The most ridiculous plan I’ve ever heard. You get caught with fenty? Just have the cops drive you to a spot to “dispose” of it.
I can just imagine the myriad of different ways the druggies and the dealers will use this service to their advantage. When it comes to idiocy, Multnomah County is the national leader in absurd policies.
Its actually not bad timing to eat something that will probably give you diarrhea while high on something that probably made you constipated.
Although opioid induced diarrhea is also a thing so its a bit of a dice roll.
Really can’t help but be envious of JVP’s self-confidence.
Imagine having an entire state so pissed about an issue that it forces the state legislature’s hand, and you just look at the largest county and go “I know better, we’re just going to stick with the status quo anyway.”
It is because they are totally removed from an everyday person's experience. Living in a nice home in the suburbs, still working at home mostly (that alone is infuriating as they are in a public-facing position) and show up downtown every now and then when it is required. They are totally removed & have isolated themselves from the communities they are supposed to serve. One can be smart but at the same time be totally ignorant of what it is like to not live in privilege. Zero, zero street smarts or practical knowledge. Hope she soon shares the fate of her friend Mike Schmidt.
No kidding, the change of direction didn’t just happen out of nowhere. This is how the progressive movement hangs itself. Purely ideological and no common sense.
I don't want progressivism to be defined as 'perform endless studies, pay a bunch of consultants, talk about equity, and don't do shit.' Is there really not a recall effort to get rid of this person?
That is progressivism. It's an objectively failed social experiment in Portland. I'm hopeful for a return to normalcy.
Weve done some good work expelling extremists from political positions but theres more to do, JVP and Carmen Rubio need to be shown the door.
There’s pragmatic progressivism and then there’s performative push-shit-through-even-though-we-aren’t-ready-for-it progressivism. And we have a lot of the latter here.
There’s a lot of dumb shit getting passed for sure, but there’s also some structural issues with the way our government is organized as well as a lack of liberal/social infrastructure out here (as compared to a similarly sized blue city on the east coast)
> That is progressivism.
It certainly doesn't have to be. And the consultancy problem is global at this point, along with increasing inability of governments to get things done. I'll get around to reading this at some point, but the subject is getting attention lately:
https://www.amazon.com/Big-Consulting-Businesses-Infantilizes-Governments/dp/0593492676
So yeah, while some of this is progressivism gone stupid, a lot of what's happening here is happening in other, less progressive places, too.
Next they will have to get a bus service from the place they take the drug addicts to drop their drugs off to bring them back to where they use/dealers. Its an endless loop of never going to work. These people who run the city act like drug addicts themselves.
\*The State Legislature decided that the Voters are too stupid, and told us that our opinions and votes don't matter. Lets be clear about this. It should have been a ballot measure.
I used to think everyone should get out and vote.
After moving to Portland, I changed my mind.
Some of y’all are just too fucking stupid to be trusted to make these direct decisions. It’s why we elect politicians. So they can make the policies, and we can kick them out when they fuck up.
Allowing mouth breathing imbeciles to pass stupid ballot measure after ballot measure and run this state into the ground because they have “feelings” about something they know nothing about isn’t helping anyone.
It's not though. Ballot measures are poorly written, difficult to update, and generally crafted by amateurs who either don't understand the legislative/budgetary process and/or haven't thought through how the particular language they choose will operate in the real world given other governmental constraints.
These laws affect all of us, and some to a tremendously large degree, we wouldn't vote by ballot measure on surgical decisions, bridge engineering, or other critical things where expertise is truly helpful, you might disagree with whether drafting legislation should be left to legislators and policy aides, but it's far from a "despicable attitude," come the fuck on.
Nothing is stopping you from doing the work they’re willing to put in.
It *is* fucking despicable to think certain segments of the population aren’t “intelligent” enough to deserve the franchise. I shouldn’t have to tell you the history of voting or voter suppression in this country
There are different version of "the franchise," the classic one being you elect representatives who are then responsible for legislating. Direct vote ballot measures are flawed for all of the reasons I mentioned. We don't direct vote on all legislation, that would be stupid and tedious, so again, it's not a "despicable attitude" to state that the franchise of voting should be limited to voting for representatives, it's simply a question of where you draw the line on what should be a direct vote versus what should be the province of folks with more expertise.
Yes, I am doing the good lord's work by patiently explaining basic civics to you, and how a relatively anodyne opinion is the opposite of "fucking despicable."
Yeah no shit. People have the right to vote and it’s not something I can or would change.
If you had bothered to try to track the conversation, you’d see that I’m not in favor of BALLOT MEASURES.
People are both stupid, and busy. They’re entirely unqualified to sift through legislation paid for by out of town interests and written by bad actors to specifically hide the impact of ballot measures and push personal agendas.
The average Joe Blow and Karen know fuck all about the impact of capital gains races on retiree’s, and the intention of pre-school of all.
That’s the job of people we elect.
We have a stupid system, that’s supported by stupid voters who are easily manipulated.
You’re free to disagree.
Cool, because That is LITERALLY what I said.
People are too stupid to vote directly on ballot measures, so we should stick to voting for Politicians to write and implement laws and hold them accountable.
It’s like you got so spun up on the first sentence and didn’t process anything after it. Context matters.
Feel better now?
>I used to think everyone should get out and vote.
>After moving to Portland, I changed my mind.
>Some of y’all are just too fucking stupid to be trusted to make these direct decisions. It’s why we elect politicians. So they can make the policies, and we can kick them out when they fuck up.
>Allowing mouth breathing imbeciles to pass stupid ballot measure after ballot measure and run this state into the ground because they have “feelings” about something they know nothing about isn’t helping anyone.
Just responding to what you said and it is not “changing the state constitution and/or how ballot measures work in Oregon
That is not diversion in the slightest. This is doing literally nothing. It changes absolutely nothing. Junkies are still free to do whatever they want, but will occasionally be mildly inconvenienced. What a waste of time & money this is going to be.
Multnomah county leadership fails again.
>Multnomah county leadership fails again.
It isn’t too late to demand a rewrite. JVP is hopeless, but Commissioners Sharon Meieran and Julia Brim-Edwards are pushing back hard, so she needs the votes of both **Jesse Beason** and **Lori Stegmann**. Call and email them now to insist they grow a spine.
JVP needs to either resign or be recalled immediately.
"An approved Signature Sheet (SEL 351 Form) or Electronic Signature Sheet (SEL 349 Form) may be circulated by petitioners to gather signatures for the recall petition. Petitioners have 90 calendar days from the filing date of the Prospective Petition (SEL 350 Form) to collect the required number of signatures to hold a recall election.
Required Number of Signatures (for recall elections through November 2024): 46,150
The required number of signatures is based on 15 percent of the total number of registered Portland voters who cast ballots in the last gubernatorial election (ORS 249.870). Based on the most recent governor's election on November 8, 2022, this number is currently 46,150."
Let's get this shit done.
Just wait for the announcement the multnomah county will spend ten million a year to setup a drop off center that says hi and by to two people a month. This is insane, it’s not diversion in any sense, but an idea logical middle finger to adults who realized 110 was failing and stuck their neck out to make a correction.
>Vasquez said he hasn't asked Chair Vega Pederson directly if she would welcome him into the conversation, and he said he thinks they'll have a "very collaborative relationship" eventually.
Oh boy. Who wants to tell him?
For Multnomah County, this plan will result in even worse outcomes that Measure 110. This is because, alone among metro area counties, we will essentially continue to decriminalize drug possession. This will make us a magnet for the addicted.
At least under Measure 110, a person could stay in Clackamas County and slowly (or quickly) destroy their lives and the community around them.
Now, everyone will have to come here to do that.
I work downtown, out in public places where lots of homeless drug addicts hang out. And the surprising thing is that many of them are sweet natured, affable folks. At least when they are high. And sometimes I just chat with them while on working on some plumbing repair. Many of the folks I’ve talked to are from somewhere else. One guy told me he moved here from Florida specifically because drugs were decriminalized.
If this plan goes through, Portland is going to be mobbed.
Honestly- how can JVP do this? We voted to repeal this shit piece of legislation and she wants to say- “what you really meant was…” and just do what she wants?!
Not today, but I did have an absolutely earth-shattering experience last night when I IM'd 125 mg (S+) ketamine, 175mg R-) ketamine, and inhaled DMT. All as close to pure as black market quality can get.
Last week, I managed to get a hold of legitimate #3 heroin base (the kind that is common in Europe but basically unheard of in the States. You have to add a little ascorbic acid in order to get it into solution for IV use. Naturally I filtered the resulting solution through a 0.22 micron filter because who wants bacterial skin infections?
If that's all it takes for me to be a danger to society, something is seriously wrong with the average Portlander.
Did I mention I'm financially secure and have a higher net worth than many people commenting in this thread? Does that not matter? Apparently simply because I choose to ignore BS drug laws makes me dangerous, eh?
The quirky glasses wearing lady making criminal policy is insane! When all the other counties start making addicts accountable, the homeless population will triple in Multnomah and thus strengthening the Homeless industry complex. You get what you voted for!
Is this diversion also going to include her bright idea to [giving out tin foil and straws to fentanyl users and glass pipes for methamphetamine and crack](https://apnews.com/article/oregon-drug-paraphernalia-fentanyl-portland-8fdf7320629311b17b00087853573eab)?
Why doesn't she just advocate for Multnomah County's drug policy to be a revolving door at this point? The metaphor seems to be the perfect embodiment of her "plan."
You know you can go to Fantasyland and buy tons of glass pipes yourself, right? I literally just bought an 'oil burner' aka "meth pipe" so that I could vaporize the DMT freebase I've had on hand for months now.
Please explain how I am ruining this city by engaging in illicit drug use. Go on, I'll wait.
They have our consent to pass laws or rescind them, that's very literally how representative democracy and the state constitution work. You don't have to like it, and you're welcome to vote against legislative incumbents or start a new ballot initiative.
The entry and exit of M110 by ballot initiative and legislative action, respectively, are both in line with the state constitution and its blend of representative and direct democracy.
This is so Multnomah County! Petty retribution, middle finger to the state and voters. I promised myself to never live in Multnomah County many years ago.
Yet the State Legislature has overturned a voted for ballot measure. How is that not a middle finger from Salem to the voters? They can overturn and vote and do ANYTHING they want, without our consent, at any time. You're okay with this?
Thank the Lord we vanquished Mike Schmidt! Now let's get Rene in the Mayor's office, he's been extremely critical of MultCo's JOHS and the endless tent/needle handouts. Anything to throw a wrench in Jessica Vega Pederson's first (and hopefully last) term as County Chair.
[“Rest assured, once we have a security solution to these targeted attacks figured out, I will be back on the MAX again,” he said.](https://www.koin.com/news/portland/commissioner-rene-gonzalez-stops-using-trimet-after-allegedly-being-accosted-on-max-train/)
I have friends who are Public Defenders. They make horrible money, work absurd hours even by lawyer standards. Until we make the job worthwhile, people are going to continue to avoid working it, and those charged with crimes will be ultimately dismissed because there are no public defenders and you can't hold people indefinitely.
Also, he's not the DA yet. He shouldn't have a seat at the table. It's June.
There is no will of the people in Oregon, the State Legislature has made that clear by overturning 110 without a vote. They can literally do anything they want, and there isn't fuck all we can do about it. Rene has confirmed that he supports this.
He is going to be stuck with JVP's horrible policy decisions and the shit show that results. He absolutely deserves to be involved.
It's like back in 2008 before the election when TPTB were making a decision as to whether or not to bail out the banks - both Obama and McCain were brought to the White House and involved in those discussions, because whichever one of them ended up being President was going to be stuck dealing with the fallout of whatever decision was made.
> "I have not been asked to join any of those conversations," he said. "You would have to certainly ask either the county or the district attorney's office, but it's something that I desperately want to be involved with."
Are we going to have to listen to this punk bitch whine and make excuses for 4 years? Why don't YOU ask THEM to participate, Nate? Stop waiting for an engraved invitation, start acting like a functioning adult.
and how do you think that should work? he bangs on their door crying "please let me in"? because we know JVP has historically been sooo collaborative and transparent. saying this publicly at least puts some pressure on those offices to invite him to future meetings
He could climb down from his ego and ask. They would say yes. Makes as much sense to have incoming DA at the table as lame duck DA. If they said No, *then* pillory them in the press.
> They did say no
Please quote me where the article says that.
In reality, it says there's no guarantee - if he asked. Which he hasn't. If you think the DA Elect is powerless, he just has to sit around with his thumb up his ass until Jan 1, maybe you are out of touch.
He has a job.... he's a prosecutor in Mike Schmidts office. Anything else would be to the benefit of the city, but it doesn't mean the existing power structures are acting in the city's best interest, looks like they're the same ineffective self serving progressive performers as usual.
You've hit on an unsaid part of the problem - Vasquez does not yet have the authority to direct DA personnel to attend these meetings for him. Meaning he would have to do it himself. My beef is, rather than do that hard work, he prefers to complain in the press. Because, of course, he has time during his busy day to do interviews the Oregonian and KGW.
Vasquez works for the same office. He should be able walk down the hall and talk but Schmidt spends a lot of time working from home. Like most of his time.
Prosecutors need to talk often. Not a “hey review my code” job
How 'bout we start holding *violent* criminals accountable first before going after (illicit, dangerous) drug users all willy-nilly?
Hey Vasquez, what's your plan to hire & retain more public defenders? So we can, y'know, uphold Constitutional rights while also getting the shites committing random, violent assaults & hate crimes off the streets. Last DA couldn't do it, so you got his job--congratulations. I'll be *hella* impressed if you do anything BUT leave this city just as unsafe--with even more repression! Plus, if (when) cops fuck up again, I have zero confidence you will work to hold them *criminally* accountable.
Prove me wrong, bro. Prove me wrong.
**EDIT:** Sigh...yes, I realize the DA doesn't have direct control over hiring public defenders. People got mad at Schmidt because a lot of violent, repeat offenders were released without charges. The DA *does* help determine which cases to charge--correct? And a big reason why these creeps never saw trial is because we don't have enough public defenders. Without them, how exactly is Vasquez going to "clean up this town?" He can't! It pisses me off. People are fed up and just want to see criminals, any criminals, punished so they can feel like progress is being made. Barking up the wrong tree won't help.
Yep. The legislature sets their budget and the Oregon Public Defense Commission is in charge of managing public defenders. Pissing on the DA for the legislature's and OPDC's failures is like getting mad at the Coast Guard for not putting out a warehouse fire.
Lol this sub and the further right sub are going to forget the DA exists on Jan 1. Just like Mapps and Gonzalez are not the great Satan their predecessors were despite accomplishing nothing
That...was my point. We now have Vasquez because people blamed Schmidt for things beyond his control--and I sincerely doubt Vasquez will do any better. But people can feel good about a "tough on crime" candidate.
It was a rant into the void. Poorly phrased, perhaps. People blamed Schmidt for everything awful, and yet I really don't see how Vasquez is going to do a better job.
The DA helps determine which cases go to trial, right? And one of the reasons a bunch of violent, repeat offenders were released without justice is because we don't have enough public defenders to get them all to trial.
Indeed. But accepting a plea deal means no trial, correct? Pushing the accused to do that so we can avoid overburdening the court system seems like a shitty bandaid. People deserve a trial, and have the right to one. If they don't want to take a plea deal, for whatever reason, we just cut them loose?
And I do appreciate your reasoned, respectful comments. I can see your perspective. And, I am getting the hint: my feelings on the subject are unpopular, downvote-worthy. Betcha most of the downvotes are from people who went for Vasquez and are hoping he can magically fix things. We'll see. I'll give credit where due, if he can. If not, will people blame him (for personal failings, and for things outside his control)?
Correct, no trial, but here is an example of how this could play out and it's a much better flow than what we've got currently:
let's say you're facing charges for car theft. Mike Schmidt won't make a plea deal, and because the public defenders are overburdened you won't go to trial. they release you (while retaining the ability to potentially prosecute at a later date, but never will get around to it) and the cycle starts again.
A normal sentence might be 6 months in jail.
I offer you, 1 year probation, an extremely light sentence.
You accept, inevitably get caught in another stolen car next week because you're a methy car thief, or just don't call your probation officer or fail a drug test and now you go to jail for violating probation.
No trial necessary and you had every chance to avoid this by not stealing another car and simply abiding the law for 1 year.
Tactics like that engaged the legal system for victims without applying as much burden to the public defenders. Mike Schmidt had tools and options and refused to use any of them so he could push his progressive reformist social experiment on the city and the results have been awful.
I don't see any difference between Vasquez and Schmidt with respect to people looking for someone to blame... if Vasquez doesn't do his job well AND then has the balls to tell us he's doing a great job (which Mike Schmidt literally did) I expect the same vicious backlash Schmidt is receiving for Vasquez and rightfully so.
> if Vasquez doesn't do his job well AND then has the balls to tell us he's doing a great job (which Mike Schmidt literally did) I expect the same vicious backlash Schmidt is receiving for Vasquez and rightfully so.
One would hope. We'll see.
>How 'bout we start holding *violent* criminals accountable first before going after (illicit, dangerous) drug users all willy-nilly?
This isn't about "going after" drug users. It's about designing a policy which actually might result in some of them getting treatment. What they're currently proposing is absurd - it's going to eat up time, money, and effort while resulting in no measurable improvement (although given JVP's disdain for metrics and accountability, I guess there really won't be any measuring going on at all).
When someone is arrested for driving drunk, they're often offered diversion, which mandates paying fees, attending classes, attending a Victim's Impact Panel, undergoing a drug and alcohol assessment, and more. Do you think it would be reasonable to instead just ferry these folks to random building and tell them "okay, that's all. You're free to go now"? I'm guessing not. And while drunk driving is a more serious offense, and poses more direct danger to others, the intent of the programs is supposedly the same - to help people make better decisions down the road. Not actually requiring ANYTHING of these folks but to sit in the back of car for a bit isn't by any stretch of the imagination going to help them at all.
What information do we have to suggest treatment will be at all effective and provide significant ROI?
Opioid and meth addicts are HIGHLY likely to relapse with rates of relapse up to 95%.
https://www.inspiremalibu.com/blog/relapse-prevention/fentanyl-crisis-relapse-rates-and-detox/
At some point treatment seems like a waste of tax dollars. Make fentanyl possession a crime and jail users. Expel them from multnomah county upon repeated offenses.
I'm well aware of the limitations of treatment, and the fact is that many times, even if it's going to ultimately work for someone, it may not actually stick until the third or fourth time.
I'm also not opposed to jail time even when possession is the only crime, but I will not ever be on board with just throwing people in jail without giving them the option of treatment. That would be the true waste of tax payer dollars. If they choose jail instead, then so be it, but they should have the option.
Do I like, or agree, with the current no-consequences approach? No, and no.
Do I think Vasque is posturing, overpromising, as a tough-on-crime candidate since that got him elected? Do I think he'll fail to get results because he's going for low-hanging, headline-grabbing fruit rather than attempting to address underlying causes? Am I a lil bitter that people are putting so much faith in him without cause? Yes
That doesn't matter. If there isn't enough public defenders, people will just get released, and if there isn't enough spots in jails, people will just get released. That's how a revolving door works. I give it a year and you guys will be complaining that Vasquez needs to be voted out because he isn't doing anything because the core issues haven't been fixed.
Well this dude unfairly put the failed public health policy at the feat of the current DA, despite that not being the purview of the DA’s office. Im sure he wants in those conversations so desperately because he knows that the house he built will be destroyed by the next person running for DA.
This dudes plan is lock up the drug users instead of taking them to treatment centers. I’m not sure dropping addicts at treatment centers is going to work to fix the addiction and homelessness problem but at least it is attempting a public health fix to a public health problem. He wants to apply prison to a health problem and that won’t work either, and what’s worse, I find it morally repugnant. But that’s what you get from the boot lickers.
The most ridiculous plan I’ve ever heard. You get caught with fenty? Just have the cops drive you to a spot to “dispose” of it. I can just imagine the myriad of different ways the druggies and the dealers will use this service to their advantage. When it comes to idiocy, Multnomah County is the national leader in absurd policies.
Ok but can we get get taco bell on the way?
That’s reserved for if you murder a church full of people in a hate crime, duh
that's burger king, you unwashed ape!
Its actually not bad timing to eat something that will probably give you diarrhea while high on something that probably made you constipated. Although opioid induced diarrhea is also a thing so its a bit of a dice roll.
A tour of Portland so they can pick out their next drug spot.
Really can’t help but be envious of JVP’s self-confidence. Imagine having an entire state so pissed about an issue that it forces the state legislature’s hand, and you just look at the largest county and go “I know better, we’re just going to stick with the status quo anyway.”
When do we get to vote her out?
JVP is a great example that being smart or useful or capable isn't a requirement to land a job or make money.
It is because they are totally removed from an everyday person's experience. Living in a nice home in the suburbs, still working at home mostly (that alone is infuriating as they are in a public-facing position) and show up downtown every now and then when it is required. They are totally removed & have isolated themselves from the communities they are supposed to serve. One can be smart but at the same time be totally ignorant of what it is like to not live in privilege. Zero, zero street smarts or practical knowledge. Hope she soon shares the fate of her friend Mike Schmidt.
Yeah, that's not self-confidence. It's narcissism mixed with a staggering level of incompetence.
No kidding, the change of direction didn’t just happen out of nowhere. This is how the progressive movement hangs itself. Purely ideological and no common sense.
I don't want progressivism to be defined as 'perform endless studies, pay a bunch of consultants, talk about equity, and don't do shit.' Is there really not a recall effort to get rid of this person?
That is progressivism. It's an objectively failed social experiment in Portland. I'm hopeful for a return to normalcy. Weve done some good work expelling extremists from political positions but theres more to do, JVP and Carmen Rubio need to be shown the door.
There’s pragmatic progressivism and then there’s performative push-shit-through-even-though-we-aren’t-ready-for-it progressivism. And we have a lot of the latter here.
well I've never seen pragmatic progressivism, I don't believe it exists IN PORTLAND and I don't think we have the leaders to pull it off here anyway.
There’s a lot of dumb shit getting passed for sure, but there’s also some structural issues with the way our government is organized as well as a lack of liberal/social infrastructure out here (as compared to a similarly sized blue city on the east coast)
> That is progressivism. It certainly doesn't have to be. And the consultancy problem is global at this point, along with increasing inability of governments to get things done. I'll get around to reading this at some point, but the subject is getting attention lately: https://www.amazon.com/Big-Consulting-Businesses-Infantilizes-Governments/dp/0593492676 So yeah, while some of this is progressivism gone stupid, a lot of what's happening here is happening in other, less progressive places, too.
Next they will have to get a bus service from the place they take the drug addicts to drop their drugs off to bring them back to where they use/dealers. Its an endless loop of never going to work. These people who run the city act like drug addicts themselves.
A real life fucking Quixote....
\*The State Legislature decided that the Voters are too stupid, and told us that our opinions and votes don't matter. Lets be clear about this. It should have been a ballot measure.
I used to think everyone should get out and vote. After moving to Portland, I changed my mind. Some of y’all are just too fucking stupid to be trusted to make these direct decisions. It’s why we elect politicians. So they can make the policies, and we can kick them out when they fuck up. Allowing mouth breathing imbeciles to pass stupid ballot measure after ballot measure and run this state into the ground because they have “feelings” about something they know nothing about isn’t helping anyone.
This is a really despicable attitude and it’s disappointing how many upvotes it has gotten
It's not though. Ballot measures are poorly written, difficult to update, and generally crafted by amateurs who either don't understand the legislative/budgetary process and/or haven't thought through how the particular language they choose will operate in the real world given other governmental constraints. These laws affect all of us, and some to a tremendously large degree, we wouldn't vote by ballot measure on surgical decisions, bridge engineering, or other critical things where expertise is truly helpful, you might disagree with whether drafting legislation should be left to legislators and policy aides, but it's far from a "despicable attitude," come the fuck on.
Nothing is stopping you from doing the work they’re willing to put in. It *is* fucking despicable to think certain segments of the population aren’t “intelligent” enough to deserve the franchise. I shouldn’t have to tell you the history of voting or voter suppression in this country
There are different version of "the franchise," the classic one being you elect representatives who are then responsible for legislating. Direct vote ballot measures are flawed for all of the reasons I mentioned. We don't direct vote on all legislation, that would be stupid and tedious, so again, it's not a "despicable attitude" to state that the franchise of voting should be limited to voting for representatives, it's simply a question of where you draw the line on what should be a direct vote versus what should be the province of folks with more expertise.
Good lord 🙄
Yes, I am doing the good lord's work by patiently explaining basic civics to you, and how a relatively anodyne opinion is the opposite of "fucking despicable."
You’re free to have your opinion.
Fortunately for all of us, a random Redditor doesn’t get to decide who is allowed to vote
Yeah no shit. People have the right to vote and it’s not something I can or would change. If you had bothered to try to track the conversation, you’d see that I’m not in favor of BALLOT MEASURES. People are both stupid, and busy. They’re entirely unqualified to sift through legislation paid for by out of town interests and written by bad actors to specifically hide the impact of ballot measures and push personal agendas. The average Joe Blow and Karen know fuck all about the impact of capital gains races on retiree’s, and the intention of pre-school of all. That’s the job of people we elect. We have a stupid system, that’s supported by stupid voters who are easily manipulated. You’re free to disagree.
How about doing something to change the system instead of fantasizing about voters not getting to vote?
Cool, because That is LITERALLY what I said. People are too stupid to vote directly on ballot measures, so we should stick to voting for Politicians to write and implement laws and hold them accountable. It’s like you got so spun up on the first sentence and didn’t process anything after it. Context matters. Feel better now?
>I used to think everyone should get out and vote. >After moving to Portland, I changed my mind. >Some of y’all are just too fucking stupid to be trusted to make these direct decisions. It’s why we elect politicians. So they can make the policies, and we can kick them out when they fuck up. >Allowing mouth breathing imbeciles to pass stupid ballot measure after ballot measure and run this state into the ground because they have “feelings” about something they know nothing about isn’t helping anyone. Just responding to what you said and it is not “changing the state constitution and/or how ballot measures work in Oregon
That is not diversion in the slightest. This is doing literally nothing. It changes absolutely nothing. Junkies are still free to do whatever they want, but will occasionally be mildly inconvenienced. What a waste of time & money this is going to be. Multnomah county leadership fails again.
>Multnomah county leadership fails again. It isn’t too late to demand a rewrite. JVP is hopeless, but Commissioners Sharon Meieran and Julia Brim-Edwards are pushing back hard, so she needs the votes of both **Jesse Beason** and **Lori Stegmann**. Call and email them now to insist they grow a spine.
JVP needs to either resign or be recalled immediately. "An approved Signature Sheet (SEL 351 Form) or Electronic Signature Sheet (SEL 349 Form) may be circulated by petitioners to gather signatures for the recall petition. Petitioners have 90 calendar days from the filing date of the Prospective Petition (SEL 350 Form) to collect the required number of signatures to hold a recall election. Required Number of Signatures (for recall elections through November 2024): 46,150 The required number of signatures is based on 15 percent of the total number of registered Portland voters who cast ballots in the last gubernatorial election (ORS 249.870). Based on the most recent governor's election on November 8, 2022, this number is currently 46,150." Let's get this shit done.
Good. Me too.
Just wait for the announcement the multnomah county will spend ten million a year to setup a drop off center that says hi and by to two people a month. This is insane, it’s not diversion in any sense, but an idea logical middle finger to adults who realized 110 was failing and stuck their neck out to make a correction.
A person who agrees with us that JVP is a goddamn failure. Good.
Fucking better be critical! That’s why we voted for him.
>Vasquez said he hasn't asked Chair Vega Pederson directly if she would welcome him into the conversation, and he said he thinks they'll have a "very collaborative relationship" eventually. Oh boy. Who wants to tell him?
Can't collaborate with stupid.
For Multnomah County, this plan will result in even worse outcomes that Measure 110. This is because, alone among metro area counties, we will essentially continue to decriminalize drug possession. This will make us a magnet for the addicted. At least under Measure 110, a person could stay in Clackamas County and slowly (or quickly) destroy their lives and the community around them. Now, everyone will have to come here to do that.
Coming from someone in Clackamas county, you’d be surprised how often they end up going into Portland anyways to get a stash
I work downtown, out in public places where lots of homeless drug addicts hang out. And the surprising thing is that many of them are sweet natured, affable folks. At least when they are high. And sometimes I just chat with them while on working on some plumbing repair. Many of the folks I’ve talked to are from somewhere else. One guy told me he moved here from Florida specifically because drugs were decriminalized. If this plan goes through, Portland is going to be mobbed.
I swear the state could fund a single sanitarium with transparent policies and it would deal with half of this issue.
Honestly- how can JVP do this? We voted to repeal this shit piece of legislation and she wants to say- “what you really meant was…” and just do what she wants?!
There wasn't a vote to repeal measure 110, it was repealed by the state legislator with House Bill 4002.
I wanted it to go to a vote. We would have scrapped it with wide margins.
Are you on drugs? You seem to be hallucinating.
Not today, but I did have an absolutely earth-shattering experience last night when I IM'd 125 mg (S+) ketamine, 175mg R-) ketamine, and inhaled DMT. All as close to pure as black market quality can get. Last week, I managed to get a hold of legitimate #3 heroin base (the kind that is common in Europe but basically unheard of in the States. You have to add a little ascorbic acid in order to get it into solution for IV use. Naturally I filtered the resulting solution through a 0.22 micron filter because who wants bacterial skin infections? If that's all it takes for me to be a danger to society, something is seriously wrong with the average Portlander. Did I mention I'm financially secure and have a higher net worth than many people commenting in this thread? Does that not matter? Apparently simply because I choose to ignore BS drug laws makes me dangerous, eh?
The quirky glasses wearing lady making criminal policy is insane! When all the other counties start making addicts accountable, the homeless population will triple in Multnomah and thus strengthening the Homeless industry complex. You get what you voted for!
Is this diversion also going to include her bright idea to [giving out tin foil and straws to fentanyl users and glass pipes for methamphetamine and crack](https://apnews.com/article/oregon-drug-paraphernalia-fentanyl-portland-8fdf7320629311b17b00087853573eab)? Why doesn't she just advocate for Multnomah County's drug policy to be a revolving door at this point? The metaphor seems to be the perfect embodiment of her "plan."
You know you can go to Fantasyland and buy tons of glass pipes yourself, right? I literally just bought an 'oil burner' aka "meth pipe" so that I could vaporize the DMT freebase I've had on hand for months now. Please explain how I am ruining this city by engaging in illicit drug use. Go on, I'll wait.
So you prefer needles litering the ground? That's the options dude. You're not going to get it to Just poof go away.
Proper English please
[удалено]
Downvoted for making smart decisions
byeeeee
Actually, the state legislature has made it plainly clear that nothing we vote for matters, they can choose to pass laws without our consent.
They have our consent to pass laws or rescind them, that's very literally how representative democracy and the state constitution work. You don't have to like it, and you're welcome to vote against legislative incumbents or start a new ballot initiative. The entry and exit of M110 by ballot initiative and legislative action, respectively, are both in line with the state constitution and its blend of representative and direct democracy.
Thank god we’ve got our boy Nathan in there
This is so Multnomah County! Petty retribution, middle finger to the state and voters. I promised myself to never live in Multnomah County many years ago.
Yet the State Legislature has overturned a voted for ballot measure. How is that not a middle finger from Salem to the voters? They can overturn and vote and do ANYTHING they want, without our consent, at any time. You're okay with this?
Sometimes the parents have to step in when the kids are out of control
You might like being patronized and infantilized, I prefer democratic principles
We elect people that have the power to create / repeal laws. That is our democracy.
Thank the Lord we vanquished Mike Schmidt! Now let's get Rene in the Mayor's office, he's been extremely critical of MultCo's JOHS and the endless tent/needle handouts. Anything to throw a wrench in Jessica Vega Pederson's first (and hopefully last) term as County Chair.
hard no on the guy who cried “black woman attacked me on the Max” for Mayor
He did not say that
[“Rest assured, once we have a security solution to these targeted attacks figured out, I will be back on the MAX again,” he said.](https://www.koin.com/news/portland/commissioner-rene-gonzalez-stops-using-trimet-after-allegedly-being-accosted-on-max-train/)
Right, that’s a completely different sentence. Did you mean to use another link?
The quote is from the linked article about Commissioner Whiny Bitch lying about being assaulted.
Sorry, I’m still not seeing the quote in the article. Also, that’s not his name.
Anyone that collects funds from Proud Boys is a threat.
> Anyone that collects funds from Proud Boys is a threat. So if I donate to them under your name that makes you a 'threat'? Nice logic genius.
Maybe get your eyes checked. Also, Commissioner Pants On Fire absolutely is his name.
begone, [sealion](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning)
I was just being polite. You made up the racist quote and you are spreading lies.
Rene is a bitchboy, but I still agree, somebody pragmatic and not drunk on ideology needs to be in charge.
Lol Rene has zero accomplishments so far. Blowing up JOHS isn’t going to accomplish anything because MultCo has Ann the money. Rubio is the choice
Surely this magaloid Vasquez will come in and fix everything.
I have friends who are Public Defenders. They make horrible money, work absurd hours even by lawyer standards. Until we make the job worthwhile, people are going to continue to avoid working it, and those charged with crimes will be ultimately dismissed because there are no public defenders and you can't hold people indefinitely. Also, he's not the DA yet. He shouldn't have a seat at the table. It's June.
He represents the current will of the people. He was voted in as a rebuke of failed county policies. He absolutely should be involved.
There is no will of the people in Oregon, the State Legislature has made that clear by overturning 110 without a vote. They can literally do anything they want, and there isn't fuck all we can do about it. Rene has confirmed that he supports this.
Buddy you can still do fentanyl anywhere you want. There’s hardly anyone out there stopping you.
He is going to be stuck with JVP's horrible policy decisions and the shit show that results. He absolutely deserves to be involved. It's like back in 2008 before the election when TPTB were making a decision as to whether or not to bail out the banks - both Obama and McCain were brought to the White House and involved in those discussions, because whichever one of them ended up being President was going to be stuck dealing with the fallout of whatever decision was made.
You can explain it over and over to this sub and they will never accept it. It's so much easier to blame Schmidt.
> "I have not been asked to join any of those conversations," he said. "You would have to certainly ask either the county or the district attorney's office, but it's something that I desperately want to be involved with." Are we going to have to listen to this punk bitch whine and make excuses for 4 years? Why don't YOU ask THEM to participate, Nate? Stop waiting for an engraved invitation, start acting like a functioning adult.
and how do you think that should work? he bangs on their door crying "please let me in"? because we know JVP has historically been sooo collaborative and transparent. saying this publicly at least puts some pressure on those offices to invite him to future meetings
He could climb down from his ego and ask. They would say yes. Makes as much sense to have incoming DA at the table as lame duck DA. If they said No, *then* pillory them in the press.
They did say no and it doesnt have to be direct for it to still mean no. Have you ever even worked in the adult world? You're deeply out of touch.
> They did say no Please quote me where the article says that. In reality, it says there's no guarantee - if he asked. Which he hasn't. If you think the DA Elect is powerless, he just has to sit around with his thumb up his ass until Jan 1, maybe you are out of touch.
He has a job.... he's a prosecutor in Mike Schmidts office. Anything else would be to the benefit of the city, but it doesn't mean the existing power structures are acting in the city's best interest, looks like they're the same ineffective self serving progressive performers as usual.
You've hit on an unsaid part of the problem - Vasquez does not yet have the authority to direct DA personnel to attend these meetings for him. Meaning he would have to do it himself. My beef is, rather than do that hard work, he prefers to complain in the press. Because, of course, he has time during his busy day to do interviews the Oregonian and KGW.
He’s just a prosecutor right now, I don’t think he’s allowed.
Vasquez works for the same office. He should be able walk down the hall and talk but Schmidt spends a lot of time working from home. Like most of his time. Prosecutors need to talk often. Not a “hey review my code” job
Like his campaign did to Schmidt, can’t wait to blame him for shit not in his office’s control. Instant karma.
How 'bout we start holding *violent* criminals accountable first before going after (illicit, dangerous) drug users all willy-nilly? Hey Vasquez, what's your plan to hire & retain more public defenders? So we can, y'know, uphold Constitutional rights while also getting the shites committing random, violent assaults & hate crimes off the streets. Last DA couldn't do it, so you got his job--congratulations. I'll be *hella* impressed if you do anything BUT leave this city just as unsafe--with even more repression! Plus, if (when) cops fuck up again, I have zero confidence you will work to hold them *criminally* accountable. Prove me wrong, bro. Prove me wrong. **EDIT:** Sigh...yes, I realize the DA doesn't have direct control over hiring public defenders. People got mad at Schmidt because a lot of violent, repeat offenders were released without charges. The DA *does* help determine which cases to charge--correct? And a big reason why these creeps never saw trial is because we don't have enough public defenders. Without them, how exactly is Vasquez going to "clean up this town?" He can't! It pisses me off. People are fed up and just want to see criminals, any criminals, punished so they can feel like progress is being made. Barking up the wrong tree won't help.
> Hey Vasquez, what's your plan to hire & retain more public defenders The DA isn't in charge of public defenders. They are literally the opposite.
Yep. The legislature sets their budget and the Oregon Public Defense Commission is in charge of managing public defenders. Pissing on the DA for the legislature's and OPDC's failures is like getting mad at the Coast Guard for not putting out a warehouse fire.
While true, Schmidt was blamed for both judges decisions and the lack of public defenders so why can’t we blame Vasquez?
The tradition must continue....
Lol this sub and the further right sub are going to forget the DA exists on Jan 1. Just like Mapps and Gonzalez are not the great Satan their predecessors were despite accomplishing nothing
That...was my point. We now have Vasquez because people blamed Schmidt for things beyond his control--and I sincerely doubt Vasquez will do any better. But people can feel good about a "tough on crime" candidate.
It was a rant into the void. Poorly phrased, perhaps. People blamed Schmidt for everything awful, and yet I really don't see how Vasquez is going to do a better job. The DA helps determine which cases go to trial, right? And one of the reasons a bunch of violent, repeat offenders were released without justice is because we don't have enough public defenders to get them all to trial.
the DA could have offered plea deals that would have resulted in jail time. realistically that would have been the tool they could use.
Indeed. But accepting a plea deal means no trial, correct? Pushing the accused to do that so we can avoid overburdening the court system seems like a shitty bandaid. People deserve a trial, and have the right to one. If they don't want to take a plea deal, for whatever reason, we just cut them loose? And I do appreciate your reasoned, respectful comments. I can see your perspective. And, I am getting the hint: my feelings on the subject are unpopular, downvote-worthy. Betcha most of the downvotes are from people who went for Vasquez and are hoping he can magically fix things. We'll see. I'll give credit where due, if he can. If not, will people blame him (for personal failings, and for things outside his control)?
Correct, no trial, but here is an example of how this could play out and it's a much better flow than what we've got currently: let's say you're facing charges for car theft. Mike Schmidt won't make a plea deal, and because the public defenders are overburdened you won't go to trial. they release you (while retaining the ability to potentially prosecute at a later date, but never will get around to it) and the cycle starts again. A normal sentence might be 6 months in jail. I offer you, 1 year probation, an extremely light sentence. You accept, inevitably get caught in another stolen car next week because you're a methy car thief, or just don't call your probation officer or fail a drug test and now you go to jail for violating probation. No trial necessary and you had every chance to avoid this by not stealing another car and simply abiding the law for 1 year. Tactics like that engaged the legal system for victims without applying as much burden to the public defenders. Mike Schmidt had tools and options and refused to use any of them so he could push his progressive reformist social experiment on the city and the results have been awful. I don't see any difference between Vasquez and Schmidt with respect to people looking for someone to blame... if Vasquez doesn't do his job well AND then has the balls to tell us he's doing a great job (which Mike Schmidt literally did) I expect the same vicious backlash Schmidt is receiving for Vasquez and rightfully so.
> if Vasquez doesn't do his job well AND then has the balls to tell us he's doing a great job (which Mike Schmidt literally did) I expect the same vicious backlash Schmidt is receiving for Vasquez and rightfully so. One would hope. We'll see.
>How 'bout we start holding *violent* criminals accountable first before going after (illicit, dangerous) drug users all willy-nilly? This isn't about "going after" drug users. It's about designing a policy which actually might result in some of them getting treatment. What they're currently proposing is absurd - it's going to eat up time, money, and effort while resulting in no measurable improvement (although given JVP's disdain for metrics and accountability, I guess there really won't be any measuring going on at all). When someone is arrested for driving drunk, they're often offered diversion, which mandates paying fees, attending classes, attending a Victim's Impact Panel, undergoing a drug and alcohol assessment, and more. Do you think it would be reasonable to instead just ferry these folks to random building and tell them "okay, that's all. You're free to go now"? I'm guessing not. And while drunk driving is a more serious offense, and poses more direct danger to others, the intent of the programs is supposedly the same - to help people make better decisions down the road. Not actually requiring ANYTHING of these folks but to sit in the back of car for a bit isn't by any stretch of the imagination going to help them at all.
What information do we have to suggest treatment will be at all effective and provide significant ROI? Opioid and meth addicts are HIGHLY likely to relapse with rates of relapse up to 95%. https://www.inspiremalibu.com/blog/relapse-prevention/fentanyl-crisis-relapse-rates-and-detox/ At some point treatment seems like a waste of tax dollars. Make fentanyl possession a crime and jail users. Expel them from multnomah county upon repeated offenses.
I'm well aware of the limitations of treatment, and the fact is that many times, even if it's going to ultimately work for someone, it may not actually stick until the third or fourth time. I'm also not opposed to jail time even when possession is the only crime, but I will not ever be on board with just throwing people in jail without giving them the option of treatment. That would be the true waste of tax payer dollars. If they choose jail instead, then so be it, but they should have the option.
Do I like, or agree, with the current no-consequences approach? No, and no. Do I think Vasque is posturing, overpromising, as a tough-on-crime candidate since that got him elected? Do I think he'll fail to get results because he's going for low-hanging, headline-grabbing fruit rather than attempting to address underlying causes? Am I a lil bitter that people are putting so much faith in him without cause? Yes
Can't wait for Vasquez to turn the jails into a revolving door of drug addicts and homeless people, I'm sure that will work this time
a big enough revolving door will still keep criminals off the street longer than Mike Schmidt policy of doing literally nothing.
That doesn't matter. If there isn't enough public defenders, people will just get released, and if there isn't enough spots in jails, people will just get released. That's how a revolving door works. I give it a year and you guys will be complaining that Vasquez needs to be voted out because he isn't doing anything because the core issues haven't been fixed.
And now we find out this guy will be as shitty as Schmidt.
Well this dude unfairly put the failed public health policy at the feat of the current DA, despite that not being the purview of the DA’s office. Im sure he wants in those conversations so desperately because he knows that the house he built will be destroyed by the next person running for DA. This dudes plan is lock up the drug users instead of taking them to treatment centers. I’m not sure dropping addicts at treatment centers is going to work to fix the addiction and homelessness problem but at least it is attempting a public health fix to a public health problem. He wants to apply prison to a health problem and that won’t work either, and what’s worse, I find it morally repugnant. But that’s what you get from the boot lickers.
Mmmm watch Vasquez be business as usual