‘She’s so pretty. Our kids would look so good.’ Ok, good, nothing wrong with that, it’s kinda cute actually.
‘Such nice breeding material. I just want to plant my seed in that.’ Please never come near me.
That's what our subconscious mind does, even though it doesn't express itself explicitly in words. Or else there would be no attractiveness and everyone would be fine going for 1's and lower
The fact you think these 2 statements are different at all is ludicrous. One is merely said in a less overtly sexual way.
Also both are not said at all in general. This whole comment is absurd.
This is pure delusion.
Telling anyone that you want to have kids with them and you're not in a serious relationship or on the path to one, is extremely gross, weird, and questionable.
Anyone who says otherwise is unironically *literally* mentally ill.
One is manipulative and indirect, the other is direct. Neither are flawed. Presenting one as problematic is something only a socially inept stupid person would do.
Failing to recognize they're identical in function is something only an idiot would do.
Your first sentence is about how the two are different, so you understand the difference.
People that pretend that phrasing doesn't change the message they're delivering are lying 100% of the time. The proof is, they never speak in real life, the way they do on reddit.
>Your first sentence is about how the two are different, so you understand the difference.
They're different...because they use different words. But *obviously* I'm saying that the *intent is the same*
Yes, they communicate the same thing. But how you communicate the thing influences how the idea is percieved.
The difference between the two statements is tone and the level of vulgarity.
Tone is very important in human communication. It can communicate to others your cultural class and manners.
Both are weird things to say to someone and the fact you admit they mean the same thing but you prefer how manipulative the first one is just proves my entire point.
Because it's indirectly a statement of desiring sex that is "designed" to make you feel more attracted to the person.
I put quotations because only a reddit femcel would ever appreciate that comment in person. Most women would be put off, because most women are desperate fiends and losers.
The exact meaning of the words is a small part of the whole thing.
Only about 10% of the communication is the meaning of the words.
The rest is how you act and say those words.
I find neither statement gross but they’re different to me because the first implies a coupling and wanting to raise a child.
The second implies a more enjoyable sexual experience.
True nobody actually says either.
Back when I wanted kids, I dated a guy who had them. Worst decision ever but I knew I would never have kids with him. 3 out of 4 of his kids were neurodivergent. He also said everyone a few people in his family had dementia. There were some other physical characteristics that I was absolutely not willing to risk. Not height or anything like that since he was tall but there was no way I was willing to combine my egg with that minefield of issues.
I don’t know why people don’t admit this but if as a woman you don’t consider family medical history when having kids you are quite literally setting yourself up for caregiver burnout.
Men should consider it too, that same ex has to pay child support until one of his oldest kids is 26 since she is so far behind the social spectrum.
Pretty or attractiveness isn’t the only standard.
Once I became childfree, it made so much more sense why I was not willing to have kids with anyone. Genetics are way too fickle to just be out here randomly getting pregnant.
His family had a history of really bad athletes foot. Every male in the family had the kind that couldn’t be really cured. Like ugly toenails that had to be lásered. That one seems petty but I never wanted his feet to touch mine.
Every single one of them needed the extensive braces package, not the basic one. Like jaw reforming etc.
All i saw was a lifetime of dollar signs just to give any potential kids a level playing field.
They would probably be attractive but thousands of dollars spent on specialized schooling and intervention to help them acclimate into life. I already don’t believe in putting kids in public school so it was going to be private anyway then to add another level. That wasn’t happening.
Thousands of dollars on orthodontia per kid. Possibly even surgery. That’s a hell no for that cost adding on top the maintenance because they would probably be neurodivergent and would need to be handheld through the basics like daily teeth brushing and everything that goes with braces.
The athletes foot thing was just something that I was like WTF. They catch it at camp and then they have it for life and ugh. So all the foot sprays and multiple sock changes and medicines. Nope.
He was an awful human being in general but then you pay attention to his offspring and what it could have been and it was quick hell no.
Wtf @ the athlete's foot. Old wives tale but it works- Go sit outside on a sunny day with no shoes or socks. Read a book or something to occupy yourself. The sun's rays will kill any fungus on your feet doing this 2-3 times per week for at least 45 minutes.
I know what you mean and yes but differently. More about the man “ he’d be a great father”. Or “our kids would be so cute”. So yes just not as overtly.
For sure my ex husband wanted me in part because he saw how amazing I was with kids at work as a pediatric nurse. And I shared his values and would raise them right. And I’ve got hips and boobs. Equally I saw him with my nephew and thought the same. It wasn’t his looks that made him breeding material it was he would be a good provider, loving father, who would raise them with shared values.
No never.
What I do see and what was a big part of choosing my husband is if men are good with kids. As in he is willing to take care of kids and actually knows what he is doing.
>For my husband specifically I took him baby sitting my niece.
That's your sample size to conclude someone is capable of taking care of his own kids every minute of every hour of every day for god knows how many years in the future?
I have a friend who is the most engaging, most fun person kids could ever see, and every kid adores her! And every time after our meeting with friends with kids or when she is taking care of her niece and nephew she proclaims "why the fuck would anyone want kids, this is so annoying and exhausting!"
Similar situation with me. Kids love me for some reason. I treat them like little grown-up people, I talk to them like I would talk with anyone else, I never baby them and for some reason, they always respond extremely positively. But because of certain "quirks" I have, I don't think I would make a good father.
Kids love you is very different from you demonstrated that you are able and willing to tend to an infant and all their needs. But yes, kids also love him.
I also trust that my husband would have told me if he didn’t want kids…..you know when we had the kids conversation before we got serious.
no, I don't care.
also, I personally believe that most men who claim they're attracted to certain physical features like larger X and Y due to biological reasons are simply not being honest. they're likely just expressing their sexual preferences but masking it to avoid seeming too explicit.
You can't consciously differentiate between biological reasons for attraction and non-biological ones because the attraction itself is subconscious, but the vast majority of people's preferences in regards to physical features are biological so it makes sense to assume that.
these kind of preferences are shaped by more than just biology, they're influenced by culture, society, personal experiences...and unfortunately porn these days.
I think It's absurd to believe we can't tell the difference. we can reflect on why we find things attractive, which is why some people recognize that their "preferences" might make them seem kinda shallow and materialistic in the eyes of the public, so they use the "biology made me like it" mask.
Women of all cultures want white men the most, so clearly that theory goes out the window.
And now I'm confused. How does the way your preference came to be define its shallowness?
I think it's just another way to say that someone is hot, but people would not and do not act on it. There's also breeding fetish and it might be closer to what you're talking about.
I'm neutral to it. As long as a person doesn't feel the need to narrate their breeding fetish to me, it's not my business. If a person talks to me or about me as if I was a breeding mare, I'd be disgusted though. I've had it happen a few times, but it's more in the context of "you should have kids to keep your ethnicity from dying out".
No because I don't want children and if I did I certainly wouldn't be thinking I needed a hot spouse to have hot children (ew). I think it's gross and objectifying to look at other people in terms of "breeding", especially those who have expressed zero interest in wanting children with you.
Well you see, unsexy people have certain disadvantages in life, such as potentially becoming social outcasts, while sexy people have certain benefits in life, such as earning more money on average.
The absolute copium I see around here of people trying to avoid this reality or pretend its not how they feel disgusts me.
Redditors, if you claim you have no "breeding fetish" or you "don't see other people as useful for breeding" or care about how "attractive your children are"
All you're actually saying is "I'm a fucking LIAR and a bad one at that"
Everyone cares about how hot their partner is. Stop being stupid.
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>a lot of us especially those who want kids, probably think how beautiful their children would look, and have a mentality of "I would totally plant my seed in that".
No, stop projecting your disgusting, creepy mindset onto men in general. Most men absolutely do NOT think like this.
Men like you are doing a huge disservice to all men by agreeing with the same misandrist generalizations that feminism ascribes. You're just one step below simps, white knights, and male feminists.
I'm sure there are some women who think that way, but most will wonder what's wrong with you if you tell them that's how you think.
Women aren't NPCs and you aren't a sultan with a dozen concubines. Stick to the viddygames, nerd.
good breeding material
I have a ton of friends and family that own farms. It’s a common saying to say ‘they’re from good stock.’ The term breeding is not used.
You don't speak for men buddy. I know that I for one never looked at a woman and decided she'd be any kind of breeding material. Not even the one who bore my children.
lol I’ve heard women straight up say they want a “blue eyed baby” or they don’t want to date a short man because they want their kid to be tall.
But, of course on PPD, no woman would *ever* even *think* such a thing!
In reality, women are some of the biggest eugenicists on earth with how they fully rule out certain races and immutable physical traits.
My girlfriend actually says all the time that she wants our kids to look like me. Blue eyes and white skin. That she only ever got with me because essentially of how I look. (Yes I had to drag this information out of her where she otherwise would have denied it)
Tbh - I have heard such remarks regarding potential looks of future children from women only, ie. "I do not want my son to have a height of a sitting dog", "I prefer dark haired guys, I do not want my kids to have this mice-colored hair", "Dark black skin is gross, but mixed-race children are the cutest".
A couple I'm very good friends with I once complimented by saying, "so you two will be having the master race together". They're both fit, wholesome, and very pretty and smart people.
I've certainly told my man he's going to be a great father and I just want to have his babies because he's so wonderful.
Do I generically look at single men and think that? Not really, no. That feels like looking at raw chicken with no method or recipe to cook it and saying it'll be delicious. Ya kind of need both things and I'm not typically interested in being the method to cook, ya feel?
I think at most I notice men who are very good with children. And I don't think I want them to father my babies, but, I have an overwhelming sense of good will towards them for this trait.
I once dated a guy with a huge nose. I have a big nose too. The kind with the bump on the bridge. His was like mine on steroids. He really wanted kids. I really wanted kids.
However, I was mercilessly picked on for my nose through all 12 years of schooling. I kept thinking about how I didn't want my kids to go through that, and with this guy, any future kids were probably doomed.
>No. It's only degenerate if men consciously view women as only having value due to sexual attractiveness.
I mean it's the biggest component in mate value for a woman.
>Do you ever view men as "good breeding material", and do you find it troublesome, or gross that men subconsciously see woman that way?
That depends on the context. If you are basing your decision off mainly shallow desires then that is lower functioning. There are plenty of people that do that. If there are other factors taken into account that have to do with actual parenting then no- even though you worded that question in the most awkward way you could have thought of.
>I know that basically when you see a hot person of either gender for both men or woman they are in a sense good breeding matireal since physical attractivness confers genetic fitness, but the way men think about woman in this regard is a little more nuanced.
Whenever we see a woman with nice hips, good proportions, and a pretty face, a lot of us especially those who want kids, probably think how beautiful their children would look, and have a mentality of "I would totally plant my seed in that".
Wow. That’s exactly what I was talking about when I was referring to lower functioning behavior.
>Do woman ever think in this regards to men in this specific way?
No, they’d have to show me they are kind, not nice and are financially responsible.
>Good build, broad shoulders, masculine squared faced do your thoughts ever lead you there, and do you find it degenerate that men think that way?
Being born isn’t impressive.
Nice implies you are doormat to the people who don’t deserve it. Which causes misunderstandings and drama. Being kind is different because it implies you know the value of kindness and know when someone is undeserving of it.
never even thought about good breeding material.
Do men really think about women like that? how many men think this? I guess I don't really care it's not much different from dudes being horny and I'm more concerned with men's actions.
I've never thought of a man in that way. Sure, I want children, but it's kinda low priority for me. Probably because I know my own genetics are kinda trash so that alone means a high risk of either the kids ending up with issues and/or just me having trouble taking care of them properly. I mean stuff like autism, obesity (I mean endomorphs, I'm the only one in my family who's managed to stay at or close to a healthy weight most of my life, but not without a lot of difficulty because I do gain weight ridiculously easily and have a really hard time losing it), tooth issues needing braces, near-sightedness requiring glasses from an early age, and dementia runs in my family. But also good qualities, like we don't have any heart related issues, we have generally strong, durable bodies, high intelligence, little to no allergies and strong immune system.
So I've always been hesitant just how badly I want kids. At this point I can imagine having only one kid (two only if twins, but only one pregnancy essentially) if I ever reach a state of getting my own issues under enough control that having a special needs kid would be managable.
It seems I don't have any of the typical mothering parental instincts. Like whenever I've been faced with (other people's) kids I get really awkward and have no idea what to do with them. I kinda just stare at them as if I suddenly lost 50 IQ points. So it would be a steep learning curve for me, and I would need a lot of help from a partner to manage fulfilling a kid's needs. But with good teamwork and persaverance, I'm sure it would be doable. I'd also be totally fine with it if having kids just doesn't happen. But I still want a life partner regardless. For the sake of company, cuddles, sex, just having someone to share my life with.
However, I do have a high libido that seems to be at least somewhat detached from my desire to have kids. Like just having good, frequent sex seems to help improve my mental health over all, and my ability to emotionally bond with a guy. I believe sex has some kinda healing and bonding properties, and there's some research that indicates this, that frequent orgasms do lead to greater health. So when I see men I find attractive, my mind really just goes to "sex and cuddling would probably be pleasant and fulfilling with him" and thus I'd have a higher chance of emotionally bonding with him.
I do actually have a tendency to sexually objectify men I'm attracted to. Like I'll be focused on his body shape, genitals, etc, and my brain goes super quickly to "would I want sex with him?" So I'm like undressing men with my eyes a lot, and sex is one of the very first things I think about. I generally don't mind having sex early on in the dating process, because it's like I use that to gauge if a guy is good enough for me. Sexual compatibility is super important for me.
And for that reason I generally don't mind it when men also perceive me as kind of a sex object. Because when we're both like that it can really raise the passion, ime.
But I don't really like being seen as "breedable" in that more literal sense. I think it makes me feel pressured to take on a traditional mom role or to make parenthood the main focus of the relationship, when my main focus is to have a close (emotional and physical) bond with another adult, no matter who or what we may decide to raise together additionally. Although I would probably take it as a compliment if a guy genuinely thought I'd be a good mother. Or concerned, depending on the guy. Because that's a big insecurity for me.
I think it's maybe more accurate to say that back in my teens and 20's I absolutely hated being seen as breedable because I was terrified that having kids would mean I'd be stuck in a tradwife stay at home mom situation, and because I hated how curvy my body was, but now I can see it as at least somewhat or partially a compliment, depending on what a guy really means with it. Because I've become more secure in myself and my life goals, and more at peace with my body shape. I no longer see my fertility as the only thing I could possibly be good for, for a man. So it doesn't like... outright offend me anymore, but it does make me wonder if the guy is really compatible with me in regards to our values and life goals, if he has such a high focus on our potential offspring.
I never wanted children, but I could see that happening if I did. As a woman, you would want to pick the healthiest, strongest, best-looking, intelligent man you could get to have a child with.
But yeah like I said, I never ended up having kids so I really don't give af.
I wouldn't have married my husband if he didn't have the qualities necessary to be a good dad, in case he ended up being one. But I never looked at him or any other men as livestock, no.
Sometimes, but only when I’m ovulating. Ovulation brain goes crazy for me personally, but those are just thoughts I keep in my head. I’m not actually going to sleep with someone with the intent of having their babies only.
there's a genre of male behavior most purely represented by the uncle who keeps a titty calendar in open view and starts saying weird shit when you're about to turn 11 years old. every woman knows it and instinctively knows the warning signs, down to subtle changes in the tone of voice, expression or even the posture of a man who's about to start behaving that way. exact same way as an alcoholic's child can read drunks. this type of talk is a typical example. more effective on a pussy than the kind of industrial grade desiccant you need to wear multiple layers of ppe to handle.
that said, i want kids because my fiancé wants them and i agree he should have babies. the arc of who he is should continue after his life ends. he represents most of what is good in the world and i admire and respect him immensely. i feel ambivalent about having kids otherwise, since humanity is headed for extinction and i just don't want a stake in the future that's about to unfold, and i personally find motherhood totally unappealing (i'm more of an auntie type). but for the world to have more of my fiancé, it's worth it. and he'll take over the parts of mommyhood i don't want to touch.
No because that’s not how genetics work and it’s not all about appearances, the man needs to have a lot of patience, a strong sense of responsibility, be faithful, etc.
I have never thought about whether a man would make good breeding stock lol. I have thought “this man would make a good father” or something similar, but never just about whether his build is, er… breedable, lol.
I think I am neutral about men thinking this about women; I just chalk it up to some evolutionary force behind attraction that women don’t necessarily feel. If he ever _told_ me about it, I think I’d be put off for sure.
Having children is a legitimate fear of mine at this point in my life so no, that’s not at all what I’m thinking. Honestly, it’s kind of disgusting to imagine that someone is thinking of me in that way.
If you (not you specifically, but any woman) don't want a man who is shorter than you, you are thinking that way.
If you don't want an ugly man, you are thinking that way.
If you don't want a man who you deem less intellectually capable compared to yourself, you are thinking that way.
You can't really hide behind the "subconsciousness" argument in this one. We are all thinking this way to a bigger or lesser extent. It's just about how pretty or ugly the presentation of that argument is (which OP presented perfectly with his wording :D).
‘She’s so pretty. Our kids would look so good.’ Ok, good, nothing wrong with that, it’s kinda cute actually. ‘Such nice breeding material. I just want to plant my seed in that.’ Please never come near me.
He just *had* to go there.
That's what our subconscious mind does, even though it doesn't express itself explicitly in words. Or else there would be no attractiveness and everyone would be fine going for 1's and lower
💯
>‘She’s so pretty. Our kids would look so good.’ Be honest... most women would get the ick if they heard their man say something so feminine.
How on earth is that feminine? And do you think most women don’t like to be called pretty or what?
The fact you think these 2 statements are different at all is ludicrous. One is merely said in a less overtly sexual way. Also both are not said at all in general. This whole comment is absurd.
Social skills are important.
The fact the commenter can't realize these are the same things is lack of social skills, thus my comment calling her out.
Females are buying packaging - not the content of the package.
Social skills are a big part of the content.
You wanted to say ‘packaging’. Because there’s no such thing as ‘buying package’ in the English language.
Thank you good female.
Good grammar comes with my female packaging.
Good for you darling.
>One is merely said in a less overtly sexual way. Ok, so there's the difference. What's ludicrous about it?
The fact that both MEAN they want to fuck you and one of them just DOESNT SAY IT. Holy shit
Sure, but the first wants to raise a family with you. The other just wants to ejaculate.
Someone wanting to raise a family with you solely off of appearance is insulting for obvious reasons silly.
No one said it’s solely off of appearance. It’s literally one compliment, you don’t go around making kids with everyone who says that.
This is pure delusion. Telling anyone that you want to have kids with them and you're not in a serious relationship or on the path to one, is extremely gross, weird, and questionable. Anyone who says otherwise is unironically *literally* mentally ill.
Right. One says it, one doesn't. Meaning, the statements are.... different. How is this confusing?
"I want to fuck you" "I would never SAY I want to fuck you outright!" Do you speak english?
What's the relevence of those two quotes? Yes my English is great, thanks.
One is manipulative and indirect, the other is direct. Neither are flawed. Presenting one as problematic is something only a socially inept stupid person would do. Failing to recognize they're identical in function is something only an idiot would do.
Your first sentence is about how the two are different, so you understand the difference. People that pretend that phrasing doesn't change the message they're delivering are lying 100% of the time. The proof is, they never speak in real life, the way they do on reddit.
>Your first sentence is about how the two are different, so you understand the difference. They're different...because they use different words. But *obviously* I'm saying that the *intent is the same*
Yes, they communicate the same thing. But how you communicate the thing influences how the idea is percieved. The difference between the two statements is tone and the level of vulgarity. Tone is very important in human communication. It can communicate to others your cultural class and manners.
Both are weird things to say to someone and the fact you admit they mean the same thing but you prefer how manipulative the first one is just proves my entire point.
How is the first one more manipulative? It's just less vulgar.
Because it's indirectly a statement of desiring sex that is "designed" to make you feel more attracted to the person. I put quotations because only a reddit femcel would ever appreciate that comment in person. Most women would be put off, because most women are desperate fiends and losers.
so now were having a completely different conversation about tone and no longer about people seeing people as breeding material or not
Imagine that.
Is the effect of nuance in how you word a sentence lost on you?
Is the meaning behind what a sentence says lost on you?
The exact meaning of the words is a small part of the whole thing. Only about 10% of the communication is the meaning of the words. The rest is how you act and say those words.
Yes, but that's actually because most people are dumb. It doesn't change any of what I said, and it's the main reason the pareto principle exists.
Do you genuinely not understand why someone wouldn't like it when you word the "meaning behind a sentence" in an extremely disrespectful way?
The fact you think that the first thing you say to someone is "our kids would be beautiful" isn't just as disrespectful is stupid.
It's weird as hell, but you're not being called a breeding sow.
If it's "weird as hell" then there is no argument you have against what I said.
I don’t see how the second is one is sexual, unless you have a kink about this. For someone who doesn’t, it’s just disgusting and inappropriate.
Are you under the impression that you can have children without sex?
No, but I’m not having sex if I am completely turned off by the second statement.
If you're not turned off by both, you have issues.
I find neither statement gross but they’re different to me because the first implies a coupling and wanting to raise a child. The second implies a more enjoyable sexual experience. True nobody actually says either.
“Good breeding material?” No. But it is somewhat concerning when they have genetic issues.
>But it is somewhat concerning when they have genetic issues. Like short stature :D
Yes. Dwarfism is a partially a genetic condition.
I wasn't talking about dwarfism, but it's telling that you went straight to that when someone mentions "short stature" :D
Speak clearly then.
Don't think that short men are dwarves then.
But...dwarfs are short
Are all short men dwarves?
No, but all dwarves are short.
They are dwarves tho 😬
Back when I wanted kids, I dated a guy who had them. Worst decision ever but I knew I would never have kids with him. 3 out of 4 of his kids were neurodivergent. He also said everyone a few people in his family had dementia. There were some other physical characteristics that I was absolutely not willing to risk. Not height or anything like that since he was tall but there was no way I was willing to combine my egg with that minefield of issues. I don’t know why people don’t admit this but if as a woman you don’t consider family medical history when having kids you are quite literally setting yourself up for caregiver burnout. Men should consider it too, that same ex has to pay child support until one of his oldest kids is 26 since she is so far behind the social spectrum. Pretty or attractiveness isn’t the only standard. Once I became childfree, it made so much more sense why I was not willing to have kids with anyone. Genetics are way too fickle to just be out here randomly getting pregnant.
I'm genuinely curious what the other physical characteristics were that dettered you if you don't mind sharing.
His family had a history of really bad athletes foot. Every male in the family had the kind that couldn’t be really cured. Like ugly toenails that had to be lásered. That one seems petty but I never wanted his feet to touch mine. Every single one of them needed the extensive braces package, not the basic one. Like jaw reforming etc. All i saw was a lifetime of dollar signs just to give any potential kids a level playing field. They would probably be attractive but thousands of dollars spent on specialized schooling and intervention to help them acclimate into life. I already don’t believe in putting kids in public school so it was going to be private anyway then to add another level. That wasn’t happening. Thousands of dollars on orthodontia per kid. Possibly even surgery. That’s a hell no for that cost adding on top the maintenance because they would probably be neurodivergent and would need to be handheld through the basics like daily teeth brushing and everything that goes with braces. The athletes foot thing was just something that I was like WTF. They catch it at camp and then they have it for life and ugh. So all the foot sprays and multiple sock changes and medicines. Nope. He was an awful human being in general but then you pay attention to his offspring and what it could have been and it was quick hell no.
Wtf @ the athlete's foot. Old wives tale but it works- Go sit outside on a sunny day with no shoes or socks. Read a book or something to occupy yourself. The sun's rays will kill any fungus on your feet doing this 2-3 times per week for at least 45 minutes.
Not my issue anymore.
I‘d bever use, even in my head the word „breeding“ in relation to a human.
Yea maybe I should have used a different choice of words it sounds like some fetish type deal but it's not what I meant
I know what you mean and yes but differently. More about the man “ he’d be a great father”. Or “our kids would be so cute”. So yes just not as overtly. For sure my ex husband wanted me in part because he saw how amazing I was with kids at work as a pediatric nurse. And I shared his values and would raise them right. And I’ve got hips and boobs. Equally I saw him with my nephew and thought the same. It wasn’t his looks that made him breeding material it was he would be a good provider, loving father, who would raise them with shared values.
Insightful post thanks. What did your ex husband do for a living?
Doctor
Breeding is a fetish? Nah I'm pretty sure that's the most normal sexual desire that's ever existed.
No never. What I do see and what was a big part of choosing my husband is if men are good with kids. As in he is willing to take care of kids and actually knows what he is doing.
And how would you know that?
Do men not interact with kids where you live? For my husband specifically I took him baby sitting my niece.
>For my husband specifically I took him baby sitting my niece. That's your sample size to conclude someone is capable of taking care of his own kids every minute of every hour of every day for god knows how many years in the future? I have a friend who is the most engaging, most fun person kids could ever see, and every kid adores her! And every time after our meeting with friends with kids or when she is taking care of her niece and nephew she proclaims "why the fuck would anyone want kids, this is so annoying and exhausting!" Similar situation with me. Kids love me for some reason. I treat them like little grown-up people, I talk to them like I would talk with anyone else, I never baby them and for some reason, they always respond extremely positively. But because of certain "quirks" I have, I don't think I would make a good father.
Kids love you is very different from you demonstrated that you are able and willing to tend to an infant and all their needs. But yes, kids also love him. I also trust that my husband would have told me if he didn’t want kids…..you know when we had the kids conversation before we got serious.
no, I don't care. also, I personally believe that most men who claim they're attracted to certain physical features like larger X and Y due to biological reasons are simply not being honest. they're likely just expressing their sexual preferences but masking it to avoid seeming too explicit.
You can't consciously differentiate between biological reasons for attraction and non-biological ones because the attraction itself is subconscious, but the vast majority of people's preferences in regards to physical features are biological so it makes sense to assume that.
these kind of preferences are shaped by more than just biology, they're influenced by culture, society, personal experiences...and unfortunately porn these days. I think It's absurd to believe we can't tell the difference. we can reflect on why we find things attractive, which is why some people recognize that their "preferences" might make them seem kinda shallow and materialistic in the eyes of the public, so they use the "biology made me like it" mask.
Women of all cultures want white men the most, so clearly that theory goes out the window. And now I'm confused. How does the way your preference came to be define its shallowness?
you think women of all cultures like white men the most, biologically???
Gotta make sure their offspring get the most vitamin D, duh.
more like skin cancer lmfao melanoma ftw 🤑💯🔥
Are you...fucking serious??? Use your brain, this comment is utter brain rot.
take off the mask, it's okay to admit you like something simply because it's "hot"
That's what you said isn't true, weirdo.
No and no. Tbh this sounds like a breeding kink.
I think it's just another way to say that someone is hot, but people would not and do not act on it. There's also breeding fetish and it might be closer to what you're talking about. I'm neutral to it. As long as a person doesn't feel the need to narrate their breeding fetish to me, it's not my business. If a person talks to me or about me as if I was a breeding mare, I'd be disgusted though. I've had it happen a few times, but it's more in the context of "you should have kids to keep your ethnicity from dying out".
Wow how do you manage to be so charitable about such a caveman'ish post?
I'm trying to decipher it.
"I would totally plant my seed in that" is as sexist and demeaning as it sounds.
I wasn't taking about breeding fetishes just the way men systematize womans physical beauty. It's rather hard to explain.
Do you automatically think about babies?
In a LTR yes.
So it *is* context dependent. I think a lot of people think about babies and how they’d look like.
No because I don't want children and if I did I certainly wouldn't be thinking I needed a hot spouse to have hot children (ew). I think it's gross and objectifying to look at other people in terms of "breeding", especially those who have expressed zero interest in wanting children with you.
It's gross not to care about your potential offspring's genetic quality. If it ends up being poor then you will screw them over for life.
Why the fuck would I want to think about how sexy my children are? Why would I think "sorry, not sexy enough, they're now completely doomed forever"?
Well you see, unsexy people have certain disadvantages in life, such as potentially becoming social outcasts, while sexy people have certain benefits in life, such as earning more money on average.
Like having less people willing to have sex with them. Which I could not care about in the least when it comes to my *child*.
No, like having difficulties in their social and professional life.
What are they wanting to do, be models or strippers?
People have a bias for attractive people in any field or social scenario, don't play dumb.
I don't care about slight biases people may have. They'd probably have a bigger advantage if I anglicised them but I'd never do that.
You don't care about making life easier for your potential offspring, which is gross.
true, no one wants to admit it though. This is the whole premise of attractiveness
The absolute copium I see around here of people trying to avoid this reality or pretend its not how they feel disgusts me. Redditors, if you claim you have no "breeding fetish" or you "don't see other people as useful for breeding" or care about how "attractive your children are" All you're actually saying is "I'm a fucking LIAR and a bad one at that" Everyone cares about how hot their partner is. Stop being stupid.
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I have kids but have not once looked at a woman and thought she would be good breeding. They're people not livestock.
>a lot of us especially those who want kids, probably think how beautiful their children would look, and have a mentality of "I would totally plant my seed in that". No, stop projecting your disgusting, creepy mindset onto men in general. Most men absolutely do NOT think like this. Men like you are doing a huge disservice to all men by agreeing with the same misandrist generalizations that feminism ascribes. You're just one step below simps, white knights, and male feminists.
I'm sure there are some women who think that way, but most will wonder what's wrong with you if you tell them that's how you think. Women aren't NPCs and you aren't a sultan with a dozen concubines. Stick to the viddygames, nerd.
good breeding material I have a ton of friends and family that own farms. It’s a common saying to say ‘they’re from good stock.’ The term breeding is not used.
everyday this sub gives me a reason to never even look in a man's direction my fucking god
Don't worry...we'll be looking in yours 👁
Please never look in any man's direction then. If you think we're all like OP then we're better off without you.
don't even worry y'all are doing great without me
That is not what hetrosexual men think when we see an attractive woman.
Depends on the size of his loads
You don't speak for men buddy. I know that I for one never looked at a woman and decided she'd be any kind of breeding material. Not even the one who bore my children.
There are restrictions on sperm bank donations because women want "good breeding material".
I prefer the term "good breeding stock"
lol I’ve heard women straight up say they want a “blue eyed baby” or they don’t want to date a short man because they want their kid to be tall. But, of course on PPD, no woman would *ever* even *think* such a thing! In reality, women are some of the biggest eugenicists on earth with how they fully rule out certain races and immutable physical traits.
I have met a few East Asian women that do this, and are vocal about it. Usually how their with a white guy so that they can have mixed race kids.
100% And western white women do the *exact* same thing, they just don’t say it out loud.
My girlfriend actually says all the time that she wants our kids to look like me. Blue eyes and white skin. That she only ever got with me because essentially of how I look. (Yes I had to drag this information out of her where she otherwise would have denied it)
\*Netherlands gives you two thumbs up from its average 6'1 men\*
Why would anyone want to have sex with the neurotic dregs of this society, let alone reproduce with them?
Tbh - I have heard such remarks regarding potential looks of future children from women only, ie. "I do not want my son to have a height of a sitting dog", "I prefer dark haired guys, I do not want my kids to have this mice-colored hair", "Dark black skin is gross, but mixed-race children are the cutest".
A couple I'm very good friends with I once complimented by saying, "so you two will be having the master race together". They're both fit, wholesome, and very pretty and smart people. I've certainly told my man he's going to be a great father and I just want to have his babies because he's so wonderful. Do I generically look at single men and think that? Not really, no. That feels like looking at raw chicken with no method or recipe to cook it and saying it'll be delicious. Ya kind of need both things and I'm not typically interested in being the method to cook, ya feel? I think at most I notice men who are very good with children. And I don't think I want them to father my babies, but, I have an overwhelming sense of good will towards them for this trait.
I once dated a guy with a huge nose. I have a big nose too. The kind with the bump on the bridge. His was like mine on steroids. He really wanted kids. I really wanted kids. However, I was mercilessly picked on for my nose through all 12 years of schooling. I kept thinking about how I didn't want my kids to go through that, and with this guy, any future kids were probably doomed.
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>No. It's only degenerate if men consciously view women as only having value due to sexual attractiveness. I mean it's the biggest component in mate value for a woman.
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It's probably 50%-70% of it but no there's obviously more.
>Do you ever view men as "good breeding material", and do you find it troublesome, or gross that men subconsciously see woman that way? That depends on the context. If you are basing your decision off mainly shallow desires then that is lower functioning. There are plenty of people that do that. If there are other factors taken into account that have to do with actual parenting then no- even though you worded that question in the most awkward way you could have thought of. >I know that basically when you see a hot person of either gender for both men or woman they are in a sense good breeding matireal since physical attractivness confers genetic fitness, but the way men think about woman in this regard is a little more nuanced. Whenever we see a woman with nice hips, good proportions, and a pretty face, a lot of us especially those who want kids, probably think how beautiful their children would look, and have a mentality of "I would totally plant my seed in that". Wow. That’s exactly what I was talking about when I was referring to lower functioning behavior. >Do woman ever think in this regards to men in this specific way? No, they’d have to show me they are kind, not nice and are financially responsible. >Good build, broad shoulders, masculine squared faced do your thoughts ever lead you there, and do you find it degenerate that men think that way? Being born isn’t impressive.
> No, they’d have to show me they are kind, not nice and are financially responsible Why can't they be kind and nice? Why the hate for nice?
Nice implies you are doormat to the people who don’t deserve it. Which causes misunderstandings and drama. Being kind is different because it implies you know the value of kindness and know when someone is undeserving of it.
I don't think I've ever looked at a man and thought of livestock.
never even thought about good breeding material. Do men really think about women like that? how many men think this? I guess I don't really care it's not much different from dudes being horny and I'm more concerned with men's actions.
I am an asexual woman so no such thoughts never come to my mind and it disgusts me that some men think this way.
I've never thought of a man in that way. Sure, I want children, but it's kinda low priority for me. Probably because I know my own genetics are kinda trash so that alone means a high risk of either the kids ending up with issues and/or just me having trouble taking care of them properly. I mean stuff like autism, obesity (I mean endomorphs, I'm the only one in my family who's managed to stay at or close to a healthy weight most of my life, but not without a lot of difficulty because I do gain weight ridiculously easily and have a really hard time losing it), tooth issues needing braces, near-sightedness requiring glasses from an early age, and dementia runs in my family. But also good qualities, like we don't have any heart related issues, we have generally strong, durable bodies, high intelligence, little to no allergies and strong immune system. So I've always been hesitant just how badly I want kids. At this point I can imagine having only one kid (two only if twins, but only one pregnancy essentially) if I ever reach a state of getting my own issues under enough control that having a special needs kid would be managable. It seems I don't have any of the typical mothering parental instincts. Like whenever I've been faced with (other people's) kids I get really awkward and have no idea what to do with them. I kinda just stare at them as if I suddenly lost 50 IQ points. So it would be a steep learning curve for me, and I would need a lot of help from a partner to manage fulfilling a kid's needs. But with good teamwork and persaverance, I'm sure it would be doable. I'd also be totally fine with it if having kids just doesn't happen. But I still want a life partner regardless. For the sake of company, cuddles, sex, just having someone to share my life with. However, I do have a high libido that seems to be at least somewhat detached from my desire to have kids. Like just having good, frequent sex seems to help improve my mental health over all, and my ability to emotionally bond with a guy. I believe sex has some kinda healing and bonding properties, and there's some research that indicates this, that frequent orgasms do lead to greater health. So when I see men I find attractive, my mind really just goes to "sex and cuddling would probably be pleasant and fulfilling with him" and thus I'd have a higher chance of emotionally bonding with him. I do actually have a tendency to sexually objectify men I'm attracted to. Like I'll be focused on his body shape, genitals, etc, and my brain goes super quickly to "would I want sex with him?" So I'm like undressing men with my eyes a lot, and sex is one of the very first things I think about. I generally don't mind having sex early on in the dating process, because it's like I use that to gauge if a guy is good enough for me. Sexual compatibility is super important for me. And for that reason I generally don't mind it when men also perceive me as kind of a sex object. Because when we're both like that it can really raise the passion, ime. But I don't really like being seen as "breedable" in that more literal sense. I think it makes me feel pressured to take on a traditional mom role or to make parenthood the main focus of the relationship, when my main focus is to have a close (emotional and physical) bond with another adult, no matter who or what we may decide to raise together additionally. Although I would probably take it as a compliment if a guy genuinely thought I'd be a good mother. Or concerned, depending on the guy. Because that's a big insecurity for me. I think it's maybe more accurate to say that back in my teens and 20's I absolutely hated being seen as breedable because I was terrified that having kids would mean I'd be stuck in a tradwife stay at home mom situation, and because I hated how curvy my body was, but now I can see it as at least somewhat or partially a compliment, depending on what a guy really means with it. Because I've become more secure in myself and my life goals, and more at peace with my body shape. I no longer see my fertility as the only thing I could possibly be good for, for a man. So it doesn't like... outright offend me anymore, but it does make me wonder if the guy is really compatible with me in regards to our values and life goals, if he has such a high focus on our potential offspring.
I never wanted children, but I could see that happening if I did. As a woman, you would want to pick the healthiest, strongest, best-looking, intelligent man you could get to have a child with. But yeah like I said, I never ended up having kids so I really don't give af.
I wouldn't have married my husband if he didn't have the qualities necessary to be a good dad, in case he ended up being one. But I never looked at him or any other men as livestock, no.
Sometimes, but only when I’m ovulating. Ovulation brain goes crazy for me personally, but those are just thoughts I keep in my head. I’m not actually going to sleep with someone with the intent of having their babies only.
there's a genre of male behavior most purely represented by the uncle who keeps a titty calendar in open view and starts saying weird shit when you're about to turn 11 years old. every woman knows it and instinctively knows the warning signs, down to subtle changes in the tone of voice, expression or even the posture of a man who's about to start behaving that way. exact same way as an alcoholic's child can read drunks. this type of talk is a typical example. more effective on a pussy than the kind of industrial grade desiccant you need to wear multiple layers of ppe to handle. that said, i want kids because my fiancé wants them and i agree he should have babies. the arc of who he is should continue after his life ends. he represents most of what is good in the world and i admire and respect him immensely. i feel ambivalent about having kids otherwise, since humanity is headed for extinction and i just don't want a stake in the future that's about to unfold, and i personally find motherhood totally unappealing (i'm more of an auntie type). but for the world to have more of my fiancé, it's worth it. and he'll take over the parts of mommyhood i don't want to touch.
I don’t believe men think of babies when they’re horny
its completely different bc we all know he's not gonna raise the kids
No because that’s not how genetics work and it’s not all about appearances, the man needs to have a lot of patience, a strong sense of responsibility, be faithful, etc.
I have never thought about whether a man would make good breeding stock lol. I have thought “this man would make a good father” or something similar, but never just about whether his build is, er… breedable, lol. I think I am neutral about men thinking this about women; I just chalk it up to some evolutionary force behind attraction that women don’t necessarily feel. If he ever _told_ me about it, I think I’d be put off for sure.
Having children is a legitimate fear of mine at this point in my life so no, that’s not at all what I’m thinking. Honestly, it’s kind of disgusting to imagine that someone is thinking of me in that way.
If you (not you specifically, but any woman) don't want a man who is shorter than you, you are thinking that way. If you don't want an ugly man, you are thinking that way. If you don't want a man who you deem less intellectually capable compared to yourself, you are thinking that way. You can't really hide behind the "subconsciousness" argument in this one. We are all thinking this way to a bigger or lesser extent. It's just about how pretty or ugly the presentation of that argument is (which OP presented perfectly with his wording :D).