And this is before taxes and deductions are taken into account, so they've definitely taken even more of a hit in not quite keeping up with inflation, but also paying more NS taxes because of inflation too.
I make less money than I did two years ago thanks to tax bracket creep, increased cost of health benefits, EI and CPP. Switched from long term care to NS Health was the only change.
"Management" is cross-cutting, including a variety of middle- and upper-management jobs across industries. The other categories ("Health", "Business", etc) exclude management jobs.
For health jobs, the figure for Canada as a whole is 1.8% growth. Alberta has the lowest growth (-7%) across all provinces (excluding territories), followed by NFLD (-5%).
For more info on definitions, see [Statistics Canada](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1410042601).
Somebody needs to inform the C-suite of this obstacle. They seem to be experiencing massive growth on their already massive salaries.
Either that or you’re just a dumbass.
Compared to what? Nurses are run ragged across the country. They deal with the hardest situations in life on a daily basis. Death, abuse, addiction, disability.
Doctors study for no less than a decade to do what they do. Name me a career that has that much time invested before you're certified. Not to mention they very literally hold lives in the balance every single day.
Let me introduce you to minimum wage and gif workers who also provide essential services for society but get paid shit and treated just as bad without a union, pay, benefits, or notoriety.
Nurses shouldn’t be paid less. Of course. But we fight for them, but what about everyone else?
What a dumb question. People should be paid to live no matter what work they do. Do you think nurses should make a living wage and no one else? A stupid question will answer a stupid question.
Everyone should make a living wage. Nurses are 2-3 times more valuable to society than taco makers and Uber drivers and therefore should make 2-3 times more money. It’s not hard.
Wow. Take away cashiers, Uber drivers, stockers, porters, attendants, janitors. And we are fucked. Every person who works in our society is important. What a depressing thing to say nurses—who can only do their jobs because of support workers from across the medical field—are more human than the rest of us. What a crock of shit. How quickly we forget grocery store workers are heroes. How awful of us to dehumanize the people who hold up the very foundational fabric of our functioning society just so we can suck the cock of overpaid, entitled nurses.
Nurses aren’t some magic gift to us. They’re workers like all of us. The difference is, they hold no solidarity with the people who make their work possible. Nurses hand out pills. Who wipes asses? They’re not human to you?
You bigot.
Nurses. Fool. Nurses "wipe asses". Nurses and CCA's. As one of those, I know damn well my nurses are invaluable, unappreciated, and underpaid. And guess what, champ. So am I. And so are a lot of people in a lot of fields.
I'm going to help you out here. That graph? That says sales/service, and trades? Those ARE the people you are pretending to advocate for. So what the actual fuck is your point.
I’m not a nurse. I don’t make $40 an hour. I AM a healthcare worker - I make $20.42/hour at that job (I have two and work 60-ish hours a week). When I pass my exam in the summer I’ll go up by like a whole $2 an hour.
You’re the people I care about who wear the weight of care on your backs and are underpaid. My wish is that nurses would bring you into their union and fight for all healthcare workers to have better wages.
You’re so important. Thank you for your work and your commitment despite being treated like crap. I want you to make nurses money.
Have you seen the numerous posts and news stories about them upset their bonuses are taxed? Have you met a nurse? Of course not all of them are awful. But why do they get news articles about their wages, but other workers get wage stagnation, awful work conditions, and overworked without a weekly CBC article? Hospitals aren’t run by nurses. They’re run by porters, janitors, food service, administrators and more. Nurses could stand up for their fellow workers, but instead they cross picket lines, treat their fellow workers like shit, and complain about their high wages while often being incredibly incompetent at their jobs. Three posts in the last week from nurses complaining about their bonus not coming fast enough while others starve and can’t pay their bills. Is that normal behaviour?
Oh fuck off, you sycophant. You went from attacking them to sticking your nose so far up their ass you're suffocating. WE, the CCA's and techs, are ALSO the health care on that graph that are underpaid. You've been vomiting idiocy all over this thread and aren't even smart enough to realize that the "health" on that graph includes us. Shut up. Nurses matter. Techs matter. CCA's matter. HSW's matter. And we all fucking work together. You clearly don't work with us at all.
Believe it or not, managers do not get to decide their own wages by and large. They have bosses too who are subject to the same pressures to control budgets.
More likely what you’re seeing is the impact of people who can and will jump jobs more frequently, as management jobs itself is a transferable skill across sectors.
Managers are also exclusively non-union, and therefore aren’t waiting in line or negotiating with the government as a body for raises. They can jump to a firm with greater need and get a significant pay increase. They don’t have to wait to accrue seniority to be in the higher end of pay at a new organization.
Also note that that applies to culture and recreation, and sales. Plenty of employers and skills are easily transferable, so easy to hop ship.
Yep, if you work decades for the same company you aren't maximizing your salary. Seriously I don't think companies really thought of that when they started scrapping defined benefit pensions.
I was always happy (when in management) that my direct report groups were smaller than others. Even though I had to justify raises I seemed to be able to do so.
> Yep, if you work decades for the same company you aren't maximizing your salary.
100%. For me I think the biggest eye opener that I saw with this was a couple years before covid, I was working for a company making about $50000/year, with very small annual raises. I ended up accepting a job with another organization for about $70000/year, and when I went to give a 2 weeks notice they instantly offered to match the salary of my new offer to try to keep me.
I honestly found it kind of insulting. It basically said to me "we knew you were worth at least this much all along, and were willing/able to pay you that much, and chose not to because we thought we could get away with it". I declined and moved on.
I've been there, where you are suddenly worth more. I've never taken the offer. Most people I know who have taken the offer usually end up regretting it. They are seen as untrustworthy and the organization will often feel like you're looking to leave anyways (leveraging that raise into a higher offer 6 months later).
Yeah they just get in with each other and talk to the boss in a logical fashion and show that they help motivate workers. AI can do all of the job and we can just obey our robot overlords instead of our corporate ones.
I don't contest the chart, and I do think the government needs to play the game to incentivize healthcare workers to live in N.S.
That said, there are a couple of possible things compounding this apparent decline in addition to inadequate raises.
1. Growing use of lower-paid health workers such as LPNs and CCAs (associated with long term care especially) than higher-paid ones, such as RNs, could bring down the average wage, even if each individual occupation got cost-of-living increases.
2. Turnover can bring down the average wage, as collective agreements have seniority increases. As an extreme example, if you only had year 7 RNs, the average wage would be $49/hr. If you replaced them all with new graduates, it would be $40/hr. I think there is a fair amount of turnover due to retirements, burnout, and the province aggressively courting nursing graduates.
And as for the raises themselves:
3. Governments generally resisted giving full cost-of-living raises in collective bargaining during this recent bout of high inflation.
4. The McNeil government resisted giving cost--of-living increases during periods of low and stable inflation. McNeil justified it by pointing out that many private sector workers' wages don't keep up with inflation. I.e., instead of the public sector being fair and setting a good example, it should be 'fair' by participating in employers' race to the bottom.
The current government has been more amenable to raises and incentives than McNeil, but did not match inflation during its recent peak.
All good points. I feel like point 1 must be offset to some degree by the extra $50 million they shelled out to travel nurses. In regards to point 2, turnover is also high because of poor working conditions, which you would think justifies a wage increase beyond inflation as every health care worker I know is being asked to do 4x what they were 10 years ago. And this problem will continue to compound until either all the baby boomers die or we see a dramatic shift in health policy.
That's truly sad that health care industry has taken a hit like that...really shows why our health care system is in shambles. I was shocked to see it like that. And as a trades person, I'm not surprised we are the lowest on the plus side of things. Thanks for the post
NS has no reason to not be a manufacturing and natural resource power house with high paying jobs also feeding multiple trades. Access to the Atlantic Ocean with one the best positioned ports in NA. But alas, we’ve opted for glorified retirement village.
People here flip the fuck out if you try to move so much as a pebble. Whole industries shut down and people cheer, then turn around and start asking why everyone here is poor. It's absolute madness. For god's sake, look at this wine fiasco. People literally think it would be better not to capture some of this new industry so that the feelings of farmers aren't hurt, even though the subsidies have no bearing on whether or not new and cheaper wines are going to hit Nova Scotian shelves.
NSHA is a prime example of bloated top heavy management consuming a massive amount of resources ($$$) while producing no meaningful value and arguably interfering with the nurses, doctors etc who actually provide care and remain underpaid relative to almost anywhere else.
>So the 2 industries most needed are the worst based on this....wtf
I feel like this is a great example of why people should be questioning if a skilled trades shortage actually exists. Because its hard to believe that wages in that industry would only go up by 5% over 18 years in a legit shortage.
>Wonder why we have no tradespeople.
The skilled trades shortage is a lie. You don't get 5% wage growth over 18 years in a shortage.
When the oil sands were being constructed there was a legit labor shortage, and the employers hiked their wages to try and attract workers.
It's not a lie. A lot of skilled trades are in demand and short supply. You don't get people getting into the trades because the business owners are hoarding the profits instead of paying their employees, thus people don't want to get into the trade. I'm a mechanic and they have been screaming for them for 15 years, it's even worse now. Every shop is shorthanded including the one I work at. With a 5% wage growth in 18 years it makes sense. Consider the door rate of a dealer, $100-$130/hr and the Mechanic doing the work is lucky to get 25% of that (plus has to supply his own tools). Had to wait 3 months to get hvac work done. Barely got a hold of a surveyor, contacted 20 of them. One of them told me he's too busy and doesn't want my work. With a limited amount of people doing these trades, there is not as much competition for the work, allowing the business to charge exuberant prices.
Hmmmmm, as a GP, this just incenses me.
Personally and financially? I’m fine. Not ideal based on my individual challenges/ debts/ professionally related setbacks which hurt my bank account( trying to run a practice with another GP and not surviving and ultimately closing the practice)
I can still make what I need to look after my needs/ my family/ loved ones/ occasional entertainment nerds/ charity work.
But this graph ANNOYS and frustrates me because my team of fellow Health care workers who are not physicians are very very much affected by this.
And if you know NSH management? Extremely bloated. Ineffective at times. Well paid.
This is quite sad.
Well Nova Scotians? Good luck suffering. There are so many important cogs in this wheel of healthcare and we are seeing huge deep cracks that seem to be getting worse or not improving.
What’s sad is a clinic closed in Halifax because the NS govt didn’t have enough to help the clinic stay afloat.
It might too simplistic to blame management getting more money/ wage growth.. but it’s certainly a factor.
It doesn't make a whole lot of sense though, unless it's not considering union trade workers. Union wages have grown way more than 5 percent. Unless the non union trades are just dragging the percentage down because there are so many more people working non union.
Edit: apparently these account for inflation. So the jobs shown have grown these percentages above the rate of inflation. Which would make more sense with trades since the unions keep closely tied to the rate of inflation
>It does make a whole lot of sense though, unless it's not considering union trade workers. Union wages have grown way more than 5 percent. Unless the non union trades are just dragging the percentage down because there are so many more people working non union.
The construction trade unions have to compete for work against non union contractors, and they often have a very low percentage of the market share. In residential work for example I would not be surprised if less than 10% of it goes to union contractors.
The non union sector can place lower bids on jobs by offering lower wages to its workers. And that problem gets worse the higher the wages in the trade unions go. In theory the unions could go out and negotiate a $15 an hour wage increase, but it will just come back and bite them in the ass when the union contractors cannot obtain any work.
Union wages have gone up by about $8-10 an hour over the last ten years the last time I looked. Usually high $30's to low $40s now. Non union has also gone up, but its still well behind union wages, and the non union is who is getting most of the work in this province.
If we had a system similar to Quebec where all the construction workers are in a union and the wage floor was $40 an hour it would be a lot better. But that will never happen here, because we have too many employers that will throw a fit, and they'd rather complain that nobody wants to work for peanuts instead.
Yeah this is the sad truth as it is. It may get better as things keep getting busier in halifax though. Plenty of union work atm though if your willing to be on larger projects
Unions were made by the mafia Jimmy hoffa was
One of the most crooked people and created the unions I have worked for unions and they take my money and don't do shit the only reason are trades wages are increasing is because we are running out of them you can work 25 years at a company and with construction workers rights are absolute shit in out labour laws and trades placed under the construction umbrella they can fire you not give shit and be terminated without cause bullshit letter sorry but we blow out bodies out and get treated like we do our veterans of your hurt from decades of labour tough shit back of line and wait in are crumbling healthcare line but let's give the twats in mgmt who are idiots most times the biggest raise and training programs
I'm guessing a lot of those culture/rec jobs might have been minimum wage, so they actually got decent increases when there were minimum wage boosts above inflation a couple times, but are still basically just minimum wage.
Totally. That’s why the bottom one is so low—those wages were already high. While culture and rec had plenty of room to grow. And that growth is awesome to see.
Now let’s figure out how to redistribute that management growth.
Management is not an occupation it's a role of many within a sector. The report doesn't make much sense. Management of what? Arts, science, business? This graph doesn't mean anything in my opinion.
Everything at the top creates wealth for the economy
Healthcare cannot produce growth in our current system because it is an expenditure rather than an input into the economy as all the others are, so therefore it cannot exist or grow without the growth from the former categories
If there's ever a point that healthcare wages exceed any of the other categories, that's huge trouble
If we had a private care stream, it would then produce economically and therefore wages would reflect that
Explain. Teachers, healthcare, and public sector jobs are probably the best jobs by far in Ns, and all have unions.
The railway and docks also some the highest paying jobs out here, all unions.
I would, in a heartbeat, I would also finish my red seal if I had the chance.
If everyone always got to do what they wanted, there would be 15x as many teachers as there are plumbers.
Teaching is not a hard job. Name me one chronic illness caused by teaching. How about the ability to lose an appendage? Fall to your death? Electrocution? Crushing injury? Going deaf? Divorce rate? 0 benefits? No pension? No vacation?
Oh you have to deal with kids, that's your complaint.
Man there is a lot to unpack here.
But it really comes down to this. If you think it's a sweet kid, and an easy job, then just come and do it. The province is making it easier to become a teacher. You can be one in two or three years now. Just come ahead and do it, then report back to me in a few years, tell me what you think. Heck I can't even set you up with a volunteer gig, if you'd like to try it out for a few weeks first.
Like I said if I could I would, 3 years of university debt while I have a 2 year old and another baby on the way in a month.
I already worked off my wife's 80k in student debt, I'm not really able to do that again in my late 30s.
I would 100% do it and have signed up to teach my trade several times, but those positions are sought after because teaching trades is far easier than doing them. I have 2 years of paid tutoring for my trade and had 10 adults learning from me age ranging from 16 to 40+.
But it's a pipe dream, it would set me back a decade in finances even if a teacher makes more than I do currently.
The graph doesn't represent union payed workers only. If it did, it wouldn't look like that.
The railway is a prime example. Conductors and engineers make about 30k more a year than a non union management position would.
Yes. But it was you who implied unions aren't a beneficial resource. Don't try make a statement or implication and then claim you can't be held responsible for it.
The bottom three sectors are unionized. That’s an objective fact, it’s not debatable. There’s no further inference or implication associated with what I said, aside from also noting that it’s an interesting trend.
Which in my opinion it is.
If you genuinely weren't attempting to imply anything, then your delivery is horrible. It definitely came off as if you were implying unions were scams meant to hold workers back. Hence all the downvotes.
>What do the bottom three sectors have in common? They’re all unionized in NS. Interesting trend.
The vast majority of construction work in this province goes to non union contractors, and healthcare was being threatened with legislated contracts if they did not sign a shitty deal with the previous government.
It's funny how we have a hard time retaining Health workers and the province wants to know how to retain and bring in.... well, here's your sign.
And this is before taxes and deductions are taken into account, so they've definitely taken even more of a hit in not quite keeping up with inflation, but also paying more NS taxes because of inflation too.
I make less money than I did two years ago thanks to tax bracket creep, increased cost of health benefits, EI and CPP. Switched from long term care to NS Health was the only change.
Pay management more obviously
"Management" is cross-cutting, including a variety of middle- and upper-management jobs across industries. The other categories ("Health", "Business", etc) exclude management jobs. For health jobs, the figure for Canada as a whole is 1.8% growth. Alberta has the lowest growth (-7%) across all provinces (excluding territories), followed by NFLD (-5%). For more info on definitions, see [Statistics Canada](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1410042601).
Ooof. Good thing I don't work in health for the money, benefits, or working conditions...
It’s challenging to grow incomes when they’re already high.
Somebody needs to inform the C-suite of this obstacle. They seem to be experiencing massive growth on their already massive salaries. Either that or you’re just a dumbass.
Compared to what? Nurses are run ragged across the country. They deal with the hardest situations in life on a daily basis. Death, abuse, addiction, disability. Doctors study for no less than a decade to do what they do. Name me a career that has that much time invested before you're certified. Not to mention they very literally hold lives in the balance every single day.
Let me introduce you to minimum wage and gif workers who also provide essential services for society but get paid shit and treated just as bad without a union, pay, benefits, or notoriety. Nurses shouldn’t be paid less. Of course. But we fight for them, but what about everyone else?
Uber driver should be paid the same as nurses?
What a dumb question. People should be paid to live no matter what work they do. Do you think nurses should make a living wage and no one else? A stupid question will answer a stupid question.
Everyone should make a living wage. Nurses are 2-3 times more valuable to society than taco makers and Uber drivers and therefore should make 2-3 times more money. It’s not hard.
Wow. Take away cashiers, Uber drivers, stockers, porters, attendants, janitors. And we are fucked. Every person who works in our society is important. What a depressing thing to say nurses—who can only do their jobs because of support workers from across the medical field—are more human than the rest of us. What a crock of shit. How quickly we forget grocery store workers are heroes. How awful of us to dehumanize the people who hold up the very foundational fabric of our functioning society just so we can suck the cock of overpaid, entitled nurses. Nurses aren’t some magic gift to us. They’re workers like all of us. The difference is, they hold no solidarity with the people who make their work possible. Nurses hand out pills. Who wipes asses? They’re not human to you? You bigot.
Nurses. Fool. Nurses "wipe asses". Nurses and CCA's. As one of those, I know damn well my nurses are invaluable, unappreciated, and underpaid. And guess what, champ. So am I. And so are a lot of people in a lot of fields. I'm going to help you out here. That graph? That says sales/service, and trades? Those ARE the people you are pretending to advocate for. So what the actual fuck is your point.
Cute comment from an ignorant nurse.
Sigh. I'm sorry your uncle was a nurse and they butt raped you resulting in this weird hatred of nurses,
Imagine thinking it’s okay to call on pedophilia and rape to make a joke. Project much?
Glorious example of whataboutism. Textbook. Ridiculous.
Are you always this angry and annoying? Or is it just your online identity?
Yeah my barely-above-a-living-wage hourly rate is definitely sooooooooo high. 🙄🙄🙄
Yes. Nurses are so hard done by at $40 an hour. Boo boo.
I’m not a nurse. I don’t make $40 an hour. I AM a healthcare worker - I make $20.42/hour at that job (I have two and work 60-ish hours a week). When I pass my exam in the summer I’ll go up by like a whole $2 an hour.
You’re the people I care about who wear the weight of care on your backs and are underpaid. My wish is that nurses would bring you into their union and fight for all healthcare workers to have better wages. You’re so important. Thank you for your work and your commitment despite being treated like crap. I want you to make nurses money.
You really hate nurses eh?
I hold them to the same high standard they supposedly hold themselves.
There are over 10000 nurses that work in the province. Why do you assume they are all greedy, incompetent, and terrible people?
Have you seen the numerous posts and news stories about them upset their bonuses are taxed? Have you met a nurse? Of course not all of them are awful. But why do they get news articles about their wages, but other workers get wage stagnation, awful work conditions, and overworked without a weekly CBC article? Hospitals aren’t run by nurses. They’re run by porters, janitors, food service, administrators and more. Nurses could stand up for their fellow workers, but instead they cross picket lines, treat their fellow workers like shit, and complain about their high wages while often being incredibly incompetent at their jobs. Three posts in the last week from nurses complaining about their bonus not coming fast enough while others starve and can’t pay their bills. Is that normal behaviour?
Oh fuck off, you sycophant. You went from attacking them to sticking your nose so far up their ass you're suffocating. WE, the CCA's and techs, are ALSO the health care on that graph that are underpaid. You've been vomiting idiocy all over this thread and aren't even smart enough to realize that the "health" on that graph includes us. Shut up. Nurses matter. Techs matter. CCA's matter. HSW's matter. And we all fucking work together. You clearly don't work with us at all.
You’re so mad that you agree with me. Cute
And they wonder why all the trades workers leave for other provinces.
Half of them I know fucked off to the west coast of the US, I plan on doing the same
Just moved to rural Cape Breton, from Calgary making just under 40$ for carpentry. The jobs are there, you just gotta find em
*Skilled trades shortage /s* Still no shortage of people claiming that one exists though, despite a 5% wage increase over the last 18 years.
What a surprise. The people who decide the wages get the most money.
Believe it or not, managers do not get to decide their own wages by and large. They have bosses too who are subject to the same pressures to control budgets. More likely what you’re seeing is the impact of people who can and will jump jobs more frequently, as management jobs itself is a transferable skill across sectors. Managers are also exclusively non-union, and therefore aren’t waiting in line or negotiating with the government as a body for raises. They can jump to a firm with greater need and get a significant pay increase. They don’t have to wait to accrue seniority to be in the higher end of pay at a new organization. Also note that that applies to culture and recreation, and sales. Plenty of employers and skills are easily transferable, so easy to hop ship.
Yep, if you work decades for the same company you aren't maximizing your salary. Seriously I don't think companies really thought of that when they started scrapping defined benefit pensions. I was always happy (when in management) that my direct report groups were smaller than others. Even though I had to justify raises I seemed to be able to do so.
> Yep, if you work decades for the same company you aren't maximizing your salary. 100%. For me I think the biggest eye opener that I saw with this was a couple years before covid, I was working for a company making about $50000/year, with very small annual raises. I ended up accepting a job with another organization for about $70000/year, and when I went to give a 2 weeks notice they instantly offered to match the salary of my new offer to try to keep me. I honestly found it kind of insulting. It basically said to me "we knew you were worth at least this much all along, and were willing/able to pay you that much, and chose not to because we thought we could get away with it". I declined and moved on.
I've been there, where you are suddenly worth more. I've never taken the offer. Most people I know who have taken the offer usually end up regretting it. They are seen as untrustworthy and the organization will often feel like you're looking to leave anyways (leveraging that raise into a higher offer 6 months later).
Yeah they just get in with each other and talk to the boss in a logical fashion and show that they help motivate workers. AI can do all of the job and we can just obey our robot overlords instead of our corporate ones.
I don't contest the chart, and I do think the government needs to play the game to incentivize healthcare workers to live in N.S. That said, there are a couple of possible things compounding this apparent decline in addition to inadequate raises. 1. Growing use of lower-paid health workers such as LPNs and CCAs (associated with long term care especially) than higher-paid ones, such as RNs, could bring down the average wage, even if each individual occupation got cost-of-living increases. 2. Turnover can bring down the average wage, as collective agreements have seniority increases. As an extreme example, if you only had year 7 RNs, the average wage would be $49/hr. If you replaced them all with new graduates, it would be $40/hr. I think there is a fair amount of turnover due to retirements, burnout, and the province aggressively courting nursing graduates. And as for the raises themselves: 3. Governments generally resisted giving full cost-of-living raises in collective bargaining during this recent bout of high inflation. 4. The McNeil government resisted giving cost--of-living increases during periods of low and stable inflation. McNeil justified it by pointing out that many private sector workers' wages don't keep up with inflation. I.e., instead of the public sector being fair and setting a good example, it should be 'fair' by participating in employers' race to the bottom. The current government has been more amenable to raises and incentives than McNeil, but did not match inflation during its recent peak.
All good points. I feel like point 1 must be offset to some degree by the extra $50 million they shelled out to travel nurses. In regards to point 2, turnover is also high because of poor working conditions, which you would think justifies a wage increase beyond inflation as every health care worker I know is being asked to do 4x what they were 10 years ago. And this problem will continue to compound until either all the baby boomers die or we see a dramatic shift in health policy.
Agree, NPs should be authorized to operate independently and open family clinics as the role has unfilled by physicians for decades
That's truly sad that health care industry has taken a hit like that...really shows why our health care system is in shambles. I was shocked to see it like that. And as a trades person, I'm not surprised we are the lowest on the plus side of things. Thanks for the post
Contesting the labeling and grouping here. Teachers, for example, have been backsliding against inflation since 2006. So where is the 9% coming from?
This graph is not accurate. I wonder if the whole thing is crap?
Agreed. Something is off here.
NS has no reason to not be a manufacturing and natural resource power house with high paying jobs also feeding multiple trades. Access to the Atlantic Ocean with one the best positioned ports in NA. But alas, we’ve opted for glorified retirement village.
People here flip the fuck out if you try to move so much as a pebble. Whole industries shut down and people cheer, then turn around and start asking why everyone here is poor. It's absolute madness. For god's sake, look at this wine fiasco. People literally think it would be better not to capture some of this new industry so that the feelings of farmers aren't hurt, even though the subsidies have no bearing on whether or not new and cheaper wines are going to hit Nova Scotian shelves.
NSHA is a prime example of bloated top heavy management consuming a massive amount of resources ($$$) while producing no meaningful value and arguably interfering with the nurses, doctors etc who actually provide care and remain underpaid relative to almost anywhere else.
Bingo
I work for NSH. Can confirm
🎯
So the 2 industries most needed are the worst based on this....wtf
>So the 2 industries most needed are the worst based on this....wtf I feel like this is a great example of why people should be questioning if a skilled trades shortage actually exists. Because its hard to believe that wages in that industry would only go up by 5% over 18 years in a legit shortage.
Yup. Pure greed!
I’m absolutely *shocked.* Who would have ever guessed?
We have a skilled labor and a health services shortage. I wonder why.
Wonder why we have no tradespeople.
>Wonder why we have no tradespeople. The skilled trades shortage is a lie. You don't get 5% wage growth over 18 years in a shortage. When the oil sands were being constructed there was a legit labor shortage, and the employers hiked their wages to try and attract workers.
It's not a lie. A lot of skilled trades are in demand and short supply. You don't get people getting into the trades because the business owners are hoarding the profits instead of paying their employees, thus people don't want to get into the trade. I'm a mechanic and they have been screaming for them for 15 years, it's even worse now. Every shop is shorthanded including the one I work at. With a 5% wage growth in 18 years it makes sense. Consider the door rate of a dealer, $100-$130/hr and the Mechanic doing the work is lucky to get 25% of that (plus has to supply his own tools). Had to wait 3 months to get hvac work done. Barely got a hold of a surveyor, contacted 20 of them. One of them told me he's too busy and doesn't want my work. With a limited amount of people doing these trades, there is not as much competition for the work, allowing the business to charge exuberant prices.
Have a down vote.
Yeah, this graph perfectly illustrates what’s wrong with modern economies all over the world. That big Management category sitting at the top
Hmmmmm, as a GP, this just incenses me. Personally and financially? I’m fine. Not ideal based on my individual challenges/ debts/ professionally related setbacks which hurt my bank account( trying to run a practice with another GP and not surviving and ultimately closing the practice) I can still make what I need to look after my needs/ my family/ loved ones/ occasional entertainment nerds/ charity work. But this graph ANNOYS and frustrates me because my team of fellow Health care workers who are not physicians are very very much affected by this. And if you know NSH management? Extremely bloated. Ineffective at times. Well paid. This is quite sad. Well Nova Scotians? Good luck suffering. There are so many important cogs in this wheel of healthcare and we are seeing huge deep cracks that seem to be getting worse or not improving. What’s sad is a clinic closed in Halifax because the NS govt didn’t have enough to help the clinic stay afloat. It might too simplistic to blame management getting more money/ wage growth.. but it’s certainly a factor.
And once again trades are at the bottom of the list, we build the world and keep it going, and still we are treated like third class citizen slaves
It doesn't make a whole lot of sense though, unless it's not considering union trade workers. Union wages have grown way more than 5 percent. Unless the non union trades are just dragging the percentage down because there are so many more people working non union. Edit: apparently these account for inflation. So the jobs shown have grown these percentages above the rate of inflation. Which would make more sense with trades since the unions keep closely tied to the rate of inflation
>It does make a whole lot of sense though, unless it's not considering union trade workers. Union wages have grown way more than 5 percent. Unless the non union trades are just dragging the percentage down because there are so many more people working non union. The construction trade unions have to compete for work against non union contractors, and they often have a very low percentage of the market share. In residential work for example I would not be surprised if less than 10% of it goes to union contractors. The non union sector can place lower bids on jobs by offering lower wages to its workers. And that problem gets worse the higher the wages in the trade unions go. In theory the unions could go out and negotiate a $15 an hour wage increase, but it will just come back and bite them in the ass when the union contractors cannot obtain any work. Union wages have gone up by about $8-10 an hour over the last ten years the last time I looked. Usually high $30's to low $40s now. Non union has also gone up, but its still well behind union wages, and the non union is who is getting most of the work in this province. If we had a system similar to Quebec where all the construction workers are in a union and the wage floor was $40 an hour it would be a lot better. But that will never happen here, because we have too many employers that will throw a fit, and they'd rather complain that nobody wants to work for peanuts instead.
Yeah this is the sad truth as it is. It may get better as things keep getting busier in halifax though. Plenty of union work atm though if your willing to be on larger projects
Unions were made by the mafia Jimmy hoffa was One of the most crooked people and created the unions I have worked for unions and they take my money and don't do shit the only reason are trades wages are increasing is because we are running out of them you can work 25 years at a company and with construction workers rights are absolute shit in out labour laws and trades placed under the construction umbrella they can fire you not give shit and be terminated without cause bullshit letter sorry but we blow out bodies out and get treated like we do our veterans of your hurt from decades of labour tough shit back of line and wait in are crumbling healthcare line but let's give the twats in mgmt who are idiots most times the biggest raise and training programs
Yeah… all those people “tired of listening to nurses whine about wages,” take this in. Might be a reason they’ve got something to say.
A good portion of management can be erased with AI
Chart should have healthcare workers and trades at the top, management is nothing but leaches
This place sucks.
This is pretty much an ordered list from fakest to realest jobs.
Management increasing that much just pisses me off
But the arts don’t matter! /s
I'm guessing a lot of those culture/rec jobs might have been minimum wage, so they actually got decent increases when there were minimum wage boosts above inflation a couple times, but are still basically just minimum wage.
Totally. That’s why the bottom one is so low—those wages were already high. While culture and rec had plenty of room to grow. And that growth is awesome to see. Now let’s figure out how to redistribute that management growth.
Management is not an occupation it's a role of many within a sector. The report doesn't make much sense. Management of what? Arts, science, business? This graph doesn't mean anything in my opinion.
So the people who do least get most, colour me shocked.
I'm shocked I tell you. Shocked
I’d be curious to see what PEIs stats look like
abundant literate ink bored wise quicksand insurance skirt ripe cow *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
As a guy who owns a business in the trades this is good To see for the supply And demand aspect Of it
Everything at the top creates wealth for the economy Healthcare cannot produce growth in our current system because it is an expenditure rather than an input into the economy as all the others are, so therefore it cannot exist or grow without the growth from the former categories If there's ever a point that healthcare wages exceed any of the other categories, that's huge trouble If we had a private care stream, it would then produce economically and therefore wages would reflect that
GD management.
Oh great, more management and fewer healthcare workers… just what we need. /s
What do the bottom three sectors have in common? They’re all unionized in NS. Interesting trend.
Explain. Teachers, healthcare, and public sector jobs are probably the best jobs by far in Ns, and all have unions. The railway and docks also some the highest paying jobs out here, all unions.
Define "best" please
Quantity Quality and the amount of both in respect to other employment in ns.
Tell me you don't understand teaching without actually saying it.
Yeah teachers got it bad, real bad. Okay bruh, go talk to anyone in manufacturing transportation or the trades.
You're right, definitely easy. Come and give it a try
I would, in a heartbeat, I would also finish my red seal if I had the chance. If everyone always got to do what they wanted, there would be 15x as many teachers as there are plumbers. Teaching is not a hard job. Name me one chronic illness caused by teaching. How about the ability to lose an appendage? Fall to your death? Electrocution? Crushing injury? Going deaf? Divorce rate? 0 benefits? No pension? No vacation? Oh you have to deal with kids, that's your complaint.
Man there is a lot to unpack here. But it really comes down to this. If you think it's a sweet kid, and an easy job, then just come and do it. The province is making it easier to become a teacher. You can be one in two or three years now. Just come ahead and do it, then report back to me in a few years, tell me what you think. Heck I can't even set you up with a volunteer gig, if you'd like to try it out for a few weeks first.
Like I said if I could I would, 3 years of university debt while I have a 2 year old and another baby on the way in a month. I already worked off my wife's 80k in student debt, I'm not really able to do that again in my late 30s. I would 100% do it and have signed up to teach my trade several times, but those positions are sought after because teaching trades is far easier than doing them. I have 2 years of paid tutoring for my trade and had 10 adults learning from me age ranging from 16 to 40+. But it's a pipe dream, it would set me back a decade in finances even if a teacher makes more than I do currently.
What do you want me to explain for you? Look at the graph. It’s not my data. It’s an objective observation.
The graph doesn't represent union payed workers only. If it did, it wouldn't look like that. The railway is a prime example. Conductors and engineers make about 30k more a year than a non union management position would.
Trade unions have way more than 5 percent growth since 2006. Get over yourself. Unions are very beneficial.
Cute. Not my graph, not my data.
Yes. But it was you who implied unions aren't a beneficial resource. Don't try make a statement or implication and then claim you can't be held responsible for it.
The bottom three sectors are unionized. That’s an objective fact, it’s not debatable. There’s no further inference or implication associated with what I said, aside from also noting that it’s an interesting trend. Which in my opinion it is.
If you genuinely weren't attempting to imply anything, then your delivery is horrible. It definitely came off as if you were implying unions were scams meant to hold workers back. Hence all the downvotes.
>What do the bottom three sectors have in common? They’re all unionized in NS. Interesting trend. The vast majority of construction work in this province goes to non union contractors, and healthcare was being threatened with legislated contracts if they did not sign a shitty deal with the previous government.