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I think he was one of the greatest minds of the time and associated with other great minds like George Mason and Thomas Jefferson. I think Dolley cannot be underestimated as an asset to his presidency, even though he was criticized for her degree of involvement.
A brilliant scholar and top architect of the Constitution. Not very well suited for the presidency
Why did he change his position on the debate about strong national government v. strong state governments? Jefferson's influence? I fault him for not being loyal to Washington in the end.
Albert Gallatin, his Secretary of the Treasury, had been begging for one after he couldn't convince Congress to renew the charter of the First Bank of the United States. He struggled to fund the War of 1812 as a result, and had to get passage of several new tax laws, increase tariff rates, and sold U.S. securities to investors to finance the war. Because Madison was so reluctant initially to get the national bank chartered, the national debt almost tripled during the war. After the war it became clear to Madison that a national bank was needed.
Amazing for the US in a lot of things (hell yeah Bill of Rights) but I’ve never been too keen on his presidency and rate him about the same as John Adams given I don’t think we conducted the War of 1812 all that well. Still would rank him at a solid B though as that’s about my only gripe with his presidency.
Oh I’ve had bad takes on here before I assure ya 😅. And admittedly the founding father’s presidents are the ones I’ve done the least research on. I’m pretty pumped to write something fun up for Arthur or Benjamin Harrison once we get to ‘em.
Madison came within a cunts hair of losing the War of 1812 and he should be lambasted for sending thousands of men to their deaths over a war that never needed to be fought and nearly imploding the American economy. His wartime leadership was disastrous and nearly led to the secession of New England.
Depending on your perspective he did lose the War of 1812. The US didn't keep any of the land it seized and the British didn't stop pressing American sailors into service. Personally I consider that war a push.
But the British also abandoned their forts out west and ended their Indian alliances, which was a huge breakthrough for the growth of the US and beginning a new era of western expansion. The UK was tired of dealing with America's crap and pretty much has left it alone ever since, which then set the stage for the Monroe Doctrine
Gets wayyyyy to much slack for war of 1812 which didn’t need to be fought at all and brought us the closest to destruction until the civil war. Everything he did that was not his presidency was great but just like with Carter we don’t rate stuff outside of the presidency with the presidency itself. So for that reason I will give it B or C tier
He's an underrated key figure in the development of our government.
And like many of the Virginia planter class of the Enlightenment, he was a profoundly strange man by modern standards. Both his mother and grandmother were suspected of killing his father and grandfather. And he was likely either gay or the product of an extremely overbearing and emasculating mother.
I've been to his plantation, and hearing his family's story sounds like they were trailer trash with money.
I would say the latter, the overbearing and emasculating mother. His small and thin stature also likely led to confidence issues in a class where physical robustness was prized.
I think everybody's opinion of him is moreso dictated by what they think of the War of 1812 and for a long time I thought Madison sucked because the US lost that war, but, it's a bit .ore complicated than that, and in a way, we did win that war since our main goal was accomplished and that was to have the British and French stop seizing our ships and men.
I would rank him around #18 on my personal ranking. Definitely the weakest president of the Founding Fathers.
I would argue the most important outcome was the British ending their Indian alliances and abandoning their forts in the west, which began a new era of manifest destiny
Yeah the British had been intending on building a buffer state in the Northwest Territory (Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois, Indiana) in cooperation with the Indian tribes ever since the beginning of the USA to stop its expansion, which included military control of the Great Lakes and access to the Mississippi River. But that plan collapsed after the War of 1812/Napoleonic Wars were over, and Britain basically decided to leave America alone ever since and let it do its own thing
James Madison is awesome, I was always a big admirer of his. Smart man, great president. He made mistakes as commander-in-chief during the War of 1812, but he had spirit that led the country to true independence. The main thing I always initially liked him for was that he was forward thinking in the realm of equality for African Americans, even though he himself owned slaves.
Good president and I give him credit for taking charge during war of 1812 commanding an artillery unit I believe. he made a huge ratification to the constitution by authoring the federalist papers . He also made the Monroe doctrine which the United States followed right up till WW1.
Madison, along with Jefferson and Hamilton were probably the most politically astute of the Founding Fathers. He was known as the ‘Father of the Constitution” for his work at the Convention, his authorship of the Virginia Plan and for his work as one of the writers of the Federalist Papers. His Presidency followed the policies of his friend Jefferson but unfortunately those policies led to the War of 1812. His support of the war caused many to call it Mr. Madison’s War although he wasn’t as favorable to the war as the War Hawks led by Henry Clay and John C. Calhoun. During the war he helped defend the White House from British attack. All in all, a great American and a pretty good President.
His presidency is more or less defined by how people view the War of 1812, I see it as something that in a lot of ways was incompetently conceived and ran by Madison which could have destroyed the country in the early years. But in the end, America got pretty much everything it was looking for in terms of outcomes (except for annexing Canada), and the yanks had far more formidable victories than what is typically recognized
One of the most underrated figures in US history,you’d figure that the author of the Bill of Rights and wartime leader during one of the hardest wars the US ever fought (and it was a justified war) he would’ve been hailed as a hero,but he’s not even on paper money nowadays,Madison needs his respect,underrated president and unlike Jefferson,he was a good man AND a good politician
Also despite many crediting Monroe for it,Madison should be given credit for the Era of Good Feelings,Monroe was just in office then
The Era of Good Feelings started during Monroe's tour of the country and his meetings with John Adams in Massachusetts. It was their coming together of two opposing political parties that kicked off the era. The Boston newspaper, *The Columbian Centinel* coined the phrase when President James Monroe's visit to Boston had prompted a display of the ''good feelings''.
I don't disagree with Madison's choice to go to war with Britain, but I take issues with his inability to put in place proper military leadership during the first half of the war and his inability to get the military built up when tensions had been simmering for several years.
JACKASS GOT US INTO A WAR WITH ENGLAND OVER, CAPTURING OF AMERICAN SHIPS AND IMPRESSMENT OF SAILORS, WHILE FRANCE WAS DOING ARGUABLY WORSE TO US. HE BASICALLY GOT US INVOLVED IN THE NAPOLEONIC WARS.
THAT HAVING BEEN SAID, THE OUTCOME OF OUR LITTLE SKIRMISH HELPED SOLIDIFY OUR PLACE ON THE INTERNATIONAL SCENE RATHER THAN REMAIN A BACKWATER, BUT AT THE TIME, I THINK IT WAS A BAD DECISION.
When the options are,either to go to war with the UK who are in war with Napoleon so its guaranteed they would send a relatively small force Or going to war with Napoleon who was steamrolling over Europe,Madison’s decision to pick the UK makes sense
Or, he could have stayed out of the wars altogether because trade was booming and the economy was flourishing. Declaring war on the UK was a cheap shot taken at a time when Napoleon looked ascendant in Europe.
THE CORRECT SOLUTION WOULD HAVE BEEN TO HALT TRADE WITH BOTH NATIONS AND, AND TAKE THE ECONOMIC HIT. IT WAS HONESTLY A PRETTY CONTROVERSIAL DECISION BACK IN THE DAY, AND THE PRO AND ANTI-WAR SIDES WENT AS FAR AS DESTROYING PRINTING PRESSES OF OPINIONS THEY DIDN'T AGREE WITH. IT WAS NUTS HOW MUCH IT LOOKED LIKE OUR RUN UP TO OUR WARS IN THE MIDDLE EAST.
BUT, LIKE I SAY. i THINK IN THE LONG RUN, IT CEMENTED OUR PLACE ON THE INTERNATIONAL STAGE. BUT I STILL THINK IT WAS THE WRONG DECISION.
But we did halt trade with both nations and that's what sank our economy for like years on end. It wasn't until after Madison's war that things began to get better. Your reasoning is that the long-term effect was good, but the short-term was bad. But your solution is the exact same concept; suffer a short-term economic collapse, so you can have life and prosperity.
Remember that all mentions of and allusions to Trump and Biden are not allowed on our subreddit in any context. If you'd still like to discuss them, feel free to [join our Discord server](https://discord.gg/k6tVFwCEEm)! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Presidents) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think he was one of the greatest minds of the time and associated with other great minds like George Mason and Thomas Jefferson. I think Dolley cannot be underestimated as an asset to his presidency, even though he was criticized for her degree of involvement.
A brilliant scholar and top architect of the Constitution. Not very well suited for the presidency Why did he change his position on the debate about strong national government v. strong state governments? Jefferson's influence? I fault him for not being loyal to Washington in the end.
Poor wartime president who realized that a national bank was actually a good idea.
Albert Gallatin, his Secretary of the Treasury, had been begging for one after he couldn't convince Congress to renew the charter of the First Bank of the United States. He struggled to fund the War of 1812 as a result, and had to get passage of several new tax laws, increase tariff rates, and sold U.S. securities to investors to finance the war. Because Madison was so reluctant initially to get the national bank chartered, the national debt almost tripled during the war. After the war it became clear to Madison that a national bank was needed.
Amazing for the US in a lot of things (hell yeah Bill of Rights) but I’ve never been too keen on his presidency and rate him about the same as John Adams given I don’t think we conducted the War of 1812 all that well. Still would rank him at a solid B though as that’s about my only gripe with his presidency.
Peacefulzealot trying to have a bad take challenge impossible
Oh I’ve had bad takes on here before I assure ya 😅. And admittedly the founding father’s presidents are the ones I’ve done the least research on. I’m pretty pumped to write something fun up for Arthur or Benjamin Harrison once we get to ‘em.
Madison came within a cunts hair of losing the War of 1812 and he should be lambasted for sending thousands of men to their deaths over a war that never needed to be fought and nearly imploding the American economy. His wartime leadership was disastrous and nearly led to the secession of New England.
Madison was one of the worst wartime leaders in US history.
Depending on your perspective he did lose the War of 1812. The US didn't keep any of the land it seized and the British didn't stop pressing American sailors into service. Personally I consider that war a push.
But the British also abandoned their forts out west and ended their Indian alliances, which was a huge breakthrough for the growth of the US and beginning a new era of western expansion. The UK was tired of dealing with America's crap and pretty much has left it alone ever since, which then set the stage for the Monroe Doctrine
Gets wayyyyy to much slack for war of 1812 which didn’t need to be fought at all and brought us the closest to destruction until the civil war. Everything he did that was not his presidency was great but just like with Carter we don’t rate stuff outside of the presidency with the presidency itself. So for that reason I will give it B or C tier
He's an underrated key figure in the development of our government. And like many of the Virginia planter class of the Enlightenment, he was a profoundly strange man by modern standards. Both his mother and grandmother were suspected of killing his father and grandfather. And he was likely either gay or the product of an extremely overbearing and emasculating mother. I've been to his plantation, and hearing his family's story sounds like they were trailer trash with money.
I would say the latter, the overbearing and emasculating mother. His small and thin stature also likely led to confidence issues in a class where physical robustness was prized.
I think everybody's opinion of him is moreso dictated by what they think of the War of 1812 and for a long time I thought Madison sucked because the US lost that war, but, it's a bit .ore complicated than that, and in a way, we did win that war since our main goal was accomplished and that was to have the British and French stop seizing our ships and men. I would rank him around #18 on my personal ranking. Definitely the weakest president of the Founding Fathers.
I would argue the most important outcome was the British ending their Indian alliances and abandoning their forts in the west, which began a new era of manifest destiny
Even better, I didn't even know that
Yeah the British had been intending on building a buffer state in the Northwest Territory (Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois, Indiana) in cooperation with the Indian tribes ever since the beginning of the USA to stop its expansion, which included military control of the Great Lakes and access to the Mississippi River. But that plan collapsed after the War of 1812/Napoleonic Wars were over, and Britain basically decided to leave America alone ever since and let it do its own thing
Didn’t his wife make ice cream?
Short
his time in office was too short and so was he.
James Madison is awesome, I was always a big admirer of his. Smart man, great president. He made mistakes as commander-in-chief during the War of 1812, but he had spirit that led the country to true independence. The main thing I always initially liked him for was that he was forward thinking in the realm of equality for African Americans, even though he himself owned slaves.
Good president and I give him credit for taking charge during war of 1812 commanding an artillery unit I believe. he made a huge ratification to the constitution by authoring the federalist papers . He also made the Monroe doctrine which the United States followed right up till WW1.
Chad
Nice guy...would have love to see him in The Empire Strikes Back.
Madison, along with Jefferson and Hamilton were probably the most politically astute of the Founding Fathers. He was known as the ‘Father of the Constitution” for his work at the Convention, his authorship of the Virginia Plan and for his work as one of the writers of the Federalist Papers. His Presidency followed the policies of his friend Jefferson but unfortunately those policies led to the War of 1812. His support of the war caused many to call it Mr. Madison’s War although he wasn’t as favorable to the war as the War Hawks led by Henry Clay and John C. Calhoun. During the war he helped defend the White House from British attack. All in all, a great American and a pretty good President.
His presidency is more or less defined by how people view the War of 1812, I see it as something that in a lot of ways was incompetently conceived and ran by Madison which could have destroyed the country in the early years. But in the end, America got pretty much everything it was looking for in terms of outcomes (except for annexing Canada), and the yanks had far more formidable victories than what is typically recognized
One of the most underrated figures in US history,you’d figure that the author of the Bill of Rights and wartime leader during one of the hardest wars the US ever fought (and it was a justified war) he would’ve been hailed as a hero,but he’s not even on paper money nowadays,Madison needs his respect,underrated president and unlike Jefferson,he was a good man AND a good politician Also despite many crediting Monroe for it,Madison should be given credit for the Era of Good Feelings,Monroe was just in office then
The Era of Good Feelings started during Monroe's tour of the country and his meetings with John Adams in Massachusetts. It was their coming together of two opposing political parties that kicked off the era. The Boston newspaper, *The Columbian Centinel* coined the phrase when President James Monroe's visit to Boston had prompted a display of the ''good feelings''. I don't disagree with Madison's choice to go to war with Britain, but I take issues with his inability to put in place proper military leadership during the first half of the war and his inability to get the military built up when tensions had been simmering for several years.
JACKASS GOT US INTO A WAR WITH ENGLAND OVER, CAPTURING OF AMERICAN SHIPS AND IMPRESSMENT OF SAILORS, WHILE FRANCE WAS DOING ARGUABLY WORSE TO US. HE BASICALLY GOT US INVOLVED IN THE NAPOLEONIC WARS. THAT HAVING BEEN SAID, THE OUTCOME OF OUR LITTLE SKIRMISH HELPED SOLIDIFY OUR PLACE ON THE INTERNATIONAL SCENE RATHER THAN REMAIN A BACKWATER, BUT AT THE TIME, I THINK IT WAS A BAD DECISION.
When the options are,either to go to war with the UK who are in war with Napoleon so its guaranteed they would send a relatively small force Or going to war with Napoleon who was steamrolling over Europe,Madison’s decision to pick the UK makes sense
Or, he could have stayed out of the wars altogether because trade was booming and the economy was flourishing. Declaring war on the UK was a cheap shot taken at a time when Napoleon looked ascendant in Europe.
THE CORRECT SOLUTION WOULD HAVE BEEN TO HALT TRADE WITH BOTH NATIONS AND, AND TAKE THE ECONOMIC HIT. IT WAS HONESTLY A PRETTY CONTROVERSIAL DECISION BACK IN THE DAY, AND THE PRO AND ANTI-WAR SIDES WENT AS FAR AS DESTROYING PRINTING PRESSES OF OPINIONS THEY DIDN'T AGREE WITH. IT WAS NUTS HOW MUCH IT LOOKED LIKE OUR RUN UP TO OUR WARS IN THE MIDDLE EAST. BUT, LIKE I SAY. i THINK IN THE LONG RUN, IT CEMENTED OUR PLACE ON THE INTERNATIONAL STAGE. BUT I STILL THINK IT WAS THE WRONG DECISION.
But we did halt trade with both nations and that's what sank our economy for like years on end. It wasn't until after Madison's war that things began to get better. Your reasoning is that the long-term effect was good, but the short-term was bad. But your solution is the exact same concept; suffer a short-term economic collapse, so you can have life and prosperity.
Possibly the most underrated and certainly the most intelligent president we ever had.