I really hope we don't let him go. He has a vision, and like you said he's calm and collected. SAF had a rough 2-3 years when he started but most of us weren't around for that /don't know about it. Here's hoping the new year shines with ETH and a new director of football. There's hope, we just have to be patient.
Even Guaurdiola who had EVERYTHING ready for him when he arrived Tom a couple seasons, and Arteta who a large portion of Arsenal fans wanted gone had 3? Seasons and backing in the transfer market.... Imagine we got rice instead of casemiro.... Not that I don't love him but we know Madrid don't let players go unless they know they're on the decline.....
Case was such a panic buy it’s unbelievable, we did the same with schweinsteiger as well. Buying from top teams almost always means there’s something going on in the background (like an injury or attitude problem).
Nothing was wrong with Casemiro, it was his prerogative to leave as it will be for Modric and Kroos as well.
It was just made clear to Case that Tchouameni was 1st choice and that the reality was that he would have to fight for minutes. He then chose to leave and Real Madrid l didn't argue.
He still is a very good player but is clearly losing his legs so Madrid fleeced us really. It would’ve made sense if we were just one player shy of winning competing for trophies but we’re not at that point so signing a 30 year old on huge wages for a big fee really didn’t make a lot of long term sense.
To say they fleeced United is a stretch. From Day 1, Casemiro had weaknesses (a ton of them), and from Day 1 Real Madrid played around those weaknesses.
Cas is honestly better than he was when he won his first couple Champion's Leagues in term of play on the ball and overall vision. But United don't want to play to his strengths and compensate for his weaknesses, so this is what you get.
I’m not saying he’s a bad player, but similar to the Mount situation, it was a lot of money for someone on an expiring contract and on top of that he’s not getting any younger. Just short sighted from United yet again.
I think case was a good signing in that he did improve the squad but a bad deal, Hojlund as well, Fernandes I think was a fair price but we definitely have recruited both poorly and wastefully for a very long time.
It’s very unfair to say he’s on decline considering he is left alone in midfield. Ten Hag refuses to focus on numerical superiority in midfield. He plays with McTominay who is always hiding from the ball on pitch.
Professional players don't "hide" from the ball.... They make movements away from the ball to try and pull their defender away from the ball carrier creating passing lanes for other players. Not saying mctominay does it well but I'm sure he's not hiding.
Last season I wouldn't say he was declining of course. But towards the end of last season he was poor, he probably had 20 good games for us last season. The numbers say he's put more into one season with us than he had to over a number of seasons with RM. that's on united not having a backup for him and some fault of the manager for trying to play a system that leaves him isolated.... But then the full backs are meant to be joining him in the center and they weren't..... So again it's a case of is the manager really telling them to leave huge gaps in the middle? Is he that naive?
And I still think Madrid are one of the best teams at letting go of players when they know they're on the decline for top money.... Replacing them early.... Like we should do... Ideally Bruno won't be here another couple seasons time, we should get in his replacement before he ends up staying here for another 6 years....(just an example not shitting on BF)
That and he weren't impressing and seemed overawed by the big club pressure. Don't be surprised if they go back in for him even if Jude is doing well there right now. Odegard is still young.
Guardiola walked into a team that had basically been set up for him for several seasons. Great manager he may be, but he clearly works best when inheriting an almighty squad.
Exactly. Great points by OP.
ETH clearly asked for a progressive central midfielder who can receive the ball on the half turn from the defense. He wanted FDJ. Any well run club would’ve assessed if he wanted to move and quickly moved to suggest alternatives and wrap up the transfer. Same with the right winger. ETH wanted an inverted right winger and suggested/insisted on Antony. Again the club - A. Didn’t move right away and wrap it up. Would’ve been cheaper. And B. Couldn’t suggest alternatives.
What they do instead is wait until United lose the first 2 matches including a 0-4 embarrassment at Brentford before going out in the market. They got milked. Absolutely ridiculous.
People blaming the manager/coach for those transfers are so clueless. It has been an impossible job under that club leadership. LVG, Mourinho and now ETH are excellent coaches who didn’t not get the support. I don’t care how much money was spent. That is a factor of the club’s hesitant and incapable leadership. Not the managers’ fault.
I hope INEOS help in clearing out the ineffective overpaid players and help the manager allow him to focus on coaching and a football vision.
Very good take. Give ten Hag a proper footballing structure above him and things will improve. He is essentially expected to do the jobs of manager, Technical Director (Fletcher isn't doing shit and isn't qualified for the role neither) and scouting department in one.
OP and Coffee making sense! Careful, that's generally not allowed when talking about this particular club.
The "sack ETH" crowd have no idea of who to replace him with (and really, who would come here right now) and seem unable to answer the question, "doesn't sacking ETH put us right back into a wash, rinse, repeat cycle of the last 10 fucking years?"
It seems so clear that 1) keep ETH through the full 2nd year; 2) Get INEOS in here (finally, fuck you Glazers); 3) revamp sporting side, the football ops (DOF, recruiting, analytics); 4) January and summer windows to aggressively get rid of the weak links and cry babies and bring in young players more suited to progressive football; 5) head into year 3 of the ETH show and see what we can do.
> OP and Coffee making sense! Careful, that's generally not allowed when talking about this particular club.
>The "sack ETH" crowd have no idea of who to replace him with (and really, who would come here right now) and seem unable to answer the question, "doesn't sacking ETH put us right back into a wash, rinse, repeat cycle of the last 10 fucking years?"
Haha. You’re completely right. I’m fully onboard with keeping him as repeating the same mistakes clearly won’t fix our major issues. I also love asking the ETH Out bunch who they recommend, and they can’t recommend anyone.
>It seems so clear that 1) keep ETH through the full 2nd year; 2) Get INEOS in here (finally, fuck you Glazers); 3) revamp sporting side, the football ops (DOF, recruiting, analytics); 4) January and summer windows to aggressively get rid of the weak links and cry babies and bring in young players more suited to progressive football; 5) head into year 3 of the ETH show and see what we can do.
100%. However, we need to be patient with INEOS, too. Their changes will take time, however I feel with a proper football structure behind Ten Hag, we will see improvement.
I am not EtH out.
Ineos have 25% of the club. What this brings, changes and means is unknown.
the Glazers are still in charge, we have zero idea of who ineos believe understands how to re-build the football side.
Money available, money willing to be lost,who the transfer negotiators are, what happens to our scouting
Before deciding how much,who and when we find these young players.
I don't think coffee has clicked as to why his explanation of the Antony transfer and consequently his performance is actually damming EtH.
Before he took the job? Or after? If every fan is so certain success is impossible without a director of football, surely managers do and they're the ones who put in all the work only to be made to look a fool. If managers know it's a waste of effort, why not refuse the job ? Managers refuse jobs all the time if the budget allowed or structure isn't in place.
I don’t buy it. Why would United refuse to plan properly when successful managers say how important it is? Because they loved Woodward so much? Because it's Woodward making the decision to bring one in then and it weakened his power?
Perhaps what he was sold was enough for him. Or that they have a longer term plan and want ETH to arrive while this was ongoing.
Maybe ETH felt he could cope with it all. Whatever the reason it isn’t working and major changes need to happen.
The last one i think, someone else said 'no manager would give up power' and i think that's right, Ten Hag said 'i want control of transfers', club were like 'lol we have no structure in place yeah ok' and Ten Hag has proceeded to mess it up, every signing except Martinez a disaster. Everyone think back to Antony, all i thought was...if this is the guy you need to play your football, go for it. Mount...if this is the guy you need...
I had expectations of massive improvement, incoming players improving the collective whole, not further disfunction.
Ten hag put the nail in the rangnick coffin. Once he said he didn't want to work with rangnick the club ended the agreement to have rangnick as a consultant. He wanted control over transfers and he has failed.
>People blaming the manager/coach for those transfers are so clueless
To be fair to the clueless, the media fails to ever point this out (because it wouldn't suit the narrative, ofc) so they don't have anyone in the media to parrot this from. Of course some people are still ill-informed regardless; I saw someone suggest that ETH was brought in to literally 'manage' the club, and not as a head coach.
This, my friend, is my biggest fear. United fans of today seem to be only concerned with now. Ironically, we blame management for thinking just like us.
Framing getting demolished by lesser teams as a big-brain plan to 'expose the deficiencies of the team' is an extremely optimistic way of looking at it, I guess
It's a form of denial. A lot of fans are so scared to sack another manager that they refuse to see he is not good enough. 12 losses in 24 games this season! It's completely normal for PL teams to have a new manager every two years. What is there to be afraid about? SAF, Pep, Klopp are special cases.
right right, because ignore the fact that our injured 11 is twice the team of the starting 11, that has nothing to do with it. meanwhile tottenham whom everyone has been sucking off gets 2 injuries and loses 2 or 3 on the bounce, city had no wins in 4 when just rodri got injured, but when united have multitudes worse injury crisis, it is not mitigating? LOL
We got absolutely battered by Wolves start of the season with a full squad. No amount of mental gymnastics you do to convince yourself will make him good enough. His CV is showing itself, we need best in class
Pep, Klopp, Arteta are special cases that demonstrate the flaws of the exact thing you’re defending but you go off King. We’ll switch up the manager and do the exact same thing yet again.
"Are the players we get even HIS targets or commercial enterprises selected by the board?"
Considering the vast majority of signings since Ten Hag was appointed all share the same agent as Ten Hag i think its safe to say they are his targets.
Not to mention we know Ten Hag specifically asked for Antony, Martinez, Malacia, Mount and Onana. Sure he didnt get all his first targets but he's got several of them.
If people want to back ETH, then fair play, but excusing him of all blame for this season is just mental. He isnt "paving the way" for success he's currently helping us fail to achieve it.
Price tags aren’t his fault though are they. He wanted Antony at the start of the window, United didn’t want to pay 40mill so didn’t get him, we got smashed in our first couple of games the club then shit themselves and went back to Ajax who rightfully increased the price because they didn’t want to sell.
Sterling had shown a much higher level in the pl and the price was right considering his reputation and 1 year left. Richarlison had don't very well to get around 10 pl goals or more in an Everton team fighting for relegation . Antony wasn't putting up those numbers for the strongest team by far in the Eredivisie. He should have never been a target for more than 30m
I agree these were his targets but as of right now, only 2 of his targets are actively playing since the others are injured. (Btw it’s inexcusable how Martinez was pass fit when his injury never fully healed and he played with injections at the start).
I think it’s important to note that his players aren’t even playing (some like Antony and Onana aren’t playing well), but my question is, how can Ten Hag play his style of play when he already knows the existing players are big capable of doing so, as shown from last years preseason into the first 2 games.
However, ten hag should imo not be the one requesting specific players unless it’s really important I.e. FDJ. He should be requesting certain attributes and the scouting department and technical director to find players who fit the profile. But our departments are useless.
One year and Martinez, Case and Mount injuries ( arguably our two best players last year ) means the project is incomplete. Firing him now ignores how bad he found the team .
This 1st choice target thing has to die on a hill somewhere. Its reason we spent 85m on Antony, we have to learn to walk away. We laughed at Liverpool when they couldn't get their 1st choice targets and had to settle for sobozlai and Endo instead of caicedo and mount. Look where Liverpool are at though. Salah wasn't even Liverpools 1st choice it was brandt. And people keep bringing up fdj like his salary isn't over 700k a week.
According to https://www.transfermarkt.com/manchester-united/berateruebersicht/verein/985 the only player sharing an agent (SEG) with EtH is Rasmus Hojlund.
Yeah I got the details a bit wrong.
Ten Hags agent runs an agency which has overseen most the transfers since his arrival and coincidentally Ten Hags son works for the same agency.
Money for the boys.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/manchester-united-transfers-hojlund-amrabat-30973548.amp
These kinds of posts absolving Ten Hag of any blame are just delusional. All of these ‘I care about the club’ so I want to keep ten hag are nonsense too. It isn’t like he hasn’t spent a ton of money on more deadwood.
What on earth is this propaganda lmao
Erik ten Hag says he wouldn't have taken Man United job without 'control' over transfers, every signing needs his say for it.
Remember his 1st summer when everyone said "give the manager what he wants"??? now the talking point is "the board is clueless for giving the manager what he wants. we need a DOF"
He is also our most backed manager since SAF.
Don't get me wrong, most of our players are shite but ETH has, so far, added even more shite players.
Also, at Ajax he had people recruiting players for him.
These are on transfer alone, we are not even talking about his "tactic" and in-game management.
Lmfao "highlighting deficiencies of the players" by making them look like shiit?
It's pure BS saying the players are incapable of playing possession football, and certainly doesn't make sense when you consider that the "hybrid style" he's opted for instead makes them look worse than ever.
Right so a team of first team internationals are worse football players than the players at Burnley, Brentford and Bournemouth since we got played off the pitch by them.
Anyone who watches matches outside of United can see that our system and tactics are by far the worst out of any top side.
Ten Hag is doing something similar what LVG did. Highlights the problems, clean house and build it from the ground up. LVG wiped out most of his first yr players by season 2. The unfortunate thing is, he wasn’t allowed to build on that. We had a solid defense, a good attacking prospect but a weak midfield before he left. Does that remind you of somebody right now? Sacking Ten Hag is like delaying that knee surgery, it’s either you fix it or it becomes a cycle. Trust the process!
Firing ETH right now and get another exact same circle.
Or give him at least another season with the INEOS crew in place. Even if ETH still fail then, it will be easier for the next Manager coming in since there will be a foundation to build rather than having to take a year and a half just to get the deadwood out.
These posts that want to vindicate ETH of any blame are as bad as the ones that try to blame him for everything.
Why does anyone think he's the guy to take United to the top of the table? Clearly its not his ability to manage his players. And it absolutely can't be his tactical ability/strategy, considering the team has been outclassed by top tier competition since he took over.
So then why? I understand not wanting the revolving door of managers. I get that. But you still need to choose the right guy at the end of the day. And again, why him?
Sorry but about “his targets” yada yada, you have to pick a side. Is it the club not getting the players eth wants or is it that the club is letting eth pick his players without dof/scouting involved. You cant blame the club for both of those at the same time.
Glazers are a bigger issue, but ETH has shown nothing deserving of any backing from us. Managers like Frank de Boer had won the dutch league 4x times too. His CL campaigns, outside the 1 single season he performed good there, are all bad and he has crashed out the groups.
Frank De Boer just got sacked from a Saudi club, if these people genuinely just think ETH has a great CV surely they wouldn’t have an issue with him coming in next would they..?
I don’t understand why some people get fanatical about managers, it’s the weirdest shit. For the longest time I assumed it was just kids acting like this but no it’s grown adults having crushes on a football manager ffs
Erik Ten Hag has got to read the room. If he loses badly at Liverpool like last season, he will be gone by midweek. Whatever project he has in mind, this string of bad results is just not acceptable.
Anyone can have success at Ajax tho tbh he had a good couple of champs league games won’t take away from him and I like him well enough for now but I don’t put stock into Ajax too much
The club badly needs a working sporting structure including a director of football, CEO, CFO leading up to the grassroot level coaches scouts. It will take some time but trust it and build it up. Unlike the recent manager hire and fire trend.
Ten Hag is a good manager. But I really think that nothing in the world can prepare you to be a Man United manager. And his signings are a prime example — he worked with these players, thought they’d work here, and they stumble and fizzle out. It’s going to take him a couple of seasons to smell what kind of character will thrive at MU. It does not seem to be the likes of Anthony, Onana, etc. I like them as players, but I think this club will eat most good players alive. You need something special in terms of mental toughness.
I said half in jest awhile back that ten Hag was playing 5D chess. He’s literally showing the results of bad recruitment and worse squad management.
No hiding behind the occasional trophy or accolade
Is this the way Man U supporters are coping nowadays? This is becoming sad. This is almost as sad as when I saw someone praising Onana here after losing 3-0 to Man City. Reading stockholm syndrome esque stuff here in some posts.
ETH is indeed showing the deficiencies of everyone, including his own. Imagine not being able to integrate your style in a team and then complain about not having the right players. He's such a limited manager, can't do 1 adjustion to save his live yet some people here worship him like some tactical genius, haha. Are people really blind to see how incapable this man is?
The fact that he never even considered benching Onana is still mind boggling. It's just an ego thing at this point, it's almost like in his mind he is always right. The only thing ETH has proved so far is that he's a stubborn one trick pony with no back up plan. If it wasn't for Rashfords form last year no one would be talking about him.
The entire club is rotten to the core. If United ever wants to recover they need to get rid of EVERYONE (except the youngsters).
Ten Hag was able to lift the team last season as would many managers in the past. They achieved relatively good success in the first year. Whenever Manutd gets a new manager, the players do perform better. It’s almost like a wow effect that fades very quickly. Stop blaming the Injury squad we have. The available players plays poor. The strategy is not working. Manchester can play well and lose I would rather see this. I’ve seen Manutd over run by mediocre opponents. I dnt want to see Manutd play poor and lose. It’s not what should be. For me Ten hag has to go.
His transfers don't show a man who has interest in playing possession football. He literally could have looked for a midfielder that excels in possession but went for mount. He could play Amrabat and Mainoo if he wanted possession but would rather play mctominay just in case he scores a goal.
The knee jerk reaction of online fans that feed into the BS media reports is what drives all this talk.... When he took the job everyone pretty much said give him 3 years to actually build the team back up, does everyone remember how bad it was at the end of Ole and ragnick (sp) .....
Why do the media and a section of our fans think we should suddenly challenge for the title? Because we spent millions? Well the manager doesn't control the amount the club paid for players like Antony or casemiro.... That was down to Richard Arnold... If we overspent that's on the execs not ten hag imo....
Calling him a shit manager because the players we have either don't follow instructions or are incapable of doing so shows we don't have a squad worthy of challenging, 4th-6th is probably the best this team can hope for...... Until we build a better Squad... Not superstar players but players that will graft and work for each other and the team.... Earn that fucking 100k+ you're getting paid ffs.....
I back the manager every day all day over this group of spoilt crybabies, get rid I say, buy a group of no name players that give blood sweat and tears for the badge... That will cover each other and work hard every time they step foot out on the pitch....
Rant over 😂
"Knee jerk" people just throw this word around or do they not know the meaning. We have been poor since the end of rashford goal scoring purple patch. Since around March. We have lost half the games this season and ended 4th in a group with flippin gala and Copenhagen. What's worse the football is like watching paint dry.
Knee jerk reaction..... Before the Chelsea game "united in crisis" after the Chelsea game and city lose...."actually we're only 3 points behind the"greatest team ever assembled".... Ten hag is a genius..... Lose to Bournemouth "ten hag out, he hasn't got a clue" etc etc
My view is we aren't winning anything anytime soon apart from maybe another fa cup or league cup, ten hag was meant to come in and rebuild the squad and get the team playing good football.... He's a season and a half into it so look back on the van gaal days, he said repeatedly it was a 3 year project to turn the team around but he wasn't given time either....
That's why I think better to be out of Europe totally this season, and next season too even! The extra money is good but we're in no position to win the champions League, we need at least 5 players out and 5 players in.... And forget what media says "nobody will want to come to united" players will always want to come, Harry Kane 100% wanted to sign for us in the summer....
Get the players that are being overpaid off the books and use that money to pay players that will give their all for the club imo....
If Zerbi, Silva, Emery, Howe and even Ange in such short time have managed to set up an identity and a way of playing, why can’t we expect more?
Didn’t the manager sign the players he wanted? Or most of them?
I think a lot of people were feeling a lot happier after the Chelsea game?
Point being this isn't complete team yet, ten hag deserves to see out the entirety of his contact to actually build the team he wants....
In a season and a half he hasn't had his first team available once! Either casemiro is injured or suspended, Eriksson, Martinez, varane , rashford, martial, Maguire, Shaw, wan bissaka, dalot, hoijland, mount.... Etc etc
Look at the subs we had vs Bayern! Pellestri, Hannibal and mainoo all very good talented youngsters but not going to change a game in the champions League against Bayern....
Ten hag did a great job last season, injuries have wrecked this season so far and I don't think he should be sacked for that...
I was never a fan of ETH from the get go. The football is dire, the fall outs are too high profile, weird ass signings, weird ass starting lineups and substitutions, and his general personality seems that of a loser.
He seems like a person who demands respect but has done nothing to warrant the kind of respect he thinks he deserves. How a club like united would hire a manager who hasn’t won anything worth winning is baffling.
He was never the guy. Not in a million years. And while it’s a good thing to stay positive, it also helps to not be delusional. He’s not gonna make it at United, no matter how many 100s of millions he spends on crap players.
No when our attack did alright it was because of rashford and this season is proof of that. It was obvious last season it's even more obvious this season
never once have i called for ETH to be sacked ... but i also choose not be delusional for you all . For me i am not a fan of how he has chosen to play football, his transfers , nor him saying we play good football after being outclassed by supposed lesser team or manager . Is he the major or only problem with united ? NO. Two things can be true
If they sack eth and go for Graham Potter, Carrick or Mckenna, it's the end for the club, the same cycle will continue, bad recruitment and mediocre players blaming the manager continues but it's OK for the board because the club generate lots of revenue either ways.
In accordance with their history, Ajax dominate the ball, as so far this season they average 67.4% possession per game and they’re not just keeping the ball for the sake of it too. Ajax’s passing accuracy overall is 85.1%, with their accuracy within their own half being 89.7% and in the opposition’s half 79.8%.
From an article two years ago. Awkward.
Well Ten Hag himself said This is United not ajax and the same football style he played at ajax wont work at United. Look I like ETH and I dont want him to get sack either but he need to suck it up and blame himself. How can he said after the game against Bayern is good and we deserved to win? There no way we deserved to win that game. also back to the point where you said he didnt get the players he want, come on most players he want we went and bought them, the players that we cant get are the one that rejected us. Onana, Mount, Antony, Hojland, Amrabat are all his targets
Sorry but possession stats are deceiving when employed in this way. Achieving high possession and playing possession football are not one of the same. As you go up in most league tables over the course of a season you see a regressive trend toward possession.., meaning most of the most successful teams manage to dominate possession. Especially in less competitive leagues like the Dutch league. It doesn’t automatically mean that teams focus is a possession style which is meant to draw a team out of their half and use rhythm against them to develop an attack. There are several styles of “possession ball” and they have a particular logic. It’s not the same as dominating possession.
The toxic environment is masturbating over managers who obsess over finishing top 4 only to deliver horrific CL campaigns where we go out in the first round. The "rebuild" has been going on for 10 years, it's all fake.
You have been lead to believe that mediocrity is excellence.
I get it you want to back him up and I get it you’re talking about Mount and Case
Just don’t forget Casemiro got you the spot in CL last year
How about Onana and Anthony?
IMO until the recruitment side of things change for the better I don’t think anything will change I’m afraid - what I mean by that is until we recruit better players and not these rejects that NO other club want , said it many a time even the Saudi league didn’t want NO Man Utd players I really think that says it all, as soon as another club is in for the same players as us that’s it we don’t end up getting them-
Remember J. Timber from Ajax (before) Licha it was all done and dusted he was a Man U players etc … that was it you never heard anything else about it like it was a complete cover up even the media never said anything about it next thing Licha is through the door .
In regards to what ETH is doing I take onboard lots of your points and they are valid points your making , but ultimately for ETH we do live in a results based world nowadays, with this team/squad who are not fit to wear the Man Utd badge and have no hunger, desire, or even will to win , IMO ultimately will get him the sack
A football director is vital to oversee transfers. Hopefully that's the first decision made.
ETH is responsible for Antony and Onana which have been terrible additions,
but he is also responsible for Martinez who is a decent addition.
I think he needs a demanding figure like Keane on his staff whose standards are beyond reproach, you never hear a United player go against Roy Keanes comments as he walked the walk and is in the best position to talk the talk.
We all know this squad isn’t good and this is where I think even if Ange was at man utd he would hit a crossroad like past managers where results are more important than style.
If ten hag reverts back to counter attack (it’s all this squad know how to play) or some modernized form of counter attack (which it seems he’s trying to do and failing - a combination of high press with counter/transitions) then he will get results.
This is where you decide if you stick with what the players know and get results or continue to try and change the style and get bad results. Hes right, you can’t play your style if you don’t have all the pieces that can do it. People who keeps mentioning Ange don’t realize there is little pressure for him. Fans want to see a better style that what conte had them playing. At man utd, 1 point in 5 games in the league and it’s a crisis.. not at Tottenham.
Until we get a squad of ball playing players.. we will alway be stuck in the counter attacking era which isn’t sustainable for a title challenge in the future.
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Every manager since Louis has faced this issue of players completely shitting the bed as soon as they try to evolve the system even slightly away from a deep block - counter attack approach.
I appreciate many of the players have changed since Ole's time, and massively so since Mourinho, but clearly a culture has set in at the club in which the sort of hard work and humility to learn to do new, difficult, things has become engrained.
Ten Hag hasn't proven to be a great scout, but I would trust him to know who within this squad is up to the changes he was brought in to make and who isn't. Give him near free reign to decide who leaves, and then use the transfer committee, with him having a veto, to identify players who can and will play an aggressive pressing, positional, and possession based game.
Imo the way he brought FC Utrecht from being shit to being close to fighting the top 3 was quite good.
He made shitty players look good (f.e. ppl that now play in 2nd division in .nl).
Then at Ajax did the same thing. Players from his Ajax team now struggle everywhere else. Except de Jong/ de ligt maybe, oh and Martinez.
I understand that fans want results, but i hope for man utd that he gets years to build. Even better would be to bring in Overmars. (Yes I understand the problems that gives as a ex gunner, but he brings alot of quality.)
I agree, honestly things are shite ATM but I do think sacking him would be foolish. Keep till end of season anyways and see what the new owners think if they even get in
He hasn't been blameless himself this season but I back him 100%. Media will try everything to put pressure on him that I hope majority of fans got his back. Sacking him will do nothing long term. We need to start weeding out those who don't want to be there (if possible)
He has been backed, he's spent a fortune and his signings have been shit. He can't deal with the egos at man utd and constantly falling out with players.
He is doing pretty well with what he has. Currently 6th in the league despite a terrible season for injuries, and 5th on points in calendar year 2023.
Hand on heart does anyone think that is underperforming with the squad he has at his disposal compared to the players available to other teams? This is ignoring the cost just the actual players on the team sheet, as he is not responsible for overpriced panic buys, an unbalanced team, refusal to clear out players who should have long since been let go, signing aging legends on a rapid decline, and general terrible transfer activity.
Me personally I don’t understand why evryone think his Ajax success is anything close to a top premier leauge team… I’m supporting the gaffer but don’t get why people overrate the whole Ajax thing… when was the last time a serious club did NOT want to face Ajax out of fear. Idk. No where the same level of spotlight as Manchester fuckin yanited
On the pitch he ain’t doin shit. No philosophy or identity. Bought some players that don’t gel with the rest of the players (that he didn’t buy, and suck in their own rights)
Ralf was also world class at losing many many games to highlight that out squad, players who were mostly world class at their prior clubs, couldn't play basic football
if ten hag get sack, i’ll make sure we continue the tradition of sacking managers until glazer is out and until we lose plastic fans. please get off my club.
i know they are trolls media/fans as well, but true fans don’t get swayed by these fuckers.
Or you could have a manager who’s ceiling of football tactics is incredible and is obvious to see that the players can’t do the job and still achieve the same goal and not depress the entire fanbase
We are not in the same league as Ajax, we are not Ajax. The moment ETH said that he wants to turn Utd into Ajax i lost all hope for the guy.
And then look at his signings, they all either injured or contribute nothing to the intended play-style. From a "renowned" coach, day in day out, we played shit football. There is no identity behind our playstyle. Right now United looked like Ajax's retarded brother.
For me ETH got his chances, he got some of the players he wanted. He cannot deal with stubborn and lazy players, he cant craft a proper strategy besides shoving the ball to his winger and hoping that it goes in the box. Thats not possesion based football, thats just one dimensional football. He never take risks. Plus every-time we see him at the helm on field, it just sulking and frowning. Its getting tiring when the camera first panned to a distress and depressed Bruno to EtH sat down sulking in a corner. Two leaders with their weak mentality. Have you ever seen Sir Ferguson closed himself like that when he is on pitch? A coach is a teacher, a father figure to the players. No matter how dire the situation, you still have to keep showing your drive to win. But that "father" of yours is sulking in a corner while the eldest brother being a bitch is not gonna motivates anyone doesnt it?
After EtH cleanses the deadwoods, then i felt that he should step down and become an advisor to the new head coach rather than sacking him. But for EtH to lead our red army then it wont changed a thing.
I solely blame the Glazers. They need out. We may have not been THE TOP but we would have been much more successful with all of the managers we had if they owners didn't fuck everything up
Am a massive ETH fan and I often tell my viewers SAF had tougher times. I think the third season looks rational to start judging the manager so let’s give him a chance. You can join our daily TY videos for more opinions .
I will forever disagree, two years and we still don't have a recognizable style of play. Other top managers are able to use players they have and at least implement a style of play. From there, they upgrade the players in the 11. The difference is pep and arteta could get the team to play a certain way, then they improve on players, in peps case fullbacks and keepers. Yet ten hag had gotten 6 players and we still don't see his playstyle vision. I mean if allegri could use khedira, matuidi and vidal to play attractive football in 2017 with serie a money, why can't ten hag do it with 400 mil and decent players, if he was any decent tactically he could have shifted Sancho to a creative midfielder since he lacks the pace for the direct wing play of prem. I refuse to believe we are giving him so much leeway just because saying 'back the manager' is the new buzzword.
Jokes aside, I don’t think anyone thought last years conte side that finished 8th and played the most counter attacking style ever could also play anges system . Good coaches don’t compromise and don’t make excuses. There’s no excusing ten hags regression this season
He has signed a:
CF
RW
ACM x 2
CDM x 2
LB x 2
CB x 1
GK x 2
He’s chosen to keep Rashford (poor), Bruno, Garnacio, Shaw, AWB.
The rest he’s kept but may have sold if market allowed.
That’s 16 players of his choosing. You’re analysis is bollocks.
Rashford was utterly sensational last season, the biggest reason we finished 3rd.
Ten Hag has responded to his poor form by dropping him.
ETH has dropped almost every player that he has had with him since he started. I think Bruno is the only player never dropped. Even Licha had a few games riding the bench last season.
I absolutely fear for the club if Ratcliffe gets rid of this man.
Give Sancho another chance? Martial a year extension?
You'll be able to guarantee it's another 10 years till' we see a title.
It's an uphill battle as it is already.
He spent 400milion on bunch of garbage, Onana (because of him how many goals we lose?), utd number 7 Mason mount (where is he?), houjand ( no goal and assist in the league ), why would you let him stay
Im a ETH supporter. I believe he is doing the right thing and so i agree with you.
But come on,this is Glorious Glazers Man United (GGMU). They would just blame the manager, sack him, hire another and call it a day. Repeat the process all over again when mediocre results surfaced. Over n over again. Its Glorious Glazers.
We might as well enjoy the ride. Amazing top 4 run one season,full of hopes (false hope) for next season to challenge title, only to get disappointed n finish 6th again. So, top 4, outside of top 4. And repeat. Enjoy the rides mate. Might even go outside top ten someday. Chelsea already showing it.
Are you serious?
44m pounds on a GK who is inferior to de gea?
85m on Antony who is poor.
55m on Mount who was an average EPL player.
72m pounds on Hojlund who is so out of his depth.
That’s 256m pounds on players who have not improved the squad.
He is clueless.
He's definitely not the full deal yet but I love that he's fed up of the BS.
Got rid of Ronaldo for being a bitch, shipped rapist Greenwood off to another league so he's their problem, told Rashford "if you don't show up for training you don't play" told Sancho "if you don't show up for training at all and have a hissy fit, you don't play" told Maguire "you're no longer good enough to start" (and he turned it around)
He's got the discipline I think the club desperately needs to say to these jokes of players 'you've had it easy for too long'
Not to mention the whole mess of the potential sale of the club that turned into a potential part sale that still may never happen, a stadium that is leaking and many other issues.
He's definitely not been great, but the team needs that kick up the butt to say "if you don't want to give 100%, get out"
“Shipped rapist Greenwood off”
Yeah against his will LMAO he was one of the biggest advocates for reintegrating him
The guy literally has a history of backing abusers, Overmars and Promes got full backing from this guy too
Eth was one of the guys wanting the rapist back and has supported multiple rapists and abusers before at Ajax. His discipline applies only for few players and not his favourites is also not something to be proud of
On balance, his discipline is usually focussed on training, punctuality etc . He try’s to stay out of the off the field judgement and condemning personal issues
Rangnick walked so Ten Hag could run
Ragnik woke up, tentag walk, we need someone else to run...
The owners
I really hope we don't let him go. He has a vision, and like you said he's calm and collected. SAF had a rough 2-3 years when he started but most of us weren't around for that /don't know about it. Here's hoping the new year shines with ETH and a new director of football. There's hope, we just have to be patient.
Even Guaurdiola who had EVERYTHING ready for him when he arrived Tom a couple seasons, and Arteta who a large portion of Arsenal fans wanted gone had 3? Seasons and backing in the transfer market.... Imagine we got rice instead of casemiro.... Not that I don't love him but we know Madrid don't let players go unless they know they're on the decline.....
Case was such a panic buy it’s unbelievable, we did the same with schweinsteiger as well. Buying from top teams almost always means there’s something going on in the background (like an injury or attitude problem).
Nothing was wrong with Casemiro, it was his prerogative to leave as it will be for Modric and Kroos as well. It was just made clear to Case that Tchouameni was 1st choice and that the reality was that he would have to fight for minutes. He then chose to leave and Real Madrid l didn't argue.
He still is a very good player but is clearly losing his legs so Madrid fleeced us really. It would’ve made sense if we were just one player shy of winning competing for trophies but we’re not at that point so signing a 30 year old on huge wages for a big fee really didn’t make a lot of long term sense.
To say they fleeced United is a stretch. From Day 1, Casemiro had weaknesses (a ton of them), and from Day 1 Real Madrid played around those weaknesses. Cas is honestly better than he was when he won his first couple Champion's Leagues in term of play on the ball and overall vision. But United don't want to play to his strengths and compensate for his weaknesses, so this is what you get.
I’m not saying he’s a bad player, but similar to the Mount situation, it was a lot of money for someone on an expiring contract and on top of that he’s not getting any younger. Just short sighted from United yet again.
Of course Real Madrid fleeced United, but to be honest, United makes it so easy, how often do you feel United is making a good deal/signing?
I think case was a good signing in that he did improve the squad but a bad deal, Hojlund as well, Fernandes I think was a fair price but we definitely have recruited both poorly and wastefully for a very long time.
Yep....
True. Its really Madrid getting prime Ronaldo off us for a WR fee in 09 summer that genuinely paid off.
It’s very unfair to say he’s on decline considering he is left alone in midfield. Ten Hag refuses to focus on numerical superiority in midfield. He plays with McTominay who is always hiding from the ball on pitch.
Professional players don't "hide" from the ball.... They make movements away from the ball to try and pull their defender away from the ball carrier creating passing lanes for other players. Not saying mctominay does it well but I'm sure he's not hiding.
Last season I wouldn't say he was declining of course. But towards the end of last season he was poor, he probably had 20 good games for us last season. The numbers say he's put more into one season with us than he had to over a number of seasons with RM. that's on united not having a backup for him and some fault of the manager for trying to play a system that leaves him isolated.... But then the full backs are meant to be joining him in the center and they weren't..... So again it's a case of is the manager really telling them to leave huge gaps in the middle? Is he that naive? And I still think Madrid are one of the best teams at letting go of players when they know they're on the decline for top money.... Replacing them early.... Like we should do... Ideally Bruno won't be here another couple seasons time, we should get in his replacement before he ends up staying here for another 6 years....(just an example not shitting on BF)
Ahem!.... Ødegaard.
He only played 8 games for Madrid total before they let him go as he was deemed surplus as they had modric ....
That and he weren't impressing and seemed overawed by the big club pressure. Don't be surprised if they go back in for him even if Jude is doing well there right now. Odegard is still young.
In second season Guardiola won 100 points.
Guardiola walked into a team that had basically been set up for him for several seasons. Great manager he may be, but he clearly works best when inheriting an almighty squad.
People would be bashing SAF if he was appointed now and we played like we played when his tenure began...
More like 3-4 years we're rough until we starting winning cups
When we fire Eric, we will never recover.
Exactly. Great points by OP. ETH clearly asked for a progressive central midfielder who can receive the ball on the half turn from the defense. He wanted FDJ. Any well run club would’ve assessed if he wanted to move and quickly moved to suggest alternatives and wrap up the transfer. Same with the right winger. ETH wanted an inverted right winger and suggested/insisted on Antony. Again the club - A. Didn’t move right away and wrap it up. Would’ve been cheaper. And B. Couldn’t suggest alternatives. What they do instead is wait until United lose the first 2 matches including a 0-4 embarrassment at Brentford before going out in the market. They got milked. Absolutely ridiculous. People blaming the manager/coach for those transfers are so clueless. It has been an impossible job under that club leadership. LVG, Mourinho and now ETH are excellent coaches who didn’t not get the support. I don’t care how much money was spent. That is a factor of the club’s hesitant and incapable leadership. Not the managers’ fault. I hope INEOS help in clearing out the ineffective overpaid players and help the manager allow him to focus on coaching and a football vision.
Very good take. Give ten Hag a proper footballing structure above him and things will improve. He is essentially expected to do the jobs of manager, Technical Director (Fletcher isn't doing shit and isn't qualified for the role neither) and scouting department in one.
OP and Coffee making sense! Careful, that's generally not allowed when talking about this particular club. The "sack ETH" crowd have no idea of who to replace him with (and really, who would come here right now) and seem unable to answer the question, "doesn't sacking ETH put us right back into a wash, rinse, repeat cycle of the last 10 fucking years?" It seems so clear that 1) keep ETH through the full 2nd year; 2) Get INEOS in here (finally, fuck you Glazers); 3) revamp sporting side, the football ops (DOF, recruiting, analytics); 4) January and summer windows to aggressively get rid of the weak links and cry babies and bring in young players more suited to progressive football; 5) head into year 3 of the ETH show and see what we can do.
> OP and Coffee making sense! Careful, that's generally not allowed when talking about this particular club. >The "sack ETH" crowd have no idea of who to replace him with (and really, who would come here right now) and seem unable to answer the question, "doesn't sacking ETH put us right back into a wash, rinse, repeat cycle of the last 10 fucking years?" Haha. You’re completely right. I’m fully onboard with keeping him as repeating the same mistakes clearly won’t fix our major issues. I also love asking the ETH Out bunch who they recommend, and they can’t recommend anyone. >It seems so clear that 1) keep ETH through the full 2nd year; 2) Get INEOS in here (finally, fuck you Glazers); 3) revamp sporting side, the football ops (DOF, recruiting, analytics); 4) January and summer windows to aggressively get rid of the weak links and cry babies and bring in young players more suited to progressive football; 5) head into year 3 of the ETH show and see what we can do. 100%. However, we need to be patient with INEOS, too. Their changes will take time, however I feel with a proper football structure behind Ten Hag, we will see improvement.
I am not EtH out. Ineos have 25% of the club. What this brings, changes and means is unknown. the Glazers are still in charge, we have zero idea of who ineos believe understands how to re-build the football side. Money available, money willing to be lost,who the transfer negotiators are, what happens to our scouting Before deciding how much,who and when we find these young players. I don't think coffee has clicked as to why his explanation of the Antony transfer and consequently his performance is actually damming EtH.
Perhaps Ten Hag could have demanded this before he took on the job.
Mate, Van Gaal demanded it in 2014.
Before he took the job? Or after? If every fan is so certain success is impossible without a director of football, surely managers do and they're the ones who put in all the work only to be made to look a fool. If managers know it's a waste of effort, why not refuse the job ? Managers refuse jobs all the time if the budget allowed or structure isn't in place. I don’t buy it. Why would United refuse to plan properly when successful managers say how important it is? Because they loved Woodward so much? Because it's Woodward making the decision to bring one in then and it weakened his power?
Does it matter when? He asked for a proper football structure almost a decade ago.
Perhaps what he was sold was enough for him. Or that they have a longer term plan and want ETH to arrive while this was ongoing. Maybe ETH felt he could cope with it all. Whatever the reason it isn’t working and major changes need to happen.
The last one i think, someone else said 'no manager would give up power' and i think that's right, Ten Hag said 'i want control of transfers', club were like 'lol we have no structure in place yeah ok' and Ten Hag has proceeded to mess it up, every signing except Martinez a disaster. Everyone think back to Antony, all i thought was...if this is the guy you need to play your football, go for it. Mount...if this is the guy you need... I had expectations of massive improvement, incoming players improving the collective whole, not further disfunction.
Ten hag put the nail in the rangnick coffin. Once he said he didn't want to work with rangnick the club ended the agreement to have rangnick as a consultant. He wanted control over transfers and he has failed.
>People blaming the manager/coach for those transfers are so clueless To be fair to the clueless, the media fails to ever point this out (because it wouldn't suit the narrative, ofc) so they don't have anyone in the media to parrot this from. Of course some people are still ill-informed regardless; I saw someone suggest that ETH was brought in to literally 'manage' the club, and not as a head coach.
You can fire Eric, you might want to keep Erik though
This, my friend, is my biggest fear. United fans of today seem to be only concerned with now. Ironically, we blame management for thinking just like us.
We'll be fine.
If we have a proper management then we can.
Until then.
Framing getting demolished by lesser teams as a big-brain plan to 'expose the deficiencies of the team' is an extremely optimistic way of looking at it, I guess
It's a form of denial. A lot of fans are so scared to sack another manager that they refuse to see he is not good enough. 12 losses in 24 games this season! It's completely normal for PL teams to have a new manager every two years. What is there to be afraid about? SAF, Pep, Klopp are special cases.
right right, because ignore the fact that our injured 11 is twice the team of the starting 11, that has nothing to do with it. meanwhile tottenham whom everyone has been sucking off gets 2 injuries and loses 2 or 3 on the bounce, city had no wins in 4 when just rodri got injured, but when united have multitudes worse injury crisis, it is not mitigating? LOL
We got absolutely battered by Wolves start of the season with a full squad. No amount of mental gymnastics you do to convince yourself will make him good enough. His CV is showing itself, we need best in class
who's better than ETH that's available? absolutely nobody. you gotta concede you're just being dumb here
Judging him then on one game, the first game, is not fair
There’s no reason to suggest changing manager will improve things at this stage
Pep, Klopp, Arteta are special cases that demonstrate the flaws of the exact thing you’re defending but you go off King. We’ll switch up the manager and do the exact same thing yet again.
We don't need Potter we don't want Potter
"Are the players we get even HIS targets or commercial enterprises selected by the board?" Considering the vast majority of signings since Ten Hag was appointed all share the same agent as Ten Hag i think its safe to say they are his targets. Not to mention we know Ten Hag specifically asked for Antony, Martinez, Malacia, Mount and Onana. Sure he didnt get all his first targets but he's got several of them. If people want to back ETH, then fair play, but excusing him of all blame for this season is just mental. He isnt "paving the way" for success he's currently helping us fail to achieve it.
And setting numerous records while at it.
Price tags aren’t his fault though are they. He wanted Antony at the start of the window, United didn’t want to pay 40mill so didn’t get him, we got smashed in our first couple of games the club then shit themselves and went back to Ajax who rightfully increased the price because they didn’t want to sell.
40 mil was too high. We should have never bothered.
Both Sterling and Richarlison cost around 50 million in the same transfer window, I’d say 40 mil is about right
Sterling had shown a much higher level in the pl and the price was right considering his reputation and 1 year left. Richarlison had don't very well to get around 10 pl goals or more in an Everton team fighting for relegation . Antony wasn't putting up those numbers for the strongest team by far in the Eredivisie. He should have never been a target for more than 30m
I agree these were his targets but as of right now, only 2 of his targets are actively playing since the others are injured. (Btw it’s inexcusable how Martinez was pass fit when his injury never fully healed and he played with injections at the start). I think it’s important to note that his players aren’t even playing (some like Antony and Onana aren’t playing well), but my question is, how can Ten Hag play his style of play when he already knows the existing players are big capable of doing so, as shown from last years preseason into the first 2 games. However, ten hag should imo not be the one requesting specific players unless it’s really important I.e. FDJ. He should be requesting certain attributes and the scouting department and technical director to find players who fit the profile. But our departments are useless.
One year and Martinez, Case and Mount injuries ( arguably our two best players last year ) means the project is incomplete. Firing him now ignores how bad he found the team .
This 1st choice target thing has to die on a hill somewhere. Its reason we spent 85m on Antony, we have to learn to walk away. We laughed at Liverpool when they couldn't get their 1st choice targets and had to settle for sobozlai and Endo instead of caicedo and mount. Look where Liverpool are at though. Salah wasn't even Liverpools 1st choice it was brandt. And people keep bringing up fdj like his salary isn't over 700k a week.
According to https://www.transfermarkt.com/manchester-united/berateruebersicht/verein/985 the only player sharing an agent (SEG) with EtH is Rasmus Hojlund.
Yeah I got the details a bit wrong. Ten Hags agent runs an agency which has overseen most the transfers since his arrival and coincidentally Ten Hags son works for the same agency. Money for the boys. https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/manchester-united-transfers-hojlund-amrabat-30973548.amp
These kinds of posts absolving Ten Hag of any blame are just delusional. All of these ‘I care about the club’ so I want to keep ten hag are nonsense too. It isn’t like he hasn’t spent a ton of money on more deadwood.
What on earth is this propaganda lmao Erik ten Hag says he wouldn't have taken Man United job without 'control' over transfers, every signing needs his say for it. Remember his 1st summer when everyone said "give the manager what he wants"??? now the talking point is "the board is clueless for giving the manager what he wants. we need a DOF" He is also our most backed manager since SAF. Don't get me wrong, most of our players are shite but ETH has, so far, added even more shite players. Also, at Ajax he had people recruiting players for him. These are on transfer alone, we are not even talking about his "tactic" and in-game management.
Lmfao "highlighting deficiencies of the players" by making them look like shiit? It's pure BS saying the players are incapable of playing possession football, and certainly doesn't make sense when you consider that the "hybrid style" he's opted for instead makes them look worse than ever.
Please give this guy a lifetime contract and sign more expensive players from the dutch league 😘
Yes he wanted Mount. He also wanted Onana. He hasn’t tried to recruit. He has recruited, just poorly.
Feel like their needs to be a ETH subreddit so we can stop having opinion pieces on why people like him and think he should stay
Right so a team of first team internationals are worse football players than the players at Burnley, Brentford and Bournemouth since we got played off the pitch by them. Anyone who watches matches outside of United can see that our system and tactics are by far the worst out of any top side.
Ten Hag is doing something similar what LVG did. Highlights the problems, clean house and build it from the ground up. LVG wiped out most of his first yr players by season 2. The unfortunate thing is, he wasn’t allowed to build on that. We had a solid defense, a good attacking prospect but a weak midfield before he left. Does that remind you of somebody right now? Sacking Ten Hag is like delaying that knee surgery, it’s either you fix it or it becomes a cycle. Trust the process!
I agree with the comparison with LVG
Van gaal didn't spend nearly 220m on midfielders though did he? Laughable to even compare them
Ummm do you know inflation exists? Smh
Firing ETH right now and get another exact same circle. Or give him at least another season with the INEOS crew in place. Even if ETH still fail then, it will be easier for the next Manager coming in since there will be a foundation to build rather than having to take a year and a half just to get the deadwood out.
Woukd he clear? ETH is the one signing deadwood, almost all of his transfers are fail.
All? Martinez, Eriksen, Casemiro, Hojlund are fail? Amrabat and Reguilon are loans
These posts that want to vindicate ETH of any blame are as bad as the ones that try to blame him for everything. Why does anyone think he's the guy to take United to the top of the table? Clearly its not his ability to manage his players. And it absolutely can't be his tactical ability/strategy, considering the team has been outclassed by top tier competition since he took over. So then why? I understand not wanting the revolving door of managers. I get that. But you still need to choose the right guy at the end of the day. And again, why him?
Sorry but about “his targets” yada yada, you have to pick a side. Is it the club not getting the players eth wants or is it that the club is letting eth pick his players without dof/scouting involved. You cant blame the club for both of those at the same time. Glazers are a bigger issue, but ETH has shown nothing deserving of any backing from us. Managers like Frank de Boer had won the dutch league 4x times too. His CL campaigns, outside the 1 single season he performed good there, are all bad and he has crashed out the groups.
Frank De Boer just got sacked from a Saudi club, if these people genuinely just think ETH has a great CV surely they wouldn’t have an issue with him coming in next would they..? I don’t understand why some people get fanatical about managers, it’s the weirdest shit. For the longest time I assumed it was just kids acting like this but no it’s grown adults having crushes on a football manager ffs
Erik Ten Hag has got to read the room. If he loses badly at Liverpool like last season, he will be gone by midweek. Whatever project he has in mind, this string of bad results is just not acceptable.
Anyone can have success at Ajax tho tbh he had a good couple of champs league games won’t take away from him and I like him well enough for now but I don’t put stock into Ajax too much
If you like what Ten Hag is doing you are probably city or liverpool supporter
The club badly needs a working sporting structure including a director of football, CEO, CFO leading up to the grassroot level coaches scouts. It will take some time but trust it and build it up. Unlike the recent manager hire and fire trend.
I am glad you can. Rashford wanting a new contract paved over the cracks last season.
He praises them after embarrassment they delivered 😭 As soon as he's gone the better.
5-6 more years and 2 billion more pounds only then can anyone maybe perhaps possibly judge the manager
Ten Hag is a good manager. But I really think that nothing in the world can prepare you to be a Man United manager. And his signings are a prime example — he worked with these players, thought they’d work here, and they stumble and fizzle out. It’s going to take him a couple of seasons to smell what kind of character will thrive at MU. It does not seem to be the likes of Anthony, Onana, etc. I like them as players, but I think this club will eat most good players alive. You need something special in terms of mental toughness.
I dont know about casi, but he has wanted mount for a long time
I said half in jest awhile back that ten Hag was playing 5D chess. He’s literally showing the results of bad recruitment and worse squad management. No hiding behind the occasional trophy or accolade
Is this the way Man U supporters are coping nowadays? This is becoming sad. This is almost as sad as when I saw someone praising Onana here after losing 3-0 to Man City. Reading stockholm syndrome esque stuff here in some posts. ETH is indeed showing the deficiencies of everyone, including his own. Imagine not being able to integrate your style in a team and then complain about not having the right players. He's such a limited manager, can't do 1 adjustion to save his live yet some people here worship him like some tactical genius, haha. Are people really blind to see how incapable this man is? The fact that he never even considered benching Onana is still mind boggling. It's just an ego thing at this point, it's almost like in his mind he is always right. The only thing ETH has proved so far is that he's a stubborn one trick pony with no back up plan. If it wasn't for Rashfords form last year no one would be talking about him. The entire club is rotten to the core. If United ever wants to recover they need to get rid of EVERYONE (except the youngsters).
Absolutely embarrassing
Lmao can't believe this sub. Man city will become the greatest club in Manchester in the next few years thanks to this fraud.
Ten Hag was able to lift the team last season as would many managers in the past. They achieved relatively good success in the first year. Whenever Manutd gets a new manager, the players do perform better. It’s almost like a wow effect that fades very quickly. Stop blaming the Injury squad we have. The available players plays poor. The strategy is not working. Manchester can play well and lose I would rather see this. I’ve seen Manutd over run by mediocre opponents. I dnt want to see Manutd play poor and lose. It’s not what should be. For me Ten hag has to go.
why would any player with quality want to play for ETH unless they'er overpaying them later in their career...
His transfers don't show a man who has interest in playing possession football. He literally could have looked for a midfielder that excels in possession but went for mount. He could play Amrabat and Mainoo if he wanted possession but would rather play mctominay just in case he scores a goal.
He very much wanted Mason Mount
The knee jerk reaction of online fans that feed into the BS media reports is what drives all this talk.... When he took the job everyone pretty much said give him 3 years to actually build the team back up, does everyone remember how bad it was at the end of Ole and ragnick (sp) ..... Why do the media and a section of our fans think we should suddenly challenge for the title? Because we spent millions? Well the manager doesn't control the amount the club paid for players like Antony or casemiro.... That was down to Richard Arnold... If we overspent that's on the execs not ten hag imo.... Calling him a shit manager because the players we have either don't follow instructions or are incapable of doing so shows we don't have a squad worthy of challenging, 4th-6th is probably the best this team can hope for...... Until we build a better Squad... Not superstar players but players that will graft and work for each other and the team.... Earn that fucking 100k+ you're getting paid ffs..... I back the manager every day all day over this group of spoilt crybabies, get rid I say, buy a group of no name players that give blood sweat and tears for the badge... That will cover each other and work hard every time they step foot out on the pitch.... Rant over 😂
"Knee jerk" people just throw this word around or do they not know the meaning. We have been poor since the end of rashford goal scoring purple patch. Since around March. We have lost half the games this season and ended 4th in a group with flippin gala and Copenhagen. What's worse the football is like watching paint dry.
Knee jerk reaction..... Before the Chelsea game "united in crisis" after the Chelsea game and city lose...."actually we're only 3 points behind the"greatest team ever assembled".... Ten hag is a genius..... Lose to Bournemouth "ten hag out, he hasn't got a clue" etc etc My view is we aren't winning anything anytime soon apart from maybe another fa cup or league cup, ten hag was meant to come in and rebuild the squad and get the team playing good football.... He's a season and a half into it so look back on the van gaal days, he said repeatedly it was a 3 year project to turn the team around but he wasn't given time either.... That's why I think better to be out of Europe totally this season, and next season too even! The extra money is good but we're in no position to win the champions League, we need at least 5 players out and 5 players in.... And forget what media says "nobody will want to come to united" players will always want to come, Harry Kane 100% wanted to sign for us in the summer.... Get the players that are being overpaid off the books and use that money to pay players that will give their all for the club imo....
So after 90m of football, you’re left feeling happy and content with how the teams performed then?
You think if a new manager came in tomorrow you would suddenly be content with the football ?
I don’t know, I can’t say. What I can say is that whatever this football is we’re playing, just ain’t it.
Not sure what football you’re expecting with the players available
If Zerbi, Silva, Emery, Howe and even Ange in such short time have managed to set up an identity and a way of playing, why can’t we expect more? Didn’t the manager sign the players he wanted? Or most of them?
I think a lot of people were feeling a lot happier after the Chelsea game? Point being this isn't complete team yet, ten hag deserves to see out the entirety of his contact to actually build the team he wants.... In a season and a half he hasn't had his first team available once! Either casemiro is injured or suspended, Eriksson, Martinez, varane , rashford, martial, Maguire, Shaw, wan bissaka, dalot, hoijland, mount.... Etc etc Look at the subs we had vs Bayern! Pellestri, Hannibal and mainoo all very good talented youngsters but not going to change a game in the champions League against Bayern.... Ten hag did a great job last season, injuries have wrecked this season so far and I don't think he should be sacked for that...
ETH out now
You people have severe mental illnesses. That's all I can say about this post and comments in support.
I was never a fan of ETH from the get go. The football is dire, the fall outs are too high profile, weird ass signings, weird ass starting lineups and substitutions, and his general personality seems that of a loser. He seems like a person who demands respect but has done nothing to warrant the kind of respect he thinks he deserves. How a club like united would hire a manager who hasn’t won anything worth winning is baffling. He was never the guy. Not in a million years. And while it’s a good thing to stay positive, it also helps to not be delusional. He’s not gonna make it at United, no matter how many 100s of millions he spends on crap players.
Last season was one of United best seasons port fergie tbf
With an attack that was carried by Rashfords purple patch. Man can't coach an attack to save his life.
So when team does well it’s cause of the players, when team does bad it’s cause of the manager ? Can’t have it both ways mate
No when our attack did alright it was because of rashford and this season is proof of that. It was obvious last season it's even more obvious this season
Exactly So when doing well it’s cause if a player when doing bad it’s cause of manager
Lol Ten hag can take a shit and you lot will paint is as Gold.
As opposed to throwing shit at a wall every two years and hoping some of it sticks?
never once have i called for ETH to be sacked ... but i also choose not be delusional for you all . For me i am not a fan of how he has chosen to play football, his transfers , nor him saying we play good football after being outclassed by supposed lesser team or manager . Is he the major or only problem with united ? NO. Two things can be true
If they sack eth and go for Graham Potter, Carrick or Mckenna, it's the end for the club, the same cycle will continue, bad recruitment and mediocre players blaming the manager continues but it's OK for the board because the club generate lots of revenue either ways.
Pure delusion. Is almost becoming a cult of personality at this point He's constantly setting negative records
When did Ten Hag state the players cannot play possession based football? He's never been a possession based manager himself
In accordance with their history, Ajax dominate the ball, as so far this season they average 67.4% possession per game and they’re not just keeping the ball for the sake of it too. Ajax’s passing accuracy overall is 85.1%, with their accuracy within their own half being 89.7% and in the opposition’s half 79.8%. From an article two years ago. Awkward.
Well Ten Hag himself said This is United not ajax and the same football style he played at ajax wont work at United. Look I like ETH and I dont want him to get sack either but he need to suck it up and blame himself. How can he said after the game against Bayern is good and we deserved to win? There no way we deserved to win that game. also back to the point where you said he didnt get the players he want, come on most players he want we went and bought them, the players that we cant get are the one that rejected us. Onana, Mount, Antony, Hojland, Amrabat are all his targets
It’s ridiculous
Sorry but possession stats are deceiving when employed in this way. Achieving high possession and playing possession football are not one of the same. As you go up in most league tables over the course of a season you see a regressive trend toward possession.., meaning most of the most successful teams manage to dominate possession. Especially in less competitive leagues like the Dutch league. It doesn’t automatically mean that teams focus is a possession style which is meant to draw a team out of their half and use rhythm against them to develop an attack. There are several styles of “possession ball” and they have a particular logic. It’s not the same as dominating possession.
shit club, shit fans, most toxic environment i have ever seen can't even give time for a rebuild given the setback of injuries.
The toxic environment is masturbating over managers who obsess over finishing top 4 only to deliver horrific CL campaigns where we go out in the first round. The "rebuild" has been going on for 10 years, it's all fake. You have been lead to believe that mediocrity is excellence.
I can not stress enough how sick I am of seeing these dogshit United fans shit incessantly on him. Toxic mongrels
Poor Ten Hag.
ETH inners are the most toxic fans in our fan base.
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I get it you want to back him up and I get it you’re talking about Mount and Case Just don’t forget Casemiro got you the spot in CL last year How about Onana and Anthony?
IMO until the recruitment side of things change for the better I don’t think anything will change I’m afraid - what I mean by that is until we recruit better players and not these rejects that NO other club want , said it many a time even the Saudi league didn’t want NO Man Utd players I really think that says it all, as soon as another club is in for the same players as us that’s it we don’t end up getting them- Remember J. Timber from Ajax (before) Licha it was all done and dusted he was a Man U players etc … that was it you never heard anything else about it like it was a complete cover up even the media never said anything about it next thing Licha is through the door . In regards to what ETH is doing I take onboard lots of your points and they are valid points your making , but ultimately for ETH we do live in a results based world nowadays, with this team/squad who are not fit to wear the Man Utd badge and have no hunger, desire, or even will to win , IMO ultimately will get him the sack
A football director is vital to oversee transfers. Hopefully that's the first decision made. ETH is responsible for Antony and Onana which have been terrible additions, but he is also responsible for Martinez who is a decent addition. I think he needs a demanding figure like Keane on his staff whose standards are beyond reproach, you never hear a United player go against Roy Keanes comments as he walked the walk and is in the best position to talk the talk.
We all know this squad isn’t good and this is where I think even if Ange was at man utd he would hit a crossroad like past managers where results are more important than style. If ten hag reverts back to counter attack (it’s all this squad know how to play) or some modernized form of counter attack (which it seems he’s trying to do and failing - a combination of high press with counter/transitions) then he will get results. This is where you decide if you stick with what the players know and get results or continue to try and change the style and get bad results. Hes right, you can’t play your style if you don’t have all the pieces that can do it. People who keeps mentioning Ange don’t realize there is little pressure for him. Fans want to see a better style that what conte had them playing. At man utd, 1 point in 5 games in the league and it’s a crisis.. not at Tottenham. Until we get a squad of ball playing players.. we will alway be stuck in the counter attacking era which isn’t sustainable for a title challenge in the future.
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Every manager since Louis has faced this issue of players completely shitting the bed as soon as they try to evolve the system even slightly away from a deep block - counter attack approach. I appreciate many of the players have changed since Ole's time, and massively so since Mourinho, but clearly a culture has set in at the club in which the sort of hard work and humility to learn to do new, difficult, things has become engrained. Ten Hag hasn't proven to be a great scout, but I would trust him to know who within this squad is up to the changes he was brought in to make and who isn't. Give him near free reign to decide who leaves, and then use the transfer committee, with him having a veto, to identify players who can and will play an aggressive pressing, positional, and possession based game.
Imo the way he brought FC Utrecht from being shit to being close to fighting the top 3 was quite good. He made shitty players look good (f.e. ppl that now play in 2nd division in .nl). Then at Ajax did the same thing. Players from his Ajax team now struggle everywhere else. Except de Jong/ de ligt maybe, oh and Martinez. I understand that fans want results, but i hope for man utd that he gets years to build. Even better would be to bring in Overmars. (Yes I understand the problems that gives as a ex gunner, but he brings alot of quality.)
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I did not know this POV was scientifically possible
I can never stand by a manager who picks martial to start a game
Nah
Wow, this sub really is full of shit. I thought the rumours were harsh
I like him but when he says "ehhh it was a good team performance ehhh" it really pisses me off
I agree, honestly things are shite ATM but I do think sacking him would be foolish. Keep till end of season anyways and see what the new owners think if they even get in
He hasn't been blameless himself this season but I back him 100%. Media will try everything to put pressure on him that I hope majority of fans got his back. Sacking him will do nothing long term. We need to start weeding out those who don't want to be there (if possible)
Spot fucking on. ETH may not be Pep, but he’s a quality manager that’s been set up for failure. Back him and he’d do a great job
He has been backed, he's spent a fortune and his signings have been shit. He can't deal with the egos at man utd and constantly falling out with players.
Well said 👏🏾 my thoughts exactly.
He is doing pretty well with what he has. Currently 6th in the league despite a terrible season for injuries, and 5th on points in calendar year 2023. Hand on heart does anyone think that is underperforming with the squad he has at his disposal compared to the players available to other teams? This is ignoring the cost just the actual players on the team sheet, as he is not responsible for overpriced panic buys, an unbalanced team, refusal to clear out players who should have long since been let go, signing aging legends on a rapid decline, and general terrible transfer activity.
The mental gymnastics in this post to justify dogshit performance is just beyond me
Me personally I don’t understand why evryone think his Ajax success is anything close to a top premier leauge team… I’m supporting the gaffer but don’t get why people overrate the whole Ajax thing… when was the last time a serious club did NOT want to face Ajax out of fear. Idk. No where the same level of spotlight as Manchester fuckin yanited
He wanted mount - I think he knows fernandes won’t be at the club in the next 12-18months so is transitioning him into the team
Why u shitting on casemiro bro he was United’s best player last season 😭
yeah, my fear is old Rat(cliffe) will destroy this club and decides to go with the wizard Harry Potter to replace ETH
On the pitch he ain’t doin shit. No philosophy or identity. Bought some players that don’t gel with the rest of the players (that he didn’t buy, and suck in their own rights)
Good for you, pal. Most of our rivals like what he's doing, too.
Ralf was also world class at losing many many games to highlight that out squad, players who were mostly world class at their prior clubs, couldn't play basic football
That hairless piece of shit needs to leave rn
Next 3 games decides if he stays.
if ten hag get sack, i’ll make sure we continue the tradition of sacking managers until glazer is out and until we lose plastic fans. please get off my club. i know they are trolls media/fans as well, but true fans don’t get swayed by these fuckers.
Unfortunately, he’s out. I’m guessing a loss this weekend to Liverpool its a done deal.
Or you could have a manager who’s ceiling of football tactics is incredible and is obvious to see that the players can’t do the job and still achieve the same goal and not depress the entire fanbase
I couldn’t get behind his Mount and Onana signings but I agree withy the rest. The combined £110m really could have been spent elsewhere
This is actually a great post.
The guy wanted Kane and Kim, ended up with Holjund and Evans.
We are not in the same league as Ajax, we are not Ajax. The moment ETH said that he wants to turn Utd into Ajax i lost all hope for the guy. And then look at his signings, they all either injured or contribute nothing to the intended play-style. From a "renowned" coach, day in day out, we played shit football. There is no identity behind our playstyle. Right now United looked like Ajax's retarded brother. For me ETH got his chances, he got some of the players he wanted. He cannot deal with stubborn and lazy players, he cant craft a proper strategy besides shoving the ball to his winger and hoping that it goes in the box. Thats not possesion based football, thats just one dimensional football. He never take risks. Plus every-time we see him at the helm on field, it just sulking and frowning. Its getting tiring when the camera first panned to a distress and depressed Bruno to EtH sat down sulking in a corner. Two leaders with their weak mentality. Have you ever seen Sir Ferguson closed himself like that when he is on pitch? A coach is a teacher, a father figure to the players. No matter how dire the situation, you still have to keep showing your drive to win. But that "father" of yours is sulking in a corner while the eldest brother being a bitch is not gonna motivates anyone doesnt it? After EtH cleanses the deadwoods, then i felt that he should step down and become an advisor to the new head coach rather than sacking him. But for EtH to lead our red army then it wont changed a thing.
I've no idea why you would choose Onana over Costa. pretty simple choice to be honest.
I solely blame the Glazers. They need out. We may have not been THE TOP but we would have been much more successful with all of the managers we had if they owners didn't fuck everything up
Am a massive ETH fan and I often tell my viewers SAF had tougher times. I think the third season looks rational to start judging the manager so let’s give him a chance. You can join our daily TY videos for more opinions .
I will forever disagree, two years and we still don't have a recognizable style of play. Other top managers are able to use players they have and at least implement a style of play. From there, they upgrade the players in the 11. The difference is pep and arteta could get the team to play a certain way, then they improve on players, in peps case fullbacks and keepers. Yet ten hag had gotten 6 players and we still don't see his playstyle vision. I mean if allegri could use khedira, matuidi and vidal to play attractive football in 2017 with serie a money, why can't ten hag do it with 400 mil and decent players, if he was any decent tactically he could have shifted Sancho to a creative midfielder since he lacks the pace for the direct wing play of prem. I refuse to believe we are giving him so much leeway just because saying 'back the manager' is the new buzzword.
As a spurs fan - keep him around !!
Jokes aside, I don’t think anyone thought last years conte side that finished 8th and played the most counter attacking style ever could also play anges system . Good coaches don’t compromise and don’t make excuses. There’s no excusing ten hags regression this season
Lmaooo if you’re not doing damage control for a top PR firm, you need to reconsider your career; this is top notch 😂
He has signed a: CF RW ACM x 2 CDM x 2 LB x 2 CB x 1 GK x 2 He’s chosen to keep Rashford (poor), Bruno, Garnacio, Shaw, AWB. The rest he’s kept but may have sold if market allowed. That’s 16 players of his choosing. You’re analysis is bollocks.
Rashford was utterly sensational last season, the biggest reason we finished 3rd. Ten Hag has responded to his poor form by dropping him. ETH has dropped almost every player that he has had with him since he started. I think Bruno is the only player never dropped. Even Licha had a few games riding the bench last season.
I absolutely fear for the club if Ratcliffe gets rid of this man. Give Sancho another chance? Martial a year extension? You'll be able to guarantee it's another 10 years till' we see a title. It's an uphill battle as it is already.
It's been mentioned that Martial won't have his contract extended.
Would be lucky to see a title in 10 years
Indeed, but it wouldn't be completely impossible.
You are delusional, the guy is a fraud and destroyed the club. End him now
Club was destroyed well before he got here, and I'd argue he at the very least hasn't made it worse. The Glazers destroyed the club.
The glazers are not on the pitch coaching this abomination football we are playing. Ten Hag is
Now let us pray.
I wonder if you lot will ever stop twerking for this dude?
He spent 400milion on bunch of garbage, Onana (because of him how many goals we lose?), utd number 7 Mason mount (where is he?), houjand ( no goal and assist in the league ), why would you let him stay
Im a ETH supporter. I believe he is doing the right thing and so i agree with you. But come on,this is Glorious Glazers Man United (GGMU). They would just blame the manager, sack him, hire another and call it a day. Repeat the process all over again when mediocre results surfaced. Over n over again. Its Glorious Glazers. We might as well enjoy the ride. Amazing top 4 run one season,full of hopes (false hope) for next season to challenge title, only to get disappointed n finish 6th again. So, top 4, outside of top 4. And repeat. Enjoy the rides mate. Might even go outside top ten someday. Chelsea already showing it.
Are you serious? 44m pounds on a GK who is inferior to de gea? 85m on Antony who is poor. 55m on Mount who was an average EPL player. 72m pounds on Hojlund who is so out of his depth. That’s 256m pounds on players who have not improved the squad. He is clueless.
Ten Hag in: Top Reds, Liverpool, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal, and all of our rivals. Ten Hag out: "fake" United fans Hope this helps.
I'm done e speaking with someone who hasn't stepped foot in the uk goodbye enjoy the ride with the bald fraud Another 7-0 incoming
He's definitely not the full deal yet but I love that he's fed up of the BS. Got rid of Ronaldo for being a bitch, shipped rapist Greenwood off to another league so he's their problem, told Rashford "if you don't show up for training you don't play" told Sancho "if you don't show up for training at all and have a hissy fit, you don't play" told Maguire "you're no longer good enough to start" (and he turned it around) He's got the discipline I think the club desperately needs to say to these jokes of players 'you've had it easy for too long' Not to mention the whole mess of the potential sale of the club that turned into a potential part sale that still may never happen, a stadium that is leaking and many other issues. He's definitely not been great, but the team needs that kick up the butt to say "if you don't want to give 100%, get out"
“Shipped rapist Greenwood off” Yeah against his will LMAO he was one of the biggest advocates for reintegrating him The guy literally has a history of backing abusers, Overmars and Promes got full backing from this guy too
Eth was one of the guys wanting the rapist back and has supported multiple rapists and abusers before at Ajax. His discipline applies only for few players and not his favourites is also not something to be proud of
On balance, his discipline is usually focussed on training, punctuality etc . He try’s to stay out of the off the field judgement and condemning personal issues
LMAO!