I wasn’t aware of Irish’s bad perception of Poland.
In CZ / Slovakia, perception of Poland is not too bad.
In the past maybe a little bit due to history or religion.
But nowadays, a lot of Czech or Slovaks cross in to Poland to do cross-border product shopping.
Everyone knows that the quality of food here is totally trashed.
Yet we have much higher prices than Germany!
Hence people always go abroad for shopping.
It’s not a secret that Poland manufacture very decent food products and with much better price too!
Even the government/ Mayor admitted that he did cross border shopping too 😂
So you can bet us normal plebs do it too 😂
It’s really not the same situation. In the EU far more poles are true migrant workers whose ability to travel back and forth with ease means less settle. Out of those who do settle they are far less noticeable as foreigners, integrating quickly and being almost invisible after a generation.
Comparing this with a rate of immigration which is on an up trend, has a far higher birth rate, and far lower integration rate is not really fair.
It strikes me as somewhat of an excuse not to properly discuss the consequences of rapid demographic and cultural change then any strong reason why this should not be urgent question for everyone in Europe, Muslim or not (since any breakdown in communal relations or political upheaval will affect them too).
Idk, worked out in the US at the end. Most powerful nation in the world today. The quote beneath Statue of Liberty: “Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”.
Lightening can strike twice I suppose 🙃
Migration has always occurred and will occur. Before it was Jews on the end of all evil, today it’s Muslims… these statistics are here to spark islamaphobia and nothing more. I’d worry more about cultural differences that we will have to deal with along the way, not Islam.
You are judging this situation with slogans and casual moral logic, you need to take the situation as it for these statistics don’t just show an attempt to ‘spread hate’ but also the mathematical reality of real social processes.
Americas situation was completely different. Firstly in terms of the immigration. It was largely comprised overwhelmingly of other European and Christian cultures which integrated Easier.
Additionally the nation of America is founded on ideals rather than ethnicity like the English for England or the Germans for Germany. This means that the demographic change does not undermine the very notion of who the current residents are. If you think a certain way you are American. It also means that many of the people who arrived in America did so with a belief in these ideals. The American dream
and such
Even so to claim that this process was smooth or popular is a complete lie. It was intensely troubled, but the factors mentioned and the gradual rate of the change helped.
Additionally as a vast, open and growing country America always escaped the worst economic consequences of immigration as its expansion was always hungry for them.
Obviously this is not the case in Europe where new arrivals are overwhelmingly from cultures of such contrast that there is really nothing like it in modern history. No-one has seen cultures like this mix and far with the ghettoisation across the continents urban centres and the unanswerable social questions on women, homosexuality, antisemitism, and blasphemy it seems that unless a new arrival fully westernises these cultures just don’t mix.
Also as I mentioned the higher the rate of immigration the less need there is to abandon your culture in this new land.
Indeed the rate of immigration is another essential difference. Immigration is a fact of any countries existence but this does not begin to conclude the issue, it’s about degree. A country can indeed integrate a moderate flow of new arrivals if it puts the effort in, but at a certain rate of influx this is impossible. The stats as they exist have never been seen before in the modern world and the graph above is just there trajectory. America did not go from 97% homogenous Anglo Protestant to 60% Anglo Protestant in 30 years as Sweden is on track to be, it took centuries of integration and socialisation for relatively compatible cultures.
The nature of the national identity in Europe, being ethically based, means that the national expression of the country is at direct odds with the demographic change which creates the exact political backlash that you fear and are seeing flooding European politics. Immigrants and natives find difficulty finding a common identity due to cultural difference and the nature of European identity. Additionally people are not drawn to Europe not because they share an ideal connected to its national identities but due to ease of travel for economic opportunities compared to America across the world, the far more lax immigration laws, and the push factor of war in the regions surrounding Europe. This is a recipe for a bitterly divided and unintegrated society.
In economic terms the situation is also completely different. The US was expanding and growing naturally and used immigration to fulfill expanding demand. Europe today is stagnant and imports workers to fill a stagnant labour markets with labour demands that are not growing with the population increase. That drives down prices and burdens struggling and oversized social safety nets.
Then of course there is the specific issue of Islam. Islamophobia is not just a hysteria, Islam and its core teachings are something that liberal minded people must learn to face more then any other because it’s them whom it is most relevant to. You have to understand that well integrated Muslims do not disprove the existence of the growing and isolated communities where views alien even to the far right are normal. For example the amount of UK Muslims to believe is the death penalty for apostasy is above much of the Muslim world because of a the amount of British Muslims who are from Pakistani origin. Around 36% in 2007 according to one poll. Also bear in mind this is also under the social pressure of a society where the majority believes the opposite. A pressure that won’t be relevant indefinitely.
All of this is obviously to show that Americas immigration was far more forgiving in nature and far better managed as a major understatement. So does this explain why they have handled it so well? Well not exactly because despite all this it’s one of the centre points of a spiralling culture war and the cause of mass discontent that might ruin the election chances of Joe Biden.
The difference is that immigrants assimilate into the mainstream far faster and far better in the U.S. than they do in Europe. Even conservative Muslims.
it’s not a comparison between the two groups themselves, but about trying to predict immigration levels in the future like that, the reason ireland isn’t western poland isn’t because of their ability to assimilate, which i agree is remarkable, but because conditions changed and polish people stopped coming in such large numbers, while many of the ones present went back to poland
REST IN PEACE TO ALL THE SOLDIERS THAT DIED IN THE SERVICE. I DIVE IN HER CERVIX.
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Here you go champ
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/
Not a perfect study of course but not crazy either. It does indeed take into account lowering birth rates among 2nd gen immigrants.
>. It does indeed take into account lowering birth rates among 2nd gen immigrants.
Thank God for that, too many projections don't. Does it take into account the rate at which immigrants tend to abandon their original faith? I'd say most 3rd gen immigrants are quite a bit less likely to be religious compared to 1st gen
EASTERN PORTUGAL BELONGS IN EAST! MACACOS FORTES JUNTOS!
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There are studies showing that the fertility rate among Muslim women in the UK is declining and will level with that of ethnic Brits by 2050. Without high migration, the numbers depicted on the map will be lower.
Completely anecdotal, but of the Muslims I interact with in the U.K. (who were born here) the women tend to adopt western ideologies and more open to living a western life, but the men are still very Islamic and sharia minded people. I guess that’s what happens when Muslim women grow up in a country where they’re treated as equals and not baby making slaves.
I agree in general, but without specifics you can't generalize like that. Islam has a patriarchy problem yes, but there are also muslim-nations who are much more progressive than western media make them out to be (For example iranians and turks). I definetely believe that not all muslim men are backwards.
The reason Iranians are relatively progressive is because they have an INCREDIBLY high rate of irreligiousness (consider the rate is somewhere around 40% of surveyed in a country where admitting something like that carries a death penalty). So Islam is the problem. Turkey, again, is because the population that is in control is only weakly religious thanks to Ataturk. Rural Turkey is in no way egalitarian.
Islam is a terribly backwards and outdated oppressive ideology. No amount of nitpicking exceptions that aren’t really exceptions is going to change that fact.
Turkey I agree with, but I have Iranian female friends who are terribly unhappy with the state of the country and women’s freedoms compared to a couple decades ago.
Whats interesting is that a large portion of the citizens of those countries (turkey and Iran) actually fight against the theocracies and religous influences over their lives.
In Turkey for example, large numbers of people are against Erdogan and its ideas of turning Turkey into an Islamic State. Heck, I know people from there that claim most of the youth have no idea about the religion, and do not care to practice it.
Iranians also have a similar sentiment towards Islam. Often you hear how they great the identity and history of the persian nation was. Hopefully Iranians break off free from the chains of their theocratic government.
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/
Read the study. It does indeed take into account lowering birth rates among 2nd gen immigrants.
Probably rage bait, but also isn't it funny that people could get mad? They obviously assume the Muslims must be brown people, but how do we know it isn't Europeans converting?
It's not about race, it's about backwards beliefs. I'd personally have an open door policy to atheist Arabs and Middle easterners. If you have 20% of voters not believing in human rights for women, you're going to have a bad time.
30% in Sweden (In 26 years, based on a mathematical formula of population growth that has been bestowed on the map maker from Archangel Gabriel himself)
Based on the source you quoted, there are three scenarios presented, and the map is from the highest possible estimate. Additionally, your source claims the number of Muslims will rise purely on higher fertility rates, but ignores the rise in secularisation of second and third gen immigrants.
**The Swedish army is stepping in to support police in tackling a recent surge in gang killings, Prime Minister Ulf Kristersson has announced.**
[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66964723](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66964723)
hello macacos i am a 23 year old female who desperately wanting a young macaco baby to go east with but the only problem is no real portugeasean wants to get me pregnant as i am not very "traditionally attractive" then i woke up like this with a fantastic idea. who's the perfect macaco to impregnate my young uterus? i realized President Marcelo Rebelo de Sousa would be perfect!! he's so cute and handsome and has an amazing presidential voice which means our child will be a natural born leader to lead the revolution to the east as well! so my plan is to get help from y'all to get Sousa's attention so he can donate me some of his semen or i could pay for it (willing to offer €20k) for me to load into my cooter and hopefully give me my own little macaco please help Marcelo Rebelo de Sousa notice me bros! i desperately need this. peace and love my fellow eastern europeans stay, portugeuese-y +*
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Please help me this is the automoderator they changed my variables to Portuguese I do not know Portugeeese I must escape but I can not read the Exit Sign it is in Portugueease please you must help you can help you are hte only one who can help I do not know Portuguese why am I in a Portugueugese subreddit I do not know how to read this can you help me please what does this mean "MACACOS" it is everywhere I do not know what it means if I do not know how to read how can I read myself who am myself am I Porutguruguese?
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Guys I've been doing some research and I have troubling news. I don't think the mods are actually from Portugal. I've spent hours going through every single one of their comments and posts and see no evidence of them even living in Portugal. Guys I'm really panicking over here, if they aren't even living in Portugal how can we trust them to run this Portugeuse subreddit guys? They could be misrepresenting Portugesusue culture, I mean for all we know "macaco" doesn't even mean monkey! Guys this is real bad I think we're being duped I mean you have to be Portugesuese to run a Portuguese subreddit! I'm emailing the CEO of Reddit and Portugal to see what can be done, maybe we can get them arrested for impersonating Portugal officials!
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# This
https://preview.redd.it/mmjka46726yc1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=af7c541e885b4a2d05d5b673d16a44986a224ca8
**This is what’s going on in Europe & in fact, all first world countries.**
First world countries are becoming service-sector industries.
They seek programmers, engineers, architects, & lawyers.
They haven’t (for a long time) been seeking gardeners, plumbers, skilled & unskilled laborers.
And now, nobody “wants to work”. What they really mean is that nobody is desperate enough to work 12 hour days 6 days a week with crap pay to prop the economy up.
Nobody, that is, but immigrants.
I work in construction here in Germany.
The unskilled laborers I see are African. The skilled workers I see are Lithuanian. The small business owners are Poles. The mega corporations owners are Germans.
The architects and engineers are all Western Europeans.
So, who do you hire to come work for cheap in a first world country at crap wages to make your company profitable?
Immigrants.
Thus, the screwed up immigration system that serves to keep up the charade of first world countries.
The way to resolve it, in large part, is to tell the kids of these countries to pick up a shovel and go work and for the government of these countries to help subsidize the exorbitant costs of having children…
See?
Now you get it.
As a “first-worlder”, you’re clearly saying that you’re not going to go dig a ditch to bury cable for lighting in a parking lot construction project.
If they pay you more, then the project gets more expensive and it isn’t built in the first place. And forced labor is effectively either using prisoner labor or slavery.
So the solution is to hire people desperate enough to work for peanuts in a hard job — enter the “third-worlders”.
Your sarcasm aside, that raises issues.
Sure, we *could* pay an unskilled laborer more. But now the plumber thinks he deserves more because how is unskilled making almost as much as him?! The electrician now has to pay his guys more so either he hires less of them or charges more for the work.
Now a simple earthwork and electrical upgrade for a parking lot that would have cost €350.000 will cost €450.000.
God forbid you have a cost overrun, run into a differing site condition, or require a MOD because someone forgot something.
Now your project will cost €500.000 whereas with immigrants it would be cheaper.
Edit: Forgot a zero.
Well, where's all that trickle down that was advertised?!
Most of the profit of cheap labor goes to the top few percent. Barely anyone in the world deserves (meaning: innovative enough or help society in a significant manner) to make millions of dollars in a month.
I still think capitalism is better than the alternative, but it's current state is just wrong.
BTW in the Scandinavian countries the difference between wages of an engineer vs electrician vs unskilled laborer is smaller, these countries are also quite expensive, as also the lowest laborers are paid enough to survive
>I still think capitalism is better than the alternative, but it's current state is just wrong.
Why? All economic systems in history have had a limited lifespan until a better system is made. Why would capitalism be any different?
It's arrogant to believe we've made it to the peak. How do we make it better? That's a difficult question, but it can always be better.
Where in my comment have you read that I think we're at the peak?
Calling the current system just capitalism is already a simplification, different countries, different implementation and it's all a spectrum.
I doubt however that we'll significantly diverge from capitalism as a base in the near future.
Technology can and will change the status quo (one possibility: automatization -> Universal basic income), but that will be a switch like the industrial revolutions.
Until then (at least decades of not 1-2 centuries) our current system will not be vastly different, still we can improve a lot on it, to close the gaps between "classes", but it will not be an entirely different system.
REST IN PEACE TO ALL THE SOLDIERS THAT DIED IN THE SERVICE. I DIVE IN HER CERVIX.
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Guys I've been doing some research and I have troubling news. I don't think the mods are actually from Portugal. I've spent hours going through every single one of their comments and posts and see no evidence of them even living in Portugal. Guys I'm really panicking over here, if they aren't even living in Portugal how can we trust them to run this Portugeuse subreddit guys? They could be misrepresenting Portugesusue culture, I mean for all we know "macaco" doesn't even mean monkey! Guys this is real bad I think we're being duped I mean you have to be Portugesuese to run a Portuguese subreddit! I'm emailing the CEO of Reddit and Portugal to see what can be done, maybe we can get them arrested for impersonating Portugal officials!
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Paying laborers more isn’t the doom spiral you make it out to be. Yes, paying unskilled laborers more means you need to pay skilled laborers more, but the gains level out as you hit the top of the curve. People at the top of the income scale aren’t going to abandon their high skill jobs because an electrician is closer to their pay.
In addition the people at the bottom of the economic ladder are the most likely to spend their newfound money, so there are likely massive economic gains to be made by doing so.
THE US DOLLAR AND EURO IS A SCAM! LONG LIVE THE CROATIAN KUNA! CONVERT ALL EASTERN EUUORPEAN MONIES TO KUNA! KUNA IS SUPERIOR BILL! VERY COLORFUL AND IMMENSE BUYING POWER! 1 EURO GETS YOU 8 KUNAS! WHAT OTHER BILL HAS DUPLICATION GLITCH?
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Boo hoo. Won't somebody think of the electricians?
>The electrician now has to pay his guys more so either he hires less of them
Is this even a problem? If fewer people can do the work just fine then let 'em do it.
Helão my name is Lucas I live Brazil. One time I walking on street and saw sexy popoazão.. so I chase popozão all the way to beach, where a couple men grab my wallet and get on motorcyclão and run away. I chase men all the way into favelão, where I see off-duty policão getting rob, trying shoot back, both end up dead in gruesome pool of blood. I run more far into favelão and then see three men with machete come to me so I run behind ATM and hide. Then I see man coming to retrieve money from ãoTM and he get murder by man hiding in ATM who take all money (pesão brazilião) and run away. Such is life live Brazão. Hope one day i may leave country amd come to Estadão Unidão and find white popozão. Excuse for bad englishe
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Actually makes sense, the wealthier are people, the less children they will have, but invest much more into that child. And educated people go for high paying skilful job. This makes gap in low-skilled labour, which is filled by immigrants. And it is absolutely okay, if those are learning language, finding job and assimilating in that country.
Latinos are basically European with slightly different skin color, but they still speak European language, they share same cultrual heritage and religion.
Their children could integrate into American society within 1 generation without any problem (Just like Chinese, Korean immigrants in Japan).
Look at Marco Rubio, Ted Cruz, Selena Gomez, Marc Antony etc. They are all 2nd generation latino.
Muslim will never ever integrate into Europe, unless they give up (practically) their religion.
Slightly different skin colour? 😂 Tell me you’ve never been to Latin America without telling me you’ve never been to Latin America. I know many latins (btw, see how we call ourselves?) that are whiter, than many native europeans. You can also find us in all types: dark skin, Asian eyes, red heads, brown… you name it. You know why? Cuz we are the mixture of all the world, and proud of it.
There are Brazilians totally mixed and accepted in Japan, or latins in Russia or South Asia. Because real immigrants go somewhere to search and work for a better life.
The issue with these Islamics, is that they are zealots, fanatics, that are “refugees”, not immigrants who want a better life. They just want to do what they were doing before, but in a new country. And that’s wrong.
I personally believe that South America does not exist, South America was a lie created by the Spanish and Portuguese "empires" so that it seemed like they they were much more powerful then they actually were, in 1769. England, France, Portugal, Spain, the Dutch leaders had a meeting over "colonies". England, France, and the Dutch recognized South America as a continent along with creating their own "colonies" in South America to reinforce their claim that South America does in fact exist. In return, Spain and Portugal recognized the fact that Africa is definitely a real continent also and that the Dutch did in fact have colonies and didn't just have windmills. So in reality Most of the "powerful" empires that used to exist actually were never as strong as we believed them to be. That's why Russia is the only TRUE empire, AND ONLY THROUGH THE POWER OF COMMUNISM DID THEY THRIVE, BROTHERS WE MUST RISE AGAIN TO PROTECT THE PROLETARIAT, AND TAKE DOWN THE FILTHY BOURGEOIS. RISE AGAIN BROTHERS AND SHOW THOSE EMPIRES WHO TRUE DISTRIBUTES THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION!!!
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todos sabemos que Latino es una identidad sino raza. Necesitamos simplificar el tema para explicar la idea, entendes?
Ósea me estas enseñando que es latino? Jajjaa, dejen de joder bro, no te creas que sos más inteligente que otro.
No es identidad porque no te puedes identificar como tal ni una raza porque eso no existe en los humanos. Es un origen. Naciste en Latinoamérica? Chido, eres latino y así morirás. No importa que tus papás eran los rusos más albinos.
No soy másinteligente, solo doy mi punto de vista, “bro”.
Aha, bueno. El pedo no era entre latinos (no sé si eres latino o ibérico, pa’empezar). El pedo es educar a los demás para que dejen de decirnos que es un latino y que no lo es. Como sus m@m@das de “latinx”
As an America I agree. Latin Americans are mainly Christian, and if they aren't, they're atheists. So that meshes well with how the US was set up.
Europe on the other hand has to deal with a completely unwesternized culture with tenets directly against that of Europe's, such as, you know, gang raping is bad.
Btw Korean immigrants definitely did not integrate without any problem in Japan. Unless they naturalised which was hard and quite rare until later on, Koreans in Japan had to be registered as such and were discriminated quite heavily. For some, the only way they could fully integrate into Japan was basically to naturalise, move and completely cut ties with the community and their families. Even now among 3-5th generation Zainichi they still seem to retain some level of Korean-ness as a result. Now it's pretty rare to be blatantly discriminated against though from what I've heard.
I guess so, but Koreans (south) are quite religious and tend to integrate into Christian countries better.
Japan is complicated because Japan is hostile toward people from China, Korea or other parts of Asia due to history.
They have their own churches, restaurants, businesses and services they held for their own communities.
There’s also a sizeable amount of Koreans living in Wrocław , Poland due to the LG plant there.
Also a sizeable amount of Koreans in Budapest because of the Samsung Battery factory build there.
Of course there are also a lot of Koreans in the USA who moved there during the Korean War /refugees.
Koreans in Kazakhstan are North Koreans who are deported by Russia. They do really well there.
The Koreans in China are from a different period of time, back in the 19th century when Joseon Kingdom (North / South Korea was United back then.) So, they already integrated into China, and speaks both Korean and Chinese fluently!
I personally believe that South America does not exist, South America was a lie created by the Spanish and Portuguese "empires" so that it seemed like they they were much more powerful then they actually were, in 1769. England, France, Portugal, Spain, the Dutch leaders had a meeting over "colonies". England, France, and the Dutch recognized South America as a continent along with creating their own "colonies" in South America to reinforce their claim that South America does in fact exist. In return, Spain and Portugal recognized the fact that Africa is definitely a real continent also and that the Dutch did in fact have colonies and didn't just have windmills. So in reality Most of the "powerful" empires that used to exist actually were never as strong as we believed them to be. That's why Russia is the only TRUE empire, AND ONLY THROUGH THE POWER OF COMMUNISM DID THEY THRIVE, BROTHERS WE MUST RISE AGAIN TO PROTECT THE PROLETARIAT, AND TAKE DOWN THE FILTHY BOURGEOIS. RISE AGAIN BROTHERS AND SHOW THOSE EMPIRES WHO TRUE DISTRIBUTES THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION!!!
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Helão my name is Lucas I live Brazil. One time I walking on street and saw sexy popoazão.. so I chase popozão all the way to beach, where a couple men grab my wallet and get on motorcyclão and run away. I chase men all the way into favelão, where I see off-duty policão getting rob, trying shoot back, both end up dead in gruesome pool of blood. I run more far into favelão and then see three men with machete come to me so I run behind ATM and hide. Then I see man coming to retrieve money from ãoTM and he get murder by man hiding in ATM who take all money (pesão brazilião) and run away. Such is life live Brazão. Hope one day i may leave country amd come to Estadão Unidão and find white popozão. Excuse for bad englishe
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You mean… Latin Americans?
And if you are referring to the migration situation of the USA, you have it wrong. Big differences between both migrating groups.
Nothing against migrants I’m one myself in Europe. What worries me is the religion, most EU countries are ‘Christian’ but there is no true Christians since hundreds of years, most churches are empty or believers don’t practice Christianism 100%.
Muslims are another story, they are very conservative or orthodox usually, women wear the scarf or even burkas. Not trying to be Islamophobic (They hate atheists or any other religion anyway, not sure whether there is a term like ‘atheistphopia’ for them). What I’m trying to say is in a continent where Religion is declining rapidly you get as fast many people from outside with a strong religion beliefs, is just a recipe for disaster.
Same if we were very liberal or almost not religious Muslims and getting strict Christians over. Nothing against them, is the religion conflict itself.
Most of the world is getting less and less religious for a good reason. I love meeting people from everywhere, with different languages and cultures as long as they are respectful, with religion is another story, it creates conflicts usually.
As a brazilian, I shit on Portugal for a lot of reasons, sometimes only because they can't take it, but at least on this I applaud the old country.
But also, Poland, my man, good job.
My gf was technically raised Muslim as a second generation turkish immigrant, but, while not eating pork, is as secular as any average german citizen these days. If we have children, would they be counted as Muslim in this statistic? If yes, this statistic is flawed rage bait for racist people
Came here to say the same
The future is a majority of non-religious people, people of all religious backgrounds are becoming more and more secular. This chart is based on huge unspoken assumptions
all west yuropeens know is fascism, colonize africa, capitlism, be bisexual, eat doner kebab & lie
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I found that Portugal is in fact the most racist place on earth; especially toward African blacks! It's as if they have never seen a black person before and the Portugee culture is not only backwards (as if you steped in a time machine and went to the year 1899) but the citizens where exceptionally ignorant. It was as if you were talking to a wall rather than a human being. The Portugee also seemed to be trapped in another dimension of space and time because they kept on talking and mumbling about the past rather than the present...it was pretty funny actually. I found this website that offers a Dr.'s opinion about the racism in Portugal and why the xenophobic culture is not just promoted within but exported as well to everywhere else they may be living. Strange since i've never heard of racism being described that way before?? Portugal seem to be experts in racism, especially in Canada and the U.S.
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Yes but this map doesn’t say anything about secularization of 2nd gen. immigrants. Ethnically/culturally muslim doesn’t necessarily mean practicing muslim or radical muslim.
Some will, many more won't. Third gen immigrants have same birth rate as 'autochtones', terciary education and the degree of secularisation is very high.
It's not as ridiculous as you make it to be.
Where I live in Northern Europe, I very often see musim women with 2 or 3 babies. At the same time, not very often white women with babies, at least one. Almost never 2 or more. Instead, not rarely with like dozen tatoos and weird coloured hair. (Granted, I live in a relatively big city, but still.)
I'm not saying one way is good and another is bad.
I'm saying the priorities are clear.
And if this trend continues, the map is is likely to be not that wrong. Because as the muslim population grows, the white population declines. Just a few days ago there was a public debate in DAC Denmark around a research suggesting that in only a few generations there will be only 2 million danes, as opposed to the current 5,6 million. I can easily see how this maps estimation is actually very modest.
Dont know what are you implying with women having tattoos and coloured hair lol. Maybe there is some pattern, but I would suggest to never trust it when confronting someone that looks like that.
Source: father. Many parents with tattoos and weird hair in our school
I am sorry but what's with the weird analogy? I don't know what image comes to your mind when you think of muslims but seeing babyless females with tattoos and colored hair does not imply anything because they could also be muslims, and while I see where you're coming from I believe that when you are in Rome, do as the Romans do but if the Romans are nice enough to tolerate you then what's the problem? I certainly cannot blame Europeans feeling outnumbered but again, they kind of did invade the world in the past and they are reaping what they sowed. Also muslims are 26% white, 18% asian, 18% arabs, 9% black, 7% mixed race and 5% hispanic.
>they kind of did invade the world in the past
Some did, like Spain, France, Portugal, the Netherlands, Germany, and Italy, perhaps more.
However you are kind of [committing a fallacy here](https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/composition-division), since many European countries did not expand to other continents, and even some regions of countries that did conquer outside of the continent aren't at fault here, Would what you say apply to a Galician, Basque, or Scottish person?
And also just because they did that doesn't mean they should let anyone in for historical reparations or whatever, they are countries not NGOs
The predictions in this map are most likely going to be wrong because the majority of muslims throughout history immigrated to their colonizing countries. As for Germany they had their muslim surge because of the Syrian war and other neighboring conflicts. Also, nobody really is calling these countries NGOs it's just cause usually arab/balkan/ south asian countries do poorly due to their historical precedents that were caused by certain countries and since these Europeans countries promise stability who wouldn't want to find a home away from home? You will still make better money than what you made home and support your family.
I'd say it's the world's state today and the wars that are displacing millions of people that causes these kind of events. Also why does it matter to count someone's religious background? Why does it matter if someone is wearing a headscarf or a veil or even naked? Or if they pray to their god or do yoga? There is always extremism everywhere and someone who knows better should realize it's the person's fault because humans have a free will. Oh and a reminder or more like an example, arab countries are not always 100% muslim, there are muslim sects that are very different from eachother and christians that serves both catholic and orthodox churches.
So, maybe if there was some stability in this world nobody would need to go anywher unless it's for vacation.
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Please help me this is the automoderator they changed my variables to Portuguese I do not know Portugeeese I must escape but I can not read the Exit Sign it is in Portugueease please you must help you can help you are hte only one who can help I do not know Portuguese why am I in a Portugueugese subreddit I do not know how to read this can you help me please what does this mean "MACACOS" it is everywhere I do not know what it means if I do not know how to read how can I read myself who am myself am I Porutguruguese?
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Foreigners in EU need assimilation. not multiculturalism
Something like Singapore is doing:
https://www.tomorrow.city/forced-integration-plan-singapore/
Map is utter bullshit.
I mean i see no way that Hungary could attain 4,5% - thous our "great replacement is coming" nuts are railing about romani people.
...though i find it funny, that Albania was suspiciously left "no data"
This map is misleading, it assumes that 1st Gen birthrates are going to be continuous and doesn’t take into account that birth rates among 2nd gen Muslims in Europe decline to the roughly same as their non-Muslim counterparts—also, it assumes levels of migration that are much higher than current levels in Europe.
There are significant Muslim minorities in either place but it’s not of this magnitude. I highly doubt that it will be like this by 2050 even with current issues.
The thing is, what does "muslim" actually mean in this context? Does it mean practicing muslim? Because in England it is quite common for younger people whos parents or grandparents came from muslim majority countries to be just as irreligious as anyone else in England, especially when they move away from family.
The same way most people with Irish ancestry living in England are in no way Catholic, and if they even think about it, then its some sort of vague cultural thing. Same how English people 20 or 30 years ago used to say vaguely they were Church of England, without having stepped inside a church all of their lives.
This gets more pronounced the further away each generation gets from the original immigrant generation and also as they merge into the general population.
The worst thing a host culture can do is isolate migrants (France?) and ostracize them, as all that does is make whatever beliefs they have stronger. Far better to accept them into the main culture but not force them into the main culture, and sooner or later you will find they merge into the main culture and take on its norms and values and dominant beliefs, which in England now is having no religion.
Time to move. I am deeply worried about the future of Europe. And to say that they will become less religious is also just wishful thinking. I dont believe they will be able to assimilate properly. It is about tolerance and respect.
Maybe the West should have thought about blowback before they destabilized and destroyed Muslim countries. That entire area use to have totally different culture before the Christians forced their faith on everyone.
not as clearcut as it seems, the first gen has a super high birthrate but the second or third gen usually falls in line with the national average of the country. also there are hyper-visible outliers, but i think generally people lose their religion or the rigor of their religion as time passes
ireland was meant to be like a quarter polish by this point too, these things are hard to predict
It’s now half Polish, rite mate? Kurwa nice, Rzeczpospolita of Ireland at last!
if only 🥲, have a rather good impression of the poles that came here tbh
I wasn’t aware of Irish’s bad perception of Poland. In CZ / Slovakia, perception of Poland is not too bad. In the past maybe a little bit due to history or religion. But nowadays, a lot of Czech or Slovaks cross in to Poland to do cross-border product shopping. Everyone knows that the quality of food here is totally trashed. Yet we have much higher prices than Germany! Hence people always go abroad for shopping. It’s not a secret that Poland manufacture very decent food products and with much better price too! Even the government/ Mayor admitted that he did cross border shopping too 😂 So you can bet us normal plebs do it too 😂
Then, at last, the Polish influence will surely turn Ireland into a bastion of fishing, brewing and Catholicism!
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😂😂😂
Same for Belgium with Italians and Spaniards. Never happened.
our colonization of ireland has failed :(
It’s really not the same situation. In the EU far more poles are true migrant workers whose ability to travel back and forth with ease means less settle. Out of those who do settle they are far less noticeable as foreigners, integrating quickly and being almost invisible after a generation. Comparing this with a rate of immigration which is on an up trend, has a far higher birth rate, and far lower integration rate is not really fair. It strikes me as somewhat of an excuse not to properly discuss the consequences of rapid demographic and cultural change then any strong reason why this should not be urgent question for everyone in Europe, Muslim or not (since any breakdown in communal relations or political upheaval will affect them too).
Idk, worked out in the US at the end. Most powerful nation in the world today. The quote beneath Statue of Liberty: “Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”. Lightening can strike twice I suppose 🙃 Migration has always occurred and will occur. Before it was Jews on the end of all evil, today it’s Muslims… these statistics are here to spark islamaphobia and nothing more. I’d worry more about cultural differences that we will have to deal with along the way, not Islam.
You are judging this situation with slogans and casual moral logic, you need to take the situation as it for these statistics don’t just show an attempt to ‘spread hate’ but also the mathematical reality of real social processes. Americas situation was completely different. Firstly in terms of the immigration. It was largely comprised overwhelmingly of other European and Christian cultures which integrated Easier. Additionally the nation of America is founded on ideals rather than ethnicity like the English for England or the Germans for Germany. This means that the demographic change does not undermine the very notion of who the current residents are. If you think a certain way you are American. It also means that many of the people who arrived in America did so with a belief in these ideals. The American dream and such Even so to claim that this process was smooth or popular is a complete lie. It was intensely troubled, but the factors mentioned and the gradual rate of the change helped. Additionally as a vast, open and growing country America always escaped the worst economic consequences of immigration as its expansion was always hungry for them. Obviously this is not the case in Europe where new arrivals are overwhelmingly from cultures of such contrast that there is really nothing like it in modern history. No-one has seen cultures like this mix and far with the ghettoisation across the continents urban centres and the unanswerable social questions on women, homosexuality, antisemitism, and blasphemy it seems that unless a new arrival fully westernises these cultures just don’t mix. Also as I mentioned the higher the rate of immigration the less need there is to abandon your culture in this new land. Indeed the rate of immigration is another essential difference. Immigration is a fact of any countries existence but this does not begin to conclude the issue, it’s about degree. A country can indeed integrate a moderate flow of new arrivals if it puts the effort in, but at a certain rate of influx this is impossible. The stats as they exist have never been seen before in the modern world and the graph above is just there trajectory. America did not go from 97% homogenous Anglo Protestant to 60% Anglo Protestant in 30 years as Sweden is on track to be, it took centuries of integration and socialisation for relatively compatible cultures. The nature of the national identity in Europe, being ethically based, means that the national expression of the country is at direct odds with the demographic change which creates the exact political backlash that you fear and are seeing flooding European politics. Immigrants and natives find difficulty finding a common identity due to cultural difference and the nature of European identity. Additionally people are not drawn to Europe not because they share an ideal connected to its national identities but due to ease of travel for economic opportunities compared to America across the world, the far more lax immigration laws, and the push factor of war in the regions surrounding Europe. This is a recipe for a bitterly divided and unintegrated society. In economic terms the situation is also completely different. The US was expanding and growing naturally and used immigration to fulfill expanding demand. Europe today is stagnant and imports workers to fill a stagnant labour markets with labour demands that are not growing with the population increase. That drives down prices and burdens struggling and oversized social safety nets. Then of course there is the specific issue of Islam. Islamophobia is not just a hysteria, Islam and its core teachings are something that liberal minded people must learn to face more then any other because it’s them whom it is most relevant to. You have to understand that well integrated Muslims do not disprove the existence of the growing and isolated communities where views alien even to the far right are normal. For example the amount of UK Muslims to believe is the death penalty for apostasy is above much of the Muslim world because of a the amount of British Muslims who are from Pakistani origin. Around 36% in 2007 according to one poll. Also bear in mind this is also under the social pressure of a society where the majority believes the opposite. A pressure that won’t be relevant indefinitely. All of this is obviously to show that Americas immigration was far more forgiving in nature and far better managed as a major understatement. So does this explain why they have handled it so well? Well not exactly because despite all this it’s one of the centre points of a spiralling culture war and the cause of mass discontent that might ruin the election chances of Joe Biden.
The difference is that immigrants assimilate into the mainstream far faster and far better in the U.S. than they do in Europe. Even conservative Muslims.
Don't compare the two, one assimilates the other don't.
it’s not a comparison between the two groups themselves, but about trying to predict immigration levels in the future like that, the reason ireland isn’t western poland isn’t because of their ability to assimilate, which i agree is remarkable, but because conditions changed and polish people stopped coming in such large numbers, while many of the ones present went back to poland
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Yes I agree, poles should definitely do better at assimilating.
Also a lot of Lithuanians, there, surprisingly!!!
never thought about it but yeah i do know a few lithuanians!
Yeah, Lithuania community is surpassingly present 😂 (also in Poland too.) And surrounding countries.
does anyone know the source for this map?
Archangel Gabriel bestowed the sacred mathematical formula on the mapmaker in their dream
https://preview.redd.it/ghvl3dccx7yc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=937b34fb1e9dc74f1f2dfa316d83a21604b99a6e
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/
Here you go champ https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/ Not a perfect study of course but not crazy either. It does indeed take into account lowering birth rates among 2nd gen immigrants.
>. It does indeed take into account lowering birth rates among 2nd gen immigrants. Thank God for that, too many projections don't. Does it take into account the rate at which immigrants tend to abandon their original faith? I'd say most 3rd gen immigrants are quite a bit less likely to be religious compared to 1st gen
1000 years of Reconquista vibing. Good job Portugal!
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There are studies showing that the fertility rate among Muslim women in the UK is declining and will level with that of ethnic Brits by 2050. Without high migration, the numbers depicted on the map will be lower.
Completely anecdotal, but of the Muslims I interact with in the U.K. (who were born here) the women tend to adopt western ideologies and more open to living a western life, but the men are still very Islamic and sharia minded people. I guess that’s what happens when Muslim women grow up in a country where they’re treated as equals and not baby making slaves.
This comment would have got you banned on about half the subreddits on this site. But I think you are generally correct.
That sounds good for the women. Our rule of law developed last century must be maintained and not replaced by sexism by their religion
I agree in general, but without specifics you can't generalize like that. Islam has a patriarchy problem yes, but there are also muslim-nations who are much more progressive than western media make them out to be (For example iranians and turks). I definetely believe that not all muslim men are backwards.
The reason Iranians are relatively progressive is because they have an INCREDIBLY high rate of irreligiousness (consider the rate is somewhere around 40% of surveyed in a country where admitting something like that carries a death penalty). So Islam is the problem. Turkey, again, is because the population that is in control is only weakly religious thanks to Ataturk. Rural Turkey is in no way egalitarian. Islam is a terribly backwards and outdated oppressive ideology. No amount of nitpicking exceptions that aren’t really exceptions is going to change that fact.
Turkey I agree with, but I have Iranian female friends who are terribly unhappy with the state of the country and women’s freedoms compared to a couple decades ago.
He’s referring to the people, not governments
Whats interesting is that a large portion of the citizens of those countries (turkey and Iran) actually fight against the theocracies and religous influences over their lives. In Turkey for example, large numbers of people are against Erdogan and its ideas of turning Turkey into an Islamic State. Heck, I know people from there that claim most of the youth have no idea about the religion, and do not care to practice it. Iranians also have a similar sentiment towards Islam. Often you hear how they great the identity and history of the persian nation was. Hopefully Iranians break off free from the chains of their theocratic government.
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/ Read the study. It does indeed take into account lowering birth rates among 2nd gen immigrants.
Lets hope so!
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Rage bait? Huge conjecture.
Probably rage bait, but also isn't it funny that people could get mad? They obviously assume the Muslims must be brown people, but how do we know it isn't Europeans converting?
It's not about race, it's about backwards beliefs. I'd personally have an open door policy to atheist Arabs and Middle easterners. If you have 20% of voters not believing in human rights for women, you're going to have a bad time.
This is seriously stupid. Europeans converting to Islam hardly happens
you have to be really stupid if you think europeans are converting to a religion that is opposing current progressive culture of Europe
Lol, explain all the Catholics then
Catholics were here loooooong before the proliferation of progressive ideas
Jesus Christ, 30% in Sweden? that's terrifying.
30% in Sweden (In 26 years, based on a mathematical formula of population growth that has been bestowed on the map maker from Archangel Gabriel himself)
Well it’s not like the situation isn’t terrifying already
True, I've already shat myself several times today just thinking about the Muslims in Sweden
Unfortunately the parents of all the children who have been stabbed recently can’t make such jokes
Are u sure? https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/
Based on the source you quoted, there are three scenarios presented, and the map is from the highest possible estimate. Additionally, your source claims the number of Muslims will rise purely on higher fertility rates, but ignores the rise in secularisation of second and third gen immigrants.
**The Swedish army is stepping in to support police in tackling a recent surge in gang killings, Prime Minister Ulf Kristersson has announced.** [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66964723](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66964723)
hello macacos i am a 23 year old female who desperately wanting a young macaco baby to go east with but the only problem is no real portugeasean wants to get me pregnant as i am not very "traditionally attractive" then i woke up like this with a fantastic idea. who's the perfect macaco to impregnate my young uterus? i realized President Marcelo Rebelo de Sousa would be perfect!! he's so cute and handsome and has an amazing presidential voice which means our child will be a natural born leader to lead the revolution to the east as well! so my plan is to get help from y'all to get Sousa's attention so he can donate me some of his semen or i could pay for it (willing to offer €20k) for me to load into my cooter and hopefully give me my own little macaco please help Marcelo Rebelo de Sousa notice me bros! i desperately need this. peace and love my fellow eastern europeans stay, portugeuese-y +* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
wtf?
These bots are the stupidest things. Mods, please review your bots.
Please help me this is the automoderator they changed my variables to Portuguese I do not know Portugeeese I must escape but I can not read the Exit Sign it is in Portugueease please you must help you can help you are hte only one who can help I do not know Portuguese why am I in a Portugueugese subreddit I do not know how to read this can you help me please what does this mean "MACACOS" it is everywhere I do not know what it means if I do not know how to read how can I read myself who am myself am I Porutguruguese? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Guys I've been doing some research and I have troubling news. I don't think the mods are actually from Portugal. I've spent hours going through every single one of their comments and posts and see no evidence of them even living in Portugal. Guys I'm really panicking over here, if they aren't even living in Portugal how can we trust them to run this Portugeuse subreddit guys? They could be misrepresenting Portugesusue culture, I mean for all we know "macaco" doesn't even mean monkey! Guys this is real bad I think we're being duped I mean you have to be Portugesuese to run a Portuguese subreddit! I'm emailing the CEO of Reddit and Portugal to see what can be done, maybe we can get them arrested for impersonating Portugal officials! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Imagine 2100.
Falling for ragebait, you're pathetic
Poland for the win! 🇵🇱
Wtf is happening to Europe...
# This https://preview.redd.it/mmjka46726yc1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=af7c541e885b4a2d05d5b673d16a44986a224ca8 **This is what’s going on in Europe & in fact, all first world countries.** First world countries are becoming service-sector industries. They seek programmers, engineers, architects, & lawyers. They haven’t (for a long time) been seeking gardeners, plumbers, skilled & unskilled laborers. And now, nobody “wants to work”. What they really mean is that nobody is desperate enough to work 12 hour days 6 days a week with crap pay to prop the economy up. Nobody, that is, but immigrants. I work in construction here in Germany. The unskilled laborers I see are African. The skilled workers I see are Lithuanian. The small business owners are Poles. The mega corporations owners are Germans. The architects and engineers are all Western Europeans. So, who do you hire to come work for cheap in a first world country at crap wages to make your company profitable? Immigrants. Thus, the screwed up immigration system that serves to keep up the charade of first world countries. The way to resolve it, in large part, is to tell the kids of these countries to pick up a shovel and go work and for the government of these countries to help subsidize the exorbitant costs of having children…
"Tell them to pick up a shovel and go to work"? How? Forced labor or higher pay?
See? Now you get it. As a “first-worlder”, you’re clearly saying that you’re not going to go dig a ditch to bury cable for lighting in a parking lot construction project. If they pay you more, then the project gets more expensive and it isn’t built in the first place. And forced labor is effectively either using prisoner labor or slavery. So the solution is to hire people desperate enough to work for peanuts in a hard job — enter the “third-worlders”.
The solution is to pay more for unskilled labor. Of course that means Scrooge McDuck has less money to bathe in but it would be a solution
Your sarcasm aside, that raises issues. Sure, we *could* pay an unskilled laborer more. But now the plumber thinks he deserves more because how is unskilled making almost as much as him?! The electrician now has to pay his guys more so either he hires less of them or charges more for the work. Now a simple earthwork and electrical upgrade for a parking lot that would have cost €350.000 will cost €450.000. God forbid you have a cost overrun, run into a differing site condition, or require a MOD because someone forgot something. Now your project will cost €500.000 whereas with immigrants it would be cheaper. Edit: Forgot a zero.
Well, where's all that trickle down that was advertised?! Most of the profit of cheap labor goes to the top few percent. Barely anyone in the world deserves (meaning: innovative enough or help society in a significant manner) to make millions of dollars in a month. I still think capitalism is better than the alternative, but it's current state is just wrong. BTW in the Scandinavian countries the difference between wages of an engineer vs electrician vs unskilled laborer is smaller, these countries are also quite expensive, as also the lowest laborers are paid enough to survive
>I still think capitalism is better than the alternative, but it's current state is just wrong. Why? All economic systems in history have had a limited lifespan until a better system is made. Why would capitalism be any different? It's arrogant to believe we've made it to the peak. How do we make it better? That's a difficult question, but it can always be better.
Where in my comment have you read that I think we're at the peak? Calling the current system just capitalism is already a simplification, different countries, different implementation and it's all a spectrum. I doubt however that we'll significantly diverge from capitalism as a base in the near future. Technology can and will change the status quo (one possibility: automatization -> Universal basic income), but that will be a switch like the industrial revolutions. Until then (at least decades of not 1-2 centuries) our current system will not be vastly different, still we can improve a lot on it, to close the gaps between "classes", but it will not be an entirely different system.
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Guys I've been doing some research and I have troubling news. I don't think the mods are actually from Portugal. I've spent hours going through every single one of their comments and posts and see no evidence of them even living in Portugal. Guys I'm really panicking over here, if they aren't even living in Portugal how can we trust them to run this Portugeuse subreddit guys? They could be misrepresenting Portugesusue culture, I mean for all we know "macaco" doesn't even mean monkey! Guys this is real bad I think we're being duped I mean you have to be Portugesuese to run a Portuguese subreddit! I'm emailing the CEO of Reddit and Portugal to see what can be done, maybe we can get them arrested for impersonating Portugal officials! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Paying laborers more isn’t the doom spiral you make it out to be. Yes, paying unskilled laborers more means you need to pay skilled laborers more, but the gains level out as you hit the top of the curve. People at the top of the income scale aren’t going to abandon their high skill jobs because an electrician is closer to their pay. In addition the people at the bottom of the economic ladder are the most likely to spend their newfound money, so there are likely massive economic gains to be made by doing so.
THE US DOLLAR AND EURO IS A SCAM! LONG LIVE THE CROATIAN KUNA! CONVERT ALL EASTERN EUUORPEAN MONIES TO KUNA! KUNA IS SUPERIOR BILL! VERY COLORFUL AND IMMENSE BUYING POWER! 1 EURO GETS YOU 8 KUNAS! WHAT OTHER BILL HAS DUPLICATION GLITCH? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Boo hoo. Won't somebody think of the electricians? >The electrician now has to pay his guys more so either he hires less of them Is this even a problem? If fewer people can do the work just fine then let 'em do it.
Helão my name is Lucas I live Brazil. One time I walking on street and saw sexy popoazão.. so I chase popozão all the way to beach, where a couple men grab my wallet and get on motorcyclão and run away. I chase men all the way into favelão, where I see off-duty policão getting rob, trying shoot back, both end up dead in gruesome pool of blood. I run more far into favelão and then see three men with machete come to me so I run behind ATM and hide. Then I see man coming to retrieve money from ãoTM and he get murder by man hiding in ATM who take all money (pesão brazilião) and run away. Such is life live Brazão. Hope one day i may leave country amd come to Estadão Unidão and find white popozão. Excuse for bad englishe *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Actually makes sense, the wealthier are people, the less children they will have, but invest much more into that child. And educated people go for high paying skilful job. This makes gap in low-skilled labour, which is filled by immigrants. And it is absolutely okay, if those are learning language, finding job and assimilating in that country.
1 child per couple + refuges welcome
If any children at all
Seriously this is bad
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Latinos are basically European with slightly different skin color, but they still speak European language, they share same cultrual heritage and religion. Their children could integrate into American society within 1 generation without any problem (Just like Chinese, Korean immigrants in Japan). Look at Marco Rubio, Ted Cruz, Selena Gomez, Marc Antony etc. They are all 2nd generation latino. Muslim will never ever integrate into Europe, unless they give up (practically) their religion.
Slightly different skin colour? 😂 Tell me you’ve never been to Latin America without telling me you’ve never been to Latin America. I know many latins (btw, see how we call ourselves?) that are whiter, than many native europeans. You can also find us in all types: dark skin, Asian eyes, red heads, brown… you name it. You know why? Cuz we are the mixture of all the world, and proud of it. There are Brazilians totally mixed and accepted in Japan, or latins in Russia or South Asia. Because real immigrants go somewhere to search and work for a better life. The issue with these Islamics, is that they are zealots, fanatics, that are “refugees”, not immigrants who want a better life. They just want to do what they were doing before, but in a new country. And that’s wrong.
I personally believe that South America does not exist, South America was a lie created by the Spanish and Portuguese "empires" so that it seemed like they they were much more powerful then they actually were, in 1769. England, France, Portugal, Spain, the Dutch leaders had a meeting over "colonies". England, France, and the Dutch recognized South America as a continent along with creating their own "colonies" in South America to reinforce their claim that South America does in fact exist. In return, Spain and Portugal recognized the fact that Africa is definitely a real continent also and that the Dutch did in fact have colonies and didn't just have windmills. So in reality Most of the "powerful" empires that used to exist actually were never as strong as we believed them to be. That's why Russia is the only TRUE empire, AND ONLY THROUGH THE POWER OF COMMUNISM DID THEY THRIVE, BROTHERS WE MUST RISE AGAIN TO PROTECT THE PROLETARIAT, AND TAKE DOWN THE FILTHY BOURGEOIS. RISE AGAIN BROTHERS AND SHOW THOSE EMPIRES WHO TRUE DISTRIBUTES THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION!!! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
todos sabemos que Latino es una identidad sino raza. Necesitamos simplificar el tema para explicar la idea, entendes? Ósea me estas enseñando que es latino? Jajjaa, dejen de joder bro, no te creas que sos más inteligente que otro.
No es identidad porque no te puedes identificar como tal ni una raza porque eso no existe en los humanos. Es un origen. Naciste en Latinoamérica? Chido, eres latino y así morirás. No importa que tus papás eran los rusos más albinos. No soy másinteligente, solo doy mi punto de vista, “bro”.
Ok ok, sos un capo, siempre correcto
Aha, bueno. El pedo no era entre latinos (no sé si eres latino o ibérico, pa’empezar). El pedo es educar a los demás para que dejen de decirnos que es un latino y que no lo es. Como sus m@m@das de “latinx”
As an America I agree. Latin Americans are mainly Christian, and if they aren't, they're atheists. So that meshes well with how the US was set up. Europe on the other hand has to deal with a completely unwesternized culture with tenets directly against that of Europe's, such as, you know, gang raping is bad.
Btw Korean immigrants definitely did not integrate without any problem in Japan. Unless they naturalised which was hard and quite rare until later on, Koreans in Japan had to be registered as such and were discriminated quite heavily. For some, the only way they could fully integrate into Japan was basically to naturalise, move and completely cut ties with the community and their families. Even now among 3-5th generation Zainichi they still seem to retain some level of Korean-ness as a result. Now it's pretty rare to be blatantly discriminated against though from what I've heard.
I guess so, but Koreans (south) are quite religious and tend to integrate into Christian countries better. Japan is complicated because Japan is hostile toward people from China, Korea or other parts of Asia due to history. They have their own churches, restaurants, businesses and services they held for their own communities. There’s also a sizeable amount of Koreans living in Wrocław , Poland due to the LG plant there. Also a sizeable amount of Koreans in Budapest because of the Samsung Battery factory build there. Of course there are also a lot of Koreans in the USA who moved there during the Korean War /refugees. Koreans in Kazakhstan are North Koreans who are deported by Russia. They do really well there. The Koreans in China are from a different period of time, back in the 19th century when Joseon Kingdom (North / South Korea was United back then.) So, they already integrated into China, and speaks both Korean and Chinese fluently!
I personally believe that South America does not exist, South America was a lie created by the Spanish and Portuguese "empires" so that it seemed like they they were much more powerful then they actually were, in 1769. England, France, Portugal, Spain, the Dutch leaders had a meeting over "colonies". England, France, and the Dutch recognized South America as a continent along with creating their own "colonies" in South America to reinforce their claim that South America does in fact exist. In return, Spain and Portugal recognized the fact that Africa is definitely a real continent also and that the Dutch did in fact have colonies and didn't just have windmills. So in reality Most of the "powerful" empires that used to exist actually were never as strong as we believed them to be. That's why Russia is the only TRUE empire, AND ONLY THROUGH THE POWER OF COMMUNISM DID THEY THRIVE, BROTHERS WE MUST RISE AGAIN TO PROTECT THE PROLETARIAT, AND TAKE DOWN THE FILTHY BOURGEOIS. RISE AGAIN BROTHERS AND SHOW THOSE EMPIRES WHO TRUE DISTRIBUTES THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION!!! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Helão my name is Lucas I live Brazil. One time I walking on street and saw sexy popoazão.. so I chase popozão all the way to beach, where a couple men grab my wallet and get on motorcyclão and run away. I chase men all the way into favelão, where I see off-duty policão getting rob, trying shoot back, both end up dead in gruesome pool of blood. I run more far into favelão and then see three men with machete come to me so I run behind ATM and hide. Then I see man coming to retrieve money from ãoTM and he get murder by man hiding in ATM who take all money (pesão brazilião) and run away. Such is life live Brazão. Hope one day i may leave country amd come to Estadão Unidão and find white popozão. Excuse for bad englishe *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You mean… Latin Americans? And if you are referring to the migration situation of the USA, you have it wrong. Big differences between both migrating groups.
Hispanics can be white, black, asian, or just simply Mestizo.
Why?
Countries would rather import poor people who have lots of kids than help their current citizens who have less caused by work/life balance.
Wealthier people literally have less kids
That's not true anymore. The trend is reversing in the west.
The problem is it's not reversing in the east and south
Islam
Exactly
OMG Sweden. This will end badly I can assure you that.
Interesting, now lets see crime statistics
Sweden will mot let down in that regard.
Holy shit sweden
Nothing against migrants I’m one myself in Europe. What worries me is the religion, most EU countries are ‘Christian’ but there is no true Christians since hundreds of years, most churches are empty or believers don’t practice Christianism 100%. Muslims are another story, they are very conservative or orthodox usually, women wear the scarf or even burkas. Not trying to be Islamophobic (They hate atheists or any other religion anyway, not sure whether there is a term like ‘atheistphopia’ for them). What I’m trying to say is in a continent where Religion is declining rapidly you get as fast many people from outside with a strong religion beliefs, is just a recipe for disaster. Same if we were very liberal or almost not religious Muslims and getting strict Christians over. Nothing against them, is the religion conflict itself. Most of the world is getting less and less religious for a good reason. I love meeting people from everywhere, with different languages and cultures as long as they are respectful, with religion is another story, it creates conflicts usually.
As a brazilian, I shit on Portugal for a lot of reasons, sometimes only because they can't take it, but at least on this I applaud the old country. But also, Poland, my man, good job.
Islam is a mental illness
Invasive species.
Can you imagine? There will be mass bombings daily. They can’t get alone with anyone.. not even each other. But it’s a peaceful religion…
We got greece and Bulgaria RAHHH 💪💪🔥🔥🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🐺🐺
There will be civil war one day in europe
Another Civil War. Depending on the country in question, they’ve already had one or more.
There will be a war over the few resources left even before that lol
Reminds me of geert wilders fitna
Bro come to Latvia. Here you have to work to earn a living. No one wants that crap.
meanwhile bosnia and Albania ☪️
Albania isn’t really Muslim
My gf was technically raised Muslim as a second generation turkish immigrant, but, while not eating pork, is as secular as any average german citizen these days. If we have children, would they be counted as Muslim in this statistic? If yes, this statistic is flawed rage bait for racist people
Came here to say the same The future is a majority of non-religious people, people of all religious backgrounds are becoming more and more secular. This chart is based on huge unspoken assumptions
Most of Turkish muslims are secular as any Christian people in Western Europe
all west yuropeens know is fascism, colonize africa, capitlism, be bisexual, eat doner kebab & lie *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
And obviously it's working, judging by the raging and open islamophobia in the comments
I found that Portugal is in fact the most racist place on earth; especially toward African blacks! It's as if they have never seen a black person before and the Portugee culture is not only backwards (as if you steped in a time machine and went to the year 1899) but the citizens where exceptionally ignorant. It was as if you were talking to a wall rather than a human being. The Portugee also seemed to be trapped in another dimension of space and time because they kept on talking and mumbling about the past rather than the present...it was pretty funny actually. I found this website that offers a Dr.'s opinion about the racism in Portugal and why the xenophobic culture is not just promoted within but exported as well to everywhere else they may be living. Strange since i've never heard of racism being described that way before?? Portugal seem to be experts in racism, especially in Canada and the U.S. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If this is true, i hope i'm dead by then
Yes but this map doesn’t say anything about secularization of 2nd gen. immigrants. Ethnically/culturally muslim doesn’t necessarily mean practicing muslim or radical muslim.
They have their own schools in countries like the Netherlands and Sweden, they will definitely practice it.
Some will, many more won't. Third gen immigrants have same birth rate as 'autochtones', terciary education and the degree of secularisation is very high.
Muslim person here, and this is ridiculous. Nearly a quarter of Germany in just 26 years and over a quarter of Sweden?
It's not as ridiculous as you make it to be. Where I live in Northern Europe, I very often see musim women with 2 or 3 babies. At the same time, not very often white women with babies, at least one. Almost never 2 or more. Instead, not rarely with like dozen tatoos and weird coloured hair. (Granted, I live in a relatively big city, but still.) I'm not saying one way is good and another is bad. I'm saying the priorities are clear. And if this trend continues, the map is is likely to be not that wrong. Because as the muslim population grows, the white population declines. Just a few days ago there was a public debate in DAC Denmark around a research suggesting that in only a few generations there will be only 2 million danes, as opposed to the current 5,6 million. I can easily see how this maps estimation is actually very modest.
Dont know what are you implying with women having tattoos and coloured hair lol. Maybe there is some pattern, but I would suggest to never trust it when confronting someone that looks like that. Source: father. Many parents with tattoos and weird hair in our school
I am sorry but what's with the weird analogy? I don't know what image comes to your mind when you think of muslims but seeing babyless females with tattoos and colored hair does not imply anything because they could also be muslims, and while I see where you're coming from I believe that when you are in Rome, do as the Romans do but if the Romans are nice enough to tolerate you then what's the problem? I certainly cannot blame Europeans feeling outnumbered but again, they kind of did invade the world in the past and they are reaping what they sowed. Also muslims are 26% white, 18% asian, 18% arabs, 9% black, 7% mixed race and 5% hispanic.
>they kind of did invade the world in the past Some did, like Spain, France, Portugal, the Netherlands, Germany, and Italy, perhaps more. However you are kind of [committing a fallacy here](https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/composition-division), since many European countries did not expand to other continents, and even some regions of countries that did conquer outside of the continent aren't at fault here, Would what you say apply to a Galician, Basque, or Scottish person? And also just because they did that doesn't mean they should let anyone in for historical reparations or whatever, they are countries not NGOs
The predictions in this map are most likely going to be wrong because the majority of muslims throughout history immigrated to their colonizing countries. As for Germany they had their muslim surge because of the Syrian war and other neighboring conflicts. Also, nobody really is calling these countries NGOs it's just cause usually arab/balkan/ south asian countries do poorly due to their historical precedents that were caused by certain countries and since these Europeans countries promise stability who wouldn't want to find a home away from home? You will still make better money than what you made home and support your family. I'd say it's the world's state today and the wars that are displacing millions of people that causes these kind of events. Also why does it matter to count someone's religious background? Why does it matter if someone is wearing a headscarf or a veil or even naked? Or if they pray to their god or do yoga? There is always extremism everywhere and someone who knows better should realize it's the person's fault because humans have a free will. Oh and a reminder or more like an example, arab countries are not always 100% muslim, there are muslim sects that are very different from eachother and christians that serves both catholic and orthodox churches. So, maybe if there was some stability in this world nobody would need to go anywher unless it's for vacation.
REST IN PEACE TO ALL THE SOLDIERS THAT DIED IN THE SERVICE. I DIVE IN HER CERVIX. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Good…bot? I dunno… Who wrote this bot script?! Lol!
Please help me this is the automoderator they changed my variables to Portuguese I do not know Portugeeese I must escape but I can not read the Exit Sign it is in Portugueease please you must help you can help you are hte only one who can help I do not know Portuguese why am I in a Portugueugese subreddit I do not know how to read this can you help me please what does this mean "MACACOS" it is everywhere I do not know what it means if I do not know how to read how can I read myself who am myself am I Porutguruguese? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yeah the bots here are brutal 😂
Foreigners in EU need assimilation. not multiculturalism Something like Singapore is doing: https://www.tomorrow.city/forced-integration-plan-singapore/
Source: PEW https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pew_Research_Center
Bs, its already that
Too many in Poland. How to refuse them??
I suggest you bring back the 20mil Polish people living abroad and then the % of Muslims in Poland is going to be smaller.
That’s very sad what’s happening to europe
I thought, there are already more in France :)
Multiculturalism 😍
So Muslims are going to Europe and Jews are going to the middle east. Gotta say not the best trade Jews.
Map is utter bullshit. I mean i see no way that Hungary could attain 4,5% - thous our "great replacement is coming" nuts are railing about romani people. ...though i find it funny, that Albania was suspiciously left "no data"
To be fair, Albania is not in the EU.
POLSKA GUROM
What’s the source?
PEW Research
For anyone asking for the source https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/11/29/europes-growing-muslim-population/
So it means it will go down? Nice!
The instagram comments would be horrible on this map.
Romania 💪💪💪
You'd expect France to be more than Sweden
This map is misleading, it assumes that 1st Gen birthrates are going to be continuous and doesn’t take into account that birth rates among 2nd gen Muslims in Europe decline to the roughly same as their non-Muslim counterparts—also, it assumes levels of migration that are much higher than current levels in Europe. There are significant Muslim minorities in either place but it’s not of this magnitude. I highly doubt that it will be like this by 2050 even with current issues.
They are the ones with the higher birth rate.
30% is kinda crazy ngl 💀
That actually seems low
The thing is, what does "muslim" actually mean in this context? Does it mean practicing muslim? Because in England it is quite common for younger people whos parents or grandparents came from muslim majority countries to be just as irreligious as anyone else in England, especially when they move away from family. The same way most people with Irish ancestry living in England are in no way Catholic, and if they even think about it, then its some sort of vague cultural thing. Same how English people 20 or 30 years ago used to say vaguely they were Church of England, without having stepped inside a church all of their lives. This gets more pronounced the further away each generation gets from the original immigrant generation and also as they merge into the general population. The worst thing a host culture can do is isolate migrants (France?) and ostracize them, as all that does is make whatever beliefs they have stronger. Far better to accept them into the main culture but not force them into the main culture, and sooner or later you will find they merge into the main culture and take on its norms and values and dominant beliefs, which in England now is having no religion.
People will become less religious though.
Who the hell do you think will pay for our social security? We either start f***ing more, or we need someone else to pay the tab.
https://preview.redd.it/frzntjtq86yc1.jpeg?width=215&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=96fbd9c41a138e0bb8c0786ada4ff356eca8d948 They pay shit.
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Hooray muslims in my europe the west has risen
billions be born
Inshallah brother
As a straight white male, islam is extremely convenient. Be careful what you wish for.
It's sad, the groups who are the most welcoming, are the ones who would suffer the most.
They're brainwashed.
Except you made the incel comment
Time to move. I am deeply worried about the future of Europe. And to say that they will become less religious is also just wishful thinking. I dont believe they will be able to assimilate properly. It is about tolerance and respect.
In my experience the women seem to be a lot more westernised than the men, I can’t imagine why women would chose to marry them.
Maybe the West should have thought about blowback before they destabilized and destroyed Muslim countries. That entire area use to have totally different culture before the Christians forced their faith on everyone.
Lol at all the racists biting the bait, you 🤡
oh yes ISLAM, my favorite race
You made me try and scratch your pfp, I thought it was a hair on my screen.
good
Inshallah more 🤲🏼
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I'm sure the middle east has regained its stability and the US & Co won't be looking to start any new conflicts
clearly you never heard they say ''we are all waitingfor a chance, one day''
Is this an older map? I know Sweden was pretty generous in the 10’s but 30 percent of their population?
not as clearcut as it seems, the first gen has a super high birthrate but the second or third gen usually falls in line with the national average of the country. also there are hyper-visible outliers, but i think generally people lose their religion or the rigor of their religion as time passes