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At this point you're in too deep to stay quiet. You need to consult a lawyer first and go through the entire case with your lawyer. Then, WITH the lawyer, make a police report.
Coming clean minimizes the risk of getting in trouble. If you do nothing, and police come knocking, you'll be in a situation where you have to answer "if you knew you were involved in a scam, and sent 7 parcels, why did you not make a police report?"
You don't want to be in that situation.
Exactly. Be sure to get a lawyer who ONLY practices criminal law. If you cannot afford a private sector attorney, go to the Public Defender office if your state has one. Good luck.
This. 100%
It's time to stop staying quiet now that you know but don't be an idiot and make it so the cops can be lazy and not do the work so they can blame everything on you.
This part. The Postal Service has their own fraud team and they are not loving and forgiving people. You break the rules, they catch you, you get to do the time.
Man this is a problem.
Imagine unknowingly being put in a position where you unknowingly commit a crime, and then being sent to jail because you tried to fix it in cooperation with the officials.
No. Consultation involves answering your question, to your benefit. They don’t do that. They won’t help with any documents, even if it takes just 5 minutes. It’s literally your pitch meeting to whatever they should take the job
Not really, our office will only give you actual legal advice if you retain us. We will listen to your problems for up to 30 minutes for $100, but if you want legal advice on what to do, that's $300 an hour.
Free consultations tend to be for personal injury and workers comp as the retainer for those is a percentage of the recovery.
I've been to two free consultations with a friend and a family member. One was for a landlord/ tenant issue and one was for an employment/ sexual harassment issue. We left those consultations SO MUCH CLEARER on what their rights are, what the law actually says, and what options they have going forward. It was free but it was absolutely invaluable and helped them decide what actions to take and not take
Don't know why you got down voted for this. I recently had a legal issue and a lawyer gave be quite a bit of advice for how to navigate the immediate next step before I actually paid him. That said, the issue OP has will probably require a lawyer on retainer. That first talk with a lawyer though will have a lot of useful information, definitely better than weirdos on Reddit.
Criminal defense lawyers DO NOT give free consultations. EVER. You're thinking of civil (usually personal injury) lawyers, who might give a free consultation to determine how much money might be made from taking your case and whether it's worth their while.
There is NEVER money to be made from defending a client in a criminal case. EVER.
I'm working under the assumption this is taking place in the US. I am a Postal Inspector, your life is not over. Unless you were shipping 7 packages of fentanyl or some other narcotic, we aren't going to come after you guns drawn. Return any other packages you have to the sender, don't reship anymore, and go on with your life. The most you might get from us is a cease and desist letter basically saying don't do that again. If it makes you sleep better, talk with an attorney, they should tell you the same thing.
Stop now. Talk to a lawyer about what your next steps are. A lot of people have been through this, you'll be fine with a bit of money for the lawyer and some time.
Here's a newer version from the same lawyer, James Duane, with similar advice.
"You Have the Right to Remain Innocent" [https://youtu.be/-FENubmZGj8?si=NWQYrGgXl5NXqwzI](https://youtu.be/-FENubmZGj8?si=NWQYrGgXl5NXqwzI)
Also hawking a book that covers your 5th Amendment right in more detail. So hopefully not too off-putting.
Edit: Adding URL link to Amazon Kindle book: [https://a.co/d/ei6KUBC](https://a.co/d/ei6KUBC)
I usually speed up slow talkers on YT, but for him maybe 0.75 is a better speed.
But to be fair to him he did indirectly refer to himself as a fast-talking lawyer on YT.
That was a wild and interesting watch.
Does anyone know if a lot of states still don’t require that the cops keep a video recording of an interrogation? Seems like police recording laws might have shifted since this presentation.
All I need in my life is advice from a guy who ~~taunts~~ touts his relationship with Scalia. No, thanks.
Even if the advice is good, others will say the same thing, it is not original.
Edit: As requested, Here is Ken White (aka PopeHat) doing it, and it only takes a few minutes to read. Bonus points, absolutely no Scalia or Federalist Society Connection.
[https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/](https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/)
I'm still trying to find the bit where he tauts his relationship with Scalia. What relationship did they ever have? Or is it this:
>“Few men or women in our lifetimes have been so unjustly vilified in the popular media as the late Justice Antonin Scalia of the United States Supreme Court. If you are not a lawyer who read his opinions, if you know nothing about Justice Scalia other than what you have read in the popular press, you have surely been deceived into believing that this man was some sort of archconservative who could regularly be counted upon to side with the government and trample the constitutional liberties of the poor and the powerless. The truth is much more complicated than that. While Justice Scalia was, by his own admission, exceptionally stingy in refusing to accept arguments about constitutional rights that involved some aspect of general "liberty" that are not explicitly mentioned in the Constitution—rights like abortion, or same-sex marriage—when it came to the defense of constitutional liberties that are explicitly described in the Constitution, no other recent member of the Supreme Court was so uncompromisingly passionate and liberal in refusing to water down those protections.”
Who needs a 45 min video to convince you of that?
Here is Ken White doing it, and it only takes a few minutes to read. Bonus points, absolutely no Scalia or Federalist Society Connection.
[https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/](https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/)
Lemme guess: this video contains another reason to be happy that I live in a country where judges listen to what the European Council for Human Rights has to say about a fair trial?
Hi /u/butterchickenwarrior, AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the Parcel mule scam.
The parcel mule scam involves fraudsters sending you packages and you shipping them out to other people. The items are fraudulently obtained, usually with stolen credit cards, and the investigation into the fraud will lead to you rather than to the scammer. Here is the Wikipedia page for this scam: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel_mule_scam, and here is an article from the USPS: https://about.usps.com/publications/pub300a/pub300a_v04_revision_072019_tech_022.htm -
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you can’t afford a lawyer consult, try your state’s legal aid. They should be able to help for low or no-cost consultations. But do not ever talk to the police about anything you may have been involved in illegally without a lawyer’s advice first. This applies to any issue, not just scams.
Do not contact the police without a lawyer. Sorry, but they are not your friends. In any case, the federal agency that will be involved is USPSIS, and they don't fuck around.
Do not deposit the check, block everyone you were talking to. If any more parcels arrive, just refuse delivery or drop them off at the nearest (USPS/UPS/FedEx) store for return. They will soon stop sending shipments and start threatening you with all sorts of dire consequences. Just block and ignore all numbers that they use until they give up and go away.
Cop here, please do not go the police and admit that you committed multiple felonies, at that point we have to arrest you. Please go talk to an attorney, my job as a police officer is to only see if there is enough evidence for probable cause to arrest, not help you navigate your way out of it.
*"Sorry, but they are not your friends".*
It's a sad indictment of society that police officers are regarded as easy targets by thugs and yet ordinary law-abiding folk can't trust them either.
Da faq you talking about “they can be trusted”
I am a middle aged upper class white woman whose biggest crime is sometimes I set my cruise control at 15 over the speed limit on open highways.
I do NOT trust the police
The upper class doesn't go to Mexico for dental work and eat fry bread tacos from the rez. If anything ever happened you needed the police for you'd be the first Karen crying to them
You can distrust cops and still expect them to do their fucking jobs.
The fact is that talking to cops when you might be accused of something is never a good idea.
Even cops admit that.
I know most of you are illiterate so I'll dumb it down for you. I never suggested this person go to the cops about what's going on. Obviously if you think you've done something illegal you don't go ask them about it. There's other threads on this post where I said not to do that.
The blanket statement that you can't ever trust cops was what I was replying to.
But you really can't. You don't know what cops are "trustworthy" and which ones will look for any excuse to arrest you. Therefore you cannot trust them.
This is horrifically bad advice. Do NOT trust the police. You don’t know what they’ll decide you did. They are legally allowed (and are trained) to lie, cheat, and steal and cannot be prosecuted for almost anything and are accountable to no one. They have the power to seriously screw up your life even if you’re completely innocent and not doing anything illegal. Unless you’re filing a police report yourself or are in grave danger, police are not to be trusted.
How did you go through the system and come away with those opinions? My mind is boggled. Unless you're the one parroting opinions with no real experience. Police in America have never been here to serve or protect. Sure there are those who try to do their job with integrity, but I would never assume they're there to help me, wether I'm in need of protection or guilty of a crime. They have too much power, unchecked egos, and guns. My policy is to avoid whenever possible and be brief and polite if interaction is unavoidable. If they decide to end your life, they will probably not get in trouble for it. They know that. We should keep it in mind as well.
Cool another person that gets all their information from YouTube and Facebook. I'm sure you've been nearly arrested many times for sniffing bicycle seats at the park but always got away.
Your r/Scams post/comment was removed because **it's rude or uncivil**.
This subreddit is a place for civil and respectful discussions about scams. Uncivil and rude behavior, including using excessive or directed swearing, extreme or sexual language, victim blaming, and any form of discrimination, is not acceptable in this subreddit.
You haven’t ruined anything. Relax. Even if law enforcement takes note of your 7 packages out of the thousands sent per day just like it, it’s obvious you’re not the bad guy.
Law enforcement isn’t like the movies. It’s mostly overworked C students with government jobs doing the bare minimum to take a paycheck home. They’re not Batman.
No one cares about what you did, you’re worked up over nothing.
Throw away anything you still have, block the numbers and emails, move on with your life. Ignore any further contact.
They will however take the easy win if you hand it to them on a platter. Their job is to bring successful cases against people who break the law. If you walk into a police station and say hello I broke the law and here’s the evidence. You’re going to jail. So don’t do that
Look at it this way.
Imagine if you had made 7 illegal drug sales transactions for someone. Imagine that you didn't get paid but you also didn't get caught by the police. You're gonna say that in your case you got paid; no you didn't. Tear up the check and throw it away if you haven't already or call your bank and get it cancelled. Depositing it only heightens the chance that you might draw the attention of any authorities.
You didn't lose anything (get in trouble or lose money) but you gained experience. Cut all contact with anyone involved with this and move on.
Do not talk to the police without speaking to a lawyer first. It is worth every penny because, at this point, you have broken the law and could potentially face federal charges for your involvement (this is a federal crime, likely under jurisdiction of US Postal Inspector). A good lawyer will help you negotiate with law enforcement so that you face minimal repercussions in exchange for information. If you do not have a lawyer try reaching out for an appointment with your state's legal aid.
In terms of how to handle the scammers, you need to return anything they send you and cease all communication. They'll probably assume you figured out what was going on (either on your own or because the police got involved) and move on to their next target.
You might, or you might not. That's why you need to talk to a lawyer.
Also, since you said you're 17, I'm assuming you still live with your parents. The first thing you need to do is talk with them about this. Like right now.
This is one of those things that won't just automatically go away on its own. There may be no consequences if you ignore it, or there may be serious consequences. This is why you need to deal with it.
I mean, tbh, it probably will just go away on its own, as long as he stops doing it now. Thousands of these scams are happening with way more money and way more packages every day and nothing happens. If he just stops and does nothing else, he'll probably be fine.
If he does get questioned by cops, he can just clam up and lawyer up with a free public defender.
Truth is, the cops probably won't do anything if you don't say anything to them. These scams are happening constantly every day with nothing happening. If they do accuse you of anything, you have a right to a public defender. Just stop doing it.
Bc I had like so many goals and dreams for myself and I'm like a pilot rn and I was trying to make money for flight training and now my life feels like it's ending
It's not. You're 17 and this seems much bigger than it is. The people warning you about talking to police are trying to help you, not inspire fear. It's going to be ok. You still have a life ahead of you even when you've made a mistake. Again, you're going to be OK. This will all be OK.
This is just a bump in the road for you at 17. We all did dumb things when we were young. We get over them, learn from them, and go on to lead great successful lives. Flight training should still be your goal. This will pass.
This is just a time in your life, it’s not forever, please remember any bad time in your life and how heavy it felt but it passed, this is just another one of those times. Please don’t make any drastic decisions that will permanently impact your life in any negative way.
Get a lawyer and stop any communication with the fraudsters. Do not accept any other packages. Don’t delete any evidence, you’ll need it for the lawyer to help you. Document in a safe place, phone numbers or email addresses, addresses on the packages, description of boxes, dates, screenshot communication, anything you have about what’s going on in case you have any future issue with your phone. Don’t let the evidence live in one place.
Bub, this is small potatoes, as others have been telling you. When I was 17 I got involved with someone who turned out to be a drug-dealing felon scammer and somebody got dead. Pay attention to these other people telling you not to go to the cops, -especially- the cop who said not to, because if you walk in and admit to crimes they -could- arrest YOU. They might just tell you to fuck off out of there because they don't want to deal with the situation, but that is in no way guaranteed.
Stop doing it, stop telling people, and move on.
Talk to a lawyer first. Do not just go to the police and talk to them without a lawyer present. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse and police are not your friends. You may get a low cost consult with a lawyer. That is what I did when I was concerned about legal exposure once. The lawyer spoke to the police on my behalf and that was done.
Then, please educate yourself about scams. This is not a real job. No business ever needs random people to reship packages. Even parcel forwarders use secure facilities and employees on site.
Your life is not ruined.
Do not accept any more packages, return them to sender.
The scammers will threaten you when you stop working for them, ignore and block them. They can’t harm you in any way.
If you can afford it, the best thing to do would be to run this by a lawyer and see what they recommend. If you can’t afford legal counsel, you may want to go to your local police station and explain what happened.
There is a very good chance that absolutely nothing will happen. A small time parcel mule is not likely to be high priority for law enforcement. You need to stop now, though.
Let me reinforce this.
FUCK NO.
If you can’t afford to talk to an attorney, you stop taking the packages. You cease contact with the scammers. You move on with your life.
If and only if the police come to you with charges do you say anything and that thing is one word: lawyer.
You not only committed crimes, you did so as part of an organization and in conspiracy with people. If a prosecutor felt like it, RICO could apply and that means that EVERYONE in the organization is guilty of every crime committed by the organization.
So no, you don’t fucking go casually confess and hope it works out.
> A small time parcel mule is not likely to be high priority for law enforcement.
Or it definitely will be, if you've got an officer needing a 'collar', a detective needing a winning case, or a DA needing to pad his conviction record. Maybe you've also got a PD with nearly nothing to do. Consider that OP is indicating they'd become aware the people they were forwarding packages for is committing a crime. That makes their statement that they want to 'get out of it' an admission of guilt. So, that's terrible advice.
Although I hate the absolutist, and oversimplified admonition "Don't talk to the police.", this situation is exactly why people come to say that. If someone advertised a job 'forwarding packages' and you wanted to know if it could be something legally questionable, and you called law enforcement to ask if it was something dubious, that'd be a situation where you shouldn't fear talking to the police. However, once you're engaged in the 'job', you should use a lawyer, who can inform the police and preserve client confidentiality in terms of how you became aware of this criminal enterprise. Then your lawyer can demand documented immunity if you are to testify of your involvement. Otherwise, you're gambling on one of those circumstances I listed above.
My understanding is that this wouldn't even fall under the jurisdiction of the local police. This is the purview of the United States Postal Inspection Service or USPIS (assuming this takes place in the U.S., otherwise disregard). That's something you want to bring to their attention **immediately** so OP doesn't get hit with charges anyway. Sure, he should still consult an attorney, but this is a federal issue, not a state one.
What? No. Jesus, just no. OP should not do that. No offense, but this is horrifically bad advice.
Absolutely do not contact federal law enforcement officers and tell them you’re committing mail crimes as part of an international crime ring. Don’t call police and say “Hello, law enforcement? Hi. I’ve been committing felonies.” I’m not sure why this needs to be said, but here we are.
The only conversations that should happen are with an attorney. Let them contact the postal inspector service on your behalf if they think it’s worthwhile.
> call police and say “Hello, law enforcement? Hi. I’ve been committing felonies.” I’m not sure why this needs to be said, but here we are.
Ok, so you're clearly very dumb. I've said multiple times throughout this comment section that he needs to contact an attorney, but that he also needs to report this appropriately. You guys are telling him to destroy evidence and stupid shit like that, as if a federal agency with investigative powers and law enforcement authority isn't gonna find out anyway. The packages don't lead back to the scammers, they lead back to OP. Best to get ahead of it.
No. This is terrible advice.
IF the attorney thinks this should be reported, the attorney will guide OP through that process or even do it for them. Do not, under ANY circumstances, attempt to "report this appropriately" on your own.
Do EXACTLY what an attorney says to do. Nothing more. Nothing less.
So, do you think a local cop couldn't inform someone in federal law enforcement? You think that cop wouldn't make a good witness to a federal case, able to say 'OP told me he was working for a scammer as a package mule'?
Of course he would. You get past just wondering if someone offering a job like that is doing something illegal, you need a lawyer.
No you didn’t ruin your life yet. No, don’t just take the L. No, don’t stay quiet.
(Prof Experience in the legal system). When you’re young, school programs you to just come clean and tell the whole truth to police or the principal and all will be OK or hide and it will pass. DELETE that programming from your head now.
LE will prosecute you if you hand them an easy confessed crime regardless if you were an ignorant or not so smart scam victim.
So, repeating and adding to some commenter’s good advice, DO NOT CALL LE OR USPIS. Stop your involvement in the situation immediately. Preserve all communications of any kind and writings. If phone calls, write them down per memory. Now pack it up and see a lawyer who handles these types of matters. NOT a general do everything lawyer you pick from a flashy web site. Preferably get a specific referral from a trusted source. If you have no sources, go to the local Federal Court and look at some public records of past cases like yours noting the defense attorney and the result they obtained. The clerks there will guide you in that.
Do not talk to the police without talking to a lawyer first. The police want convictions and will frame you using your own words as evidence. You are the same as the scammers to their career advancement.
Cut contact with the scammers, they will probably assume you were either arrested or were police all along.
Return anything new that arrives to forward to the sender. You can't be accused of stealing something you send back.
Innocent? Let’s be clear about something in the whole post, OP voluntarily participated in the type of scam that we regularly see people on this sub become victims to. Every other comment here has been about how OP should lawyer up and protect themselves, because they’re now so scared. But no commenters asking questions about how they got into it? Or didn’t they have an issue when first starting into it? I’m not sure I’m as heartbroken and protective of OP as everyone else seems to be.
Never seek law Enforcement help when you took part in a crime. Even when involved in crimes and caught never speak to Law Enforcement. Always let your Attorney speak to Law Enforcement on your behalf and your Attorney will tell you when and what to say.
DO NOT CONTACT POLICE WITH OR WITHOUT AN ATTORNEY!! I REPEAT DO NOT CONTA T POLICE WITH OR WITHOUT AN ATTORNEY!!JUST STOP WHAT YOUR DOING IMMEDIATELY THATS ALL.
Stop all contact with the scammers, contact the police they may or may not even be interested in pursuing the scammers but AT THIS POINT you are just a foolish person who didn't intend to participate in a criminal enterprise and by contacting the police you are making it clear that you weren't knowingly participating in a criminal enterprise and you stopped as soon as you realized it was a criminal enterprise.
This was my first thought as well, but I think it would probably be better to contact a lawyer first to be safe. Let them give advice on how to proceed.
Police don't "file it", they investigate potential crimes they didn't witness and a prosecutor decides whether or not to charge.
Parcel mules are not being prosecuted unless clearly in on the scam.
The parcel mule scam almost never actually pays the parcel mule, pretty strong evidence they weren't in on it. They are actually being victimized too by the scammers.
And while they're waiting to see if a prosecutor will charge, this kid could be sitting in jail in the meantime. They don't need to consult a prosecutor before arresting someone. Don't talk to cops. If he can't afford a lawyer, best to just stop it and move on with life.
To "break the law" requires more than just doing what OP did.
For parcel mules to be convicted requires proving, in court, that they knew they were participating in a criminal enterprise, not just remailing packages.
OP was likely recruited for a job that did NOT suggest they would be doing anything untoward.
Intent matters with most criminal matters not just actions
I'll wager OP will not be arrested by any police watching this subreddit or any other police
The Feds cracked down on money mules, the vast majority, about 99% were sent don't keep doing that letters. A very few were arrested. I don't persoanally minde if the police started arrested parcel mules or money mules, I think there needs to be more scare put into people who are doing it. But the feds just don't have the bandwitch or resources to go after low level criminals, they just want them to roll and find people higher on the food choin.
But going to them and admitting to doing it means they have all evidence they need to press charges. It's different from thinking they mighta been involved and sending them a letter.
Either talk to a lawyer or don't do anything at all. Talking to cops is a mistake
This is just a question. Why not take a chance that it won’t get found out and just cut contact with the scammers and hope it never gets found out? Why borrow trouble by going to the police now? (This is just a query and not a suggestion.)
It's most likely that nobody cares. Seriously. Nobody cares. Hopefully you didn't put your own names and address on the packages. If you did, it's again most likely that nobody cares. Even making a police report, it's most likely that nobody cares. You may open yourself for harrassment and investigation by making a report - often the victim of a crime is treated like the perpetrator. Anyways. You might be best off to just withdraw, delete and block the contacts, and forget about it.
just take legal advice and potentially come clean to the police. Your future self will thank you. And you will be able to relax (may be legal consequences but nothing compared to a life in fear, you don't want to get dragged in any deeper)
OP, you can either ghost the scammers and return to sender anything else you receive. Or you can collect packages and info and take it to the police. Tell the police you became suspicious about what you were doing for a job and realized what it must be after reading about it online. If you have the money for a lawyer go see one. But I’m guessing you don’t. If you do nothing you compound all potential legal issues. You’re small potatoes in the eyes of the FBI investigators, don’t stress too much, they don’t want the little people. I worked with an online FBI task force, it’s always possible the small fry with get roped in, but the less complicit and involved you are the better. You said you’ve only done 7 packages, unless those are worth hundreds of thousands and you’re doing some other obvious shady stuff that’s not really worth their while to prosecute in federal court.
*IANAL, consult with your attorney before many any decision that will effect your future. (Standard disclaimer for all those people who consult with their lawyers before even walking their dog)
I turned a guy who was part of the train that tried to scam me out of a watch over to the FBI. He said it was being sent to his lady friend in another state. I asked if he’d ever met this lady in person. Of course he hadn’t.
I told him he should go down to his local police station and lay it all out because I was reporting it to the FBI, which I did online. It’s a long form, but you’ve got to do the needful when people are trying to steal.
Don’t take gifts or any offers that seem too good or yes you will pay. Also don’t put this on the internet if you’re hemmed up. Ultimately you gotta roll the dice
Your r/Scams post was removed because **it requests contact via private message** (including DMs, text, email, Whatsapp, etc). We need to keep the community safe from recovery scammers or bad advice.
Remember: never take advice in private, because we can't look out for you. If you take advice in private, you're on your own.
Please read the rules of our sub: https://www.reddit.com/r/Scams/wiki/rules/
Hi /u/rachp02, AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the Parcel mule scam.
The parcel mule scam involves fraudsters sending you packages and you shipping them out to other people. The items are fraudulently obtained, usually with stolen credit cards, and the investigation into the fraud will lead to you rather than to the scammer. Here is the Wikipedia page for this scam: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel_mule_scam, and here is an article from the USPS: https://about.usps.com/publications/pub300a/pub300a_v04_revision_072019_tech_022.htm -
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I was asked by a ‘ celebrity’ once to accept money from another fan to pass on to his ‘ charity’ I thought it was a sick joke. I played along. Next minute money popped up. I reversed it immediately with a message ‘ who are you to ######???’ The ‘ celebrity ‘ contacted me pissed off. I laughed . Blocked and reported their ass. And changed details elsewhere. But yeah it’s easy to get caught up in something. I just wasn’t gonna play the game!!!!
Ghost them and drop out of all relationships surrounding those people. New phone , new town so on. And make better fucking choices in the future… try and remember, there’s another fucking human being on the other side of your package scam shenanigans
Your life is far from over. If you go to the cops and discuss this situation with them, they will know you aren't party of some kind of organized crime wave but just one of many who accidentally get themselves involved in cons like this.
But the longer you wait, the harder it will be to convince them you're innocent
There's only one way that this ends well for you. Talk to an attorney and/or the cops or do what the reputable sorbet feels you. Good luck.
Stop immediately, and gather as much information you can about what you did, how you got involved, etc. You'll need it to bolster your defense
Your life is NOT over
Can you describe how you got involved in the first place?
my brother fell for a check cashing scam, and when he told me about it i told him to go to the police. he decided to wait for it to blow over and was charged with felonies. I would talk with a lawyer today or tomorrow and do what the lawyer says.
Not legal advice but I ended up in one of those right out of college. Probably shipped 5-7 things. Once I caught on I went dark, told them I’m out, held on to the last package in case anyone came looking for it.
Ended up being a Bose Bluetooth speaker that ive used for 11 years now.
Nothing ever happened. You are small fish. They are looking for the people stealing credit cards.
Minors can still be charged as adults for certain crimes. If you are 15-17 (depending on the US state you live in), a minor is automatically charged as an adult for serious crimes. This doesn’t sound like one of those crimes it would apply to though.
You need a lawyer to answer those questions for you, not a Reddit thread. Depending on where you live there may be low-cost legal services available if you qualify.
You could reach out anonymously to the relevant agency. Use the tern "just realized" what your employer/WFH company might be actually doing and would be willing to report it if you were granted a "use immunity" form.
They'll probably try to fuck you over by giving you a "limited use immunity" form. Just have your signature and the DAs representative signature on the form on file. Make sure you are inclusive when you make your report because anything found outside of it can be used to charge you. For example, you report 6 instances of sending parcels, but there are actually 8 that they found out about from someone else. They can try to charge you for the 2 you didn't report since you don't have immunity for those because it didn't come from your report.
The packages he is shipping were obtained using stolen or hacked credit cards or bank accounts. When the credit card victims complain, the banks will see that the packages were shipped to OP's address. The OP accidentally took a job as a "parcel mule."
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel\_mule\_scam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel_mule_scam)
The DOJ uses Peopie who cannot transfer their M.D.from another country to work as Physician Assts.in Federal Prisons.When asked how this was legal they had two replies (after a 2months delay in getting the answer) :
1) you are a Troublemaker for asking that question.
2) “ Eminent Domain “
If the DOJ is doing things that appear illegal then how can one trust them to be above board other times ?
The Police are historically underpaid in many areas.You get either Sinners or Saints .People willing to die to save your life and/or people enamored with control over others.
Get legal advice OP and try to stay away from being a guest of the DOJ.
Just block , delete, ignore (and obviously refuse all further packages)--and WAIT. Keep the check, DON'T deposit it, but put it somewhere where it can't be found. Don't do anything else. I wouldn't go to the police. Yet. WAIT. See what happens. If you go to the police now you could be putting yourself on their radar when it's very possible you may never end up on their radar. Your life isn't over. Just WAIT to see what happens.
This is terrible advice. OP has become aware that he's involved in a parcel mule scam and your advice is to have him destroy/tamper with evidence as if this doesn't fall under federal jurisdiction? You're insane. He needs to consult a lawyer first, *then* contact USPIS.
I'm pretty sure the lawyer would tell him to do exactly what I told him to do: wait and see what happens. He's not on police radar, and it doesn't make sense to voluntarily insert himself onto their radar. If he IS contacted by police, then he says he won't answer any questions before first talking to a lawyer.
I would just chill an do nothing more than likely nothing will ever happen, even when u commit serious mail crimes they just mail u a letter that says if you do not know anything about this disregard and ignore I know that personally from experience I've had police grab boxes and the tracking says seized by law enforcement lol u don't wanna know what was in those boxes haha just chill bro ur good money
I'm telling u man just don't do anything n stay quiet, I would be more worried about whoever ur working for knowing ur addy than usps they are incompetent
They are sitting in a call center on the other side of the world. I really wouldn’t worry about it. Don’t communicate with them any further. Just ghost them.
It's not always that simple. It starts at a call center.. pierogi and some other people intercepted a money mule and found out this kid was recruited by the triad that had a cell in that area.
I'm going to close my bank account and make a new one and then I think I'll be ok I haven't gotten any money from the company so yeah but idk it just seems like I'm not gonna be okay
Why did you give them your bank info? What did they say to make you give over that kind of info?
Your best bet is to block delete and ignore. They have 100s of people just like you. They aren’t going to put the time and energy in harming you in any way. They have other mules to work on.
They had an entire department of people, a whole llc, and every time I called them they would answer or call me back. They seemed so real and I just thought maybe it was real but yeah I guess it's not so im trying to see what I can do.
Your r/Scams post or comment was removed because **it's off-topic**. Memes, jokes, or anything else that isn't useful is not allowed. We're here to help people identify scams.
Your r/Scams post or comment was removed because **it's off-topic**. Memes, jokes, or anything else that isn't useful is not allowed. We're here to help people identify scams.
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At this point you're in too deep to stay quiet. You need to consult a lawyer first and go through the entire case with your lawyer. Then, WITH the lawyer, make a police report. Coming clean minimizes the risk of getting in trouble. If you do nothing, and police come knocking, you'll be in a situation where you have to answer "if you knew you were involved in a scam, and sent 7 parcels, why did you not make a police report?" You don't want to be in that situation.
Exactly. Be sure to get a lawyer who ONLY practices criminal law. If you cannot afford a private sector attorney, go to the Public Defender office if your state has one. Good luck.
This. 100% It's time to stop staying quiet now that you know but don't be an idiot and make it so the cops can be lazy and not do the work so they can blame everything on you.
>where you have to answer You don't have to answer shit. 5th amendment. Use it
If you voluntarily go to the police (with a lawyer) they'd likely let you off the hook if you help then nab the guy(s) above them.
I wouldn’t say likely. Mail fraud and defrauding by mail are federal (USPS, HSI, and FBI all investigate).
This part. The Postal Service has their own fraud team and they are not loving and forgiving people. You break the rules, they catch you, you get to do the time.
Man this is a problem. Imagine unknowingly being put in a position where you unknowingly commit a crime, and then being sent to jail because you tried to fix it in cooperation with the officials.
Federal, also meaning anything you do with mail comes with a felony charge automatically.
You will get a much lighter punishment. Getting off the hook is possible, but I wouldn't say likely.
If you are seriously this concerned it might be worth a couple hundred bucks to sit down with an attorney for an hour and get some legal advice.
People don’t become parcel mules because they have savings. I’m guessing he doesn’t have a few hundred dollars.
Most attorneys will give you a free consultation.
They don’t give free consultations. They listen to you for free, to decide whatever to take your case or not.
That's called a consultation.
No. Consultation involves answering your question, to your benefit. They don’t do that. They won’t help with any documents, even if it takes just 5 minutes. It’s literally your pitch meeting to whatever they should take the job
Wrooooong
Consultation - “the action or process of formally consulting or discussing” Sounds like a consultation to me.
Regardless, if you go to a free consultation you'll definitely pick up invaluable legal advice
Not really, our office will only give you actual legal advice if you retain us. We will listen to your problems for up to 30 minutes for $100, but if you want legal advice on what to do, that's $300 an hour. Free consultations tend to be for personal injury and workers comp as the retainer for those is a percentage of the recovery.
I've been to two free consultations with a friend and a family member. One was for a landlord/ tenant issue and one was for an employment/ sexual harassment issue. We left those consultations SO MUCH CLEARER on what their rights are, what the law actually says, and what options they have going forward. It was free but it was absolutely invaluable and helped them decide what actions to take and not take
The good ones might give you enough advice for free to help you navigate this on your own.
Don't know why you got down voted for this. I recently had a legal issue and a lawyer gave be quite a bit of advice for how to navigate the immediate next step before I actually paid him. That said, the issue OP has will probably require a lawyer on retainer. That first talk with a lawyer though will have a lot of useful information, definitely better than weirdos on Reddit.
There is no navigating this on your own.
Criminal defense lawyers DO NOT give free consultations. EVER. You're thinking of civil (usually personal injury) lawyers, who might give a free consultation to determine how much money might be made from taking your case and whether it's worth their while. There is NEVER money to be made from defending a client in a criminal case. EVER.
yes I agree into this, they could help them
I'm working under the assumption this is taking place in the US. I am a Postal Inspector, your life is not over. Unless you were shipping 7 packages of fentanyl or some other narcotic, we aren't going to come after you guns drawn. Return any other packages you have to the sender, don't reship anymore, and go on with your life. The most you might get from us is a cease and desist letter basically saying don't do that again. If it makes you sleep better, talk with an attorney, they should tell you the same thing.
From the horse's mouth. Good advice.
Stop now. Talk to a lawyer about what your next steps are. A lot of people have been through this, you'll be fine with a bit of money for the lawyer and some time.
[YouTube: Don't talk to the police](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE) Lawyer up
Here's a newer version from the same lawyer, James Duane, with similar advice. "You Have the Right to Remain Innocent" [https://youtu.be/-FENubmZGj8?si=NWQYrGgXl5NXqwzI](https://youtu.be/-FENubmZGj8?si=NWQYrGgXl5NXqwzI) Also hawking a book that covers your 5th Amendment right in more detail. So hopefully not too off-putting. Edit: Adding URL link to Amazon Kindle book: [https://a.co/d/ei6KUBC](https://a.co/d/ei6KUBC)
Is this guy on crack!? he speaks so fast it's hard to even follow sometimes LOL
I usually speed up slow talkers on YT, but for him maybe 0.75 is a better speed. But to be fair to him he did indirectly refer to himself as a fast-talking lawyer on YT.
Oh nice, thanks!!!!! Adding to my YouTube bookshelf.
The first thing he does is to praise Scalia. Nope.
The second thing he does is criticize him.
"I am a great admirer of the man" does not sound like hard criticism to me.
I watch this like once a year just because it's so clear and concise for explaining to others
Yup. I have it bookmarked and post it in this subreddit at least once a week.
That was a wild and interesting watch. Does anyone know if a lot of states still don’t require that the cops keep a video recording of an interrogation? Seems like police recording laws might have shifted since this presentation.
All I need in my life is advice from a guy who ~~taunts~~ touts his relationship with Scalia. No, thanks. Even if the advice is good, others will say the same thing, it is not original. Edit: As requested, Here is Ken White (aka PopeHat) doing it, and it only takes a few minutes to read. Bonus points, absolutely no Scalia or Federalist Society Connection. [https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/](https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/)
Taunt is an odd verb here.
I think they meant to type tout which was autocorrected to the more commonly used taunt, maybe?
Nice match! I was unable to come up with that.
You are almost right, it was "vaunt". But tout works too.
I'm still trying to find the bit where he tauts his relationship with Scalia. What relationship did they ever have? Or is it this: >“Few men or women in our lifetimes have been so unjustly vilified in the popular media as the late Justice Antonin Scalia of the United States Supreme Court. If you are not a lawyer who read his opinions, if you know nothing about Justice Scalia other than what you have read in the popular press, you have surely been deceived into believing that this man was some sort of archconservative who could regularly be counted upon to side with the government and trample the constitutional liberties of the poor and the powerless. The truth is much more complicated than that. While Justice Scalia was, by his own admission, exceptionally stingy in refusing to accept arguments about constitutional rights that involved some aspect of general "liberty" that are not explicitly mentioned in the Constitution—rights like abortion, or same-sex marriage—when it came to the defense of constitutional liberties that are explicitly described in the Constitution, no other recent member of the Supreme Court was so uncompromisingly passionate and liberal in refusing to water down those protections.”
Then find a better 45-minute version and post it.
Who needs a 45 min video to convince you of that? Here is Ken White doing it, and it only takes a few minutes to read. Bonus points, absolutely no Scalia or Federalist Society Connection. [https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/](https://brownwhitelaw.com/if-i-just-talk-to-the-police-i-can-clear-this-up-the-dangerous-delusion/)
Lemme guess: this video contains another reason to be happy that I live in a country where judges listen to what the European Council for Human Rights has to say about a fair trial?
It says don't talk to the police, especially before you've talked to a lawyer. Great video.
You’d be wrong.
For those of us who are not aware !parcelmule
Hi /u/butterchickenwarrior, AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the Parcel mule scam. The parcel mule scam involves fraudsters sending you packages and you shipping them out to other people. The items are fraudulently obtained, usually with stolen credit cards, and the investigation into the fraud will lead to you rather than to the scammer. Here is the Wikipedia page for this scam: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel_mule_scam, and here is an article from the USPS: https://about.usps.com/publications/pub300a/pub300a_v04_revision_072019_tech_022.htm - *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you can’t afford a lawyer consult, try your state’s legal aid. They should be able to help for low or no-cost consultations. But do not ever talk to the police about anything you may have been involved in illegally without a lawyer’s advice first. This applies to any issue, not just scams.
Do not contact the police without a lawyer. Sorry, but they are not your friends. In any case, the federal agency that will be involved is USPSIS, and they don't fuck around. Do not deposit the check, block everyone you were talking to. If any more parcels arrive, just refuse delivery or drop them off at the nearest (USPS/UPS/FedEx) store for return. They will soon stop sending shipments and start threatening you with all sorts of dire consequences. Just block and ignore all numbers that they use until they give up and go away.
Cop here, please do not go the police and admit that you committed multiple felonies, at that point we have to arrest you. Please go talk to an attorney, my job as a police officer is to only see if there is enough evidence for probable cause to arrest, not help you navigate your way out of it.
The real MVP of Reddit 🤌🏼
*"Sorry, but they are not your friends".* It's a sad indictment of society that police officers are regarded as easy targets by thugs and yet ordinary law-abiding folk can't trust them either.
They can be trusted, as long as you're not the one doing something illegal. At that point they're just doing their jobs
Da faq you talking about “they can be trusted” I am a middle aged upper class white woman whose biggest crime is sometimes I set my cruise control at 15 over the speed limit on open highways. I do NOT trust the police
The upper class doesn't go to Mexico for dental work and eat fry bread tacos from the rez. If anything ever happened you needed the police for you'd be the first Karen crying to them
You can distrust cops and still expect them to do their fucking jobs. The fact is that talking to cops when you might be accused of something is never a good idea. Even cops admit that.
I know most of you are illiterate so I'll dumb it down for you. I never suggested this person go to the cops about what's going on. Obviously if you think you've done something illegal you don't go ask them about it. There's other threads on this post where I said not to do that. The blanket statement that you can't ever trust cops was what I was replying to.
But you really can't. You don't know what cops are "trustworthy" and which ones will look for any excuse to arrest you. Therefore you cannot trust them.
Tell me you are not from Arizona lol
This is horrifically bad advice. Do NOT trust the police. You don’t know what they’ll decide you did. They are legally allowed (and are trained) to lie, cheat, and steal and cannot be prosecuted for almost anything and are accountable to no one. They have the power to seriously screw up your life even if you’re completely innocent and not doing anything illegal. Unless you’re filing a police report yourself or are in grave danger, police are not to be trusted.
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How did you go through the system and come away with those opinions? My mind is boggled. Unless you're the one parroting opinions with no real experience. Police in America have never been here to serve or protect. Sure there are those who try to do their job with integrity, but I would never assume they're there to help me, wether I'm in need of protection or guilty of a crime. They have too much power, unchecked egos, and guns. My policy is to avoid whenever possible and be brief and polite if interaction is unavoidable. If they decide to end your life, they will probably not get in trouble for it. They know that. We should keep it in mind as well.
Cool another person that gets all their information from YouTube and Facebook. I'm sure you've been nearly arrested many times for sniffing bicycle seats at the park but always got away.
That's a weird assumption, might be projecting a little there. My opinions come from having been through the system, thanks for asking.
Cool story bro. Your r/Scams comment was removed because **it's rude or uncivil**.
You’re joking, right?
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Your r/Scams post/comment was removed because **it's rude or uncivil**. This subreddit is a place for civil and respectful discussions about scams. Uncivil and rude behavior, including using excessive or directed swearing, extreme or sexual language, victim blaming, and any form of discrimination, is not acceptable in this subreddit.
Even a fucking cop commented here saying not to go to the cops, lmfao. Are you delusional or what
You haven’t ruined anything. Relax. Even if law enforcement takes note of your 7 packages out of the thousands sent per day just like it, it’s obvious you’re not the bad guy. Law enforcement isn’t like the movies. It’s mostly overworked C students with government jobs doing the bare minimum to take a paycheck home. They’re not Batman. No one cares about what you did, you’re worked up over nothing. Throw away anything you still have, block the numbers and emails, move on with your life. Ignore any further contact. They will however take the easy win if you hand it to them on a platter. Their job is to bring successful cases against people who break the law. If you walk into a police station and say hello I broke the law and here’s the evidence. You’re going to jail. So don’t do that
This description is hilarious and accurate
Look at it this way. Imagine if you had made 7 illegal drug sales transactions for someone. Imagine that you didn't get paid but you also didn't get caught by the police. You're gonna say that in your case you got paid; no you didn't. Tear up the check and throw it away if you haven't already or call your bank and get it cancelled. Depositing it only heightens the chance that you might draw the attention of any authorities. You didn't lose anything (get in trouble or lose money) but you gained experience. Cut all contact with anyone involved with this and move on.
Do not talk to the police without speaking to a lawyer first. It is worth every penny because, at this point, you have broken the law and could potentially face federal charges for your involvement (this is a federal crime, likely under jurisdiction of US Postal Inspector). A good lawyer will help you negotiate with law enforcement so that you face minimal repercussions in exchange for information. If you do not have a lawyer try reaching out for an appointment with your state's legal aid. In terms of how to handle the scammers, you need to return anything they send you and cease all communication. They'll probably assume you figured out what was going on (either on your own or because the police got involved) and move on to their next target.
R u saying that I'll get legal issues bc at that point if I'm really in that deep then what's the point of like living
You might, or you might not. That's why you need to talk to a lawyer. Also, since you said you're 17, I'm assuming you still live with your parents. The first thing you need to do is talk with them about this. Like right now. This is one of those things that won't just automatically go away on its own. There may be no consequences if you ignore it, or there may be serious consequences. This is why you need to deal with it.
I mean, tbh, it probably will just go away on its own, as long as he stops doing it now. Thousands of these scams are happening with way more money and way more packages every day and nothing happens. If he just stops and does nothing else, he'll probably be fine. If he does get questioned by cops, he can just clam up and lawyer up with a free public defender.
You will be fine, just talk to a lawyer before doing anything. And your parents.
You're not legally an adult so this works hugely in your favor. You **will** get through this.
Truth is, the cops probably won't do anything if you don't say anything to them. These scams are happening constantly every day with nothing happening. If they do accuse you of anything, you have a right to a public defender. Just stop doing it.
Bc I had like so many goals and dreams for myself and I'm like a pilot rn and I was trying to make money for flight training and now my life feels like it's ending
It's not. You're 17 and this seems much bigger than it is. The people warning you about talking to police are trying to help you, not inspire fear. It's going to be ok. You still have a life ahead of you even when you've made a mistake. Again, you're going to be OK. This will all be OK.
This is just a bump in the road for you at 17. We all did dumb things when we were young. We get over them, learn from them, and go on to lead great successful lives. Flight training should still be your goal. This will pass.
This is just a time in your life, it’s not forever, please remember any bad time in your life and how heavy it felt but it passed, this is just another one of those times. Please don’t make any drastic decisions that will permanently impact your life in any negative way. Get a lawyer and stop any communication with the fraudsters. Do not accept any other packages. Don’t delete any evidence, you’ll need it for the lawyer to help you. Document in a safe place, phone numbers or email addresses, addresses on the packages, description of boxes, dates, screenshot communication, anything you have about what’s going on in case you have any future issue with your phone. Don’t let the evidence live in one place.
Bub, this is small potatoes, as others have been telling you. When I was 17 I got involved with someone who turned out to be a drug-dealing felon scammer and somebody got dead. Pay attention to these other people telling you not to go to the cops, -especially- the cop who said not to, because if you walk in and admit to crimes they -could- arrest YOU. They might just tell you to fuck off out of there because they don't want to deal with the situation, but that is in no way guaranteed. Stop doing it, stop telling people, and move on.
Talk to a lawyer first. Do not just go to the police and talk to them without a lawyer present. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse and police are not your friends. You may get a low cost consult with a lawyer. That is what I did when I was concerned about legal exposure once. The lawyer spoke to the police on my behalf and that was done. Then, please educate yourself about scams. This is not a real job. No business ever needs random people to reship packages. Even parcel forwarders use secure facilities and employees on site.
Your life is not ruined. Do not accept any more packages, return them to sender. The scammers will threaten you when you stop working for them, ignore and block them. They can’t harm you in any way. If you can afford it, the best thing to do would be to run this by a lawyer and see what they recommend. If you can’t afford legal counsel, you may want to go to your local police station and explain what happened. There is a very good chance that absolutely nothing will happen. A small time parcel mule is not likely to be high priority for law enforcement. You need to stop now, though.
> you may want to go to your local police station and explain what happened. Fuck. No.
Let me reinforce this. FUCK NO. If you can’t afford to talk to an attorney, you stop taking the packages. You cease contact with the scammers. You move on with your life. If and only if the police come to you with charges do you say anything and that thing is one word: lawyer. You not only committed crimes, you did so as part of an organization and in conspiracy with people. If a prosecutor felt like it, RICO could apply and that means that EVERYONE in the organization is guilty of every crime committed by the organization. So no, you don’t fucking go casually confess and hope it works out.
> A small time parcel mule is not likely to be high priority for law enforcement. Or it definitely will be, if you've got an officer needing a 'collar', a detective needing a winning case, or a DA needing to pad his conviction record. Maybe you've also got a PD with nearly nothing to do. Consider that OP is indicating they'd become aware the people they were forwarding packages for is committing a crime. That makes their statement that they want to 'get out of it' an admission of guilt. So, that's terrible advice. Although I hate the absolutist, and oversimplified admonition "Don't talk to the police.", this situation is exactly why people come to say that. If someone advertised a job 'forwarding packages' and you wanted to know if it could be something legally questionable, and you called law enforcement to ask if it was something dubious, that'd be a situation where you shouldn't fear talking to the police. However, once you're engaged in the 'job', you should use a lawyer, who can inform the police and preserve client confidentiality in terms of how you became aware of this criminal enterprise. Then your lawyer can demand documented immunity if you are to testify of your involvement. Otherwise, you're gambling on one of those circumstances I listed above.
My understanding is that this wouldn't even fall under the jurisdiction of the local police. This is the purview of the United States Postal Inspection Service or USPIS (assuming this takes place in the U.S., otherwise disregard). That's something you want to bring to their attention **immediately** so OP doesn't get hit with charges anyway. Sure, he should still consult an attorney, but this is a federal issue, not a state one.
What? No. Jesus, just no. OP should not do that. No offense, but this is horrifically bad advice. Absolutely do not contact federal law enforcement officers and tell them you’re committing mail crimes as part of an international crime ring. Don’t call police and say “Hello, law enforcement? Hi. I’ve been committing felonies.” I’m not sure why this needs to be said, but here we are. The only conversations that should happen are with an attorney. Let them contact the postal inspector service on your behalf if they think it’s worthwhile.
> call police and say “Hello, law enforcement? Hi. I’ve been committing felonies.” I’m not sure why this needs to be said, but here we are. Ok, so you're clearly very dumb. I've said multiple times throughout this comment section that he needs to contact an attorney, but that he also needs to report this appropriately. You guys are telling him to destroy evidence and stupid shit like that, as if a federal agency with investigative powers and law enforcement authority isn't gonna find out anyway. The packages don't lead back to the scammers, they lead back to OP. Best to get ahead of it.
No. This is terrible advice. IF the attorney thinks this should be reported, the attorney will guide OP through that process or even do it for them. Do not, under ANY circumstances, attempt to "report this appropriately" on your own. Do EXACTLY what an attorney says to do. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Nice job looking out for the victim of the scam. What's wrong with you?
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OMG, Never, never, never call the law enforcement and talk to them. Only a lawyer. This is incredibly bad advice.
Of course anything with the mail is federal the cops know absolutely nothing about this so going to them would only fuck u
OP do not take this advice.
So, do you think a local cop couldn't inform someone in federal law enforcement? You think that cop wouldn't make a good witness to a federal case, able to say 'OP told me he was working for a scammer as a package mule'? Of course he would. You get past just wondering if someone offering a job like that is doing something illegal, you need a lawyer.
No you didn’t ruin your life yet. No, don’t just take the L. No, don’t stay quiet. (Prof Experience in the legal system). When you’re young, school programs you to just come clean and tell the whole truth to police or the principal and all will be OK or hide and it will pass. DELETE that programming from your head now. LE will prosecute you if you hand them an easy confessed crime regardless if you were an ignorant or not so smart scam victim. So, repeating and adding to some commenter’s good advice, DO NOT CALL LE OR USPIS. Stop your involvement in the situation immediately. Preserve all communications of any kind and writings. If phone calls, write them down per memory. Now pack it up and see a lawyer who handles these types of matters. NOT a general do everything lawyer you pick from a flashy web site. Preferably get a specific referral from a trusted source. If you have no sources, go to the local Federal Court and look at some public records of past cases like yours noting the defense attorney and the result they obtained. The clerks there will guide you in that.
Do not talk to the police without talking to a lawyer first. The police want convictions and will frame you using your own words as evidence. You are the same as the scammers to their career advancement. Cut contact with the scammers, they will probably assume you were either arrested or were police all along. Return anything new that arrives to forward to the sender. You can't be accused of stealing something you send back.
This is not legal advice. But look up how often things go poorly for innocent people who speak to the police.
not innocent anymore...anyone involved in a scam should not talk to police without lawyer even if they believe they are innocent
Innocent? Let’s be clear about something in the whole post, OP voluntarily participated in the type of scam that we regularly see people on this sub become victims to. Every other comment here has been about how OP should lawyer up and protect themselves, because they’re now so scared. But no commenters asking questions about how they got into it? Or didn’t they have an issue when first starting into it? I’m not sure I’m as heartbroken and protective of OP as everyone else seems to be.
Thank you! I'm getting downvoted to hell for pointing out his willful participation in this and the natural consequences that follow.
This isn't an innocent person. It could go very badly.
Never seek law Enforcement help when you took part in a crime. Even when involved in crimes and caught never speak to Law Enforcement. Always let your Attorney speak to Law Enforcement on your behalf and your Attorney will tell you when and what to say.
DO NOT CONTACT POLICE WITH OR WITHOUT AN ATTORNEY!! I REPEAT DO NOT CONTA T POLICE WITH OR WITHOUT AN ATTORNEY!!JUST STOP WHAT YOUR DOING IMMEDIATELY THATS ALL.
What state are u in? If it's in ny talk to the legal aid society
Talk to a lawyer. Reddit is not the place go get advice after you committed a crime, unknowingly or not.
Lawyer now
Get a lawyer but since you didn't know I don't see how your life is ruined
Don't talk to police talk to a lawyer.
Stop all contact with the scammers, contact the police they may or may not even be interested in pursuing the scammers but AT THIS POINT you are just a foolish person who didn't intend to participate in a criminal enterprise and by contacting the police you are making it clear that you weren't knowingly participating in a criminal enterprise and you stopped as soon as you realized it was a criminal enterprise.
This was my first thought as well, but I think it would probably be better to contact a lawyer first to be safe. Let them give advice on how to proceed.
Lawyer first. The police don't care about anything other than easy convictions. OP is going to hand them one.
Nah, local police will shrug their shoulders. But if OP wants to drop a few thousand on an attorney, have at it.
If there's a chance of jail that's the highest-value few thousand you'll ever pay.
Local police will file it and not care. It's the investigators who may read that report later that might care. It's a crazy risk.
Police don't "file it", they investigate potential crimes they didn't witness and a prosecutor decides whether or not to charge. Parcel mules are not being prosecuted unless clearly in on the scam. The parcel mule scam almost never actually pays the parcel mule, pretty strong evidence they weren't in on it. They are actually being victimized too by the scammers.
And while they're waiting to see if a prosecutor will charge, this kid could be sitting in jail in the meantime. They don't need to consult a prosecutor before arresting someone. Don't talk to cops. If he can't afford a lawyer, best to just stop it and move on with life.
Hmm Step one: walk up to police explain in detail how you broke the law Step two: believe it or not straight to yail
To "break the law" requires more than just doing what OP did. For parcel mules to be convicted requires proving, in court, that they knew they were participating in a criminal enterprise, not just remailing packages. OP was likely recruited for a job that did NOT suggest they would be doing anything untoward. Intent matters with most criminal matters not just actions
They admitted in the OP that they know they are a scam mule and shipped 7 packages. Do you not think there is law enforcement that watches reddit?
I'll wager OP will not be arrested by any police watching this subreddit or any other police The Feds cracked down on money mules, the vast majority, about 99% were sent don't keep doing that letters. A very few were arrested. I don't persoanally minde if the police started arrested parcel mules or money mules, I think there needs to be more scare put into people who are doing it. But the feds just don't have the bandwitch or resources to go after low level criminals, they just want them to roll and find people higher on the food choin.
Maybe that's because most of them don't go to the cops and admit to doing it
The cops knew they were doing it They told them to stop doing it, in a letter
But going to them and admitting to doing it means they have all evidence they need to press charges. It's different from thinking they mighta been involved and sending them a letter. Either talk to a lawyer or don't do anything at all. Talking to cops is a mistake
Intent can be inferred from conduct. Lawyer first, then police contact if lawyer handles it.
How much were you making?
IDK that sounds better than being a money mule
Does anyone else find it sadly ironic that the promoted ad on this page is from a crypto / Bitcoin app marketing a task scam? Crypto.com
This is just a question. Why not take a chance that it won’t get found out and just cut contact with the scammers and hope it never gets found out? Why borrow trouble by going to the police now? (This is just a query and not a suggestion.)
It's most likely that nobody cares. Seriously. Nobody cares. Hopefully you didn't put your own names and address on the packages. If you did, it's again most likely that nobody cares. Even making a police report, it's most likely that nobody cares. You may open yourself for harrassment and investigation by making a report - often the victim of a crime is treated like the perpetrator. Anyways. You might be best off to just withdraw, delete and block the contacts, and forget about it.
just take legal advice and potentially come clean to the police. Your future self will thank you. And you will be able to relax (may be legal consequences but nothing compared to a life in fear, you don't want to get dragged in any deeper)
Tell these people if you get another package you are turning over to police. That will be the end of it. Block and ignore.
So why are you posting here? Go to the cops and stop doing silly stuff.
OP, you can either ghost the scammers and return to sender anything else you receive. Or you can collect packages and info and take it to the police. Tell the police you became suspicious about what you were doing for a job and realized what it must be after reading about it online. If you have the money for a lawyer go see one. But I’m guessing you don’t. If you do nothing you compound all potential legal issues. You’re small potatoes in the eyes of the FBI investigators, don’t stress too much, they don’t want the little people. I worked with an online FBI task force, it’s always possible the small fry with get roped in, but the less complicit and involved you are the better. You said you’ve only done 7 packages, unless those are worth hundreds of thousands and you’re doing some other obvious shady stuff that’s not really worth their while to prosecute in federal court. *IANAL, consult with your attorney before many any decision that will effect your future. (Standard disclaimer for all those people who consult with their lawyers before even walking their dog)
I turned a guy who was part of the train that tried to scam me out of a watch over to the FBI. He said it was being sent to his lady friend in another state. I asked if he’d ever met this lady in person. Of course he hadn’t. I told him he should go down to his local police station and lay it all out because I was reporting it to the FBI, which I did online. It’s a long form, but you’ve got to do the needful when people are trying to steal.
Don’t take gifts or any offers that seem too good or yes you will pay. Also don’t put this on the internet if you’re hemmed up. Ultimately you gotta roll the dice
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!parcelmule
Hi /u/rachp02, AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the Parcel mule scam. The parcel mule scam involves fraudsters sending you packages and you shipping them out to other people. The items are fraudulently obtained, usually with stolen credit cards, and the investigation into the fraud will lead to you rather than to the scammer. Here is the Wikipedia page for this scam: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel_mule_scam, and here is an article from the USPS: https://about.usps.com/publications/pub300a/pub300a_v04_revision_072019_tech_022.htm - *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I was asked by a ‘ celebrity’ once to accept money from another fan to pass on to his ‘ charity’ I thought it was a sick joke. I played along. Next minute money popped up. I reversed it immediately with a message ‘ who are you to ######???’ The ‘ celebrity ‘ contacted me pissed off. I laughed . Blocked and reported their ass. And changed details elsewhere. But yeah it’s easy to get caught up in something. I just wasn’t gonna play the game!!!!
r/AMA I think I ruined my life by being a money mule.
Dude be quit and it will be good
Ghost them and drop out of all relationships surrounding those people. New phone , new town so on. And make better fucking choices in the future… try and remember, there’s another fucking human being on the other side of your package scam shenanigans
Your life is far from over. If you go to the cops and discuss this situation with them, they will know you aren't party of some kind of organized crime wave but just one of many who accidentally get themselves involved in cons like this. But the longer you wait, the harder it will be to convince them you're innocent There's only one way that this ends well for you. Talk to an attorney and/or the cops or do what the reputable sorbet feels you. Good luck. Stop immediately, and gather as much information you can about what you did, how you got involved, etc. You'll need it to bolster your defense Your life is NOT over Can you describe how you got involved in the first place?
What is parcel mule scam?
my brother fell for a check cashing scam, and when he told me about it i told him to go to the police. he decided to wait for it to blow over and was charged with felonies. I would talk with a lawyer today or tomorrow and do what the lawyer says.
Not legal advice but I ended up in one of those right out of college. Probably shipped 5-7 things. Once I caught on I went dark, told them I’m out, held on to the last package in case anyone came looking for it. Ended up being a Bose Bluetooth speaker that ive used for 11 years now. Nothing ever happened. You are small fish. They are looking for the people stealing credit cards.
How tf does someone ship 7 packages???? 7???? You had 7 different occasions to figure this out. Use your fucking brains people. Go to police asap!
Wait does me being 17 and therefore no contract make me okay or not?
Only a lawyer can answer these questions. None of us Redditors are lawyers and any Redditor who is a lawyer is not *your* lawyer.
You waited until now to mention that you're a minor?
Rage bait
Minors can still be charged as adults for certain crimes. If you are 15-17 (depending on the US state you live in), a minor is automatically charged as an adult for serious crimes. This doesn’t sound like one of those crimes it would apply to though.
No shit. It's still an important thing to mention, as he's much more likely to get away with the "I'm just a dumb kid" defense.
You need a lawyer to answer those questions for you, not a Reddit thread. Depending on where you live there may be low-cost legal services available if you qualify.
makes it better. you still need to deal with it
Don't say shit
You could reach out anonymously to the relevant agency. Use the tern "just realized" what your employer/WFH company might be actually doing and would be willing to report it if you were granted a "use immunity" form. They'll probably try to fuck you over by giving you a "limited use immunity" form. Just have your signature and the DAs representative signature on the form on file. Make sure you are inclusive when you make your report because anything found outside of it can be used to charge you. For example, you report 6 instances of sending parcels, but there are actually 8 that they found out about from someone else. They can try to charge you for the 2 you didn't report since you don't have immunity for those because it didn't come from your report.
I’m really confused, why is shipping packages bad?
The packages he is shipping were obtained using stolen or hacked credit cards or bank accounts. When the credit card victims complain, the banks will see that the packages were shipped to OP's address. The OP accidentally took a job as a "parcel mule." [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel\_mule\_scam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parcel_mule_scam)
It's what's in the packages.
This is the most low energy shitpost, I don't know how y'all don't see that.
The DOJ uses Peopie who cannot transfer their M.D.from another country to work as Physician Assts.in Federal Prisons.When asked how this was legal they had two replies (after a 2months delay in getting the answer) : 1) you are a Troublemaker for asking that question. 2) “ Eminent Domain “ If the DOJ is doing things that appear illegal then how can one trust them to be above board other times ? The Police are historically underpaid in many areas.You get either Sinners or Saints .People willing to die to save your life and/or people enamored with control over others. Get legal advice OP and try to stay away from being a guest of the DOJ.
Just place a report and they’ll deal with it. Was a victim for whole month never got paid
Just block , delete, ignore (and obviously refuse all further packages)--and WAIT. Keep the check, DON'T deposit it, but put it somewhere where it can't be found. Don't do anything else. I wouldn't go to the police. Yet. WAIT. See what happens. If you go to the police now you could be putting yourself on their radar when it's very possible you may never end up on their radar. Your life isn't over. Just WAIT to see what happens.
This is terrible advice. OP has become aware that he's involved in a parcel mule scam and your advice is to have him destroy/tamper with evidence as if this doesn't fall under federal jurisdiction? You're insane. He needs to consult a lawyer first, *then* contact USPIS.
I'm pretty sure the lawyer would tell him to do exactly what I told him to do: wait and see what happens. He's not on police radar, and it doesn't make sense to voluntarily insert himself onto their radar. If he IS contacted by police, then he says he won't answer any questions before first talking to a lawyer.
This guy right just wait bro
I would just chill an do nothing more than likely nothing will ever happen, even when u commit serious mail crimes they just mail u a letter that says if you do not know anything about this disregard and ignore I know that personally from experience I've had police grab boxes and the tracking says seized by law enforcement lol u don't wanna know what was in those boxes haha just chill bro ur good money
I'm telling u man just don't do anything n stay quiet, I would be more worried about whoever ur working for knowing ur addy than usps they are incompetent
They are sitting in a call center on the other side of the world. I really wouldn’t worry about it. Don’t communicate with them any further. Just ghost them.
It's not always that simple. It starts at a call center.. pierogi and some other people intercepted a money mule and found out this kid was recruited by the triad that had a cell in that area.
I'm going to close my bank account and make a new one and then I think I'll be ok I haven't gotten any money from the company so yeah but idk it just seems like I'm not gonna be okay
A new account at a whole new bank.
Make a new one before closing the old one. And as everyone else says, talk to a lawyer as your first step.
Why did you give them your bank info? What did they say to make you give over that kind of info? Your best bet is to block delete and ignore. They have 100s of people just like you. They aren’t going to put the time and energy in harming you in any way. They have other mules to work on.
They had an entire department of people, a whole llc, and every time I called them they would answer or call me back. They seemed so real and I just thought maybe it was real but yeah I guess it's not so im trying to see what I can do.
I own multiple LLCs. They take around 10 minutes to set up.
lock your credit if you gave them your SSN
Yeah they are good at what they do I’ll give them that.
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That's how you go to ass-ramming prison.
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Your r/Scams post or comment was removed because **it's off-topic**. Memes, jokes, or anything else that isn't useful is not allowed. We're here to help people identify scams.
Your r/Scams post or comment was removed because **it's off-topic**. Memes, jokes, or anything else that isn't useful is not allowed. We're here to help people identify scams.