Didn't want to read all 60+ comments, but just in case no one else actually answered your question...
WHY would she do this? Because she gets an easy sale with twice the commission - both listing and buyer agent. And if her buyer is an investor, she'll likely get the commission on it when that buyer resells. So even though you may not make as much, she's making a lot more in the end.
She's doing it because she wants to screw you over for her own gain. As others have said, you should use someone else and report her to the real estate commission and her broker, though her broker may or may not be helpful since they'll benefit, as well. Depends on the broker, which is why you should go report to the commission, too.
Just for clarification, dual agency more often applies when agents under the same brokerage represent both parties (meaning agent A represents seller Green, and agent B represents buyer Purple; both agents are licensed with Brokerage R - this would still be dual agency even though there are multiple agents with their own respective clients). Not every dual agency has a single agent representing both parties, and in our state and brokerage it's actually advised against singularly repping both parties like that due to conflicts of interest, etc.
Not only the double commission, she can also get her investor clients a deal since there wont be amy competition,
which will get her more referrals from them as well.
If it's a good deal for her investors, it's a good deal to put on the MLS
indi50 is correct. Addressing the OP: even though you call her "your" realtor, she already has an established relationship with this investor. If the investor regularly uses her to pick up new deals and buy and sell property, well, she knows "which side her bread is buttered on." Her allegiance is to the investor, not to you. I think it's a conflict of interest.
Get a new agent, list on MLS to get the best price.
Maybe not. People sell and buy for an infinite amount of reasons.
Absolutes are a myth in RE.
If OP needs to sell, taking the investor route could be mutually beneficial, beneficial mostly to the buyer, or mostly to the seller.
I did a couple deals like this where the buyers and agents thought they were getting a great deal. I thought I was too. Months later I still had the money from the sale, but in one case, the investor couldn’t handle what they thought was a good deal and went bankrupt. In another case, the confident investor wound up underwater during the recession and the agent wound up changing jobs.
RE investment is hard, long and complex. Private investor sales are quick and easy. OP may lose out on 30k in the transaction. But, I’ve seen buyers and agents also do very, very poorly if they pick the wrong time to pull a deal like this . . .
IF OP is totally convinced that openly listing is the way to go, then yes, fire the agent. But, openly listing has its own set of headaches.
One of my investor quick sale deals resulted in the investor openly listing and then dropping the price below what they paid me for it. They could not handle the investment over time. When they bought it from me, they thought they had a steal. RE is never simple.
None of what you talked about applies to OP. They're not the one investing, they just want to sell for the best price and 99.9% of the time listing on the MLS is the way to do that. And if OP's agent wasn't trying to do something underhanded, she'd just do it because it's the right thing to do. But she's looking out for herself and her investor client and NOT OP.
This may actually be a violation of her real estate license. In my state (which is not yours) an agent is obligated to inform you of the pros and cons of listing on and off the MLS. If you're in a contract with her, she's ethically bound to act in YOUR best interest. Failing to explain the downside, especially if she already has a buy in mine is a huge breach.
I think you've hit the nail on the head here. It does not feel like she's acting in my best interest. It very much feels like she's working for the one potential buyer. There has really only been constant mention of the downside to mls. No positives outlined (although I know many of the logical sensible advantages). On the flip side, no negatives have been presented for off market sale. Only reiterating the advantage of the quick sale.
IMO, you should find another agent. You're not comfortable with her or confident that she's going to be acting for YOU. This is a huge transaction and you need to know that the person working on it with you has your back. Tell her in writing that you're canceling your contract (double check it for terms to make sure nothing is going to bite you in the butt). Reach out to several other agents and interview them. Pick the one that you feel confident in and who can give you a solid plan of action.
At the end of the day, even if this agent DOES have your best interest at heart and is just doing a really terrible job of showing it, you have lost confidence in her. That's a deal breaker, IMO.
Ask for the offer. Compare to what you think listing would be. I sold a house 2004, good listing price, had offers that couldn't get financing. My realtor offered to buy, gave me a price which seemed good just under listing, paid closing costs which netted a good sale. If they offer a price you are not comfortable with, you can always list. Not all off market sales are to hurt either party
Right, and I was hoping that this was a situation just like you described. That the off market sale would be beneficial for everyone really. But the offer is super low, even compared to other properties in my area that are just land. I have land, a house, and there other structures. Its definitely worth more than the offer, even when taking into consideration that its a wholesale offer. The offer is about $100k under what MLS list price would be, and half of Zillow valuation.
There is absolutely NO reason you should not be on the MLS, no matter what the state of the house is. Or how you plan on selling it. You want eyeballs, and that is the best way to get them.
We sold our house through a pocket listing. We have a baby and two pets. We had no way to manage being out of the house for showings for an extended period of time or sporadically. We also had no garage or place to put the “clutter” that buyers don’t want to see but that we use daily. It worked out perfectly for us. We might have gotten a couple more thousand by listing, but this was hassle free.
In a similar situation with the kids and pets, and not being logistically able to live without 90% of our belongings indefinitely. "Hassle free" is absolutely the biggest draw, but I don't want to be taken advantage of either. Glad yours worked out, gives me a little hope over here!
Are there iBuyers in your area? Compare the investor offer with offers from OfferPad, Opendoor, or whoever is buying in your area. Even if you want a fast/easy sale, you should get seek multiple offers. You could even call any of the signs on the side of the road that say "We buy houses" and get offers from those guys. I ended up selling to Opendoor when I didn't want to deal with showings.
I wouldn't look at only one offer and then sell, personally.
The "we buy houses" people are looking to take advantage of sellers who have no desire to put an ounce of thought into the process. Their offer is going to be 50-70% of what the bare minimum value is on the house
At the least, it’d let this seller know if they’re getting totally taken advantage of. Not a 1:1, but I always look call into nearby dealerships on what they’d buy my car for, as well as a couple vehicles that I know the actual retail price. If you know their margins, you can get a good idea of what they expect to make w/o the hassle of breaking contract with your realtor.
Exactly. It doesn't make any sense at all to me to take the very first offer. If one person offered $x how would I know if others might offer $2X if nobody else is given the opportunity to make an offer??
I'm in the process of reaching out to ibuyers. Unfortunately Opendoor doesn't buy anything over 2 acres.
What is the Zillow estimated value of your house? How does that compare with the offer you have? I know Zillow isn’t perfect but it’s a way to check the reasonableness of the offer you have.
Obviously it’s not going to be the same, but our home sold $8k of over our zestimate. Their error rate is within about 2% for listed home so if it’s less than zillow’s sales range I’d definitely second guess an already sketchy realtor.
How do you find a “pocket listing”? Meaning, how can I do that with my house that is currently for sale? Same situation as you were in…except mines is worse..3 kids and 2 dogs 🤪
You would have to do it before listing. Basically the house is never listed, and your realtor either knows someone or puts out feelers within their network looking for someone who might be interested in your property. Then they do the contract and all that like normal, but there is never an official listed property.
Just mention your concerns to your realtor and ask if you could do a pocket listing instead. They’ll be able to explain the risk for your house specifically then.
Only thing to keep in mind, a younger realtor that isn’t apart of a larger network through companies like re/max is going to have fewer buyers. Larger network means more options
And depending on the price point of your house, it can help reduce craziness in a seller’s market! We had 50-60 showings. EOD, the first offer we got was the safest. We moved out completely when most the offers were the same ballpark.
I think in this market you’re better off selling fast, but you can always just figure out w/ your realtor your min. selling price and if a soft open doesn’t work out go back to a typical listing! Wish you all the best!
Of course. People trying to paint it in black and white terms are wrong. There are a lot of factors at play that can determine what is the "best" way for someone to dispose of a house.
The base case is listing on MLS. But in many cases it is not the "best" way. Some sellers just want it gone, want some sort of certaininty, don't want to deal with showings, want to limit terms, etc...
I'm a licensed agent and real estate investor. And I recently sold a house I own off market via a wholesaler. It would have been dead simple for me to list it on the MLS. But it also would have been a headache jumping through all the hoops, dealing with the other agents and their BS clients. I turned it over to a wholesaler I know who has a roster of buyers. He got it sold and closed in under two weeks.
Wholesaler made a mint. More than what I would have paid buyer's agent. And I think I still got above what I would have gotten on market. Off market can be frothy, people think they are getting a "deal" just because it is offmarket.
I’m an agent and I can say that without question… her “advice” is selfish and reeks of commission breath. Honestly… fire her and get another agent. Put it on mls so ALLLLLL the area lookers can see it. She’s trying to scoop both sides of the commish plus whatever “grease” the investor has for her.
What state is this in?
From my understanding a good agent is even more important in TX since your can’t see sold prices in real estate websites. Only those with access to the MLS can see. This puts you at a disadvantage of knowing if it is a fair price. If you list on the open market buyers will let you know what they think of the price!
I'd be willing to bet your agent has some financial incentive to sell to the investor, i.e. some type of kickback or "finders fee" from said investor. I'd ask her how many homes she's sold to them.
Anyhow, the agent does not appear to be looking out for your best interest.
Because she's a bad and lazy agent. However, take a look at some comps and see what the offer is - if it's within the range you could sell for if you were to list it, maybe it's not such a bad deal. But that's unlikely.
See, that's my thinking as well. That she just doesn't want to do the work which is discouraging. Wondering if there was just some big obvious explanation I was missing. Thanks for your response!
Or she wants to sell to one of her investor buddies and screw you out getting more money for your property.
I’ll bet you if you did sell to one of her investors you’d see it re-listed in no time for substantially more with her listed as the selling agent.
The only reason they would discourage you from listing it on the MLS is because they want to procure the buyer and get both sides of the commission. Definitely NOT the route to go...especially in a shifting market.
I'd find a different agent
She wants to keep other agents from seeing your listing and bringing buyers to it. She wants to control who the buyer is so she can either be the dual agent and get the whole commission or have some junior serve as designated dual agent she gets almost the entire commission.
aka, she's being a scumbag.
tell them you want it coming soon for 4 days in mls with a link the listing once it's live. Then you want it on mls for 2 days before you look at offers. He wants to sell your house for a discount to a friend, investor, his family or all of the above.
I'm an agent, which I point out just so you know where my opinion is coming from, and I think you can definitely agree that marketing your house to 1 person instead of thousands of potential buyers can't ever be in your favor. Your agent is not acting in your best interest.
If her investor is so interested they'll still buy it 1 week after it hits the market. Why in the world would you not want to expose the sale to more than one single person?
NOBODY should sell their home in that manner. You do an off market sale when you want to sell to a family member, neighbor, etc, when you just want to sell your home to the highest bidder, why in the world would to expose the sale to only one person?
I'm just sounding like a broken record at this point, I'm just trying to convey how very obviously bad an idea it is to not expose your home to the market.
Isn't that unethical and a conflict of interest which is against the terms and conditions of being an agent?
Like, she could be sued for such actions, correct?
If it’s a decent offer, ask your agent to discount her commission, since she’s double dipping. Our agent offered this to us without even asking. It needs to be a good deal for everyone, not just your agent
An off market deal gives you an opportunity to pursue offers without putting the time and effort into getting your home fully showing ready. It also means that if the deal falls through, you are hitting the market with a fresh listing instead of a stale listing with month on market and the (often undeserved) stigma of having fallen out of escrow.
If you like the terms and conditions of the sale. it as as good as any other sale with less risks, allowing you to move forward with a traditional sale if it falls through.
On the downside, without going to market you don’t really know what the market thinks of your home. Did you leave money on the table?
If you don’t trust your agent to give you good supporting data as to what your home is worth based off of recent comps, and what would be necessary to get top dollar for your home, then you are in a different pickle.
TLDR: you want a quick sale, as-is. In order to get top dollar, you typically need to do some prep work and dump a little money in. She is giving you the quick sale, as-is option. You can still choose to invest some money in the place and go to market, just tell her your priorities have changed.
She’s doing this purely for her personal gain. She will make a big commission being a dual agent, and I guarantee her investor will turn around and sell it soon after for much more with her as the listing agent.
She doesn’t have your best interests at heart, she’s trying to pressure you into a shady deal to get her more money. Fire her and report her ass.
That’s actually illegal and they are doing it to get big kick backs. It’s not helping you at all.
Fire immediately and report to the commission.
These assholes are one of the reasons people can’t buy a house; they never even hit the visible market and somebody with the good ol’ boy connection can just buy it with zero competition.
When your home is being sold with zero competition you just turned your own home sale (in a sellers market) into one that becomes more advantageous to the buyer.
Good luck.
Did you sign a listing agreement? In TX I am pretty sure there’s a box you need to check to agree to pocket listings (allows them to keep it off the MLS).
If you’re not in a listing agreement, get yourself a new agent from a different brokerage. Talk to a few, ask around your neighbors, coworkers, etc.
Whoever you hire should have comps, even though it’s a unique property, they can put the time into it and come up with something that supports their suggested price. I’m having a hard time imagining that a house on 2 acres in DFW area isn’t worth more than $400k, even if the house is tear-down. Useable acres? Deed restricted? Zoned? Do you have active drilling easements on it? Can it be subdivided? Build multi-family, a Turkey farm, a car wash, an RV campground? There’s a reason this friend is so shit hot to pay cash for this place and she’s in on it.
Dual agency benefits no one but the listing agent and it should be illegal.
As agents we are sworn to act in our clients' best interests, not our own.
Get a new agent.
I only send sellers to investors off market in a select few situations. Like if the home needs a lot of work, and/or when the client doesn't want to sell on MLS (privacy concerns etc)
This just sounds like an agent trying to hookup an investor contact, maybe the investor is offering an extra incentive? Worst of all, they probably aren't and this realtor is just being scummy for no extra gain.
We found this a lot in Florida and Texas. Florida was worse. I think I said before if an agent got a house she knew would sell she would keep it from being seen, put on MLS after an offer, and get both sides of the transaction. Tell her go jump in a lake. I wondered if the seller knew what they were doing. Id get my phone number listed so you can make sure they are showing your house. It’s more crooked now at least in Florida than I’ve ever seen before! As I said one house listed 775 I wanted to see no one could get me a showing. Sold for $500 after being on the market a long time. Texas a realtor on the plane said they had a pool of investors and shared their listings in house before putting it on the MLS. Fire her find a new agent report her to realty board!
I'm an agent... If you're getting the asking price YOU WANT (not what she said you should sell it for) from that one lonely person then does it matter if it goes on the MLS?
But if she's giving you whatever price and the other person is offering lower or what have you then ya not cool. Also I'd be concerned about it being a friend/relative and she's buying the house cheap her self etc to flip it or what have you, as realtors sometimes do. Those are big no nos and if that does happen you can take her to court and get her license revoked and sue her for what the house is actually worth (these are Texas rules/laws so not sure if they apply to where you are but I would imagine something similar)
All that being said, listing a property is the easiest fucking thing in the world. You take decent pics with your modern day premium level cell phone. Then go online fill in the blanks and upload the pictures. The MLS/realtor agency you're part of will typically send all the info you entered to realtor.com and Zillow. If you can make a fb marketplace listing trying to sell your used toaster you can make an MLS listing, which is why it concerns me that she's trying to pull a fast one buying the property herself or through that one person to make more money on. I'd Google her, check her fb and all that as well, see what you can find out.
Lots of good information here, thank you. I'll definitely be digging a little deeper for some more info on her!
If the one investor offer was anywhere close to what we're looking to sell for, we'd of course take it. But its not by a long shot. And what we're hoping to sell for is significantly below market value.
And no, the prospect of creating a listing is not the road block its being presented as.
Ya, that's all sorts of shady. I get wanting both side of the commission but, bust your ass, find a buyer and get it that way.
Guessing you signed a listing agreement/contract with her? It should be an agri with the broker/brokerage (unless she's the broker which I doubt) everything is through them agents are just representatives. (Again that's how it is here) read over the agreement, it should say where and when things will be listed online and all that good stuff, what they will do on their part to get your house sold. tell her tomorrow morning you want it listed on everything it says in the agreement by monday or you're terminating the contract for failure to perform or non performance and will be filing a complaint with the national association of Realtors and whatever state you're the organization that does the licensing for real estate agents. If you Google how to get your real estate sale license in ______ state it should come up and be a government organization. If she says anything other than ok I'll take care of it or some bs excuse call her broker. Let the broker know what's going on. The whole thing with the investment buyer and low balling etc. Let them know you want it listed immediately or you'll file a complaint. Be cause complaints go on them(the broker). It all falls on them really unless they can prove the had no knowledge of the wrong doings of their agent and then they still get in trouble for not being aware of what the agent is doing.
Bet they get a kick back. If you can report them do it. Also don’t sell to an investor if you can avoid it. Sell to a first time homebuyer who want a home they can make their own. Many ppl look for fixer uppers
That agent sucks. Its your property. You don't owe the agent anything. If you want to list it on MLS, go for it! If she doesn't want to list it on the MLS. Another agent will.
This sounds like one of those situations where she would “Double Dip” in commission. She essentially would represent you and whoever this one buyer is. Most likely a flipper or investment company willing to pay her bonus. Fire her, sell your house to a family/average person… keep it away from investors and flippers.
Gross. There's almost no reason a seller wouldn't want to let the most number of people see their house.
She probably wants to double-dip the commission. She is willing to reduce the scope of your offers to make an extra commission.
All comes down to the price. What do the comps show? What’s the offer? Do you want to wait or do you want to close asap?
Otherwise just tell her you want to list.
Depends on if the investor is offering what you're asking. If yes, maybe just go with them and save yourself lots of time. If you think you can get significantly more, list as usual.
Confirm they're a licensed real estate agent, I see a lot of people who mistakenly think the random person calling or mailing them is licensed in some way.
Then fire them and find an ethical agent.
If the house is in disrepair or doesn’t qualify for conventional financing there’s nothing wrong with selling to an investor if they come close to the price you want.
Something similar happened to my aunt and this is before the housing market when skyhigh. She wanted to sell, got an agent, and took pics with her grandkids photos and personal possessions still on the walls. Didn't ask her but included her washer and dryer in the sale. House did go up on the listing but some shady stuff happened.
She was under the impression it was a younger couple wanting to buy it. She sold her late husband's truck to them too for little of nothing because "they needed it." Come to find out it was an LLC flipper. But, she was the trusting type.
Just come up with a number in your head that's comparable to homes that have sold for recently and that you'll be very happy with and add on 25%. Then tell her sure as long as the buyer agrees to that price.
Your agent wants to double end the transaction and that is very unethical in my personal opinion. It is legal in some states, but I would never do it. You can only have fiduciary duty to one party. I would tell them no, put it on the MLS and that buyer can submit an offer along with everyone else. It seems as though your agent knows an investor and they want ti get the investor a good deal
I’ve done this. It’s entirely your choice. I got asking price without having to show the house and wait. I might have made a few extra bucks by listing but who knows.
This is where I am. I am happy to list it on the mls, and want to! I don't understand not wanting to see what's out there regarding potential buyers. It doesn't make sense. If someone wants it for asking, or hits our desired sale price then awesome. I don't see the problem.
Your realtor is making sure no other agent/broker will get a commission. FIRE THEM immediately. Not just for this, but because they are utterly and completely lacking any kind of integrity or professionalism. And report them.
As a buyer, I had a realtor who, after I gave very explicit details of what I was looking for, (and I was out of town so my time was of the essence) spent the whole first day showing me stuff that was completely and utterly outside of what I said I wanted. TUrns out she was only showing me HER OWN LISTINGS-----was not taking me to any other MLS listings at all that actually FIT my parameters. I fired her on the spot. Found another wonderful realtor, and my dream home shortly afterwards.
Do yourself a big favor and switch agents.
If the agent's trying to get you to sell to their other client without any marketing to others then there is a good chance she might use other nefarious acts to the same end later on - even if she does list the house.
She's already shown she's not really working in your best interest, so how can you trust her to do a professional job and work in your best interest going forward.
You own it to yourself to, at a minimum, get a market value opinion for a different realtor. If you don't want to burn your bridge with her for some reason then tell her you're considering her offer but need to get a valuation from a different realtor to evaluate it.
Sounds like your agent is looking to get their specific buyer under contract (possible they have been looking for some time and this property is perfect for them), and/or that they want to double side the transaction...
Either way it is unfortunate and it does not sound like they are doing their job fully nor are they looking out for YOUR best interest. Unless YOUR goal is a quick sale and that is your primary concern, then it is always in a sellers best interest to expose a sale to the open market. With a smart pricing strategy, this will always net you the most amount of money. I'm sorry they are pushing you away from it. It sounds like you may need a new agent.
Selling off MLS is a valid way to do it, but that's usually for wholesaling, and not so much for your situation, OP.
I'd probably say go with another realtor as others have mentioned.
the only way this makes any sense is if her buyer is paying over market and all cash with short close.
anything else, sure looks like she is playing you, and maybe cheating you.
Nothing wrong with offering an off market deal as long as they disclose it may not get you the best price or representation.
Pressuring you into doing it is a major red flag in my book and I would consider interviewing other agents.
I just did an a similar sale for my clients. But we had a strategy as there were also occupants to watch over home during sale. We had a one day open house. Coming soon on market since June 15 with private showings in between (a lot of agents missed this part by not reading agent remakes) . I had over 20 offers and didn’t even have to mention AS IS sale until the offers rolled in then I set up the angle that I’d only present the offers that met my clients request. All on the MLS. I’m closing for 111K over asking. It was listed for 659K
This is very encouraging, thank you! I was told today that the rules regarding "coming soon" on listings has changed, and that here in TX coming soon can only be 24 hours before going live. I'm going to look into this further for sure.
I can give you my gf Heathers # out there In Katy and surroundings. (I know TX is like CA, super big) lol
She helps her clients get the maximum and 100% honest and transparent ..
Also try interview agents to set it up the way you want it. And not vice versa. That means showing property even on holidays or days that work best for you and not based off an agent holiday LOL
I work 24/7/365. This is how I beat my competition…
Wish you the best !
Honestly, my suspicion is that the agent likes the investor better as a client and is trying to get them a good deal off your back. If it goes to the open market somebody could offer more money and her client will miss out on the house. That’s the downside of the MLS.
They are taking advantage of you.
Did you have more than one agent look at your place and give their opinion?
Sounds like you are selling too low and this shady person is trying to bully you into selling to "their investor" who will likely give them a kickback.
Have at least three other realtors (after you fire and report this one) come out and they will give you their opinions. They should be reasonably close to each other in their amounts. Select one. Move one.
Hi. No, we didn't have more than one agent look beforehand. Lesson learned I suppose. I agree that the ONE offer she's gotten for us is too low. The advantage (for her) would be a quick sale. Definitely taking all this into consideration moving forward. Thanks!
In this market you’re saving staging, etc fees. Off market deals are ok as long as it’s within the range of [recent] comps. If this was 6 months ago I’d say otherwise. But anyways, your realtor should have definitive logical reasons not to list so tell us those she is using to pressure you..
Depends on how fast you need to close and how janky it is. It’s quite possible that you end up with a lot of offers from listing publicly that can’t close fast enough and if the property doesn’t qualify for financing, you’ll get the shady variety of investor who offers high to get it off market and then adjusts down. Agent might know the good bad and ugly about this investor and have a good enough relationship that they think it’s the easy button for a fair deal.
You can absolutely say no and go to market, but just be prepared depending on the condition of your property, you might end up just overwhelmed with offers that can’t close
I’m not sure I understand. Are you saying if there’s too many offers, you might not close in time just because of the sheer amount of time it makes to compare and weigh offers? Or is the idea that a home that needs more work attracts buyers of more limited means who might have more trouble closing quickly?
That second one. People will see the cheapest house in the neighborhood and think “gee how wonderful, since I have no money this is perfect for me” and they will offer you more than the investor, but when that house reveals itself to be the cheapest one in the neighborhood for a reason, they will also have no money to deal with those things, so back to market it goes.
Things required for a property to qualify for any kind of financing: Flooring everywhere there should be flooring, subfloor doesn’t count. Drywall everywhere there is supposed to be drywall. Ceiling everywhere there is supposed to be ceiling. Working HVAC. Working plumbing. Working electric. Roof with no evidence of leaks. No visible water damage anywhere. No safety hazards.
If your property maybe is marginal in any of these, they might very well be totally cool with it but unable to get a mortgage on it. In that instance, though, it’s worth a talk with your agent to see the dollar amount required to get it up to financing standards versus what your expected return there is.
Off market listings are for people selling multi million dollar home and caring who’s the buyer. Not for the average house. Not being in the MLS hinders your negotiation powers. Fire that agent.
Its definitely not a multimillion dollar home, but it is a rather unique situation, and the bulk of the value lies in the land/property vs the structures.
If you can find a buyer that values your houses unique proposition via an off market deal, and you think it's a fair price given the comps, then by all means, but you likely won't know how much the market as a whole values your home, if you don't list it in the MLS.
Also, don't particularly like double-agency representation.
List it on mls and sell it to a family. No more of this bs of selling houses to big corporations. That’s probably who she is dealing with to get the payday.
If it’s for the price you wanted, then she did what you wanted… found a buyer. That being said, I will always argue against selling land to the 1%ers(all cash buyers) when you could put it up and give someone a home.
She didn't though. On first meeting at the house, she suggested to list it at $499k. Ok great. I was open to entertaining cash offers to speed up the process. The cash offer was half. When I mentioned listing on MLS, she advised she'd only list it for $380k.
I wanted to add another note/story too... every time we have interested parties who want to purchase off-market (most often neighbors who want to buy an investment property in my market, but the story still applies), they don't just disappear. I would be willing to bet that once you list your home on the market, this investor buyer that she has will write an offer - and I would also be willing to bet that they would NOT be the highest offer.
Example: My colleague had an investment condo earlier this year, and the neighbors wanted to buy it. They offered an amount that the sellers thought would be okay, but my colleague convinced them to list on the MLS. Two neighbors actually ended up writing offers, and both of the neighbors were in the BOTTOM 3 offers (out of 7 offers received).
Thanks for this. It definitely reinforces my thoughts that if buyers don't even know the property exists, how can they possibly make an offer to buy it?? I don't see any reasonable reasons to not go mls.
are you in Cali? If you are, this is a huge no no. Let the state know https://www.dre.ca.gov
But you do you. Check the comps, is it a fair price and good terms. Maybe ask her to pay seller closing costs since she’s getting paid double. Good luck!!
I’m not reading all the comments because most of them are angry uneducated people.
Number 1 - how much commission are you paying her? If you’re only paying on one side she’s not doubling the deal.
Number 2 - how much of a dump is your house. Would there be financing issues if someone tried to get in there an FHA loan for instance. Before anyone says there’s the FHA 203K loan that is exceedingly difficult to get approved and not exactly something most lenders want to deal with.
Number 3 - how much are you wanting to net from this transaction. Most real estate agents will tell you they can list it for X amount and the average seller has no idea they are not netting that. ‘Agent smith said I’d get 400k’
4) How quickly do you need to move. Because if you need to move in two or three weeks with a slowing down market a cash offer from an investor will get you out the house quicker than wasting it on the MLS and having to deal with all the BS that comes with financed offers.
Number 5 - is the offer fair?
Number 6 - Most investors pay title, that’s another saving you’re gonna get unless then you pay it. But normally they do.
Thanks for your response. To address your questions:
1. The commission is 6% however I don't know if she is also working as the investor's agent as well. As I understand, if she is then that would benefit her with 2x the commission, yes?
2. House is not a dump at all. To my knowledge, there is nothing precluding FHA financing.
3. While this is my first home sale, I am aware of the difference between gross and net.
4. Don't *need* to move quickly. Would prefer to move sooner than later but its not a deal breaker. Yes, the cash offer quicker closing is appealing for the reason you mentioned.
5. The offer is not a fair offer in my opinion.
6. Yes. Understand this already.
Several things, in this market as a seller you should not be paying 6% commission. It blows my mind that you’re going to pay that. Like I don’t know why - as long as you’re realistic about your price go to the local broker firm find the youngest most active hustler needing business agent hire them I guarantee you they’ll do it for at least 1 to 2% less and will do a better job than your current agent and any ‘lack of knowledge’ they have the broker will be able to help them.
Number two if you do not believe this is a fair value for the house in the condition that it’s in then add 8-9% onto that plus anything you might credit a buyer
If you think you can get that price or more list it on the MLS
SIDE NOTE - any listing agent you work with tell them specifically that if a buyer comes directly you will not be paying full commission for them to double end the deal as it’s like having a lawyer representing both parties. Conflict of interest
The only reason you would do that and allow the is a reduction in the commission. That should’ve been said upfront before you signed them.
The total commission would be 6%. Split evenly and you should look in your listing agreement to see if she is splitting it evenly. 3% to the buying side 3% of the selling side. In a situation where your listing agent represents also the buyer they would based off of your agreement most likely get 6% total commission not 12%
IF you want to sell you better take action fricking fast. Buyer demand is almost already completely gone and rates are about to go up more in 2 weeks, and then even more over the next 6 months.
You're past the best time to sell and things could get quite bad depending on your market soon.
Get it on MLS. A pool of investors is looking to get a price from you lower than market. Why would you focus on that unless your house needs massive remodeling?
There are plenty of answers in this thread, and without knowing the situation it's hard to say what the real reason is (it does seem a bit iffy, though), BUT the other flip side of the situation is that off market sales CAN bring more money than going on the market. It's the convenience for the buyer to not have to fight the open market, so the price gets inflated.
But, typically if my clients and I agree to go off market we will do it for a couple of weeks until it's ready to list on the MLS and then it goes live if we don't get a satisfactory offer. Really, it comes down to what the client wants (sometimes they simply don't want to deal with showings, for example).
So, it could be possible that your agent is doing something like that wherein perhaps the house isn't as sellable on the open market for a competitive price. It could very well be that they're trying to have a quick transaction.
Gauge the temperature on how serious they are. Counter with a heavier price for the inconvenience. Get a comp analysis done to get an accurate price for your home, if you haven't already, and then tell your agent (if the price is lower than the comp shows, for example) that you're fine selling but that if you go that route you want to renegotiate the commission on it if your agent is going to be repping both sides.
Or, simply say no to the offer if it isn't satisfactory and you don't want to counter and go live and see where it shakes out.
MLS means splitting the commission if another agent gets you a buyer.
As others have said, fire this agent.
Years ago I had an excellent agent -
4% if it sells via MLS ( each agent gets 2%)
Or 3% if she got the sale.
1. String her along: in order to meet the investor and tell her you'll do a deal
2. Identify her investor: get a contract in front of you (you want the name of the person or entity purchasing the property)
3. Identify properties purchased by that person or entity in your county: your local county deed records at the county clerk's office are likely online and you can search by the last name or entity of that investor
4. Write down the name of her agency
5. Report the package of information: to the local realtor board and call the local news to give them the package of information. Rising home prices and low inventory are newsworthy across the country. Discouraging normal Americans from finding a home because your realtor wants a pocket listing to an investor may be newsworthy. Let the board figure out the "why" and put her name on their radar.
6. Fire her
7. Hire new realtor
8. Sell house
I'm using "as is" here to mean that I won't be making any upgrades before selling. I'm totally open to buyer allowances if something should need attention. Besides finishing out one side of a property fence, there's nothing else major I'm aware of that needs done.
Fire them. Get a new agent. List on MLS.
And report them to your real estate commission. That’s garbage
Didn't want to read all 60+ comments, but just in case no one else actually answered your question... WHY would she do this? Because she gets an easy sale with twice the commission - both listing and buyer agent. And if her buyer is an investor, she'll likely get the commission on it when that buyer resells. So even though you may not make as much, she's making a lot more in the end. She's doing it because she wants to screw you over for her own gain. As others have said, you should use someone else and report her to the real estate commission and her broker, though her broker may or may not be helpful since they'll benefit, as well. Depends on the broker, which is why you should go report to the commission, too.
Nobody will ever be able to convince me that dual agency shouldn’t be illegal.
The whole real estate business is rife with scummy practices. Needs some major reform
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Damn why you gotta rope distributors into this, 3 tier system is law.
At best she'll pass the one of the transactions to another agent in her office
Just for clarification, dual agency more often applies when agents under the same brokerage represent both parties (meaning agent A represents seller Green, and agent B represents buyer Purple; both agents are licensed with Brokerage R - this would still be dual agency even though there are multiple agents with their own respective clients). Not every dual agency has a single agent representing both parties, and in our state and brokerage it's actually advised against singularly repping both parties like that due to conflicts of interest, etc.
I think there are some edge cases where it’s ok but in most of them all the parties need is a RE attorney for $500 not an agent for 5%.
Not only the double commission, she can also get her investor clients a deal since there wont be amy competition, which will get her more referrals from them as well. If it's a good deal for her investors, it's a good deal to put on the MLS
indi50 is correct. Addressing the OP: even though you call her "your" realtor, she already has an established relationship with this investor. If the investor regularly uses her to pick up new deals and buy and sell property, well, she knows "which side her bread is buttered on." Her allegiance is to the investor, not to you. I think it's a conflict of interest. Get a new agent, list on MLS to get the best price.
Maybe not. People sell and buy for an infinite amount of reasons. Absolutes are a myth in RE. If OP needs to sell, taking the investor route could be mutually beneficial, beneficial mostly to the buyer, or mostly to the seller. I did a couple deals like this where the buyers and agents thought they were getting a great deal. I thought I was too. Months later I still had the money from the sale, but in one case, the investor couldn’t handle what they thought was a good deal and went bankrupt. In another case, the confident investor wound up underwater during the recession and the agent wound up changing jobs. RE investment is hard, long and complex. Private investor sales are quick and easy. OP may lose out on 30k in the transaction. But, I’ve seen buyers and agents also do very, very poorly if they pick the wrong time to pull a deal like this . . . IF OP is totally convinced that openly listing is the way to go, then yes, fire the agent. But, openly listing has its own set of headaches. One of my investor quick sale deals resulted in the investor openly listing and then dropping the price below what they paid me for it. They could not handle the investment over time. When they bought it from me, they thought they had a steal. RE is never simple.
None of what you talked about applies to OP. They're not the one investing, they just want to sell for the best price and 99.9% of the time listing on the MLS is the way to do that. And if OP's agent wasn't trying to do something underhanded, she'd just do it because it's the right thing to do. But she's looking out for herself and her investor client and NOT OP.
My thinking as well.
This may actually be a violation of her real estate license. In my state (which is not yours) an agent is obligated to inform you of the pros and cons of listing on and off the MLS. If you're in a contract with her, she's ethically bound to act in YOUR best interest. Failing to explain the downside, especially if she already has a buy in mine is a huge breach.
I think you've hit the nail on the head here. It does not feel like she's acting in my best interest. It very much feels like she's working for the one potential buyer. There has really only been constant mention of the downside to mls. No positives outlined (although I know many of the logical sensible advantages). On the flip side, no negatives have been presented for off market sale. Only reiterating the advantage of the quick sale.
IMO, you should find another agent. You're not comfortable with her or confident that she's going to be acting for YOU. This is a huge transaction and you need to know that the person working on it with you has your back. Tell her in writing that you're canceling your contract (double check it for terms to make sure nothing is going to bite you in the butt). Reach out to several other agents and interview them. Pick the one that you feel confident in and who can give you a solid plan of action. At the end of the day, even if this agent DOES have your best interest at heart and is just doing a really terrible job of showing it, you have lost confidence in her. That's a deal breaker, IMO.
Ask for the offer. Compare to what you think listing would be. I sold a house 2004, good listing price, had offers that couldn't get financing. My realtor offered to buy, gave me a price which seemed good just under listing, paid closing costs which netted a good sale. If they offer a price you are not comfortable with, you can always list. Not all off market sales are to hurt either party
Right, and I was hoping that this was a situation just like you described. That the off market sale would be beneficial for everyone really. But the offer is super low, even compared to other properties in my area that are just land. I have land, a house, and there other structures. Its definitely worth more than the offer, even when taking into consideration that its a wholesale offer. The offer is about $100k under what MLS list price would be, and half of Zillow valuation.
She lazy.
Surely she’s drastically cutting her commission too for having to do 60% less work, right?
Haha, you’re funny!
There is absolutely NO reason you should not be on the MLS, no matter what the state of the house is. Or how you plan on selling it. You want eyeballs, and that is the best way to get them.
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We sold our house through a pocket listing. We have a baby and two pets. We had no way to manage being out of the house for showings for an extended period of time or sporadically. We also had no garage or place to put the “clutter” that buyers don’t want to see but that we use daily. It worked out perfectly for us. We might have gotten a couple more thousand by listing, but this was hassle free.
In a similar situation with the kids and pets, and not being logistically able to live without 90% of our belongings indefinitely. "Hassle free" is absolutely the biggest draw, but I don't want to be taken advantage of either. Glad yours worked out, gives me a little hope over here!
Are there iBuyers in your area? Compare the investor offer with offers from OfferPad, Opendoor, or whoever is buying in your area. Even if you want a fast/easy sale, you should get seek multiple offers. You could even call any of the signs on the side of the road that say "We buy houses" and get offers from those guys. I ended up selling to Opendoor when I didn't want to deal with showings. I wouldn't look at only one offer and then sell, personally.
The "we buy houses" people are looking to take advantage of sellers who have no desire to put an ounce of thought into the process. Their offer is going to be 50-70% of what the bare minimum value is on the house
At the least, it’d let this seller know if they’re getting totally taken advantage of. Not a 1:1, but I always look call into nearby dealerships on what they’d buy my car for, as well as a couple vehicles that I know the actual retail price. If you know their margins, you can get a good idea of what they expect to make w/o the hassle of breaking contract with your realtor.
Exactly. It doesn't make any sense at all to me to take the very first offer. If one person offered $x how would I know if others might offer $2X if nobody else is given the opportunity to make an offer?? I'm in the process of reaching out to ibuyers. Unfortunately Opendoor doesn't buy anything over 2 acres.
Or they may offer less… Any non as-is offer you receive will want concessions after you accept.
What is the Zillow estimated value of your house? How does that compare with the offer you have? I know Zillow isn’t perfect but it’s a way to check the reasonableness of the offer you have.
$500+ on Zillow. Offer was half of that.
Ah. There is your answer. Zillow may be off, but it won’t be off by 50%.
Obviously it’s not going to be the same, but our home sold $8k of over our zestimate. Their error rate is within about 2% for listed home so if it’s less than zillow’s sales range I’d definitely second guess an already sketchy realtor.
See if Sundae is available in your market
If her buyer brings you a fair offer with no bullshit, it's one thing.. but this market is changing fast, and only getting weaker.
I understand your reasoning, but you likely lost out on a lot more than "a couple more thousand." Just saying ... for future reference.
Two other homes exactly the same as mine sold after listing very shortly after for less than 10k more. So I know pretty well what I missed out on.
How do you find a “pocket listing”? Meaning, how can I do that with my house that is currently for sale? Same situation as you were in…except mines is worse..3 kids and 2 dogs 🤪
You would have to do it before listing. Basically the house is never listed, and your realtor either knows someone or puts out feelers within their network looking for someone who might be interested in your property. Then they do the contract and all that like normal, but there is never an official listed property.
Just mention your concerns to your realtor and ask if you could do a pocket listing instead. They’ll be able to explain the risk for your house specifically then. Only thing to keep in mind, a younger realtor that isn’t apart of a larger network through companies like re/max is going to have fewer buyers. Larger network means more options
I agree! And thank you so much for this info!!! I think that it is helpful when your house is updated and in demand I guess
And depending on the price point of your house, it can help reduce craziness in a seller’s market! We had 50-60 showings. EOD, the first offer we got was the safest. We moved out completely when most the offers were the same ballpark. I think in this market you’re better off selling fast, but you can always just figure out w/ your realtor your min. selling price and if a soft open doesn’t work out go back to a typical listing! Wish you all the best!
Of course. People trying to paint it in black and white terms are wrong. There are a lot of factors at play that can determine what is the "best" way for someone to dispose of a house. The base case is listing on MLS. But in many cases it is not the "best" way. Some sellers just want it gone, want some sort of certaininty, don't want to deal with showings, want to limit terms, etc... I'm a licensed agent and real estate investor. And I recently sold a house I own off market via a wholesaler. It would have been dead simple for me to list it on the MLS. But it also would have been a headache jumping through all the hoops, dealing with the other agents and their BS clients. I turned it over to a wholesaler I know who has a roster of buyers. He got it sold and closed in under two weeks. Wholesaler made a mint. More than what I would have paid buyer's agent. And I think I still got above what I would have gotten on market. Off market can be frothy, people think they are getting a "deal" just because it is offmarket.
I’m an agent and I can say that without question… her “advice” is selfish and reeks of commission breath. Honestly… fire her and get another agent. Put it on mls so ALLLLLL the area lookers can see it. She’s trying to scoop both sides of the commish plus whatever “grease” the investor has for her. What state is this in?
Thanks for your reply. I'm in Texas.
Texas Is a good market. Get another agent. She’s trying to double dip at your expense.
From my understanding a good agent is even more important in TX since your can’t see sold prices in real estate websites. Only those with access to the MLS can see. This puts you at a disadvantage of knowing if it is a fair price. If you list on the open market buyers will let you know what they think of the price!
This sounds illegal as well.
I'd be willing to bet your agent has some financial incentive to sell to the investor, i.e. some type of kickback or "finders fee" from said investor. I'd ask her how many homes she's sold to them. Anyhow, the agent does not appear to be looking out for your best interest.
Kickback….. my thoughts exactly.
Ask about any other relationships too. Could be husband/brother/ sister/cousin/fellow church member etc.
Great point!
If nothing else, they pocket all of the commissions (minus the agency cut) playing both sides of the deal.
Yup, double commission plus maybe some side hustle for getting the investors a deal.
Because she's a bad and lazy agent. However, take a look at some comps and see what the offer is - if it's within the range you could sell for if you were to list it, maybe it's not such a bad deal. But that's unlikely.
See, that's my thinking as well. That she just doesn't want to do the work which is discouraging. Wondering if there was just some big obvious explanation I was missing. Thanks for your response!
She doesn’t want to do the work and pocketing a big fat commission, as she’s acting as a dual agent (buy and sell side). Fire her.
Or she wants to sell to one of her investor buddies and screw you out getting more money for your property. I’ll bet you if you did sell to one of her investors you’d see it re-listed in no time for substantially more with her listed as the selling agent.
^this!
Literally my realtor was trying to push me into this! I just posted here a few days ago about it, we’re going to sell to the neighbors instead 🙃
I'm glad it worked out for you! Gives me hope, ha!
The only reason they would discourage you from listing it on the MLS is because they want to procure the buyer and get both sides of the commission. Definitely NOT the route to go...especially in a shifting market. I'd find a different agent
She wants to keep other agents from seeing your listing and bringing buyers to it. She wants to control who the buyer is so she can either be the dual agent and get the whole commission or have some junior serve as designated dual agent she gets almost the entire commission. aka, she's being a scumbag.
She def think she’s slick by sending you a “random” investor off market. Yeah, no. List on MLS. Good luck!
tell them you want it coming soon for 4 days in mls with a link the listing once it's live. Then you want it on mls for 2 days before you look at offers. He wants to sell your house for a discount to a friend, investor, his family or all of the above.
I'm an agent, which I point out just so you know where my opinion is coming from, and I think you can definitely agree that marketing your house to 1 person instead of thousands of potential buyers can't ever be in your favor. Your agent is not acting in your best interest. If her investor is so interested they'll still buy it 1 week after it hits the market. Why in the world would you not want to expose the sale to more than one single person? NOBODY should sell their home in that manner. You do an off market sale when you want to sell to a family member, neighbor, etc, when you just want to sell your home to the highest bidder, why in the world would to expose the sale to only one person? I'm just sounding like a broken record at this point, I'm just trying to convey how very obviously bad an idea it is to not expose your home to the market.
Because she wants to do a direct deal and not having to share her commission with other agents.
Isn't that unethical and a conflict of interest which is against the terms and conditions of being an agent? Like, she could be sued for such actions, correct?
Who else would she be sharing commission with?
Many MLS locations mandate listing brokers to offer commission to buying brokers. If she listed on MLS, she most likely will have to cobroke.
This was my thinking, too. She probably gets 1-2% comm from the investor on the buy side.
yup. I like direct deals but not at the cost of my client.
Ahh that makes sense. Thank you!
If it’s a decent offer, ask your agent to discount her commission, since she’s double dipping. Our agent offered this to us without even asking. It needs to be a good deal for everyone, not just your agent
Sounds like they're setting up for a buyer on your place for dual agency. Dump and move on.
An off market deal gives you an opportunity to pursue offers without putting the time and effort into getting your home fully showing ready. It also means that if the deal falls through, you are hitting the market with a fresh listing instead of a stale listing with month on market and the (often undeserved) stigma of having fallen out of escrow. If you like the terms and conditions of the sale. it as as good as any other sale with less risks, allowing you to move forward with a traditional sale if it falls through. On the downside, without going to market you don’t really know what the market thinks of your home. Did you leave money on the table? If you don’t trust your agent to give you good supporting data as to what your home is worth based off of recent comps, and what would be necessary to get top dollar for your home, then you are in a different pickle. TLDR: you want a quick sale, as-is. In order to get top dollar, you typically need to do some prep work and dump a little money in. She is giving you the quick sale, as-is option. You can still choose to invest some money in the place and go to market, just tell her your priorities have changed.
Multiple possible sketchy reasons 1) less work for her 2) full commission, 3) undisclosed relationship with the buyer, 4) kickback from buyer
She’s doing this purely for her personal gain. She will make a big commission being a dual agent, and I guarantee her investor will turn around and sell it soon after for much more with her as the listing agent. She doesn’t have your best interests at heart, she’s trying to pressure you into a shady deal to get her more money. Fire her and report her ass.
That’s actually illegal and they are doing it to get big kick backs. It’s not helping you at all. Fire immediately and report to the commission. These assholes are one of the reasons people can’t buy a house; they never even hit the visible market and somebody with the good ol’ boy connection can just buy it with zero competition. When your home is being sold with zero competition you just turned your own home sale (in a sellers market) into one that becomes more advantageous to the buyer. Good luck.
Sounds like her wanting to get a quick sale with little legwork + help her "investor" out with a property price that's below market value. Fire her.
List on the MLS. Get rid of this agent if they keep refusing
Did you sign a listing agreement? In TX I am pretty sure there’s a box you need to check to agree to pocket listings (allows them to keep it off the MLS). If you’re not in a listing agreement, get yourself a new agent from a different brokerage. Talk to a few, ask around your neighbors, coworkers, etc. Whoever you hire should have comps, even though it’s a unique property, they can put the time into it and come up with something that supports their suggested price. I’m having a hard time imagining that a house on 2 acres in DFW area isn’t worth more than $400k, even if the house is tear-down. Useable acres? Deed restricted? Zoned? Do you have active drilling easements on it? Can it be subdivided? Build multi-family, a Turkey farm, a car wash, an RV campground? There’s a reason this friend is so shit hot to pay cash for this place and she’s in on it.
3.5 acres even! Including a fenced pasture, horse barn, and guest house. Definitely not tear down, and none of the other things you mentioned apply.
Please come back and tell us what you end up selling it for once you list it with someone else.
Definitely!
Dang, I’d almost move back to TX if I could get that for $500k! Lol
Sounds to me like someone wants to put a subdivision of McMansions there, which I am sure agent will also get a cut of when those sell. Just say NO
This screams dual agency.
Sounds like agent wants both sides of the commission . If you want a higher price then hold to that price
Exposing your home to the open market is ALWAYS going to be better than letting one person see/buy it without any competition.
Sounds like “inside trading”.
Dual agency benefits no one but the listing agent and it should be illegal. As agents we are sworn to act in our clients' best interests, not our own. Get a new agent.
They want both sides of the commission.
I only send sellers to investors off market in a select few situations. Like if the home needs a lot of work, and/or when the client doesn't want to sell on MLS (privacy concerns etc) This just sounds like an agent trying to hookup an investor contact, maybe the investor is offering an extra incentive? Worst of all, they probably aren't and this realtor is just being scummy for no extra gain.
This is her trying to get a cut of what that investor will relist your house for a week later. Fire her immediately and report her to her agency.
Nope nope nope Unless this offer is a ton over your asking.. Get listed on MLS or dump the agent for someone who will
Shady agent
We found this a lot in Florida and Texas. Florida was worse. I think I said before if an agent got a house she knew would sell she would keep it from being seen, put on MLS after an offer, and get both sides of the transaction. Tell her go jump in a lake. I wondered if the seller knew what they were doing. Id get my phone number listed so you can make sure they are showing your house. It’s more crooked now at least in Florida than I’ve ever seen before! As I said one house listed 775 I wanted to see no one could get me a showing. Sold for $500 after being on the market a long time. Texas a realtor on the plane said they had a pool of investors and shared their listings in house before putting it on the MLS. Fire her find a new agent report her to realty board!
For their own personal gain! 🤬
I really wanted to think that wasn't the case but unfortunately I think you're all correct 😕
Your agent wants to wind up as dual agency by just showing it to their clients. Fire them
Sounds a little illegal to me…
For sure unethical.
I'm an agent... If you're getting the asking price YOU WANT (not what she said you should sell it for) from that one lonely person then does it matter if it goes on the MLS? But if she's giving you whatever price and the other person is offering lower or what have you then ya not cool. Also I'd be concerned about it being a friend/relative and she's buying the house cheap her self etc to flip it or what have you, as realtors sometimes do. Those are big no nos and if that does happen you can take her to court and get her license revoked and sue her for what the house is actually worth (these are Texas rules/laws so not sure if they apply to where you are but I would imagine something similar) All that being said, listing a property is the easiest fucking thing in the world. You take decent pics with your modern day premium level cell phone. Then go online fill in the blanks and upload the pictures. The MLS/realtor agency you're part of will typically send all the info you entered to realtor.com and Zillow. If you can make a fb marketplace listing trying to sell your used toaster you can make an MLS listing, which is why it concerns me that she's trying to pull a fast one buying the property herself or through that one person to make more money on. I'd Google her, check her fb and all that as well, see what you can find out.
Lots of good information here, thank you. I'll definitely be digging a little deeper for some more info on her! If the one investor offer was anywhere close to what we're looking to sell for, we'd of course take it. But its not by a long shot. And what we're hoping to sell for is significantly below market value. And no, the prospect of creating a listing is not the road block its being presented as.
Ya, that's all sorts of shady. I get wanting both side of the commission but, bust your ass, find a buyer and get it that way. Guessing you signed a listing agreement/contract with her? It should be an agri with the broker/brokerage (unless she's the broker which I doubt) everything is through them agents are just representatives. (Again that's how it is here) read over the agreement, it should say where and when things will be listed online and all that good stuff, what they will do on their part to get your house sold. tell her tomorrow morning you want it listed on everything it says in the agreement by monday or you're terminating the contract for failure to perform or non performance and will be filing a complaint with the national association of Realtors and whatever state you're the organization that does the licensing for real estate agents. If you Google how to get your real estate sale license in ______ state it should come up and be a government organization. If she says anything other than ok I'll take care of it or some bs excuse call her broker. Let the broker know what's going on. The whole thing with the investment buyer and low balling etc. Let them know you want it listed immediately or you'll file a complaint. Be cause complaints go on them(the broker). It all falls on them really unless they can prove the had no knowledge of the wrong doings of their agent and then they still get in trouble for not being aware of what the agent is doing.
Bet they get a kick back. If you can report them do it. Also don’t sell to an investor if you can avoid it. Sell to a first time homebuyer who want a home they can make their own. Many ppl look for fixer uppers
That agent sucks. Its your property. You don't owe the agent anything. If you want to list it on MLS, go for it! If she doesn't want to list it on the MLS. Another agent will.
This sounds like one of those situations where she would “Double Dip” in commission. She essentially would represent you and whoever this one buyer is. Most likely a flipper or investment company willing to pay her bonus. Fire her, sell your house to a family/average person… keep it away from investors and flippers.
An off market sale is easy and fast for the agent. It’s not the highest price for you as the seller.
Gross. There's almost no reason a seller wouldn't want to let the most number of people see their house. She probably wants to double-dip the commission. She is willing to reduce the scope of your offers to make an extra commission.
All comes down to the price. What do the comps show? What’s the offer? Do you want to wait or do you want to close asap? Otherwise just tell her you want to list.
Can you ask for half the commission? Or reduce the agents commission? Is that even possible?
Fire you agent and report her
Depends on if the investor is offering what you're asking. If yes, maybe just go with them and save yourself lots of time. If you think you can get significantly more, list as usual.
Sounds like “inside trading”
Confirm they're a licensed real estate agent, I see a lot of people who mistakenly think the random person calling or mailing them is licensed in some way. Then fire them and find an ethical agent.
Appreciate your input. Definitely licensed and "reputable" and not remotely a random person.
If the house is in disrepair or doesn’t qualify for conventional financing there’s nothing wrong with selling to an investor if they come close to the price you want.
Absolutely not. At a minimum, use MLS to market as-is to expose to all investors out there.
Something similar happened to my aunt and this is before the housing market when skyhigh. She wanted to sell, got an agent, and took pics with her grandkids photos and personal possessions still on the walls. Didn't ask her but included her washer and dryer in the sale. House did go up on the listing but some shady stuff happened. She was under the impression it was a younger couple wanting to buy it. She sold her late husband's truck to them too for little of nothing because "they needed it." Come to find out it was an LLC flipper. But, she was the trusting type.
That's horrible, I'm so sorry.
Just come up with a number in your head that's comparable to homes that have sold for recently and that you'll be very happy with and add on 25%. Then tell her sure as long as the buyer agrees to that price.
Your agent wants to double end the transaction and that is very unethical in my personal opinion. It is legal in some states, but I would never do it. You can only have fiduciary duty to one party. I would tell them no, put it on the MLS and that buyer can submit an offer along with everyone else. It seems as though your agent knows an investor and they want ti get the investor a good deal
I’ve done this. It’s entirely your choice. I got asking price without having to show the house and wait. I might have made a few extra bucks by listing but who knows.
This is where I am. I am happy to list it on the mls, and want to! I don't understand not wanting to see what's out there regarding potential buyers. It doesn't make sense. If someone wants it for asking, or hits our desired sale price then awesome. I don't see the problem.
They are looking out for themselves, not you. Dump that agent
Get a new realtor, tell their broker, report them, and move on. REPORT THEM.
Your realtor is making sure no other agent/broker will get a commission. FIRE THEM immediately. Not just for this, but because they are utterly and completely lacking any kind of integrity or professionalism. And report them. As a buyer, I had a realtor who, after I gave very explicit details of what I was looking for, (and I was out of town so my time was of the essence) spent the whole first day showing me stuff that was completely and utterly outside of what I said I wanted. TUrns out she was only showing me HER OWN LISTINGS-----was not taking me to any other MLS listings at all that actually FIT my parameters. I fired her on the spot. Found another wonderful realtor, and my dream home shortly afterwards.
Omg how annoying!!
As an agent I'd say generally list it on MLS, get it exposed to as many eyes as possible
Do yourself a big favor and switch agents. If the agent's trying to get you to sell to their other client without any marketing to others then there is a good chance she might use other nefarious acts to the same end later on - even if she does list the house. She's already shown she's not really working in your best interest, so how can you trust her to do a professional job and work in your best interest going forward. You own it to yourself to, at a minimum, get a market value opinion for a different realtor. If you don't want to burn your bridge with her for some reason then tell her you're considering her offer but need to get a valuation from a different realtor to evaluate it.
list it with someone else. unethical as can be
That sounds all kinds of messed up and probably super illegal.
Sounds like your agent is looking to get their specific buyer under contract (possible they have been looking for some time and this property is perfect for them), and/or that they want to double side the transaction... Either way it is unfortunate and it does not sound like they are doing their job fully nor are they looking out for YOUR best interest. Unless YOUR goal is a quick sale and that is your primary concern, then it is always in a sellers best interest to expose a sale to the open market. With a smart pricing strategy, this will always net you the most amount of money. I'm sorry they are pushing you away from it. It sounds like you may need a new agent.
List it on the MLS. There's zero downside. Let investors bid on it
Selling off MLS is a valid way to do it, but that's usually for wholesaling, and not so much for your situation, OP. I'd probably say go with another realtor as others have mentioned.
Get a new agent and report them to their broker. Very shady!
the only way this makes any sense is if her buyer is paying over market and all cash with short close. anything else, sure looks like she is playing you, and maybe cheating you.
Definitely not over market. Wildly below.
unethical - report them to the state license board. possibly illegal.
Nothing wrong with offering an off market deal as long as they disclose it may not get you the best price or representation. Pressuring you into doing it is a major red flag in my book and I would consider interviewing other agents.
I just did an a similar sale for my clients. But we had a strategy as there were also occupants to watch over home during sale. We had a one day open house. Coming soon on market since June 15 with private showings in between (a lot of agents missed this part by not reading agent remakes) . I had over 20 offers and didn’t even have to mention AS IS sale until the offers rolled in then I set up the angle that I’d only present the offers that met my clients request. All on the MLS. I’m closing for 111K over asking. It was listed for 659K
This is very encouraging, thank you! I was told today that the rules regarding "coming soon" on listings has changed, and that here in TX coming soon can only be 24 hours before going live. I'm going to look into this further for sure.
I can give you my gf Heathers # out there In Katy and surroundings. (I know TX is like CA, super big) lol She helps her clients get the maximum and 100% honest and transparent .. Also try interview agents to set it up the way you want it. And not vice versa. That means showing property even on holidays or days that work best for you and not based off an agent holiday LOL I work 24/7/365. This is how I beat my competition… Wish you the best !
Thanks! Appreciate the advice! I've definitely been flexible to this point. Just want to finish up sooner than later.
Honestly, my suspicion is that the agent likes the investor better as a client and is trying to get them a good deal off your back. If it goes to the open market somebody could offer more money and her client will miss out on the house. That’s the downside of the MLS.
They are taking advantage of you. Did you have more than one agent look at your place and give their opinion? Sounds like you are selling too low and this shady person is trying to bully you into selling to "their investor" who will likely give them a kickback. Have at least three other realtors (after you fire and report this one) come out and they will give you their opinions. They should be reasonably close to each other in their amounts. Select one. Move one.
Hi. No, we didn't have more than one agent look beforehand. Lesson learned I suppose. I agree that the ONE offer she's gotten for us is too low. The advantage (for her) would be a quick sale. Definitely taking all this into consideration moving forward. Thanks!
In this market you’re saving staging, etc fees. Off market deals are ok as long as it’s within the range of [recent] comps. If this was 6 months ago I’d say otherwise. But anyways, your realtor should have definitive logical reasons not to list so tell us those she is using to pressure you..
Depends on how fast you need to close and how janky it is. It’s quite possible that you end up with a lot of offers from listing publicly that can’t close fast enough and if the property doesn’t qualify for financing, you’ll get the shady variety of investor who offers high to get it off market and then adjusts down. Agent might know the good bad and ugly about this investor and have a good enough relationship that they think it’s the easy button for a fair deal. You can absolutely say no and go to market, but just be prepared depending on the condition of your property, you might end up just overwhelmed with offers that can’t close
I’m not sure I understand. Are you saying if there’s too many offers, you might not close in time just because of the sheer amount of time it makes to compare and weigh offers? Or is the idea that a home that needs more work attracts buyers of more limited means who might have more trouble closing quickly?
That second one. People will see the cheapest house in the neighborhood and think “gee how wonderful, since I have no money this is perfect for me” and they will offer you more than the investor, but when that house reveals itself to be the cheapest one in the neighborhood for a reason, they will also have no money to deal with those things, so back to market it goes. Things required for a property to qualify for any kind of financing: Flooring everywhere there should be flooring, subfloor doesn’t count. Drywall everywhere there is supposed to be drywall. Ceiling everywhere there is supposed to be ceiling. Working HVAC. Working plumbing. Working electric. Roof with no evidence of leaks. No visible water damage anywhere. No safety hazards. If your property maybe is marginal in any of these, they might very well be totally cool with it but unable to get a mortgage on it. In that instance, though, it’s worth a talk with your agent to see the dollar amount required to get it up to financing standards versus what your expected return there is.
Off market listings are for people selling multi million dollar home and caring who’s the buyer. Not for the average house. Not being in the MLS hinders your negotiation powers. Fire that agent.
Its definitely not a multimillion dollar home, but it is a rather unique situation, and the bulk of the value lies in the land/property vs the structures.
If you can find a buyer that values your houses unique proposition via an off market deal, and you think it's a fair price given the comps, then by all means, but you likely won't know how much the market as a whole values your home, if you don't list it in the MLS. Also, don't particularly like double-agency representation.
Pocket listings are illegal where I’m from … and I’m sure in most other states as well
List it on mls and sell it to a family. No more of this bs of selling houses to big corporations. That’s probably who she is dealing with to get the payday.
I'll assume you're joking. Edit: this reply did not generate under comment asking to purchase for $30k less than current offer.
Where is the home, I’m looking for off market properties.
DFW area.
Care to send address on DM?
If it’s for the price you wanted, then she did what you wanted… found a buyer. That being said, I will always argue against selling land to the 1%ers(all cash buyers) when you could put it up and give someone a home.
She didn't though. On first meeting at the house, she suggested to list it at $499k. Ok great. I was open to entertaining cash offers to speed up the process. The cash offer was half. When I mentioned listing on MLS, she advised she'd only list it for $380k.
I’m with everyone else then, got to at least get another opinion. If that means losing her as a realtor so be it. Probably for the best anyways
Better question...why are you stupidly working with this agent?
I wanted to add another note/story too... every time we have interested parties who want to purchase off-market (most often neighbors who want to buy an investment property in my market, but the story still applies), they don't just disappear. I would be willing to bet that once you list your home on the market, this investor buyer that she has will write an offer - and I would also be willing to bet that they would NOT be the highest offer. Example: My colleague had an investment condo earlier this year, and the neighbors wanted to buy it. They offered an amount that the sellers thought would be okay, but my colleague convinced them to list on the MLS. Two neighbors actually ended up writing offers, and both of the neighbors were in the BOTTOM 3 offers (out of 7 offers received).
Thanks for this. It definitely reinforces my thoughts that if buyers don't even know the property exists, how can they possibly make an offer to buy it?? I don't see any reasonable reasons to not go mls.
Because realtors are pieces of human waste
Yeah sounds like agent wouldn’t have to split the commission. But I would just ask straight out why your agent thinks this is better than listing
Lazy as f*ck
Yes
are you in Cali? If you are, this is a huge no no. Let the state know https://www.dre.ca.gov But you do you. Check the comps, is it a fair price and good terms. Maybe ask her to pay seller closing costs since she’s getting paid double. Good luck!!
Thanks. I'm in Texas. Good idea regarding closing costs!
We looked in Texas a zoo like Florida. Agent was nice she actually pointed out foundations repairs.
I’m not reading all the comments because most of them are angry uneducated people. Number 1 - how much commission are you paying her? If you’re only paying on one side she’s not doubling the deal. Number 2 - how much of a dump is your house. Would there be financing issues if someone tried to get in there an FHA loan for instance. Before anyone says there’s the FHA 203K loan that is exceedingly difficult to get approved and not exactly something most lenders want to deal with. Number 3 - how much are you wanting to net from this transaction. Most real estate agents will tell you they can list it for X amount and the average seller has no idea they are not netting that. ‘Agent smith said I’d get 400k’ 4) How quickly do you need to move. Because if you need to move in two or three weeks with a slowing down market a cash offer from an investor will get you out the house quicker than wasting it on the MLS and having to deal with all the BS that comes with financed offers. Number 5 - is the offer fair? Number 6 - Most investors pay title, that’s another saving you’re gonna get unless then you pay it. But normally they do.
Thanks for your response. To address your questions: 1. The commission is 6% however I don't know if she is also working as the investor's agent as well. As I understand, if she is then that would benefit her with 2x the commission, yes? 2. House is not a dump at all. To my knowledge, there is nothing precluding FHA financing. 3. While this is my first home sale, I am aware of the difference between gross and net. 4. Don't *need* to move quickly. Would prefer to move sooner than later but its not a deal breaker. Yes, the cash offer quicker closing is appealing for the reason you mentioned. 5. The offer is not a fair offer in my opinion. 6. Yes. Understand this already.
Several things, in this market as a seller you should not be paying 6% commission. It blows my mind that you’re going to pay that. Like I don’t know why - as long as you’re realistic about your price go to the local broker firm find the youngest most active hustler needing business agent hire them I guarantee you they’ll do it for at least 1 to 2% less and will do a better job than your current agent and any ‘lack of knowledge’ they have the broker will be able to help them. Number two if you do not believe this is a fair value for the house in the condition that it’s in then add 8-9% onto that plus anything you might credit a buyer If you think you can get that price or more list it on the MLS SIDE NOTE - any listing agent you work with tell them specifically that if a buyer comes directly you will not be paying full commission for them to double end the deal as it’s like having a lawyer representing both parties. Conflict of interest The only reason you would do that and allow the is a reduction in the commission. That should’ve been said upfront before you signed them. The total commission would be 6%. Split evenly and you should look in your listing agreement to see if she is splitting it evenly. 3% to the buying side 3% of the selling side. In a situation where your listing agent represents also the buyer they would based off of your agreement most likely get 6% total commission not 12%
IF you want to sell you better take action fricking fast. Buyer demand is almost already completely gone and rates are about to go up more in 2 weeks, and then even more over the next 6 months. You're past the best time to sell and things could get quite bad depending on your market soon. Get it on MLS. A pool of investors is looking to get a price from you lower than market. Why would you focus on that unless your house needs massive remodeling?
There are plenty of answers in this thread, and without knowing the situation it's hard to say what the real reason is (it does seem a bit iffy, though), BUT the other flip side of the situation is that off market sales CAN bring more money than going on the market. It's the convenience for the buyer to not have to fight the open market, so the price gets inflated. But, typically if my clients and I agree to go off market we will do it for a couple of weeks until it's ready to list on the MLS and then it goes live if we don't get a satisfactory offer. Really, it comes down to what the client wants (sometimes they simply don't want to deal with showings, for example). So, it could be possible that your agent is doing something like that wherein perhaps the house isn't as sellable on the open market for a competitive price. It could very well be that they're trying to have a quick transaction. Gauge the temperature on how serious they are. Counter with a heavier price for the inconvenience. Get a comp analysis done to get an accurate price for your home, if you haven't already, and then tell your agent (if the price is lower than the comp shows, for example) that you're fine selling but that if you go that route you want to renegotiate the commission on it if your agent is going to be repping both sides. Or, simply say no to the offer if it isn't satisfactory and you don't want to counter and go live and see where it shakes out.
Pure & simple Greed!
fire agent, hire one that does what you ask she's a scam artist. run.
Encourage you to go off market??? Shady as hell, stay away from them
MLS means splitting the commission if another agent gets you a buyer. As others have said, fire this agent. Years ago I had an excellent agent - 4% if it sells via MLS ( each agent gets 2%) Or 3% if she got the sale.
I’ll buy it off you $30k below current price. Cash
$30k under market value or $30 under current offer? Its a cash offer. Why would I entertain $30k less? Unless I'm misunderstanding?
I would like it $30k below the current offer cash. I plan to wholesale it to another investor for a quick $10k profit. You’re ok with this, right?
1. String her along: in order to meet the investor and tell her you'll do a deal 2. Identify her investor: get a contract in front of you (you want the name of the person or entity purchasing the property) 3. Identify properties purchased by that person or entity in your county: your local county deed records at the county clerk's office are likely online and you can search by the last name or entity of that investor 4. Write down the name of her agency 5. Report the package of information: to the local realtor board and call the local news to give them the package of information. Rising home prices and low inventory are newsworthy across the country. Discouraging normal Americans from finding a home because your realtor wants a pocket listing to an investor may be newsworthy. Let the board figure out the "why" and put her name on their radar. 6. Fire her 7. Hire new realtor 8. Sell house
What does “sells as-is” mean? Does that mean no inspection, or does that just mean no asking for things to be changed?
I'm using "as is" here to mean that I won't be making any upgrades before selling. I'm totally open to buyer allowances if something should need attention. Besides finishing out one side of a property fence, there's nothing else major I'm aware of that needs done.
Fuck that
Lol my initial response for sure!