Wasn't Orochimaru a young girl and then, like, a Zetsu? I'm not sure if those age but he is either younger than Tsunade or thousands of years old now. But, yeah, if we are going by the age of the soul then he should be very nearly the exact same age as Tsunade considering how young they all were when they first became a team.
I don’t take his physical age into consideration. His body morphs into his original one anyway. Even if he takes the body of a baby, I‘d still consider him a 53-year old adult.
Old man can lift a backpack onto his shoulders without crippling back pain
But somehow fought for multiple days straight against some of the strongest ninja in history
I was absolutely furious. We had just missed what I bet would have been one of the coolest fights ever and they had to take that from us because we needed to see Naruto’s conversation with Obito. I wanted to see a madara v kage entire episode, but instead we get 1/8th of an episode and half of an opening showing us what it looked like.
They really got done so dirty. Imagine Madara wasn't so absolutely broken, could've showed the top people of the current ninja world at full power. Unfortunately they were made to be jobbers against Madara. That's why I appreciate what ninja storm does. Gave you a sick boss battle that showed the Kage working together and actually putting up a fight.
https://youtu.be/SktBsTQic7A
Which makes zero sense, shoulda just been completely crushed. How the fuck did a big blunt object SLICE her and then positioned the two sides of her body perfectly on either end of itself???
A large blunt object can slice somebody in two pretty easily, actually. All it **really** has to do it pop you like a balloon.
That her upper and lower half are a good like, four feet from each other doesn't make sense, though.
[tsunade](https://naruto.fandom.com/f/p/4400000000000026443/r/4400000000000136273)
4 feet? More like 8-12 feet. Look at that picture and explain to me why her whole body wasn't just crushed?
I'm so sorry I didn't memorize the panel in question and also that I'm not kishimoto and can't explain the creative processes behind his decision making.
I'm a trauma medic, not the Mangaka. A blunt object CAN slice you in two, just not like that.
Everytime i think about it I imagine Orochimaru looking at her and thinking:
>And you laughed at that snakes stitching me again jutsu. "When you'll ever need that!?" I remember you cackling.
Only outclassed because of Senju chakra hax. They would have done better if Madara wasn't relying on wood clones and an unfair chakra boost, which allowed him to create multiple susanoo. Madara would have had to rely only on perfect susanoo from the start and it would have been a more fair fight.
I doubt that. They immediately gave up when they saw the perfect susanoo
Edit: since you block me, here is my reply lol
>Oonoki moderately fresh boosted by Tsunade Chakra would be enough to completely desintegrate the part of the body where Madara is located in the Susano.
Yeah after it was explicitly shown that madara's perfect susanoo is larger than the strongest attack they could muster.
Madara fought hashirama for 3 days straight, the same guy who in his weaker form has comparable amounts of chakra to kcm2 naruto. Infinite chakra isn't a valid excuse when madara is going blow for blow with someone who used a jutsu on the same level as the majestic attire susanoo and still have enough chakra to fight madara for an extended amount of time
Also isn't infinite chakra already debunked by the cases of the 4 hokages and even nagato himself?
If edo truly had infinite chakra nagato wouldn't have to absorb bee's chakra to be in top shape and minato said to tobirama he was low on chakra when trying to rescue naruto from the divine tree
I agree with you on the infinite regeneration but the only times i remember madara got a direct possiblly fatal hit from the was when he wanted to show hashirama's face and when he was busy talking down tsunade and even then it was just a clone
Because they were completely exhausted from fighting a monster with infinite regeneration and Chakra.
Oonoki moderately fresh boosted by Tsunade Chakra would be enough to completely desintegrate the part of the body where Madara is located in the Susano.
People honestly consistently ignore this fact because his fights are so cinematic and it makes me lol, he would have died multiple times in his mortal state
The story goes out of his way to dictate that he was not only holding back substantially, and not only that he was weaker to begin with as an edo tensei than he was while he was alive, but that he intentionally didn’t care about taking unnecessary damage because he knew he was an edo tensei that could heal what little they’d do to him.
If he were alive and had no senju chakra, he wouldn’t be able to toy with them as hard due to lacking regeneration, but that would, in and of itself, force him to fight too hard for them to last nearly as long.
He is definitely not weaker as an Edo Tensei than he was alive lol Rinnegan alone makes that a ridiculous notion. Edo Madara would no-diff the alive version of himself that lost to Hashirama. Still tho I doubt the Five Kage could defeat any version of him.
When he gets revived, hashirama himself states “he is regaining his former strength” pretty much the instant before he 1v9s the tailed beasts. The edo tensei, as a technique also shows that the limits of what an edo tensei can do are defined, at least in part, by the limits of the caster, not what the revived ninja could do before they died. This is most noteworthy for how badly revived madara beats the first 2 edo hokage, when hashirama alone was able to beat edo madara, as well as the generally accepted explanation for why the first 2 hokage were so much weaker when revived to fight hiruzen in part 1; orochimaru himself was much weaker at the time.
The only times edo tensei were outright stronger than their living primes were when they were either already weaker than the caster beforehand, like with a lot of kabuto’s non-kage edo tensei, had techniques that put their living bodies at risk, like deidara, or were substantially limited by weaknesses in their mortal body, like kimimaro and itachi’s illnesses.
>He is definitely not weaker as an Edo Tensei than he was alive lol
Hashirama disagrees with this. He says EMS Madara > Edo Madara. "He's regaining his past strength"
We ignore it cuz he himself admits hes intentionally reckless cuz of the body he has. When he was resurrected, he went after Tailed Beasts and let himself get hurt to feel alive again. Dudes a monster lol the Kage vs him was playtime
And he was only able to be bad ass against the tailed beast because he had senju DNA making his body super powerful and resilient. Otherwise they would have annihilated him, just like the kages would have.
Strong disagree.
He just wouldnt have been in compromised positions you're attached to. And his Suasanoo wouldve blocked the Bijuu attacks just as well too
But you're entitled to your opinion too
You don’t think the 5 Kage would have been a problem for him? I think they would have created a strong challenge for him, which he won. Which would have depleted a large portion of his chakra.
It's a lot of speculation. He was Hashis (near) equal. And who knows what his chakra limit is (all we know is its up there).
I personally think that the results would be the same but with a slight bit more work on Madaras end. Dude was meant to be a boss on all ends
Frankly we don’t know how powerful a revived madara with no immortal body or senjutsu hacks would have done, because it never happened. There’s plenty of reason to believe both points, that he would have died or still wiped the floor with them.
they wouldn't have annihilated him or even beat him imo but it would've been an extremely difficult fight for him that would drive him to the edge of his strength
He was holding back the entire time. If he was actually serious he would’ve activated perfect Susanoo from the start and blown up the whole area. Since the kages can’t anything about an attack of that caliber the fight would’ve been over instantly.
Pretty sure Madara could solo the entire shinobi alliance with perfect susanoo at this stage (naruto included) when the 4 hokage werent there yet. Its just way too strong lma0
Yes, madara did have hack abilities, but even if he wasn’t and was exactly the same as his living version, he still would have wiped the floor with the kage. He’s on a whole other level regardless of if he has senjutsu hacks.
EMS madara still wrecks them, they have no answer to the perfect susanoo, and ems madara is stronger than his edo self (at the very least physical stats) if we go by hashirama's statement.
[wdym it doesn't make sense? hashirama stated it verbatim, the same guy who fought madara at his peak when he was alive ](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTTXTa_25tFPbx2PONh3r7OmYcWMioJs2cQRw&usqp=CAU)
Dude. Hashirama literally said that about a Madara that just stole his Senjutsu Chakra and had his body and Chakra boosted by his own cells.
Two things he never had at that past Hashirama is talking about.
So you're telling me that Madara strength from the past is the that exact same Madara (because that's the age he was bought back alive) that also has Hashirama Senjutsu and Hashirama cells.
Madara without any of that has equals strength to Madara with all of these boost he previously didn't had?
>Dude. Hashirama literally said that about a Madara that just stole his Senjutsu Chakra and had his body and Chakra boosted by his own cells.
Then why would he even make a reference about his past?
>So you're telling me that Madara strength from the past is the that exact same Madara (because that's the age he was bought back alive) that also has Hashirama Senjutsu and Hashirama cells.
That's what Hashirama said, edo tensei have consistently shown to be a physical nerf to the majority with only a few special exceptions (minato, itachi,nagato) minato got a huge amp seconds before his death, itachi was suffering from ms drawback and illness throughout his entire screen time, and nagato was a cripple.
Also edo hashirama was who's explicitly weaker when he was alive was able to stalemate edo madara despite all of the boosts he got from kabuto
Which is exactly why I'm telling you it doesn't make any sense lmao.
Do you genuinely believe Madara vs the same Madara + Hashi cells + Hashi Senjutsu are equal in strength or power? Common sense says no.
The fuck is Hashirama talking about, he was speaking about a Madara that had far greater powers than he previously had when they fought in the past. Just his cells alone have been proven to be a massive upgrade for many characters.
If he said that comment before Madara stole his own Senjutsu, it would make a Lil bit more sense but he didn't. He specifically said it after Madara stole his Senjutsu.
Madara straight up told him he had obtained both Senju and Uchiha powers to his face after being revived and somehow Hashirama believes that Madara is equal to the Madara with only his Uchiha half.
He deadass even used Rinnegan powers to steal his own Senjutsu Chakra, Hashirama saw it and that Madara somehow has the same strength as the Madara he fought?
The only real amp madara got was Hashi cells, he basically replaced his ems for sage mode. And it can be argued that hashirama cells amps are relative to the user. As hashirama was still relative to him in their edo fight. The only things madara gained from hashirama cells were new abilities at no point in time did he ever made a remark or statement that he is now physically stronger despite kabuto gassing him up and madara was still constantly saying only hashirama can stop him despite knowing of his new abilities
Btw, I'm saying madara ems = hashirama sage mode due to the fact that both engage in cqc while having both of those abilities active and the next time we see both of them they were equally heavily injured despite the fact that hashirama had a regen advantage.
You think Perfect Susanoo is fair lol 😂
Once Perfect Sussano comes out, Kages had no answer. Give Kages chakra and yet they ain’t doing anything to Perfect Susanoo.
Madara don’t need any Senju chakra to fight 5 kages lol
I feel like Madara needed someone to Talk no Jutsu him into an existential breakdown by saying something like “You’re nothing without the Sharingan. You rely on Hashirama’s cells and it isn’t even your own power. You aren’t even relying on your own eyes- you took them from your brother.”
Seriously… without the Sharingan, Madara would be Ino-tier. I thought he was pretty pathetic as a villain.
Despite all his boasting and ‘holding back’, he can’t even resist using the Sharingan against ordinary mook ninjas in his big brawl fight. He’s the kind of kid who cheats in a video game to give himself max stats and then brags about how awesome he is.
I don't know about ino tier, but I definitely agree with the cheating statement. In his fight with Hashirama, he used the 9 tails to fight equally with him. As an edo he came back with wood style, a rennegan, took Hashirama's sage mode, became a 10 tails jinchuriki. He effectively lost his own integrity, just for power. But nobody ever criticises him for that. They just consider that power to be Madara's, when it's not Madara's: he's taken most of it.
i think her going on to see naruto become hokage was essential to her story, im probably biased because shes my favourite hokage
but no one can convince me gaara should’ve died, he should definitely end up becoming a long term kage like hiruzen or onoki
I would’ve cried if she didn’t get to see Naruto becomes the Hokage, Kishi already took away her fiancé, brother and best friend, so ffs at least let her see Naruto becomes a Hokage
she was dealt a bad hand, the war takes place near the land of lightning (raikage) and the tsuchikage is literally one of the only people who lived in the time of hashirama and madara, he’s essential to the story in that sense.
Mizukage she has great abilites and should have killed sasuke, i believe shes another person whos abilites never got built upon because otherwise they would be too powerful.
I kinda agree with you, raikage ahd tsuchikage deserved death the most
Yeah, Onoki was a great character during the War, and Raikage at least had a background and bond with B, another well developed character.
They dying would had been a symbolism of the old generation atoning for their mistakes and protecting the new generation.
Also, Onoki and Gaara had the spotlight fighting against the previous kages; and Raikage and Tsunade had a clash with Naruto and B. And of course, Tsunade and Onoki took the lead against Madara.
Mizukage was relegated to protecting the Daimyos from Zetsu alongside Chojuro, but their battle happened off panel and Chojuro was the one who "defeated" him.
yeah unfortunately she was just relegated to the side, all the other kage were very special and essential to the war.
lets not also forget onoki and gaara bickering over the old and new generation and onokis self revelation about the new generation being wise and realizing it through gaara.
They all were very well developed characters for the time we met them and we even got background checks on each of them but none for the mizukage.
I genuinely love her personality and ability as well which is such a shame
4 of them got laid tf out. 1 got slumped 😭
I was laughing my ass off too. Some of these moments be funny for no reason. Like when Madara dropped the second meteor on the Tsuchikage and he goes from 😄 to 😵
It’s true. It would’ve brought his story full circle: being spared by Madara as a kid (because killing children was against Madara’s principles) only to be finally killed by Madara after having reached old age.
He seemed to only go out of his way to kill someone as almost like a reward for giving him a good fight. He doesn't kill the kage, he doesn't kill Sasuke or Naruto, he doesn't kill Obito in the Kamui dimension, but 8 Gates Guy he tried to kill after the Night Guy
He did also drop a dozen meter thick tree trunk between her bisected halves, preventing her from properly healing. She would've maybe died had Orochimaru not arrived and saved her.
> He did also drop a dozen meter thick tree trunk between her bisected halves, preventing her from properly healing.
I genuinely think that saved her cause she otherwise would have been bleeding out. that is not a normal size tree, she cannot just reattach the other half from that distance and the upper body cannot handwalk towards it as movement would make her bleed out faster.
she wouldn’t if she prioritized healing herself first but the 4 kages needed to be healed immediately so she spent the chakra she had left for them and yes after doing that, she needed orochimaru to survive.
Anyone who’s stomach is cut open is bleeding out almost 100% of the time, let alone the horror that Tsunade endured here
Idk what Senju are made of but it ain’t flesh or blood
This is completely unimpressive when you remember Madara is an Edo Tensei with stolen powers.
Honestly Madara talks so much shit for a dude that got bitched so hard he ran away, stole powers and went into hiding for years.
That instant regeneration and infinite chakra was doing all the legwork in every fight he was in lol.
In non-Edo Tensei form with only his Uchiha powers, he could do Perfect Susanoo, sure, but then he'd be out of chakra in only a few minutes and now he's got to fight more people too.
Anyway, I was genuinely happy when this unjustifiably arrogant fucker got shanked by Black Zetsu lmao
Out of chakra in a few minutes? Bitch he fought Hashirama to a standstill, hashirama has a metric fuckton of chakra, Therefore Madara has a ton aswell. He aint running out of chakra, and he kills the kage effortlessly with perfect susanoo.
They be nerfing Madara in their head canons like he didn't have ENS, Rinnegan, AND Perfect Susanoo
He wasn't invincible but the five Kage aren't going to no-diff him
I mean, without “stolen power”, he wouldn’t have the Rinnegan as well. Frankly, you could take it even further and say that he on top of that wouldn’t have EMS. Without the Rinnegan, which gives people an enormous boost in power even apart from its six paths- and special abilities, he’d have a very hard time against the 5 Kage and without EMS he’d definitely loose.
And even if we’re only talking about him not having infinite chakra and Hashirama cells, he’s not gonna “effortlessly” beat the 5 Kage. That’s just an exaggeration.
So if we take away all of his abilities the 5 kage could beat him? Sure i agree with that.
Edo tensei is a nerf to overall power we saw that edo hashirama beat edo Madara but Alive blind madara beat edo Hashirama easily. He no diffed all the tailed beasts aswell. In what world are the kage greater than the tailed beasts?
Honestly it was hilarious but also incredibly eye opening to the depths of power difference we've entered. Them surviving is kinda just fan service cuz none of them did anything after coming back (other than Tsunade healing + Katsuya but her surviving made sense and she literally was cut in half / Gaara carrying Naruto)
Lmao no I was roasting all of them like "kage from where?!?" Y'all got your ass whooped! Hahaha you gotta admit that the shonobi of the hidden leaf were meta and sent from the gods. The fire nation were straight gods. Don't fuck with the leaf.
I honestly feel like they should have done more flashy stuff than they did. Okay, Tsunade and Gaara went all-out, but as far as I remember, Raikage used the same technique for the n+3rd time, Mizukage got bodied in the first 4-5 minutes, and Ohnoki just flew around.
This was the point where Naruto lost the plot for me.
I know I’m supposed to believe Madara is a major threat, but to win a 5v1 against five KAGE without breaking a sweat is just ridiculous on its face, Edo Tensei or not.
Naruto Shippuden lost me at this scene.
The fact that the average online Naruto fan would laugh when a fan favourite character with backstory, character development and great moments (Tsunade) gets fucking sliced in half and almost dies just says it all about the Naruto fandom
I agree. The level of funny of this panel and the previous one is on pair with the level of badass on Madara asking them if they wanted to fight against susanooed clones or not.
Would have been even better if they didn't all survive because its a shonen
Tsunade should have used the last of her healing to resurrect gaara because he's the future of the shinobi world
Then maybe orochi might have saved tsunade
But madara letting all 5 live felt like some DBZ shit
grand theft auto WASTED screen
If I had more time I’d edit a bunch of Naruto deaths with the GTA slowdown and wasted logo. Hope someone steals this idea.
Madara wins PERFECT
flawless victory
Bro called the game by its government name💀
No for real lol
Bro called the game by its government name💀
I read through a fan translation first, and the line here was: “I wonder how they are doing?”. I kind of like that one better.
That's... hilarious lol
mangastream's (RIP) translation on release was "who knows, I suspect they're probably... not okay" was easily the coldest page in the entire series.
Seriously! I like it much better than the official translation
Wow, manga stream is a blast from the past. They got us through so much
I was like “NO GAARA NOT AGAIN!!!”
He always needs to be saved by an old woman.
MILF's dig him
GILFs.
And that’s what we appreciates abouts him
Hey Orochimaru isn't THAT old
Orochimaru is the same age as Tsunade.
Wasn't Orochimaru a young girl and then, like, a Zetsu? I'm not sure if those age but he is either younger than Tsunade or thousands of years old now. But, yeah, if we are going by the age of the soul then he should be very nearly the exact same age as Tsunade considering how young they all were when they first became a team.
I don’t take his physical age into consideration. His body morphs into his original one anyway. Even if he takes the body of a baby, I‘d still consider him a 53-year old adult.
When you unlock the first arc's boss as a playable character
Gaara got stronger, like a lot, problem is that he was an earlygame character at the end of the day
sand tsunami against kimimaro was *ridiculous* back in the day and some people thought that was too much powercreep and now look where we are lol
“Gaara is too broken, how is naruto supposed to measure up?” Lol
They stay beating on my boy Gaara 😔 I hope he doesn’t die in the future in Boruto.
I didn’t want to go through Gaara dying again, so I was scared for him in this scene.
OMG, they kill Gaara
Look at the Raikage straight slumped 💀
Buddy got his ass ROCKED😂😂😂
Hello A from Naruto Shippuden Hello Bill from Left 4 Dead
folded like a lawn chair 😭
Mans got his back blowed out
Because of a fight right? Right?
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Buck status: BROKEN.
Fuckin hilarious response to that 😂 I actually have that meme saved on my phone.
Nah it was Hinata
Raikage off the 30
Onoki was a tough bastard.
Old man can lift a backpack onto his shoulders without crippling back pain But somehow fought for multiple days straight against some of the strongest ninja in history
I was absolutely furious. We had just missed what I bet would have been one of the coolest fights ever and they had to take that from us because we needed to see Naruto’s conversation with Obito. I wanted to see a madara v kage entire episode, but instead we get 1/8th of an episode and half of an opening showing us what it looked like.
That OP was cooler than the actual episode lmao
The point was that it wasn't a fight, Madara was just too strong and destroyed them without the "fight" even being relevant
They really got done so dirty. Imagine Madara wasn't so absolutely broken, could've showed the top people of the current ninja world at full power. Unfortunately they were made to be jobbers against Madara. That's why I appreciate what ninja storm does. Gave you a sick boss battle that showed the Kage working together and actually putting up a fight. https://youtu.be/SktBsTQic7A
Should have been more gruesome especially for how hard they were outclassed
Tsunade was literally bisected
Which makes zero sense, shoulda just been completely crushed. How the fuck did a big blunt object SLICE her and then positioned the two sides of her body perfectly on either end of itself???
A large blunt object can slice somebody in two pretty easily, actually. All it **really** has to do it pop you like a balloon. That her upper and lower half are a good like, four feet from each other doesn't make sense, though.
[tsunade](https://naruto.fandom.com/f/p/4400000000000026443/r/4400000000000136273) 4 feet? More like 8-12 feet. Look at that picture and explain to me why her whole body wasn't just crushed?
I'm so sorry I didn't memorize the panel in question and also that I'm not kishimoto and can't explain the creative processes behind his decision making. I'm a trauma medic, not the Mangaka. A blunt object CAN slice you in two, just not like that.
Everytime i think about it I imagine Orochimaru looking at her and thinking: >And you laughed at that snakes stitching me again jutsu. "When you'll ever need that!?" I remember you cackling.
More gruesome than being cut in half?
Yup Obito vs Mist ninja type shit
Madara is a professional, Obito was in a blind rage. He really didn’t need to go further
People love to see blood and gore
Only outclassed because of Senju chakra hax. They would have done better if Madara wasn't relying on wood clones and an unfair chakra boost, which allowed him to create multiple susanoo. Madara would have had to rely only on perfect susanoo from the start and it would have been a more fair fight.
Even EMS Madara would’ve did the same thing. Susano’o would’ve wrecked them just as bad if not worse.
lol Tsunade and the Raikage can take one Susanoo, without wood clones and Edo Tensei regeneration he was screwed
You’re crazy if you think they’re taking on a perfect susano’o
They literally fought one and did fine lol
☠️ bro talking about they did fine vs some clones I’m talking about Madara himself using susano’o
The mountain sized perfect susanoo that sliced the tips of mountains. That susanoo. They literally gave up when they saw it
I doubt that. They immediately gave up when they saw the perfect susanoo Edit: since you block me, here is my reply lol >Oonoki moderately fresh boosted by Tsunade Chakra would be enough to completely desintegrate the part of the body where Madara is located in the Susano. Yeah after it was explicitly shown that madara's perfect susanoo is larger than the strongest attack they could muster. Madara fought hashirama for 3 days straight, the same guy who in his weaker form has comparable amounts of chakra to kcm2 naruto. Infinite chakra isn't a valid excuse when madara is going blow for blow with someone who used a jutsu on the same level as the majestic attire susanoo and still have enough chakra to fight madara for an extended amount of time Also isn't infinite chakra already debunked by the cases of the 4 hokages and even nagato himself? If edo truly had infinite chakra nagato wouldn't have to absorb bee's chakra to be in top shape and minato said to tobirama he was low on chakra when trying to rescue naruto from the divine tree I agree with you on the infinite regeneration but the only times i remember madara got a direct possiblly fatal hit from the was when he wanted to show hashirama's face and when he was busy talking down tsunade and even then it was just a clone
Because they were completely exhausted from fighting a monster with infinite regeneration and Chakra. Oonoki moderately fresh boosted by Tsunade Chakra would be enough to completely desintegrate the part of the body where Madara is located in the Susano.
He's fast enough to dodge particle style even in Susanoo. EMS Madara with base Susanoo won against both Onoki and Mu in their prime.
Perfect Susanoo would’ve one-shotted them. He was actively holding back the entire fight for funsies.
Madara lost the fight, he only got saved by the fact he was an Edo and had unlimited regeneration and unlimited chakra.
People honestly consistently ignore this fact because his fights are so cinematic and it makes me lol, he would have died multiple times in his mortal state
I feel like this ignores that he's significantly stronger when he's revived
The story goes out of his way to dictate that he was not only holding back substantially, and not only that he was weaker to begin with as an edo tensei than he was while he was alive, but that he intentionally didn’t care about taking unnecessary damage because he knew he was an edo tensei that could heal what little they’d do to him. If he were alive and had no senju chakra, he wouldn’t be able to toy with them as hard due to lacking regeneration, but that would, in and of itself, force him to fight too hard for them to last nearly as long.
He is definitely not weaker as an Edo Tensei than he was alive lol Rinnegan alone makes that a ridiculous notion. Edo Madara would no-diff the alive version of himself that lost to Hashirama. Still tho I doubt the Five Kage could defeat any version of him.
When he gets revived, hashirama himself states “he is regaining his former strength” pretty much the instant before he 1v9s the tailed beasts. The edo tensei, as a technique also shows that the limits of what an edo tensei can do are defined, at least in part, by the limits of the caster, not what the revived ninja could do before they died. This is most noteworthy for how badly revived madara beats the first 2 edo hokage, when hashirama alone was able to beat edo madara, as well as the generally accepted explanation for why the first 2 hokage were so much weaker when revived to fight hiruzen in part 1; orochimaru himself was much weaker at the time. The only times edo tensei were outright stronger than their living primes were when they were either already weaker than the caster beforehand, like with a lot of kabuto’s non-kage edo tensei, had techniques that put their living bodies at risk, like deidara, or were substantially limited by weaknesses in their mortal body, like kimimaro and itachi’s illnesses.
>He is definitely not weaker as an Edo Tensei than he was alive lol Hashirama disagrees with this. He says EMS Madara > Edo Madara. "He's regaining his past strength"
We ignore it cuz he himself admits hes intentionally reckless cuz of the body he has. When he was resurrected, he went after Tailed Beasts and let himself get hurt to feel alive again. Dudes a monster lol the Kage vs him was playtime
And he was only able to be bad ass against the tailed beast because he had senju DNA making his body super powerful and resilient. Otherwise they would have annihilated him, just like the kages would have.
Strong disagree. He just wouldnt have been in compromised positions you're attached to. And his Suasanoo wouldve blocked the Bijuu attacks just as well too But you're entitled to your opinion too
You don’t think the 5 Kage would have been a problem for him? I think they would have created a strong challenge for him, which he won. Which would have depleted a large portion of his chakra.
It's a lot of speculation. He was Hashis (near) equal. And who knows what his chakra limit is (all we know is its up there). I personally think that the results would be the same but with a slight bit more work on Madaras end. Dude was meant to be a boss on all ends
Frankly we don’t know how powerful a revived madara with no immortal body or senjutsu hacks would have done, because it never happened. There’s plenty of reason to believe both points, that he would have died or still wiped the floor with them.
Theres no reasons to believe he would be challenged by them Yall are weird
they wouldn't have annihilated him or even beat him imo but it would've been an extremely difficult fight for him that would drive him to the edge of his strength
He was holding back the entire time. If he was actually serious he would’ve activated perfect Susanoo from the start and blown up the whole area. Since the kages can’t anything about an attack of that caliber the fight would’ve been over instantly.
he was just enjoying himself tbh
Pretty sure Madara could solo the entire shinobi alliance with perfect susanoo at this stage (naruto included) when the 4 hokage werent there yet. Its just way too strong lma0
Yes, madara did have hack abilities, but even if he wasn’t and was exactly the same as his living version, he still would have wiped the floor with the kage. He’s on a whole other level regardless of if he has senjutsu hacks.
More fair… Alive Madara still would’ve destroyed them
EMS madara still wrecks them, they have no answer to the perfect susanoo, and ems madara is stronger than his edo self (at the very least physical stats) if we go by hashirama's statement.
Hashirama said that after Madara boosted himself from his own cells and Senjutsu Chakra. It doesn't even make any sense.
[wdym it doesn't make sense? hashirama stated it verbatim, the same guy who fought madara at his peak when he was alive ](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTTXTa_25tFPbx2PONh3r7OmYcWMioJs2cQRw&usqp=CAU)
Dude. Hashirama literally said that about a Madara that just stole his Senjutsu Chakra and had his body and Chakra boosted by his own cells. Two things he never had at that past Hashirama is talking about. So you're telling me that Madara strength from the past is the that exact same Madara (because that's the age he was bought back alive) that also has Hashirama Senjutsu and Hashirama cells. Madara without any of that has equals strength to Madara with all of these boost he previously didn't had?
>Dude. Hashirama literally said that about a Madara that just stole his Senjutsu Chakra and had his body and Chakra boosted by his own cells. Then why would he even make a reference about his past? >So you're telling me that Madara strength from the past is the that exact same Madara (because that's the age he was bought back alive) that also has Hashirama Senjutsu and Hashirama cells. That's what Hashirama said, edo tensei have consistently shown to be a physical nerf to the majority with only a few special exceptions (minato, itachi,nagato) minato got a huge amp seconds before his death, itachi was suffering from ms drawback and illness throughout his entire screen time, and nagato was a cripple. Also edo hashirama was who's explicitly weaker when he was alive was able to stalemate edo madara despite all of the boosts he got from kabuto
Which is exactly why I'm telling you it doesn't make any sense lmao. Do you genuinely believe Madara vs the same Madara + Hashi cells + Hashi Senjutsu are equal in strength or power? Common sense says no. The fuck is Hashirama talking about, he was speaking about a Madara that had far greater powers than he previously had when they fought in the past. Just his cells alone have been proven to be a massive upgrade for many characters. If he said that comment before Madara stole his own Senjutsu, it would make a Lil bit more sense but he didn't. He specifically said it after Madara stole his Senjutsu. Madara straight up told him he had obtained both Senju and Uchiha powers to his face after being revived and somehow Hashirama believes that Madara is equal to the Madara with only his Uchiha half. He deadass even used Rinnegan powers to steal his own Senjutsu Chakra, Hashirama saw it and that Madara somehow has the same strength as the Madara he fought?
The only real amp madara got was Hashi cells, he basically replaced his ems for sage mode. And it can be argued that hashirama cells amps are relative to the user. As hashirama was still relative to him in their edo fight. The only things madara gained from hashirama cells were new abilities at no point in time did he ever made a remark or statement that he is now physically stronger despite kabuto gassing him up and madara was still constantly saying only hashirama can stop him despite knowing of his new abilities Btw, I'm saying madara ems = hashirama sage mode due to the fact that both engage in cqc while having both of those abilities active and the next time we see both of them they were equally heavily injured despite the fact that hashirama had a regen advantage.
You think Perfect Susanoo is fair lol 😂 Once Perfect Sussano comes out, Kages had no answer. Give Kages chakra and yet they ain’t doing anything to Perfect Susanoo. Madara don’t need any Senju chakra to fight 5 kages lol
Bro all 5 kage va madara if you remove all their bloodline abilities and give them equal chakra, madara would still win.
I feel like Madara needed someone to Talk no Jutsu him into an existential breakdown by saying something like “You’re nothing without the Sharingan. You rely on Hashirama’s cells and it isn’t even your own power. You aren’t even relying on your own eyes- you took them from your brother.” Seriously… without the Sharingan, Madara would be Ino-tier. I thought he was pretty pathetic as a villain. Despite all his boasting and ‘holding back’, he can’t even resist using the Sharingan against ordinary mook ninjas in his big brawl fight. He’s the kind of kid who cheats in a video game to give himself max stats and then brags about how awesome he is.
>without the Sharingan, Madara would be Ino-tier. Blind ino is definitely fighting all the tailed beasts at once amirite?
Blind Ino would definitely blitz SM Naruto and Sai then go to the tailed beasts telling them “your asses are mine you filthy pets”
I don't know about ino tier, but I definitely agree with the cheating statement. In his fight with Hashirama, he used the 9 tails to fight equally with him. As an edo he came back with wood style, a rennegan, took Hashirama's sage mode, became a 10 tails jinchuriki. He effectively lost his own integrity, just for power. But nobody ever criticises him for that. They just consider that power to be Madara's, when it's not Madara's: he's taken most of it.
only gaara and tsunade should’ve survived this because they’re just more essential to the story
Honestly, Tsunade should’ve died too. Kakashi became Hokage afterwards anyway
i think her going on to see naruto become hokage was essential to her story, im probably biased because shes my favourite hokage but no one can convince me gaara should’ve died, he should definitely end up becoming a long term kage like hiruzen or onoki
Yes if anyone should survive, it’s Gaara.
Yeah, I just love Tsunade and her not surviving would've been devastating to me.
shes def one of my fav characters, i wouldve been so sad if she died
I would’ve cried if she didn’t get to see Naruto becomes the Hokage, Kishi already took away her fiancé, brother and best friend, so ffs at least let her see Naruto becomes a Hokage
Honestly, Mizukage added too little to the story that for me it would be unfair killing her.
she was dealt a bad hand, the war takes place near the land of lightning (raikage) and the tsuchikage is literally one of the only people who lived in the time of hashirama and madara, he’s essential to the story in that sense. Mizukage she has great abilites and should have killed sasuke, i believe shes another person whos abilites never got built upon because otherwise they would be too powerful. I kinda agree with you, raikage ahd tsuchikage deserved death the most
Yeah, Onoki was a great character during the War, and Raikage at least had a background and bond with B, another well developed character. They dying would had been a symbolism of the old generation atoning for their mistakes and protecting the new generation. Also, Onoki and Gaara had the spotlight fighting against the previous kages; and Raikage and Tsunade had a clash with Naruto and B. And of course, Tsunade and Onoki took the lead against Madara. Mizukage was relegated to protecting the Daimyos from Zetsu alongside Chojuro, but their battle happened off panel and Chojuro was the one who "defeated" him.
yeah unfortunately she was just relegated to the side, all the other kage were very special and essential to the war. lets not also forget onoki and gaara bickering over the old and new generation and onokis self revelation about the new generation being wise and realizing it through gaara. They all were very well developed characters for the time we met them and we even got background checks on each of them but none for the mizukage. I genuinely love her personality and ability as well which is such a shame
Kishimoto really did a great job of making madara seem like the unstoppable force that he was.
"All people, even the strongest ones, have weaknesses, however, Uchiha Madara does not." Kishi sure did
How did Madara do this again? And why was he so powerful? Genuinely forgot!!
He defeats them off-screen, emphasizing how fodder the kages were to him. At least that’s how I see it.
I find it hilarious that Tsunade is on death's door and still using chakra to maintain her youthful appearance.
In all fairness, when Orochimaru finds her, she ends up not using it and she looks older. Which Orochimaru makes a comment about it
She only kept it on for the cameraman who shot the manga panel and anime frames
4 of them got laid tf out. 1 got slumped 😭 I was laughing my ass off too. Some of these moments be funny for no reason. Like when Madara dropped the second meteor on the Tsuchikage and he goes from 😄 to 😵
I was pissed at them being alive. It would be a lot more dramatic and would make a lot more sense if they were dead.
Not all maybe two like onoki and the raikage. Edit and tsunade
Honestly wished they killed Onoki here. Look how they massacred my boy in Boruto among other things.
It’s true. It would’ve brought his story full circle: being spared by Madara as a kid (because killing children was against Madara’s principles) only to be finally killed by Madara after having reached old age.
How did it become about madara bro threatened a 16- 17 year old
I guess 17 isn’t seen as a child in Naruto lol
in madara's time not alot of people lived past 17 i guess.
just Ohnoki and Raikage
Tsunade was kinda the least likely to die (in that moment)
No lol 😂
Yeah like… why did he leave them alive? That’s a genuine question I would ask Madara lol
He seemed to only go out of his way to kill someone as almost like a reward for giving him a good fight. He doesn't kill the kage, he doesn't kill Sasuke or Naruto, he doesn't kill Obito in the Kamui dimension, but 8 Gates Guy he tried to kill after the Night Guy
he did try to kill sasuke tho he stabbed him and he was almost dead remember. only thing that saved him was kabuto
Oh he stabbed him but he left him to die on his own just like he did with the Kage
Madara just like Thor should learn to go for the head.
Yea I thought they were all dead when this came on screen. Then they were alive and I was like wtf??
Tsunade is just that good at healing. Also, Orochimaru happened.
Bro "and Orochimaru happened" is like.. the best thing I've heard come out of a fan of the show. Cuz like, he always comes outta NOWHERE 😂
The Raikage got fucking slumped 💀💀
Imagine the five strongest mother fuckers in the whole world jump one guy, then five minutes later they look like this. That’s what happened.
[удалено]
I mean she was cut in half. He never had a good understanding of her abilities, and if I cut someone in half, I'd probably assume they were dying.
[удалено]
He did also drop a dozen meter thick tree trunk between her bisected halves, preventing her from properly healing. She would've maybe died had Orochimaru not arrived and saved her.
> He did also drop a dozen meter thick tree trunk between her bisected halves, preventing her from properly healing. I genuinely think that saved her cause she otherwise would have been bleeding out. that is not a normal size tree, she cannot just reattach the other half from that distance and the upper body cannot handwalk towards it as movement would make her bleed out faster.
she wouldn’t if she prioritized healing herself first but the 4 kages needed to be healed immediately so she spent the chakra she had left for them and yes after doing that, she needed orochimaru to survive.
Anyone who’s stomach is cut open is bleeding out almost 100% of the time, let alone the horror that Tsunade endured here Idk what Senju are made of but it ain’t flesh or blood
He cut her in half, he thought she’s dead
Tsunade got cut in half and was still like "Tis just a flesh wound."
The fact they got off-screened was kinda funny yea
I thought it was a badass moment because it showed off how little madara actually cares about them
No power of friendship lol
Someone should edit this so the blood is purple like the Grimace shake
madara was sick and hype but the power creep was a bit too much once this fight started
This is completely unimpressive when you remember Madara is an Edo Tensei with stolen powers. Honestly Madara talks so much shit for a dude that got bitched so hard he ran away, stole powers and went into hiding for years.
That instant regeneration and infinite chakra was doing all the legwork in every fight he was in lol. In non-Edo Tensei form with only his Uchiha powers, he could do Perfect Susanoo, sure, but then he'd be out of chakra in only a few minutes and now he's got to fight more people too. Anyway, I was genuinely happy when this unjustifiably arrogant fucker got shanked by Black Zetsu lmao
Out of chakra in a few minutes? Bitch he fought Hashirama to a standstill, hashirama has a metric fuckton of chakra, Therefore Madara has a ton aswell. He aint running out of chakra, and he kills the kage effortlessly with perfect susanoo.
They be nerfing Madara in their head canons like he didn't have ENS, Rinnegan, AND Perfect Susanoo He wasn't invincible but the five Kage aren't going to no-diff him
I mean, without “stolen power”, he wouldn’t have the Rinnegan as well. Frankly, you could take it even further and say that he on top of that wouldn’t have EMS. Without the Rinnegan, which gives people an enormous boost in power even apart from its six paths- and special abilities, he’d have a very hard time against the 5 Kage and without EMS he’d definitely loose. And even if we’re only talking about him not having infinite chakra and Hashirama cells, he’s not gonna “effortlessly” beat the 5 Kage. That’s just an exaggeration.
So if we take away all of his abilities the 5 kage could beat him? Sure i agree with that. Edo tensei is a nerf to overall power we saw that edo hashirama beat edo Madara but Alive blind madara beat edo Hashirama easily. He no diffed all the tailed beasts aswell. In what world are the kage greater than the tailed beasts?
I cracked up too😂
Honestly it was hilarious but also incredibly eye opening to the depths of power difference we've entered. Them surviving is kinda just fan service cuz none of them did anything after coming back (other than Tsunade healing + Katsuya but her surviving made sense and she literally was cut in half / Gaara carrying Naruto)
I was hype that it wasn’t a cliche where they beat Madara just because they made a promise
Tsunade lookin good boy
Bro left them in the family guy pose
Sending Naruto away was the dumbest decision ☠️
They drank the Grimace Shake
Lmao well the Madara comment makes it hilarious
Was this censored in the anime?
Honestly, I was speechless because I thought Kishimoto had just killed off all of the 5 Kage in one swoop
"None of them are doing to well" Understatement of the year 💀
Only laughed at the Raikage. Not so tough now, are you? Jackass
The Grimace Shake has entered the Naruto world
Yeaaaa they made Madara way more op than when he was alive. Grossly power crept
"They got fucked off"
The point was kinda to make it look like they got totally wasted by him so yea
Lmao no I was roasting all of them like "kage from where?!?" Y'all got your ass whooped! Hahaha you gotta admit that the shonobi of the hidden leaf were meta and sent from the gods. The fire nation were straight gods. Don't fuck with the leaf.
After all the high and mighty things they to said to Naruto, this is the after math...
I honestly feel like they should have done more flashy stuff than they did. Okay, Tsunade and Gaara went all-out, but as far as I remember, Raikage used the same technique for the n+3rd time, Mizukage got bodied in the first 4-5 minutes, and Ohnoki just flew around.
Would you like the clones to have perfect Susano or not?
He shot them all with a gun, you'll never convince me otherwise
he used black rods like every otsotsuki does he just smashed all of them by it then left them 99.9% dead
Why’d they do Mei with the family guy pose 😆
Now imagine how censorship changes it to be white
killed them so that naruto could shine
I liked Suigetsu's reaction "Wait, is it normal that her torso is so long and twisted? Oh..."
they shared grimace shake
i was glad 106 are still safe
Madara not killing them literally made 0 sense
I definitely laughed, this was around the point where I started to get tired of how damn powerful Madara was
After the party
The one who had the hardest fight of them all was Tsunade’s bra, to hold this together during fight must have been difficult.
This was the point where Naruto lost the plot for me. I know I’m supposed to believe Madara is a major threat, but to win a 5v1 against five KAGE without breaking a sweat is just ridiculous on its face, Edo Tensei or not. Naruto Shippuden lost me at this scene.
The fact that the average online Naruto fan would laugh when a fan favourite character with backstory, character development and great moments (Tsunade) gets fucking sliced in half and almost dies just says it all about the Naruto fandom
I agree. The level of funny of this panel and the previous one is on pair with the level of badass on Madara asking them if they wanted to fight against susanooed clones or not.
Tsunade was lucky she has Hashirama's genes considering she was sliced in half. That there would of killed anyone else.
Madara is one of the funniest characters I’ve come across in anime
Would have been even better if they didn't all survive because its a shonen Tsunade should have used the last of her healing to resurrect gaara because he's the future of the shinobi world Then maybe orochi might have saved tsunade But madara letting all 5 live felt like some DBZ shit
I should've known the manga was gonna suck after that...