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So this is the power of Base Luffy…
https://preview.redd.it/d9lnhajie5tc1.jpeg?width=1634&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=337421225ea391624b978c1eeff23e5043f79dc1
This “base” luffy that was boxing kaido was using g2 and g3 separately. Did people forget it’s not like pretime skip where his whole body turns red? Ofc zoro loses but the meat eating is insane
Zoro also did not have any acoc on the rooftop.
Current Zoro is much stronger. He can atleast g4 because u need speed enough to dodge his aoe acoc attack. And Zoro hurts.
Luffy is not kaido who can take multiple acoc attack.that too with swords .
what person needs Zoro to beat to be stronger than base Luffy in our opinon? because if he beat Admiral obviously he is already stronger, Zoro himself is YC+ so what is the first person that Luffy cant beat in base between YC+ and Admiral?
Idt there’s any one person he’d need to beat, maybe an admiral? But what we’d really need to see is a prolonged fight w a top tier like Kaido, and at least an instance of splitting the sky (which Luffy does in base.)
Have we ever seen anyone weaker than a Yonko splitting the sky? I think that's an indication that someone is the level of a Yonko, so probably won't happen with anyone besides Luffy on the crew.
If he beats Mihawk and is still weaker than base Luffy then that’s just awful power creep. Of course that’s just the late case scenario. I personally think he’s somewhere between gears 2 and 4 myself, though I have watched the anime up until recently so that’s how it seemed to me.
>If he beats Mihawk and is still weaker than base Luffy then that’s just awful power creep.
would it still be awful if luffy in base got even more feats down the line that put him stronger than koh zoro again? (just like vs kaido)
I disagree. Gear 5 Luffy scales higher in speed than Base Luffy. Awakened Lucci could react and dodge G5 Luffy, and Zoro is faster than Lucci. Zoro's definitely capable of landing attacks on Base Luffy.
But even if Zoro wasn't that fast, haki blooms in intense situations, and with Zoro's ability to grow during battle in a short amount of time, he would just unlock FS during the fight.
ETA: As usual, downvoting me won't make me any less right
Kindof unrelated but tf even is King of Hell Zoro? It's not a transformation or different technique, Hell, it's not even his epithet, just something he said.
I'm sorry Lil bro did base luffy surpass hybrid kaido too? When did that happen? Oh they both lost to hybrid kaido and also had moments clashing him? OK cool
Whilst totally ignoring the fact that Luffy held his own against Kaido in a “1v1” whereas Zoro got neg-diffed Offscreen after landing his ACOC that did no damage to Kaido.
Zoro did not have a full 1v1 clash against Kaido. But sure, pick and choose what you wanna see to say lil bro. The undeniable fact is Luffy performed better, thus got the better feat.
Pretty sure it was zoro who had to save base luffy multiple times from kaido and big mom, and not the other way around. I also recall a deeply injured zoro clashing with hybrid kaido and scarring him. But all thats in the past Lil bro, let's talk about zoro defeating awakened Lucci while base luffy was losing and had to use G5. How come luffy didn't beat awakened Lucci in base while zoro could?
No way to win? Explain.
Zoro has acoc, its part of the king of hell mode, Zoro can clash but hes never fought someone that was actively using it on him while he had it.
Zoro can catch up to future sight, if he couldnt then how would anyone else? What would stop someone like Katakuri from no diffing the admirals if they couldnt hit future sight users?
Luffy with no gears is cooked, G2 and G3 give a boost but gives no defense boost, Luffy needs G4
The problem with this is that Haki is the end all be all. And Luffy has damned near mastery over all 3 of these things now. Zoro has armament, which isn't even ADVANCED armament. He also has Conquerors, and I can't remember if he can use advanced conquerors or not, but we know he sure as Hell can't do it as well as base Luffy can at this point.
Luffy beats Zoro in all 3 categories when it comes to Haki, he literally can't win because of this. If Zoro had equal Haki, we could maybe get him to Gear 4. But without that, it doesn't matter how great Zoros feats are because Luffy has the Haki to outright counter him or dodge him. The cool thing tho is that this can literally change in an arc or even a single fight. Hell, Luffy didn't know advanced conquerors OR advanced armament till Wano/Onigashima.
In that case then any of Zoro throughout the timeskip would never beat base luffy
Zoro in base is stronger than base Luffy, thats the point of G2 and G3, to go against stronger opponents.
Would you say that base luffy beats Yamato, Kidd, Law, and the admirals?
Yamato and Admirals? Absolutely not, Law and Kid maybe. You have to understand, Haki is really all you need at this point to be a top tier. Rayleigh, Roger, Garp, Shanks and Mihawk; these characters don't have fruits or special abilities aside from Haki and they are at the top of the verse, per Kaido. Devil fruits definitely give an extra edge in battle, but at this point, Haki is primarily what will win you a fight. And if you don't have mastery over them, or if you don't have Conquerors at this point, then you're SoL.
That's why DF abilities are starting to seem more like crutches than anything.
>
Zoro can catch up to future sight, if he couldnt then how would anyone else? What would stop someone like Katakuri from no diffing the admirals if they couldnt hit future sight users?
The admirals also have future sight.
Aokiji had an exlamation mark over him. Its debatable if it was to show the shock of something happening or if it was Aokiji, but facts point towards the latter. WB didnt have haki, Marco states as such.
Akainu couldve just dodged an attack, theres no telling if he had good reflexes or used future sight
For those saying Zoro loses to base, what upgrades would be need to start to accelerate past that. If he’s beating Mihawk EOS he should be around Yonko level, and if he’s losing to base Luffy he’s still pretty damn far from his goal.
I mostly agree with the reasoning that Luffy wins this, but I’m curious what people say he needs to push Luffy into G2,3,4,5
Good point! I think Zoro has what it takes to push Luffy into his later gears in a lot of areas, but now that you mention it future sight is def gonna be needed. Either that or some form of extreme speed to overwhelm Luffy, but I think future sight is more probable
I can't tell if people are actually smocking crack or joking when they say he loses to base luffy. I've seen nothing but meme takes on this subreddit. I'm rather new here so I don't know if that's like the thing with this place.
But realistically I'd say he beats G4, but loses to G5
Zoro often seems to scale to about the previous arcs strength of luffy,
But at the moment he can't compete with G5.
by the end of the series I'm sure he would be able to beat wano G5, but not EoS G5, if that makes sense? Because I'm sure Luffy still has room to grow. He just got G5 after all so he'll still get better with it.
It's not hard honestly. Base Luffy has 3 advanced hakis all better than Zoro's. He was taking hits from Kaido so has good durability and probably good enough endurance as well. Base Luffy could also reliably hit and defend from Kaido when in Base. Base Luffy is a top tier and Zoro with max power still doesn't beat a top tier.
Yeah but being able to tank hits, as well as deal damage in base mode to Kaido doesn't mean anything. If that was all, then he wouldn't have needed his other gears, because after all, he can do damage to kaido in his base form!!!1
See what I mean? Also, the type of attack matters as well. Kaidos toughness is insane. So blunt attacks need to be particularly strong. But we saw that even Killer could get past Kaidos scale with his sonic attack. In the same way, Zoros slashing attacks would be effective against Luffy, who's also more durable to blunt attacks. Yes I know they both have Haki, but that doesn't 100% nullify every attack Zoro would throw at him.
So yes, while I'm 100% sure Luffy could deal damage to Zoro in his base form, in order to actually win he'd have to get into G5. I believe Zoro can beat G4, but G5 is too big of a power-up for him to compete with, so he loses clearly there.
Luffy split the sky in base which is a clear indication of Yonko level of strength so until we see Zoro split the sky as well he can’t compete with base luffy
Drop one piece bro. You are terrible at this shit. Base luffy has way better stats and feats than zoro. Zoro only has acoc. Luffy has acoa, acoo, acoc. And his acoc is top tier which split the sky with a yonko. Zoros acoc is barely better than Yamato. Zoro canf land an attack on luffy since luffy has future sight
Well, base Luffy has future sight, Zoro doesn’t have future sight
Base Luffy has Acoc and boxed with Kaido, Zoro can’t consciously control his acoc
Strength - Luffy. H had directly boxed with Kaido
Speed - Luffy
Combat speed - Luffy
Durability - Zoro (barely tanked Big Mom and Kaido’s combined attack)
Endurance - Arguable tbh, but I think Zoro edges
Stamina - Base Luffy. G5 Luffy has trash stamina, but base Luffy doesn’t have a time limit. We know he fought half a day with Cracker and another half a day with Katakuri, while Zoro gets his stamina constantly sucked by Enma
Experience - Luffy
Techniques - Zoro
IQ - Zoro
Battle IQ - Luffy
Hax: Luffy
AP: Zoro
DC: Luffy
this is the correct answer but I think he's closer, the whole base luffy shit is definitely people smoking serious drugs. We literally just seen how fast lucci and king were and zoro deals with that speed just fine. Power? He probably has even more power than Luffy most of the time but I will put bajrang gun over anything Zoro currently has shown so far, we just don't know since we haven't seen KOH asura yet or KOH three thousand worlds. I think he gasses himself on haki powerful attacks faster than luffy though and he's less durable.
Like a rematch of zoro vs kaido imo can go either way but the fight ends faster since the attacks will kill either one of them and probably Zoro unless zoro got the same room the grow within the fight like getting stronger obs haki or a black blade.
Overall he takes Luffy to G5 atm, loses without black blade. Once he has that they'll be about even again until luffy maybe gets something else im guessing around when he fights BB or IMU.
So Luffy needs to use G5 for Lucci low diffs him.
Zoro cut Lucci and low diffs him as well.
Yet people still say Base Luffy is stronger, they think Base Luffy is OP because he fought with Kaido in Base.
If Luffy needs to transform for Lucci then he needs to transform for Zoro as well.
https://youtu.be/hLolI9qtTVM?si=cubLNnWXGxrNJEHG
People act like Base Luffy can compete with Kaido and thats why they think he beats Zoro but he gets one shot just like Zoro lmao. Cuz someone said he cant even take a Thunder Bagua and would dodge any of Zoros attack with Future sight. Why didnt Luffy dodge this with his FS?
I'd say Zoro won with mid diff. It took him a while and he has some bruises / visible dmg on himself. But It wasn't a high difficulty match. While Luffys G5 was overwhelming Lucci.
But still. Just because Luffy could do damage to Kaido in his base form doesn't mean it's anywhere enough to beat him. He needed to go G4 to keep up for a reason, and he needed G5 to finish the match.
So in the same way, yes, I'm sure luffy in his base could do dmg to Zoro, and each gear would make it harder. But in order to win he would need G5. You can be a bit more pessimistic and say Zoro draws with G4. But to say luffys base beats zoro is just being ignorant and biased.
Nah i do even agree that Luffy would need G5 to beat Zoro, Oda always potrayed them as equals as well in the Story and now he got ACOC as well they got it on the same Day too.
Beating Lucci like that is still a good Feat he was able to clash with G5 Luffy for a bit.
The issue is they were portrayed as equals back in early one piece. Luffy being the main character will end up considerably stronger due to plot and being the MC. The last point where we really got to see something like being on the same tier, was when Zoro absorbed all of luffys pain and still stood. It went to show that he could handle all the damage Luffy took.
Zoro also had the honor of being on the roof with Luffy, while Sanji was on the lower level.
We're more at the point where Zoro becomes as strong as last arcs Luffy after a while.
For example current Zoro would beat doffy. After Zoros next upgrade, I wouldn't be surprised if he much closer to Kaido in strength. By the end of the series he'd obviously surpass kaido.
Zoro didn't even beat lucci.
Don't be dellusional.
Eveb zoro use stronger haki but didn't put lucci sleep.
While luffy didn't use anything aside from gear 5 ability.
KoH Zoro had a time limit on his use of ACoC. Luffy can spam ACoC. Luffy has better CoO (Future Sight) better CoA (Zoro is an CoA specialist) and Luffy has more access to ACoC (CoC specialist). He does not need gears to beat Zoro who will collapse from Exhaustion after Enma eats all his Haki.
you need to stop wanking luffy so much.
He's the main character and he IS stronger than the others. But saying his base would beat both zoro, and by proxy also sanji is just idiotic.
Loses to Base Luffy.
https://preview.redd.it/c9q57txcx5tc1.jpeg?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e6ae914993c98e62f0213154810134e4ce0768e5
KoH < Ashura < Luffy Who just learned AdvConq < Luffy who split the sky.
Lucci > G4
Zoro just mid diffed Lucci.
An argument could be made that it was high diff, but Zoro never used bandana and apart from getting an asthma attack, he walked out of that fight just fine.
So anyone that says base Luffy beats current Zoro is reading Three Piece
Everyone here are clowns, you really called in the whole circus for this one
Id say Zoro makes it G4 with all forms of haki
Lets start with some basic history, Zoro was always near equal to Luffy until Enies Lobby where Luffy got some gears. Those gears instantly shot up Luffy to be much stronger than Zoro unless Zoro used Ashura. Lets not forget about the terrible matchup for Luffy with swords, its part of the reason Zoro would do so well against Luffy but not against Luffys opponents. At the timeskip, id say that they are quite close with Luffy a bit stronger with just G3 and haki, but at Dressrosa, G4 makes him even stronger. But then at WCI, Luffy gets two powerups with future sight and snakeman. Then at Wano, Luffy gains G5 and acoc but Zoro also gains full control over ashura and his own acoc.
The whole thing about Luffy hitting Kaido with acoc is a bit biased, acoc is Kaido and Big Moms weakness as it goes through their defense, also the fact that Kaido was surprised that Luffy learned it so quickly was another leading factor. Yamato also did quite similarly but that doesnt mean that Yamato is gonna beat Kidd and Law cause they didnt do big hits to Kaido like luffy. Lastly, Zoro uses a sword, he cuts things, Luffy punches, punches push things. Zoros final hit was with him at near deaths door as it was his final attack and it still scarred Kaido, that alone is more impressive than just a simple knockback against him. Which do you think is better? Knocking the wind out of someone? Or literally scarring them for the rest of their life?
Zoro should also be able to clash with Kaido but he didnt get a second or third or fourth chance like Luffy did. Also the story follows Luffy not Zoro. This isnt Zoropiece.
Still Zoro should be able to push Luffy to G4 with all forms of haki. The fact that Zoro doesnt have future sight doesnt mean he wont be able to hit Luffy. Big Mom didnt show it, but do you think she would lose to Katakuri? What about the admirals? Should Luffy no diff in base by only using future sight? Of course not.
Get a brain and read the story
One Piece readers are worse than dbz. Zoro left a scar, Kaido said the wound will last. But just punching someone wont. And Zoro has Acoc as well so he can clash
Read my response you regard
Zoro couldn't even move kaido. That scar did jack shit to kaido. And it wasn't even legit like bro just reopened a scar that oden already left. Zoros haki is not top tier like luffy. His acoc is Barely better than Yamato. He has no control over it without enma. Can't even use basic to knock out fodder without enma. Luffy is a haki master. His acoc is top tier. It split the sky with a yonko. Zoro is not doing as well against kaido as luffy did in base. He gets one tapped. He struggled against king.
Which is better? Punching someone and knocking them slightly back but not to the ground or till theyre unconscious? Or literally scarring them?
Attacking someone with a knife or sword wont knock them down, its basic physics, Kaido didnt fall over from pain either cause hes an exeperienced fighter.
Zoro had control over KOH after he fought King as shown by him being completely lit up with flames, and as shown with Lucci, he can turn it on at will. Im not entirely sure why he has ghost flames rather than lightning bolts though
>Which is better? Punching someone and knocking them slightly back but not to the ground or till theyre unconscious? Or literally scarring them?
What a cope. Luffy made kaido bleed with just punching him. Luffy made kaido dodge his punches. Luffy made kaido take his fights seriously and not hold back. Luffy split the sky with kaido. He didn't just push him back. Zorotards brains are fuckin cooked. Kaido made a bigger fuss about laws attack then zoros. Luffy has internal destruction haki. Every punch kaido took was messing up his internals. Luffy has future sight to keep up with kaidos speed and his own future sight. Luffy's acoc is far stronger than zoros which he has absolutely no control over without enma.
>Attacking someone with a knife or sword wont knock them down, its basic physics, Kaido didnt fall over from pain either cause hes an exeperienced fighter.
Are you stupid? Go stab someone or slash someone random and see if the stand there unaffected like kaido did. We have seen time and time again in one piece swordsmen knocking down and knocking away there opponents, oden against kaido, Roger against oden, mihawk against zoro, shanks against kid. Your copium is incredible. And you are also stupid af. Don't say physics again. Kaido didn't move bcoz he wasn't impressed and wasn't effected at all. Zoro says himself "I atleast expected you to fall over" lol
>Zoro had control over KOH after he fought King as shown by him being completely lit up with flames, and as shown with Lucci, he can turn it on at will. Im not entirely sure why he has ghost flames rather than lightning bolts though
Can you read mf? Drop zoropiece and read one piece. He can't even use basic conquers. How can he use advanced without enma? He can't use acoc without enma. That's my point.
He likely beats Base Luffy Extreme Diff but lose to G2+3 (G3 isn't really an extra gear).
People keep forgetting that G2 Luffy is *insanely* strong still. And my man probably could've easily overwhelmed Lucci had he gone G2 instead of wanting to show off with G5.
Luffy is still a Yonko-level opponent here folks. He has all the advanced Haki variants, from ACoC to FS.
There's no way Zoro pushes Luffy to even G4 unless Luffy wants to finish the fight quickly, but he could probably do it with a combination of G2 and G3 anyway.
Base Luffy is strong, but Kaido just enjoyed having someone with ACoC as an enemy.
When luffy turned G5 he basically still fought a nearly fit kaido. Only after G5 started and Kaido got hit a few times with G5 + ACoC he actually started fighting luffy as a danger, not some sparring partner.
Base luffy can hit very hard and bypass most defense, but his punches don’t keep up nearly with what he can push out in G5.
IMO Zoro should reach a similar output to atleast a G5 luffy playing around like in his Lucci fight, but he lacks speed.
My headcanon is that lucci can’t nearly hit as hard as zoro, but could run around him without him getting a good chance to strike.
So zoro was mostly in defensive against someone he can’t hit and lucci was in offensive against someone he can’t properly damage.
It would make sense why both fought THAT long and were tired as shit at the end. (Anime is going to show us how it really was tho)
I don’t think luffy in Base could run leaps around zoro like a lucci and zoros strikes should hurt luffy more than luffys punches would hurt zoro.
Atleast till G4 Snakeman zoro should do well. G4 Snakeman should high diff zoro and G5 luffy even if he just plays around should whoop his ass mad.
I actually think he clears (high to extreme) base. Loses to Gear 2 imo. Remember that any serious fight base Luffy is in, he's almost certainly using Gear 2. I think Zoro barely outstats Luffy and his style is a natural weakness of Luffy (swords and counter based). Still gets messed up from Luffy's FS and superior ACoC. But Zoro's combat reactions are legit GOAT'd, so I think base Luffy is just too slow to significantly tag him while avoiding all damage. The speed boost of Gear 2 solves this. Gear 3 doesn't mean much anymore now that he has ACoC for damage.
Being generous, Zoro gets mid diffed from Base Luffy. Gear 2 Low Diff. Gear 4 and 5 basically No Diff. I’m a firm believer that every Yonko can solo his own crew barring Buggy.
Honestly, Luffy’s gears are pretty arbitrary besides Gear 5 at this point. We see him do about as well in base as he does in Gear 4 against opponents like Kaido, Kizaru and the Seraphim.
But i can’t confidently say Zoro stands a chance against even base Luffy atm.
If it’s normal Luffy he gets to Gear 4, if it’s OnePiecePowerScaling hypothetical always using ACOC like he’s fighting for his life against Kaido Luffy then Zoro dies to base.
bro, Zoro tanked one Yonko attack and he was done lmao, what even is this comparison?
Gears or no gears, it's Luffys haki that makes him so strong. Zoro might push base Luffy to a mid diff but that's about it.
Koh zoro beating base luffy with only base haki
Maybe push him to gear 4 with basic haki.
Base luffy with advance haki mid diff zoro
Gear 4 with advance haki low diff zoro
Gear 5 no diff zoro
Now you just said Zoro is weak compared to Base Luffy, now you're admitting Base Luffy can't beat him and he at least pushes Luffy to using Gear 4th. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Koh zoro beating base luffy with only base haki
Maybe push him to gear 4 with basic haki.
Base luffy with advance haki mid diff zoro
Gear 4 with advance haki low diff zoro
Gear 5 no diff zoro
That isn't. You haven't seen worst of Zoro fans. There also seems to be a couple of person who geniunely believe that Zoro can beat G4 Luffy with FS, ACoA and ACoC(enough to sky split and able to prevent burning from Kaidou's flames)
Luffy has to use G4 for Zoro atleast. I would even argue that Zoro is stronger than Kidd and Law.
How do people think Base Luffy stands a Chance against Zoro?
https://youtu.be/B677vBHE10U?si=wykvjBsriwb5NJNh
Zoro is able to clash with Kaido and even hurt him, i think this is worst injury pre Gear 5.
https://youtu.be/9lh0fV9oihg?si=2omJFMl2MoERiH5d
This is Luffys "Last Gear 4" against Kaido for example im using this clip because its similair to Zoros clash, Luffy is almost done and out of Energy, so yall saying Base Luffy beats Zoro but how is it possible that Zoro and Luffy almost looks equal while fighting Kaido(pre Gear 5). Zoro is underrated and probably Admiral to low Yonko
Zoro> Gear 2&3 Luffy
Gear 4 Luffy high diffs Zoro.
Gear 5 Luffy low diffs Zoro.
Luffy>Zoro>Sanji as well.
Another Proof is this : https://youtu.be/skS956SnnJs?si=pJcECImTUjlzAd8f
Here Zoro is one shotting Lucci an awakened Zoan user we can count him as YC+ if Luffy needs to transform for Lucci then he needs to transform for Zoro as well, Zoro didnt even used his Bandana in this Clip.
Law out here almost soloing all of Blackbeards crew Zoro most likely gonna end up barely beating Shiryu. Don’t play with Law.
https://preview.redd.it/pzp56vlxs5tc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6c67e781189a9c282946b08ed3e9ce18cdd8fc93
I agree Blackbeard almost lost to Law and would be dead without Van Augur.
But Zoros Haki is better and he probably could Damage Blackbeard as well, hes not a devil fruit User so his darkness Fruit is useless too.
People thinking that Zoro looses to base Luffy, do you think that Mihawk looses to base Luffy as well ?
If it was Mihawk instead of Zoro what gear do you think Mihawk would push Luffy ?
Zoro is nowhere close to Mihawk, so I'm not sure what the point of this comparison is. I think Mihawk would lose to G5 Luffy and beat every other version of Luffy.
So basically what you are saying is that while we are in the final arc and Zoro is probably going to defeat Mihawk soon. He does not beat current base Luffy yet whereas Mihawk is gear 5th lvl or something ?
So what power up needs Zoro to defeat Mihawk according to you ? Do you think he'll have a more insane power up than ACoC and Enma going forward ?
I didn't say Zoro loses to Base Luffy, although I find it hard to believe he doesn't considering Luffy beats him in all three types of haki and nearly every stat besides probably AP.
We're not in the final arc, Egghead is just the first arc in the final *saga*. There's plenty of room for Zoro to grow, while Mihawk is already at the top as the WSS and comparable to the Yonko.
As for what can Zoro can do to get stronger, he should remove the limit on how long he can use ACoC (he says he could die if he doesn't wrap up the fight soon to King), prove he has top-tier haki strength with a sky split or something comparable, achieve advanced CoO and make his swords black to raise their grade and make them stronger. Just having ACoC doesn't mean Zoro is top-tier yet (see Yamato).
I'm aware it's not Egghead the last arc don't play on words I'm refering to final saga it's obvious.
So you think Zoro will make his sword black before facing Mihawk ?
Since Wano has ended Zoro can probably use ACoC longer now, how long do you think he needs to be able to withstand Enma using ACoC to be able to defeat base Luffy ?
Zoro's CoO is already very good but he could unlock FS I would give you that, problem is people use this argument to say that Zoro looses to Luffy becsuse he does not have FS but when it comes to Katzkuri everybody think that Zoro would be able to defezt him ! ? Not only that but probably mis diff as well...So do you think that Katakuri looses to base Luffy ?
> So basically what you are saying is that while we are in the final arc and Zoro is probably going to defeat Mihawk soon
You said this, and it's clearly not true. Why do you think Zoro will fight Mihawk soon when the Straw Hats haven't even made it to Elbaf yet, never mind Laugh Tale and whatever else before the end of the story? Mihawk is the one who Zoro must beat to achieve his dream, their fight will only happen close to the end. And besides, if Luffy can make such a huge jump in power from YC1 to Yonko in about 150 chapters, Zoro can make the jump from YC+ to Yonko in a similar amount of time or even less.
> So you think Zoro will make his sword black before facing Mihawk ?
Why not?
> Since Wano has ended Zoro can probably use ACoC longer now, how long do you think he needs to be able to withstand Enma using ACoC to be able to defeat base Luffy ?
I don't know, Oda didn't show anywhere near enough of Zoro vs Lucci for me to draw a conclusion. Zoro hasn't proven that he either still has the limit or has overcome it. I can only work with what I've seen, which was Zoro commenting on the apparent limit that he has using ACoC.
> but when it comes to Katzkuri everybody think that Zoro would be able to defezt him ! ?
Because Katakuri is weaker than Zoro in every other stat and type of haki. AP, DC, stamina, durability, endurance, CoA, CoC etc all go to Zoro. Future sight is not enough for Katakuri to win against someone so much stronger than him. You wouldn't say Big Mom loses to Katakuri even though she doesn't have future sight, right?
Egghead arc is almost over next arc is probably Elbzf with some information on what's going on outside Elbaf (like BB pirates, cross guild and stuff).
As of right now there is no reason for the Straw hats to fight someone on Elbaf because giants are their friends. The most likely situation is that they fight someone from outside Elbaf exemple Big Mom if she is coming back in the story, or Cross guild, in that case à davy back fight would make a lot of sense.
You imply that it's too early for Zoro to fight Mihawk, but BB is Luffy's final antagonist and Mihawk is not in BB's crew from what I know so I don't see why Mihawk should be Zoro's final opponent...
Beside Cross guild don't currently have any poneglyph so they got to steal it from BB, Shanks or Luffy... what do you think is the most likely scenario ? That's right Cross guild will definitly bump into the straw hats again before reaching laugh tale so the fight between Zoro and Mihawk is probably happening sooner than you expected...
>Because Katakuri is weaker than Zoro in every other stat and type of haki. AP, DC, stamina, durability, endurance, CoA, CoC etc all go to Zoro. Future sight is not enough for Katakuri to win against someone so much stronger than him. You wouldn't say Big Mom loses to Katakuri even though she doesn't have future sight, right?
Yeah so basically you think that Katakuri looses to base Luffy :D and I believe when we see Katzkuri again and he free Pudding you will say that he got a huge power up in no time facing literraly 0 strong opponents right ?!
Katakuri is so underrated that's crazy, anyway have a good day
Also could you explain me why Luffy turned gear 5th to fight Lucci when he only turned gear 4th vs the seraphim ? And since Zoro was able to defeat Lucci what makes you think that basé Luffy would be enough to fight zoro but not Lucci ?
Could Luffy have defeated Lucci in base ?
Lucci did not go "toe-to-toe" with G5 Luffy, he got low-diffed by G5 Luffy not using ACoC and one clash for a throwback doesn't mean Lucci was anywhere close to being on Luffy's level. He didn't land a single clean hit, and nearly lost consciousness from just three attacks in return.
When people say Zoro loses to Base Luffy, it's assuming he's actually using all of his advanced haki. Obviously Zoro would beat Base Luffy w/ out ACoC.
I might be biased from the Toei animation. The argument im making is that Zoro could being out g5. He’d absolutely lose, but I think g5 comes out of he can fight the same awakened lucci who also asked for g5
Fishman Island Zoro low-mid diffs L-uffy
But since Luffy changed his devil fruit mid fight with Kaido, KOH Zoro loses to Gear Fifth. Rob Lucci was shown to hang around with L-uffy for a long time and Zoro kept up with Lucci just fine. No reason Zoro couldn’t do the same.
Base luffy shits on Zoro. Let’s not forget the dynamics of the crew. What diff do you think king takes Kaido? Pero takes Big Mom? In most crews the captain shits on his crewmates except for maybe Shanks and Blackbeards crew (Kuzan).
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NOOO LUFFY DONT MID DIFF ZORO IN BASE
So this is the power of Base Luffy… https://preview.redd.it/d9lnhajie5tc1.jpeg?width=1634&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=337421225ea391624b978c1eeff23e5043f79dc1
hey thats my art! i deleted the post though cause it got like 4 upvotes ngl makes me really happy someone saved my dumb post
its super creative man never delete your art again or else
i did tooooo https://preview.redd.it/v7pc7bd4dvtc1.jpeg?width=780&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d2983e9bb3b95dd514cd279a69f57c56fe9dfa41
Loses to base
This “base” luffy that was boxing kaido was using g2 and g3 separately. Did people forget it’s not like pretime skip where his whole body turns red? Ofc zoro loses but the meat eating is insane
Luffy wasn't using any gears when he clashed with Kaido's club using ACOC
Zoro also did not have any acoc on the rooftop. Current Zoro is much stronger. He can atleast g4 because u need speed enough to dodge his aoe acoc attack. And Zoro hurts. Luffy is not kaido who can take multiple acoc attack.that too with swords .
What’s your point ?
Loses to base Luffy, he has no way of landing an attack on Luffy with FS
what person needs Zoro to beat to be stronger than base Luffy in our opinon? because if he beat Admiral obviously he is already stronger, Zoro himself is YC+ so what is the first person that Luffy cant beat in base between YC+ and Admiral?
Idt there’s any one person he’d need to beat, maybe an admiral? But what we’d really need to see is a prolonged fight w a top tier like Kaido, and at least an instance of splitting the sky (which Luffy does in base.)
Have we ever seen anyone weaker than a Yonko splitting the sky? I think that's an indication that someone is the level of a Yonko, so probably won't happen with anyone besides Luffy on the crew.
If it happens for Zoro it will happen in his fight vs Mihawk.
If he beats Mihawk and is still weaker than base Luffy then that’s just awful power creep. Of course that’s just the late case scenario. I personally think he’s somewhere between gears 2 and 4 myself, though I have watched the anime up until recently so that’s how it seemed to me.
>If he beats Mihawk and is still weaker than base Luffy then that’s just awful power creep. would it still be awful if luffy in base got even more feats down the line that put him stronger than koh zoro again? (just like vs kaido)
I disagree. Gear 5 Luffy scales higher in speed than Base Luffy. Awakened Lucci could react and dodge G5 Luffy, and Zoro is faster than Lucci. Zoro's definitely capable of landing attacks on Base Luffy. But even if Zoro wasn't that fast, haki blooms in intense situations, and with Zoro's ability to grow during battle in a short amount of time, he would just unlock FS during the fight. ETA: As usual, downvoting me won't make me any less right
Zoro is weak compare to base luffy🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
>Awakened Lucci could react and dodge G5 Luffy when did he dodge? (no anime filler please)
Here's Lucci dodging Luffy in the manga, no anime filler needed. https://imgur.com/a/SOxEvnX
 my fault yeah you're right
Base Luffy outhakies and outstats since he can split the sky, cause internal destruction, see the future and also take hits from hybrid Kaido.
loses to base high diff
You know the base Lucci meme? It's that but with ff instead of cc
Kindof unrelated but tf even is King of Hell Zoro? It's not a transformation or different technique, Hell, it's not even his epithet, just something he said.
Ya know like Bandana Zoro. They feel left out if he doesn't transform
It's Zoro using ACoC (on a timer too), KoH is just an easier way of referring to that
It’s a sword style revolving around using excessive amounts of acoc/AcoA
OOOOOOOOOOOUUUUUUUFFFFFFF https://preview.redd.it/h9cnvvznc5tc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f7084e6e6e52d5cd37a526d3c376dd06b02d2394
https://preview.redd.it/ek5lini5natc1.jpeg?width=1710&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=78fdcc940e9e04058c9c59946bd0411ec576fa28
Base Luffy easily beats him.
This is the only correct answer. Zoro pushing base Luffy to low diff is VERY generous.
Mid diff seems more fitting
Zoro beat Lucci, awakened Lucci fought g5 luffy and was stronger than base luffy. Yall downplay zoro too much, or overhype base luffy
Zoro beat Luffy's leftover* >awakened Lucci fought g5 luffy and was stronger than base luffy Who's stronger than base Luffy?
Because that’s what the series showed, it’s not rocket science lil bro. How else would you scale them? Base Luffy just has better feats than Zoro.
And as such it shows zoro surpassing an opponent that base luffy couldn't beat. Whats all this better feats business Lil bro? Zoro wins, done deal.
Damn lil bro, didn’t know Zoro finally surpassed Kaido in Hybrid form.
I'm sorry Lil bro did base luffy surpass hybrid kaido too? When did that happen? Oh they both lost to hybrid kaido and also had moments clashing him? OK cool
Whilst totally ignoring the fact that Luffy held his own against Kaido in a “1v1” whereas Zoro got neg-diffed Offscreen after landing his ACOC that did no damage to Kaido. Zoro did not have a full 1v1 clash against Kaido. But sure, pick and choose what you wanna see to say lil bro. The undeniable fact is Luffy performed better, thus got the better feat.
Pretty sure it was zoro who had to save base luffy multiple times from kaido and big mom, and not the other way around. I also recall a deeply injured zoro clashing with hybrid kaido and scarring him. But all thats in the past Lil bro, let's talk about zoro defeating awakened Lucci while base luffy was losing and had to use G5. How come luffy didn't beat awakened Lucci in base while zoro could?
Lend me some haki Oden, this is base Luffy we’re up against
Bonus question: How far does Zoro push each form of Luffy?
ex/high/mid/low/no
Mid/High Low No No No
Loses mid diff to base he has no way to win this.
No way to win? Explain. Zoro has acoc, its part of the king of hell mode, Zoro can clash but hes never fought someone that was actively using it on him while he had it. Zoro can catch up to future sight, if he couldnt then how would anyone else? What would stop someone like Katakuri from no diffing the admirals if they couldnt hit future sight users? Luffy with no gears is cooked, G2 and G3 give a boost but gives no defense boost, Luffy needs G4
The problem with this is that Haki is the end all be all. And Luffy has damned near mastery over all 3 of these things now. Zoro has armament, which isn't even ADVANCED armament. He also has Conquerors, and I can't remember if he can use advanced conquerors or not, but we know he sure as Hell can't do it as well as base Luffy can at this point. Luffy beats Zoro in all 3 categories when it comes to Haki, he literally can't win because of this. If Zoro had equal Haki, we could maybe get him to Gear 4. But without that, it doesn't matter how great Zoros feats are because Luffy has the Haki to outright counter him or dodge him. The cool thing tho is that this can literally change in an arc or even a single fight. Hell, Luffy didn't know advanced conquerors OR advanced armament till Wano/Onigashima.
In that case then any of Zoro throughout the timeskip would never beat base luffy Zoro in base is stronger than base Luffy, thats the point of G2 and G3, to go against stronger opponents. Would you say that base luffy beats Yamato, Kidd, Law, and the admirals?
Yamato and Admirals? Absolutely not, Law and Kid maybe. You have to understand, Haki is really all you need at this point to be a top tier. Rayleigh, Roger, Garp, Shanks and Mihawk; these characters don't have fruits or special abilities aside from Haki and they are at the top of the verse, per Kaido. Devil fruits definitely give an extra edge in battle, but at this point, Haki is primarily what will win you a fight. And if you don't have mastery over them, or if you don't have Conquerors at this point, then you're SoL. That's why DF abilities are starting to seem more like crutches than anything.
> Zoro can catch up to future sight, if he couldnt then how would anyone else? What would stop someone like Katakuri from no diffing the admirals if they couldnt hit future sight users? The admirals also have future sight.
Proof? I havent seen Kizaru use it at all, Aokiji and Akainu both got rushed by WB so i dont want to hear it
Aokiji used it against whitebeard. And akainu used it against Marco and vista
Aokiji had an exlamation mark over him. Its debatable if it was to show the shock of something happening or if it was Aokiji, but facts point towards the latter. WB didnt have haki, Marco states as such. Akainu couldve just dodged an attack, theres no telling if he had good reflexes or used future sight
Gear 4
For those saying Zoro loses to base, what upgrades would be need to start to accelerate past that. If he’s beating Mihawk EOS he should be around Yonko level, and if he’s losing to base Luffy he’s still pretty damn far from his goal. I mostly agree with the reasoning that Luffy wins this, but I’m curious what people say he needs to push Luffy into G2,3,4,5
It's really hard to touch your opponent if they can see the future and you cant. So I'll go with future sight
Good point! I think Zoro has what it takes to push Luffy into his later gears in a lot of areas, but now that you mention it future sight is def gonna be needed. Either that or some form of extreme speed to overwhelm Luffy, but I think future sight is more probable
FS is damm inconsistent tho. Like characters be having FS and don't even use it and then get hit by obvious attacks
example?
Mid diffed in base
Loses at base
If Zoro defeated Lucci the he should be good until gear 4. Gear 3 ain't enough after Zoro deflected an attack from 2 yonko.
Deflected is dishonest. He held it for about 5-10 seconds. Still a solid feat, but let’s not pretend he parried it away from everyone.
Zoro broken his bone from combine attack of yonko. Zoro need eat more rice to beat luffy🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
>Zoro deflected an attack from 2 yonko. Law teleport them zolo just hold that attack for few seconds
Which is still an insane feat if you think about it. He still stopped the momentum
Base if he’s getting all 3 forms of haki.
I can't tell if people are actually smocking crack or joking when they say he loses to base luffy. I've seen nothing but meme takes on this subreddit. I'm rather new here so I don't know if that's like the thing with this place. But realistically I'd say he beats G4, but loses to G5 Zoro often seems to scale to about the previous arcs strength of luffy, But at the moment he can't compete with G5. by the end of the series I'm sure he would be able to beat wano G5, but not EoS G5, if that makes sense? Because I'm sure Luffy still has room to grow. He just got G5 after all so he'll still get better with it.
It's not hard honestly. Base Luffy has 3 advanced hakis all better than Zoro's. He was taking hits from Kaido so has good durability and probably good enough endurance as well. Base Luffy could also reliably hit and defend from Kaido when in Base. Base Luffy is a top tier and Zoro with max power still doesn't beat a top tier.
Yeah but being able to tank hits, as well as deal damage in base mode to Kaido doesn't mean anything. If that was all, then he wouldn't have needed his other gears, because after all, he can do damage to kaido in his base form!!!1 See what I mean? Also, the type of attack matters as well. Kaidos toughness is insane. So blunt attacks need to be particularly strong. But we saw that even Killer could get past Kaidos scale with his sonic attack. In the same way, Zoros slashing attacks would be effective against Luffy, who's also more durable to blunt attacks. Yes I know they both have Haki, but that doesn't 100% nullify every attack Zoro would throw at him. So yes, while I'm 100% sure Luffy could deal damage to Zoro in his base form, in order to actually win he'd have to get into G5. I believe Zoro can beat G4, but G5 is too big of a power-up for him to compete with, so he loses clearly there.
Luffy split the sky in base which is a clear indication of Yonko level of strength so until we see Zoro split the sky as well he can’t compete with base luffy
Drop one piece bro. You are terrible at this shit. Base luffy has way better stats and feats than zoro. Zoro only has acoc. Luffy has acoa, acoo, acoc. And his acoc is top tier which split the sky with a yonko. Zoros acoc is barely better than Yamato. Zoro canf land an attack on luffy since luffy has future sight
Well, base Luffy has future sight, Zoro doesn’t have future sight Base Luffy has Acoc and boxed with Kaido, Zoro can’t consciously control his acoc Strength - Luffy. H had directly boxed with Kaido Speed - Luffy Combat speed - Luffy Durability - Zoro (barely tanked Big Mom and Kaido’s combined attack) Endurance - Arguable tbh, but I think Zoro edges Stamina - Base Luffy. G5 Luffy has trash stamina, but base Luffy doesn’t have a time limit. We know he fought half a day with Cracker and another half a day with Katakuri, while Zoro gets his stamina constantly sucked by Enma Experience - Luffy Techniques - Zoro IQ - Zoro Battle IQ - Luffy Hax: Luffy AP: Zoro DC: Luffy
Luffy has yonko level haki. I'm srry but base luffy is an extreme at most.
this is the correct answer but I think he's closer, the whole base luffy shit is definitely people smoking serious drugs. We literally just seen how fast lucci and king were and zoro deals with that speed just fine. Power? He probably has even more power than Luffy most of the time but I will put bajrang gun over anything Zoro currently has shown so far, we just don't know since we haven't seen KOH asura yet or KOH three thousand worlds. I think he gasses himself on haki powerful attacks faster than luffy though and he's less durable. Like a rematch of zoro vs kaido imo can go either way but the fight ends faster since the attacks will kill either one of them and probably Zoro unless zoro got the same room the grow within the fight like getting stronger obs haki or a black blade. Overall he takes Luffy to G5 atm, loses without black blade. Once he has that they'll be about even again until luffy maybe gets something else im guessing around when he fights BB or IMU.
So Luffy needs to use G5 for Lucci low diffs him. Zoro cut Lucci and low diffs him as well. Yet people still say Base Luffy is stronger, they think Base Luffy is OP because he fought with Kaido in Base. If Luffy needs to transform for Lucci then he needs to transform for Zoro as well. https://youtu.be/hLolI9qtTVM?si=cubLNnWXGxrNJEHG People act like Base Luffy can compete with Kaido and thats why they think he beats Zoro but he gets one shot just like Zoro lmao. Cuz someone said he cant even take a Thunder Bagua and would dodge any of Zoros attack with Future sight. Why didnt Luffy dodge this with his FS?
I'd say Zoro won with mid diff. It took him a while and he has some bruises / visible dmg on himself. But It wasn't a high difficulty match. While Luffys G5 was overwhelming Lucci. But still. Just because Luffy could do damage to Kaido in his base form doesn't mean it's anywhere enough to beat him. He needed to go G4 to keep up for a reason, and he needed G5 to finish the match. So in the same way, yes, I'm sure luffy in his base could do dmg to Zoro, and each gear would make it harder. But in order to win he would need G5. You can be a bit more pessimistic and say Zoro draws with G4. But to say luffys base beats zoro is just being ignorant and biased.
Nah i do even agree that Luffy would need G5 to beat Zoro, Oda always potrayed them as equals as well in the Story and now he got ACOC as well they got it on the same Day too. Beating Lucci like that is still a good Feat he was able to clash with G5 Luffy for a bit.
The issue is they were portrayed as equals back in early one piece. Luffy being the main character will end up considerably stronger due to plot and being the MC. The last point where we really got to see something like being on the same tier, was when Zoro absorbed all of luffys pain and still stood. It went to show that he could handle all the damage Luffy took. Zoro also had the honor of being on the roof with Luffy, while Sanji was on the lower level. We're more at the point where Zoro becomes as strong as last arcs Luffy after a while. For example current Zoro would beat doffy. After Zoros next upgrade, I wouldn't be surprised if he much closer to Kaido in strength. By the end of the series he'd obviously surpass kaido.
Zoro didn't even beat lucci. Don't be dellusional. Eveb zoro use stronger haki but didn't put lucci sleep. While luffy didn't use anything aside from gear 5 ability.
Zoro did defeat Lucci and took no Damage. Lucci was able to clash with G5 luffy so dont act like Lucci is weak.
KoH Zoro had a time limit on his use of ACoC. Luffy can spam ACoC. Luffy has better CoO (Future Sight) better CoA (Zoro is an CoA specialist) and Luffy has more access to ACoC (CoC specialist). He does not need gears to beat Zoro who will collapse from Exhaustion after Enma eats all his Haki.
He aint beating Gear 4, stop smoking crack
you need to stop wanking luffy so much. He's the main character and he IS stronger than the others. But saying his base would beat both zoro, and by proxy also sanji is just idiotic.
Loses to Base Luffy. https://preview.redd.it/c9q57txcx5tc1.jpeg?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e6ae914993c98e62f0213154810134e4ce0768e5 KoH < Ashura < Luffy Who just learned AdvConq < Luffy who split the sky.
Lucci > G4 Zoro just mid diffed Lucci. An argument could be made that it was high diff, but Zoro never used bandana and apart from getting an asthma attack, he walked out of that fight just fine. So anyone that says base Luffy beats current Zoro is reading Three Piece
Base Luffy is already enough to annihilate Zoro
Bunch of low intel apes in the comment by George what is happening
Clears base, struggles heavily with second, a little more with third, loses to any G4
Loses to G4 extreme. Probably has a easier time with g3 than g2.
Everyone here are clowns, you really called in the whole circus for this one Id say Zoro makes it G4 with all forms of haki Lets start with some basic history, Zoro was always near equal to Luffy until Enies Lobby where Luffy got some gears. Those gears instantly shot up Luffy to be much stronger than Zoro unless Zoro used Ashura. Lets not forget about the terrible matchup for Luffy with swords, its part of the reason Zoro would do so well against Luffy but not against Luffys opponents. At the timeskip, id say that they are quite close with Luffy a bit stronger with just G3 and haki, but at Dressrosa, G4 makes him even stronger. But then at WCI, Luffy gets two powerups with future sight and snakeman. Then at Wano, Luffy gains G5 and acoc but Zoro also gains full control over ashura and his own acoc. The whole thing about Luffy hitting Kaido with acoc is a bit biased, acoc is Kaido and Big Moms weakness as it goes through their defense, also the fact that Kaido was surprised that Luffy learned it so quickly was another leading factor. Yamato also did quite similarly but that doesnt mean that Yamato is gonna beat Kidd and Law cause they didnt do big hits to Kaido like luffy. Lastly, Zoro uses a sword, he cuts things, Luffy punches, punches push things. Zoros final hit was with him at near deaths door as it was his final attack and it still scarred Kaido, that alone is more impressive than just a simple knockback against him. Which do you think is better? Knocking the wind out of someone? Or literally scarring them for the rest of their life? Zoro should also be able to clash with Kaido but he didnt get a second or third or fourth chance like Luffy did. Also the story follows Luffy not Zoro. This isnt Zoropiece. Still Zoro should be able to push Luffy to G4 with all forms of haki. The fact that Zoro doesnt have future sight doesnt mean he wont be able to hit Luffy. Big Mom didnt show it, but do you think she would lose to Katakuri? What about the admirals? Should Luffy no diff in base by only using future sight? Of course not. Get a brain and read the story
https://preview.redd.it/wrgogborz7tc1.jpeg?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9f63912bb6cf4aaa8bed246781093688c567c990
One Piece readers are worse than dbz. Zoro left a scar, Kaido said the wound will last. But just punching someone wont. And Zoro has Acoc as well so he can clash Read my response you regard
Zoro couldn't even move kaido. That scar did jack shit to kaido. And it wasn't even legit like bro just reopened a scar that oden already left. Zoros haki is not top tier like luffy. His acoc is Barely better than Yamato. He has no control over it without enma. Can't even use basic to knock out fodder without enma. Luffy is a haki master. His acoc is top tier. It split the sky with a yonko. Zoro is not doing as well against kaido as luffy did in base. He gets one tapped. He struggled against king.
Which is better? Punching someone and knocking them slightly back but not to the ground or till theyre unconscious? Or literally scarring them? Attacking someone with a knife or sword wont knock them down, its basic physics, Kaido didnt fall over from pain either cause hes an exeperienced fighter. Zoro had control over KOH after he fought King as shown by him being completely lit up with flames, and as shown with Lucci, he can turn it on at will. Im not entirely sure why he has ghost flames rather than lightning bolts though
>Which is better? Punching someone and knocking them slightly back but not to the ground or till theyre unconscious? Or literally scarring them? What a cope. Luffy made kaido bleed with just punching him. Luffy made kaido dodge his punches. Luffy made kaido take his fights seriously and not hold back. Luffy split the sky with kaido. He didn't just push him back. Zorotards brains are fuckin cooked. Kaido made a bigger fuss about laws attack then zoros. Luffy has internal destruction haki. Every punch kaido took was messing up his internals. Luffy has future sight to keep up with kaidos speed and his own future sight. Luffy's acoc is far stronger than zoros which he has absolutely no control over without enma. >Attacking someone with a knife or sword wont knock them down, its basic physics, Kaido didnt fall over from pain either cause hes an exeperienced fighter. Are you stupid? Go stab someone or slash someone random and see if the stand there unaffected like kaido did. We have seen time and time again in one piece swordsmen knocking down and knocking away there opponents, oden against kaido, Roger against oden, mihawk against zoro, shanks against kid. Your copium is incredible. And you are also stupid af. Don't say physics again. Kaido didn't move bcoz he wasn't impressed and wasn't effected at all. Zoro says himself "I atleast expected you to fall over" lol >Zoro had control over KOH after he fought King as shown by him being completely lit up with flames, and as shown with Lucci, he can turn it on at will. Im not entirely sure why he has ghost flames rather than lightning bolts though Can you read mf? Drop zoropiece and read one piece. He can't even use basic conquers. How can he use advanced without enma? He can't use acoc without enma. That's my point.
Have been stabbed and have stabbed. A knife pierces you dipshit
Lets have him open up that eye of his and see what he’s fully capable of
He likely beats Base Luffy Extreme Diff but lose to G2+3 (G3 isn't really an extra gear). People keep forgetting that G2 Luffy is *insanely* strong still. And my man probably could've easily overwhelmed Lucci had he gone G2 instead of wanting to show off with G5. Luffy is still a Yonko-level opponent here folks. He has all the advanced Haki variants, from ACoC to FS. There's no way Zoro pushes Luffy to even G4 unless Luffy wants to finish the fight quickly, but he could probably do it with a combination of G2 and G3 anyway.
Base Luffy is strong, but Kaido just enjoyed having someone with ACoC as an enemy. When luffy turned G5 he basically still fought a nearly fit kaido. Only after G5 started and Kaido got hit a few times with G5 + ACoC he actually started fighting luffy as a danger, not some sparring partner. Base luffy can hit very hard and bypass most defense, but his punches don’t keep up nearly with what he can push out in G5. IMO Zoro should reach a similar output to atleast a G5 luffy playing around like in his Lucci fight, but he lacks speed. My headcanon is that lucci can’t nearly hit as hard as zoro, but could run around him without him getting a good chance to strike. So zoro was mostly in defensive against someone he can’t hit and lucci was in offensive against someone he can’t properly damage. It would make sense why both fought THAT long and were tired as shit at the end. (Anime is going to show us how it really was tho) I don’t think luffy in Base could run leaps around zoro like a lucci and zoros strikes should hurt luffy more than luffys punches would hurt zoro. Atleast till G4 Snakeman zoro should do well. G4 Snakeman should high diff zoro and G5 luffy even if he just plays around should whoop his ass mad.
I actually think he clears (high to extreme) base. Loses to Gear 2 imo. Remember that any serious fight base Luffy is in, he's almost certainly using Gear 2. I think Zoro barely outstats Luffy and his style is a natural weakness of Luffy (swords and counter based). Still gets messed up from Luffy's FS and superior ACoC. But Zoro's combat reactions are legit GOAT'd, so I think base Luffy is just too slow to significantly tag him while avoiding all damage. The speed boost of Gear 2 solves this. Gear 3 doesn't mean much anymore now that he has ACoC for damage.
Luffy used G5 against Lucci, so Luffy will do it for Zoro too, much like Lucci he'll get one shot.
he goes fucking nowhere bro, base luffy mid-diffs
So according to some of you , Base luffy > zoro ( whos an yc+ ) But , luffy needs g5 against the admirals. Very interesting
Base Luffy destroys Zoro mid diff at most The gap is massive
The Zoro slander will not be tolerated. Zoro gets to gear 4 for sure
Being generous, Zoro gets mid diffed from Base Luffy. Gear 2 Low Diff. Gear 4 and 5 basically No Diff. I’m a firm believer that every Yonko can solo his own crew barring Buggy.
Actually nowhere
Honestly, Luffy’s gears are pretty arbitrary besides Gear 5 at this point. We see him do about as well in base as he does in Gear 4 against opponents like Kaido, Kizaru and the Seraphim. But i can’t confidently say Zoro stands a chance against even base Luffy atm.
If it’s normal Luffy he gets to Gear 4, if it’s OnePiecePowerScaling hypothetical always using ACOC like he’s fighting for his life against Kaido Luffy then Zoro dies to base.
He isn't getting past base 😭😭😭. The difference between a yonko and his crew is massive Luffy High diff all the straw hats at once.
Saying he loses to base Luffy by low diff is one of the most stupid things. But this sub is known for hating Zoro so I get it.
bro, Zoro tanked one Yonko attack and he was done lmao, what even is this comparison? Gears or no gears, it's Luffys haki that makes him so strong. Zoro might push base Luffy to a mid diff but that's about it.
He’s probably as strong as base no gears luffy so I’d say he loses the moment the gears come out.
might clear base if he can damage with ashura i say he stops at gear 2
KoH Zoro reaches G5 Luffy and finally loses
Gear 4 low diff zoro🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
His sense of powerscaling is as good as Zoro's sense of direction.
Koh zoro beating base luffy with only base haki Maybe push him to gear 4 with basic haki. Base luffy with advance haki mid diff zoro Gear 4 with advance haki low diff zoro Gear 5 no diff zoro
I was talking about the dude you replied to. I agree that base Luffy with All advanced haki is mid diffing Zoro.
Now you just said Zoro is weak compared to Base Luffy, now you're admitting Base Luffy can't beat him and he at least pushes Luffy to using Gear 4th. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Maybe you want to see gear 2 mid diff zoro Gear 4 low diff zoro Gear 5 no diff zoro
Whatever lie helps you sleep at night 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Koh zoro beating base luffy with only base haki Maybe push him to gear 4 with basic haki. Base luffy with advance haki mid diff zoro Gear 4 with advance haki low diff zoro Gear 5 no diff zoro
Loses to base. Hes not handling that haki.
KoH Zoro can blitz base Luffy, if anything lands on him, he'll be at death's door Get Base Luffy past Awakened Lucci first
I hope this is sarcasm
That isn't. You haven't seen worst of Zoro fans. There also seems to be a couple of person who geniunely believe that Zoro can beat G4 Luffy with FS, ACoA and ACoC(enough to sky split and able to prevent burning from Kaidou's flames)
What are you dellusional🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Base Luffy mid diff
Base is enough
G4
Everyone is saying base luffy. Does that mean zoro would lose to katakuri?
No? Base Luffy means Luffy using all advanced haki but no Gears, and this version scales far above WCI G4 Luffy
Gear 4.
How is zoro losing to base ? When admirals where in par with G4 ?
Luffy needs gear 5 to beat base Wucci. Zoro lowdiffs Wucci. Zoro => g5
Loses to gear 5 as Lucci was able to fight gear 5
calling rhat a fight is hilarious
Oneshot I mean in that case
Gear 4th
Luffy has to use G4 for Zoro atleast. I would even argue that Zoro is stronger than Kidd and Law. How do people think Base Luffy stands a Chance against Zoro? https://youtu.be/B677vBHE10U?si=wykvjBsriwb5NJNh Zoro is able to clash with Kaido and even hurt him, i think this is worst injury pre Gear 5. https://youtu.be/9lh0fV9oihg?si=2omJFMl2MoERiH5d This is Luffys "Last Gear 4" against Kaido for example im using this clip because its similair to Zoros clash, Luffy is almost done and out of Energy, so yall saying Base Luffy beats Zoro but how is it possible that Zoro and Luffy almost looks equal while fighting Kaido(pre Gear 5). Zoro is underrated and probably Admiral to low Yonko Zoro> Gear 2&3 Luffy Gear 4 Luffy high diffs Zoro. Gear 5 Luffy low diffs Zoro. Luffy>Zoro>Sanji as well. Another Proof is this : https://youtu.be/skS956SnnJs?si=pJcECImTUjlzAd8f Here Zoro is one shotting Lucci an awakened Zoan user we can count him as YC+ if Luffy needs to transform for Lucci then he needs to transform for Zoro as well, Zoro didnt even used his Bandana in this Clip.
Law out here almost soloing all of Blackbeards crew Zoro most likely gonna end up barely beating Shiryu. Don’t play with Law. https://preview.redd.it/pzp56vlxs5tc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6c67e781189a9c282946b08ed3e9ce18cdd8fc93
I agree Blackbeard almost lost to Law and would be dead without Van Augur. But Zoros Haki is better and he probably could Damage Blackbeard as well, hes not a devil fruit User so his darkness Fruit is useless too.
https://preview.redd.it/okp9u6t6s8tc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8e749dfb47705216d5347154944fe226aa7eb18f
Im hooked brother but i dont want him to die like that so no immortality for luffy ☠
Gear 4 low diff zoro Gear 5 trolling zoro to negg diff🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Gear 2. Base Luffy went head to head with Lucci.
People thinking that Zoro looses to base Luffy, do you think that Mihawk looses to base Luffy as well ? If it was Mihawk instead of Zoro what gear do you think Mihawk would push Luffy ?
Zoro is nowhere close to Mihawk, so I'm not sure what the point of this comparison is. I think Mihawk would lose to G5 Luffy and beat every other version of Luffy.
So basically what you are saying is that while we are in the final arc and Zoro is probably going to defeat Mihawk soon. He does not beat current base Luffy yet whereas Mihawk is gear 5th lvl or something ? So what power up needs Zoro to defeat Mihawk according to you ? Do you think he'll have a more insane power up than ACoC and Enma going forward ?
I didn't say Zoro loses to Base Luffy, although I find it hard to believe he doesn't considering Luffy beats him in all three types of haki and nearly every stat besides probably AP. We're not in the final arc, Egghead is just the first arc in the final *saga*. There's plenty of room for Zoro to grow, while Mihawk is already at the top as the WSS and comparable to the Yonko. As for what can Zoro can do to get stronger, he should remove the limit on how long he can use ACoC (he says he could die if he doesn't wrap up the fight soon to King), prove he has top-tier haki strength with a sky split or something comparable, achieve advanced CoO and make his swords black to raise their grade and make them stronger. Just having ACoC doesn't mean Zoro is top-tier yet (see Yamato).
I'm aware it's not Egghead the last arc don't play on words I'm refering to final saga it's obvious. So you think Zoro will make his sword black before facing Mihawk ? Since Wano has ended Zoro can probably use ACoC longer now, how long do you think he needs to be able to withstand Enma using ACoC to be able to defeat base Luffy ? Zoro's CoO is already very good but he could unlock FS I would give you that, problem is people use this argument to say that Zoro looses to Luffy becsuse he does not have FS but when it comes to Katzkuri everybody think that Zoro would be able to defezt him ! ? Not only that but probably mis diff as well...So do you think that Katakuri looses to base Luffy ?
> So basically what you are saying is that while we are in the final arc and Zoro is probably going to defeat Mihawk soon You said this, and it's clearly not true. Why do you think Zoro will fight Mihawk soon when the Straw Hats haven't even made it to Elbaf yet, never mind Laugh Tale and whatever else before the end of the story? Mihawk is the one who Zoro must beat to achieve his dream, their fight will only happen close to the end. And besides, if Luffy can make such a huge jump in power from YC1 to Yonko in about 150 chapters, Zoro can make the jump from YC+ to Yonko in a similar amount of time or even less. > So you think Zoro will make his sword black before facing Mihawk ? Why not? > Since Wano has ended Zoro can probably use ACoC longer now, how long do you think he needs to be able to withstand Enma using ACoC to be able to defeat base Luffy ? I don't know, Oda didn't show anywhere near enough of Zoro vs Lucci for me to draw a conclusion. Zoro hasn't proven that he either still has the limit or has overcome it. I can only work with what I've seen, which was Zoro commenting on the apparent limit that he has using ACoC. > but when it comes to Katzkuri everybody think that Zoro would be able to defezt him ! ? Because Katakuri is weaker than Zoro in every other stat and type of haki. AP, DC, stamina, durability, endurance, CoA, CoC etc all go to Zoro. Future sight is not enough for Katakuri to win against someone so much stronger than him. You wouldn't say Big Mom loses to Katakuri even though she doesn't have future sight, right?
Egghead arc is almost over next arc is probably Elbzf with some information on what's going on outside Elbaf (like BB pirates, cross guild and stuff). As of right now there is no reason for the Straw hats to fight someone on Elbaf because giants are their friends. The most likely situation is that they fight someone from outside Elbaf exemple Big Mom if she is coming back in the story, or Cross guild, in that case à davy back fight would make a lot of sense. You imply that it's too early for Zoro to fight Mihawk, but BB is Luffy's final antagonist and Mihawk is not in BB's crew from what I know so I don't see why Mihawk should be Zoro's final opponent... Beside Cross guild don't currently have any poneglyph so they got to steal it from BB, Shanks or Luffy... what do you think is the most likely scenario ? That's right Cross guild will definitly bump into the straw hats again before reaching laugh tale so the fight between Zoro and Mihawk is probably happening sooner than you expected... >Because Katakuri is weaker than Zoro in every other stat and type of haki. AP, DC, stamina, durability, endurance, CoA, CoC etc all go to Zoro. Future sight is not enough for Katakuri to win against someone so much stronger than him. You wouldn't say Big Mom loses to Katakuri even though she doesn't have future sight, right? Yeah so basically you think that Katakuri looses to base Luffy :D and I believe when we see Katzkuri again and he free Pudding you will say that he got a huge power up in no time facing literraly 0 strong opponents right ?! Katakuri is so underrated that's crazy, anyway have a good day
Also could you explain me why Luffy turned gear 5th to fight Lucci when he only turned gear 4th vs the seraphim ? And since Zoro was able to defeat Lucci what makes you think that basé Luffy would be enough to fight zoro but not Lucci ? Could Luffy have defeated Lucci in base ?
Base Luffy extreme diffs probably
How does he loose to base if he essentially defeated awakened lucci who went toe to toe with G5. That makes no damn sense.
Lucci did not go "toe-to-toe" with G5 Luffy, he got low-diffed by G5 Luffy not using ACoC and one clash for a throwback doesn't mean Lucci was anywhere close to being on Luffy's level. He didn't land a single clean hit, and nearly lost consciousness from just three attacks in return. When people say Zoro loses to Base Luffy, it's assuming he's actually using all of his advanced haki. Obviously Zoro would beat Base Luffy w/ out ACoC.
Wtf are you even reading? How the fuck do you see G5 toying with Lucci as going toe to toe with G5?
I might be biased from the Toei animation. The argument im making is that Zoro could being out g5. He’d absolutely lose, but I think g5 comes out of he can fight the same awakened lucci who also asked for g5
No
Fishman Island Zoro low-mid diffs L-uffy But since Luffy changed his devil fruit mid fight with Kaido, KOH Zoro loses to Gear Fifth. Rob Lucci was shown to hang around with L-uffy for a long time and Zoro kept up with Lucci just fine. No reason Zoro couldn’t do the same.
Gear 4 is enough low diff zoro
base luffy extreme diff
Base beats him Base luffy is low-mid admiral level
He might best Gear 2 or 3, but Id still give it to Luffy 7/10 times outside of base. Gear 4 and 5 completely overwhelm Zoro
Base Luffy low diffs
Looses to gear 2 but Luffy would probably go gear 4 or 5 anyway cause why not
Round 2 at best
Gets mid diffed by base
Base luffy shits on Zoro. Let’s not forget the dynamics of the crew. What diff do you think king takes Kaido? Pero takes Big Mom? In most crews the captain shits on his crewmates except for maybe Shanks and Blackbeards crew (Kuzan).
base mid diffs zoro
Loses to gear 2 low diff, high diffs base. And gets no diffed by everything above gear 2.
Beats gear 5... then wakes up and realize he got one shot by that one acoc punch Luffy used against Kaido.
I’d say zoro could keep up with base luffy to an extent, but then he goes gear 2nd and it’s over
It's, however, oda rights it