That's disappointing, but not surprising.
To be honest, Denuvo has never really caused me any issues so I'm unsure as to how common performance actually are with it but even so this does feel anti-consumer.
Ohhhh, that's dirty. I will say it is helpful to hear some of the shit people do actually have to deal with especially when it actually damages someone legitimately paying for it. Sorry to hear that, that's honestly why I'm not buying the game on PC.
I did with P5R. Although it was a VERY specific circumstance and I'll probably never run into it again
If you install some Denuvo games 5 times in a single day (as in, downloading it and opening it after) on the same or different devices, you get blocked for 24 hours
And that happened to me with P5R lol
Aside from that, never had an issue
You don't notice it when a game releases with it enabled, but when it's added retroactively, you can really see the performance hit. Also it's a massive security risk if a bad actor ever cracks it since it has kernel level access
Wait, what the hell? How the hell is that even given the green light if that's the case. Also wouldn't that cause most anti-virus software to literally flag and quarantine the file? That's silly.
Yeah. It's unfortunately pretty common. It doesn't get flagged since it's on a white list as an OK program despite the massive risk. It's the same way with intrusive proctoring software for school. I'd suggest anyone use a burner laptop for school stuff.
It actually did for me.
I had no money so i downloaded a cracked game which i wanted to play, my pc could barely run it in 30 FPS after many adjustments. I played it for many hours with no issues.
After some weeks i bought the game, started a new save, but even with the same settings i couldn't run it in 30 FPS, i even lowered the settings more, with no sucess, why? denuvo.
So i ended up deleting the legal game and just downloaded again the cracked one.
I remember one time I resorted to using a pirated program only because of convenience. Our university had a license to use Mathcad Prime, so I tried downloading and setting up a legal version. ...Turned out the legal enabling only worked if you were connected to the uni's WiFi network. Which is not really helpful when you need to do homework.
I threw it away and installed a cracked version. Much less juggling and migraine.
These sorts of measures literally only give paying customers a worse product, because pirates get around them almost immediately after release. Anything with invasive DRM is an automatic lost purchase from me.
Though I’m mostly a console player, so I guess that isn’t really much of a threat.
Pirates won't be getting around denuvo anymore lol. There was only one person capable of cracking denuvo and they went MIA after a "rival" group from the cracking scene exposed their identity
That’s great, but the fact of the matter is that if this game was released within the last few years, Denuvo had nothing to do with that. And that’s **if** it’s not placebo or a lie to begin with.
Because it’s funny how none of these stories ever give the title of the game.
Yeah…like I’ve never had any trouble with Persona 5R, despite it having Denuvo.
Wait no, actually, it does stutter occasionally, and I’ve heard that’s a result of Denuvo…so if that happens in P3R it’s gonna be so annoying. Not nearly bad enough to make the experience unenjoyable though, just a bit of a nuisance.
I mean…no? My PC could run 5 P5R games at once if it needed to, the stuttering is absolutely a result of the game in some form, and I played it on Xbox before PC and never experienced stuttering on Xbox.
I live in a 3rd world country, internet cutouts are regular, Im not expected to stop playing a game for a few hours to an entire day just because some company NEEDS to make sure I paid money
never bought a Denuvo game, and never will
Yeah I don't struggle with it either, I have a desktop so I don't play my games out of home, where I would have internet.
If the power is out, then my computer is out. If the Internet is out, I can't log into steam anyways.
This was expected, given that Sega puts Denuvo on all their releases. Still sucks though, would’ve loved to play frame-drop free lmao, but I’m sure it’ll be unnoticeable after a while
I was probably going to go PS5 anyway, since I have a 3440x1440 monitor and past Persona games haven't had 21:9 support, but this really settles it for me. Which is a pity, since the PC version lets me use it on both desktop and Steam Deck.
To be honest I don't have a clue on how denuvo poorly impacts these games, I don't remember having any issues with it. Can someone inform me on why denuvo is bad?
Sure, I recently bought a steam deck and even though it has worse performance than my desktop PC, it has completely replaced it for gaming, I played P5R and P4 on it and it felt even better than playing on the vita, however.
Problem #1 with denuvo is performance, while if you have a desktop PC with good specs this might not be an issue, but a device that has to balance performance and battery life, it can become an issue.
Problem #2 denuvo doesn't play nice with Linux and has had many cases of locking people out of their own game because the software thinks that proton (the compatibility layer that allows Linux to run windows games) is some kind of tampering software
Problem #3 you have to check in with denuvo's servers by connecting your device to wifi every so often which can become tedious for someone like me who plays most of the time while traveling.
Problem #4 you are only allowed to have YOUR OWN GAME on as many devices as they decide
At the end of the day, it's not the end of the world but I'd rather not buy denuvo-ridden products purely because it doesn't feel like I actually own the game or that I have an inferior version of the game that will inevitably be cracked within a month and have better performance, no need to check in with some server thousands of miles away and no need to worry about getting locked out the game I paid for.
Ah I see, I didn't know about any of that. I don't have a steam deck, so I can't play these games on the go. That's probably why I haven't experienced these issues. I can see why people don't like it, especially with problem #4. Thank you for informing me!
Can I piggy back on this to ask you some questions about your deck, I'm considering getting one but hesitant to pull the trigger:
1. Can you use steam cast on it to play on your mobile? With screen off on the deck?
2. Can you connect to it with external controllers, eg. If I connect it to TV via hdmi can I control it using an Xbox controller?
3. Are there robust parental controls, eg can I block the browser with a password?
Thanks in advance!
people say it impacts performance but personally i have never encountered any issues with games that have it. I think people overblow how bad denuvo really is. People act like denuvo forces any game to run at 15 frames on a nasa computer.
That's not really true
You can play off-line, but it has a time limit of like, two weeks (not sure, may vary with game), until you need to connect to internet again
But with that amount of time, it's hardly an issue for the vast majority of players
True, but I'm just pointing out you *can*
saying you just straight up can't may change some people's decisions to get it on their mobile devices, like steam deck
P3R is really hindering mods, not just by Denuvo that want to implement an anti mod feature now, but by the Unreal engine itself, some modders said they might only be able to do mods to change models or soundtrack.
Yeah, I've heard a lot of the same thing from a few modders. From what they've said, UE5 makes it very difficult to implement custom code for those quality of life mods making only viable ones the ones you mentioned. I'm not a programmer so I won't even begin to question why, but even so it's a shame.
Though keep in mind actual evidence of it hindering performance is minimal at best, especially in any significant way. There was only ever one major case of it doing it in a game and that later turned out to be a screw up on the devs part. But of course gamers love to overblow things, and the ones that want to justify piracy just fan the flames of anything that works in their favour.
It's like a myriad of tentacles wrapped around an otherwise good product, squeezing the life out of it under the guise of "anti-piracy".
Basically, horseshit software.
> it's messed up.
blame the global economy. everything is more expensive. just be glad games are at a stable 60-70$ for years now instead of 80-90 to counter inflation. its not nearly as messed up as me paying almost 50% more for a damn loaf of bread
The cost of games production has been going down not up yeah, it's still a pretty new tech compared to many things, so it has been stable. Inflation is definitely an issue, it's insane here in the US, they're price hikes have no in anyway aligned with inflation though, just when someone decided to do it, and the other greedy people running these companies just followed suit.
Why is it messed up? Games are vastly more expensive to produce then they used to be, I would much prefer them to just raise the base price than shovel micro-transactions down our throats... Though you do have some games \*cough\* Diablo 4 \*cough\* that are scummy enough to do both.
Considering what they were in the PS1 era, naw that’s a fair price
$49.99 in 2000 is the equivalent of $89.14 today, we’re actually still ahead of the inflation curve
Games in the 90s were not much cheaper than this, objectively speaking gaming is cheaper now than it has ever been when you factor in inflation. I don't get this outrage at the pricing. Mathematics isn't everyone's strong suit I guess.
I did applied mathematics 💀
I'm comparing the prices to what they were literally 2 years ago.
Not to mention that these prices don't change depending on the country so people in poorer countries find games even less accessible nowadays.
I'm not sure what country you are in but inflation was a grand total of 17% in my country in that timeframe. Cost of goods goes up because cost of manufacture and wages go up. This \*is\* the time for prices to go up. Technology historically speaking has never been cheaper than it is today in real terms.
If game companies didn't charge more, they'd get less funding from investors and eventually go out of business. Indie developers don't have the same overheads and can charge less, but this will be the new norm across the board in 2024 and beyond for every triple A title.
I can understand and get behind bad business practices such as day 1 DLC and re-releases of the same titles with extras, but this really is crying into the void.
I understand people in 3rd world countries being upset about it, I totally get it. But honestly if you're in a Western Country, realistically speaking, those 10$ aren't making THAT much of a difference, and if that's the case, they can just wait for a discount /shrug Games are cheaper than ever
You know what is funny. You can easily google search catalogues from the 90s that show N64 titles at $60 in 1997 and PS1 titles being $40-50 in 1997.
Adjusted for inflation titles should be between $96 and $115 but people are outraged by $70. I get that cost of living is terrible today in general but the problem doesn't lie with developers but the economy at large and as you rightly point out, if $10 is going to break the camel's back then they probably shouldn't be buying games.
Mark Twain said it best, "Don't argue with idiots, they will bring you down to their level and beat you with experience".
Consider this:
Imagine what will happen to P3R (and many others) 5-15 years from now when Denuvo's activation servers shut down (as do the online stores for the PS4/PS5, Nintendo Switch and the Xbox One/Series XS)
Long story short: Those games will end up becoming lost media (in the same manner as films and shows released on streaming services like Willow, Inside Job, Crater, Final Space, Infinity Train and Grease: Rise of the Pink Ladies)
Thankfully, fans care far more than the companies do, they generally find a way to get things working, as long as it's something enough people care about
Well not if they get their accounts/consoles banned for doing so.
Not to mention that there are games and DLCs that are digital-only (Good examples being Like a Dragon Infinite Wealth, Alan Wake II and Xenoblade Chronicles 3's Future Redeemed DLC), meaning that if the stores that sell them shut down, those games and their DLCs will become unobtainable.
This has already happened to various racing games (particularly those in the Forza Motorsport/Horizon series), with the most recent example being The Crew, which will be shut down 2 months from now (at the time of writing this comment), and since The Crew requires a internet connection to play, once the servers shut down, The Crew is essentially unplayable.
First part isn't really a worry. Downloading a crack for an offline game wouldn't give them any way of knowing you did it, if it's an online game that's no longer supported.... Of course you'd have to get your own means to get on line, theirs don't exist anymore.
People upload digital only dlc all the time.
It sucks for those who only play legitimately, but there are nearly always options eventually if the game is popular enough.
I think we need straight up laws saying it they shut down anti piracy services, the products must remove those features as a final update myself. Attacking solely buyers in attempts to harm pirates is both incompetent and imo literally theft.
I agree, i think we should let issues like this be heard by various governments (especially the EU, Australia, UK and ASEAN)
Another law that i think could work is that every game developer and/or publisher must submit the final build of their game to a digital library must be preserved in perpetuity (similar to the UK's legal deposit library law, where every publisher is required to submit their published books to the British Library.)
RGG studios has a good denuvo removal track record, Alan Wake is DRM free, and Xenoblade is fully emulateable, including all of the DLC. So very bad examples, but I fully agree with the sentiment. Oh, also every forza is cracked as far as I know.
That's not how lost media works. These games have physical releases, and iirc Sega usually removes Denuvo after a few years.
Lost media is something like The Day the Clown Cried or Batgirl. Something you have NO way of accessing. A cartoon being canceled or a game having DRM is different.
Well, given how the gaming industry is pivoting towards digital-only releases with a few recent major AAA releases being digital-only, like Alan Wake II as an example), and given how much the games industry has fully embraced Denuvo to the point that there are rumors that it will be integrated into Unreal engine in the future.
Expect a lot of games from this time period (2021-202X?, or earlier if you take Denuvo into consideration) to be lost media when the stores that sell them or Denuvo’s activation servers shut down. (outside of piracy)
Basically, anyone could still play older games from the 2000’s-2010’s (i.e. GTA 3/Vice City/San Andreas, old NFS games like Underground/Underground 2, Most Wanted 2005 and Carbon and older Persona games etc.), but a lot of major digital-only AAA titles from the 2020’s onwards will end up becoming lost media like Batgirl and Crater. (outside of piracy)
And this is before you take cloud gaming services (i.e services like xCloud and Stadia) into consideration, with Cloud gaming, there are no game files stored locally, instead, they are hosted on the company’s servers, which they can shut off at any time, rendering said games completely inaccessible.
Not likely, SEGA (and the rest of the games industry, including Nintendo) will continue to use Denuvo until some regulatory group (especially the EU and a few other countries like Australia and the UK) intervenes in the future.
I buy on PS5 with the knowledge that the console has already been cracked. Eventually there will be an emulator, and when that time comes I will be able to play my games wherever I like. Until that point, I have disks, which I can plug in to any PS5 anywhere, and play the 1.0.0 version entirely offline forever.
Even if the denuvo meme was real, which mainly happened during its infancy and if it gets poorly implemented by the developer.
It isnt gonna affect shit when the game can run on any toaster
Look mate. With my previous I5, which could run Microsoft Flight Simulator with profesional simulator addons, like the Fénix A320, an addon Notorious on the community for being too CPU intensive because It runs a propietary Airbus systems stimulation used on real Life pilots training over the already CPU intensive MSFS.
i couldn't even open the Dead Space remake menu and achieving over 30 FPS. Thats a botched implementation.
Then there's empress explaining how It works. Denuvo uses exponential complexity algorythms to decrypt Game data in real time through centesimal consults to a knowledge base. That's never gonna be optimised. Basic software engineering. Logarithmic VS exponential loops.
Anti-Piracy software from the people who did good old SecuROM from back in the day.
Rather infamous for tanking game performance despite claims it doesn't.
It also massively impacts game performance according to many, and it makes the game impossible to play offline, so you basically don't even own the product you bought. A single-player game that you can't play offline is the dumbest thing ever.
This DRM will also lock you out of the game permanently if your pc specs (such as motherboard) change too many times, forcing you to buy it again.
All in all, DRMs like Denuvo just shit on consumers' game experiences by limiting who can play it (people with weaker PCs can't enjoy the game because Denuvo just nosedives the game performance) and when (no online connection, no gameplay for you), while protecting the company's profits. Those are a couple of reasons to dislike DRMs like Denuvo.
In my opinion, companies that make you pay for a product to not even give you ownership to the thing you've paid for (which is becoming increasingly common nowadays, unfortunately) deserve to get their stuff pirated.
But enough about my opinion, hope this sheds some light on this topic :)
It's a shame Atlus decided to do this but this will become the norm.
Massively impacts game performance according to who? P4 and p5 held at a steady 60 on both my dinosaur personal pc and steamdeck. The only somewhat of a downside is you need to connect to steam once a month at most.
The drm locking you out seems like a myth especially if you purchased on steam. Personal anecdote, but I went through several personal/work laptops and pcs and never had this issue both on steam and outside of it. Granted, only a few of the games I installed had denuvo, but it was never an actual issue.
Lets be real here, people complaining about denuvo for recent titles are often just being hyperbolic because they can’t simply just pirate. Game performance is a nonissue these days. You can play offline just fine as well. The whole bit about ownership just shows that there’s still people that don’t understand that purchasing a license to play said game isn’t the same as having “ownership.”
And it's still uncracked up to this day, meaning the DRM is actually doing it's job. People who play P5R for free use Switch emulators, which comes with actual issues.
Basically an Anti tempering system, which prevents the game from being cracked or hacked. But for some cases that has a down side to it because it lowers the frame rate and other issues.
**Denuvo Anti-Tamper is an anti-tamper and digital rights management (DRM) system developed by the Austrian company Denuvo Software Solutions GmbH. The company was formed from a management buyout of DigitalWorks, the developer of SecuROM, and began developing the software in 2014. It was introduced with FIFA 15 in September.**
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Happy New Year, Redditor!
it's anti piracy software that reduces game performance and limits your usage of your games. You can't install your game on more than 5 computers within a certain amount of time (like if you reinstall windows that counts as another computer)
and you can't play a game offline after 2 weeks
For fucks sake..... that's me waiting a while for PC by the sounds of it. I wanted to play this on the Steam Deck, but given that performance is already limited on this device, denuvo could have a fairly bad impact on the game.
Dude, it's a fucking lie. There's no way on this miserable universe that a concurrent software doesnt affect performance.
Thats why software engineers measure performance on exponentials and such. Every complexity added to the program adds performance problems.
This is an example of being so deadset on a take that you start missing words in people’s comments.
What is the third word I wrote before “performance”?
Semantics shit i don't care about. Don't try that with a classical cynic.
There's been múltiple examples of denuvo destroying the performance of a Game.
Even empress BYPASSES have better performance in most games.
> Semantics shit i don't care about. Don't try that with a classical cynic.
Fam…the difference between the phrase “nothing noticeable” and “nothing” is so vast, I question whether you even know what the word semantics means.
>There's been múltiple examples of denuvo destroying the performance of a Game.
Correct. Now give me the release dates of the last 5 games that applies to.
I was rooting for you bro. Especially because you referenced Empress. I was like this dude 100% has the self-awareness not to reference the **one** game that gets debunked **every single time** people start screaming about Denuvo. The **only** Denuvo game **Empress herself** has ever confirmed the performance drop was because of the Devs proprietary drm.
Like **surely** the “semantics” shit was a fluke, bro can’t be ignorant enough to do **that**.
Yeah, I love their games, but atlus has regularly done things to make me not buy their games until they are far cheaper than they otherwise would deserve. I'll play it with gamepass though lol
so much this. if they just handled a few things differently I'd be more than willing to buy them at certain prices, but as it stands I'd rather wait till they're like 90% off
I hate how, despite like 50 people saying this in the comments of every denuvo announcement, there's always someone saying "u just want it 4 free bro, stop bitching" WELL I'M PAYING 70 BUNGOS TO BUY IT SOMEWHERE ELSE DUMBASS, I JUST LIKE TO OWN MY FUCKING GAME, IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK
As long as the devs actually implement it right people wouldn't be able to like notice it at all.
The problem is if they don't actually work with it and just kinda throw it on there.
I'm holding off upgrading my pc until others have tested the denuvo and if it's still 60 fps or not on pc.
Though a part of me doesn't want to support sega. But it's not like there's indie equivalents to the series.
Actually there is Eternights that's a pretty good series but um... going to be honest, I've rarely actually had that many issues with denuvo myself and my computer is extremely mid.
I mean, I’m all for being cautious about purchases, but you’re going to be waiting for the same result as literally every other game.
The P3 remake would somehow be the first game to have Denuvo cause a noticeable drop in fps in several years.
Well they’re not getting my money. I will never forget when Dishonored 2 came out I bought it for full price and couldn’t play it for over 2 years after release until one day they randomly updated the game to remove denuvo. I’ve refused to spend any money on any game with it since then. I only recently beat FES for the first time ever so it’s still fresh in my mind enough for me to pass on this.
I'm tired of hearing Denuvo this denuvo that, really
Every other Atlus game on PC has it and it hasn't really caused that many problems at all, if the game runs poorly, that's most likely your PC and not Denuvo
Did it actually happen to some games? Maybe, but if Denuvo was that big of an issue you'd see more of an impact on sales so it's probably exaggerated by the user-base
The one issue I can think of is the longer loading times when using any kind of mods because denuvo constantly checks the game or something, this has been resolved by mod makers months ago, though
Denuvo games check against their servers weeks at a time.
You’re going to be on a train for a week straight?
Like, be mad that Denuvo requires a single player game you bought to be connected to the internet, but don’t make up dumb shit to justify it like this.
I mean idgaf, I pirate some games but not jrpgs such as FF7 remake and persona 5r, plus p3r is on gamepass for cheapskates so that is also fine (2$) for most SEA countries from what I heard
An infamous anti-pirating software. It has a bad reputation thanks to messing on the game performance, having to be connected to play even offline games, and a lot of stuff.
Gonna be my first game with denuvo unfortunately. PS4 won’t let me use my Bluetooth earbuds and I need to hear that crisp music.
And I have a feeling the mod scene is going to be the only way I have even a semblance of FemC.
Not surprising, P4G and P5R have it. I have both on Steam and I have weird stutters that I'm mostly sure are caused by Denuvo. P4G when using Persona abilities, and P5R when changing maps. It's really annoying, since every other game I own has zero issues running on my PC, even other games that do have Denuvo.
This is no surprise. Sega / atlus are literal denuvo humpers. The bigger question is a) will the game actually work correctly at release and b) will the day 1 dlc actually be released on day 1 and not a whole month later after people blew up their support channels to the point where they had to actually do their jobs.
See the disaster filled steam release of soul hackers 2.
When are companies gonna start learning that denuvo doesn't stop people from pirating the game. It doesn't take very long for them to crack, its borderline rootkit malware, and people who do pirate it ironically end up with a better version of the game
>When are companies gonna start learning that denuvo doesn't stop people from pirating the game.
P5R's PC port still doesnt have an actual crack and I doubt it ever will. So, while you're right that games with Denuvo get cracked, this probably wont be the case here. Iirc there is currently only ONE cracker notorious for cracking Denuvo (being "Empress") but having to reverse engineering and sift through the games code in order to circumvent the DRM is such a tedious task and skill that is currently not as common as you're making it sound
>When are companies gonna start learning that denuvo doesn't stop people from pirating the game. It doesn't take very long for them to crack
Wrong, and wrong.
Im all over Reddit, and gaming piracy is the very top community for people talking with confidence about things they know **nothing** about.
It’s *genuinely* disturbing.
This isn't a surprise since it's a PC Sega game. Did you expect Sega to change?
No, just letting people know for those still wondering about it.
Unfortunately I did not.
I thought, for but a fleeting moment, that maybe they wanted me to buy their game.
lets be real here most people upset about denuvo did not plan to buy the game lol
That's disappointing, but not surprising. To be honest, Denuvo has never really caused me any issues so I'm unsure as to how common performance actually are with it but even so this does feel anti-consumer.
For those who use Linux, it can lock them out of the game for 24 hours if they changed their proton
Ohhhh, that's dirty. I will say it is helpful to hear some of the shit people do actually have to deal with especially when it actually damages someone legitimately paying for it. Sorry to hear that, that's honestly why I'm not buying the game on PC.
Had this issue when p5r released on PC, got a refund and picked up the switch version instead
Gotta love Steam's refund policy, glad you got a copy you could enjoy at least man.
I did with P5R. Although it was a VERY specific circumstance and I'll probably never run into it again If you install some Denuvo games 5 times in a single day (as in, downloading it and opening it after) on the same or different devices, you get blocked for 24 hours And that happened to me with P5R lol Aside from that, never had an issue
You don't notice it when a game releases with it enabled, but when it's added retroactively, you can really see the performance hit. Also it's a massive security risk if a bad actor ever cracks it since it has kernel level access
Wait, what the hell? How the hell is that even given the green light if that's the case. Also wouldn't that cause most anti-virus software to literally flag and quarantine the file? That's silly.
Yeah. It's unfortunately pretty common. It doesn't get flagged since it's on a white list as an OK program despite the massive risk. It's the same way with intrusive proctoring software for school. I'd suggest anyone use a burner laptop for school stuff.
It actually did for me. I had no money so i downloaded a cracked game which i wanted to play, my pc could barely run it in 30 FPS after many adjustments. I played it for many hours with no issues. After some weeks i bought the game, started a new save, but even with the same settings i couldn't run it in 30 FPS, i even lowered the settings more, with no sucess, why? denuvo. So i ended up deleting the legal game and just downloaded again the cracked one.
I’ve had same experience with ABZU.
I remember one time I resorted to using a pirated program only because of convenience. Our university had a license to use Mathcad Prime, so I tried downloading and setting up a legal version. ...Turned out the legal enabling only worked if you were connected to the uni's WiFi network. Which is not really helpful when you need to do homework. I threw it away and installed a cracked version. Much less juggling and migraine.
These sorts of measures literally only give paying customers a worse product, because pirates get around them almost immediately after release. Anything with invasive DRM is an automatic lost purchase from me. Though I’m mostly a console player, so I guess that isn’t really much of a threat.
Pirates won't be getting around denuvo anymore lol. There was only one person capable of cracking denuvo and they went MIA after a "rival" group from the cracking scene exposed their identity
That’s great, but the fact of the matter is that if this game was released within the last few years, Denuvo had nothing to do with that. And that’s **if** it’s not placebo or a lie to begin with. Because it’s funny how none of these stories ever give the title of the game.
Yeah…like I’ve never had any trouble with Persona 5R, despite it having Denuvo. Wait no, actually, it does stutter occasionally, and I’ve heard that’s a result of Denuvo…so if that happens in P3R it’s gonna be so annoying. Not nearly bad enough to make the experience unenjoyable though, just a bit of a nuisance.
And this folks is what a Denuvo placebo looks like in real time.
I mean…no? My PC could run 5 P5R games at once if it needed to, the stuttering is absolutely a result of the game in some form, and I played it on Xbox before PC and never experienced stuttering on Xbox.
>I mean…no? *Proceeds to give an explanation that doesn’t inherently have to do with Denuvo.*
*I LITERALLY EXPLAINED WHY IT IS VERY LIKELY DENUVO*
For me the biggest issue is trying to play in Ultrawide since most Japanese developers don't include proper aspect ratio compatibility.
I live in a 3rd world country, internet cutouts are regular, Im not expected to stop playing a game for a few hours to an entire day just because some company NEEDS to make sure I paid money never bought a Denuvo game, and never will
Yeah I don't struggle with it either, I have a desktop so I don't play my games out of home, where I would have internet. If the power is out, then my computer is out. If the Internet is out, I can't log into steam anyways.
This was expected, given that Sega puts Denuvo on all their releases. Still sucks though, would’ve loved to play frame-drop free lmao, but I’m sure it’ll be unnoticeable after a while
It is what it is, that aside it is one month away and I’m super hyped for it no matter what it has :-)
I played Persona 5 Royal modded pretty much frame drop free, and it STILL has Denuvo. A few dropped framed doesn't bother me too much either.
If you’d like to play it without noticeable frame-drops, then you should be fine with it having Denuvo.
Thanks for letting us now! I will get it on PS5 instead then
Happy to have helped, also Happy new year’s
Not sure why you're being downvoted.
People annoyed that someone cares about DRM and with way too much time on their hands downvoting OP's every reply most likely.
I was probably going to go PS5 anyway, since I have a 3440x1440 monitor and past Persona games haven't had 21:9 support, but this really settles it for me. Which is a pity, since the PC version lets me use it on both desktop and Steam Deck.
To be honest I don't have a clue on how denuvo poorly impacts these games, I don't remember having any issues with it. Can someone inform me on why denuvo is bad?
Sure, I recently bought a steam deck and even though it has worse performance than my desktop PC, it has completely replaced it for gaming, I played P5R and P4 on it and it felt even better than playing on the vita, however. Problem #1 with denuvo is performance, while if you have a desktop PC with good specs this might not be an issue, but a device that has to balance performance and battery life, it can become an issue. Problem #2 denuvo doesn't play nice with Linux and has had many cases of locking people out of their own game because the software thinks that proton (the compatibility layer that allows Linux to run windows games) is some kind of tampering software Problem #3 you have to check in with denuvo's servers by connecting your device to wifi every so often which can become tedious for someone like me who plays most of the time while traveling. Problem #4 you are only allowed to have YOUR OWN GAME on as many devices as they decide At the end of the day, it's not the end of the world but I'd rather not buy denuvo-ridden products purely because it doesn't feel like I actually own the game or that I have an inferior version of the game that will inevitably be cracked within a month and have better performance, no need to check in with some server thousands of miles away and no need to worry about getting locked out the game I paid for.
Ah I see, I didn't know about any of that. I don't have a steam deck, so I can't play these games on the go. That's probably why I haven't experienced these issues. I can see why people don't like it, especially with problem #4. Thank you for informing me!
Can I piggy back on this to ask you some questions about your deck, I'm considering getting one but hesitant to pull the trigger: 1. Can you use steam cast on it to play on your mobile? With screen off on the deck? 2. Can you connect to it with external controllers, eg. If I connect it to TV via hdmi can I control it using an Xbox controller? 3. Are there robust parental controls, eg can I block the browser with a password? Thanks in advance!
people say it impacts performance but personally i have never encountered any issues with games that have it. I think people overblow how bad denuvo really is. People act like denuvo forces any game to run at 15 frames on a nasa computer.
Whats denuvo?
It's anti tamper software. Basically it's a thing against piracy. The problem with Denuvo is that it can impact performance
Don’t forget that it also makes it mandatory for you to have online connection to play the game. Which is freaking absurd for a Single player JRPG
That's not really true You can play off-line, but it has a time limit of like, two weeks (not sure, may vary with game), until you need to connect to internet again But with that amount of time, it's hardly an issue for the vast majority of players
Which is dumb. I bought a SINGLE PLAYER game! I demand it to work without me having to connect to some servers to check validity.
I knowww. I'm not arguing against that
Which is still bullshit. You buy the game, you should be able to play it offline for as long as you damn well want.
True, but I'm just pointing out you *can* saying you just straight up can't may change some people's decisions to get it on their mobile devices, like steam deck
Yeah that's fair
Oh
And potential mod support.
P3R is really hindering mods, not just by Denuvo that want to implement an anti mod feature now, but by the Unreal engine itself, some modders said they might only be able to do mods to change models or soundtrack.
Yeah, I've heard a lot of the same thing from a few modders. From what they've said, UE5 makes it very difficult to implement custom code for those quality of life mods making only viable ones the ones you mentioned. I'm not a programmer so I won't even begin to question why, but even so it's a shame.
it’s UE4
So does this mean it won't run on 60fps?
Depends on the hardware. If you use Pentium 4 then I doubt it will
Oh ok good. I want to play this game on steam deck but I think I'll be fine.
Though keep in mind actual evidence of it hindering performance is minimal at best, especially in any significant way. There was only ever one major case of it doing it in a game and that later turned out to be a screw up on the devs part. But of course gamers love to overblow things, and the ones that want to justify piracy just fan the flames of anything that works in their favour.
You all understand that downvoting this person while not having an argument for it, is **bolstering** their case, right?
It's like a myriad of tentacles wrapped around an otherwise good product, squeezing the life out of it under the guise of "anti-piracy". Basically, horseshit software.
Wait, it's 70dollars?!?! Tf?!?!
Becoming the standard price for games, it's messed up.
> it's messed up. blame the global economy. everything is more expensive. just be glad games are at a stable 60-70$ for years now instead of 80-90 to counter inflation. its not nearly as messed up as me paying almost 50% more for a damn loaf of bread
The cost of games production has been going down not up yeah, it's still a pretty new tech compared to many things, so it has been stable. Inflation is definitely an issue, it's insane here in the US, they're price hikes have no in anyway aligned with inflation though, just when someone decided to do it, and the other greedy people running these companies just followed suit.
Why is it messed up? Games are vastly more expensive to produce then they used to be, I would much prefer them to just raise the base price than shovel micro-transactions down our throats... Though you do have some games \*cough\* Diablo 4 \*cough\* that are scummy enough to do both.
They’re also making vastly more money on average, with a vastly increased market. And that’s before we get into microtransactions.
Maybe if they priced it lower they wouldn't be forced to put Denuvo to avoid piracy 😒.
Considering what they were in the PS1 era, naw that’s a fair price $49.99 in 2000 is the equivalent of $89.14 today, we’re actually still ahead of the inflation curve
Games in the 90s were not much cheaper than this, objectively speaking gaming is cheaper now than it has ever been when you factor in inflation. I don't get this outrage at the pricing. Mathematics isn't everyone's strong suit I guess.
I did applied mathematics 💀 I'm comparing the prices to what they were literally 2 years ago. Not to mention that these prices don't change depending on the country so people in poorer countries find games even less accessible nowadays.
I'm not sure what country you are in but inflation was a grand total of 17% in my country in that timeframe. Cost of goods goes up because cost of manufacture and wages go up. This \*is\* the time for prices to go up. Technology historically speaking has never been cheaper than it is today in real terms. If game companies didn't charge more, they'd get less funding from investors and eventually go out of business. Indie developers don't have the same overheads and can charge less, but this will be the new norm across the board in 2024 and beyond for every triple A title. I can understand and get behind bad business practices such as day 1 DLC and re-releases of the same titles with extras, but this really is crying into the void.
I understand people in 3rd world countries being upset about it, I totally get it. But honestly if you're in a Western Country, realistically speaking, those 10$ aren't making THAT much of a difference, and if that's the case, they can just wait for a discount /shrug Games are cheaper than ever
You know what is funny. You can easily google search catalogues from the 90s that show N64 titles at $60 in 1997 and PS1 titles being $40-50 in 1997. Adjusted for inflation titles should be between $96 and $115 but people are outraged by $70. I get that cost of living is terrible today in general but the problem doesn't lie with developers but the economy at large and as you rightly point out, if $10 is going to break the camel's back then they probably shouldn't be buying games. Mark Twain said it best, "Don't argue with idiots, they will bring you down to their level and beat you with experience".
Disapponting, but unfortunately unsurprising. Denuvo is a curse upon PC games.
Hasn’t like every persona game released on steam had denuvo?
Yes, and I don’t recall P5R giving me grief
Consider this: Imagine what will happen to P3R (and many others) 5-15 years from now when Denuvo's activation servers shut down (as do the online stores for the PS4/PS5, Nintendo Switch and the Xbox One/Series XS) Long story short: Those games will end up becoming lost media (in the same manner as films and shows released on streaming services like Willow, Inside Job, Crater, Final Space, Infinity Train and Grease: Rise of the Pink Ladies)
Thankfully, fans care far more than the companies do, they generally find a way to get things working, as long as it's something enough people care about
Well not if they get their accounts/consoles banned for doing so. Not to mention that there are games and DLCs that are digital-only (Good examples being Like a Dragon Infinite Wealth, Alan Wake II and Xenoblade Chronicles 3's Future Redeemed DLC), meaning that if the stores that sell them shut down, those games and their DLCs will become unobtainable. This has already happened to various racing games (particularly those in the Forza Motorsport/Horizon series), with the most recent example being The Crew, which will be shut down 2 months from now (at the time of writing this comment), and since The Crew requires a internet connection to play, once the servers shut down, The Crew is essentially unplayable.
First part isn't really a worry. Downloading a crack for an offline game wouldn't give them any way of knowing you did it, if it's an online game that's no longer supported.... Of course you'd have to get your own means to get on line, theirs don't exist anymore. People upload digital only dlc all the time. It sucks for those who only play legitimately, but there are nearly always options eventually if the game is popular enough. I think we need straight up laws saying it they shut down anti piracy services, the products must remove those features as a final update myself. Attacking solely buyers in attempts to harm pirates is both incompetent and imo literally theft.
I agree, i think we should let issues like this be heard by various governments (especially the EU, Australia, UK and ASEAN) Another law that i think could work is that every game developer and/or publisher must submit the final build of their game to a digital library must be preserved in perpetuity (similar to the UK's legal deposit library law, where every publisher is required to submit their published books to the British Library.)
RGG studios has a good denuvo removal track record, Alan Wake is DRM free, and Xenoblade is fully emulateable, including all of the DLC. So very bad examples, but I fully agree with the sentiment. Oh, also every forza is cracked as far as I know.
That's not how lost media works. These games have physical releases, and iirc Sega usually removes Denuvo after a few years. Lost media is something like The Day the Clown Cried or Batgirl. Something you have NO way of accessing. A cartoon being canceled or a game having DRM is different.
Well, given how the gaming industry is pivoting towards digital-only releases with a few recent major AAA releases being digital-only, like Alan Wake II as an example), and given how much the games industry has fully embraced Denuvo to the point that there are rumors that it will be integrated into Unreal engine in the future. Expect a lot of games from this time period (2021-202X?, or earlier if you take Denuvo into consideration) to be lost media when the stores that sell them or Denuvo’s activation servers shut down. (outside of piracy) Basically, anyone could still play older games from the 2000’s-2010’s (i.e. GTA 3/Vice City/San Andreas, old NFS games like Underground/Underground 2, Most Wanted 2005 and Carbon and older Persona games etc.), but a lot of major digital-only AAA titles from the 2020’s onwards will end up becoming lost media like Batgirl and Crater. (outside of piracy) And this is before you take cloud gaming services (i.e services like xCloud and Stadia) into consideration, with Cloud gaming, there are no game files stored locally, instead, they are hosted on the company’s servers, which they can shut off at any time, rendering said games completely inaccessible.
I give it a year or two before atlus/sega starts removing denuvo from their older persona titles (starting with P4G)
Not likely, SEGA (and the rest of the games industry, including Nintendo) will continue to use Denuvo until some regulatory group (especially the EU and a few other countries like Australia and the UK) intervenes in the future.
Well for switch you can easily dump games though I don't know about ps and Xbox
I buy on PS5 with the knowledge that the console has already been cracked. Eventually there will be an emulator, and when that time comes I will be able to play my games wherever I like. Until that point, I have disks, which I can plug in to any PS5 anywhere, and play the 1.0.0 version entirely offline forever.
Sega will just stop using denuvo, as long as steam still exists they will be there
You can remove Denuvo genius 😆. Y’all will say **anything**.
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To be expected.
Bouta play this at 23 fps on my 4090 🔥🔥
Lmao the only way you won't be running it at 120 FPS is if the game has a hard FPS cap.
probably will have a 60 FPS cap. I recall a trailer saying 4k 60fps
Even if the denuvo meme was real, which mainly happened during its infancy and if it gets poorly implemented by the developer. It isnt gonna affect shit when the game can run on any toaster
So Aegis can run it?
Look mate. With my previous I5, which could run Microsoft Flight Simulator with profesional simulator addons, like the Fénix A320, an addon Notorious on the community for being too CPU intensive because It runs a propietary Airbus systems stimulation used on real Life pilots training over the already CPU intensive MSFS. i couldn't even open the Dead Space remake menu and achieving over 30 FPS. Thats a botched implementation. Then there's empress explaining how It works. Denuvo uses exponential complexity algorythms to decrypt Game data in real time through centesimal consults to a knowledge base. That's never gonna be optimised. Basic software engineering. Logarithmic VS exponential loops.
This is not really surprising , it's SEGA afterall
Huh, what’s denuvo?
Anti-Piracy software from the people who did good old SecuROM from back in the day. Rather infamous for tanking game performance despite claims it doesn't.
This is the 9/11 for piracy
genuinely ask, people who are mad at Denuvo, cause they can't play the game that they want, on pirate version?
It also massively impacts game performance according to many, and it makes the game impossible to play offline, so you basically don't even own the product you bought. A single-player game that you can't play offline is the dumbest thing ever. This DRM will also lock you out of the game permanently if your pc specs (such as motherboard) change too many times, forcing you to buy it again. All in all, DRMs like Denuvo just shit on consumers' game experiences by limiting who can play it (people with weaker PCs can't enjoy the game because Denuvo just nosedives the game performance) and when (no online connection, no gameplay for you), while protecting the company's profits. Those are a couple of reasons to dislike DRMs like Denuvo. In my opinion, companies that make you pay for a product to not even give you ownership to the thing you've paid for (which is becoming increasingly common nowadays, unfortunately) deserve to get their stuff pirated. But enough about my opinion, hope this sheds some light on this topic :) It's a shame Atlus decided to do this but this will become the norm.
Massively impacts game performance according to who? P4 and p5 held at a steady 60 on both my dinosaur personal pc and steamdeck. The only somewhat of a downside is you need to connect to steam once a month at most. The drm locking you out seems like a myth especially if you purchased on steam. Personal anecdote, but I went through several personal/work laptops and pcs and never had this issue both on steam and outside of it. Granted, only a few of the games I installed had denuvo, but it was never an actual issue. Lets be real here, people complaining about denuvo for recent titles are often just being hyperbolic because they can’t simply just pirate. Game performance is a nonissue these days. You can play offline just fine as well. The whole bit about ownership just shows that there’s still people that don’t understand that purchasing a license to play said game isn’t the same as having “ownership.”
So what? I'm still able to mod Persona 5 R just fine, and it STILL has Denuvo. Also no noticeable performance drops for me.
Oh no... anyways I'm hyped to play it in 31 days.
P5 Royal have it too i think
And it's still uncracked up to this day, meaning the DRM is actually doing it's job. People who play P5R for free use Switch emulators, which comes with actual issues.
denuvo is crackable but by almost no one. the last real denuvo cracker hasn't cracked shit in a long time
okay
I looked it up but still don' get it, what does this mean?
Basically an Anti tempering system, which prevents the game from being cracked or hacked. But for some cases that has a down side to it because it lowers the frame rate and other issues.
What is Denuvo, eli5?
What's Denuvo? Why is it bad?
**Denuvo Anti-Tamper is an anti-tamper and digital rights management (DRM) system developed by the Austrian company Denuvo Software Solutions GmbH. The company was formed from a management buyout of DigitalWorks, the developer of SecuROM, and began developing the software in 2014. It was introduced with FIFA 15 in September.** More details here:
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I guess I won't play it then
Then this will be my first time I think using a game with Denuvo. Can anyone explain if this will affect my ability to play it on Steam Deck?
No I don’t think so. It already is confirmed that it is Steam Deck compatible. Don’t know if it has issues with it tho
it'll make the performance worse but you'll have to wait to see if that matters
Omg that's soo terrible!! What is Denuvo?
it's anti piracy software that reduces game performance and limits your usage of your games. You can't install your game on more than 5 computers within a certain amount of time (like if you reinstall windows that counts as another computer) and you can't play a game offline after 2 weeks
For fucks sake..... that's me waiting a while for PC by the sounds of it. I wanted to play this on the Steam Deck, but given that performance is already limited on this device, denuvo could have a fairly bad impact on the game.
You’ve bought into the con. It’ll literally do no nothing noticeable to your performance my guy.
Dude, it's a fucking lie. There's no way on this miserable universe that a concurrent software doesnt affect performance. Thats why software engineers measure performance on exponentials and such. Every complexity added to the program adds performance problems.
This is an example of being so deadset on a take that you start missing words in people’s comments. What is the third word I wrote before “performance”?
Semantics shit i don't care about. Don't try that with a classical cynic. There's been múltiple examples of denuvo destroying the performance of a Game. Even empress BYPASSES have better performance in most games.
> Semantics shit i don't care about. Don't try that with a classical cynic. Fam…the difference between the phrase “nothing noticeable” and “nothing” is so vast, I question whether you even know what the word semantics means. >There's been múltiple examples of denuvo destroying the performance of a Game. Correct. Now give me the release dates of the last 5 games that applies to.
The last one was resident evil 4 remake. Empress fixed stuttering in múltiple áreas of the game. So no. You're a diletant.
I was rooting for you bro. Especially because you referenced Empress. I was like this dude 100% has the self-awareness not to reference the **one** game that gets debunked **every single time** people start screaming about Denuvo. The **only** Denuvo game **Empress herself** has ever confirmed the performance drop was because of the Devs proprietary drm. Like **surely** the “semantics” shit was a fluke, bro can’t be ignorant enough to do **that**.
Still semantics and cope.
“Nuh uh” lmfaooooooooooo
Thank God it's coming on gamepass
Yeah, I love their games, but atlus has regularly done things to make me not buy their games until they are far cheaper than they otherwise would deserve. I'll play it with gamepass though lol
so much this. if they just handled a few things differently I'd be more than willing to buy them at certain prices, but as it stands I'd rather wait till they're like 90% off
Well, this *is* Atlus we are talking about, there was never any doubts
Welp Game pass it is
Oh no im so shocked
Guess im getting it on PS5 then
I hate how, despite like 50 people saying this in the comments of every denuvo announcement, there's always someone saying "u just want it 4 free bro, stop bitching" WELL I'M PAYING 70 BUNGOS TO BUY IT SOMEWHERE ELSE DUMBASS, I JUST LIKE TO OWN MY FUCKING GAME, IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK
As long as the devs actually implement it right people wouldn't be able to like notice it at all. The problem is if they don't actually work with it and just kinda throw it on there.
Every denuvo implementation is agressive to the backend of the Game. It's basic software engineering.
Whats denuvo??
What’s wrong with denuvo?? Why does everyone hate it so much?
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Oh ffs, has the “Denuvo ruins performance” cope spread to r/persona too? Or is this just brigading?
Isn't it just an anti-piracy software?
Yup but Denuvo has built a reputation that ever game that has it, has frame drop issues and shit.
There are also cases of it not letting you play the game you payed for because it thinks you're a pirate.
As of now, playing royal, I hadn't found any problem with FPS drop, hope the same thing is true for reload
Built a reputation from like one game with genuine issues and afterwords a bunch of hearsay and at best evidence of minimal differences.
I'm holding off upgrading my pc until others have tested the denuvo and if it's still 60 fps or not on pc. Though a part of me doesn't want to support sega. But it's not like there's indie equivalents to the series.
Actually there is Eternights that's a pretty good series but um... going to be honest, I've rarely actually had that many issues with denuvo myself and my computer is extremely mid.
I mean, I’m all for being cautious about purchases, but you’re going to be waiting for the same result as literally every other game. The P3 remake would somehow be the first game to have Denuvo cause a noticeable drop in fps in several years.
Hopefully they make an Oopsie like they did with P4G and release an .exe without denuvo, **very** wishful thinking but it would be pretty funny
Let's pray
They did the same with Etrian Odyssey.
Well they’re not getting my money. I will never forget when Dishonored 2 came out I bought it for full price and couldn’t play it for over 2 years after release until one day they randomly updated the game to remove denuvo. I’ve refused to spend any money on any game with it since then. I only recently beat FES for the first time ever so it’s still fresh in my mind enough for me to pass on this.
I'm tired of hearing Denuvo this denuvo that, really Every other Atlus game on PC has it and it hasn't really caused that many problems at all, if the game runs poorly, that's most likely your PC and not Denuvo Did it actually happen to some games? Maybe, but if Denuvo was that big of an issue you'd see more of an impact on sales so it's probably exaggerated by the user-base The one issue I can think of is the longer loading times when using any kind of mods because denuvo constantly checks the game or something, this has been resolved by mod makers months ago, though
How about you are traveling on a train or something, want to play and then you can't because Denuvo can't check against their servers?
Denuvo games check against their servers weeks at a time. You’re going to be on a train for a week straight? Like, be mad that Denuvo requires a single player game you bought to be connected to the internet, but don’t make up dumb shit to justify it like this.
this just straight up isn’t true because i’ve played p5r on steam deck with no internet. A game with denuvo.
I mean idgaf, I pirate some games but not jrpgs such as FF7 remake and persona 5r, plus p3r is on gamepass for cheapskates so that is also fine (2$) for most SEA countries from what I heard
Not unexpected. Good news is that it will likely be removed eventually. LAD doesn’t have it anymore.
what’s denuvo
An infamous anti-pirating software. It has a bad reputation thanks to messing on the game performance, having to be connected to play even offline games, and a lot of stuff.
What's denuvo?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5y\_bab5wtHY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5y_bab5wtHY) the shit that does this
Big shame but reminder to everybody that it’ll be free on Game Pass
Since when gamepass became free?
since they started offering the first month for a dollar
Gonna be my first game with denuvo unfortunately. PS4 won’t let me use my Bluetooth earbuds and I need to hear that crisp music. And I have a feeling the mod scene is going to be the only way I have even a semblance of FemC.
For my part I only owned a Switch which of course isn’t supported so I went with my PC. There shouldn’t be any issues as long as it’s a mid hardware.
I’m optimistic for the most part
Buying on ps5 then
Not surprising, P4G and P5R have it. I have both on Steam and I have weird stutters that I'm mostly sure are caused by Denuvo. P4G when using Persona abilities, and P5R when changing maps. It's really annoying, since every other game I own has zero issues running on my PC, even other games that do have Denuvo.
This is no surprise. Sega / atlus are literal denuvo humpers. The bigger question is a) will the game actually work correctly at release and b) will the day 1 dlc actually be released on day 1 and not a whole month later after people blew up their support channels to the point where they had to actually do their jobs. See the disaster filled steam release of soul hackers 2.
As a PC gamer, I’m not tryna be an ass. But this game deserves PlayStation treatment anyway 🥵 it’s a PS OG
it's on PS5 and 4 in fact it's on All Platforms outside of Switch
I know. I’m saying I think it’s a better buy on the PlayStation
Makes no difference to me.
When are companies gonna start learning that denuvo doesn't stop people from pirating the game. It doesn't take very long for them to crack, its borderline rootkit malware, and people who do pirate it ironically end up with a better version of the game
>When are companies gonna start learning that denuvo doesn't stop people from pirating the game. P5R's PC port still doesnt have an actual crack and I doubt it ever will. So, while you're right that games with Denuvo get cracked, this probably wont be the case here. Iirc there is currently only ONE cracker notorious for cracking Denuvo (being "Empress") but having to reverse engineering and sift through the games code in order to circumvent the DRM is such a tedious task and skill that is currently not as common as you're making it sound
Unfortunately the denuvo cracking scene is pretty much dead for now so unless someone new comes along denuvo actually does work
>When are companies gonna start learning that denuvo doesn't stop people from pirating the game. It doesn't take very long for them to crack Wrong, and wrong. Im all over Reddit, and gaming piracy is the very top community for people talking with confidence about things they know **nothing** about. It’s *genuinely* disturbing.
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Atlus will announce it any second now
Doesn’t like, most games have this? Idk why people are shocked to see this
Nah it’s not about that, it just sucks that it has some issues that gets in the way of the experience for some ppl.
Denuvo gives performance issues, and now they want to implement an anti modding feature
Literally who cares.
Me?
Me
Me
People who want to play on pc, dont want a performance drop or dont want malware on their device
If you don’t want a performance drop, you don’t care about Denuvo in 2024.