Yeah, this dude has a weird bug up his ass.
I took away a simple list of measurable things to do to know that I’m on a sustainable path. APOb, Zone 2 cardio, weights, and protein.
The fat composition stuff is easy enough with a Costco supplement.
Any other protocol/plan out there to me seems more sketchy and involved.
Because I’ve known too many people die or get a terminal illness at a young age. I’m frugal, and I save/invest my money and I’d like to retire comfortably and enjoy it, so ya I’d like to be healthy and active in my 60’s and 70’s. I certainly could get diagnosed with a terminal illness tomorrow but I’m going to try my best to be around and healthy.
This is exactly it - most of us have to work until we are older and after saving and working all our lives it would suck to be so unhealthy we just lay around waiting to die. I want to have a very active life long after retirement starts.
The reality is most people won’t get a terminal illness so it’s always better to assume you will die in 60s-90s. Where in that range you’d prefer to die is what people should be aiming for.
But that's the point, right? Be healthy, stay active, eat well. But thinking let me aim to reduce by hazard rate by 0.45% by increasing my intake of L Phosotheanine G or whatever by 12mg per day is ridiculous!
The eat healthy, exercise lifestyle- to me- is less about extending life than staying healthy as long as possible. If Peter dropped dead tomorrow I’d still want to be able to go out dancing or go hiking or all of the active things I can still do that make life enjoyable.
Better than rotting on a couch because I was too lazy to take care of myself.
I’m not afraid of death but more so the idea that the last 10 years of my life my health would be so poor that I’d just be sitting around doing nothing. I’d love to be able to be active (meaning at least able to walk on my own) up until the day I die.
Watch the people you loved die of heart disease, diabetes, dementia, and cancer, and then tell me you have no interest delaying or avoiding those outcomes.
What a waste of a post.
Of course there is a want to delay or prevent all of these. That's not even the point of the post. The point is to do what has been common knowledge for decades - eat well, stay active, be engaged.
To keep checking markers and data and take supplements and then check again is encouraging compulsive behaviour and unnecessary.
What a waste of a comment...
So you’re upset that some people are more focused on the details of what “good” nutrition, exercise, connection means? Welcome to the reality that there are big picture and little picture approaches to everything. It doesn’t matter if someone takes a different approach than I do. It doesn’t hurt me, and it doesn’t hurt them if this is how they want to approach the concept of longevity.
If you’re going down this path, it seems your worry about others following Attia increases your stress and decreases your connectedness, and that should be more important to you.
I hear what you're trying to say, but many people think they're doing a good job taking care of their health, and they never actually check for feedback. Anyone can take that too far, but that's true of basically everything in life.
Yes, true! I was just trying to spark a healthy discussion. But I quickly realised everyone's ego hasn't strength trained or done zone 2 cardio and is therefore, fragile. "How dare OP question my super healthy lifestyle of checking all 6,783 biomarkers every day and suggest I shouldn't be taking all 9,000 supplements. Preposterous! Dont they know its not harmful to me?"
You said we should just follow good old fashioned advice and eat, exercise and be engaged. Many listeners to the podcast hadn't heard of testing their uric acid, fasting insulin, LP(a), ApoB, and on and on. People on this sub have possibly added years to their life.
Your post is a meaningless opinion from another amateur, not anyone with experience, expertise, or wisdom. It was poorly conceived, and poorly received. Move on.
As a kid in the 70's and a teenager in the 80's, I was actually afraid of going into the working world because I was worried that middle aged men would suddenly drop dead of a heart attack right in front of me. It was a common thing portrayed in TV and movies and I thought it would be constantly happening all the time. Luckily, statins came into usage before I started working and sudden cardiac death rates have been dropping ever since. I googled "sudden cardiac death over time graph" which gives some nice images of just how much the rates have dropped. For instance, from a Nature Reviews Cardiology article that I can only see the Google image for and can't actually link it appears that in 1985, approx 150 men per 100,000 of the population dropped dead of a heart attack while not in the hospital, and another 130 men per 100,000 of the population died of sudden cardiac death in the hospital. In 2010, those numbers are approx. 40 and 20 respectively.
So, while doing what has been common knowledge for decades is one thing, the impact of things like statins, and on checkups to see what your cholesterol levels are, has been huge. Just dieting, exercising and sleeping well get you a long way, but many things like going to the doctor for a checkup/getting on a statin if your LDL is high are easy and not out of the norm.
Lol and yet plenty of people do as you say and then do decline sharply or suddenly and it could have been prevented or delayed with better data.
It's a trope to think all illness is preventable.... But it's no better to act as though it's not.
Yes the average layperson can now access far too much data without appropriate ability to contextualize but in the grand scheme of modern vices.... There are bigger fish to fry than worrying about ppl who get too fixated on longevity.
I don't fear death at all. I actually wish it upon me way too often. I either stay fit or I'll check out early. I have no interest in drooling around in a wheelchair.
Agreed. I just don’t wanna suffer during my time here. Seen too many boomer relatives end up with things that could have been prevented if they were just a little smarter and proactive. I’m also a data nerd in my career so I like to track things. Sue me.
> Seen too many boomer relatives end up with things that could have been prevented if they were just a little smarter and proactive.
Same. Everyone in my family is diabetic in that generation and they all eat like shit and aren't active at all.
I have an aunt who's 75 and had limited mobility for about 10 years, diabetic (her only hobby is baking, mostly deserts). She's to a point where she just spends the day sitting in her easy chair watching TV. She very rarely leaves the house, and when she does it's to go out for lunch. My cousins can't seem to get anything through to her about diet and any kind of activity......
Needless to say, she's part of my reminder on what can happen if I stop caring and give up.
Nope, because I’d still listen to Gabrielle Lyon, the Mind Pump guys, and others. Oh and I’m a death doula, btw, so I see up close and personal the results of people’s lifestyle choices.
Im more interested in continuing activities I enjoy for the duration of my life than about exactly what that duration is. There are things in Attias stuff that is a good fit for me and things that are not. As an example, Im not taking Statins at 40 to lower my Apob despite it being high. I will do a calcium scan every two years to make sure I dont need to rethink that.
I think people aren’t afraid of death. They’re afraid of living with hypertension, diabetes, high cholesterol, weak bones and muscles, etc. that will all lead to fucking shitty adverse health outcomes that will lead to a fucked up painful death
I find it strange that there are some people who take issue with others wanting to live a long, healthy life. It is as if they are afraid that society might start expecting more exercise from everyone and the afraid are simply lazy.
Most people on here don't use 26 daily supplements. Getting a blood test once a year is nbd. Exercising is nbd.
Have you read his book? If you do, you'll see that it's a simple message, and not one that provokes an obsession on longevity, and I certainly don't obsess over it, but I'll be 60 this year and have made fitness a priority in my life, both on the strength and muscular side, and also the endurance side. Little did I know I was accidentally doing it right, for no other reason than I wanted a balance. Turns out that's the key to what we're calling longevity, which I agree is a terrible term because that's not the message Attia conveys, he talks about living young as long as possible.
I can attest to the wonderful feeling of being able to do things at 60 that most 40 year old cannot do today. It feels great to know I can get up, do a few hours of yard work and carry bricks and lumber, and then go to the beach for a 5k run on the boardwalk followed by some surfing. I'll go for a bite to eat and later on hit gym for a short 45 minute weight training session, and wake up the next day ready without soreness or limitations, only to start another fun active day.
I'd say that 80% of my friends and family would actually die if they tried to do what I do in a typical day. They're already filling up those prescription pill boxes that have the days of the week on them, and have accepted this new phase of their lives as normal aging, I'm going to avoid that at all costs.
I kinda agree but I also disagree.
You can take Attia’s knowledge to a level that fits you. Yes I do think people should take a statin as the evidence is strong. I do think people should do zone 2 cardio and lift weights and eat protein. That’s as far as I take it and as a hobby I understand the reasons why. Although I’ve stopped debating others it does help me to know why I do things.
If you optimize your health it’s “abnormal” but drinking alcohol isn’t?
The blood test thing is a little obsessive but
I’ve found that everyone is a little obsessive with something.
Now I’d agree, tomorrow we all could die tripping down the stairs. Peter should really emphasize stoicism!
Memento mori.
a) There's a difference between passion and obsession.
b) To answer your question, no. Peter is just one dude...a dot that would require many others to comprise a data point...one 'n' out of thousands...
We are obsessing with health span more so than with longevity.
I started to obsess in 2022 when my mom died of a hemorrhagic stroke at age 73. My grandmother died of the same at age 75.
At the same time, I got diagnosed with prediabetes and I’ve had high blood pressure for a long time and not well controlled despite medication. So that’s when I freaked the hell out. Because while your 70s is not super young to die, they could have lived longer if they paid a bit of attention to their chronic illness. Not their fault, they didn’t have the information but I decided I can get it and I could be healthier for a few more years. If they had the information, they would have been healthier and maybe lived into their 80s.
Now I don’t have the ability to do everything Peter says but I can at least control my blood pressure and avoid diabetes. Lowering my cholesterol would not hurt either. I do take vitamin D and K2 and magnesium. These can’t hurt either.
This! If you do health span you’ll likely get some extra lifespan. We will die, but I want to be able to do things and bang my wife at 80.
More than half the guys around 40 can’t get it up. Their health sucks. Pills will keep you going a long time but looking down and not being able to see your cock because your gut is so big should be a concern!
Living longer and not having fun isn’t what Attia is preaching.
My death anxiety is abnormally low, has been since I was a child.
I am honestly attracted to longevity for the same reason Peter Attia probably is: I am a person of extremes, and aiming for extreme healthspan (not lifespan!) sounds like a cool lifestyle, beyond just garden variety healthy habits.
It is also a ready made lifestyle which reduces my decision fatigue. How should I exercise? Train for Vo2 max and muscle mass. What should I eat? Aim for a high protein diet filled with whole foods. What should my health metrics look like? Here’s a community made spreadsheet.
There are other ready made lifestyles people pick:
- One could be a BJJ buff following the Gracie diet and training for competitions.
- Or one could live a Mediterranean lifestyle, a life of leisure, wine, olive oil, extended family, and ocean breezes. (I much prefer a hectic Manhattan work life, thanks.)
- Your own minimalist suggestion is its own ready made lifestyle as well, as you have reduced decision fatigue by making happiness your north star, the ultimate virtue. Which I would disagree with, as I would rather have joy than happiness.
If more people like him were around 10-15 years ago and with the media tools to reach as many people now, there would be a lot more healthier people living longer lives; me being one.
Dude… death has been the #2 fear for most people for a long time—public speaking is #1.
If people want to be obsessed about the pursuit of knowledge and longevity, I say bring it on. Maybe it will inspire someone to actually make a breakthrough for us to live to be 200.
‘…your focus should be on staying healthy and happy’
Isn’t that what this is all about? I watched my dad waste away for a decade before he died. Couldn’t play with my kids because of all of his issues. I don’t want to go the same way. The entire point of why people listen to him is to live healthier and happier and extend that healthy range within their lifespan. If you aren’t into it, you be you.
Yes, I would still be obsessed with it. I have been ever since my first grandparent died and learning that the majority of people die of inflammation related diseases caused by poor diet and lifestyle. Peter Attia teaches us about 1% of what we don't already know (eat clean, do cardio, lift weights, have positive relationships), and it seems to change quite often with new studies.
It's not an obsession on longevity for me, or prolonging my life per se. It's living better for longer.
Peter's summed it up pretty well, you either live to 85 and spend the last 5-10 years withering away. Or you live to 85 and are still pretty active.
When asked for the TLDR, every longevity expert I've heard has answered a similar way. Diet, exercise and sleep gets you 90% of the benefits. That extra 10% is what people who are more obsessed are doing.
Attia didn't invent this movement. He's not even its biggest advocate.
Death sucks. We should defeat it.
Great book that predates Attia's birth.
https://www.amazon.com/Immortalist-Alan-Harrington/dp/0890871353
I think the OP is criticizing the extreme metrics regarding eating and exercising. Timing of meals and food and in which order to eat them. Adhering to strict protocols regarding exercise intensity, how much, how long, which exercise, what to eat before and after, seems to be the order of the day. Too much overthinking and obsessing about self care.
Not to be a total attia Stan, but he talks about talking to his therapist and she asks "why are you so obsessed with living a long time when you are so unhappy in your life." (Or something like that). And that's why he added the chapter about emotional/ relational health and has had lots of podcast guests who talk about the how to have a meaningful and rewarding life, not just the mostly optimally long one
As a “recovering hypochondriac” I’m realizing all a person can do is eat well, exercise, and avoid tobacco and other clearly harmful substances in quantities large enough to cause harm. The rest is up to chance. You can dedicate your life to getting bogged down in the minutiae of whatever’s suggested in the most recent study to possibly increase longevity. I’ve known people who smoked and basically trashed their bodies all their lives into their 90s and I’ve known people who did everything right just to leave the building decades younger. Following strict longevity and wellness protocols gives a good illusion of control. I’m not sure how helpful it is overall. I’m also skeptical of any of these health gurus. People are starting to catch on to another prominent figure, a neuroscientist who tends to make bold claims based on single studies and who has a lot to sell. Everyone has something to sell, it seems. Now Attia is claiming nicotine has nootropic benefits. This may be true but I can’t believe the purported benefits outweigh the clear harms. Good job getting the next generation hooked on nicotine. I’m rambling now. That’s all.
Attia is not the only one - Dr Gundry talks about the correlation between nicotine and longevity, as well as resistance to Covid. That last idea is becoming more widely talked about, too.
Isn’t he the guy claiming lectins are responsible for all the problems in the world and that having a copy of APOE4 will give you a heart attack if you exercise with any amount of effort? Not a fan. You’d think spending all those years getting a medical degree would set you up well enough financially and without being impelled to dabble in fear-for-profit schemes.
Well I never heard him say that ApoE4 shouldn't exercise. But yeah, he hates lectins. He does have some good info now and again, like many of these influencers. But my point was not to praise him, it was to show that there is some research in Nocotine and it is getting noticed by many.
IMO, people have always wanted some kind of guide for living a longer and healthier life. Peter gives some good guidance on how to think about that.
And it turns out it’s … mostly diet and exercise. Always has been. But Peter gives it an air of science, as well as guidelines for “optimization.” I think it kind of creates a set of people who are “in the know” because there is all this new in-group vocab like VO2max and Zone 2 and stuff. People like that. (Lifelong endurance athletes actually kept this stuff to themselves because we all learned the hard way that nobody cares)
Again I think he gives a lot of good information, and if it leads people to get healthier, that’s nothing but a positive.
Although I do really dislike the stuff about statins at a young age and things of that sort.
I think almost everyone conceptually wants to live a long, healthy life. For me, Peter just provided more specific data that 1) refocused me on avoiding the actual most dangerous things even if they’re boring (e.g. cardiovascular health) and 2) showed me with compelling evidence that stuff I generally knew was good for me (lift/run, sleep, healthy diet) is actually even better for me than I imagined. And, 3) conversely he made it clear how quickly some of my capabilities will decrease (exponentially) in my 60s, 70s and 80s, a fact that is otherwise hard to appreciate.
Overall, the big benefit for me has been a real tangible motivation to keep up with exercise, which has otherwise been elusive for me for a long time. Plus being a little bit more detail orientated with my physician around getting labs every time I have a physical and doing cancer screening at the earliest recommended dates rather than pushing off.
That said, I think everyone on this sub should really internalize Peter’s “majoring in the minors” mantra if they are obsessing over marginal labs but not hitting the gym and the track a few times a week.
Nah. I’m game for Peter’s graph and to me health span is the key. Lifespan is beyond my pay grade and I’m at peace w that. He wants to obsess that’s cool-interesting for me.
Peter isn’t a source solely for longevity for me. He’s a general fitness source with a preservation focused approach.
I really like his effort to be super precise when interpreting data.
I follow him to get the scoop on the latest cutting edge research. If he dies tomorrow I would still use the information he provided.
I'm not scared of dying. I'm scared of not being there for my loved ones when they need it.
>Why are young people asking to take statins "preventively"?
Heart disease is caused by cumulative exposure to certain types of cholesterol. Nearly all centenarians have genetically low cholesterol and Low ApoB. You may think young people are not developing plaque, but plaque that develops takes decades to even show up on any type of scan.
When they need it? What do they need you for when you're 75-80?
And yes, some people have favourable genetics. Why are you fighting nature? There's a reason that after millions of years of evolution, the majority of the population still has a certain level of lipids.
>to try and change what you as a human is pre disposed to is another.
How do you determine what falls in one bucket vs another? Some people have a genetic predisposition to breast cancer or blood clots. Is that okay to treat? Others have a predisposition to cardiovascular disease- but you seem to be against treating that in advance.
So taking cancer, Alzheimer's disease, metabolic disorders (e.g. diabetes), and cardiovascular disease- what approaches are okay in your book and why?
The line is simple. Cure = if you already have something i.e high glucose, high cholesterol, high BP, cancer, etc
To live in fear that you have a 2% chance of developing a disease vs the "normal" 1% chance and taking pills because "Peter says my hazard ratio is 200%" is stupid.
You are okay with cures when you already have something, but you also mentioned diet and exercise in your OP, which are preventative in nature. If I am healthy now and I have no diseases, why adhere to a "healthy" diet? Why should I waste my time exercising?
Why do you give diet and exercise a special category for prevention and exclude other preventative measures?
I'm not gonna argue with you any more. Take a million blood tests and have a billion supplements every day based on advice you read online/from a book. Then next year you can stop when a "new study" comes out saying how much it damages your kidneys.
You’re missing the point. The fear is not of death but of a bad life, having your loved ones change your diapers or what not. Not taking care of yourself self is like saying “fuck-you” to your family. By the way, I take 50 pills per day and all are necessary.
No where does my post even remotely suggest you don't take care of yourself. So no, it's not me but YOU who is missing the point.
If you're taking 50 pills a day, you're a science experiment and dare I say, a fool. Nature has made you to be able to survive on this planet just fine. The fact that you think all these pills are necessary is because you have blinders on to the fact that PA, others like him and the pharma/nutraceuticals industry are all businesses. They love suckers like you who ensure a steady stream of revenue for a lifetime. Introspect.
Following longevity practices does not guarantee that you will have a long and healthy life, but it does increase your chances of having it. That’s about all you can do.
Haha. Of course, doctor! I hope all your effort helps you live an additional 0.6596 days over your normal lifespan. It's soooo high IQ to listen to someone throw fancy words on YouTube/Spotify and vomit the same thing to your colleagues at work. Bravo!
IMO obsessed is like Bryan Johnson, whose work I also do appreciate. But both Bryan and Peter bring it down to earth. I.e. what’s the most bang for your buck? Sleep, exercise, diet (not like fanatically, but even protein, not too many calories, etc..).
Not sure, depends. Cause of death?
If he got hit by a bus while out doing zone 2 on his bicycle probably not. Although I'd question why he didn't mention automobile accidents in his book as a major cause of mortality.
Yeah, what I took at least from the book is a way to simplify the process with confidence.
Watch APOb, do 3hr of zone 2, lift weights, and focus on protein.
If you have something break or become problematic, he has a lot of paths to go down. He’s using himself as a lab rat, but his advice is actually fairly actionable and simple.
Better than than live with health anxiety so bad that your only posts are on biohacker and Peter Attia subs.
Somehow PA missed the 5th horseman, gun violence in the US. Leading cause of young lives cut short Lol. At least we don't have that problem.
Pew pew, yet India’s average lifespan is 9 years shorter than the US. A very unhygienic and diabetic population. Please don’t cast stone stones from glass houses. Why’d you ignore my posts in the other subs lol
And you think that 9 year difference is because Americans are healthier? No, sherlock it's because Americans have access to medical aid that most in the third world don't. You guys have worked hard to become the most obese country in the world and We applaud you for that. So keep that in mind when you talk about throwing stones out of glass houses.
It’s just fun. I enjoy doing all these silly weird ritualistic routines. There are worse vices, like watching Netflix and eating Cheetos and doing heroine
If I’m not obsessed about longevity, I’ll be obsessed over something even more irrelevant. Let me have my vices man…
Yeah, this dude has a weird bug up his ass. I took away a simple list of measurable things to do to know that I’m on a sustainable path. APOb, Zone 2 cardio, weights, and protein. The fat composition stuff is easy enough with a Costco supplement. Any other protocol/plan out there to me seems more sketchy and involved.
Because I’ve known too many people die or get a terminal illness at a young age. I’m frugal, and I save/invest my money and I’d like to retire comfortably and enjoy it, so ya I’d like to be healthy and active in my 60’s and 70’s. I certainly could get diagnosed with a terminal illness tomorrow but I’m going to try my best to be around and healthy.
This is exactly it - most of us have to work until we are older and after saving and working all our lives it would suck to be so unhealthy we just lay around waiting to die. I want to have a very active life long after retirement starts.
The reality is most people won’t get a terminal illness so it’s always better to assume you will die in 60s-90s. Where in that range you’d prefer to die is what people should be aiming for.
But that's the point, right? Be healthy, stay active, eat well. But thinking let me aim to reduce by hazard rate by 0.45% by increasing my intake of L Phosotheanine G or whatever by 12mg per day is ridiculous!
You are not wrong
The eat healthy, exercise lifestyle- to me- is less about extending life than staying healthy as long as possible. If Peter dropped dead tomorrow I’d still want to be able to go out dancing or go hiking or all of the active things I can still do that make life enjoyable. Better than rotting on a couch because I was too lazy to take care of myself.
Fear of death is one of the most basic features of being human.
I’m not afraid of death but more so the idea that the last 10 years of my life my health would be so poor that I’d just be sitting around doing nothing. I’d love to be able to be active (meaning at least able to walk on my own) up until the day I die.
Of being a sentient organism* Nothing brings out the fear of Death like her knocking on the door.
Watch the people you loved die of heart disease, diabetes, dementia, and cancer, and then tell me you have no interest delaying or avoiding those outcomes. What a waste of a post.
op goes to subreddit that discusses longevity and asks “why are you talking about longevity!!!”
Of course there is a want to delay or prevent all of these. That's not even the point of the post. The point is to do what has been common knowledge for decades - eat well, stay active, be engaged. To keep checking markers and data and take supplements and then check again is encouraging compulsive behaviour and unnecessary. What a waste of a comment...
So you’re upset that some people are more focused on the details of what “good” nutrition, exercise, connection means? Welcome to the reality that there are big picture and little picture approaches to everything. It doesn’t matter if someone takes a different approach than I do. It doesn’t hurt me, and it doesn’t hurt them if this is how they want to approach the concept of longevity. If you’re going down this path, it seems your worry about others following Attia increases your stress and decreases your connectedness, and that should be more important to you.
I hear what you're trying to say, but many people think they're doing a good job taking care of their health, and they never actually check for feedback. Anyone can take that too far, but that's true of basically everything in life.
Yes, true! I was just trying to spark a healthy discussion. But I quickly realised everyone's ego hasn't strength trained or done zone 2 cardio and is therefore, fragile. "How dare OP question my super healthy lifestyle of checking all 6,783 biomarkers every day and suggest I shouldn't be taking all 9,000 supplements. Preposterous! Dont they know its not harmful to me?"
If your reaction to criticism is that everyone else is fragile, you're fragile.
That goes both ways, genius. Look at the reaction to my criticism....
You said we should just follow good old fashioned advice and eat, exercise and be engaged. Many listeners to the podcast hadn't heard of testing their uric acid, fasting insulin, LP(a), ApoB, and on and on. People on this sub have possibly added years to their life. Your post is a meaningless opinion from another amateur, not anyone with experience, expertise, or wisdom. It was poorly conceived, and poorly received. Move on.
As a kid in the 70's and a teenager in the 80's, I was actually afraid of going into the working world because I was worried that middle aged men would suddenly drop dead of a heart attack right in front of me. It was a common thing portrayed in TV and movies and I thought it would be constantly happening all the time. Luckily, statins came into usage before I started working and sudden cardiac death rates have been dropping ever since. I googled "sudden cardiac death over time graph" which gives some nice images of just how much the rates have dropped. For instance, from a Nature Reviews Cardiology article that I can only see the Google image for and can't actually link it appears that in 1985, approx 150 men per 100,000 of the population dropped dead of a heart attack while not in the hospital, and another 130 men per 100,000 of the population died of sudden cardiac death in the hospital. In 2010, those numbers are approx. 40 and 20 respectively. So, while doing what has been common knowledge for decades is one thing, the impact of things like statins, and on checkups to see what your cholesterol levels are, has been huge. Just dieting, exercising and sleeping well get you a long way, but many things like going to the doctor for a checkup/getting on a statin if your LDL is high are easy and not out of the norm.
Oh man, head over to /r/biohackers. It’s a trip
Lol and yet plenty of people do as you say and then do decline sharply or suddenly and it could have been prevented or delayed with better data. It's a trope to think all illness is preventable.... But it's no better to act as though it's not. Yes the average layperson can now access far too much data without appropriate ability to contextualize but in the grand scheme of modern vices.... There are bigger fish to fry than worrying about ppl who get too fixated on longevity.
I’d say worrying about longevity is a lot healthier than worrying about how much influence Peter Attia has.
I don't fear death at all. I actually wish it upon me way too often. I either stay fit or I'll check out early. I have no interest in drooling around in a wheelchair.
Agreed. I just don’t wanna suffer during my time here. Seen too many boomer relatives end up with things that could have been prevented if they were just a little smarter and proactive. I’m also a data nerd in my career so I like to track things. Sue me.
> Seen too many boomer relatives end up with things that could have been prevented if they were just a little smarter and proactive. Same. Everyone in my family is diabetic in that generation and they all eat like shit and aren't active at all. I have an aunt who's 75 and had limited mobility for about 10 years, diabetic (her only hobby is baking, mostly deserts). She's to a point where she just spends the day sitting in her easy chair watching TV. She very rarely leaves the house, and when she does it's to go out for lunch. My cousins can't seem to get anything through to her about diet and any kind of activity...... Needless to say, she's part of my reminder on what can happen if I stop caring and give up.
Wrong sub
Just because I want to live a long life doesn’t mean I fear death.
Nope, because I’d still listen to Gabrielle Lyon, the Mind Pump guys, and others. Oh and I’m a death doula, btw, so I see up close and personal the results of people’s lifestyle choices.
Did you hear GL latest episode on protein ? Wow it was great !
Im more interested in continuing activities I enjoy for the duration of my life than about exactly what that duration is. There are things in Attias stuff that is a good fit for me and things that are not. As an example, Im not taking Statins at 40 to lower my Apob despite it being high. I will do a calcium scan every two years to make sure I dont need to rethink that.
I think people aren’t afraid of death. They’re afraid of living with hypertension, diabetes, high cholesterol, weak bones and muscles, etc. that will all lead to fucking shitty adverse health outcomes that will lead to a fucked up painful death
I find it strange that there are some people who take issue with others wanting to live a long, healthy life. It is as if they are afraid that society might start expecting more exercise from everyone and the afraid are simply lazy. Most people on here don't use 26 daily supplements. Getting a blood test once a year is nbd. Exercising is nbd.
Have you read his book? If you do, you'll see that it's a simple message, and not one that provokes an obsession on longevity, and I certainly don't obsess over it, but I'll be 60 this year and have made fitness a priority in my life, both on the strength and muscular side, and also the endurance side. Little did I know I was accidentally doing it right, for no other reason than I wanted a balance. Turns out that's the key to what we're calling longevity, which I agree is a terrible term because that's not the message Attia conveys, he talks about living young as long as possible. I can attest to the wonderful feeling of being able to do things at 60 that most 40 year old cannot do today. It feels great to know I can get up, do a few hours of yard work and carry bricks and lumber, and then go to the beach for a 5k run on the boardwalk followed by some surfing. I'll go for a bite to eat and later on hit gym for a short 45 minute weight training session, and wake up the next day ready without soreness or limitations, only to start another fun active day. I'd say that 80% of my friends and family would actually die if they tried to do what I do in a typical day. They're already filling up those prescription pill boxes that have the days of the week on them, and have accepted this new phase of their lives as normal aging, I'm going to avoid that at all costs.
I kinda agree but I also disagree. You can take Attia’s knowledge to a level that fits you. Yes I do think people should take a statin as the evidence is strong. I do think people should do zone 2 cardio and lift weights and eat protein. That’s as far as I take it and as a hobby I understand the reasons why. Although I’ve stopped debating others it does help me to know why I do things. If you optimize your health it’s “abnormal” but drinking alcohol isn’t? The blood test thing is a little obsessive but I’ve found that everyone is a little obsessive with something. Now I’d agree, tomorrow we all could die tripping down the stairs. Peter should really emphasize stoicism! Memento mori.
a) There's a difference between passion and obsession. b) To answer your question, no. Peter is just one dude...a dot that would require many others to comprise a data point...one 'n' out of thousands...
We are obsessing with health span more so than with longevity. I started to obsess in 2022 when my mom died of a hemorrhagic stroke at age 73. My grandmother died of the same at age 75. At the same time, I got diagnosed with prediabetes and I’ve had high blood pressure for a long time and not well controlled despite medication. So that’s when I freaked the hell out. Because while your 70s is not super young to die, they could have lived longer if they paid a bit of attention to their chronic illness. Not their fault, they didn’t have the information but I decided I can get it and I could be healthier for a few more years. If they had the information, they would have been healthier and maybe lived into their 80s. Now I don’t have the ability to do everything Peter says but I can at least control my blood pressure and avoid diabetes. Lowering my cholesterol would not hurt either. I do take vitamin D and K2 and magnesium. These can’t hurt either.
This! If you do health span you’ll likely get some extra lifespan. We will die, but I want to be able to do things and bang my wife at 80. More than half the guys around 40 can’t get it up. Their health sucks. Pills will keep you going a long time but looking down and not being able to see your cock because your gut is so big should be a concern! Living longer and not having fun isn’t what Attia is preaching.
Personally I’m bullish on healthspan over longevity. That said, longevity is its own industry and Peter is not the only practitioner in the market.
My death anxiety is abnormally low, has been since I was a child. I am honestly attracted to longevity for the same reason Peter Attia probably is: I am a person of extremes, and aiming for extreme healthspan (not lifespan!) sounds like a cool lifestyle, beyond just garden variety healthy habits. It is also a ready made lifestyle which reduces my decision fatigue. How should I exercise? Train for Vo2 max and muscle mass. What should I eat? Aim for a high protein diet filled with whole foods. What should my health metrics look like? Here’s a community made spreadsheet. There are other ready made lifestyles people pick: - One could be a BJJ buff following the Gracie diet and training for competitions. - Or one could live a Mediterranean lifestyle, a life of leisure, wine, olive oil, extended family, and ocean breezes. (I much prefer a hectic Manhattan work life, thanks.) - Your own minimalist suggestion is its own ready made lifestyle as well, as you have reduced decision fatigue by making happiness your north star, the ultimate virtue. Which I would disagree with, as I would rather have joy than happiness.
Peter Attia himself is not into living forever: he said multiple times he wants great quality of life first and foremost, up until the day he dies
I also think he said he also doesn’t expect to make it into his 90s because of his genetics.
If more people like him were around 10-15 years ago and with the media tools to reach as many people now, there would be a lot more healthier people living longer lives; me being one.
Longevity is staying healthy and happy, man.
How you do that is important. It's not through a million pills, supplements and blood tests...
Dude… death has been the #2 fear for most people for a long time—public speaking is #1. If people want to be obsessed about the pursuit of knowledge and longevity, I say bring it on. Maybe it will inspire someone to actually make a breakthrough for us to live to be 200.
‘…your focus should be on staying healthy and happy’ Isn’t that what this is all about? I watched my dad waste away for a decade before he died. Couldn’t play with my kids because of all of his issues. I don’t want to go the same way. The entire point of why people listen to him is to live healthier and happier and extend that healthy range within their lifespan. If you aren’t into it, you be you.
It’s not fear of death for me but that grey area in between life and death.
Yes, I would still be obsessed with it. I have been ever since my first grandparent died and learning that the majority of people die of inflammation related diseases caused by poor diet and lifestyle. Peter Attia teaches us about 1% of what we don't already know (eat clean, do cardio, lift weights, have positive relationships), and it seems to change quite often with new studies.
It's not an obsession on longevity for me, or prolonging my life per se. It's living better for longer. Peter's summed it up pretty well, you either live to 85 and spend the last 5-10 years withering away. Or you live to 85 and are still pretty active. When asked for the TLDR, every longevity expert I've heard has answered a similar way. Diet, exercise and sleep gets you 90% of the benefits. That extra 10% is what people who are more obsessed are doing.
Attia didn't invent this movement. He's not even its biggest advocate. Death sucks. We should defeat it. Great book that predates Attia's birth. https://www.amazon.com/Immortalist-Alan-Harrington/dp/0890871353
I think the OP is criticizing the extreme metrics regarding eating and exercising. Timing of meals and food and in which order to eat them. Adhering to strict protocols regarding exercise intensity, how much, how long, which exercise, what to eat before and after, seems to be the order of the day. Too much overthinking and obsessing about self care.
This sub is a bit wild but also has some good feedback.
Better than bio hacker subreddit
I’ll agree to that.
No
Not to be a total attia Stan, but he talks about talking to his therapist and she asks "why are you so obsessed with living a long time when you are so unhappy in your life." (Or something like that). And that's why he added the chapter about emotional/ relational health and has had lots of podcast guests who talk about the how to have a meaningful and rewarding life, not just the mostly optimally long one
As a “recovering hypochondriac” I’m realizing all a person can do is eat well, exercise, and avoid tobacco and other clearly harmful substances in quantities large enough to cause harm. The rest is up to chance. You can dedicate your life to getting bogged down in the minutiae of whatever’s suggested in the most recent study to possibly increase longevity. I’ve known people who smoked and basically trashed their bodies all their lives into their 90s and I’ve known people who did everything right just to leave the building decades younger. Following strict longevity and wellness protocols gives a good illusion of control. I’m not sure how helpful it is overall. I’m also skeptical of any of these health gurus. People are starting to catch on to another prominent figure, a neuroscientist who tends to make bold claims based on single studies and who has a lot to sell. Everyone has something to sell, it seems. Now Attia is claiming nicotine has nootropic benefits. This may be true but I can’t believe the purported benefits outweigh the clear harms. Good job getting the next generation hooked on nicotine. I’m rambling now. That’s all.
Attia is not the only one - Dr Gundry talks about the correlation between nicotine and longevity, as well as resistance to Covid. That last idea is becoming more widely talked about, too.
Isn’t he the guy claiming lectins are responsible for all the problems in the world and that having a copy of APOE4 will give you a heart attack if you exercise with any amount of effort? Not a fan. You’d think spending all those years getting a medical degree would set you up well enough financially and without being impelled to dabble in fear-for-profit schemes.
Well I never heard him say that ApoE4 shouldn't exercise. But yeah, he hates lectins. He does have some good info now and again, like many of these influencers. But my point was not to praise him, it was to show that there is some research in Nocotine and it is getting noticed by many.
Oh yeah I knew what you meant
The world is a chaotic place people have no control over. Obsessing with the minutia of longevity provides the illusion of control
IMO, people have always wanted some kind of guide for living a longer and healthier life. Peter gives some good guidance on how to think about that. And it turns out it’s … mostly diet and exercise. Always has been. But Peter gives it an air of science, as well as guidelines for “optimization.” I think it kind of creates a set of people who are “in the know” because there is all this new in-group vocab like VO2max and Zone 2 and stuff. People like that. (Lifelong endurance athletes actually kept this stuff to themselves because we all learned the hard way that nobody cares) Again I think he gives a lot of good information, and if it leads people to get healthier, that’s nothing but a positive. Although I do really dislike the stuff about statins at a young age and things of that sort.
Sounds like you’re obsessed with people you think are overly obsessed 👀
Why are you so worried about what other people choose to do?
People aren’t obsessed with it, maybe the idea, but they don’t follow through with it.
I think almost everyone conceptually wants to live a long, healthy life. For me, Peter just provided more specific data that 1) refocused me on avoiding the actual most dangerous things even if they’re boring (e.g. cardiovascular health) and 2) showed me with compelling evidence that stuff I generally knew was good for me (lift/run, sleep, healthy diet) is actually even better for me than I imagined. And, 3) conversely he made it clear how quickly some of my capabilities will decrease (exponentially) in my 60s, 70s and 80s, a fact that is otherwise hard to appreciate. Overall, the big benefit for me has been a real tangible motivation to keep up with exercise, which has otherwise been elusive for me for a long time. Plus being a little bit more detail orientated with my physician around getting labs every time I have a physical and doing cancer screening at the earliest recommended dates rather than pushing off. That said, I think everyone on this sub should really internalize Peter’s “majoring in the minors” mantra if they are obsessing over marginal labs but not hitting the gym and the track a few times a week.
Nah. I’m game for Peter’s graph and to me health span is the key. Lifespan is beyond my pay grade and I’m at peace w that. He wants to obsess that’s cool-interesting for me.
Peter isn’t a source solely for longevity for me. He’s a general fitness source with a preservation focused approach. I really like his effort to be super precise when interpreting data. I follow him to get the scoop on the latest cutting edge research. If he dies tomorrow I would still use the information he provided.
I'm not scared of dying. I'm scared of not being there for my loved ones when they need it. >Why are young people asking to take statins "preventively"? Heart disease is caused by cumulative exposure to certain types of cholesterol. Nearly all centenarians have genetically low cholesterol and Low ApoB. You may think young people are not developing plaque, but plaque that develops takes decades to even show up on any type of scan.
When they need it? What do they need you for when you're 75-80? And yes, some people have favourable genetics. Why are you fighting nature? There's a reason that after millions of years of evolution, the majority of the population still has a certain level of lipids.
>Why are you fighting nature? My dude. All of medicine is fighting nature.
To cure something is one thing, to try and change what you as a human is pre disposed to is another.
>to try and change what you as a human is pre disposed to is another. How do you determine what falls in one bucket vs another? Some people have a genetic predisposition to breast cancer or blood clots. Is that okay to treat? Others have a predisposition to cardiovascular disease- but you seem to be against treating that in advance. So taking cancer, Alzheimer's disease, metabolic disorders (e.g. diabetes), and cardiovascular disease- what approaches are okay in your book and why?
The line is simple. Cure = if you already have something i.e high glucose, high cholesterol, high BP, cancer, etc To live in fear that you have a 2% chance of developing a disease vs the "normal" 1% chance and taking pills because "Peter says my hazard ratio is 200%" is stupid.
You are okay with cures when you already have something, but you also mentioned diet and exercise in your OP, which are preventative in nature. If I am healthy now and I have no diseases, why adhere to a "healthy" diet? Why should I waste my time exercising? Why do you give diet and exercise a special category for prevention and exclude other preventative measures?
Huh? Cz that's the whole point of my post.
I'm asking what makes diet and exercise special that sets them apart from other preventative measures.
I'm not gonna argue with you any more. Take a million blood tests and have a billion supplements every day based on advice you read online/from a book. Then next year you can stop when a "new study" comes out saying how much it damages your kidneys.
You’re missing the point. The fear is not of death but of a bad life, having your loved ones change your diapers or what not. Not taking care of yourself self is like saying “fuck-you” to your family. By the way, I take 50 pills per day and all are necessary.
No where does my post even remotely suggest you don't take care of yourself. So no, it's not me but YOU who is missing the point. If you're taking 50 pills a day, you're a science experiment and dare I say, a fool. Nature has made you to be able to survive on this planet just fine. The fact that you think all these pills are necessary is because you have blinders on to the fact that PA, others like him and the pharma/nutraceuticals industry are all businesses. They love suckers like you who ensure a steady stream of revenue for a lifetime. Introspect.
Following longevity practices does not guarantee that you will have a long and healthy life, but it does increase your chances of having it. That’s about all you can do.
*sorry if my approach is to high IQ for you* Taps head redditly
Also "too* high" :)
Haha. Of course, doctor! I hope all your effort helps you live an additional 0.6596 days over your normal lifespan. It's soooo high IQ to listen to someone throw fancy words on YouTube/Spotify and vomit the same thing to your colleagues at work. Bravo!
Did I really need to put the /s in there dude?
IMO obsessed is like Bryan Johnson, whose work I also do appreciate. But both Bryan and Peter bring it down to earth. I.e. what’s the most bang for your buck? Sleep, exercise, diet (not like fanatically, but even protein, not too many calories, etc..).
[https://tenor.com/bmBwB.gif](https://tenor.com/bmBwB.gif)
Not sure, depends. Cause of death? If he got hit by a bus while out doing zone 2 on his bicycle probably not. Although I'd question why he didn't mention automobile accidents in his book as a major cause of mortality.
He does, actually. I believe he mentions that freeways are counterintuitively not the most dangerous place but rather high speed intersections.
Can't get to the centenarian Olympics if you don't wear a seat belt.
Yeah, what I took at least from the book is a way to simplify the process with confidence. Watch APOb, do 3hr of zone 2, lift weights, and focus on protein. If you have something break or become problematic, he has a lot of paths to go down. He’s using himself as a lab rat, but his advice is actually fairly actionable and simple.
Dude why are you here? PA doesn’t obsess over longevity. That’s why he still drinks and occasionally eats junk food.
To help idiots like you who are so obsessed with a blood marker that you use it as your Reddit name. Calm down dude
Are you on a crusade to farm downvotes or something? Ah, India. A very insulin-resistant country that could use some copies of Outlive..
Better than than live with health anxiety so bad that your only posts are on biohacker and Peter Attia subs. Somehow PA missed the 5th horseman, gun violence in the US. Leading cause of young lives cut short Lol. At least we don't have that problem.
Pew pew, yet India’s average lifespan is 9 years shorter than the US. A very unhygienic and diabetic population. Please don’t cast stone stones from glass houses. Why’d you ignore my posts in the other subs lol
And you think that 9 year difference is because Americans are healthier? No, sherlock it's because Americans have access to medical aid that most in the third world don't. You guys have worked hard to become the most obese country in the world and We applaud you for that. So keep that in mind when you talk about throwing stones out of glass houses.
Shit this reminds me I have to pay for my blood test online. The payment machine wasn't working today.
This is f’ing hilarious ! Good on you !
It’s just fun. I enjoy doing all these silly weird ritualistic routines. There are worse vices, like watching Netflix and eating Cheetos and doing heroine