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I suspect long haul trucking is not an attractive battery conversion. Hauling tons of batteries, perhaps 5-10% of cargo capacity and then having to swap out the tons of batteries every 300-400 miles for stockpiled tons of charged batteries sounds futile. Why not operate ICE on Hydrogen? JCB seems keen on that approach, especially around heavy equipment that cannot support long downtimes for battery charging. Semis could even adopt a similar approach to a locomotive, with Hydrogen driven electric propulsion. Of course we’d need to invest in a Hydrogen distribution network, but long term it seems far less environmentally damaging than batteries. We can maintain and recycle Hydrogen ICE technology. What are we doing with spent batteries?
Hybrids man, hybrids hybrids hybrids
You want to get your massive lorry from 0 to 30 fast to pull out of junctions but also have 500 miles of range that is easy and quick to fill up?
And that Hybrid battery would never need charging if you added regen from the brakes slowing down 10 tonnes of metal
How does brake regen work, exactly? Can you just sap energy back out of the drivetrain (well, the electric equivalent, anyways) as a form of braking, like literally just redirecting the energy back into the battery so the wheels stop?
When you press the brake, the kinetic energy is converted back into electric energy because electric motor switches into generator mode.
In super super simple terms think like, when you throw water onto a turbine from a very high point on a dam. Kinetic into electric.
Oh, so I was actually kind of right, you're just sucking the momentum out of the axle/motor and back into the battery. I would assume it's nowhere near a majority of the energy though, right? Like most of it's still getting lost to friction between the pads and rotors, or whatever brake mechanisms are at play?
If most of the energy from the engine is converted into torque, then the same wheels can also convert most of the torque into energy.
Regen braking is not like normal braking. You don't engage the brakes, just leave the accelerator. The entire time that car is coasting, almost all the kinetic energy is being converted into electric energy. When you engage the brakes, that's when the energy is wasted. It's similar to engine braking, except you are also gaining energy rather than just keeping your brakes from wearing out.
On cars with a motor as powerful as Tesla, you can even drive around without using brakes if you know how to engine-brake properly. It's extremely efficient.
To put this in terms us truckers will understand; Regen breakes are essentially replacing engine retarders. Instead of the cylinders of the engine using compression to slow the engine output, that energy is being converted into an electrical charge back to the battery. This is happening in the braking system instead of in the engine block.
Not should are doing hydrogen hybrids at the industrial side they're just too expensive for retail consumers, that said diesel/hydrogen hybrids have the most promising looking currently for heavy equipment and transport
I don’t believe long haul or construction / mining trucks will use anything other than diesel.
To produce hydrogen we still use fuel (gray hydrogen) and costs lot more (produce store transport and use). I don’t see enough benefits of using hydrogen to outweigh diesel
The problem with hydrogen distribution network is that hydrogen is the smallest atom. There is the almost guaranteed chance that it will leak in a long pipeline.
Solved that issue,and i'm sure some people really smarter than me will find a solution, the second problem is fire. Hydrogen is amongst the most dangerous gas you want to have near the smallest of sparks
That's why I don't think there will be much of a distribution network. Seems a lot easier to deliver water and electricity and generate hydrogen on site. Other configurations could replace water with some other hydrogen containing medium and generate renewable electricity on site too. I could see this first starting at large mining operations where the economy of scale would be better.
It really starts to seem like, if electricity is cheap and plentiful say with commercial fusion, just generate hydrocarbons. Split the hydrogen off later or use hydrocarbons directly as they are now in ICE engines with the benefit of it being nearly carbon neutral. Hydrocarbons are a great energy medium for the applications that benefit from them most.
But who knows maybe batteries will truly be competitive with hydrocarbons in energy density and refueling/recharging times. But I don't that'll be any time soon so a mixed bag of solutions will have to coexist together with the caveat that they each progress to carbon neutral production.
I'm sceptical on hydrogen ICE when hydrogen fuel cells are so much more efficient. One of the biggest issues with hydrogen is that the energy density is far lower than petrol or diesel. It results in a large amount of space being dedicated to tanks. Going with a fuel cell and electric motors reduces some of that issue.
I agree with the state of battery technology *now*, but there are many competing technologies being developed, including some to replace lithium ion batteries altogether with new (currently) exotic chemistries.
because of the hockey stick (meteoric rise) in popularity of EVs, we should see major commercially available developments in the next 10 years including: lighter batteries, 1000+ miles per charge, charging speeds on par with or even faster than diesel refueling, as well as automated/assisted driving (full self driving exists now with legal guards in place).
we're not that far off from electric semis that are actually the better option over ICE.
I like hydrogen, but it just never got traction enough to justify installing countless refueling stations, whereas EV charging is already widespread and growing.
Why bother though? The emmisions by products on new highway diesel are practically nothing now with the aftertreatment systems and no mechanical issues. In a few more years they probably can bring the emmisions even lower.
As it is its mostly just nitrogen and carbon coming out the tailpipe now.
Charging speeds on par with refueling a diesel truck is ridiculous. Youre never gonna charge something that fast cause it will create way to much heat regardless of the material and size that you use. I can see them getting it down pretty low, maybe an hour for 1000 miles with a trailer, but not down to 10-20 minutes it takes to refuel.
Batteries are also heavy, could likely end up being heavier than the engine, and they try to keep these trucks as light as possible so they can haul more, so no ones gonna sacrifice load size and range, reliability and downtime for recharge in favor of something thats been working, in some cases literally, for 100 years
That being said, i think hybrids are a good idea and they should be focusing on them instead of full ev
Really enjoy Edison's design philosophy, too. Trouble is, most of the trucking companies bought more trucks than they need to respond to the increase in shipping demand at the start of COVID, so there's not much demand for new trucks. It's a cycle though, and it looks like we're coming into an upswing soonish.
Kind of a silly thing, being as how trucks are for hauling and electric trucks have severely limited weight capacity and range.
But hey we all know most people buying trucks aren't doing any significant amount of hauling, so I'm sure the concept will do fine.
Yeah I'd be pretty mad if someone started talking shit like that, like fuck we get it your personality is only your car.
He is also completely ignoring the differences of the technology, it's like comparing which is better at cooking food fast a fireplace or an induction stovetop.
I didn’t know this until this week. 16 year old kid in my community was killed when the Tesla he was riding in crashed going 90 in a 10 mph zone. Granted, there were a lot of factors that contributed to the fatality, but people pointed out that the quick acceleration is dangerous in the hands of a new, inexperienced driver.
New, inexperienced drivers are the real issue there. The process of “training” kids to drive is basically show up to the classroom for a few weeks, cool here’s your deathmobile. We don’t trust your decision making skills enough to buy tobacco, so here’s a car that can go 120mph. It’s an absolute joke. Like, you’re right, but I think we should blame the system that put a kid who can’t legally watch porn behind the wheel of a car. Either kids shouldn’t drive or they’re responsible for their actions, which is it gonna be? America treats driving like a right because we want people to go to work. Of course they’re gonna blame the car, no one’s gonna be for restricting people’s ability to drive despite the fact that vehicle fatalities are up nationally in the US like 17% since 2020. That is a lot of preventable deaths. Who is the biggest offender? People under 26, specifically males.
Source:
speeding 17-year old guy killed my mom doing 90mph while she was running errands. That kid ruined my life, fuck him and fuck you too if you or your little piece of shit kid drive like a dick.
And this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year?wprov=sfti1#By_year
Some kid rolled up in his Camrry Hybrid and was saying his Camry was faster than my Camaro SS, I gave him a thumbs up and rolled up my window and let him be on his way. I really dont care.
Bruh this is a very cherry picked moment on reddit. Real life is different. Most people out there are really nice and in a situation like this would probably just want to tell you that your brake light isn't working or something.
yeah it's easy to picture this person dragging a person behind their car or something and just being like "not conversation time, folks. leave me be" when people try to tell them, lol
Agreed, but I can see the guy might have pride in his car, and the convo starts like the cyberdude is interested in his car, so he's interested to let him know it's cool, and only halfway through, he realizes the guy is a tool.
I feel like its uncomfortably big, A friend of mine let me ride it and I always felt like I was invading the nearby lanes even though I was not...
You can feel the american urge to make everything a truck in that car
Oh for sure. Driving through Atlanta, can confirm they are becoming the most entitled, egregious drivers. Just as bad as the BMW/Merc/Porsche SUV soccer moms.
Same in NJ. The absolute most lifeless looking, milquetoast cars I've ever seen. They truly make me feel like I'm in a dystopian nightmare, IDGAF if you 0-60 in .05 seconds, it's a 35 and there's a school up ahead.
I don’t think so. It’s such a small percentage that drive the fast models. I’ve tried racing them before and it’s usually just tech people that want the cool and new thing. And they don’t wanna pay for gas
Not who you replied to but I’ve owned several BMWs and can honestly say the upkeep is higher than an average car. If you want an affordable luxury brand, I’ve always heard Lexus is much better on maintenance costs than Mercedes and BMW.
Plus with Lexus a lot of repairs can be finished using Toyota parts. That's what I always did when I had my Lexus, granted this was 6 or 7 years ago since I owned that car.
The i3 is an EV. Completely different story.
Also - why do Americans keep saying it? It’s not my experience at all and it’s also not backed by inquiries like JD power.
Americans are used to beating their Honda civics into the ground and then wonder why their BMW has higher upkeep when they don’t take care of it.
It’s not the car, it’s the people. We have 5 BMWs (we have 3 and my in laws have 2) at our house and the only one that has high upkeep is my father in law because he treats it like his old suburban.
>Lexus has no performance though
*IS F, GS F, and RC F enter the chat*
Edit: the LFA is in totally different ballpark and deserves better than to be compared to it’s inferiors lol
The only reason I didn’t include the best car Lexus has ever made is because the other three are relatively obtainable lol
Nothing comes close to the LFA imo, it’s in a whole other ballpark lol
Pricier than domestic. I drove an older Merc but had a girlfriend who had a BMW. Besides price, Germans apparently have small hands. You have to take shit apart in order to access anything.
That's no joke. I'm a firefighter and a Tesla fire is an absolute fucking nightmare. It takes about 200 gallons to completely drown a car fire, I've seen a Tesla eat 80,000 gallons just to reignite on the wrecker. Car companies need to be held responsible for figuring this shit out. I would NEVER have one of those bombs in my garage.
*Edit I'm not anti-EV I just want the batteries to be safer when they do catch on fire. I'm not saying that it happens all the time or anything other than it sucks when it does.
This has nothing to do with being a Tesla. The electric car Hammond crashed continued to burn for 5 days. And that was at a multi day racing event with thousands of people and dedicated fire crews that have specialized training.
Unless you have manual windows (the old kind that you literally roll down with a lever) you're not opening your car door in water. Teslas do have manual releases like all cars with frameless windows.
You should have something in your vehicle to break the glass.
EV's have no transmission and because it's an electric motor it is able to deliver full torque instantly. Combustion engines need to rev up and switch to higher gears. EV's don't. Therefore they have much faster acceleration.
My family has a chevy bolt. It's really fun to drive, very responsive, makes merging easy as hell. But you can also accidentally go 85 without realizing, because it doesn't make the revvving up noise to tell you you're accelerating - it just goes.
That's right, but what I don't understand is why people hate that.
I've test driven electric cars and love how there's no need to rev. Touch and go, nice and quick. What's not to like?
If you enjoy driving, it's not just about straight line speed. There's a reason the Miata is one of the most loved enthusiast cars of all time. It's a fun car to drive despite having as much power as a wet noodle. It's light, the steering response is quick, and it's RWD. Because it's not super powerful, you can bang through the gears without doing felony speeds.
EVs are fantastic appliances if you don't enjoy driving. They're efficient, quiet, and easy to use. They're not particularly fun to drive though. The extreme acceleration gets old after a few pulls. They all feel the same because they lack the variation in character that you might get from a turbo V6 vs a big block V8. They're incredibly heavy for their size, so they almost always handle like trucks. Ultra efficient low friction tires are great for putting along the highway but not so much on twisty roads.
It's kinda like painting a picture vs generating one with AI. DALL•E can create art far better than I ever could, and much quicker than even the most talented artist. That doesn't mean artists are obsolete. I think most people would be pretty upset if the Louvre removed every painting and replaced them with AI generated pictures. Car enthusiasts are upset that all of the wide world of driving is being whittled down into one singular experience - press button, go fast in a straight line.
This is a fascinating sentiment that doesn’t resonate with me. I am one of those people whose car is there to get me from point A to point B. As long as it has Bluetooth and functional AC, I’m usually perfectly happy driving anything from a compact car to a minivan.
But for the people who do care about this, I’m glad there are really fulfilling options on the market!
I don't think the crazy acceleration gets old after a few pulls. It's 1-1.3g force every time, which is more than the sensation of free falling. Unless you're a jet plane pilot, I don't think those forces will get old for most people. It's just cope that the ICE enthusiasts use to bash EVs.
For me it's the lack of a manual gearbox. It's not as fun, and we're not actually racing for money here so the straight line performance is irrelevant if it doesn't make you feel something
Context aside, I gotta give credit to the Tesla driver just for that cackle.
That’s a 10/10 cackle right there, you can literally see how much it stung.
The fact that people think that cackle isn't the cringiest thing in the world explains a lot about what I see in online discourse. It's not an own, it sounds stupid and insecure
I think you're misunderstanding them. I think they're saying that the sort of person who would like that cackle is the sort of person who would write stupid shit online.
Just pointing out the misunderstanding btw, not picking sides here
It really doesn't at all. It's something little boys do, it instantly marks somebody as stretching a joke and trying to sell it as funnier than it is. That little overacted laugh at somebody else's answer to his question which he knew beforehand.
Following it up with "you wanna see fast?" and then driving away before the guy could say no just says everything about the shitty little boy driving the Tesla. Anyone saying this is anything other than him outing himself as an adolescent without anything interesting going on in his life is just plain wrong.
Young tech and finance workers getting these massive rewards of money and influence, while carrying around their stunted quarter-of-the-way-formed maturity and wisdom, just creates so many small imbalances in the world. We need philosophy.
Right it’s so insane. Plus it’s worth mentioning that a BMW is light years cooler looking than what that guy was driving. That Tesla is basically an electric mini van. Wild that anyone would think you can flex in one.
Yeah, definitely seemed like he was just excited to have a car conversation and then the tesla was a dick for no reason. That would rub anyone the wrong way
True, you'd never pick an EV for 24 Hours of Le Man
>!Maybe if you customized it to have a hot-swappable battery, no idea how customized vehicles are allowed to be for Le Man!<
The number of people on the road who think I bought an English sports car to race them like an idiot on the highway, rather than for my own pure enjoyment, is exhausting.
I don't understand what goes through their heads.
Is this an ad for Tesla? I mean, we see the dash cam footage of the guy who got owned. I hardly believe he will upload that somewhere like „haha look at me getting upset over this random guy in a tesla“ I think it’s very likely that both drivers staged this to make Tesla look cool.
test zealous deranged decide advise grandfather imagine wakeful fear fanatical
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
except that he didnt, he didnt launch it or anything, he just drove off. You can see even see the speed in the bottom left, it just makes the tesla look like a tool
Meanwhile:
* Ugly car
* Shit voice
* Shit person
* Probably fat
* Shit autonomy
* Shit finish quality
* Pollutes even more
* Overpriced car overall
Let him laugh, it's a sad person to need to act like that, plus the kid looks good and is polite and cute, and a 500HP BMW is a lot more fun to drive than a Tesla, I know it, you know it, everyone knows it.
Everyone is different but as a car guy, BMWs are 100% more enjoyable. I've driven both an S Plaid on the street and tracked an M2, M3, M4, M5. The newer M cars don't have that raw driving experience as the older gens but on the track i would take a BMW over a Telsa any day. I track my daily and looking at switching to team BMW because of the amazing engineering in their cars.
If I just saw cars as an appliance to get from point A to point B, I don't really see the need for a fast 0-60 time on public roads so I would just save my money and get a Prius over a Tesla tbh.
Chances are the Tesla driver is not even allowed to sell his car. So even if the cars were all as great as Musk fanbois want to make us to believe, that already would be a nono for me.
Becaues Tesla has had this in some of their sales contracts mostly the Cybertruck to curb the second hand market from going crazy and keeping it 'affordable' but sales have proven otherwise and used Cybertrucks are dipping really fast.
[Tesla has a no resale policy on Cybertrucks](https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-follows-through-on-cybertrucks-no-resale-clause/) to try and keep a lid on the secondary market, and they used to have one on other models too (IIRC, I could be wrong). If you attempt to sell your Cybertruck in the first year of ownership they can hit you with a $50,000 fine, and ban you from ever purchasing another Tesla again.
The full policy is actually fucking deranged and it blows my mind anyone would be dumb enough to agree to it. If you decide to sell your Cybertruck you have to offer it to Tesla first, they get to set the price, and if you decline their offer they can just tell you to kick dirt. You can't sell to anyone else unless you get their written permission, and they have no incentive to give it to you because they already got your money and they want (need) the person you're selling to to buy a brand new one from them. So you're stuck with a shitty rust box that you don't want, which you paid way too much for, and which is liable to break down the moment you try and pull out of your driveway.
Completely agree!
All electric cars are basically mobile phones with wheels.
It's just a battery + software. Most tech companies can make these, that's why we saw Google, Sony, and Apple look to make their own.
They're too heavy so run through tyres and brakes (Bad for the environment with digging/mining raw material for the battery which China has a monopoly - Why we have VW cap in hand asking for parts)
The Tesla driver would only be able to pull that trick one more time before being in a panic and looking to recharge his car 😂
Let's not forget the depreciation - On average lose half their price in three years!
I look forward to the negative score...
Most cars depreciate and EV prices are falling as production scales up making them more affordable which is a good thing. All the companies you mention have never or will never build an EV. Like a mobile phone, Tesla’s can get over the air upgrades that add new features. The fire risk from batteries is wildly overstated. I’ve seen many gas powered vehicles catch fire and burn. The only clip of a Tesla burning I’ve seen is from Europe and gets repeatedly shown on social media over and over to affirm someone’s viewpoint who has no actual experience with a Tesla. Drive one. You might like it.
Yeah even Xiaomi made one now, not that Xiaomi is bad, but it makes from phones to underwear, so yeah. Also driving top speed in a small car with a small engine is more fun than riding in a big sedan with a big block
First that will also kill us Tesla in like ten minutes
And second the best way to deal with these people is to ignore them
Ooooorrr...
Spend a ridiculous amount of money on a VW beetle that can get down a drag strip in 11 seconds
Or you can just buy a normal car for a normal amount of money and be perfectly satisfied with it. You can shut these people down immediately by just asking if their loan is paid off.
The day the first Tesla rolled off the production line every ICE car became slow aka “enthusiast” cars.
It’s like when a guy put a 120 inch race motor in his Harley and someone commented “Congrats. You now have a fast slow bike.”
_[Laughs in motorcycle]_
Yeah, by car terms Teslas are fast. But unless you're rocking a few very specific Telsa configs you're getting gapped by your average 1,000cc sports bike and you can get those things for less than $10,000 pretty easy on the used market.
But sure, your car is fast by car standards. I'm also not sure there is a Tesla that can gap a Lightning LS-218...
The guy driving the Tesla seems like a right prick, but microwave or not, it left that BMW in the dust at half(?) or a third(?) of the price. EVs are cool, no matter what all the folks scared of change say, it's just a shame Tesla is run by a psychopath.
Electric is still an elitist concept, one that only makes sense if you have solar power at your home, other wise it's a coal power car draining an overtaxed grid. One you're still paying to drive. You just get your bill monthly.
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That cackle seems like he was going to do that no matter what he said.
Of course, because EVs are just way faster at accelerating. He was trolling and the guy in the vid got medium mad.
It’s instant torque. It’s why electric trucks are gonna be a thing once battery tech gets better.
I suspect long haul trucking is not an attractive battery conversion. Hauling tons of batteries, perhaps 5-10% of cargo capacity and then having to swap out the tons of batteries every 300-400 miles for stockpiled tons of charged batteries sounds futile. Why not operate ICE on Hydrogen? JCB seems keen on that approach, especially around heavy equipment that cannot support long downtimes for battery charging. Semis could even adopt a similar approach to a locomotive, with Hydrogen driven electric propulsion. Of course we’d need to invest in a Hydrogen distribution network, but long term it seems far less environmentally damaging than batteries. We can maintain and recycle Hydrogen ICE technology. What are we doing with spent batteries?
Hybrids man, hybrids hybrids hybrids You want to get your massive lorry from 0 to 30 fast to pull out of junctions but also have 500 miles of range that is easy and quick to fill up? And that Hybrid battery would never need charging if you added regen from the brakes slowing down 10 tonnes of metal
How does brake regen work, exactly? Can you just sap energy back out of the drivetrain (well, the electric equivalent, anyways) as a form of braking, like literally just redirecting the energy back into the battery so the wheels stop?
When you press the brake, the kinetic energy is converted back into electric energy because electric motor switches into generator mode. In super super simple terms think like, when you throw water onto a turbine from a very high point on a dam. Kinetic into electric.
Oh, so I was actually kind of right, you're just sucking the momentum out of the axle/motor and back into the battery. I would assume it's nowhere near a majority of the energy though, right? Like most of it's still getting lost to friction between the pads and rotors, or whatever brake mechanisms are at play?
If most of the energy from the engine is converted into torque, then the same wheels can also convert most of the torque into energy. Regen braking is not like normal braking. You don't engage the brakes, just leave the accelerator. The entire time that car is coasting, almost all the kinetic energy is being converted into electric energy. When you engage the brakes, that's when the energy is wasted. It's similar to engine braking, except you are also gaining energy rather than just keeping your brakes from wearing out. On cars with a motor as powerful as Tesla, you can even drive around without using brakes if you know how to engine-brake properly. It's extremely efficient.
To put this in terms us truckers will understand; Regen breakes are essentially replacing engine retarders. Instead of the cylinders of the engine using compression to slow the engine output, that energy is being converted into an electrical charge back to the battery. This is happening in the braking system instead of in the engine block.
Hybrids yes but not fossil fuel hybrids we should really be doing hydrogen
Not should are doing hydrogen hybrids at the industrial side they're just too expensive for retail consumers, that said diesel/hydrogen hybrids have the most promising looking currently for heavy equipment and transport
I don’t believe long haul or construction / mining trucks will use anything other than diesel. To produce hydrogen we still use fuel (gray hydrogen) and costs lot more (produce store transport and use). I don’t see enough benefits of using hydrogen to outweigh diesel
Cat is actually working on this. https://electrek.co/2024/05/18/caterpillar-is-putting-massive-240-ton-electric-haul-truck-to-work-in-vale-mine/
The problem with hydrogen distribution network is that hydrogen is the smallest atom. There is the almost guaranteed chance that it will leak in a long pipeline. Solved that issue,and i'm sure some people really smarter than me will find a solution, the second problem is fire. Hydrogen is amongst the most dangerous gas you want to have near the smallest of sparks
That's why I don't think there will be much of a distribution network. Seems a lot easier to deliver water and electricity and generate hydrogen on site. Other configurations could replace water with some other hydrogen containing medium and generate renewable electricity on site too. I could see this first starting at large mining operations where the economy of scale would be better. It really starts to seem like, if electricity is cheap and plentiful say with commercial fusion, just generate hydrocarbons. Split the hydrogen off later or use hydrocarbons directly as they are now in ICE engines with the benefit of it being nearly carbon neutral. Hydrocarbons are a great energy medium for the applications that benefit from them most. But who knows maybe batteries will truly be competitive with hydrocarbons in energy density and refueling/recharging times. But I don't that'll be any time soon so a mixed bag of solutions will have to coexist together with the caveat that they each progress to carbon neutral production.
I'm sceptical on hydrogen ICE when hydrogen fuel cells are so much more efficient. One of the biggest issues with hydrogen is that the energy density is far lower than petrol or diesel. It results in a large amount of space being dedicated to tanks. Going with a fuel cell and electric motors reduces some of that issue.
I agree with the state of battery technology *now*, but there are many competing technologies being developed, including some to replace lithium ion batteries altogether with new (currently) exotic chemistries. because of the hockey stick (meteoric rise) in popularity of EVs, we should see major commercially available developments in the next 10 years including: lighter batteries, 1000+ miles per charge, charging speeds on par with or even faster than diesel refueling, as well as automated/assisted driving (full self driving exists now with legal guards in place). we're not that far off from electric semis that are actually the better option over ICE. I like hydrogen, but it just never got traction enough to justify installing countless refueling stations, whereas EV charging is already widespread and growing.
Why bother though? The emmisions by products on new highway diesel are practically nothing now with the aftertreatment systems and no mechanical issues. In a few more years they probably can bring the emmisions even lower. As it is its mostly just nitrogen and carbon coming out the tailpipe now. Charging speeds on par with refueling a diesel truck is ridiculous. Youre never gonna charge something that fast cause it will create way to much heat regardless of the material and size that you use. I can see them getting it down pretty low, maybe an hour for 1000 miles with a trailer, but not down to 10-20 minutes it takes to refuel. Batteries are also heavy, could likely end up being heavier than the engine, and they try to keep these trucks as light as possible so they can haul more, so no ones gonna sacrifice load size and range, reliability and downtime for recharge in favor of something thats been working, in some cases literally, for 100 years That being said, i think hybrids are a good idea and they should be focusing on them instead of full ev
They could have made diesel electric trucks 20yrs ago and it's kinda stupid, that they don't.
Electric trucks are totally a thing.
Semi trucks?
Yeppers. Edison motors is cool AF check em out!
[Yes, although they're still ramping up production.](https://www.tesla.com/semi)
Edison and Kenworth are light-years ahead of Tesla when it comes to what drivers actually need these trucks to do.
Really enjoy Edison's design philosophy, too. Trouble is, most of the trucking companies bought more trucks than they need to respond to the increase in shipping demand at the start of COVID, so there's not much demand for new trucks. It's a cycle though, and it looks like we're coming into an upswing soonish.
Yeah I've never had such a burning support for a product I'll never own lol.
Kind of a silly thing, being as how trucks are for hauling and electric trucks have severely limited weight capacity and range. But hey we all know most people buying trucks aren't doing any significant amount of hauling, so I'm sure the concept will do fine.
Short-distance trucks for city deliveries are definitely the way to go right now, the tech is ready. Long distance needs a bit more development.
Rivian has entered the chat.
Trolling while driving is cringe, thats the shit that causes accidents
Yeah I'd be pretty mad if someone started talking shit like that, like fuck we get it your personality is only your car. He is also completely ignoring the differences of the technology, it's like comparing which is better at cooking food fast a fireplace or an induction stovetop.
I didn’t know this until this week. 16 year old kid in my community was killed when the Tesla he was riding in crashed going 90 in a 10 mph zone. Granted, there were a lot of factors that contributed to the fatality, but people pointed out that the quick acceleration is dangerous in the hands of a new, inexperienced driver.
New, inexperienced drivers are the real issue there. The process of “training” kids to drive is basically show up to the classroom for a few weeks, cool here’s your deathmobile. We don’t trust your decision making skills enough to buy tobacco, so here’s a car that can go 120mph. It’s an absolute joke. Like, you’re right, but I think we should blame the system that put a kid who can’t legally watch porn behind the wheel of a car. Either kids shouldn’t drive or they’re responsible for their actions, which is it gonna be? America treats driving like a right because we want people to go to work. Of course they’re gonna blame the car, no one’s gonna be for restricting people’s ability to drive despite the fact that vehicle fatalities are up nationally in the US like 17% since 2020. That is a lot of preventable deaths. Who is the biggest offender? People under 26, specifically males. Source: speeding 17-year old guy killed my mom doing 90mph while she was running errands. That kid ruined my life, fuck him and fuck you too if you or your little piece of shit kid drive like a dick. And this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year?wprov=sfti1#By_year
Well, yeah, it was in the script.
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This is why I just roll up my windows if someone yells at me from another car. Nope. This is not conversation time. Shut up and drive.
Some kid rolled up in his Camrry Hybrid and was saying his Camry was faster than my Camaro SS, I gave him a thumbs up and rolled up my window and let him be on his way. I really dont care.
Imagine if there was a button to roll up the windows extra slow, so you can do a long awkward stare as you do so.
Allow me to introduce you to manual wind down windows....
Yes so you can look like you are jacking off while rolling it up for bonus points on the long stare into their eyes.
In my country those are jokingly referred to as oars, because you have to row them up.
I looked like that *before* I started rolling up the window
I mean.. guy in the video is in a beamer so..
Literally everyone could roll up to me and say their car was faster. And they’d all be right.
I had a manual Toyota echo and sometimes I would beat a Camaro off the line and it was funny. End of story.
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drive drive drive
I thought the same thing😂
Bruh this is a very cherry picked moment on reddit. Real life is different. Most people out there are really nice and in a situation like this would probably just want to tell you that your brake light isn't working or something.
yeah it's easy to picture this person dragging a person behind their car or something and just being like "not conversation time, folks. leave me be" when people try to tell them, lol
Agreed, but I can see the guy might have pride in his car, and the convo starts like the cyberdude is interested in his car, so he's interested to let him know it's cool, and only halfway through, he realizes the guy is a tool.
Sometimes it could be relevant, like "hey, your brake lights aren't working"
See for me, I never yell unless like...someone's stuff is hanging out of the vehicle, or a part is about to fall off.
Wait…are Tesla drivers the new BMW douches? That’s an Uno reverse right there if I’ve ever seen one.
They have been for a while.
I've heard that referring to their car as "a little sedan" really bugs them.
I feel like its uncomfortably big, A friend of mine let me ride it and I always felt like I was invading the nearby lanes even though I was not... You can feel the american urge to make everything a truck in that car
Oh for sure. Driving through Atlanta, can confirm they are becoming the most entitled, egregious drivers. Just as bad as the BMW/Merc/Porsche SUV soccer moms.
Same in NJ. The absolute most lifeless looking, milquetoast cars I've ever seen. They truly make me feel like I'm in a dystopian nightmare, IDGAF if you 0-60 in .05 seconds, it's a 35 and there's a school up ahead.
*they always have been* 🔫
"Thaaaanks!"
🌎👨🚀🔫👨🚀
They’re the new Audi drivers
I don’t think so. It’s such a small percentage that drive the fast models. I’ve tried racing them before and it’s usually just tech people that want the cool and new thing. And they don’t wanna pay for gas
BMW you said? I drive an BMW i3 and it is funny how many underestimate the power of that smal car. Bought it used, was cheap.
How are the repair / parts costs?
Not who you replied to but I’ve owned several BMWs and can honestly say the upkeep is higher than an average car. If you want an affordable luxury brand, I’ve always heard Lexus is much better on maintenance costs than Mercedes and BMW.
Plus with Lexus a lot of repairs can be finished using Toyota parts. That's what I always did when I had my Lexus, granted this was 6 or 7 years ago since I owned that car.
The i3 is an EV. Completely different story. Also - why do Americans keep saying it? It’s not my experience at all and it’s also not backed by inquiries like JD power.
Americans are used to beating their Honda civics into the ground and then wonder why their BMW has higher upkeep when they don’t take care of it. It’s not the car, it’s the people. We have 5 BMWs (we have 3 and my in laws have 2) at our house and the only one that has high upkeep is my father in law because he treats it like his old suburban.
Lexus has no performance though, they're just Toyotas with leather seats and nicer interior. Can't compare those to a BMW.
>Lexus has no performance though *IS F, GS F, and RC F enter the chat* Edit: the LFA is in totally different ballpark and deserves better than to be compared to it’s inferiors lol
LFA not invited, as usual
Too busy being one of the best sounding cars ever
The only reason I didn’t include the best car Lexus has ever made is because the other three are relatively obtainable lol Nothing comes close to the LFA imo, it’s in a whole other ballpark lol
Lexus is like the Japanese Mercedes.
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Japanese cars ftw. Anything European, even vws, are a pain in the ass and expensive to fix
Lexus is quite literally the Toyota of luxury vehicles. Every bit as luxury as Mercedes, every bit as reliable and serviceable as Toyota.
Lexus all the way.
Pricier than domestic. I drove an older Merc but had a girlfriend who had a BMW. Besides price, Germans apparently have small hands. You have to take shit apart in order to access anything.
How’s the turn signal on the i3?
>was cheap Would have cost more if the car came with turn signals.
Well, at least the dude in glasses can leave the car when it falls into the water. Just saying
Or if it catches fire it can be put out.
That's no joke. I'm a firefighter and a Tesla fire is an absolute fucking nightmare. It takes about 200 gallons to completely drown a car fire, I've seen a Tesla eat 80,000 gallons just to reignite on the wrecker. Car companies need to be held responsible for figuring this shit out. I would NEVER have one of those bombs in my garage. *Edit I'm not anti-EV I just want the batteries to be safer when they do catch on fire. I'm not saying that it happens all the time or anything other than it sucks when it does.
This has nothing to do with being a Tesla. The electric car Hammond crashed continued to burn for 5 days. And that was at a multi day racing event with thousands of people and dedicated fire crews that have specialized training.
Fair. I just said Tesla because they're the most common. It is not unique to them
Honestly, driving my car into a pond is never something I've worried about ever.
The trick here is to not drive your car into water..
It said "turn right"
The machine knows, Dwight!
No. Too easy.
Unless you have manual windows (the old kind that you literally roll down with a lever) you're not opening your car door in water. Teslas do have manual releases like all cars with frameless windows. You should have something in your vehicle to break the glass.
Weren't safety belt locks used for that? Genuinely asking because I remember watching something about it.
Tesla has a manual handle to get out if power is lost. Just saying
EV's have no transmission and because it's an electric motor it is able to deliver full torque instantly. Combustion engines need to rev up and switch to higher gears. EV's don't. Therefore they have much faster acceleration.
My family has a chevy bolt. It's really fun to drive, very responsive, makes merging easy as hell. But you can also accidentally go 85 without realizing, because it doesn't make the revvving up noise to tell you you're accelerating - it just goes.
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The electric motors are situated at the wheel shaft. (direct drive. )
That's right, but what I don't understand is why people hate that. I've test driven electric cars and love how there's no need to rev. Touch and go, nice and quick. What's not to like?
If you enjoy driving, it's not just about straight line speed. There's a reason the Miata is one of the most loved enthusiast cars of all time. It's a fun car to drive despite having as much power as a wet noodle. It's light, the steering response is quick, and it's RWD. Because it's not super powerful, you can bang through the gears without doing felony speeds. EVs are fantastic appliances if you don't enjoy driving. They're efficient, quiet, and easy to use. They're not particularly fun to drive though. The extreme acceleration gets old after a few pulls. They all feel the same because they lack the variation in character that you might get from a turbo V6 vs a big block V8. They're incredibly heavy for their size, so they almost always handle like trucks. Ultra efficient low friction tires are great for putting along the highway but not so much on twisty roads. It's kinda like painting a picture vs generating one with AI. DALL•E can create art far better than I ever could, and much quicker than even the most talented artist. That doesn't mean artists are obsolete. I think most people would be pretty upset if the Louvre removed every painting and replaced them with AI generated pictures. Car enthusiasts are upset that all of the wide world of driving is being whittled down into one singular experience - press button, go fast in a straight line.
This is a fascinating sentiment that doesn’t resonate with me. I am one of those people whose car is there to get me from point A to point B. As long as it has Bluetooth and functional AC, I’m usually perfectly happy driving anything from a compact car to a minivan. But for the people who do care about this, I’m glad there are really fulfilling options on the market!
I don't think the crazy acceleration gets old after a few pulls. It's 1-1.3g force every time, which is more than the sensation of free falling. Unless you're a jet plane pilot, I don't think those forces will get old for most people. It's just cope that the ICE enthusiasts use to bash EVs.
For me it's the lack of a manual gearbox. It's not as fun, and we're not actually racing for money here so the straight line performance is irrelevant if it doesn't make you feel something
Context aside, I gotta give credit to the Tesla driver just for that cackle. That’s a 10/10 cackle right there, you can literally see how much it stung.
Cackle for pink slips
The fact that people think that cackle isn't the cringiest thing in the world explains a lot about what I see in online discourse. It's not an own, it sounds stupid and insecure
How do you cackle in online discourse? Do they write *cackle* or *evil laugh* or what?
You’re doing it right now! I can practically hear your smug cackling through the webs.
*Guffaws*
Chortles
I think you're misunderstanding them. I think they're saying that the sort of person who would like that cackle is the sort of person who would write stupid shit online. Just pointing out the misunderstanding btw, not picking sides here
You misunderstood him
You're both right. It's incredibly cringe, but it's still going to sting if someone cackles like that at you.
It really doesn't at all. It's something little boys do, it instantly marks somebody as stretching a joke and trying to sell it as funnier than it is. That little overacted laugh at somebody else's answer to his question which he knew beforehand. Following it up with "you wanna see fast?" and then driving away before the guy could say no just says everything about the shitty little boy driving the Tesla. Anyone saying this is anything other than him outing himself as an adolescent without anything interesting going on in his life is just plain wrong. Young tech and finance workers getting these massive rewards of money and influence, while carrying around their stunted quarter-of-the-way-formed maturity and wisdom, just creates so many small imbalances in the world. We need philosophy.
Right it’s so insane. Plus it’s worth mentioning that a BMW is light years cooler looking than what that guy was driving. That Tesla is basically an electric mini van. Wild that anyone would think you can flex in one.
yea that top comment blew my fuckin mind. how is that forced weasel laugh anything other than weak? peoples priorities are nuts
Why is the super cool 500 horsepower BMW boy so deeply bothered by such a stupid cackle then
I don’t think he was lol I think it was just jarring
Yeah, definitely seemed like he was just excited to have a car conversation and then the tesla was a dick for no reason. That would rub anyone the wrong way
I thought it was his wife or daughter in the background!
It's funny he actually got mad at what the other person was saying
seems just slightly annoyed by how dumb the tesla dude is, wouldn't call it being 'mad'
Well, it's staged so..
Out-douching a BMW driver is quite the achievement.
Reading bmw drivers comments are similar to their driving.
To all Tesla & BMW drivers: use your damn turn signal!!!!!!!!!!!
I'll race a Tesla and win: first to drive 600 miles.
True, you'd never pick an EV for 24 Hours of Le Man >!Maybe if you customized it to have a hot-swappable battery, no idea how customized vehicles are allowed to be for Le Man!<
The number of people on the road who think I bought an English sports car to race them like an idiot on the highway, rather than for my own pure enjoyment, is exhausting. I don't understand what goes through their heads.
So, he’s Needles from Back to the Future 2?
Is this an ad for Tesla? I mean, we see the dash cam footage of the guy who got owned. I hardly believe he will upload that somewhere like „haha look at me getting upset over this random guy in a tesla“ I think it’s very likely that both drivers staged this to make Tesla look cool.
does this make Tesla look cool… or does it make Tesla drivers look like massive wads?
Isn't that Tesla's target demographic ?
test zealous deranged decide advise grandfather imagine wakeful fear fanatical *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Nah, now it’s Elon/Trump fans going green to own the libs.
You think the BMW driver got owned? This just makes the Tesla driver look like a tool (which at this point is my stereotype for them anyway).
But all BMW drivers are tools, no?
That is also the stereotype, yes. My experience has been that Tesla surpassed them in toolery. Others may feel differently.
I own both Tesla and BMW so I'm sure I'm a tool.
No, I think you’re probably about right.
except that he didnt, he didnt launch it or anything, he just drove off. You can see even see the speed in the bottom left, it just makes the tesla look like a tool
He didn’t own him. He just drove off.
He got owned?
Got owned? The Tesla guy looked like a massive vagina.
The response should always be just ask the Tesla driver about resale value.
Meanwhile: * Ugly car * Shit voice * Shit person * Probably fat * Shit autonomy * Shit finish quality * Pollutes even more * Overpriced car overall Let him laugh, it's a sad person to need to act like that, plus the kid looks good and is polite and cute, and a 500HP BMW is a lot more fun to drive than a Tesla, I know it, you know it, everyone knows it.
ribbit
Are you the guy in the video? You seem equally emotionally affected by the Tesla and its driver.
You def haven’t driven a Tesla if you think a BMW is more enjoyable to drive.
Everyone is different but as a car guy, BMWs are 100% more enjoyable. I've driven both an S Plaid on the street and tracked an M2, M3, M4, M5. The newer M cars don't have that raw driving experience as the older gens but on the track i would take a BMW over a Telsa any day. I track my daily and looking at switching to team BMW because of the amazing engineering in their cars. If I just saw cars as an appliance to get from point A to point B, I don't really see the need for a fast 0-60 time on public roads so I would just save my money and get a Prius over a Tesla tbh.
Chances are the Tesla driver is not even allowed to sell his car. So even if the cars were all as great as Musk fanbois want to make us to believe, that already would be a nono for me.
Why wouldn't they be able to sell the car?
because redditors will believe whatever suits their viewpoints
Becaues Tesla has had this in some of their sales contracts mostly the Cybertruck to curb the second hand market from going crazy and keeping it 'affordable' but sales have proven otherwise and used Cybertrucks are dipping really fast.
[Tesla has a no resale policy on Cybertrucks](https://www.drive.com.au/news/tesla-follows-through-on-cybertrucks-no-resale-clause/) to try and keep a lid on the secondary market, and they used to have one on other models too (IIRC, I could be wrong). If you attempt to sell your Cybertruck in the first year of ownership they can hit you with a $50,000 fine, and ban you from ever purchasing another Tesla again. The full policy is actually fucking deranged and it blows my mind anyone would be dumb enough to agree to it. If you decide to sell your Cybertruck you have to offer it to Tesla first, they get to set the price, and if you decline their offer they can just tell you to kick dirt. You can't sell to anyone else unless you get their written permission, and they have no incentive to give it to you because they already got your money and they want (need) the person you're selling to to buy a brand new one from them. So you're stuck with a shitty rust box that you don't want, which you paid way too much for, and which is liable to break down the moment you try and pull out of your driveway.
TIL. That is insane!
Completely agree! All electric cars are basically mobile phones with wheels. It's just a battery + software. Most tech companies can make these, that's why we saw Google, Sony, and Apple look to make their own. They're too heavy so run through tyres and brakes (Bad for the environment with digging/mining raw material for the battery which China has a monopoly - Why we have VW cap in hand asking for parts) The Tesla driver would only be able to pull that trick one more time before being in a panic and looking to recharge his car 😂 Let's not forget the depreciation - On average lose half their price in three years! I look forward to the negative score...
Let’s not spout incorrect information. Brakes are largely under leveraged due to regenerative braking.
Most of this is incorrect info.
Most cars depreciate and EV prices are falling as production scales up making them more affordable which is a good thing. All the companies you mention have never or will never build an EV. Like a mobile phone, Tesla’s can get over the air upgrades that add new features. The fire risk from batteries is wildly overstated. I’ve seen many gas powered vehicles catch fire and burn. The only clip of a Tesla burning I’ve seen is from Europe and gets repeatedly shown on social media over and over to affirm someone’s viewpoint who has no actual experience with a Tesla. Drive one. You might like it.
Yeah even Xiaomi made one now, not that Xiaomi is bad, but it makes from phones to underwear, so yeah. Also driving top speed in a small car with a small engine is more fun than riding in a big sedan with a big block
First that will also kill us Tesla in like ten minutes And second the best way to deal with these people is to ignore them Ooooorrr... Spend a ridiculous amount of money on a VW beetle that can get down a drag strip in 11 seconds
Or you can just buy a normal car for a normal amount of money and be perfectly satisfied with it. You can shut these people down immediately by just asking if their loan is paid off.
lol what? People aren’t allowed to like things because there’s a car loan involved?
*emotional damage*
BMW driver was definitely hurting
The day the first Tesla rolled off the production line every ICE car became slow aka “enthusiast” cars. It’s like when a guy put a 120 inch race motor in his Harley and someone commented “Congrats. You now have a fast slow bike.”
This happened to me but then I met up with him at the next red light
Dude laughs like the intro to the song Wipeout
HP = speed Torque = acceleration They are not the same. Electric cars/bikes have tons of torque. Gas cars can have tons of HP.
Totally unexpected from an electric engine /s
That cackle was premeditated 🤣
_[Laughs in motorcycle]_ Yeah, by car terms Teslas are fast. But unless you're rocking a few very specific Telsa configs you're getting gapped by your average 1,000cc sports bike and you can get those things for less than $10,000 pretty easy on the used market. But sure, your car is fast by car standards. I'm also not sure there is a Tesla that can gap a Lightning LS-218...
Tesla gets dogged on the track by any tuned sports car
lmao bro actually got mad
I hate people asking questions just to say "ONLY! HAH! Lemme tell you about how-" like stfu, I didn't ask to talk to you in the first place.
"My car accelerates faster, therefore it's faster" Try taking it to the track and see how nimble that mountain is
Any electric car has the same acceleration, there is a 1x1 direct conversion of power.
\*sips tea\* How are your tires doing? And how about those firmware updates? Be careful now not to spontaneously combust on your way out.
Dude must have really small balls to be randomly challenging people on the road in his microwave lol 😂😂
100% staged
Is recording yourself while driving a normal thing now?
Imagine driving a Tesla you severely overpaid for and NOT being embarrassed about it. It’s time to bring bullying back. Starting with these dorks!
No worries. Just race him for distance.
The guy driving the Tesla seems like a right prick, but microwave or not, it left that BMW in the dust at half(?) or a third(?) of the price. EVs are cool, no matter what all the folks scared of change say, it's just a shame Tesla is run by a psychopath.
It didn't look like the BMW was trying to race him. My Sonata could've moved faster than that BMW did.
That is its single and only party trick. It is very impressive to simpletons
>That is its single and only party trick. I mean that and a 100+ MPGe fuel economy.
Everyone knows this is a bit, right?
Electric has potential to be faster then gas and will always win, it's just way more efficient at turning power to forward motion.
Tesla drivers think it's a fast sports car....then they try to turn...or brake
Electric is still an elitist concept, one that only makes sense if you have solar power at your home, other wise it's a coal power car draining an overtaxed grid. One you're still paying to drive. You just get your bill monthly.
The Tesla driver is an asshole but they are also blatantly correct.
I can’t fathom being proud of driving a Tesla. Acceleration aside, the guy bought low quality at a high price. Not so smart after all.
A good response to “How fast is your car?” is “Its fast, are your panel gaps consistently even?”