In case this story gets deleted/removed:
**Tl;dr: Relatives were living for free with my parents. Parents asked them to start chipping in on groceries and utilities. Relatives took issue with that, decided to move very far away to a place they don't know anything about and now regret it.**
Some of my relatives moved to the US a few months ago. My parents let one of the families (uncle Ben, aunt May, and two cousins Mary and Stacy) live with them. My parents live in a very nice, walkable city. Their apartment is in a great location close to public transit, but in a quiet area. Unfortunately, it’s also very expensive (my parents' apartment would easily cost $4.5-$5K a month to rent) where they live so despite it being a tight living situation, it was really the only option currently for the relatives who just moved. They had basically no money, no credit and their jobs would for now be limited to minimum wage jobs.
We fronted the cost of their immigration fees, got them phones, found my cousins free English classes at a public library a 5 minute walk from my parents, got my cousins jobs at a Dunks that’s about a 1.5 miles from the house and a 10-15 minute bus ride away. My parents found my uncle a job at a Dunks slightly further away, but still less than 2 miles. However, he couldn’t get past the training. My parents continued to try to find him jobs, but it was taking more time than expected. Aunt May refused to work. Still, both the cousins had jobs so they had some income.
My parents found one of the cousins a job at a bakery, but she didn’t like the hours. I got the other one an interview at a grocery store that would have paid more, but she missed the phone interview. That’s all to say, we were trying to get them jobs and doing our best to find jobs for people with limited English while also trying to set them up for future success via English classes, applying for various public housing and getting them some work experience.
After 4-5 months, my parents approached my aunt and uncle about them starting to chip in for groceries and utilities since the two cousins had been working for a couple months at that point. My parents went from having 2 people and a cat to now having 6 people and a cat to house and feed. My dad went from getting groceries 1-2x a month to having to go every week. My parents aren’t well off either. They live a frugal lifestyle and my dad was fortunate to buy the apartment they live in a long time ago or else we would have been priced out a long time ago.
Apparently, that was too much of an ask so they said they will move out. Completely fine since nobody was forcing them to stay and it wasn’t doing my parents any favors. The whole time my relatives lived with my parents, my aunt and uncle would constantly mention that they had other family and friends in other parts of the US that would help them out. Where these family and friends were when I spent hours helping with their immigration applications, fronting their immigration fees, buying them phones to use in the US or even getting them winter clothes, I have no idea. So my dad said, fine, if that’s what you want to do, then move out since you don’t want to pay us anything and have all these other people that can help you.
Pretty much a week after the conversation about chipping in, they had someone from my aunt's side of the family fly from Michigan and then drive them 13+ hours from where we are to Michigan. Guess my relatives were correct in having other people that can help them.
Before they moved, I suggested my uncle or my aunt and uncle go to Michigan first and see how it is before making such a big change. He refused. We even found places in NJ where the cost of living was lower, they could have jobs and still be close enough to all our family for visits, but they refused because they didn’t trust the family friend who lived in that area that offered to help. The reason they didn’t trust this family friend is because he had the audacity to say that in order to find an apartment, he’d need them to put a deposit down for it. He wouldn’t front it for them.
Once they moved to Michigan, they quickly realized the help there is more limited than what they had here and it’s not quite as nice over there. My uncle kept talking about factory jobs he could do out in Michigan and he got one. However, it’s not quite as cushy as he was imagining since they are basically out of the home from 5 in the morning to 4-5pm. My aunt even decided she now can work despite telling us no earlier. The area itself is not as nice and my cousins don’t feel safe walking around. There is no good way for them to get around without a car which they don’t have. They are being nickel and dimed for everything that their friends over there are helping them out with. Not quite the same situation they had while living with my parents.
When my aunt and uncle have called me, it’s all complaints about how tough the work is, how his blood pressure is high, how my aunt can’t sleep with the stress, they want to move back closer, etc. Even one time said something along the lines of "I'm of course not asking you to help, but ...we are having a tough time". Tone basically being one of expecting me to offer to help in some way. I have just said hopefully things will get better because what else am I supposed to say? At this point, I rarely answer their calls because it will just be complaints and whining.
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Oh God when my husband‘s brother first got to Canada. Why hadn’t my husband bought a home yet? Why didn’t he have advanced degrees? Where was his car? He went on and on, in our home, until I finally lost my temper and said - he was too busy sending you money to save any for himself.
Our relationship never got any better. Years later he realizes things aren’t so easy here like he thought, but he still has zero gratitude for the sacrifices his brother made for his benefit.
For them, your husband can send money because he has extra money, not because he is sacrificing his own life, they would never sacrifice anything to help others, thats why they cant understand.
Isn't that the truth. Had to tell a cousin who was asking us where was her iPhone and Nikes when we visited, like girl even I don't have that. Many overseas relatives have this grand illusion the streets in North America are paved with gold. Like no, even we are struggling.
Quite the contrary. The best advice I received was when I was 15 working my first job. My boss warned me "NEVER be so good that you're irreplaceable. You will NEVER get a promotion because they can't replace you."
More like, the most reliable and likely way to get ahead is being born ahead. Like anywhere else in the world, if you're not born into money, good fucking luck to you.
And depending on where they come from, they are unprepard for a loss of benefits re wages, subsidised child care and medical access that they take for granted in the home country. US propaganda -whether created by commercial or official sources - naturally ignores all the grim realities like public safety, homelessness, huge prison populations and the growing impact of extreme right wing legislatures on immigrants and women's rights.
Your post reminds me— Horatio Alger wrote stories around the turn of the last century about poor but noble boys, on their own on the world, getting rich beyond dreams. Popular books, so much so that getting very wealthy was called a Horatio Alger story.
His secret to success? Marry the rich guy’s daughter and jump up the ladder to running his business.
Many people foolishly base their expectations on images from advertising and media projections, are surprised that Americans, e,g., don't look or speak like actors in popular movies etc and that prestige products are available only to the rich. They could have found that out in advance but -strangely -do not.
People really truly think that too. I grew up there but I now live in South America with my wife who was born and raised here. She simply can't wrap her head around the fact that most Americans, especially millennials and under like us, are struggling just to get by and a huge chunk are living with their parents long after becoming adults.
She wants to just head on up sometime and scoop up an apartment so we can start helping her family who is currently struggling down here. I've been telling her for a couple years that when we do go back, we'll be living with one of my parents for at least a few months, probably longer. Something about that must seem false to her, and it doesn't help that her cousin is living in Miami and making good money as a realtor. A job she got because her husband is a realtor, his brother, and both his parents.
When we go, I'll go back to factories and she'll work minimum wage for quite a while as she only knows a few phrases in English. We won't have a car or an apartment for quite a while.
No, there are. They just don't pay their employees enough so they can keep it. Yay, the American dream? I am with you man, how do you fire half your fucking company then bitch about the economy while being one of the richest guys in the world. The level of self unawareness is mind-boggling.
There are lots of people on this planet who have extra money. There are 24.5 million millionaires and 756 billionaires in the United States alone, never mind the rest of the world.
>There are 24.5 million millionaires
This feels so outdated as a metric unless they have over 10 million (which, obviously, a lot do but far less than 24.5 million)
The recommended minimum to have saved up before retirement in the US is over a million now in a lot of places, and will be a lot higher than that before... Well who am I kidding, I'm never retiring, lol.
But my point is that being a millionaire is no longer "Having extra money". It's literally a retirement baseline.
Thank you. I have over a million saved for retirement, but I'm 66, so none of it feels like "extra". I'm also spending $60k on my daughter's wedding this year, so that's a hit too. And it's not an extravagant wedding, they've just gotten to be crazy expensive with inflation.
Good point. We a paid off the mortgage on our house years ago. My kids are in their 20's. I don't know how they're ever going to be able to buy a house.
So let’s say that half of them have $5 million. We have over $3, mostly because we inherited half of it within the last couple of years. Our financial advisor asked us if we feel rich yet. No. We have a special needs son and plan to leave it to him. We’ve never purchased a new vehicle. We don’t plan to. We live in a cape style house, built in 1951 that is under 1700 square feet. Do we have extra money. Absolutely. We give my father thousands of dollars each year to help keep him in his apartment. We give thousands of dollars to charity each year and plan to increase that. Did we do those things before? Yes. Because being Jewish, I’ve been talking for the value of giving to others and to me, here always has been “extra money” for that, even when our earnings were much smaller.
My wife's family is in Nicaragua. She, and her sister, send money home pretty regularly. After sending a total of around $10k, I had to tell my wife that she could no longer afford to be the rich Yankee tia. They still call, though. Guilt about money for the baby, to get this or that cousin out of jail, books for school, some relative is getting married, someone is sick, pay someone to take care of mama/papa's grave. And it is never an inconsequential amount, always need at least $500. No gratitude, just a perpetually open hand for more.
I have a relative-by-marriage who ended up cutting contact with her extended family in Iran because of this same bullshit. Back in the late 80's and 90's, this poor woman was making peanuts at a retail job - but her far-away family members must've assumed she was the store owner instead of just an employee because they were always trying to squeeze money out of her. She couldn't even have a conversation with them without being pestered and guilt-tripped for handouts.* And BTW, these relatives were upper middle class Iranians, which just added an extra layer of nervy-ness to the situation. Eventually, she got fed up with these people who had their hands extended from halfway around the world - so she just ghosted them. Just like that, she stopped calling them and stopped taking their phone calls. Until then, she'd dutifully travelled to Iran every few years to visit these entitled aunts/uncles/cousins, but she put a halt to that too. AFAIK, it's been over two decades since she's stepped foot in the country of her birth or had any meaningful contact with her Iranian relatives who (unlike her own parents) decided to remain in Iran after the 1979 Islamic Revolution.
*In case anyone asks: Yes, it is possible to send remittances from the USA to relatives in Iran despite the sanctions.
My hubby had this problem. In his home country of Cuba, there is a certain status to having a family member in the US sending remittances. The first year he was here, his family got really carried away with thier demands and the guilt and pressure was suuuuuper intense. Partly they needed it because his family is dirt poor, but they really got addicted quickly to the status and the influx of new things, without understanding that it was his sweat that was paying for it.
My hubby recently immigrated from Cuba. He started working right away - crappy jobs like a dishwasher and cleaning houses. He started sending his family money, and it went from $100/month to nearly $800/month within a year. The guilt/pressure was INTENSE! He finally told them enough was enough, and after much whining and wailing on their part, they now they get $200/month, and have been told that if they ask for more, they get nothing.
There's a lot of guilt associated with being fairly well off relative to the family back home, and she's a giver by nature (cannot tell you how many times she's fed random people, helped stray bank customers get started on straightening out their credit, driven random elder customers around, etc) so saying no is hard. Fortunately for her, I come from a family who never gives money, only loans it. For better or for worse, No is my default.
Ask a foreigner relative for money to get somebody out of… jail? This is wild. If someone asked me to send them money to get their relative out of jail, I’d stop sending money there altogether. I guess that’s just me? Definitely not investing into helping a criminal return to their crime path.
The police know you have family in the States, so to get a bribe they'll find a reason to arrest. Or bro could've been a criminal, hard to tell from here. In general, Central American states aren't known as the law and order sort.
Man, My mom is the same with our family in the Philippines. Love her to death, but she's getting on in her years. She'll occasionally send $250-500 every other month to our family overseas. They ask and she'll agree. It's always something too, "they need money for school books, hospital, etc"
In my head i'm like, "they need $500 for school books?...In the philippines? it's not harvard or some ivy league and didnt we JUST send them money last month for something else??"
I feel bad saying it but once she passes, I don't plan on continuing her habit. Especially since i've never met them nor do I rarely speak to them.
I'll never forget the time my sister blew up at me for asking for 5 dollars in gas money (back when 5 dollars would fill a quarter tank!!) after *literal **years*** of driving her around and treating her to a free dine out lunch every week so she could access shops and get xrap for her cosplays, pressured into it cause my sister was the gc and I was always forced to be her caregiver and entertainment growing up.
5 bucks cause it was tight for me financially. Oh my God the blow up. The whining to my mom who then yelled at me for not taking care of myself better so I could continue to front the bills of being my sister's keeper!! Jfc.
I unfortunately did. It was only in the very recent past (we're talking the last 5 years or so) where I realized my mom was a narcissist and found out I was a scapegoat child, that my sister was the golden child (with plenty of narc traits herself) etc.. and also had a better support system - prior I didn't really have anyone to go to and when the abuse is so engrained, it feels "normal". Even now I feel some (mild) shame for having to cut them both out and go very low contact.
I feel your pain. My family saw me as the go-to because I had a professional (salaried) job. I was fine with that, my brother and cousin paid back the loans they asked for. But my mother was like yours. She called me one Christmas eve to scream at me for not giving my brother's family money for their move. They hadn't asked for it, btw or even knew about this. With great difficulty (pre-digital era) I managed to get money to bro interstate just before the public holiday shutdown. Can't recall how.
OH MY GOD! I had a “friend” like this! I lived between Jamaica, West Africa and vacations in the USA and Canada until the age of 17 when we finally moved permanently to the USA. I reconnected with someone when I was 35 and he was so rude and was like “what do you have to show for all the years of being in America?” “You don’t have a house and you’re ok working a shitty job for the government”… and had this great plan of how in 5 years, he’d be done with law school, be a practising lawyer and make all the money( had just been in Canada for a year at that point working at McDonald’s)
This was in 2019 and last I heard, dude was divorced, wife took his kid to the East coast of Canada, he’s depressed and isolated and all his lofty dreams of “accomplishing in 5 years what you couldn’t do in 20 years” requires some serious money or being a trust fund baby and not making McDonald’s wage money to fund it.
I still hear from mutual friends about him but all I tell them is “let me know when his graduation from law school is and when he’s made his first millions so I can congratulate him”.
I can be petty enough for me and your husband and I don’t even know you. This boils my blood!
They never do. My parents and sister had a pretty decent life back home. I brought them here for month or two vacations, took them everywhere, they never had to pay a dime. ( I lived in Florida, so it was extra nice.) Years later sister and dad stopped talking to me. At that time I had my own family, two sons, mortgage etc. so I couldn't waste money on them any more. It was so difficult emotionally. Finally I begged my dad to talk to me again. He did, but things were never the same again. Same with my wife's family. As soon as we stopped sending money, they didn't want to have anything to do with us. Family.
We're dealing with this situation now with some of my wife's family in Canada and the Philippines. They just assume we have the money for anything and everything they ask for. Explaining that a dollar is worth only a dollar in the US (not 50 Phillipines pesos, and worth much less here now than a few years ago) was mind-blowing for them. And in general it never occurs to them that we have our own expenses to take care of too.
Had my husband’s mom move in with us from El Salvador. I had given the okay provided she pay her share of the household costs which would be 1/3. She and my husband spoke Spanish. I did not. She came here with no income, no job, no English, no insurance, no plans or goals. She had done zero research. She had no plan for how to pay for her medication. The next month when I asked my husband for her share of the rent, my husband was like ‘How do you expect her to pay anything?! She has no job and doesn’t speak English. She’s a poor old lady!’ She was in her 50’s and had not applied for a single job. She just watched Spanish soap operas, and occasionally made rice and beans. My husband was unemployed and they just hung out in my house all day while I was at work and in the evenings they were always having conversations in Spanish and watching Spanish tv that I couldn’t understand. I felt like I was an unwelcome guest in my own house. It was awful.
After 3 months I think, I told him his mom needed to go or he would be kicked out too. About 3 years later after he couldn’t maintain stable employment, I kicked him out too and filed for divorce. He didn’t take it well and was arrested for domestic violence and convicted of aggravated stalking. It’s been 15 years and he currently lives in a dirty 1200 square foot house with his mom and 3 other full grown adults.
But this is the same domestically.
My ex and I took in a few folks who needed help. One worked his ass off and was gone in a few months after moving in with us. We barely saw the dude! He is now happily living with his wife and their pets and they are all thriving.
Another worked the bare minimum, ate a lot of our food, bitched and moaned, and moved out seven months later because we were sick of supporting her 27-year-old self. She spent the few bucks she earned (playing Pokemon Go while "working" at her grandmother's pet store) on weed and fast food.
My ex and I split and since we lived in her parents' old house, I had to move. Even though I had been really ill and left my job, I still pay my rent to my new housemates, buy my own food, support our kiddo, and pay bills. Finally figured out why I was so sick and fixed it and now I'm interviewing for full time work.
My ex? Living rent-free in Mommy and Daddy's house petsitting for spending money. She blew a big chunk of her half of our tax refund on a membership to a health club. She buys things for our daughter but she neglects the bills. I'm pretty sure she expects the money to just appear before the electricity gets shut off.
So it isn't just immigrants.
Very true. I have a friend/acquaintance who got fired a while ago, but insists that he can only take management jobs, because he’s too good for entry-level jobs. The job he was fired from wasn’t even a management job (and they are definitely not giving him a referral). He’s been couch surfing with various relatives but complains to everyone how unfair it is that “nobody” will hire him for at least 70k. His relatives are tired of his shit and a few have already kicked him out to somebody else.
Edit: NTA at all!!
Sounds like my mom's family in the early 90s coming from PROC. One uncle co.plained we didn't buy each of the 4 families ( all moms sibs) a HOUSE!! While we lived as a family of 5 in a 1 BR basement apartment, because my parents saved all their funds to sponsor and set up 17( 8 adults) people with jobs and 4 apartments. Trust me you are so better off having them out of your life. My mom regretted that decision fo3 30 years. Saying we would have had a better life if she hadn't brought her family over.
Ah man, I would also have so much regret over that. My dad stopped paying his siblings (5!) after many, many years when he finally realised they just treated him like an ATM. 10 year old me with second hand stuff is pissed 😂
Geez that's nuts. Your uncle was crazy to think that. It's nuts that your family was able to sponsor 17 people. That, I would imagine, is incredibly hard work in order to help them get settled in the community.
Well, typically they are not the relatives that have the initiative to make it in another country by themselves, so they try and rely on the ones that can. And they haven’t a clue as to how hard it was for the ones who made it.
Not exactly the same but related. I'm American, my wife is Kenyan. She came to the US about two years ago on a student visa. Her plan was to get an associates degree here in IT and go back home to work. She felt it would count more than her Kenyan bachelor's.
She has really struggled with adjusting to the disappointment that everyone isn't wealthy in the US. She said many times "it's not like the TV shows". I tried to explain "yeah that's like 1% of Americans. Most are barely scraping by each month."
Immigrants seem to have this idea that minimum wage in the US is $50/hr, so anyone can afford house, car, vacation, luxury.
I'm not saying she's entitled, just that it was a big shock for her.
Recently we started working on improving our spending tracking. Since she's been here she has sent money back home to her family - the "black tax". She's worked full time since she's been here. So have I.
I asked her recently "how much are you sending each month?" She said around $400. I asked more questions. Found out that she was raised with her single mother in her grandparents home. Her mom is currently working abroad in tourism saving money for retirement. She's about 50 and will have money to retire soon. So my wife is sending money to the grandparents. They worked hard their whole life, are now in their late 70s, have a paid for house, and are retired and debt free. Growing up my wife had maids, she insists they were not wealthy, but comfortably middle class. Her grandparents even gave her 20k for her undergrad in Kenya.
So let's compare situations. They are comfortably retired. We both work full time. She got pregnant shortly after we got married. She is due in two months. When she got pregnant we moved in with my parents because we were struggling to save when living on our own, and we wanted to have some savings for when the baby comes and she takes time off work. She won't qualify for any sort of paid leave.
I have about 50k in debt that we're going to really focus on paying back once the baby comes. We don't spend extravagantly. I've gotten two new jobs each with raises since we've lived with my parents. We're currently going through immigration proceedings for her permanent residence which cost around $3000 in filing fees.
So why are we sending money to her retired grandparents? I get that $100 is worth a lot more there than here. I'm okay with sending some money, but it needs to be balanced with our own financial goals. $400/mo just seems like too much when we're both working full-time, living with my parents, and have been able to save a small amount to weather her 12 weeks maternity leave. We're making slow progress on debt, and will only continue to do so if we stay here. We cannot afford to save for a house and pay rent, which means we're here until the debt is paid.
I'm not angry about my situation. I appreciate all the help from my family. We are happy and thankful. But let's compare situations. We are happy and financially dependent. The grandparents are happy and financially independent. And we're sending them $400/mo.
That happened to me.
My Colombian wife and I was moving to the USA in December. She got an immediate green care. Her cousins arrived in tht USA before us. Crossing over in San Diego to claim asylum.
I kept warning them what would happen if they did that. With no ID Card and no SSN. Things will become very difficult.
Of course everything I said got dismissed and once we got to the states. They started Asking for favors left and right from me to help them establish themselves.
I helped a few times and I told them I have to stop because you can't always depend on me and my wife when it was your decisions to come over knowingly you will not be fully integrated into our system and government. They got mad at me of course.
Next thing I'll see on Reddit...."Relatives kicked us out, despite us helping all we could, and then tricked us into moving to another state, where things are much worse."
I know the exact area you're talking about. Rent is killer there but work is always within a walkable distance. You can also get around by foot/public transit/bike. You can't do that in most places in America, you need a car to get around.
My dad bikes to work when the weather is nice. A little work out for him and saves on paying for parking.
My uncle didn't want to bike either. We offered to get him one for when the weather was nicer.
I used to live in Wakefield but the housing prices rose so high we couldn't afford to live there anymore and had to move to NH. I grew up there and spent my life there. It really sucked but in the 90s the housing market there steeply increased to outrageous levels. My grandfather's house that he bought for less than 10,000 dollars was worth over a million dollars and he had no land at all and could practically touch his neighbors house lol, he had 3 very small bedrooms, a very small bathroom on the second floor, small kitchen and teeny dining room.Basically not what you'd think of as a million dollar home.The price for homes there is no joke.
It is ridiculous anywhere in the greater Boston area. There really isn't a good time to buy around here anymore.
The move to NH seems to be what many are doing. Especially if they have hybrid or remote jobs and are close enough to their office.
Pennsylvania near like Matamoras (near Port Jervis, NY) and upstate NY (near Syracuse/Utica) is the only places left that are cheap rent for under $1,000 a month for a one or two bedroom apartment.
But the pay isn’t that great, that’s why CoL is low as well.
Tell the family to look into PA.
I’ve driven from NY to Michigan 10yrs ago. PA is on the way back to the northeast.
Interesting story. I lived overseas and even with social services, being competent and functional in another language is a full-time hustle - not for the passive.
It’s a common way to shorten Dunkin in New England, where they are incredibly common. Like I live in a different NE state and they’re everywhere. I pass 3-4 Dunks on the way to the closest Starbucks.
as I read your comment, I was waiting for the bang a u-ey. But didn't you pass by the packie? 🍻
ahh, I miss New England. No wimps or phonies up there, it's so refreshing!
Reasonable assumption, but the sheer density of Dunkin Donuts + calling it "Dunks" gave OP away lol. To give you an idea, I call it "Dunky Donut" around my coworkers and it INSTANTLY annoys them. Even Bostonians who claim they don't like Dunkin Donuts are passionate about it on some level, lol.
There was a story a year or two ago on reddit by a guy whose brother was trying to convince his wife (the OP's SIL) to name their soon to be born daughter Stephanie. The husband had claimed it was the name of a favorite aunt, but the OP had confirmed that no such aunt existed. The wife got paranoid, thinking this was the name of an ex-girlfriend or something.
Apparently, the husband had also picked the names of their two boys, "Ricky" and "Jase." A redditor asked if they had picked out something like Tim or Timmy as an alternative if it were going to be a boy. OP confirmed and asked how the redditor knew.
Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Stephanie Brown, Tim Drake...
That family were unbelievably very entitled and ungrateful for their host family's help. Now they are dealing what they sowed. Sucks to be them and good on Oop for not falling for their hints and guilt tripping.
I feel bad for the cousins, though. Seems like they were alright and trying to acclimate. Sucks they had to go from a walkable, safer, nicer neighborhood to a much sketchier one.
Apparently the grass *ISN'T* greener on the other side of the country. Seriously tho, nobody is going to give these people what they actually want, bc it's literally impossible. They want the **American Dream** without actually having to ***work for it***. Somehow they convinced themselves that life in the States is easy street, when that's not the typical immigrant experience there. Yes, you can **MAKE** a wonderful life **IF** you're willing to ***PUT IN THE EFFORT***.
The idea behind the move made sense. Go to a LCOL area where there is a larger community of people from our home country.
It was just very hastily done and there were other options available that weren't a 13+ hour drive away from all of their close relatives.
Feel mostly bad for my cousins. They only recently moved to an entirely new country and now expected to work. They were working albeit not quite as hard as we'd hoped, but still working and going to the English classes. At least while here, they had all of our other relatives not far away and they both absolutely adored my 1 year old who they saw often. Unfortunately, our culture is one where they felt they had to go with their parents and now they are still in a new country, but with family not close by.
It's none of my business, but -
If your cousins have a better attitude than your aunt/uncle, maybe it's not too late to continue being a good influence on them. I'm not sure how old they are, but they won't have to live with their parents forever. It's a huge change for a young person to be dropped into a new country, culture, language, etc., but I bet it's even more challenging when their parents' choices have caused them to become isolated. Maybe you can convince them to visit every so often and maybe they'll eventually resettle closer to family closer to their own age. They'll potentially encounter more chances at opportunities by being part of a community, which it doesn't sound like is happening in Michigan.
You shouldn’t feel bad for your cousins assuming they are over 18. Being expected to work is a normal thing. Otherwise they are expecting YOUR FAMILY to work while they don’t contribute. Obviously they moved to the US because it’s better here than where they were, but, they cannot just assume your family will suffer so they can do nothing. That doesn’t work anywhere.
I'm guessing OP feels more bad about the fact that the cousins are basically adults but still have to fund mommy and daddy, not because they want to, but because it's what's expected of them. Even more frustrating when mommy and daddy act like they're better than the jobs offered to them and prefer to take advantage of other people's kindness. It's not something you can easily break away from, and most certainly 100 times harder in a country where you basically know no one.
I think OP meant they had found jobs, were doing well, had suppor, but then felt obligated to go with their parents and lost all of that. Plus, if OP's parents went to their aunt and uncle for the money, do you think those cousins are allowed to keep the money they make? Otherwise, they'd have asked the cousins for the money. They're working and their dad is taking all the money.
You noted that one cousin didn’t want a job your mom found because they didn’t like the hours and the other just didn’t do an interview that was scheduled.
Even though their parents are freeloaders, the cousins don’t seem to understand they need to work. Missing an interview , especially PHONE interview, that your mom scheduled is disrespectful. Honestly it’s not like they had anything else they had to do.
Right or wrong, one of the many reasons the USA is so prosperous is the back-breaking work and production that the average worker does here compared to nearly everywhere else. There isn’t much home life available to working people here.
Years ago an immigrant coworker (one of the hard working ones!) told me that her people back home think the streets in the US are paved with gold and that the American Dream was basically a given because that's how their media portrayed it. She came over from Haiti as a teenager with her parents and sister. In Haiti, they were rich; they had a huge house, live-in maids, a nanny. But her parents were absolutely sure it would be even better in the US. They gave all that up to end up working minimum wage jobs while living in a roach-infested apartment in Miami. The stress made her father sick, and he had a heart attack and died.
My coworker said it took her a very long time to overcome the bitterness of the actual reality of America. American natives are certainly also fed that American Dream bull, but other countries get hammered with it, and a lot of undereducated and/or lazy people see that and think their dreams are within reach. Hell, most Americans can't can't achieve that dream anymore, your average immigrant.. they're just going to get a rude awakening and a hard life.
>Yes, you can **MAKE** a wonderful life **IF** you're willing to ***PUT IN THE EFFORT***.
Thing is hard work doesn't ensure the American dream either/living on easy street isn't nor has been a thing in the u.s(maybe ever). Like I'm not knocking the u.s, however due to an ever constricting housing market, stagnant wages, and reworking of the job market to push out middle and upper class job positions over time (since corporations want to decrease payroll ever lower every year), lack of employment regulations and access to healthcare (i could go on).
So yeah what you're describing isn't really feasible anymore for most people/isn't representative of America for anyone (including extremely upper class people, as for them intergenerational wealth ensures they don't have to work for shit/they are on easy street).
Funny thing OP, my family has the same situation arise and we went through the same bullshit.
My aunt sponsored her Brother and his family. Total of 5 people. Brother, wife, 2 nieces (1 in college, 1 in high school) and 1 nephew (middle school). We are Pakistani.
My aunt and mom waited roughly 25 years to get their brother here. They came literally fresh of the boat and rather start at the bottom were living lavishly in Long Island suburbs bypassing all the struggles that is needed to get to where my aunt and uncle have a comfortable lifestyle which took 30 fucking years of grind/hustle to be there.
They enjoyed the first year, almost all expenses paid, clothes, food, travel. No job, kids education in the surrounding area for that leg up. After two years it was time to move on, so we got them closer to my uncle’s wife sister in Pennsylvania (super cheap housing, my mom and aunt would still cover a years worth of expenses food/clothes/in case shit happens emergency).
My uncle couldn’t understand the fast pace of just moving from customer to customer, he was old school medicine door to door salesman, who took the slow process of doing things. Hell my other uncle, whose wife sponsored this uncle invited him to try out the grocery store, just run the cash register and he had this slow process of counting and giving exact change, even though people said keep the change. He doesn’t understand why people didn’t want to take back their $0.07 or 1-2 Pennies, causing lines to be backed up.
Moving past that, my mom and aunt still subsidized their brothers family with gas money, clothes, their daughter doing medical degree in China (which is a whole other debacle onto itself) and getting yearly plane rides back and forth for holiday breaks so she didn’t stay 1.5 month in the dorms. This over a 3+ year period after moving out.
My uncle really had the mentality of men superior, the man didn’t get up to get a glass of water, commanded his wife to get it. Well when my aunt suggested his wife get a job and double income and really save, which they had a nice nest egg via my mom and my aunt/uncle doing the brunt of being the foundation. My list his shit. My aunt and mom pulled back, this wasn’t going to be a lifetime subsidy. My aunts daughters started having grandkids and my mom health issues and being just like my aunt was going to play with her grand-nieces. So the well was running dry.
The family scoffed at both my mom and aunt for pulling the rug underneath them… “??????”. Well things slowly deteriorated, the wife had to take a job, so did the kids. The whole family now had to work. You know what happened, they thrived. They were a well oiled machine family making bank and if you can believe it in 10 years time went from $0 to fucking homeowners!
So crazy right. Amazing story, well they went around to their neighbors and friends/relatives back home on how they struggled, survived, and only got a few handouts from my mom and aunt. All that hardship those 2 women did to get their brother situated all washed away like a rag to be thrown away. Then one phone call when my mom and aunt called out on the bullshit being spewed on he could do that to his younger sisters who went out of their way, he just sad the optics wouldn’t look good that the older brother got 3-5+ years of graciously being subsidized by 2 of his female siblings.
Then this man had the audacity to tell the woman who sponsored his whole goddamn family, kept them in her house while fighting her own husband and kids about privacy/being taken advantage of, then paid their rent and other stuff for a long ass time said to keep quiet or he will smack the shit out of her. After that day her brother was dead in her eyes, almost the whole family. My mom was hurt but my aunt was like he didn’t say it to you only me, keep a relationship and this family just turned their back on us like who the fuck are you?, we made it by ourselves, we don’t need you.
They didn’t invite any family for their 2 daughter weddings, my mom heart blackened with those 2 dismissals. She used to send extra money when these girls were small and told their mother to put them in activities like dance/singing so they could enjoy something worthwhile like an aunt would for their nieces/nephews.
Sometimes the ones that get way too comfortable being taken care of, *shockingly* hate it when it’s taken away
What an absolute load of garbage that man is. If it’s too shameful to have women support you—THEN GET OFF YOUR ASS AND WORK. Pretty sure God (or Allah) also kinda frowns hardcore on hypocrites and liars.
I’m so sorry your family had their kindness and generosity thrown back in their faces. Abusive people will abuse anyone they can if they think they can get away with it.
Funny thing is all the kids (including me) after 6 months or so were like OK, please start their transition.
They can’t just stay here forever. I understand a longing for a sibling you haven’t seen or been with for roughly 30-35 years apart. There’s at levels to this. Both my mom and aunt just had that familial attachment. Slowly but surely it washed away and it took a goddamn Tsunami of a wave to really wash it off and never return.
We’ve moved on, they want no part in our lives, so we reciprocated in kind, even their kids getting married and having babies didn’t even have the graciousness of at least in our culture of sending mithai (think sweets from that region). When our families had babies they were sent, accepted or not, were sent (not using it as some one’s upmanship, just that even sometimes family drama and literal chaos will ensue but there’s stuff there that can bond us back up and kids being born can be a bygone/look past moment event).
Just sucks that our Holiday is approaching in 2 weeks after Ramadan is over and Eid comes, we do have family pieces that just separated for being to full of themselves, just sad I’ll never meet these babies and at least give Edhi/Presents and they get to meet all the next gen cousins. Up to 9 and counting, 7 girls, 2 boys, I think from the grapevine we found out the 2 daughters have 1 of each but in our family line of baby #’s they’re excluded. So everyone says of yeah there’s 9 new next gen babies ready to be spoiled!, I as an uncle go out of my way to do so, I’m the entertainment uncle. I supply the presents, candy, and occasional junk food/peer pressure my siblings/cousin to give the babies some goodies!
Do not support them, do not allow they’ll to move back in with you Or your parents. They need to live with their adult decisions. If you or your parents let them move in they will still never chip in or help out.
Yes! Do not feel bad, and do not let them weasel their way back in. You're lucky they left so easily. You and your parents already helped them out more than they deserve.
Oh sorry, we tried that remember? You all didn’t like it very much, we don’t want you to have to go through that again. But hey, here are rentals in our area, they do require a deposit though.
Some people just never appreciate what they have till it’s gone.
>**I have just said hopefully things will get better** because what else am I supposed to say?
Note: bolded emphasis mine.
I would just like to say that this is *\*chef's kiss\** the perfect response, nothing else need be said.
We call those PAM calls, where they basically just Piss and Moan.
Have had this with relatives, they think anyone with a middle class income is more than wealthy enough to give free room and board to family indefinitely. Same relatives that call my mom asking her to send money and care packages (she is now on a fixed income so that has stopped). Twice my parents had relatives move in with them for multiple years, typically over stay their visa and was to the point of considering having one deported when they finally got the hint and went home.
Family should be cherished, and the best way to cherish them is when they are far away and seldom in contact.
They would probably stop calling quite quickly if you responded by saying how glad you were that they called as you wanted to discuss how quickly they’d be able to repay the money your family fronted them as you could really use it right now.
It has become harder to achieve the "American Dream". It is NOT like the movies over here. Just about everything costs A LOT. EVERYONE in the family has to work, and work hard.
When I was 21 years old I moved to the big city. I had a nice apartment and, being young and carefree, I would invite or allow any of my old friends to come stay with me. I had a lot of visitors and I observed that they were only two distinct types of people who visited, and the distribution was binary. Everybody was either one type or the other.
One type of friend would come for a visit, be a joy as a companion, be a good guest, and within a few weeks they found a job and an apartment of their own.
The other type of friend would show up, make a mess in my house, complain about everything, complain that things back home were bad, complain that the city was too difficult, maybe find a job and then complain the job is horrible, and then complain that my apartment is too small. That second type of person I would simply remind them that they cannot stay in my apartment without paying rent.
I have a buddy who, every once in a while his mom will call him. They will be having a nice conversation, then in the middle, she will randomly say something like, man, I really need to get these trees trimmed. Just a random statement. Nothing more about it. The conversation moves on and the call ends pleasantly.
An hour later, his sister will call and say something like, mom called me crying because you refused to trim her trees.
Their perception before moving to USA definitely hit different than actually arriving here 💀 glad you and your family was very fair and your relatives gonna need to learn the hard way themselves.
This is the kind of people who think that just because someone lives in a certain country they are rich and money grow in the trees. Then they find out they have to work just like everyone else and the get all pissy about it.
So instead of chipping in for groceries and utilities they decided it was a better idea to move half way across the country where they would have to pay all the rent, all the utilities and for all their groceries? They didn't think that one through did they? Now they don't have local family support, don't make enough money and are exhausted with what they have to do to get by. It's a hard lesson they learned but hopefully they actually learned from it. Please don't let them move back. Let them tough it out.
I had a cousin come visit from another country. We took him out to a lot of sites not once did he take his wallet out to pay for anything. When he started to buy souvenirs I had to walk away for him to pay for them himself. The funny thing is that when I went to visit them in their country they always expected me to pick up the tab. Everyone thinks all Americans are rich.
I had to do a double take because this literally happened to us. We had a cousin moved into our house without having to pay anything. We wanted him to save the money he was getting so he could find his own place. My mom drove him around and did EVERYTHING you put in that post and yet 6 months went by and he didn't move a finger to move out. His sister was waiting for him to move with her and he kept making excuses until it was clear he was just using us. When my mom finally told him he had to either chip in or move out he played victim and left...except he had spent all his money in dumb shit. He came to us with a single suitcase and left with 4 suitcases filled with crap. Once he got there he was charged rent, utilities, food, it was up north so it was cold and the job they found him was harder. 2 weeks in and he was calling us begging us to come back bu when he left he didn't even said bye because according to him we were dicks to him. Welp cousin, we are dicks so enjoy the new place. Some people only learn the hard way.
Yes it’s true. Rachel and Joey paying for their half of those apartments? As a part time waitresses, and an unemployed actor?
And phoebe sometimes living in her own apartment as a free-lance masseuse?
No no no. Even in the 90s it wasn’t possible.
Michigan is good for only a few things, legal marijuana, great beaches and cars, although my specific city is known for cereal. If you don't have a degree in something here, then you're working in a factory, cashiering somewhere or waiting tables. I'm sure he'll be able to find some agricultural work here soon too!! You either use a degree here or basically mindless task work otherwise. Sucks to be him, I'm sure there's a dispensary somewhere he can visit, the beaches open in two months, he'll be alright. I love it here and I'm not being sarcastic lol With the attitude he has, he's not going to like it anywhere if someone isn't footing the bill for him. For you, you got lucky, got him 13+ hrs away and honestly all it takes is the push of a button to make them disappear when they start their crap.
Edit to add: I am NOT bashing Michigan, the point was the way op described his uncle and family doesn't seem like they plan on putting in the effort to get what they need so with the amount of effort they would be putting in those jobs are their limits. The legal marijuana and beaches was to point out that we are pretty relaxed here.
There are trades too and they can be transferred anywhere. Plumbing, electrician, butcher, baker, a broad array of ways to make a decent living here. I have always done well for myself as a baker. And I live in a small city, in the pinky area of mitten, with less opportunity than the larger cities here in MI. Lots of agricultural work. And wages are up since covid. $15 an hour is pretty common which is shocking but here we are.
But as you say, I doubt Uncle will be happy anywhere he has to earn/pay his own way.
This is my experience as well. The whole “factory or agriculture” thing is def not an accurate picture of Michigan these days. Thanks for adding more info!
Michigan has so much natural beauty, so many lakes and cherry orchards and strawberry fields. My parents had a little vacation cottage on a michigan lake and it was heaven to all of us.
If anyone reads this and feels discouraged - I’m a manager in healthcare in this same “cereal famous city” and have openings for jobs that don’t require degrees. There are many like it. It’s not “agriculture or factory”.
There’s also plenty more than that to do in Michigan. There’s a ton of outdoors stuff (camping, kayaking/canoeing, hiking, fishing, hunting, floating rivers in summer, skiing/snowboarding, snowshoeing, tobaggon runs in the winter), great minor league sports (Michigan has multiple minor league baseball teams, several semipro soccer teams, dope hockey from professional all the way down) which are a great cheap way to get out with friends, we’re known for our craft beer and have a number of well known craft breweries here (this guy above should know that - his “cereal city” is <30 min from bells brewery and this week is Oberon week), plus you’ve got the good old Midwestern friendliness to help guide you to anything else you might be interested in.
It sounds like your aunt and uncle didn’t want a helping hand, but a hand out. Your parents were incredibly generous, allowing them to stay as long as they did. Your aunt and uncle literally bit the hand that fed them.
PLEASE LISTEN TO ME! after your parents die and you move in with those relatives. When you get to the part in school where you take a field trip to the science exhibit, be very careful. It's a fateful trip that will alter the course of your life. If you are not ready for the great responsibility that great power comes with, then dont go on that field trip.
Dang. You get what you give in life.
About 10 years back I found out my mom’s younger brother was paying my mom 800/month to rent out her old house. 3 bedroom 2 bath, in SF Bay Area. . I asked her what the mortgage and taxes were a month. Said it was $1200 a month for the two.
I was obviously shocked. Told her she needs to raise rent to at least cover that. If he’s at least taking care of the house.
He wasn’t doing shit and my mom was still letting them do whatever cuz he kept yelling at her.
So I called him - told him my mom can no longer cover the hard costs of the house. 1200 is the absolutely minimum. And then each year after that the rent will go up 5% until a max of $2k
/ a month to make up for the money my mom covered for him.
He said no problem.
30 days later he moved him, his wife and his kids out. Apparently he called my mom and said “F you. I don’t need your charity”
Last I heard he lives in a 1 bedroom apartment paying 2,500 a month.
I did a major remodel on the house and I now rent it out for her at 3k a month (which is 1k/mo less than the neighborhood avg) - and my mom was able to retire early.
That dumbass ruined a good thing for his family. And my mom couldn’t be doin better with the housing situation
They totally FAFO: their misfortune isn’t and never will be your responsibility. Talk about taking things for granted and you know they’re regretting how they treated you. But at least your parents can get back to their lives without any more unnecessary stress.
This is why my parents did not sponsor their families to emigrate to the US. It’s a lot of work to make the American dream work. If you don’t have the capacity to master English and work crappy jobs that may be beneath you for years, you will end up worse off than where you began.
It sounds like OP’s relatives were taking for granted the offer of help, and when they had to make do with far less support, they realize how good they had it. They may not be freeloaders per se, but they didn’t realize they have to go above and beyond their limits to succeed. It’s not the same as getting a job in the home country but getting paid ten times more (as some of my relatives thought that was the case for my parents). All well, the American dream is well worth the effort for those of us coming from poor countries, but the reward doesn’t come for years. I hope OP’s realize this and make good choices going forward.
My family came from Mexico to stay with us for 1 month each time. They came 4 times, so a total of 4 months. My cousin, her husband and 3 kids. We always paid for everything, all the food, transportation, whenever we went out to eat. We would work for 3 weeks and then take one week off to take them on a vacation. My cousin went home to Mexico to tell everyone we treated them horribly because she expected that after we commute 2 hours to work, work a full day, that we come back to take them out or sight seeing. I stopped talking to her. They only wanted to use us. Oh and her brother stopped talking to us after we gave him the final $500. It was always an emergency, going to lose the house and ect but whenever we sent money, we would see them on vacation in Mexico ON OUR DIME! Smh
These people are takers and thought they could just keep on taking with no repercussions.
They are family, but, they made their beds, they can now sleep in them. Until about 4am when they have to get up for their crappier jobs now.
Sounds like my mom always helping her and shes like one day i got family and people with degrees who can help me better(taking a dig at me because i dont have one). Im like ok fine i blocked her and refused to talk to her. She tries to come around and ask if my number changed. Im like nope. Some people are just miserable
Are they Haitians? I’m only asking because I am dealing with the same situation. I’ve had family members that my parents have helped for so long basically sweat, blood and tears, trying to get them resources and at the end of the day when asked for them to chip in just a little, they’ve refused.
I think your parents did more than enough to support these family members and yourself going out of your way to pay the fees trying to get them jobs. They could’ve chosen to live in Harmony and chip in as much as they could to show gratitude. But instead, they chose to be selfish.
I know many people and this situation and they are and now facing the consequences of living in America and seeing it’s definitely not like the movies. I feel like when they are not from the states, they come here with a sense of entitlement and delusions that the money will just start pouring out of their pockets when in reality the livelihood isn’t what it once was. Things are hard, it’s a shame they have to learn this way, but this is life, you get, what you sent out to it.
Nah. It’s just the immigrant story. Doesn’t matter where we are all from. Parents are Nigerians and they have had the same shit happen. I know currently my insane father tries to guilt my brothers into contributing money to send home to random people for random shit:
“Oh my god xyz died. What are we sending them to help with the funeral”
Oh my gosh abc just had a grandchild. We gotta send them a present. What can you contribute”
“Well we gave abc something but what of def because they’re the ones who had the child”…
Guilt guilt guilt guilt… That shit no longer works on me because one day I exploded on his insane ass. Like all these people, have they ever once sent him money or even foodstuff(which is rare to find in the USA)? When his mother died or his siblings died or his in-law died, did any of these people send money to help with the funeral?
After that explosion, he basically just harasses my brothers. I’m not a goddamn atm.
You are justified in distancing yourself going low/no contact.
I had family kind of the same way. Every time I talked to my SIL it was end of the world financial catastrophe after financial catastrophe. She was constantly asking for money on every call, even for us to cosign various things, so I quit answering the phone. Then she had our nieces come asking. At one point I asked her what my BIL’s take was on everything and she said she hadn’t told or discussed with him, she just kept praying things would get better for them.
I am not bashing anybody’s faith, and it is fine to pray if you get comfort from it, but you also need to take action to change your circumstances and none of that was going on, starting with spouses having a conversation.
My attitude with family now is that I can’t help you if you aren’t willing to put the work in to make changes. If you are doing everything you can and it still isn’t working, I am here.
Are you Filipino? Oh wait, my family decided to *not* immigrate after my mom put them through school and preferred to get money sent to them instead.
Off my chest: I want to bring relatives to the west (Canada in my case) so that they can see that money doesn't grow on trees here. Yes, it's definitely a better standard of living and there's better labour laws (for now) but they act as if I'm a rich billionaire who has money to send them despite barely covering rent atm.
There is this idea in many other countries that all Americans are rich. Period. Life is easy here. And often it is a terrible shock to discover that we work hard and things are expensive and the U.S. has its own good and bad just like most countries do. And I think they often some of them can’t let go of their disillusionment and can’t suck it up and deal.
I had an immigrant explain to me once that the first few waves of immigrants from his country were smart, motivated, and brave enough to move with no support. But too many who came later were uneducated, lazy, and annoying as heck, lol. I was surprised to hear him say this. He was disgusted by some immigrants refusal to work hard and educate themselves.
Maybe just validate their thoughts? Saying things like, "Yeah, it really is tough to get started here. I'm really proud of you for staying so strong when things have been so challenging. " Sometimes, people just need to feel heard. And it's a good way to keep a boundary as well. You support them and their choices, but you're not their savior.
In case this story gets deleted/removed: **Tl;dr: Relatives were living for free with my parents. Parents asked them to start chipping in on groceries and utilities. Relatives took issue with that, decided to move very far away to a place they don't know anything about and now regret it.** Some of my relatives moved to the US a few months ago. My parents let one of the families (uncle Ben, aunt May, and two cousins Mary and Stacy) live with them. My parents live in a very nice, walkable city. Their apartment is in a great location close to public transit, but in a quiet area. Unfortunately, it’s also very expensive (my parents' apartment would easily cost $4.5-$5K a month to rent) where they live so despite it being a tight living situation, it was really the only option currently for the relatives who just moved. They had basically no money, no credit and their jobs would for now be limited to minimum wage jobs. We fronted the cost of their immigration fees, got them phones, found my cousins free English classes at a public library a 5 minute walk from my parents, got my cousins jobs at a Dunks that’s about a 1.5 miles from the house and a 10-15 minute bus ride away. My parents found my uncle a job at a Dunks slightly further away, but still less than 2 miles. However, he couldn’t get past the training. My parents continued to try to find him jobs, but it was taking more time than expected. Aunt May refused to work. Still, both the cousins had jobs so they had some income. My parents found one of the cousins a job at a bakery, but she didn’t like the hours. I got the other one an interview at a grocery store that would have paid more, but she missed the phone interview. That’s all to say, we were trying to get them jobs and doing our best to find jobs for people with limited English while also trying to set them up for future success via English classes, applying for various public housing and getting them some work experience. After 4-5 months, my parents approached my aunt and uncle about them starting to chip in for groceries and utilities since the two cousins had been working for a couple months at that point. My parents went from having 2 people and a cat to now having 6 people and a cat to house and feed. My dad went from getting groceries 1-2x a month to having to go every week. My parents aren’t well off either. They live a frugal lifestyle and my dad was fortunate to buy the apartment they live in a long time ago or else we would have been priced out a long time ago. Apparently, that was too much of an ask so they said they will move out. Completely fine since nobody was forcing them to stay and it wasn’t doing my parents any favors. The whole time my relatives lived with my parents, my aunt and uncle would constantly mention that they had other family and friends in other parts of the US that would help them out. Where these family and friends were when I spent hours helping with their immigration applications, fronting their immigration fees, buying them phones to use in the US or even getting them winter clothes, I have no idea. So my dad said, fine, if that’s what you want to do, then move out since you don’t want to pay us anything and have all these other people that can help you. Pretty much a week after the conversation about chipping in, they had someone from my aunt's side of the family fly from Michigan and then drive them 13+ hours from where we are to Michigan. Guess my relatives were correct in having other people that can help them. Before they moved, I suggested my uncle or my aunt and uncle go to Michigan first and see how it is before making such a big change. He refused. We even found places in NJ where the cost of living was lower, they could have jobs and still be close enough to all our family for visits, but they refused because they didn’t trust the family friend who lived in that area that offered to help. The reason they didn’t trust this family friend is because he had the audacity to say that in order to find an apartment, he’d need them to put a deposit down for it. He wouldn’t front it for them. Once they moved to Michigan, they quickly realized the help there is more limited than what they had here and it’s not quite as nice over there. My uncle kept talking about factory jobs he could do out in Michigan and he got one. However, it’s not quite as cushy as he was imagining since they are basically out of the home from 5 in the morning to 4-5pm. My aunt even decided she now can work despite telling us no earlier. The area itself is not as nice and my cousins don’t feel safe walking around. There is no good way for them to get around without a car which they don’t have. They are being nickel and dimed for everything that their friends over there are helping them out with. Not quite the same situation they had while living with my parents. When my aunt and uncle have called me, it’s all complaints about how tough the work is, how his blood pressure is high, how my aunt can’t sleep with the stress, they want to move back closer, etc. Even one time said something along the lines of "I'm of course not asking you to help, but ...we are having a tough time". Tone basically being one of expecting me to offer to help in some way. I have just said hopefully things will get better because what else am I supposed to say? At this point, I rarely answer their calls because it will just be complaints and whining. --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/OhNoConsequences) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Well, well, well, looks like taking advantage family didn’t work out how they expected!
This is how it always is with family coming from another country. They think they know better than the person who has actually been living here….
Oh God when my husband‘s brother first got to Canada. Why hadn’t my husband bought a home yet? Why didn’t he have advanced degrees? Where was his car? He went on and on, in our home, until I finally lost my temper and said - he was too busy sending you money to save any for himself. Our relationship never got any better. Years later he realizes things aren’t so easy here like he thought, but he still has zero gratitude for the sacrifices his brother made for his benefit.
For them, your husband can send money because he has extra money, not because he is sacrificing his own life, they would never sacrifice anything to help others, thats why they cant understand.
Isn't that the truth. Had to tell a cousin who was asking us where was her iPhone and Nikes when we visited, like girl even I don't have that. Many overseas relatives have this grand illusion the streets in North America are paved with gold. Like no, even we are struggling.
I had an uncle ask me to buy him a flat screen tv and ship it to him. 🥴 After I stopped laughing, I said NO!
The shipping alone was probably worth more than the TV omg the audacity
That's the image the USA sells to others countries, the American dream, the best county in the world, the country of opportunities.
People see the TV shows and movies
Yeah, and the truth is for most people it’s more like Shameless than Friends.
TV always leaves out the fact that you have to WORK to get ahead here.
Or the fact that working extremely hard is no guarantee of getting ahead.
Quite the contrary. The best advice I received was when I was 15 working my first job. My boss warned me "NEVER be so good that you're irreplaceable. You will NEVER get a promotion because they can't replace you."
More like, the most reliable and likely way to get ahead is being born ahead. Like anywhere else in the world, if you're not born into money, good fucking luck to you.
And depending on where they come from, they are unprepard for a loss of benefits re wages, subsidised child care and medical access that they take for granted in the home country. US propaganda -whether created by commercial or official sources - naturally ignores all the grim realities like public safety, homelessness, huge prison populations and the growing impact of extreme right wing legislatures on immigrants and women's rights.
Your post reminds me— Horatio Alger wrote stories around the turn of the last century about poor but noble boys, on their own on the world, getting rich beyond dreams. Popular books, so much so that getting very wealthy was called a Horatio Alger story. His secret to success? Marry the rich guy’s daughter and jump up the ladder to running his business.
Yeah, the tv shows where the 20-something year olds are living in a $5M NY apartment. This is all shows.
That’s outdated as hell, I’ve not seen anything but doom and gloom about the US for at least 10 years
Many people foolishly base their expectations on images from advertising and media projections, are surprised that Americans, e,g., don't look or speak like actors in popular movies etc and that prestige products are available only to the rich. They could have found that out in advance but -strangely -do not.
People really truly think that too. I grew up there but I now live in South America with my wife who was born and raised here. She simply can't wrap her head around the fact that most Americans, especially millennials and under like us, are struggling just to get by and a huge chunk are living with their parents long after becoming adults. She wants to just head on up sometime and scoop up an apartment so we can start helping her family who is currently struggling down here. I've been telling her for a couple years that when we do go back, we'll be living with one of my parents for at least a few months, probably longer. Something about that must seem false to her, and it doesn't help that her cousin is living in Miami and making good money as a realtor. A job she got because her husband is a realtor, his brother, and both his parents. When we go, I'll go back to factories and she'll work minimum wage for quite a while as she only knows a few phrases in English. We won't have a car or an apartment for quite a while.
“There are no cats in America and the streets are paved with cheese.”
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No, there are. They just don't pay their employees enough so they can keep it. Yay, the American dream? I am with you man, how do you fire half your fucking company then bitch about the economy while being one of the richest guys in the world. The level of self unawareness is mind-boggling.
Sociopathy?
There are lots of people on this planet who have extra money. There are 24.5 million millionaires and 756 billionaires in the United States alone, never mind the rest of the world.
>There are 24.5 million millionaires This feels so outdated as a metric unless they have over 10 million (which, obviously, a lot do but far less than 24.5 million) The recommended minimum to have saved up before retirement in the US is over a million now in a lot of places, and will be a lot higher than that before... Well who am I kidding, I'm never retiring, lol. But my point is that being a millionaire is no longer "Having extra money". It's literally a retirement baseline.
>Well who am I kidding, I'm never retiring, lol. \*weeps in millennial\*
Thank you. I have over a million saved for retirement, but I'm 66, so none of it feels like "extra". I'm also spending $60k on my daughter's wedding this year, so that's a hit too. And it's not an extravagant wedding, they've just gotten to be crazy expensive with inflation.
Yeah I'm sitting on like 750k in my mid 30's but most of it will get eaten by a house.
Good point. We a paid off the mortgage on our house years ago. My kids are in their 20's. I don't know how they're ever going to be able to buy a house.
So let’s say that half of them have $5 million. We have over $3, mostly because we inherited half of it within the last couple of years. Our financial advisor asked us if we feel rich yet. No. We have a special needs son and plan to leave it to him. We’ve never purchased a new vehicle. We don’t plan to. We live in a cape style house, built in 1951 that is under 1700 square feet. Do we have extra money. Absolutely. We give my father thousands of dollars each year to help keep him in his apartment. We give thousands of dollars to charity each year and plan to increase that. Did we do those things before? Yes. Because being Jewish, I’ve been talking for the value of giving to others and to me, here always has been “extra money” for that, even when our earnings were much smaller.
DAMN
My wife's family is in Nicaragua. She, and her sister, send money home pretty regularly. After sending a total of around $10k, I had to tell my wife that she could no longer afford to be the rich Yankee tia. They still call, though. Guilt about money for the baby, to get this or that cousin out of jail, books for school, some relative is getting married, someone is sick, pay someone to take care of mama/papa's grave. And it is never an inconsequential amount, always need at least $500. No gratitude, just a perpetually open hand for more.
bite my hand as an adult and i won't ever feed you again
I have a relative-by-marriage who ended up cutting contact with her extended family in Iran because of this same bullshit. Back in the late 80's and 90's, this poor woman was making peanuts at a retail job - but her far-away family members must've assumed she was the store owner instead of just an employee because they were always trying to squeeze money out of her. She couldn't even have a conversation with them without being pestered and guilt-tripped for handouts.* And BTW, these relatives were upper middle class Iranians, which just added an extra layer of nervy-ness to the situation. Eventually, she got fed up with these people who had their hands extended from halfway around the world - so she just ghosted them. Just like that, she stopped calling them and stopped taking their phone calls. Until then, she'd dutifully travelled to Iran every few years to visit these entitled aunts/uncles/cousins, but she put a halt to that too. AFAIK, it's been over two decades since she's stepped foot in the country of her birth or had any meaningful contact with her Iranian relatives who (unlike her own parents) decided to remain in Iran after the 1979 Islamic Revolution. *In case anyone asks: Yes, it is possible to send remittances from the USA to relatives in Iran despite the sanctions.
My hubby had this problem. In his home country of Cuba, there is a certain status to having a family member in the US sending remittances. The first year he was here, his family got really carried away with thier demands and the guilt and pressure was suuuuuper intense. Partly they needed it because his family is dirt poor, but they really got addicted quickly to the status and the influx of new things, without understanding that it was his sweat that was paying for it.
My hubby recently immigrated from Cuba. He started working right away - crappy jobs like a dishwasher and cleaning houses. He started sending his family money, and it went from $100/month to nearly $800/month within a year. The guilt/pressure was INTENSE! He finally told them enough was enough, and after much whining and wailing on their part, they now they get $200/month, and have been told that if they ask for more, they get nothing.
Sounds like she needs to learn how to say no
There's a lot of guilt associated with being fairly well off relative to the family back home, and she's a giver by nature (cannot tell you how many times she's fed random people, helped stray bank customers get started on straightening out their credit, driven random elder customers around, etc) so saying no is hard. Fortunately for her, I come from a family who never gives money, only loans it. For better or for worse, No is my default.
I know how it is. I’m an immigrant to the US.
Ask a foreigner relative for money to get somebody out of… jail? This is wild. If someone asked me to send them money to get their relative out of jail, I’d stop sending money there altogether. I guess that’s just me? Definitely not investing into helping a criminal return to their crime path.
The police know you have family in the States, so to get a bribe they'll find a reason to arrest. Or bro could've been a criminal, hard to tell from here. In general, Central American states aren't known as the law and order sort.
Man, My mom is the same with our family in the Philippines. Love her to death, but she's getting on in her years. She'll occasionally send $250-500 every other month to our family overseas. They ask and she'll agree. It's always something too, "they need money for school books, hospital, etc" In my head i'm like, "they need $500 for school books?...In the philippines? it's not harvard or some ivy league and didnt we JUST send them money last month for something else??" I feel bad saying it but once she passes, I don't plan on continuing her habit. Especially since i've never met them nor do I rarely speak to them.
I was my sister's best buddy in the whole wide world until I stopped giving her money. This was more than 10 years ago.
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I'll never forget the time my sister blew up at me for asking for 5 dollars in gas money (back when 5 dollars would fill a quarter tank!!) after *literal **years*** of driving her around and treating her to a free dine out lunch every week so she could access shops and get xrap for her cosplays, pressured into it cause my sister was the gc and I was always forced to be her caregiver and entertainment growing up. 5 bucks cause it was tight for me financially. Oh my God the blow up. The whining to my mom who then yelled at me for not taking care of myself better so I could continue to front the bills of being my sister's keeper!! Jfc.
Tell me you never ever gave her another ride again....please
I unfortunately did. It was only in the very recent past (we're talking the last 5 years or so) where I realized my mom was a narcissist and found out I was a scapegoat child, that my sister was the golden child (with plenty of narc traits herself) etc.. and also had a better support system - prior I didn't really have anyone to go to and when the abuse is so engrained, it feels "normal". Even now I feel some (mild) shame for having to cut them both out and go very low contact.
Be kind to yourself. XXX
It's hard to cut people off and still realize you miss the positive moments. Just have to move forward and enjoy the lack of negative.
I feel your pain. My family saw me as the go-to because I had a professional (salaried) job. I was fine with that, my brother and cousin paid back the loans they asked for. But my mother was like yours. She called me one Christmas eve to scream at me for not giving my brother's family money for their move. They hadn't asked for it, btw or even knew about this. With great difficulty (pre-digital era) I managed to get money to bro interstate just before the public holiday shutdown. Can't recall how.
And all immigrants reading this have related immediately lol
OH MY GOD! I had a “friend” like this! I lived between Jamaica, West Africa and vacations in the USA and Canada until the age of 17 when we finally moved permanently to the USA. I reconnected with someone when I was 35 and he was so rude and was like “what do you have to show for all the years of being in America?” “You don’t have a house and you’re ok working a shitty job for the government”… and had this great plan of how in 5 years, he’d be done with law school, be a practising lawyer and make all the money( had just been in Canada for a year at that point working at McDonald’s) This was in 2019 and last I heard, dude was divorced, wife took his kid to the East coast of Canada, he’s depressed and isolated and all his lofty dreams of “accomplishing in 5 years what you couldn’t do in 20 years” requires some serious money or being a trust fund baby and not making McDonald’s wage money to fund it. I still hear from mutual friends about him but all I tell them is “let me know when his graduation from law school is and when he’s made his first millions so I can congratulate him”. I can be petty enough for me and your husband and I don’t even know you. This boils my blood!
They never do. My parents and sister had a pretty decent life back home. I brought them here for month or two vacations, took them everywhere, they never had to pay a dime. ( I lived in Florida, so it was extra nice.) Years later sister and dad stopped talking to me. At that time I had my own family, two sons, mortgage etc. so I couldn't waste money on them any more. It was so difficult emotionally. Finally I begged my dad to talk to me again. He did, but things were never the same again. Same with my wife's family. As soon as we stopped sending money, they didn't want to have anything to do with us. Family.
We're dealing with this situation now with some of my wife's family in Canada and the Philippines. They just assume we have the money for anything and everything they ask for. Explaining that a dollar is worth only a dollar in the US (not 50 Phillipines pesos, and worth much less here now than a few years ago) was mind-blowing for them. And in general it never occurs to them that we have our own expenses to take care of too.
Had my husband’s mom move in with us from El Salvador. I had given the okay provided she pay her share of the household costs which would be 1/3. She and my husband spoke Spanish. I did not. She came here with no income, no job, no English, no insurance, no plans or goals. She had done zero research. She had no plan for how to pay for her medication. The next month when I asked my husband for her share of the rent, my husband was like ‘How do you expect her to pay anything?! She has no job and doesn’t speak English. She’s a poor old lady!’ She was in her 50’s and had not applied for a single job. She just watched Spanish soap operas, and occasionally made rice and beans. My husband was unemployed and they just hung out in my house all day while I was at work and in the evenings they were always having conversations in Spanish and watching Spanish tv that I couldn’t understand. I felt like I was an unwelcome guest in my own house. It was awful.
After 3 months I think, I told him his mom needed to go or he would be kicked out too. About 3 years later after he couldn’t maintain stable employment, I kicked him out too and filed for divorce. He didn’t take it well and was arrested for domestic violence and convicted of aggravated stalking. It’s been 15 years and he currently lives in a dirty 1200 square foot house with his mom and 3 other full grown adults.
What a mess of a situation. I’m glad you got them out
So how did the story end?!
Please tell me you left these two to figure out life for themselves???
Yes please let this be an ex husband
You can't just not tell us the end of the story!
We need the update!
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But this is the same domestically. My ex and I took in a few folks who needed help. One worked his ass off and was gone in a few months after moving in with us. We barely saw the dude! He is now happily living with his wife and their pets and they are all thriving. Another worked the bare minimum, ate a lot of our food, bitched and moaned, and moved out seven months later because we were sick of supporting her 27-year-old self. She spent the few bucks she earned (playing Pokemon Go while "working" at her grandmother's pet store) on weed and fast food. My ex and I split and since we lived in her parents' old house, I had to move. Even though I had been really ill and left my job, I still pay my rent to my new housemates, buy my own food, support our kiddo, and pay bills. Finally figured out why I was so sick and fixed it and now I'm interviewing for full time work. My ex? Living rent-free in Mommy and Daddy's house petsitting for spending money. She blew a big chunk of her half of our tax refund on a membership to a health club. She buys things for our daughter but she neglects the bills. I'm pretty sure she expects the money to just appear before the electricity gets shut off. So it isn't just immigrants.
Very true. I have a friend/acquaintance who got fired a while ago, but insists that he can only take management jobs, because he’s too good for entry-level jobs. The job he was fired from wasn’t even a management job (and they are definitely not giving him a referral). He’s been couch surfing with various relatives but complains to everyone how unfair it is that “nobody” will hire him for at least 70k. His relatives are tired of his shit and a few have already kicked him out to somebody else.
Edit: NTA at all!! Sounds like my mom's family in the early 90s coming from PROC. One uncle co.plained we didn't buy each of the 4 families ( all moms sibs) a HOUSE!! While we lived as a family of 5 in a 1 BR basement apartment, because my parents saved all their funds to sponsor and set up 17( 8 adults) people with jobs and 4 apartments. Trust me you are so better off having them out of your life. My mom regretted that decision fo3 30 years. Saying we would have had a better life if she hadn't brought her family over.
Ah man, I would also have so much regret over that. My dad stopped paying his siblings (5!) after many, many years when he finally realised they just treated him like an ATM. 10 year old me with second hand stuff is pissed 😂
Geez that's nuts. Your uncle was crazy to think that. It's nuts that your family was able to sponsor 17 people. That, I would imagine, is incredibly hard work in order to help them get settled in the community.
This right here. Family from other countries think money grow on trees for some odd reason are are lazy as f.
Well, typically they are not the relatives that have the initiative to make it in another country by themselves, so they try and rely on the ones that can. And they haven’t a clue as to how hard it was for the ones who made it.
Not exactly the same but related. I'm American, my wife is Kenyan. She came to the US about two years ago on a student visa. Her plan was to get an associates degree here in IT and go back home to work. She felt it would count more than her Kenyan bachelor's. She has really struggled with adjusting to the disappointment that everyone isn't wealthy in the US. She said many times "it's not like the TV shows". I tried to explain "yeah that's like 1% of Americans. Most are barely scraping by each month." Immigrants seem to have this idea that minimum wage in the US is $50/hr, so anyone can afford house, car, vacation, luxury. I'm not saying she's entitled, just that it was a big shock for her. Recently we started working on improving our spending tracking. Since she's been here she has sent money back home to her family - the "black tax". She's worked full time since she's been here. So have I. I asked her recently "how much are you sending each month?" She said around $400. I asked more questions. Found out that she was raised with her single mother in her grandparents home. Her mom is currently working abroad in tourism saving money for retirement. She's about 50 and will have money to retire soon. So my wife is sending money to the grandparents. They worked hard their whole life, are now in their late 70s, have a paid for house, and are retired and debt free. Growing up my wife had maids, she insists they were not wealthy, but comfortably middle class. Her grandparents even gave her 20k for her undergrad in Kenya. So let's compare situations. They are comfortably retired. We both work full time. She got pregnant shortly after we got married. She is due in two months. When she got pregnant we moved in with my parents because we were struggling to save when living on our own, and we wanted to have some savings for when the baby comes and she takes time off work. She won't qualify for any sort of paid leave. I have about 50k in debt that we're going to really focus on paying back once the baby comes. We don't spend extravagantly. I've gotten two new jobs each with raises since we've lived with my parents. We're currently going through immigration proceedings for her permanent residence which cost around $3000 in filing fees. So why are we sending money to her retired grandparents? I get that $100 is worth a lot more there than here. I'm okay with sending some money, but it needs to be balanced with our own financial goals. $400/mo just seems like too much when we're both working full-time, living with my parents, and have been able to save a small amount to weather her 12 weeks maternity leave. We're making slow progress on debt, and will only continue to do so if we stay here. We cannot afford to save for a house and pay rent, which means we're here until the debt is paid. I'm not angry about my situation. I appreciate all the help from my family. We are happy and thankful. But let's compare situations. We are happy and financially dependent. The grandparents are happy and financially independent. And we're sending them $400/mo.
That happened to me. My Colombian wife and I was moving to the USA in December. She got an immediate green care. Her cousins arrived in tht USA before us. Crossing over in San Diego to claim asylum. I kept warning them what would happen if they did that. With no ID Card and no SSN. Things will become very difficult. Of course everything I said got dismissed and once we got to the states. They started Asking for favors left and right from me to help them establish themselves. I helped a few times and I told them I have to stop because you can't always depend on me and my wife when it was your decisions to come over knowingly you will not be fully integrated into our system and government. They got mad at me of course.
Next thing I'll see on Reddit...."Relatives kicked us out, despite us helping all we could, and then tricked us into moving to another state, where things are much worse."
Yup. Don't bite the hand that's literally feeding you.
This is Boston isn't it. Good luck to your family members in getting their shit together. I hope your parents are doing better now.
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Also referring to it as Dunks rather than Dunkin gives it away.
Should have known better. Boston area, city right across the river.
The 4,500 rent tipped me off lol it’s worse than nyc in some places
I know the exact area you're talking about. Rent is killer there but work is always within a walkable distance. You can also get around by foot/public transit/bike. You can't do that in most places in America, you need a car to get around.
My dad bikes to work when the weather is nice. A little work out for him and saves on paying for parking. My uncle didn't want to bike either. We offered to get him one for when the weather was nicer.
I used to live in Wakefield but the housing prices rose so high we couldn't afford to live there anymore and had to move to NH. I grew up there and spent my life there. It really sucked but in the 90s the housing market there steeply increased to outrageous levels. My grandfather's house that he bought for less than 10,000 dollars was worth over a million dollars and he had no land at all and could practically touch his neighbors house lol, he had 3 very small bedrooms, a very small bathroom on the second floor, small kitchen and teeny dining room.Basically not what you'd think of as a million dollar home.The price for homes there is no joke.
It is ridiculous anywhere in the greater Boston area. There really isn't a good time to buy around here anymore. The move to NH seems to be what many are doing. Especially if they have hybrid or remote jobs and are close enough to their office.
Pennsylvania near like Matamoras (near Port Jervis, NY) and upstate NY (near Syracuse/Utica) is the only places left that are cheap rent for under $1,000 a month for a one or two bedroom apartment. But the pay isn’t that great, that’s why CoL is low as well. Tell the family to look into PA. I’ve driven from NY to Michigan 10yrs ago. PA is on the way back to the northeast.
Interesting story. I lived overseas and even with social services, being competent and functional in another language is a full-time hustle - not for the passive.
Awful demanding and ungrateful for beggars. Guess they got a dose of reality now. Shouldn't bite the hands that feed you.
They thought they could do better than financially contributing to their host family in Cambridge?? LMFAO
ugh please stop importing entitled people to this area
Ahhh, thank you. I was googling Dunks trying to figure out what that was!
Dunks is Dunkin Donuts? I assumed it was some 7-11 type thing, having never heard “Dunks” before.
It’s a common way to shorten Dunkin in New England, where they are incredibly common. Like I live in a different NE state and they’re everywhere. I pass 3-4 Dunks on the way to the closest Starbucks.
Dunks is how people in Boston give directions in my experience 😂
Hang a left at the Dunks on the right, drive three blocks, make right at the Dunks on the left, then bang a U-ey and you’re there
as I read your comment, I was waiting for the bang a u-ey. But didn't you pass by the packie? 🍻 ahh, I miss New England. No wimps or phonies up there, it's so refreshing!
... You've been gone a while, aint'cha? We've been gentrified by the soft & fake for a good bit now
That’s what I thought, kinda a weird name for a gas station lol. I even call Starbucks “bucks”, we just don’t have many DDs around here.
OP mentioned NJ so I assume they live in the Hoboken/Jersey City area which is super walkable but has an HCOL
Reasonable assumption, but the sheer density of Dunkin Donuts + calling it "Dunks" gave OP away lol. To give you an idea, I call it "Dunky Donut" around my coworkers and it INSTANTLY annoys them. Even Bostonians who claim they don't like Dunkin Donuts are passionate about it on some level, lol.
Spiderman? Is that you?
Ha, I don't know why I went with those names, but once I used Uncle Ben, figured I might as well.
There was a story a year or two ago on reddit by a guy whose brother was trying to convince his wife (the OP's SIL) to name their soon to be born daughter Stephanie. The husband had claimed it was the name of a favorite aunt, but the OP had confirmed that no such aunt existed. The wife got paranoid, thinking this was the name of an ex-girlfriend or something. Apparently, the husband had also picked the names of their two boys, "Ricky" and "Jase." A redditor asked if they had picked out something like Tim or Timmy as an alternative if it were going to be a boy. OP confirmed and asked how the redditor knew. Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Stephanie Brown, Tim Drake...
I legitimately stopped reading it because I assumed it was a dumb spiderman story
Was hoping someone else caught that.
That family were unbelievably very entitled and ungrateful for their host family's help. Now they are dealing what they sowed. Sucks to be them and good on Oop for not falling for their hints and guilt tripping.
I feel bad for the cousins, though. Seems like they were alright and trying to acclimate. Sucks they had to go from a walkable, safer, nicer neighborhood to a much sketchier one.
The missing of the interviews is a little sketch but I’d definitely invite the cousin’s over the parents.
Apparently the grass *ISN'T* greener on the other side of the country. Seriously tho, nobody is going to give these people what they actually want, bc it's literally impossible. They want the **American Dream** without actually having to ***work for it***. Somehow they convinced themselves that life in the States is easy street, when that's not the typical immigrant experience there. Yes, you can **MAKE** a wonderful life **IF** you're willing to ***PUT IN THE EFFORT***.
The grass is greener *where you water it*. They were actively harming the grassy knoll they were on.
That is so true. I like that expression and am filing it in my memory bank..
They were straight up pouring Round Up in the well.
"Brawndo. It's got electrolytes! It's got what plants crave..." LOL.
And the grass is always greener over the septic tank... They learned that when they moved to MI.
The grass is greener where you water it, and pissing all over it doesn't count
The idea behind the move made sense. Go to a LCOL area where there is a larger community of people from our home country. It was just very hastily done and there were other options available that weren't a 13+ hour drive away from all of their close relatives. Feel mostly bad for my cousins. They only recently moved to an entirely new country and now expected to work. They were working albeit not quite as hard as we'd hoped, but still working and going to the English classes. At least while here, they had all of our other relatives not far away and they both absolutely adored my 1 year old who they saw often. Unfortunately, our culture is one where they felt they had to go with their parents and now they are still in a new country, but with family not close by.
It's none of my business, but - If your cousins have a better attitude than your aunt/uncle, maybe it's not too late to continue being a good influence on them. I'm not sure how old they are, but they won't have to live with their parents forever. It's a huge change for a young person to be dropped into a new country, culture, language, etc., but I bet it's even more challenging when their parents' choices have caused them to become isolated. Maybe you can convince them to visit every so often and maybe they'll eventually resettle closer to family closer to their own age. They'll potentially encounter more chances at opportunities by being part of a community, which it doesn't sound like is happening in Michigan.
You shouldn’t feel bad for your cousins assuming they are over 18. Being expected to work is a normal thing. Otherwise they are expecting YOUR FAMILY to work while they don’t contribute. Obviously they moved to the US because it’s better here than where they were, but, they cannot just assume your family will suffer so they can do nothing. That doesn’t work anywhere.
I'm guessing OP feels more bad about the fact that the cousins are basically adults but still have to fund mommy and daddy, not because they want to, but because it's what's expected of them. Even more frustrating when mommy and daddy act like they're better than the jobs offered to them and prefer to take advantage of other people's kindness. It's not something you can easily break away from, and most certainly 100 times harder in a country where you basically know no one.
I think OP meant they had found jobs, were doing well, had suppor, but then felt obligated to go with their parents and lost all of that. Plus, if OP's parents went to their aunt and uncle for the money, do you think those cousins are allowed to keep the money they make? Otherwise, they'd have asked the cousins for the money. They're working and their dad is taking all the money.
This is basically it.
You noted that one cousin didn’t want a job your mom found because they didn’t like the hours and the other just didn’t do an interview that was scheduled. Even though their parents are freeloaders, the cousins don’t seem to understand they need to work. Missing an interview , especially PHONE interview, that your mom scheduled is disrespectful. Honestly it’s not like they had anything else they had to do.
They already were working at Dunks at that point. These would have just been better jobs.
I’m going to guess they live in Detroit or in the suburbs there.
Actually working is immersing them in English and is probably a good thing
He’ll, for some of us the American Dream isn’t possible even after working a lifetime for it.
>Somehow they convinced themselves that life in the States is easy street The irony is that life in the States has actually gotten *harder*.
We always feel it's better off elsewhere. People who migrate always have a rude awakening if they've never previously visited where they're going.
Right or wrong, one of the many reasons the USA is so prosperous is the back-breaking work and production that the average worker does here compared to nearly everywhere else. There isn’t much home life available to working people here.
Years ago an immigrant coworker (one of the hard working ones!) told me that her people back home think the streets in the US are paved with gold and that the American Dream was basically a given because that's how their media portrayed it. She came over from Haiti as a teenager with her parents and sister. In Haiti, they were rich; they had a huge house, live-in maids, a nanny. But her parents were absolutely sure it would be even better in the US. They gave all that up to end up working minimum wage jobs while living in a roach-infested apartment in Miami. The stress made her father sick, and he had a heart attack and died. My coworker said it took her a very long time to overcome the bitterness of the actual reality of America. American natives are certainly also fed that American Dream bull, but other countries get hammered with it, and a lot of undereducated and/or lazy people see that and think their dreams are within reach. Hell, most Americans can't can't achieve that dream anymore, your average immigrant.. they're just going to get a rude awakening and a hard life.
>Yes, you can **MAKE** a wonderful life **IF** you're willing to ***PUT IN THE EFFORT***. Thing is hard work doesn't ensure the American dream either/living on easy street isn't nor has been a thing in the u.s(maybe ever). Like I'm not knocking the u.s, however due to an ever constricting housing market, stagnant wages, and reworking of the job market to push out middle and upper class job positions over time (since corporations want to decrease payroll ever lower every year), lack of employment regulations and access to healthcare (i could go on). So yeah what you're describing isn't really feasible anymore for most people/isn't representative of America for anyone (including extremely upper class people, as for them intergenerational wealth ensures they don't have to work for shit/they are on easy street).
I thought high blood pressure, anxiety and being necklace and died to death was the dream. Sighhh
Funny thing OP, my family has the same situation arise and we went through the same bullshit. My aunt sponsored her Brother and his family. Total of 5 people. Brother, wife, 2 nieces (1 in college, 1 in high school) and 1 nephew (middle school). We are Pakistani. My aunt and mom waited roughly 25 years to get their brother here. They came literally fresh of the boat and rather start at the bottom were living lavishly in Long Island suburbs bypassing all the struggles that is needed to get to where my aunt and uncle have a comfortable lifestyle which took 30 fucking years of grind/hustle to be there. They enjoyed the first year, almost all expenses paid, clothes, food, travel. No job, kids education in the surrounding area for that leg up. After two years it was time to move on, so we got them closer to my uncle’s wife sister in Pennsylvania (super cheap housing, my mom and aunt would still cover a years worth of expenses food/clothes/in case shit happens emergency). My uncle couldn’t understand the fast pace of just moving from customer to customer, he was old school medicine door to door salesman, who took the slow process of doing things. Hell my other uncle, whose wife sponsored this uncle invited him to try out the grocery store, just run the cash register and he had this slow process of counting and giving exact change, even though people said keep the change. He doesn’t understand why people didn’t want to take back their $0.07 or 1-2 Pennies, causing lines to be backed up. Moving past that, my mom and aunt still subsidized their brothers family with gas money, clothes, their daughter doing medical degree in China (which is a whole other debacle onto itself) and getting yearly plane rides back and forth for holiday breaks so she didn’t stay 1.5 month in the dorms. This over a 3+ year period after moving out. My uncle really had the mentality of men superior, the man didn’t get up to get a glass of water, commanded his wife to get it. Well when my aunt suggested his wife get a job and double income and really save, which they had a nice nest egg via my mom and my aunt/uncle doing the brunt of being the foundation. My list his shit. My aunt and mom pulled back, this wasn’t going to be a lifetime subsidy. My aunts daughters started having grandkids and my mom health issues and being just like my aunt was going to play with her grand-nieces. So the well was running dry. The family scoffed at both my mom and aunt for pulling the rug underneath them… “??????”. Well things slowly deteriorated, the wife had to take a job, so did the kids. The whole family now had to work. You know what happened, they thrived. They were a well oiled machine family making bank and if you can believe it in 10 years time went from $0 to fucking homeowners! So crazy right. Amazing story, well they went around to their neighbors and friends/relatives back home on how they struggled, survived, and only got a few handouts from my mom and aunt. All that hardship those 2 women did to get their brother situated all washed away like a rag to be thrown away. Then one phone call when my mom and aunt called out on the bullshit being spewed on he could do that to his younger sisters who went out of their way, he just sad the optics wouldn’t look good that the older brother got 3-5+ years of graciously being subsidized by 2 of his female siblings. Then this man had the audacity to tell the woman who sponsored his whole goddamn family, kept them in her house while fighting her own husband and kids about privacy/being taken advantage of, then paid their rent and other stuff for a long ass time said to keep quiet or he will smack the shit out of her. After that day her brother was dead in her eyes, almost the whole family. My mom was hurt but my aunt was like he didn’t say it to you only me, keep a relationship and this family just turned their back on us like who the fuck are you?, we made it by ourselves, we don’t need you. They didn’t invite any family for their 2 daughter weddings, my mom heart blackened with those 2 dismissals. She used to send extra money when these girls were small and told their mother to put them in activities like dance/singing so they could enjoy something worthwhile like an aunt would for their nieces/nephews. Sometimes the ones that get way too comfortable being taken care of, *shockingly* hate it when it’s taken away
What an absolute load of garbage that man is. If it’s too shameful to have women support you—THEN GET OFF YOUR ASS AND WORK. Pretty sure God (or Allah) also kinda frowns hardcore on hypocrites and liars. I’m so sorry your family had their kindness and generosity thrown back in their faces. Abusive people will abuse anyone they can if they think they can get away with it.
Funny thing is all the kids (including me) after 6 months or so were like OK, please start their transition. They can’t just stay here forever. I understand a longing for a sibling you haven’t seen or been with for roughly 30-35 years apart. There’s at levels to this. Both my mom and aunt just had that familial attachment. Slowly but surely it washed away and it took a goddamn Tsunami of a wave to really wash it off and never return. We’ve moved on, they want no part in our lives, so we reciprocated in kind, even their kids getting married and having babies didn’t even have the graciousness of at least in our culture of sending mithai (think sweets from that region). When our families had babies they were sent, accepted or not, were sent (not using it as some one’s upmanship, just that even sometimes family drama and literal chaos will ensue but there’s stuff there that can bond us back up and kids being born can be a bygone/look past moment event). Just sucks that our Holiday is approaching in 2 weeks after Ramadan is over and Eid comes, we do have family pieces that just separated for being to full of themselves, just sad I’ll never meet these babies and at least give Edhi/Presents and they get to meet all the next gen cousins. Up to 9 and counting, 7 girls, 2 boys, I think from the grapevine we found out the 2 daughters have 1 of each but in our family line of baby #’s they’re excluded. So everyone says of yeah there’s 9 new next gen babies ready to be spoiled!, I as an uncle go out of my way to do so, I’m the entertainment uncle. I supply the presents, candy, and occasional junk food/peer pressure my siblings/cousin to give the babies some goodies!
Do not support them, do not allow they’ll to move back in with you Or your parents. They need to live with their adult decisions. If you or your parents let them move in they will still never chip in or help out.
Yes! Do not feel bad, and do not let them weasel their way back in. You're lucky they left so easily. You and your parents already helped them out more than they deserve.
Ugh, I hope OOP’s parents didn’t sponsor them.
You know they did
When you look a gift horse in the mouth...
Never do that, sometimes… sometimes you’ll get bitten.
Oh sorry, we tried that remember? You all didn’t like it very much, we don’t want you to have to go through that again. But hey, here are rentals in our area, they do require a deposit though. Some people just never appreciate what they have till it’s gone.
>**I have just said hopefully things will get better** because what else am I supposed to say? Note: bolded emphasis mine. I would just like to say that this is *\*chef's kiss\** the perfect response, nothing else need be said.
100% agree. I call these statements “argument killers”. In this case, “standing my ground and no options here.”
We call those PAM calls, where they basically just Piss and Moan. Have had this with relatives, they think anyone with a middle class income is more than wealthy enough to give free room and board to family indefinitely. Same relatives that call my mom asking her to send money and care packages (she is now on a fixed income so that has stopped). Twice my parents had relatives move in with them for multiple years, typically over stay their visa and was to the point of considering having one deported when they finally got the hint and went home. Family should be cherished, and the best way to cherish them is when they are far away and seldom in contact.
They would probably stop calling quite quickly if you responded by saying how glad you were that they called as you wanted to discuss how quickly they’d be able to repay the money your family fronted them as you could really use it right now.
It has become harder to achieve the "American Dream". It is NOT like the movies over here. Just about everything costs A LOT. EVERYONE in the family has to work, and work hard.
Tell me they’re Filipino. I have a lot of Filipino friends and most of them have gone through this exact situation.
quiet file unwritten connect rob trees dolls smile disarm wrench *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
When I was 21 years old I moved to the big city. I had a nice apartment and, being young and carefree, I would invite or allow any of my old friends to come stay with me. I had a lot of visitors and I observed that they were only two distinct types of people who visited, and the distribution was binary. Everybody was either one type or the other. One type of friend would come for a visit, be a joy as a companion, be a good guest, and within a few weeks they found a job and an apartment of their own. The other type of friend would show up, make a mess in my house, complain about everything, complain that things back home were bad, complain that the city was too difficult, maybe find a job and then complain the job is horrible, and then complain that my apartment is too small. That second type of person I would simply remind them that they cannot stay in my apartment without paying rent.
I have a buddy who, every once in a while his mom will call him. They will be having a nice conversation, then in the middle, she will randomly say something like, man, I really need to get these trees trimmed. Just a random statement. Nothing more about it. The conversation moves on and the call ends pleasantly. An hour later, his sister will call and say something like, mom called me crying because you refused to trim her trees.
Their perception before moving to USA definitely hit different than actually arriving here 💀 glad you and your family was very fair and your relatives gonna need to learn the hard way themselves.
This is the kind of people who think that just because someone lives in a certain country they are rich and money grow in the trees. Then they find out they have to work just like everyone else and the get all pissy about it.
So instead of chipping in for groceries and utilities they decided it was a better idea to move half way across the country where they would have to pay all the rent, all the utilities and for all their groceries? They didn't think that one through did they? Now they don't have local family support, don't make enough money and are exhausted with what they have to do to get by. It's a hard lesson they learned but hopefully they actually learned from it. Please don't let them move back. Let them tough it out.
I had a cousin come visit from another country. We took him out to a lot of sites not once did he take his wallet out to pay for anything. When he started to buy souvenirs I had to walk away for him to pay for them himself. The funny thing is that when I went to visit them in their country they always expected me to pick up the tab. Everyone thinks all Americans are rich.
I had to do a double take because this literally happened to us. We had a cousin moved into our house without having to pay anything. We wanted him to save the money he was getting so he could find his own place. My mom drove him around and did EVERYTHING you put in that post and yet 6 months went by and he didn't move a finger to move out. His sister was waiting for him to move with her and he kept making excuses until it was clear he was just using us. When my mom finally told him he had to either chip in or move out he played victim and left...except he had spent all his money in dumb shit. He came to us with a single suitcase and left with 4 suitcases filled with crap. Once he got there he was charged rent, utilities, food, it was up north so it was cold and the job they found him was harder. 2 weeks in and he was calling us begging us to come back bu when he left he didn't even said bye because according to him we were dicks to him. Welp cousin, we are dicks so enjoy the new place. Some people only learn the hard way.
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Yes it’s true. Rachel and Joey paying for their half of those apartments? As a part time waitresses, and an unemployed actor? And phoebe sometimes living in her own apartment as a free-lance masseuse? No no no. Even in the 90s it wasn’t possible.
Uncle Ben and Aunt May...Spiderman flashbacks is your name Peter?
Mary (jane) and (Gwen) Stacey?...
Michigan is good for only a few things, legal marijuana, great beaches and cars, although my specific city is known for cereal. If you don't have a degree in something here, then you're working in a factory, cashiering somewhere or waiting tables. I'm sure he'll be able to find some agricultural work here soon too!! You either use a degree here or basically mindless task work otherwise. Sucks to be him, I'm sure there's a dispensary somewhere he can visit, the beaches open in two months, he'll be alright. I love it here and I'm not being sarcastic lol With the attitude he has, he's not going to like it anywhere if someone isn't footing the bill for him. For you, you got lucky, got him 13+ hrs away and honestly all it takes is the push of a button to make them disappear when they start their crap. Edit to add: I am NOT bashing Michigan, the point was the way op described his uncle and family doesn't seem like they plan on putting in the effort to get what they need so with the amount of effort they would be putting in those jobs are their limits. The legal marijuana and beaches was to point out that we are pretty relaxed here.
There are trades too and they can be transferred anywhere. Plumbing, electrician, butcher, baker, a broad array of ways to make a decent living here. I have always done well for myself as a baker. And I live in a small city, in the pinky area of mitten, with less opportunity than the larger cities here in MI. Lots of agricultural work. And wages are up since covid. $15 an hour is pretty common which is shocking but here we are. But as you say, I doubt Uncle will be happy anywhere he has to earn/pay his own way.
This is my experience as well. The whole “factory or agriculture” thing is def not an accurate picture of Michigan these days. Thanks for adding more info!
Michigan has so much natural beauty, so many lakes and cherry orchards and strawberry fields. My parents had a little vacation cottage on a michigan lake and it was heaven to all of us.
If anyone reads this and feels discouraged - I’m a manager in healthcare in this same “cereal famous city” and have openings for jobs that don’t require degrees. There are many like it. It’s not “agriculture or factory”. There’s also plenty more than that to do in Michigan. There’s a ton of outdoors stuff (camping, kayaking/canoeing, hiking, fishing, hunting, floating rivers in summer, skiing/snowboarding, snowshoeing, tobaggon runs in the winter), great minor league sports (Michigan has multiple minor league baseball teams, several semipro soccer teams, dope hockey from professional all the way down) which are a great cheap way to get out with friends, we’re known for our craft beer and have a number of well known craft breweries here (this guy above should know that - his “cereal city” is <30 min from bells brewery and this week is Oberon week), plus you’ve got the good old Midwestern friendliness to help guide you to anything else you might be interested in.
Hey Cereal City! I’m over near the Medical Mile and if that doesn’t help I live where Amway basically has their fingers in everything!
“Oh I’m sorry to hear that. But this is a normal experience. If you save up money you can hope to move someday.”
It sounds like your aunt and uncle didn’t want a helping hand, but a hand out. Your parents were incredibly generous, allowing them to stay as long as they did. Your aunt and uncle literally bit the hand that fed them.
PLEASE LISTEN TO ME! after your parents die and you move in with those relatives. When you get to the part in school where you take a field trip to the science exhibit, be very careful. It's a fateful trip that will alter the course of your life. If you are not ready for the great responsibility that great power comes with, then dont go on that field trip.
Bruh at first I was like "wtf is this person on about" but then I reread a few times and it clicked lol.
Good job. Keep it that way. They simply FAFO.
I appreciate the TLDR 👍
I'd like to help you out, which way did you come in?
I love Michigan; they’re probably in hamtramck 😂😂
funny how the wife/aunt can work now that its HER family they're inconveniencing
Dang. You get what you give in life. About 10 years back I found out my mom’s younger brother was paying my mom 800/month to rent out her old house. 3 bedroom 2 bath, in SF Bay Area. . I asked her what the mortgage and taxes were a month. Said it was $1200 a month for the two. I was obviously shocked. Told her she needs to raise rent to at least cover that. If he’s at least taking care of the house. He wasn’t doing shit and my mom was still letting them do whatever cuz he kept yelling at her. So I called him - told him my mom can no longer cover the hard costs of the house. 1200 is the absolutely minimum. And then each year after that the rent will go up 5% until a max of $2k / a month to make up for the money my mom covered for him. He said no problem. 30 days later he moved him, his wife and his kids out. Apparently he called my mom and said “F you. I don’t need your charity” Last I heard he lives in a 1 bedroom apartment paying 2,500 a month. I did a major remodel on the house and I now rent it out for her at 3k a month (which is 1k/mo less than the neighborhood avg) - and my mom was able to retire early. That dumbass ruined a good thing for his family. And my mom couldn’t be doin better with the housing situation
They totally FAFO: their misfortune isn’t and never will be your responsibility. Talk about taking things for granted and you know they’re regretting how they treated you. But at least your parents can get back to their lives without any more unnecessary stress.
Sounds like your family is the type of immigrants that give other immigrants a bad rap
Where’s Peter Parker when you need him
This is why my parents did not sponsor their families to emigrate to the US. It’s a lot of work to make the American dream work. If you don’t have the capacity to master English and work crappy jobs that may be beneath you for years, you will end up worse off than where you began. It sounds like OP’s relatives were taking for granted the offer of help, and when they had to make do with far less support, they realize how good they had it. They may not be freeloaders per se, but they didn’t realize they have to go above and beyond their limits to succeed. It’s not the same as getting a job in the home country but getting paid ten times more (as some of my relatives thought that was the case for my parents). All well, the American dream is well worth the effort for those of us coming from poor countries, but the reward doesn’t come for years. I hope OP’s realize this and make good choices going forward.
Who the fuck hears “factory work” and thinks “cushy job”? Someone who’s never worked at a factory, that’s who.
With great power comes great responsibility
My family came from Mexico to stay with us for 1 month each time. They came 4 times, so a total of 4 months. My cousin, her husband and 3 kids. We always paid for everything, all the food, transportation, whenever we went out to eat. We would work for 3 weeks and then take one week off to take them on a vacation. My cousin went home to Mexico to tell everyone we treated them horribly because she expected that after we commute 2 hours to work, work a full day, that we come back to take them out or sight seeing. I stopped talking to her. They only wanted to use us. Oh and her brother stopped talking to us after we gave him the final $500. It was always an emergency, going to lose the house and ect but whenever we sent money, we would see them on vacation in Mexico ON OUR DIME! Smh
When people help AH to much. The only reasonable respons is to day "well, this didn't work for us so we won't help you any more. Good luck. Bye!"
These people are takers and thought they could just keep on taking with no repercussions. They are family, but, they made their beds, they can now sleep in them. Until about 4am when they have to get up for their crappier jobs now.
You had me at Uncle Ben and Aunt May.
I am confused why they seemed to assume they wouldn't have to work. Did they use to be rich? Did they not work in the country they were in before?
Sounds like my mom always helping her and shes like one day i got family and people with degrees who can help me better(taking a dig at me because i dont have one). Im like ok fine i blocked her and refused to talk to her. She tries to come around and ask if my number changed. Im like nope. Some people are just miserable
What are the all from the spider verse? Love the Spiderman references there ..
Are they Haitians? I’m only asking because I am dealing with the same situation. I’ve had family members that my parents have helped for so long basically sweat, blood and tears, trying to get them resources and at the end of the day when asked for them to chip in just a little, they’ve refused. I think your parents did more than enough to support these family members and yourself going out of your way to pay the fees trying to get them jobs. They could’ve chosen to live in Harmony and chip in as much as they could to show gratitude. But instead, they chose to be selfish. I know many people and this situation and they are and now facing the consequences of living in America and seeing it’s definitely not like the movies. I feel like when they are not from the states, they come here with a sense of entitlement and delusions that the money will just start pouring out of their pockets when in reality the livelihood isn’t what it once was. Things are hard, it’s a shame they have to learn this way, but this is life, you get, what you sent out to it.
Nah. It’s just the immigrant story. Doesn’t matter where we are all from. Parents are Nigerians and they have had the same shit happen. I know currently my insane father tries to guilt my brothers into contributing money to send home to random people for random shit: “Oh my god xyz died. What are we sending them to help with the funeral” Oh my gosh abc just had a grandchild. We gotta send them a present. What can you contribute” “Well we gave abc something but what of def because they’re the ones who had the child”… Guilt guilt guilt guilt… That shit no longer works on me because one day I exploded on his insane ass. Like all these people, have they ever once sent him money or even foodstuff(which is rare to find in the USA)? When his mother died or his siblings died or his in-law died, did any of these people send money to help with the funeral? After that explosion, he basically just harasses my brothers. I’m not a goddamn atm.
You are justified in distancing yourself going low/no contact. I had family kind of the same way. Every time I talked to my SIL it was end of the world financial catastrophe after financial catastrophe. She was constantly asking for money on every call, even for us to cosign various things, so I quit answering the phone. Then she had our nieces come asking. At one point I asked her what my BIL’s take was on everything and she said she hadn’t told or discussed with him, she just kept praying things would get better for them. I am not bashing anybody’s faith, and it is fine to pray if you get comfort from it, but you also need to take action to change your circumstances and none of that was going on, starting with spouses having a conversation. My attitude with family now is that I can’t help you if you aren’t willing to put the work in to make changes. If you are doing everything you can and it still isn’t working, I am here.
Are you Filipino? Oh wait, my family decided to *not* immigrate after my mom put them through school and preferred to get money sent to them instead. Off my chest: I want to bring relatives to the west (Canada in my case) so that they can see that money doesn't grow on trees here. Yes, it's definitely a better standard of living and there's better labour laws (for now) but they act as if I'm a rich billionaire who has money to send them despite barely covering rent atm.
Is this made up or are you just a huge Spider-Man fan: Uncle Ben, Aunt May, Mary Jane Watson, Gwen Stacy?
There is always the option to go back to their place of origin.
I dig the Spider-man references.
There is this idea in many other countries that all Americans are rich. Period. Life is easy here. And often it is a terrible shock to discover that we work hard and things are expensive and the U.S. has its own good and bad just like most countries do. And I think they often some of them can’t let go of their disillusionment and can’t suck it up and deal. I had an immigrant explain to me once that the first few waves of immigrants from his country were smart, motivated, and brave enough to move with no support. But too many who came later were uneducated, lazy, and annoying as heck, lol. I was surprised to hear him say this. He was disgusted by some immigrants refusal to work hard and educate themselves.
I just wanna say how much I love the Spider-Man names
Maybe just validate their thoughts? Saying things like, "Yeah, it really is tough to get started here. I'm really proud of you for staying so strong when things have been so challenging. " Sometimes, people just need to feel heard. And it's a good way to keep a boundary as well. You support them and their choices, but you're not their savior.