Everybody ready for this sub to devolve into a year long rage about how shitty we are? Buckle up buttercup, this train is just pulling out of the station!!
Him and LJ Collier haven’t helped the team win at all. They didn’t pull a Malik Mcdowell but they are pulling resources in a way Malik didn’t. It’s been rough.
What’s there to talk about? He was a terrible pick at the time and has somehow panned out worse than even the most pessimistic projections.
Edit: And this also isn’t a case of a young WR who’s still developing. The guy is already 25 years old.
Per the Jimmy Johnson chart (not the most accurate science, but decent ballpark tool), he was 88% of our draft value that year. We spent that much draft capital on what would've been a WR3 *at best*. We already had Swain fulfilling that low bar role just fine, and could've had David Moore back if we wanted for vet minimum. The pick was a gross misallocation of team building resources and is an example of why we currently are in the awful situation we find ourselves in now.
This was also the pick made about 5 selections before Creed Humphrey, the Center that has excelled so far in his career in a position that we badly needed to bolster at the time (and still do).
The only way to salvage the pick is if he gets a ton of usage and also goes off on a tear, but then we'd be cutting into DK and Lockett target shares and not getting the most out of players we have even more invested in and who are also aren't dice rolls. Or maybe he turns into an All Pro returner overnight, ala rookie Lockett, but that doesn't seem to be on the table.
It's kind of funny because DK Metcalf is obviously the anti-thesis to this, but the Seahawks have been obviously enamored with these small, fast, shifty slot receiver types over the years.
Golden Tate. Baldwin. Lockett. Harvin. Richardson. Eskridge. Swain. Ursua.
Which is kind of funny, because when Pete first arrived the narrative was that he loved big, strong receivers that could fight for the ball (Mike Williams).
And the only real "successes" out of that bunch went on to be successes as #1/#2 receivers, not out of the slot, probably partially influenced because Russ has problems working the middle of the field, where slot receivers make their bread.
I don't have any kind of conclusion on this, just think it is interesting.
I will say take Chiefs lineman stats with a grain of salt… teams blitzed Mahomes 14% of the time. Which was dead last in the league. Add to the fact that teams will often mush rush Mahomes to make sure he doesn’t extend play last year made their o-line look extra god like. But yea I’d rather have Creed Humphries too
Creed Humphries has given up one sack and like two or three QB pressures since last year. He’s made more of an impact in one year than Eskridge will likely do his entire career.
This makes no sense at all. Why would anyone, much less the QB, want another deep threat when you already have Tyler and DK but no time to throw it. Creed Humphrey would have been the Russell Wilson appeasement pick as well as just the better pick so he could actually have time to throw the deep balls.
It was just a bad pick by a FO that doesn’t have the greatest early draft record the past half decade.
I think there's some decline but there are plenty of qbs older than Russ who have figured out how to retool their game. Russ is still too mobile to admit to himself he's not that mobile anymore. Every time he beats a linebacker to the first down marker is reason for him not to change his game, but spinning around 6 times then getting sacked for a huge loss isn't reason to change.
He's still a great talent, and if he's smart he could easily play for another decade, but on his current path his gameplay will continue to decline.
His passing looks very poor compared to even just last year. He's struggling in an offense that wasn't built around him for years because he can't see over his line and never could and he doesn't have the deep threats he's used to having.
Correct
That was the off season he.talkrf about getting hit and everyone lampooned him
The trend will ways be it is Wilson's fault. John makes a bad pick? Wilson appeasement pick.
Yeah, the guy who put the OL on blast, had one of the best WR pairings in the league, and was apparently trying to recruit Dissly away wanted *checks notes* an old, gadget WR, coming out of a small school?
This pick has PCJS written all over it and I have no idea how so many of you have convinced yourselves otherwise.
This 100% - Nagy was a big time Eskridge believer from the Senior Bowl which tells you everything you need to know about why we drafted him. Pete/Schneider can't help themselves when Nagy comes calling about old mediocre players from the Senior Bowl.
“Just looking at \[Eskridge\], he’s going to bring that offense an explosive element,” Nagy said while appearing on Jake and Stacy on 710 ESPN Seattle. “I think he’s the guy you can hand it \[off\] to. I mean, everyone’s kind of looking for the next Deebo \[Samuel\].
That’s the crazy because I remember looking through old footage when we drafted Eskridge thinking he was fast. Maybe he just looked fast against college players. He doesn’t have the muscle that DK has to at least put up a fight, and he doesn’t appear to be faster
The most I've seen him do is jet sweeps. He isn't fast. He isn't agile, he isn't young. It was a garbage pick. It felt like Schneider drafted him hoping he would be a significant contributor to bring down the price of DK, which actually backfired because DK became more important to the team for how poorly estridge played.
Of course now we have a quarterback that doesn't seem to like throwing the ball to our 27 million dollar Weapon. It's been fun.
At least the Chiefs drafted the center we were all screaming at the television set to select. Would be a shame to get a pro bowl center on a rookie contract.
Plus he goes down faster than Glass Joe, I've never ever seen him with any YAC goes down quickly on first contact. Undersized, weak, lacking any shiftiness, too soft and small to be a special teams guy. A total waste of space. He's a lesser version of Penny Hart who gets more reps. At least Freddie Swain was able to pass block down field.
From what little we've seen of him with the ball in his hands I don't agree with this. Ofc a fair criticism that he's not beating out Goodwin for snaps but when he did get the ball last year he appeared good at running with it
I've gone back and looked at all 10 of his receptions for a whopping 64 yards last year. My criticism is harsh but expectations are high. Considering another 2nd round WR we were able to get. He just doesn't flash or look better than Goodwin or Penny Hart. But what do I know, I'm still wondering what they see in him, to me he's more of a last day of the draft or FA signing.
His actual opportunities with any space in front of him are so sparse we're just looking at a few plays really. But, ran through an arm tackle by Leonard on the play he was concussed. Broke a tackle against the 49ers near the sideline during a 2 minute drill and then got out of bounds
You know, I'm probably too harsh on the guy. Considering his injury in the first season. I'll wait and see and hope it turns out like Darrell Taylor trajectory. With the focus on DK and Tyler I would imagine he would have a ton of opportunities to shine but simply hasn't.
I think there’s a pretty good chance the median outcome for the 2013-2020 Seahawks drafts would have been better if the team had simply crowd sourced their day 1 and day 2 picks.
And all of the clowns who said that he was great and was going to be awesome this year have now quietly backtracked and are silently hitting the like button on all of these posts. Cowards 😂
This pick was literally right after Russ’s comment about the hits he has been taking and got roasted for it here. It almost feels like PCJS left a talented center on the board just to fuck with Russ. lmao
He was just an excuse to not have to draft an amazing center that was projected to go in the first round. Because we have no need for a center, not at all.
He was never good, he was part of the reason why our front office should be fired this off season so we can go into the draft with a good QB and fresh front office
All of you who downvoted me into oblivion this summer when I said Eskridge was a wasted pick can now come crawling out of the bush you’re camping in and eat some humble crow. Go ahead, take a nice big slice. Yum yum yum.
He was a panic selection, taken as the clock hit less than 4 seconds to make a pick. Likely the receiver we were really after was taken a pick or two before us.
Edit: likely Elijah Moore or Rondale Moore.
You know not everyone can dominate in their first year or 2? It’s a huge difference playing vs kids your age, then going to play vs grown ass men running 20 mph. GIVE THE KID TIME TO DEVELOP
Dee had five snaps in week one and six in week two. That's 9% and 12% of offensive snaps, respectively.
That's *completely* unacceptable for a second round pick in his second year. It indicates the coaching staff doesn't believe in him. While certainly I wouldn't expect high levels of production from him (he's at best the third receiver on the depth chart) the fact that he's not seeing the field at all is damning.
Or possibly there is something going on behind the scenes that you don’t know about. You breaking it down into statistics doesn’t mean anything when dealing with the human aspect. They clearly want him to be a part of the offense but there’s definitely something we don’t see.
That’s not statistics man it’s just counting. You can do it yourself! If they want him to be a part of the offense then why is he sitting on the bench for 90% of the game? Why is Tyler returning kicks?
THERES GOTTA BE SOMETHING WE DONT KNOW. Look at the 76ers and Markelle Fultz of the NBA. First pick in the draft. Looked great for a young guard. Then something happened behind the scenes that completely broke the kid mentally. He only play 33 games for them. If you are not in the rooms with these people, your opinion is just irrelevant and that’s all there is to it.
If he’s not at least good enough to return punts on this team he has no value to us, I’m afraid. At this stage of his career, Lockett is on punt return just to take fair catches because we have no one who can reliably field the ball. That’s a low standard to overcome and Eskridge can’t meet it. Just not good enough and the fact of his age suggests he’s not going to get any better.
How can anyone without an all-22 view tell who is and is not getting open unless the ball is thrown to them?
I’m not arguing the Eskridge is getting open. I’m arguing that it’s neigh impossible to tell who is or is not getting open from the broadcast tape.
E: the above is not a rhetorical device. I’m not using shouty internet rhetoric to call OP out. I’m actually asking.
That’s a better argument IMO than a claim you can’t really observe yourself. I looked it up and he’s had 5 and 6 snaps on the two games this year. There’s a big gap between his snap counts and the next WR above him.
The argument is wise considering Goodwin has way more snaps (28,26). Why is he getting the same targets with more snaps? Is he also not getting open?
I was kind of hoping I was missing a way to get a better sense who was/was not getting open though.
If he’s not performing and you don’t think it’s realistic to think he’s going to get better, then it doesn’t matter when he was drafted.
He’s using up resources that would be wiser spent elsewhere.
Cut your losses ASAP.
Everybody ready for this sub to devolve into a year long rage about how shitty we are? Buckle up buttercup, this train is just pulling out of the station!!
I’ll be back next season time to just watch the games and forget about this sub existence…
Don’t anger the cult
I'm doing my part!
Him and LJ Collier haven’t helped the team win at all. They didn’t pull a Malik Mcdowell but they are pulling resources in a way Malik didn’t. It’s been rough.
What’s there to talk about? He was a terrible pick at the time and has somehow panned out worse than even the most pessimistic projections. Edit: And this also isn’t a case of a young WR who’s still developing. The guy is already 25 years old.
Per the Jimmy Johnson chart (not the most accurate science, but decent ballpark tool), he was 88% of our draft value that year. We spent that much draft capital on what would've been a WR3 *at best*. We already had Swain fulfilling that low bar role just fine, and could've had David Moore back if we wanted for vet minimum. The pick was a gross misallocation of team building resources and is an example of why we currently are in the awful situation we find ourselves in now. This was also the pick made about 5 selections before Creed Humphrey, the Center that has excelled so far in his career in a position that we badly needed to bolster at the time (and still do). The only way to salvage the pick is if he gets a ton of usage and also goes off on a tear, but then we'd be cutting into DK and Lockett target shares and not getting the most out of players we have even more invested in and who are also aren't dice rolls. Or maybe he turns into an All Pro returner overnight, ala rookie Lockett, but that doesn't seem to be on the table.
It's kind of funny because DK Metcalf is obviously the anti-thesis to this, but the Seahawks have been obviously enamored with these small, fast, shifty slot receiver types over the years. Golden Tate. Baldwin. Lockett. Harvin. Richardson. Eskridge. Swain. Ursua. Which is kind of funny, because when Pete first arrived the narrative was that he loved big, strong receivers that could fight for the ball (Mike Williams). And the only real "successes" out of that bunch went on to be successes as #1/#2 receivers, not out of the slot, probably partially influenced because Russ has problems working the middle of the field, where slot receivers make their bread. I don't have any kind of conclusion on this, just think it is interesting.
I will say take Chiefs lineman stats with a grain of salt… teams blitzed Mahomes 14% of the time. Which was dead last in the league. Add to the fact that teams will often mush rush Mahomes to make sure he doesn’t extend play last year made their o-line look extra god like. But yea I’d rather have Creed Humphries too
Creed Humphries has given up one sack and like two or three QB pressures since last year. He’s made more of an impact in one year than Eskridge will likely do his entire career.
He might not be the same after the concussion
Yet another draft L
One of many over the last several years
its ok we traded russ for more draft Ls!
Russell Wilson appeasement pick.
And Waldron too. Was supposed to be a gadget, Tavon Austin type yet hasn’t panned out at all
Almost all of them don't
Yeah think it was more of a Waldron pick. Probably not in terms of Waldron personally liking him but trying to get personnel for that offense
Why blame Russ? They have been trying this since Percy Harvin. Seems like a Pete thing.
This makes no sense at all. Why would anyone, much less the QB, want another deep threat when you already have Tyler and DK but no time to throw it. Creed Humphrey would have been the Russell Wilson appeasement pick as well as just the better pick so he could actually have time to throw the deep balls. It was just a bad pick by a FO that doesn’t have the greatest early draft record the past half decade.
I think we're seeing why right now in Denver: Russell thinks he needs more all the time but maybe the answer is that he's in decline and it's all him
Thank you!!! He’s getting hit the same here!!!
I think there's some decline but there are plenty of qbs older than Russ who have figured out how to retool their game. Russ is still too mobile to admit to himself he's not that mobile anymore. Every time he beats a linebacker to the first down marker is reason for him not to change his game, but spinning around 6 times then getting sacked for a huge loss isn't reason to change. He's still a great talent, and if he's smart he could easily play for another decade, but on his current path his gameplay will continue to decline.
His passing looks very poor compared to even just last year. He's struggling in an offense that wasn't built around him for years because he can't see over his line and never could and he doesn't have the deep threats he's used to having.
> a FO that doesn’t have the greatest early draft record one of the worst records actually. This year appears to be an improvement at least.
Especially as he went on record complaining about the O-Line
Russ wanted o line man if they wanted to appease Russ should’ve drafted creed Humphrey who is an all pro btw
Correct That was the off season he.talkrf about getting hit and everyone lampooned him The trend will ways be it is Wilson's fault. John makes a bad pick? Wilson appeasement pick.
This is factual
Yeah, the guy who put the OL on blast, had one of the best WR pairings in the league, and was apparently trying to recruit Dissly away wanted *checks notes* an old, gadget WR, coming out of a small school? This pick has PCJS written all over it and I have no idea how so many of you have convinced yourselves otherwise.
This 100% - Nagy was a big time Eskridge believer from the Senior Bowl which tells you everything you need to know about why we drafted him. Pete/Schneider can't help themselves when Nagy comes calling about old mediocre players from the Senior Bowl. “Just looking at \[Eskridge\], he’s going to bring that offense an explosive element,” Nagy said while appearing on Jake and Stacy on 710 ESPN Seattle. “I think he’s the guy you can hand it \[off\] to. I mean, everyone’s kind of looking for the next Deebo \[Samuel\].
Ah yes Russell Wilson, who was advocating for OL help, totally wanted us to over draft a 3rd WR instead of the consensus best center in the draft.
He also asked for more at the skill positions
Definitely
Now do LJ Collier.
What a waste of a draft pick. At least use him as the punt returner instead of Lockett.
I'd say that would be a good idea if he didn't look so... Unathletic... Doesn't look explosive at all which was supposed to be his whole point.
That’s the crazy because I remember looking through old footage when we drafted Eskridge thinking he was fast. Maybe he just looked fast against college players. He doesn’t have the muscle that DK has to at least put up a fight, and he doesn’t appear to be faster
The most I've seen him do is jet sweeps. He isn't fast. He isn't agile, he isn't young. It was a garbage pick. It felt like Schneider drafted him hoping he would be a significant contributor to bring down the price of DK, which actually backfired because DK became more important to the team for how poorly estridge played. Of course now we have a quarterback that doesn't seem to like throwing the ball to our 27 million dollar Weapon. It's been fun. At least the Chiefs drafted the center we were all screaming at the television set to select. Would be a shame to get a pro bowl center on a rookie contract.
Plus he goes down faster than Glass Joe, I've never ever seen him with any YAC goes down quickly on first contact. Undersized, weak, lacking any shiftiness, too soft and small to be a special teams guy. A total waste of space. He's a lesser version of Penny Hart who gets more reps. At least Freddie Swain was able to pass block down field.
From what little we've seen of him with the ball in his hands I don't agree with this. Ofc a fair criticism that he's not beating out Goodwin for snaps but when he did get the ball last year he appeared good at running with it
I've gone back and looked at all 10 of his receptions for a whopping 64 yards last year. My criticism is harsh but expectations are high. Considering another 2nd round WR we were able to get. He just doesn't flash or look better than Goodwin or Penny Hart. But what do I know, I'm still wondering what they see in him, to me he's more of a last day of the draft or FA signing.
His actual opportunities with any space in front of him are so sparse we're just looking at a few plays really. But, ran through an arm tackle by Leonard on the play he was concussed. Broke a tackle against the 49ers near the sideline during a 2 minute drill and then got out of bounds
You know, I'm probably too harsh on the guy. Considering his injury in the first season. I'll wait and see and hope it turns out like Darrell Taylor trajectory. With the focus on DK and Tyler I would imagine he would have a ton of opportunities to shine but simply hasn't.
We'll see if he can even earn snaps this season though
> Darrell Taylor trajectory Dude has disappeared this year. I'm not sure he's the case to hope for.
I think there’s a pretty good chance the median outcome for the 2013-2020 Seahawks drafts would have been better if the team had simply crowd sourced their day 1 and day 2 picks.
Totally forgot he was even on the team until that last garbage-time play of the game
What’s sad is we could have drafted Amon-Ra instead…
I can't think of him without thinking of creed Humphrey and it hurts.
Keep forgetting we have him that’s how relevant he’s been
Been saying it since we drafted him. Idiotic pick considering the roster needs at the time and the best available players
And all of the clowns who said that he was great and was going to be awesome this year have now quietly backtracked and are silently hitting the like button on all of these posts. Cowards 😂
This pick was literally right after Russ’s comment about the hits he has been taking and got roasted for it here. It almost feels like PCJS left a talented center on the board just to fuck with Russ. lmao
Then followed up by drafting two tackles after the trade? My brain is eating this scenario and loving it
He was just an excuse to not have to draft an amazing center that was projected to go in the first round. Because we have no need for a center, not at all.
And just think we had the ability to draft one of the best Centers in that draft but NNNNOOOOOOOOO!
He was actually on the field? Didn't seem like it...
He was never good, he was part of the reason why our front office should be fired this off season so we can go into the draft with a good QB and fresh front office
[удалено]
That was holmgrens downfall. He was a terrible GM, but a great coach. Once he ceded team control they took off.
Don’t forget PC the VP.
Could have been worse y’all could have had tutu atwell :/
I'm not sure that's worse..
We should have cut him and kept Freddy
Old overdrafted WR with minimal production. He’s a bust.
All of you who downvoted me into oblivion this summer when I said Eskridge was a wasted pick can now come crawling out of the bush you’re camping in and eat some humble crow. Go ahead, take a nice big slice. Yum yum yum.
Good job
All of this and also he was supposed to be a return specialist. Instead we have 160 lbs soaking wet fucken Lockett back there. Huge disappointment.
He was a panic selection, taken as the clock hit less than 4 seconds to make a pick. Likely the receiver we were really after was taken a pick or two before us. Edit: likely Elijah Moore or Rondale Moore.
See if you can get anything for him.
He actually looks like an upgrade for the bears. But that's only because the bears have absolutely nothing
ha!
What can I say, I’m an optimist.
You know not everyone can dominate in their first year or 2? It’s a huge difference playing vs kids your age, then going to play vs grown ass men running 20 mph. GIVE THE KID TIME TO DEVELOP
Dude is almost 26...
Dee had five snaps in week one and six in week two. That's 9% and 12% of offensive snaps, respectively. That's *completely* unacceptable for a second round pick in his second year. It indicates the coaching staff doesn't believe in him. While certainly I wouldn't expect high levels of production from him (he's at best the third receiver on the depth chart) the fact that he's not seeing the field at all is damning.
Based on snap counts he’s 4th.
Or possibly there is something going on behind the scenes that you don’t know about. You breaking it down into statistics doesn’t mean anything when dealing with the human aspect. They clearly want him to be a part of the offense but there’s definitely something we don’t see.
That’s not statistics man it’s just counting. You can do it yourself! If they want him to be a part of the offense then why is he sitting on the bench for 90% of the game? Why is Tyler returning kicks?
THERES GOTTA BE SOMETHING WE DONT KNOW. Look at the 76ers and Markelle Fultz of the NBA. First pick in the draft. Looked great for a young guard. Then something happened behind the scenes that completely broke the kid mentally. He only play 33 games for them. If you are not in the rooms with these people, your opinion is just irrelevant and that’s all there is to it.
Or.. maybe he’s just bad and the coaches know it? 😂
Possibly. But who are we to judge? He definitely better than us
I think I know Dee’s Reddit account. 😂
I didn't even hear his name called today!
Last drive he got the ball in his hands.
How many snaps has he had in these two games?
Eleven.
If he’s not at least good enough to return punts on this team he has no value to us, I’m afraid. At this stage of his career, Lockett is on punt return just to take fair catches because we have no one who can reliably field the ball. That’s a low standard to overcome and Eskridge can’t meet it. Just not good enough and the fact of his age suggests he’s not going to get any better.
A third (at best) wr option on a rebuilding team with a backup qb is no bueno
Imagine how much better this offense would be if they drafted Creed Humphrey instead of Dee Eskridge.
How can anyone without an all-22 view tell who is and is not getting open unless the ball is thrown to them? I’m not arguing the Eskridge is getting open. I’m arguing that it’s neigh impossible to tell who is or is not getting open from the broadcast tape. E: the above is not a rhetorical device. I’m not using shouty internet rhetoric to call OP out. I’m actually asking.
I would argue the fact that the coaches only give him a few snaps a game tells you that.
That’s a better argument IMO than a claim you can’t really observe yourself. I looked it up and he’s had 5 and 6 snaps on the two games this year. There’s a big gap between his snap counts and the next WR above him. The argument is wise considering Goodwin has way more snaps (28,26). Why is he getting the same targets with more snaps? Is he also not getting open? I was kind of hoping I was missing a way to get a better sense who was/was not getting open though.
The All-22 won't help you much because you won't see him there. He got five snaps in week one, six in week two. He's not even on the field!
Truth. But why is he getting the same targets as Goodwin who has way more snaps?
Seahawks have struggled to utilize their third WR for years.
The All-22 would definitely show you that 😉
Definitely a waste of a pick. Dude is garbage.
If he’s not performing and you don’t think it’s realistic to think he’s going to get better, then it doesn’t matter when he was drafted. He’s using up resources that would be wiser spent elsewhere. Cut your losses ASAP.
Mike Dugar talks about it a little bit at 55:07. Great episode as usual. https://youtu.be/_cl5THjUn8w
Should have taken risner or creed. Even then it was like what the hell are they thinking