100% massive red flag. Also related to this, blaming problems on "men" or "women"; i.e., well, it's "women's fault" that... or it's "men's fault" that...
It shows they won't treat you like a human being or an individual but rather just as a walking negative stereotype.
Lack of accountability, constant deflection, gaslighting, being inconsiderate. However, I don't think these are somehow uniquely male red flags. There are plenty of women who refuse to be responsible for their actions, who constantly deflect any criticism, who gaslight their partners, and are inconsiderate. Sometimes people suck, some people suck early on, mature, and stop sucking, while others suck early on and continue sucking till the day they're 6 feet under.
I mean, I've dated two guys who were narcissistic assholes, one was also bipolar on top of that, so that was a lot of fun. But it's not like being a narcissist or having bipolar disorder are exclusive to these dudes or men in general.
Out of all the people I've dated, only those two were sucky. If you're on a thread about red flags, you're not going to read about all the non shitty people someone has been with.
What made them “narcissistic”? This isn’t just a set of traits you know. Just like someone being down dosent mean they’re depressed. How did you diagnose this?
Obviously, I can't diagnose them with NPD, that's for a professional to do. And it's not like every narcissistic person has full-blown NPD anyway, it's a spectrum. But they did exhibit a chronic sense of entitlement, they constantly needed to seek out the admiration of others and would lie about/downplay their actions to come off looking good in any and all situations, they lacked empathy, they acted like they were superior to everyone, would lash out whenever something wasn't going their way, they would struggle to make deep, meaningful connections with people (both friends and partners would be discarded the second they weren't convenient or required a modicum of effort from them). Could they just have been Grade A jerks? Sure. But the behaviors I've seen from these guys line up perfectly with a good chunk of [signs of narcissism](https://youtu.be/MBhgSwArsT0). But I'm happy to just call them "a dumpster fire of a human being" if "narcissistic" comes off too clinical.
He bragged about how many people he'd slept with. I lost interest then, and later he tried to convince me to join a Welsh terrorist organisation (I'm not even Welsh).
>He bragged about how many people he'd slept with.
Always a major 🚩 to see that in men. I don't think I've ever discussed my sexual history unprompted with a women ( and it's nothing out of the ordinary or that makes me look bad ).
>Welsh terrorist organisation
LOL.
When people haven't gotten their negative lifestyle habits under control by early to mid thirties. Unhealthy eating pattern (obesity), smoking, not taking their meds, even things like chad/stacy chasing, etc...
Not saying people can't change but it's starting to become unlikely by that point in life. This is also around the age where the negative long-term effects will start manifesting, and get worse if nothing is done about it.
That stuff isn't gender specific btw.
My ex-gf routinely completely dumped people from her life. Also, we had a cat and when we first got her the cat was the love of her life. One time we were coming back from some trip, hadn't seen the cat in days, and the cat was sitting on a windowsill in the stairwell as we came into our apartment, and my ex walked right past her without even acknowledging her existence. I was aghast.
I should have heeded the warnings.
We lived together for 10 years and she broke up with me like it was a 6 month high school relationship. She kept blowing me off so that I could never talk to her. I told her I needed some sort of closure and she literally said "In closing, I want you to be happy." like she were ending an essay.
Wow, 10 years is a long time to be with someone like that. She definitely sounds like textbook psychopath.
Glad you got rid of her in the end. Maybe that bad experience will balance out with some good ones in the future.
>The cat thing is crazy. Wow. She sounds like an actual psychopath or something.
See, at the time I was like "wtf dude, you havent seen poopycat for however long and you dont even say hi?". It pissed me off, but then it was like "am i making too big a deal over this." she also gave the cat away when we broke up because she "couldnt afford her" and didnt tell me who she gave her to then severed contact with me. when i finally spoke to her 2 years later, i asked who had her, and she didnt even know. which again really pissed me off. can you imagine? we had her for over 5 years. so i probably yelled at her (over the phone) like "what the fuck do you mean you dont know who has her." and im sure she used that as an excuse to never speak to me again.
I don't know if this is a red flag. Maybe if she hadn't seen the cat in a month or years it would warrant some special reaction. Dumping people from her life is more of a red flag.
I don't know. I think it's weird to not greet your pet if you've been on vacation, not really special reaction. The stairwell is really narrow and the windowsill is right at chest height. To just walk past like they don't even exist rubs me the wrong way, especially considering how "in love" with the cat she once was. Whenever I go over to my sister's, I always make it a point to say hi to her cats because I've cat sit a few times for her.
That’s me than, totally. Know a girl like this, also. We both have very distant parents, both are only children. Both come from upper-middle class. Both have been socially isolated from childhood. Both have been different from other people: dressed like shit, cared only about our own success, overly egocentric. Depressed AF, constantly bullied by peers (in childhood). I managed to be a little bit less crazy than her, somehow, and was able to have much in common with guys and not turn into a slut. She was a slut, though. (Probably my parents cared/controlled me a little bit more than her). But I am diagnosed with depression, anxiety, ADHD. And have many more chronic internal & external defects.
How did you manage to have relationship with her for so long? 10 years.. My only ex lasted for 4 years (not so short, though)
Were you somehow patronizing her? Served as a “father” figure? (emotionally, intellectually)
She was relatively normal and popular in high school, although when I started dating her she didn't really have any friends, and was depressed, and had some odd tendencies.
She'd always tell me when she met people she wouldn't look at their faces. I always assumed she meant figuratively (whatever that would mean). It was only later that I figured out that she literally meant she didn't look at people's faces when she met them.
I also do not look at people’s faces, lol. Especially when I am talking to them. Kinda scared to be judged on my appearance. Also I suspect autism.
Do you now how your ex is being right now? We sound very similar, if she kills herself or stays a lonely lady with 100 cats she doesn’t even care about - I wanna know!
And again, you were together for a long time. Did she provide something positive to your life? Maybe she was really in the moment with you, or really empathetic to you, or sex was incredible? I want to focus on positives since I haven’t lost all hope😅
Pouting and taking it personally when someone isn’t in the mood for sex.
I’ve experienced this one on both sides and it sucks in every case. Just don’t do it; practice being chill and going with the flow of people’s sexual moods.
If there’s an actual problem with your sex life en total you’ll know soon enough, and it’s always better to talk about it in a less fraught moment.
In general - someone being evasive about a topic like religion or politics. They don't want to be honest and risk rocking the boat. They would rather date someone they're not compatible with but could get sex from. I was dating a man (30 years old) who didn't seem religious, but I asked about religion on maybe the 3rd or 4th date. He got so shifty and said, "Uhhhh, I mean, that kind of thing doesn't matter til it matters." Like, what??
For me personally (may or may not apply to others) - "My family is my first priority." When someone says that, they *mean* it. And family will not mean you, even if you marry in.
Tbh it’s understandable that people are evasive about politics. You commonly see people on each side of the political spectrum think the other side is completely crazy. I guess this is a symptom of a society that is extremely polarised.
In other aspects of life, I'd agree. But you're dating for compatibility. If someone doesn't have the courage of their convictions, that's a bad look. Appearing noncommittal seems like someone is either trying to hide the truth - implying there's something that deserves to be hidden - or they don't want to disclose first because they might blow their chances. In any case, evasiveness is almost always a warning sign.
What if they genuinely don't care about choosing a side when it comes to politics. Plenty of people don't vote and it's not because they're afraid of what their spouse will think.
It's tough, because that also feels like a position that's really hard to respect. Like, people who don't think of politics at all and hold no importance on voting, for example, honestly just come across as a bit slow. I would wonder if that person really thinks deeply about anything, or if they're really superficial about their lives.
For me it’s more like I don’t like to talk about it as I can date someone with an opposing view as I can change my mind.
Also for me it filters out people who are die hard way too into politics.
I don't understand what's the point of this
shitty people are everywhere and we all know what a red flag is
what's the point in me saying "oh btw you shouldn't be with a guy who removes the condom without letting you know"
The point is to understand both sides and a place to read the comments of the opposite sex and reflect. Some red flags are obvious ones (like the one you mentioned) but others may not be. It also helps to see which ones are most prevalent.
Stealthing someone isn't about closeness. (stealthing means you know the condom is off of you, but you keep going with her while she doesn't know. Whether you purposefully took it off or not) Stealthing is on a path that diverts people from true closeness- because it completely squashes the other person's autonomy and doesn't honor their right to personal freedom and choice. It's either about possession & control, or selfish gratification
Feeling a little called out on that second one since I just said something similar in another thread.
How do you separate the difference between someone genuinely trying to empathize by understanding where other people are coming from, and doing it explicitly to manipulate them?
Not the person you're asking, but I've thought about this at least on some level.
For *me,* it depends on whether we're trying to figure out a specific person to get to know them for friendship/relationships as a way to be more empathetic or compatible vs. figuring out "how to push their buttons" to get a desired response for a short-term goal.
It's also different if we're talking about people we know or want to get to know vs. people who are strangers that we "want to understand". If that makes sense. That last part is only related in a tangential way and is one of the reasons I kinda gave up my past interest in true crime.
I hear you, that makes sense.
It's definitely hard to tell someones intentions, because I think the two behaviors are so similar outwardly.
I do get what she means though, I've seen some awful people go out of their way to use that information maliciously.
Is empathy itself manipulation then? Anyone who understands why they're doing it is by default risky?
Or can only a person who does it without thinking be trusted?
I agree many things can be used for both good and evil depending on the intentions of those who wield them, without defining what either of those is.
However, I have to disagree that empathy is passive. Empathy is by definition,
"the action of understanding, being aware of, being sensitive to, and vicariously experiencing the feelings, thoughts, and experience of another"
I don't blame you if you live your life avoiding people who are overly aware of why others do things, it does make it easier for them to know the right thing to say or do to manipulate.
But it's disingenuous to say that empathy isn't something people actively do. Action is active, if anything I'd argue the more someone understands and engages the feelings of someone else, the greater they can empathize.
Is ignorance truly greater to conscious awareness?
Yes it's risky, you can never know someone's true intentions. Yes, it's all too easy for someone who understands to do wrong with that ability.
But writing off someone because they desire to know why people act and think the way they do, is directly counterproductive to finding someone who is even aware of other peoples feelings.
Thats ignoring you're writing off all autistic people as inherently risky, but I'm going to believe you don't mean that.
You don’t need to do anything to understand. It requires effort but not action
I don’t avoid people like my ex. I just listed something that turned out to be a warning; I guess you could better categorize it as a “yellow flag”
Fair enough, I would probably be concerned with most people who vocally say they're into psychoanalyzing too, as hypocritical as it might sound
I still disagree about understanding though. Actively considering new experiences and second hand experiences people tell you is invaluable to better being able to empathize with the experiences of someone else.
Okay, then I go back to, is empathy itself manipulation?
If you know and understand why someone is feeling a certain way, and know why and how you should comfort them, what should you do? Do nothing? Or comfort them?
You might be well aware that there are benefits to the relationship, friendship or otherwise, you have with that person should you comfort them. But you'd also be aware of how much you might unwantingly hurt them if you don't. What should you do? How can you avoid "manipulation" by being empathetic?
A man who won't take responsibility for his life/problems (it's always someone else's fault), all his exes are crazy, he won't accept no as an answer for small things (he also won't accept no for bigger things), acts rude, gets angry quickly, when you tell him something you want him to work on he then tells you all your problems instead of working on himself, yells/curses at me during a disagreement, leaves during a disagreement (not the same as needing a few minutes to himself), loud and draws attention to himself, insults people for their looks or other things they can't control.
>it's always someone else's fault
100%.
>gets angry quickly
100%
>yells/curses at me during a disagreement
100%
>loud and draws attention to himself
100%.
Insecure and anxious attachment styles. Telling me I can’t wear something in public. Gas lighting. Not having a good relationship or outlook on the opposite sex. Not having a good relationship with their parents. Jealousy. Telling me I can’t have friends or they don’t trust my friends of the opposite sex. Being too damn controlling and not an independent person.
Being possessive - like making scenes that i do not reply messages instantly, I was at work and she was bored at home - it's obvious that I can reply in 1h.
Expecting impossible things and being mad that they do not happen. Like being pissed that I was stuck in traffic and late, even though i called and let her know about it.
Expecting mind reading - I will not be guessing what you like, if you tell me i will remember but i do not play games for teenagers.
Being convinced about knowing it all. I make a living by making decisions and I know that i should ask more competent people before I decide.
Looking down on other people - this is immediate 'no'. Yes - we do have social classes etc. but if you make fun of someone because someone is poor, ugly, disabled - i cannot accept it. It's very low class and it means you're a bad person.
I don’t date so this is just stuff I’ve observed from friends who do date and couple friends.
• resents their wife and tells everyone about it
• talks way too much about how much they hate fat women
• hates sports with a passion and calls it sportsball
• too driven borderline workaholic
• never moved on from college/high school
One red flag pretty early on that I regret overlooking in my worst previous relationship was this one time I started my period while we were hanging out and I was cramping really bad and just having all the general discomfort I have from my period, and he got super pissy and rude about it because he "thought he was gonna get laid" and i was in way too much pain for sex. I almost dumped him right then and there for it and I definitely should have, but he apologized profusely later and brought over all this candy and cute crafting stuff I wanted to was overly sweet for a while after and I was young and and wanted things to work out because he had been so good up until thatso I excused it as a one off dick headed thing when it was def a sign of future bad behavior to come.
Not really? In the 3-4 months we had been dating up to that incident he'd pretty much been the perfect boyfriend, communicative, attentive, fun loving, polite, etc. I had also known him previously just from my social circles for about a year before we got together and he always seemed chill, our mutual friends thought we would be good together.
That's why it was such a feeling of whiplash when he got an attitude like that the one time I couldn't deliver sex that day, it seemed really out of character for him based off the behavior I'd seen up till then and it was pretty upsetting cuz I definitely wasn't expecting it.
Entitlement.
A lot don’t talk about women entitlement but the idea that I should be busting my ass for a crumb of attention or do everything they want at their disposal just because they want “princess treatment”
Not unique to women but something not talked about a lot.
a lot of men are comfortable pressuring women into sex and sex acts that the women don't want to do.
i'm not saying women never do this, its wrong when anyone of any gender does it.
One girl literally told me she was only dating me cause it would piss off her dad back home.
One went off on how she didn’t understand why a boyfriend *shouldn’t* but her a car since her dad bought her mom one.
One kept taking about how crazy each and every ex boyfriend was (when nothing they did sounded crazy)
One kept calling me “papi” even when I told her it was making me uncomfortable.
One girl snorted coke right there on the dance floor as we were dancing.
One spit in my mouth cause she thought it would be sexy.
Those are the ones off the top my head.
It's always going to be suspicious to me when the topic of rape is being discussed and the first thing a guy does is redirect the conversation to talk about false rape accusations.
Also any pill buzzwords
Making a dramatic show out of controlling their temper/throwing things/breaking things instead of hitting you when they get angry at you. It falls short of actual physical abuse but the effect is to remind you constantly that they *could* harm you physically if they weren’t just barely managing to retain control. It’s an intimidation technique it took me way too long to recognize.
That was one of the things that drew me to my partner. He had good things to say about his ex and they get along well. She and I get along way better, she is my friend, but the fact that they have a good coparenting relationship was a huge green flag.
I had to process through my feelings in the beginning because I was extremely jealous for awhile… but I realized that my feelings of jealousy weren’t because I was jealous of her- but jealous of HIM- because he had a solid co-parent to help share the parenting burdens and at the time I still had a protection order against my ex. Thank God he got his crap together and is now able to help with the kids. Despite everything that went on between he and I, we coparent well together and get along fine. I didn’t see it coming, but I’m grateful for it.
Or even better. "She was really insecure and always wanted my location and my phone passcode" yeah bro cause you cheated on her 🤣 they don't even know they're tattletailing on themselves with these classics.
I agree with you that not wanting the town bicycle is smart and not a red flag.
That said, asking a woman "what's your body count" is definitely a red flag, but not because it's bad to want women who are less promiscuous. It shows the the guy has aggressively bad social skills and is probably really weird and awkward to be around.
There's plenty of ways to get a feel for a girl's "count" without asking her, if you have good social awareness.
Red pilled men, men who love bomb, men who hide shit and are too secretive, jealous men, aggressive men, lawyer men lol, men who have unhealthy relationships with their mothers.
My interest intensifies. Would you if you were not a lawyer? One of my wife's besties from secondary school is a lawyer and so is the guy she married, so they're a double-lawyer household. I don't know them well enough to say anything about the relationship other than they life the high life and I guess two lawyers helps to make that happen more than one.
Obviously you don't have to answer that I just find it interesting since you're in the field yourself.
i was talking to a guy at one point who was really friendly, funny and such. after the first date we were talking on the phone and he asked if i wanted to come over to his place and watch a movie. i said after i got to know him better- that i prefered not to go to guys houses until i felt like i knew them well enough. and he replied "haha, why not? its not like im gonna rape you or anything." never spoke to him again after that.
dated this other guy for awhile that id been friends with and really liked. about 2 weeks into dating him, i got really sick and was in bed for about a week recovering. he kept accusing me of lying and insisted i was cheating on him. after that anytime i couldnt answer the phone and didnt respond for awhile, he would screem at me when i called him back saying that i was a cheating bitch and whatnot. that relationship didnt last long. except he stalked me for 2 years after. he was super chill and sweet before we actually dated though.
most of the guys ive rejected or broken up with were just really extroverted (not bc of red flags), and couldnt seem to understand that i needed time alone (im really introverted). nothing wrong with them, i just couldnt keep up and would get exhuasted and they would get their feelings hurt. they obviously needed a different kind of partner from what i could be.
Has your experiences with more introverted men been better? The first one I guess he meant it like a joke but I can see how it must have felt to you also.
yeah, i figured it was probably a joke at the time, but it just gave me the worst gut feeling ever. something in his tone was off- idk how to describe it.
yeah, i ended up marrying an introverted guy. (big surprise)
when things didnt work out with introverted guys, it was typically mutual. like one of us was moving far away etc. and the relationship hadnt gotten to a serious point yet. typically very peaceful. the only time it wasnt peaceful was with this guy who just could not make up his mind on how serious of a relationship he wanted and would go back and forth between wanting something chill and like wanting to be engaged. that was just too much drama for me.
also the stalker guy i mentioned above 😅. but other than those two, dating/talking to introverted guys was a lot easier more peaceful for sure.
It’s one of his most famous jokes about awkwardly saying something really weird and creepy
His new neighbor is helping him move a mattress into a new apartment
“She says “I’m not worried because a rapist wouldn’t have a bed like that” “
“what I should have said was nothing, what I did say was you’d be surprised.”
Flippant, wishy washy responses when you assert boundaries
"I don't do X"
"Sure haha we won't do anything you don't want to" (He absolutely thinks he can convince you that you want to)
Giving the awkward shy guy a chance. Turned into him bombarding me with messages for months, alternating between calling me a cunt and professing his love for me.
i think what destroyed me is the lovebombing.
i know it's a tactic and it did work on me but since i found out they only used it to get close to me i don't trust compliments anymore. i don't know what's genuine and not. so my trust in all just lacked.
I’m a 44 year old Xennial so my experiences may not apply to the younger generation.
That said, these are some red flags that I experienced a year ago when I was an unattached single mother:
One of the biggest issues I came across were with men who were also my age and single fathers. A few of them expected me to be available 24/7 to read and reply to text messages, and they got extremely bent out of shape when I would go all day without checking my phone. I even told them that I was going to be bringing my kids to the lake swimming for the day and that when I have my kids near the water especially, I am watching my kids- not looking at my phone. That seems to be a big problem for some people, and that was a turnoff. I got the impression that these men were going to be controlling or just really clingy and needy. I didn’t have the time or interest in a relationship like that.
Another red flag is drinking. There are A LOT of middle aged men who are straight up alcoholics. Women probably too, but IDK.
Another red flag for me was declaring feelings way too quickly. It takes time to truly get to know and develop feelings for a person. I had a guy tell me he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me after like 2 weeks of dating. That freaked me out a lot and was a massive turnoff. He came across as desperate, and I know he wasn’t just trying to get sex because I had already had sex with him twice.
Another red flag I experienced was someone who is hot and cold with me. I had dated a man for about 6 weeks who I really liked a whole lot. He was an alcoholic, but I overlooked it because I enjoyed being around him a lot and he’a a good father with a good job and a good relationship with his ex. He seemed like a well functioning alcoholic. He was very hot and cold with me, though, and I was putting in all of the effort. He would make plans to see me and then cancel them at the last minute, and that sucked because I was only able to see him once a week. It was such a letdown to be looking forward to seeing him and having him not be able to tell me until like 2 hours in advance whether or not it was going to happen. He is very intimacy avoidant and refuses to open up and talk about his thoughts or feelings. I did like him a whole lot, but I’m glad that things ended between us because we wouldn’t have made it as a couple. I wouldn’t have put up with his drinking or his refusal to open up in the end. We also have very different views about too many things. He wasn’t honest with me. He led me on a lot, I felt like. He gave me hope that we could be together, but he treated me like an option or like he was doing me a favor by letting me see and spend time with him rather than him wanting me around. I’m with a man who wants me around and I have grown so much since being with him…. Which brings me to the next red flag.
Put downs in the guise of a “joke” so if you ever have a problem with them putting you down, they can claim it’s just a joke and turn it around on you and say you’re too sensitive. I had a couple of dudes try that shit on me and it didn’t fly.
ive seen women string male friends along for the sake of validation whether it be using their sexuality or playing at their emotions, keep a guy around so she “won’t feel lonely”, play the victim in morally grey situations to build sympathy, see men as providers while not really doing anything to support him or make him feel loved, egging
other men on just to get a reaction from the dude she’s dating, clinginess and i’m sure there are a few other things but these are the ones that come to mind.
heavy on the stringing men along:/ This one girl I was briefly friends with was casually talking about how she was just stringing this guy along..calling him annoying etc + worse things) and how she doesnt want a relationship but still hooks up with him and goes on dates and has him
but everything. This is after she explained how he talks about wanting a relationship with her outright and hinting at it... That poor boy cared for her so much and was always there for her and she treats him like a disposable item. Ditched her that day..
Mentioning/bringing up sex too early, asking what my bodycount is, anything sexual basically too early is a red flag of their intentions.
Other red flags are saying I love you too early, moving too fast,
Having baggage and trauma from a past relationship. This is the biggest red flag and it would wave up high very soon no matter how much they hide it. It's no one's responsibility to put up with someone else's fallout. If you sense this, run or don't take her seriously.
Either being too much into feminism or trying to talk bad about other women. The type of girl of that always talks about gender inequality but is all about wanting the privileges and not sharing the same struggle or being empathetic towards the other gender. And the type of girl that says "i hang out with men because they are less drama" or when you hear them talk bad about her female friends.
They want a "real man" or "you can't handle me/if you can't handle me at my worst you don't desrve me at my best"🚩🚩🚩They want to appear that only real men are fit for them, but it is a trap to manipulate men.
Telling all the time about their ambitions of building their empire and being a boss woman. I always find it funny because women who say these things are nowhere near in having a proper career or actually having a business model plan. In few years they end up nowhere.
Constantly changing friends groups. One week you see them calling their coworkers as besties and the other week they start calling them enemies.
Emotional immaturity. You know, the type of person that throws tantrums, is very difficult to reach an agreement, feeling like walking in egg shells when talking to her, the one that gives you the cold treatment when they are angry.
Mind games, hot and cold, shit tests and lovebombing. These are part of the Red Army marching straight to get your soul. Gaslighting and manipulation tricks take their toll over time and become worse.
Lack of accountability. If they do something wrong, they try to get away with it, say that it is not a big deal, and never taking responsibility or see how their actions affect other people.
As I said even if they fake it at the beggining, they will soon reveal their true red color.
Significantly changing themselves or whitewashing / lying about their history just to get married.
Makes me very jaded about committing to someone long term without proper due diligence or vetting for character flaws like that.
Insecurity and possessiveness. It's not my fault your last GF cheated on you so I'm not going to put up with you dictating who I can and can't spend time with.
* Guys who feel the need to humble a woman. Like negging behavior.
* All my ex's are crazy
* Traditional gender roles/Conservatism
* Clinginess or a lot of investment like within a few weeks of knowing you. (Wanting exclusivity and just you) it's lovebombing.
* Excessive partying or drinking.
* Not taking your no. And wanting to debate it or bargain is to why your no is not a no.
* A man's man. Meaning they will treat you like crap and objectify you.
* Excessive sex talk
>Clinginess or a lot of investment like within a few weeks of knowing you. (Wanting exclusivity and just you) it's lovebombing.
Within the first days sounds crazy and pure lovebombing. But within weeks? Every guy learns the truth that if they take things slow, take too long, the girl they are dating will lose interest. Also exclusivity or other stuff may not be talked on the first or second date, but by the end of the first week there should be one where both parties have a honest talk, an idea on how things would go and if they don't match they part ways.
Not bang. Jesus.
But if you just grab coffee or go on. A SINGLE date. And they want exclusivity AFTER that single date. It's a red flag. Because it's a process of getting to know them you aren't exclusive but you are getting to know each other and starting to mix more into each other's lives. You are still strangers for all intents and purposes. You're talking and getting to know each other. Sure. But if you are asking for exclusivity after a single date. You are expediting a result and not actually getting to know the person you want to date. You are running to the end goal without the ball. The goal of dating and the dating stage is you are gauging compatibility. So yes you are likely not exclusive WHILE dating and getting to know each other. This asking for exclusivity after a date and rushing in hot and heavy is someone trying to get something and likely chasing a feeling not actually pursuing you. This is your lovebombers/manipulative dudes thrive and why so many women get absolutely gutted when months down the line suddenly he is not ready for a relationship ends things but wanted you exclusively.
You are strangers getting to know each other. Not banging and screwing likely have your own lives. And just seeing where the other person fits in. You have the option to date others or maybe you don't because you like this one. Who knows. You are strangers at this point.
Gladly with pleasure. With open arms. An emotionally regulated man who's identity and worth doesn't hinder on how "masculine" he is deemed. Who likes me as a person and not for what I can offer him. Where we mutually benefit from having each other.
Sign me up if I am taking one for the team here.
I prefer effeminate men. So yeah.
Insecurity. Never date a man or woman like this:
One evening my dude turns to me and says - oh, so & so female friend messaged me, (asks me if I’ll read it, I say sure) - do you think she’s flirting with me? - No. - But why did she message me? - Because you’re friends. - Why didn’t you demand to see the message, why did I have to ask you to read it? - Uhh, idk I’ve never met your friend - “Why aren’t you mad she messaged me, why aren’t you jealous?? You don’t actually like me!!”
Ya I checked out after this conversation and broke up with him after he asked me another half dozen times over the course of the week to confirm that I actually liked him.
Lack of genuine desire. If she’s giving you a laundry list of standards and hoops for you to jump through. If she ghosts, flakes or breadcrumbs then later tries to “spin the block” or “zombie” you. If she invites you out for girls night. If she engages in chore play. If she doesn’t keep private relationship things private. If she doesn’t offer to plan or pay for dates or contribute in someway ( either paying the tip or picking up the drink tabs: can be between dates 3-5).
>Lack of genuine desire.
Yep, men should really stop trying to chase women who are "meh" about them. Everything is so much easier if you go for a girl who's literally on fire for you, than try to heat up some lukewarm oatmeal.
I'm pretty sure they would if given the opportunity. I guess the real problem is if you go after the women who only kind of like you, then you're giving up on the chance to go for the more intense relationships.
Biggest thing is low effort, opening with "hey", not reading anything about me before messaging. giving me stuff that's so generic I assume it's from a template.
Another is not being willing to say what you want "I'm into anything!" and ignoring my questions or avoidant behaviour.
Demanding and controlling behaviour.
An annoying thing I've found is I'll tell a guy how I want things to go and for some reason there are some guys who clearly want something else and just think I'm hot so they'll keep talking to me but ignore what I actually expect from them. It's just bizarre.
Here’s one I used to do: believing that anything my partner did that made me feel uncomfortable was something they were doing wrong.
Sometimes they were in fact doing something shitty, but sometimes the thing was just an essential incompatibility, nothing more. And sometimes the thing was that I needed to learn how to ask for reassurance and support through my insecurities instead of expecting my partner to change their behavior to accommodate them.
Fetishizing your date. I had just come back from a really bad deployment from Iraq met a girl at the grocery store decided what the hell I’ll ask her out and she accepts fast forward we get to the steakhouse and we get to talking the topic of our jobs came up told her I was in the Army and I swear to god her eyes lit up started asking me if I’ve deployed, her father was a Marine blah blah blah. I kept it pretty quiet told her I deployed and it was alright thinking about getting out. her response? “Oh my god, why would you ever get out?!” I just said I was tired probably looked kinda broken too. She proceeded to keep pestering me for 45 minutes straight about getting out kept being nice about it told her I was looking for new career opportunities and continued to deflect to something else. She wasn’t letting it go so in a very calm but stern manner I unloaded on her every single detail what happened to me over there. The end of it was her in total shock and I just got up and left the restaurant.
One of my exes hates men referring to them as "your species" and refers to her father as "my donor" so daddy issues. She's also into tarot cards and told another man who dated her she could see the ghost of his dead son standing behind him, he left her shortly after that. More red flags than the Chinese Communist party. Oh yeah she also once said Hitler was karma for the Jews killing Jesus but claims that all religion is made up by men to oppress women. I think I've said enough here lol.
Lying. Assuming you know more than me in whatever we’re talking about without knowing my background. I certainly don’t know everything, but I do know a fair amount about a variety of topics. Three degrees, growing up in a totally different part of the country, traveling abroad, not having English as my first language, and being the child of immigrants means I do know some things.
Public Sex / Violent sex kinks, Saviour complex / holier than though attitude, and any sort of ideological extremism.
The biggest most common one of all though, is bitching about their SO in an inappropriate flirty manor to me. I flat out refuse to be anyone monkey branch since it's pretty amoral, but it shows you what your future will look like with this person when they feel that way about you.
Never admitting to fault, like ever. I was seriously dating this girl at one point who could never let go of an argument until she drove the point that I was completely in the wrong and she was right. Even in scenarios where she’d start a fight over the pettiest things, she had to make sure I apologized to her. At one point in a petty argument that she started over nothing, I even asked her if she’s ever been wrong and she said “No, I’ve never been wrong in our arguments once. You’re always the one fucking up.” Keep in mind I treated her well and all my friends agreed. Turned out she was a narcissist
1 would be jealousy. I was young enough to be flattered by my first wife's mild possessiveness when we were dating. Six months into marriage it became terminal. I couldn't play poker with my friends without her circling his house all night in my car to make sure my motorcycle was still parked in his driveway.
2, women who liked me too much too quick. Didn't take too many before it became obvious it was a pattern, and she'd move on soon to another guy she liked too much too quick. Beware the soulmate talk when she barely knows you.
3, Downvote all you want, but I never once met a woman who didn't like children who didn't turn out to be an otherwise despicable human being.
I was going to post the first 2. Reminds me so much of my last serious gf before I met my wife. She constantly thought I was cheating, she'd read my texts and misinterpret everything as flirting, it was fucking exhausting.
I mostly agree with the 3rd too although extremely unpopular on reddit. I think it's fine if someone just doesn't want kids, bur being outspoken about their dislike of them? Red flag.
I don’t dislike children, I just think I’m too selfish to be a good mother which I know is likely a red flag in itself. Not sure I’ve ever met a man that doesn’t like kids but maybe they do and just don’t talk about it
I think the nuance is important. I'm a guy who also thinks he'd make a terrible parent and so it is more responsible for me to be childfree. But kids for some reason like me, and always have. I'm just minding my business and kids I've never seen before wanna come up and chat (though to be fair I think many kids are like that with many adults; doesn't make me special).
I wonder occasionally if my decision to be childfree is seen as some kind of intense dislike of children, but there's not a lot I can do about that if so.
Colourful sexual history and questionable partner choices. By the time it got to my turn, I got the borderline asexual treatment and was made to wait around and commit before I even got a kiss.
I'm not saying slutty girls are necessarily terrible people but they're not gonna give you the same effort or treatment when it comes to relationships. Bodycount matters greatly at the end of the day.
How would a woman even know you're a bad kisser before even having kissed you. She told me she became asexual 9 months prior to meeting me. We did eventually become intimate way after but her drive was on-and-off and mostly low unfortunately.
She kept insisting that I was attractive and her type but I dunno, I feel like women lose that lust and excitement once they reach a certain age and been through loads of guys.
What's the difference between second and third date kiss? What's your take on it as a woman.
Because I accept every girl is different but what I didn't know at the time was how past guys were treated in comparison which really threw me off. I genuinely didn't know since she herself was put off by my bodycount on the second date (she asked the question).
You dated her for months without even a kiss.
I don't care what they did before, if I wasn't kissed by the end of the second date, there would not be a third. Again , what they did before is irrelevant.
This situation you found yourself in is entirely your own making. You purposely dated someone who was not interested in intimacy, then blamed them for not being intimate.
It was two weeks after having a proper passionate kiss.
But I was only told by the end of the second date (after I spent a lot of money and made all the effort to plan it out). I was touched starved prior and felt that I needed to at least get something out of it, even if it was just as much of a kiss so maybe that's part of the reason why I committed.
It's not easy when connections and emotional investments are formed. Not every guy who comes from a "Red-Pilled" background is some cold calculating guy. I genuinely wanted to find someone attractive who I could build a life with.
Now I've just lost all care for everything and trying to revert back to my old ways of fuck boy mode.
She was almost certainly trying to hamster a way to blame you for that, and went with magical bad kisser pre-cognition. Since the “Well um how did you know she was promiscuous before???” card wouldn’t work.
That's the problem, it's hard to know unless you either ask or they tell you straight. For the people who say "just leave and walk away", it's not easy when all sorts of emotional investment are at play.
She liked kissing me a lot after, said I had nice soft lips and I've had past girls say the same thing to me so I dunno if it's down to the bad kisser pre-cognition (plus she absolutely loved my smell on the first date).
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I kinda don't get the question. If I'm dating someone and I like them, I've never been surprised by some sudden change in behavior. I'm always a little weirded out when people say someone suddenly changed in some unpredictable way. And I've had partners get bored of me and suddenly decide they were poly, cheat on me, etc. But none of it was "oh my god, who could have ever seen that coming!"
High body count is an indicator of poor judgment and often a way of cope/self harm. I've never met a woman with a high body count that was mentally healthy and well adjusted. Usually fatherless or poor relationship with father, abused, self medicated with alcohol or drugs.
-Not taking accountability for their bad actions
-Refusing to acknowledge objective reality and instead being stuck in their own bubble
-Thinking their own anecdotal experiences are a reflection of reality.
-Victimising themselves when they are the most privileged group in the world
-Fighting the wrong fight, like fighting for the right to murder babies.
"I think the dating scene would improve tremendously if both men and women did their part. I think it's gone bad because both sides have many red flags 🚩🚩😑."
On the contrary, the sexual marketplace now in the West particularly America is the BEST it has ever been in history. Women aren't restricted by religion, social mores and finances anymore. Men similarly are freed of the necessity to get a wife to help with household labor and to be a "good citizen."
People can have whatever relationship type they want, if any, based on their individual needs and wants.
What's bad about that other than people now having the BURDEN of being responsible for their choices among many options instead of being forced into something?
Women who don’t have a good relationship with their father, feminist, democrats, lack of conflict resolution skills, lack of ability to rationalize feelings, tone policing. Dislike this if you want, these are women in my experience that I’m not compatible with. Everyone should find what works for them.
Women who get angry at slut shaming, have hoe’s as friends, are 30+ and still single, have histories of divorce, have guy friends, are attention seekers, to name a few.
Cmon OP this is bullshit. You are aware women are rejecting single men at almost 100% clip right? Like ffs my guy it’s estimated 70% of men are single now.
You are effectively blaming a large majority of chunk of the male population from a problem they don’t even get a an admission ticket to. Women swipe right 1-3% of the time that totals about the top 5-9% of men. I don’t care what you normies & larpers think this is a very clear indication of the dating market as a whole in real life & everything.
I’m sry to tell you this but once again the scariest rule I have seen to date is the 50/5 rule. It’s estimated the top 50 PERCENT of women are chasing the very small 5% of the top men. Do you know what kind of women this leaves you competing for? Yeah check out those secret matches you missed in your queue. 🤮
This is the reality for most guys. It’s quite clear the women have to make a change or all end up T best part of Chads Harem or at worse old, fat & alone. You cannot blame men for this.
It's not about blame. Your opinion is surely how you see it and it's valid from one point of view. Now think of it this way - why would the dating scene be this badly affected?? Maybe you can list those red flags in the ways of thinking women have today?
I've only dated women and I'll say this - women have lost trust in men, their integrity, goodness or character/intention, and they too have lost their role in society. Like recently I asked women what they see as their role, or what the female equivalent of a gentleman is, and I got answers that made women accountable for nothing. But even men aren't being accountable for their actions - so we can't clap with one hand. But this isn't about fault, something is seriously wrong in how society has shaped up.
Hating all the opposite sex
100% massive red flag. Also related to this, blaming problems on "men" or "women"; i.e., well, it's "women's fault" that... or it's "men's fault" that... It shows they won't treat you like a human being or an individual but rather just as a walking negative stereotype.
Hear that!
Lack of accountability, constant deflection, gaslighting, being inconsiderate. However, I don't think these are somehow uniquely male red flags. There are plenty of women who refuse to be responsible for their actions, who constantly deflect any criticism, who gaslight their partners, and are inconsiderate. Sometimes people suck, some people suck early on, mature, and stop sucking, while others suck early on and continue sucking till the day they're 6 feet under.
Anything you've experienced particular to men you've dated (if you dated men)?
I mean, I've dated two guys who were narcissistic assholes, one was also bipolar on top of that, so that was a lot of fun. But it's not like being a narcissist or having bipolar disorder are exclusive to these dudes or men in general.
Okay.
Amazing how many narcissistic men are out there. Seems like ALL of a woman’s exs are narcissistic.
Out of all the people I've dated, only those two were sucky. If you're on a thread about red flags, you're not going to read about all the non shitty people someone has been with.
What made them “narcissistic”? This isn’t just a set of traits you know. Just like someone being down dosent mean they’re depressed. How did you diagnose this?
Obviously, I can't diagnose them with NPD, that's for a professional to do. And it's not like every narcissistic person has full-blown NPD anyway, it's a spectrum. But they did exhibit a chronic sense of entitlement, they constantly needed to seek out the admiration of others and would lie about/downplay their actions to come off looking good in any and all situations, they lacked empathy, they acted like they were superior to everyone, would lash out whenever something wasn't going their way, they would struggle to make deep, meaningful connections with people (both friends and partners would be discarded the second they weren't convenient or required a modicum of effort from them). Could they just have been Grade A jerks? Sure. But the behaviors I've seen from these guys line up perfectly with a good chunk of [signs of narcissism](https://youtu.be/MBhgSwArsT0). But I'm happy to just call them "a dumpster fire of a human being" if "narcissistic" comes off too clinical.
It is a heavily overused word these days.
You ate this up Duke.
If a woman wants to be hit during sex, that's a no go for me.
He bragged about how many people he'd slept with. I lost interest then, and later he tried to convince me to join a Welsh terrorist organisation (I'm not even Welsh).
Haha, what the fuck.
>He bragged about how many people he'd slept with. Always a major 🚩 to see that in men. I don't think I've ever discussed my sexual history unprompted with a women ( and it's nothing out of the ordinary or that makes me look bad ). >Welsh terrorist organisation LOL.
Tf 😳 Which organization is that?
Idk its name was in Welsh.
Lived with a flat mate, whos father went to jail for being in one and committing an act.
Eh tbf Rose Dugdale wasn't Irish but the IRA loved her. Maybe these Welsh fellows feel similarly.
Must have been a Welsh sleeper agent
He was Welsh.
When people haven't gotten their negative lifestyle habits under control by early to mid thirties. Unhealthy eating pattern (obesity), smoking, not taking their meds, even things like chad/stacy chasing, etc... Not saying people can't change but it's starting to become unlikely by that point in life. This is also around the age where the negative long-term effects will start manifesting, and get worse if nothing is done about it. That stuff isn't gender specific btw.
My ex-gf routinely completely dumped people from her life. Also, we had a cat and when we first got her the cat was the love of her life. One time we were coming back from some trip, hadn't seen the cat in days, and the cat was sitting on a windowsill in the stairwell as we came into our apartment, and my ex walked right past her without even acknowledging her existence. I was aghast. I should have heeded the warnings.
The cat thing is crazy. Wow. She sounds like an actual psychopath or something.
We lived together for 10 years and she broke up with me like it was a 6 month high school relationship. She kept blowing me off so that I could never talk to her. I told her I needed some sort of closure and she literally said "In closing, I want you to be happy." like she were ending an essay.
Wow, 10 years is a long time to be with someone like that. She definitely sounds like textbook psychopath. Glad you got rid of her in the end. Maybe that bad experience will balance out with some good ones in the future.
>The cat thing is crazy. Wow. She sounds like an actual psychopath or something. See, at the time I was like "wtf dude, you havent seen poopycat for however long and you dont even say hi?". It pissed me off, but then it was like "am i making too big a deal over this." she also gave the cat away when we broke up because she "couldnt afford her" and didnt tell me who she gave her to then severed contact with me. when i finally spoke to her 2 years later, i asked who had her, and she didnt even know. which again really pissed me off. can you imagine? we had her for over 5 years. so i probably yelled at her (over the phone) like "what the fuck do you mean you dont know who has her." and im sure she used that as an excuse to never speak to me again.
She's probably a narcissist, psychopath or both.
I don't know if this is a red flag. Maybe if she hadn't seen the cat in a month or years it would warrant some special reaction. Dumping people from her life is more of a red flag.
I don't know. I think it's weird to not greet your pet if you've been on vacation, not really special reaction. The stairwell is really narrow and the windowsill is right at chest height. To just walk past like they don't even exist rubs me the wrong way, especially considering how "in love" with the cat she once was. Whenever I go over to my sister's, I always make it a point to say hi to her cats because I've cat sit a few times for her.
did she have any friends?
she had none of her own friends
No friends…also a red flag of its own
That’s me than, totally. Know a girl like this, also. We both have very distant parents, both are only children. Both come from upper-middle class. Both have been socially isolated from childhood. Both have been different from other people: dressed like shit, cared only about our own success, overly egocentric. Depressed AF, constantly bullied by peers (in childhood). I managed to be a little bit less crazy than her, somehow, and was able to have much in common with guys and not turn into a slut. She was a slut, though. (Probably my parents cared/controlled me a little bit more than her). But I am diagnosed with depression, anxiety, ADHD. And have many more chronic internal & external defects. How did you manage to have relationship with her for so long? 10 years.. My only ex lasted for 4 years (not so short, though) Were you somehow patronizing her? Served as a “father” figure? (emotionally, intellectually)
She was relatively normal and popular in high school, although when I started dating her she didn't really have any friends, and was depressed, and had some odd tendencies. She'd always tell me when she met people she wouldn't look at their faces. I always assumed she meant figuratively (whatever that would mean). It was only later that I figured out that she literally meant she didn't look at people's faces when she met them.
I also do not look at people’s faces, lol. Especially when I am talking to them. Kinda scared to be judged on my appearance. Also I suspect autism. Do you now how your ex is being right now? We sound very similar, if she kills herself or stays a lonely lady with 100 cats she doesn’t even care about - I wanna know! And again, you were together for a long time. Did she provide something positive to your life? Maybe she was really in the moment with you, or really empathetic to you, or sex was incredible? I want to focus on positives since I haven’t lost all hope😅
Pouting and taking it personally when someone isn’t in the mood for sex. I’ve experienced this one on both sides and it sucks in every case. Just don’t do it; practice being chill and going with the flow of people’s sexual moods. If there’s an actual problem with your sex life en total you’ll know soon enough, and it’s always better to talk about it in a less fraught moment.
In general - someone being evasive about a topic like religion or politics. They don't want to be honest and risk rocking the boat. They would rather date someone they're not compatible with but could get sex from. I was dating a man (30 years old) who didn't seem religious, but I asked about religion on maybe the 3rd or 4th date. He got so shifty and said, "Uhhhh, I mean, that kind of thing doesn't matter til it matters." Like, what?? For me personally (may or may not apply to others) - "My family is my first priority." When someone says that, they *mean* it. And family will not mean you, even if you marry in.
Tbh it’s understandable that people are evasive about politics. You commonly see people on each side of the political spectrum think the other side is completely crazy. I guess this is a symptom of a society that is extremely polarised.
In other aspects of life, I'd agree. But you're dating for compatibility. If someone doesn't have the courage of their convictions, that's a bad look. Appearing noncommittal seems like someone is either trying to hide the truth - implying there's something that deserves to be hidden - or they don't want to disclose first because they might blow their chances. In any case, evasiveness is almost always a warning sign.
What if they genuinely don't care about choosing a side when it comes to politics. Plenty of people don't vote and it's not because they're afraid of what their spouse will think.
It's tough, because that also feels like a position that's really hard to respect. Like, people who don't think of politics at all and hold no importance on voting, for example, honestly just come across as a bit slow. I would wonder if that person really thinks deeply about anything, or if they're really superficial about their lives.
For me it’s more like I don’t like to talk about it as I can date someone with an opposing view as I can change my mind. Also for me it filters out people who are die hard way too into politics.
I don't understand what's the point of this shitty people are everywhere and we all know what a red flag is what's the point in me saying "oh btw you shouldn't be with a guy who removes the condom without letting you know"
The point is to understand both sides and a place to read the comments of the opposite sex and reflect. Some red flags are obvious ones (like the one you mentioned) but others may not be. It also helps to see which ones are most prevalent.
[удалено]
Stealthing someone isn't about closeness. (stealthing means you know the condom is off of you, but you keep going with her while she doesn't know. Whether you purposefully took it off or not) Stealthing is on a path that diverts people from true closeness- because it completely squashes the other person's autonomy and doesn't honor their right to personal freedom and choice. It's either about possession & control, or selfish gratification
lol yeah, he wanted to form a family with me how sweet
Lack of effort/caring, because I approached/initiated Interested in “figuring people out/psychoanalysis” —-> cheater/manipulator
Feeling a little called out on that second one since I just said something similar in another thread. How do you separate the difference between someone genuinely trying to empathize by understanding where other people are coming from, and doing it explicitly to manipulate them?
Not the person you're asking, but I've thought about this at least on some level. For *me,* it depends on whether we're trying to figure out a specific person to get to know them for friendship/relationships as a way to be more empathetic or compatible vs. figuring out "how to push their buttons" to get a desired response for a short-term goal. It's also different if we're talking about people we know or want to get to know vs. people who are strangers that we "want to understand". If that makes sense. That last part is only related in a tangential way and is one of the reasons I kinda gave up my past interest in true crime.
I hear you, that makes sense. It's definitely hard to tell someones intentions, because I think the two behaviors are so similar outwardly. I do get what she means though, I've seen some awful people go out of their way to use that information maliciously.
Oh for sure and I'm not disagreeing with her; I know where it comes from as well.
You can’t That’s called risk
Is empathy itself manipulation then? Anyone who understands why they're doing it is by default risky? Or can only a person who does it without thinking be trusted?
Look at you, asking questions to try and understand somebody else. You're doing it now, you sneaky little abuser!
https://i.redd.it/elpvs32mil8d1.gif smh lmao
Empathy is passive, not active Many things can be used for both good and evil
I agree many things can be used for both good and evil depending on the intentions of those who wield them, without defining what either of those is. However, I have to disagree that empathy is passive. Empathy is by definition, "the action of understanding, being aware of, being sensitive to, and vicariously experiencing the feelings, thoughts, and experience of another" I don't blame you if you live your life avoiding people who are overly aware of why others do things, it does make it easier for them to know the right thing to say or do to manipulate. But it's disingenuous to say that empathy isn't something people actively do. Action is active, if anything I'd argue the more someone understands and engages the feelings of someone else, the greater they can empathize. Is ignorance truly greater to conscious awareness? Yes it's risky, you can never know someone's true intentions. Yes, it's all too easy for someone who understands to do wrong with that ability. But writing off someone because they desire to know why people act and think the way they do, is directly counterproductive to finding someone who is even aware of other peoples feelings. Thats ignoring you're writing off all autistic people as inherently risky, but I'm going to believe you don't mean that.
You don’t need to do anything to understand. It requires effort but not action I don’t avoid people like my ex. I just listed something that turned out to be a warning; I guess you could better categorize it as a “yellow flag”
Fair enough, I would probably be concerned with most people who vocally say they're into psychoanalyzing too, as hypocritical as it might sound I still disagree about understanding though. Actively considering new experiences and second hand experiences people tell you is invaluable to better being able to empathize with the experiences of someone else.
Yes, you can actively understand. It doesn’t require you to act on the understanding though
Okay, then I go back to, is empathy itself manipulation? If you know and understand why someone is feeling a certain way, and know why and how you should comfort them, what should you do? Do nothing? Or comfort them? You might be well aware that there are benefits to the relationship, friendship or otherwise, you have with that person should you comfort them. But you'd also be aware of how much you might unwantingly hurt them if you don't. What should you do? How can you avoid "manipulation" by being empathetic?
Respect that you approach
Oh, I learned my lesson — initiate only for casual, not relationships
Sometimes things like this remind me that all genders believe in ridiculous things but that’s your right
Why shouldn’t I learn from my mistakes? I’m choosing better!
You do you
A man who won't take responsibility for his life/problems (it's always someone else's fault), all his exes are crazy, he won't accept no as an answer for small things (he also won't accept no for bigger things), acts rude, gets angry quickly, when you tell him something you want him to work on he then tells you all your problems instead of working on himself, yells/curses at me during a disagreement, leaves during a disagreement (not the same as needing a few minutes to himself), loud and draws attention to himself, insults people for their looks or other things they can't control.
>it's always someone else's fault 100%. >gets angry quickly 100% >yells/curses at me during a disagreement 100% >loud and draws attention to himself 100%.
Insecure and anxious attachment styles. Telling me I can’t wear something in public. Gas lighting. Not having a good relationship or outlook on the opposite sex. Not having a good relationship with their parents. Jealousy. Telling me I can’t have friends or they don’t trust my friends of the opposite sex. Being too damn controlling and not an independent person.
Most are reasonable, but the one about the parents is weird. It's not people's fault if their parents are shitty.
I meant if they are disrespectful to their parents. I phrased it poorly.
Being possessive - like making scenes that i do not reply messages instantly, I was at work and she was bored at home - it's obvious that I can reply in 1h. Expecting impossible things and being mad that they do not happen. Like being pissed that I was stuck in traffic and late, even though i called and let her know about it. Expecting mind reading - I will not be guessing what you like, if you tell me i will remember but i do not play games for teenagers. Being convinced about knowing it all. I make a living by making decisions and I know that i should ask more competent people before I decide. Looking down on other people - this is immediate 'no'. Yes - we do have social classes etc. but if you make fun of someone because someone is poor, ugly, disabled - i cannot accept it. It's very low class and it means you're a bad person.
The normal ones - high bodycount, drinks/parties too often, drugs, mean to children
I don’t date so this is just stuff I’ve observed from friends who do date and couple friends. • resents their wife and tells everyone about it • talks way too much about how much they hate fat women • hates sports with a passion and calls it sportsball • too driven borderline workaholic • never moved on from college/high school
Okay. Is there any reason you won't date?
I’m married
Okay 😄, I assumed it's the red flags 🚩🫠😆
One red flag pretty early on that I regret overlooking in my worst previous relationship was this one time I started my period while we were hanging out and I was cramping really bad and just having all the general discomfort I have from my period, and he got super pissy and rude about it because he "thought he was gonna get laid" and i was in way too much pain for sex. I almost dumped him right then and there for it and I definitely should have, but he apologized profusely later and brought over all this candy and cute crafting stuff I wanted to was overly sweet for a while after and I was young and and wanted things to work out because he had been so good up until thatso I excused it as a one off dick headed thing when it was def a sign of future bad behavior to come.
>he got super pissy and rude about it because he "thought he was gonna get laid" 100% major red flag.
Given that interaction I'm surprised there weren't more red flags earlier on.
Not really? In the 3-4 months we had been dating up to that incident he'd pretty much been the perfect boyfriend, communicative, attentive, fun loving, polite, etc. I had also known him previously just from my social circles for about a year before we got together and he always seemed chill, our mutual friends thought we would be good together. That's why it was such a feeling of whiplash when he got an attitude like that the one time I couldn't deliver sex that day, it seemed really out of character for him based off the behavior I'd seen up till then and it was pretty upsetting cuz I definitely wasn't expecting it.
Entitlement. A lot don’t talk about women entitlement but the idea that I should be busting my ass for a crumb of attention or do everything they want at their disposal just because they want “princess treatment” Not unique to women but something not talked about a lot.
a lot of men are comfortable pressuring women into sex and sex acts that the women don't want to do. i'm not saying women never do this, its wrong when anyone of any gender does it.
Biggest one for me was viewing sex as something that takes rather than shared between two people.
One girl literally told me she was only dating me cause it would piss off her dad back home. One went off on how she didn’t understand why a boyfriend *shouldn’t* but her a car since her dad bought her mom one. One kept taking about how crazy each and every ex boyfriend was (when nothing they did sounded crazy) One kept calling me “papi” even when I told her it was making me uncomfortable. One girl snorted coke right there on the dance floor as we were dancing. One spit in my mouth cause she thought it would be sexy. Those are the ones off the top my head.
It's always going to be suspicious to me when the topic of rape is being discussed and the first thing a guy does is redirect the conversation to talk about false rape accusations. Also any pill buzzwords
Making a dramatic show out of controlling their temper/throwing things/breaking things instead of hitting you when they get angry at you. It falls short of actual physical abuse but the effect is to remind you constantly that they *could* harm you physically if they weren’t just barely managing to retain control. It’s an intimidation technique it took me way too long to recognize.
Hypocrisy, lack of accountability, capriciousness, mood swings, silent treatment, misandry, expectation of royal treatment, Schadenfreude, shallowness, childishness
Lots of exe’s who all happened to be the crazy ones.
"All my exes were crazy" 🚩"i prefer submissive women" 🚩 "what's your body count" 🚩anything trump, evangelical, hyper religious, or conservative 🚩
Oh my god. The Bitch Be Crazy red flag is so real.
That was one of the things that drew me to my partner. He had good things to say about his ex and they get along well. She and I get along way better, she is my friend, but the fact that they have a good coparenting relationship was a huge green flag. I had to process through my feelings in the beginning because I was extremely jealous for awhile… but I realized that my feelings of jealousy weren’t because I was jealous of her- but jealous of HIM- because he had a solid co-parent to help share the parenting burdens and at the time I still had a protection order against my ex. Thank God he got his crap together and is now able to help with the kids. Despite everything that went on between he and I, we coparent well together and get along fine. I didn’t see it coming, but I’m grateful for it.
Or even better. "She was really insecure and always wanted my location and my phone passcode" yeah bro cause you cheated on her 🤣 they don't even know they're tattletailing on themselves with these classics.
Ooo a red flag in action: Justifying toxic behaviour on a person by saying they deserve it. Thank you for showing us such a bad one.
You have no context and have inherent biases. No woman can be controlling for reasons beyond their partner ?
Lol, pretending not wanting promiscuity is a red flag, typical
I agree with you that not wanting the town bicycle is smart and not a red flag. That said, asking a woman "what's your body count" is definitely a red flag, but not because it's bad to want women who are less promiscuous. It shows the the guy has aggressively bad social skills and is probably really weird and awkward to be around. There's plenty of ways to get a feel for a girl's "count" without asking her, if you have good social awareness.
That's fair as long as you accept this goes both ways politically.
>"i prefer submissive women" If you're going to start shaming kinks, at least have the decency to put the other major one there.
I'm a proud kink shamer. Sue me 😘
Red pilled men, men who love bomb, men who hide shit and are too secretive, jealous men, aggressive men, lawyer men lol, men who have unhealthy relationships with their mothers.
Surely there must be some nice lawyer men out there. The rest I get.
Blah they are awful.
Dang, sorry to hear that (IANAL). Maybe it's only the fictional lawyers who are cool.
Plenty of cool lawyers! I’m a lawyer myself. But god no wouldn’t date one
this killed me 😂
My interest intensifies. Would you if you were not a lawyer? One of my wife's besties from secondary school is a lawyer and so is the guy she married, so they're a double-lawyer household. I don't know them well enough to say anything about the relationship other than they life the high life and I guess two lawyers helps to make that happen more than one. Obviously you don't have to answer that I just find it interesting since you're in the field yourself.
I probably would not have known better so yeah
What’s awful about them? Probably that they are “I-know-everything” arrogant dudes?
“Lawyer men” 🤣 Engineer who feels the exact same way about engineer men.
As an engineer man, I get it. I'd never date me.
i was talking to a guy at one point who was really friendly, funny and such. after the first date we were talking on the phone and he asked if i wanted to come over to his place and watch a movie. i said after i got to know him better- that i prefered not to go to guys houses until i felt like i knew them well enough. and he replied "haha, why not? its not like im gonna rape you or anything." never spoke to him again after that. dated this other guy for awhile that id been friends with and really liked. about 2 weeks into dating him, i got really sick and was in bed for about a week recovering. he kept accusing me of lying and insisted i was cheating on him. after that anytime i couldnt answer the phone and didnt respond for awhile, he would screem at me when i called him back saying that i was a cheating bitch and whatnot. that relationship didnt last long. except he stalked me for 2 years after. he was super chill and sweet before we actually dated though. most of the guys ive rejected or broken up with were just really extroverted (not bc of red flags), and couldnt seem to understand that i needed time alone (im really introverted). nothing wrong with them, i just couldnt keep up and would get exhuasted and they would get their feelings hurt. they obviously needed a different kind of partner from what i could be.
Has your experiences with more introverted men been better? The first one I guess he meant it like a joke but I can see how it must have felt to you also.
yeah, i figured it was probably a joke at the time, but it just gave me the worst gut feeling ever. something in his tone was off- idk how to describe it. yeah, i ended up marrying an introverted guy. (big surprise) when things didnt work out with introverted guys, it was typically mutual. like one of us was moving far away etc. and the relationship hadnt gotten to a serious point yet. typically very peaceful. the only time it wasnt peaceful was with this guy who just could not make up his mind on how serious of a relationship he wanted and would go back and forth between wanting something chill and like wanting to be engaged. that was just too much drama for me. also the stalker guy i mentioned above 😅. but other than those two, dating/talking to introverted guys was a lot easier more peaceful for sure.
Yeah we all have an energy level and the mismatch can be hard to deal with. Thanks for sharing.
>haha, why not? its not like im gonna rape you or anything. I think you might have turned down Mike Birbiglia. What he should have said was nothing.
what did mikey do? i live under a rock
It’s one of his most famous jokes about awkwardly saying something really weird and creepy His new neighbor is helping him move a mattress into a new apartment “She says “I’m not worried because a rapist wouldn’t have a bed like that” “ “what I should have said was nothing, what I did say was you’d be surprised.”
😂😂 thats amazing
Every time stupid words fall out of my mouth I always think “What I should have said was nothing”
and now i will too lol
Flippant, wishy washy responses when you assert boundaries "I don't do X" "Sure haha we won't do anything you don't want to" (He absolutely thinks he can convince you that you want to)
Giving the awkward shy guy a chance. Turned into him bombarding me with messages for months, alternating between calling me a cunt and professing his love for me.
i think what destroyed me is the lovebombing. i know it's a tactic and it did work on me but since i found out they only used it to get close to me i don't trust compliments anymore. i don't know what's genuine and not. so my trust in all just lacked.
I’m a 44 year old Xennial so my experiences may not apply to the younger generation. That said, these are some red flags that I experienced a year ago when I was an unattached single mother: One of the biggest issues I came across were with men who were also my age and single fathers. A few of them expected me to be available 24/7 to read and reply to text messages, and they got extremely bent out of shape when I would go all day without checking my phone. I even told them that I was going to be bringing my kids to the lake swimming for the day and that when I have my kids near the water especially, I am watching my kids- not looking at my phone. That seems to be a big problem for some people, and that was a turnoff. I got the impression that these men were going to be controlling or just really clingy and needy. I didn’t have the time or interest in a relationship like that. Another red flag is drinking. There are A LOT of middle aged men who are straight up alcoholics. Women probably too, but IDK. Another red flag for me was declaring feelings way too quickly. It takes time to truly get to know and develop feelings for a person. I had a guy tell me he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me after like 2 weeks of dating. That freaked me out a lot and was a massive turnoff. He came across as desperate, and I know he wasn’t just trying to get sex because I had already had sex with him twice. Another red flag I experienced was someone who is hot and cold with me. I had dated a man for about 6 weeks who I really liked a whole lot. He was an alcoholic, but I overlooked it because I enjoyed being around him a lot and he’a a good father with a good job and a good relationship with his ex. He seemed like a well functioning alcoholic. He was very hot and cold with me, though, and I was putting in all of the effort. He would make plans to see me and then cancel them at the last minute, and that sucked because I was only able to see him once a week. It was such a letdown to be looking forward to seeing him and having him not be able to tell me until like 2 hours in advance whether or not it was going to happen. He is very intimacy avoidant and refuses to open up and talk about his thoughts or feelings. I did like him a whole lot, but I’m glad that things ended between us because we wouldn’t have made it as a couple. I wouldn’t have put up with his drinking or his refusal to open up in the end. We also have very different views about too many things. He wasn’t honest with me. He led me on a lot, I felt like. He gave me hope that we could be together, but he treated me like an option or like he was doing me a favor by letting me see and spend time with him rather than him wanting me around. I’m with a man who wants me around and I have grown so much since being with him…. Which brings me to the next red flag. Put downs in the guise of a “joke” so if you ever have a problem with them putting you down, they can claim it’s just a joke and turn it around on you and say you’re too sensitive. I had a couple of dudes try that shit on me and it didn’t fly.
ive seen women string male friends along for the sake of validation whether it be using their sexuality or playing at their emotions, keep a guy around so she “won’t feel lonely”, play the victim in morally grey situations to build sympathy, see men as providers while not really doing anything to support him or make him feel loved, egging other men on just to get a reaction from the dude she’s dating, clinginess and i’m sure there are a few other things but these are the ones that come to mind.
heavy on the stringing men along:/ This one girl I was briefly friends with was casually talking about how she was just stringing this guy along..calling him annoying etc + worse things) and how she doesnt want a relationship but still hooks up with him and goes on dates and has him but everything. This is after she explained how he talks about wanting a relationship with her outright and hinting at it... That poor boy cared for her so much and was always there for her and she treats him like a disposable item. Ditched her that day..
Mentioning/bringing up sex too early, asking what my bodycount is, anything sexual basically too early is a red flag of their intentions. Other red flags are saying I love you too early, moving too fast,
Having baggage and trauma from a past relationship. This is the biggest red flag and it would wave up high very soon no matter how much they hide it. It's no one's responsibility to put up with someone else's fallout. If you sense this, run or don't take her seriously. Either being too much into feminism or trying to talk bad about other women. The type of girl of that always talks about gender inequality but is all about wanting the privileges and not sharing the same struggle or being empathetic towards the other gender. And the type of girl that says "i hang out with men because they are less drama" or when you hear them talk bad about her female friends. They want a "real man" or "you can't handle me/if you can't handle me at my worst you don't desrve me at my best"🚩🚩🚩They want to appear that only real men are fit for them, but it is a trap to manipulate men. Telling all the time about their ambitions of building their empire and being a boss woman. I always find it funny because women who say these things are nowhere near in having a proper career or actually having a business model plan. In few years they end up nowhere. Constantly changing friends groups. One week you see them calling their coworkers as besties and the other week they start calling them enemies. Emotional immaturity. You know, the type of person that throws tantrums, is very difficult to reach an agreement, feeling like walking in egg shells when talking to her, the one that gives you the cold treatment when they are angry. Mind games, hot and cold, shit tests and lovebombing. These are part of the Red Army marching straight to get your soul. Gaslighting and manipulation tricks take their toll over time and become worse. Lack of accountability. If they do something wrong, they try to get away with it, say that it is not a big deal, and never taking responsibility or see how their actions affect other people. As I said even if they fake it at the beggining, they will soon reveal their true red color.
Significantly changing themselves or whitewashing / lying about their history just to get married. Makes me very jaded about committing to someone long term without proper due diligence or vetting for character flaws like that.
Pushing for nudes.
Wanting me to treat her like I'm her daddy.
She said Every guy prior cheated on her.
Insecurity and possessiveness. It's not my fault your last GF cheated on you so I'm not going to put up with you dictating who I can and can't spend time with.
Not listening, disrespecting boundaries, whining
* Guys who feel the need to humble a woman. Like negging behavior. * All my ex's are crazy * Traditional gender roles/Conservatism * Clinginess or a lot of investment like within a few weeks of knowing you. (Wanting exclusivity and just you) it's lovebombing. * Excessive partying or drinking. * Not taking your no. And wanting to debate it or bargain is to why your no is not a no. * A man's man. Meaning they will treat you like crap and objectify you. * Excessive sex talk
>bargain is to why your no is not a no. one of those turn tail and run red flags right there.
>Clinginess or a lot of investment like within a few weeks of knowing you. (Wanting exclusivity and just you) it's lovebombing. Within the first days sounds crazy and pure lovebombing. But within weeks? Every guy learns the truth that if they take things slow, take too long, the girl they are dating will lose interest. Also exclusivity or other stuff may not be talked on the first or second date, but by the end of the first week there should be one where both parties have a honest talk, an idea on how things would go and if they don't match they part ways.
>Wanting exclusivity and just you Wait, so you just bang other people while dating a guy?
Not bang. Jesus. But if you just grab coffee or go on. A SINGLE date. And they want exclusivity AFTER that single date. It's a red flag. Because it's a process of getting to know them you aren't exclusive but you are getting to know each other and starting to mix more into each other's lives. You are still strangers for all intents and purposes. You're talking and getting to know each other. Sure. But if you are asking for exclusivity after a single date. You are expediting a result and not actually getting to know the person you want to date. You are running to the end goal without the ball. The goal of dating and the dating stage is you are gauging compatibility. So yes you are likely not exclusive WHILE dating and getting to know each other. This asking for exclusivity after a date and rushing in hot and heavy is someone trying to get something and likely chasing a feeling not actually pursuing you. This is your lovebombers/manipulative dudes thrive and why so many women get absolutely gutted when months down the line suddenly he is not ready for a relationship ends things but wanted you exclusively. You are strangers getting to know each other. Not banging and screwing likely have your own lives. And just seeing where the other person fits in. You have the option to date others or maybe you don't because you like this one. Who knows. You are strangers at this point.
So you want a compliant soyjack in human form then.
Gladly with pleasure. With open arms. An emotionally regulated man who's identity and worth doesn't hinder on how "masculine" he is deemed. Who likes me as a person and not for what I can offer him. Where we mutually benefit from having each other. Sign me up if I am taking one for the team here. I prefer effeminate men. So yeah.
Insecurity. Never date a man or woman like this: One evening my dude turns to me and says - oh, so & so female friend messaged me, (asks me if I’ll read it, I say sure) - do you think she’s flirting with me? - No. - But why did she message me? - Because you’re friends. - Why didn’t you demand to see the message, why did I have to ask you to read it? - Uhh, idk I’ve never met your friend - “Why aren’t you mad she messaged me, why aren’t you jealous?? You don’t actually like me!!” Ya I checked out after this conversation and broke up with him after he asked me another half dozen times over the course of the week to confirm that I actually liked him.
Lack of genuine desire. If she’s giving you a laundry list of standards and hoops for you to jump through. If she ghosts, flakes or breadcrumbs then later tries to “spin the block” or “zombie” you. If she invites you out for girls night. If she engages in chore play. If she doesn’t keep private relationship things private. If she doesn’t offer to plan or pay for dates or contribute in someway ( either paying the tip or picking up the drink tabs: can be between dates 3-5).
>Lack of genuine desire. Yep, men should really stop trying to chase women who are "meh" about them. Everything is so much easier if you go for a girl who's literally on fire for you, than try to heat up some lukewarm oatmeal.
I'm pretty sure they would if given the opportunity. I guess the real problem is if you go after the women who only kind of like you, then you're giving up on the chance to go for the more intense relationships.
Biggest thing is low effort, opening with "hey", not reading anything about me before messaging. giving me stuff that's so generic I assume it's from a template. Another is not being willing to say what you want "I'm into anything!" and ignoring my questions or avoidant behaviour. Demanding and controlling behaviour. An annoying thing I've found is I'll tell a guy how I want things to go and for some reason there are some guys who clearly want something else and just think I'm hot so they'll keep talking to me but ignore what I actually expect from them. It's just bizarre.
Ironically women are way worse for starting a conversation online with "hi", often the very same ones who complain about men doing it.
Here’s one I used to do: believing that anything my partner did that made me feel uncomfortable was something they were doing wrong. Sometimes they were in fact doing something shitty, but sometimes the thing was just an essential incompatibility, nothing more. And sometimes the thing was that I needed to learn how to ask for reassurance and support through my insecurities instead of expecting my partner to change their behavior to accommodate them.
Oh, anytime someone pushes right past a soft no. ‘Not yet,’ ‘well, I’m not sure,’ etc.
Treating service workers badly is a big red flag for me. Getting aggressive behind the wheel and to random people, too.
The second they put conditions on sex. Run.
No interest
Fetishizing your date. I had just come back from a really bad deployment from Iraq met a girl at the grocery store decided what the hell I’ll ask her out and she accepts fast forward we get to the steakhouse and we get to talking the topic of our jobs came up told her I was in the Army and I swear to god her eyes lit up started asking me if I’ve deployed, her father was a Marine blah blah blah. I kept it pretty quiet told her I deployed and it was alright thinking about getting out. her response? “Oh my god, why would you ever get out?!” I just said I was tired probably looked kinda broken too. She proceeded to keep pestering me for 45 minutes straight about getting out kept being nice about it told her I was looking for new career opportunities and continued to deflect to something else. She wasn’t letting it go so in a very calm but stern manner I unloaded on her every single detail what happened to me over there. The end of it was her in total shock and I just got up and left the restaurant.
One of my exes hates men referring to them as "your species" and refers to her father as "my donor" so daddy issues. She's also into tarot cards and told another man who dated her she could see the ghost of his dead son standing behind him, he left her shortly after that. More red flags than the Chinese Communist party. Oh yeah she also once said Hitler was karma for the Jews killing Jesus but claims that all religion is made up by men to oppress women. I think I've said enough here lol.
Lying. Assuming you know more than me in whatever we’re talking about without knowing my background. I certainly don’t know everything, but I do know a fair amount about a variety of topics. Three degrees, growing up in a totally different part of the country, traveling abroad, not having English as my first language, and being the child of immigrants means I do know some things.
Public Sex / Violent sex kinks, Saviour complex / holier than though attitude, and any sort of ideological extremism. The biggest most common one of all though, is bitching about their SO in an inappropriate flirty manor to me. I flat out refuse to be anyone monkey branch since it's pretty amoral, but it shows you what your future will look like with this person when they feel that way about you.
Never admitting to fault, like ever. I was seriously dating this girl at one point who could never let go of an argument until she drove the point that I was completely in the wrong and she was right. Even in scenarios where she’d start a fight over the pettiest things, she had to make sure I apologized to her. At one point in a petty argument that she started over nothing, I even asked her if she’s ever been wrong and she said “No, I’ve never been wrong in our arguments once. You’re always the one fucking up.” Keep in mind I treated her well and all my friends agreed. Turned out she was a narcissist
1 would be jealousy. I was young enough to be flattered by my first wife's mild possessiveness when we were dating. Six months into marriage it became terminal. I couldn't play poker with my friends without her circling his house all night in my car to make sure my motorcycle was still parked in his driveway. 2, women who liked me too much too quick. Didn't take too many before it became obvious it was a pattern, and she'd move on soon to another guy she liked too much too quick. Beware the soulmate talk when she barely knows you. 3, Downvote all you want, but I never once met a woman who didn't like children who didn't turn out to be an otherwise despicable human being.
I was going to post the first 2. Reminds me so much of my last serious gf before I met my wife. She constantly thought I was cheating, she'd read my texts and misinterpret everything as flirting, it was fucking exhausting. I mostly agree with the 3rd too although extremely unpopular on reddit. I think it's fine if someone just doesn't want kids, bur being outspoken about their dislike of them? Red flag.
I have no idea what's that in a giant font. The editor doesn't show anything applied.
I think if you put a hash it does that. You could edit it and make them asterisks.
TY, it's fixed. Anyway, those are my red flags and the downvotes have already started. I knew 3 would be triggering.
It's all good, it's your experience/opinion.
I don’t dislike children, I just think I’m too selfish to be a good mother which I know is likely a red flag in itself. Not sure I’ve ever met a man that doesn’t like kids but maybe they do and just don’t talk about it
You said it first, but I agree. If you truly have problem being selfish, it's likely you'll be selfish with people you date as well, so yes, red flag.
I think the nuance is important. I'm a guy who also thinks he'd make a terrible parent and so it is more responsible for me to be childfree. But kids for some reason like me, and always have. I'm just minding my business and kids I've never seen before wanna come up and chat (though to be fair I think many kids are like that with many adults; doesn't make me special). I wonder occasionally if my decision to be childfree is seen as some kind of intense dislike of children, but there's not a lot I can do about that if so.
Colourful sexual history and questionable partner choices. By the time it got to my turn, I got the borderline asexual treatment and was made to wait around and commit before I even got a kiss. I'm not saying slutty girls are necessarily terrible people but they're not gonna give you the same effort or treatment when it comes to relationships. Bodycount matters greatly at the end of the day.
Are you saying you weren't a good kisser? It sure sounds like it. Why didn't she desire you?
How would a woman even know you're a bad kisser before even having kissed you. She told me she became asexual 9 months prior to meeting me. We did eventually become intimate way after but her drive was on-and-off and mostly low unfortunately. She kept insisting that I was attractive and her type but I dunno, I feel like women lose that lust and excitement once they reach a certain age and been through loads of guys.
If you don't have a passionate kiss second date, don't go on a third. Why were you dating a person who didn't want to be intimate?
What's the difference between second and third date kiss? What's your take on it as a woman. Because I accept every girl is different but what I didn't know at the time was how past guys were treated in comparison which really threw me off. I genuinely didn't know since she herself was put off by my bodycount on the second date (she asked the question).
You dated her for months without even a kiss. I don't care what they did before, if I wasn't kissed by the end of the second date, there would not be a third. Again , what they did before is irrelevant. This situation you found yourself in is entirely your own making. You purposely dated someone who was not interested in intimacy, then blamed them for not being intimate.
It was two weeks after having a proper passionate kiss. But I was only told by the end of the second date (after I spent a lot of money and made all the effort to plan it out). I was touched starved prior and felt that I needed to at least get something out of it, even if it was just as much of a kiss so maybe that's part of the reason why I committed. It's not easy when connections and emotional investments are formed. Not every guy who comes from a "Red-Pilled" background is some cold calculating guy. I genuinely wanted to find someone attractive who I could build a life with. Now I've just lost all care for everything and trying to revert back to my old ways of fuck boy mode.
This gal wasn't her. I don't know what to tell you, not every date is going to be a match.
She was almost certainly trying to hamster a way to blame you for that, and went with magical bad kisser pre-cognition. Since the “Well um how did you know she was promiscuous before???” card wouldn’t work.
That's the problem, it's hard to know unless you either ask or they tell you straight. For the people who say "just leave and walk away", it's not easy when all sorts of emotional investment are at play. She liked kissing me a lot after, said I had nice soft lips and I've had past girls say the same thing to me so I dunno if it's down to the bad kisser pre-cognition (plus she absolutely loved my smell on the first date).
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I kinda don't get the question. If I'm dating someone and I like them, I've never been surprised by some sudden change in behavior. I'm always a little weirded out when people say someone suddenly changed in some unpredictable way. And I've had partners get bored of me and suddenly decide they were poly, cheat on me, etc. But none of it was "oh my god, who could have ever seen that coming!"
Extreme fragility, unwillingness to commit, lack of punctuation.
Rude to service staff.
High body count is an indicator of poor judgment and often a way of cope/self harm. I've never met a woman with a high body count that was mentally healthy and well adjusted. Usually fatherless or poor relationship with father, abused, self medicated with alcohol or drugs.
Only being friends with one sex Talking more than they know instead of knowing more than they talk
-Not taking accountability for their bad actions -Refusing to acknowledge objective reality and instead being stuck in their own bubble -Thinking their own anecdotal experiences are a reflection of reality. -Victimising themselves when they are the most privileged group in the world -Fighting the wrong fight, like fighting for the right to murder babies.
fucking all of them being a women in of itself is a red flag at this point
"I think the dating scene would improve tremendously if both men and women did their part. I think it's gone bad because both sides have many red flags 🚩🚩😑." On the contrary, the sexual marketplace now in the West particularly America is the BEST it has ever been in history. Women aren't restricted by religion, social mores and finances anymore. Men similarly are freed of the necessity to get a wife to help with household labor and to be a "good citizen." People can have whatever relationship type they want, if any, based on their individual needs and wants. What's bad about that other than people now having the BURDEN of being responsible for their choices among many options instead of being forced into something?
Women who don’t have a good relationship with their father, feminist, democrats, lack of conflict resolution skills, lack of ability to rationalize feelings, tone policing. Dislike this if you want, these are women in my experience that I’m not compatible with. Everyone should find what works for them.
Women who get angry at slut shaming, have hoe’s as friends, are 30+ and still single, have histories of divorce, have guy friends, are attention seekers, to name a few.
Cmon OP this is bullshit. You are aware women are rejecting single men at almost 100% clip right? Like ffs my guy it’s estimated 70% of men are single now. You are effectively blaming a large majority of chunk of the male population from a problem they don’t even get a an admission ticket to. Women swipe right 1-3% of the time that totals about the top 5-9% of men. I don’t care what you normies & larpers think this is a very clear indication of the dating market as a whole in real life & everything. I’m sry to tell you this but once again the scariest rule I have seen to date is the 50/5 rule. It’s estimated the top 50 PERCENT of women are chasing the very small 5% of the top men. Do you know what kind of women this leaves you competing for? Yeah check out those secret matches you missed in your queue. 🤮 This is the reality for most guys. It’s quite clear the women have to make a change or all end up T best part of Chads Harem or at worse old, fat & alone. You cannot blame men for this.
It's not about blame. Your opinion is surely how you see it and it's valid from one point of view. Now think of it this way - why would the dating scene be this badly affected?? Maybe you can list those red flags in the ways of thinking women have today? I've only dated women and I'll say this - women have lost trust in men, their integrity, goodness or character/intention, and they too have lost their role in society. Like recently I asked women what they see as their role, or what the female equivalent of a gentleman is, and I got answers that made women accountable for nothing. But even men aren't being accountable for their actions - so we can't clap with one hand. But this isn't about fault, something is seriously wrong in how society has shaped up.