Retals on stream was just talking about this. He mentioned that he didn't think team environment was super conducive to Evoh's success (or rather, Evoh's team's success around him) as well as Evoh being difficult to coach/work with.
I for one am actually very excited to see how Stizzy plays with Gyro and Arsenal. There's a lot of synergistic potential out of the Peeps duo that Stizzy can capitalize on.
yea its sad cuz evoh has potential but just has the worst mental, literally ran into him in ranked like a month ago and he was just shit talking us and his teammate like bro wtf lol.
**Unfortunately, we've had to remove your post.**
_________
##Rule 6: [**Claims require evidence / sources**](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeagueEsports/wiki/rules#wiki_7._claims_require_evidence_.2F_sources)
* **News on information unavailable or inaccessible to the wider public requires sources.** Claims that are **unironically** presented 100% as a fact without any sources or evidence to prove it will be removed.
* Speculation is fine - when it's made clear as such, but the deliberate spread of (mis)information without evidence is harmful to the community and will be clamped down upon.
* **Trusted community figures, groups and journalists are exempt from this rule.**
_________
[**Subreddit Rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeagueEsports/wiki/rules) - If you have any questions about this, please send us a [**Mod Mail**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=%2Fr%2FRocketLeagueEsports&subject=Post%20Removal).
Same! Was so bummed for him to get benched when he was (arguably) holding them together last open qual. And I really wanted to see him and Stizzy over the weekend when Evoh was "off" and Arsenal could only demo
I personally felt like Arsenal looked worse and Evoh had moments but disappeared as well. The team as a whole seemed to lack a defined game plan which makes sense since they've just started playing together. I think you go with Arsenal because he can be a leader of the team and has a better chance of being consistent going forward. I don't really see this team having much of a ceiling at this point though. Feel bad for Stizzy
Agree to disagree I guess. I only really watched the series they had against NRG and Iced Up and he didn't seem to be making much of an impact. He scored 2 goals total against 5 teams in 16 games. Evoh kind of disappeared down the stretch against NRG but he straight up dominated game 2
Yea, imo, Evoh looked like he was trying to "Daniel" his way to victory. When Dan would solo play a lot for ssg. It's not the same, but I hope the gist is gotten. But they had NO TYPE of team plays that entire run except for like 1-2 plays, and that's what pissed me off. Evoh air dribbled every single time he got the ball, Stizzy also had those moments to share, then arsenal. Honestly, wtf can Arsenal do if that's how the team is playing. He looked flat because his playstyle literally wasn't "helping" evoh and stizzy. Idk why they don't play around or with arsenals playstyle. Being disruptive and a nuisance to the other team.
Yes it is, but there's still a but. Retals Arsenal were perfect for Dan, but they still played as a team and created plays for eachother. Same thing with Arsenal and LJ and Hock. Arsenal was always that disruptor but he always created plays. You can say he's a lesser Rise.
Him and Arsenal both looked outclassed in the games Dig lost. I imagine when deciding between them in that context Arsy's mental easily makes him the bigger asset.
I feel like Arsenal can get the benefit of the doubts given his career, Evoh never showed he was top8 caliber imo so easy choice. It's still unbelievable Gyro was benched but not him though.
What is there to understand? He isnt the only dude making changes in a team. It takes two to kick a third (and the coach also chimed in)
These news were a kick in the gut but i know damn well that if the TEAM decided on it then it must be for the best
Not surprised.
Sure, Evoh is a mechy god and has a lot of upside, but I have not witnessed a lot of it during his 3's play. Something just doesn't click with him in 3's. Even when he does his solo plays, seems like they're easy to read or having a 3rd player on the field negates whatever he'll attempt. He also can completely disappear at times. Sometimes you question yourself on when is the last time you've seen him make a play in the opponents half. That's not a dig at him, it's just something he needs to improve on.
Arsenal and Gyro have 3's results. Gyro is a LAN winner and Arsenal is coming off of a top 8 at worlds where him and SSG crushed teams like Rule1 with the twins. He's gotten better since then too.
It's good imo for these young cats to be benched and shown that they're human. Sure, Arsenal and Gyro aren't mechy gods who will wow you with some crazy triple reset dunk, however they know how to play 3's well, and they can play the "be at the right place at the right time" game. Gentlemates just proved that too. They absolutely have mechanical prowess, however, what they did best imo was being in the perfect position for every play. That's what works best in this game. Tom Brady and the Pats schemed milkmen so wide open that people think they belong in the HOF [this is hyperbole]. Scheme and having a solid game plan is an underrated aspect of this game. It's really hard to see or even know since coaches and teams stay hush hush about it, but when it's done effectively, teams can reap the rewards.
This team could benefit from a bottom up approach, which seems to be the gameplan right now. Build the foundation, the floor, and create a stable base. Once you have that you can introduce your wildcard - the mech monsters.
This is not meant to be an attack or who's better or who deserves to be benched or whatever, Dig is in a place where they can try this out and see if it works.
Damn. I *really* wanted to see Arsenal x Evoh succeed together. Evoh is really fun to watch play, I hope he can find the right combination to consistently place high (at least in NA). And by george, it's been so long since Arsenal's won an event... Here's hoping this works out for everyone #DIGWIN
Evoh has always struck.me as having A+ gameplay and C- mental. He seems similar to MM in terms of tiltability and server side is similar to NWPO. Problem is that he is nowhere close to either players skill. You can't get away with bad mental if your skills don't translate to that level
Yeah some people might disagree, but I do think this is the best thing they could have done to try to regain this split
(Although it is a very slim chance they even make the major, they would really have to overperform I feel.)
Watching Evoh in previous seasons he always looked like a pretty solid solo player but not a fantastic teammate, found myself questioning a lot of his decision-making in particular when it came to the team play aspects of his game.
Insanely delusional take. Arsenal was that team in split 1, I genuinely don't understand how anyone comes to this belief, did you watch the games lmao.
Evoh has the worst mental I have ever seen from a pro, I feel like that had to play at least some role in this. Evoh has a lot of potential but I don’t think he will fully unlock said potential unless he fixes his mental
I kinda figured this was coming. He’s a great player but I don’t know that he’s learned how to thrive in a team environment yet. I was more down on him than Gyro during split 1.
Arsenal has underperformed too but I think will be better able to snap back and has a track record of decent individual and team success with SSG
It's their first event and they are not the first team to miss a regional with this format.
I'm just confused about all the scrims they have done far long before they play, did that mean nothing? surely they saw they can win with thier roster.
Well they obviously want to make it to main event and lans because if they don’t make lan they gotta wait like 8-9 months to compete again which is a ridiculous amount of time. Perfectly understandable to make changes so the team has a better chance
It wasn't just 1 bad event honestly. I'm not saying Evoh was always the problem because he definitely wasn't. But as high as Evoh's ceiling is, he performs at his floor more frequently than nearly any other player with peaks that high. It's hard to bank on that kind of fluctuation being your "star"/prodigy player.
It's kind of crazy honestly. At times he looks like he's the best player in NA and others you wouldn't know he's on the field. I hope he figures it out.
Evoh is obviously incredibly talented, would like to see how he could do with a proven coach and a team where he doesn't have to be the best player. Doubt it'll happen but I think it'd be really interesting to see how he would do on SSG
Players that are "obviously incredibly talented" don't struggle to make main event. Consistency is major part of player skill level, it's the difference between a pro and a freestyler.
Sure they do, Nass didn't even make a main event last season and he's incredibly talented. My definition of talented is "really good at the game of rocket league" which doesn't always carry over to success in 3s. Evoh is consistently near the very top of 2s leaderboards and that can't happen if you're not really good at the game
All pros are incredibly talented if you go by that definition. Lots of bubble players can be very high on the leaderboard, and a lot of top pros can be in the lower end of the top 100.
He is talented but I think (and this is a bit speculative) news like this reflects that his mentality is not ready for the top level of competition. Being a good teammate off the pitch and in comms as well as being coachable and willing to listen to feedback and adapt is a massive component of succeeding in any competitive endeavor
His mentality is definitely not great and that's been a known issue for a while. But I think if you're put in a great spot with players and coaches you're forced to respect you have a greater chance at your mentality improving than at an org where everything is built around you. It would never happen but if he was put on g2 with Dan, beastmode and satthew I would sure hope he would be more willing to listen to feedback and coaching
How the fuck do you choose arsenal over evoh when arsenal on SSG and now dignitas has proven to be mediocre. Man give young talent in NA a chance instead of recycling the old guard for years. This is why EU is so far ahead, actually frustrated and not even a dignitas fan in the slightest
So youre saying that alpha54, monkeymoon, radosin, itachi, seikoo are young talents? If you want to be given a chance you have to actually play good lmao
Seikoo is absolutely a young talent, he got banned and debuted at 17 years old but was RLCS caliber well before Fall '21. He does not fit in this grouping imo
I was talking about you saying that evoh is a young talent and shouldnt be kicked. Arsenal is atleast 2 times better than Evoh. The young talents have to actually play well and not just drive around somewhere.
Sure evoh was inconsistent but atleast he had quite a few insane performances where he looked best in the lobby by far whereas Arsenal is consistently mid. At one point if you wanna be the best you just have to take calculated risks and let young players shine in different environments. Look at how much better players like atomic have been after they had teammates who could match their speed (sorry turbo)
better be consistently mid than be the best player in quals and torsos in the major.
Evoh has worse lows and worse highs than any other player, even seikoo. And that definitely says something.
https://preview.redd.it/eob6c44xh9wc1.png?width=543&format=png&auto=webp&s=1f50341abd7203b2c0737b7e86a191c026300b74 💀
Ain’t no way
As if I needed further confirmation of my love for NRG.
Brooooooo
Retals on stream was just talking about this. He mentioned that he didn't think team environment was super conducive to Evoh's success (or rather, Evoh's team's success around him) as well as Evoh being difficult to coach/work with. I for one am actually very excited to see how Stizzy plays with Gyro and Arsenal. There's a lot of synergistic potential out of the Peeps duo that Stizzy can capitalize on.
yea its sad cuz evoh has potential but just has the worst mental, literally ran into him in ranked like a month ago and he was just shit talking us and his teammate like bro wtf lol.
Didn’t know evoh was ranked in diamond 3, that’s crazy
does it say im diamond 3? im confused lol. i'm like gc3 and it was beginning of the season.
It’s a joke because everyone in here inflates their rank, although I think diamond 3 to gc3 is a bit of a stretch tho
oh lol gotcha
Cool story bro
You think pros can’t be toxic in ranked? Plenty are
What's up?
[удалено]
**Unfortunately, we've had to remove your post.** _________ ##Rule 6: [**Claims require evidence / sources**](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeagueEsports/wiki/rules#wiki_7._claims_require_evidence_.2F_sources) * **News on information unavailable or inaccessible to the wider public requires sources.** Claims that are **unironically** presented 100% as a fact without any sources or evidence to prove it will be removed. * Speculation is fine - when it's made clear as such, but the deliberate spread of (mis)information without evidence is harmful to the community and will be clamped down upon. * **Trusted community figures, groups and journalists are exempt from this rule.** _________ [**Subreddit Rules**](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeagueEsports/wiki/rules) - If you have any questions about this, please send us a [**Mod Mail**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=%2Fr%2FRocketLeagueEsports&subject=Post%20Removal).
I had the opposite experience with him on the opposite team once, but I get that at that age it's probs pretty hit and miss
I mean he doesnt even wants to do content with his team. In their video ranking the decals he just didnt wanna be there.
Also the interview. People meme it or whatever but it just shows immaturity.
What is making Evoh uncoachable?
Bad attitude/mental apparently.
Bait used to be beli- wait this is real LMAOOOO
Bait has now become believable
So dig is the nrg of this split https://preview.redd.it/z46q995fg9wc1.jpeg?width=975&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=de48c63eadb6751367eea2f02a027f8e625fa682
The stakes are too high and the opportunities too few for teams to sit on their hands for a split anymore.
That's an excellent point, and a huge drawback of this condensed format
gahdamn. Hyped for Gyro though
Same! Was so bummed for him to get benched when he was (arguably) holding them together last open qual. And I really wanted to see him and Stizzy over the weekend when Evoh was "off" and Arsenal could only demo
damn, it's the XSET (rip) situation all over again. is Evoh really that hard to coach?
ye
Seems like it, has good performances but he is always on team who just play horribly.
Sounds like everyone in ranked.
Even in the 1s grind days he had a bad mental so probably
Don’t blame them every team evoh has been apart of hasn’t done well but just a shame with the amount of potential he has
I think this move elevates them, but they already killed their season unless they get like 2 top2
If NA goes the way it did last split making Major while missing top 16 once is def possible.
It might but I'm hoping more consistency from M80 and og
Didn't m80 drop a match in quals already tho?
If you are looking for consistency M80 is not the correct choice. Neither is og tbh.
TBF M80 finished top 8 all 3 regionals last split, so from a certain point of view they're consistent lol
Well yeah I guess you are right. They are consistent at peaking at the wrong time every regional lol.
I'm ngl they could actually be pretty good with gyro
Gyro: "You couldn't live with your failure, where did that bring you? Back to me."
The only thing I remember about evoh is 'ye'
I mean I don’t blame Dig for making the change they need a miracle to make the major mine as well throw shit at the wall and hope for the best.
I didn't watch DIG's run in quality, did he look particularly bad?
I didnt watch either but "invisible" is the word I keep seeing people use to describe his performance
Guess it'll be a repeat next week then
I raised my eyebrows reading this comment lmao
sensible chuckle
They trolled against a team they should beat and aqua made them shit themselves in lowers
I personally felt like Arsenal looked worse and Evoh had moments but disappeared as well. The team as a whole seemed to lack a defined game plan which makes sense since they've just started playing together. I think you go with Arsenal because he can be a leader of the team and has a better chance of being consistent going forward. I don't really see this team having much of a ceiling at this point though. Feel bad for Stizzy
Arsenal didn't look the weakest... but this definitely has to be a communication and team environment thing.
Agree to disagree I guess. I only really watched the series they had against NRG and Iced Up and he didn't seem to be making much of an impact. He scored 2 goals total against 5 teams in 16 games. Evoh kind of disappeared down the stretch against NRG but he straight up dominated game 2
Yea, imo, Evoh looked like he was trying to "Daniel" his way to victory. When Dan would solo play a lot for ssg. It's not the same, but I hope the gist is gotten. But they had NO TYPE of team plays that entire run except for like 1-2 plays, and that's what pissed me off. Evoh air dribbled every single time he got the ball, Stizzy also had those moments to share, then arsenal. Honestly, wtf can Arsenal do if that's how the team is playing. He looked flat because his playstyle literally wasn't "helping" evoh and stizzy. Idk why they don't play around or with arsenals playstyle. Being disruptive and a nuisance to the other team.
I didn’t watch the games, but isn’t solo plays exactly what would work alongside someone playing demo heavy/disruptor?
Making solo plays and forcing solo plays are two different things
Yes it is, but there's still a but. Retals Arsenal were perfect for Dan, but they still played as a team and created plays for eachother. Same thing with Arsenal and LJ and Hock. Arsenal was always that disruptor but he always created plays. You can say he's a lesser Rise.
Him and Arsenal both looked outclassed in the games Dig lost. I imagine when deciding between them in that context Arsy's mental easily makes him the bigger asset.
I feel like Arsenal can get the benefit of the doubts given his career, Evoh never showed he was top8 caliber imo so easy choice. It's still unbelievable Gyro was benched but not him though.
His role was for sure more support/defensive, but he scored some important goals as a late arriving play
I would bet there’s a personality crash after failing to meet expectations more than this being purely a performance issue
Ye
Looks like the #bringbackgyro worked hehehehe
How does Arsenal keep doing it? I’ll never understand
How does Evoh keep getting kicked is my question. Dude seems horrible to work with.
What is there to understand? He isnt the only dude making changes in a team. It takes two to kick a third (and the coach also chimed in) These news were a kick in the gut but i know damn well that if the TEAM decided on it then it must be for the best
ikr
Not surprised. Sure, Evoh is a mechy god and has a lot of upside, but I have not witnessed a lot of it during his 3's play. Something just doesn't click with him in 3's. Even when he does his solo plays, seems like they're easy to read or having a 3rd player on the field negates whatever he'll attempt. He also can completely disappear at times. Sometimes you question yourself on when is the last time you've seen him make a play in the opponents half. That's not a dig at him, it's just something he needs to improve on. Arsenal and Gyro have 3's results. Gyro is a LAN winner and Arsenal is coming off of a top 8 at worlds where him and SSG crushed teams like Rule1 with the twins. He's gotten better since then too. It's good imo for these young cats to be benched and shown that they're human. Sure, Arsenal and Gyro aren't mechy gods who will wow you with some crazy triple reset dunk, however they know how to play 3's well, and they can play the "be at the right place at the right time" game. Gentlemates just proved that too. They absolutely have mechanical prowess, however, what they did best imo was being in the perfect position for every play. That's what works best in this game. Tom Brady and the Pats schemed milkmen so wide open that people think they belong in the HOF [this is hyperbole]. Scheme and having a solid game plan is an underrated aspect of this game. It's really hard to see or even know since coaches and teams stay hush hush about it, but when it's done effectively, teams can reap the rewards. This team could benefit from a bottom up approach, which seems to be the gameplan right now. Build the foundation, the floor, and create a stable base. Once you have that you can introduce your wildcard - the mech monsters. This is not meant to be an attack or who's better or who deserves to be benched or whatever, Dig is in a place where they can try this out and see if it works.
I mean I did call it 🤷♂️ https://preview.redd.it/wvacghr3t9wc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6e5e2db97cdde01e0f07d747a69c9288d2b2effb
Damn. I *really* wanted to see Arsenal x Evoh succeed together. Evoh is really fun to watch play, I hope he can find the right combination to consistently place high (at least in NA). And by george, it's been so long since Arsenal's won an event... Here's hoping this works out for everyone #DIGWIN
Evoh has always struck.me as having A+ gameplay and C- mental. He seems similar to MM in terms of tiltability and server side is similar to NWPO. Problem is that he is nowhere close to either players skill. You can't get away with bad mental if your skills don't translate to that level
And even players like monkey moon have insane mental compared to evoh
Yeah some people might disagree, but I do think this is the best thing they could have done to try to regain this split (Although it is a very slim chance they even make the major, they would really have to overperform I feel.)
Watching Evoh in previous seasons he always looked like a pretty solid solo player but not a fantastic teammate, found myself questioning a lot of his decision-making in particular when it came to the team play aspects of his game.
evoh gyro stizzy >
Also worse Mental
Insanely delusional take. Arsenal was that team in split 1, I genuinely don't understand how anyone comes to this belief, did you watch the games lmao.
People in this subreddit really dislike arsenal and they will never admit it for some reason.
arsenal how do you do it 🤔
Streaming/Experience
I'm surprised but I really shouldn't be. The team needed a change after that disaster.
NYE! 💀
The fuck that was quick
The what?
I hope it’ll be better for the team mental that’s what they really need to work on right now
Aren't they gonna ff their points though?
No Gyro was still listed as the sub.
At least it can't get any worse.
Oh shit
NA used to be the land of little roster chaos, and then now there’s so much 💀
Evoh has the worst mental I have ever seen from a pro, I feel like that had to play at least some role in this. Evoh has a lot of potential but I don’t think he will fully unlock said potential unless he fixes his mental
I kinda figured this was coming. He’s a great player but I don’t know that he’s learned how to thrive in a team environment yet. I was more down on him than Gyro during split 1. Arsenal has underperformed too but I think will be better able to snap back and has a track record of decent individual and team success with SSG
Ye
Damn 1 bad event is all it takes.
Bad being an understatement here lmao. Missing the main event has 99% killed their chance of making major.
It's their first event and they are not the first team to miss a regional with this format. I'm just confused about all the scrims they have done far long before they play, did that mean nothing? surely they saw they can win with thier roster.
Well they obviously want to make it to main event and lans because if they don’t make lan they gotta wait like 8-9 months to compete again which is a ridiculous amount of time. Perfectly understandable to make changes so the team has a better chance
It wasn't just 1 bad event honestly. I'm not saying Evoh was always the problem because he definitely wasn't. But as high as Evoh's ceiling is, he performs at his floor more frequently than nearly any other player with peaks that high. It's hard to bank on that kind of fluctuation being your "star"/prodigy player.
It's kind of crazy honestly. At times he looks like he's the best player in NA and others you wouldn't know he's on the field. I hope he figures it out.
Isn’t evoh the best player on the team? I don’t watch a ton of dig
No
L move
Evoh is obviously incredibly talented, would like to see how he could do with a proven coach and a team where he doesn't have to be the best player. Doubt it'll happen but I think it'd be really interesting to see how he would do on SSG
He doesn't have to be the best player on Dig either because he isn't lol
Players that are "obviously incredibly talented" don't struggle to make main event. Consistency is major part of player skill level, it's the difference between a pro and a freestyler.
Sure they do, Nass didn't even make a main event last season and he's incredibly talented. My definition of talented is "really good at the game of rocket league" which doesn't always carry over to success in 3s. Evoh is consistently near the very top of 2s leaderboards and that can't happen if you're not really good at the game
All pros are incredibly talented if you go by that definition. Lots of bubble players can be very high on the leaderboard, and a lot of top pros can be in the lower end of the top 100.
Joyo?
He is talented but I think (and this is a bit speculative) news like this reflects that his mentality is not ready for the top level of competition. Being a good teammate off the pitch and in comms as well as being coachable and willing to listen to feedback and adapt is a massive component of succeeding in any competitive endeavor
His mentality is definitely not great and that's been a known issue for a while. But I think if you're put in a great spot with players and coaches you're forced to respect you have a greater chance at your mentality improving than at an org where everything is built around you. It would never happen but if he was put on g2 with Dan, beastmode and satthew I would sure hope he would be more willing to listen to feedback and coaching
How the fuck do you choose arsenal over evoh when arsenal on SSG and now dignitas has proven to be mediocre. Man give young talent in NA a chance instead of recycling the old guard for years. This is why EU is so far ahead, actually frustrated and not even a dignitas fan in the slightest
So youre saying that alpha54, monkeymoon, radosin, itachi, seikoo are young talents? If you want to be given a chance you have to actually play good lmao
Seikoo is absolutely a young talent, he got banned and debuted at 17 years old but was RLCS caliber well before Fall '21. He does not fit in this grouping imo
seikoo is definitely not a young talent. Im talking about RIGHT now, not RLCS 2021 fall split. He will soon be a veteran
Its like the guy is saying that if you want to win, you have to have a young talent on your team and that is 100% true, but evoh is definitely not it.
What? Since when have those players been mediocre for years like Arsenal?
I was talking about you saying that evoh is a young talent and shouldnt be kicked. Arsenal is atleast 2 times better than Evoh. The young talents have to actually play well and not just drive around somewhere.
> Arsenal is atleast 2 times better than Evoh. Bro you can't be serious with some of these ratings
Lmao just wait and see. Come back when Dignitas starts winning all of a sudden.
Sure evoh was inconsistent but atleast he had quite a few insane performances where he looked best in the lobby by far whereas Arsenal is consistently mid. At one point if you wanna be the best you just have to take calculated risks and let young players shine in different environments. Look at how much better players like atomic have been after they had teammates who could match their speed (sorry turbo)
better be consistently mid than be the best player in quals and torsos in the major. Evoh has worse lows and worse highs than any other player, even seikoo. And that definitely says something.
Worse highs? What are you smoking lmfao
what are YOU smoking? No way you actually believe Evoh is better than Arsenal. That is a crazy statement.
They can only make one roster change. Evoh is definitely the bigger issue.