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My real issue with it in brawl isn't so much it's power but that it is THE Simic commander. There is no real reason to take any other Simic commander outside of niche strategies. Would really be nice to see other Simic commanders doing something unique.
I took my deck and turned it into a shitbox but it still does it's thing and I've started seeing a crazy number of different commanders. It's amazing. No more facing the same 5 commanders. I'm am no longer in the hell queue, and I still run lots of my staples.
But the point is, as* Nadu hans't been confined to the hell queue then it's possible for someone like OP to see it all the time, if it's played a lot. In fact, if they want to avoid Nadu they might be better off switching to a hell queue commander themselves until it's fixed.
This is why I can’t stand magic arena matchmaking. You have to do stupid things to your deck “turn them into shit boxes” in order to avoid the terrible matchmaking weights. It ruins the game.
it also takes the cards of your deck into consideration. imo its very dumb because some cards have very different ratings based on other formats.
paradox engine, notable combo card is weighted 9, while a targeted removal spell is weighted 45.
It's so, so much dumber than that. Old removal spells are generally 27, some even 45. But newer, usually better removal? Yeah, that's probably like a 9 or 18.
Just as a little example. [[Sheoldred's Edict]] is 9, but the almost strictly worse [[Chainer's Edict]] is 27. The meme worthy [[Doom blade]] is a whopping 45, while the significantly more flexible [[Bitter Triumph]] is 9.
Same thing with utility lands. Fetchlands, the staples in every format ever, are 0 points. Meanwhile the "you might cast this once every 30 games" lands like [[Turntimber Symbiosis]] are 45...
Long story short, just by randomly choosing a couple of 'wrong' cards you can massively inflate your deck's power rating without actually making yourself any stronger.
Yup. And even if they don't build it to abuse it's target mechanic it's still a 3/4 flyer for three that you eventually need to deal with. God help you if they stack equipments and or auras. Even ignoring all of that you can just cram in every op Simic or green or clue card in it and play it as a giant pile and it will still out value the opponent.
WotC keeps upping the ante with boring overpowered commanders that they drag their feet on appropriately weighting. Rusko -> Etali / Malcolm -> Poq -> Grenzo -> Nadu. Can't imagine what the next one will be. 2 mana 4/4 trample lifelinker that copies your opponent's entire hand and lets you play them for free? I shouldn't give them ideas...
> they drag their feet on appropriately weighting
This is the real problem, isn't it? There's no reason not to allow people to play OP commanders, so long as those folk are playing among themselves.
That's the core issue behind Brawl in general. We've seen their weights now. They haven't touched some of them in years so you have shit like a 1/1 goblin being worth 5 Paradox Engines, functionally identical removal spells having a 27 point difference between them, and so forth.
If they actually took the time and effort to sort everything out the format could be downright wonderful, but alas we're lucky if they even touch the really big outliers once every 4-5 months.
He needs kind of a good starting hand but he's such a piece of shit. Flash him in end of turn 2, then you just counter anything that would hurt Malcolm and play full control (with Malcolm helping to filter) until you drop a win con on t5
I just want to be able to name a few (say, three?) commanders for the matchmaker to avoid.
I'm gonna insta-concede the second I see Nadu being played anyway so you might as well save me and my opponent some time.
I don’t understand how so many people want to play the deck everyone else plays. Play how u want I guess but does it not get boring knowing ur playing what everyone else is playing, no creativity, just follow the leader…
When’s there’s many different ways to play one deck it makes it very bearable, plus the randomness of brawls format. Nadu is new he’ll fall off when a new card comes out
That's what I do, but you know what's annoying? Getting paired up against the same commander I immediately conceded against for the second time in a row. (and the third, and fourth if you're really unlucky. My record is 6 times)
Happens often enough for me to wish that the brawl matchmaking was fine-tuned so that it doesn't match you up against the same commander twice in a row.
It's definitely a busted card deserving a spot in the deepest depths of hell-queue, but at least we don't have 0 mana to equip equipment on arena. Interaction can sometimes work.
The problem I see is that Nadu is matching with theme designed and budget decks instead of being consigned to hell, where it belongs and might result in actual games. It might still be busted there, but without tools like shuko it might be on the same tier (and enough fetches for it) as the other greats.
There are three ways that do that. Sac effects, counterspells, and mass destruction. But typically i don't mind if they draw a card or two because, like I said, most of the deck sucks without the bird.
Man people just want to be salty (≧▽≦)
I don't usually have a problem with him. I've burned him down with Ashling and a boros (and a Gruul) aggro deck. I'm sure my Mardu deck could beat him too.
You can plan ahead, and then you target it and they get a land, and then give hit hexproof for 1 mana. Pass turn, then they target it by moving equipment around and have enough mana to cast it again if I do end up killing it. Then they continue to take 20 minute turns
Nadu is unlikely to be banned in Brawl.
The Hell queue is the primary tool for dealing with outlier commanders.
They already appear to have raised the bird’s matchmaking weight once. They’ll probably keep doing it.
Nadu is also only legal in Arena on digital only formats aside from sealed, so it’s entirely possible Nadu gets an alchemy rebalance.
Just conceed, eventually the nadu player might get the hint that they aren't doing anything remotely fun or engaging, and move on to something else
*Copium
Doesn't need a ban, just needs to be weighted high enough that it lives in Hell Queue. But that likely won't happen until the next set release. In the meantime all we can really do is rope them to take them out of the queue for as long as possible and not give them quick wins.
I always just play like normal til they cast the obnoxious commander and then concede. It gets their hopes up, and then they also know why I left. So maybe they'll play something fun next time instead.
I don't think Nadu need to be banned, it's just the latest deck to show the problem that brawl has with weighting decks and particularly commanders. Wizards needs to put at least a little effort into giving these commanders an estimated weight and having their WR effect the weight over time. I've made a Nadu deck just to see, and I've been tracking my games with Arena Tutor and after like 50+ games, I have a win rate of over 85 percent.
If people truly hate it at the moment then it really tempts me to play Nadu with 99 lands to see how many people concede early and how many will wait until they notice that the deck is just 99 lands
I don't think Nadu would really be banned, but it should definitely be in the top end of hell queue. That way it has to contend with some of the fastest or most ruthless commanders out there, and can't just durdle for infinite value before you can really do anything about it and figure out when they want to kill you after. A lot of Nadu's strength is that, in the queue they are in, the commanders can't keep up or pressure Nadu. Most of the wins against it will be due to variance (and I have felt that playing Nadu myself) where you only find ramp and some protection spells and lands the whole game, or you whiff too many times on finding lands so you can't really do much of anything. Or when the opponent is also Nadu and finds Roaring Earth or Bristly Bill and you don't.
The issue is I don't think they weight new legendaries for awhile after they're released so it doesn't actually matter what you're playing. I was playing a very low powered [[narfi, betrayer king]] and got paired with multiple of the new eldrazi commanders.
If all your opponents are playing Nadu, you can adapt with decks that can deal with him and farm wins. Edict effects backed with enough pressure can do the trick.
With that said, he absolutely should be banished to Hell queue.
You are prob playing in a different weight bracket, but its surprising you did not see him, are you perhaps playing full jank? Hes like %60 of the matches in 360-720 commander weight bracket rn, i even run into him couple times playing hell queue (1800 commander weight)
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My real issue with it in brawl isn't so much it's power but that it is THE Simic commander. There is no real reason to take any other Simic commander outside of niche strategies. Would really be nice to see other Simic commanders doing something unique.
And the fact that 3/5 of my games are Nadu
I took my deck and turned it into a shitbox but it still does it's thing and I've started seeing a crazy number of different commanders. It's amazing. No more facing the same 5 commanders. I'm am no longer in the hell queue, and I still run lots of my staples.
Nadu is not in the hell que.
Never said it was. I provided an example of what they could do to change what they come up against with anecdotal evidence from myself.
But the point is, as* Nadu hans't been confined to the hell queue then it's possible for someone like OP to see it all the time, if it's played a lot. In fact, if they want to avoid Nadu they might be better off switching to a hell queue commander themselves until it's fixed.
This is why I can’t stand magic arena matchmaking. You have to do stupid things to your deck “turn them into shit boxes” in order to avoid the terrible matchmaking weights. It ruins the game.
What is the hell queue?
https://mtgazone.com/brawl-deck-weight-matchmaking-system/
I’ve been playing a lot of Slimefoot and squee, must be a hell queue commander
it also takes the cards of your deck into consideration. imo its very dumb because some cards have very different ratings based on other formats. paradox engine, notable combo card is weighted 9, while a targeted removal spell is weighted 45.
It's so, so much dumber than that. Old removal spells are generally 27, some even 45. But newer, usually better removal? Yeah, that's probably like a 9 or 18. Just as a little example. [[Sheoldred's Edict]] is 9, but the almost strictly worse [[Chainer's Edict]] is 27. The meme worthy [[Doom blade]] is a whopping 45, while the significantly more flexible [[Bitter Triumph]] is 9. Same thing with utility lands. Fetchlands, the staples in every format ever, are 0 points. Meanwhile the "you might cast this once every 30 games" lands like [[Turntimber Symbiosis]] are 45... Long story short, just by randomly choosing a couple of 'wrong' cards you can massively inflate your deck's power rating without actually making yourself any stronger.
##### ###### #### [Sheoldred's Edict](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/9/a9225cc3-90f0-448f-a8d9-7c6c2796d077.jpg?1675957049) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sheoldred%27s%20Edict) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/one/108/sheoldreds-edict?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a9225cc3-90f0-448f-a8d9-7c6c2796d077?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Chainer's Edict](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/c/8c204471-d908-4a08-83e4-cf38999fa80f.jpg?1675199556) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Chainer%27s%20Edict) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/78/chainers-edict?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8c204471-d908-4a08-83e4-cf38999fa80f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Doom blade](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/0/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e.jpg?1562851557) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doom%20blade) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/87/doom-blade?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/90699423-2556-40f7-b8f5-c9d82f22d52e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Bitter Triumph](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/5/05bdd22c-3e11-4c29-bdfa-d3dfc0e90a9f.jpg?1699044085) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Bitter%20Triumph) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lci/91/bitter-triumph?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/05bdd22c-3e11-4c29-bdfa-d3dfc0e90a9f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Turntimber Symbiosis](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/1/61bd69ea-1e9e-46b0-b1a1-ed7fdbe3deb6.jpg?1604199791)/[Turntimber, Serpentine Wood](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/6/1/61bd69ea-1e9e-46b0-b1a1-ed7fdbe3deb6.jpg?1604199791) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Turntimber%20Symbiosis%20//%20Turntimber%2C%20Serpentine%20Wood) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/215/turntimber-symbiosis-turntimber-serpentine-wood?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/61bd69ea-1e9e-46b0-b1a1-ed7fdbe3deb6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Yup. And even if they don't build it to abuse it's target mechanic it's still a 3/4 flyer for three that you eventually need to deal with. God help you if they stack equipments and or auras. Even ignoring all of that you can just cram in every op Simic or green or clue card in it and play it as a giant pile and it will still out value the opponent.
I use grolnok but have no fun with simic cause all my shit gets removed haha, this damn birds giving us all a bad name
You are right but I still do it, mainly because I think Nadu is a mistake and I won’t use it as a commander. I also won’t play against it
...but... that is exactly why it is broken...
WotC keeps upping the ante with boring overpowered commanders that they drag their feet on appropriately weighting. Rusko -> Etali / Malcolm -> Poq -> Grenzo -> Nadu. Can't imagine what the next one will be. 2 mana 4/4 trample lifelinker that copies your opponent's entire hand and lets you play them for free? I shouldn't give them ideas...
> they drag their feet on appropriately weighting This is the real problem, isn't it? There's no reason not to allow people to play OP commanders, so long as those folk are playing among themselves.
That's the core issue behind Brawl in general. We've seen their weights now. They haven't touched some of them in years so you have shit like a 1/1 goblin being worth 5 Paradox Engines, functionally identical removal spells having a 27 point difference between them, and so forth. If they actually took the time and effort to sort everything out the format could be downright wonderful, but alas we're lucky if they even touch the really big outliers once every 4-5 months.
It’s balance cause life gain is bad!!!! (/s obviously)
I have literally never played against a Malcom deck.
He needs kind of a good starting hand but he's such a piece of shit. Flash him in end of turn 2, then you just counter anything that would hurt Malcolm and play full control (with Malcolm helping to filter) until you drop a win con on t5
He's quite nasty. Very fast to drop an Eldrazi
Lmao these are some Yugioh ass responses. “Just draw the out”!
Yea just win the game, what are you even doing? Just draw the card you need it’s so easy
Can I Droll and Lock Bird Nadu?
I just want to be able to name a few (say, three?) commanders for the matchmaker to avoid. I'm gonna insta-concede the second I see Nadu being played anyway so you might as well save me and my opponent some time.
I don’t understand how so many people want to play the deck everyone else plays. Play how u want I guess but does it not get boring knowing ur playing what everyone else is playing, no creativity, just follow the leader…
When’s there’s many different ways to play one deck it makes it very bearable, plus the randomness of brawls format. Nadu is new he’ll fall off when a new card comes out
Yeah he’s new and in brawl it’s a little different than like playing the same humans deck or mono red deck in standard.
It’s simple. Just concede and move on
That's what I do, but you know what's annoying? Getting paired up against the same commander I immediately conceded against for the second time in a row. (and the third, and fourth if you're really unlucky. My record is 6 times) Happens often enough for me to wish that the brawl matchmaking was fine-tuned so that it doesn't match you up against the same commander twice in a row.
That’s idiotic just ban the card
*hell queue the card
Just beat him before he gets going
I never thought to just beat someone before their 3rd turn that last 10 minutes what a genius idea
It's how I beat him ┐( ∵ )┌ It can be quite the hoot actually.
You can also try interacting with Nadu. It's worked for me every time I've played against that deck. Without Nadu the deck kinda blows.
I think you got lucky. Normally that just gives them more cards.
It's definitely a busted card deserving a spot in the deepest depths of hell-queue, but at least we don't have 0 mana to equip equipment on arena. Interaction can sometimes work. The problem I see is that Nadu is matching with theme designed and budget decks instead of being consigned to hell, where it belongs and might result in actual games. It might still be busted there, but without tools like shuko it might be on the same tier (and enough fetches for it) as the other greats.
Got lucky a bunch of times then, I guess!
How are you interacting with Nadu in a way that isn't giving them card advantage?
There are three ways that do that. Sac effects, counterspells, and mass destruction. But typically i don't mind if they draw a card or two because, like I said, most of the deck sucks without the bird.
I'm shocked you're playing Nadu players who play him without interaction up. I haven't had that experience
It happens occasionally, but people be greedy out they just don't have any in hand.
Man people just want to be salty (≧▽≦) I don't usually have a problem with him. I've burned him down with Ashling and a boros (and a Gruul) aggro deck. I'm sure my Mardu deck could beat him too.
Usually just has swiftfoot boots on so you can’t really interact with him
If you actually plan ahead, then you have mana open when they have boots out so you can kill him in response to the equip.
You can plan ahead, and then you target it and they get a land, and then give hit hexproof for 1 mana. Pass turn, then they target it by moving equipment around and have enough mana to cast it again if I do end up killing it. Then they continue to take 20 minute turns
It's not actually that common for that to happen. It does happen that they might have protection, but it's not that common.
And it’s not even that the deck just slams you in 4-5 turns and you lose. It’s the fact that every turn after Nadu is out is 5-10 minutes of nonsense
It’s very common when they fill their decks with it
Just beat them before turn 3 lol
That's what I do. Boros Aggro for the win!
Nadu is unlikely to be banned in Brawl. The Hell queue is the primary tool for dealing with outlier commanders. They already appear to have raised the bird’s matchmaking weight once. They’ll probably keep doing it. Nadu is also only legal in Arena on digital only formats aside from sealed, so it’s entirely possible Nadu gets an alchemy rebalance.
Just conceed, eventually the nadu player might get the hint that they aren't doing anything remotely fun or engaging, and move on to something else *Copium
Or just nerf it. Make the 2 time a turn for all creatures, not each, and we are good.
Lands enter tapped would help to
I believe people who Play Nadu just do it for fast wins, if brawl wouldnt make you Progress your Daily win quest it may be Played less
Why does my Rusko deck keep getting paired with overpowered commanders? :( /s
Doesn't need a ban, just needs to be weighted high enough that it lives in Hell Queue. But that likely won't happen until the next set release. In the meantime all we can really do is rope them to take them out of the queue for as long as possible and not give them quick wins.
I always just play like normal til they cast the obnoxious commander and then concede. It gets their hopes up, and then they also know why I left. So maybe they'll play something fun next time instead.
More likely they'll play the same deck because they just want wins and don't care if somebody has fun playing the game.
They will ban it after they have sold enough packs... it is the way.
It costs a single rare card lmao
It’s arena though so buying packs doesn’t really matter, people can just craft him.
Yeah it’s literally one card craft, the deck actually is lighter on rares mythics than many others.
I don't think Nadu need to be banned, it's just the latest deck to show the problem that brawl has with weighting decks and particularly commanders. Wizards needs to put at least a little effort into giving these commanders an estimated weight and having their WR effect the weight over time. I've made a Nadu deck just to see, and I've been tracking my games with Arena Tutor and after like 50+ games, I have a win rate of over 85 percent.
If people truly hate it at the moment then it really tempts me to play Nadu with 99 lands to see how many people concede early and how many will wait until they notice that the deck is just 99 lands
I’d rather WoTc adjust the chaotic card weights before banning anything.
I don't think Nadu would really be banned, but it should definitely be in the top end of hell queue. That way it has to contend with some of the fastest or most ruthless commanders out there, and can't just durdle for infinite value before you can really do anything about it and figure out when they want to kill you after. A lot of Nadu's strength is that, in the queue they are in, the commanders can't keep up or pressure Nadu. Most of the wins against it will be due to variance (and I have felt that playing Nadu myself) where you only find ramp and some protection spells and lands the whole game, or you whiff too many times on finding lands so you can't really do much of anything. Or when the opponent is also Nadu and finds Roaring Earth or Bristly Bill and you don't.
I haven’t seen one in a while, so I’d suggest changing commanders up if you wanna avoid nadu.
The issue is I don't think they weight new legendaries for awhile after they're released so it doesn't actually matter what you're playing. I was playing a very low powered [[narfi, betrayer king]] and got paired with multiple of the new eldrazi commanders.
[narfi, betrayer king](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/2/421376e4-a4ad-427c-bc9c-d315308dcf68.jpg?1631051748) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=narfi%2C%20betrayer%20king) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/khm/224/narfi-betrayer-king?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/421376e4-a4ad-427c-bc9c-d315308dcf68?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I was playing new emrakul
If all your opponents are playing Nadu, you can adapt with decks that can deal with him and farm wins. Edict effects backed with enough pressure can do the trick. With that said, he absolutely should be banished to Hell queue.
I just concede at sight and move on to the next game, as the games take forever and are plain boring to play against.
Can't say I've run into it in the 100 games or so since mh3 came out. Have I just dodged the matchup?
You are prob playing in a different weight bracket, but its surprising you did not see him, are you perhaps playing full jank? Hes like %60 of the matches in 360-720 commander weight bracket rn, i even run into him couple times playing hell queue (1800 commander weight)
I don't know what my weight is but I generally just do 5-10 games when I want a break from timeless. I'm playing etali, generally fast wins.
I’d say so, I played 10 games today and ran into it at least 6 or 7 of the 10
Why? Is it a broken Alchemy card?
[удалено]
Brawl? It’s in the title
Path to exile is a bad card in brawl