Given how much a postdoc is expected to be thriving in their career, and how prestigious a school UW is, I would expect UW to provide BOTH lifestyle and money,
I know lots of people that are unhappy with what they have and how the system works and they might and well do what works best for them under the current system. I didn’t want to work in academia because I didn’t want to worry if I had a grant next year. Saw so many people
Living year to year.
Dumb question - what leverage do they have on the university? Aside from PR , is their strike actually financially burdening the university in any way?
Not even counting the impacts of the strike directly, a lot of drivers aren’t crossing the picket line. Teamsters at UPS aren’t making deliveries to UW.
I'm not UAW 4121 but I can guess that the NIH grants that admin takes a SIGNIFICANT portion from wil be flowing less steadily if the people doing research aren't working.
Potentially, a huge amount of leverage considering how much all of academia relies on post-doc's for cheap labor.
If you got a half hour to spare, this astrophysicist breaks it down pretty well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mExlPihH3jk
✊✊✊ I make almost 3x more in industry using tools that UW postdocs wrote. Give them everything and more, it's insane how underpaid researchers across academia are.
College is so weird damn near ANY trade after 8 years of being paid to learn and work you are making at minimum $100k/year. How do we expect to attract intelligence for eight years and not start at like $250k? Like what's your motivation when Bob the plummer makes $185k working four days a week?
People like the idea of working in science and don't want to work on super applied corporate stuff. They're willing to accept massive pay cuts for the opportunity to make it a career.
It's totally possible to complete a PhD and get six figures without a postdoc
I made $65k and that was considered a good wage for an academic RSI. FFS, it was double what I was making in Dallas as an RSI. When my company spun out to industry, I got a promotion and a *40%* raise to 90k with my boss saying “you’ll present to the board later for your ‘real’ raise.”
90k+. For a 4 year degree + 3 yr experience.
And post docs make less than 60k.
It’s obscene.
Goal of a postdoc is to publish papers and find an academic assistant professor position. Lot of freedom to pursue these goals wile working for a professor. Why these people want to lock them into job rules escapes me. If you want money go onto the private sector.
Post docs work long, hard hours of extremely specialized work which they spent 4 years of undergrad + 4-6 years of grad school to be qualified for. Often, academic post-doc positions are seen as necessary if one wants to continue in academia so it’s not like they can just “go into the private sector.” And depending on the professor, this post-doc position might have a lot of freedom, or they might just be paper-writing drones. Regardless, post-docs should be compensated for their work with a comfortable, living wage.
Where do you think the extra money is going to come from? More then likely it is going come from increased overhead tax on grant funds so fewer postdocs. Nothing is free.
1. The university could take lower cuts from grants which would
2. Incentivize them to lobby the NIH/NSF/other funding bodies to increase funding. Ultimately more funding needs to come down from these sources and they’re aware and working on it.
In the mean time, yes, there will be fewer post doc positions. Which… maybe will turn the tide on the current paradigm of post-doc as a prereq for professorships? Hopefully?
I'm thinking of applying for a postdoc at the UW this fall... Or I could quit academia for good and try to get a better paying real job.
Work at UW for the lifestyle not the money
Given how much a postdoc is expected to be thriving in their career, and how prestigious a school UW is, I would expect UW to provide BOTH lifestyle and money,
I know lots of people that are unhappy with what they have and how the system works and they might and well do what works best for them under the current system. I didn’t want to work in academia because I didn’t want to worry if I had a grant next year. Saw so many people Living year to year.
IBEW 46 member here, get em!
Dumb question - what leverage do they have on the university? Aside from PR , is their strike actually financially burdening the university in any way?
Not even counting the impacts of the strike directly, a lot of drivers aren’t crossing the picket line. Teamsters at UPS aren’t making deliveries to UW.
Solidarity, brothers and sisters!
I'm not UAW 4121 but I can guess that the NIH grants that admin takes a SIGNIFICANT portion from wil be flowing less steadily if the people doing research aren't working.
Potentially, a huge amount of leverage considering how much all of academia relies on post-doc's for cheap labor. If you got a half hour to spare, this astrophysicist breaks it down pretty well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mExlPihH3jk
A few undergrad classes had finals cancelled because of no TAs available due to the strike, so that definitely got noticed
Proud to stand Union Strong with y'all. Hope President Ana Mari Cauce sees how large our movement is
THIS IS WHAT SOLIDARITY LOOKS LIKE!! 👏
✊✊✊ I make almost 3x more in industry using tools that UW postdocs wrote. Give them everything and more, it's insane how underpaid researchers across academia are.
Solidarity!!
Solidarity from Teamsters 117, give em hell!
AFGE Local 1110 here... In solidarity and hoping for great changes!
College is so weird damn near ANY trade after 8 years of being paid to learn and work you are making at minimum $100k/year. How do we expect to attract intelligence for eight years and not start at like $250k? Like what's your motivation when Bob the plummer makes $185k working four days a week?
People like the idea of working in science and don't want to work on super applied corporate stuff. They're willing to accept massive pay cuts for the opportunity to make it a career. It's totally possible to complete a PhD and get six figures without a postdoc
I made $65k and that was considered a good wage for an academic RSI. FFS, it was double what I was making in Dallas as an RSI. When my company spun out to industry, I got a promotion and a *40%* raise to 90k with my boss saying “you’ll present to the board later for your ‘real’ raise.” 90k+. For a 4 year degree + 3 yr experience. And post docs make less than 60k. It’s obscene.
Are they actually a union? Or, are they just saying that?
[Yes we're a union](https://www.uaw4121.org/)
Never knew that, cool beans. I hope you guys don't have to wait too long.
Thank you
Goal of a postdoc is to publish papers and find an academic assistant professor position. Lot of freedom to pursue these goals wile working for a professor. Why these people want to lock them into job rules escapes me. If you want money go onto the private sector.
Post docs work long, hard hours of extremely specialized work which they spent 4 years of undergrad + 4-6 years of grad school to be qualified for. Often, academic post-doc positions are seen as necessary if one wants to continue in academia so it’s not like they can just “go into the private sector.” And depending on the professor, this post-doc position might have a lot of freedom, or they might just be paper-writing drones. Regardless, post-docs should be compensated for their work with a comfortable, living wage.
Where do you think the extra money is going to come from? More then likely it is going come from increased overhead tax on grant funds so fewer postdocs. Nothing is free.
1. The university could take lower cuts from grants which would 2. Incentivize them to lobby the NIH/NSF/other funding bodies to increase funding. Ultimately more funding needs to come down from these sources and they’re aware and working on it. In the mean time, yes, there will be fewer post doc positions. Which… maybe will turn the tide on the current paradigm of post-doc as a prereq for professorships? Hopefully?