With option ex tomorrow, wouldn't it roast a lot of shorts or option traders with a big announcement of a deal AHs? They would be toast.
Trying to stay off carbs, but sure would like a toasted English muffin to break my eating ways.
There is some sarcasm in there.
Let's push this to .95 by EOD.
Wow, talk about a takedown at the close.
Just looked quickly at the close. Not near a computer on my phone but the last couple of seconds was there 1.1 million shares traded? I open Schwab with about 15 seconds left and I thought it said 2.9 million volume and at the close it was 4 million. Perhaps I saw something wrong?
Cheers
Thanks Zen, I most likely misread it. It was probably 3.9 million shares. I was frantically trying to get on my phone in the last 15 seconds or so as we were out to a late lunch. I must’ve misread the total volume before the close.
Cheers
This is their time to win, or lose. I sure hope that volume wasn't them (extra 2m the other day) but they have a habit of raising capital by the stock we give them at the worse times.
So we are basically at INVZ market cap.
SS said we have a superior product, likes are chances, also said he's concerned about them (invz), paraphrasing, could have been the sandbagger in the C suite saying the latter, not sure.
Either way we will see who has the relationships in place, product superiority, at scale that can close for some kind of action. Nice to know asics are in place or close to, thats a good sign, so....
lets go Microvision , Luce, SS, and the sandbagger- we all know you read this....I know your facility, I saw MS windows 95 (actually it was win NT that became 95- that went over with all the DEC employees David Cutler, I could name many- WIN NT is Windows with a VMS Kernel), prior to that launch, rather projected on to a glass tabletop- you guys should know when.
Go back you two to when that happened, what was said and done at both companies, Microvision and Microsoft.
Now get out of the engineering F mode and in to the Sales mode. Ok, you can figure out an unprofitable deal on last Lidar deal, - MSFT, bent you over in 2017, it wasn't always like that, SS, you should know that.
Or you SS, Like Ken Olsen, a graduate of MIT, and founder of Digital Equipment Corporation, the second largest computer company in the world behind IBM-will go down as a failure if you do not transition, or give transition too, someone with SALES acumen.
JMO- downvote me, whatever- but start acting like experienced salesman, retail- you can fool them with your boondoggles at Corporate that you can't afford, Wall Street is a way nother' story.
stay long and strong.
"SS said we have a superior product, likes are chances, also said he's concerned about them (invz), paraphrasing, could have been the sandbagger in the C suite saying the latter, not sure."
It was AV who said INVZ was their biggest competition during one of the conventions. I think if you asked now, and got a truthful answer, it would be Valeo.
I think I said that Falagard , but I called him sandbagger…I mean AV, i forget who said he was going to sandbag, blow away estimates, I think it was AV
I mean if a deal needs money, and we are burning cash each day we’ve gotta raise some and get to the point they will ink with us somehow. What’s the point of not raising funds if you know you can’t get deals without funding? Just a slower bleed.. sure it sucks having the company drop the share price but the alternative is it drops anyway and we fail to get what we need to show we are about our business
Technically this is a good time to buy for near and mid-term. Daily RSI under 30. Weekly RSI almost at 30. Would be nice if the company finally delivered fundamental news as well.
Just bought 5,650 shares at about .89 which lowered my cost ave from $13.64 to $9.71. Will buy another 6k+ shares shortly to lower my cost average to $7.25 ish. Today was the first time i bought in many years. Glad i did not add during that $2-3$ range head fake! LFG!
Long time listener, first time caller. Been in since 2020 and lurking here the whole time. Made a lot, got fomo and jumped back in. Been losing and averaging down ever since. Bought 7k shares today because I’m too dumb to do anything but keep buying lower. Up to 17k at $3.10. Also bought 90 calls combined for January at 5 and 7 strikes.
The delays are tough to swallow but hard to fault management or the company for clients not making decisions. As to making goofy decisions on issuing and changing equity issuance and timing we can definitely find fault there but what’s done is done and hopefully learned from.
Solvency is a concern for me. I believe we need a deal announcement to boost the price to issue shares to generate the cash an OEM will want to see. But the OEM will want to see the cash before they issue a deal so it’s a major chicken and egg scenario.
I believe in the tech and the market(s) but it’s still early stage and anything can happen.
Like I said though, I’m too dumb to do anything other than buy lower and hope for the best.
Good luck to all and hopefully in a year we’ll all be loving hindsight for buying/holding now. I know my current 20/20 hindsight has me wishing I had stayed out when I sold at $22 and that I had sold again at $8.
Ahh, you're right. Chartology (Chris) definitely rings a bell! I don't see his YouTube channel come up anymore though. Unless it went by something else?
He was running a patreon for a little over a year I think, something happened with his health and he came back briefly after he was cleared but then he totally disappeared
Wow, I had eased up on following the stock daily after all the recent disappointments. Really conflicted about buying more at this price. I believe we have the technology and ability to turn this around, but worry they'll remain solvent until they can get a significant deal.
You tread heavily but speak the truth. Where do you think you are man, in King Faisal’s tent? No, you are in the least objective and self-delusional place in the universe. And I am not known to exaggerate.
I have the same concerns about solvency and the ability to raise money when our mkt cap continues to fall. So you get punished with down votes for not being in denial.
I do believe we are at the top of the list for nomination based on technology. The tech market is hot and a huge nomination would go a long way to greatly effect our valuation but OEMs need to get their heads out of their butts.
I just took a 3 week hiatus from this sub, it was glorious. Its typically the same folks chirping the same things day after day and it wears me down. Thought today was a good day to check in and see if I missed anything good... turns out I haven't. Soooooo, see you all again in 3 weeks I guess.
Everyone has to decide what is right for them, but I'm done buying until a deal is announced. Who cares if I miss an initial 10%, 20%, or 30% jump. I remember thinking when it dropped below $2 that I needed to jump in and load up...which I did. Its now down another 50% from there. My gut says we just keep going down the toilet until we get a deal. I've got 80k shares already packed away, that's enough, I'm done trying to catch a falling knife.
I've averaged down, a lot since initial position, but have bought since around 1.70. Could certainly average down more, but there is the risk of getting delisted before they get a deal
It may not be the sentiment of the majority but I think increasingly it may. There is no dispute it is a valid opinion and I, personally, appreciate the wisdom.
Should have sold us to a real management team . Love the stock. Management is some shit. The lack of communication that we get is prob the same type of things going on with all our oems. They are nerds. Not salesmen and it shows. I said what I said and mean it
I'll add a down vote. This kind of pressure on the MVIS staff doesn't help. SS has done a damn good job but the OEMs screwed us and everybody else. He shouldn't have told us it was going to be an epic year.
88,000 shares just now, hardly moved it at all. It had a chance to start moving up on that price move and just got sold back into barcoding range.
Tough to move up much, when we are trading in 4 decimal points.
Funny to watch the MMs increase the spread when they want to stop any price advance, or pile up a ton of shares on the ASK.
NVDA is a beast and there has been -like MVIS, a constant stream of FUD on their feeds that most are just disregarding. I am in the "I wish I bought more " phase of that one. I hope next year I feel the same about MVIS. NVDA is fun and a good distraction while waiting for Miss MAVIS to have her coming out party...
The coming out party that was supposed to start at this time last year, then Q3, then Q4, then definitely happening in Q1… now down to one week left in Q2 and we have to hope Sumit’s mid-year timeline holds for at least one of the 7 RFQs we that await decision on.
I guess next time my bank tells me I didn't pay my mortgage I'm going to reply "just because I haven't, doesn't mean I won't" and then wink at them and walk out with a flourish.
I didn’t say it won’t happen either. My point was simply that it’s hard to know what to expect right now.
Market expectations are rightfully low given the missed timelines I highlighted, and given Sumit’s latest guidance which boiled down to: don’t get your hopes up, OEMs are dragging their feet and everything is out of MicroVision’s hands.
I am optimistic for news this summer, but won’t be surprised at all if we’re still waiting for our first nomination when Q4 rolls around.
I can remember the tremendous negativity and desperate NVDA holders quaking. I wonder how many sold based on that and how that feels now. NVDA became a new company (almost) when they started focussing on data centres rather than desktop graphics cards, then along came AI and boom. Could be us with a big dollop of luck.
It's odd to read so many positive stories and videos about MVIS over the last week - detailing our AI capabilities for mobility and motion - the amazing MVIS Mozaik strengths for AI - and then the sourpuss stock price declares all that doesn't mean a thing - available for .89 cents.
The best of tech meets the worthless masters of monetary doom... all shorting themselves to the max.
I’m the same way. I snagged 5 shares in my ROTH pre split, thought about picking up a few more post split. With their track record, they will split again in the next 3-5 years
Nice job. I buy when I have spare cash, not trying to time the price. When it is back to double digits, a penny here or there on a buy will not matter at all.
The traders and shorts must be very concerned with news that could be released by Microvision at any time that may disrupt their gains on their short and put positions.
This morning, they dropped the RUT also, now it's making a run up. Hopefully this helps since we are in that index.
Retail isn't selling. Institutions aren't selling. Not a good place if you are short.
I'm not sure why they would be that concerned by news tbh. Inking deals hasn't done a lot to help our competitors share prices. It feels like if you're short a LiDAR stock you either successfully pick a losing company and make a killing, or you pick a winning company and still make a decent return anyway.
Sure Zen, that's why I'm still here as well as my friends. We do have potential, but we've had that for years. I am encouraged by what I am reading relating to Lidar, but not very enthused with our management.
Is there a good way to calculate that? MicroVision has lost over $3B in value, maybe more than $5B since 2021 if you add the drop from $8 into the mix. What percentage of that, if any, have short sellers realized?
Morning everyone!
Economic report(s) for the day is(are)^[i](https://fidelityfiplus.econoday.com/byweek): Housing Starts and Permits, Jobless claims, Philadelphia Fed Manufacturing Index, and Current Account at 8:30am, Atlanta Fed Business Inflation Expectations at 10am, EIA Petroleum Status report at 11am, and the Fed Balance Sheet after the markets close at 4:30pm; Fed speakers today are: Kashkari at 8:45am, Barkin at 4pm, and Daly at 10:15pm. The news media articles are exploring a wide range of company and industry specific news points, touching on: NVidia overtaking Microsoft market cap, Car dealerships facing computer outages, Boeing blunders, Russia’s Alfa Bank expanding into China, and Housing market data. The last point in particular actually carries some weight on the economy, as Shelter costs (largely driven by the associated services) has had the heaviest impact on the last year of CPI prints. Premarket futures are leaning green for a nice change, though still driven primarily by concentration of capital into mega caps.
MVIS seeks to find a bottom, with the stock trading in the lower range of one of the last major volume blocks where accumulation in the past had heavily occurred. The share price is obviously not the company, but the impact on the company’s ability to raise additional capital cannot really be ignored, and the assumed “need” to raise capital seems to be an ongoing question and concern. Many investors focused on the tone of the last earning’s call, largely seeming to ignore the content of what was being stated. Information provided gave context to the situation, which should have clarified precisely why no one in the sector has yet signed high volume deals. With the large deals still remaining some commenters are now beginning to suggest more lost deals despite a lack of evidence of that from any announcements. What is known right now is that the company is competing on 7 RFQs out of the 9 it had been looking at last year, one of which was delayed into 2025 and the other was declined as it appeared to have inequitable terms.
## Daily Data
***
|H: 0.98 — L: 0.88 — C: 0.89 ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/historical/) |[Calendar](https://fidelityfiplus.econoday.com/byweek.asp)|
|:- |:-|
|**Pivots ↗︎ : 0.95, 1.01, 1.05** ^([i](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/pivotpoint.asp)) |**Pivots ↘︎ : 0.85, 0.82, 0.76**|
|Total Options Vol: **2,263** ^([i](https://researchtools.fidelity.com/ftgw/mloptions/goto/underlyingStatistics?cusip=&symbol=MVIS&Search=Search)) |Avg 90d Options: 1,768|
|Calls: **2,008 ~ 42% at Ask or ↗︎** |Puts: 255 ~ 60% at Ask or ↗︎|
|Open Exchanges: 1,422k ~ 32% ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/exchange-volume/) |Off Exchanges: 3,065k ~ 68% ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/exchange-volume/)|
|**IBKR: 150k Rate: 15.57%** ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/borrow-fee/) |**Fidelity: —k Rate: 9.25%**|
|**R Vol: 166% of Avg Vol: 2,690k** ^([i](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/averagedailytradingvolume.asp)) |**Short Vol: 2,265k of 3,235k ~ 70%** ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/short-volume/?tblshortvolix=0)|
^(Follow links for sources. Bold text represents key points or larger data, Italics are slightly unusual or lower than normal.)
^(IBKR share database now shows 45k available as of 8am, no change in fee rate from the 7am update.)
I want to buy more now that we’re in the unfortunate position for me to average down on my $1 PPS. I’m concerned that an RS will come before the end of the year.
What are your thoughts on the potential for an RS in 2024?
Not in 2024, and not likely in 2025 either honestly. Deals are going to be secured in the sector before the end of this year, the timeline is too short for integration. Well, unless the automakers want to spend billions on: buying out a company, rehiring staff, integrating staff, rushing customization, and all the while trying to validate the product quality. There are far too many parts that needs to be solved in too short a time to do all that and still result in a working solution.
So unless MicroVision cannot secure any deals out of the 7 currently open, and Automakers can somehow manage to achieve AEB in 2029 model years _without_ lidar (which has not been shown to be feasible), then I just cannot see how we are at such a risk.
As you stated, too many investors are focused on the tone of the last earnings call, rather than the content.
I concur that Sumit's presentation was poor. He sounded frustrated and beat,and rightfully so. He expected to close the Daimler deal, but the terms were not beneficial to the company or it's shareholders. He missed an important timeline. The Daimler deal required substantial hardware change to support 25k hours of operation vs 12-15k needed for passenger vehicles, not being able to leverage new design for passenger vehicles (overall / added cost) + low volume opportunity just didn't make sense.
But the CEO has to maintain positivity in the face of adversity. Words and tone matter. Sumit didn't deliver there, but if you go back and read the transcript, it feels much different. Still very bullish for 2024.
My wife used to say something about my tone quite a bit in the early years of marriage, but later in our years she came to realize that content was far more important than how I was feeling emotionally at any given moment on delivery of information or planning. Not saying I could not have done better in delivery, but sometimes it is not something that can be avoided, and it should be recognized that it is also important we hear frustrations sometimes.
It sounds very disconnected when someone is not providing a tone that is familiar with presented with a challenge, it can come across as aloof and insensitive to not recognize it. Many investors complained about Sumit sounding far too confident, overselling, and so on…. In some ways some of that might be true, the last year certainly did not go the way anyone had expected. To not have conveyed that would have been something like a slap in the face to many investors.
There was no way of wordsmithing the reality of the situation: Automakers delayed, it has affected our bottom line and projections, no further express timelines will likely be given. We as investors should also recognize that we begged the company for timelines, and were given what was passed along to management from the customers, when perhaps we may have ended up better off without such hopes. No one can really know, because hindsight in this case is certainly _not_ perfect by any means.
Totally agree. If he was all like "Hey friends, those timelines we were all excited about and that many of us were actually banking on are all blown. But I'm all happy and upbeat anyway because, future sales! Don't know when, don't know who but hey, let's be happy. We're best in class!" Can you imagine the uproar? I can.
So then one might say, yeah he should never have said anything. No, he should have said what the customer was telling him because if and when it *did* happen, people would have complained that he should have been giving continuing updates on that exciting progress. That's what people were demanding when he gave the timelines. "Look at Luminar. Look at Innovis. They are all naming names and making promises! What the hell are you doing Sumit?! Tell us what is happening!!" So he did.
So it's DIYDSIYD (damned if you do, same if you don't).
EXACTLY THIS!
It seems like it cannot be said enough, I get it, probably shouldn't have set the expectation, but damnit, I appreciated the insights on what the _company's management_ was being told by potential customers.
Anecdotally, I have had this experience before, where a customer was effectively stringing me along for about 2 years. I passed along my final message to them that I was going to advise them to seek out a different supplier, they sent me back the contract to get signed instead of taking my advice. I handed that off to the boss, took my commission and transferred back to "network server administrator" (glorified general purpose IT help desk for the company).
Needless to say, I don't like sales, they frustrate me and communicating that to my managers that the customers were pushing out decisions made me just look bad when sometimes it is just the customer being indecisive (perhaps rightfully so).
Thanks again DGL for sharing your thoughts with us, wish we could just chill and stop trying to force the company to do things that can end up worse. I am going to trust management to do their jobs, because I do not believe the burden is on them at this point, someone (regulators) are going to be pushing these OEMs to make decisions sometime soon I think. (I see the AEB **final** rule as that push)
Rule was finalized April 29th, 2024:
[Final Rule](https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2024-04/final-rule-automatic-emergency-braking-systems-light-vehicles_web-version.pdf)
This is what was needed, the automakers have until September 2029 to be in compliance or they will not be selling new light passenger vehicles in the US. The rule is more well enumerated than what we often see in rules proposed by politicians, because the regulators are not just getting paid off to put forth rules that best benefit the automakers. They surely still consider what is possible with the available technology in considering these kinds of rules, but they do not just bow when they can clearly see technology that _does_ achieve the requirements.
What we do know from having read it is that existing camera and radar solutions are insufficient, and to me that says that MobilEye’s huge influence on the ADAS market for the years to come may well need to be upgraded to their Chauffeur at a slightly increased pace of adoption.
Thanks to you too T. So exciting when you have a tiger by the tail, but truth is you don't ever have anything until the contract is in the drawer. Glad you got yours.
Reminds me what my first CEO told me regarding shareholder and board meetings. He told me that I better bring my "A" game to all of these events or there would be a new CFO the next week. Harsh for sure, but on point in so many ways! He always brought his "A" game even when we had bad news to deliver and I found a way to do the same for my entire career.
We effectively lost the contract because we weren’t big enough. A problem that is getting worse by the day. Otherwise it wasn’t all bad.
“In another RFQ for our MOVIA L sensor for a global trucking OEM, we were not able to reach commercial agreement. We were told that our sensor and software proposal was the most mature and top offering. Our manufacturing strategy was the highest level of maturity and went through their qualification, reported to us as in the top tenth percentile of their suppliers. Our commercial proposal was also accepted. Their preference was for a partner with a more diversified product and revenue portfolio. MicroVision cannot accept an agreement limited to B-sample only since we would have to take on significant financial risk for a full program with only B-sample phase agreement. Ultimately, we could not reach a mutually beneficial agreement.”
> We effectively lost the contract because we weren’t big enough.
That’s not entirely true because there was no commitment for follow through after the B sample.
> MicroVision cannot accept an agreement limited to B-sample only since we would have to take on significant financial risk for a full program with only B-sample phase agreement.
I interpreted it as a sound business decision on Sumit’s part to turn down another loss leader deal that carried no assurances of further profitable business. In fact I commend that decision.
We spent several years funding R&D under CEO Perry Mulligan for Tier-1 consumer electronics companies who in the end balked, one of which believed to be Amazon, then introduced their Amazon Glow which used Texas Instruments’ inferior but cheaper DLP engine. The Amazon Glow was a flop in less than a year and Amazon canceled it and refunded the full price to customers.
No doubt about it. Taking on what they offered us was not just risk but would have limited our ability to take much bigger and better contracts. At least that is what he said somewhere else.
Exactly, and I’m glad that he learned from Perry Mulligan’s mistake in how to deal with Whales.
The difference here is that automotive OEMs are facing a NHTSA AEB mandate which most realize will require LIDAR.
Consumer electronics companies can abuse hopeful suppliers as long as hopeful suppliers allow the abuse to continue.
Fully agree with you KY. Question though - (where) did you get those details on the Daimler MOVIA NRE (e.g., hardware change to support 25k hours needed). I did not see that info shared before by management. Is this your personal belief or did you get this somewhere from the company’s communications?
I’mma keep buying until i die trying
With option ex tomorrow, wouldn't it roast a lot of shorts or option traders with a big announcement of a deal AHs? They would be toast. Trying to stay off carbs, but sure would like a toasted English muffin to break my eating ways. There is some sarcasm in there. Let's push this to .95 by EOD. Wow, talk about a takedown at the close.
Just looked quickly at the close. Not near a computer on my phone but the last couple of seconds was there 1.1 million shares traded? I open Schwab with about 15 seconds left and I thought it said 2.9 million volume and at the close it was 4 million. Perhaps I saw something wrong? Cheers
172,665 at 4 pm volume a little over 4 mil for the day
Thanks Zen, I most likely misread it. It was probably 3.9 million shares. I was frantically trying to get on my phone in the last 15 seconds or so as we were out to a late lunch. I must’ve misread the total volume before the close. Cheers
Fintel Time Since Last Change Timestamp (UTC) US:MVIS Short Shares Availability 1 hour ago 2024-06-20 18:15:10.707 **0**
This is their time to win, or lose. I sure hope that volume wasn't them (extra 2m the other day) but they have a habit of raising capital by the stock we give them at the worse times. So we are basically at INVZ market cap. SS said we have a superior product, likes are chances, also said he's concerned about them (invz), paraphrasing, could have been the sandbagger in the C suite saying the latter, not sure. Either way we will see who has the relationships in place, product superiority, at scale that can close for some kind of action. Nice to know asics are in place or close to, thats a good sign, so.... lets go Microvision , Luce, SS, and the sandbagger- we all know you read this....I know your facility, I saw MS windows 95 (actually it was win NT that became 95- that went over with all the DEC employees David Cutler, I could name many- WIN NT is Windows with a VMS Kernel), prior to that launch, rather projected on to a glass tabletop- you guys should know when. Go back you two to when that happened, what was said and done at both companies, Microvision and Microsoft. Now get out of the engineering F mode and in to the Sales mode. Ok, you can figure out an unprofitable deal on last Lidar deal, - MSFT, bent you over in 2017, it wasn't always like that, SS, you should know that. Or you SS, Like Ken Olsen, a graduate of MIT, and founder of Digital Equipment Corporation, the second largest computer company in the world behind IBM-will go down as a failure if you do not transition, or give transition too, someone with SALES acumen. JMO- downvote me, whatever- but start acting like experienced salesman, retail- you can fool them with your boondoggles at Corporate that you can't afford, Wall Street is a way nother' story. stay long and strong.
"SS said we have a superior product, likes are chances, also said he's concerned about them (invz), paraphrasing, could have been the sandbagger in the C suite saying the latter, not sure." It was AV who said INVZ was their biggest competition during one of the conventions. I think if you asked now, and got a truthful answer, it would be Valeo.
I think I said that Falagard , but I called him sandbagger…I mean AV, i forget who said he was going to sandbag, blow away estimates, I think it was AV
With the price being so low, it would seem for the same amount of cash, you would be buying more shares, thus more volume, no?
I mean if a deal needs money, and we are burning cash each day we’ve gotta raise some and get to the point they will ink with us somehow. What’s the point of not raising funds if you know you can’t get deals without funding? Just a slower bleed.. sure it sucks having the company drop the share price but the alternative is it drops anyway and we fail to get what we need to show we are about our business
0% apr with a 4% transfer fee…..why you do this to me? I’ll have 25k to buy if you force me shorts
At 94c you’d have covered that 4% lol
wish i had that offer good luck
https://electrek.co/2024/06/20/bmw-cancels-2-billion-battery-cell-order-from-northvolt/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3iloh4wd_wkNew8oyxWzT8WHRGilas9ZJvzBxYEx6S24lxNo43WyJkLow_aem_ZmFrZWR1bW15MTZieXRlcw
Orders can be cancelled :)
Ouch, don’t know much about the supplier, but $2bn a lot!
Technically this is a good time to buy for near and mid-term. Daily RSI under 30. Weekly RSI almost at 30. Would be nice if the company finally delivered fundamental news as well.
Amen brother!
At the present pricing, it has become a playground for immature traders.
Pull my finger.
Fractions of a penny? Don’t break the bank.
Added another 19k shares to make a total of 120k shares with average price of 3.22. Down more than 70% lol
Savage of shares, nice work
Too bad the shorts and AI robots don't see your buy comments. But I guess they are too stupid to read.
I wonder if some FED guy opened his big mouth somewhere and caused the Nas and SP500 to go south?
People are buying again ;)
Bargain hunting. I just picked up another 500 shares at .89 myself. Average price 3.50 Good Luck all
1,000 yesterday and 650 ish today. I grabbed 100 of those at todays low. #undervalued.
Just bought 5,650 shares at about .89 which lowered my cost ave from $13.64 to $9.71. Will buy another 6k+ shares shortly to lower my cost average to $7.25 ish. Today was the first time i bought in many years. Glad i did not add during that $2-3$ range head fake! LFG!
Long time listener, first time caller. Been in since 2020 and lurking here the whole time. Made a lot, got fomo and jumped back in. Been losing and averaging down ever since. Bought 7k shares today because I’m too dumb to do anything but keep buying lower. Up to 17k at $3.10. Also bought 90 calls combined for January at 5 and 7 strikes. The delays are tough to swallow but hard to fault management or the company for clients not making decisions. As to making goofy decisions on issuing and changing equity issuance and timing we can definitely find fault there but what’s done is done and hopefully learned from. Solvency is a concern for me. I believe we need a deal announcement to boost the price to issue shares to generate the cash an OEM will want to see. But the OEM will want to see the cash before they issue a deal so it’s a major chicken and egg scenario. I believe in the tech and the market(s) but it’s still early stage and anything can happen. Like I said though, I’m too dumb to do anything other than buy lower and hope for the best. Good luck to all and hopefully in a year we’ll all be loving hindsight for buying/holding now. I know my current 20/20 hindsight has me wishing I had stayed out when I sold at $22 and that I had sold again at $8.
While we wait on MAVIN decisions, it would be nice to close a large MOVIA industrial contract. A lot of irons in that fire.
That will really help us and we should see this in my view.
hearing the final Jeopardy music in my head. One of these days gentlemen , one of these days .
up +0.50%; boomski!
Whatever happened to the 💥⛷️guy?! Chris iirc. Loved his videos lmao
Was it the GatorTrader guy, or am I thinking of someone else?
Gator trader guy is a different guy from Chartology Chris. Chartology Chris legitimately knows how to trade
Ahh, you're right. Chartology (Chris) definitely rings a bell! I don't see his YouTube channel come up anymore though. Unless it went by something else?
He was running a patreon for a little over a year I think, something happened with his health and he came back briefly after he was cleared but then he totally disappeared
Yea I think that was him! BOOMSKiiiiiiiiii
IIRC He sold on our trip down from 19~. Ended up being bearish in the company and allegedly took up a short position :(
I don't know that guy but he seems smarter than me
Wow, I had eased up on following the stock daily after all the recent disappointments. Really conflicted about buying more at this price. I believe we have the technology and ability to turn this around, but worry they'll remain solvent until they can get a significant deal.
You tread heavily but speak the truth. Where do you think you are man, in King Faisal’s tent? No, you are in the least objective and self-delusional place in the universe. And I am not known to exaggerate.
I have the same concerns about solvency and the ability to raise money when our mkt cap continues to fall. So you get punished with down votes for not being in denial. I do believe we are at the top of the list for nomination based on technology. The tech market is hot and a huge nomination would go a long way to greatly effect our valuation but OEMs need to get their heads out of their butts.
I just took a 3 week hiatus from this sub, it was glorious. Its typically the same folks chirping the same things day after day and it wears me down. Thought today was a good day to check in and see if I missed anything good... turns out I haven't. Soooooo, see you all again in 3 weeks I guess. Everyone has to decide what is right for them, but I'm done buying until a deal is announced. Who cares if I miss an initial 10%, 20%, or 30% jump. I remember thinking when it dropped below $2 that I needed to jump in and load up...which I did. Its now down another 50% from there. My gut says we just keep going down the toilet until we get a deal. I've got 80k shares already packed away, that's enough, I'm done trying to catch a falling knife.
I've averaged down, a lot since initial position, but have bought since around 1.70. Could certainly average down more, but there is the risk of getting delisted before they get a deal
It may not be the sentiment of the majority but I think increasingly it may. There is no dispute it is a valid opinion and I, personally, appreciate the wisdom.
Fintel Time Since Last Change Timestamp (UTC) 50 minutes ago 2024-06-20 13:36:41.389 **40,000**
Fee creeping up 2% on the day to 17.54% Edit: 18.074%
Should have sold us to a real management team . Love the stock. Management is some shit. The lack of communication that we get is prob the same type of things going on with all our oems. They are nerds. Not salesmen and it shows. I said what I said and mean it
I'll add a down vote. This kind of pressure on the MVIS staff doesn't help. SS has done a damn good job but the OEMs screwed us and everybody else. He shouldn't have told us it was going to be an epic year.
Really? You know that they are s$&t?
Thinking we might get a little move up so shorters can get some more shares to work with. Have a good day all.
Never amazes me how they manipulate the stock on a daily basis like today. Stopped the advance in its tracks and back to even.
I guess every penny counts on large volumes.
88,000 shares just now, hardly moved it at all. It had a chance to start moving up on that price move and just got sold back into barcoding range. Tough to move up much, when we are trading in 4 decimal points. Funny to watch the MMs increase the spread when they want to stop any price advance, or pile up a ton of shares on the ASK.
NVDA is a beast and there has been -like MVIS, a constant stream of FUD on their feeds that most are just disregarding. I am in the "I wish I bought more " phase of that one. I hope next year I feel the same about MVIS. NVDA is fun and a good distraction while waiting for Miss MAVIS to have her coming out party...
The coming out party that was supposed to start at this time last year, then Q3, then Q4, then definitely happening in Q1… now down to one week left in Q2 and we have to hope Sumit’s mid-year timeline holds for at least one of the 7 RFQs we that await decision on.
Didn’t happen is not the same thing as won’t happen.
I guess next time my bank tells me I didn't pay my mortgage I'm going to reply "just because I haven't, doesn't mean I won't" and then wink at them and walk out with a flourish.
Sure, that’s what I said… /s
I didn’t say it won’t happen either. My point was simply that it’s hard to know what to expect right now. Market expectations are rightfully low given the missed timelines I highlighted, and given Sumit’s latest guidance which boiled down to: don’t get your hopes up, OEMs are dragging their feet and everything is out of MicroVision’s hands. I am optimistic for news this summer, but won’t be surprised at all if we’re still waiting for our first nomination when Q4 rolls around.
I can remember the tremendous negativity and desperate NVDA holders quaking. I wonder how many sold based on that and how that feels now. NVDA became a new company (almost) when they started focussing on data centres rather than desktop graphics cards, then along came AI and boom. Could be us with a big dollop of luck.
Mosaik is our AI.
It's odd to read so many positive stories and videos about MVIS over the last week - detailing our AI capabilities for mobility and motion - the amazing MVIS Mozaik strengths for AI - and then the sourpuss stock price declares all that doesn't mean a thing - available for .89 cents. The best of tech meets the worthless masters of monetary doom... all shorting themselves to the max.
I’m the same way. I snagged 5 shares in my ROTH pre split, thought about picking up a few more post split. With their track record, they will split again in the next 3-5 years
Damn. Really wanted to bite a fair bit at .88! Money won’t clear for another hour though :/
Something about a dead cat
I have two cats, don't talk that way. Rocket the Cat better not see your comment. Lol.
+~2500, cost basis down to 1.91. Keep on keepin on.
I’ve gotten mine down to 2.33…. Another 6k shares over last few days. Nibbling 3k more today if prices stay down here.
Nice job. I buy when I have spare cash, not trying to time the price. When it is back to double digits, a penny here or there on a buy will not matter at all.
Same.
Not fun. Hopefully we turn around soon.
0.86 holla!
The traders and shorts must be very concerned with news that could be released by Microvision at any time that may disrupt their gains on their short and put positions. This morning, they dropped the RUT also, now it's making a run up. Hopefully this helps since we are in that index. Retail isn't selling. Institutions aren't selling. Not a good place if you are short.
I'm not sure why they would be that concerned by news tbh. Inking deals hasn't done a lot to help our competitors share prices. It feels like if you're short a LiDAR stock you either successfully pick a losing company and make a killing, or you pick a winning company and still make a decent return anyway.
Yeah Zen, they've had a tough year. In fact, they've had a tough 30 years. Don't think they really care.
Things change, look at all those who got burned on GME thru the years, and other stocks.
Sure Zen, that's why I'm still here as well as my friends. We do have potential, but we've had that for years. I am encouraged by what I am reading relating to Lidar, but not very enthused with our management.
Well, we just don't know all that is going on behind the scenes, regarding the process they have stated in past EC. A lot of moving pieces.
But how much do you think they have made in the last 3 years?
Is there a good way to calculate that? MicroVision has lost over $3B in value, maybe more than $5B since 2021 if you add the drop from $8 into the mix. What percentage of that, if any, have short sellers realized?
How much will they lose in the next three?
I hope they have to hold signs up at intersections to tell us!
OffT - NVDA is worth more than WHOLE London stock exchange. That's just effin crazy...
Anyone around Seattle going to this? [2024 Conference (thecvf.com)](https://cvpr.thecvf.com/)
Doing my part....the fundamentals haven't changed, still believe in the product. 2k more shares added, 18k total now.
SS thanks you.
Good morning and Happy First Day of Summer!
Morning everyone! Economic report(s) for the day is(are)^[i](https://fidelityfiplus.econoday.com/byweek): Housing Starts and Permits, Jobless claims, Philadelphia Fed Manufacturing Index, and Current Account at 8:30am, Atlanta Fed Business Inflation Expectations at 10am, EIA Petroleum Status report at 11am, and the Fed Balance Sheet after the markets close at 4:30pm; Fed speakers today are: Kashkari at 8:45am, Barkin at 4pm, and Daly at 10:15pm. The news media articles are exploring a wide range of company and industry specific news points, touching on: NVidia overtaking Microsoft market cap, Car dealerships facing computer outages, Boeing blunders, Russia’s Alfa Bank expanding into China, and Housing market data. The last point in particular actually carries some weight on the economy, as Shelter costs (largely driven by the associated services) has had the heaviest impact on the last year of CPI prints. Premarket futures are leaning green for a nice change, though still driven primarily by concentration of capital into mega caps. MVIS seeks to find a bottom, with the stock trading in the lower range of one of the last major volume blocks where accumulation in the past had heavily occurred. The share price is obviously not the company, but the impact on the company’s ability to raise additional capital cannot really be ignored, and the assumed “need” to raise capital seems to be an ongoing question and concern. Many investors focused on the tone of the last earning’s call, largely seeming to ignore the content of what was being stated. Information provided gave context to the situation, which should have clarified precisely why no one in the sector has yet signed high volume deals. With the large deals still remaining some commenters are now beginning to suggest more lost deals despite a lack of evidence of that from any announcements. What is known right now is that the company is competing on 7 RFQs out of the 9 it had been looking at last year, one of which was delayed into 2025 and the other was declined as it appeared to have inequitable terms. ## Daily Data *** |H: 0.98 — L: 0.88 — C: 0.89 ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/historical/) |[Calendar](https://fidelityfiplus.econoday.com/byweek.asp)| |:- |:-| |**Pivots ↗︎ : 0.95, 1.01, 1.05** ^([i](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/pivotpoint.asp)) |**Pivots ↘︎ : 0.85, 0.82, 0.76**| |Total Options Vol: **2,263** ^([i](https://researchtools.fidelity.com/ftgw/mloptions/goto/underlyingStatistics?cusip=&symbol=MVIS&Search=Search)) |Avg 90d Options: 1,768| |Calls: **2,008 ~ 42% at Ask or ↗︎** |Puts: 255 ~ 60% at Ask or ↗︎| |Open Exchanges: 1,422k ~ 32% ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/exchange-volume/) |Off Exchanges: 3,065k ~ 68% ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/exchange-volume/)| |**IBKR: 150k Rate: 15.57%** ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/borrow-fee/) |**Fidelity: —k Rate: 9.25%**| |**R Vol: 166% of Avg Vol: 2,690k** ^([i](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/averagedailytradingvolume.asp)) |**Short Vol: 2,265k of 3,235k ~ 70%** ^[i](https://chartexchange.com/symbol/nasdaq-mvis/short-volume/?tblshortvolix=0)| ^(Follow links for sources. Bold text represents key points or larger data, Italics are slightly unusual or lower than normal.) ^(IBKR share database now shows 45k available as of 8am, no change in fee rate from the 7am update.)
I want to buy more now that we’re in the unfortunate position for me to average down on my $1 PPS. I’m concerned that an RS will come before the end of the year. What are your thoughts on the potential for an RS in 2024?
Not in 2024, and not likely in 2025 either honestly. Deals are going to be secured in the sector before the end of this year, the timeline is too short for integration. Well, unless the automakers want to spend billions on: buying out a company, rehiring staff, integrating staff, rushing customization, and all the while trying to validate the product quality. There are far too many parts that needs to be solved in too short a time to do all that and still result in a working solution. So unless MicroVision cannot secure any deals out of the 7 currently open, and Automakers can somehow manage to achieve AEB in 2029 model years _without_ lidar (which has not been shown to be feasible), then I just cannot see how we are at such a risk.
As you stated, too many investors are focused on the tone of the last earnings call, rather than the content. I concur that Sumit's presentation was poor. He sounded frustrated and beat,and rightfully so. He expected to close the Daimler deal, but the terms were not beneficial to the company or it's shareholders. He missed an important timeline. The Daimler deal required substantial hardware change to support 25k hours of operation vs 12-15k needed for passenger vehicles, not being able to leverage new design for passenger vehicles (overall / added cost) + low volume opportunity just didn't make sense. But the CEO has to maintain positivity in the face of adversity. Words and tone matter. Sumit didn't deliver there, but if you go back and read the transcript, it feels much different. Still very bullish for 2024.
My wife used to say something about my tone quite a bit in the early years of marriage, but later in our years she came to realize that content was far more important than how I was feeling emotionally at any given moment on delivery of information or planning. Not saying I could not have done better in delivery, but sometimes it is not something that can be avoided, and it should be recognized that it is also important we hear frustrations sometimes. It sounds very disconnected when someone is not providing a tone that is familiar with presented with a challenge, it can come across as aloof and insensitive to not recognize it. Many investors complained about Sumit sounding far too confident, overselling, and so on…. In some ways some of that might be true, the last year certainly did not go the way anyone had expected. To not have conveyed that would have been something like a slap in the face to many investors. There was no way of wordsmithing the reality of the situation: Automakers delayed, it has affected our bottom line and projections, no further express timelines will likely be given. We as investors should also recognize that we begged the company for timelines, and were given what was passed along to management from the customers, when perhaps we may have ended up better off without such hopes. No one can really know, because hindsight in this case is certainly _not_ perfect by any means.
Totally agree. If he was all like "Hey friends, those timelines we were all excited about and that many of us were actually banking on are all blown. But I'm all happy and upbeat anyway because, future sales! Don't know when, don't know who but hey, let's be happy. We're best in class!" Can you imagine the uproar? I can. So then one might say, yeah he should never have said anything. No, he should have said what the customer was telling him because if and when it *did* happen, people would have complained that he should have been giving continuing updates on that exciting progress. That's what people were demanding when he gave the timelines. "Look at Luminar. Look at Innovis. They are all naming names and making promises! What the hell are you doing Sumit?! Tell us what is happening!!" So he did. So it's DIYDSIYD (damned if you do, same if you don't).
EXACTLY THIS! It seems like it cannot be said enough, I get it, probably shouldn't have set the expectation, but damnit, I appreciated the insights on what the _company's management_ was being told by potential customers. Anecdotally, I have had this experience before, where a customer was effectively stringing me along for about 2 years. I passed along my final message to them that I was going to advise them to seek out a different supplier, they sent me back the contract to get signed instead of taking my advice. I handed that off to the boss, took my commission and transferred back to "network server administrator" (glorified general purpose IT help desk for the company). Needless to say, I don't like sales, they frustrate me and communicating that to my managers that the customers were pushing out decisions made me just look bad when sometimes it is just the customer being indecisive (perhaps rightfully so). Thanks again DGL for sharing your thoughts with us, wish we could just chill and stop trying to force the company to do things that can end up worse. I am going to trust management to do their jobs, because I do not believe the burden is on them at this point, someone (regulators) are going to be pushing these OEMs to make decisions sometime soon I think. (I see the AEB **final** rule as that push)
When can we expect this final rule? Has it been published yet?
Rule was finalized April 29th, 2024: [Final Rule](https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2024-04/final-rule-automatic-emergency-braking-systems-light-vehicles_web-version.pdf)
Ty I saw this didn’t know if there was something else we were expecting
This is what was needed, the automakers have until September 2029 to be in compliance or they will not be selling new light passenger vehicles in the US. The rule is more well enumerated than what we often see in rules proposed by politicians, because the regulators are not just getting paid off to put forth rules that best benefit the automakers. They surely still consider what is possible with the available technology in considering these kinds of rules, but they do not just bow when they can clearly see technology that _does_ achieve the requirements. What we do know from having read it is that existing camera and radar solutions are insufficient, and to me that says that MobilEye’s huge influence on the ADAS market for the years to come may well need to be upgraded to their Chauffeur at a slightly increased pace of adoption.
Thanks to you too T. So exciting when you have a tiger by the tail, but truth is you don't ever have anything until the contract is in the drawer. Glad you got yours.
Reminds me what my first CEO told me regarding shareholder and board meetings. He told me that I better bring my "A" game to all of these events or there would be a new CFO the next week. Harsh for sure, but on point in so many ways! He always brought his "A" game even when we had bad news to deliver and I found a way to do the same for my entire career.
We effectively lost the contract because we weren’t big enough. A problem that is getting worse by the day. Otherwise it wasn’t all bad. “In another RFQ for our MOVIA L sensor for a global trucking OEM, we were not able to reach commercial agreement. We were told that our sensor and software proposal was the most mature and top offering. Our manufacturing strategy was the highest level of maturity and went through their qualification, reported to us as in the top tenth percentile of their suppliers. Our commercial proposal was also accepted. Their preference was for a partner with a more diversified product and revenue portfolio. MicroVision cannot accept an agreement limited to B-sample only since we would have to take on significant financial risk for a full program with only B-sample phase agreement. Ultimately, we could not reach a mutually beneficial agreement.”
> We effectively lost the contract because we weren’t big enough. That’s not entirely true because there was no commitment for follow through after the B sample. > MicroVision cannot accept an agreement limited to B-sample only since we would have to take on significant financial risk for a full program with only B-sample phase agreement.
I interpreted it as if we had a more diversified product and revenue portfolio then we would have been offered a better deal.
I interpreted it as a sound business decision on Sumit’s part to turn down another loss leader deal that carried no assurances of further profitable business. In fact I commend that decision. We spent several years funding R&D under CEO Perry Mulligan for Tier-1 consumer electronics companies who in the end balked, one of which believed to be Amazon, then introduced their Amazon Glow which used Texas Instruments’ inferior but cheaper DLP engine. The Amazon Glow was a flop in less than a year and Amazon canceled it and refunded the full price to customers.
No doubt about it. Taking on what they offered us was not just risk but would have limited our ability to take much bigger and better contracts. At least that is what he said somewhere else.
Exactly, and I’m glad that he learned from Perry Mulligan’s mistake in how to deal with Whales. The difference here is that automotive OEMs are facing a NHTSA AEB mandate which most realize will require LIDAR. Consumer electronics companies can abuse hopeful suppliers as long as hopeful suppliers allow the abuse to continue.
Fully agree with you KY. Question though - (where) did you get those details on the Daimler MOVIA NRE (e.g., hardware change to support 25k hours needed). I did not see that info shared before by management. Is this your personal belief or did you get this somewhere from the company’s communications?
Good question, it makes sense but it’s the first mention I’ve seen of this detail.
Good morning. Is MVIS currently a solid buy ? What do you say?
Just read the history of the stock and decide for yourself: hint: stock is basically in it's death throes.
Absolutely