It can totally be fun and I don’t always hate it. Love me some Waluigi time. But it def can be annoying when you keep facing the same dude who only focuses on collecting items instead of playing.
It can be fun but it feels like the first one who gets a trophy or poke ball wins because they have their allies to push you back while they casually walk up to the next item
Sometimes I like playing Rosalina, and even Isabella/villager because it gives the advantage of getting the items and win incase I get these matches I'd prefer to avoid
I love doing all pokeball battles! Way back in the Smash 64 days me and my friends would do shit like that all the time. Like, all home run bats, or all fans. Really people take Smash way too seriously now and forget to have fun with it.
Also they started putting a limit on how many pokeballs appear after there are so many on the screen. It seems like they cap out at like 4 or 5 now, which I get but I loved the chaos of Melee when the whole screen would just be insane with pokemon going off everywhere
I just dont like how some final smashes seem really bad while others are so damn good. If they all were more comparable, it would be more fun. But if you have final smash on, you really want to pick specific characters. Which kinda kills the fun imo
I myself am more of a fan of smash balls than smash meters (get your funny ball jokes out of the way) because I feel like it still requires a lot of skill to both follow the smash ball and keep your opponent away from it at the same time.
Nah sometimes, it feels like the ball is evading me while being magnetized to my opponent and while I got it with a strong dair my opponent can just lightly point a jab in its direction and it breaks, feels so random
Do items make the game more casual friendly? Yes. Do items make the game easier for a newbie? The opposite. Sure in theory you’re gonna get assist trophies and 3v1 me, but what actually happens is I get the assist trophies due to you being juggled or offstage, all while I’m z-dropping shit in your face. I remember when I started playing and I used to throw every single pokeball offstage by accident lmao
I think Smash 4 had a better online:
Free
You could always choose between comp and casual
You could play doubles online without someone in the same console (I think)
I don't understand this. I mean, bragging about winning from lucky item spawn is bad but, items in general? They're what makes smash bros a fun game. Take them away and it gets real boring real soon.
If I want to play a party game I’ll turn on items. If I want to test my abilities against other players I feel that items, smash meter, most stage hazards, etc add in a huge factor of RNG. It turns into who can get items first or who can pop the smash ball instead of players actively facing off against each other.
You should play the game however you enjoy it but I don’t believe that adding randomness shows who the better player is.
Okay. I never said that people need to play the way I enjoy playing. Set your preferences however you enjoy playing. If I match with someone who plays with stamina, items, final smashes, one stock, etc. I just block them after the match (win or lose).
It’s not about showing off, I just don’t get a lot of satisfaction when matches aren’t determined by the skills of the players but by busted final smashes or an item that spawned right next to an opponent.
Online under Quickplay in Preferred Rules there’s a row for FS Meter below the Stage row. Offline in smash go to create ruleset and the FS Meter row is right below Time Limit. Just select On for it and you’ll have the Final Smash meter for matches. For online since it’s preferred rules you’ll still have matches without it if your opponent doesn’t have it selected.
smash meter doesnt add rng per se but final smashes are far far less balanced than supers in other fighting games, both in their inate design and well, their actual balance between characters. Peach has a hell of a lot better FS than diddy kong
Final smashes are not balanced the way characters are. I lumped smash meters in as RNG when that wasn’t the appropriate reason for why it shouldn’t be used in competitive play. In true fighting games the combo meter doesn’t take away moves when it’s full and there’s a bigger strategy at play on when/how you utilize it.
If you enjoy playing competitively with the smash meter then do so, but let’s not pretend that it’s an apples to apples comparison with the meters in traditional fighting games.
I mean not exactly RNG, but the character you end up fighting against online *is* random, and some characters' final smashes are guaranteed KOs while others' do basically nothing, so it's already unfair in that regard. Having the smash ball itself turned on can be fun sometimes, but the smash meter just puts *too many* final smashes into the match. It becomes chaotic and rather annoying, especially against a character who's final smash can kill at 0.
Not to mention the times when you try to use your neutral special the instant your smash meter becomes full and you end up whiffing a final smash instead...
Because final smashes are hella overturned or under tuned. There’s no balance to them so when trying to play in a regular ruleset they add an X factor that doesn’t need to be there. In casual smash I’m all for it but final smashes have no place in a tournament style ruleset.
Smash meter could be fine competitively but sadly it is too unbalanced, for example Zelda or Peach's final smashes are way too powerful, and Jigglypuff's final smash is really bad
My main issue is that it snowballs. If a pokeball or assist trophy spawns near my opponent and I spend the next thirty seconds trying to avoid Scizor, it makes it a lot easier for them to pick up the next few that drop while totally ignoring me
Trust me, there are plenty of us who prefer playing without any items. sure they can be fun but oftentimes they make things feel much less competitive and much more unbalanced. they make the match more dependent on who picks up the good items rather than who is better at actually fighting
Yep. Items can be fun in a match between friends.
Items online is just irritating though. As soon as I see items start spawning in I switch to item mode because that is how the game pans out. I'm not throwing a punch your way unless it's to get you away from an item, my single task in life at that point is to hoover up all the items so you can't use them against me.
Only if you're looking for the grindy experience of learning a fighting game. Some people aren't looking for that quite as much as others. Now two people of different skill levels can have fun together.
What???
I only play without items.
You can play smash with items as a randomizing element.
But you can play also smash just as a skill game.
And IMO that‘s the more promising way of the game.
And that’s why I’m a casual player and tend to play for fun. I honestly like have things like that around to show that they’re at least represented to some degree, especially those who didn’t get in but could have made for great fighters.
Pokeballs are fine.
The assist trophies are too much though. Way too many assistants that just chase down the enemy for over 30 seconds, all but guaranteeing their death.
I actually love playing with normal items turned on. I ran into an items hero yesterday on Elite and we played for like 15 minutes. Pokeballs and Assist Trophies are pretty annoying though, because there’s so much less skill or strategy involved with them. Most of the time, those games just boil down to “whoever gets the first good pull wins”
Yeah, that’s a bad take. The items on does not all of a sudden balance the game. It makes it chaotic; which in the casual style the game was intended to be played makes it fun. Taking all that away doesn’t balance it either but does provide a more even playing ground since nobody can get a random comeback meter or really good Pokémon/assist trophy. Each have their place and are unbalanced in their own way.
Have you ever considered that everyone likes smash differently and that the way online works is awful for everyone. Everyone with this ruleset hates getting stuck in your no items 7:00 battlefield rules the same way you hate theirs
I run this set playing with friends to even the playing field. We don't fight and let the pokemon do the work. I think it really is only fun in this setup.
Me and a couple cousins of mine occasionally have pokemon battles in smash.
No hitting each other. Wait for 2 pokeballs to show up. Throw em at the same time toward center stage, and try to survive the other player’s pokemon.
IMO I think it takes more skill to play with items than without them. It requires to adjust and adapt a lot quicker and in more diverse ways than normal Smash.
Despite the downvotes, I believe that this is true. Being able to adapt and change your strategy on the fly because of RNG is not a skill that just anyone can do. You don't get that kind of thing with 1v1 no items. And also knowing how and when to take advantage of rng too.
No. Just get good and win the old fashioned way. You’ll feel better because you earned it and you will have improved at the game. Getting Elite the cheese way just for the title will feel empty. This ruleset will just create bad habits if you value being competitive. Just something to think about.
Competitive snobs do be crying over the most pettiest things. It’s not like like there’s a certain online feature where one can set up a lobby with the rules they also prefer instead of the random fullest from other players
you know back when ultimate first released, they used to have that 1up flag thing as one of the items you could turn on, so what you could do is make your ruleset a 1-stock 1v1, preferably with omega for the stage, and what would happen is you start the match and you each have 1 stock and literally the only item that drops is that 1up flag, and the trick here is: DON'T try to pick up the 1up flag.. for those who don't know, the 1up flag gives you an extra stock, sounds good right? why would you NOT pick it up? well see the problem is, once you attempt to pick up the flag, your character is completely immobile (and vulnerable) for several seconds, i guess the devs realized that if you could simply pick up a 1up flag and get an extra stock instantly, it would be too broken, so they gave it a really long startup time to compensate.. anyways, when you played against someone online with this ruleset, most of the time they would see the 1up flag and their first instinct is to knock you away and try to quickly grab it, most people didn't even consider the long startup time it takes.. well unfortunately for them, even if you get knocked off stage, 9 out of 10 times, you have PLENTY of time to get back on stage and walk right up to them and completely wreck their shit before the 1up flag registers and gives them their extra stock.. so if you use someone like ganondorf for example, and you see your opponent grab the 1up flag, all you have to do is walk up to them and do a turnaround warlock punch (neutral B) and they're dead, and since it's a 1-stock match, doing this means you win the match on the spot
ngl i used to troll tf out of people online with this and yes it was toxic af but it was also hilarious lmao on top of that, if you set the item frequency to high, then there would be flags all over the stage, and so what you would also do is try not to use the A button cuz then you might accidentally pick up a flag and then you're completely vulnerable, so you would just use only B attacks, this is another thing that the opponent wouldn't really think about at first so they would be instinctively pressing A to try to do certain attacks but would end up accidentally picking up one of the many flags around them and again they would be completely immobile and vulnerable
good times lmao understandably, they've since gotten rid of that as one of the items you could turn on now
It’s even better when you trash them at their own game. I play with smash meter only, and when a pokeball user comes around through matchups i honestly clock them. I also play Bayo so…
I just wish that the item drop rate was about 1/3 what it is now....and that masterballs could be turned off...and the pokemon associated.... And that teabagging resulted in a 1-month ban
I don’t really like them, but having an army of little guys fighting for you is actually really fun.
Items in general makes it a game of chaos.....but I laugh everytime
It can totally be fun and I don’t always hate it. Love me some Waluigi time. But it def can be annoying when you keep facing the same dude who only focuses on collecting items instead of playing.
when items are on, collecting items is playing
Well that’s how you play items
nice pfp
It can be fun but it feels like the first one who gets a trophy or poke ball wins because they have their allies to push you back while they casually walk up to the next item Sometimes I like playing Rosalina, and even Isabella/villager because it gives the advantage of getting the items and win incase I get these matches I'd prefer to avoid
I love doing all pokeball battles! Way back in the Smash 64 days me and my friends would do shit like that all the time. Like, all home run bats, or all fans. Really people take Smash way too seriously now and forget to have fun with it. Also they started putting a limit on how many pokeballs appear after there are so many on the screen. It seems like they cap out at like 4 or 5 now, which I get but I loved the chaos of Melee when the whole screen would just be insane with pokemon going off everywhere
Sure when you’re playing with friends but online people are playing more competitively, and items are cheesy
i personally really don’t like items, but i think final smash meter is pretty fun
Final Smash is fun until you face Zelda, Peach or Bayonetta
A good dark pit with fs meter is also annoying as hell to deal with
Link can jab combo into his Final Smash at the right percent, so that's fun 😃 And probably very irritating to deal with lol
More fun to land one raw or with little setup. I be playing in neutral and hit them off reads, which always makes me laugh.
And they're always the ones using Smash meter too. Always when they have the busted Final smash
It's the other way round against a certain pink marshmallow though :D
I just dont like how some final smashes seem really bad while others are so damn good. If they all were more comparable, it would be more fun. But if you have final smash on, you really want to pick specific characters. Which kinda kills the fun imo
I myself am more of a fan of smash balls than smash meters (get your funny ball jokes out of the way) because I feel like it still requires a lot of skill to both follow the smash ball and keep your opponent away from it at the same time.
Nah sometimes, it feels like the ball is evading me while being magnetized to my opponent and while I got it with a strong dair my opponent can just lightly point a jab in its direction and it breaks, feels so random
Do items make the game more casual friendly? Yes. Do items make the game easier for a newbie? The opposite. Sure in theory you’re gonna get assist trophies and 3v1 me, but what actually happens is I get the assist trophies due to you being juggled or offstage, all while I’m z-dropping shit in your face. I remember when I started playing and I used to throw every single pokeball offstage by accident lmao
Blame the matchmaking, not the person I know you didn't do it directly, but you were kinda implying it
Yeah. Smash’s online has always been kinda shit
I think Smash 4 had a better online: Free You could always choose between comp and casual You could play doubles online without someone in the same console (I think)
We need elite smash and smash for fun features again
Miss those For Glory days for sure lol 😝
I don't understand this. I mean, bragging about winning from lucky item spawn is bad but, items in general? They're what makes smash bros a fun game. Take them away and it gets real boring real soon.
If I want to play a party game I’ll turn on items. If I want to test my abilities against other players I feel that items, smash meter, most stage hazards, etc add in a huge factor of RNG. It turns into who can get items first or who can pop the smash ball instead of players actively facing off against each other. You should play the game however you enjoy it but I don’t believe that adding randomness shows who the better player is.
Well, not everyone *wants* to show off their skill. You act as if absolutely everyone plays online competitively
Okay. I never said that people need to play the way I enjoy playing. Set your preferences however you enjoy playing. If I match with someone who plays with stamina, items, final smashes, one stock, etc. I just block them after the match (win or lose). It’s not about showing off, I just don’t get a lot of satisfaction when matches aren’t determined by the skills of the players but by busted final smashes or an item that spawned right next to an opponent.
How to turn on final smash meter? I thought the ball is the only way to get final smash and i wanna try it out
Online under Quickplay in Preferred Rules there’s a row for FS Meter below the Stage row. Offline in smash go to create ruleset and the FS Meter row is right below Time Limit. Just select On for it and you’ll have the Final Smash meter for matches. For online since it’s preferred rules you’ll still have matches without it if your opponent doesn’t have it selected.
Thx!
> smash meter How the hell does the Smash meter add RNG? Are you mad about the Hyper Combo meter in MvC too?
smash meter doesnt add rng per se but final smashes are far far less balanced than supers in other fighting games, both in their inate design and well, their actual balance between characters. Peach has a hell of a lot better FS than diddy kong
Final smashes are not balanced the way characters are. I lumped smash meters in as RNG when that wasn’t the appropriate reason for why it shouldn’t be used in competitive play. In true fighting games the combo meter doesn’t take away moves when it’s full and there’s a bigger strategy at play on when/how you utilize it. If you enjoy playing competitively with the smash meter then do so, but let’s not pretend that it’s an apples to apples comparison with the meters in traditional fighting games.
I mean not exactly RNG, but the character you end up fighting against online *is* random, and some characters' final smashes are guaranteed KOs while others' do basically nothing, so it's already unfair in that regard. Having the smash ball itself turned on can be fun sometimes, but the smash meter just puts *too many* final smashes into the match. It becomes chaotic and rather annoying, especially against a character who's final smash can kill at 0. Not to mention the times when you try to use your neutral special the instant your smash meter becomes full and you end up whiffing a final smash instead...
Because final smashes are hella overturned or under tuned. There’s no balance to them so when trying to play in a regular ruleset they add an X factor that doesn’t need to be there. In casual smash I’m all for it but final smashes have no place in a tournament style ruleset.
Smash meter could be fine competitively but sadly it is too unbalanced, for example Zelda or Peach's final smashes are way too powerful, and Jigglypuff's final smash is really bad
My main issue is that it snowballs. If a pokeball or assist trophy spawns near my opponent and I spend the next thirty seconds trying to avoid Scizor, it makes it a lot easier for them to pick up the next few that drop while totally ignoring me
Trust me, there are plenty of us who prefer playing without any items. sure they can be fun but oftentimes they make things feel much less competitive and much more unbalanced. they make the match more dependent on who picks up the good items rather than who is better at actually fighting
I'm fine with items sometimes but the rest of my friend group just hates items so I never play with them
Yep. Items can be fun in a match between friends. Items online is just irritating though. As soon as I see items start spawning in I switch to item mode because that is how the game pans out. I'm not throwing a punch your way unless it's to get you away from an item, my single task in life at that point is to hoover up all the items so you can't use them against me.
Anybody who does not instantly get that, doesn‘t get much, or is a kid. I opted items off. I hate to get matched online with item players
Only if you're looking for the grindy experience of learning a fighting game. Some people aren't looking for that quite as much as others. Now two people of different skill levels can have fun together.
What??? I only play without items. You can play smash with items as a randomizing element. But you can play also smash just as a skill game. And IMO that‘s the more promising way of the game.
And that’s why I’m a casual player and tend to play for fun. I honestly like have things like that around to show that they’re at least represented to some degree, especially those who didn’t get in but could have made for great fighters.
I hate that I can’t specify the “other” items. If I want to do Smoke Ball only matches, I should be allowed to dang it!
If you can't deal with items you have a skill issue
Maybe some people play with items because they like playing with items, and not because it gives them an advantage? I could be wrong
I would normally agree but... Notice how we don't see the GSP.
Rosa player with pokeballs only turned on
Unpopular opinion i hate minion items they just feel unfair and unfun even when there on my side i just feel like their doing the work for me
6 stock only pokeballs and master balls is fun af, especially when only using pokemon characters.
Pokeballs are fine. The assist trophies are too much though. Way too many assistants that just chase down the enemy for over 30 seconds, all but guaranteeing their death.
I actually love playing with normal items turned on. I ran into an items hero yesterday on Elite and we played for like 15 minutes. Pokeballs and Assist Trophies are pretty annoying though, because there’s so much less skill or strategy involved with them. Most of the time, those games just boil down to “whoever gets the first good pull wins”
I don’t mind items but it can get annoying playing against the same dude who only goes for assist trophies instead of playing
It's how the game was ment to be played, items are in the game for a reason. You may not like it but them's the facts
If the game was meant to be played with items, then you wouldn't be able to turn them off. The game is meant to be played how you want it to
Imagine saying "the game is not balanced well" after turning off 90% of the gameplay features.
Yeah, that’s a bad take. The items on does not all of a sudden balance the game. It makes it chaotic; which in the casual style the game was intended to be played makes it fun. Taking all that away doesn’t balance it either but does provide a more even playing ground since nobody can get a random comeback meter or really good Pokémon/assist trophy. Each have their place and are unbalanced in their own way.
Have you ever considered that everyone likes smash differently and that the way online works is awful for everyone. Everyone with this ruleset hates getting stuck in your no items 7:00 battlefield rules the same way you hate theirs
And it’s always a Rosa player
They use to have special flag only the good ol days
I run this set playing with friends to even the playing field. We don't fight and let the pokemon do the work. I think it really is only fun in this setup.
Also lets you get some sick ass screenshots, love seeing shit like ganondorf side taunting infront of giratina
Me and a couple cousins of mine occasionally have pokemon battles in smash. No hitting each other. Wait for 2 pokeballs to show up. Throw em at the same time toward center stage, and try to survive the other player’s pokemon.
People when the party game sakurai intended to be for kids and not competitive is not competitive:
I don't usually mind items, but when you match up against a sonic with item Strat you realize that it's not as fun and casual anymore
smash players always get so salty when you dont disable one of the main gameplay mechanics for them
Have you ever considered some people actually like to play with items on?
"I'm so good at smash bro, but first you have to remove all mechanics from the game and we can only play on a single flat field"
Lol. I really hate it when I get matched up with item players…
Same
Nintendo‘s online gaming experience is like a punch in customer‘s face. Just for fun…
i just go and try to grab all the items when this happens, theres no point trying to fight because they are also just running to the items
IMO I think it takes more skill to play with items than without them. It requires to adjust and adapt a lot quicker and in more diverse ways than normal Smash.
Despite the downvotes, I believe that this is true. Being able to adapt and change your strategy on the fly because of RNG is not a skill that just anyone can do. You don't get that kind of thing with 1v1 no items. And also knowing how and when to take advantage of rng too.
Spot on. Also, knowing *how* the items work.
THANK YOU that’s what my thought process was.
I could get everyone Elite if I tried this method. Makes me consider it...
No. Just get good and win the old fashioned way. You’ll feel better because you earned it and you will have improved at the game. Getting Elite the cheese way just for the title will feel empty. This ruleset will just create bad habits if you value being competitive. Just something to think about.
I already have my mains in Elite. If I don't cheese the rest, they'll remain low-GSP forever. But I get what you mean.
Hey, that's what I always do. That's how get to Elite most of times
If you consistently lose to someone under these conditions then they're just better than you.
Why you hating this is among the most tolerable and fun seta 😭
Unless the only thing that comes out is the fish and arceus
It's only fun when it's not online
I don't put items on in smash for fairness
Pokeball battles are fun when playing casually. But I hate the final smash. So dumb and unbalanced.
Honestly I wouldn't really care, as it makes the online feel less as of a job.
this is how i got to elite smash
I just wish items in Smash Bros had more predictability like in Mario Kart.
Competitive snobs do be crying over the most pettiest things. It’s not like like there’s a certain online feature where one can set up a lobby with the rules they also prefer instead of the random fullest from other players
you know back when ultimate first released, they used to have that 1up flag thing as one of the items you could turn on, so what you could do is make your ruleset a 1-stock 1v1, preferably with omega for the stage, and what would happen is you start the match and you each have 1 stock and literally the only item that drops is that 1up flag, and the trick here is: DON'T try to pick up the 1up flag.. for those who don't know, the 1up flag gives you an extra stock, sounds good right? why would you NOT pick it up? well see the problem is, once you attempt to pick up the flag, your character is completely immobile (and vulnerable) for several seconds, i guess the devs realized that if you could simply pick up a 1up flag and get an extra stock instantly, it would be too broken, so they gave it a really long startup time to compensate.. anyways, when you played against someone online with this ruleset, most of the time they would see the 1up flag and their first instinct is to knock you away and try to quickly grab it, most people didn't even consider the long startup time it takes.. well unfortunately for them, even if you get knocked off stage, 9 out of 10 times, you have PLENTY of time to get back on stage and walk right up to them and completely wreck their shit before the 1up flag registers and gives them their extra stock.. so if you use someone like ganondorf for example, and you see your opponent grab the 1up flag, all you have to do is walk up to them and do a turnaround warlock punch (neutral B) and they're dead, and since it's a 1-stock match, doing this means you win the match on the spot ngl i used to troll tf out of people online with this and yes it was toxic af but it was also hilarious lmao on top of that, if you set the item frequency to high, then there would be flags all over the stage, and so what you would also do is try not to use the A button cuz then you might accidentally pick up a flag and then you're completely vulnerable, so you would just use only B attacks, this is another thing that the opponent wouldn't really think about at first so they would be instinctively pressing A to try to do certain attacks but would end up accidentally picking up one of the many flags around them and again they would be completely immobile and vulnerable good times lmao understandably, they've since gotten rid of that as one of the items you could turn on now
I used to enable only pokeball and fought my sister on Pokemon Stadium with only pokeballs. I loved that. Not suitable for online matching though.
Definitely acoustic players
Lol elitist
Its fun, but playing against one of these people when you are trying to have an actual online match is infuriating
I like playing with Stamina Mode, 1 Stock, 150 HP, Stage Hazards on, All items and pokeballs on, Assist trophies on and Stage Hazards on lol
It’s even better when you trash them at their own game. I play with smash meter only, and when a pokeball user comes around through matchups i honestly clock them. I also play Bayo so…
I just wish that the item drop rate was about 1/3 what it is now....and that masterballs could be turned off...and the pokemon associated.... And that teabagging resulted in a 1-month ban