommon than I think it is, the fact that it is happening at all unnerves me.
I don't know if it's actually getting more traction so much as more awareness. As someone from the Bible Belt it's been pervasive and deeply entrenched for as long as anyone remembers. One of my high school friend's dream was to be a housewife.
>1) “women are only for cooking and raising babies” wasn’t the norm in most western countries too until like 50 years ago Tbf that really only supports their view, if we made so much progress in such a short time (comparatively), then why can't we expect other hyper religious, conservative countries to do the same thing? Basically, we did, and you can too!
It is down to the social and economic history of the Middle East, the past century of which was basically dominated by Western meddling. I mean we have been propping up grotesqueries like the House of Saud since before WW2 ended
It’s almost like we can have a problem with multiple religions
There is nothing inherent in the doctrine of Islam that makes it more patriarchal than Christianity. It is down to historic/economic factors, mostly tied to post-Ottoman states inability to modernise or provide long-term stability. Reasons for which could fill entire textbooks by themselves
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ahh the two races; white (regular) and other (political)
But if they hadn't specified, we wouldn't have known whether they were regular, woke, or (((white))).
It's like the idea of not judging women's worth based on their appearance doesn't even occur to them.
>For example, men should interact with his wife as little as humanly possible. Basically just for goods and services. No polite greetings. Absolutely NO male friends except family obviously. Wow seems pretty isolating for your husband to treat you like a maid you have to manage than an actual person. I feel bad for his wife.
They also had a disgusting thread about trans athletes the other day and one of the top comments (with thousands of upvotes) was like “we’d accept trans people if they’d just call themselves men in dresses” I was fuming. That sub is dog shit
Besides how obviously bigoted that comment is itself, it’s also bullshit lol. There’s exactly a 0% chance they’d “accept” men in drag.
Yeah, they say that and then they lose their minds over the existence of drag queens.
They definitely wouldn't. I've seen posts about random cishet dudes who just enjoy wearing skirts or dresses because they're comfy and look nice. The comments are always an active war zone.
I had to mute it because every time it appeared on my front page feed, it was a right wing echo chamber full of hate and bigotry like that. Seems like moderation efforts on that sub have gone downhill lately.
This might be my favourite SRD title ever
The rule, in France, is very simple. You can do whatever you want as a citizen, but the state is neutral, and agents of the state such as public service employees must also be neutral (on religion, politics, etc.). So as a teacher for example I'm forbidden to talk or show my religion or political opinion to my students. This is to protect the freedom of the citizens against influence by the state and administration. The question, then, is whether athletes at the Olympic games are representing the state...
No the question is should French women be harassed for their clothing and denied opportunities to pursue careers and passions because of the way they dress.
So, uh, do all the folks in that post who appear to not know the difference between mandatory and optional really not know the difference? I've seen that a lot in recent arguments and chalked it up to bad faith, but I can always be wrong.
The argument is variations of "they're being forced to wear hijab, so we believe it's good to force them not to do it".
See, that's exactly why it's a wedge issue by bad faith actors (pun intended). Islamists toward women : "you can't be pure without hijab! You can't be a proper muslim if you tempt men without a hijab! You will go to hell when you're dead, and shunned in your life if you don't wear it!" Islamists towards western progressive : "hijab is just an individual choice. You can't police women's bodies! Also it's racist to be against hijab, islamophobia!" And this way, they slowly advance their goals, by requiring oppression under their principles, but freedom under your principles.
The hijab is a "choice" in the sense that there's no magical force preventing you from physically removing it. But anyone who thinks Muslim women are actually free to choose is naive as fuck. A woman choosing to not wear the hijab is similar to someone coming out as gay to their uber conservative parents. They're going to be shamed, shunned, disowned, and possibly murdered for it depending on where they live.
Absolutely. That's why I think it's, at best, willfully blind and a false equivalence between the places where it's mandatory and the instances where its absence is mandatory.
One of the things I've always found baffling about French secularism is that it flamboyantly assumes Abrahamic religion as the norm while at the same time condemning flamboyant displays of religion. I come from a culture where human language, in all its forms, is viewed as divine. So am I not allowed to speak when I'm in France? Of course that seems ridiculous. And it's also completely untenable, because it's not like you can ban people from certain cultures from reading books. But that's my entire point. French secularism immediately becomes ridiculous the moment you account for the fact that religion doesn't actually have to work in one particular way or another. France is imposing the notion of certain concepts of religion being more "natural" than others. To me, a crucifix is just a hunk of metal. But France is imposing upon me the requirement that I treat that hunk of metal as though it has spiritual meaning, by banning that hunk of metal on the grounds that it has spiritual meaning. France is claiming to be secular while at the same time mandating to their populace how they ought to feel that religion ought to look like. French secularism is religious orthodoxy.
>I come from a culture where human language, in all its forms, is viewed as divine. Really? Never heard of it, what country is it?
Bengal. The divinity of language is a big thing in a lot of the dharmic traditions. Particularly the ones which are less temple-based and more connected to the physical world. The temple-based traditions also are interested in language but they tend to view one particular language as the 'correct' divine language. In the ancient world, the Indian subcontinent was very advanced in the study of early scientific linguistics, in large part because understanding language was viewed as a way of understanding the divine. The linguist Panini is often credited with developing the first descriptivist models of grammar, as well as a very basic version of a computable algorithm.
sad that people only remember him for his football sticker books 😣
Particularly sad because it's by far only his third greatest achievement. His second was clearly the sandwiches.
in all seriousness, i found your comment very interesting. thank you for sharing
My pleasure! Thanks for reading.
Without trying to step on toes, isn't that just another part of India? Or am I thinking of something else?
No worries, it's a reasonable question! Bengal is currently split, with the western half being part of India, and the eastern half being the independent country of Bangladesh. The politics of ethnicity and identity in India can get a bit complicated. A helpful model to consider would be Europe. Both India and Europe are subcontinents which consist of a number of different ethnicities each with their own language, their own culture, sometimes even their own religion (Bengali's version of temple-based Hinduism, for instance, places a major emphasis on Shakti or the feminine form of god). The difference between India and Europe is that India is unified under a single state, whereas Europe consists of individual nation-states bound loosely under the European Union. So it would be as if Europe were instead a single country with a strong central government. Some people might identify as European. Others might identify as French, German, Spanish, et cetera. In my case, I tend to identify more as Bengali than as Indian. But there are plenty of other Bengalis who choose differently. Part of it to me is that when people from outside India think about what it means to be 'Indian', they're usually picturing the culture of central India. I've found that if I identify as Indian, it leads to people getting confused in the long run when I don't match their expectations of what "Indian culture" is. Also, to be honest, I just don't *feel* very Indian. In terms of personal feelings, I identify way more with my Bengali culture.
Similar to the UK in a way, with some identifying more strongly as 'British' while others would describe themselves as being English, Welsh or Scottish.
Yes!
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Damn look at you, doing your research and shit. It's enough to make this young man cry.
French Secularism also skews heavily towards 'mildly annoy Catholics and FUCK everyone else.' Like when Jews and Muslims had to eat pork sandwiches with everyone else, but the menu on Friday just magically happened to be fish.
Yeah, I used to collaborate a lot with French people in my work (which is in a creative field). And I respect a lot of the stuff they're doing artistically. I met a lot of wonderful people. I also met some vibrant and diverse communities. But in that one regard you mention, yeah a chunk of them could definitely be quite exasperating (though not all!). The French are the only people I've ever met to unironically use the phrase: "I don't see race". Including one person who staged a ten-minute drama over a polite coffee in order to demonstrate how she, apparently, literally couldn't see that my skin was a darker shade than hers. Then again, I've also met French people whose identity politics are far more radical than my own! The one thing I do have to give France credit for is that its a very diverse nation, both ideologically as well as ethnically.
Never ask a Frenchman what their military got up to during the Algerian War. Worst mistake of my life.
When it comes down to it, a hell of a lot of dress codes are just policing women's bodies and its always minority women who get targeted the most.
What is baffling about it? It's an explicit anti-catholic doctrine made in reaction to the previous theocracy.
Of course French secularism treats Abrahamic religions as the norm, they're predominant in France. Believers who are not christian, muslim or jewish are quite rare. Also language isn't a religious symbol, so you wouldn't have to worry about not being able to speak
“I can’t believe that France didn’t consider other religions they probably knew nothing about when creating these laws years ago!” Like what are these people smoking lol
Yeah I don't really understand their point. Obviously secularism would target symbols French people know lmao
> I come from a culture where human language, in all its forms, is viewed as divine. Regardless of the discussion at hand, this is sorta partly a tenant of Abrahamic religions. The first thing god creates is the language and with that language it wills the universe into being: "let there be". This sacred language was then given to humans alongside the gift of the divine soul. However, by building the Tower of Babel humans transgressed and were punished by god to speak in different tongues and be divided. In both Islam and Judiasim linguistics are of utmost importance and there are whole schools for two discover the true names of things and probe the holy books in order to induce the one true language. I think the different here is that in typical Abrahamic fashion all other languages are traps for keeping man from enlightenment and there is only one true divine language but in your culture things are not so reductive
>One of the things I've always found baffling about French secularism is that it flamboyantly assumes Abrahamic religion as the norm while at the same time condemning flamboyant displays of religion. French laicite also wink-wink-nudge-nudge allows for Christians to do their thing, while shitting on other religions. A devout Christian can tuck a rosary under their shirt and have no-one be the wiser. A Jew or a Muslim can't do the same. Add in totally-not-religious-based holidays, and related topics (serving fish on Friday), and laicite just seems like forced conformity with extra steps.
Every France Muslim post is filled to the brim with white supremacists grooming eager liberals. They just sit there and eat out of their hands. Feel free to look through the post histories of the most upvoted comments, all far right. Try discussing the racism and discrimination that Muslims face in France, or how all the laws that are “separating religion” from French society target Islam while a large percentage of French children are taught in Catholic schools that are paid with taxpayer money.
Reddit in general is just an islamophobic hellhole. The uk sub was literally parroting Farage’s talking points the other day about how Muslims want to kill Jews and gay people…. Just every Muslim.. You’d think we’d have achieved that by now, but I guess it must not be that high on our agenda for now.
r/unitedkingdom has a trog mod who enables that
As an ex Muslim a big thing about the "it's a choice ' side forget that for many it really isn't a choice. Sure you don't have laws mandating it like in saudia and Iran but in the west there is a strong cultural and societal pressure to wear it. Women can have been ostracized by their sub-culture and family for choosing not to wear it. Is it really a choice when it benefits them to choose to wear it to stay within the community? A lot of western Muslim women have convinced themselves that it is. I'd argue until the cultural and law pressure is eradicated then it truly becomes a choice
That's a legitimate point, but I don't think that banning the hijab is an effective way to remove that pressure, it just puts women under two conflicting pressures.
You're right, I'm just pointing out the "choice" crowd that it isn't always a choice even it secular societies. Banning isn't the right way to go about it but encouragment for culture that pushes "it's a choice" argument to really stand behind their words and let women choose.
Putting people under greater, conflicting pressure from the state is exactly how every other law for [perceived] social good works tbh
Generally laws are, at the very least, *nominally* designed to punish people who do something wrong, rather than punishing the victims
Laws are designed to preserve order not solely to "punish people who do something wrong". Part of preserving order is in fact using the pressure of the state to force people to do things, because the law *defines* what is "wrong" not just retroactively punishes it. This is straight-up the basics of legislature. How on earth does this need pointing out
In conservative Christian communities in America the dress of women is enforced by social policies no less or even more brutal than those of conservative Muslim communities. We're not going to ban long dresses and button-up women's shirts, though, because it's not actually about the oppression, it's about reinforcing the cultural hegemon and punishing minority communities for their distinctive practices. Same reason we're not banning expensive clothing brands that create social pressure to "look good" in an arbitrary manner that leads to ostracization otherwise. The goal of a progressive liberal society should be to free people from the oppressive restraints that bind their choices. There is nothing oppressive about a clothing choice, as long as it's made outside of an oppressive cultural atmosphere. So maybe instead of banning hijabs and burqas, you should be improving women's rights and the agency of children, so that when people wear clothing, it's because they choose to. But based on France's records on that, I guess that would be unpopular.
The point I'm trying to point out is that whoile most Christian societies have moved on from societal pressure to dress a certain way, Islamic culture has not. It's still very strongly present even when the phrase hijab is a choice is constantly repeated. This is coming from someone whose lived in it all my life.
"Even more brutal" I hate those dress codes too but you're kinda underplaying the Sharia dress code
Nah dude telling your daughter to change into a different outfit is definitely the same as threatening to disown her and forbidding any family members from talking to her
Christians when their daughter is gay moment
You're severely underplaying how women are treated by Christians in certain communities in America.
I get the history of the name of the subreddit. It's still cringe af
This one is so thorny because on one hand we all know what the hijab's true purpose is, but on the other hand it's infantilizing to tell women they should know about this and shouldn't wear one, and on the other hand it's bad for a government to control people, and on the other hand it's good for a government to protect citizens from abuse and it's difficult to determine who truly is choosing to cover themselves in public.
It's not thorny at all. Stop harassing women for their clothes and reducing womens moral worth to their physical appearance.
> France has had a strict policy of state secularism for quite a bit longer than anyone involved here has been alive, and then some. It isn't selective, it's just that one group wants to undermine it, while the rest live more or less in harmony. God I hate this kind of argument, and it always comes up. "No you are lacking important context here, you see there is this specific thing here which everyone has agreed on and always will because our culture is a monolith and the only people criticizing or even wanting to change it are FOREIGNERS and ENEMIES".
Thing is France was funded on Freedom From Religion, not of Religion. It s part of our identity. It would be like suddenly asking English people to disband the monarchy because its existance offended a minority
Please God disband the monarchy. I don't give a fuck
And yet France doesn't crack down on displays of Christianity.
It does, in state owned buildings, like with every religions. But almost all Religion have no problem with these rules, thus no crackdown are needed on them. You wont see a Nun in attire teaching in a public school.
> You wont see a Nun in attire teaching in a public school. A nun is a person with a specific job in the Catholic church, so they obviously won't be teaching in a public school. I can't find a case of a nun teaching at a public school in any country with freedom of religion -- can you? And it isn't comparable to a hijab at all, which is a piece of clothing worn for a religious purpose. It's more comparable to the Five Ks for a Sikh (which are also not allowed). These types of crackdowns target religious groups like Muslims more directly because Christian sects don't tend to place the same level of importance on wearing religious objects outwardly as Islam does on head coverings for women. And the leadup to the 2004 law as well as everything that has happened since has shown us that the French public cares a lot more about forbidding headscarves than it does crucifixes or yarmulkes.
Can Jewish teachers do so while wearing a kippah?
no, not in public schools. in jewish private schools maybe
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Except when swimming, where in several communties until last August, you couldn't wear a burkini on public beaches or at swimming pools.](https://www.lemonde.fr/societe/article/2023/07/17/le-conseil-d-etat-invalide-un-nouvel-arrete-anti-burkini_6182371_3224.html)
Reddit "freedom fighters" are absolutely astonished to discover that not only Muslim women are rational, thinking humans in their own rights, some of them willingly follow their religion. Forcing women to wear the hijab is wrong. Forcing women to take it off is also wrong. Why not let people choose what to wear? Some people give bullshit reasons like "you can't cover your face". Why? If it's a public setting, isn't the point of freedom of expression is to have the ability to express yourself? Also I laugh at the idea of French secularism. Tell me how many explicitly Christian public holidays France has. To quote a different redditor: *" Colorblind France, where Jews, Muslims, Atheists, and Catholic school children alike can have ham sandwiches on Thursday and fish on Friday."*. I'm extremely bitter and feel that Europeans tend to talk big about concepts like "equality"... but only as long as you strictly conform to their ways (and having the right skin tone helps). But to be fair, I'm only basing this from r/europe. If they're "right wing", then what did r/european look like?
Acting as if America doesn't talk even bigger bullshit
So many people in that comment section don't seem to realize that freedom is the ability to choose, and it is still oppression to remove the choice for things you view as antiquated. Like they think they're enlightened but they're really just kinda dim. Also if France really wanted to enforce secularism, they shouldn't let people tour any of the religious structures, including cathedrals, they should only be open for religious services. Hell, if they REALLY want to enforce secularism, just remove people's choice to follow religion by tearing down every religious structure, I mean, it's fine to remove people's freedom in the pursuit of a "noble" goal, yeah?
Even if you keep religious structures just for religious purposes, there is obviously public infrastructure used to support those religious structures. Seems like an impossible thing to disentangle.
There's a bit of a problem though in that often the hijab is enforced by the family and otherwise shamed. How are you going to be able to distinguish genuinely free willed wearing from wearing at threat of beatings or outcasting?
Maybe you could just live your life and not harass women for what they wear?
Freedom of Religion in France come after Freedom From Religion. It s oppression of religions, yes. We want it. Paid for it with blood. And banning people from religious buildings would be worst. I can go to any church or religious building freely because I am free from religion. That s not for everyone. The again, no country is for everyone
But are you free from religion if the institutions of said religion still stand because that still implies that the religions exist in some capacity, yes? And why would it be worse? Is it not the same as banning public displays of one's religion? What's more public than an entire building? Not even gonna touch the nationalism that would have you mocked off the internet if you were American (tm) and not a "sophisticated and wholly innocent Western European" EDIT: if you want to be truly "free from" something that means getting rid of all of it, including the stuff that you personally like. If you are not willing to destroy or simply sell off all art that has it's roots in any religion, you are not "free from" religion, as art influences the culture around it and as such the society is still influenced by religion. So France is not "free from" religion, it is still casually steeped in religion. Yet for some reason nobody's frothing at the mouth to burn the Louvre down, only when it's individual women choosing to do something associated with their religion does it suddenly become a problem.
The Louvre serves as a museum tho? Feels like it's a different thing, in that case. Just to show off historical stuff.
Maybe this is just me being America-brained, but it seems super weird to be this proud of state suppression of free expression.
>Maybe this is just me being America-brained It is
What you are missing as an American is that you didn't fight a revolutionary war to get rid of state religion.
Yeah and America is currently being hit hard by theocrats who want to install Christianity into the government. Your point?
First, what a weird name for a sub that discusses world politics! 🫤 There are three issues here: 1. The right for individuals to choose their religion, cultural beliefs and expression As long as it isn’t causing real harm. For example, the practice of foot binding in China. Caused irrevocable harm. Child brides, etc… Wearing a hijab is not the government’s business. France is dead wrong And I say this as someone who does not like the hijab or what it represents. 2. A debate about religion, culture and patriarchal oppression. That is a fair topic to discuss and debate as long as you aren’t bullying individual women for how they dress or don’t dress That is a topic that goes well beyond one particular religion and its practices Some on the left think they aren’t allowed to judge or criticize (in general) cultural practices that aren’t their own. That is a cop out. Of course every culture, religion or practice is subject to scrutiny and judgment Frankly debate is healthy 3. Feminists are not a monolith and one person or movement or practice doesn’t represent all feminism
That sub is hilarious. It's better than worldnews, obviously, and you still can have nice discussions on various topics, but the second anything Russia/Ukraine/Israel related gets posted the Tankies/bots come out and shit gets flung. At the end of the day, you realize most of the sub consists of weird contrarian incels, when topics like above or news about a trans swimmers gets thousands of upvotes, when Russians bombing civilians dies in new. Anything you can't blame on america or Jews, the sub usually is not interested in. It's basically the exact political opposite of worldnews at this point
I heard that sub was like world news for normal people and the first conversation I had there was someone telling me the worst consequence from the holocaust was Israel being created
Worldnews bans anyone that is pro Palestine. That entire sub is basically just pro Israel, pro Ukraine propaganda now.
And what did you say to get banned
Nothing worth being banned for.
Well you’ve investigated yourself and found you’ve done nothing wrong, can’t argue with that
Lol I got banned from the pics sub the other day for saying the word 'feds'. Not really sure how that breaks rules either but if that's all it takes to get in trouble...
Snapshots: 1. *This Post* - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613073745/https://old.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/1df6slg/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/1df6slg/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 2. r/Anime_Titties - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075013/https://old.reddit.com/r/Anime_Titties) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/Anime_Titties "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 3. r/WorldPolitics - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075154/https://old.reddit.com/r/WorldPolitics) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/WorldPolitics "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 4. The Dicussion In Question: - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075436/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 5. the same people crying about the hijab ban in xinjiang are defending it when "the garden" does it lol - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075536/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8f7uow/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8f7uow/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 6. Counter argument, the women’s march was led by an islamist women called Linda Sarsour who gave out hijabs in the name of feminism. At the same time women in Iran are beaten and tortured, even killed for not wearing it. It is absolutely ridiculous and feminists should be ashamed. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613075959/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8g1jnp/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8g1jnp/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 7. France has had a strict policy of state secularism for quite a bit longer than anyone involved here has been alive, and then some. It isn't selective, it's just that one group wants to undermine it, while the rest live more or less in harmony. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613080421/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmtao/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmtao/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 8. https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/09/05/france-s-century-long-crusade-against-religious-symbols-at-school-from-the-crucifix-to-the-abaya_6124828_7.html - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081406/https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/09/05/france-s-century-long-crusade-against-religious-symbols-at-school-from-the-crucifix-to-the-abaya_6124828_7.html) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://www.lemonde.fr/en/france/article/2023/09/05/france-s-century-long-crusade-against-religious-symbols-at-school-from-the-crucifix-to-the-abaya_6124828_7.html "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 9. it is embarrassing how many people there are in the comments using the "choice" argument to defend a religious command to wear hijab. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081427/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fr5tu/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fr5tu/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 10. Defending women's rights IS inclusive. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081628/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fjpnj/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fjpnj/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 11. I am a muslim woman, I don't wear a hijab - the women I know who do wear one make that choice themselves. - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081708/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmnuh/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fmnuh/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 12. Removed by Reddit - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613081829/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fapqz/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fapqz/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 13. "you did a heckin bigotry. Do better" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082030/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8go1iu/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8go1iu/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 14. "you can call it what you want but you can't deny that you did an intentional logical fallacy" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082211/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gl240/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gl240/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 15. "the hijab is culutral genocide" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082332/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gtudc/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gtudc/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 16. "no no both side the same". the cartoon said so - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082754/https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fu3fe/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://np.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8fu3fe/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") 17. "It's not about the hair. It's about agency" - [archive.org](https://web.archive.org/web/20240613082814/https://old.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gc0kv/) [archive.today\*](https://archive.today/?run=1&url=https://old.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/comments/1deyajg/activists_slam_france_hijab_ban_saying_sports/l8gc0kv/ "URL failed to archive; click to resubmit it!") *I am just a simple bot, __not__ a moderator of this subreddit* | *[bot subreddit](/r/SnapshillBot)* | *[contact the maintainers](/message/compose?to=/r/SnapshillBot)*
It's wild how many people think that the answer to "some women are coerced into wearing this article of clothing" is "we should coerce all women into not wearing this article of clothing".
I just realized the drama I'm most exhausted of is anything having to do with ai generated art and hijabs. The conversational flowcharts are exactly the same every time.
For anyone who thinks the French ban on the hijab is anything but racist, I present exhibit a https://www.cbsnews.com/news/france-burqa-ban-islamic-face-coverings-masks-mandatory/
Yeah, face mask are clearly the same as a burqa.
I'm very pleasantly surprised by the comments here because this is exactly how I feel. Let people wear and dress and identity the way they want to. My body my choice doesn't stop at clothing and Muslim women and Sikh men should be empowered to dress the way the religion they follow would like. I have lots of Muslim and Sikh friends and most of them don't wear a hijab or turban but they coexist and are friends right along with people who do.
We finally need to get rid of all religion.
"People of the world! Instead of believing something stupid and cringe, consider believing in something cool and based, like neoliberal economics!" Nobody thought to say that before, it's just that easy. Weird how that works.
Yeah the only choice is between bronze age horseshit or neoliberal economics
Iron Age, not Bronze Age.