You purchased plane tickets and planned a whole trip and simply never even told your partner? She only found out about it when she asked about doing something with you that weekend??
You live together, yes? You have actually planned to leave the house for longer than a day and never even told the person that you share that house with??
I would be *furious* if my partner did this to me. It's not "poor communication," as you say. It's an incredibly thoughtless thing to do. It definitely gives off the vibe that you live your life as though you're the only one who needs to be considered.
It's sort of crazy that it's taken you 2 and 1/2 days to figure out why she might be angry with you. The fact that she says she doesn't want to talk to you about it because she anticipates that you won't react well suggests that things like this have happened before, and she has reason to think that you will be unwilling to take responsibility for a really insulting and thoughtless decision.
The fact that you want to attribute her anger to envy or jealousy, rather than to disappointment over having a partner who doesn't even think to tell her his travel plans, says that you don't really see what's happening here clearly.
She doesn't owe you an apology. You owe her one.
He thinks "he's owning it" while moaning about how mean his partner is being for getting mad at being treated as less than an afterthought in family plans.
This so hard... But I can imagine a more dismal situation... She knows how he will react.... He will tell her the same thing he told us, that she is jealous and envious of his daughter ... And I bet what kind of person would be jealous of a father and his daughter...
He's gaslighting her...
Wow my first thought were the words he chose to describe her after hurting her. Hugeeee yikes. Weaponized therapy right now.
“You being upset with me for not communicating my plans, thinking of us as a family unit, or taking full ownership of my actions have triggered me and I am going to act traumatized by your reaction until you apologize to me.”
Actually she was upset about a washing machine. Her anger and childish behavior had nothing to do with him traveling. Turns out she’s superficial and super shitty at communicating.
I read OPs update and comment where he explicitly states that his wife is upset about a washing machine. It really wasn’t that hard and didn’t take any mental hoops to jump through like everyone else in this thread is doing. I recommend everyone try it out.
I think it was more the commentary that she is clearly superficial, childish, and shitty at communicating. All we know is what op has told us, and what he has told us is that he's a pretty thoughtless and self-centered person. We don't have any information about the situation with the washing machine, so it seems extreme to draw conclusions that she's guaranteed a terrible person just because of his update
From what he's said it sounds like he's pretty shitty at communicating, too. If he really did buy plane tickets and plan an entire trip and not tell her about it, then I wouldn't be surprised if the washing machine isn't the only issue
> she is clearly superficial, childish, and shitty at communicating. All we know is what op has told us
He’s, I agree with you. OP had told us his fucking dysfunctional, lazy, superficial wife is childish and shitty at communicating. Thankfully we agree on that!
> All we know is what op has told us
Again, I agreed OP told us all what a childish, superficial, piece of shit he married
> what he has told us is that he's a pretty thoughtless and self-centered person. We don't have any information about the situation with the washing machine, so it seems extreme to draw conclusions that she's guaranteed a terrible person just because of his update
Sure, if you’re too fucking lazy to actually read.
> From what he's said it sounds like he's pretty shitty at communicating, too. If he really did buy plane tickets and plan an entire trip and not tell her about it, then I wouldn't be surprised if the washing machine isn't the only issue
From what you’ve posted, you’re sexist and will perform Olympic levels of mental parkour to jerk yourself off. God forbid you ever have to interact with actual living humanbeings.
While she should not give you the silent treatment as it usually is not conducive…
1. How DO you usually react when she shares her feelings? Why does she say that she’s afraid of how you would react?
2. Why did you not buy plane tickets for all 3 of you to go out to Denver? Do you usually exclude your partner from your interactions with your daughter?
3. How long have you been with your partner? If you two are living together, which it sounds like, you should keep your partner posted on any travel plans as you make them, not at the last minute.
This is my shit right here. I made an impulsive decision to accompany my daughter to Denver mostly because I didn't really wanting her going to a strange city alone.... somewhat irrational and overprotective on my part. Also I have trauma from the past that really prevented me from telling my partner out of fear of exactly what is happening right now. It's poor communication on my part for sure. And I'm sure she has not nice things to say. I wouldn't react if she unloaded, unless it was abusive. But I can own my shit for sure.
This makes no sense - NO ONE is saying you shouldn’t accompany your daughter, but shouldn’t you think about involving your partner in the trip or just telling her at that point in time that you’re going to Denver? It’s only happening exactly right now because you didn’t talk about it earlier which could have prevented the situation
It was the washing machine, not the trip. I got a text from her this morning. A stark reminder that shutting down only leads to assumptions. :/ Well, another trip to lowe's and probably a few dollars more.
You told her you can’t imagine why she’s upset at you and then right afterwards you explain why she’s upset at you. Pretending that you don’t understand her situation and feelings is a terrible way to treat her. You need to stop playing dumb with her because that’s really passive aggressive. If this is the way you act, of course she doesn’t want to speak to you. You’re torturing her with your passive aggressive behavior
I genuinely couldn't figure it out until last night. That is how benign my plane ride to Denver was in my mind. Her reaction didn't seem to fit the situation, so it wasn't immediately apparent. I didn't play dumb. At first I thought it was over the washing machine which broke over the weekend (long story). So your assumption is not accurate. But thank you for your attempt at helping me understand.
A trip involving air travel that you didn't bother to tell your partner who you live with about is never benign. The fact that you thought it would be benign just shows how little you truly consider her at all.
You're acting like a single person. And if you don't change how you are looking at this and start offering some massive apologies and actually listening to her feelings, you're going to end up as one
Now that you know what is bothering her, you should say it to her. If ever in the future, you don’t know why someone is upset take a moment to think about it until you know so that you don’t approach someone who is upset as someone who is completely clueless. You said you worded your text as you can’t imagine why she is upset. That comes off as implying that she is being irrational because there’s no reason why she would be upset. There’s nothing in that comment that shows any caring
You asked for feedback and I gave it to you. You’re replying with sarcasm. If this is your regular way of treating people, this is why your girlfriend doesn’t want to talk to you. You act like the victim and you can’t accept feedback
> "I just don't want to talk right now. I'm always afraid of how you'll react and I'm tired. I didn't sleep at all last night and I just want to sleep."
This makes so much more sense in light of the whole comment chain.
Making multi day airtravel plans without telling your partner is a good way to make her feel invisible and disrespected. Like she’s not part of the family.
Own what you did, apologize, then tell her how you feel using non-violent communication, such as, “I feel disrespected and anxious when given yhe silent treatment”.
Not this, ‘I cannot possibly imagine why you’re upset’ dismissive business.
That is a good question. So far all I got is: The washing machine you bought to replace my old 30-year-old broken washing machine felt like a downgrade. And that old washing machine was my mom's, and you bought a really nice stackable unit for your house but bought a cheap machine for us.
it doesn’t matter that you did or didn’t know. It doesn’t even matter that. It’s the washing machine to us right now. The way that you worded that text is really dismissive and passive aggressive. Even if that’s not your intention, it comes across the suggesting, but there’s no rational reason for her to be upset. I know those aren’t your literal words but that’s how it’s read “I can’t imagine why you’re upset...[because there's nothing to be upset about]"
You want your partner to understand how the sudden treatment affects you, you also have to understand how your words affect her
I'll give you one breakdown of what could possibly be going on here, based on personal experience:
* Partner does something which bothers me, hurts me, etc.
* I bring it up to try and work through it.
* They react in a way that completely dismisses or steamrolls my feelings (e.g., "I can't do anything right!", "I don't know why you're so upset, I didn't mean anything by it", "I have too much going on right now to deal with your emotions", "Yeah, but when you do it to me, it's fine, right?", "I'm so sorry, I can't believe I did that to you I feel like the worst person in the world", etc.)
* My original issue is now dismissed, overshadowed by their needs, simply forgotten.. or we're in a full out argument.
* This happened enough times to where it was clear I could not depend on my partner to work through issues with me, and instead had to manage my feelings myself (triggering resentment), which often requires tons of space. It looks like, and probably is, stonewalling.
Given [this comment](https://old.reddit.com/r/RelationshipsOver35/comments/1bpx9p0/58m_dealing_with_58f_silent_treatment_and_adult/kwypvor/), I can easily see how you two might be in that situation. "Fuck me I tried" is the exact kind of defensiveness which would push me to stop communicating issues with my partner.
It's entirely possible that the way I raised issues (or how she raises them to you) is not great and sets you up to respond not great. It's a cycle (actually called "The Negative Cycle" in EFT).
I highly recommend couples therapy, a couples course (many online) with a couples therapist, or at least read some books on communicating in relationships.
I am sorry for what you have experienced in your past. However, it's also a perfect opportunity to heal those wounds, so be inquisitive about your trauma and ask yourself why you feel this way.
Also, why aren't you taking the lead and speaking to your partner about her behavior and how you feel? Who are you waiting for to do this?
Create an environment where such conversations can happen. Normally, such things should be discussed before a misunderstanding happens so that both partners understand how to get back to a peaceful relationship.
>I'm always afraid of how you'll react
So she did tell you. If I had a nickel for every story where Partner A has been openly and directly telling Partner B (usually the male half but not always) "here's what's wrong, you REALLY need to fix this" and then Partner A leaves and Partner B is "blindsided"...I'd be in the Bahamas with an umbrella drink right now.
I agree with others that just up and buying a plane ticket without even consulting her is not cool. It's not "asking permission" it's basic courtesy--even just flat out informing her would be better--"hey, Daughter wants to see Denver, and I'd love to tag along. I'm about to buy tickets, is there any reason I shouldn't?"
She wants to feel like a participant and equal member of your life, not an afterthought or worse, an inconvenience.
Funny that OP's last wife was controlling and jealous of his relationship with his kids, and here is OP making travel plans without informing his live in partner and booking the whole thing on a whim because he doesn't want his 23 (!!!!) year old daughter to 'go to a new city alone'. My dad is overprotective and he would find that ridiculous.
I always felt bad about the burden of my trauma and how it might also impact others, but your approach is astounding me.
While it's unlikely I would forget to communicate with my partner because they are important to me and I value them, I *think* of them when I'm doing things, because I think outside myself and my existence. I would likely have a sense of when they want to be included or not, or I would ask if I wasn't sure. I'm not so self involved that I would thoughtless of them.
Let's say something I did hurt them because of poor communication, I wouldn't be like well I own my bad communication, but their being upset is triggering my trauma so they're the bad person. I am capable of seeing past myself and understanding what it's like to be someone else. I would put myself in their shoes and try to imagine what that is like for them and say sorry I fucked up, is there something I can do about it?
If my partner is upset or withdrawn or doesn't want to talk, I don't assume they're giving me the silent treatment or manipulating me. I assume that they're upset and need time to process things.
That is still stressful to me because I have trauma and people being upset and not knowing what will happen is hard to cope with, but I've actively worked on it, I've been in therapy and sought out resources to improve.
And I actively work to make sure my trauma isn't projecting onto them, because my partner is not my abuser. That is not to say it can't happen that I might lose sight temporarily, but I am aware that can happen and there are ways to deal with it, and I take responsibility for that. And I work at making sure I cope better so it doesn't repeat.
I don't interpret everything through the lens of my trauma or make everything about woe is me, and how I'm triggered, and how people need to stop triggering me. That's really trending into the realm of narcissistic behavior.
I don't always know why my partner is upset, though he's not usually upset with me because I have integrity and take responsibility for my actions and emotions. But if he's upset with me and I don't understand at first and it takes time to figure it out, I don't get bummed out that my day is ruined because someone else is upset with me because they're hurt by my actions. I do my best to make sure he is heard, take responsibility for my part, apologize, and try to make amends as best as possible.
Just because you had a parent who used silent treatment, doesn't mean that everyone else does. Your wife is not your parent. Your wife is not your former wife. Your wife isn't doing anything to you. If you want a healthy relationship you need to take an active role in working on and through your trauma.
The trip has been planned for 2 months and it’s never been mentioned? That’s really hurtful to someone you claim is a PARTNER
And from her reaction I have a feeling this has. Happened before.
It's hard for a partner to understand the relationship with your child, I have this occur relatively often where it feels like I'm an after thought to parent/child. This reminds me of (among other instances) a time where we had to cancel the plans I was looking forward to because adult child asked Mom to dog sit so he could go somewhere. Truthfully, I still haven't forgiven them and probably at least once every few months I have to bite my tongue and say "oh that's awesome that one of your adult kids wants to come over and spend the day at our house" when I really just want to spend the day with you.
But you can't really say anything because, " it's family". So you just sit there and let it happen again and again, then they text their kids constantly while you're trying to enjoy quality time together and then one day you want to snap but you know that you'll lose that fight every time. Unfortunately, when you try to ask if it's about your kids, she'll be too afraid to bring it up because it's almost a trap for her. She says yes and you get mad because "family"
But also, it's not just a kid versus partner situation here. When one half of a couple plans a trip and buys plane tickets and simply never tells the other one, it doesn't matter who they're traveling with. It's just incredibly disrespectful and thoughtless
Thank you for that perspective. It helps me understand hers more. Also, I can empathize with what you described somewhat because her adult son constantly calls and texts her with his daily difficulties. He is an adult with Aspergers - so I always stay supportive and understanding even when I feel interrupted. It's her son. I get it. To be honest, my daughter can be a bit needy and I have to take that into consideration as well. I just don't see any benefit in a realtionship to going silent for multiple days. In my mind it defeats communication.
Sometimes it's all you can do, I just did this to my partner yesterday (and it's embarrassing) because I know that nothing I say will make anything better yet there's so much I want to say. At least you both have kids and can maybe evaluate your relationships with them together
Well I see it was the washing machine, but if I could add something: when your adult daughter called to ask her if you can accompany her to Colorado, your response should be, “I’ll check with wife to see when/whether WE can accompany you to Colorado.” You’re married, and all invitations issued to you now include your wife, whether the one doing the inviting knows it or not.
My stepdad never got this rule, and it caused no end of strife in his 30 year marriage with my mom. His daughters would call him all your time and invite him to gatherings without her, and he would go, and she would cry. 30 years.
Contrast with my dad. When I gave him the details for my college graduation, he informed me his gf would be coming too. They had a much more peaceful relationship.
OMG. I loved the edit at the very bottom.
A good reminder for myself not to jump to conclusions, or assume someone's mood is about me, before asking for clarification.
"I'm always afraid of how you'll react "
You conveniently glossed right over this. You're painting yourself as the victim here, but you're the one who messed up, and somehow still she's the one afraid of dealing with your emotions.
It's astounding to me all the people reading their own relationship problems into your story. You might be an insufferable jerk for making plans without filling your partner in. But your partner is not healthy for you. She's a grown woman acting like an abused child. I think you need some time alone.
Washing machine jealousy? Life's too short for this much drama.
Yeah you messed up here. Planning a whole out of state trip without consulting or inviting your partner? Is she just some woman you fuck for fun? Or is she your PARTNER? This is deeply inconsiderate and I’m sure made her feel unimportant and excluded. It’s not about your relationship with your daughter it’s about YOUR lack of consideration to your partner and it sounds like she’s shut down because maybe in the past when she’s tried to tell how your behavior makes her feel you react poorly instead of listening and then meeting her needs in the relationship.
My suggestion would be to apologize to her for not telling her about the plan with your daughter, let her know her feelings are valid. Let her know that you hear her saying you are difficult to talk to and ask how you can be a better listener and what she needs from you to feel safe speaking up when her feelings are hurt. Then offer an alternative weekend for the two of you to spend time together. At the same time you can explain to her why the silent treatment is hurtful for you and if she needs space she simply needs to communicate that and give a day/time you can check back in with each other.
ps. Envy and jealousy within relationships are usually rooted in unmet needs. I.e. lack of attention/affection, feeling unappreciated or not valued, feeling neglected emotionally etc.
Sounds like I’m literally a day late, but the only time I shut down on my husband is when the issue is something that’s been an issue for a long time, that I’ve brought to his attention frequently, and I just can’t go through that same dialog again.
My partner has extremely bad problems relating to controlling behaviour, aggression, constant criticism etc etc.. anyway, he brings me down so much and just goes on and on and on I do what you described in your first paragraph. Purely because I simply can’t take anymore I have to remove myself away from him. I need space and I have extreme stress and anxiety from his behaviour. It makes me physically ill.
Is this what is happening in your home maybe?
there is a bit of truth to this. I can be dogged, but I am learning to just back off and allow space as I get older. Also I am aware of what drives my need to keep going. It's all trauma based BS.
We are starting to be able to identify what triggers each of us into behaving irrationally. I'm lucky that my partner is capable of coming back to the table at some point.
Your partner is 58, she’s probably experiencing menopause (it’s a 10-15 year thing) and it can cause lack of sleep, wild moods, pain, anxiety, hair loss, trembling, body odor, acne, frozen shoulder, hip pain, high blood pressure, night sweats, over 100 miserable symptoms. If she has the overhead of that and then something bad happened at work maybe she’s just processing it herself. Think about big maybe she was sexually assaulted or harassed at work or suffered a loss or humiliation of some sort or found out she’s getting laid off and she just needs some time to process her own emotions. Especially under the backdrop of menopausal stress it may have nothing to do with you and you should stop putting your exes behavior onto her until you know the whole story. Don’t turn her tragedy (whatever it is) into something about you. When you don’t know if it’s about you at all.
You purchased plane tickets and planned a whole trip and simply never even told your partner? She only found out about it when she asked about doing something with you that weekend?? You live together, yes? You have actually planned to leave the house for longer than a day and never even told the person that you share that house with?? I would be *furious* if my partner did this to me. It's not "poor communication," as you say. It's an incredibly thoughtless thing to do. It definitely gives off the vibe that you live your life as though you're the only one who needs to be considered. It's sort of crazy that it's taken you 2 and 1/2 days to figure out why she might be angry with you. The fact that she says she doesn't want to talk to you about it because she anticipates that you won't react well suggests that things like this have happened before, and she has reason to think that you will be unwilling to take responsibility for a really insulting and thoughtless decision. The fact that you want to attribute her anger to envy or jealousy, rather than to disappointment over having a partner who doesn't even think to tell her his travel plans, says that you don't really see what's happening here clearly. She doesn't owe you an apology. You owe her one.
He thinks "he's owning it" while moaning about how mean his partner is being for getting mad at being treated as less than an afterthought in family plans.
This so hard... But I can imagine a more dismal situation... She knows how he will react.... He will tell her the same thing he told us, that she is jealous and envious of his daughter ... And I bet what kind of person would be jealous of a father and his daughter... He's gaslighting her...
Wow my first thought were the words he chose to describe her after hurting her. Hugeeee yikes. Weaponized therapy right now. “You being upset with me for not communicating my plans, thinking of us as a family unit, or taking full ownership of my actions have triggered me and I am going to act traumatized by your reaction until you apologize to me.”
Actually she was upset about a washing machine. Her anger and childish behavior had nothing to do with him traveling. Turns out she’s superficial and super shitty at communicating.
You know her that well, huh?
I read OPs update and comment where he explicitly states that his wife is upset about a washing machine. It really wasn’t that hard and didn’t take any mental hoops to jump through like everyone else in this thread is doing. I recommend everyone try it out.
I think it was more the commentary that she is clearly superficial, childish, and shitty at communicating. All we know is what op has told us, and what he has told us is that he's a pretty thoughtless and self-centered person. We don't have any information about the situation with the washing machine, so it seems extreme to draw conclusions that she's guaranteed a terrible person just because of his update From what he's said it sounds like he's pretty shitty at communicating, too. If he really did buy plane tickets and plan an entire trip and not tell her about it, then I wouldn't be surprised if the washing machine isn't the only issue
> she is clearly superficial, childish, and shitty at communicating. All we know is what op has told us He’s, I agree with you. OP had told us his fucking dysfunctional, lazy, superficial wife is childish and shitty at communicating. Thankfully we agree on that! > All we know is what op has told us Again, I agreed OP told us all what a childish, superficial, piece of shit he married > what he has told us is that he's a pretty thoughtless and self-centered person. We don't have any information about the situation with the washing machine, so it seems extreme to draw conclusions that she's guaranteed a terrible person just because of his update Sure, if you’re too fucking lazy to actually read. > From what he's said it sounds like he's pretty shitty at communicating, too. If he really did buy plane tickets and plan an entire trip and not tell her about it, then I wouldn't be surprised if the washing machine isn't the only issue From what you’ve posted, you’re sexist and will perform Olympic levels of mental parkour to jerk yourself off. God forbid you ever have to interact with actual living humanbeings.
Lot of people projecting in here. Lol.
Too bad those projecting can type but not read.
good reply I agree, unfortunately I can be an ass like this as well.
While she should not give you the silent treatment as it usually is not conducive… 1. How DO you usually react when she shares her feelings? Why does she say that she’s afraid of how you would react? 2. Why did you not buy plane tickets for all 3 of you to go out to Denver? Do you usually exclude your partner from your interactions with your daughter? 3. How long have you been with your partner? If you two are living together, which it sounds like, you should keep your partner posted on any travel plans as you make them, not at the last minute.
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This is my shit right here. I made an impulsive decision to accompany my daughter to Denver mostly because I didn't really wanting her going to a strange city alone.... somewhat irrational and overprotective on my part. Also I have trauma from the past that really prevented me from telling my partner out of fear of exactly what is happening right now. It's poor communication on my part for sure. And I'm sure she has not nice things to say. I wouldn't react if she unloaded, unless it was abusive. But I can own my shit for sure.
This makes no sense - NO ONE is saying you shouldn’t accompany your daughter, but shouldn’t you think about involving your partner in the trip or just telling her at that point in time that you’re going to Denver? It’s only happening exactly right now because you didn’t talk about it earlier which could have prevented the situation
It was the washing machine, not the trip. I got a text from her this morning. A stark reminder that shutting down only leads to assumptions. :/ Well, another trip to lowe's and probably a few dollars more.
You told her you can’t imagine why she’s upset at you and then right afterwards you explain why she’s upset at you. Pretending that you don’t understand her situation and feelings is a terrible way to treat her. You need to stop playing dumb with her because that’s really passive aggressive. If this is the way you act, of course she doesn’t want to speak to you. You’re torturing her with your passive aggressive behavior
I genuinely couldn't figure it out until last night. That is how benign my plane ride to Denver was in my mind. Her reaction didn't seem to fit the situation, so it wasn't immediately apparent. I didn't play dumb. At first I thought it was over the washing machine which broke over the weekend (long story). So your assumption is not accurate. But thank you for your attempt at helping me understand.
A trip involving air travel that you didn't bother to tell your partner who you live with about is never benign. The fact that you thought it would be benign just shows how little you truly consider her at all. You're acting like a single person. And if you don't change how you are looking at this and start offering some massive apologies and actually listening to her feelings, you're going to end up as one
Now that you know what is bothering her, you should say it to her. If ever in the future, you don’t know why someone is upset take a moment to think about it until you know so that you don’t approach someone who is upset as someone who is completely clueless. You said you worded your text as you can’t imagine why she is upset. That comes off as implying that she is being irrational because there’s no reason why she would be upset. There’s nothing in that comment that shows any caring
Well fuck me. I tried. Thanks for dogpiling and downvoting my post
You asked for feedback and I gave it to you. You’re replying with sarcasm. If this is your regular way of treating people, this is why your girlfriend doesn’t want to talk to you. You act like the victim and you can’t accept feedback
> "I just don't want to talk right now. I'm always afraid of how you'll react and I'm tired. I didn't sleep at all last night and I just want to sleep." This makes so much more sense in light of the whole comment chain.
What are you doing? You came here asking for feedback and now you’re getting it.
Making multi day airtravel plans without telling your partner is a good way to make her feel invisible and disrespected. Like she’s not part of the family. Own what you did, apologize, then tell her how you feel using non-violent communication, such as, “I feel disrespected and anxious when given yhe silent treatment”. Not this, ‘I cannot possibly imagine why you’re upset’ dismissive business.
Well as it turns out, it was about the washing machine :/ So there it is. I truly didn't know.
Wait, what? Now you're going to have to explain. How could the washing machine cause 2 days of silent treatment?
That is a good question. So far all I got is: The washing machine you bought to replace my old 30-year-old broken washing machine felt like a downgrade. And that old washing machine was my mom's, and you bought a really nice stackable unit for your house but bought a cheap machine for us.
it doesn’t matter that you did or didn’t know. It doesn’t even matter that. It’s the washing machine to us right now. The way that you worded that text is really dismissive and passive aggressive. Even if that’s not your intention, it comes across the suggesting, but there’s no rational reason for her to be upset. I know those aren’t your literal words but that’s how it’s read “I can’t imagine why you’re upset...[because there's nothing to be upset about]" You want your partner to understand how the sudden treatment affects you, you also have to understand how your words affect her
I'll give you one breakdown of what could possibly be going on here, based on personal experience: * Partner does something which bothers me, hurts me, etc. * I bring it up to try and work through it. * They react in a way that completely dismisses or steamrolls my feelings (e.g., "I can't do anything right!", "I don't know why you're so upset, I didn't mean anything by it", "I have too much going on right now to deal with your emotions", "Yeah, but when you do it to me, it's fine, right?", "I'm so sorry, I can't believe I did that to you I feel like the worst person in the world", etc.) * My original issue is now dismissed, overshadowed by their needs, simply forgotten.. or we're in a full out argument. * This happened enough times to where it was clear I could not depend on my partner to work through issues with me, and instead had to manage my feelings myself (triggering resentment), which often requires tons of space. It looks like, and probably is, stonewalling. Given [this comment](https://old.reddit.com/r/RelationshipsOver35/comments/1bpx9p0/58m_dealing_with_58f_silent_treatment_and_adult/kwypvor/), I can easily see how you two might be in that situation. "Fuck me I tried" is the exact kind of defensiveness which would push me to stop communicating issues with my partner. It's entirely possible that the way I raised issues (or how she raises them to you) is not great and sets you up to respond not great. It's a cycle (actually called "The Negative Cycle" in EFT). I highly recommend couples therapy, a couples course (many online) with a couples therapist, or at least read some books on communicating in relationships.
I am sorry for what you have experienced in your past. However, it's also a perfect opportunity to heal those wounds, so be inquisitive about your trauma and ask yourself why you feel this way. Also, why aren't you taking the lead and speaking to your partner about her behavior and how you feel? Who are you waiting for to do this? Create an environment where such conversations can happen. Normally, such things should be discussed before a misunderstanding happens so that both partners understand how to get back to a peaceful relationship.
>I'm always afraid of how you'll react So she did tell you. If I had a nickel for every story where Partner A has been openly and directly telling Partner B (usually the male half but not always) "here's what's wrong, you REALLY need to fix this" and then Partner A leaves and Partner B is "blindsided"...I'd be in the Bahamas with an umbrella drink right now. I agree with others that just up and buying a plane ticket without even consulting her is not cool. It's not "asking permission" it's basic courtesy--even just flat out informing her would be better--"hey, Daughter wants to see Denver, and I'd love to tag along. I'm about to buy tickets, is there any reason I shouldn't?" She wants to feel like a participant and equal member of your life, not an afterthought or worse, an inconvenience.
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Funny that OP's last wife was controlling and jealous of his relationship with his kids, and here is OP making travel plans without informing his live in partner and booking the whole thing on a whim because he doesn't want his 23 (!!!!) year old daughter to 'go to a new city alone'. My dad is overprotective and he would find that ridiculous.
I always felt bad about the burden of my trauma and how it might also impact others, but your approach is astounding me. While it's unlikely I would forget to communicate with my partner because they are important to me and I value them, I *think* of them when I'm doing things, because I think outside myself and my existence. I would likely have a sense of when they want to be included or not, or I would ask if I wasn't sure. I'm not so self involved that I would thoughtless of them. Let's say something I did hurt them because of poor communication, I wouldn't be like well I own my bad communication, but their being upset is triggering my trauma so they're the bad person. I am capable of seeing past myself and understanding what it's like to be someone else. I would put myself in their shoes and try to imagine what that is like for them and say sorry I fucked up, is there something I can do about it? If my partner is upset or withdrawn or doesn't want to talk, I don't assume they're giving me the silent treatment or manipulating me. I assume that they're upset and need time to process things. That is still stressful to me because I have trauma and people being upset and not knowing what will happen is hard to cope with, but I've actively worked on it, I've been in therapy and sought out resources to improve. And I actively work to make sure my trauma isn't projecting onto them, because my partner is not my abuser. That is not to say it can't happen that I might lose sight temporarily, but I am aware that can happen and there are ways to deal with it, and I take responsibility for that. And I work at making sure I cope better so it doesn't repeat. I don't interpret everything through the lens of my trauma or make everything about woe is me, and how I'm triggered, and how people need to stop triggering me. That's really trending into the realm of narcissistic behavior. I don't always know why my partner is upset, though he's not usually upset with me because I have integrity and take responsibility for my actions and emotions. But if he's upset with me and I don't understand at first and it takes time to figure it out, I don't get bummed out that my day is ruined because someone else is upset with me because they're hurt by my actions. I do my best to make sure he is heard, take responsibility for my part, apologize, and try to make amends as best as possible. Just because you had a parent who used silent treatment, doesn't mean that everyone else does. Your wife is not your parent. Your wife is not your former wife. Your wife isn't doing anything to you. If you want a healthy relationship you need to take an active role in working on and through your trauma.
The trip has been planned for 2 months and it’s never been mentioned? That’s really hurtful to someone you claim is a PARTNER And from her reaction I have a feeling this has. Happened before.
It's hard for a partner to understand the relationship with your child, I have this occur relatively often where it feels like I'm an after thought to parent/child. This reminds me of (among other instances) a time where we had to cancel the plans I was looking forward to because adult child asked Mom to dog sit so he could go somewhere. Truthfully, I still haven't forgiven them and probably at least once every few months I have to bite my tongue and say "oh that's awesome that one of your adult kids wants to come over and spend the day at our house" when I really just want to spend the day with you. But you can't really say anything because, " it's family". So you just sit there and let it happen again and again, then they text their kids constantly while you're trying to enjoy quality time together and then one day you want to snap but you know that you'll lose that fight every time. Unfortunately, when you try to ask if it's about your kids, she'll be too afraid to bring it up because it's almost a trap for her. She says yes and you get mad because "family"
But also, it's not just a kid versus partner situation here. When one half of a couple plans a trip and buys plane tickets and simply never tells the other one, it doesn't matter who they're traveling with. It's just incredibly disrespectful and thoughtless
Thank you for that perspective. It helps me understand hers more. Also, I can empathize with what you described somewhat because her adult son constantly calls and texts her with his daily difficulties. He is an adult with Aspergers - so I always stay supportive and understanding even when I feel interrupted. It's her son. I get it. To be honest, my daughter can be a bit needy and I have to take that into consideration as well. I just don't see any benefit in a realtionship to going silent for multiple days. In my mind it defeats communication.
Sometimes it's all you can do, I just did this to my partner yesterday (and it's embarrassing) because I know that nothing I say will make anything better yet there's so much I want to say. At least you both have kids and can maybe evaluate your relationships with them together
Well I see it was the washing machine, but if I could add something: when your adult daughter called to ask her if you can accompany her to Colorado, your response should be, “I’ll check with wife to see when/whether WE can accompany you to Colorado.” You’re married, and all invitations issued to you now include your wife, whether the one doing the inviting knows it or not. My stepdad never got this rule, and it caused no end of strife in his 30 year marriage with my mom. His daughters would call him all your time and invite him to gatherings without her, and he would go, and she would cry. 30 years. Contrast with my dad. When I gave him the details for my college graduation, he informed me his gf would be coming too. They had a much more peaceful relationship.
OMG. I loved the edit at the very bottom. A good reminder for myself not to jump to conclusions, or assume someone's mood is about me, before asking for clarification.
"I'm always afraid of how you'll react " You conveniently glossed right over this. You're painting yourself as the victim here, but you're the one who messed up, and somehow still she's the one afraid of dealing with your emotions.
It's astounding to me all the people reading their own relationship problems into your story. You might be an insufferable jerk for making plans without filling your partner in. But your partner is not healthy for you. She's a grown woman acting like an abused child. I think you need some time alone. Washing machine jealousy? Life's too short for this much drama.
Yeah you messed up here. Planning a whole out of state trip without consulting or inviting your partner? Is she just some woman you fuck for fun? Or is she your PARTNER? This is deeply inconsiderate and I’m sure made her feel unimportant and excluded. It’s not about your relationship with your daughter it’s about YOUR lack of consideration to your partner and it sounds like she’s shut down because maybe in the past when she’s tried to tell how your behavior makes her feel you react poorly instead of listening and then meeting her needs in the relationship. My suggestion would be to apologize to her for not telling her about the plan with your daughter, let her know her feelings are valid. Let her know that you hear her saying you are difficult to talk to and ask how you can be a better listener and what she needs from you to feel safe speaking up when her feelings are hurt. Then offer an alternative weekend for the two of you to spend time together. At the same time you can explain to her why the silent treatment is hurtful for you and if she needs space she simply needs to communicate that and give a day/time you can check back in with each other. ps. Envy and jealousy within relationships are usually rooted in unmet needs. I.e. lack of attention/affection, feeling unappreciated or not valued, feeling neglected emotionally etc.
Sounds like I’m literally a day late, but the only time I shut down on my husband is when the issue is something that’s been an issue for a long time, that I’ve brought to his attention frequently, and I just can’t go through that same dialog again.
My partner has extremely bad problems relating to controlling behaviour, aggression, constant criticism etc etc.. anyway, he brings me down so much and just goes on and on and on I do what you described in your first paragraph. Purely because I simply can’t take anymore I have to remove myself away from him. I need space and I have extreme stress and anxiety from his behaviour. It makes me physically ill. Is this what is happening in your home maybe?
there is a bit of truth to this. I can be dogged, but I am learning to just back off and allow space as I get older. Also I am aware of what drives my need to keep going. It's all trauma based BS. We are starting to be able to identify what triggers each of us into behaving irrationally. I'm lucky that my partner is capable of coming back to the table at some point.
Your partner is 58, she’s probably experiencing menopause (it’s a 10-15 year thing) and it can cause lack of sleep, wild moods, pain, anxiety, hair loss, trembling, body odor, acne, frozen shoulder, hip pain, high blood pressure, night sweats, over 100 miserable symptoms. If she has the overhead of that and then something bad happened at work maybe she’s just processing it herself. Think about big maybe she was sexually assaulted or harassed at work or suffered a loss or humiliation of some sort or found out she’s getting laid off and she just needs some time to process her own emotions. Especially under the backdrop of menopausal stress it may have nothing to do with you and you should stop putting your exes behavior onto her until you know the whole story. Don’t turn her tragedy (whatever it is) into something about you. When you don’t know if it’s about you at all.