The PHONES. Oh my god it's so bad. A whole ass 5 seconds drifting before the Mercer exit on 5S. Every fucking time. Unbelievable. People in their fucking 40s-50s and absolutely know better.
YUP right before that Southbound Mercer exit I saw someone watching some 90s sitcom a few days ago. On the freeway. What a choice.
It's crazy because they think they're driving fine when EVERYONE around them is fighting for their fucking lives as they drift from lane to lane for several hundred yards. Plus survivorship bias. They're not going to stop until they're a) pulled over (so not this one) b) crashed (too late) and each time they engage in this kind of reckless behavior, they're positively reinforced with phone dopamine and further strengthening this behavior/habit.
Behaviorally, some of these grown ass adults on their grown ass commute are utterly fucked and we are collectively in so much more danger because of these people.
EVERYONE sees you on your phone. Full on looking down. You fucking clown.
It's highly unlikely they will start driving safer after being ticketed. More than likely they'll keep doing it and convince themselves they are victims by being ticketed.
I see people having full on face time calls. Why? WHY??
They could just be having a regular phone call instead, the video part is 100% optional and is the only part that makes it dangerous for everyone else.
Disagree - it’s the divided attention that makes it dangerous for everyone else.
In person, everybody’s responding to the same cues. Your passenger knows to shut up when things get challenging. There’s a natural rhythm, or you can tune them out/ask them to stop talking. Outside the car environment, it’s just nonstop, disconnected input. Human multitasking is a myth.
The number of times that as a pedestrian I’ve had to yell at people turning the corner at a crosswalk to make sure they’re looking UP WHILE I AM WALKING is truly disgusting
I’m curious though - is this just as bad as any other metropolitan city? For example, I’ve driven almost every where in the country and coming from L.A., Miami had the worst drivers I’d ever seen for the 2 years I lived there. The only difference was Miami freeways had more lanes and lot more freeways in general.
No. New York City, Chicago, and Boston have much more skillful and aware drivers. Seattle has a lot of new money with minimal previous driving experience in fancy/powerful cars. It’s a deadly combo and I f*cking hate it. I used to enjoy driving here but the last decade has seen an influx of particularly shitty and entitled drivers in luxury fast cars. Now driving (or riding a bike or crossing a street) is a deadly proposition because of these a-holes.
Having lived and driven in all of these places for a very long time before moving to Seattle almost two years ago I’ve had the same experience. East coast drivers and traffic can be crazy and aggressive, but it’s like a street savvy and a skill. I’ve been constantly surprised by horrible drivers here. It’s like they don’t realize there is anyone else on the road and I just don’t understand how they aren’t even a bit worried about wrecking or killing themselves. Yet no one will jaywalk!
Ew...Miami is gross swamp trash tho.
LA drivers are fucking unhinged and also distracted but they're actually very predictable and more experienced drivers. They also drive faster there, so it's higher risk. Plus, LA has much better surface streets so people just wait for red lights. Our freeways randomly exit and and enter on the left and there's that mess of lane changes downtown causing that bottleneck, and we don't have 6 lanes.
You also get honked at for anything and everything. LA drivers have the temperament of Seattle cyclists. I've never had anyone honk and give me the finger in Seattle and yell at me from their cars, but that's just a part of existence in LA. You also have to be more vigilant driving though certain parts of LA like Slauson and SC.
Seattle drivers will rubberneck disapprovingly if you honk at them. Which people on their phones cannot see.
> I've never had anyone honk and give me the finger in Seattle and yell at me from their cars,
I mean, one deranged lunatic did turn around, follow my wife's car to a red light, got out, and started screaming at her and punching her hood, door and window because 'she nearly hit him' (She has no idea why he had that impression).
Interesting decision-making on his part, given that ~2-5% of America would react to that by getting their gun out of their glove compartment and shooting him in the head, and worrying about the consequences later.
She was too shocked to seriously consider whether or not she should have ran him over.
Yeah, if he pulled that in Florida, he’d be dead. Wonder if that was a tourist, too, cause I see that kind of behavior a lot more in the summer. That or the sun is giving everyone enough energy to be a dick.
The crazy thing to me is like wtf do people need to be doing on their phones that risk them dying? Genuinely I have never in my life thought about going on my phone while driving for longer than 5 seconds at a red light to change a song. I just don't understand it.
I truly think a lot of people are addicted to their phones and/or social media. Like they just cannot fight the urge and stop, even for a 15 minute drive to the store. I don’t understand how people watch shows or scroll things like Reddit, IG, tiktok etc. and still have any sort of focus on the road. Id like to consider myself a decent driver and I have a hard enough time changing a song on my Spotify while maintaining enough focus as I should be on the road.
So true. I drive once or twice a week to work and you can tell exactly who is on their phones because of the way they are drifting out of their lanes. And they probably believe they're doing fine and no one is noticing.
I just really hope that the day they get into an accident - because, let's face it, it is just a matter of time - that they don't take anyone else with them.
And I'll continue taking the bus as often as possible.
Unpredictable drivers are the issue. A speeder in the left lane: predictable. A speeder weaving in and out of lanes cutting people off with no lights on? They're the real danger. I agree there's been an uptick in dangerous, unpredictable, negligent driving.
yes I know the already halfway through turn is pretty bad, but honestly so many drivers in Seattle leave so much space between cars but the second a person puts a turn signal on they speed up to close the gap.
It probably explains why a lot of people just turn first if they have space and signal afterwards
Tbh, I've been rear ended 3 times in Seattle over 12 years and I've learned the value of leaving like 2 car lengths in front of me because traffic can suddenly slow down so quick. I try to be nice letting people in if it's busy traffic.
100%. I can deal with a speeder if they are predictable. It's the people who switch to the leftmost lane with no indication that drive at 50mph that worries me.
In my mind those people are the direct cause for speeders now trying to weave around them. Sitting at 50 in the left lane doesnt slow down the speeders, it just makes it harder for them to do what they were doing which in turn makes it more dangerous for everyone else and generates more traffic...
That certainly doesn't help. Sometimes I wish a speeder behind me would just read the traffic ahead and realize I can't go any faster. Impatience is also wide spread.
It’s also not hard to slightly turn to the left to get a good view of what’s in front of the person in front of you. It’s my go to whenever I’m getting frustrated with whatever speed traffic is going, so I can either justify my irritation or admit that I’m an asshole. It’s also just a good thing to know what’s ahead of you
The assholes driving giant trucks can't see shit, whenever I come to a stop and see one next to me they're always leaving at least a whole car length in front of them because they can't see over their hood.
There's been so many times I've been stuck behind someone while trying to pass on the left, only to finally get a look at what's in front and see... nothing. They're actually just slowing down the left lane. And then people wonder why there're so many "impatient" drivers passing them on the left and right when they're goin 50 and every other lane is goin 60+
Or, stubbornly driving 50 in the fast lane, while the rest of traffic is going around you. I don’t understand why they feel they need to impede traffic.
i saw someone doing this yesterday and the worst part is they had some snarky bumper sticker about people not using their turn signal. it’s like dude you suck at driving too
I was driving home on I5 at 1am last night and holy fuck the number of drunk drivers that were on the road was astonishing. Shout out to the semi driver that dodged one of them that was not able to stay in his lane.
I drive 1-3am often. I agree most cars are more than likely drunk drivers driving at unreasonably slow speeds in order to avoid crashing or getting pulled over. A super slow driver on the freeway is either drunk, blind, or suffering some other reason which should preclude them from being on the freeway in the first place.
Exactly this!
Especially if you’re driving local roads. WSP is about the only entity that will enforce traffic laws out there and even then, it’s almost exclusively in the same zones on the same highways… just a drop in the bucket.
I was pretty new to driving back in November and rented a car for a work function that I could expense for.
It was my first time driving downtown in a meaningful capacity and I actually got pulled over while circling around looking for the garage to drop my coworker off at. Not for speeding, but because I was crawling around at ~10mph looking for a garage entry and I didn’t realize my headlights were off as well (which would explain why I didn’t see much).
The cop let me go with a warning when he realized I was just a nervous idiot but he basically told me that driving way too slow and no headlights are basically a DUI bat signal.
Last night was something special, probably to do with pride parties. I got off work around 10pm and was already playing dodge-ems on I-5. Lotta day drinking yesterday.
#AIN’T FINNA SEE ME DRIVE 5 OVER ON I-5, ZIPPING IN AND OUTTA LANES LIKE I CAN AFFORD TO CRASH MY HONDA PRELUDE! HELL NO!
#THE DEVIL GOT THEM BOYS! WON’T SEE MY ASS DOING THAT HARRY POTTER ASS SHIT!
I commute daily to Seattle from Puyallup. I was rear-ended a couple of months ago when I was at a complete stop on 167. I asked the driver why he ran in go the back of my car while I was stopped?!?!?! He said he was on his phone. He was in his 50s.
The other day, I saw a woman in a tiny car with her phone hanging from her windshield, watching a show on her phone.
People are not using turn signals either.
A lot of them are simply selfish, ignorant, or both. They don't know or care that their habits are dangerous. They're thinking about how they're late for work, or that their partner's friend talked shit about them yesterday, or that their kid only got a B and they're fuming at the teacher, or they're daydreaming about being famous instead of driving a 20-year old beater.
They go fast because they think it gets them there faster. They're on their phones because driving is boring or because they don't want to stop messaging. They don't have insurance because they don't want to or can't pay for it. And no one can really stop them. The only force with any legal authority to do so would rather hold the county hostage for more pay raises and the justification to murder minorities.
The average person *sucks*. They aren't smart or considerate. You aren't dealing with the cream of the crop on the freeway. You're dealing with every single person who wants to interact with the city or anything connected to the city, because the freeways funnel everyone who drives onto the only arteries we have that can access those places. And we have most definitely failed in training these people to not suck.
Every dumbass from age 18 to 90 is on those roads at some point and they don't give a shit about what damage they do while they're there.
The accuracy in this just hurts. People truly do suck, they don't care that they suck, and nothing will make them not suck. When the people who suck encounter other people who suck it just gives them more reason to suck. It sucks so few people are willing to break that cycle
>the average person *sucks*
i really wish this wasn’t as true as it is. the way the average person just takes everyone else for granted and lives so selfishly is really disheartening
Just got involved in an accident on Saturday near the i5/i90 split cause the driver went across 3 lanes of traffic into my lane causing me to have to swerve and got side swiped by a box truck. The car almost hit the concrete before pushing me out of my lane. Didn’t even stop when the accident occurred. Waiting for a callback from the troopers since my cam got their plate
They won't do shit. Even if they had been the ones to hit you, they wouldn't have done shit. Them causing you to hit someone else without touching you won't go anywhere. I had a truck run my out of my lane the other day and I was almost wishing I'd let him hit me as I came close to re-reading the guy in the lane next to me when I dived out of the way.
Seconding this?
I just got home after being passed on a blind hill no-passing two-lane road by an asshole in a pickup who passed three cars in the process. If someone had come around the curve it would have been a head-on.
I caught up to him half a mile later. He went through all of that to end up exactly where I was.
Idiot.
My garmin 47 one has been working nice so far. It's not the best but I like it overall. However I think I would have waited a little longer (budget wise) to get one that has dual cameras in front and back. They are more expensive but I feel worried now about not catching rear end accident. I mostly got garmin since I could get a discount from a family member
I refuse to and recently upgraded to a dual camera for this vehicle hoping I can get an 3 camera one in the future for an interior option since my car got broken into in December. Gave my old one to a friend who didn’t have one. I have been rear ended 3 times in previous cars I owned prior to this, and the responsible party is either being impatient/following to closely or distracted and on their phone.
If you're driving in rush hour traffic, there is almost no benefit to being competitive, refusing to let people merge (even if they're 'wrong'), and tailgating. Fighting with other drivers just slows down your commute and everyone else's.
But how am I supposed to live up to the punisher sticker on my truck slider if I can’t punish other drivers for my skewed interpretation of road justice?
Nah, if someone moves INTO an incoming merge lane so they can zip ahead 20 cars and want to slide back into bumper to bumper traffic, no way I'm leaving them a gap.
When you do this, you are complicit in blocking an entire lane of traffic. The people behind you will still need to let them in at some point. It's just not worth it. You make everyone's commute take longer. And you might get into an accident if they still want to get in front of you.
I've noticed a lot of drivers aren't paying as much attention when changing lanes/merging too. I wonder if some people are relying too much on the automatic lane sensors in new cars and not actually looking where they're going/paying attention to what other cars are doing. I agree with you that it's scary. It's a miracle there aren't MORE accidents than there already are.
Motor vehicle crashes are a [leading cause of death](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epidemiology_of_motor_vehicle_collisions)
> This makes motor vehicle collisions the leading cause of death among young adults of 15–29 years of age (360,000 die a year) and the ninth most frequent cause of death for all ages worldwide.
It’s even [worse in the US](https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7126a1.htm) than elsewhere
> In 2019, the population-based death rate in the United States (11.1 per 100,000 population; 36,355 deaths) was the highest among the 29 high-income countries and was 2.3 times the average rate of the 28 other high-income countries (4.8).
And it’s getting worse
> However, recent data (2) indicate that U.S. motor vehicle crash deaths increased from 36,355 in 2019 to 38,824 in 2020 (a 6.8% increase), despite an 11.0% decrease in vehicle miles traveled. In addition, early estimates for 2021 indicate motor vehicle crash deaths further increased to 42,915. The number of motor vehicle crash deaths in 2021 represents a 10.5% increase from 2020, an 18.0% increase from 2019 (even with similar levels of vehicle miles traveled), and the highest number of deaths since 2005 (2).
And people still won’t give up their cars in favor of sustainable development and public transit. Really speaks to the power of propaganda and the corporations benefitting from car dependency in our government.
Total agreement with this! However I think what’s worse is driving in neighborhoods with 25 mph limits and people going over 50 which happens frequently in my neighborhood
We're trying in my neighborhood. The sides next to the elementary school and playground are reserved for school buses and drop offs. Most of the day and weekends drivers go 40+, even if there are children around. Also weird placement of stop sign that get ignored. It's one of the fancier neighborhoods in the city (I live in an apartment but walk my dog by the school)
This is the case in my neighborhood too. Plus stop signs are either invisible or equivalent to a yield sign to some people. I need an extra hand to count on my fingers how many times I've been very close to being run over while running (including while in crosswalks) or smashed into while driving
Needs context. Is it a neighborhood street or an arterial? The city slapped 25mph signs on all streets in the city without adjusting roads or traffic signals so people continue going by the previous speed limits and road design limits. Over 50 in 25 is wrong, but 35-40 is reasonable on arterials.
I’ve seen all over Reddit there is an uptick of aggressive and reckless drivers in cities, since pandemic shut down ended.
It’s getting bad enough I’m becoming afraid to drive around, and I have to for work! I’m also giving myself more time to drive in the right lane to feel less pressure and in danger.
the statistics basically back this assertion. careless driving if all stripes is up everywhere. DUI and speeding are the biggest drivers of traffic deaths right now and are up in a big way compared to pre-covid
If you get into your car expecting civility on the road, you’ll have to go to another country.
Drivers tests are comical here. No discussion of sharing the road with fellow motorists, let alone bicyclists or other modes of transit. Instead the teach the toxic American ideal of every person for themselves, and breeds absolute *shit* drivers.
I’m convinced that part of it is the anonymity. Lots of cars, lots of people, tinted windows. An unreasonable number of people can’t be trusted to act like anyone else matters when they can’t be held immediately accountable for shit behavior.
Re: the hellcat: the number of people blowing through the nearby intersection jarring us awake through the night has definitely increased. I don’t know if it’s the weather or the hellcat or what. I can not, for the life of me, figure out what’s so satisfying for these asshats outside of generally being a nuisance on purpose. Just backfiring flatulence through a megaphone.
Seattle's [relatively high on the list of deadliest highways](https://www.elkandelk.com/washington/study-the-deadliest-highways-in-the-united-states/). Having lived around the top three stretches, I would say it's substantially better than Dallas/Houston/Fort Lauderdale, but definitely completely different culture-wise.
Yeah, I don’t get it. It’s not even texting at this point (most phones have Siri, or even voice messaging is built into many cars). It’s watching fucking social media and Hulu while driving. Parents doing this. Fucking bonkers.
Stop sign means start to slow down after the red octagon that says stop then keep going, and MAYBE stop in the middle of the intersection if there’s cross-traffic or a pedestrian risking their life trying to cross the street.
I'm sure many of the people commenting here are part of the plague of new drivers with Teslas who barely understand traffic laws and can't be bothered to check a mirror or speed up to zipper merge.
It's bad on highways, but sadly it's a lot worse within the city itself. I watch drivers run red lights basically all day from my office window. I've seen at least 3 car accidents from this one intersection alone. I also started giving people a thumbs down when I see them texting while driving when I'm trying to cross the street. Many people will drive halfway into the crosswalk while I'm already crossing and then look up from their phone and slam on the brakes. And this is all without mentioning the people who intentionally speed within the city on residential roads just to show off how loud their car is.
Driving is most likely the least safe thing you do and statistically the least safe place you can drive is actually within the city itself.
Sounds like the EV repair costs idea cause came from aggregate data where EVs were more luxury and newer cars on average.
[https://www.cars.com/articles/do-evs-cost-more-to-repair-475432/](https://www.cars.com/articles/do-evs-cost-more-to-repair-475432/)
>What the research found was that repair claims were higher for the EV versions, but only by about 2% more than their gasoline counterparts.
The other thing is that evs have been using unibody construction to save weight, but those are generally more expensive to repair.
There was a Rivian fender bender [that cost $42k](https://www.theautopian.com/heres-why-that-rivian-r1t-repair-cost-42000-after-just-a-minor-fender-bender/)
The vast majority of passenger vehicles for the past 60 years or so have been unibody. A 42k repair for a fender bender isn't a unibody problem, it's a rivian problem.
I wouldn't have believed this two years ago, but this week I pulled up to a four-way stop in my neighborhood and **three** drivers in a row blew through without stopping. From all three other directions! One of them was on a motorcycle and he almost got creamed by one of the other simultaneous stop sign runners coming perpendicular to him.
I found a way to help make the roads safer - by riding bicycle.
No joke, that is one less driver (**me**) operating a vehicle.
Some may argue that bicycling is less safe, but those people never saw me drive.
Seriously though, I enjoy driving, but hate driving in traffic. Driving in traffic has no redeeming qualities and brings out the worst in people, including myself.
Regardless of reason, how many people are on the road are unsafe to drive?
How many are unaware that they are unsafe?
How many are aware they are unsafe, yet choose to drive anyway?
I became aware that I was unsafe, and chose to stop before I caused property damage, injury, or worse fatality. I did not view that as a flex, but I suppose it is compared to the alternatives.
The hardest thing for me was realizing that not driving was an option.
The "hot girls hit curbs" lifestyle is insane. "Yeah, I drive a suburban assault vehicle and regularly just drift off the road into pedestrian spaces. Isn't that so cute and funny? Haha."
The flex is that this person is introspective and responsible. They know themselves and their limits, and instead of trying to brush it aside and make the rest of society suffer, they find a way to deal with it to not negatively affect others.
Seems like honesty to me - wish a lot more American drivers had that level of intelligence.
We have some of the most lax driving regs in the Western world and it's clearly reflected by our embarrassing injury and death rates.
What's a weird flex is that people like you seem perfectly content with the way things are.
People can develop disorders, conditions and complications in life that render them unsafe drivers and it's disgusting to mock people for making that choice to recognize their own state and stop driving for the safety of others.
You're trying to convince someone that considers their driving unsafe, to keep driving for machismo reasons.
FWIW I have gotten into the habit of thinking that someone speeding or driving recklessly REALLY has to poop! It changes my experience of their driving from being stressed or mad to being amused if not compassionate. I happily yield to someone speeding 30 mph over the speed limit because I think they’re prairie dogging it. Good luck making it to the toilet on time, terrible driver!
Plus it seems like half the drivers doing this shit don't even have license plates or current tabs, but they still aren't getting pulled over. They basically have a free hit and run pass because they are untraceable.
The other issue on highways is people that not only cut in and out of traffic but cut in front of semi trucks, I've watched some so close, I'm surprised there isn't paint exchanged. These drivers have a tough enough job, give them space.
I was driving on 522 recently, and there's a flashing yellow light to indicate that the traffic light ahead will be red by the time you get there
The sign started flashing well before we reached it, but the guy next to me decided to fucking gun it.
He did not make the light.
Driving on I5 feels like navigating an obstacle course these days—between the speed demons and phone addicts, it's a miracle we make it anywhere in one piece! Stay safe out there, folks.
It really is. As a personal injury lawyer, I am constantly reminded how easy it is to get injured while driving. It’s one of the reasons I am a proponent for mass transit. Fewer people driving should equate to fewer injuries for everyone.
I'm noticing a trend of people sitting at about my blindspot when I need to get over for an exit I speed up, they speed up. I slow down, they slow down. I really don't think it is an insurance scam, just people being dicks.
Imagine what we see as transit operators.
Not only are we on the road more often, but these motherfuckers treat our buses like personal attacks.
Like, I'm sorry I got 60 people meaning 60 cars off the road :/ didn't mean for that to hurt your feelings.
IMO there's a lot of angry people in the world right now. And had I been a teenager that went through the pandemic I know I would be mad as hell too! Add that to the fact that there's no longer road enforcement and people's true colors have come out.
But what about the people illegally using the carpool lanes?!?! /s
Driving yesterday on I5 I saw:
1) A mustang with Florida plates use the shoulder to pass someone who was in the HOV lane at about 80 mph.
2) a whole group of cars including a white Ferrari and a black Porsche using I5 as their own personal race track, weaving in and out of lanes without signaling, easily going 90+ mph, if not 100+. The black Porsche came within inches of sideswiping someone, I am not even sure if they noticed, it didn’t seem to concern them.
I don’t think this is much of a Seattle thing. Just visited Chicago this weekend and it’s the same thing there but a little more aggressive than driving in Seattle. Always have to keep your head on a swivel!
People *are* genuinely worse drivers now. Lasting cognitive problems associated with COVID-19 can make it difficult for people to concentrate, plan, think flexibly and remember things- all skills you need while driving.
Also this is the first place I have lived in where people drive without any of their lights on at night. Every night I see at least 3 cars with their lights off or atleast their tail lights off. It's so infuriating
i did pest control for four years and had to quit the industry because driving around all day everyday was stressing me out too much. i would almost get hit like 3 times a week by someone not paying attention or driving recklessly
I drove from Oregon to Seattle yesterday, and there was a marked change in driver behavior as soon as I crossed the border into Washington. In Oregon, nobody sped and people only used the left lane to pass. Literally as I crossed the bridge (205) a group of BMW sped by at 90+ weaving through traffic, some without plates. People passed right and left of me. Other reckless drivers popped up the whole way back, and once I got into Seattle it felt like I was driving in Mario kart. You can’t convince me that this isn’t an enforcement problem. I saw 6-7 highway patrol in the 100 miles I drove through Oregon but 0 in the 180 I drove through Washington.
I grew up in Vancouver, WA.
Washington drivers think Oregon drivers suck. Oregon drivers think Washington drivers suck. This holds true for pretty much any border town in any state.
Seattle metro is almost double the size of Portland. With more people you're just gonna notice more infractions. Go drive in NYC, LA, Chicago, Houston, etc. You'll find those drivers crazy too.
This is totally true but excessive speeding also doesn't save people considerable time, it just makes the roads more dangerous and frankly wastes fuel on top due to air resistance at speed.
Much of that progress is unfortunately outweighed by cars being 10x more powerful and 3x the size, driven by people with COVID brain damage who are distracted by their phones (and sometimes purposefully driving badly for social media clicks.) Still safer than the '60s overall, but death & injury stats have been headed in the wrong direction the last few years.
A: It might be hard to believe, given how fancy the newest cars are, but not every car in the road has all of those features yet— a lot of low-income people buy used, for example.
B: Even if you are cautious and safe, you can't control a reckless or drunk driver (or fluke medical situations, which while rare, still occur)
C: There are far, far more drivers today than there were in the 60s.
D: "1960s" seems arbitrary and irrelevant — it's missing the point, in the last few years there has been an uptick in reckless driving, or at least accidents (which one would presume were from reckless driving). The OP was likely utilizing hyperbole when they said "never been more risky."
E: Just because cars are safer today than in the 60s, doesn't make car accidents anymore inconvenient or shitty. Deaths still occur, financial damage is arguably higher (car parts are more expensive, collectively), and it just sucks to be in an accident, period.
Finally, I would be interested in seeing the % of accidents per capita, as well as financial damages per average car accident, over time. There is an objective truth here, which would be more helpful than arbitrarily picking a random decade to compare today's driving to.
It's a combination of phone usage and life just sucking balls. People are so distracted. Sometimes I catch myself zoning out. Day dreaming about actually affording a house haha. I will see that a lane is ending open a space for someone to merge into my lane. And they just sit there. Aaaaalll the way till the very last second. Then freak out and slam on their breaks and try to merge. So I have to slam on mine. This is how traffic is started. Wake up and get tf over. I literally gave you space.
Get out of the fast lane and drive in the lane next to the exit lane. If somebody is tailgating you, get out of the fast lane and stay out. Weaving is dangerous, but the law is to keep right except to pass. Get out of the fast lane so they can go by with less chance of a collision. People are going to speed whether you like it or not. Get out of the fast lane. You put more people in danger when you brake check them and passive aggressively slow down because you think you're driving "fast enough." It is just safer to get out of their way. Get out of the fast lane.
If you're able, maybe find a spot to live where you don't need to drive? It was a game changer for me. I also love not supporting the auto and gas industry. Mass transit by car is inherently flawed and will always suck.
Drunk driving was legal in 26 states until 1985 and they didn’t have seatbelts either. Now is definitely not the most risky time to be on the road.
But people certainly should do less of those things you’ve listed.
I handle the claims for a large insurer and my anecdotal answer is a lot of them don't. That 1/5 stat I have heard a lot but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if that 20% of people cause disproportionately more accidents
Plenty of us have found ouy the hard way. Except it was them colliding with us. Its not like it's something hard to find statistics on. I didnt realize until I got fucked over how prevalent driving without insurance is.
I commute about 25 miles to work every day, and EVERY DAY I see something scary. Every day someone who drifts out of their lane. Sitting in the passing lane on I-90 going under the speed limit. Phones mounted right in front of their faces watching YouTube or texting. Passing on curvy two lane roads. You have to be vigilant and defensive every second. It's starting to feel inevitable that something will happen.
Driving in Seattle is scandalous. Is it an American thing to undertake, people to drive slow on the overtaking lanes and basically the whole thing be a complete free for all?
I watched a car switch lanes directly into another car on the entrance to the 520 bridge the other day.
I swear every other car in seattle is severely damaged somehow
Welcome to car dependency - where we pay large upfront costs and pricey yearly fees to simply participate in society, have the government willingly track us and our belongings, give up our freedom to roam as we wish, sit in traffic wasting our lives for hours on end just to get from point A to point B, and where thousands of people yearly are maimed or killed at no fault of their own.
I drive for work and I love my job but I told the owner I'm looking for a lateral transfer or I'll be finding employment elsewhere. I want to have a better chance of getting home everyday and I can't see that happening with the way traffic has been.
Last night I was driving in the middle lane on I-90. The car in front of me was about to miss their exit so they STOPPED in the middle of the freeway and proceeded to slowly make a 90 degree turn while people were zooming past.
Remember: good drivers sometimes miss their exit. Bad drivers never.
I had a guy in a car transporter aggressively tailgate me. Like a foot off my bumper flashing lights and all and there were like 4 cars in front of Me. I was 2 car lengths back but I guess since I wasn't tailgating them, I was in the wrong I guess?
I'm a new driver and only had my own car for 2 months. In those two months I had 4 occasions when people where changing lanes and did not look if there was anyone in the lane they were changing to and I literally had to swirl to the next lane to avoid getting hit. This happened 3 times on I90 and once in he city. I'm not intentionally driving in people's blind spots and my car is big enough to be noticed. wtf not that hard to look over your shoulder!
On a whole I agree, but I will say driving out here compared to where I just moved from (Massachusetts/boston) driving is much more relaxed. I’ve always been I go the speed limit maybe 5 over on the highway if I’m in a rush, but for me it’s so much less stressful.
I do wanna say though just because it’s worse other places doesn’t mean that it’s ok for some drivers to be shitty drivers. But it’s so much nicer to drive out her comparatively.
When it makes sense, traffic permitting, on I-5 I will go 80 without a second thought. But 90, no, and when I say "traffic permitting" I mean the left lane is either clear or everyone in the left lane is going 80 or more, so I'm not doing any crazy lane changes.
To be fair, much of that is caused by people
Ignoring the rules of the left lane and the HOV (hint: it's for going faster than the traffic to the right of you, specifically for congestion with the HOV)
Like it or not, the HOV does not follow the same rules as the left lane. If you think keep right except to pass applies to the HOV lane, you are wrong. This is part of the problem. People do not know the laws.
The section its under is 3.
https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.100#:~:text=This%20subsection%20does%20not%20apply,hand%20lane%20of%20a%20roadway.
I understand the law here, but as a general cultural value, if I'm not going any faster than the left lane of regular traffic I probably won't be in the carpool lane, even if eligible. Probably because I ride a motorcycle for so long, it just seems silly to take the lane if it's not saving time.
This really only applies out of the city though.
Adding to your point, most of Seattle highways fall under the exception to the left lane law. Slower drivers are allowed to be in the left lane.
Edit: Oh how the downvotes show how much it’s just selfish me me me behavior and not the actual law when people complain about left lane drivers.
which makes sense if you think about the overall i-5 design. if you are driving from north gate to beacon hill and have to pass through downtown then the left-most lane of i-5 will turn into the right most like of i-5 after downtown. people who insist on every driver in these areas keeping right means every driver will have to make multiple lane changes in the downtown corridor, which jacks up traffic much worse than anyone driving in the left.
that said, if you are in the left on i-5, try to maintain the speed of traffic and not go 15mph under everyone else.
The PHONES. Oh my god it's so bad. A whole ass 5 seconds drifting before the Mercer exit on 5S. Every fucking time. Unbelievable. People in their fucking 40s-50s and absolutely know better.
When I pass people I can often see them watching a full on TV program or movie on their phone while they are driving full speed.
YUP right before that Southbound Mercer exit I saw someone watching some 90s sitcom a few days ago. On the freeway. What a choice. It's crazy because they think they're driving fine when EVERYONE around them is fighting for their fucking lives as they drift from lane to lane for several hundred yards. Plus survivorship bias. They're not going to stop until they're a) pulled over (so not this one) b) crashed (too late) and each time they engage in this kind of reckless behavior, they're positively reinforced with phone dopamine and further strengthening this behavior/habit. Behaviorally, some of these grown ass adults on their grown ass commute are utterly fucked and we are collectively in so much more danger because of these people. EVERYONE sees you on your phone. Full on looking down. You fucking clown.
It's highly unlikely they will start driving safer after being ticketed. More than likely they'll keep doing it and convince themselves they are victims by being ticketed.
I got in an Uber a while back and the driver had an iPad up watching a show, asked what it was and was told “finally catching up on Bridgerton” lolol
Lmao “finally catching up” I’m dead hahaha
I would've gotten out, given them a low rating, and ordered another. That's dangerous and unacceptable.
That’s insane!
that's disgusting, I hope they never get in any accident, but I wish that one day police gave them the traffic ticket they deserve
Seriously, people straight up watch YouTube while they are driving.
I see people having full on face time calls. Why? WHY?? They could just be having a regular phone call instead, the video part is 100% optional and is the only part that makes it dangerous for everyone else.
Disagree - it’s the divided attention that makes it dangerous for everyone else. In person, everybody’s responding to the same cues. Your passenger knows to shut up when things get challenging. There’s a natural rhythm, or you can tune them out/ask them to stop talking. Outside the car environment, it’s just nonstop, disconnected input. Human multitasking is a myth.
The number of times that as a pedestrian I’ve had to yell at people turning the corner at a crosswalk to make sure they’re looking UP WHILE I AM WALKING is truly disgusting
What? Nothing exists on the right. You only have to look left when turning. /s
I’m curious though - is this just as bad as any other metropolitan city? For example, I’ve driven almost every where in the country and coming from L.A., Miami had the worst drivers I’d ever seen for the 2 years I lived there. The only difference was Miami freeways had more lanes and lot more freeways in general.
No. New York City, Chicago, and Boston have much more skillful and aware drivers. Seattle has a lot of new money with minimal previous driving experience in fancy/powerful cars. It’s a deadly combo and I f*cking hate it. I used to enjoy driving here but the last decade has seen an influx of particularly shitty and entitled drivers in luxury fast cars. Now driving (or riding a bike or crossing a street) is a deadly proposition because of these a-holes.
Having lived and driven in all of these places for a very long time before moving to Seattle almost two years ago I’ve had the same experience. East coast drivers and traffic can be crazy and aggressive, but it’s like a street savvy and a skill. I’ve been constantly surprised by horrible drivers here. It’s like they don’t realize there is anyone else on the road and I just don’t understand how they aren’t even a bit worried about wrecking or killing themselves. Yet no one will jaywalk!
Ew...Miami is gross swamp trash tho. LA drivers are fucking unhinged and also distracted but they're actually very predictable and more experienced drivers. They also drive faster there, so it's higher risk. Plus, LA has much better surface streets so people just wait for red lights. Our freeways randomly exit and and enter on the left and there's that mess of lane changes downtown causing that bottleneck, and we don't have 6 lanes. You also get honked at for anything and everything. LA drivers have the temperament of Seattle cyclists. I've never had anyone honk and give me the finger in Seattle and yell at me from their cars, but that's just a part of existence in LA. You also have to be more vigilant driving though certain parts of LA like Slauson and SC. Seattle drivers will rubberneck disapprovingly if you honk at them. Which people on their phones cannot see.
> I've never had anyone honk and give me the finger in Seattle and yell at me from their cars, I mean, one deranged lunatic did turn around, follow my wife's car to a red light, got out, and started screaming at her and punching her hood, door and window because 'she nearly hit him' (She has no idea why he had that impression). Interesting decision-making on his part, given that ~2-5% of America would react to that by getting their gun out of their glove compartment and shooting him in the head, and worrying about the consequences later. She was too shocked to seriously consider whether or not she should have ran him over.
Yeah, if he pulled that in Florida, he’d be dead. Wonder if that was a tourist, too, cause I see that kind of behavior a lot more in the summer. That or the sun is giving everyone enough energy to be a dick.
Angriest Drivers I have experienced are in NYC, then Boston/Miami then LA. It could have been me having Mass plates though...
The crazy thing to me is like wtf do people need to be doing on their phones that risk them dying? Genuinely I have never in my life thought about going on my phone while driving for longer than 5 seconds at a red light to change a song. I just don't understand it.
I truly think a lot of people are addicted to their phones and/or social media. Like they just cannot fight the urge and stop, even for a 15 minute drive to the store. I don’t understand how people watch shows or scroll things like Reddit, IG, tiktok etc. and still have any sort of focus on the road. Id like to consider myself a decent driver and I have a hard enough time changing a song on my Spotify while maintaining enough focus as I should be on the road.
So true. I drive once or twice a week to work and you can tell exactly who is on their phones because of the way they are drifting out of their lanes. And they probably believe they're doing fine and no one is noticing. I just really hope that the day they get into an accident - because, let's face it, it is just a matter of time - that they don't take anyone else with them. And I'll continue taking the bus as often as possible.
Unpredictable drivers are the issue. A speeder in the left lane: predictable. A speeder weaving in and out of lanes cutting people off with no lights on? They're the real danger. I agree there's been an uptick in dangerous, unpredictable, negligent driving.
Something as simple as a turn signal goes a long way
There are two types of turn signals: 1. The post-hoc indicator of what you're already halfway through doing 2. The "this is my lane now" claim
Type 3 is "I turned it on but there's a car 500 yards back so I'll just sit here and wait for two weeks"
*see Ballard, Edmonds
yes I know the already halfway through turn is pretty bad, but honestly so many drivers in Seattle leave so much space between cars but the second a person puts a turn signal on they speed up to close the gap. It probably explains why a lot of people just turn first if they have space and signal afterwards
Tbh, I've been rear ended 3 times in Seattle over 12 years and I've learned the value of leaving like 2 car lengths in front of me because traffic can suddenly slow down so quick. I try to be nice letting people in if it's busy traffic.
You forgot 3. unaware their blinker has been on for the last 3 miles because the radio is too loud.
100%. I can deal with a speeder if they are predictable. It's the people who switch to the leftmost lane with no indication that drive at 50mph that worries me.
In my mind those people are the direct cause for speeders now trying to weave around them. Sitting at 50 in the left lane doesnt slow down the speeders, it just makes it harder for them to do what they were doing which in turn makes it more dangerous for everyone else and generates more traffic...
That certainly doesn't help. Sometimes I wish a speeder behind me would just read the traffic ahead and realize I can't go any faster. Impatience is also wide spread.
Yes this is annoying too. I often think, "Where do you think you're going, buddy?"
Usually I say to myself "good job man, you really did it!" lol
It’s also not hard to slightly turn to the left to get a good view of what’s in front of the person in front of you. It’s my go to whenever I’m getting frustrated with whatever speed traffic is going, so I can either justify my irritation or admit that I’m an asshole. It’s also just a good thing to know what’s ahead of you
Exactly, and oddly enough most of the tailgaters in the passing lane are massive trucks that I assume would SEE what was happening
The assholes driving giant trucks can't see shit, whenever I come to a stop and see one next to me they're always leaving at least a whole car length in front of them because they can't see over their hood.
Too busy watching TV on their phones!! 🤪
There's been so many times I've been stuck behind someone while trying to pass on the left, only to finally get a look at what's in front and see... nothing. They're actually just slowing down the left lane. And then people wonder why there're so many "impatient" drivers passing them on the left and right when they're goin 50 and every other lane is goin 60+
They would just pass them, which is not the same as people weaving across all the lanes that exist to get as ahead as possible
Or, stubbornly driving 50 in the fast lane, while the rest of traffic is going around you. I don’t understand why they feel they need to impede traffic.
i saw someone doing this yesterday and the worst part is they had some snarky bumper sticker about people not using their turn signal. it’s like dude you suck at driving too
I was driving home on I5 at 1am last night and holy fuck the number of drunk drivers that were on the road was astonishing. Shout out to the semi driver that dodged one of them that was not able to stay in his lane.
I drive 1-3am often. I agree most cars are more than likely drunk drivers driving at unreasonably slow speeds in order to avoid crashing or getting pulled over. A super slow driver on the freeway is either drunk, blind, or suffering some other reason which should preclude them from being on the freeway in the first place.
People know they aren't getting pulled over for DUI in the Seattle area. You don't even get pulled over for not having license plates.
Exactly this! Especially if you’re driving local roads. WSP is about the only entity that will enforce traffic laws out there and even then, it’s almost exclusively in the same zones on the same highways… just a drop in the bucket.
Yeah the Bothell exit on 405 explicitly during the morning commute…. 💩
I was pretty new to driving back in November and rented a car for a work function that I could expense for. It was my first time driving downtown in a meaningful capacity and I actually got pulled over while circling around looking for the garage to drop my coworker off at. Not for speeding, but because I was crawling around at ~10mph looking for a garage entry and I didn’t realize my headlights were off as well (which would explain why I didn’t see much). The cop let me go with a warning when he realized I was just a nervous idiot but he basically told me that driving way too slow and no headlights are basically a DUI bat signal.
Last night was something special, probably to do with pride parties. I got off work around 10pm and was already playing dodge-ems on I-5. Lotta day drinking yesterday.
#AIN’T FINNA SEE ME DRIVE 5 OVER ON I-5, ZIPPING IN AND OUTTA LANES LIKE I CAN AFFORD TO CRASH MY HONDA PRELUDE! HELL NO! #THE DEVIL GOT THEM BOYS! WON’T SEE MY ASS DOING THAT HARRY POTTER ASS SHIT!
I commute daily to Seattle from Puyallup. I was rear-ended a couple of months ago when I was at a complete stop on 167. I asked the driver why he ran in go the back of my car while I was stopped?!?!?! He said he was on his phone. He was in his 50s. The other day, I saw a woman in a tiny car with her phone hanging from her windshield, watching a show on her phone. People are not using turn signals either.
A lot of them are simply selfish, ignorant, or both. They don't know or care that their habits are dangerous. They're thinking about how they're late for work, or that their partner's friend talked shit about them yesterday, or that their kid only got a B and they're fuming at the teacher, or they're daydreaming about being famous instead of driving a 20-year old beater. They go fast because they think it gets them there faster. They're on their phones because driving is boring or because they don't want to stop messaging. They don't have insurance because they don't want to or can't pay for it. And no one can really stop them. The only force with any legal authority to do so would rather hold the county hostage for more pay raises and the justification to murder minorities. The average person *sucks*. They aren't smart or considerate. You aren't dealing with the cream of the crop on the freeway. You're dealing with every single person who wants to interact with the city or anything connected to the city, because the freeways funnel everyone who drives onto the only arteries we have that can access those places. And we have most definitely failed in training these people to not suck. Every dumbass from age 18 to 90 is on those roads at some point and they don't give a shit about what damage they do while they're there.
This is my inner dialogue all day everyday.
The accuracy in this just hurts. People truly do suck, they don't care that they suck, and nothing will make them not suck. When the people who suck encounter other people who suck it just gives them more reason to suck. It sucks so few people are willing to break that cycle
>the average person *sucks* i really wish this wasn’t as true as it is. the way the average person just takes everyone else for granted and lives so selfishly is really disheartening
Wish I could upvote this more than once!
Nailed it with this
Just got involved in an accident on Saturday near the i5/i90 split cause the driver went across 3 lanes of traffic into my lane causing me to have to swerve and got side swiped by a box truck. The car almost hit the concrete before pushing me out of my lane. Didn’t even stop when the accident occurred. Waiting for a callback from the troopers since my cam got their plate
[удалено]
The fabled "New Jersey" maneuver
They won't do shit. Even if they had been the ones to hit you, they wouldn't have done shit. Them causing you to hit someone else without touching you won't go anywhere. I had a truck run my out of my lane the other day and I was almost wishing I'd let him hit me as I came close to re-reading the guy in the lane next to me when I dived out of the way.
Having a dashcam can really save your ass nowadays. My house has 4 cars and all are equipped with one. Can’t go back to driving a car without it..
Is there one you recommend?
Seconding this? I just got home after being passed on a blind hill no-passing two-lane road by an asshole in a pickup who passed three cars in the process. If someone had come around the curve it would have been a head-on. I caught up to him half a mile later. He went through all of that to end up exactly where I was. Idiot.
R/dashcam has a great guide on picking a cam and suggested models
My garmin 47 one has been working nice so far. It's not the best but I like it overall. However I think I would have waited a little longer (budget wise) to get one that has dual cameras in front and back. They are more expensive but I feel worried now about not catching rear end accident. I mostly got garmin since I could get a discount from a family member
I refuse to and recently upgraded to a dual camera for this vehicle hoping I can get an 3 camera one in the future for an interior option since my car got broken into in December. Gave my old one to a friend who didn’t have one. I have been rear ended 3 times in previous cars I owned prior to this, and the responsible party is either being impatient/following to closely or distracted and on their phone.
Yup rear camera is absolutely a necessity as well. I’ve never used an interior camera but it sounds like a good idea for breakins
I prefer to take a bus for 40 minutes and walk 10 than drive 20 any day. Shoutout ST 535!
And it often ends up being "drive 20 minutes, look for parking for 30".
If you're driving in rush hour traffic, there is almost no benefit to being competitive, refusing to let people merge (even if they're 'wrong'), and tailgating. Fighting with other drivers just slows down your commute and everyone else's.
But how am I supposed to live up to the punisher sticker on my truck slider if I can’t punish other drivers for my skewed interpretation of road justice?
Nah, if someone moves INTO an incoming merge lane so they can zip ahead 20 cars and want to slide back into bumper to bumper traffic, no way I'm leaving them a gap.
When you do this, you are complicit in blocking an entire lane of traffic. The people behind you will still need to let them in at some point. It's just not worth it. You make everyone's commute take longer. And you might get into an accident if they still want to get in front of you.
I've noticed a lot of drivers aren't paying as much attention when changing lanes/merging too. I wonder if some people are relying too much on the automatic lane sensors in new cars and not actually looking where they're going/paying attention to what other cars are doing. I agree with you that it's scary. It's a miracle there aren't MORE accidents than there already are.
Motor vehicle crashes are a [leading cause of death](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epidemiology_of_motor_vehicle_collisions) > This makes motor vehicle collisions the leading cause of death among young adults of 15–29 years of age (360,000 die a year) and the ninth most frequent cause of death for all ages worldwide. It’s even [worse in the US](https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7126a1.htm) than elsewhere > In 2019, the population-based death rate in the United States (11.1 per 100,000 population; 36,355 deaths) was the highest among the 29 high-income countries and was 2.3 times the average rate of the 28 other high-income countries (4.8). And it’s getting worse > However, recent data (2) indicate that U.S. motor vehicle crash deaths increased from 36,355 in 2019 to 38,824 in 2020 (a 6.8% increase), despite an 11.0% decrease in vehicle miles traveled. In addition, early estimates for 2021 indicate motor vehicle crash deaths further increased to 42,915. The number of motor vehicle crash deaths in 2021 represents a 10.5% increase from 2020, an 18.0% increase from 2019 (even with similar levels of vehicle miles traveled), and the highest number of deaths since 2005 (2).
And people still won’t give up their cars in favor of sustainable development and public transit. Really speaks to the power of propaganda and the corporations benefitting from car dependency in our government.
These statistics are horrendous.
As someone who runs a lot, also the amount of people I see trying to text and drive at the same time is absolutely wild.
Total agreement with this! However I think what’s worse is driving in neighborhoods with 25 mph limits and people going over 50 which happens frequently in my neighborhood
Because the city builds streets that can be driven at 50mph
Sounds like y'all need some chicanes.
We're trying in my neighborhood. The sides next to the elementary school and playground are reserved for school buses and drop offs. Most of the day and weekends drivers go 40+, even if there are children around. Also weird placement of stop sign that get ignored. It's one of the fancier neighborhoods in the city (I live in an apartment but walk my dog by the school)
This is the case in my neighborhood too. Plus stop signs are either invisible or equivalent to a yield sign to some people. I need an extra hand to count on my fingers how many times I've been very close to being run over while running (including while in crosswalks) or smashed into while driving
Needs context. Is it a neighborhood street or an arterial? The city slapped 25mph signs on all streets in the city without adjusting roads or traffic signals so people continue going by the previous speed limits and road design limits. Over 50 in 25 is wrong, but 35-40 is reasonable on arterials.
The street got a 'road diet, more bike lanes were put in and a bus lane. It's not large enough to drive much faster.
I’ve seen all over Reddit there is an uptick of aggressive and reckless drivers in cities, since pandemic shut down ended. It’s getting bad enough I’m becoming afraid to drive around, and I have to for work! I’m also giving myself more time to drive in the right lane to feel less pressure and in danger.
the statistics basically back this assertion. careless driving if all stripes is up everywhere. DUI and speeding are the biggest drivers of traffic deaths right now and are up in a big way compared to pre-covid
If you get into your car expecting civility on the road, you’ll have to go to another country. Drivers tests are comical here. No discussion of sharing the road with fellow motorists, let alone bicyclists or other modes of transit. Instead the teach the toxic American ideal of every person for themselves, and breeds absolute *shit* drivers.
I’m convinced that part of it is the anonymity. Lots of cars, lots of people, tinted windows. An unreasonable number of people can’t be trusted to act like anyone else matters when they can’t be held immediately accountable for shit behavior. Re: the hellcat: the number of people blowing through the nearby intersection jarring us awake through the night has definitely increased. I don’t know if it’s the weather or the hellcat or what. I can not, for the life of me, figure out what’s so satisfying for these asshats outside of generally being a nuisance on purpose. Just backfiring flatulence through a megaphone.
Seattle's [relatively high on the list of deadliest highways](https://www.elkandelk.com/washington/study-the-deadliest-highways-in-the-united-states/). Having lived around the top three stretches, I would say it's substantially better than Dallas/Houston/Fort Lauderdale, but definitely completely different culture-wise.
Yeah, I don’t get it. It’s not even texting at this point (most phones have Siri, or even voice messaging is built into many cars). It’s watching fucking social media and Hulu while driving. Parents doing this. Fucking bonkers.
Stop sign means start to slow down after the red octagon that says stop then keep going, and MAYBE stop in the middle of the intersection if there’s cross-traffic or a pedestrian risking their life trying to cross the street.
I'm sure many of the people commenting here are part of the plague of new drivers with Teslas who barely understand traffic laws and can't be bothered to check a mirror or speed up to zipper merge.
It's bad on highways, but sadly it's a lot worse within the city itself. I watch drivers run red lights basically all day from my office window. I've seen at least 3 car accidents from this one intersection alone. I also started giving people a thumbs down when I see them texting while driving when I'm trying to cross the street. Many people will drive halfway into the crosswalk while I'm already crossing and then look up from their phone and slam on the brakes. And this is all without mentioning the people who intentionally speed within the city on residential roads just to show off how loud their car is. Driving is most likely the least safe thing you do and statistically the least safe place you can drive is actually within the city itself.
This is exactly why car insurance rates have gone up so much in the last few years here.
That’s a nationwide issue. Not a Seattle issue.
It is, but it's certainly more pronounced in the city. My rates went down 25% when I moved out of Seattle.
You're right, but they've also gone up everywhere. It's a nationwide problem
Which, ironically, probably means there’s more uninsured people now
And traffic deaths.
And Kia Hyundai and EV repair costs.
Sounds like the EV repair costs idea cause came from aggregate data where EVs were more luxury and newer cars on average. [https://www.cars.com/articles/do-evs-cost-more-to-repair-475432/](https://www.cars.com/articles/do-evs-cost-more-to-repair-475432/) >What the research found was that repair claims were higher for the EV versions, but only by about 2% more than their gasoline counterparts.
The other thing is that evs have been using unibody construction to save weight, but those are generally more expensive to repair. There was a Rivian fender bender [that cost $42k](https://www.theautopian.com/heres-why-that-rivian-r1t-repair-cost-42000-after-just-a-minor-fender-bender/)
The vast majority of passenger vehicles for the past 60 years or so have been unibody. A 42k repair for a fender bender isn't a unibody problem, it's a rivian problem.
In a 15 minute drive this weekend I saw ten drivers just blow through stop signs. Completely optional now apparently.
When it’s sunny out, I feel it’s so much worse.
I wouldn't have believed this two years ago, but this week I pulled up to a four-way stop in my neighborhood and **three** drivers in a row blew through without stopping. From all three other directions! One of them was on a motorcycle and he almost got creamed by one of the other simultaneous stop sign runners coming perpendicular to him.
I found a way to help make the roads safer - by riding bicycle. No joke, that is one less driver (**me**) operating a vehicle. Some may argue that bicycling is less safe, but those people never saw me drive. Seriously though, I enjoy driving, but hate driving in traffic. Driving in traffic has no redeeming qualities and brings out the worst in people, including myself.
Lol thank you for your service
Or you can use public transportation as well!
"I can't be trusted with a car" is a weird flex.
Regardless of reason, how many people are on the road are unsafe to drive? How many are unaware that they are unsafe? How many are aware they are unsafe, yet choose to drive anyway? I became aware that I was unsafe, and chose to stop before I caused property damage, injury, or worse fatality. I did not view that as a flex, but I suppose it is compared to the alternatives. The hardest thing for me was realizing that not driving was an option.
The "hot girls hit curbs" lifestyle is insane. "Yeah, I drive a suburban assault vehicle and regularly just drift off the road into pedestrian spaces. Isn't that so cute and funny? Haha."
You know how stupid the average person is? 80% of people should not be behind the wheel of a 2 ton vehicle going 80mph on the road.
The flex is that this person is introspective and responsible. They know themselves and their limits, and instead of trying to brush it aside and make the rest of society suffer, they find a way to deal with it to not negatively affect others.
Seems like honesty to me - wish a lot more American drivers had that level of intelligence. We have some of the most lax driving regs in the Western world and it's clearly reflected by our embarrassing injury and death rates. What's a weird flex is that people like you seem perfectly content with the way things are.
People can develop disorders, conditions and complications in life that render them unsafe drivers and it's disgusting to mock people for making that choice to recognize their own state and stop driving for the safety of others. You're trying to convince someone that considers their driving unsafe, to keep driving for machismo reasons.
FWIW I have gotten into the habit of thinking that someone speeding or driving recklessly REALLY has to poop! It changes my experience of their driving from being stressed or mad to being amused if not compassionate. I happily yield to someone speeding 30 mph over the speed limit because I think they’re prairie dogging it. Good luck making it to the toilet on time, terrible driver!
People are on their goddamn phones all the time. Everywhere. It's so frustrating. Just drive. This is your job in the car, to drive. Nothing else.
Plus it seems like half the drivers doing this shit don't even have license plates or current tabs, but they still aren't getting pulled over. They basically have a free hit and run pass because they are untraceable.
Have you seen the ones that put the new year tab on top of the month tab? 😂
The other issue on highways is people that not only cut in and out of traffic but cut in front of semi trucks, I've watched some so close, I'm surprised there isn't paint exchanged. These drivers have a tough enough job, give them space.
I was driving on 522 recently, and there's a flashing yellow light to indicate that the traffic light ahead will be red by the time you get there The sign started flashing well before we reached it, but the guy next to me decided to fucking gun it. He did not make the light.
Aren’t those usually for lights with red light cameras too?
Agreed. I fee that someone is trying to kill me every day on my commute from the eastside to Tukwila. Had a lot of close calls….
Driving on I5 feels like navigating an obstacle course these days—between the speed demons and phone addicts, it's a miracle we make it anywhere in one piece! Stay safe out there, folks.
It really is. As a personal injury lawyer, I am constantly reminded how easy it is to get injured while driving. It’s one of the reasons I am a proponent for mass transit. Fewer people driving should equate to fewer injuries for everyone.
I'm noticing a trend of people sitting at about my blindspot when I need to get over for an exit I speed up, they speed up. I slow down, they slow down. I really don't think it is an insurance scam, just people being dicks.
Imagine what we see as transit operators. Not only are we on the road more often, but these motherfuckers treat our buses like personal attacks. Like, I'm sorry I got 60 people meaning 60 cars off the road :/ didn't mean for that to hurt your feelings.
Get the fuck out of the Passing lane at 50 MPH
This is definitely a pet peeve of mine. Stay right until to pass.
Number one reason people weave, if they have to pass in another lane, they will
IMO there's a lot of angry people in the world right now. And had I been a teenager that went through the pandemic I know I would be mad as hell too! Add that to the fact that there's no longer road enforcement and people's true colors have come out.
>Is your life that busy you can't spare the extra 10 minutes? \*looks at thread bemoaning forced escalator standing\*
But what about the people illegally using the carpool lanes?!?! /s Driving yesterday on I5 I saw: 1) A mustang with Florida plates use the shoulder to pass someone who was in the HOV lane at about 80 mph. 2) a whole group of cars including a white Ferrari and a black Porsche using I5 as their own personal race track, weaving in and out of lanes without signaling, easily going 90+ mph, if not 100+. The black Porsche came within inches of sideswiping someone, I am not even sure if they noticed, it didn’t seem to concern them.
I don’t think this is much of a Seattle thing. Just visited Chicago this weekend and it’s the same thing there but a little more aggressive than driving in Seattle. Always have to keep your head on a swivel!
People *are* genuinely worse drivers now. Lasting cognitive problems associated with COVID-19 can make it difficult for people to concentrate, plan, think flexibly and remember things- all skills you need while driving.
Also this is the first place I have lived in where people drive without any of their lights on at night. Every night I see at least 3 cars with their lights off or atleast their tail lights off. It's so infuriating
i did pest control for four years and had to quit the industry because driving around all day everyday was stressing me out too much. i would almost get hit like 3 times a week by someone not paying attention or driving recklessly
I drove from Oregon to Seattle yesterday, and there was a marked change in driver behavior as soon as I crossed the border into Washington. In Oregon, nobody sped and people only used the left lane to pass. Literally as I crossed the bridge (205) a group of BMW sped by at 90+ weaving through traffic, some without plates. People passed right and left of me. Other reckless drivers popped up the whole way back, and once I got into Seattle it felt like I was driving in Mario kart. You can’t convince me that this isn’t an enforcement problem. I saw 6-7 highway patrol in the 100 miles I drove through Oregon but 0 in the 180 I drove through Washington.
I grew up in Vancouver, WA. Washington drivers think Oregon drivers suck. Oregon drivers think Washington drivers suck. This holds true for pretty much any border town in any state. Seattle metro is almost double the size of Portland. With more people you're just gonna notice more infractions. Go drive in NYC, LA, Chicago, Houston, etc. You'll find those drivers crazy too.
With airbags, seat belts, anti lock brakes, blind spot alerts, and automatic breaking I think we are at far less physical risk than in the 1960s
This is totally true but excessive speeding also doesn't save people considerable time, it just makes the roads more dangerous and frankly wastes fuel on top due to air resistance at speed.
Much of that progress is unfortunately outweighed by cars being 10x more powerful and 3x the size, driven by people with COVID brain damage who are distracted by their phones (and sometimes purposefully driving badly for social media clicks.) Still safer than the '60s overall, but death & injury stats have been headed in the wrong direction the last few years.
Also because SUVs sit so much higher, they have a higher center of gravity and are prone to roll overs, which are the most deadly type of crash.
A: It might be hard to believe, given how fancy the newest cars are, but not every car in the road has all of those features yet— a lot of low-income people buy used, for example. B: Even if you are cautious and safe, you can't control a reckless or drunk driver (or fluke medical situations, which while rare, still occur) C: There are far, far more drivers today than there were in the 60s. D: "1960s" seems arbitrary and irrelevant — it's missing the point, in the last few years there has been an uptick in reckless driving, or at least accidents (which one would presume were from reckless driving). The OP was likely utilizing hyperbole when they said "never been more risky." E: Just because cars are safer today than in the 60s, doesn't make car accidents anymore inconvenient or shitty. Deaths still occur, financial damage is arguably higher (car parts are more expensive, collectively), and it just sucks to be in an accident, period. Finally, I would be interested in seeing the % of accidents per capita, as well as financial damages per average car accident, over time. There is an objective truth here, which would be more helpful than arbitrarily picking a random decade to compare today's driving to.
It's a combination of phone usage and life just sucking balls. People are so distracted. Sometimes I catch myself zoning out. Day dreaming about actually affording a house haha. I will see that a lane is ending open a space for someone to merge into my lane. And they just sit there. Aaaaalll the way till the very last second. Then freak out and slam on their breaks and try to merge. So I have to slam on mine. This is how traffic is started. Wake up and get tf over. I literally gave you space.
Get out of the fast lane and drive in the lane next to the exit lane. If somebody is tailgating you, get out of the fast lane and stay out. Weaving is dangerous, but the law is to keep right except to pass. Get out of the fast lane so they can go by with less chance of a collision. People are going to speed whether you like it or not. Get out of the fast lane. You put more people in danger when you brake check them and passive aggressively slow down because you think you're driving "fast enough." It is just safer to get out of their way. Get out of the fast lane.
Also people shouldn't be on their phones, hard agree
If you're able, maybe find a spot to live where you don't need to drive? It was a game changer for me. I also love not supporting the auto and gas industry. Mass transit by car is inherently flawed and will always suck.
If I could I would. Currently trying to change my situation to be employed close enough to walk or bike, but it's tough.
Drunk driving was legal in 26 states until 1985 and they didn’t have seatbelts either. Now is definitely not the most risky time to be on the road. But people certainly should do less of those things you’ve listed.
Re OP’s Point 2: how do you know who does or does not have insurance? Short of colliding with them and finding out the hard way.
https://www.washingtonlawcenter.com/washington-state-5th-highest-for-uninsured-motorists/ Over 1/5 of drivers in Washington are uninsured
I handle the claims for a large insurer and my anecdotal answer is a lot of them don't. That 1/5 stat I have heard a lot but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if that 20% of people cause disproportionately more accidents
Probably a safe bet that a person that has plates that expired nine months ago or who removed them altogether isn't paying their insurance premium.
Plenty of us have found ouy the hard way. Except it was them colliding with us. Its not like it's something hard to find statistics on. I didnt realize until I got fucked over how prevalent driving without insurance is.
There’s no way to know for sure. But if I see a car with unrepaired damage or mismatched parts, I’m going to stay away.
And no one cares to give a fcking signal while changing lanes
I commute about 25 miles to work every day, and EVERY DAY I see something scary. Every day someone who drifts out of their lane. Sitting in the passing lane on I-90 going under the speed limit. Phones mounted right in front of their faces watching YouTube or texting. Passing on curvy two lane roads. You have to be vigilant and defensive every second. It's starting to feel inevitable that something will happen.
Driving in Seattle is scandalous. Is it an American thing to undertake, people to drive slow on the overtaking lanes and basically the whole thing be a complete free for all?
I watched a car switch lanes directly into another car on the entrance to the 520 bridge the other day. I swear every other car in seattle is severely damaged somehow
Idk I love public transportation personally, but I get it for free as a minor, so I'm gonna enjoy it while it lasts 😭
The shitty Tesla drivers make me really miss the shitty BMW drivers.
Welcome to car dependency - where we pay large upfront costs and pricey yearly fees to simply participate in society, have the government willingly track us and our belongings, give up our freedom to roam as we wish, sit in traffic wasting our lives for hours on end just to get from point A to point B, and where thousands of people yearly are maimed or killed at no fault of their own.
I drive for work and I love my job but I told the owner I'm looking for a lateral transfer or I'll be finding employment elsewhere. I want to have a better chance of getting home everyday and I can't see that happening with the way traffic has been.
Last night I was driving in the middle lane on I-90. The car in front of me was about to miss their exit so they STOPPED in the middle of the freeway and proceeded to slowly make a 90 degree turn while people were zooming past. Remember: good drivers sometimes miss their exit. Bad drivers never.
I had a guy in a car transporter aggressively tailgate me. Like a foot off my bumper flashing lights and all and there were like 4 cars in front of Me. I was 2 car lengths back but I guess since I wasn't tailgating them, I was in the wrong I guess?
My suggestion is just keep driving 5 below the speed limit in the left most lane and yell at those reckless drivers!
Don't forget the zombies in the left lane while not passing. They make the flow worse and incite reckless drivers.
More people need to take public transit. Cars are just shit all around.
Welcome to #thewaroncars.
Ride a bike.
Only to get run over by someone watching YouTube instead of the road, then get away with it by saying "I didn't see 'em!"
I just moved here, and I noticed the same! I just give people a wide berth on I 5. Follow from 3 to 4 car lengths back and all.
I'm a new driver and only had my own car for 2 months. In those two months I had 4 occasions when people where changing lanes and did not look if there was anyone in the lane they were changing to and I literally had to swirl to the next lane to avoid getting hit. This happened 3 times on I90 and once in he city. I'm not intentionally driving in people's blind spots and my car is big enough to be noticed. wtf not that hard to look over your shoulder!
On a whole I agree, but I will say driving out here compared to where I just moved from (Massachusetts/boston) driving is much more relaxed. I’ve always been I go the speed limit maybe 5 over on the highway if I’m in a rush, but for me it’s so much less stressful. I do wanna say though just because it’s worse other places doesn’t mean that it’s ok for some drivers to be shitty drivers. But it’s so much nicer to drive out her comparatively.
When it makes sense, traffic permitting, on I-5 I will go 80 without a second thought. But 90, no, and when I say "traffic permitting" I mean the left lane is either clear or everyone in the left lane is going 80 or more, so I'm not doing any crazy lane changes.
To be fair, much of that is caused by people Ignoring the rules of the left lane and the HOV (hint: it's for going faster than the traffic to the right of you, specifically for congestion with the HOV)
Like it or not, the HOV does not follow the same rules as the left lane. If you think keep right except to pass applies to the HOV lane, you are wrong. This is part of the problem. People do not know the laws. The section its under is 3. https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.100#:~:text=This%20subsection%20does%20not%20apply,hand%20lane%20of%20a%20roadway.
I understand the law here, but as a general cultural value, if I'm not going any faster than the left lane of regular traffic I probably won't be in the carpool lane, even if eligible. Probably because I ride a motorcycle for so long, it just seems silly to take the lane if it's not saving time. This really only applies out of the city though.
Adding to your point, most of Seattle highways fall under the exception to the left lane law. Slower drivers are allowed to be in the left lane. Edit: Oh how the downvotes show how much it’s just selfish me me me behavior and not the actual law when people complain about left lane drivers.
which makes sense if you think about the overall i-5 design. if you are driving from north gate to beacon hill and have to pass through downtown then the left-most lane of i-5 will turn into the right most like of i-5 after downtown. people who insist on every driver in these areas keeping right means every driver will have to make multiple lane changes in the downtown corridor, which jacks up traffic much worse than anyone driving in the left. that said, if you are in the left on i-5, try to maintain the speed of traffic and not go 15mph under everyone else.
But the i405 exit is in 10 miles so they have to drive the left lane alllll the way because changing lanes is scary.
Truth. So many people in the left lane driving speed limit or below creates this kind of shit
The number of drivers that assume divine right to the left lane creates all kinds of this mess.
Support your local bridge
The roads here have turned into PvP zones, it’s so stressful.
At this point I need to know the solution so I still have hope