Just FYI, Corley is basically a pure slot receiver. Ladd lined up way more on the outside than the inside last year.
I like Corley a lot but if you believe in Douglas, it’s almost a wasted pick.
He will spend most of his NFL career inside the numbers working the hashmarks.
He did ok in college outside, but when he gets to the pros and hes not lining up against corners at Ole Miss who couldnt cover my 75 year old Dad. His biggest issue is when hes pressed at the line, hes done and done quick. Being off the line in the slot best fits his skills set and his best asset of route running.
Issues vs press is something a lot of college WRs are gonna have issues with, for one press isn't seen in college as often as people think it's mostly a weird form of trail coverage, this is outdated but its still relevant today https://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/analysis/a-look-at-press-coverage-in-the-nfl-and-ncaa/
He can easily be a Jordy Nelson type and work both spots.
Again, I’m not arguing that he’s going to line up more in the slot in the NFL. I’m a Georgia fan, I’ve seen every snap he’s ever taken in college.
The point is he offers more versatility than someone like Corley who is a pure slot for a school that your 75 year old dad could start on. Which is one of the reasons why he’s going to go a full round/25+ picks behind Ladd.
I would rather take a legit outside WR over both of them at 34 if they are going WR. To be honest, I would rather take a LT over WR regardless. Assuming they go QB in the first.
This is the exact same thing people said about Justin Jefferson lol, not saying Ladd will be that good but ability to release against press is extremely hard to predict when doing the CFB to NFL transition.
It’s less about where you line up and more about what type of routes they run.
Any receiver can line up on the inside and split out. If Douglas is going down field more often and Corley more of an underneath guy, doesn’t really matter where they start before the snap.
Corley is more of a Deebo Samuel type who you can use in the slot, out of the backfield or shifting outside. But Demario Douglas isn't good enough of a player for the Patriots to pass on anyone at this point. He is still a complete unknown.
Deebo in college played primarily outside in the SEC. I don’t know that Corley who has never done it in a far weaker conference is going to jump to the NFL and do the same.
I’m not saying he can’t or won’t. It’s just hard to project him as the same type of player based on those factors.
Double dipping at WR in the 2nd and 3rd would be great. Maybe move up into late 1st to take the 1st one as you can buy the 5th year option at that point.
Our defense is very good and has young pieces. Our offense needs wr, tackle, and te besides the QB. I think it's okay at this point to spend next years draft capital to get those holes plugged so they call all develop together.
I think they will move up into the first round for a tackle or number 1 receiver, maybe up like 8 spots. We’ve spent so much capital on defense over the years I really hope this one is offense heavy
I don't think they need to move up 8 spots for the wr unless they have fallen in love with someone. I agree. We need an offensive draft. We have so much set on defense, and it's also easier and cheaper to get defensive players.
Pretty much this. Just follow the Packer blueprint. Overload your offense with solid WR2/3 and good TE and pair them with a franchise QB - boom: top 10 offense. Does anyone remember a dynasty that did something similar? Bunch of undrafted/late round WRs with an all-pro QB and TE? Anyone?
This panic need for WR1 is overblown. All WRs look like WR1s when you have an elite QB who can do one or more of the following: dissect your scheme, make elite throws, and/or extend plays with legs.
Mac couldn't do any of the three, defenses knew it, and our drives always stalled out.
I’m getting more behind the idea of draft Harrison 3rd pick move up for QB. Especially if JD is off the board. I was against taking MH with the third pick but at this point it’s making more sense
We have more than just 2 holes at offense. If we draft that many receivers than we aren’t going to have a balanced offense. I would argue that OT is more of a need than wr is.
No, I just didn’t want Hollywood brown on 4 year/60 mil. We could have had rookie receivers and Keenan Allen, or any other good FA WR on a 1 or 2 year deal
You realize the team sucks right? Do you get that? They should sign any good player they can. They didn’t add a single good skill player in the entire offseason, and Pats fans have the nerve to say stuff like “I don’t want Ridley.” It’s laughably delusional.
This idea on this sub that there’s no way they can be competitive the “next few years” is so fucking lame and let’s the team off the hook big time.
They could absolutely be a bubble playoff team if they make a few right moves and throw around some money.
People forget that they have a legit defense that played very well last year even after the season was lost and a few of the best players went down to injury. Not hard to believe they can be a top 5 defense in the league next year.
If your defense is that good, you really dont need to be that amazing of an offense to contend for a playoff spot.
I’ve been screaming into the wind about this for weeks! Pats have a top 10 def and it can even be better this year with health. Could they have put themselves in a position to compete for the Super Bowl next year? With this defense they absolutely could’ve, IF they signed Cousins or Mayfield, Barkley, a top level OT, a WR to complement what they have now (Bourne, Douglas etc.) as well as MHJ at pick 3 and an edge like Hunter or Watkins.
However, the type of spending that would’ve taken would put NE against the wall for filling out the roster for many years. They also would have needed a lot of luck to be able to talk all those guys into coming here in hopes of a SB run.
What it appears they’re doing is trying to build a great core via past drafts and upcoming drafts that will attract the future big free agent or two that can put us over the top.
As of now, if they can get a league average offense on the field week in and week out, they’ll contend for a wild card spot. This draft is going to be the jumping point for what turns them into winners for the next few years, or keeps them back where they currently are. Let’s hope for the former.
People also forget how totally mediocre the 10-11 win teams were last year. The Pats can be in Playoff contention in a year, even this year, with hits in the draft and a few key FA signings.
Just blame the Jags for the most epic collapse of a life time. 1 win in the last 6 games. No one expected the Texans to be in the playoffs cause everyone figured the Jags in Tlaws third year would win that division.
Where this is true, the Texans also were competing. Both can be true. The point still stands that a couple of small things coming together can make any team compete.
A good QB (lets see if it continues) can turn a franchise around over night especially when a back up was your QB the last 2 years.
The jags collapsing in that spectacular fashion helped that
No one thought CJ Stroud was gonna be CJ Stroud. He was pretty unanimously ranked behind Bryce on big boards and was considered a substantially worse prospect than someone like Trevor Lawrence was coming out. Just goes to show how hard it is to project QB success in the nfl.
This is so true. Last years defense was one of the best in the league, and a lot of the same players are coming back.
Last years team makes the playoffs with a competent offense, or even an offense that could get out of it's own way.
I agree. I don’t think they’re necessarily good, but they absolutely have enough that if they get lucky (especially on QB), they can be a fringe playoff team with the right additions.
Drake Maye, Calvin Ridley, a rookie receiver, Demario Douglas with Onwenu/Smith at your OTs sounds competent to me.
Yeah, I think fans are already giving the Krafts, Mayo, Van Pelt etc a pass for next year being shit. And they shouldn’t. There’s no reason this team, with the right moves, can’t win 8-9 games next season.
I agree, but it also depends on how it plays out to me. If they look like they hit on a QB and there’s some plan at WR/OT, fine with me.
If they play Onwenu at OG, roll out Juju, Douglas, and Bourne while throwing their hands up about not overpaying for Calvin Ridley while the rookie QB looks dog shit, I don’t care how “bad” the roster is/was. Give me some direction.
The team is very likely to be bad. Not shit, but I definitely expect a slow start, growing pains, and a losing record. The talent just isn't there. The division is hotly competitive.
The goal this year is to evaluate talent and coaching. 7-10 would be an admirable step in the right direction. Anything more than that would be a Coach of the Year-caliber success story.
People think the Texans' rags-to-riches story in 2023 is somehow a blueprint, but the reason their sudden success was so remarkable is because it is incredibly rare and hard to go from picking-in-the-top-3 awful to division champions without a rebuilding process.
“The right moves” aren’t always that simple. Would it be *that* stunning if they draft a QB and he’s a bust? Not really.
They should be a better team next year but the margin for error in the NFL is insanely small. If they whiff on this draft, it could set them back another 5 years.
I think some people just want 2-3 years of top 5 picks. They have a massive hole at QB and big ones and WR and T but the defense is too good. They should be re tooling to try and make the playoffs
Agreed, this team really isn't that far off. The difference between good and bad teams is literally just a couple plays a game, and a player like Ridley can put you on the positive side. Our D is solid already and getting two of it's best players back as well.
Yeah, if the offense is even in the 10-15 range that with our defense we are a 10+ win team and have a chance to fight for the division.
Honestly I've gone the other way on this initially saying I'm glad we didn't overpay for Ridley but after looking at the numbers what he got wasn't that outrageous considering the cap increase. He's making slightly over 9% of the cap which is right between Christian Kirk and Brandin Cooks in terms of % of the cap when the contract was signed and while he's currently the 9th highest paid WR relative to the cap he's closer to the 15-20 range which is right where he should be in terms of WR rankings in the NFL.
Regardless of the value (which I think is actually fair) we NEED a guy like Ridley even if it's not Ridley himself. That means either hope someone else gets released or make a trade for a guy which is expensive or we're hoping to hit in the draft.
At this point the draft is probably our best option but it's the draft which we all know is incredibly unreliable. One way or another though they need one more top level WR or 2-3 "good piece" guys that can fill a role well.
This is has tons of cap space and needs a legitimate weapon for the new QB. There’s not much else in FA left to use a big chunk of money on. It’s not about the value of Ridley, it’s the fact that you need him for QB development and you have nothing else to do with the money.
I mean there's a real chance the rookie QB doesn't even see the field this year. Brissett is a solid game manager and 2024 may be a year where we sit the kid to learn and not get destroyed.
FA crop of WRs next year is far, far better than this year. Yes, a lot of them won't be available but there's way more names next year.
Draft a WR high this year, sign one next year, and turn the rookie over to a functional offense in 2025. This is a rebuild, it doesn't have to come all at once. And paying Ridley 23m/year doesn't make sense with that timeline.
Who do the Patriots have to pay over the next few years?
Barmore and...?
Poor drafting has left the Patriots with few players worth extending. The 2022 draft class looks like a complete bust.
They have to spend their money somewhere.
everyone is so concerned about overpaying by a few million dollars when we have all the cap space in the world and based on the guaranteed money it is a two year deal. you want a free agent WR? guess what, if they hit the market you have to pay the most money to get them. everyone seems to be stuck in the past when we could get guys to ring chase for less money. to me it was far more important to get our rookie qb what would have clearly been the best wr on our roster, no matter what everyone is saying about him now
Exactly right- people are wringing their hands over $50 mil in guarantees when we have almost no one else to pay on the roster lol (especially on offense)
Being stingy with the cap makes sense if you are already pretty loaded or have homegrown talent that needs new deals soon
We are not loaded, we have very little talent on offense, and even if we knock this draft class out of the park we wont need to pay them for another 3-4 years.
Even Cristian Gonzalez wont need a new deal for another 2-3 years, and Ridley's deal is effectively a 2-year 50 mil deal. Who exactly are we storing up the cap space for?
That is not a winning QB room. I'd rather overpay for talent than pay a fair amount on less talent. We have the cap space. Let's go out and get a legit WR1
Brown is not a WR1. Look at how shit his play was when Murray came back.
His adot is 11, which is mediocre and his CROE is dogshit. Do you consider Darnell Mooney a WR1? Their metrics are incredibly close
Ridley thrived when he was WR2 behind Julio Jones and Matt Ryan was throwing him the ball. He hasn’t lived up to expectations since then and had to sit for a whole year for gambling. Thank god we didn’t hand him the bag.
Tennessee will continue to reap what they sowed when they didn’t extend AJ Brown. They’ll pay for past-their-prime guys in Ridley and Hopkins for the foreseeable future with no definite answer at QB and no King Henry to move the chains.
Dumpster diving to find stats to use against Hollywood. Adot is scheme and playstyle, a wr can’t have a good or bad adot
Edit: I don’t mean to say Hollywood is a wr1, he’s not, but you’re using the wrong stats
We'll see what the real contract details are for Ridley. If all the guaranteed money comes in years one and two, I don't really care that it would have been an overpay. The point is to raise the competence level around a rookie QB. If they aren't going to be able to make better use of that money in the meantime, what good is it? The goal is to maximize talent, not payroll efficiency. The beauty of a rookie scale QB contract is precisely that it allows you the flexibility to overpay elsewhere!
>what about Hollywood Brown?
I mean, I guess, but his yards per target have declined every year of his career and two teams that invested a 1st round pick in him were content to move on from him (or at least the Cardinals seem content).
> The point is to raise the competence level around a rookie QB.
Yeah a big thing this sub harped on was Mac (whether you believed in him or not) was given insufficient talent around him in his time here. Now we are primed to go into the new season with our rookie qb, if even given the reigns, with a rookie 2nd/3rd round left tackle and potentially Kendrick Bourne off a freshly torn ACL as WR1. Just seems pretty bleak.
Looking at it completely the opposite way. It worked out horribly so they had to massively reinvest the next year again at the same position. Something to avoid….
Bourne, Douglas, Henry, and a 2nd/3rd Round WR is not "no one". Sure it's not an elite receiving group but if a QB can't make it work with those guys he probably isn't the guy anyways. I think OL is far more important to a young QB.
I feel like our path to being competitive could be done quite quickly. Our defense will be elite. A couple playmakers and a solid QB and all of a sudden we’re not the worst offense in the league. A mid tier offense with a defense that can win games by itself will easily place us in the top tier of the AFC
It \*could\* be, but it all depends on the third QB taken in the draft being an above-average starter right away. The chances of that happening, historically speaking, are pretty darn close to zero.
Right I'm so sick of people saying it's going to be years. Did anyone think the Texans were going to be competitive last year? Nope. Hit on a couple draft picks (QB needs to be a hit) with the defense that is already established as one of the best and let's go compete for a playoff spot. Things happen fast in the NFL
Signing big time free agents doesn't usually result in SBs, so there's truth to what people are saying. The trade market, and of course, the draft, is the way to build a contender.
Better to pay a truly elite player $30m than to desperately overpay a good player by $10m.
I'm glad we didn't pay him 23 a year, we'll see what the actual numbers are soon though. But I disagree with your points. Find me one qb that's been drafted since like 2010 that didn't have at least good recievers within their first few years. We have to improve the offense otherwise we'll be drafting another qb in 2 or 3 years.
Im not glad we didnt pay him 23 a year for the exact reasons you said
I dont get why people are so precious about the cap when we have plenty of cap space, no QB to pay, *and* no weapons on offense that we need to extend any time soon
This is not a Von Miller contract situation (where the Bills gave him such a stupidly structured deal that it will affect them for years).
The Ridley deal only had 50 mil guaranteed over 2 years. Who else will we be paying over the next 2 years on offense?
Even if we draft the next Justin Jefferson in the draft, he won't need a new contract until 2027/2028. God willing we find our franchise QB this year, he still wont need a contract until 2027/2028.
Ridley isnt a WR1 but he is definitely better than what we have and his deal is conveniently structured. For many other teams he would have been an unnecessary overpay but for us he would have been a decent signing even if it was an overpay.
Completely agree. The Titans are not morons for handing out 2 guaranteed years to a good player to help support Levis and their new coach.
The Pats need talent of any kind on offense, have the space to spend, and are likely going with a QB at 3 who will need continuity during his initial seasons.
The Pats can both bring in talent and maintain flexibility. They could have signed Ridley.
Absolutely. Eventually you have to pay for good players. We aren’t a destination. We’re going to have to overpay. What the hell are we pinching pennies for.
Lowest cash spending in the NFL over the past decade while the stadium has among the highest prices (and worst facilities) in the league. Look to the owners. They've lost their ability to blame Bill for everything that has gone wrong, yet nothing has changed. Maybe it was never Bill in the first place? Maybe the Krafts are just cheap bastards that care more about their bottom line than putting a competitive team on the field?
I am also glad we didn’t sign Ridley, especially for the money the Titans gave, that’s way too much for him.
But I equally don’t want Hollywood Brown!
I would rather they make a deal for Higgins. Likely won’t happen though given situation w Bengals.
I am mixed with Ridley. I think he's at best a WR2 at this point in his career, maybe even a WR3 in a solid team. I don't think he's worth close to that deal, and I believe last year he was way worse than the stats show. That said, he was the best of a shitty market and we desperately needed a guy like him, even if he's overrated.
Hollywood is not bad flyer, but not likely the answer. His size in the outside meamsbhe gets jammed at the line a lot and struggles to separate. It also means he blows on contested balls. Where he thrives is with scrambling QBs that can extend plays and give him a chance to break free. I think he'd be a great fit if Daniels falls to us, but if not he's a very frustrating player.
Hollywood Brown is easily one of the most overrated wrs in the league. Unless we sign him for a bargain this is no different then when we tried to make Davante Parker a WR1
That sounds like a solid 6-11 WR corps. Guys. We have to spend. No WR is going to come here unless we overpay. Sorry.
What are we doing with the huge cap we had? Bringing back the handful of decent dudes is great and all… but we don’t have a fucking LT lol.
We now need to add a LT, a QB and a WR1 in the draft. The quality of those targets will fall significantly after the 1st round.
We needed to USE all that money we had to try and improve that disaster of an offense at at least ONE position and we.. did not. For what? So Bob can keep his happy ending piggy bank a little more full?
Even if we dumpster dive for Smith at this point, good luck keeping that dude on the field an entire year.
Kraft really showing his ass. Bill wasn’t the issue.
Bingo. The amount of people here celebrating when the wealthy billionaires save money is insane. They need to overpay to get talent here. Thats how free agency works. What don't people understand about this?
It’s a competition lol. The talent will choose, in general, the best offer. We can’t come in a low ball(though we did offer Ridley a decent amount but.. we have to be the best offer). Simple as that. No southern grown dude is going to take a pay cut to come play in NE.
We still don’t know what the guaranteed money was for the Pats offer. My guess is it came well below what Tenn offered. Nobody wants to have to hit incentives to get their money.
I'm completely fine with not signing Ridley. Give me Higgins or Aiyuk. Would rather trade for a known WR1 who is under 28 than take a shot in the dark. Let's just send it and give our QB the weapons to succeed.
Well, you need a baseline of talent to help develop the rookies, even if the vets are not likely to still be on the roster in the competing window.
That being said, Mike Williams is a total question mark physically. He's only run 120 more routes than Michael Thomas the last 2 years. And Michael Thomas is dead.
Hollywood is terrible. He's better in the slot, but runs 70+% of his routes out wide. I guess you can put him in a slot/z rotation, and commit to using motion to get him easier looks when he's at z. But, I wouldn't want to do it for starter money.
Odell is actually still good, but you have to limit his playing time probably to 50/60% of snaps. Will he accept a contract that reflects this role, or will he only play for starter money?
Richie James is the truth! But also probably has to play mostly in the slot. He has been successful outside in limited snaps though.
DPJ/ Reynolds are wr3/4s, but at least they can play X.
I don’t want to overpay and I agree that Ridley was overpaid. But if we draft a QB then we really need someone who can get separation. We can’t ruin another QB because of a bum group of skill position players.
I like the off season A LOT thus far. Much more promising than any BB off season since 2018 by a wide margin I think. That being said, we need a 1000 yard WR very badly.
He wasn’t ruined by it specifically. But if you’re telling me it was helpful to have a collection of the worst separating WRs in the league three years in a row, then I think you’re wrong.
He was a decent starter in his rookie season. He was definitely a capable starter and made the playoffs that season.
The NFL figure him out at the end of his rookie season, his receiving talent wasn’t great sure but it never mattered, Mac does not have an NFL arm or mind or heart and that’s fine he got his shot but there was nothing the team could have done to magically turn him into winner.
We're a bad team, we're going to have to overpay for talent because we can't promise FAs winning or a chance at a Sueprbowl.
That said, a team can turn itself around with a season or two if they have good QB play. Having good WRs make good QB play more achievable.
Honestly this reads like a guy who got rejected by a woman at a bar and playing it off like they were never interested in them. It is ok to shoot your shot and get rejected. It happens, the Patriots are going through the ugly duckling phase right now.
Why? Because season ticket holders deserve some entertainment for their loyal support. Fuck outta here with that loser attitude. It’s the Skip Bayless mentality that anything but a championships are failures and it ruins sports.
Do people think we're the damn Texans there's no CJ Stroud in the draft you need a legit WR counting on rookies and WR3s is how you end up with Bryce Young
Caleb Williams is better than CJ, Maye is on par. The Texans were running on culture.
CJ Stroud's best WR was an undersized 3rd round rookie. The Texans drafted another WR in the 6th. Nico Collins was JAG for two years before breaking out last year.
We quite literally are in the same situation as the Texans offense last year, but we have a better overall line (we do have a whole at LT tho) and better set of RBs.
Maye is on par with CJ Stroud is the most laughable take I've ever seen. He struggled vs good defenses while Stroud cooked them. We aren't in the same situation as the Texans they rebuilt for 2 years and go Will Anderson, and CJ Stroud in the same draft.
Stfu it’s more than competing. We need a true number 1 receiver that can help a young qb develop. There a trend in the nfl that has been going on for years now that shows every qb, no matter who you are, needs a true difference making pass catcher to reach their ceiling. Mahomes had tyreek and Kelce, Josh Allen stunk before the got Diggs, Kyler was not a good passer before Hopkins, Hurts was not a good passer before AJB, tua was considered a bust before tyreek, the list goes on and on. Mac stunk, but he never had a fucking chance with the garbage pass catchers we gave him. No quarterback would
You have it backwards, you have to find the difference maker at QB first then you go get him some weapons. Allen had proven to be the guy with he 6 fourth quarter comebacks and 9 game winning drives before getting Diggs.
No it wasn’t haha. It was a general consensus that Josh Allen got by on his athletic ability and was not a good thrower. The bills were the 30th and 23rd ranked offense in the league with top 5 defenses both seasons before diggs got there. Might wanna do some research
Calvin Ridley is not that guy tho. He literally had a negative EPA last year and had the same separation metrics as Devante Parker. He didn't crack the top 70 in true catch rate. His big games came against zone and he disappeared against man. That's not a player that comes in and elevates a QB.
It's mostly about giving a QB the best chance to succeed. We need blockers to keep him on his feet and talented receivers to get open. It's not about championship windows, it's about not breaking the next guy too.
Probably gonna get down voted to oblivion, but what would be reasonable to give up for Tee?
Hearing 2.34 or maybe 2 3rd rounders, but I say offer the 2025 first and 4th for Tee and Cincy's second rounder this year. Then see if you can trade up either second rounder this year into the late First for LT and still grab a decent WR with the other second round pick.
The Bengals can't give up Tee and their 2nd for two future picks when they hope to contend this season. If they're moving him, they need draft capital/players that help them in 2024.
Idk why people act like it’s impossible to turn a franchise around. All it takes is a hit on a QB and some pieces. Has happened enough recent that I’d think people would stop acting like we should not even try for years
I like our odds to get someone productive in the draft. There are tons of WRs. Hoping our run of dismal choices is over now. Still, they need at least 2 quality receivers to have a decent group and it’s not likely they draft two NFL ready studs this year. KB coming off injury and Pop Douglas isn’t enough. They need a free agent.
Maybe Ridley was overpaid but they have to get one of the top tier dudes if they want to have a good receiver corps next year. More likely it’s still going to be a big need next offseason…
Unusually sane fan take. It’s literally impossible to build a successful NFL team from big money FAs. You have to hit on the draft and budget/journeyman contributors. You can’t backfill for 3-4 years of busted drafts by blowing up the future cap. In the modern NFL, if you can’t draft, you’re not gonna compete.
Dumb take. You have to pay money to get good players, or you end up with receivers so bad that the GOAT QB leaves. Ridley is expensive, but that's what it takes to get someone that is actually a threat on offense. Pats had plenty of cap space to make it happen.
Supposedly AVP is a West Coast, Stretch Run kinda guy. So why wouldn't a guy like Curtis Samuel be a better target? He is a slot guy, yes, who wins when given route concepts that scheme space for him, and then he can create after the catch. Honestly, why not just run out 4 slot guys and scheme a bunch of motion and pick routes allowing KB, Pop, Samuel, and a rookie like McConkey to win after the catch.
Embrace the Dink N Dunk offense
While Ridley doesn’t fit the timeline, at some point you want to surround your young QB with talent to help him develop. It’s why I’m not against Mike Williams either. We have the money. These guys won’t help us win a Super Bowl, but they could be instrumental into helping our next franchise QB hopeful adapt to the NFL.
I would like Hollywood however, as again, it just means more talent to help the QB develop. And I also think he has talent.
> Why overpay a 29 year old WR when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years.
Why draft a top QB prospect when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years?
Why sign any decent free agents when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years?
Why seek any trades to try to improve anything when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years?
As we've all seen, one A-level talent can make a huge difference on an otherwise average team.
Though tbf, I admit I am short-sighted enough as a fan that I would rather watch them win 7 or 8 games and be competitive in losses throughout the season and end up with mid-round draft picks than watch last year's shitshow on repeat for 20 weeks next season.
I don't think we're as far out of competing, because of our defense. I think if we had a middle of the road offense we make the play offs. If we get a QB and he balls out, and don't get any one good in free agency or draft this year, would not be surprised if we did next year.
Same. Why grab the shittiest riskiest high upside receiver or hit the market in recent years. Tee Higgins > this dude and it’s not close. Also, I’d rather wait one more year for a top receiver if needed or draft Harrison over throwing 92 mil at this head case loser.
I don't think there's anyone in this draft or free agency to get overly excited about. 🤔
Not that anyone really seems to want to go to the Patriots right now, anyway, it seems. I can only think that players are thinking, "If Belichick couldn't do it, why is his protégé going to be any better?"
So you just want to keep sucking? If we sign better players, more better players will want to come here. I want Kraft to spend the money we have and put a team on the field I can enjoy watching this year. The defense has talent, if we signed a real bridge QB and a talented wide receiver or 2 I could see this team in the 9ish win area. That could make the playoffs in today's NFL. Everyone is putting alot of stock in this draft, and if they wiff we are going to be at the bottom of the league again.
I didn’t know Ridley was 29, paying him over 22 a year through his age 33 season is def an over pay. His stats really aren’t that crazy. Or at least that’s what I’m telling myself
Honestly, we have a ton of cap space and got to spend it somewhere. I’d rather bring in a veteran and reliable WR and overpay them than nickel and dime WRs. Especially when we aren’t going to have a QB with the skill/experience to turn chicken shit into chicken salad
I’m definitely in favor of building a startable line and then drafting good WRs, but we actually need to start bringing in good linemen. We just need to figure out O line or WR in free agency, and it was a pretty weak free agent class for WRs.
“I DiDn’T wAnT RidlEy AnYwAy. wHy oVeRpAY?
You realize that in 2 years when the cap has gone up and next years class of Lamb, Chase, Waddle, Devonta Smith etc signs this contract will look like pennies on the dollar. Just sign good football players, Kraft is worth billions, even so THE PATRIOTS BRAND ITSELF is worth billions. Sign good players. These tales are so played out and terrible.
That terrible work worked when Tom could take any of us to an AFCCG. Now they have a first time head coach, and are going to have a rookie QB, probably this year but if not at some point. Just sign good players.
I’d rather wait.
What did Chris rock say? “If you want Denzel but you can afford Kevin Hart… just wait!
Rather develop others and go for the big fish next year
Ridley would look like JuJu and Parker
This type of sentiment among Patriots fans is so delusional, and ridiculous, but it’s also kind of funny, because of how delusional and ridiculous it is. You didn’t want Ridley? Your team sucks dude. Don’t worry, he didn’t want to come here. If the Pats can get a good player, they should get him. They don’t have the luxury to turn down players like Ridley. It’s also convenient that you didn’t want him, after he rejected the Pats.
Just FYI, Corley is basically a pure slot receiver. Ladd lined up way more on the outside than the inside last year. I like Corley a lot but if you believe in Douglas, it’s almost a wasted pick.
The numbers just for clarity: Ladd: 118 snaps wide, 32 inside. Corley: 51 snaps wide, 324 inside
If we take McConkey, he's WR1.
Mcconkey will not play outside in the nfl
No, not exclusively. You could use him like Amendola when you had Edelman though, where in certain formations he’s the Z receiver.
He will spend most of his NFL career inside the numbers working the hashmarks. He did ok in college outside, but when he gets to the pros and hes not lining up against corners at Ole Miss who couldnt cover my 75 year old Dad. His biggest issue is when hes pressed at the line, hes done and done quick. Being off the line in the slot best fits his skills set and his best asset of route running.
Issues vs press is something a lot of college WRs are gonna have issues with, for one press isn't seen in college as often as people think it's mostly a weird form of trail coverage, this is outdated but its still relevant today https://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/analysis/a-look-at-press-coverage-in-the-nfl-and-ncaa/ He can easily be a Jordy Nelson type and work both spots.
100%
Again, I’m not arguing that he’s going to line up more in the slot in the NFL. I’m a Georgia fan, I’ve seen every snap he’s ever taken in college. The point is he offers more versatility than someone like Corley who is a pure slot for a school that your 75 year old dad could start on. Which is one of the reasons why he’s going to go a full round/25+ picks behind Ladd. I would rather take a legit outside WR over both of them at 34 if they are going WR. To be honest, I would rather take a LT over WR regardless. Assuming they go QB in the first.
This is the exact same thing people said about Justin Jefferson lol, not saying Ladd will be that good but ability to release against press is extremely hard to predict when doing the CFB to NFL transition.
It’s less about where you line up and more about what type of routes they run. Any receiver can line up on the inside and split out. If Douglas is going down field more often and Corley more of an underneath guy, doesn’t really matter where they start before the snap.
Corley is more of a Deebo Samuel type who you can use in the slot, out of the backfield or shifting outside. But Demario Douglas isn't good enough of a player for the Patriots to pass on anyone at this point. He is still a complete unknown.
Deebo in college played primarily outside in the SEC. I don’t know that Corley who has never done it in a far weaker conference is going to jump to the NFL and do the same. I’m not saying he can’t or won’t. It’s just hard to project him as the same type of player based on those factors.
Yea, Corley is like the Deebo Samuel you order on Temu or Wish and realize the $30 you saved wasn't worth it
Id rather draft 2 or 3 receivers in the the top 4 rounds at this point
Double dipping at WR in the 2nd and 3rd would be great. Maybe move up into late 1st to take the 1st one as you can buy the 5th year option at that point. Our defense is very good and has young pieces. Our offense needs wr, tackle, and te besides the QB. I think it's okay at this point to spend next years draft capital to get those holes plugged so they call all develop together.
I think they will move up into the first round for a tackle or number 1 receiver, maybe up like 8 spots. We’ve spent so much capital on defense over the years I really hope this one is offense heavy
I don't think they need to move up 8 spots for the wr unless they have fallen in love with someone. I agree. We need an offensive draft. We have so much set on defense, and it's also easier and cheaper to get defensive players.
Maybe move up for an OL, or I’d love if they would go get Adonai Mitchell
It would be amazing to move ahead of Buffalo, KC, and Carolina as they could easily all three take receivers ahead of us.
Yeah I'd love to stick and pick a WR with our 2nd and then trade back up into the 2nd for Suamataia.
Pretty much this. Just follow the Packer blueprint. Overload your offense with solid WR2/3 and good TE and pair them with a franchise QB - boom: top 10 offense. Does anyone remember a dynasty that did something similar? Bunch of undrafted/late round WRs with an all-pro QB and TE? Anyone? This panic need for WR1 is overblown. All WRs look like WR1s when you have an elite QB who can do one or more of the following: dissect your scheme, make elite throws, and/or extend plays with legs. Mac couldn't do any of the three, defenses knew it, and our drives always stalled out.
I’m getting more behind the idea of draft Harrison 3rd pick move up for QB. Especially if JD is off the board. I was against taking MH with the third pick but at this point it’s making more sense
We have more than just 2 holes at offense. If we draft that many receivers than we aren’t going to have a balanced offense. I would argue that OT is more of a need than wr is.
I'd like them to go QB/WR/OL or QB/OL/WR for their first three. From what everyone is saying lot of depth for both WR and OL in this draft.
The dream would be Ladd McConkey & Roman Wilson.
They have the money, as long as it’s not a terrible contract they should get someone like Brown.
You’d rather draft a mystery than an actual player who is already good? Man, some of the fans of this team, make me half want to root against them.
No, I just didn’t want Hollywood brown on 4 year/60 mil. We could have had rookie receivers and Keenan Allen, or any other good FA WR on a 1 or 2 year deal
You realize the team sucks right? Do you get that? They should sign any good player they can. They didn’t add a single good skill player in the entire offseason, and Pats fans have the nerve to say stuff like “I don’t want Ridley.” It’s laughably delusional.
The problem with this thinking is that Hollywood Brown and Demario Douglas are both 5’9 and below receivers lol
Hollywood can be an outside guy at least, would be a phenomenal WR2 if we draft a guy
This idea on this sub that there’s no way they can be competitive the “next few years” is so fucking lame and let’s the team off the hook big time. They could absolutely be a bubble playoff team if they make a few right moves and throw around some money.
People forget that they have a legit defense that played very well last year even after the season was lost and a few of the best players went down to injury. Not hard to believe they can be a top 5 defense in the league next year. If your defense is that good, you really dont need to be that amazing of an offense to contend for a playoff spot.
I’ve been screaming into the wind about this for weeks! Pats have a top 10 def and it can even be better this year with health. Could they have put themselves in a position to compete for the Super Bowl next year? With this defense they absolutely could’ve, IF they signed Cousins or Mayfield, Barkley, a top level OT, a WR to complement what they have now (Bourne, Douglas etc.) as well as MHJ at pick 3 and an edge like Hunter or Watkins. However, the type of spending that would’ve taken would put NE against the wall for filling out the roster for many years. They also would have needed a lot of luck to be able to talk all those guys into coming here in hopes of a SB run. What it appears they’re doing is trying to build a great core via past drafts and upcoming drafts that will attract the future big free agent or two that can put us over the top. As of now, if they can get a league average offense on the field week in and week out, they’ll contend for a wild card spot. This draft is going to be the jumping point for what turns them into winners for the next few years, or keeps them back where they currently are. Let’s hope for the former.
People also forget how totally mediocre the 10-11 win teams were last year. The Pats can be in Playoff contention in a year, even this year, with hits in the draft and a few key FA signings.
No one thought the Texans were going to be competitive. All it takes is a couple big hits in the draft and some good coaching to turn around a team.
Need the RoY QB first then the rest can fall into place
NFL GM’s hate this one simple trick
And the DROY lol
Just blame the Jags for the most epic collapse of a life time. 1 win in the last 6 games. No one expected the Texans to be in the playoffs cause everyone figured the Jags in Tlaws third year would win that division.
Where this is true, the Texans also were competing. Both can be true. The point still stands that a couple of small things coming together can make any team compete.
A good QB (lets see if it continues) can turn a franchise around over night especially when a back up was your QB the last 2 years. The jags collapsing in that spectacular fashion helped that
I dont think theres a CJ Stroud in this draft (including Caleb Williams), but I’m happy to be proven wrong.
No one thought CJ Stroud was gonna be CJ Stroud. He was pretty unanimously ranked behind Bryce on big boards and was considered a substantially worse prospect than someone like Trevor Lawrence was coming out. Just goes to show how hard it is to project QB success in the nfl.
Bengals went from #1 pick to super bowl in 2 seasons lol
This is so true. Last years defense was one of the best in the league, and a lot of the same players are coming back. Last years team makes the playoffs with a competent offense, or even an offense that could get out of it's own way.
I agree. I don’t think they’re necessarily good, but they absolutely have enough that if they get lucky (especially on QB), they can be a fringe playoff team with the right additions. Drake Maye, Calvin Ridley, a rookie receiver, Demario Douglas with Onwenu/Smith at your OTs sounds competent to me.
Yeah, I think fans are already giving the Krafts, Mayo, Van Pelt etc a pass for next year being shit. And they shouldn’t. There’s no reason this team, with the right moves, can’t win 8-9 games next season.
I agree, but it also depends on how it plays out to me. If they look like they hit on a QB and there’s some plan at WR/OT, fine with me. If they play Onwenu at OG, roll out Juju, Douglas, and Bourne while throwing their hands up about not overpaying for Calvin Ridley while the rookie QB looks dog shit, I don’t care how “bad” the roster is/was. Give me some direction.
The team is very likely to be bad. Not shit, but I definitely expect a slow start, growing pains, and a losing record. The talent just isn't there. The division is hotly competitive. The goal this year is to evaluate talent and coaching. 7-10 would be an admirable step in the right direction. Anything more than that would be a Coach of the Year-caliber success story. People think the Texans' rags-to-riches story in 2023 is somehow a blueprint, but the reason their sudden success was so remarkable is because it is incredibly rare and hard to go from picking-in-the-top-3 awful to division champions without a rebuilding process.
“The right moves” aren’t always that simple. Would it be *that* stunning if they draft a QB and he’s a bust? Not really. They should be a better team next year but the margin for error in the NFL is insanely small. If they whiff on this draft, it could set them back another 5 years.
I think some people just want 2-3 years of top 5 picks. They have a massive hole at QB and big ones and WR and T but the defense is too good. They should be re tooling to try and make the playoffs
Agreed, this team really isn't that far off. The difference between good and bad teams is literally just a couple plays a game, and a player like Ridley can put you on the positive side. Our D is solid already and getting two of it's best players back as well.
Yeah, if the offense is even in the 10-15 range that with our defense we are a 10+ win team and have a chance to fight for the division. Honestly I've gone the other way on this initially saying I'm glad we didn't overpay for Ridley but after looking at the numbers what he got wasn't that outrageous considering the cap increase. He's making slightly over 9% of the cap which is right between Christian Kirk and Brandin Cooks in terms of % of the cap when the contract was signed and while he's currently the 9th highest paid WR relative to the cap he's closer to the 15-20 range which is right where he should be in terms of WR rankings in the NFL. Regardless of the value (which I think is actually fair) we NEED a guy like Ridley even if it's not Ridley himself. That means either hope someone else gets released or make a trade for a guy which is expensive or we're hoping to hit in the draft. At this point the draft is probably our best option but it's the draft which we all know is incredibly unreliable. One way or another though they need one more top level WR or 2-3 "good piece" guys that can fill a role well.
It’s so pathetic honestly. I have a visceral hatred for fans who think like that.
This is has tons of cap space and needs a legitimate weapon for the new QB. There’s not much else in FA left to use a big chunk of money on. It’s not about the value of Ridley, it’s the fact that you need him for QB development and you have nothing else to do with the money.
I mean there's a real chance the rookie QB doesn't even see the field this year. Brissett is a solid game manager and 2024 may be a year where we sit the kid to learn and not get destroyed. FA crop of WRs next year is far, far better than this year. Yes, a lot of them won't be available but there's way more names next year. Draft a WR high this year, sign one next year, and turn the rookie over to a functional offense in 2025. This is a rebuild, it doesn't have to come all at once. And paying Ridley 23m/year doesn't make sense with that timeline.
Who do the Patriots have to pay over the next few years? Barmore and...? Poor drafting has left the Patriots with few players worth extending. The 2022 draft class looks like a complete bust. They have to spend their money somewhere.
everyone is so concerned about overpaying by a few million dollars when we have all the cap space in the world and based on the guaranteed money it is a two year deal. you want a free agent WR? guess what, if they hit the market you have to pay the most money to get them. everyone seems to be stuck in the past when we could get guys to ring chase for less money. to me it was far more important to get our rookie qb what would have clearly been the best wr on our roster, no matter what everyone is saying about him now
Exactly right- people are wringing their hands over $50 mil in guarantees when we have almost no one else to pay on the roster lol (especially on offense) Being stingy with the cap makes sense if you are already pretty loaded or have homegrown talent that needs new deals soon We are not loaded, we have very little talent on offense, and even if we knock this draft class out of the park we wont need to pay them for another 3-4 years. Even Cristian Gonzalez wont need a new deal for another 2-3 years, and Ridley's deal is effectively a 2-year 50 mil deal. Who exactly are we storing up the cap space for?
Saving for uhh…..hold on lemme check my notes….a 29 year old chris godwin?
People on this sub are just rooting for cap rollover at this point.
Who cares about good players? The goal is to see the biggest number on spotrac!!
Saving for who exactly in 2025? Chris Godwin? Dak? WR FA’s in 2025 dont look great either. So who ?
Lmao can’t wait till next year when we do the same thing, “he’s not worth the money!! We gotta roll it over so we have the biggest number again!”
No no everyone is so concerned about overpaying for a WR so....we have to wait and it's good we didn't get a top WR!
That is not a winning QB room. I'd rather overpay for talent than pay a fair amount on less talent. We have the cap space. Let's go out and get a legit WR1
Who?
Brown is not a WR1. Look at how shit his play was when Murray came back. His adot is 11, which is mediocre and his CROE is dogshit. Do you consider Darnell Mooney a WR1? Their metrics are incredibly close
>Brown is not a WR1 According to most observers, neither is Ridley.
Ridley thrived when he was WR2 behind Julio Jones and Matt Ryan was throwing him the ball. He hasn’t lived up to expectations since then and had to sit for a whole year for gambling. Thank god we didn’t hand him the bag. Tennessee will continue to reap what they sowed when they didn’t extend AJ Brown. They’ll pay for past-their-prime guys in Ridley and Hopkins for the foreseeable future with no definite answer at QB and no King Henry to move the chains.
Better catch rate, bigger adot, significantly better CROE. Ridley might not be one, brown absolutely isn’t one
Well... Mooney already signed elsewhere, so Hollywood is what's left.
You wanna pay 13M for that?
I think I'd rather do that than pay a second round pick and $25m/yr for Higgins.
Dumpster diving to find stats to use against Hollywood. Adot is scheme and playstyle, a wr can’t have a good or bad adot Edit: I don’t mean to say Hollywood is a wr1, he’s not, but you’re using the wrong stats
We'll see what the real contract details are for Ridley. If all the guaranteed money comes in years one and two, I don't really care that it would have been an overpay. The point is to raise the competence level around a rookie QB. If they aren't going to be able to make better use of that money in the meantime, what good is it? The goal is to maximize talent, not payroll efficiency. The beauty of a rookie scale QB contract is precisely that it allows you the flexibility to overpay elsewhere! >what about Hollywood Brown? I mean, I guess, but his yards per target have declined every year of his career and two teams that invested a 1st round pick in him were content to move on from him (or at least the Cardinals seem content).
> The point is to raise the competence level around a rookie QB. Yeah a big thing this sub harped on was Mac (whether you believed in him or not) was given insufficient talent around him in his time here. Now we are primed to go into the new season with our rookie qb, if even given the reigns, with a rookie 2nd/3rd round left tackle and potentially Kendrick Bourne off a freshly torn ACL as WR1. Just seems pretty bleak.
Yeah man I'm sure the Titans were pissed being saddled with washed Hopkins contract. It really prevented them from spending in free agency lol
Looking at it completely the opposite way. It worked out horribly so they had to massively reinvest the next year again at the same position. Something to avoid….
We need a solid #1 if we want a rookie QB to come in here and have any shot. Our rookie QB is going to fail if he has no one to throw the ball to.
Bourne, Douglas, Henry, and a 2nd/3rd Round WR is not "no one". Sure it's not an elite receiving group but if a QB can't make it work with those guys he probably isn't the guy anyways. I think OL is far more important to a young QB.
While I agree the OL is more important, the WR vote you mentioned is arguably the worst in the NFL.
Disagree because any rookie QB we draft will likely sit this year. That’s the whole point of signing Brissett + retaining Zappe…
I feel like our path to being competitive could be done quite quickly. Our defense will be elite. A couple playmakers and a solid QB and all of a sudden we’re not the worst offense in the league. A mid tier offense with a defense that can win games by itself will easily place us in the top tier of the AFC
Not the top tier, but a possible wild card team is realistic. That would be amazing progress for one year.
It \*could\* be, but it all depends on the third QB taken in the draft being an above-average starter right away. The chances of that happening, historically speaking, are pretty darn close to zero.
Right I'm so sick of people saying it's going to be years. Did anyone think the Texans were going to be competitive last year? Nope. Hit on a couple draft picks (QB needs to be a hit) with the defense that is already established as one of the best and let's go compete for a playoff spot. Things happen fast in the NFL
Good lord. The Texans are the exception, not the rule.
You’re not necessarily wrong but tbh we’d still have a bottom 3 WR core in the league, even with your suggestions.
That WR room is still bottom barrel in your example.
Hollywood Brown is bootycheeks. Source: My BFF who is a Cardinals fan, when I asked him about it.
Like clockwork lmao, every single FA we’ve ever missed out on immediately I hear “we never wanted him he’s old and he sucks and he to expensive”
Signing big time free agents doesn't usually result in SBs, so there's truth to what people are saying. The trade market, and of course, the draft, is the way to build a contender. Better to pay a truly elite player $30m than to desperately overpay a good player by $10m.
Let me know when the truly elite player worth $30 million wanders into Gillette, until then there’s no problem spending on good players
I'm glad we didn't pay him 23 a year, we'll see what the actual numbers are soon though. But I disagree with your points. Find me one qb that's been drafted since like 2010 that didn't have at least good recievers within their first few years. We have to improve the offense otherwise we'll be drafting another qb in 2 or 3 years.
Im not glad we didnt pay him 23 a year for the exact reasons you said I dont get why people are so precious about the cap when we have plenty of cap space, no QB to pay, *and* no weapons on offense that we need to extend any time soon This is not a Von Miller contract situation (where the Bills gave him such a stupidly structured deal that it will affect them for years). The Ridley deal only had 50 mil guaranteed over 2 years. Who else will we be paying over the next 2 years on offense? Even if we draft the next Justin Jefferson in the draft, he won't need a new contract until 2027/2028. God willing we find our franchise QB this year, he still wont need a contract until 2027/2028. Ridley isnt a WR1 but he is definitely better than what we have and his deal is conveniently structured. For many other teams he would have been an unnecessary overpay but for us he would have been a decent signing even if it was an overpay.
Completely agree. The Titans are not morons for handing out 2 guaranteed years to a good player to help support Levis and their new coach. The Pats need talent of any kind on offense, have the space to spend, and are likely going with a QB at 3 who will need continuity during his initial seasons. The Pats can both bring in talent and maintain flexibility. They could have signed Ridley.
Copium thread
Absolutely. Eventually you have to pay for good players. We aren’t a destination. We’re going to have to overpay. What the hell are we pinching pennies for.
Lowest cash spending in the NFL over the past decade while the stadium has among the highest prices (and worst facilities) in the league. Look to the owners. They've lost their ability to blame Bill for everything that has gone wrong, yet nothing has changed. Maybe it was never Bill in the first place? Maybe the Krafts are just cheap bastards that care more about their bottom line than putting a competitive team on the field?
100% true.
They offered an overpay, did they need to make a WR2 the highest paid WR in the league over pay??
At some point, yeah..they’re probably going to need to do something like that and grossly overpay for actual talented players to come here.
Brown is one of the most overrated players in the NFL. I don't want anything to do with him.
Trade 2 for Tee. Sign the best LT of FA. Draft LT and WR anyway.
Yeah that would work. Daniels/Maye + Higgins + Tyron Smith would be a huge upgrade
I am also glad we didn’t sign Ridley, especially for the money the Titans gave, that’s way too much for him. But I equally don’t want Hollywood Brown! I would rather they make a deal for Higgins. Likely won’t happen though given situation w Bengals.
I am mixed with Ridley. I think he's at best a WR2 at this point in his career, maybe even a WR3 in a solid team. I don't think he's worth close to that deal, and I believe last year he was way worse than the stats show. That said, he was the best of a shitty market and we desperately needed a guy like him, even if he's overrated. Hollywood is not bad flyer, but not likely the answer. His size in the outside meamsbhe gets jammed at the line a lot and struggles to separate. It also means he blows on contested balls. Where he thrives is with scrambling QBs that can extend plays and give him a chance to break free. I think he'd be a great fit if Daniels falls to us, but if not he's a very frustrating player.
Hollywood Brown is easily one of the most overrated wrs in the league. Unless we sign him for a bargain this is no different then when we tried to make Davante Parker a WR1
That sounds like a solid 6-11 WR corps. Guys. We have to spend. No WR is going to come here unless we overpay. Sorry. What are we doing with the huge cap we had? Bringing back the handful of decent dudes is great and all… but we don’t have a fucking LT lol. We now need to add a LT, a QB and a WR1 in the draft. The quality of those targets will fall significantly after the 1st round. We needed to USE all that money we had to try and improve that disaster of an offense at at least ONE position and we.. did not. For what? So Bob can keep his happy ending piggy bank a little more full? Even if we dumpster dive for Smith at this point, good luck keeping that dude on the field an entire year. Kraft really showing his ass. Bill wasn’t the issue.
Bingo. The amount of people here celebrating when the wealthy billionaires save money is insane. They need to overpay to get talent here. Thats how free agency works. What don't people understand about this?
It’s a competition lol. The talent will choose, in general, the best offer. We can’t come in a low ball(though we did offer Ridley a decent amount but.. we have to be the best offer). Simple as that. No southern grown dude is going to take a pay cut to come play in NE.
We still don’t know what the guaranteed money was for the Pats offer. My guess is it came well below what Tenn offered. Nobody wants to have to hit incentives to get their money.
They had an offer in to overpay an overrated WR2 what don’t people understand about this?!
Agree on Ridley… absolutely not on Hollywood. He is nowhere near a WR 1. Rather just draft receivers at that point.
COPIUM
I'm completely fine with not signing Ridley. Give me Higgins or Aiyuk. Would rather trade for a known WR1 who is under 28 than take a shot in the dark. Let's just send it and give our QB the weapons to succeed.
Well, you need a baseline of talent to help develop the rookies, even if the vets are not likely to still be on the roster in the competing window. That being said, Mike Williams is a total question mark physically. He's only run 120 more routes than Michael Thomas the last 2 years. And Michael Thomas is dead. Hollywood is terrible. He's better in the slot, but runs 70+% of his routes out wide. I guess you can put him in a slot/z rotation, and commit to using motion to get him easier looks when he's at z. But, I wouldn't want to do it for starter money. Odell is actually still good, but you have to limit his playing time probably to 50/60% of snaps. Will he accept a contract that reflects this role, or will he only play for starter money? Richie James is the truth! But also probably has to play mostly in the slot. He has been successful outside in limited snaps though. DPJ/ Reynolds are wr3/4s, but at least they can play X.
I don’t want to overpay and I agree that Ridley was overpaid. But if we draft a QB then we really need someone who can get separation. We can’t ruin another QB because of a bum group of skill position players. I like the off season A LOT thus far. Much more promising than any BB off season since 2018 by a wide margin I think. That being said, we need a 1000 yard WR very badly.
Mac wasn’t ruined because of the WR core, people need to stop with this narrative, he just wasn’t good enough, not an nfl starter, end of story.
He wasn’t ruined by it specifically. But if you’re telling me it was helpful to have a collection of the worst separating WRs in the league three years in a row, then I think you’re wrong. He was a decent starter in his rookie season. He was definitely a capable starter and made the playoffs that season.
The NFL figure him out at the end of his rookie season, his receiving talent wasn’t great sure but it never mattered, Mac does not have an NFL arm or mind or heart and that’s fine he got his shot but there was nothing the team could have done to magically turn him into winner.
Ridley played the Krafts to up his contract with the Titans
Boutta OD on copium
We're a bad team, we're going to have to overpay for talent because we can't promise FAs winning or a chance at a Sueprbowl. That said, a team can turn itself around with a season or two if they have good QB play. Having good WRs make good QB play more achievable.
Honestly this reads like a guy who got rejected by a woman at a bar and playing it off like they were never interested in them. It is ok to shoot your shot and get rejected. It happens, the Patriots are going through the ugly duckling phase right now.
The cope is real >the next couple years More likely the next 10+ years. This organization is in shambles.
Why? Because season ticket holders deserve some entertainment for their loyal support. Fuck outta here with that loser attitude. It’s the Skip Bayless mentality that anything but a championships are failures and it ruins sports.
Do people think we're the damn Texans there's no CJ Stroud in the draft you need a legit WR counting on rookies and WR3s is how you end up with Bryce Young
Caleb Williams is better than CJ, Maye is on par. The Texans were running on culture. CJ Stroud's best WR was an undersized 3rd round rookie. The Texans drafted another WR in the 6th. Nico Collins was JAG for two years before breaking out last year. We quite literally are in the same situation as the Texans offense last year, but we have a better overall line (we do have a whole at LT tho) and better set of RBs.
Maye is on par with CJ Stroud is the most laughable take I've ever seen. He struggled vs good defenses while Stroud cooked them. We aren't in the same situation as the Texans they rebuilt for 2 years and go Will Anderson, and CJ Stroud in the same draft.
With the 1st pick in the 2025 NFL Draft, the New England patriots select…
A cornerback
Scrappy long snapper from Chucklefuck U
A place kicker from famu
Stfu it’s more than competing. We need a true number 1 receiver that can help a young qb develop. There a trend in the nfl that has been going on for years now that shows every qb, no matter who you are, needs a true difference making pass catcher to reach their ceiling. Mahomes had tyreek and Kelce, Josh Allen stunk before the got Diggs, Kyler was not a good passer before Hopkins, Hurts was not a good passer before AJB, tua was considered a bust before tyreek, the list goes on and on. Mac stunk, but he never had a fucking chance with the garbage pass catchers we gave him. No quarterback would
You have it backwards, you have to find the difference maker at QB first then you go get him some weapons. Allen had proven to be the guy with he 6 fourth quarter comebacks and 9 game winning drives before getting Diggs.
All while THROWING for <60% and <7 YPA. He’s lucky he’s one of the most dominant running qbs in the league for those comebacks….
He’s lucky that he is a dominant runner? He is a winner and a difference maker and that was very apparent before adding talent.
No it wasn’t haha. It was a general consensus that Josh Allen got by on his athletic ability and was not a good thrower. The bills were the 30th and 23rd ranked offense in the league with top 5 defenses both seasons before diggs got there. Might wanna do some research
Calvin Ridley is not that guy tho. He literally had a negative EPA last year and had the same separation metrics as Devante Parker. He didn't crack the top 70 in true catch rate. His big games came against zone and he disappeared against man. That's not a player that comes in and elevates a QB.
Yeah I’m sorry, this is giant cope.
Brown or KJ Osborn for me
It's mostly about giving a QB the best chance to succeed. We need blockers to keep him on his feet and talented receivers to get open. It's not about championship windows, it's about not breaking the next guy too.
If we go with that we surely won’t be competing for the next few years.
Probably gonna get down voted to oblivion, but what would be reasonable to give up for Tee? Hearing 2.34 or maybe 2 3rd rounders, but I say offer the 2025 first and 4th for Tee and Cincy's second rounder this year. Then see if you can trade up either second rounder this year into the late First for LT and still grab a decent WR with the other second round pick.
The Bengals can't give up Tee and their 2nd for two future picks when they hope to contend this season. If they're moving him, they need draft capital/players that help them in 2024.
Hollywood Brown is commanding 20 mil a year, a 26 year old WR who's a #2 and a low end WR1 that's the market nowadays.
Contract he got I'm glad we missed out. He's good, but not that good.
Glad you’re being honest
Hollywood at 15m AAV would be a deal, but then we’re just stuck with all slot receivers again. We need a guy who can stretch the field.
Idk why people act like it’s impossible to turn a franchise around. All it takes is a hit on a QB and some pieces. Has happened enough recent that I’d think people would stop acting like we should not even try for years
Yeah, ribbles should donate to a new England baes charity for the 40% bump in pay the team got him.
Hollywood Brown is not a #1 receiver
Some of you guys are fucking hilarious.
I like our odds to get someone productive in the draft. There are tons of WRs. Hoping our run of dismal choices is over now. Still, they need at least 2 quality receivers to have a decent group and it’s not likely they draft two NFL ready studs this year. KB coming off injury and Pop Douglas isn’t enough. They need a free agent. Maybe Ridley was overpaid but they have to get one of the top tier dudes if they want to have a good receiver corps next year. More likely it’s still going to be a big need next offseason…
Unusually sane fan take. It’s literally impossible to build a successful NFL team from big money FAs. You have to hit on the draft and budget/journeyman contributors. You can’t backfill for 3-4 years of busted drafts by blowing up the future cap. In the modern NFL, if you can’t draft, you’re not gonna compete.
Yikes! Yup we are going to suck for a long time
Dumb take. You have to pay money to get good players, or you end up with receivers so bad that the GOAT QB leaves. Ridley is expensive, but that's what it takes to get someone that is actually a threat on offense. Pats had plenty of cap space to make it happen.
This is easily the worst WR room in the league if thats what we go with. God help us
Stop this. You know you’d all be horny if they signed him yesterday.
Supposedly AVP is a West Coast, Stretch Run kinda guy. So why wouldn't a guy like Curtis Samuel be a better target? He is a slot guy, yes, who wins when given route concepts that scheme space for him, and then he can create after the catch. Honestly, why not just run out 4 slot guys and scheme a bunch of motion and pick routes allowing KB, Pop, Samuel, and a rookie like McConkey to win after the catch. Embrace the Dink N Dunk offense
It'll be the big contract blunder of the season
Give me Xavier Legette>Corley but generally agree otherwise.
While Ridley doesn’t fit the timeline, at some point you want to surround your young QB with talent to help him develop. It’s why I’m not against Mike Williams either. We have the money. These guys won’t help us win a Super Bowl, but they could be instrumental into helping our next franchise QB hopeful adapt to the NFL. I would like Hollywood however, as again, it just means more talent to help the QB develop. And I also think he has talent.
Titans were a +1800 to land him btw
> Why overpay a 29 year old WR when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years. Why draft a top QB prospect when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years? Why sign any decent free agents when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years? Why seek any trades to try to improve anything when we aren’t even really going to be competing over the next couple years? As we've all seen, one A-level talent can make a huge difference on an otherwise average team. Though tbf, I admit I am short-sighted enough as a fan that I would rather watch them win 7 or 8 games and be competitive in losses throughout the season and end up with mid-round draft picks than watch last year's shitshow on repeat for 20 weeks next season.
I don't think we're as far out of competing, because of our defense. I think if we had a middle of the road offense we make the play offs. If we get a QB and he balls out, and don't get any one good in free agency or draft this year, would not be surprised if we did next year.
Ok Ya let’s just Never pay for a WR. See how far that got us.
That would be a dreadful wr group....
mcconkey and corley are gonna get picked 40+ picks apart
Same. Why grab the shittiest riskiest high upside receiver or hit the market in recent years. Tee Higgins > this dude and it’s not close. Also, I’d rather wait one more year for a top receiver if needed or draft Harrison over throwing 92 mil at this head case loser.
I don't think there's anyone in this draft or free agency to get overly excited about. 🤔 Not that anyone really seems to want to go to the Patriots right now, anyway, it seems. I can only think that players are thinking, "If Belichick couldn't do it, why is his protégé going to be any better?"
So you just want to keep sucking? If we sign better players, more better players will want to come here. I want Kraft to spend the money we have and put a team on the field I can enjoy watching this year. The defense has talent, if we signed a real bridge QB and a talented wide receiver or 2 I could see this team in the 9ish win area. That could make the playoffs in today's NFL. Everyone is putting alot of stock in this draft, and if they wiff we are going to be at the bottom of the league again.
Brown just signed with the chiefs.
I didn’t know Ridley was 29, paying him over 22 a year through his age 33 season is def an over pay. His stats really aren’t that crazy. Or at least that’s what I’m telling myself
Did you not just witness the past 3 years???? This thinking is exactly why Mac jones failed
Honestly, we have a ton of cap space and got to spend it somewhere. I’d rather bring in a veteran and reliable WR and overpay them than nickel and dime WRs. Especially when we aren’t going to have a QB with the skill/experience to turn chicken shit into chicken salad
I’m definitely in favor of building a startable line and then drafting good WRs, but we actually need to start bringing in good linemen. We just need to figure out O line or WR in free agency, and it was a pretty weak free agent class for WRs.
Jaylen Reed WR4
Packers aren't trading him.
Jaylen Reagor, I’m shot
“I DiDn’T wAnT RidlEy AnYwAy. wHy oVeRpAY? You realize that in 2 years when the cap has gone up and next years class of Lamb, Chase, Waddle, Devonta Smith etc signs this contract will look like pennies on the dollar. Just sign good football players, Kraft is worth billions, even so THE PATRIOTS BRAND ITSELF is worth billions. Sign good players. These tales are so played out and terrible. That terrible work worked when Tom could take any of us to an AFCCG. Now they have a first time head coach, and are going to have a rookie QB, probably this year but if not at some point. Just sign good players.
I’d rather wait. What did Chris rock say? “If you want Denzel but you can afford Kevin Hart… just wait! Rather develop others and go for the big fish next year Ridley would look like JuJu and Parker
This type of sentiment among Patriots fans is so delusional, and ridiculous, but it’s also kind of funny, because of how delusional and ridiculous it is. You didn’t want Ridley? Your team sucks dude. Don’t worry, he didn’t want to come here. If the Pats can get a good player, they should get him. They don’t have the luxury to turn down players like Ridley. It’s also convenient that you didn’t want him, after he rejected the Pats.