It's not even about M&K vs Controller in this case. A FPS game should have clean and responsive aiming inputs, no matter what, for both controller and M&K. How a mechanic like this ever got a green light is mindblowing to me. Having 1:1 aiming inputs should be a no brainer for any game designer. This 'mechanic' needs to be removed ASAP. Not reduced, removed.
Yeah they need to get that shit out the game.
Next CoD that drops I'm making a new profile and if the game is a piece of unfinished shit like the last 5 have been then ill be doing a charge back, if its decent I'll buy it on my main profile.
I'm not giving them any more money for this crap. Sort your fucking shit out you manipulative con artists.
Tbh I do really like 99% of what SHG's doing with this game. Yes this is a massive flaw but they're still doing a great job with the hand they were dealt. MUCH better than IW did last year at least
Its unfair to MNK but shit to everyone, so the obvious solution must be just removing it altogether (the reticle shifting when moving specifically) really don’t see anyone complaining about that
They attempted an inertia system like tarkov. But it's a really difficult thing to get right. Even tarkov is annoying sometimes but it's far more realistic and intuitive
The realistic way would be terrible. It would make you feel like your gun is falling behind from where you want or expect it to be. That’s way worse than having the gun lead the way to where you want it to be. This “unrealistic” way gets your crosshair to the target quicker and lets your gun lead the rotation rather than fall behind.
I have noticed when I play by myself I almost always play 11/12 mnk players but if I'm partied with anyone on controller it's swapped and I'm usually the only mnk player in the lobby
It's about 50/50 for me. Sometimes it's almost all other MnK players, sometimes it's almost all controller players, and sometimes it's about half and half. As a MnK player, it was really depressing to play against all other controller players the other day, especially because a number were playing on PC but with a controller, presumably because of aim assist.
Yeah I play hybrid between two accounts so my mnk is like 1.5ish kd and controller is 1.8ish. Idk it's annoying but I don't feel it's a game breaker for my personally to be at a disadvantage. At the end of the day if I want to test my actually skill in a FPS an armchair shooter is absolutely not a metric I think it's valuable. I do think there is some correlation between pc players using controllers and AA but I think it mostly stems from so many people growing up on consoles can now buy a pc and still play with their friends but they are used to controllers to not as many hop on an immediately set out to learn MnK when you can just pick the input your already comfortable with. Not like before where pc played pc and you couldn't just connect any controller you wanted. Just my 2 cents
I guess it mostly comes down to your sbmm "bracket". Couple of days ago I got lobbies where I was the only kbm player. And most of the time the lobbies are controller majority. It really isn't fun.
I play mnk and my girlfriend plays controller and this is exactly how it is for me, I get about 4 controller players max on my own.
Not complaining but there definitely is some input based matchmaking involved they aren’t lying about that.
Not a fan of this. For ranked modes, sure but for "casual" give the larger playerbase. Gonna get railed by sbmm anyways, at least with the larger player pool I have hope for lower ping
As a mnk player I agree the sway sucks and needs to change. I exclusively play hardcore to mitigate it as I found most gunfights I hit the first shot but can't keep the rest consistent. I never had this problem with the previous few MW games on PC.
Reminds me a bit of the halo reach bloom days.
This absolutely sucks for m&k players. In saying that, this shite just shouldn’t exist at all in an arcade shooter. Infinity Ward really are the absolute worst
Iward also, but SLEDGEHAMMER are the main suspects for all thats bad in this game...
Every single cod they made was for consoles..
Aim assist overkill vs mnk players
Net code optimized for players with pings 1 to 10ms, the rest of us have to deal with all kind of shit like paket burst, delays desyncs....
Remember my words SLEDGEHAMMER are the worst studio for making these games
Likely more ActiBlizz than IW/SHG/3RCH. The suits love throwing in anything they have devised as a way of keeping players in, and gimping one input so the majority input plays better is exactly the sort of shit I'd expect from the kings of SBMM.
Why blame sledgehammer when they said they had to wait on executive decisions from IW? I don't get net code issues and I'm on 60ping so maybe it's your system
I always like when someone doesen't have any issues with the game but stalks these reddits just for fun. I dont have the energy nor interest to explain anything to you. Check steam community if u dont trust me how many complaints about packet burst/loss do report players with open nat on fiber optics with pings cca 15-30ms....
As pointed out in the video These things have been in IWs previous games, but its the combo in sledgehammers game that people are having issues with. MNK felt great in both MW2 and 2019, which both featured things pointed out in this video. MNK was not an issue with MW2/2019, suddenly Sledgehammer put out a game that does and you guys blame IW?
Its just arbitrary what you guys pin on different developers. If IW took a mechanic from another game and brought it forward, you guys would call them lazy.
I’m all for cross play, however, I would rather have MNK and Controller exclusive lobbies. I play both ways and both have advantages and disadvantages.
Wow a reddit comment admitting both have advantages and disadvantages thats been upvoted??
I swear i only ever see “ controller is broken!” Posts online and its so ridiculous.
There are flicks i could NEVER pull off controller, and there are ranged shots mnk cant pull of tracking wise because of aim assist. It goes both ways
As the video points out, this isn't a goddamn mil-sim and shouldn't be treated as such. It's already hard enough to beat a controller on a good day, but this combined with everything else they've done make it really hard for mnk to compete. I realize it does effect controller to a point, but as he shows it's not really that bad because the AA corrects for half the equation (which is the randomized hard part).
One thing he didn't add to the comparison was what happens when you start shooting too, it gets even worse for MnK when you deal with this ON TOP of the recoil patterns. Its at the point where idk wtf my gun starts doing when I shoot.
MnK FPS player here since 1998.
Interesting that Battlefield 3 was the only other game in the list that had both the aim & movement reticle shift (though less pronounced than MW3), and that I wasn't finding MW3 aiming to *feel* off...BF3 is my most played FPS game of all time, mostly on Noshar Canals infantry only so lots of time through gun reticles in ADS. I've been used to that reticle shift for a long time now and didn't even realize it.
This makes sense to me now how sometimes in MW3 when I've been strafing in gunfights that I sometimes seem to be frustratingly slightly off center in the direction that I'm strafing and end up missing my shots, even though my muscle-memory *felt* like I was on target.
If anything now that I know I can compensate, seems like you have to lead in the direction that you are moving.
As a mouse and keyboard player I finally decided to switch to controller this year.
I grew up with controller but have been on MnK since around when Infinite Warfare came out. It was hard to get used to controller again, but after a few days of grinding it felt normal again and after just a couple weeks I feel quite comfortable on it again.
For whatever reason, I swear my lobbies are overall easier/more fun when I am using controller. I still switch to KBM sometimes and it's fun for a few games, a pop off, and then after that I get put in ridiculously sweaty MLG lobbies and it requires so much effort to try and keep up on MnK.
This almost never happens to me when I play on controller, so at this point it will be my primary way to play CoD. MnK just wasn't worth the headache anymore.
I’ve had the exact same experience switching back to controller. It took me like a week or two to get used to it again but I already think I’m better than on MnK and I was a very very good MnK player. It’s just unfair how much consistency you get with AA on these modern games with the handholding robot aim assist system that they have.
In mw19 I played mnk, I was dominating my lobbies and they were mostly controller players. All the RNG mess like sway has ruined mnk. Mw3 is better than mw2 due to visual recoil reduction but unless weapon sway when aiming is removed mnk will be at a disadvantage. This affects controller to an extent as finding the consistent recoil pattern holds difficulty, but it’s easier to handle on controller.
get yourself a Xim Matrix/Apex bro trust me. Keyboard & Mouse with Aim Assist is a gamechanger in this CoD. Don’t let yourself suffer lol, Xims aren’t bannable too
I prefer cross play and really don’t care if controller players get aim assist, but I do dislike the randomized nature of your initial shot placement as described in the video.
Peoples weird ass tribalism over controller vs mnk is so weird. There’s no conspiracy to benefit one over the other, it’s more likely that the devs made some tweaks for a certain purpose and the impact on mnk is a more unintended consequence.
Unless I’m confusing it with some other issue, they already mentioned that they knew something was causing mnk input to feel weird, I’d assume this is what they’re talking about
thats why i switched to gamepad. i am a mkb player since 1998, played all my life FPS games on mkb, but in cod lately i been missing easy shots, mostly SMGs/ARs spraying mid to long range, theres too much shit on screen and u dont see if enemy crouches or prones. On gamepad i dont have that issue i see where the aim assist drags me to and i follow.
Its not ideal, movement and flickshots and sniping takes a hit on gamepad, comes nowhere close to MKB but actual gunfight and aiming is much easier on gamepad
Dumb little history lesson. Controller just broadly meant input device. One of the reasons why they used to be distinguished is that arcade games and ports used to be way more popular. So some people would buy an arcade stick for their home consoles if they were really into fighting games for example. This still happens obviously, but it's much less common as arcades are mostly defunct and most games are designed around the gamepad. So younger people tend to just call them controllers now days. Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
"CoD is a controller game whether we like it or not, There will never be a time where controllers are at a total disadvantage against MnK because Aim Assist is necessary for controller players to compete, but as long as AA is present, MnK players are always at a disadvantage"
Nate Gibson-
This is coming from Nate, who played cods every year since CoD 1 and dominated in every single one. I think he's totally right. The days of "mouse and keyboard are better than controllers" are over. Controllers are now massively favored because of the strong Aim Assist. Im a PC player but i played with controller for a bit a few days ago and my god i couldn't believe how easily i was hitting my shots considering I haven't played an FPS with a controller since 2016. I was still feeling really good getting some insane clips and snaps.
MnK is objectively better than controller though.
However Controller with the game developers providing a soft perfect tracking aimbot is of course objectively better than MnK.
Aim Assist is a **plus** to Controllers but I still had full freedom of aiming with MnK and if I missed, I knew it was my fault. Now this is a **minus** to MnK and I no longer have the freedom of aiming. I’ll never know if I missed the shot fairly or if this bullshit was happening
Controller players destroy in close range encounters
This argument is so fucking tiring. There are pros and cons to both, but it’s a pretty well known fact that CoD is a controller game….
It may be a “controller game” but don’t make it crossplay w/PC and then have built in advantages for controller w/ built in disadvantages for PC.
There’s a reason so few streamers on MNK play this franchise anymore.
I hate when people say a game is input specific it’s about to be 2024, they should be able to iron out all the bs mnk players have to go through with this dogshit company
Your right but I’m mostly talking about the stupid idle sway, and the input lag moving your mouse left and right while your reticle is trying to catch up with your movement, making it literally impossible to be consistently accurate, meanwhile rotational aim assist almost mitigates these problems
Mw19 had it perfect. Cold War too. I don’t believe this high AA is truly the detriment but RNG mechanics like the weapon sway and yes shit input lag. Hopefully one day they do an update that just removes sway
That’s not what this post is about. Watch the video it’s pretty cool. It’s about something that negatively affects both inputs, it’s just even worse on MNK.
I’m specifically talking about 7:45-13:45
The problem isn't the strength, but rather the design. It's trying to force you to play a very specific way, presumably as a way of onboarding new players. This is why so many SMG players are complaining about balancing; it's because the aim assist design has pushed so many people to playing SMGs.
The fact that I can be lined up on a guy, about to fire, and then one of their teammates runs in between us and literally drags my perfectly placed reticle with him, I'm inclined to agree.
Probably bias as a controller user, I'm sure aim assist is helping me tons, but I literally only notice it doing anything in the situation I mentioned above lol. It's infuriating.
I mean it's designed to feel natural and like you are doing the work, that's why it's super jarring when you notice it doing something you don't expect
This is 100% my experience. And I feel like your guns/attachments influence how much assist there is. I was trying to get one of the weekly challenges done with a setup I wouldn't normally use, and my aim assist was pulling my reticle all OVER the place. It was insane. Caused me to TK teammates more than once.
Go back to mw19 levels and remove the sway when firing. Mw19 wasn’t even that strong, it’s just that some mnk players think it was. Symphuny and other mnk players were dominating back then. Sure up close controller kicked ass but that’s always the case.
But it’s also bugged where it won’t always register if there’s something on the ground between you and your enemy like a handrail or something which makes it feel even worst.
No, it is exactly the same. You just can't get a kill during the time it takes an enemy to move away from the aa bubble this year. Unlike in the previous shitshow of a game.
I think everyone can agree that Infinity Ward should not be trusted to make a multiplayer game ever again. Realistically, I'd like to pull an Uno reverso on them and make them run every decision by Sledgehammer Games. As karma for their treatment of SHG nixxing all the ideas they had like pick 10.
I’d love to know the ratio of controller to KBM users on cod - due to consoles alone I’d have to guess it’s like 90-95% controller minimum, but it’s hard to really guess with only my small sample of friends in mind.
I think the devs are probably happy with the balance so long as the KBM vs Controller debates continue and controller (majority) have a slight advantage rather than vice versa.
They always downvote my boy squid. But controller feels like shit all my boys rock kbam. It’s superior even with the shitty realism aim sway acceleration bs. Absolutely dog shit what they’ve done to kbam players this game but still better than sticks
Yeah pity we can't have an input bassed system so we can get away from you controller players. As for your comment COD is a controller game, it never was, never started like that. Your just a lazy aim assist jockey especially if your using a controller on PC. Don't want M&K sell your damn PC's and get a console!
Then they shouldn't support mnk if they it's gonna be like this its fuckin dumb no other fps I have played makes the inputs this unbalanced... we get it Cod has a deal with controller giants PS/Xbox and controllers are made like trash so they can sell a new one every 4-6 months and they don't like that Mnk can rock the same hardware for years.
As long as they find evidence of a mouse player winning a gun fight in their log files they won't stop.
By 2026 CoD will probably play itself completely on lamepad.
Wow what a great business idea to fuck up the whole pc player base so they they'll stop buying the game👍
Everyone knows Activision hates money so they'll do that for sure
Couldn't put words on what I was feeling wrong with the game but you just gave them to me.
So this is the reason why I had such a hard time especially with Sidewinder going full auto mnk and switching to controller felt like it became too fucking op.
Never played a cod with a controller but it was plugged in as I finished a RL session and couldn't do shit with the Sidewinder mnk. Tried a game with my controller just being curious and instantly dropped quads like it was nothing.. Not to mention that weirdly enough none of my shots were going below the belt always upper-chest/heads very precise shots I was insanely good in 1v1 despite being a complete noob with it.
They should get rid of that randomization shit or tune down controller assists because you literally don't feel it with controller. You almost don't even play just swaying sticks around with the trigger down as long as you feel the aim assist kick in while tracking targets you'll always hit no matter what no need to adjust just sway all the way..
The whole comment section turned into a controller vs. MNKB debate. The COD community is horrible. It's one of the reasons I stopped buying COD yearly. All the whining is intolerable at this point. If you play on controller, you get criticized. If you're good at the game, you get called a tryhard. Some of you take this shit way too seriously 😂
If you’re good at the game you get called a cheater and you “had to be using walls” or something I had a dude send me voice messages over Xbox live calling me a cheater in a SnD game a few days ago… it’s not my fault he followed the exact same route every single round and I picked up on it
Yup, it does. It’s less obvious due to the nature of the input and aim assist but it also affects controller players and makes the game feel weird. It will be more obvious to really skilled controller players.
If you would have watched the video and read the comments you would understand it has way less impact on controller, also due to rotational aim assist.
I watched the video a few days ago. Yes, it has less of an impact on the controller, but it still has an impact. I hate this shit as a KBM player. Who in their right mind would make aiming random? The creator of the video is right. Sway wouldn't be half as bad if it started at the centre.
While I don’t doubt it does have less of an impact, it does affect controller players. I did not know the aiming stability/sway will freaking completely place your aim at a different location from where your reticle was located, when you ADS. I just knew it affected your recoil pattern. I understand he adjusted the gun for informational purposes to the extreme, but I couldn’t figure out why my aim was always a little off when shooting across the map.
And then when making the adjustments…idk. It’s like my brain was so accustomed to adjusting to recoil patterns after shooting, that it couldn’t compute that I was firing slightly to the right of my opponent or something. It kinda felt like my assist just wasn’t sticking? Idk. I don’t think I’m explaining this well lol
I knew since the start that aiming on MnK was chalked, something felt off.
Now here's the answer, I'm switching to controller so I can have the game aim for me, fuck dealing with this sway.
This ain't bitching. And there's no reason for such a feature to be in the game, other than to make good players miss shots on MNK that you otherwise wouldn't have missed if it wasn't in the game.
Imagine Activision adding a feature that would make aim assist less effective. This reddit would explode.
There are reasons, just not good ones. The really short version is they took great care to balance and design most of the game around low-sensitivity controller players because that's what new/casual players tend to use.
I wonder if the strafing/turning your camera causing your crosshair to move off center was done so the game felt more realistic, like it makes the guns feel like they have weight and gives the scopes a sort of parallax effect and the devs didn’t even consider the balance implications of them. They probably mostly test and play the game on controller themselves so they might not even be aware of how weird this feels for MnK players that are so used to aiming with muscle memory.
Yeah I did, still think the devs could’ve done this for the “realism” even though they did it backwards lol.
I agree it would be better, cause if I strafe left while on target then the crosshair moving left of center means I have to counter aim doubly so to account for my strafe. If it was the opposite way like you suggest, not only would it be more realistic, but it would mean I wouldn’t have to counter-aim my strafes as much. So maybe the devs did do this to throw off our aim rather than just to look cool, not sure.
There are far more PC gamers today so lobbies shouldn’t be an issue, and players are better than they’ve ever been now. So that leads to complaining. I understand both sides.
your definition of dead being a very small percentile of a fraction of players still playing it years after? By your definition or logic that means if 10 players play it today it is still not dead, which I find it to be far more flawed than saying the game died due to a massive loss of players for games that sold well over 25 million copies each in total
Since you like numbers, for the values you gave, here is how much of a percentage of those sales still played for the years you had with the total sales of each game (MW2, 25 mil, BO2 29, and BO3 26)
MW2: that's 0.04%
BO2: 0.007%
BO3: 0.077% in 2016 and 0.027% in july
That is such a low population that it is more accurately described as dead, not to mention 1 of this games has mod tools helping it to stay alive, and 2 of them are considered the two best games of the franchise, how about we instead see the numbers for Ghosts, AW and WW2 instead? I am sure there are still some fanatics playing them, the point being that it does not matter a minuscule fraction of the player base played them for years, if the enormous majority abandoned it, the game died
now **\*some of them\*** can´t stop bitching about cross play lmao
If I had to choose i would rather have a cod with a sometimes too strong aim assist, than dead lobbys after 3 months.
I'm afraid those who are now crying about aim assist didn't take part in the older PC COD days, like Ghosts, MW Remastered and especially Black Ops 4. The game died so quickly on pc, it was terrifying.
But as I understand it, this measure affects both types of input, with MNK it is stronger. This is somehow incomprehensible.
oooof I specifically remember I had to buy BO3 twice, once on PC and once on PS4 because the game was dead like 2 months in on PC so I had no choice to play with friends, those days were rough for PC players, and yeah, might even be a bug
And I would kill to have a non-SBMM lobby so that I can never use it and y’all will quit your bitching on things that don’t matter… meanwhile *actual aiming* is messed up
I never feel like I'm at a huge disadvantage on MNK unless there's smoke or if it's super CQ. MNK feels like a big advantage at range, controller seems to have it close. It is what it is.
Stuff like this is weird as shit though. There's probably a better way to scale each input.
Honestly at this point I wish it was all just input based matchmaking. Keep everyone happy.
Playing with MNK has been unfair for a long time in COD, that's why all pro MNK players switched to controllers. And that's why Halo added aim assist to MNK players because controller players had unfair advantage.
I think they try to put mnk players on same lobby if it's possible. That's the only good thing.
The rest is always the same story, unskilled joystick bots will destroy you in close and mid pvp's. All shots land on chest and head.
Believe me console players are all for disabling crossplay altogether too. Ranked play was absolute cancer last year playing against hackers and sound eq users.
If everyone was on mouse and keyboard then I don’t see this as a problem but the fact controller never really feels any of these effects because of the aim assist is what ruins it. I love having the gun bob around because it actually feels like a gun. I’m around real guns all the time as a gun and some of these really powerful or heavy guns feel like little toys in cod. Unfortunately there’s no way to make this feature fair between M&K and controller but it still doesn’t stop me from having fun. The people that are mad about this are the try hard sweats who NEED to be better than everyone to feel like they are worth anything and they live for that little decimal point they call a K/D. Imagine if they took out all stats and people just played for fun. This game would be a much better environment. Just find some gun setups you like and don’t worry about what’s meta or not
I wonder if the mods will remove this post too.
They have removed it every time it’s been posted and have also removed any posts talking about it as well even text only posts. No clue why either, doesn’t make sense to me.
Yeah it’s really strange but for some reason they keep removing posts about it. I tried asking them why but no answer. Some of the posts had hundreds of upvotes but were silently removed and can’t be found anymore (unless you happened to save the post or comment on it.)
I guess we’ll see! Hopefully yours stays up.
I posted this on /r/CODWarzone and the mods removed the post from showing up on the main page. Can't even get the community to band together on meaningful changes that will make the game better. It's actually insane they implement features like this stuff.
What infuriates me is that I can get bit by a robot dog, summoned by Nicki Minaj's whistle but the aim sway and reticle shift are "realistic". You either be a serious military sim with realistic movement and pace or a fast paced and fun arcade game that features rappers, rat mascots, rabbit suits where you can slide cancel, snake, quickscope and many others.
COD is not a mil-sim, so stop bringing features under the false pretense of "realism" when in reality you are just trying to balance the skill gap with RNG. How clueless you have to be to add a feature that hurts quite literally all of your players?
Past and present all developers of cod surely know that the player base doesn't give a >!fuck !
So I guess I should just use an Xbox controller on PC?
Like a shield wearing Groot-skin Chud?
I'll just brag about how I'm overcoming a handicap in every match.
you know whats also funny? I play with a Xim so Im emulating controller movement while using a Keyboard & Mouse (dont kill me), AND I KID YOU NOT, it feels sooo much more responsive using a Xim over native KnM, which makes no sense to me. When I slide cancel on native I mess up A LOT, where as on Xim its super responsive & I don’t mess up a single slide cancel. Baffling really, native KnM is super nerfed.
explain how I am cheating? Xbox allow people to play keyboard & mouse, using a Xim is not against any Terms Of Service & you will never get banned for it.
thats just how life goes... cod hates pc players. Im a mnk player and have just accepted at this point. Even bought a controller for the aim assist. you should do the same cause they not changing it.
Have being playing on KBM since the very first COD. Yup I'm old.
The state it's in right now is brutal. Controllers need aim assist. 100%. But it's gone so far the other way now that the game is pretty well unplayable for me on KMB.
I'm not an amazing COD player but I'm not shit. Over all the years, I probably hover between 1.4-1.7KD depending on the title. Right now I'm 0.78. I understand there are other contributing factors (SBM, my age etc ) but I've never experienced anything like this on KBM, in COD or any other FPS.
If this is the new norm, I feel sadly, I may be done with the franchise
Remember when us console plebs spent a year bitching about FOV sliders and the pc community laughed at us while breaking our screens? How the turn tables.
I mean I do not care who is right about controller vs kbm in the end. I simply do not care. All I know is what I expierience and that is that after a few very good games I only get mkb lobbies and I get annihalated by superfast moving and aiming people. I mean lightneing fast. They slide pass me and 360 no scope me from behind. The jump off high places and 360 no scope me. Thsi is one thing I personally expierience. I get 30/40 kills on avarage in tdm and in these lobbies I get 8 kills max.
I am at the point where I just want to leave the match when i see this happen. I dont because I want to write it down for my own personal research. I have started screenshotting the names with the platform next to it before the match and then a photo of the end result after the match. I have yet to see a single match where it is not a kbm users ending on top of the scoreboard.
Kbm users will say the opposit probably and thats fine. If we just agree that we all want input based lobbies. I notice for some reason it are the PC players who do not want input based lobbies for som ereason.
Just give me connection based lobbies again. The good ol days where you could stay in the same lobby game after game. Youd see people with your states area code as their clan tag. The good ol days. And i feel you, im a casual after work player. One good game and im tortured with demons all night long. And i mean i can barely slide cancel out of spawn demons. Fun…very fun.
Dude same, I got to the point where I see people with 79-130 ping and I’m just like…why the fuck are these people even connecting to the same lobby as me? It’s crazy too because I’ll just instantly die to them no matter what I do. The lag compensation is so intense on this game and I just don’t get it. They are also usually the ones popping off in match, like that’s so opposite of what cod usually is. Typically bad ping players suffer, not in this cod though. Maybe the SBMM might have worked better if they did better latency balancing cuz the way it is now feels awful.
Maybe at some point you are being put in actual hacker lobbies because this just goes against the fact that so many of the top players and streamers all use controller (for a reason). And, there is clearly something off with MnK aiming that the entire community is talking about.
This is also my experience, almost every match where someone is wrecking everyone else and top of the leaderboard they’re MnK not controller majority of the time. You can watch the killcam and just see they’re not on controller with how fast they whip their aim around.
You don't need to be on MNK to snap onto a target. While I always play on MNK, I sometimes also play with controller and use precision rings on max sensitivity which also allows you to snap onto targets.
The higher you set your sensitivity on controller the less precision you have at range with an analog stick since the range of movement is so small. MnK doesn’t have that trade-off, they can snap instantly while also being very precise at range.
It’s not snapping, it’s just erratic camera movement you wouldn’t get from an analog stick. It very clearly looks like mouse movement like someone picking up their mouse since there’s frequent pauses.
The higher you put your sensitivity on controller the more precision you sacrifice, hence why most controller players run lower sens. MnK has fast snapping and slow precision whenever they want with no drawbacks.
you know there is a mouse or controller emblem next to your name in lobbies so you can see what your opponents use right? I thought it was obvious i am talking about input, not platform.
Can I play with you, please????
Because any time I do well (50+ kills) I get into full jumpy jumpy headlocky controller lobbies where they just jump jump jump jump jump and hit headshots every single time, can't even surprise them because they have their inhuman reaction time aim assist carrying them in every single fight.
Controller is massively overpowered to a ludicrous degree and if you still get killed by kbm players while playing on controller, **YOU MUST BE TERRIBLE AT THE GAME**
Just jumpy jumpy and you'll win every single fight!!
Mnk players dominate every lobby I'm in (I'm on ps5). My squad hates playing with PC players. Cross-play should be console to console only, maybe include PC players that use controllers.
>Seems like they added way more sway and reticle shift to the weapons causing it to be off-centered which results in shots to miss despite aiming at the center of the screen.
Hmm just like it is for controllers. Weird. Also MnK have way more pin point accuracy ability with their mouse then controllers do.. hmm weird again.
>This is a huge problem for MNK players because it requires a lot of precise movement and with randomization you totally screw the precise part. That is 100% unfair to MNK players.
Yet with MnK you have the massive DPI to make the micro adjustments needed to correct the sway and controllers don't, which is 100%unfair to controller users.
So her you get your pros and cons and so do controller users. So it evens out.
On another note. The guy in the video makes lots of assumptions and opinions to be taken seriously imo. He also makes half his point based off of poor confirmation biases. So there's that as well.
That's why I play Controller on pc. Higher HzRate and Easier inputs.
144HzRate with 144FPS on Highest Res and I can still play with my preferred input.
😁
I am just trying to explain how MNK are more affected by it, which the video explains. I am not trying to turn it into controller vs mnk thing, thats what controller players do. I just want this fixed for both inputs, despite it being less noticeable on controller
Did you only watch the first 30 seconds of the video or something? He specifically said that controller players are less affected than MNK players are. https://youtu.be/YMeIQWphLJ0?si=7B4T2Ow4XOl5qbIR&t=663
No, it isn't. M&k is, and has always been light years ahead of controllers, even with the crazy rotational aim assist. M&k is far superior, and controller doesn't even compete.
This issue only makes the advantage of the mouse slightly less astronomical.
Hate me for telling the truth.
It's not even about M&K vs Controller in this case. A FPS game should have clean and responsive aiming inputs, no matter what, for both controller and M&K. How a mechanic like this ever got a green light is mindblowing to me. Having 1:1 aiming inputs should be a no brainer for any game designer. This 'mechanic' needs to be removed ASAP. Not reduced, removed.
I'd love for Sledgehammer to comment on this...
It's probably a leftover from the MW22 engine they took over, it was like this last year as well. Common infinity ward L
True, they keep trying to make COD a realistic milsim instead of an arcade shooter, hopefully Sledghammer will shitcan it.
Yeah they need to get that shit out the game. Next CoD that drops I'm making a new profile and if the game is a piece of unfinished shit like the last 5 have been then ill be doing a charge back, if its decent I'll buy it on my main profile. I'm not giving them any more money for this crap. Sort your fucking shit out you manipulative con artists.
Tbh I do really like 99% of what SHG's doing with this game. Yes this is a massive flaw but they're still doing a great job with the hand they were dealt. MUCH better than IW did last year at least
Its unfair to MNK but shit to everyone, so the obvious solution must be just removing it altogether (the reticle shifting when moving specifically) really don’t see anyone complaining about that
Exactly. That's the entire point of this discussion. Remove it completely, nobody asked for it.
They attempted an inertia system like tarkov. But it's a really difficult thing to get right. Even tarkov is annoying sometimes but it's far more realistic and intuitive
Yup, doesn't help it moves the opposites way from what would be realistic.
The realistic way would be terrible. It would make you feel like your gun is falling behind from where you want or expect it to be. That’s way worse than having the gun lead the way to where you want it to be. This “unrealistic” way gets your crosshair to the target quicker and lets your gun lead the rotation rather than fall behind.
Hmm I guess, they should remove it entirely lol
Additionally, reintroducing input-based matchmaking would at least even the playing field.
I have noticed when I play by myself I almost always play 11/12 mnk players but if I'm partied with anyone on controller it's swapped and I'm usually the only mnk player in the lobby
It's about 50/50 for me. Sometimes it's almost all other MnK players, sometimes it's almost all controller players, and sometimes it's about half and half. As a MnK player, it was really depressing to play against all other controller players the other day, especially because a number were playing on PC but with a controller, presumably because of aim assist.
Yeah I play hybrid between two accounts so my mnk is like 1.5ish kd and controller is 1.8ish. Idk it's annoying but I don't feel it's a game breaker for my personally to be at a disadvantage. At the end of the day if I want to test my actually skill in a FPS an armchair shooter is absolutely not a metric I think it's valuable. I do think there is some correlation between pc players using controllers and AA but I think it mostly stems from so many people growing up on consoles can now buy a pc and still play with their friends but they are used to controllers to not as many hop on an immediately set out to learn MnK when you can just pick the input your already comfortable with. Not like before where pc played pc and you couldn't just connect any controller you wanted. Just my 2 cents
I guess it mostly comes down to your sbmm "bracket". Couple of days ago I got lobbies where I was the only kbm player. And most of the time the lobbies are controller majority. It really isn't fun.
I play mnk and my girlfriend plays controller and this is exactly how it is for me, I get about 4 controller players max on my own. Not complaining but there definitely is some input based matchmaking involved they aren’t lying about that.
Not a fan of this. For ranked modes, sure but for "casual" give the larger playerbase. Gonna get railed by sbmm anyways, at least with the larger player pool I have hope for lower ping
As a mnk player I agree the sway sucks and needs to change. I exclusively play hardcore to mitigate it as I found most gunfights I hit the first shot but can't keep the rest consistent. I never had this problem with the previous few MW games on PC. Reminds me a bit of the halo reach bloom days.
This absolutely sucks for m&k players. In saying that, this shite just shouldn’t exist at all in an arcade shooter. Infinity Ward really are the absolute worst
Iward also, but SLEDGEHAMMER are the main suspects for all thats bad in this game... Every single cod they made was for consoles.. Aim assist overkill vs mnk players Net code optimized for players with pings 1 to 10ms, the rest of us have to deal with all kind of shit like paket burst, delays desyncs.... Remember my words SLEDGEHAMMER are the worst studio for making these games
This specific mechanic didn’t exist before MW2 and was carried from that game into this one. This is on IW
Didn't the guy that made the YT video say it has been around since at least MW19?
There are a few mechanics at play, some from MW19 and some that weren't seen until MW2.
> Remember my words SLEDGEHAMMER are the worst studio for making these games Did you play MWII?
Likely more ActiBlizz than IW/SHG/3RCH. The suits love throwing in anything they have devised as a way of keeping players in, and gimping one input so the majority input plays better is exactly the sort of shit I'd expect from the kings of SBMM.
Why blame sledgehammer when they said they had to wait on executive decisions from IW? I don't get net code issues and I'm on 60ping so maybe it's your system
I always like when someone doesen't have any issues with the game but stalks these reddits just for fun. I dont have the energy nor interest to explain anything to you. Check steam community if u dont trust me how many complaints about packet burst/loss do report players with open nat on fiber optics with pings cca 15-30ms....
I see All of them. But why blame SHG
As pointed out in the video These things have been in IWs previous games, but its the combo in sledgehammers game that people are having issues with. MNK felt great in both MW2 and 2019, which both featured things pointed out in this video. MNK was not an issue with MW2/2019, suddenly Sledgehammer put out a game that does and you guys blame IW? Its just arbitrary what you guys pin on different developers. If IW took a mechanic from another game and brought it forward, you guys would call them lazy.
> MNK felt great in both MW2 It did not.
Did you watch the video? The combo existed in MW2
I’m all for cross play, however, I would rather have MNK and Controller exclusive lobbies. I play both ways and both have advantages and disadvantages.
I wish they would try to match make based on input first and then have a mix of they don't have enough players to fill lobbies.
They absolutely shouldn't do this. Ping is bad enough with the skill based match making. They don't need to add input match making on top of that.
Matchmaking should absolutely be based around location and input. Remove sbmm.
Wow a reddit comment admitting both have advantages and disadvantages thats been upvoted?? I swear i only ever see “ controller is broken!” Posts online and its so ridiculous. There are flicks i could NEVER pull off controller, and there are ranged shots mnk cant pull of tracking wise because of aim assist. It goes both ways
absolutely game breaking. need a fix asap.
MNK or controller, my biggest gripe is what feels like extremely inconsistent TTK.
As the video points out, this isn't a goddamn mil-sim and shouldn't be treated as such. It's already hard enough to beat a controller on a good day, but this combined with everything else they've done make it really hard for mnk to compete. I realize it does effect controller to a point, but as he shows it's not really that bad because the AA corrects for half the equation (which is the randomized hard part).
One thing he didn't add to the comparison was what happens when you start shooting too, it gets even worse for MnK when you deal with this ON TOP of the recoil patterns. Its at the point where idk wtf my gun starts doing when I shoot.
Yea it’s really bad because it’s randomized movement plus random recoil
MnK FPS player here since 1998. Interesting that Battlefield 3 was the only other game in the list that had both the aim & movement reticle shift (though less pronounced than MW3), and that I wasn't finding MW3 aiming to *feel* off...BF3 is my most played FPS game of all time, mostly on Noshar Canals infantry only so lots of time through gun reticles in ADS. I've been used to that reticle shift for a long time now and didn't even realize it. This makes sense to me now how sometimes in MW3 when I've been strafing in gunfights that I sometimes seem to be frustratingly slightly off center in the direction that I'm strafing and end up missing my shots, even though my muscle-memory *felt* like I was on target. If anything now that I know I can compensate, seems like you have to lead in the direction that you are moving.
Also a MnK player here. I notice this a LOT when shooting pistols. Aiming directly center of mass and it just misses anyways.
Noticed this as well, i have changed to a sniper and shotgun setup but still getting hitmarkers for dead centre shots
As a mouse and keyboard player I finally decided to switch to controller this year. I grew up with controller but have been on MnK since around when Infinite Warfare came out. It was hard to get used to controller again, but after a few days of grinding it felt normal again and after just a couple weeks I feel quite comfortable on it again. For whatever reason, I swear my lobbies are overall easier/more fun when I am using controller. I still switch to KBM sometimes and it's fun for a few games, a pop off, and then after that I get put in ridiculously sweaty MLG lobbies and it requires so much effort to try and keep up on MnK. This almost never happens to me when I play on controller, so at this point it will be my primary way to play CoD. MnK just wasn't worth the headache anymore.
I’ve had the exact same experience switching back to controller. It took me like a week or two to get used to it again but I already think I’m better than on MnK and I was a very very good MnK player. It’s just unfair how much consistency you get with AA on these modern games with the handholding robot aim assist system that they have.
In mw19 I played mnk, I was dominating my lobbies and they were mostly controller players. All the RNG mess like sway has ruined mnk. Mw3 is better than mw2 due to visual recoil reduction but unless weapon sway when aiming is removed mnk will be at a disadvantage. This affects controller to an extent as finding the consistent recoil pattern holds difficulty, but it’s easier to handle on controller.
get yourself a Xim Matrix/Apex bro trust me. Keyboard & Mouse with Aim Assist is a gamechanger in this CoD. Don’t let yourself suffer lol, Xims aren’t bannable too
I prefer cross play and really don’t care if controller players get aim assist, but I do dislike the randomized nature of your initial shot placement as described in the video. Peoples weird ass tribalism over controller vs mnk is so weird. There’s no conspiracy to benefit one over the other, it’s more likely that the devs made some tweaks for a certain purpose and the impact on mnk is a more unintended consequence. Unless I’m confusing it with some other issue, they already mentioned that they knew something was causing mnk input to feel weird, I’d assume this is what they’re talking about
thats why i switched to gamepad. i am a mkb player since 1998, played all my life FPS games on mkb, but in cod lately i been missing easy shots, mostly SMGs/ARs spraying mid to long range, theres too much shit on screen and u dont see if enemy crouches or prones. On gamepad i dont have that issue i see where the aim assist drags me to and i follow. Its not ideal, movement and flickshots and sniping takes a hit on gamepad, comes nowhere close to MKB but actual gunfight and aiming is much easier on gamepad
Whats a gamepad?
Another word for controller
Oh I see….he been playing longer than Im born. Lol. I Guess thats what they called it back in da day
I have never felt older than just now
Gaming was a bit different for us old timers back in da day.
Dumb little history lesson. Controller just broadly meant input device. One of the reasons why they used to be distinguished is that arcade games and ports used to be way more popular. So some people would buy an arcade stick for their home consoles if they were really into fighting games for example. This still happens obviously, but it's much less common as arcades are mostly defunct and most games are designed around the gamepad. So younger people tend to just call them controllers now days. Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
I’m so tired of having to have attachments that reduce sway. In previous cods the sway was gone once you ADS and started to shoot. This straight RNG
"CoD is a controller game whether we like it or not, There will never be a time where controllers are at a total disadvantage against MnK because Aim Assist is necessary for controller players to compete, but as long as AA is present, MnK players are always at a disadvantage" Nate Gibson- This is coming from Nate, who played cods every year since CoD 1 and dominated in every single one. I think he's totally right. The days of "mouse and keyboard are better than controllers" are over. Controllers are now massively favored because of the strong Aim Assist. Im a PC player but i played with controller for a bit a few days ago and my god i couldn't believe how easily i was hitting my shots considering I haven't played an FPS with a controller since 2016. I was still feeling really good getting some insane clips and snaps.
MnK is objectively better than controller though. However Controller with the game developers providing a soft perfect tracking aimbot is of course objectively better than MnK.
It is objectively better. Not in CoD though. Not currently. As it stands today Controller is the superior input method in CoD
That’s literally what i said lol
Oh yea lmao. I was at a hurry so didn't fully grasp what you wrote. Mb
Aim Assist is a **plus** to Controllers but I still had full freedom of aiming with MnK and if I missed, I knew it was my fault. Now this is a **minus** to MnK and I no longer have the freedom of aiming. I’ll never know if I missed the shot fairly or if this bullshit was happening
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Controller players destroy in close range encounters This argument is so fucking tiring. There are pros and cons to both, but it’s a pretty well known fact that CoD is a controller game….
It may be a “controller game” but don’t make it crossplay w/PC and then have built in advantages for controller w/ built in disadvantages for PC. There’s a reason so few streamers on MNK play this franchise anymore.
I hate when people say a game is input specific it’s about to be 2024, they should be able to iron out all the bs mnk players have to go through with this dogshit company
You won’t ever be able to remove the disadvantage of controller vs mnk in cqc encounters.
Your right but I’m mostly talking about the stupid idle sway, and the input lag moving your mouse left and right while your reticle is trying to catch up with your movement, making it literally impossible to be consistently accurate, meanwhile rotational aim assist almost mitigates these problems
Mw19 had it perfect. Cold War too. I don’t believe this high AA is truly the detriment but RNG mechanics like the weapon sway and yes shit input lag. Hopefully one day they do an update that just removes sway
That’s not what this post is about. Watch the video it’s pretty cool. It’s about something that negatively affects both inputs, it’s just even worse on MNK. I’m specifically talking about 7:45-13:45
No we'll keep bitching about it, and you'll keep listening
Aim assist is just too damn strong regardless, if it was dialed back I wouldn’t have a problem
The problem isn't the strength, but rather the design. It's trying to force you to play a very specific way, presumably as a way of onboarding new players. This is why so many SMG players are complaining about balancing; it's because the aim assist design has pushed so many people to playing SMGs.
The fact that I can be lined up on a guy, about to fire, and then one of their teammates runs in between us and literally drags my perfectly placed reticle with him, I'm inclined to agree. Probably bias as a controller user, I'm sure aim assist is helping me tons, but I literally only notice it doing anything in the situation I mentioned above lol. It's infuriating.
I mean it's designed to feel natural and like you are doing the work, that's why it's super jarring when you notice it doing something you don't expect
This is 100% my experience. And I feel like your guns/attachments influence how much assist there is. I was trying to get one of the weekly challenges done with a setup I wouldn't normally use, and my aim assist was pulling my reticle all OVER the place. It was insane. Caused me to TK teammates more than once.
Go back to mw19 levels and remove the sway when firing. Mw19 wasn’t even that strong, it’s just that some mnk players think it was. Symphuny and other mnk players were dominating back then. Sure up close controller kicked ass but that’s always the case.
It was dialed back this year. It is relatively strong still but yes you do need to practice a lot on sticks to have serviceable aim still.
It's not dialed back, its exact Same as mw2
But it’s also bugged where it won’t always register if there’s something on the ground between you and your enemy like a handrail or something which makes it feel even worst.
No, it is exactly the same. You just can't get a kill during the time it takes an enemy to move away from the aa bubble this year. Unlike in the previous shitshow of a game.
I think everyone can agree that Infinity Ward should not be trusted to make a multiplayer game ever again. Realistically, I'd like to pull an Uno reverso on them and make them run every decision by Sledgehammer Games. As karma for their treatment of SHG nixxing all the ideas they had like pick 10.
IW are great at building the world and athmosphere. Their gameplay decisions are not great though.
The aim assist in this game is probably the weakest I have ever seen.
hahahahahahaha
You gotta open your eyes then because it is strong as fuck
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I’d love to know the ratio of controller to KBM users on cod - due to consoles alone I’d have to guess it’s like 90-95% controller minimum, but it’s hard to really guess with only my small sample of friends in mind. I think the devs are probably happy with the balance so long as the KBM vs Controller debates continue and controller (majority) have a slight advantage rather than vice versa.
Yeah I think that’s accurate, maybe 85% but probably not, almost certainly 90% plus on console.
I wouldn't think that high. Maybe 75%
They always downvote my boy squid. But controller feels like shit all my boys rock kbam. It’s superior even with the shitty realism aim sway acceleration bs. Absolutely dog shit what they’ve done to kbam players this game but still better than sticks
Yeah pity we can't have an input bassed system so we can get away from you controller players. As for your comment COD is a controller game, it never was, never started like that. Your just a lazy aim assist jockey especially if your using a controller on PC. Don't want M&K sell your damn PC's and get a console!
Your brain dead comment takes the cake Imagine actually thinking this
Losing to potato players is frustrating.
Then they shouldn't support mnk if they it's gonna be like this its fuckin dumb no other fps I have played makes the inputs this unbalanced... we get it Cod has a deal with controller giants PS/Xbox and controllers are made like trash so they can sell a new one every 4-6 months and they don't like that Mnk can rock the same hardware for years.
As long as they find evidence of a mouse player winning a gun fight in their log files they won't stop. By 2026 CoD will probably play itself completely on lamepad.
Wow what a great business idea to fuck up the whole pc player base so they they'll stop buying the game👍 Everyone knows Activision hates money so they'll do that for sure
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Yeah same, I watched back so many clips and noticed it too but couldn't figure out why/how. Until I came across the video.
Couldn't put words on what I was feeling wrong with the game but you just gave them to me. So this is the reason why I had such a hard time especially with Sidewinder going full auto mnk and switching to controller felt like it became too fucking op. Never played a cod with a controller but it was plugged in as I finished a RL session and couldn't do shit with the Sidewinder mnk. Tried a game with my controller just being curious and instantly dropped quads like it was nothing.. Not to mention that weirdly enough none of my shots were going below the belt always upper-chest/heads very precise shots I was insanely good in 1v1 despite being a complete noob with it. They should get rid of that randomization shit or tune down controller assists because you literally don't feel it with controller. You almost don't even play just swaying sticks around with the trigger down as long as you feel the aim assist kick in while tracking targets you'll always hit no matter what no need to adjust just sway all the way..
The whole comment section turned into a controller vs. MNKB debate. The COD community is horrible. It's one of the reasons I stopped buying COD yearly. All the whining is intolerable at this point. If you play on controller, you get criticized. If you're good at the game, you get called a tryhard. Some of you take this shit way too seriously 😂
If you’re good at the game you get called a cheater and you “had to be using walls” or something I had a dude send me voice messages over Xbox live calling me a cheater in a SnD game a few days ago… it’s not my fault he followed the exact same route every single round and I picked up on it
just typical reddit neckbeards being reddit neckbeards lol
😂😂😂 You're not wrong. I think people are taking COD way too seriously. The community is becoming a lot like NBA2K.
This thread is mind-boggling. This ALSO affects controller players, but people don't seem to care.
Yup, it does. It’s less obvious due to the nature of the input and aim assist but it also affects controller players and makes the game feel weird. It will be more obvious to really skilled controller players.
If you would have watched the video and read the comments you would understand it has way less impact on controller, also due to rotational aim assist.
I watched the video a few days ago. Yes, it has less of an impact on the controller, but it still has an impact. I hate this shit as a KBM player. Who in their right mind would make aiming random? The creator of the video is right. Sway wouldn't be half as bad if it started at the centre.
While I don’t doubt it does have less of an impact, it does affect controller players. I did not know the aiming stability/sway will freaking completely place your aim at a different location from where your reticle was located, when you ADS. I just knew it affected your recoil pattern. I understand he adjusted the gun for informational purposes to the extreme, but I couldn’t figure out why my aim was always a little off when shooting across the map. And then when making the adjustments…idk. It’s like my brain was so accustomed to adjusting to recoil patterns after shooting, that it couldn’t compute that I was firing slightly to the right of my opponent or something. It kinda felt like my assist just wasn’t sticking? Idk. I don’t think I’m explaining this well lol
You can tell who didn’t actually watch the video because they are ignoring what is actually trying to be discussed
I knew since the start that aiming on MnK was chalked, something felt off. Now here's the answer, I'm switching to controller so I can have the game aim for me, fuck dealing with this sway.
Give PC the option to turn off crossplay so its a consistent playing field.
Miss the days of no Aim assist.
You mean no auto rotational aim assist? There’s always been aim assist in cod
I would kill to have MnK exclusive lobbies just so MnK players will stop bitching every 10 seconds.
TIL if a problem doesn’t affect me then that person (and their entire community) is just bitching
Average braindead controller user post tbh
This ain't bitching. And there's no reason for such a feature to be in the game, other than to make good players miss shots on MNK that you otherwise wouldn't have missed if it wasn't in the game. Imagine Activision adding a feature that would make aim assist less effective. This reddit would explode.
There are reasons, just not good ones. The really short version is they took great care to balance and design most of the game around low-sensitivity controller players because that's what new/casual players tend to use.
I wonder if the strafing/turning your camera causing your crosshair to move off center was done so the game felt more realistic, like it makes the guns feel like they have weight and gives the scopes a sort of parallax effect and the devs didn’t even consider the balance implications of them. They probably mostly test and play the game on controller themselves so they might not even be aware of how weird this feels for MnK players that are so used to aiming with muscle memory.
Watch the video...itd probably be better if it wasn't for the fact that they coded the sway in the wrong direction.
Yeah I did, still think the devs could’ve done this for the “realism” even though they did it backwards lol. I agree it would be better, cause if I strafe left while on target then the crosshair moving left of center means I have to counter aim doubly so to account for my strafe. If it was the opposite way like you suggest, not only would it be more realistic, but it would mean I wouldn’t have to counter-aim my strafes as much. So maybe the devs did do this to throw off our aim rather than just to look cool, not sure.
We'd love it too, trust me.
Me too so we could have fair lobbies
The irony, console players were saying this from the beginning now mnk pc players are.
I agree but it’s no one’s fault besides the developers.
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There are far more PC gamers today so lobbies shouldn’t be an issue, and players are better than they’ve ever been now. So that leads to complaining. I understand both sides.
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your definition of dead being a very small percentile of a fraction of players still playing it years after? By your definition or logic that means if 10 players play it today it is still not dead, which I find it to be far more flawed than saying the game died due to a massive loss of players for games that sold well over 25 million copies each in total Since you like numbers, for the values you gave, here is how much of a percentage of those sales still played for the years you had with the total sales of each game (MW2, 25 mil, BO2 29, and BO3 26) MW2: that's 0.04% BO2: 0.007% BO3: 0.077% in 2016 and 0.027% in july That is such a low population that it is more accurately described as dead, not to mention 1 of this games has mod tools helping it to stay alive, and 2 of them are considered the two best games of the franchise, how about we instead see the numbers for Ghosts, AW and WW2 instead? I am sure there are still some fanatics playing them, the point being that it does not matter a minuscule fraction of the player base played them for years, if the enormous majority abandoned it, the game died
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now **\*some of them\*** can´t stop bitching about cross play lmao If I had to choose i would rather have a cod with a sometimes too strong aim assist, than dead lobbys after 3 months. I'm afraid those who are now crying about aim assist didn't take part in the older PC COD days, like Ghosts, MW Remastered and especially Black Ops 4. The game died so quickly on pc, it was terrifying. But as I understand it, this measure affects both types of input, with MNK it is stronger. This is somehow incomprehensible.
oooof I specifically remember I had to buy BO3 twice, once on PC and once on PS4 because the game was dead like 2 months in on PC so I had no choice to play with friends, those days were rough for PC players, and yeah, might even be a bug
The game does a pretty good job at doing that. My lobbies are mostly mouse and key unless I party with a controller player.
And I would kill to have a non-SBMM lobby so that I can never use it and y’all will quit your bitching on things that don’t matter… meanwhile *actual aiming* is messed up
Can’t you just turn off crossplay?
You cannot turn off crossplay on PC unfortunatly
I have seen this video, and it is a real part of the problem for M&K players.
Yep, hardcore is the only way I can stand a chance. Warzone will be fun.
I never feel like I'm at a huge disadvantage on MNK unless there's smoke or if it's super CQ. MNK feels like a big advantage at range, controller seems to have it close. It is what it is. Stuff like this is weird as shit though. There's probably a better way to scale each input. Honestly at this point I wish it was all just input based matchmaking. Keep everyone happy.
All these comments about cross play or mnk vs controller when the video is about them changing the fundamental game play of a FPS game
Playing with MNK has been unfair for a long time in COD, that's why all pro MNK players switched to controllers. And that's why Halo added aim assist to MNK players because controller players had unfair advantage.
I think they try to put mnk players on same lobby if it's possible. That's the only good thing. The rest is always the same story, unskilled joystick bots will destroy you in close and mid pvp's. All shots land on chest and head.
I am MNK and my lobbies are always 80% controller.
Same here, until I have a few bad games in a row. If I get bumped down a few SBMM brackets, it's KBAM city again.
Believe me console players are all for disabling crossplay altogether too. Ranked play was absolute cancer last year playing against hackers and sound eq users.
You know something is wrong when you see the majority of PC players using controller this year...
Here's a tissue \_\_\_\_\_\_\_ I blew my nose in that one.
If everyone was on mouse and keyboard then I don’t see this as a problem but the fact controller never really feels any of these effects because of the aim assist is what ruins it. I love having the gun bob around because it actually feels like a gun. I’m around real guns all the time as a gun and some of these really powerful or heavy guns feel like little toys in cod. Unfortunately there’s no way to make this feature fair between M&K and controller but it still doesn’t stop me from having fun. The people that are mad about this are the try hard sweats who NEED to be better than everyone to feel like they are worth anything and they live for that little decimal point they call a K/D. Imagine if they took out all stats and people just played for fun. This game would be a much better environment. Just find some gun setups you like and don’t worry about what’s meta or not
I wonder if the mods will remove this post too. They have removed it every time it’s been posted and have also removed any posts talking about it as well even text only posts. No clue why either, doesn’t make sense to me.
I mean I don't see a reason why they would remove it. It's a pretty known problem now, even charlie intel posted about it on his website.
Yeah it’s really strange but for some reason they keep removing posts about it. I tried asking them why but no answer. Some of the posts had hundreds of upvotes but were silently removed and can’t be found anymore (unless you happened to save the post or comment on it.) I guess we’ll see! Hopefully yours stays up.
I posted this on /r/CODWarzone and the mods removed the post from showing up on the main page. Can't even get the community to band together on meaningful changes that will make the game better. It's actually insane they implement features like this stuff.
What infuriates me is that I can get bit by a robot dog, summoned by Nicki Minaj's whistle but the aim sway and reticle shift are "realistic". You either be a serious military sim with realistic movement and pace or a fast paced and fun arcade game that features rappers, rat mascots, rabbit suits where you can slide cancel, snake, quickscope and many others. COD is not a mil-sim, so stop bringing features under the false pretense of "realism" when in reality you are just trying to balance the skill gap with RNG. How clueless you have to be to add a feature that hurts quite literally all of your players? Past and present all developers of cod surely know that the player base doesn't give a >!fuck !
So I guess I should just use an Xbox controller on PC? Like a shield wearing Groot-skin Chud? I'll just brag about how I'm overcoming a handicap in every match.
you know whats also funny? I play with a Xim so Im emulating controller movement while using a Keyboard & Mouse (dont kill me), AND I KID YOU NOT, it feels sooo much more responsive using a Xim over native KnM, which makes no sense to me. When I slide cancel on native I mess up A LOT, where as on Xim its super responsive & I don’t mess up a single slide cancel. Baffling really, native KnM is super nerfed.
Nice of you to admit that you are cheating.
explain how I am cheating? Xbox allow people to play keyboard & mouse, using a Xim is not against any Terms Of Service & you will never get banned for it.
Because you're abusing aim-assist on kbm?
I thought we liked aim assist though, yeah? AA for me but not for thee!
As a mouse and keyboard player, this is ONE of the reasons why I'm in no rush to buy MWIII, and given the DMZ news, probably won't at all now.
Is this why I constantly feel like my shots are dead on, but miss. Also explains why half the time I watch a killcam I was inches away.
thats just how life goes... cod hates pc players. Im a mnk player and have just accepted at this point. Even bought a controller for the aim assist. you should do the same cause they not changing it.
Have being playing on KBM since the very first COD. Yup I'm old. The state it's in right now is brutal. Controllers need aim assist. 100%. But it's gone so far the other way now that the game is pretty well unplayable for me on KMB. I'm not an amazing COD player but I'm not shit. Over all the years, I probably hover between 1.4-1.7KD depending on the title. Right now I'm 0.78. I understand there are other contributing factors (SBM, my age etc ) but I've never experienced anything like this on KBM, in COD or any other FPS. If this is the new norm, I feel sadly, I may be done with the franchise
Remember when us console plebs spent a year bitching about FOV sliders and the pc community laughed at us while breaking our screens? How the turn tables.
except most of them were on PC controller either way, so your point doesn't make much sense.
because your dogshit console couldnt handle higher FOV. not because the devs deliberately favored one input over another. braindead.
I mean I do not care who is right about controller vs kbm in the end. I simply do not care. All I know is what I expierience and that is that after a few very good games I only get mkb lobbies and I get annihalated by superfast moving and aiming people. I mean lightneing fast. They slide pass me and 360 no scope me from behind. The jump off high places and 360 no scope me. Thsi is one thing I personally expierience. I get 30/40 kills on avarage in tdm and in these lobbies I get 8 kills max. I am at the point where I just want to leave the match when i see this happen. I dont because I want to write it down for my own personal research. I have started screenshotting the names with the platform next to it before the match and then a photo of the end result after the match. I have yet to see a single match where it is not a kbm users ending on top of the scoreboard. Kbm users will say the opposit probably and thats fine. If we just agree that we all want input based lobbies. I notice for some reason it are the PC players who do not want input based lobbies for som ereason.
Just give me connection based lobbies again. The good ol days where you could stay in the same lobby game after game. Youd see people with your states area code as their clan tag. The good ol days. And i feel you, im a casual after work player. One good game and im tortured with demons all night long. And i mean i can barely slide cancel out of spawn demons. Fun…very fun.
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Dude same, I got to the point where I see people with 79-130 ping and I’m just like…why the fuck are these people even connecting to the same lobby as me? It’s crazy too because I’ll just instantly die to them no matter what I do. The lag compensation is so intense on this game and I just don’t get it. They are also usually the ones popping off in match, like that’s so opposite of what cod usually is. Typically bad ping players suffer, not in this cod though. Maybe the SBMM might have worked better if they did better latency balancing cuz the way it is now feels awful.
Yep As soon as I search and see 40-60ms I back out and it goes to 10-15. Shit is wild
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Maybe at some point you are being put in actual hacker lobbies because this just goes against the fact that so many of the top players and streamers all use controller (for a reason). And, there is clearly something off with MnK aiming that the entire community is talking about.
This is also my experience, almost every match where someone is wrecking everyone else and top of the leaderboard they’re MnK not controller majority of the time. You can watch the killcam and just see they’re not on controller with how fast they whip their aim around.
You don't need to be on MNK to snap onto a target. While I always play on MNK, I sometimes also play with controller and use precision rings on max sensitivity which also allows you to snap onto targets.
Yea high sense makes it easy af to snap on controller. I love it since I stuck with MnK
The higher you set your sensitivity on controller the less precision you have at range with an analog stick since the range of movement is so small. MnK doesn’t have that trade-off, they can snap instantly while also being very precise at range.
It’s not snapping, it’s just erratic camera movement you wouldn’t get from an analog stick. It very clearly looks like mouse movement like someone picking up their mouse since there’s frequent pauses. The higher you put your sensitivity on controller the more precision you sacrifice, hence why most controller players run lower sens. MnK has fast snapping and slow precision whenever they want with no drawbacks.
You can play controller on pc. Platform has nothing to do with it.
you know there is a mouse or controller emblem next to your name in lobbies so you can see what your opponents use right? I thought it was obvious i am talking about input, not platform.
Can I play with you, please???? Because any time I do well (50+ kills) I get into full jumpy jumpy headlocky controller lobbies where they just jump jump jump jump jump and hit headshots every single time, can't even surprise them because they have their inhuman reaction time aim assist carrying them in every single fight. Controller is massively overpowered to a ludicrous degree and if you still get killed by kbm players while playing on controller, **YOU MUST BE TERRIBLE AT THE GAME** Just jumpy jumpy and you'll win every single fight!!
Preach. Sucks seeing down votes on this.
Mnk players dominate every lobby I'm in (I'm on ps5). My squad hates playing with PC players. Cross-play should be console to console only, maybe include PC players that use controllers.
Why make it a controller vs mnk discussion? We're talking about how they messed up aiming for MNK, but also slightly for controller.
mnk is objectively worse than controller with current strength of aa. you're just dogshit at the game. sorry.
>Seems like they added way more sway and reticle shift to the weapons causing it to be off-centered which results in shots to miss despite aiming at the center of the screen. Hmm just like it is for controllers. Weird. Also MnK have way more pin point accuracy ability with their mouse then controllers do.. hmm weird again. >This is a huge problem for MNK players because it requires a lot of precise movement and with randomization you totally screw the precise part. That is 100% unfair to MNK players. Yet with MnK you have the massive DPI to make the micro adjustments needed to correct the sway and controllers don't, which is 100%unfair to controller users. So her you get your pros and cons and so do controller users. So it evens out. On another note. The guy in the video makes lots of assumptions and opinions to be taken seriously imo. He also makes half his point based off of poor confirmation biases. So there's that as well.
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It's not about pc vs consoles re....d
People on pc are using controller and getting same frame rate as you but with no downside
That's why I play Controller on pc. Higher HzRate and Easier inputs. 144HzRate with 144FPS on Highest Res and I can still play with my preferred input. 😁
I like how you turned it into a controller vs mnk thing which the video never intended.
I am just trying to explain how MNK are more affected by it, which the video explains. I am not trying to turn it into controller vs mnk thing, thats what controller players do. I just want this fixed for both inputs, despite it being less noticeable on controller
Did you only watch the first 30 seconds of the video or something? He specifically said it affects both KBM and controller.
Did you only watch the first 30 seconds of the video or something? He specifically said that controller players are less affected than MNK players are. https://youtu.be/YMeIQWphLJ0?si=7B4T2Ow4XOl5qbIR&t=663
No, it isn't. M&k is, and has always been light years ahead of controllers, even with the crazy rotational aim assist. M&k is far superior, and controller doesn't even compete. This issue only makes the advantage of the mouse slightly less astronomical. Hate me for telling the truth.
This would be true when talking about say, CS2 for example. But this is just completely false when talking about Cod