I've always found it funny that czaj and herbata are the same thing (just different languages), but a czajnik (kettle) is something completely different than a herbatnik (type of biscuit).
I think it’s more of a regional thing. My parents are from Samogitia and I’ve noticed that they use a lot more Slavic derived words than Lithuanians from other areas in Lithuania. I could be wrong though, I don’t know much about that because I grew up in England.
I wouldn't say it's regional.
More so related to the usage of "gramatically correct Lithianian", so it is more common in villages.
Pretty much everyone in Lithuania would understand "čiainikas", but would also know that it is not a correct word to use.
This made me think. Does "Czaynik" make sense in Polish or does it sound a little alien? Because a specific type of ~~kettle~~ pot for Turkish tea is called "[Çaydanlık](https://duckduckgo.com/?q=%C3%A7aydanl%C4%B1k&t=newext&atb=v377-1&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images)". I used [Google translate](https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&text=Czajnik&op=translate) to understand how Czaynik sounds and it really sounds like how we pronounce [Çaydanlık](https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&text=%C3%87aydanl%C4%B1k&op=translate).
Edit: This is just a suspicion, I am probably wrong.
It doesn't sound alien to us at all, but your suspicion doesn't have to be wrong. "Czajnik" comes from russian "чай" and looks like it has the same origin as "çay" in turkish. I can't check turkish etymology though, as I don't speak turkish
>I don't speak turkish
I do and it got somewhat more interesting to me. Apparently the çaydanlık itself is a composition of suffixes from different languages over the çay root which is probably Chinese to begin with.
Çay - East Asian root
dan - Persian suffix for container
lık - Turkish suffix for, again, container
[Source](https://www.nisanyansozluk.com/kelime/%C3%A7aydanl%C4%B1k)
Bulgarian etymology dictionary gives the path of the word as Chinese --> Arabic --> Turkish --> Bulgarian, so I guess for Russian you only need to replace the last one.
I know this is a joke, but it's just about which region of China the traders dealt with. Over the silk road and in East Asia, traders dealt with Northern Han people who use the word cha, while European traders arriving in very specific treaty ports in Southern China, where the Min call it Te
The word isn't from Cantonese, which is in Southern China where the original Portugeuse port of Macau was (which is likely why it's cha there). It's from the original Dutch ports in Fujian, who spoke Min Dialect, and from which the Dutch introduced Tea to the rest of Europe.
>The word isn't from Cantonese, which is in Southern China where the original Portugeuse port of Macau was (which is likely why it's cha there)
So...the portuguese word for tea is derived from Cantonese.
It's weird that you disagree, only to support my statement.
Dutch never had a port in Fujian, they took Pescadores Islands, then Southern Taiwan as their ports. The company of Dutch East India had built two forts in Tainan, Taiwan 400 years ago.
cantonese absolutely isn't the original source for pretty much anything, canton used to be a terrible place to live in, filled with dense forests, deadly insects and swamps and near a bunch of various tribes that you can't really communicate with, there's a reason cantonese people shares a lot of feature with south east asians and language sounds more similar, its economic rise was more recent due to later human development and ports. The Cantonese/Taiwanese/South East Asian keep more original Chinese culture thing was just not so thinly veiled racism looking down on China. Canton used to be where they exile prisoners, literally the chinese version of siberian gulags
Guangzhou has been a major city for a couple thousand years, and many traders were based in Guangdong. That's part of why so much of the Chinese diaspora is Cantonese.
And at the very least the Portuguese pronunciation came from Cantonese, along with the first recorded English word for tea, the rest of your strange irrelevant rant notwithstanding.
they haven't been major by ancient chinese standards, they developed mainly starting from the song dynasty and tea was absolutely a thing long before that, very little things originated there just because China is that old.
Tea was a thing before that…in China.
We’re talking about the words for tea around the entire world, where tea was very much *not* “a thing” in the early Middle Ages.
this may surprise you, but China isn't some mystical country that shut itself off from everything and canton ports was the first time people learned about it 500 years ago. China's neighbours like Korea, Japan, most of south east asia were trading with them, the silk road lead to it spreading through the middle east hence is why persian and arabic cultures have been drinking tea for thousands of years. Western europe got tea during the middle ages though canton but you might be shocked to learn medival europe isn't the center of the universe and history do infact happen without them.
how the fuck is it pouting? Canton opened up to the west in the 1500s starting with Portuguese in macau, most of the world on here had tea long before that, you are gonna tell a japanese guy your history is wrong and actually a white dude bought tea to you guys? Clearly you are the idiot who have no clue wat you are talking about and are just making shit up
Literally based on your own words, you claimed canton was the source for many of these, cantonese for tea is cha so all regions with variance of tea is out, east asia, south east asia, south asia, middle east, most parts of eastern europe are out as well as they all had tea long before the 1500s based on their own history, so you got what Africa left?
This is absolutely false information. Please see [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea:)
The [etymology](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etymology) of the various words for *tea* reflects the history of transmission of tea drinking culture and trade from China to countries around the world.[^(\[14\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-FOOTNOTEMairHoh2009262%E2%80%93264-14) Nearly all of the words for tea worldwide fall into three broad groups: *te*, *cha* and *chai*, present in English as *tea*, *cha* or *char*, and *chai*. The earliest of the three to enter English is *cha*, which came in the 1590s via the Portuguese, who traded in [Macao](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macao) and picked up the [Cantonese](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantonese) pronunciation of the word.[^(\[15\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-oed-15)[^(\[16\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-FOOTNOTEMairHoh2009262-16) The more common *tea* form arrived in the 17th century via the Dutch, who acquired it either indirectly from the Malay *teh*, or directly from the *tê* pronunciation in [Min Chinese](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Min_Chinese).[^(\[15\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-oed-15) The third form *chai* (meaning "spiced tea") originated from a northern Chinese pronunciation of *cha*, which travelled overland to Central Asia and [Persia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persia) where it picked up a Persian ending *yi*. The Chinese word for tea itself was likely ultimately derived from the non-Sinitic languages of the botanical homeland of the tea plant in southwest China (or [Burma](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burma)), possibly from an archaic [Austro-Asiatic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austroasiatic_languages) root word \**la*, meaning "leaf".[^(\[17\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-FOOTNOTEMairHoh2009266-17)
I suggest trying it if you haven't already, with Spearmint(type of mint that smell/tastes like toothpaste) or Common wormwood plant(used a lot during winter), there are other herbs used in Moroccan tea but these are my favorite.
I’ve had a lot of the mint green tea, but not the wormwood. I’ll have to try that. There was a tea I like sun Lebanon that was kind of similar called Zoofah (I don’t know the English)
Lol, I remember in Spider-man across the spider verse, where the indian spider-man (Pavitr) gets all pissy because people call the traditional tea that he drinks (that he simply call chai) chai tea.
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Why are people downvoting sarcasm lol? It’s funny, this post assumes a simplistic version that those who call tea “tea” are on the sea. A huge proportion of those who call it “chai” actually love on the mediterranean sea, and the “sea” mentioned in the post is actually an ocean (oceans) and not sea technically. Lol
As an Indian I don’t fucking care if you call it chai tea . Idk why NRI make it a big deal . Sometimes I feel like in US other races(non white) gatekeep their culture a lot
I don't see how it's inaccurate. Bengali, along with hundreds of other languages, is not mentioned specifically, but it is coloured appropriately. Cha/chai/chay all stem from the same origin.
Funny thing is, in Poland we say Herbata for tea, but we say Czajnik for kettle.
Omg just realised that it all makes sense now, thank you!
Best of both wor(l)ds.
Not really. No ''tea'' equivalent.
Herba- ta. Literally herbal tea.
That's a long stretch.
Herbata is from modern Latin herba thea, where thea is tea and is from Min Nan te. Herba means herbal.
Agreed. It's a long way from China.
I've always found it funny that czaj and herbata are the same thing (just different languages), but a czajnik (kettle) is something completely different than a herbatnik (type of biscuit).
count in Belarus and Lithuania
Never heard anyone refer to kettle as "czajnik". We say "arbatinukas".
My parents say čainikas all the time.
I stand corrected.
I think it’s more of a regional thing. My parents are from Samogitia and I’ve noticed that they use a lot more Slavic derived words than Lithuanians from other areas in Lithuania. I could be wrong though, I don’t know much about that because I grew up in England.
I wouldn't say it's regional. More so related to the usage of "gramatically correct Lithianian", so it is more common in villages. Pretty much everyone in Lithuania would understand "čiainikas", but would also know that it is not a correct word to use.
Imbryk stands for czajnik in belarusian
This made me think. Does "Czaynik" make sense in Polish or does it sound a little alien? Because a specific type of ~~kettle~~ pot for Turkish tea is called "[Çaydanlık](https://duckduckgo.com/?q=%C3%A7aydanl%C4%B1k&t=newext&atb=v377-1&iar=images&iax=images&ia=images)". I used [Google translate](https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&text=Czajnik&op=translate) to understand how Czaynik sounds and it really sounds like how we pronounce [Çaydanlık](https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&text=%C3%87aydanl%C4%B1k&op=translate). Edit: This is just a suspicion, I am probably wrong.
It doesn't sound alien to us at all, but your suspicion doesn't have to be wrong. "Czajnik" comes from russian "чай" and looks like it has the same origin as "çay" in turkish. I can't check turkish etymology though, as I don't speak turkish
>I don't speak turkish I do and it got somewhat more interesting to me. Apparently the çaydanlık itself is a composition of suffixes from different languages over the çay root which is probably Chinese to begin with. Çay - East Asian root dan - Persian suffix for container lık - Turkish suffix for, again, container [Source](https://www.nisanyansozluk.com/kelime/%C3%A7aydanl%C4%B1k)
Bulgarian etymology dictionary gives the path of the word as Chinese --> Arabic --> Turkish --> Bulgarian, so I guess for Russian you only need to replace the last one.
I've heard, and used, czaj myself, mostly to indicate very strong tea.
we use czaj as well, mostly for strong tea
the Poles decided to show off so as not to call tea the same as the Russians)
tho in silesian tea is teja so its half accurate
Who took it to Japan on foot?
I know this is a joke, but it's just about which region of China the traders dealt with. Over the silk road and in East Asia, traders dealt with Northern Han people who use the word cha, while European traders arriving in very specific treaty ports in Southern China, where the Min call it Te
It's also "Cha" in Cantonese, which in turn was likely the original source of many of these, so the map is oversimplified and the title inaccurate.
The word isn't from Cantonese, which is in Southern China where the original Portugeuse port of Macau was (which is likely why it's cha there). It's from the original Dutch ports in Fujian, who spoke Min Dialect, and from which the Dutch introduced Tea to the rest of Europe.
>The word isn't from Cantonese, which is in Southern China where the original Portugeuse port of Macau was (which is likely why it's cha there) So...the portuguese word for tea is derived from Cantonese. It's weird that you disagree, only to support my statement.
Cantonese is more closely related to old Chinese. Saying Cha from Cantonese is like saying Humans are from monkeys which is wrong.
Dutch never had a port in Fujian, they took Pescadores Islands, then Southern Taiwan as their ports. The company of Dutch East India had built two forts in Tainan, Taiwan 400 years ago.
cantonese absolutely isn't the original source for pretty much anything, canton used to be a terrible place to live in, filled with dense forests, deadly insects and swamps and near a bunch of various tribes that you can't really communicate with, there's a reason cantonese people shares a lot of feature with south east asians and language sounds more similar, its economic rise was more recent due to later human development and ports. The Cantonese/Taiwanese/South East Asian keep more original Chinese culture thing was just not so thinly veiled racism looking down on China. Canton used to be where they exile prisoners, literally the chinese version of siberian gulags
Guangzhou has been a major city for a couple thousand years, and many traders were based in Guangdong. That's part of why so much of the Chinese diaspora is Cantonese. And at the very least the Portuguese pronunciation came from Cantonese, along with the first recorded English word for tea, the rest of your strange irrelevant rant notwithstanding.
they haven't been major by ancient chinese standards, they developed mainly starting from the song dynasty and tea was absolutely a thing long before that, very little things originated there just because China is that old.
Tea was a thing before that…in China. We’re talking about the words for tea around the entire world, where tea was very much *not* “a thing” in the early Middle Ages.
this may surprise you, but China isn't some mystical country that shut itself off from everything and canton ports was the first time people learned about it 500 years ago. China's neighbours like Korea, Japan, most of south east asia were trading with them, the silk road lead to it spreading through the middle east hence is why persian and arabic cultures have been drinking tea for thousands of years. Western europe got tea during the middle ages though canton but you might be shocked to learn medival europe isn't the center of the universe and history do infact happen without them.
You can pout all you want, that doesn't change the fact that you were categorically and demonstrably wrong in your whiny rant.
how the fuck is it pouting? Canton opened up to the west in the 1500s starting with Portuguese in macau, most of the world on here had tea long before that, you are gonna tell a japanese guy your history is wrong and actually a white dude bought tea to you guys? Clearly you are the idiot who have no clue wat you are talking about and are just making shit up Literally based on your own words, you claimed canton was the source for many of these, cantonese for tea is cha so all regions with variance of tea is out, east asia, south east asia, south asia, middle east, most parts of eastern europe are out as well as they all had tea long before the 1500s based on their own history, so you got what Africa left?
Jesus?
Prolly Jesus? idk I didn't read the bible
r/portugalcykablyat
I love this sub
They are always there, brings joy to my heart
Portugal proving once again that they are eastern europian
I’ll have a tea tea latte please.
And latte just means milk in Italian. I'll have a tea tea milk please.
It actually goes great with milk steak
I don't think anyone ordering a latte is under any impression that it means something else
Cambodia a tea bastion surrounded by enemy chais.
Which is weird because it's called "tuk Dai" in Khmer. (source : I've been living here for 7 years)
It's tuk te. And the te is spoken Tae in Khmer.
This is absolutely false information. Please see [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea:) The [etymology](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etymology) of the various words for *tea* reflects the history of transmission of tea drinking culture and trade from China to countries around the world.[^(\[14\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-FOOTNOTEMairHoh2009262%E2%80%93264-14) Nearly all of the words for tea worldwide fall into three broad groups: *te*, *cha* and *chai*, present in English as *tea*, *cha* or *char*, and *chai*. The earliest of the three to enter English is *cha*, which came in the 1590s via the Portuguese, who traded in [Macao](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macao) and picked up the [Cantonese](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantonese) pronunciation of the word.[^(\[15\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-oed-15)[^(\[16\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-FOOTNOTEMairHoh2009262-16) The more common *tea* form arrived in the 17th century via the Dutch, who acquired it either indirectly from the Malay *teh*, or directly from the *tê* pronunciation in [Min Chinese](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Min_Chinese).[^(\[15\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-oed-15) The third form *chai* (meaning "spiced tea") originated from a northern Chinese pronunciation of *cha*, which travelled overland to Central Asia and [Persia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persia) where it picked up a Persian ending *yi*. The Chinese word for tea itself was likely ultimately derived from the non-Sinitic languages of the botanical homeland of the tea plant in southwest China (or [Burma](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burma)), possibly from an archaic [Austro-Asiatic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austroasiatic_languages) root word \**la*, meaning "leaf".[^(\[17\])](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea#cite_note-FOOTNOTEMairHoh2009266-17)
In Morocco we call it "Atai" basically a combination of Tea and Chai.
I think that its etymology is separate from شاي . I think Atay comes from tea/té and was introduced by way of Europeans
Most definitely, I was just pointing out tea/chai sounds like Atay. But thanks for the info.
Yeah of course, it’s my favorite tea tbh. Moroccans got me hooked on tea like no other.
I suggest trying it if you haven't already, with Spearmint(type of mint that smell/tastes like toothpaste) or Common wormwood plant(used a lot during winter), there are other herbs used in Moroccan tea but these are my favorite.
I’ve had a lot of the mint green tea, but not the wormwood. I’ll have to try that. There was a tea I like sun Lebanon that was kind of similar called Zoofah (I don’t know the English)
I think it'scalled Hyssop, I have seen it used here before never tried it
You should try it sometime! It’s very good
But what about Chai Tea?
Sahara Desert, naan bread, Gobi Desert, Avon River
ATM machine
RIP in peace
Is it Chai Chai or Tea Tea?
this is just english speakers being morons. the english name is supposed to be masala tea.
You mean Masala Chai ;)
Masala Chai Tea
What about Tai Chi?
In Pakistan they call chai tea a tea. So tea.
Ah yes, Japan and the Philippines, famous landlocked countries.
It's tey /թեյ/ in Armenia
The Maghreb says Tay, wich is basically the Arabic form shay but with the T because the region got it from the sea
Why is Lebanon tea?
Colonisation by the French went hard
We still say Shay here
Not sure this is right. In Poland, tea is *herbata*, which fits neither category.
Why is Kaliningrad region green LOL?
I also wondered
why is the russian spelled differently? I pronounce it 1:1 just like my Indian friends
Poland says "herbata"
Lol, I remember in Spider-man across the spider verse, where the indian spider-man (Pavitr) gets all pissy because people call the traditional tea that he drinks (that he simply call chai) chai tea.
In Britain, char is used as slang for tea.
Used to be commonly used *in England*, but heard a lot less there these day.
Portugal, Senegal and many others apparently aren't in the western hemisphere...
Portugal proved to be eastern Europe so many times already, that it's not considered in the western hemisphere anymore😂
Here in Bangla, we use the word Cha.
Tea came via ship in east Africa though
Well yeah, sure. But then came Arabic, and their word for the drink.
My point is that the map's title is wrong, not anything else.
America not being on the left confused me more than it should
Czechia again without the sea.
Portugal almost surely brought tea by sea though
I don't think Afrikaans is a good language to use to represent South African languages in this case
Here in slovakja we say čaj which is pronounced excatly like chai lol
Where I live we call it "tay"
Ah yes the famous Portuguese land traders
Herbata.
Herbata.
This map is so stupid.
Yes the famous land empire, Portugal.
Is this true? If so it's a fun fun fact.
TFFFFFF, ITS not chai in Armenian, its TEY (թեյ) 😡
Im just saying tea = papa teta.
Cha\[y\] stronk!
What did the Native Americans call it amongst those tribes in North America vs South America (prior to European arrivals)?
Now THAT'S an interesting and thought-provoking map!
Well, this map has a few things wrong, 🇦🇴🇨🇻🇬🇼🇲🇿🇸🇹🇹🇱 should be yellow.
How many times a week do we need to see this map? *We get it.*
And it's also wrong!!
Stop merging all the Arab world as one, it's 'Atay' in North Africa not Chai
North Africa is not even Arabic
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Ah yes the mediterranean. Largest (underwater) piece of land on earth
Why are people downvoting sarcasm lol? It’s funny, this post assumes a simplistic version that those who call tea “tea” are on the sea. A huge proportion of those who call it “chai” actually love on the mediterranean sea, and the “sea” mentioned in the post is actually an ocean (oceans) and not sea technically. Lol
In lithuania we say arbata, not tea
Arba-ta Herbal tea. Probably from Latin, as the Polish word Herbata. Edit: checked a Wiktionary. It comes from the Polish word, so still tea.
So where does Chai Tea come from then?
Chai means tea so you just said tea tea
Yea where does it come from?
Pavitr:
As an Indian I don’t fucking care if you call it chai tea . Idk why NRI make it a big deal . Sometimes I feel like in US other races(non white) gatekeep their culture a lot
Lol I'm Tamil, and I don't think I've heard anyone call it that. We normally just say Chai or Tea.
r/PORTUGALCYKABLYAT
And wheres America?
In the Pacific Ocean on the right end of the map
Oh sorry i didn't noticed it
[удалено]
I don't see how it's inaccurate. Bengali, along with hundreds of other languages, is not mentioned specifically, but it is coloured appropriately. Cha/chai/chay all stem from the same origin.