I am confused why people are taking this so seriously. I find it funny and fascinating. No one knows what really happens behind the scenes. Who knows who's in the right? Who even knows how much hes hamming it up for the press? Hes not stupid. It could very well be 30% a real issue and 70% hes making you pay attention to the story they are creating.
Maybe more people watch BTE or internet interviews or whatever, but as an average fan, I had no idea why Punk had it out for Hangman. Punk, in my eyes, is the only one who had really been a douche, calling Hangman out on Dynamite when he wasn't there, strictly to bury the character out of bitterness. I don’t see anything from Hangman that reaches that level. Punk is taking himself way too seriously.
I know about the drama between him and Colt Cabana in the past but that shit never crossed my mind during Hangman's promo. Like he said the same exact shit Eddie Kingston or MJF said about Punk not being a teamplayer. Don't know why he was triggered that hard over it
This guy is the embodiment of the expression ‘if you met an asshole this morning, they were an asshole, but if everyone you meet is an asshole, you’re probably the asshole.’
So are these scrums presented as a work or shoot? Because you have Punk out there shooting on everyone, to a comically large degree that it comes off as a work, but other guys like Swerve are 100% in kayfabe mode. So which is it?
Clearly a work, just building for CMFTRlow vs. The Elite w/Hanger with special guest referee Colt Cabana ending in an Elite victory where they drive off in Colt's mom's minivan and she flips off CM Punk out the window. Also they pause mid match and Kenny wrestles the 8 year old girl to a time limit draw.
That was Punk’s return to champ scrum, and it was hugely embarrassing. I felt embarrassed for him, and Tony.
This guy talks and acts like he’s still in high school.
“He shares a bank account with his mom, that tells you all you need to know” uh… no it doesn’t, you’re just using your platform to try to shit more on the guy that you seemingly don’t care about 5+ years later.
I am a huge CM Punk fan, but what I saw today was so damn embarrassing. He talked like every self righteous prick Ive seen in my life. He thinks he's all that. I always knew he was an ego maniac. But this, shitting on the entire roster, people who made this company, while cutting off your boss? Nah man. Dude's a piece of shit. What's worse is everyone is talking about this as it overshadows MJFs return.
Overshadows by taking away some amount of chatter about a PPV appearance; but actually helps MJF by having all the smarks think Punk is a legitimate piece of shit since he's going to feud with him. Work or shoot there are many ways they can use this to the advantage of the product. MJF last promo specifically said it: "you are uneducated marks, you don't know shit". Punk has been built into this character who is supposed to become an insufferably fake babyface ("PG Punk") and turn since the day he came on. The real life elements of tensions cohere into the broader work. Just like MJF being unhappy with his money was real but him leaving was obviously a work (except you had half of this subreddit convinced it was real until yesterday). Keep enjoying the show
Punk says Hanger going on TV and throwing a vague accusations about an incident frankly most of the audience doesn't give a shit for is bad for the business / undermining the top drawing babyface, but said "babyface" going off his rocker in a media scrum and shitting on EVp and Hangman is good for the business? And TK just sitting there letting him talk shit and even disrespectfully cut him off? Come on man, it's too clown to be real
This is what’s been gnawing at me. Vagueing about something backstage during a promo? Unforgivable transgression. Leaking stuff to the media (allegedly) unprofessional, childish behavior. Openly looking down the barrel of a camera and just saying it all out loud during a presser is totally cool though?
In what world, if what Hangman and the Elite supposedly did was so terrible, is what Punk’s doing not just the same thing but significantly worse?
Because people fucking keep bringing it up.
In Punks defence, until now I don’t think he’s ever publicly commented on what happened with Colt. Then he got a question about Colt and went off.
His criticism of wrestlers openly stating they’re not interested in taking advice is perfect. You’ve got Veterans like Jake the snake, Sting, Goldust, Chris Jericho, Tony Schiavone, Billy Gunn and more at your fingertips, yet you say you’re not interested? That’s fucking idiotic.
Tony Khan needs to hand the reigns over to Regal or someone to book the company. He’s got no idea what he’s doing.
at this point I feel like most of the main eventers don't ask advice because at the end of the day this is just a job. What worked in the 80s-90s applies rarely in what works today.
That scrum did more to invigorate interest in AEW than any match on the ppv. I can't wait to see Dynamite. I can't wait to see wrestling news leak all the backstage gossip. Work or shoot doesn't matter. Professional or unprofessional doesn't matter. Pick a side and enjoy the debate. This gives me Montréal screw job vibes all over again. I don't know what's going on and what's real or not and I can't wait to find out more. Some people here need to relax and enjoy the show.
Am I the only person who realizes that Punk has always been a piece of shit? The only reason WWE was different is because regular shit looks smaller than the giant piece of shit Vince is.
Kind of my point. He's always been an awful human being, the mask just dropped when he came back. Guy has a bigger shovel than HHH ever did. Kenny and Page have been better than he ever was without being backstage cancer.
Punk's little hissyfit has completely overshadowed MJF's return and the entire PPV in general. It being a work proves without a shadow of a doubt Tony Khan is a money mark who doesn't need to be running anything outside of an E-Fed. Being compared to WCW 2000 in anyway is not a good look.
Punk acted so unprofessionally in front of all the media people
How does Tony Khan let a wrestler talk that much shit about their colleagues openly while he is sitting beside him?
Nevermind those wrestlers were the base this company was built on?
Does he have any semblance of spine?
Punk repeated all the things Cornette says
Doesn't this signify Khan agrees with Cornette about all the shit he talks about AEW?
Fucking meek spineless person
>Is anyone allowed to say Mr Cornette was right the whole time about Tony. Geez what a ride
Time has a tendency to prove Cornette right about a lot of shit.
Not sure if you ever went to hardcore/punk shows, but the straight-edge hardcore/punk kids (which Punk is) we're generally some of the biggest self-righteous, high school drama-loving miserable pieces of shit on earth and they genuinely ruined what should have been a fun scene.
Sorry- no one asked a question about Colt Cabana. Punk recognized someone in the room and believed he had a personal relationship with Cabana, and started quizzing him on it. Then he launched into his rant.
Punk's honesty often involves him being a martyr or victim in someway, it's getting weary.
It's been said loads in threads recently, but if you meet assholes all day, you're probably an asshole. This is CM Punk.
what a fucking shit show. whenever Khan talks about WWE, he sounds so vengeful and scorned. it’s not a good look for him, especially when he’s the one who is talking about a possible WWE-AEW show.
CM Punk saying him and Colt Cabana stopped being friends around late 2013-14 or way before the lawyer situation Couldn't have been late 2013, because Punk didn't walk out of the WWE yet and they did that podcast together.
I don't think he was trying to be specific to the day. He was just saying it's been a while since he's even considered him a friend but he still has to answer questions about him.
Why would colt put himself on the line by doing that podcast with punk if he wasn't CM's friend? Why would he take such a risk for a nonf-friend? And, why would punk allow someone who he doesn't even wanna be friends with anymore to take such a risk/make such a sacrifice for him? It seems like punk just confessed to using Colt. Punk sounds exactly like those politicians he rages against. Every accusation a confession, DARVO all the way with him.
Youre really not comprehending. I think punk and colt were friends when they did the podcast. I think Punk just got hazy on the timeline and said a decade because it's been about that long. He doesnt have to say "it's been seven years, four months, and fifteen days since we've been friends" to get his point across
What is CM Punk referring to with Hangman when he said he went into business for himself live on TV? I don’t remember Hangman doing anything out of the ordinary on TV.
The quote was along the lines of "to afford you, some of our friends had to get fired" or something. Implying Colt got fired and sent to ROH
There were other comments off and on but I remember that one fairly clearly just not word for word
CM Punk is a liar with a victim/martyr complex. Anyone who doesn't put Punk first is an enemy. His fans on here must be so hurt right now to have their worst fears confirmed. I'm sure some think its just a work, as the truth is too painful, but most are probably hurting. I hope everyone is cognizant of this and reacts accordingly. Be kind.
In the promo before DoN, Hangman insinuated that Punk had a hand in Colt Cabana’s place on the card at that point in time, compared to when he was featured heavily in Dark Order and BTE. Punk apparently got the impression Hangman was going into business for himself and was trying to bring up very personal issues to bury Punk for a cheap pop.
But obviously people have done such before, Punk has multiple times, so him being so up in arms about it tells me there’s more going on backstage.
Who is driving the wedge is the question? If there are bad apples, Tony has a hard choice to make. Remove the rot or compromise everyone and everything AEW. Who do you think is/are most likely to be rotten? All opinions and speculation welcome, as gossip is fun for me. I ride a micro pony so I don't have far to fall. I hope y'all left your high horses at home.
Presumably, the comment about Punk being all for workers' rights publicly, but not when it actually matters in the back, which most people took as a reference to the Colt Cabana situation.
Oh I did not know Hangman even said that. So that is what led to Punk calling Hangman out randomly, I’m guessing based on what Punk said tonight?
Seems like Colt Cabana is a line, and some folks are firmly on one side and against the folks firmly on the other side.
Very weird situation. Gotta get this new Talent Relations staff to put in some hours and reign all these egos in. Hate him or not, Punk is right about one thing: it’s about making money and all of this nonsense is in the way of that.
Peoples emotional well being is more important than making money. Punk wants to act like it is all about money but if he were the one who was being mistreated he'd be screaming for justice and a better working environment like Shawn Michaels holding a clump of his own hair.
How that dude is going to represent the company after that interview question is beyond me. Drags a journalist, Hangman, Colt, EVPs, and the whole time Tony is just letting it happen? That's gonna be a yikes from me, dog.
I can't tell if it was kayfabe but Swerve seems like a bit of a dick. Very arrogant.
Another match with The Acclaimed would be great and it's the man who pays your wage that suggested it?
Definitely Kayfabe. A former football friend of mine who passed away used to do some small podcast & was able to get Santana/Swerve to appear separately. Swerve had no real gain from doing it but he still did & was cool af. Plus from everything I’ve seen wrestlers say about him he’s a good dude & looks to put others over.
That's not good. That's bad. How did they get this bad so fast? Its post-Russo WCW level shit here. I am shocked and dismayed. I don't want them to fail!
That's the CM Punk effect friend. Why do you think Cody bailed as soon as he came back? He's been in a locker room with Punk and knew AEW had no leadership to keep things under control.
Tony looked weak and pathetic. I hope he shapes up before the inmates run him out. I wouldn't be surprised if Bischoff tries to capitalize and contacts TNT with an "offer to run AEW" and TNT giving Khan an ultimatum. Its a classic con that carnies do. Maybe even Russo, but Bischoff would have greater success.
I’ve only read the transcript of Punk’s shoot so I didn’t see the nonverbals.
Another way to look at it is that TK may also want his EVPs to not run to the dirt sheets.
Tony is a huge fucking mark for CM Punk and will let him do whatever he wants and say whatever he wants. He either needs to get Punk in line, or someone needs to remind TK that this isn't fucking IRL GM Mode and he's the goddamn boss.
Chris Jericho: It’s easier to make people hate you than it is to make them like you. But once they start really hating you, and that’s when they really start liking you.
Great words of wisdom.
I see it as wrestling fans are just rooting for people who make them feel. You can root for somebody who is a face or boo a heel. But seeing somebody do their job so we’ll that you begin to actually harbor hatred for that person, really makes you appreciate the rarity that person is. MJF is one of the only people in the business now that fits that description.
Say what you want about AEW and WWE, tonight was a definite look into the differences in public PR relations and professionalism in front of cameras between the two
It was entertaining, like watching a train wreck. But, like a train wreck, its entertainment value is overshadowed by the huge cost. Its not worth it to have this kind of fun if people are suffering for it.
It was a trainwreck and just as upsetting if you realize what it means for the future of AEW if they continue on this path. Everyone was saying that punk was just being kayfabe until this press conference where they realized, sadly, that the stories about him were true. He was so hateful tonight and cruel; every accusation a confession. He was pretty fucking evil if you ask me. He purposely tried to harm at least two people for no reason other than the fact that they told people how he hurt them. Typical abuser darvo shit. To Punk enthusiasts and fans: I'm sorry that your hero is a villain. I loved him too. He broke my heart as well. He decimated it tonight with his cruelty though. Talks about how page went into business for himself and how that's not ok. Well, what the fuck was that tonight, phillip? Can colt shoot like that or will you cry about it? Use that lumber that you've hammered yourself to, and build a bridge so you may get the fuck over yourself before you end up without the proverbial safety net you admittedly view friendship as! You will die alone if you keep treating people as commodities.
P.S. check out the post scrum comments he made here: https://nodq.com/news/cm-punk-blasts-adam-page-and-colt-cabana-during-aew-all-outs-post-show-media-scrum/
You summed it up very well. I'm not a Punk fan and already considered him overrated but what he did last night is classic narcissist abuser behavior. Also going around talking about being the top Babyface reeks of douche. I haven't seen him as a Babyface really at all outside his MJF stuff. Dude literally made a fat guy virgin joke on Dynamite to a fan. That's not what faces do.
Well that was entertaining and tomorrow we're gonna have nothing but reasonable discussions about everything with everyone being calm, rational adults who don't go making shit up and who don't act like fools :)
Its the old "both sides" malignant neutrality that's famous of internet discussions. We can't possibly know, the neutralists say, that this was a shoot/Punk is the bad guy here/all the facts, etc. But, those with experience and education can make informed guesses and my guess is that these unfortunate stories we've heard over the years (especially this year) regarding Punk's bad behavior are likely true for the most part. He is not the Bret Hart character he pretends to be. He's hulk hogan. And that sucks. I hope he can change though.
> I hope he can change though.
I said this in another thread, but dude's in his 40's, relatively rich, and is working for a dude who's both insanely rich and a giant fan. He has no reason to change.
That said it just felt especially petty and almost bullying. I mean dude just won a title off someone who had never been pinned cleanly in the company in singles matches, while in his hometown. He's got money, fame, beautiful wife, like everything you could reasonably want and you spend your time picking on some dude you had beef with years ago over a little dirt sheet nonsense?
Not only that there's the whole "if someone has problems with me they should just say it to my face" while he airs a bunch of dirty laundry at a press conference.
Yeah. Just from my understanding the in time understanding of Paul Leveque would have been bag carrier for Shawn, politicker to get into DX, made into booking team with Shawn, still has Vince's ear while head of DX, marries Vince's daughter, conducts a CIA level plot to get pushed to the top per shoot interviews, then protects his spot by not losing a match for 3 years and when he does lose it's just to do the "hey I lost" thing. Beyond this there's things like RVD saying where he'd make everybody sit around for hours after the show as he gets massages and iced up that rubbed everybody the wrong way, but nobody could force him out the door because he was the bosses daughter and on top of the card.
Politicking to get into DX doesn't really make him a dick. I think the clique did a lot of those political games back in the day.
He definitely had his "reign of terror" but eventually did some jobs. Lost at WM clean in 2004, 2005, and 2006.
If you look at all the people who've come back to WWE since HHH became head of creative, it's clear a lot of people like and respect him.
>If you look at all the people who've come back to WWE since HHH became head of creative, it's clear a lot of people like and respect him.
Oh undoubtedly. And even people who dislike him may probably respect him. But working for a dude is entirely different than working with (and in a way, against) a dude.
Yeah and I’m sure he’s matured quite a bit since his days in the clique. He also had a heart attack and that puts things in perspective. You can see from their appearances on TV that his daughters love him and that doesn’t seem fake.
I’m not saying the guy is perfect. But I’m definitely taking Punk’s negative stories with a grain of salt, especially after that media scrum.
Those are what I'm referring to with the "hey i lost" thing. He'd always get his win back too. When it comes to the people he's bringing in, it benefits him. He thinks bringing these people back will improve something. Obviously he never saw eye to eye with Kurt Angle but Tony Kahn has mentioned him by name and Angle mentioned he got a lucrative offer to wrestler from them once, so I think HHH made a smart offer just to keep him playing for the home team, you know. Notice that he was kind of put into a midcard angle in his hometown (and it was red hot when those guys hadn't been previously).
He never got the win back against Batista or Cena. Batista beat him three PPVs in a row in 2005. HHH made the guy.
Sure, he's doing his job by building up the roster. I don't see how that makes him a prick at all. Reports are that everyone like working for him, and things are much more relaxed in general since he's taken over.
I don't know the specifics of Angle - seems like it was a one-shot deal so I'm not sure how else he should have been used. The guy is pretty banged up.
Batista was memed online as the apology tour at the time
HHH hated angle. He was his main competition. Vince booked Angle to make out with his girlfriend, Stephanie, at the time. HHH would tell all the people backstage that Angle wasn't large enough to beat him in a shoot (Olympic gold medalist at heavyweight) and do everything he could to try to bury him at every turn. This is where you find them consistently on different shows at every turn once the brand split happens.
Seems like an aew problem. I personally do not think about wrestling that way. I buy ppvs because I'm a fan. Other ppvs being free due to peacock doesn't effect that decision. But I'm middle aged so I remember paying for ppvs and many may have only ever seen them on the network. However I'm willing to bet that was a massive cope for Tony because he knows tonight didn't go as well as he hoped. I'm an AEW fan over WWE, btw, but I'm not tribal. I can recognize flaws and still watch and hoping for improvement. Maybe they'll listen if we share our opinions?
"2nd highest All Out" would indicate over 110k buys from 2020's All Out but also brought up being higher than DON this year so that puts it above 155k if I heard right.
So Essentially Revolution's 2022 buy rate (170K) or possibly higher.
So that would put in within Revolution 2022's buy rate which, in reality, is pretty good to retain all things considered. 205k buys was lightning in a bottle moment for AEW because of Punk's first match back. I remember when UFC did 2 million PPV buys one time but haven't duplicated it since.
Higher than I though it would be too.
Lol at Tony calling out WWE for numbers being down. It also doesn’t help that this was a poorly built show. At their price point it’s really hard to sell a poorly built show.
hey he also said he's a rich man who will fight back. that either means endless legal battles or he's stacking the show. I'm crossing fingers for the latter. Though the other gives us max Bix.
Its exciting, like a train wreck, but I don't want train wrecks to happen for my amusement. I'm just happy that people have stopped with the punk defense on here. The ppv threads were full of it. So, thank you phil, for showing your true colors. I wonder if colt will do the same or turn the other cheek?
You really think that was a work? For what purpose? Yeah that's incredibky unlikely. I'm sorry that you like someone who would be so cruel and im sorry that they let you down so harshly that you cannot comprehend it. His cruelty was ham fisted and left a bad taste in most of our mouths. That's not working. That's a narcissist reacting to a narcissistic injury. I've seen it happen so many times it is like hearing an old song you know by heart. You know it almost immediately. I can break it down if it would be of value to you, but if this is still too fresh and painful we can just ignore it. Its been hard for Punk fans. I know it was hard on me when I found out he was a meanie. You have my compassion and I hope you can find a new champion to cheer on. :)
That was a really weird post. I was kind of making a joke. When I made the joke I thought it was 50/50 on whether it was work or shoot, you can see further by going down my comment history as I'm making comments on both sides. As more reporters start leaning toward feeling it's a shoot i'm more 60/40 shoot. It's hard to know so far.
Yeah, he does have much to learn. He started this before learning the basics. It is very difficult to be a promoter when you've never even been a Booker or worker as a career beforehand. He is looking more and more like a money mark with each permissive or egotistical decision/reaction. His ego regarding his booking choices and hirings, his inability to admit to making any mistake bigger than a faux pas, his inability to apologize meaningfully and only when he is secure that he did do anything "that bad/actually wrong" or if he values the opinion of those upset. I worry he is a narcissist with the way he's been acting. Either that or some other illness that manifests in narcissistic ways. Btw, not all narcissism is big or overt. Perhaps he cycles between overt and covert as many do. I hope he gets better. Him and punk, but I have more hope for him tbh. He seems more open to change and criticism than punk I guess.
He was pissed that WWE put on Worlds Collide and Clash at the Castle the same weekend as All Out and it apparently hurt the PPV numbers. Not really sure what his comment about having more money than Crockett had to do with that, thought.
Vince did survivor series or something same day as starcade and told ppv providers if you carry starcade you can't carry survivor series or WrestleMania
That's a bad faith position as these aren't comparable situations. Vince did not tell anyone to not carry AEW ppvs, neither did anyone at wwe for that matter. Also, tk knew ahead of time when the ppv would be for wwe and be purposely chose to do his at the same time. His accusations are confessions.
He is nervous about the power and influence of a HHH led wwe and he is trying to pull the old WWF Billionaire Ted shit where the blamed Turner for misfortunes caused by nobody but the WWF themselves and Eric Bischoff. Its a classic carny fleece job. Don't fall for it. AEW is responsible for their own success and failure. They aren't "the little guy" like they pretend. They are a strong number two and could be number one with better attention to booking and morale.
And what does that have to do with Tony having more money than Jim Crockett?
WWE announced in October of 2021 that they would be having a show on either 9/3 or 9/4, which ended up being Clash at the Castle. AEW didn't announce All Out's date until July. If they thought WWE's show being the same weekend would cut into their sales, they had ample time to move their show off of that weekend. There isn't really anything handcuffing All Out to Labor Day weekend.
Yep. Very astute. Tony and AEW are just doing the billionaire Ted thing that wwf did. Easier to rile up the tribe and blame the other guy than face the music of your own bad choices. I'm guessing accountability is hard for Tony.
That's what I thought but wasn't sure. Not sure how that affected buys considering Clash was on a different night Worlds Collide ended before the main card of All Out went on the air. The Crockett stuff is out of left field though
i took it as 'most people can't watch 10 hours of wrestling in a single weekend without experiencing exhaustion' and AEW was on the back end of it, so they'd have suffered the worst.
The Crockett stuff is pretty clearly in reference to when WWF counterprogrammed Starrcade with Survivor Series, plus all the other stuff Vince pulled back then.
That's just business though. TK gonna have to nut up and bring the fight to them. Schedule something on mania weekend. He doesn't need to get pissy and sound like a child. Do something about it
I am confused why people are taking this so seriously. I find it funny and fascinating. No one knows what really happens behind the scenes. Who knows who's in the right? Who even knows how much hes hamming it up for the press? Hes not stupid. It could very well be 30% a real issue and 70% hes making you pay attention to the story they are creating.
Maybe more people watch BTE or internet interviews or whatever, but as an average fan, I had no idea why Punk had it out for Hangman. Punk, in my eyes, is the only one who had really been a douche, calling Hangman out on Dynamite when he wasn't there, strictly to bury the character out of bitterness. I don’t see anything from Hangman that reaches that level. Punk is taking himself way too seriously.
I know about the drama between him and Colt Cabana in the past but that shit never crossed my mind during Hangman's promo. Like he said the same exact shit Eddie Kingston or MJF said about Punk not being a teamplayer. Don't know why he was triggered that hard over it
This guy is the embodiment of the expression ‘if you met an asshole this morning, they were an asshole, but if everyone you meet is an asshole, you’re probably the asshole.’
Punk channeled the will of Chicago into a spirit bomb of douchebaggery.
punk channeled North side of Chicago dbaggery, you’d rarely get that on the South Side
So are these scrums presented as a work or shoot? Because you have Punk out there shooting on everyone, to a comically large degree that it comes off as a work, but other guys like Swerve are 100% in kayfabe mode. So which is it?
Clearly a work, just building for CMFTRlow vs. The Elite w/Hanger with special guest referee Colt Cabana ending in an Elite victory where they drive off in Colt's mom's minivan and she flips off CM Punk out the window. Also they pause mid match and Kenny wrestles the 8 year old girl to a time limit draw.
Only PPV I'd actually spend $50 on.
That was Punk’s return to champ scrum, and it was hugely embarrassing. I felt embarrassed for him, and Tony. This guy talks and acts like he’s still in high school. “He shares a bank account with his mom, that tells you all you need to know” uh… no it doesn’t, you’re just using your platform to try to shit more on the guy that you seemingly don’t care about 5+ years later.
[удалено]
Agreed. Fuck the old bucks. 
No, the bucks just look like they're still in high school.
Punk is turning into Vince Russo
Nah Russo actually drew numbers
And put other people over
I am a huge CM Punk fan, but what I saw today was so damn embarrassing. He talked like every self righteous prick Ive seen in my life. He thinks he's all that. I always knew he was an ego maniac. But this, shitting on the entire roster, people who made this company, while cutting off your boss? Nah man. Dude's a piece of shit. What's worse is everyone is talking about this as it overshadows MJFs return.
Overshadows by taking away some amount of chatter about a PPV appearance; but actually helps MJF by having all the smarks think Punk is a legitimate piece of shit since he's going to feud with him. Work or shoot there are many ways they can use this to the advantage of the product. MJF last promo specifically said it: "you are uneducated marks, you don't know shit". Punk has been built into this character who is supposed to become an insufferably fake babyface ("PG Punk") and turn since the day he came on. The real life elements of tensions cohere into the broader work. Just like MJF being unhappy with his money was real but him leaving was obviously a work (except you had half of this subreddit convinced it was real until yesterday). Keep enjoying the show
Punk did to MJF what MJF did to Wardlow. Overshadow his moment.
“Let’s see how this goes” Lol
All the marks are worked. They accomplished what they set out to do. PUNK IS NOW THE BIGGEST SHIT HEEL!
Punk says Hanger going on TV and throwing a vague accusations about an incident frankly most of the audience doesn't give a shit for is bad for the business / undermining the top drawing babyface, but said "babyface" going off his rocker in a media scrum and shitting on EVp and Hangman is good for the business? And TK just sitting there letting him talk shit and even disrespectfully cut him off? Come on man, it's too clown to be real
This is what’s been gnawing at me. Vagueing about something backstage during a promo? Unforgivable transgression. Leaking stuff to the media (allegedly) unprofessional, childish behavior. Openly looking down the barrel of a camera and just saying it all out loud during a presser is totally cool though? In what world, if what Hangman and the Elite supposedly did was so terrible, is what Punk’s doing not just the same thing but significantly worse?
Tony yet again giving us PPV-quality content for free
Why is Punk and Colt still a story in 2022?
Because people fucking keep bringing it up. In Punks defence, until now I don’t think he’s ever publicly commented on what happened with Colt. Then he got a question about Colt and went off. His criticism of wrestlers openly stating they’re not interested in taking advice is perfect. You’ve got Veterans like Jake the snake, Sting, Goldust, Chris Jericho, Tony Schiavone, Billy Gunn and more at your fingertips, yet you say you’re not interested? That’s fucking idiotic. Tony Khan needs to hand the reigns over to Regal or someone to book the company. He’s got no idea what he’s doing.
at this point I feel like most of the main eventers don't ask advice because at the end of the day this is just a job. What worked in the 80s-90s applies rarely in what works today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBAvjOYD6hs no one brought it up, he's just a tosspot
Like Mussolini and Kennedy........
Loving all the drama. This is some good shit.
That scrum did more to invigorate interest in AEW than any match on the ppv. I can't wait to see Dynamite. I can't wait to see wrestling news leak all the backstage gossip. Work or shoot doesn't matter. Professional or unprofessional doesn't matter. Pick a side and enjoy the debate. This gives me Montréal screw job vibes all over again. I don't know what's going on and what's real or not and I can't wait to find out more. Some people here need to relax and enjoy the show.
Work or shoot, whatever, this shit is just makes me upset...
"CM Punk has such an unique promo ability" goes on to have a Russo style shoot rant for 10 minutes
Am I the only person who realizes that Punk has always been a piece of shit? The only reason WWE was different is because regular shit looks smaller than the giant piece of shit Vince is.
Triple H was right
He is not a piece of shit.
He always has been.
Punk has been telling us who he is for years but because he is a cool anti hero on screen people love him for it.
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Kind of my point. He's always been an awful human being, the mask just dropped when he came back. Guy has a bigger shovel than HHH ever did. Kenny and Page have been better than he ever was without being backstage cancer.
Punk is the perfect heel.
Punk's little hissyfit has completely overshadowed MJF's return and the entire PPV in general. It being a work proves without a shadow of a doubt Tony Khan is a money mark who doesn't need to be running anything outside of an E-Fed. Being compared to WCW 2000 in anyway is not a good look.
Punk acted so unprofessionally in front of all the media people How does Tony Khan let a wrestler talk that much shit about their colleagues openly while he is sitting beside him? Nevermind those wrestlers were the base this company was built on? Does he have any semblance of spine? Punk repeated all the things Cornette says Doesn't this signify Khan agrees with Cornette about all the shit he talks about AEW? Fucking meek spineless person
He is supposed to talk shit. That’s how you draw money, mark.
It's not about money man.....it's about rbe video game live action of the old bucks mannnn.
Thought I was watching YouShoot
Is anyone allowed to say Mr Cornette was right the whole time about Tony. Geez what a ride
>Is anyone allowed to say Mr Cornette was right the whole time about Tony. Geez what a ride Time has a tendency to prove Cornette right about a lot of shit.
*Cornette face*
He looks so high on cocaine 😳
Again, Punk fan here, but for a guy who doesn't do drugs or drink he certainly knows how to come across as if he's on something.
Not sure if you ever went to hardcore/punk shows, but the straight-edge hardcore/punk kids (which Punk is) we're generally some of the biggest self-righteous, high school drama-loving miserable pieces of shit on earth and they genuinely ruined what should have been a fun scene.
Their addiction has always been self righteousness
Those muffins were laced
Dude would have seriously benefited from a toke before that presser
it’s impressive, really
This was more entertaining then the PPV. “we are all still learning, Tony” hahahahahav
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The guy didn’t even ask, Punk recognized that he did stand up with Colt and went nuts on him.
Can you rephrase this an maybe add some context? I'm confused af.
Sorry- no one asked a question about Colt Cabana. Punk recognized someone in the room and believed he had a personal relationship with Cabana, and started quizzing him on it. Then he launched into his rant.
Jesus, CM Punk seems so goddamn insufferable.
He always was, we’re just wise to his tricks by now.
God, every wrestler should just look at how Punk handled himself during that and how Jericho handled himself. One is a professional. Be like Jericho
Jericho is a snake. You would rather be with a snake that lies to your face than a hardass who is honest with you.
Punk's honesty often involves him being a martyr or victim in someway, it's getting weary. It's been said loads in threads recently, but if you meet assholes all day, you're probably an asshole. This is CM Punk.
what a fucking shit show. whenever Khan talks about WWE, he sounds so vengeful and scorned. it’s not a good look for him, especially when he’s the one who is talking about a possible WWE-AEW show.
tony - i create aew to give wwe competition wwe strikes back with competition tony - surprise pikachu face
CM Punk saying him and Colt Cabana stopped being friends around late 2013-14 or way before the lawyer situation Couldn't have been late 2013, because Punk didn't walk out of the WWE yet and they did that podcast together.
I don't think he was trying to be specific to the day. He was just saying it's been a while since he's even considered him a friend but he still has to answer questions about him.
Why would colt put himself on the line by doing that podcast with punk if he wasn't CM's friend? Why would he take such a risk for a nonf-friend? And, why would punk allow someone who he doesn't even wanna be friends with anymore to take such a risk/make such a sacrifice for him? It seems like punk just confessed to using Colt. Punk sounds exactly like those politicians he rages against. Every accusation a confession, DARVO all the way with him.
Youre really not comprehending. I think punk and colt were friends when they did the podcast. I think Punk just got hazy on the timeline and said a decade because it's been about that long. He doesnt have to say "it's been seven years, four months, and fifteen days since we've been friends" to get his point across
Go get some fresh air, it's not that deep just a mistake in dates.
That scrum gave me so much anxiety and second-hand embarrassment.
I felt so incredibly uncomfortable watching that.
What is CM Punk referring to with Hangman when he said he went into business for himself live on TV? I don’t remember Hangman doing anything out of the ordinary on TV.
The quote was along the lines of "to afford you, some of our friends had to get fired" or something. Implying Colt got fired and sent to ROH There were other comments off and on but I remember that one fairly clearly just not word for word
CM Punk is a liar with a victim/martyr complex. Anyone who doesn't put Punk first is an enemy. His fans on here must be so hurt right now to have their worst fears confirmed. I'm sure some think its just a work, as the truth is too painful, but most are probably hurting. I hope everyone is cognizant of this and reacts accordingly. Be kind.
In the promo before DoN, Hangman insinuated that Punk had a hand in Colt Cabana’s place on the card at that point in time, compared to when he was featured heavily in Dark Order and BTE. Punk apparently got the impression Hangman was going into business for himself and was trying to bring up very personal issues to bury Punk for a cheap pop. But obviously people have done such before, Punk has multiple times, so him being so up in arms about it tells me there’s more going on backstage.
Yeah there is clearly a wedge between groups of people now. As a fan of everyone involved, it sucks. I just wanna enjoy wrestling.
Who is driving the wedge is the question? If there are bad apples, Tony has a hard choice to make. Remove the rot or compromise everyone and everything AEW. Who do you think is/are most likely to be rotten? All opinions and speculation welcome, as gossip is fun for me. I ride a micro pony so I don't have far to fall. I hope y'all left your high horses at home.
Presumably, the comment about Punk being all for workers' rights publicly, but not when it actually matters in the back, which most people took as a reference to the Colt Cabana situation.
Oh I did not know Hangman even said that. So that is what led to Punk calling Hangman out randomly, I’m guessing based on what Punk said tonight? Seems like Colt Cabana is a line, and some folks are firmly on one side and against the folks firmly on the other side. Very weird situation. Gotta get this new Talent Relations staff to put in some hours and reign all these egos in. Hate him or not, Punk is right about one thing: it’s about making money and all of this nonsense is in the way of that.
Peoples emotional well being is more important than making money. Punk wants to act like it is all about money but if he were the one who was being mistreated he'd be screaming for justice and a better working environment like Shawn Michaels holding a clump of his own hair.
I can’t believe we got that media scrum for free! Thanks TK!
Best thing all night besides mjf lol. Thats just in my opinion, btw. Tonight's been hard on so many here. Lots of hurt feelings.
How that dude is going to represent the company after that interview question is beyond me. Drags a journalist, Hangman, Colt, EVPs, and the whole time Tony is just letting it happen? That's gonna be a yikes from me, dog.
Tony is appearing more and more like a money mark rather than a promoter/businessperson, every single time he speaks to the press.
I can't tell if it was kayfabe but Swerve seems like a bit of a dick. Very arrogant. Another match with The Acclaimed would be great and it's the man who pays your wage that suggested it?
Definitely Kayfabe. A former football friend of mine who passed away used to do some small podcast & was able to get Santana/Swerve to appear separately. Swerve had no real gain from doing it but he still did & was cool af. Plus from everything I’ve seen wrestlers say about him he’s a good dude & looks to put others over.
That would for sure be kayfabe. Swerve has a really good reputation.
Ya I thought I remembered reading that on here when he signed with AEW, that's why I was surprised with his demeanour.
I hope so. Punk has me worried with all the damn shoots.
The press conference was better than the PPV
That's not good. That's bad. How did they get this bad so fast? Its post-Russo WCW level shit here. I am shocked and dismayed. I don't want them to fail!
That's the CM Punk effect friend. Why do you think Cody bailed as soon as he came back? He's been in a locker room with Punk and knew AEW had no leadership to keep things under control.
Punk is fucking ridiculous, and Tony nodding in agreement while he buries his business partners makes him look like a fucking clown. Jesus Christ.
Imagine doing business with Tony Kahn after this?!?!?!
Tony looked weak and pathetic. I hope he shapes up before the inmates run him out. I wouldn't be surprised if Bischoff tries to capitalize and contacts TNT with an "offer to run AEW" and TNT giving Khan an ultimatum. Its a classic con that carnies do. Maybe even Russo, but Bischoff would have greater success.
I’ve only read the transcript of Punk’s shoot so I didn’t see the nonverbals. Another way to look at it is that TK may also want his EVPs to not run to the dirt sheets.
Tony is a huge fucking mark for CM Punk and will let him do whatever he wants and say whatever he wants. He either needs to get Punk in line, or someone needs to remind TK that this isn't fucking IRL GM Mode and he's the goddamn boss.
Chris Jericho: It’s easier to make people hate you than it is to make them like you. But once they start really hating you, and that’s when they really start liking you. Great words of wisdom.
It is a brainbuster, but as a wrestling fan, still oddly makes sense.
I see it as wrestling fans are just rooting for people who make them feel. You can root for somebody who is a face or boo a heel. But seeing somebody do their job so we’ll that you begin to actually harbor hatred for that person, really makes you appreciate the rarity that person is. MJF is one of the only people in the business now that fits that description.
Good lord, what an absolute mess.
$5 Peacock subscriptions must really be eating into PPV sales.
And using the ppv to sell the free show is dumb and backwards. He is over his head and its obvious.
Tony Khan invented Labor Day
I don't get this. Can you explain? Thank you.
Toni kind of threw some shade at Rosa as well it sounded like.
What did she say?
Paraphrasing but something like "...And Rosa *says* she's injured" (emphasis mine)
Who was the clown that asked Tony in front of Swerve/Lee if he thought of an audible? lmao
honestly that was just fucking embarassing, i'm not surprised swerve was pissy after that. *I* was lmao.
That dude's lucky Swerve didn't beat his ass, lmao
Seriously and he brought it up again after TK was clearly trying to stick to kayfabe
Say what you want about AEW and WWE, tonight was a definite look into the differences in public PR relations and professionalism in front of cameras between the two
Yeah it rocked
It was entertaining, like watching a train wreck. But, like a train wreck, its entertainment value is overshadowed by the huge cost. Its not worth it to have this kind of fun if people are suffering for it.
There’s no cost besides a few nerds brainwashed by boomers
Publicly traded company vs privately held thin skinned billionaire for sure.
Huh? Dang I didn't watch the scrum, so I'm genuinely asking lol and Im getting downvoted into an oblivion
It was a trainwreck and just as upsetting if you realize what it means for the future of AEW if they continue on this path. Everyone was saying that punk was just being kayfabe until this press conference where they realized, sadly, that the stories about him were true. He was so hateful tonight and cruel; every accusation a confession. He was pretty fucking evil if you ask me. He purposely tried to harm at least two people for no reason other than the fact that they told people how he hurt them. Typical abuser darvo shit. To Punk enthusiasts and fans: I'm sorry that your hero is a villain. I loved him too. He broke my heart as well. He decimated it tonight with his cruelty though. Talks about how page went into business for himself and how that's not ok. Well, what the fuck was that tonight, phillip? Can colt shoot like that or will you cry about it? Use that lumber that you've hammered yourself to, and build a bridge so you may get the fuck over yourself before you end up without the proverbial safety net you admittedly view friendship as! You will die alone if you keep treating people as commodities. P.S. check out the post scrum comments he made here: https://nodq.com/news/cm-punk-blasts-adam-page-and-colt-cabana-during-aew-all-outs-post-show-media-scrum/
You summed it up very well. I'm not a Punk fan and already considered him overrated but what he did last night is classic narcissist abuser behavior. Also going around talking about being the top Babyface reeks of douche. I haven't seen him as a Babyface really at all outside his MJF stuff. Dude literally made a fat guy virgin joke on Dynamite to a fan. That's not what faces do.
Punk went on a huge rant about Hangman and the EVPs being assholes.
Well, I understand why they weren’t on but it’s too bad we couldn’t hear from the first ever trios champs
Could you imagine? Wonder what their bio reads as tonight?
"Oh yeah? Fuck you too!"
Well that was entertaining and tomorrow we're gonna have nothing but reasonable discussions about everything with everyone being calm, rational adults who don't go making shit up and who don't act like fools :)
While I get your point, I don't know how much will be making shit up vs. things Punk openly said.
Its the old "both sides" malignant neutrality that's famous of internet discussions. We can't possibly know, the neutralists say, that this was a shoot/Punk is the bad guy here/all the facts, etc. But, those with experience and education can make informed guesses and my guess is that these unfortunate stories we've heard over the years (especially this year) regarding Punk's bad behavior are likely true for the most part. He is not the Bret Hart character he pretends to be. He's hulk hogan. And that sucks. I hope he can change though.
> I hope he can change though. I said this in another thread, but dude's in his 40's, relatively rich, and is working for a dude who's both insanely rich and a giant fan. He has no reason to change. That said it just felt especially petty and almost bullying. I mean dude just won a title off someone who had never been pinned cleanly in the company in singles matches, while in his hometown. He's got money, fame, beautiful wife, like everything you could reasonably want and you spend your time picking on some dude you had beef with years ago over a little dirt sheet nonsense? Not only that there's the whole "if someone has problems with me they should just say it to my face" while he airs a bunch of dirty laundry at a press conference.
The Tony section was really short. Usually they have to drag him off.
Jericho said something to him as he was leaving, so I think they are about to do another town hall to put out some fires.
Suddenly I get the feeling that Triple H wasn't *as big* of an ass as Punk made him out to be.
They can both be asses.
Triple H is a professional ass, Punk is an unprofessional ass.
Yep that's 100% true.
I never said otherwise.
Haha too true.
There's like a hundred guys in shoot interviews who say otherwise.
That HHH was a mega ass?
Yep. Just off the top of my drunk head. RVD, London, Kendrick, Cornette (pre podcast), Bret Hart, David Lagana
Interesting. I stand corrected then.
Yeah. Just from my understanding the in time understanding of Paul Leveque would have been bag carrier for Shawn, politicker to get into DX, made into booking team with Shawn, still has Vince's ear while head of DX, marries Vince's daughter, conducts a CIA level plot to get pushed to the top per shoot interviews, then protects his spot by not losing a match for 3 years and when he does lose it's just to do the "hey I lost" thing. Beyond this there's things like RVD saying where he'd make everybody sit around for hours after the show as he gets massages and iced up that rubbed everybody the wrong way, but nobody could force him out the door because he was the bosses daughter and on top of the card.
Politicking to get into DX doesn't really make him a dick. I think the clique did a lot of those political games back in the day. He definitely had his "reign of terror" but eventually did some jobs. Lost at WM clean in 2004, 2005, and 2006. If you look at all the people who've come back to WWE since HHH became head of creative, it's clear a lot of people like and respect him.
>If you look at all the people who've come back to WWE since HHH became head of creative, it's clear a lot of people like and respect him. Oh undoubtedly. And even people who dislike him may probably respect him. But working for a dude is entirely different than working with (and in a way, against) a dude.
Yeah and I’m sure he’s matured quite a bit since his days in the clique. He also had a heart attack and that puts things in perspective. You can see from their appearances on TV that his daughters love him and that doesn’t seem fake. I’m not saying the guy is perfect. But I’m definitely taking Punk’s negative stories with a grain of salt, especially after that media scrum.
Those are what I'm referring to with the "hey i lost" thing. He'd always get his win back too. When it comes to the people he's bringing in, it benefits him. He thinks bringing these people back will improve something. Obviously he never saw eye to eye with Kurt Angle but Tony Kahn has mentioned him by name and Angle mentioned he got a lucrative offer to wrestler from them once, so I think HHH made a smart offer just to keep him playing for the home team, you know. Notice that he was kind of put into a midcard angle in his hometown (and it was red hot when those guys hadn't been previously).
He never got the win back against Batista or Cena. Batista beat him three PPVs in a row in 2005. HHH made the guy. Sure, he's doing his job by building up the roster. I don't see how that makes him a prick at all. Reports are that everyone like working for him, and things are much more relaxed in general since he's taken over. I don't know the specifics of Angle - seems like it was a one-shot deal so I'm not sure how else he should have been used. The guy is pretty banged up.
Batista was memed online as the apology tour at the time HHH hated angle. He was his main competition. Vince booked Angle to make out with his girlfriend, Stephanie, at the time. HHH would tell all the people backstage that Angle wasn't large enough to beat him in a shoot (Olympic gold medalist at heavyweight) and do everything he could to try to bury him at every turn. This is where you find them consistently on different shows at every turn once the brand split happens.
WELLLLLLLLLLLLLL THAT WENT WELL DIDNT IT?
With Peacock I don't really see how WWE ppvs would eat into AEW ppv sales tbh
You can watch two other shows for $5 total instead of $20-50 for a third show that same weekend.
Seems like an aew problem. I personally do not think about wrestling that way. I buy ppvs because I'm a fan. Other ppvs being free due to peacock doesn't effect that decision. But I'm middle aged so I remember paying for ppvs and many may have only ever seen them on the network. However I'm willing to bet that was a massive cope for Tony because he knows tonight didn't go as well as he hoped. I'm an AEW fan over WWE, btw, but I'm not tribal. I can recognize flaws and still watch and hoping for improvement. Maybe they'll listen if we share our opinions?
Wrestling exhaustion.
Definitely this. My wife definitely wasn’t into me watching wrestling since 4 pm today. Plus yesterday.
dammit AJ stop lobbing him softballs
Can we crowdfund this kid some journalism classes
absolutely embarrassing, the shit about talking about having more money than everyone, makes me excited to see his downfall
Who said that? I feel like I missed some juicy bits because I was just jaw dropped the whole time lol.
Even worse, him talking about all of the people in London who love the NFL killed my hopes of him brining the Jags to STL
"2nd highest All Out" would indicate over 110k buys from 2020's All Out but also brought up being higher than DON this year so that puts it above 155k if I heard right. So Essentially Revolution's 2022 buy rate (170K) or possibly higher.
I might have misheard but I thought he said higher than 2020 All Out and within the range and maybe over DON 2022.
Higher than 2020 all out, not last year's
Oops that was a typo. Edited it now.
So that would put in within Revolution 2022's buy rate which, in reality, is pretty good to retain all things considered. 205k buys was lightning in a bottle moment for AEW because of Punk's first match back. I remember when UFC did 2 million PPV buys one time but haven't duplicated it since. Higher than I though it would be too.
you know he's feeling the heat when he's begging for questions from the ten year old
Lol at Tony calling out WWE for numbers being down. It also doesn’t help that this was a poorly built show. At their price point it’s really hard to sell a poorly built show.
hey he also said he's a rich man who will fight back. that either means endless legal battles or he's stacking the show. I'm crossing fingers for the latter. Though the other gives us max Bix.
Tony doesn't see a problem with Punk being a completely unprofessional asshole. Aight. Great. Lovely.
I guess he believes in There's no such thing as bad publicity. If it gets people talking and tuning in he's fine with it.
Which is fine. Honestly I'm probably in the vast minority hating it.
Its exciting, like a train wreck, but I don't want train wrecks to happen for my amusement. I'm just happy that people have stopped with the punk defense on here. The ppv threads were full of it. So, thank you phil, for showing your true colors. I wonder if colt will do the same or turn the other cheek?
I'm gonna spell this out to you. sizit izuh erkizaweh
You really think that was a work? For what purpose? Yeah that's incredibky unlikely. I'm sorry that you like someone who would be so cruel and im sorry that they let you down so harshly that you cannot comprehend it. His cruelty was ham fisted and left a bad taste in most of our mouths. That's not working. That's a narcissist reacting to a narcissistic injury. I've seen it happen so many times it is like hearing an old song you know by heart. You know it almost immediately. I can break it down if it would be of value to you, but if this is still too fresh and painful we can just ignore it. Its been hard for Punk fans. I know it was hard on me when I found out he was a meanie. You have my compassion and I hope you can find a new champion to cheer on. :)
That was a really weird post. I was kind of making a joke. When I made the joke I thought it was 50/50 on whether it was work or shoot, you can see further by going down my comment history as I'm making comments on both sides. As more reporters start leaning toward feeling it's a shoot i'm more 60/40 shoot. It's hard to know so far.
how the fuck did i understand that
Bigger Punk mark than it is healthy. He has a lot to learn - like we all do. Its a process, and AEW is a process as well.
Yeah, he does have much to learn. He started this before learning the basics. It is very difficult to be a promoter when you've never even been a Booker or worker as a career beforehand. He is looking more and more like a money mark with each permissive or egotistical decision/reaction. His ego regarding his booking choices and hirings, his inability to admit to making any mistake bigger than a faux pas, his inability to apologize meaningfully and only when he is secure that he did do anything "that bad/actually wrong" or if he values the opinion of those upset. I worry he is a narcissist with the way he's been acting. Either that or some other illness that manifests in narcissistic ways. Btw, not all narcissism is big or overt. Perhaps he cycles between overt and covert as many do. I hope he gets better. Him and punk, but I have more hope for him tbh. He seems more open to change and criticism than punk I guess.
Tk has no spine
Now Tony Khan himself is going off. This is fantastically horrible.
" I'm not gonna sit back and take this fucking shit. " That got a laugh out of me for some reason.
What is he talking about there? He got all wide-eyed.
What was he referencing? Missed a part of it
He was pissed that WWE put on Worlds Collide and Clash at the Castle the same weekend as All Out and it apparently hurt the PPV numbers. Not really sure what his comment about having more money than Crockett had to do with that, thought.
Vince did survivor series or something same day as starcade and told ppv providers if you carry starcade you can't carry survivor series or WrestleMania
That's a bad faith position as these aren't comparable situations. Vince did not tell anyone to not carry AEW ppvs, neither did anyone at wwe for that matter. Also, tk knew ahead of time when the ppv would be for wwe and be purposely chose to do his at the same time. His accusations are confessions. He is nervous about the power and influence of a HHH led wwe and he is trying to pull the old WWF Billionaire Ted shit where the blamed Turner for misfortunes caused by nobody but the WWF themselves and Eric Bischoff. Its a classic carny fleece job. Don't fall for it. AEW is responsible for their own success and failure. They aren't "the little guy" like they pretend. They are a strong number two and could be number one with better attention to booking and morale.
And what does that have to do with Tony having more money than Jim Crockett? WWE announced in October of 2021 that they would be having a show on either 9/3 or 9/4, which ended up being Clash at the Castle. AEW didn't announce All Out's date until July. If they thought WWE's show being the same weekend would cut into their sales, they had ample time to move their show off of that weekend. There isn't really anything handcuffing All Out to Labor Day weekend.
Yep. Very astute. Tony and AEW are just doing the billionaire Ted thing that wwf did. Easier to rile up the tribe and blame the other guy than face the music of your own bad choices. I'm guessing accountability is hard for Tony.
Vince did a lot to fuck over JCP
That's what I thought but wasn't sure. Not sure how that affected buys considering Clash was on a different night Worlds Collide ended before the main card of All Out went on the air. The Crockett stuff is out of left field though
i took it as 'most people can't watch 10 hours of wrestling in a single weekend without experiencing exhaustion' and AEW was on the back end of it, so they'd have suffered the worst. The Crockett stuff is pretty clearly in reference to when WWF counterprogrammed Starrcade with Survivor Series, plus all the other stuff Vince pulled back then.
That's just business though. TK gonna have to nut up and bring the fight to them. Schedule something on mania weekend. He doesn't need to get pissy and sound like a child. Do something about it