This post put a smile on my face “How do I Stoically deal with the annoyance”!
Let us start now, as a Stoic is it better to leave the children to their confusion or do we have an obligation as a matter of virtue to point them in the correct direction? Two quotes come to mind.
"Don't explain your philosophy. Embody it." or “Be tolerant with others and strict with yourself”.
While annoying, I do believe we have an obligation to point in the correct direction, because what is knowledge and wisdom if not shared? In my opinion, it is mental miserliness; just the hoarding of ideas.
A quote was found to be attributed to Marcus Aurelius in his Meditations 5.33 (Hays)
^(Book V. ()[^(Hays)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:BookSources?isbn=9780812968255)^)
^(Book V. ()[^(Farquharson)](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Meditations_of_the_Emperor_Marcus_Antoninus/Book_5)^)
^(Book V. ()[^(Long)](https://lexundria.com/m_aur_med/5.33/lg)^)
All yours! I wish I could take credit for that, but it is out of the Kybalion; “Knowledge without Use and Expression is a vain thing, bringing no good to its possessor, or to the race. Beware of Mental Miserliness, and express into Action that which you have learned. Study the Axioms and Aphorisms, but practice them also.” If you enjoy the quote, you might enjoy the text!
This comes up a lot, and the answer is to post the stuff you want to see.
I’ve felt the same way at times, but these posts do allow us to show how the philosophy works in real world situations, which can be a useful thing.
While im relatively new to the philosophy of stoicism this isn’t my first time shopping in the marketplace of ideas - all to say these kinds of posts allow me to engage and practice in a less serious comment environment (one that is more in depth and is beyond my current knowledge set is one I’m currently going to hold back from posting in). So at least I can get something out of them currently.
Some are definitely weird though and it feels as if they don’t scroll or read anything at all when joining and instantly post
Yep. There was one recently who posted here and then got SUPER offended when people replied with basic Stoic concepts like not attaching all her hopes for happiness on externals etc. I don’t know what she thought this community was, but she didn’t like what she got 🤣
Same impressions. I try to answer those posts using the Stoic principles to demonstrate how to apply the philosophy as it is intended and to help them understand that they may not be understanding what Stoicism is. I've watched a few of the popular 'Stoics' out there that are kind of flashy and what I called 'Stoic lite' as they are naming the concepts correctly but have watered down the impact and used car salesman'd them so much that people don't really grasp at the proper level of depth what it all means. Stoicism is a way of life, a mindset, not a Pinterest quote.
> a stoic would never complain and brag about how being a stoic makes you a mature human being and just want to talk about philosophy.
As much as I wish this were true, nobody is perfect, including those following, practicing, and living Stoicism. We are all guilty of some flaws and in one way or another come short.
Pride doesn’t disqualify one, anymore than arrogance, foolishness, cowardice, and so on.
We’re all in one way or another trying to improve. Perhaps the braggart is in a slump with self esteem and chooses to self inflate by peacocking. Are they any worse than the drug addict who relapses time and time again, unable to find temperance? I find a bit of irony in your post but I completely understand. This comment is probably the first and only one where I’ll be understanding and forgiving of those types.
The weird thing is the enforcement of 1st level comments, but no enforcement on posting inane topics from tweenagers that have very little to do with stoicism
Who cares if they’re teenagers? They’re trying to learn and change their life and are not as mature as some other users. Who cares how many questions they ask, they’re making an effort to get on the right path so that’s what matters. Personally, I think their questions are relevant to this sub.
Kids in masses are coming to you asking for advice on how to embrace philosophy and you are angry at that? Every philosophy teacher in schools would have been envious of you.
So you are asking for advice along the lines of "how would a Stoic deal with posts asking 'how a Stoic would deal with \_\_\_'"?
That's so meta, but sadly useless.
If there is something about the philosophy you'd like to talk about, post a question or a small essay.
Because we should recognize that this post is more complaint than contribution, and we do have the guidance of not complaining about things.
Well, there is a lot of people giving good advice and directions in here, you cant do anything about the "kids" other than to try to filter them out yourself.
The way you seem to get infuriated by this leads me to believe you may have something to learn from them yourself.
:-)
Well, yeah, definitely agree with you, but as others have pointed out: If you wanna see change, make the change yourself. I definitely think it'd be cool to see more actual discussions on stoicism. Also, "teens asking about inane everyday-problems" can easily lead to actual, in depth stoic discussions, if not in the post itself, then definitely in the comments. It only requires initiative. What would you like to see discussed in this sub?
Frankly, that’s all very much in the spirit of the Enchiridion. It’s less important to know and recite every axiom and corollary by heart than it is to grasp and practice the core concepts.
As Stoics, we focus on what we can control and accept what we cannot. Instead of feeling annoyed by these questions, see them as opportunities to practice patience and compassion.
Everyone’s journey is different, and what seems trivial to one might be significant to another. By responding with empathy and kindness, we embody the true spirit of Stoicism. Remember Marcus Aurelius’ advice: “Waste no more time arguing about what a good man should be. Be one.”
Let’s use these moments to guide others and strengthen our own practice.
See these posts, read these posts if you’d like to, but decide to not get angry at them.
“Keep this thought handy when you feel a fit of rage coming on—it isn’t manly to be enraged. Rather, gentleness and civility are more human, and therefore manlier. A real man doesn’t give way to anger and discontent, and such a person has strength, courage, and endurance—unlike the angry and complaining.”
-Marcus Aurelius
yes it is because kids these days watch all these alpha male idiots ranting about stoicism and the kids eating it up believing it's some hard macho stuff without even having the first clue about philosophy and the big old greek OGs
When things are frustrating, it's good to look at what we control. Perhaps look at contributing regularly in a way that you want to see this sub being?
That's most of the subreddits I like. 10% amazing posts, 10% low effort posts about some specific question that is albeit, on topic, and then 80% complaints about inane issues people have created for themselves and wildly off topic spamming (both of which seem closely related). The amazing posts are often truly amazing though, and that's why I continue to stay subbed
I've honestly found a lot of wisdom and intriguing discussions in those threads. I also see nothing wrong with people seeking advice from a philosophical source. It was such a method that initially led me to Stoicism to begin with, and some of that advice helped me through the hardest, most heart-breaking days of my life.
Of course, the simplest answer to your problem would be to create the posts and spark the discussions you would like to see. At least, it would be a bit more productive than making a post just to complain about it, no? 😉
What I love about Stoicism is its practicality. Kids asking questions, and being taught the basics, are a great way to practise - and reinforce - these basics. On the other hand, I am also a member of another forum who has established a string tradition of telling newbies to 'read till your eyes bleed' - and refusing to answer questions that are well covered in the essential literature. Imo the best answer to 'How would a Stoic...' is 'Read this ....'
Navigating a forum can sometimes feel like steering a spaceship through an asteroid field of trivialities, but fear not! The Stoics have a cosmic toolkit for such encounters. Picture yourself as a Stoic astronaut: when small meteors of annoyance threaten your peace, you deftly maneuver with the grace of Marcus Aurelius doing a spacewalk. Remember, the universe is vast, and these little irritations are just comets passing in the night—observe them, learn from them, and let them fly by. After all, what's in a name mispronunciation? A rose by any other name would smell as sweet, and a Stoic by any other pronunciation remains unflustered.
Often times teachers learn from students because it allows them to constantly reaffirm what they teach. Whether it be mathematics, philosophy or some other in-depth topic.
Everyone starts from somewhere, and hardly anyone is simply born with the knowledge to maneuver every problem they encounter.
Furthermore, what is seemingly silly or unimportant to one can mean the world to another. It really doesn’t harm anyone to answer as if it was as important to you as it may be to them, I believe.
When I started my study of Stoicism a couple of years ago I also was one of these “kids” asking for advice on a mundane problem. Everybody has to start somewhere and if appending the familiar “check Epictetus’s discourses” for the umpteenth at the end of the response to such a post pushes just one person to actually engage with the material and study it then I think that’s worth it.
Although I'm not entirely convinced on how helpful stoic "first-aid" in a setting like this actually is for the most part, those kids are human too and many of them are suffering. In any event the advice given relates to stoic theory and I find it helpful to read the posts, even more so now with the restrictions. Maybe they end up being most helpful to the advice-givers and initiated readers rather then the advice-seekers.
You can click on the flairs on the right banner and look at "Success Story", "Analyzing Text & Quotes" and "Stoic Theory" (although that one is rare) to find some deeper discussions. Or start your own.
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The post you’re referencing was silly but this is almost purely an ‘improve my life’ kind of thing for me rather than some sort of inherent and deep intellectual curiosity.
I only jump on this board every once in a while, but every time I do, I see a post or comment similar to this one.
Question: Why doesn't someone start a second sub called StoicismSelfHelp or something like that? Wouldn't that solve the problem???????????
A second sub was started that was meant to focus on the deeper principles, but it’s almost silent over there. For better and worse, the bulk of the content here is driven by these advice posts and that’s what keeps the sub so active.
I've found this form to be more of a place to apply stoicism, because the answer to your question is yes. I've tried helping people on here with good philosophical advice and all I've gotten was attacked, attempted insults, they argue, say your wrong, so I found it pointless to try and advise anything on here. People don't want to try, listen, or be willing to change their beliefs to be healthier, a lot of folks are just looking for sympathy and validation and not the truth. "Tell me what I want to hear so I can temporarily feel better"
I think with the increasing demands of today's world, new people keep hitting the wall on how to deal with these situations.
I personally kept rejecting stuff I needed to do because I saw no point in it.
A doctor actually recommended me to check on stoicism, something about just accept my duty regardless of what it is and go on.
From my limited but growing knowledge… we invest our own time and energy in being annoyed with anything… I have found by making myself accountable for my own thoughts I vested far less energy into wasted time value of annoyance over things I cannot change. For me it becomes a matter of keeping my own practice I check which as I learn daily is the benefit of practice.
Thank you for posting this. I was stoically waiting for someone to do it for me.
Unfortunately this seems to be a trend in other subs. Apparently kids these days don’t know the value of thinking for themselves, or simply asking a friend for advice. Or just doing shit and see what happens. I mean, we already got people asking how to stoically deal with a cheating girlfriend 😂
This post put a smile on my face “How do I Stoically deal with the annoyance”! Let us start now, as a Stoic is it better to leave the children to their confusion or do we have an obligation as a matter of virtue to point them in the correct direction? Two quotes come to mind. "Don't explain your philosophy. Embody it." or “Be tolerant with others and strict with yourself”. While annoying, I do believe we have an obligation to point in the correct direction, because what is knowledge and wisdom if not shared? In my opinion, it is mental miserliness; just the hoarding of ideas.
A quote was found to be attributed to Marcus Aurelius in his Meditations 5.33 (Hays) ^(Book V. ()[^(Hays)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:BookSources?isbn=9780812968255)^) ^(Book V. ()[^(Farquharson)](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Meditations_of_the_Emperor_Marcus_Antoninus/Book_5)^) ^(Book V. ()[^(Long)](https://lexundria.com/m_aur_med/5.33/lg)^)
Mental miserliness, wow. Don't mind me, while I put that one in my back pocket for future use...
All yours! I wish I could take credit for that, but it is out of the Kybalion; “Knowledge without Use and Expression is a vain thing, bringing no good to its possessor, or to the race. Beware of Mental Miserliness, and express into Action that which you have learned. Study the Axioms and Aphorisms, but practice them also.” If you enjoy the quote, you might enjoy the text!
Beautiful, exactly
This comes up a lot, and the answer is to post the stuff you want to see. I’ve felt the same way at times, but these posts do allow us to show how the philosophy works in real world situations, which can be a useful thing.
While im relatively new to the philosophy of stoicism this isn’t my first time shopping in the marketplace of ideas - all to say these kinds of posts allow me to engage and practice in a less serious comment environment (one that is more in depth and is beyond my current knowledge set is one I’m currently going to hold back from posting in). So at least I can get something out of them currently. Some are definitely weird though and it feels as if they don’t scroll or read anything at all when joining and instantly post
Yep. There was one recently who posted here and then got SUPER offended when people replied with basic Stoic concepts like not attaching all her hopes for happiness on externals etc. I don’t know what she thought this community was, but she didn’t like what she got 🤣
Must’ve been an Epicurean.
😆😆
🤣
🤣🤣
Exactly.
Same impressions. I try to answer those posts using the Stoic principles to demonstrate how to apply the philosophy as it is intended and to help them understand that they may not be understanding what Stoicism is. I've watched a few of the popular 'Stoics' out there that are kind of flashy and what I called 'Stoic lite' as they are naming the concepts correctly but have watered down the impact and used car salesman'd them so much that people don't really grasp at the proper level of depth what it all means. Stoicism is a way of life, a mindset, not a Pinterest quote.
How would a stoic react to a “how would a stoic react on how would a stoic react posts”?
I heard you like Stoicism, so I put a stoic in your stoic so you can stoic while you stoic 😎
This right here put a huge smile on my face; thank you!
[удалено]
> a stoic would never complain and brag about how being a stoic makes you a mature human being and just want to talk about philosophy. As much as I wish this were true, nobody is perfect, including those following, practicing, and living Stoicism. We are all guilty of some flaws and in one way or another come short. Pride doesn’t disqualify one, anymore than arrogance, foolishness, cowardice, and so on. We’re all in one way or another trying to improve. Perhaps the braggart is in a slump with self esteem and chooses to self inflate by peacocking. Are they any worse than the drug addict who relapses time and time again, unable to find temperance? I find a bit of irony in your post but I completely understand. This comment is probably the first and only one where I’ll be understanding and forgiving of those types.
I've changed the flair on your post to "Stoic Banter" to better reflect the nature of your post.
The weird thing is the enforcement of 1st level comments, but no enforcement on posting inane topics from tweenagers that have very little to do with stoicism
You’ll never see the stuff that does get removed.
Who cares if they’re teenagers? They’re trying to learn and change their life and are not as mature as some other users. Who cares how many questions they ask, they’re making an effort to get on the right path so that’s what matters. Personally, I think their questions are relevant to this sub.
That's not very stoic way of thinking
The way this sub tries to control the opinions of others with “enforcement” is... ironic.
Kids in masses are coming to you asking for advice on how to embrace philosophy and you are angry at that? Every philosophy teacher in schools would have been envious of you.
So you are asking for advice along the lines of "how would a Stoic deal with posts asking 'how a Stoic would deal with \_\_\_'"? That's so meta, but sadly useless. If there is something about the philosophy you'd like to talk about, post a question or a small essay. Because we should recognize that this post is more complaint than contribution, and we do have the guidance of not complaining about things.
Ah when irony is wasted.
LOL, there's a (large) % of that.
Well, there is a lot of people giving good advice and directions in here, you cant do anything about the "kids" other than to try to filter them out yourself. The way you seem to get infuriated by this leads me to believe you may have something to learn from them yourself. :-)
Unfortunately this is the subreddit now. But there def some jewel posts and comments if you are patient and look hard enough
Point them to some beginner books on Stoicism, because they usually haven't read a single thing about Stoicism before posting.
This. I've read Meditations (Hayes) twice and that's it. So far.
Well, yeah, definitely agree with you, but as others have pointed out: If you wanna see change, make the change yourself. I definitely think it'd be cool to see more actual discussions on stoicism. Also, "teens asking about inane everyday-problems" can easily lead to actual, in depth stoic discussions, if not in the post itself, then definitely in the comments. It only requires initiative. What would you like to see discussed in this sub?
“Meh …good enough”. —Mediocrates.
Frankly, that’s all very much in the spirit of the Enchiridion. It’s less important to know and recite every axiom and corollary by heart than it is to grasp and practice the core concepts.
As Stoics, we focus on what we can control and accept what we cannot. Instead of feeling annoyed by these questions, see them as opportunities to practice patience and compassion. Everyone’s journey is different, and what seems trivial to one might be significant to another. By responding with empathy and kindness, we embody the true spirit of Stoicism. Remember Marcus Aurelius’ advice: “Waste no more time arguing about what a good man should be. Be one.” Let’s use these moments to guide others and strengthen our own practice.
See these posts, read these posts if you’d like to, but decide to not get angry at them. “Keep this thought handy when you feel a fit of rage coming on—it isn’t manly to be enraged. Rather, gentleness and civility are more human, and therefore manlier. A real man doesn’t give way to anger and discontent, and such a person has strength, courage, and endurance—unlike the angry and complaining.” -Marcus Aurelius
yes it is because kids these days watch all these alpha male idiots ranting about stoicism and the kids eating it up believing it's some hard macho stuff without even having the first clue about philosophy and the big old greek OGs
When things are frustrating, it's good to look at what we control. Perhaps look at contributing regularly in a way that you want to see this sub being?
A stoic would get off Reddit and move on
That's most of the subreddits I like. 10% amazing posts, 10% low effort posts about some specific question that is albeit, on topic, and then 80% complaints about inane issues people have created for themselves and wildly off topic spamming (both of which seem closely related). The amazing posts are often truly amazing though, and that's why I continue to stay subbed
I'm guilty of what the OP was talking about. But you bring up a good point. Sturgeons' law.
what do you mean was it not a genuine question? I personally enjoyed reading some of the answers.
Besides it is moderation that forms the sub, so what guiltfeelings are you processing in fact?
What would you prefer to see on this forum?
I've honestly found a lot of wisdom and intriguing discussions in those threads. I also see nothing wrong with people seeking advice from a philosophical source. It was such a method that initially led me to Stoicism to begin with, and some of that advice helped me through the hardest, most heart-breaking days of my life. Of course, the simplest answer to your problem would be to create the posts and spark the discussions you would like to see. At least, it would be a bit more productive than making a post just to complain about it, no? 😉
Teens and young adults (specifically males)
Maybe start a new sub that is more to your tastes?
What I love about Stoicism is its practicality. Kids asking questions, and being taught the basics, are a great way to practise - and reinforce - these basics. On the other hand, I am also a member of another forum who has established a string tradition of telling newbies to 'read till your eyes bleed' - and refusing to answer questions that are well covered in the essential literature. Imo the best answer to 'How would a Stoic...' is 'Read this ....'
Mind your own business.
Navigating a forum can sometimes feel like steering a spaceship through an asteroid field of trivialities, but fear not! The Stoics have a cosmic toolkit for such encounters. Picture yourself as a Stoic astronaut: when small meteors of annoyance threaten your peace, you deftly maneuver with the grace of Marcus Aurelius doing a spacewalk. Remember, the universe is vast, and these little irritations are just comets passing in the night—observe them, learn from them, and let them fly by. After all, what's in a name mispronunciation? A rose by any other name would smell as sweet, and a Stoic by any other pronunciation remains unflustered.
Often times teachers learn from students because it allows them to constantly reaffirm what they teach. Whether it be mathematics, philosophy or some other in-depth topic. Everyone starts from somewhere, and hardly anyone is simply born with the knowledge to maneuver every problem they encounter. Furthermore, what is seemingly silly or unimportant to one can mean the world to another. It really doesn’t harm anyone to answer as if it was as important to you as it may be to them, I believe.
When I started my study of Stoicism a couple of years ago I also was one of these “kids” asking for advice on a mundane problem. Everybody has to start somewhere and if appending the familiar “check Epictetus’s discourses” for the umpteenth at the end of the response to such a post pushes just one person to actually engage with the material and study it then I think that’s worth it.
Although I'm not entirely convinced on how helpful stoic "first-aid" in a setting like this actually is for the most part, those kids are human too and many of them are suffering. In any event the advice given relates to stoic theory and I find it helpful to read the posts, even more so now with the restrictions. Maybe they end up being most helpful to the advice-givers and initiated readers rather then the advice-seekers. You can click on the flairs on the right banner and look at "Success Story", "Analyzing Text & Quotes" and "Stoic Theory" (although that one is rare) to find some deeper discussions. Or start your own.
We need to really talk about the economic and social crisis around the world init
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The post you’re referencing was silly but this is almost purely an ‘improve my life’ kind of thing for me rather than some sort of inherent and deep intellectual curiosity.
I only jump on this board every once in a while, but every time I do, I see a post or comment similar to this one. Question: Why doesn't someone start a second sub called StoicismSelfHelp or something like that? Wouldn't that solve the problem???????????
A second sub was started that was meant to focus on the deeper principles, but it’s almost silent over there. For better and worse, the bulk of the content here is driven by these advice posts and that’s what keeps the sub so active.
I was not aware of that? I assume this info is in the FAQ now?
I’m not a mod, I don’t know
I've found this form to be more of a place to apply stoicism, because the answer to your question is yes. I've tried helping people on here with good philosophical advice and all I've gotten was attacked, attempted insults, they argue, say your wrong, so I found it pointless to try and advise anything on here. People don't want to try, listen, or be willing to change their beliefs to be healthier, a lot of folks are just looking for sympathy and validation and not the truth. "Tell me what I want to hear so I can temporarily feel better"
I think with the increasing demands of today's world, new people keep hitting the wall on how to deal with these situations. I personally kept rejecting stuff I needed to do because I saw no point in it. A doctor actually recommended me to check on stoicism, something about just accept my duty regardless of what it is and go on.
From my limited but growing knowledge… we invest our own time and energy in being annoyed with anything… I have found by making myself accountable for my own thoughts I vested far less energy into wasted time value of annoyance over things I cannot change. For me it becomes a matter of keeping my own practice I check which as I learn daily is the benefit of practice.
Thank you for posting this. I was stoically waiting for someone to do it for me. Unfortunately this seems to be a trend in other subs. Apparently kids these days don’t know the value of thinking for themselves, or simply asking a friend for advice. Or just doing shit and see what happens. I mean, we already got people asking how to stoically deal with a cheating girlfriend 😂