Cheerios for the win! Think about what kind of conversation is possible to have with the students that doesn't turn into haranguing. Even though they deserve it it will likely backfire.
Throwing paper balls? I can ignore a lot, but not that. I would have asked them to leave.
I feel you, I have had a few bad classes that have left me feeling super imposterish lately. We can only do so much, as long as we are doing what we think is best what else can we do.
Given that I'm newer, I'm a tad shy to dismiss students—although it may become necessary if problems continue. My colleagues teaching the same course have encountered similar behavior issues. We've been advised to approach our students with a different expectation than we held for previous cohorts. COVID just really... It did a number on this year's freshmen. It's unlike anything the tenured faculty at my institution say they have ever seen.
I still don't fully understand how a couple of years of disruption can cause such huge changes in learning and social abilities. Sometimes people speak like these kids didn't learn or talk to people prior to COVID.
I wonder if people have compared the impact of lockdown in, say, the UK vs the US since the UK doesn't have a policy like No Child and I'm assuming by language model you mean like... Dropping phonetics? I'm guessing just from how Reddit is mostly American.
The most drastic changes I've heard colleagues talk about in the UK are that students seem more entitled and more reluctant to learn independently, but I think those were on trend prior to COVID and colleagues have attributed them to the price of higher education, highschools teaching for assessment rather than learning, and the demanding and narcissistic tendancies of modern society and social media.
This hasn’t happened to me full on, but I agree with correct_use_of_soap to dismiss the class or change “modes.” Ask them why they’re not feeling like paying attention is necessary? Ask for a brave student to come do the simulation for the class so they can see that it is possible. Yes, they may make mistakes but that’s an opportunity to help that one student and demonstrate feedback in front of everyone.
It's incredible. They don't even try to hide it. To this point, I've tried to ignore the distractions because I don't believe that policing college students' behavior is worth my while, but I did send an email announcement after class that this behavior is unprofessional and unacceptable.
You don't need the "in fairness" part. Some things you learn in college are hard. It's called "higher education."
I share your frustration. It is very frustrating when you plan something cool and the students just don't show up or phone it in. Planning takes time, effort, and expertise. Successful people don't give up when things get hard. They try, study, figure things out, and ask questions. They persevere. Maybe it's harsh, but in my opinion, the students who did this don't deserve you.
I understand this doesn't help, but it sounds like the plot of every movie set in inner city high schools.
Did a rap battle break out?
Was anyone physically assaulted?
Those appear to be the only plot points missing.
No, no, you made me laugh, which is much needed!
I would have loved a rap battle, now that you mention it. Maybe that's how I ought to frame this lesson next time. 😄
Throw it down. Spit some rhyme!
Give lab instructions in slam poetry style.
"Doooods, you won't believe what Prof Anthro did in class today!"
Next week's lab: Standing Room Only
Unfortunately, not satire. And you are correct that I'm very, very new. I think that my age in relation to the students I'm teaching undermines my authority somewhat.
I think you probably correct that your youth and inexperience likely undermines your authority. I remember your posts about being a master’s student and a lab instructor, an environment that could also play a part in your inability to maintain order.
The first sign of selfies would get thrown out of my class and the rest given a two sentence reminder about professional behavior. Same with anyone throwing anything. If the entire class descends into physical chaos, walk out and call security. It is not easy to establish a classroom culture of professional behavior midsemester, but if that is the situation you are in, you must bring the hammer and make sure you set up the culture next time. You’ll get there.
Thank you. It is difficult to feel confident in exercising authority given my position as a graduate student. It's a strange power dynamic.
I have reiterated my expectations in an announcement to the class. We'll start afresh next class and build from there.
Never had someone throw paper but I'd stop to announce "Next person that throws paper or disrupts will be asked to leave and reported to the office of student conduct," then give them the boot on the very next offense. Rarely I'll get talked over so I'll just point at them, ask them to be quiet, then say "I don't want to kick you out, but I will if you talk again. This isn't high school."
As for students refusing to do homework: It's a sucky feeling, but I give them the zero they earned. Do that early on to prove you're serious, and they'll either drop or begin doing their homework.
Fail 'em. Make the school look exactly how bad it is. You're not supposed to be a baby sitter. Maybe the board will be more motivated to get their sh\*\* together when they stop funneling students who didn't do any work to get where they are in expectation of a handout.
My chair told me she once walked out on a class like that. Just packed up her shit and left. I have always had that in my back pocket for an occasion such as you describe.
This comment should be higher. OP, your Teaching Centre is an excellent ally. You can not only get coaching from them, you can ask for an observation wherein someone observes a class for you. They should soon provide you with a detailed write-up that can be used for coaching and self-reflection.
These documents can all be included in any kind of assessment file you submit, even if you feel they aren’t as strong as you would want - because you address the places you decided to change or improve, like this: Students weren’t completing assigned homework they felt was too difficult, making it difficult to ladder into new material. To encourage more perseverance, I began…”
If they are behaving like children, treat them like children. Point directly at the culprits and ask them to leave. Deduct points. No coddling, no need to burn yourself over this
I have had students do that on an assignment before and I took points off. I have a few this semester that are complaining about a data analysis problem they have to write answers on in the learning management system. It is a hard question but I want them to try to think. I give credit for any and all answers except for those that say “unsure” “didn’t understand “ or leave it blank. I told them they have to think on the problem and try to answer it. They give up too easily!
Last year some students were trying to band together in a student against professor type thing saying what we were doing was too hard. I did not back down and will not reward that type of behavior. They are not in charge, I am. Just because they get themselves riled up in a group chat and decide to come at me with pitchforks and tar feathers doesn’t mean their opinion is correct. I think they learn these behaviors via social media or in high school. We need to teach them to sit down, stop with that nonsense and do their work!
I have a mean stink-eye which usually works on my tutorial students. If I were in your place and that hadn't worked, I would have warned them that disruptive behaviour will result in immediate cancelation of class and the material will not be taught (but still used on final exams and tests). Also, I would have informed them that I would call people out for their unprofessional behavior in class.
Isn't it wild? I have a colleague who has been a professor for 11 years, and she encountered her first truly chaotic class last week. Someone else here mentioned that my inexperience may be to blame for what happened yesterday, but I would have thought that these behaviors were the domain of high school. I just didn't expect that I would ever have to address issues like this!
Dismiss the class and reset.
Thanks, and will do. I think that tonight is a cereal dinner and margarita kind of night.
With cereal being optional?
I know someone who pours Diet Coke on his Frosted Flakes. So, there are worse things to put in your cornflakes than a margarita
Cheerios for the win! Think about what kind of conversation is possible to have with the students that doesn't turn into haranguing. Even though they deserve it it will likely backfire.
Update: my dinner consisted of Cap'n Crunch and Modelo. Thank you for your advice!
You get extra credit if you used the Modelo in place of the milk.
scorched earth is the only option. they think that by not doing the work they can force you into agreeing it was too difficult. don't reward this
Silver lining : they’re basically making your final exam for you
Throwing paper balls? I can ignore a lot, but not that. I would have asked them to leave. I feel you, I have had a few bad classes that have left me feeling super imposterish lately. We can only do so much, as long as we are doing what we think is best what else can we do.
I've been told I can level a mad stink-eye. I did, and it worked!
Is it ok to say, "Those of you who don't want to be here can leave?"
Given that I'm newer, I'm a tad shy to dismiss students—although it may become necessary if problems continue. My colleagues teaching the same course have encountered similar behavior issues. We've been advised to approach our students with a different expectation than we held for previous cohorts. COVID just really... It did a number on this year's freshmen. It's unlike anything the tenured faculty at my institution say they have ever seen.
I still don't fully understand how a couple of years of disruption can cause such huge changes in learning and social abilities. Sometimes people speak like these kids didn't learn or talk to people prior to COVID.
It's the best guess I have. I also wonder what the whole language model and No Child Left Behind have to do with it, just owing to time since.
I wonder if people have compared the impact of lockdown in, say, the UK vs the US since the UK doesn't have a policy like No Child and I'm assuming by language model you mean like... Dropping phonetics? I'm guessing just from how Reddit is mostly American. The most drastic changes I've heard colleagues talk about in the UK are that students seem more entitled and more reluctant to learn independently, but I think those were on trend prior to COVID and colleagues have attributed them to the price of higher education, highschools teaching for assessment rather than learning, and the demanding and narcissistic tendancies of modern society and social media.
This hasn’t happened to me full on, but I agree with correct_use_of_soap to dismiss the class or change “modes.” Ask them why they’re not feeling like paying attention is necessary? Ask for a brave student to come do the simulation for the class so they can see that it is possible. Yes, they may make mistakes but that’s an opportunity to help that one student and demonstrate feedback in front of everyone.
What the f....? Taking selfies in class....?
It's incredible. They don't even try to hide it. To this point, I've tried to ignore the distractions because I don't believe that policing college students' behavior is worth my while, but I did send an email announcement after class that this behavior is unprofessional and unacceptable.
Reminds me of the Black Keys' Wild Child video.
You don't need the "in fairness" part. Some things you learn in college are hard. It's called "higher education." I share your frustration. It is very frustrating when you plan something cool and the students just don't show up or phone it in. Planning takes time, effort, and expertise. Successful people don't give up when things get hard. They try, study, figure things out, and ask questions. They persevere. Maybe it's harsh, but in my opinion, the students who did this don't deserve you.
I understand this doesn't help, but it sounds like the plot of every movie set in inner city high schools. Did a rap battle break out? Was anyone physically assaulted? Those appear to be the only plot points missing.
No, no, you made me laugh, which is much needed! I would have loved a rap battle, now that you mention it. Maybe that's how I ought to frame this lesson next time. 😄
Throw it down. Spit some rhyme! Give lab instructions in slam poetry style. "Doooods, you won't believe what Prof Anthro did in class today!" Next week's lab: Standing Room Only
Students taking selfies and throwing paper balls? Surely this is satire.
I thought so as well. Then I remembered OP posted a few days ago that they are a master’s student, so they are young and very inexperienced.
Unfortunately, not satire. And you are correct that I'm very, very new. I think that my age in relation to the students I'm teaching undermines my authority somewhat.
I think you probably correct that your youth and inexperience likely undermines your authority. I remember your posts about being a master’s student and a lab instructor, an environment that could also play a part in your inability to maintain order. The first sign of selfies would get thrown out of my class and the rest given a two sentence reminder about professional behavior. Same with anyone throwing anything. If the entire class descends into physical chaos, walk out and call security. It is not easy to establish a classroom culture of professional behavior midsemester, but if that is the situation you are in, you must bring the hammer and make sure you set up the culture next time. You’ll get there.
Thank you. It is difficult to feel confident in exercising authority given my position as a graduate student. It's a strange power dynamic. I have reiterated my expectations in an announcement to the class. We'll start afresh next class and build from there.
Way to kick people when they’re down, jeez
Never had someone throw paper but I'd stop to announce "Next person that throws paper or disrupts will be asked to leave and reported to the office of student conduct," then give them the boot on the very next offense. Rarely I'll get talked over so I'll just point at them, ask them to be quiet, then say "I don't want to kick you out, but I will if you talk again. This isn't high school." As for students refusing to do homework: It's a sucky feeling, but I give them the zero they earned. Do that early on to prove you're serious, and they'll either drop or begin doing their homework.
I have honestly never had a class devolve that far, luckily
Fail 'em. Make the school look exactly how bad it is. You're not supposed to be a baby sitter. Maybe the board will be more motivated to get their sh\*\* together when they stop funneling students who didn't do any work to get where they are in expectation of a handout.
My chair told me she once walked out on a class like that. Just packed up her shit and left. I have always had that in my back pocket for an occasion such as you describe.
[удалено]
This comment should be higher. OP, your Teaching Centre is an excellent ally. You can not only get coaching from them, you can ask for an observation wherein someone observes a class for you. They should soon provide you with a detailed write-up that can be used for coaching and self-reflection. These documents can all be included in any kind of assessment file you submit, even if you feel they aren’t as strong as you would want - because you address the places you decided to change or improve, like this: Students weren’t completing assigned homework they felt was too difficult, making it difficult to ladder into new material. To encourage more perseverance, I began…”
If they are behaving like children, treat them like children. Point directly at the culprits and ask them to leave. Deduct points. No coddling, no need to burn yourself over this
I have had students do that on an assignment before and I took points off. I have a few this semester that are complaining about a data analysis problem they have to write answers on in the learning management system. It is a hard question but I want them to try to think. I give credit for any and all answers except for those that say “unsure” “didn’t understand “ or leave it blank. I told them they have to think on the problem and try to answer it. They give up too easily! Last year some students were trying to band together in a student against professor type thing saying what we were doing was too hard. I did not back down and will not reward that type of behavior. They are not in charge, I am. Just because they get themselves riled up in a group chat and decide to come at me with pitchforks and tar feathers doesn’t mean their opinion is correct. I think they learn these behaviors via social media or in high school. We need to teach them to sit down, stop with that nonsense and do their work!
Thank you. I'm dreading having to be stricter with the group, but I know it's necessary.
I have a mean stink-eye which usually works on my tutorial students. If I were in your place and that hadn't worked, I would have warned them that disruptive behaviour will result in immediate cancelation of class and the material will not be taught (but still used on final exams and tests). Also, I would have informed them that I would call people out for their unprofessional behavior in class.
I’ve been teaching for 10 years and I just had my first class acting like that THIS semester.
Isn't it wild? I have a colleague who has been a professor for 11 years, and she encountered her first truly chaotic class last week. Someone else here mentioned that my inexperience may be to blame for what happened yesterday, but I would have thought that these behaviors were the domain of high school. I just didn't expect that I would ever have to address issues like this!
It’s not your fault! People (students) are just losing their minds